Latest / The Extra Mile Podcast / Do You Know Your Enemy? (with Pastor Adam Gooch)

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Do You Know Your Enemy? (with Pastor Adam Gooch) · The Extra Mile Podcast

0:00
SPEAKER_01: So I just think it's odd, man, that there are liars and deceivers besides the devil, false teachers and pulpits and uh false uh false pastors on platforms that um are teaching things that are unbiblical and leading people away from the faith, and we're afraid to call them out man Peter, Paul, Jesus, and they name a name.
0:24
SPEAKER_01: Well, listen, man, welcome everybody to the X-Mile Podcast sitting here with uh my XP, Pastor Adam Gooch.
0:29
SPEAKER_01: And uh we're gonna have a conversation based on a new series we started this past weekend, uh having a uh pretty deep, I think significant, important conversation that probably we don't have enough conversation about.
0:40
SPEAKER_01: And maybe depending on your background, you maybe think we talk about it too much, but we're gonna try to find a balance because God's word has a lot to say about this topic.
0:48
SPEAKER_01: And so, Pastor Adam, welcome, man, around the table.
0:50
SPEAKER_00: Welcome to me.
0:51
SPEAKER_00: Glad to be here.
0:52
SPEAKER_00: Thank you for having me back again.
0:53
SPEAKER_00: And uh it's a fun topic, it's gonna be interesting.
0:56
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you've had lots of life change since the uh last time you're with us, not that long ago, man.
1:00
SPEAKER_01: Kids, you have two kids in the military.
1:02
SPEAKER_00: No doubt.
1:02
SPEAKER_00: That that brings about a whole different set of uh adding things to your prayer list, you know.
1:07
SPEAKER_01: And uh and a son killing it on the football field.
1:10
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, man, they're proud of all of them for different reasons.
1:12
SPEAKER_00: You don't, you know, the interesting thing when you have two sons going to the military, like, I bet you're so proud.
1:18
SPEAKER_00: And like, well, I was proud of them before they did.
1:20
SPEAKER_00: Like they didn't have to join the army for for me to be proud, but there's there's just a different level of the sacrifice and the understanding the significance of the decision they made.
1:29
SPEAKER_00: Like they came to us and were like, Dad, can I can I talk to you?
1:33
SPEAKER_00: It wasn't like we, hey, this would be a good path for you, son.
1:36
SPEAKER_00: We never saw it for them.
1:37
SPEAKER_00: But it's cool when you see your kids hearing from the Lord and we all have peace that like, no, you're right.
1:43
SPEAKER_00: That that's a good path for you.
1:45
SPEAKER_01: You know, my son going into uh going to law enforcement, your two of your boys going into uh military.
1:50
SPEAKER_01: I think there's a difference, the nuances between being proud of them, being like I respect them.
1:54
SPEAKER_01: Like they didn't have to do that, but man, for them to put themselves basically in harm's way for other people, for our nation, for our community, like, man, I just respect that.
2:03
SPEAKER_01: So to launch this conversation, um, I want to talk about 9-11, because man, we just commemorated as a nation that horrific moment uh 25 years ago.
2:12
SPEAKER_01: I remember where I was when I heard the first plane hit the first tower.
2:16
SPEAKER_01: And then not too long after that, I think the second plane hit the second tower in New York.
2:20
SPEAKER_01: Uh, then the Pentagon was struck, and then obviously a fourth plane went down in uh Butler, Pennsylvania.
2:26
SPEAKER_01: And what stands out to me about that moment is um the conversation that really happened just last two weeks ago as we commemorated 25 years.
2:34
SPEAKER_01: And it was this reminder in a divided nation.
2:37
SPEAKER_01: What was important in that moment 25 years ago, that we've lost now as a nation is because of our division, um, what we're reminded of is what brought us together if we had a common enemy.
2:47
SPEAKER_01: Like, no matter what your background, no matter what your political viewpoint, like, hey, somebody attacked us as a nation.
2:54
SPEAKER_01: And man, we responded.
2:55
SPEAKER_01: And you can disagree with how we responded with our military action out in the Middle East, but to come back to this idea, like, hey, we responded as a nation, our boundaries, our devices, you know, all those things that kept us apart were brought down because we recognized we had a common enemy.
