Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / MILLIONAIRE-PARTY-MOM MOWS DOWN 2 BOYS WITH MERCEDES, JURY-RIGS?

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MILLIONAIRE-PARTY-MOM MOWS DOWN 2 BOYS WITH MERCEDES, JURY-RIGS? · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace breaking news.
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: Tonight, a young mom and dad walking with their children
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: on a stroll in the neighborhood when suddenly, out of nowhere,
• 0:14
  Speaker 2: a married millionaire socialite comes flying around the curve after
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: a boozy date with her boyfriend.
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: Drag racing, Yes, drag racing.
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: Mom tries desperately to save all of her children, risking
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: her own life to save them, but she could not
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: reach two of her little boys. Tonight, after mowing down
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: two little boys dead and then fleeing the seed of
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: the crash, only stopping when her airbags deploy on her
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: Mercedes and it literally stopped. Now am I actually hearing
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: reports she is tampering with the jury. Good evening, I'm
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: with us.
• 1:04
  Speaker 3: Two SUVs are speeding toward a crosswalk where the Iskander
• 1:07
  Speaker 3: family is crossing. Nancy Askander says the cars are zigzagging
• 1:12
  Speaker 3: with each other as if they were playing or racing.
• 1:15
  Speaker 3: The drivers don't stop at the intersection, not even when
• 1:18
  Speaker 3: two children are hit. Nancy A. Skander says the cars
• 1:21
  Speaker 3: didn't stop even with her eleven year old son Mark
• 1:25
  Speaker 3: on the hood of the car he has found two
• 1:27
  Speaker 3: hundred and fifty four feet away. Her eight year old son,
• 1:30
  Speaker 3: Jacob is tossed fifty feet and is lying near the curb.
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: You know, I've covered a lot of the hicular homicides.
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: I have prosecuted vehicular homicides, and I don't believe I
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: have ever seen a case where a human was thrown
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: two one hundred and fifty feet the other child thrownd
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: fifty feet That is nearly the length of a football field.
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: There's been a lot of back and forth about whether
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: she was drag racing or not.
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: Does it matter? After drinking and reportedly.
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: Using drugs on some boozy date with her boyfriend, this
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: multi millionaire woman, She's got everything, Why does she have
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: to do this? And then apparently the athlete boyfriend she
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: was canondling with goes and hides in the bushes and sees,
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: oh yeah, him, him, goes in highs to see what unfold.
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: Did anybody go out and try to save the boys?
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: Did they even stop? No, they didn't. And now is
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: this real? She's actually trying to get to the judge,
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: trying to get friends to talk the judge into a
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: new trial, trying to reach out to giors to say
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: what what, trying to get a new trial, and even
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: contacting the boys mother and father with me an all
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: star panel to make sense of what we know right now.
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: But first, to Amen Murphy joining us with the Acorn News,
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: Aimen what first?
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: I'm going to get back to.
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: The actual lowing down the two little boys and then
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: continuing to go into your airbags, deploy and stop your mercedes.
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: I'll get back to that.
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: But what can you tell me about this woman who
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: the judge amazingly says, Oh, she's just naive? Really, what
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: can you tell me about them trying to reach the
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: mom and dad of the little boy victims.
• 3:38
  Speaker 4: Well, she sent them a letter after she was convicted,
• 3:43
  Speaker 4: and they had previously expressed a desire not to be
• 3:45
  Speaker 4: contacted by her.
• 3:46
  Speaker 5: Well, aim, when you're exactly correct. Listen, Nancy and Kareem
• 3:50
  Speaker 5: Eskinder endured the Denzil. They're two boys hitting killed by
• 3:53
  Speaker 5: social aite Rebecca Grossman speeding through the streets. Now, they
• 3:56
  Speaker 5: claim Grossman is writing them from jail after receiving a
• 3:59
  Speaker 5: love from grosswand on March thirteenth, the Eskinders reach out
• 4:02
  Speaker 5: to the county, asking.
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: Officials to put a stop to it. You know, very curious.
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: Do we know aimon what she's writing about?
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: Now? This is after the victim's parents specifically say go away, woman,
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: leave us alone. Yes, she writes them to say what
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: she had a chance to apologize already.
• 4:26
  Speaker 4: We're not sure what the letter said. It hasn't been
• 4:30
  Speaker 4: made public. The judge did order her not to have
• 4:34
  Speaker 4: any more contact, so we don't know at this point
• 4:39
  Speaker 4: what she said to to Nancy and Kareema Scander.
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: Take a listen to how this young mom describes the
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: moment she finds son, Jacob.
• 4:49
  Speaker 6: His mother described finding Jacob near the curb. Dori say
• 4:52
  Speaker 6: he was thrown about fifty feet in the collision. She
• 4:55
  Speaker 6: said it looked like he was sleeping, and she put
• 4:57
  Speaker 6: her ear to his chest and heard his heart beating.
