Latest / Rusty's Garage / Mark Winterbottom Part 1: “Blindsided” by Team 18 departure, back to Tickford and the Shanghai grate incident

Transcript

Mark Winterbottom Part 1: “Blindsided” by Team 18 departure, back to Tickford and the Shanghai grate incident · Rusty's Garage

• 0:02
  A listener production.
• 0:14
  I'm automotive commentator and journalist Greg Rust and this is Rusty's Garage.
• 0:27
  For this episode, I'm in the listener studios in Melbourne.
• 0:30
  Mark Winterbottom is coming in to talk with us.
• 0:32
  He's just returned from a very memorable Adelaide 500, one where the sport paused to celebrate his career before his final full-time race.
• 0:43
  We have had some great TV chats over the years, but not like this one.
• 0:48
  From the respect that he's garnered in the pit lane, the highs, lows, why he's so excited for the next phase, and the chance to work with some rising stars.
• 0:57
  We'll talk Brazilian stock car racing and memories of the wild nature of things there, both on and off the track,
• 1:04
  and how close he came to relocating to that side of the pond to pursue more of it.
• 1:09
  How difficult it was to make the transition to a Camaro after so long with the blue oval and how that blue blood in his veins never really drained away.
• 1:19
  Keep in mind, this is Mark in his words, and Team 18 aren't here to talk about their side or view of his departure.
• 1:26
  It's a feature-length one-on-one conversation with Frosty.
• 1:29
  And as always, he is a total professional.
• 1:32
  But you'll get a sense of how difficult it's been to process, and his perspective on it now with a little bit of time.
• 1:39
  From the 2015 title win to an epic battle with Jamie Wincup on the way to winning the great race, Bathurst in 2013.
• 1:47
  And there is much more too.
• 1:49
  He talks about driving for Larco, the Shanghai tin opener, his time in carts, Formula Ford, and he answers some of your questions too.
• 1:57
  Thank you to our listeners for sending those through.
• 2:00
  Enjoy being a part of the Convo with Mark Winterbottom.
• 2:03
  It is an overdue addition to The Garage.
• 2:08
  Hello, mate.
• 2:08
  How are you?
• 2:09
  I'm very well.
• 2:10
  They tell me you've been clearing out the locker today, have you?
• 2:14
  Far out.
• 2:15
  I've never really done that before.
• 2:16
  Actually, I did at Tickford, but I had a lot of stuff there after 13 years.
• 2:20
  But yeah, it's funny, all the little things, your earpieces and then all the bits of memorabilia people gave you over the weekend, photos and all that sort of stuff.
• 2:30
  So I kind of put it all in my bag.
• 2:32
  So it's a bit sad.
• 2:33
  My whole racing life fits in one bag, effectively.
• 2:36
  But yeah.
• 2:37
  Yeah, I've got my stuff now and I'm loaded and in transition effectively.
• 2:41
  Amazing.
• 2:42
  You have conducted yourself, I think, amazingly during this whole period.
• 2:46
  What have those last few weeks been like, right?
• 2:49
  Like is it the kind of deal where you –
• 2:51
  You run on adrenaline because you're going from thing to thing to thing, so you probably don't stop to take it all in too much.
• 3:00
  But is it starting to sink in now, and how does that feel that you're not doing full-time anymore?
• 3:05
  You're still going to drive, which is great, but not full-time.
• 3:07
  Yeah.
• 3:07
  Uh, the last couple of weeks was, was crazy because, um, it got busy, like busier than ever.
• 3:12
  And I got to thank Renee, my wife, like she, um, she's worn out the poor thing.
• 3:18
  She does so much because I think when you're racing, you've still got this, um, I'm
• 3:22
  I don't like drive to succeed, you know, like you go to Adelaide, I'm there to compete.
• 3:27
  But then the secondary thing is probably the more important part effectively is your end of your chapter.
• 3:32
  So she looked after majority of it and helped, um, put all the photos together and all the social stuff.
• 3:38
  And, um, she kind of created.
• 3:40
  She timed some beautiful pieces together, didn't she?
• 3:42
  She created a lot of work because she said, I'll send some stuff in and then hundreds and hundreds of photos coming, which were really cool.
• 3:49
  And.
• 3:49
  That's awesome.
• 3:50
  Um, that kind of got me emotional before the weekend, seeing all them.
• 3:53
  And then she actually did a video for me from, um, some colleagues I'd worked with, um, some good friends and then my kids.
• 4:00
  And that was, that broke me.
• 4:01
  I'm this super strong Westie ego bloke that like was in tears effectively listening to my boys, um, wording.
• 4:09
  So emotional going in.
• 4:11
  Um, and then in race mode was.
• 4:14
  I don't know, you get this, don't distract me, let me race.
• 4:17
  And then the send-off that supercars did, I'm really grateful for.
• 4:21
  You know, I think that you don't want to be centre of attention and stuff.
• 4:25
  I'm not one of those attention seekers, but that walk down pit lane with Slady as well and seeing...
• 4:30
  some of your hardest enemies that you've raced against.
• 4:33
  In a guard of honour, mate.
• 4:34
  In a guard of honour.
• 4:35
  That's a lot about you.
• 4:36
  That was really touching.
• 4:37
  So I really love the send-off.
• 4:39
  And then Monday night they did a really, really nice piece at the gala.
• 4:41
  So, you know, I think, you know, the way Supercar's handled, I'm so grateful for the send-off that I got.
• 4:48
  So I'm feeling really relieved now that all that stuff's done and we handled it like we've had our old career, which is,
• 4:58
  you know, at the forefront, like just be professional and be the person you are.
• 5:01
  And I thought that reflected really well.
• 5:03
  And I'm happy.
• 5:04
  I'm really happy now.
• 5:06
  You could tell the way it resonated too, Mark, because I mean, even Craig Bear doesn't often chime in on socials.
• 5:13
  There's a really nice comment from him somewhere too about the person that you are and how it, you know, sort of reflected or summed it up, didn't it?
• 5:20
  Yeah, he was good.
• 5:21
  He sent me a message and
• 5:22
  Um, he's by far the best, um, DSO we've ever had because you go in there, you can't bullshit.
• 5:29
  Like you go in there and you're like, I'm guilty.
• 5:31
  How am I going to get around this?
• 5:32
  And I used to go in there and he'd say, Hey, and I, yeah, I'm done.
• 5:35
  And he respected that honesty because we all go in there trying to plead innocent when 99% of the time we're guilty.
• 5:43
  Um, but he would ask me sometimes, you know, if it's wet, he'd come to me, Hey, is it
• 5:47
  Is it safe enough?
• 5:48
  Is it?
• 5:49
  Um, so I had this really, I knew I had respect from him, um, and it goes both ways, but, um, yeah, it's really nice.
• 5:56
  Those people that I guess you don't know, you know, they respect you, but when you finish it.
• 6:02
  you really know who respects you and who doesn't, you know, and it was, he sent me really, really nice messages.
• 6:06
  And, um, he was one of many, I've got really nice messages.
• 6:10
  That's why I feel good now.
• 6:11
  It's like, you're done a bit with that side.
• 6:14
  You can relax, let your hair down.
• 6:16
  Not that I got as much as I used to let your hair down and, um, just enjoy it because it's a celebration, not, not a disappointment to finish.
• 6:24
  I see it as a celebration and I'm trying to,
• 6:26
  yeah, enjoy it for what it was.
• 6:28
  And the send-off and the messages was as good as it could be for me.
• 6:32
  That sat really well.
• 6:33
  Excellent.
• 6:33
  You brought up René there before.
• 6:34
  Kids and family are a great support invariably in these moments, right, and probably a welcome distraction too.
• 6:41
  What was the kids' reaction?
• 6:42
  Because, you know, for their lives, all they've known is Dad going to work in a race car, haven't they?
