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Be Kind, Please Rewind - The Cringe & Chemistry of '80s Video Dating · Dirt Nap City - History's Most Interesting Dead People

• 0:09
  SPEAKER_01: Hey Alex, good to see you, man.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_01: Hey Kelly, what's going on, man?
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I'm not Kelly.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_01: Oh.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I'm Dave.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_01: I like waterbeds.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_01: I like pop music.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: I like a woman who respects my mullet.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_01: And when I'm not tuning up my Pontiac Fiero, you can find me at the arcade working on my centipede high score and perfecting my cassette tape mix for long night drives.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_01: I'm looking for a classy lady who isn't afraid of a little aquanet, enjoys microwave cuisine cuisine, and wants to share a romantic fondue dinner this Friday.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_01: If that's you, check me out.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: This would be video video dating?
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_01: I want to talk to you about video dating in the ancient ages of the 80s.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_01: A little different than video dating today, right?
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_03: You can go some great rabbit holes on YouTube with um I guess companies have closed and then just uh and then just uploaded all their stuff beyond their way out.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, this this is actually this is actually a real a real one that I found.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_01: Transcribed.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_03: Are those privacy protected?
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_01: Like when you signed up for those, were you I'm sure I I'm sure they were, but I'm sure as soon as the company closed, it just didn't matter anymore, right?
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: Who are they gonna sue?
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_01: They're gonna sue Great Expectations.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_03: That sounds awful.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_03: Great Expectations was the name of a was that the name of a place?
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_01: That was the biggest one, Great Expectations, founded in 1976 by Jeff Ullman.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it was the kind of the juggernaut with over 500 locations around the country.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_03: And were they at the mall?
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_03: Like next to Glamour Shots?
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: They they would be, yes, they could be at the mall, they could be in a in a strip mall in a a small place, some were in office buildings.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_01: But let's let's let's just kind of back it up a little bit and let me set the scene.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_01: First of all, um I don't think either of us have much experience with uh with online dating these days, with swiping left and swiping right and all that stuff.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you you know, we hear about it.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_01: We we've seen some seen some little things about it, but this is way different because that that um instantaneous satisfaction you got and that connecting right away stuff, that didn't happen.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_01: This this was much, much slower to happen.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: Back back then, do you know do you know what the process was um at the local mall or the mall kiosk?
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_03: I well I th on the on which side, the recording or the selecting?
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: Well both, but starting with the recording.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_03: Recording, I think they had like a little studio.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_03: And you go in and you and there'd be a camera and you'd you'd um they'd probably have prompts for you to to to to talk about, right?
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_01: They had an interviewer.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_01: They they had an interviewer.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um so so but you you missed step one, and step one was you had to join, right?
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_01: So you had to plunk down a membership fee for an annual membership.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_01: And this was Yeah, yeah, it was an annual membership.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_01: Because you know, it might take 12 months to find your find your soulmate.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_03: But what if it took three weeks, then you're on the hook for a whole year?
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_01: Well, then you know what?
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_01: It's kind of like when you pay somebody to fix something at your house and they do it really quickly.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_01: Do you are you happy about that, or do you feel like you got ripped off?
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_01: Because you you paid a lot of money, they fixed it quickly.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know what I mean?
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's it's like uh somebody who finds their love immediately and doesn't have to have the rest of the year.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like they got a better deal, honestly.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_03: I feel like if you tell someone there's an annual membership, you're kind of admitting that this isn't gonna really work right away.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_01: I think you're giving yourself you're hedging your bets.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I think it would be more of a marketing um plan to say, look, we can go month to month.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_03: It's probably only gonna take a month, but we'll just do a recurring monthly fee just so you don't have to worry about you know keep paying, but it probably won't take more than a month.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_03: Um but you'd you do your interview, but then on the selecting side, you'd probably have to check out a bunch of video tapes, right?
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_03: And you go into a room like a little kiosk and just pop them in the the VCR.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um well there was a step before that.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_01: So you joined, um, you recorded your own video interview, and we'll talk more about that in a minute, and and some people who uh actually did these interviews.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: But you went to an office, you dressed up, you looked good, um, someone interviewed you with prompt questions, usually like three to five minutes.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_01: You know, who what do you look for in a soulmate?
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_01: What is your perfect weekend?
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_01: What do you enjoy?
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_01: What kind of music do you like?
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: Do you, you know, all those kind of questions that you would expect.