3:10
SPEAKER_01: This conversation today is, hey, we have, has have always had, we continue to have as a human race, and more importantly, as Christ followers, we have a common enemy.
3:19
SPEAKER_01: And uh, I just want to have this conversation about this person we call the devil, um, this person we call Satan has lots of titles and names.
3:25
SPEAKER_01: And so, man, it was a big conversation.
3:26
SPEAKER_01: And I'm just curious from you, man, just maybe out of the gate, what was the takeaway that maybe landed on your plate?
3:31
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I think, you know, kind of how you started it, I think it's one of the as we went through the message, you talked about, you know, truly understanding the identity and the names of Satan, one of those being the deceiver.
3:41
SPEAKER_00: And even when you look back at 9-11 and all the the things that happened after that, I think one of his greatest tools of deception is us seeing each other as the enemy.
3:51
SPEAKER_00: So then that we still disagreed on the same granular things on September the 12th that we did September the 11th.
3:58
SPEAKER_00: Like you still had different backgrounds and different theologies and different beliefs and socioeconomics, but in that moment we saw each other's as brothers and sisters as neighbors, and we had a different understanding for love your neighbor as yourself.
4:13
SPEAKER_00: That like we're really in this together, and it was kind of that I've got a brother, you've got brothers that like we can fight, but nobody else is gonna mess with my brother, you know, and just having that commonality of like we're family, like we're um, and I do think the church has lost that for a lot of you know reasons.
4:32
SPEAKER_00: But one of the main tools I think of the enemy is just figuring out a way to to put that seed of you fight again battle against each other, you know.
4:40
SPEAKER_00: And Jesus warned us, you battle not against flesh and blood, but somehow we we miss that.
4:45
SPEAKER_01: You know, and I think we're losing some of the battles we're fighting.
4:48
SPEAKER_01: And again, we're gonna get into what that battle is, but we're losing that battle because we're not fighting it because we're too busy fighting each other.
4:54
SPEAKER_01: We're fighting politics, we're fighting race, we're fighting, you know, how much money you have or don't have, we're fighting the wrong thing.
5:00
SPEAKER_01: So, how can you win a battle you don't fight?
5:02
SPEAKER_01: So we have to lean into this conversation we're gonna have on spiritual warfare, which, you know, I'll be honest still, as a as a pastor, as a believer, spiritual warfare, it sounds um, I mean, I understand how serious it is, but I understand at the same time, it sounds like a little hokey.
5:18
SPEAKER_01: It sounds a little um, you know, pre-science or like we're foolish.
5:22
SPEAKER_01: What do you spiritual warfare?
5:23
SPEAKER_01: It sounds goofy, but at the end of the day, if you're a Christ follower, the word of God explicitly teaches.
5:29
SPEAKER_01: And you've already said it, man.
5:31
SPEAKER_01: Paul said, we don't battle against flesh and blood.
5:33
SPEAKER_01: Our battle is not with people, it's not with who lives next to us, it's not with people who live on the other side of the world.
5:38
SPEAKER_01: It is a spiritual battle.
5:40
SPEAKER_01: And that, you know, I just, you know, why do you think people have such a hard time maybe embracing that that idea of it being spiritual?
5:46
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think because we are so carnally minded, I think it's easy to see the things, the friend or the neighbor or the person down the street that that wrongs you, you know, um, it's easy to lash out at them because I feel like I can put I can put hands on that, I can control that.
6:02
SPEAKER_00: Um whereas if you truly understood it from a from a spiritual standpoint, you know, when you see someone who's struggling, whether it be an addiction or whatever the case may be, if you saw that on the spiritual standpoint, you've got a brother or sister that's been wounded, that's bleeding out on the, you know, and I don't know who it was that said at the church is the only people that shoot their wounded, you know, like we want to pounce on the person that's sitting here bleeding out because the enemies attack them.
6:30
SPEAKER_00: Um and rather than rendering aid and and understanding this is serious.
6:36
SPEAKER_00: Um even people that we know who like are fighting with bullet holes and like you've been shot, I can see it.
6:43
SPEAKER_00: Um but I think we just don't we've been so taught to think that that this is all there is.
6:49
SPEAKER_00: It's gotta you gotta put hands on it, you gotta be able to touch it, you gotta be able to see it.
