Latest / Skin Anarchy / The Science Behind Pregnancy-Safe Skincare with Dr. Kate Viola of Lady Polpo

Transcript

The Science Behind Pregnancy-Safe Skincare with Dr. Kate Viola of Lady Polpo · Skin Anarchy

• 0:02
  SPEAKER_01: Hey guys, welcome back to Skincare Anarchy.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_01: This is your host, Exta, and I'm really, really excited about the brand we're featuring today because I think you know we don't really hear a lot about when it comes to skincare or any topical solutions.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: We don't really talk about these like multifactorial aspects that come in.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_01: For example, women that are pregnant or breastfeeding, or you know, anyone who has this extra need for precaution, you know, when they're utilizing any kind of products, much less something topical, something prone to go and get into your bloodstream.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_01: There's just not a lot of information out there about these things.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, I'm really excited to talk to our guests today and discuss a lot of different things.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_01: I think we're gonna dive into a lot of different topics.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_01: But without further ado, I'm gonna introduce you guys to Dr.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_01: Kate Viola, who is a board-certified dermatologist and the founder of Lady Pulp.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to the show, Dr.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_01: Viola.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so excited to host you.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much, Dr.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: Eccia.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_00: I'm thrilled to be here.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'm really excited to chat with you and to learn from you about, you know, obviously your journey, but also um just how you see our industry and where you think the white spaces are.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_01: And but if you could get us started, um tell us a little bit about you know what got you into dermatology and also what led to the creation of the the brand, Lady Pulple.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_00: Fantastic.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: So I um I actually started in general surgery.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, my alley.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right up right up your alley.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_00: I started in general surgery.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_00: I had a mentor in medical school who was a breast surgeon, and he was just in such an incredible surgeon.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: He was really old school, kind, caring, uh, and just had incredible skill.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_00: And so he was he kind of was this wonderful mentor in in school.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_00: And so I was I was really excited to start general surgery.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I was accepted to a program in New York City, and I did that for two years, but I realized very early on I just was not in the right place because I was really enjoying spending the time with my patients more than just within the operating room.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_00: So I was fortunate to have the opportunity after second year of general surgery residency, a lot of people do research.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_00: And so I was accepted to into the Robert Wood Johnson Clinical Scholars Program at Yale to start uh a research program there.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_00: And this was more of translation translational research.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: So looking at diseases and then finding the best treatment options and looking at research as a way to kind of fuel how we how we treat our patients, the decisions that we make, you know, in order to treat our patients.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_00: And so I happened to have a mentor whose uncle was a dermatologist and whose wife was a dermatologist.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_00: And he was a primary care doc.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: He ran the VA at Yale, but he was really interested in the interface between derms and primary care docs.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_00: And so he and I just started working together, and he really actually ended up being the true mentor who led me to dermatology.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_00: And it was really very special because we looked at kind of this interface between primary care docs referring lesions of concern.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_00: So these were like skin cancers to the dermatologists.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_00: So what percentage of those lesions were indeed skin cancers?
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_00: And what we found was that that was a low number.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_00: However, the dermatologists ended up finding something else that was a skin cancer.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_00: That number was much higher.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: So throughout that whole journey, and it was it was wonderful because it was published in this very elite dermatology journal, and we got a lot of press for it.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_00: And then he and I started to do more research.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_00: And he said to me one day, you know, Kate, this is, I feel like you should be a dermatologist.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: Do you love this stuff?
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_00: And so I had to go through this kind of crazy transition because dermatology is one of those specialties.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's super niche, super difficult to get into.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: Everybody has, you know, research or something special that has led them to derm.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_00: So my story was a little bit odd for the normal dermatology resident or dermatologist.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_00: However, I was fortunate to do a dermatopharmacology fellowship at Albert Einstein in in New York in the Bronx.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_00: And the chair and I did a lot of wonderful stuff, wonderful research together.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_00: And then he accepted me into his program.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_00: So I will I will be always indebted to Dr.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_00: Cohen from Albert Einstein.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_00: And so I I became a dermatology resident, and I really just fell in love with Durham.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_00: I think, you know, the nice thing about dermatology is one day in my office, you know, I'll have a patient who is one year old, and then the next patient will be 99, and everyone in between.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: It's just a very special, special field.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_00: And I feel like, especially we have such amazing research going on in Durham, and just there's so many advancements with certain skin diseases like psoriasis and eczema, where we can keep people clear for a very, very long time in a very healthy way, looking at treating the cause rather than the result now.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm I'm really excited to be in such a wonderful field, and I feel very fortunate.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, I mean, I think that's that's such a cool transition that you made, you know, from Gen Surge to germ because they're both very competitive specialties, but it's also a more of this like, you know, I think you you realize what your calling is in residency uh more than ever.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_01: And people always tell me Yes, yes.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_01: They're like, you know, once you're in residency, you're locked in, and it's just not the case, you know, for anyone listening out there that's an aspiring physician.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_01: We get a lot of those.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_00: Uh so you know, yeah, you have to go with your calling, exactly.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_00: In your heart, you always know if you're in the right place, for sure.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_00: For sure.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: So I want to know, like, what led you to, I know you did wonderful research.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_01: And so when you were thinking, I mean, what led you to wanting to create your own brand and and wanting to put yourself out there in this way, you know?