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_01: And then there were two things.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_01: There was a videotape, usually VHS, but then there was also a binder.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_01: And that binder was all this information written out.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_01: And these binders were all filed and categorized along with your photo.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_01: And the first step that someone would take when they would come in is they would actually go through the binders, find ones, pull the binders out, look at your picture, read your bio, and if they were interested, then they watch the tape.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_01: So there was a little bit of pre-screening before you watch the tape.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_03: I'm guessing most people skip the bio, just went right to the pictures and then right to the tape.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_03: Most men.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_01: Men.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_01: I I think for women maybe it was more important, the bio.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_01: You know, they they're looking for some substance.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_01: But then once you found a um a photo and a bio uh in a binder that you like, you would request the VHS tape, and you might take two or three of them.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know what the, you know, it's kind of like a changing room.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_01: You go in there, you might change, try on two or three outfits, but not too many.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_01: And then you would pop the tape in and you would watch it.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_01: And then that's the point where you kind of swiped left or swiped right.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_01: And if you if you didn't like the person, you just return the tape in the binder and you're done with that one.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_01: But if you did like them, you would let the person who worked at Great Expectations or wherever it was know.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_01: And then they would fill out a postcard, mail it to the person who uh had recorded that says, Hey, someone viewed your video.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_01: If you're interested, contact us and we will connect you.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_01: So there were lots of checks and balances before you actually gave your phone number away or actually connected with somebody, but they were slow.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_01: This was not this was not something that happened in, you know, like a hookup, you know, that happened the same day.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_01: This was something that took several weeks to get through.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_01: Pretty sounds pretty wholesome.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_01: Well, um so so after you got that thing, uh, that thing in the mail, let's say, let's say you recorded something, I went and watched it, and I'm like, I like the cut of this guy's jib.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_01: And they send you the postcard.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_01: Then the next step actually, you have to come in and watch my video and decide if if uh if if you like me, and then they connect us.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_01: If you come in, you could still veto the whole thing.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_01: You could blow that whole relationship up.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_01: We wouldn't be sitting here right now.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_01: My lovely friend.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um so so you actually just um you just asked about uh that notion of how it was kind of marketed, you know, like how long does it take for this to work?
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um one of the big challenges that these companies had was a stigma.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_01: So, like, you know, what what was your perception as a youngster uh, you know, in the 80s about people who did video dating?
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, yeah, I put it up there with like the you know, love connection um game show, you know.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_03: I mean it's just yeah, it just um there used to be a perception that desperation or that you can't meet anyone on your own or you know, yeah, that kind of thing.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_03: Um yeah, that that isn't there anymore.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_01: Well, do you think that's still a thing with uh dating apps?
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_01: Or you think it's you think dating apps are just accepted?
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_03: I think that's what most people use these days.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_03: Um you know, once you're out of college, especially, I think there's you know, the only people you tend to meet are are at um work.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_03: You know?
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_03: So and um yes, you're going to bars or church or you don't just randomly don't run into people and strike up a relationship with them.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, I think I think apps are the way that pe most people go these days.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_03: And I don't think there's a stigma.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_03: But I remember I had a friend that early, early on met his now wife on a dating app, but this was like when they first came out, and there was such a stigma that they didn't tell anybody, they told everyone they had a mutual friend named Annette.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_03: Get it?
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_01: Annette.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_01: I I yeah.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_01: Her first initial is her WWW.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_01: Wanda, Juanita, Wayne, Annette.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: I can't think of three female W names.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_03: Um I mean, I don't think that stigma exists anymore.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_03: But back definitely in the 80s, going into a mall, I mean, that's that's you know, that's right up there with an adult bookstore or glamour shots.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_01: Or or or the uh Orange Julius booth, right?
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_01: So so uh yes, that was definitely, you know, it's it's for losers, it's for people who can't meet people, it's for weirdos.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_01: That was a that was a big problem that they faced.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_01: But the way they overcame that was actually, I don't know if you remember seeing any advertisements in magazines or in you know gentlemen's quarterly, might gq might be.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_01: Is that a video dating service?
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_01: It it was, but their model was um they set you up for lunch.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_01: And so they would, you know, they'd say lunch is kind of a low stakes deal, like a lot less of a stake than an actual date, right?
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_01: So, or like grabbing coffee with somebody, I think is a low stakes deal.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_01: But ultimately, their thing was that they were they were sort of culling through people for you.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_01: Now, now, a lot of these video dating services, you picked your own because like great expectations.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_01: You look through the binders, you look through the folders, you found the person you wanted to uh contact, and then they saw your video and it you make that connection.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_01: Things like it's just lunch were a little bit more prescriptive, meaning that they would actually use some kind of um, I don't know if it I wouldn't call it an algorithm at the time, but they would use data about both of you and try to connect people that they thought would be a good fit based on the answers to their survey questions, right?