6:52
SPEAKER_00: Um and it just that that idea is hard for us to rationalize, but but at the same time it goes completely against, like you said, what scripture teaches.
7:01
unknown: Yeah.
7:01
SPEAKER_01: So it's uh this conversation is gonna get a little stickier as we move through the series.
7:05
SPEAKER_01: In fact, it's gonna get a little harder for people to really believe if they don't believe the foundation, man, the Bible is our truth.
7:12
SPEAKER_01: You know, I think most people would say, yeah, I believe there's a spiritual realm, and yeah, I believe there's a devil, and maybe there's some temptation or maybe there's some deception, but it I'm not a victim of it.
7:21
SPEAKER_01: It doesn't affect my life.
7:23
SPEAKER_01: And so we really start to downplay the battle.
7:25
SPEAKER_01: So we're certainly gonna downplay the solution or how we get victory.
7:28
SPEAKER_01: And so as we go deeper into this, man, it's gonna get, it's gonna feel challenging.
7:32
SPEAKER_01: But again, we have to come back to the foundation that this is what God's Word teaches.
7:35
SPEAKER_01: There is a real spiritual enemy.
7:37
SPEAKER_01: We are in a real spiritual battle, and that spiritual battle is really affecting us on practical levels of life.
7:43
SPEAKER_01: And it's not just church on Sunday, it is your marriage, it is your home, it is your finances, it is life.
7:48
SPEAKER_01: And um, again, so for those who are struggling to maybe wrap their arms around this idea of spiritual warfare, uh, I open with a quote by C.S.
7:55
SPEAKER_01: Lewis, and I'll re reread the quote.
7:57
SPEAKER_01: But basically, his point is there are generally two viewpoints in this world.
8:01
SPEAKER_01: It's either there are there are no devils.
8:03
SPEAKER_01: And so if there are no devils, there's no battle to fight.
8:06
SPEAKER_01: Or yeah, there are devils.
8:07
SPEAKER_01: And so, man, there's the devil's responsible for everything.
8:10
SPEAKER_01: Everything I do that's bad, I can just blame the devil.
8:13
SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, everything that's happened happening bad in my neighbor neighborhood community, everything's happening bad.
8:18
SPEAKER_01: Well, that's all the devil.
8:19
SPEAKER_01: Well, that takes personal responsibility out it out of it.
8:22
SPEAKER_01: And at the end of the day, I think we have to come to this place where we recognize we have personal responsibility.
8:28
SPEAKER_01: We have choices that are making, that we're making every day that is impacting the world around us for good or evil.
8:33
SPEAKER_01: Um, but in the background of our biggest battles is a bigger battle in spiritual warfare.
8:38
SPEAKER_01: And the enemy's looking for every opportunity to uh to instigate, to initialize, to stir up, to do whatever he can to really make the worst of the battle we're in, make it even uh more significant, more impactful.
8:51
SPEAKER_01: Um so man, just drawing attention to this reality that I think where we're at as a church is I don't think church, I don't think church people, I don't think Christians have a hard time admitting there's a devil.
9:00
SPEAKER_01: I think they have a hard time admitting that it's impacting them.
9:03
SPEAKER_01: And uh so they're fighting carnal, they're fighting spiritual battles with carnal weapons.
9:07
SPEAKER_01: Well, if I budget better, if I get marriage counseling, if I read this self-help book, um, hey, I'm gonna get better.
9:13
SPEAKER_01: And if you don't fight it on a spiritual level, you can't win a spiritual battle.
9:16
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
9:17
SPEAKER_00: I think exactly what you said.
9:19
SPEAKER_00: I think they don't think that this spiritual warfare, this battle that we're in is impacting them because they don't actually understand what spiritual warfare looks like.
9:27
SPEAKER_00: Um we were kind of chatting before the podcast started, and I think whether it's Hollywood or history or whatever you look at, we've kind of been led to believe, and you kind of made the reference in your in your sermon, like, oh, the devil's this guy with with horns and a red pajamas and a pitchfork, you know, and it so then we start framing spiritual warfare as this dark, evil.
9:47
SPEAKER_00: I don't deal with witchcraft, I don't have Ouija boards, I don't have dark black things in my bedroom, so therefore I'm not battling spiritual warfare.