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_00: So when I was pregnant, I was, it was my last year of residency.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_00: I was the chief resident.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_00: It was a very stressful time.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_00: And my husband was doing his fellowship in Washington, and I was in New York by myself.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so, and I had I had wonderful friends in my program.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: You know, when you're a resident, as you know, you just develop these bonds with your with your colleagues, and and it's a bond for life.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_00: It's a very, very close bond.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: And so I had it, I had another girlfriend who was pregnant in my program, and we were, you know, it was just like this wonderful time, but we kind of kept going back and forth to each other and saying, no, wait, I can use this in pregnancy, right?
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, let me just double check.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_00: When we just weren't sure, you know, what we were, what was right to be putting on our faces.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_00: We knew not, we knew what not to put on.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_00: Like we knew, you know, don't use a retinoid, don't be taking accutane, don't be using hydroquinone, these certain things that we all know are no like the no-goes in pregnancy.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_00: But then it was like, what can we really be using?
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_00: What can we use that is effective?
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_00: And it's hard when you're in in your germ residency, especially, you know, you get all these free samples of things and you're trying, you know, Botox on one another, you practice on one another and all that crazy stuff.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_00: And so we we kind of were more like, okay, but what where's our clear path of what we can use that's gonna really kind of brighten and tighten our skin, make make us look great, get that real pregnancy glow kind of deal.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_00: And it was very confusing.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_00: The other thing, too, is that I noticed that at the time there were so many products that, you know, that were recommended by like board-certified dermatologists in, you know, magazines, vogue, you know, purpose bizarre, all these kinds of magazines in style.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, for your wash, you use cetophil, for your moisturizer, you use La Roche Posay.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_00: But there wasn't one brand that was really covering everything unless it was for the belly.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_00: Now that was 2015.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_00: Things have changed a little bit more in terms of other options, but there was a lot of belly stuff for the pregnant woman, lots of creams for the body, oils for the belly.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_00: They started coming out with the masks for the belly, but there wasn't anything like, here I am, I'm 30-something, my first child, like most of my friends in New York, you know, we're a little bit older, we're already using like anti-aging products.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: What are we gonna do?
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_00: And what is really truly safe?
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_00: You know, there were certain ingredients I knew prescription-wise, like azoleic acid, which is safe in pregnancy.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, that does have some anti-aging effects, a little bit of increase in collagen over time.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_00: But there wasn't anything that was really like I could say, yes, this is this is a good thing that I should be doing.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_00: And it and and also when you are a little bit older having a baby, you don't need to be doing 50,000 things every day.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_00: The other thing too is that you want something very simple and uh effective.
• 9:17
  unknown: Right.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, do you know what I'm talking about?