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_01: And so ultimately, though, the the big thing was they tried to say it was discrete, it was professional, it was selective, it was high class, right?
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_01: This wasn't this wasn't something that you you had to have some money.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_01: That was, I think, part of the reason the cost, the annual fee, could be thousands of dollars.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_01: Because they they wanted to sort of weed out the riffraff, so to speak.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and I think the uh assessment part that you were talking about where you you know you you take a compatibility test.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_03: I think it was a short jump from that into e-harmony.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_03: It wasn't very many years that lapsed between the end of video dating and the beginning of eharmony.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, no, no.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_01: That the e-harmony came up, I believe, in the mid-90s.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_01: So probably, yeah.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_01: Video dating stopped in the early 90s, late 80s, kind of with the rise of the internet.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_01: So I I want to ask you if you know about probably one of the most famous people who was involved in um in video dating at Great Expectations, was an employee of Great Expectations.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_01: You know anything about this?
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_04: No.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna play you a little interview.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um He was uh an interviewer, so he actually produced the videos.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_01: He'd go in and you know, set up the lighting, and I guess the lighting was probably preset.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_01: Have them sit down, make them comfortable, and then ask them some questions.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_03: Now, here's let's be clear, you would have loved this job.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_01: I would have loved this job.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yeah.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_03: If there's ever a job made for you, this was it, right?
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_03: It involved everything, involved being nosy, interviewing, video, editing.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_03: Like it's your wheelhouse, man.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_01: Probably, probably beautiful people, you know.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_03: And if you were 20 years earlier, you might have founded one of these companies.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, that's a that's a fair thing.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_01: That's a fair thing.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_01: I was I would have done it on Betamax instead of VHS, but you know, that's just me.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_01: Uh all right, here we go.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_01: Let's take a listen to this one.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_05: Now the dating, the dating agency, this is Brian's life.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_05: Seriously, get this book.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_05: Best life ever.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_05: I just use the mold.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_05: Was it was the dating agency before the weddings or after the weddings?
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_05: It was actually uh after.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_05: But this is uh a lovely thing.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_05: Well, not they weren't lovely, but the we don't have them anymore.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_05: This was you were you were filming people's video profiles.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_02: Before the online companies of dating and all that sort of thing, you actually had to go into an office.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_02: And this uh company was called Great Expectations, and it was actually very, very successful.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_02: And they would match people up.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_02: And basically, you would go in, you would take a picture, you would write out a profile of who you are, and then you would have a short videotape so that men or women can watch someone and go, I like, I like the feel of this person.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_02: This it feels genuine or whatever.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_02: And so I would conduct the videotape interviews and I'd have a little secret button, and most of them would come in and go, Well, I like walks on the beach and I'm very romantic and I like to cook at home.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_02: And it's like, okay, calm down.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: Amazing.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we don't, this is not gonna work because you're trying too hard.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_02: Just relax.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_02: So I would usually tell a joke, and then they would laugh and I'd push the button when they're laughing and start the tape and then say, Do you have a joke?
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_02: And they would say something or tell a joke, not knowing they were being taped.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_02: And uh, 50 seconds later, I'd say, That's it.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_02: We're done.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_02: And we just wanted to get a little snippet of of who they really are.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_02: And it really worked.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_05: But now I don't know, because again, like you know, there's all the apps and things now, people have forgotten this world of these things.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_05: Somebody, uh very handily, did a little montage of men who'd done these things.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_05: So I don't know if you've directed any of these.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_05: It's quite I think uh we'll see the name of the company.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_05: I can't remember what it's called, but here we go.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, early to bed, early to rise makes a woman healthy, wealthy, and wise.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_00: That's why you're wiser than me.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_00: It's Steven.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: Uh you've probably already noticed that I have incredibly blue eyes.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_00: My name is Phil.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: Uh most of my friends call me Big Phil.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_03: Brian Cranston.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_01: Brian Cranston was uh was a video dating interviewer at uh Great Expectations.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_01: I thought that was pretty hilarious.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, no kidding.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_03: Do you have a sense of what kind of gender mix there was?
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_03: I were getting the feeling these are those those clips were all men.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_01: I think I do think more men than women signed up for these kind of things.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I I can't speak to why, you know, if maybe the taboo-ness was less uh less daunting for a man, you know, like well, and it she seems kind of a like a frightening thing to put out there if you're a woman, right?