• 6:48
  Yeah, well, um, I've got generations.
• 6:50
  So I've got 13, 11 and a five-year-old.
• 6:52
  So the 13 and 11 year olds saw me win Bathurst.
• 6:55
  They were young, but they were there for that moment.
• 6:58
  They saw me win the championship.
• 6:59
  The five-year-old's only seen me win Darwin.
• 7:01
  So he thinks he doesn't think I'm very good.
• 7:04
  Um, but the other two, they've been on the journey, you know, and that's, um, that the family play a huge part.
• 7:09
  People don't see that in any sport.
• 7:11
  You know, we get judged on on-track results, but when we go home, if you're in a good mood,
• 7:17
  household's happy.
• 7:18
  If you're in a bad mood, they're the ones that bring you back because they're an honest filter.
• 7:22
  They don't, you know, I've, I've been very lucky with Renee and the kids.
• 7:25
  They don't fluff you up.
• 7:26
  They're not fluffers.
• 7:27
  They're like the sort of people that go, well, you stuffed up.
• 7:30
  So that's how it is.
• 7:32
  And I've, I've lived by that, which I really love.
• 7:35
  But, um, you know, Oliver, my oldest, he, him and I are very, very close and he learned to read timing sheets before he learned to read books.
• 7:43
  You know, he,
• 7:44
  understand sectors.
• 7:45
  He tells me like we, he used to come to the track with me, um, you know, seven o'clock in the morning, right.
• 7:51
  I'm going with dad from a, from a young age, you know?
• 7:54
  Um, and then he'd sit there, dad, you're slow in the first sector, dad, you're good in the, he, he's been my little guy.
• 8:00
  And that, that's the message he gave me.
• 8:02
  I love that.
• 8:02
  Was on that video is what made me really get teary because everything he said, it's not just words.
• 8:08
  I hate words, but he backs it up with his actions through his whole life.
• 8:11
  And, um,
• 8:13
  People can find that, but for those who haven't seen it, recount that for them.
• 8:16
  Yeah, it was, well, oh, it was just a personal video that Rene, yeah, Rene did for me.
• 8:20
  And he said, you know, thank you.
• 8:22
  Dad, I remember that moment we stood out in the rain and put tyre bags over our head.
• 8:26
  And I remember when you got this purple sector at Townsville and you won both races in 15.
• 8:31
  And I remember, you know, he just remembers the moments.
• 8:33
  And that's really cool.
• 8:35
  Yeah.
• 8:37
  They've been really good.
• 8:38
  Like they're sporty, but at the same time, they're happy to have dad back, you know?
• 8:41
  And that's, that's what I love about it because you're not sick.
• 8:45
  You're, your life's ahead of you.
• 8:47
  Your racing career may have stopped, but the next chapter opens and, um, they're making their own little careers and, um.
• 8:55
  They're great.
• 8:55
  My family is really good.
• 8:56
  And that's, you need good people around you when you're not down, but looking for that next chapter and my life's just starting.
• 9:04
  So I'm lucky.
• 9:05
  I've got a good family.
• 9:06
  Good.
• 9:06
  I want to come to the good stuff and the next chapter in a second.
• 9:10
  You have maintained in the way you've just described there before, right?
• 9:13
  This very professional approach throughout the whole deal.
• 9:16
  So don't, don't.
• 9:17
  expand if you don't want to.
• 9:18
  It did feel like you were blindsided, mate.
• 9:20
  How do you feel in the processing of all that now?
• 9:24
  And, you know, did it, it sounded as though you felt as though you'd be staying and it was more or less sorted and it caught you by surprise.
• 9:32
  Yeah, it did.
• 9:34
  And, you know, I think when, the thing that upset me was when I went to that team, I
• 9:40
  Um, you know, I, I did a lot to go there because I had a really good gig at Tickford.
• 9:45
  I had a good car and a team that could win.
• 9:47
  And I gave that up to go to a team that I built from scratch effectively.
• 9:51
  When I joined, it was, they were last, they were one car and they were literally last, um, on the grid.
• 9:56
  And I remember like people were, you know, what are you doing?
• 9:59
  But I was looking for that new challenge, but at the same time, um,
• 10:04
  you know, you got told the dream of what you were going there for.
• 10:07
  And I, and I thought I gave a profile and we moved to two cars and got crew in that weren't probably going to come and tried to build that team up.
• 10:15
  Um, and you know, I was told that I had a deal for next year and that's, um, to me words, handshakes, whatever, they're the same thing.
• 10:24
  But you know, you learn that pen to paper is when it actually becomes official, I guess, but, um,
• 10:30
  Yeah, I was told 100% I had the gig.
• 10:32
  We're only talking about whether it was one or two years.
• 10:34
  That was what we were discussing and, yeah, got blindsided.
• 10:37
  So, yeah, I was disappointed because of how much I put into it because as a driver, contractually, you go there as take your helmet, take your raised gloves and boots and, yeah.
• 10:50
  There's a lap time, do a good job, we'll re-sign you again.
• 10:53
  You don't have to do the stuff that I did, but I invested a lot of time and stuff that I didn't have to do, um, to try and make that team better and be part of the journey.
• 11:03
  Um, and I think, yeah, I just didn't feel, didn't finish well for me.
• 11:09
  Um, and you know, what was said and what was delivered was two different things, but
• 11:13
  Um, you know, doors closed, doors open.
• 11:15
  You got to look at a game.
• 11:17
  If I had have stayed there, I would have been there for co-driving and that was my future.
• 11:21
  I was committing the rest of my racing career there because that's what I said I would do.
• 11:25
  So, um, so opportunities stop and, um, I've got a good chance to win Bathurst now moving forward.
• 11:34
  So I was blindsided and that's, that's what hurt because, um.
• 11:37
  Uh, you know, I gave a lot of time and effort and relationship felt stronger than what was dealt.
• 11:43
  And that's, um, anyway, you, you, you live by it, don't you?
• 11:46
  And everyone has a decision, but, um, I am a man of my word and shake and that's a deal to me.
• 11:53
  So, um, anyway, is what it is.
• 11:54
  Let's, let's, let's go eyes forward now.
• 11:57
  Great quote there.
• 11:58
  I think from Rod Nash today about you still had blue blood and you're going back.
• 12:05
  I am.
• 12:05
  I am.
• 12:05
  How good.
• 12:06
  Yeah.
• 12:06
  And I feel, I feel great.
• 12:08
  Like, um, you know, Tickford to me is home.
• 12:10
  That's, that's home, whether you spent six years here or 13 years there or whatever.
• 12:15
  Like my, my most successful time was at Tickford and, um.
• 12:19
  Ford brought me through the program.
• 12:21
  You know, I am, I can say it now because, well, I probably can't do December 31.
• 12:25
  But, no, I'm, you know, I'm, I'm Ford.
• 12:30
  That's, that's what I was and that's who I am.
• 12:32
  But, the teams determine what cars you drive.
• 12:34
  So sometimes you're,
• 12:36
  end up in a car or whatever, but, um, yeah, going home and, you know, Rod's been amazing and, um, you know, Cam is a really good mate of mine.
• 12:45
  And we worked in those early days, you know, he won super two championship when I won, um, the main championship.
• 12:53
  Um, I worked with him really well and it's gone full circle.
• 12:55
  I was like his, I don't know, mentor or whatever.
• 12:59
  Um, and now I'm just complimenting him at the two big ones.
• 13:02
  So, um, yeah, really happy with going back home and.
• 13:05
  Maddie Roberts, um, you know, Rod Nash, Sven, um, you know, Brad with shoes and all the team that I had, what is it now?
• 13:14
  Seven years ago, six years ago, still there.
• 13:17
  And, um, which is really cool and they're fast and.
• 13:20
  It feels like you're going at a good time, mate.