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, that makes sense.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_01: It it's really interesting what you're saying because you know, not to cut you off, but like just for I know for anyone listening out there that's gone through the journey, you know, of pregnancy and going through all that, there's so many skin changes that are always reported, you know, by patients, whether it's you know, mild stuff or even sometimes severe.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, there's a lot of allergic reactions that start happening that you never had before, you know.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_01: Like I know with my with my own mother, like I've never been pregnant.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, so for me, I I can't give a personal experience.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_01: My mom, I remember being a child when she got pregnant with my brother, she developed allergies in her pregnancy.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_01: She'd never had allergies before that, you know, like it was like a new thing.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_01: And so I know that it's such an interesting set of you know processes that go on in your body, you know, when you're pregnant, that's just aside from the fact that you're growing a child, you know, it's just your normal physiology going kind of crazy, you know, in all ways.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: So from that perspective, I find it to be extremely interesting that this area of you know OTC products has not grown more, you know, in the last decade or so.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's kind of fascinating to me that we haven't, you know, done more.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: No, it's so true.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_00: So really, I think that pregnancy is truly a catalyst for one of the most influential changes in our skin because hormones, hormones really play a role in so much.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's it's incredible.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: We have all of these hormones shifting, and then the skin follows suit.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_00: So really, our body is continually changing throughout pregnancy.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_00: We have increase in blood flow, we have increased in oil production that can lead to breakouts, we have increased, you know, because of these fluctuating hormones, we really see this superficial pigmentation.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: So it's very interesting.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_00: Our placenta actually makes this hormone called melanocyte stimulating hormone.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_00: And in combination with more estrogen and progesterone, we have more of the cells that make our pigment, the melanocytes, working over time.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_00: They go kind of nuts.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: And that's why about 50 to 70 percent of pregnant women get melasma.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_00: And this is what we call like the, you know, the mask of pregnancy, this brown pigmentation on your face.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_00: You can also, these hormones are also responsible for something called linea nigra, the the black line on your tummy that you can get.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_00: You can get, you know, darkening of the nipples and the skin folds and the and even the genitals.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_00: And that in itself can be, especially on the face, can be very exasperating, honestly, and frustrating for women.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: But I do think also what we see is that in our second, so there was a really great study that looked at the actual changes of the epidermis and dermis during pregnancy and found that within the second trimester, there was a significant decrease in our skin surface lipids.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_00: It was really loud.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_00: It was from scientific reports a couple years back.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_00: And what it really showed was that there was this very significant change or decrease in the lipids or the fats that are responsible for maintaining, you know, our protective barrier, relaying signals to keep the skin microflora healthy.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: And this decrease really led to weakened skin barrier and a big sensitivity.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that that's also incredibly important here when we um create products for pregnant women is that we have to understand that our skin is sensitive during this time.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_00: And this also plays a role, Dr.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: Ecta, when it comes to menopause, fluctuation of hormones that can cause the same exact thing where we have the sensitivity of our skin.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: So I have patients, you know, who are 35 who are pregnant saying, oh my God, my skin is so dry.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_00: Then I have patients who are 55 saying the same exact thing.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_00: And this really boils down to these hormone fluctuations, the changes in the actual, you know, lipid profile of our skin, which is a very has such protective qualities.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_00: The irony of it all is that what so many products have shown, or the the kind of the design of products for pregnant women have all been more plant-based organic.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, this is because we think we, if we eat healthy and you know, we're having organic food while we're pregnant, well, we might as well be putting that on our skin as well.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's really, really wild that so many of the products that are designed for pregnant women are plant-based organic skincare or this kind of, it's called like natural personal, excuse me, care products or NPCPs.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um really heavily marketed to this population because we think as mothers to be, it's better to use products derived from nature, right?
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_00: The problem is there's a lot of problems with this.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_00: The first problem is that when we say something is clean, you know, what does that really mean?
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_00: Because there's really no governing body or guidance to say this is clean, this is not clean.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_00: What is truly clean skincare?
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_00: So the FDA doesn't, they haven't defined clean or natural.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_00: So anybody can put this in America on their products and say, oh, I have clean, you know, I have clean product.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_00: But the issue is really that the a lot of the clean beauty products are allergenic.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that is, to me, the biggest take-home message that I tell my pregnant women is that really, you know, you have to be ingredients matter.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_00: So, and I I tell all of my patients about uh there was a recent study from Stanford that looked at tons of thousands of products from like Whole Foods, Walgreens, Target that were that were clean beauty.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_00: And they worked with the American Contact Dermatitis Society, which is a phenomenal organization.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_00: I've been a member with them for years and years and years, and they just collect the best data on you know allergens.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: And so they did this, they did this study with ECDS, American Contact Derm, and they found that at least 90% of these skincare products had a had one or more contact allergens in them.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, so you have to be super, super careful because not only are these products, this is this is they were looking at uh, you know, normal skin.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: You can imagine with the sensitive skin we have in pregnancy, like what your mom went through, you know, that the skin is just so much more sensitive.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_00: So, really, the products that you need to use should be safer, sensitive skin, free of fragrance, free of dye.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_00: That those are the kinds of products you should really choose.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_00: You should make wise decisions in pregnancy of what you're putting on your skin.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, that really resonates with me.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm glad that you're actually shining a light on this because one of the things, I mean, we learn in medical school all of these things that are bad for pregnant women, you know, like we're taught all these different drugs and all of these like naturally occurring things, you know, in medical botany and what whatever.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_01: But the common consumer, you made such an such an important point when you said a lot of these are very a lot of the natural quote unquote ingredients that you guys are looking at sometimes, they're because they're not processed in a lab setting and refined in a lab setting, they have a lot of other chemicals in them that are going to be like you know, Dr.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_01: Vella is saying, like they're going to be kind of you know prone to causing allergic reactions or even worse.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's something that it's not discussed.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_01: Consumers are not educated enough about it.