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  Speaker 6: He was taking to the hospital, where he was pronounced
• 5:01
  Speaker 6: dead a few hours later. Mark was two hundred and
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  Speaker 6: fifty four feet away, a distance a deputy who specializes
• 5:06
  Speaker 6: in crash incidents previously testified was the farthest he has
• 5:09
  Speaker 6: known a human to be tossed in a crash. His
• 5:11
  Speaker 6: mother said his body was crumpled and he had blood
• 5:14
  Speaker 6: pouring out of his nose. He was pronounced dead of
• 5:16
  Speaker 6: the scene straight.
• 5:17
  Speaker 2: Back to Aman Murphy joining us from the acorn. Tell
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: me about what happened the day that these two little
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: boys were mowed down by socialite Rebecca Grossman. Well.
• 5:28
  Speaker 4: It was September twenty twenty and the family had gone
• 5:32
  Speaker 4: out to take a walk along the lake in Westlake
• 5:35
  Speaker 4: Village where they lived. It was covid, so they were
• 5:39
  Speaker 4: out getting some air. Nancy Ascander and her three sons
• 5:44
  Speaker 4: and went to cross the street towards the lake. Her
• 5:48
  Speaker 4: husband and their baby daughter had proceeded down the street further,
• 5:51
  Speaker 4: so they were separate at that point. While Nancy and
• 5:55
  Speaker 4: her sons were crossing the street, Nancy was in front
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  Speaker 4: with her youngest boy, and the two older boys, Mark
• 6:01
  Speaker 4: and Jacob were behind them in the crosswalk. As Nancy
• 6:09
  Speaker 4: got towards the curb in the second two lanes of traffic,
• 6:14
  Speaker 4: because it's a four lane divided road, two SUVs came
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  Speaker 4: roaring up the road, a black and a white. The
• 6:22
  Speaker 4: black was in front. She said they were zigzagging as
• 6:25
  Speaker 4: if they were playing or racing. She grabbed her youngest
• 6:28
  Speaker 4: boy and dove out of the way of the first car,
• 6:31
  Speaker 4: the black car, and then the white car went through,
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  Speaker 4: and she turned and saw that Mark and Jacob were gone.
• 6:40
  Speaker 4: And Mark had been struck and was fifty feet forward,
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  Speaker 4: and Jacob was sorry. Mark was two hundred and fifty
• 6:51
  Speaker 4: feet and Jacob was fifty feet and Jacob died at
• 6:57
  Speaker 4: the hospital and Mark died at the scene.
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: An ulstar panel and makes sense of what we know
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  Speaker 2: right now to doctor jan Gorniac joining us, Doctor Gorniac,
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  Speaker 2: Board certified forensic pathologist, renowned medical examiner for a medical
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: examiner Clark County, that's Vegas. Doctor Garniac has always such
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: an honor to have you on with us. Thank you
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: for taking time to be with us and address this case.
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: For a child to be thrown two hundred and fifty
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: four feet through the air, another child fifty feet one
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  Speaker 2: of them was on the hood of the car for
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: a period of time, the internal injuries had to be horrific.
• 7:45
  Speaker 7: Yes, just looking at the vehicle, you see how much
• 7:49
  Speaker 7: damage is to the vehicle, and that's from impact to
• 7:53
  Speaker 7: the children, you know, horrifically. So I say that Jacob
• 7:58
  Speaker 7: was the one that was to the curb, Do I
• 8:01
  Speaker 7: have that correct? And so and he was, and so
• 8:06
  Speaker 7: he his mom Unfortunately this is so Sad could still
• 8:11
  Speaker 7: hear his heart beating and was taken to the hospital
• 8:14
  Speaker 7: where he was later pronounced dead.
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: So he I'm.
• 8:18
  Speaker 7: Just looking at the the height difference. So unlike an
• 8:23
  Speaker 7: adult getting hit by a car, right, you think more
• 8:26
  Speaker 7: lower impact to the body. So the height of these kids,
• 8:30
  Speaker 7: you're thinking more chest impact and more head impact. So Jacob,
• 8:36
  Speaker 7: who was close, he probably you know, didn't fly up
• 8:41
  Speaker 7: onto the hood like Mark did, and that's why he
• 8:44
  Speaker 7: traveled more. So he probably got more depending on what
• 8:49
  Speaker 7: part of the suv hit him. He could have been
• 8:52
  Speaker 7: tossed by like the front corner panel and tossed. Meanwhile,
• 8:57
  Speaker 7: Mark got up on the hood and you can actually
• 8:59
  Speaker 7: see the indentation on the hood, and then was carried
• 9:03
  Speaker 7: by the speed and then when he was tossed off,
• 9:06
  Speaker 7: he went that far. So I'm surmising head trauma, definitely,
• 9:11
  Speaker 7: chest trauma, internal injuries, fractures, multiple, multiple injuries. And unfortunately,
• 9:19
  Speaker 7: obviously this is the story that we're talking about today.
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: Taking a look at these two little boys out walking
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: with their mom and dad and sibling in their neighborhood
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  Speaker 2: and they never make it back home. Why because Rebecca
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: Grossman a wealthy socialite, plows them down with her Mercedes,
• 9:39
  Speaker 2: playing some kind of a drag racing game with her boyfriend.
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: Where was her husband? Long story short? What happens next? Listen?