• 13:22
  It's a great time.
• 13:23
  They had a significant change at the beginning of the year.
• 13:26
  Even when you look at Thomas Randall on the podium at the very, very end of things there, it feels like there are some good ducks in a row, good things in place as you rejoin them, isn't it?
• 13:33
  Well, they're fast.
• 13:34
  They're fast and they've got a good chance to win.
• 13:36
  So I'm really excited now.
• 13:38
  I've had tough results.
• 13:40
  So I'm looking forward to hopping in the car and just being a driver again and not worrying about –
• 13:45
  The marketing, the, the team personnel, the this and that.
• 13:48
  I'm a driver.
• 13:48
  I get in there and my job is to compliment Cam and drive the car.
• 13:52
  And, um, it was hard, you know, the last six years, not talking about that again, but you played a lot of roles more than just driver.
• 13:59
  And it's nice to hop in a car, put the helmet on.
• 14:03
  He's doing that job.
• 14:04
  He's doing that.
• 14:04
  She's doing this.
• 14:05
  Everything's done.
• 14:06
  And you drive the car and do it for the love of what you do it against.
• 14:09
  I'm really looking forward to that.
• 14:10
  And they're fast.
• 14:12
  They've got a good chance to win.
• 14:14
  And if you could win the Endurance Cup, I don't know.
• 14:18
  You win Bathurst, you take that over 12 hard rounds.
• 14:21
  So we'll see where we sit next year.
• 14:23
  But new tyres are coming out.
• 14:24
  They always change the rules.
• 14:25
  So you never know.
• 14:26
  Like the form guide always changes.
• 14:28
  But, yeah, they're in a good position definitely to do well.
• 14:31
  Good on you.
• 14:32
  Okay.
• 14:32
  The role is more encompassing than just co-driver or endurance driver, right?
• 14:37
  So the chance to mentor, to do some of that stuff you talked about even with, you know, kind of Cam Waters before.
• 14:42
  You've got great young guys at the moment in Ryland Gray, who I've dealt with in GT4, Lockie Dalton in Trans Am and so on, sharing that knowledge.
• 14:51
  But I don't sense in you that that will be in a, you know, when we say mentor now, it almost sounds standardized and you don't want it to be standardized, do you?
• 15:00
  Um, I said to Rod and to Simon, who's CEO of Tickford, um, they presented the role and I'm like, well, I'm an all in kind of guy.
• 15:07
  Like I don't just fluff around and just, oh, I'll do it.
• 15:11
  And then half in I'm, I'm, it's, it's a good thing and a bad thing because it takes your time up because you know that.
• 15:18
  So I said to them, yep.
• 15:20
  Oh, I'd love to do it.
• 15:21
  Cause one thing about this sport is that you always give back, you know, you give back to what's given to you and this, I love the sport.
• 15:31
  the good things that you learn and try and fast track some of these guys.
• 15:34
  Cause someone like Roland Gray is 17 years old, but he's going to be an incredible talent.
• 15:38
  I've watched him a lot.
• 15:39
  Um, but can I help him become a 40 year old bloke in three months?
• 15:44
  You know, that's what I'm trying to do.
• 15:45
  So, you know, what throttle position off the start, which curb do you hit here?
• 15:49
  Where would you place the car at turn one at the start?
• 15:51
  The professional demands outside the car, all that stuff.
• 15:53
  Yeah.
• 15:54
  How do I handle media?
• 15:54
  How do I do this?
• 15:55
  Like just try and, so it's mentoring, but it's just been a, a,
• 16:00
  a person that's not doing them over because in the sport there's often, and, and Tickford aren't like that, but some of these young guys are trying to take the drives.
• 16:08
  And they're green too, aren't they?
• 16:10
  So they're, they're kind of, you know, you've been exposed to what the business can be like.
• 16:14
  Yeah.
• 16:14
  So I'm really looking forward to that.
• 16:15
  So I'll do every round.
• 16:16
  I'll get every round and literally if you can get four cars finishing first, second, third and fourth for them, then that's awesome.
• 16:23
  That's, and whatever order they just need to sort it out.
• 16:25
  But, um,
• 16:27
  Just being, yeah, like a guy with no hidden agenda.
• 16:30
  Um, ask me what you want.
• 16:32
  If you need to give me a call to lean on me or, cause probably me, you don't want to ever tell the team your issues.
• 16:37
  You don't want to tell your sponsor your issues.
• 16:39
  You need that person that's got your back.
• 16:41
  And I'm that guy that they can just lean on and Hey, I don't like this.
• 16:44
  It's like, well, that's normal.
• 16:45
  Or no, that's not normal.
• 16:47
  Try handling it this way.
• 16:48
  Yeah.
• 16:48
  That's not normal.
• 16:48
  Let's go with this.
• 16:49
  And just, I don't know.
• 16:50
  So it's, it's a different approach, but, um, yeah, do all the rounds.
• 16:53
  I'm looking forward to that.
• 16:54
  Still get to be around the team and.
• 16:56
  experience the sport and I don't like it to go to a concert at Adelaide or something because I haven't been to one in the last 21 years, watch some Speedway if it's on, but, um, just, yeah, just being a good guy around the guys that they trust.
• 17:07
  And, um, you know, like Cam and like Chaz and all those guys that I helped back in the day when they win and they do well, I'm actually really proud of them because you, there's that element of mateship.
• 17:20
  Um, and you see them do things, you know, like, oh, I helped him like that sneaky little trade, like little shit.
• 17:25
  I shouldn't have told him that, you know, but, um, you see them develop and it's rewarding.
• 17:30
  And that's what I tried to do at Team 18.
• 17:31
  You want to see things grow.
• 17:32
  When you put effort in and you step back, you want to see it, you know, succeed.
• 17:36
  And, um, these young guys are part of that journey too.
• 17:38
  Is there a window in the diary for other driving?
• 17:41
  Will you do things that might tick a box or quench your thirst that hasn't been quenched either locally or internationally?
• 17:48
  Yeah.
• 17:49
  Um, it's sort of hard.
• 17:50
  Like I think supercars is, I love it.
• 17:53
  I love the rawness of them.
• 17:54
  They're sometimes not the best cars to drive, but that's what I love about him is that they're sometimes just this big, heavy, noisy car that just moves around and bounces around and they're not perfect.
• 18:06
  That's what I love about them.
• 18:07
  So it's hard to...
• 18:09
  fulfill your excitement after driving these cars.
• 18:12
  Like, I love them.
• 18:13
  I absolutely love them.
• 18:14
  But, you know, I loved Brazil when I raced there.
• 18:17
  That was really cool.
• 18:18
  That's pretty wild, mate, that.
• 18:19
  That was wild.
• 18:20
  They're wild.
• 18:20
  So I don't... Tell people a little bit about that.
• 18:22
  I think you've told me a story about, you know, the...
• 18:24
  The kind of deal doing was very different.
• 18:27
  It's all done on WhatsApp, but they don't do contracts.
• 18:30
  It's bizarre.
• 18:31
  And they pay you in cash.
• 18:32
  So you go there, you land and, um, Ronaldo picks you up or Ricardo or whoever it was, picks you up and you've got a helmet, a bag, and literally you're in a foreign country and they take you in a bulletproof car, which is legit.
• 18:46
  They, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they,
• 18:49
  He tells you, he goes, hey, hop in.
• 18:50
  Um, don't worry about your watch.
• 18:52
  Your watch is good.
• 18:53
  Bulletproof.
• 18:54
  It's like tested.
• 18:54
  He's like, no.
• 18:55
  Okay.
• 18:56
  Like, no worries.
• 18:57
  So we go to the hotel, go in next morning, seat fit on track, do your day, finish Sunday night.
• 19:05
  Both co-drivers come in.
• 19:06
  There's two brown bags there.