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I I know for a fact, you know, a lot of people say, well, you know, I know I can't use my retinoids or my vitamin A derivative products.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_01: That's a that's a give, you know, easy thing that I understand that I can't do in German, you know, when it comes to my my skin care and my skin health.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_01: But even things like essential oils.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_01: Like how many times are essential oils and products and we're using them not only as normal consumers, but much less if you're pregnant, they're actual oils, you know what I mean, proven to be harmful in pregnancy.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_01: So, like we we don't ever get any label or anything that tells us, okay, yeah, you know, this is safe and this isn't.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_01: So I I'm with you.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I think it's a huge topic, and we need to educate, and people need to be educated about it because you could be using something that you know you don't even know what it's doing.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_01: You it you'll notice later on what the effects were, but yeah, 100%.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_00: 100%.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_00: I had a patient recently, uh, this just lovely pregnant woman, and she really was so good.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_00: It was it was her first child, she was 41, was her first baby.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: So she was very, very, she was trying to be so thoughtful.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: And every single mood that she made, I was just so impressed by her because she was so excited to have the baby.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: She and the other thing I should make mention is that a lot of people who go through IVF have those same experiences because there's also the fluctuation of hormones.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_00: They may not even have gotten pregnant yet, but they have the same kind of experience where because of the fluctuation of hormones, their skin is super, super sensitive.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_00: Plus, they're going through all of this at such a very, very stressful time.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_00: The last thing they should be worrying about is that they're going to get a skin reaction to something they're putting on.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_00: And this was the situation for this woman because she uh came to me when she was pregnant, but she was using this lavender oil-based, like an essential oil-based cream, and she just developed these blisters everywhere.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_00: And she said, Oh, I thought I had a little bit of that before when I was going through my IVF treatments.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_00: It's the same principle.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_00: And it was because she was trying so hard to make these wonderfully thoughtful decisions without as much guidance as she needed in terms of what to use that was safe.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: And she thought, well, you know, lavender, how could what could be more safe than something like a lavender oil, you know?
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, exactly.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_01: No, exactly.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_01: And even like ginseng, no one talks about ginseng, but like it's in every skincare product or ice cream at this point.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_01: And that's bad for you in pregnancy, you know, like you're not supposed to have that.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_01: So it's it's really interesting you mentioned I I I recently just went through my IVF uh journey with um in terms of like, you know, my oaside retrieval and stuff.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_01: And I that's fantastic.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_01: And I wanted to tell you, I actually used the Lady Pulpo serum when I was putting it in.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, terrific.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_00: I'm so glad.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_00: I will send you more.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_01: It's so good.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_01: No, I'm gonna need more because what happened to me was, and I I gotta tell you the story because when I started the hormones, it wasn't like uh rash or anything that happened, but my face, I kept getting these like blotchy red areas all over my face.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: And it wasn't even anything crazy that I was doing.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_01: I wasn't, you know, using brand new products and you know, new cleansers or anything.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_01: It was just normal.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_01: Like it just net naturally my body was reacting like that.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_01: And so all I was doing for you know, the weeks that I was going through these hormones and you know, doing all this was just washing my face as gently as I possibly could, and then using the serum because it's it was tolerated by my skin, you know, it was actually so glad.
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so glad.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's really a very real thing, what you brought up about IVF.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_01: That's why I wanted to mention that for all of our listeners.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_01: Like I it happened to me.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_00: So 100% and surrogates as well have to go through all of this, uh you know, but we see I think this is also really important because this is a time, you know, we never talked about pregnancy before in terms of skincare, you know, and this is a time when people are are going through IVF, they are going through IUI.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_00: I went through IUI and the same kind of thing where we had to do hormones.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's it's not, it's a very stressful time.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_00: And it's a very, I mean, honestly, gynecologists still, even though I worked with a very smart gynecologist, gynecologists in general are not sure either what should be done.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, it's important that we all work together and kind of as women especially in educating on making the right decisions for our skin at this time, you know, and in menopause.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_00: I think these are things that we just don't talk enough about.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, I completely agree because you know, we are still, I think, at that phase in science where we're still trying.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: Figure out something as it seems simple, but it's not.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_01: But the effect of high, high, high levels of estrogen on your skin.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_01: You know, like in IVF, your estrogen levels are gonna shoot through the roof, they're gonna be in their thousands, like 4,000 range is what they're gonna have you in, you know.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_01: And so when you have any hormone reaching these extreme levels, you're gonna have a skin reaction.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_01: There's gonna be something that manifests.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if what it'll be for you know each person, it's different for everybody, but we don't have the answers in science yet.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_01: And then when you look at menopause, it's the other way around.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_01: And also it's like you have the you know, the dryness and the those kind of effects because of low estrogen.