• 9:47
  Speaker 5: Deputies reportedly catch up with the white Mercedes with significant
• 9:51
  Speaker 5: front end damage a third of a mile from the scene.
• 9:54
  Speaker 5: Behind the wheel is Rebecca Grossman. A deputy describes finding
• 9:57
  Speaker 5: the vehicle stopped at the curb, Engrossman saying she didn't
• 10:00
  Speaker 5: know why her airbag had been triggered. As Grossman speaks
• 10:03
  Speaker 5: to a nine to one to one operator, she's asked
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  Speaker 5: if she hit someone. Grossman can be heard saying, I
• 10:08
  Speaker 5: don't know what I hit.
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: But isn't it true?
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: To Amon Murphy joining us from the acorn, she actually
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: a riald.
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: Tried to blame.
• 10:17
  Speaker 2: The boyfriend and why was he hiding in the bushes
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  Speaker 2: watching everything?
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  Speaker 4: That was the whole defense was that the boyfriend's car,
• 10:25
  Speaker 4: the boyfriend being Scott Erickson, a former Major League Baseball pitcher,
• 10:29
  Speaker 4: that it was in fact his car that hit the boys.
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: First question, Yes, you think I care he was with
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: e MLB. I don't care.
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: I don't care who he is, I don't care if
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: he's Elvis Presley come back from the dead.
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: Okay, he's hiding in the bushes.
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: Why why do people hide amon because they're afraid? Okay,
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: why is he afraid because he knows they've done something wrong?
• 10:55
  Speaker 4: That's actually that was part of the defense, the hiding
• 10:57
  Speaker 4: in the bush's bit and it was a Grossman's daughter
• 11:01
  Speaker 4: who testified to that. Alexis Grossman said she saw Scott
• 11:05
  Speaker 4: Erickson hiding in the bushes. The prosecution disputed this, challenged
• 11:11
  Speaker 4: her account of that evening and the hiding in the
• 11:16
  Speaker 4: bushes was was no deputy reported or anybody reported seeing
• 11:21
  Speaker 4: anyone hiding in the bushes throughout the whole investigation. But
• 11:25
  Speaker 4: as part of the story that cast suspicion on Scott Erickson,
• 11:30
  Speaker 4: it was said by Rebecca Grossman's lawyers that he hid
• 11:33
  Speaker 4: in the bushes to watch the investigation and also went
• 11:36
  Speaker 4: back to confront Alexis Grossman saying, you know, don't tell
• 11:40
  Speaker 4: anybody about this, you know, threatening her and so on.
• 11:43
  Speaker 4: That was all part of the defense.
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: Okay, Well, let me ask you a couple more questions
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: regarding the boyfriend. Now, is the boyfriend also married like
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: Rebecca grossmayos I believe he's divorced. Okay, So then no,
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: I don't care who's cheating on, who, who's with who,
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: who's getting drunk at lunch. I don't care what they're
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: doing and their spare time. That's between her and her husband.
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: But when it comes to what happened after that, I
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: care crime stories with Nancy Grace. So that night, that night, tell.
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: Me aimon the cops come to her car, which is
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: now disabled because the air bag went off, And what
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: does she say, I didn't do it with the whole
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: front end of the car bashed in.
• 12:38
  Speaker 4: Well, she said that her airbag, she came around the
• 12:42
  Speaker 4: corner and the airbag went off, and that she didn't
• 12:45
  Speaker 4: know what she hit. So that that was her position
• 12:50
  Speaker 4: immediately afterwards, and the deputies had indicated to her that
• 12:55
  Speaker 4: there was an accident and there were perhaps children involved,
• 13:00
  Speaker 4: and she, you know, it was her position that she
• 13:02
  Speaker 4: hadn't seen, you know, what she had in the road
• 13:06
  Speaker 4: and that she didn't know why. Dera Beg went off.
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: Straight out to Matthew Mangino, joining US high profile lawyer,
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: former prosecutor, author of the Executioner's Toll, Get this crimes
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: arrest Trials appeals last meals and final words of the
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: executions of forty six people in the US. Okay, you
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: have me at last meals. The rest of that was
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: just fluff, that said Matthew Mangino. What is this woman thinking?
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: You know, first of all, point zero eight is typically
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: the legal limit throughout across our country.
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: Point zero eight.
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: Now, this woman had valium and booze in her system.
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: I'm going to go back to doctor Gorniack in just
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: a moment on this.
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: But man Gino, why don't we just mix those two together.
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: Shouldn't the blood alcohol be in hand when your act
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: also popping pels?
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: I mean, I don't get it. This woman has everything.
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: She and her husband created this wonderful burn clinic that's
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: done so much good. She's like the nonprofit queen of California.
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: She's got it all. Designer, this designer that you name it.
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: Why does she have to get drunk and high on
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: valume at lunch with her boyfriend and do this?
• 14:33
  Speaker 8: Well, Nancy, she's obviously a very selfish person as well.
• 14:37
  Speaker 8: You know, she's going to use alcohol and valume. She's
• 14:40
  Speaker 8: going to drive through a residential area at a high
• 14:43
  Speaker 8: rate to speed, maybe drag racing with her lover as
• 14:48
  Speaker 8: she goes to her home.