• 19:08
  And you're looking at his, you're like, shit, that guy's got a little bit more than me.
• 19:11
  And it was Lauren's van for, and I'm like, how much you get?
• 19:13
  He's like, and you can see the bag and a few more little greenbacks in there.
• 19:17
  They pay you in US dollar cash.
• 19:18
  Okay.
• 19:18
  Okay.
• 19:19
  hello to all the tax department listening, I guess.
• 19:22
  But, yeah, and then they, and that's it.
• 19:25
  And then it's like, righto, we'll WhatsApp you and thanks.
• 19:29
  And then off you go and Riccardo takes you back to the airport and you fly home.
• 19:32
  It's bizarre.
• 19:33
  Were they good cars?
• 19:33
  What were they like?
• 19:35
  Awesome.
• 19:35
  Awesome car.
• 19:36
  They're like a GT car.
• 19:36
  It's a Brazilian stock car, they call them, don't they?
• 19:38
  Yeah, but it's a GT cross supercar.
• 19:40
  Okay.
• 19:40
  Um, amazing crew.
• 19:42
  Don't speak English.
• 19:43
  So when they all, and they're all very religious.
• 19:45
  Yeah.
• 19:46
  So when they do the pit stop, they do the thank you.
• 19:50
  And I'm like, just do your job.
• 19:51
  You don't need to thank God.
• 19:52
  Just put the wheel on.
• 19:53
  You know, like if you do your job, probably don't need to thank him.
• 19:55
  And you drive off going shit like what?
• 19:57
  Why are they praying?
• 19:58
  Just like, just do your job properly.
• 20:00
  So, um, but yeah, no English.
• 20:02
  So you have an interpreter come talk on the radio.
• 20:06
  Um, good names.
• 20:07
  And it's good at that stage.
• 20:08
  Maxie Wilson and all sorts.
• 20:09
  Max Wilson, Ruben Barrichello, Felipe Massa, um, Nelson PK Jr. Like the list goes, it was awesome.
• 20:15
  So if I could get back to do that, they actually asked me in 2019 if I wanted to do the full championship and I'm like, okay, Renee, we're moving to Brazil.
• 20:24
  There's no contract.
• 20:25
  Um, yeah.
• 20:26
  Um, and she's like, yeah, sounds legit.
• 20:30
  So, um, but now awesome.
• 20:31
  Something, something like that, because they have 45 cars, like it's like supercars on ridiculous levels.
• 20:37
  So, um, but yeah, if they, if it works there and get a co-drive there, um, that was really, really good fun, but dodgy, like it's really, it's really dodgy.
• 20:48
  You talked before about the endurance aspect of the championship, right?
• 20:52
  One of the changes that we've seen announced this year.
• 20:54
  They've had a pretty good year on that front, haven't they?
• 20:56
  From the announcement of Toyota coming in 2026, I thought the energy around the return to New Zealand and Topol was terrific.
• 21:03
  As someone who's been in the game, as you said, now for 20-odd years,
• 21:06
  Are there things that you've looked at and you think, I'd love them to do a bit more of that or less of this?
• 21:11
  And what do you think of the notion of what they're going to do with the championship next year?
• 21:16
  I think having a crack there to be admired for, in my opinion.
• 21:19
  Yeah, well, that's the hardest part about stopping because you miss –
• 21:22
  what's coming, that's the hardest thing to swallow.
• 21:24
  So you know that every year, you know, like every year something else comes, it's cool.
• 21:30
  You know, like we've been to America, we've been to China, we've been, and they're all sort of one offs.
• 21:34
  So if you weren't in that era, you miss it.
• 21:36
  Um,
• 21:37
  the finals campaign, I'm going to miss it.
• 21:39
  And I think it's awesome.
• 21:40
  Like for me, the sport, the cars and the racing is awesome.
• 21:44
  Like I think, and the driver, the quality, we've got some of the best things in the world.
• 21:48
  But when you get to the final round, you need four cars going for a championship.
• 21:52
  Like I'm a big fan for that because I've been part of championships that are wrapped up before the final round.
• 21:57
  And you almost go, it's like a charity race almost because he's championing.
• 22:02
  it doesn't matter if you win because you can't move up positions.
• 22:05
  It's kind of, everything's done.
• 22:06
  So, um, it's come out of the grand final, hasn't it?
• 22:09
  Yeah.
• 22:09
  So like in footy, I follow footy in top of the ladder and they get knocked out in week two.
• 22:14
  You go, oh, well, they weren't good enough.
• 22:15
  Like it's just how you follow sport, you know?
• 22:17
  So, um, I think the finals campaign's great.
• 22:19
  I think the thing that, um, and this is probably, I'm not in the economic side of it, but it's very expensive to go to the races.
• 22:28
  And I think, um,
• 22:29
  I would love as a patron, as a, as a customer, as a customer.
• 22:33
  So like, you know, Bathurst, I bought tickets for the, cause we don't buy tickets obviously cause you get your allocation, but I had to buy tickets.
• 22:40
  It was $160 for one day for Sunday for my sister to come.
• 22:44
  Um, and I, I pay for it, bought the ticket, but for her to buy that, that's a lot of money.
• 22:49
  And I would love to have 200,000 people there and see him charge $80 and have, you know, like footy footy's 30 bucks or something to go.
• 22:57
  So, um, so I, I, you know, from a, I'd like to see the stands pack cause we,
• 23:03
  have tracks that have so much real estate.
• 23:05
  And when you see Bathurst 20 deep on the parade lap, like that's just as a drive, nothing beats it.
• 23:11
  And if it's getting too expensive, then I know the flip side is people watch it on TV and it's still watched, but there's nothing like,
• 23:19
  a sellout at Bathurst, you know, that, that 20 deep crowd coming through the last corner and across the top people yelling abuse.
• 23:26
  You can hear them in the car.
• 23:27
  Sometimes you're going across the top and they're yelling and you're like, oh, like it's, it's, that's the stuff that they need to make sure we maintain.
• 23:34
  And money's the thing that's going to, you know, determine that.
• 23:37
  But, um, sports in a good place, like manufacturers coming and, um,
• 23:41
  Um, there's talks of overseas races coming back again and, um, I just hope super to go there so I can go and watch, but, um, sport always evolves and, um, yeah, that's what you miss.
• 23:54
  That's what you're going to miss with that part of the sport is five years time.
• 23:57
  It could be racing in Thailand, Singapore Grand Prix.
• 24:00
  um a street race in perth um you know geelong might pop up or all this cool stuff that happens the sport moves very quickly um but we've got a good product so i think they're doing a great job it's just little things that like you'd like bigger crowds and um and that side but i don't control it so there's obviously always reasons to it so um but yeah that's the only thing i change probably
• 24:32
  If you're enjoying this chat with Frosty, you might enjoy his hilarious housemate at Team 18, Dave Reynolds, who's gradually, and I mean gradually, restoring a special set of wheels.
• 24:44
  It's the first car I ever bought.
• 24:46
  Okay.
• 24:46
  What series is it?
• 24:47
  Series 1.
• 24:48
  Series 1.
• 24:48
  Series 1.
• 24:49
  12A or?
• 24:50
  It started life out as a 12A Bridgeport.
• 24:52
  Admittedly, it was all fucked.
• 24:55
  I bought it for $1,000.
• 24:56
  It was a shocking car.
• 24:57
  It was fucking...
• 25:00
  Two hyenas talking supercars, bathless winds, heartbreaking losses and more.
• 25:06
  If only Rusty kept his base Gemini.
• 25:08
  What an epic first car that must have been.
• 25:11
  Insert roll eyes emoji here.
• 25:13
  Now back to Frosty.
• 25:17
  You've been lucky enough to drive various iterations of supercar over the course of your career, right?
• 25:22
  When I first set off on this podcast journey, one of the producers I worked with in the early phase, he said, I want to try and tap into a connection to the machine, right?