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: So it's very interesting to me that like we're still from a scientific standpoint, we're still figuring it out, but it's also important, and I've always believed this, which is why I really love skincare and this whole space, is we need to alongside you know, academic medicine, we need to also be working, you know, to try to find these options for people and provide options that are actually safe for them because 100%.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_01: Because what happens is what you were talking about earlier, where it's like, you know, somebody in their kitchen is making these quote natural what they're putting it all over their skin.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_01: And it's just that's not it.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_00: That's just not it.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_00: So and I would make also mention of this also for babies.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_00: So I know we're talking about pregnancy and we're talking about menopause, but for children as well, so many new moms are using these kinds of products as well.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_00: They think organic plant-based, and for a very long time there were many, many products for babies, you know, that that were in that realm, very, very much more, you know, using ingredients that were were organic or you know, from flowers or from herbs, blah, blah, blah.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_00: And so you saw that in that's in the space for for babies, like baby shampoo, baby lotion.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_00: But what has actually happened in the past, I would say five years, there's there's been more of a push towards products that are for sensitive skin.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I've seen that the most for baby products.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's really interesting.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_00: Like Mostella, which is a wonderful French brand.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I had my kid in Mostella, but it smells divine.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_00: You know, he just happens to have, you know, very non-sensitive skin.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_00: But they just came out uh a couple of years ago with a skincare line that has no fragrance.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of these brands now are starting to go the no fragrance route.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_00: And and so I think that that's it's interesting you see this with babies, but you know, you're you see this not specifically target to pregnant women still.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's it's really interesting you brought up actual babies because it, you know, when it comes to like what, you know, people are so hyper conscious about what you put in your body during pregnancy, what you're doing, it's all gonna affect the baby, you know, it's all gonna have an impact on the child.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_01: And but then after the child is born also, I mean, there are things to keep in mind, you know, you have to, you have to really kind of consider in my opinion at least, you know, when you look at things like pediatrics and you're looking at like OBGY and pediatrics really overlap in this way in terms of like how to deal with the skin types because they're very, very sensitive, you know, early on.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, babies don't have a microbiome when they're born, you know, like they do, but it's developed.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, their whole system is still under development on every level.
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_01: And so we have to be more cautious about things like you know, fragrances or whatever we're putting in these products, they have to be very meticulously crafted, you know, and so and the same thing applies with with pregnancy care and you know, maternity care.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_01: You have to be meticulous, or there's no other way to do it.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, there's no shortcut to this, is what I'm trying to say.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_00: It really, really isn't.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_00: I think one of the things that uh instigated this kind of push with babies and children was more that, you know, the number one skin disease we see in babies and children is eczema.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_00: And we know that, you know, there's this huge sensitivity of the skin with eczema.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_00: This is a breakdown of the skin barrier that we see.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_00: Lots of inflammation is driving this.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_00: So as a result, you know, you have to use products that are safe for sensitive skin.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think that a lot of companies realize, you know, what are what are kids getting?
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_00: They're getting eczema.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_00: And so then let's target this patient popular or not patient, but this this consumer population, you know, to ensure that, you know, we're we're maximizing on profit because this is this makes sense to do something for eczema, you know.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that makes sense.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_01: It does make sense.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_01: But uh, you know, I again, I don't know.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_01: I just when it comes to like babies, like I'm really like I always get very just I think overly cautious because I just don't big I don't trust big pharma, you know what I mean?
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like enough to like let them do anything when it comes to you know, really like infants, like it just doesn't make sense to me.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_01: And I I I feel like that's where the OTC space, honestly, Dr.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_01: Bill, it shines for me because I think there's so many people that care, you know, in the in this space that like they really want to create options and and fill a white space, but yeah, big pharma scares me when it comes to certain demographics.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_00: No, it's true, it's true.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_00: I I feel the same way, and I think also there's just so much out there, so much junk out there, you know.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_00: Social media.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_00: That's why we have the Sephora teen.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_00: I know you do work with teens.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, this is why we have these problems because there's just so much social media out there.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_00: It's confusing for a teenager, it's confusing for a pregnant woman, it's confusing, you know, for for women uh in general.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_00: It's just it's too much with being bombarded.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_00: And I would say, sadly, my you know, my specialty has played a little bit of a negative role, I think, in that because they're putting out so much junk on Instagram and you know, YouTube.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_00: And it one day they they're recommending this, the next day that.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_00: It's just terrible.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and so I can understand why the consumer would be confused.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_01: No, absolutely.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_01: I think I completely, you know, I want to second that because I think there's a lot of and no hate against any doctors.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we are both, you know, I'm both physicians, yeah.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_01: We're both physicians.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_01: We have no hate against any physician, but you know, much respect to anyone who's gone through the grind of becoming a doctor.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_01: But at the end of the day, there is a lot of stuff out there, you guys.