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_01: I mean right.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um I I do I'd I'd guess 60-40 based on all the interviews.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_01: Most most of the really bad ones and really cringy ones are were men.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I would probably say more like 75-25, I'm guessing.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_01: Could have been.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_01: And and and so, you know, if you were a woman, you probably had a much much better uh rate of success, right?
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_01: A much better chance of of finding that person.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_03: Probably uh uh more women um than men mix on that than the party lines.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_01: Are you gonna talk about those?
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe maybe someday we'll talk about party lines, but I'm guessing there were really no women on that.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_01: And then and then the wasn't it 976, the 976 numbers, those were the the sexy, sexy phone lines that you would call it?
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_03: That's for another day, but still kind of the same crowd of of desperate guys.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_03: Desperate guys in cells today.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you know, this this was a um kind of flash in the pan.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: The technology at the time did its best, but it really was a long game, right?
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_01: You weren't going to find somebody.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: I I do think part of the reason it took a year or why you signed up for a year was because it took so long just to get one date, right?
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_03: And but it probably seemed really high tech back then.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_03: It probably it probably seemed like the high like can you believe what we can do now?
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_03: We can meet each other without ever meeting each other.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, that whole thing.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_03: We don't have to put ourselves out there and be nervous and have sweaty palms.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_03: We can just we can just bear our souls about who we really are in a comfortable setting with Brian Cranston and then and then somebody can watch us and we're kind of be at our best rather than fumbling around in a bar and you know stuttering.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_03: And if you don't have any game, maybe this was a great way to go.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_01: What one thing that I couldn't find out that I was really wanted to know, um, and I'd like your theory on this, was whether or not they let you keep a copy of your own tape.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_01: Like, like if you got to bring a VHS copy of a tape that you made home with you or not, I think it would be a I mean, potentially hugely embarrassing kind of thing, right?
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_01: But also potentially what a what a keepsake, right?
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_01: Here's here's my dating tape from 1986.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um you'd think about it.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_03: Once once you made a match, they would give both parties their tapes.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah, yeah.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_01: And then that could have been the differentiator if we had started.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_01: Well, if if we had started this in college, just imagine where where we could have gone with this, you know.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_03: Well, yeah, I don't know.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_03: We probably would have got rich quick, but then we probably obviously, unless you do like an e-harmony type of thing, then you probably lose all your money.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_01: So here's the thing.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_01: I think you and I would have had the sense to to evolve, right?
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_01: I think we would have seen the writing on the wall, the the Kodak, you know, the Kodak film, the digital, the the VHS to the internet thing.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_01: I think we would have seen that and we would have evolved quickly.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: Now, yeah, what would be what would be one thing you would do to differentiate um the Dirtnap City dating service over others?
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_03: Like what if we Yeah, well, I like the it's just lunch thing.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_03: I really like that because it caters to more upscale people and like and but you know, and uh it was a different time though.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_03: When I see these tapes, all the guys have suits on, you know.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_01: That's true.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_01: So schedule was a different was a different definition back then.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_03: Um you can you can go that route or you can go the other direction, you know.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_03: You can just make it like for dirtbags only.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_03: Um we specialize like you have to wear a you have to wear a uh sleeves cut off, no sleeves allowed in in the interview videos, and and uh or there's all those services now like you know, JDate or farmersonly.com or all these really specialty areas where you just find a niche and then you go, okay, we're just for people that work in you know food service, you know.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_01: Is there really a farmersonly.com?
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_03: You've never heard of that?
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, farmers only.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_03: Farmersonly.com.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, okay.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_01: I did not know.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I'm gonna just warn our listeners and viewers is unless you have a couple of hours to kill, because it will kill a couple hours, don't Google this because the minute you do, you're gonna be down a rabbit hole.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, seriously.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_03: Now you had mentioned before about you and me finding each other on this, but do you know were did they have same-sex um couples doing this?
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_03: Or was that it seems like in the 80s that might have even been like prohibited or something, stupid.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_01: That's a good question.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_01: I actually don't know the answer to that, whether or not that was something that they supported or even had like a special set of folders, you know, over to one side.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_03: But it actually also seems like a really good and smart idea.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_03: Safe way to to I mean, I don't know about safe, but yeah, smart idea.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_03: idea for people because it was a lot more difficult to put yourself out there when you're in the closet.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_03: Like maybe that would have been a good plan, but I don't know how these if these companies were supporting that stuff back then.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_01: No, that's that's a question I don't know the answer to.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_01: I would I would think if there was money that could be made that you know especially in certain markets, right?
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_01: If you're in San Francisco, that might have been something that was a bigger market.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um and so it might have been something they did.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: I I just don't know how that would have been handled other than potentially maybe there were different folders on different people that some of them were categorized differently, right?