• 25:32
  So a car…
• 25:35
  a piece of racing real estate?
• 25:36
  Is there one that kind of you think back now and you go, that thing there, whether it's, you know, Bathurst 13, Championship 15, whatever it might have been, is there one that you are drawn to?
• 25:44
  Yeah, I think 07, that was that B, A, the white with the blue stripes, the cobra.
• 25:51
  That thing used to, the note was like, because we used to make our own exhaust back then.
• 25:55
  Sorry, not we, the team made their own exhausts.
• 25:58
  the engines were built by the engine builder of the team.
• 26:01
  And, um, we had Rob Benson at Tickford.
• 26:04
  Um, and that note, the exhaust used to wrap around underneath you, backside there.
• 26:09
  And you could hear that the grunt was like, it used to grow out.
• 26:13
  Like it was a note that I've never repeated really.
• 26:17
  Like it was just a note of that car.
• 26:18
  And at 07 at Bathurst, it used to hum, like you'd feel, you know,
• 26:22
  like the tail shaft's going to come through the seat.
• 26:24
  Like it was like.
• 26:25
  Plus it's tapping into history with that paint scheme, mega.
• 26:27
  Yeah.
• 26:28
  But that car and that note was, that was awesome.
• 26:31
  Like I remember, I haven't really replicated that.
• 26:34
  Like I think the cars now sound good, but.
• 26:36
  the way that thing wrapped, you could, it was, you could feel it as well as hear it.
• 26:40
  That was, that was an awesome note.
• 26:42
  Um, so I love that car.
• 26:43
  It was, yeah, one of my favorites.
• 26:45
  Um, and then track wise, like they're all good.
• 26:49
  Like I like all the tracks, like every, everyone has a favorite.
• 26:52
  Um, but they're all good and unique.
• 26:55
  Like I think Bathurst is the best that you race, you know, drive around, but Texas was really cool.
• 27:00
  Like that was a really, really cool track.
• 27:02
  Um, going up that hill in turn one and, um, yeah, really enjoyed that track.
• 27:06
  China was, except for the greats, um, was a great track.
• 27:10
  Yeah, that was a, that was a good track.
• 27:13
  I shouldn't say great track because it brings back bad memories.
• 27:15
  Um, Townsville, Adelaide, um, you know, so many good tracks.
• 27:20
  I don't know.
• 27:20
  I don't just say if, if I had a supercar and bought one and said, where would you go?
• 27:25
  I'd go all of them because you get bored at one place.
• 27:27
  You just want to race them all.
• 27:28
  They're all good tracks.
• 27:33
  Cobra BA car.
• 27:34
  Nice.
• 27:35
  And I'd need eight blokes to help me run it.
• 27:38
  And I'd go everywhere, just drive all the tracks.
• 27:40
  Love it.
• 27:41
  A couple of fans have asked questions, which I'll pepper through the conversation.
• 27:44
  And one of them was about Shanghai.
• 27:46
  I've got great memories of that trip because it was kind of our first real as a sport adventure together.
• 27:53
  And the bulk of us were all staying in the same hotel and we were going to this Grand Prix track, which was, you know, was fairly new on the road.
• 28:01
  On the calendar, you know, as far as motorsport was concerned.
• 28:05
  Take us back there.
• 28:06
  I mean, obviously, that was a pretty interesting part of your career with Larco, who I know would love to have had the kind of the wherewithal to do more with what he had at that stage and so on.
• 28:16
  Yeah, that was really cool like that.
• 28:19
  That was the first world-class facility type setup that we went to.
• 28:23
  But it was really weird because one of the most terrifying bits was the taxi trip from the hotel to the track.
• 28:30
  Do you remember that?
• 28:31
  Yeah, because you couldn't drive.
• 28:32
  You weren't allowed to drive.
• 28:32
  You had to go with someone.
• 28:33
  Someone had to drive you.
• 28:34
  Man, they're out of control.
• 28:35
  So I thought…
• 28:36
  It made the track really easy.
• 28:37
  The dude that we had wore the white gloves, he had white knuckle fever.
• 28:40
  He was out of control.
• 28:41
  So, um, getting to the track was a mission.
• 28:44
  Um, but the problem is when we go to these tracks, I always create shortcuts.
• 28:47
  We never get to use the whole track.
• 28:49
  Like I wish when we did go to Austin or we went to China, we used the full, the full layout because when you have cut throughs, you create complications.
• 28:57
  And that is what happened with our car, um,
• 29:00
  when we went through the cut through, it hit that grate and it flicked up and sheeted in half.
• 29:04
  But, um, but that track, like down that back straight, that was one of the coolest bits of when you said track before, like that was one of the best tracks.
• 29:12
  Like we were six gear, like hard pinned, pinned.
• 29:16
  And then you'd break from 200 meters out because the thing took 200 meters to stop into a hairpin.
• 29:21
  Like you imagine Bathurst.
• 29:23
  straight, even longer with a hairpin at the end of it.
• 29:26
  Like it was awesome.
• 29:27
  Like it was, and you could bomb someone from like 200 meters back, like just bang up the inside and switchbacks.
• 29:34
  And, um, yeah, that was, that was awesome.
• 29:36
  And then having everyone together kind of felt it's the first time I think we felt like we weren't all competing against each other in a foreign country and you said hello at breakfast.
• 29:46
  Yeah.
• 29:46
  Yeah.
• 29:46
  I created a, I don't know.
• 29:48
  We did things together.
• 29:48
  Did things together.
• 29:49
  And then, um, so I really enjoyed that.
• 29:51
  Then we did, um, sightseeing things together.
• 29:53
  You, me and Max Wilson did a Kung Fu thing.
• 29:55
  Yeah, we did Kung Fu.
• 29:56
  Yeah, yeah.
• 29:57
  He's a little nugget too, so I didn't want to fight him.
• 29:59
  But, um, yeah, we did that.
• 30:01
  And then on Sunday we went to the markets and bought some handbags because I was out of the race.
• 30:05
  So we bought some knockoff handbags on Sunday down at Shenzhen Markets or whatever it was, Shanghai Markets.
• 30:11
  So, um, but no, awesome experience.
• 30:13
  And that's.
• 30:14
  you know, when international races, people sometimes say it's not good for the sport because it takes it away from Australia.
• 30:20
  But as long as we're complimenting it here, um, and not taking away races and adding to the calendar, like there's some of the best moments like, um, you know, Shanghai and Austin and they were the best, but, uh, and, and, you know, Larko, um, he, you know, gave me what he could and we had a good time together and, um, no, it was good.
• 30:40
  Everything's built, you know, building.
• 30:41
  So what I learned from him, I took into my career and.
• 30:44
  he engineer me at times and, um,
• 30:46
  Yeah, he was good.
• 30:46
  He was, he was good to me.
• 30:47
  What's he like?
• 30:48
  When we get, we love his mannerisms now in the broadcast.
• 30:51
  What's he like in an engineering sense?
• 30:53
  Well, he was busy.
• 30:54
  He was on the board.
• 30:54
  So I'd be like, radio check.
• 30:56
  Nah, Larco's in the board meeting.
• 30:57
  I'm like, okay, so what are we doing here?
• 31:01
  It's like, nah, he'll be back soon.
• 31:02
  And then lap one, hey, radio check, Larco here.
• 31:04
  All right, when do you want to pit?
• 31:06
  It's like, what's up to you, mate?
• 31:08
  So, but no, he was good.
• 31:09
  He's a racer and wears his heart on his sleeve and he's a good guy.
• 31:13
  So he engineered me for a bit and then.
• 31:15
  I went from him to Greg Wheeler, a South African guy who smoked maybe three or four packets a day.
• 31:22
  So radio check, no, he's having a smoke.