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_01: Like for everyone tuning in, like, I know that you have your favorite derm online that you watch, and that's great.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I encourage you always educate yourselves, but like also just don't take everything at face value, you know, just don't take it immediately as the truth.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_01: Look it up, you know what I mean?
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_01: Go on to PubMed and find out if it's the truth.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_01: Because a lot of times, I mean, and it's not their fault though, you know, because at the end of the day, there's a lot in dermatology, and I think you you hinted at this point.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_01: Dermatology is a very evolving field of medicine.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_01: Like, there is not much that we really know.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, look at some of the pharmaceuticals we're utilizing, you know, in Durham.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_01: Like they're very dated, in my opinion, you know, like I really believe that there is a need to kind of revamp the pharmaceutical like offerings in dermatology.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_01: I think there's a lot of space there that, you know, we can do a lot better, but like it's still an evolving field.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_01: So we can't really expect as consumers that we're gonna go on social media and there's gonna be some random person, you know, on TikTok or YouTube or whatever, and they have all the answers because science doesn't have the answers yet.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_01: So they can't, they pause, yeah, they can't have the answers, you know.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_00: No, for sure.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_00: I think what is the interesting thing, and I made mention of this before, but what the what is the good interesting thing about dermatology for chronic skin disease is that we're actually looking to treat the causes of psoriasis and eczema.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_00: Those are the two big ones, uh, I would say we're actually looking at blocking the cause.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, a lot of dermatology is about inflammation.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_00: And we're actually blocking the molecules that cause the inflammation of psoriasis or cause the inflammation of eczema.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_00: And these are in the biologic forms, and the biologics have are these medicines that are actually doing that, and they've really evolved over the years from something like a humera to something like a skyrhizia or trumphya that we use for psoriasis, where you know, you have very little side effects.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_00: I have patients who are going undergoing active chemotherapy and still on their psoriasis medicines and are still clear.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_00: So I think in some ways, dermatology has truly evolved and we're really going to like the crux of the issue instead of just cheating the end result with steroids, you know?
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_01: No, I think that's really there's a lot of promising stuff.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_01: I was reading an article the other day.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_01: It was, um, I believe it was like a special edition of Frontiers that was published.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_01: And it was talking about psoriasis actually, and how they were talking actually about the immunology of psoriasis and discussing how a lot of the new up-and-coming medications are now geared towards really um working with the immune system.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_01: You know, they're really working with the TH2 response, which I mean, I'm not going to go too much into that and bore people, but yeah, it was very fascinating, you know, to see that.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_01: It's very fascinating to see that.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_01: Durham, I mean, it's a it's a really great field of medicine.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_01: Unfortunately, it just requires a lot more, you know, like I guess, understanding of, you know, more things, like more, just more stuff, like immunology, physiology, you know, biomassy to actually target the real cause of these diseases.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_00: 100%.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_00: 100%.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_00: We just need more time.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_01: We need more time to discover all this stuff.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_01: But I want to get gears a little bit.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_01: I want to ask you a little bit more about Lady Pulpo and just, you know, when you were crafting the formulations, like I love the serum very much.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_01: The serum, it's great.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_01: It's really great.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I think you have such heavy-hitting ingredients in there that are just tried and true, but then also the way you've combined them is really great for anyone who has sensitivity.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, even if you're not going undergoing pregnancy or anything that requires special care, it's a great maintenance serum.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_01: So I would love for you to tell us about the formulation.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like what was your reason behind it?
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, well, thank thank you so much for using it.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_00: I'm so glad that you like it.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_00: For for me, I I thought to myself, okay, so the issue really is that I didn't have anything that I could use daily that I felt good about when I was pregnant that I knew was safe, but that was also effective in terms of anti-aging.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_00: So the idea was that I wanted to create something that was for skin that maybe was, you know, 30 plus, but also that was very safe during this time.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_00: So I worked actually with a reproductive health toxicologist from Harvard and a wonderful gynecologist to go.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_00: I made the reproductive health toxicologist actually made this kind of algorithm for me.
• 33:15
  SPEAKER_00: And we recreate, we created like our own little book of what were safe ingredients to use in pregnancy and what were not safe.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_00: In dermatology, what you'll find is that it takes a lot to say something is safe in pregnancy because nobody wants to test pregnant women with a product if there were to be any harm to the baby.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_00: So I think a lot of the studies that like something like Bacochiol, right?