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: Mangino, what do you mean, maybe drag racing?
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: Just say it, man.
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: The witnesses say, she's weaving back in fourth The boyfriend,
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: the one they climb, hid in the bushes after the crash.
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: He's weaving back and forth, two cars, weaving back and
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: forth in a residential area. Her speed seventy three mph.
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: I call that drag racing. That's what I call that,
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: and that's against the law. So why are you so
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: timid about it? Say it, man, Speak the truth.
• 15:21
  Speaker 8: I'm sorry, Nancy.
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: Oh now you're still apologizing. Don't this woman killed two boys?
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: She did think about your child at age eight, at
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: age eleven?
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: I mean, no shame, no shamman, Gino. Why couldn't we
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: merge the alcohol with the valume?
• 15:43
  Speaker 8: Well, I don't know why. There couldn't be a relation
• 15:46
  Speaker 8: back test, so we know three hours later she's at
• 15:49
  Speaker 8: point zero eight. That means that if she hasn't had
• 15:53
  Speaker 8: any alcohol, which I would assume she wouldn't, you could
• 15:56
  Speaker 8: relate back. You know, with a toxic cology is to
• 16:00
  Speaker 8: show what her alcohol level might have been at the
• 16:03
  Speaker 8: time of the accident, and you mix that with valume.
• 16:06
  Speaker 8: At least in Pennsylvania where I practice, any drug in
• 16:10
  Speaker 8: your system that could impair you could result in a
• 16:14
  Speaker 8: DUI because there's no way of measuring the level of
• 16:18
  Speaker 8: valume or the level of marijuana to determine whether or
• 16:22
  Speaker 8: not that you are under the influence. So just any
• 16:26
  Speaker 8: trace of it in your blood is enough to charge
• 16:28
  Speaker 8: somebody with driving under Therey.
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: Matthew, you're a veteran trial lawyer, and I say that
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: with a great deal of respect, because you know, there's
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: a lot of lawyers that claim their trial lawyers because
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: they send interrogatories like written questions to the other side,
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: and then they write their answers, and then they send them.
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: Back and they go back.
• 16:49
  Speaker 2: I mean, you've been in the courtroom, duking it out,
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: getting hot, sweaty, dirty, bloody in the courtroom.
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: Trying a case on both sides. You know what.
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: This is what I've learned from my vehicular homicides. Point
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: zero eight typically put a mail at four drinks. Okay,
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: point zero eight equals four drinks for an adult, So
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: she's had four alcoholic drinks.
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: And I don't mean a beer, I mean hard liquor.
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: Plus the valuume.
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: She's out of her gourd and trying to drive in
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: her big fat Mercedes at seventy three miles an hour.
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: You know what, she probably didn't know what she hit.
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: Matthew, Yeah, she may not have.
• 17:45
  Speaker 8: I mean, she is impaired, and she's driving through a
• 17:49
  Speaker 8: residential neighborhood at a high rate of speed, drag racing
• 17:55
  Speaker 8: that ultimately, you know that, you know defense that I
• 18:00
  Speaker 8: don't know what I hit in my airbag deployed and
• 18:02
  Speaker 8: I continue driving and I never went back to see
• 18:06
  Speaker 8: what I hit. You know, all adds up to someone
• 18:08
  Speaker 8: who does know that they did something terribly wrong and
• 18:12
  Speaker 8: doesn't want to face that.
• 18:13
  Speaker 6: In the hours before the crash, Grossman has seen drinking
• 18:15
  Speaker 6: marguerite as the former Mets and Yankees pitcher Scott Erickson.
• 18:18
  Speaker 6: Grossman and Rickson were reportedly driving from Julio's restaurant in
• 18:21
  Speaker 6: separate SUVs. Police said the two sped closely together through
• 18:24
  Speaker 6: the crosswalk, with Ericson in the lead racing. Ericson is
• 18:27
  Speaker 6: charged with misdemeanor, but judge orders him to make a
• 18:29
  Speaker 6: public service announcement about the importance of safe driving with
• 18:32
  Speaker 6: a teenage audience in mind. His case wrapped in twenty
• 18:35
  Speaker 6: twenty two. Still Ericson's attorney maintains he wasn't racing or
• 18:38
  Speaker 6: driving recklessly and had no involvement in the hit and
• 18:40
  Speaker 6: run that killed the boys. Ericson's SUV shows no sign
• 18:43
  Speaker 6: of damage.
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: Okay, his suv shows no sign of damage to the boyfriend.
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: Hers is bashed in in the front, Yet she says
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: she didn't do it and tries to blame the boyfriend.
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: Guys.
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: The antics don't stop there. The dirty tactics of killer
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: socialite Rebecca Roastman all to try and get a new
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: trial go on. She mowed down to little boys while drunk,
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: and on there they are, and on valium. And as
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: far as drag racing or not drag racing, listen.
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: Two cars for racing.
• 19:23
  Speaker 3: We believe speed is a factor, alcohol is a factor.