• 31:25
  But he was one of the best engineers I had.
• 31:27
  He was so good.
• 31:27
  And he saved my career, Greg Wheeler, when he came into Lycos.
• 31:30
  Tell me why.
• 31:32
  Well, that was the first time I had an engineer that was an actual, you know, dedicated engineer, I guess.
• 31:37
  And, um, he come in and Tickford were looking at me at the time and I went top 10 shootout at Darwin, top 10 shootout at Queensland and,
• 31:47
  finished fifth somewhere and that was enough to get me through.
• 31:49
  Without that, I was in a bit of trouble.
• 31:51
  Um, so when Greg come, he, you know, he was very clever, um, worked as a contractor and really saved my career to be honest, cause I was in a bit of trouble.
• 32:00
  We were auditioning against others and those three good rounds, um, did enough to get me across the line.
• 32:06
  I'll come to that in a second.
• 32:07
  The tin can thing that the fans have asked about, mate, it was actually pretty scary.
• 32:12
  I can vividly recall going there to report on it and stuff.
• 32:16
  It cut it open pretty good, didn't it?
• 32:17
  It did.
• 32:18
  It took through the roll cage, so the roll cage sheared in half.
• 32:21
  Uh, and took a gap, like a big chunk out of the seat and the seats, I think it's 50 mil the seat and it took about 30 mil out of it.
• 32:28
  So 20 mil more and.
• 32:30
  You would have been walking different.
• 32:31
  Yeah.
• 32:32
  Yeah.
• 32:33
  I would have been Mrs. Winterbottom at that point.
• 32:35
  So, um, yeah, it was pretty close, but.
• 32:37
  Wow.
• 32:38
  Um, crazy.
• 32:40
  Like you, you build the cars to crash, you know, they roll over, you see this spectacular Fabian one rolls over at Bathurst.
• 32:46
  This car hits a fence at turn eight, you know, 50G and bang, we hop out.
• 32:50
  But imagine getting taken by, like, just, it's not the way you're meant to crash these cars.
• 32:55
  So, um, yeah, crazy.
• 32:57
  But it was really close, like 20 mil and it would have ripped me in half if it ripped a roll cage in half.
• 33:02
  Um, and I didn't really fancy going to a Chinese hospital over there, to be honest.
• 33:06
  I just...
• 33:07
  Yeah, so I bought handbags anyway, like I said.
• 33:09
  I went shopping the next – and the handbags weren't for me.
• 33:12
  They almost were if it went pear-shaped, but they were for Renee, so we went shopping.
• 33:17
  Well done.
• 33:17
  You talked about auditioning.
• 33:19
  I think that was the word you used a moment ago there.
• 33:21
  I don't know if I've got the dots join right or if it's a story of legend, but is it a case of you were going to go one way, J-Dub was going to go another, and in fact you ended up in the opposite position?
• 33:31
  So there was talk that you were going to go to AAA, wasn't there?
• 33:33
  Yeah.
• 33:34
  So Campbell, little –
• 33:36
  the great Campbell Little, um, he, him and I were very close and he rang me as like, oh, with opportunity at, um, triple eight.
• 33:45
  And I went and had a meeting with Campbell and Ludo and flew up to Brisbane.
• 33:49
  Um, and Campbell said, okay, this is all like a, like a hotel hush, hush, or is this a hush, hush type one and whatever.
• 33:57
  So it was Ludo, Campbell and myself and Campbell said, righto.
• 34:01
  Ludo's going to ask you these five questions.
• 34:03
  Bang.
• 34:04
  I want you to answer it like this.
• 34:05
  He's going to ask you this, answer it like that.
• 34:07
  So he was wording me up and I didn't get the gig.
• 34:10
  So I don't know if, um, my answers were the wrong ones or not, but, uh, Ludo's like, I could see him looking at me going, that's a very educated answer.
• 34:18
  How did you know that?
• 34:19
  And I see Campbell sitting there like, oh, that's great, Mike.
• 34:21
  Yeah.
• 34:22
  Like, so we were doubling up, but, um, yeah.
• 34:25
  And then, uh, effectively I was going to go to triple eight, but yeah.
• 34:29
  Like I was trying to sell me to teams, which he didn't really have the option to, but he rang Roland and said, um, if you want him, then you're going to have to buy him.
• 34:38
  And Roland was like, well, why am I buying a bloke that's finished in 15th?
• 34:41
  I'm not interested.
• 34:42
  And, um, went and signed Jamie.
• 34:45
  So if like, I guess, didn't make that call at the time, I would have gone to triple eight.
• 34:50
  Um, and then Tickford and, and then, um, like, oh yeah.
• 34:55
  Didn't pay me for the last two months of my contract and that got me out and then that let me go to Tickford.
• 35:00
  So, um, yeah, it's funny how it all worked out, but would, would you change it?
• 35:05
  You know, I was really happy with my years at Tickford and, um, I was so well supported there and everything.
• 35:10
  So I'm happy with, everything happens for a reason, doesn't it?
• 35:12
  But, um, it was funny.
• 35:14
  Like, yeah, Campbell, when I walked out, I had, I go, he's like, well,
• 35:17
  well, you said everything I told you to say, so we're pretty good.
• 35:20
  Well, good to go.
• 35:21
  You know, it's like, so, um, anyway, it was close, really, really close to yeah, different paths.
• 35:26
  And then when Jamie signed, he come off the, and he wasn't in demand either.
• 35:30
  Like he was having a tough run to try and get in.
• 35:32
  So we were both these young guys that had lots of potential.
• 35:35
  but weren't really showcasing ourself.
• 35:37
  And someone had to back you.
• 35:38
  And someone had to back it.
• 35:39
  So we're really lucky that Triple Eight backed him, I guess.
• 35:43
  And then Tickford backed me.
• 35:44
  And then we become like two of the guys in the sport that headbutt each other for years to come.
• 35:50
  Come to the highs with Tickford for me if you can.
• 35:54
  I mean, firstly…
• 35:55
  to clinch Bathurst in a battle against him, a battle of the ages, mate.
• 35:59
  I know a lot played out in those final few laps, but I mean, it is one of the, you know, things that people often replay, I mean, classic finish.
• 36:07
  And there's, I mean, there's always great races up there.
• 36:09
  Um, we've got some, you know, some amazing ones, but that's, that's, you know, to do it that day in those sorts of circumstances, pretty wild.
• 36:15
  Yeah.
• 36:16
  Um, you know, to, to go head to head, like you, you, you take any back, but it's like you want, but you want to win against the best team and the best driver in the day, you know, you want to not have a mechanical failure that takes him out of the race.
• 36:29
  And I've always wanted to beat the best, you know, and, um, Is that exhausting?
• 36:33
  Is that, well, we went head to head with 60 for 66 laps.
• 36:37
  We went head to head and Richo.
• 36:38
  in fairness, put us in the lead.
• 36:41
  He drove unbelievable that day.
• 36:42
  I didn't really like the car throughout the day.
• 36:45
  It's funny.
• 36:45
  And Richo was like, we're going to win today.
• 36:47
  And I'm like, what car are you driving?
• 36:49
  It was moving.
• 36:50
  It was oversteering across the top.
• 36:53
  He wanted to keep taking wing off.
• 36:54
  And the way I drive, I wanted to keep adding wing on.
• 36:56
  So we were in this...
• 36:58
  Like, can we just get a happy compromise?
• 37:01
  And he was fast.
• 37:02
  Like he, uh, Dumbaral drove off the track, had a mistake and Richo got him and he drove unbelievable.
• 37:08
  Like he put us in front, um, cause we ran P2 all day, really put us in front and then 66 to go, I jumped in and held it and that's kind of how the day rolled out, but we were head-butting all day.
• 37:19
  Like.
• 37:20
  And we'd come off having previously eight cross-threaded wheel nuts.