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_00: So Bacotiol is an is a natural ingredient that's like a natural like retinoid.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_00: It has properties like a retinol or retinoid, but it's natural, it's I think it's Ayurvedic.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_00: And so the idea was, you know, but can we use this on pregnant women?
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_00: No dermatologist, even though the data, the research, the way that the mechanism of action of this medication worked, it actually did not penetrate beyond the epidermis.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_00: So it's not going to affect anything but your skin.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_00: And but yet no dermatologist will come out and say this is safe in pregnancy.
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_00: And it's it for me, I wanted to really kind of have like this book of ingredients of what we know is super safe, that we can use what we know.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_00: We already know really what you can't use.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_00: But what where there was a question mark, we actually could put an exclamation point, you know, and say this is safe, this is a good thing to use.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_00: And so I worked with her for a long time to create this kind of list of ingredients.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_00: I knew, you know, that vitamin C was very important.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_00: There's so many vitamin Cs out there, though.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_00: It's like overwhelming.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_00: So we use the two most potent that would also be best for sensitive skin.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_00: So I did it, uh, two vitamin C's in there.
• 34:55
  SPEAKER_00: And then these simple ingredients like the niacinamides, the peptides, and even a probiotic.
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_00: I think these ingredients together, you know, worked very well.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_00: We worked also closely with environmental working group.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_00: I know that a lot of women kind of go to EWG because it is kind of a seal, like your seal, Dr.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_00: Ecta, where we know that this is safe and we don't have to think twice.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's a big thing.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_00: So, and it was funny because when I called the FDA, I I had a meeting with them to say, okay, what can I say in terms of pregnancy?
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_00: Because I wasn't really seeing anything that said pregnancy skincare.
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_00: So I could never say safe for pregnancy.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_00: I could say pregnancy safe ingredients, because the FDA said to me, you can't say this is pregnancy safe skincare.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_00: We know that each ingredient separately is indeed safe in pregnancy, but when you combine them, maybe they're not, which is, you know, it doesn't even make any sense when you say that out loud.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_00: But this is, you know, what they said to me.
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_00: So I never say anything is pregnancy safe.
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_00: I say it's pregnancy safe ingredients.
• 35:59
  SPEAKER_00: So every ingredient we choose not only chose, not only was pregnancy safe by the reproductive health toxicologist, but also environmental working group.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_00: Environmental working group was good because they looked a lot at reproductive health and the growth of the fetus.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_00: So that was very helpful for me because you could see, and they, and the FDA was funny about EWG.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_00: They said EWG is 10 times harder to get a seal for than the FDA.
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_00: They thought that they were like the hardest things on earth to get through.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_00: So I was so relieved when we were able to do this in in such a good way that EWG, you know, we could get their seal.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_00: But they're they're very stringent, very, very stringent.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_00: So the idea was to create each of the, have each of these ingredients, but also it was very important that the preservatives or the uh binders, all of these ingredients too were very good, safe in pregnancy, but also safe for sensitive skin.
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_00: So ingredients that some people are allergic to, like propylene glycol, you know, we couldn't do anything like that.
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_00: It was it was truly a labor of love.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_00: I had just such a lovely chemist from LA that just was so patient with me and he really understood what I was trying to do.
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm so thankful to Fred Corey because he just stuck by me through this whole adventure and said, okay, let's try this instead.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, like our preservative is from banana peel, you know.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_00: So we do have these natural things, but the banana peel is not allergenic, you know, plus, you know, it's EWG verified.
• 37:43
  SPEAKER_00: So it took us a very long time.
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_00: I think that is what makes us different from any other product that says pregnancy safe.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_00: We actually every ingredient mattered here.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_00: And most importantly, when you put them all together, they were still great for the skin.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_00: They were sensitive for the skin, like they understood, you know, they worked really synergistically together in a good way, but they were also anti-aging.
• 38:06
  SPEAKER_00: So there were so many things that I had to accomplish with making the serum.
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that was the really hard part, and that's what took so long in in making.
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, it makes sense because I mean, you what you said was very interesting about um the feedback you got from the FDA about the synergy of these ingredients and their reactions, because I think it it is kind of like it doesn't make sense, but you know, people put things in in weird temperatures and stuff.
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_01: So maybe that's why they said that, you know, like because you can't control consumers, you can only control what you're doing.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_00: It's true.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_00: It's very, very true.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_00: And the other, the funny thing is is that with these ingredients, so when we first came out, you know, somebody wrote to me and they said, Is vitamin C really safe?
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_00: I I had read somewhere it's not safe in pregnancy, you know.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_00: So I got a lot of like pushback from people because they found somewhere else, don't use this, you know, from like a long time ago.