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: You are hearing right there, Captain Salvador Bakara from the
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: La County Sheriff's Department.
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: That's our friends at NBCLA four.
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: A grown woman, a millionaire, drag racing drunk her Mercedes
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: joining me.
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: Audition to Karen Start.
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: Renowned psychologist is Robin Drake, behavior expert, former FBI special
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: agent and author of Sizing People Up, a veteran FBI
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: agent'cy manual for behavior prediction. Also, it's not all about me.
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: He've got a ton of awesome books. Wow, okay, I've
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: only got time to put out two of them, Robin Drake,
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: What is a grown woman married?
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: And I'm not the church lady.
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: If people want to run around, go go, I'd just
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: be mad if you didn't. But a grown woman with
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: everything she could possibly want ever, a family, a lovely family,
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: a husband, a philanthropist, a mansion, the Mercedes, the clothes.
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: The hair, the this, the that. I mean, what is.
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: A grown woman drunk on valium, flying at seventy three
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: mph through a residential neighborhood and mowing down these two boys.
• 20:49
  Speaker 9: Well you said she's a grown woman, but she's not.
• 20:51
  Speaker 9: I mean, our first impressions we get when we hear
• 20:54
  Speaker 9: the stories like this that fill us her with rage
• 20:56
  Speaker 9: is exactly what we saw. We saw a drunk teenage
• 21:00
  Speaker 9: because that's when her development stopped, I think. And she's
• 21:03
  Speaker 9: chasing happiness through her life, and happiness she thinks is
• 21:06
  Speaker 9: through materialism, and so she keeps chasing it. She's caught
• 21:09
  Speaker 9: up in the cult of more to the disease of comparison,
• 21:11
  Speaker 9: and the tragedy came because of her being a drunk teenager.
• 21:15
  Speaker 9: It's really plain and simple because all her behaviors from
• 21:17
  Speaker 9: that point are exactly the same. It's me, me, Me.
• 21:21
  Speaker 9: Even that letter that she sent to the family that
• 21:23
  Speaker 9: she wasn't supposed to, I guarantee you if we had
• 21:26
  Speaker 9: a copy of that, it would be all about her.
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: Okay, Robin Drake, I'm totally with you, except when you
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: say she's a junk teenager. Everybody in this studio and
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: huh what Okay, because that's kind of letting her off
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: the hook.
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: She's not a teenager.
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: She's a fifty something year old woman. She's gorgeous. She
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: has this everything you could possibly want in life, all right,
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: and calling her even if you think her her development
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: stopped as a team, it didn't. This woman is at
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: one charity ball after the next in designer clothes.
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: Karen Stark, can you help me because I obviously was
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: not clear in my question to Robert Drink, former FBI
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: I expected something different from him.
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna let him think about what he said.
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: Karen Stark Renow TV radio trauma expert at Karenstark dot com.
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: Karen joining us today from Manhattan helped me, Karen, what
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: is it? What the more all your dreams come true,
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: the more your prayers are answered, the wors she become.
• 22:26
  Speaker 2: That's completely bast ackwards and then trying to pin it
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: on the boyfriend, Nancy. She's a narcissist. She's not a teenager.
• 22:34
  Speaker 10: I'm sorry to say, but she really is a narcissist
• 22:37
  Speaker 10: who only thinks about herself. Think about what she said.
• 22:40
  Speaker 10: Even with the jury, they're not a good jury. Why
• 22:43
  Speaker 10: are they not a good jury? Because I can already
• 22:45
  Speaker 10: tell they're not going to be on my side. And
• 22:48
  Speaker 10: you bet that what she wrote to that family, which
• 22:51
  Speaker 10: she wasn't supposed to write, was all of that mouse.
• 22:54
  Speaker 10: She didn't mean it, She couldn't have done it. She
• 22:57
  Speaker 10: didn't know, and yet she knew. She hit so thing.
• 23:00
  Speaker 10: I don't know what I hit, but I hit something.
• 23:03
  Speaker 10: She's totally responsible for what happened.
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: Karen, Please come down out of your ivory tower for
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: just one moment. I know she's responsible. I'm saying, what,
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: why does she do this? What is her behavior?
• 23:20
  Speaker 8: Why?
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: I don't understand it?
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: Because I have this plat I guess you would call
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: it sits on our kitchen island. And you know what
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: it says. It says I remember what I prayed for,
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: the things I have now, my husband, my family, my
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: mom is still with me.
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: Hell, this incredible job, so many blessings.
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: I see that every single morning.
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: But it seems like some people get all these prayers answered,
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: all these blessings, and they just gobble it up and
• 23:56
  Speaker 2: keep gobbling it up at everyone else's expense. And even
• 24:00
  Speaker 2: now that she's convicted, she's trying to get somebody to
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: get to the judge, to influence the judge in this case,
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: trying to contact the Gurrrs and Kara Start. I learned
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: about this as a prosecutor. The defense will send out
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: their own PI private investigator, and they won't tell the
• 24:20
  Speaker 2: witness or the gurror or the whoever I work for
• 24:23
  Speaker 2: the defense. They go, hey, I'm a private investigator working
• 24:26
  Speaker 2: on the case of Blah, and then they'll try to
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: get information out of the target. A lot of these
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: people said, we didn't even know who we were talking to.