• 37:24
  So we were leading Texas, cross-threaded wheel nut, finished 10th.
• 37:27
  We were leading somewhere else, cross-threaded wheel nut.
• 37:30
  So we had this run-in of just potential, but kept having these pit stop hiccups.
• 37:35
  So in Bathurst, you need every pit stop to be bang on.
• 37:38
  And they bought 160 new wheel nuts and the tolerance was out by 0.1 of a mil.
• 37:45
  So with, you know, all these little things that...
• 37:47
  I don't know.
• 37:48
  It was all the stars aligning.
• 37:49
  We just, I don't know.
• 37:50
  We were good enough on the day to go head to head and we beat one of the best teams.
• 37:54
  And that was really rewarding.
• 37:55
  But to do it with Tickford and to do it with Richo was really important for me because we should have won 07.
• 38:03
  And now I'm old.
• 38:04
  I can waffle and look back on old things.
• 38:06
  But like 07, we should have won.
• 38:07
  And again, Richo put us in the lead and we were so dominant.
• 38:11
  And Lowndes ran off the track with...
• 38:13
  in his final stop, we had a 25 second lead and the safety car come out.
• 38:17
  Um, and I, and I, and I messed up and I was in the car at the final stint and, um, made a mistake and.
• 38:23
  in the slippery conditions and cost them the win.
• 38:25
  So I always wanted to, if you're in that moment again, don't stuff up again, you know, like give me that moment, that opportunity, um, with the same team and the same driver in the same type, high pressure, learn from your mistakes.
• 38:38
  And it was really important.
• 38:39
  It was a really important win to, to go head to head.
• 38:41
  And I wasn't going to back down.
• 38:42
  Like when he went the outside at two, I was going to drive him in the fence.
• 38:45
  I was like, just, I'm winning at all costs here.
• 38:47
  Like I'm not...
• 38:48
  Not today.
• 38:50
  We're winning this thing.
• 38:50
  Not today.
• 38:51
  We're winning this thing.
• 38:52
  So, um, but yeah, it's funny how, you know, that was that seven years after you get that opportunity again.
• 38:58
  And, um, yeah, we took it and for, for Tickford as well, they'd finished second a lot of times.
• 39:04
  Um, coming in and seeing Richo and, um, you know, Chris O'Toole and these guys in tears that are the manliest, like toughest dudes you've ever met, um, in tears in front of your family and like, just, it's, it's an emotion that.
• 39:17
  You can't describe like it's unbelievable.
• 39:19
  So to go head to head, the emotional, just, oh shit, we've won it.
• 39:24
  Like you're driving straight into pit lane and boom, like people everywhere.
• 39:28
  Um, yeah.
• 39:29
  Unbelievable moment that you never, never, ever forget.
• 39:31
  And yeah, you want to replicate it.
• 39:33
  That's the thing you win one, you want to, and then Chas went on to win the year after in another epic battle with the same guy, you know, like, um,
• 39:41
  Yeah, Tickford had an unbelievable run there, but you win one, gets the monkey off the back, and they seem to flow, and then Reynolds almost won 15 or whatever it was.
• 39:49
  So, like, it was a, yeah, we're on a run there.
• 39:51
  So, awesome win.
• 39:52
  I'll come to the championship in a moment.
• 39:54
  You've identified a couple of people that I wouldn't mind to comment on.
• 39:57
  Firstly, the late Campbell Little.
• 39:59
  It's only, you know, it's relatively fresh for a lot of the people in the sport.
• 40:03
  He was an unbelievable guy.
• 40:04
  And his experience across all sorts of different forms of motorsport, he's going to be much missed.
• 40:10
  He always, I can't profess to know him in the way that you would have.
• 40:15
  But he always made time.
• 40:16
  He would have a conversation with you and then invariably that would help you with something.
• 40:20
  You know, he's just that kind of guy, wasn't he?
• 40:22
  He's unbelievable.
• 40:24
  Like people see the hard Campbell and that's his race face.
• 40:30
  When he's happy, he looks grumpy, you know, like it's just who he was.
• 40:33
  But, you know, from day one, he took me in at Stone Brothers and engineered me in the Super 2 program.
• 40:38
  And...
• 40:39
  Um, he was just like, like a father figure type thing.
• 40:42
  He'd no bullshit, just right.
• 40:45
  Oh, this is what we're doing.
• 40:45
  This is, you know, and he'd tell you like, you're doing this wrong.
• 40:49
  Like just, he'd guide you through, but he did it really respectfully.
• 40:53
  And for, for a very strict guy, he's very nurturing.
• 40:57
  He had this fatherly way, very way, which, um, you know, Bathurst, I went out in, uh, in the first year, 2003 and I was just, I qualified 11th, I think.
• 41:07
  And I was just banging cars out of the way and hitting everything.
• 41:10
  It's like, all right, go hit the safety car, mate, because you did every effing car out there.
• 41:14
  So go hit that one.
• 41:15
  And I'm like, I can't.
• 41:16
  He goes, I'm being serious.
• 41:17
  Hit it, get it out of your system, and let's get on with this effing race.
• 41:21
  And I'm like, I'm really sorry.
• 41:23
  But he, yeah, and then, you know, we were running third that day, and he engineered the car against Ambrose Ningal, and they were running fifth or something.
• 41:31
  And he was like, he was just...
• 41:33
  I know it's just a good guy.
• 41:33
  And then I got him to Tickford when, when, um, we needed someone there and I got him there and he used to come down and stay at a house once a week.
• 41:41
  And cause I said to him, don't go to hotels, come stay with us.
• 41:43
  Like, um, and there's racetrack Campbell, who is the absolute goat of engineering to the Campbell that comes home, that sits at home, watches TV with you, has dinner with you.
• 41:57
  Um, just two different people.
• 41:59
  So I got to know.
• 42:00
  every part of him and, um, you know, people see, people only see race weekends.
• 42:05
  That's the hardest part with our sport.
• 42:06
  People see who you are behind that camera between Friday, Saturday, Sunday, but they don't see the work, the person, the efforts, the, in the background.
• 42:15
  And he, um, he goes above and beyond.
• 42:18
  And, um, for someone who's very successful still is very, very grounded.
• 42:22
  So, um, yeah, he'll be missed.
• 42:24
  Like he, even to this day, like before he passed away, I used to ring him with chat
• 42:28
  You'd be like, what are you doing here?
• 42:29
  Like, you just tell you, um, from a good place, what you're doing right, what you're doing wrong, just pull your head in.
• 42:36
  Like, um, just a good guy that always had your back and, um.
• 42:40
  Much missed.
• 42:40
  Much missed.
• 42:41
  Much missed.
• 42:42
  Richo.
• 42:43
  I can recall he and Ange before kids.
• 42:46
  I'm talking sort of, uh.
• 42:48
  you know, 1999 Bathurst win with Murph and so on.
• 42:53
  To do, I mean, what he has done, we probably don't shine a big enough light on, you know, in terms of the Bathurst wins, different people, yourself, Lowndes and so on.
• 43:02
  I mean, to get the chance to do that with him, that's damn good.
• 43:06
  He's a good guy.
• 43:07
  Like Richo is just one of the nicest people you ever race with.
• 43:13
  And when you got him as an ally, you feel good.
• 43:15
  Like, because you want to team up with guys that,
• 43:18
  you feel good around because they're effectively galvanizes a teammate through his nature.
• 43:23
  And he's got this, um, nothing's too hard like attitude.
• 43:27
  And like, even throughout the career, like we got to race as teammates as well.
• 43:34
  And we never had this ego thing.
• 43:35
  It was, he won Darwin.
• 43:36
  I went down and gave him this massive hug and he's like,
• 43:38
  like, and like, we just worked together.
• 43:41
  Well, it wasn't, I'm trying to do this to you.
• 43:43
  You're true.