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_01: So here's just kind of straight up the middle heterosexual relationships and then here's other things that aren't that, you know?
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_03: No judgment were there any like underground services like that were more kind of spicy than others?
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_03: Or were they all kind of like this?
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_01: I think once you I think once you got into that it was no longer a service that was advertised um in normal venues.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_01: Like yes of course there are um but I object to the word normal there but here's the thing okay that's fair.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_01: Here's the thing though if if you were looking for that would you really want to go have to look through a dossier, watch a VHS tape, wait for a postcard you know what I mean?
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_01: It's like you're you're looking for something a little more instantaneous at that point.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know I think I'm just trying to think back on what what we could have how we could have differentiated ourselves.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_03: And you really got to go extreme one way or the other or niche I think.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's it.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's the it's the niche would have been the way to do it and and to really just lean into you know we're gonna we're gonna service people who like this kind of thing.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_01: The the problem also back then is I don't think everybody um I don't think there was as much information about what people liked, you know, in terms of kinks or in terms of types of relationships as there is today.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like it's a lot more talked about it's a lot more out in the open on the internet if you want to go find it.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_03: Back then it was all a lot more taboo and so you know you would have you would have got some people uh resisting it but some opportunities what was the time frame that this stuff lasted like from 83 to 95 or even less time than that?
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_01: No I think it was actually I mean uh Great Expectations was founded in 76.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_01: I mean it kind of came it kind of came yeah founded by Jeff Ullman in 1976.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_01: Um it it kind of came with um the advent of the VHS recorder right and and and of course video recording existed before that but it was very hard to get a hold of it was expensive.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_01: It was when people started getting VCRs and these companies could afford to have 10 of these screening rooms with the VCRs in them that you know kind of brought it along and then started to decline with the advent of things like DVDs.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_01: It was a lot harder to to author and write a DVD than it was to just hit record on a recorder, right?
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_03: No, let me ask you this we both admitted that we don't know anything about these apps that exist today but as far as I know they're just pictures are there some that where you do an interview and and um where you can actually see the person or did we lose that and now we're just going by of a photo?
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_01: Well I was I was reading a little bit about um like hinge and TikTok uh tick TikTok dating pitches.
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_01: So those are videos.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_01: Those are more um more where you put yourself out there on some platform that's either dedicated to connecting people and dating or something like TikTok where maybe you're just you're pitching pitching going out on a date uh you know here's here's why you should date me or here's why you should contact me.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_01: So I think video is very involved.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_01: It's funny because everything has gone to video.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_01: Very rarely is it just photos anymore.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_01: The photo might be the thumbnail or the introduction but I I believe now if you click on a dating service and you swipe right you can dig a little deeper into that person's profile and start to see videos and stuff like that.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_03: If they are the concern the certain these days is deep fakes and it's not really well yeah I mean it cuts both ways right so at some point you actually have to meet the person and be in the same room with them I suppose.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_01: Right right right yeah ultimately everybody I think the big thing that people used to do do you do you know what the number one thing people would do on uh dating apps for a long time was before AI could change things they'd use a younger picture.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_01: Their picture would be yeah that's me but that's 10 years ago you know that's that's me that's me ten pounds ago or whatever.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_01: So my best yeah yeah yeah so so yeah you kind of have to take that with a grain of salt and you're right really what it all comes down to is you got to have that personal connection and meet somebody in person before you get their vibe.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_03: Where do you think uh for those listeners out there who are trying to meet someone where do you think the best the the best place to meet somebody is I'm gonna say uh Dirtnap City podcast meetups is really the place to go.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_01: Message board yeah our message board come to our website if you're if you're a listen if you're a lonely soul we could we could make one pretty easily if you're if you're a lonely soul and you're looking for companionship um Alex and I can can help you out.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_01: Just join our join our Patreon and uh we will we will uh shepherd you through the process do a little interview with you give you a shout out on the show and introduce you to other fine fine fans like Al from Austin or Pink Flock.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_01: We got a whole bevy of our moms we got a whole bevy of uh of fans that you might want to meet for friendship or more who knows no not not not my mom not your mom okay my mom's single though so it could work.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_04: All right well that's video dating uh love to hear your comments about it uh please be sure to subscribe on your favorite podcast platform or each week we do a dead end and then every other week we talk about an interesting dead person and the great news is we have no idea who's coming up next week so hope you'll join in for the fun and the surprise expectations they booked me in four a camera stool and a blue paint door they asked what I like what I wanted to find I try to sound easy then change my mind live called the blink instead of something on the state on the state too much so much all the movies down the lines