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: They didn't identify they were working for her. Rebecca Grosberg,
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: I just explain to me what this behavior is even
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: now trying to manipulate the system.
• 24:49
  Speaker 10: I know it's hard to believe Nancy, but she doesn't
• 24:52
  Speaker 10: care about anyone but herself. Yes, she has everything in
• 24:56
  Speaker 10: the world, and you're grateful, and I like to think
• 25:00
  Speaker 10: I am really grateful, But she could care less because
• 25:03
  Speaker 10: she believes she's entitled to have what she has, and
• 25:08
  Speaker 10: she's entitled to get away with this and say that
• 25:11
  Speaker 10: she's innocent and influence the jurors and have it be
• 25:15
  Speaker 10: all about her, not what she did. She doesn't care
• 25:20
  Speaker 10: what she did. She's going to make sure that she's
• 25:23
  Speaker 10: going to get off and be okay.
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: Crime stores with Nancy Grace.
• 25:37
  Speaker 6: Prosecutors fear Grossman maybe using her phone privileges to find
• 25:41
  Speaker 6: someone to get to Judge Joseph Brandolino to convince the
• 25:43
  Speaker 6: judge to give her a new trial. Prosecutors say the
• 25:46
  Speaker 6: recorded calls document potential criminal conspiracies, such as requested as
• 25:50
  Speaker 6: close protected discovery, discussions of various attempts to interfere with
• 25:53
  Speaker 6: witnesses and their testimony. In one call, Grossman tells her
• 25:57
  Speaker 6: husband to talk to her ex lover, former major league
• 25:59
  Speaker 6: pitcher Scott Ericson. On the recording call, February twenty fifth,
• 26:02
  Speaker 6: Rebecca Grossman tells her husband to quote call Scott ericson
• 26:05
  Speaker 6: and tell him to get on a video and that
• 26:07
  Speaker 6: he needs to confess.
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: Aimon Murphy, an investigative reporter writer for the Acorn News,
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: aimen again, thank you for being with us.
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: What did I just hear?
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: She actually is trying to suborn perjury and nobody's doing
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: anything trying to get the boyfriend to make.
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: A video or what catch him on video.
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: Or record him on the phone, trying to get him
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: to claim he's the one that mowed down the little boys.
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: That's suborning perjury.
• 26:39
  Speaker 4: Well, the judge addressed that in court. His position was
• 26:42
  Speaker 4: they weren't asking Scott Erickson to do anything that they
• 26:46
  Speaker 4: didn't think was true.
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: That's what the judge said.
• 26:49
  Speaker 2: Wait wait, whit whit whit whit Wait wait hold on, amen,
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: I'm having a hard time ingesting what you're just saying.
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: Is this the same judge that sat through the jury trial?
• 26:57
  Speaker 4: Yes, same judge.
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: Okay, so he knows that it was Rebecca Grossman that
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: mowed down the two little boys.
• 27:04
  Speaker 4: Yes, no, well he knows that that was what the
• 27:06
  Speaker 4: jury found.
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: He didn't see that picture that I just saw of
• 27:10
  Speaker 2: the front end of her white Mercedes bashed in from a.
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: Little boy getting run down. He didn't see that.
• 27:15
  Speaker 4: He saw that, and more he heard from experts talking
• 27:18
  Speaker 4: about how the impact matched the position of the boys,
• 27:22
  Speaker 4: even how the pattern on the grill matched wounds on
• 27:26
  Speaker 4: one of the boys.
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: So he heard all about that. Okay, I'm going to
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: ask a tough question, Amon Murphy. So the judge saw that.
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: The judge heard the testimony. The judge, you noticed what
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: the jury said.
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: But this judge actually stated with a straight face, well,
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: trying to get her boyfriend to say.
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: He really ran the boys down, that's not.
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: Really suborning perjury because she thinks they think it's true.
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: It's not true. It is suborning perjury. Why is this
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: judge beaming over.
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: Backwards, contorting the facts and the law and Rebecca Grossmand's favor.
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: Why, Aimen, I.
• 28:08
  Speaker 4: Mean, I can't speculate about, you know, what's going on
• 28:11
  Speaker 4: in the judge's head. I think throughout the process that
• 28:14
  Speaker 4: I've seen, he's been at pains to be very even
• 28:21
  Speaker 4: handed in the sense of ensuring a process that is
• 28:25
  Speaker 4: totally fair and you know, would hold up on appeal
• 28:29
  Speaker 4: to be really frank, because now we do have emotion
• 28:32
  Speaker 4: for a new trial, which is not an appeal, but
• 28:35
  Speaker 4: it is an attempt to question the process that led
• 28:39
  Speaker 4: to the conviction, and all of it is being questioned
• 28:42
  Speaker 4: by her new lawyers. So the judge, I think, wanted
• 28:45
  Speaker 4: to make sure all the boxes were checked, you know,
• 28:47
  Speaker 4: all the eyes dotted, all the tea's crossed.
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: Well, is it true?