• 43:44
  We worked well the whole time.
• 43:46
  Um, which then flowed into the co-driving stuff really well, but he was, he was fast.
• 43:51
  Like Oh seven fast 13.
• 43:53
  Like I said before, he was as fast, if not faster than me on that day.
• 43:57
  Like, um, he was really, really quick, but he does it in a way that's just no fast, just calm.
• 44:04
  Everything's calm and he uses his experience.
• 44:06
  But, um,
• 44:07
  Yeah.
• 44:07
  Great guy to be around.
• 44:08
  And he was one of the guys that come up to me in Adelaide at the final race.
• 44:12
  He rang me, where are you?
• 44:13
  I'm getting a rub, right?
• 44:14
  I'm coming in.
• 44:15
  I'm in my jocks and he comes, gives me this big hug and, and I was like, oh, this is weird, but it's richer so we can go with it.
• 44:20
  You know?
• 44:20
  So we had this big, um, but he's, he's a good guy that just, um, you know, I was very lucky to race with him because.
• 44:27
  He's one of the goats of sport, five-time Bathurst winner.
• 44:32
  Should have been six.
• 44:33
  He should have won in 07.
• 44:36
  But yeah, just no fuss.
• 44:38
  Got you back.
• 44:39
  And even one year, he raced at Bathurst and he hopped.
• 44:43
  He was doing this thing with Jim for Friday Night Live, and he did his back.
• 44:48
  He was cooked, but he was getting injections, and he was coming through.
• 44:51
  He mastered well.
• 44:52
  They didn't need that whole deal.
• 44:53
  He's just racist.
• 44:54
  There's guys that are like, oh, I've got a toenail that he's cutting.
• 44:57
  Oh, I can't.
• 44:58
  I can't.
• 44:58
  He's like, yep, double stint.
• 44:59
  He was cooked.
• 45:00
  He couldn't get out of the car to grab him out.
• 45:02
  He was just one of those guys that...
• 45:04
  If he's injured, if he's battling, if he battles, he just, he's tough.
• 45:08
  And he's got this friendly persona, but he's the hardest competitor.
• 45:12
  Yeah.
• 45:13
  And I loved him in my corner.
• 45:14
  And when I went to Charlie's, he come there as well.
• 45:17
  Um, I raced with him and he, um, was meant to be there a lot longer and, you know, he had his, um, dealings or whatever, but he was meant to be part of the system there cause you want good people.
• 45:27
  Good people make good teams.
• 45:28
  And he's, um, he's one of the nicest, um,
• 45:32
  Um, you know, good people of the sport for sure.
• 45:34
  And hardened, as you say, battle hardened is damn good in that.
• 45:37
  He'll fight you.
• 45:38
  If he needs to fight, he'll fight you.
• 45:39
  And he can move.
• 45:40
  He can dance too.
• 45:41
  There's a lot of our rich.
• 45:42
  Have you seen him breakdance?
• 45:43
  No way.
• 45:44
  Tell me about it.
• 45:44
  Oh man, he can breakdance.
• 45:45
  So he's like.
• 45:47
  What is he?
• 45:47
  He's like, I don't know.
• 45:50
  He's like Usher.
• 45:51
  Really?
• 45:51
  He's like Richo Usher.
• 45:52
  He can move.
• 45:53
  We have to see this.
• 45:54
  Yeah.
• 45:55
  So if you ever wonder how him and Ange met, ask him to dance.
• 45:58
  He's moved.
• 45:59
  She's a lucky lady.
• 46:00
  So yeah, he's a mover.
• 46:02
  But 13 after Bathurst, he was bringing all the break dancing out.
• 46:05
  He can do the worm.
• 46:06
  He's got it all covered.
• 46:07
  Oh, fantastic.
• 46:08
  He's got a, he's got a, not a nerdy persona, but a very calm persona for a dude that can move.
• 46:14
  So yeah.
• 46:14
  Yep.
• 46:15
  You talked there about 07 a couple of times.
• 46:17
  I've said in this pod often, I'm not a believer in regret, right?
• 46:21
  You make the best decision at the time.
• 46:22
  Sometimes things happen and that's how you deal with that, not necessarily the...
• 46:26
  the issue at the time.
• 46:28
  Do you look back on anything and go, could have done that better on track or even something off track?
• 46:34
  Do you think about stuff like that?
• 46:35
  Not really.
• 46:36
  Like I think if you make a mistake, you learn.
• 46:38
  That's how I've always been.
• 46:39
  Like 07, I remember, obviously I keep, you know, I've said that a couple of times, but, you know, Bathurst's so hard to win.
• 46:46
  So when you get a chance, you don't stuff up there.
• 46:48
  And when you do, you've got to own it.
• 46:50
  I walk straight back in and Richo actually, in speaking about good people, you know, he met me at the car.
• 46:55
  Did he?
• 46:55
  So we pulled up, literally cost him the race.
• 46:59
  But you're battling.
• 47:00
  He knows the situation.
• 47:01
  It's not like you just drove off and whatever.
• 47:03
  You were pushing hard and slippery conditions and young guy and trying your best.
• 47:07
  But he was at the car, opened the door for me.
• 47:10
  And we park in that park for my area.
• 47:12
  So it's not like it's at your garage.
• 47:14
  He had to walk a kilometer down to come and see me.
• 47:16
  Pulled up, opened the door.
• 47:17
  He was like, good job, mate.
• 47:18
  Gave me a hug.
• 47:19
  And like that made me feel, because I went back to the team and I'm not in tears, but I was close.
• 47:24
  I'm like, I'm really sorry.
• 47:25
  Like, and they just said, brother, Gold Coast two weeks, let's go.
• 47:28
  So you had good people around you that didn't, they weren't like downers, you know, they always just picked you up.
• 47:34
  And that was what being part of that team was.
• 47:37
  And he, you know, he set the standard as well, very high.
• 47:39
  So you don't, as long as you get back in that 13 moment, it's like, brother, I'm
• 47:44
  I'm not going off here.
• 47:45
  I'm not doing this.
• 47:46
  I'm driving you in the fence.
• 47:47
  I'm winning this thing.
• 47:48
  Like you just got to own your mistakes, you know, and that's, yeah, that's all you can do.
• 47:53
  And outside of the car, if you be yourself, I think if you're never going to regret anything, you just be yourself.
• 48:00
  So if someone likes you because you act like that, awesome.
• 48:04
  If they don't like you, well, that's who you are.
• 48:05
  So I've always been very true that, you know,
• 48:08
  just wear my heart on my sleeve type thing and just be the person you are.
• 48:13
  And if people don't like you, that's who you are.
• 48:16
  So they don't like you, they don't like you.
• 48:18
  If they like you, you're not going to see anything fake.
• 48:20
  I've never faked anything out of the car.
• 48:22
  So no, no regrets.
• 48:23
  I think you just learn lessons.
• 48:25
  Life's about lessons, isn't it?
• 48:26
  You learn and if you do it twice, then you're an idiot.
• 48:30
  So make mistake once, learn, fix it.
• 48:41
  That's the end of part one of my feature episode with Supercars Champion and Bathurst winner Mark Winterbottom.
• 48:47
  We don't stagger the releases.
• 48:48
  We never have.
• 48:49
  So part two is all loaded up in the library and ready for you to enjoy right now or whenever you're next on the road or.
• 48:56
  on the way to work or even tinkering in the garage.
• 48:59
  That's a great place to listen to them.
• 49:01
  There is a great story in relation to his work on the movie Cars 2 and all sorts of yarns on his supercars journey.
• 49:09
  The next chapter of his career, as you can probably tell, is something that he is clearly excited about.
• 49:15
  A return to Ford, Tickford and the chance to work with the next generation as they walk a similar path.
• 49:21
  It's all ahead here on Rusty's Garage.