• 39:05
  SPEAKER_00: It said don't use this or don't use this or don't, you know, but I I had this wonderful the work that we did with the reproductive health toxicologists, like we have this from the research, from all of the data that showed, you know, this is safe in pregnancy because of the mechanism of action of each of these ingredients, allow it to be safe in pregnancy.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that doing that due diligence, you know, I am I can have all of my consumers and patients rest assured that they're going, that this is safe and there's nothing to worry about in terms of their skin as well as their their future baby.
• 39:43
  SPEAKER_00: And that was another thing I have to say that was also very important to us was that we wanted to create a product, you know, we're this is a this is a product for a pregnant woman, and this is really about her future and her child's future.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_00: So this the sister serum bottle is zero plastic, like literally zero plastic.
• 40:05
  SPEAKER_00: It took me two years to find that bottle because there's always a little part of the bottle that's plastic.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_00: So on a dropper bottle, on a glass, it's a glass dropper bottle, there is a lip at the top of the bottle that on 99.9% of all bottles is plastic.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_00: But we really wanted to go with zero plastic.
• 40:28
  SPEAKER_00: So finally we we found a company in Spain that made them without the plastic.
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_00: But it took me two years to find just the simple bottle for this.
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_00: But it you you have to be kind of you have to be true to yourself and true to the mantra of of what you are creating because how could I possibly have a bottle that had plastic in it?
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, given the fact that, you know, this is for a woman, and this is also about the woman's future and their children's future.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, we have to be, we have to acknowledge that.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_01: I completely agree.
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_01: I love that you went the extra mile.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it really shows, you know, the the line is beautiful.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's got two products right now, you guys, for everyone listening, the cleanser and the wonderful serum.
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_01: And it's really a great option, like I said.
• 41:14
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I find it to be obviously for the wonderful reasons that we've talked about here, you know, and the topics we've discussed, but also uh many of you email us asking for just safer options, you know, what you consider to be safer, meaning I I I'm what I'm interpreting is that you have sensitive skin and that you're reacting to some of the products you might be using right now.
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_01: And so we always try to give you guys recommendations, but I think this one is a very obvious recommendation because it's a great option for anyone with sensitive skin types.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_01: It's not going to cause, and from what I can tell from seeing the ingredients, it's not gonna cause you to have you know these ridiculous reactions or even the extra sensitivity that comes with using too much skincare, which I know a lot of people are experiencing.
• 42:02
  SPEAKER_01: You're not really gonna see that here.
• 42:03
  SPEAKER_01: And it's a very nice all-in-one serum from my perspective, you know, as a consumer.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_01: Like I said, when I was using it in my IVF journey, I was not putting anything else on my face, like not even a moisturizer on top.
• 42:16
  SPEAKER_01: And it was doing exactly what I needed.
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_01: My skin was hydrated, it was, you know, taken care of.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't feel like it was, you know, just flaky and all of those things you want to avoid, and you're always trying to combat with just everyday skincare.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_01: It was, I was maintaining that, and it was really great because that blotchiness that I was seeing, the red blotchiness was also going away by utilizing it.
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_01: So I think it's just, you know, it's important to find options, you know, for yourself.
• 42:42
  SPEAKER_01: And especially now, I'm I'm seeing a lot more people are becoming more on the sensitive side when it comes to their skin health.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_01: You know, they have more sensitive skin types now.
• 42:51
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, this is I I can't recommend it enough.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, Dr.
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_01: Bell, I think it's so reached.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, absolutely.
• 42:59
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's important to highlight, you know, because that we do get a lot of emails about hey, you know, my skin is reacting.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_01: What do I do?
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_01: I'm freaking out.
• 43:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, of course.
• 43:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so um I hope that everybody checks it out.
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_01: And if you guys have any have any questions regarding, you know, pregnancy safe ingredients or anything like that, if you want to keep this conversation going, please send us an email.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_01: We can definitely have that conversation and and keep this going.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_01: But thank you so much, Dr.
• 43:28
  SPEAKER_01: Riola.
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_01: This has been so wonderful to chat with it.
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's been an honor, Dr.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_00: Ecto.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_00: You do phenomenal work, and I'm I'm just so happy to be a part of this.
• 43:37
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_01: The honor is truly mine, and we should do this again.
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_01: We should do a part two just for education purposes.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_00: I would love to.
• 43:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 43:45
  SPEAKER_01: Awesome.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_01: I would love to.
• 43:47
  SPEAKER_01: Well, thank you so much.
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_00: Have a great weekend.
• 43:51
  SPEAKER_01: You too.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_01: Hey guys, so I hope you love that episode.
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