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: Also, Aimon Murphy from the Acorn that he kind of
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: wrote off all of her behavior.
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: And this is not just her.
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: Somebody's on the other end of that phone, that jail
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: phone that is recording FYI, somebody's going along with it,
• 29:07
  Speaker 2: aid a betting, encouraging her, responding to her. That is
• 29:13
  Speaker 2: what we call under the law, Matthew Mangino, a conspiracy
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: to commit a crime when you have someone colluding and
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: aiding and a betting encouraging that's conspiring to do a
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: bad thing. This woman is convicted of a double vehicular
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: homicide and now she's trying to get her ex lover
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: to go on video and say okay, I did it.
• 29:40
  Speaker 2: That is the borning perjury, Mangino. Why is a judge
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: dancing around it like a ballet artist.
• 29:46
  Speaker 8: Well, The first thing that's most appalling is that she
• 29:50
  Speaker 8: was able to contact the victims in this case. Normally
• 29:54
  Speaker 8: after conviction, and even when you're on bell there's a
• 29:57
  Speaker 8: no contact order, you can't reach out contact the victims
• 30:01
  Speaker 8: as a defendant directly. The issue with regard to talking
• 30:06
  Speaker 8: to jurors, that's common. Private investigator is going to talk
• 30:09
  Speaker 8: to jurors.
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: Unless they're trying to get them to claim misdoing, like
• 30:14
  Speaker 2: an Alex murdog and trying to get a new try.
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: And you think that's okay. No, it's not okay.
• 30:18
  Speaker 8: But it's not necessarily inappropriate to reach out to jurors
• 30:23
  Speaker 8: after a case. But what is inappropriate and illegal is
• 30:27
  Speaker 8: to try to influence the outcome of your appeal by
• 30:31
  Speaker 8: number one, trying to seek someone to talk to the judge.
• 30:34
  Speaker 8: Number two, by trying to influence witnesses in some way
• 30:39
  Speaker 8: and trying to have someone confess that you know is
• 30:45
  Speaker 8: not guilty, have that person confess to the crime. I
• 30:48
  Speaker 8: think it's a wild idea and no one's going to
• 30:51
  Speaker 8: do it.
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: Still suborning perjury.
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: Can you just say yes, no, Matthew Mangino, I don't
• 30:56
  Speaker 2: know why am I saying inappropriate it's more than in
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: a it's suborning perjury. You're trying to get someone to
• 31:04
  Speaker 2: lie about what happened and submit it, show it to
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: the court.
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: Matthew Mangino.
• 31:12
  Speaker 2: The jury has spoken, the judge knows what happened, and
• 31:17
  Speaker 2: now this woman is trying to get a new trial
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: based on perjured testimony.
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: Is that not suborning perjury? Matthew You, well, it would be.
• 31:26
  Speaker 8: But Nancy, the idea here, and this is where I
• 31:29
  Speaker 8: think the judge is talking maybe about being naive. Do
• 31:33
  Speaker 8: you think someone is going to come forward and confess
• 31:35
  Speaker 8: to killing two children because your husband?
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: No, I don't you know what I think.
• 31:41
  Speaker 2: I think that some people for the right amount of
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: money a million dollars and knowing that they would be
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: acquitted at trial if the boyfriend went on trial.
• 31:52
  Speaker 1: Let's just get real. What about a drake.
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: If the boyfriend goes on trial, If the boyfriend does
• 31:57
  Speaker 2: this video that she's asking him to do, and he
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: just goes on trial, okay, or her case gets reversed
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: because of it new evidence, he's going to get acquitted
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: because all his lawyers got to do is say, hey,
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: they already convicted her. Siam and they'll let him go too.
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: Under those circumstances, he might do it.
• 32:20
  Speaker 9: Yeah.
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: Maybe. And I don't like any of this having to
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: do with the judge. I don't like any of it
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: having to.
• 32:25
  Speaker 9: Do with the fact that hal Com it took them
• 32:26
  Speaker 9: three hours for law enforcement to give her to blog
• 32:29
  Speaker 9: alcohol test. I just don't like the look of all
• 32:31
  Speaker 9: the confirmation bias in her favor going on here. So
• 32:35
  Speaker 9: I'm I don't put it by it. I don't think
• 32:37
  Speaker 9: it was naivitate at all. I think it was completely
• 32:40
  Speaker 9: her trying to subvert the system for her own benefit.
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: I'll tell you my theory.
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: My theory is Robin Drake that Rebecca Grossman and her
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: husband are wealthy.
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: They're millionaires with high social standing versus the scanders.
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: Who are nowhere, nowhere in money, in power, in prestige
• 33:19
  Speaker 2: that the Grossmans have, and so everybody is bending over
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: backwards to help the Grossman's. She is behind bars, trying
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: to get her friends to influence the judge, trying to
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: reach the jurors to do what recan't say that they
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: that was not a true verdict, change their minds post
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: a verdict, trying to suborn perjury, and nothing is happening.
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: In fact, the judge actually calls her, quote naive, help me, Dreek,
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: this is BS.
• 33:58
  Speaker 9: I totally agree, Nancy, And whenever we see a behavior
• 34:01
  Speaker 9: like this, it's very rarely the first time the behavior
• 34:04
  Speaker 9: has happened. And so I think they just have in
• 34:06
  Speaker 9: this area with that kind of affluence, they probably have
• 34:09
  Speaker 9: a reputation and a lifetime of reps, as I call them,
• 34:13
  Speaker 9: of doing just this kind of thing, having favoritism towards
• 34:16
  Speaker 9: this part of society. And I think it's incredibly unjust
• 34:19
  Speaker 9: two little boys who were murdered by her, complete narcissistic negligence.
• 34:25
  Speaker 6: When Rebecca Grossman adds defense attorney James Furtis to our
• 34:28
  Speaker 6: team the prosecution of Jack's over a possible conflict of interest,
• 34:32
  Speaker 6: as Spurtis currently represents Diana Taran from the Los Angeles
• 34:36
  Speaker 6: District Attorney's Office. Tiranas charged with eleven felonies for allegedly
• 34:40
  Speaker 6: misusing confidential law enforcement records, but before she was charged
• 34:44
  Speaker 6: with those crimes, she oversaw the prosecutors Engrossman's second degree
• 34:48
  Speaker 6: murder trial. Because of this, the DA reassigned the prosecutors
• 34:52
  Speaker 6: from the case due to a potential conflict of interest
• 34:55
  Speaker 6: straight out.
• 34:56
  Speaker 2: To a special guest joining us Aimon from Acorn Murphy.
• 35:01
  Speaker 2: What exactly is the alleged conflict of interest that could
• 35:05
  Speaker 2: result in a new trial for Rebecca Grossman.
• 35:08
  Speaker 4: Well, it's not that the conflict would result in a
• 35:11
  Speaker 4: new trial. It's more that it could be an issue
• 35:13
  Speaker 4: on appeal. The conflict is that James Burtis, her new lawyer,
• 35:18
  Speaker 4: also represents Diana Turan, who was an assistant district attorney
• 35:22
  Speaker 4: supervising the prosecution of Rebecca Grossman. So at first the
• 35:27
  Speaker 4: prosecutors filed emotion saying this is a potential conflict because
• 35:33
  Speaker 4: he's representing a defendant who was prosecuted by a team
• 35:37
  Speaker 4: that she oversaw. Then they looked into it further and
• 35:41
  Speaker 4: they filed emotion earlier this month saying there's an actual
• 35:44
  Speaker 4: conflict here because when James Burtis prepares a motion for
• 35:48
  Speaker 4: a new trial, one argument he might make is prosecutorial
• 35:51
  Speaker 4: misconduct that would require him impugning the work of his
• 35:56
  Speaker 4: other client. So that's a conflict for her Diana Turan.
• 36:00
  Speaker 4: And if he doesn't do that on appeal, Rebecca Grossman
• 36:03
  Speaker 4: could claim, well, he didn't do that because he was
• 36:05
  Speaker 4: representing Diana Turenn, and he didn't want to call her
• 36:08
  Speaker 4: work into question.
• 36:09
  Speaker 2: The judge has just ruled there is no conflict of
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: interest in Grossman's case after she hired a lawyer who
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: also That lawyer also represents a woman who used to
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: work for the DA's office, and that woman oversaw the trial.
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: So there is a lawyer that represents a form a prosecutor.
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: That prosecutor has now caught some charges. That prosecutor worked
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: on Grossman's prosecution. Okay, So Grossman goes and hires the
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: lawyer for the prosecutor. That's her decision. She knows about
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: the conflict and she's waiving the conflict by hiring that lawyer.
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: Correct.
• 37:06
  Speaker 4: The judge didn't find an actual conflict. He did have
• 37:10
  Speaker 4: her wave the potential conflict so that it won't come
• 37:14
  Speaker 4: up as an appeal issue. The charges against Diana Turenn
• 37:18
  Speaker 4: were announced about a month after James Burtis became attorney
• 37:21
  Speaker 4: of record for Rebecca Grossman, so she was not charged
• 37:26
  Speaker 4: at that point when he joined Rebecca Grossman's team, but
• 37:31
  Speaker 4: his firm had represented her in the past in another matter,
• 37:35
  Speaker 4: and the judge said, you know, these cases are not related,
• 37:37
  Speaker 4: so we don't have an actual conflict, but out of
• 37:40
  Speaker 4: an abundance of caution, we'll have the defendant waive this
• 37:44
  Speaker 4: as a potential issue so she can't bring it up
• 37:46
  Speaker 4: down the road.
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: Just more heartache for the victim's parents. We wait as
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: justice unfolds, and we stopped to remember American hero Deputy
• 37:57
  Speaker 2: share of David Bosker, shot and killed in the line
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: of duty. Deputy Bosker, a US Marine veteran twenty one
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: years in law enforcement, survived by grieving wife Brenda and
• 38:13
  Speaker 2: stepson John. American hero Deputy Sheriff David Bosker. Thank you
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: to all of our guests for being with us tonight,
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: but especially to you for joining with us. Nancy Gray
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: signing off, good night friend,