9:56
SPEAKER_00: Um but that's actually not the picture that scripture paints at all of what spiritual warfare is.
10:02
SPEAKER_00: Um, it's much more nuanced than that because Satan, as the deceiver, as the accuser, one of the worst tactics he could have would be to come at you with something so blatantly dark that we would say that's demonic.
10:15
SPEAKER_00: That's satanic.
10:16
SPEAKER_00: Don't watch that movie, don't do that thing.
10:18
SPEAKER_00: Meanwhile, you said it in the sermon, you know, like I'm mistreating my wife and I'm talking behind my friend's back and I'm, you know, shortcutting what God's called me to do because I'm I'm more Jonah than I am John.
10:31
SPEAKER_00: You know, like, no, that that's the satanic.
10:34
SPEAKER_00: That's the demonic.
10:35
SPEAKER_00: Don't don't let the sleight of hand fool you that, you know, and so I think that's the trick of like, of course I don't deal with spiritual warfare.
10:41
SPEAKER_00: I don't, I don't go to haunted houses, I don't watch rated R horror movies, I don't deal in the dark magic world, you know.
10:48
SPEAKER_00: I don't I didn't watch Harry Potter.
10:50
SPEAKER_00: Um, but at the same time, you know, I also don't serve in my church because it's more about me than anybody else.
10:55
SPEAKER_00: And you're like, that's that's right, that's the that's the satanic thing that you're part of.
11:00
SPEAKER_01: That's right.
11:01
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
11:01
SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, one of the things I I didn't mention Sunday, and it's I'm sure if people would view this as controversial, but I think this in part is is um is some spiritual battle that's happening in our nation.
11:10
SPEAKER_01: And not that Americans, not that we're perfect and we're the race or we're the community or we're the culture to have it all figured out and the rest of the world is wrong.
11:18
SPEAKER_01: But um, because we are probably more Christianized, I'm not necessarily Christian, but as a nation, you know, man, this influx of Muslims, again, I think we should have some on-ramp for people in other nations to come to this great nation and experience the freedom and liberty and prosperity that we get that many other nations don't experience.
11:37
SPEAKER_01: I think, man, this this influx of Muslims that are transforming communities.
11:42
SPEAKER_01: And when I say transforming community, it's not just what they believe, it's now what they're teaching.
11:46
SPEAKER_01: Uh, you can go into many cities in uh in Hamtrack, uh, in Dearborn, Michigan, and you can go in the middle of the day five times a day because part of their uh religion is praying five times a day.
11:57
SPEAKER_01: And you can go in and you can hear broadcast over a speaker over the entire city this prayer chant.
12:03
SPEAKER_01: Well, they're introducing, if you believe there's one God and Allah is not the one true God, they're worshiping publicly in our communities the false gods, which in my book are demons.
12:14
SPEAKER_01: It's demonic.
12:15
SPEAKER_01: That is spiritual warfare that we're like, well, man, we just we've got to let them, you know, worship a God.
12:20
SPEAKER_01: And again, I don't know how we deal with it, but I think to recognize what is spiritual warfare, what where's where is the enemy finding strongholds in?
12:27
SPEAKER_01: And I think it is in our hearts when we hate our brother.
12:31
SPEAKER_01: Uh we'll dig into a minute, uh, some conversation again we have beforehand, but it is definitely pride because that was the downfall of Satan.
12:38
SPEAKER_01: But I think it's the subtle takeover of what God's plans are by the enemy.
12:43
SPEAKER_01: And we either participate in that or we um we co-sign it, we help it help it pass that agenda further along, or we stand on the sideline and say, no, that's not the devil at all.
12:52
SPEAKER_01: And it happens any uh nonetheless.
12:54
SPEAKER_01: So um let's talk about this, man, this idea of the fall of the enemy.
12:58
SPEAKER_01: Again, it was pride.
13:00
SPEAKER_01: Um, and nobody likes to think they're prideful because that's what pride is.
13:05
SPEAKER_01: Like, I'm not proud.
13:07
SPEAKER_01: And uh, but it was the enemy, he used this three times.
13:10
SPEAKER_01: Um, Isaiah tells us, Isaiah 14, that the enemy said, I will.
13:14
SPEAKER_01: I will ascend to the heavens.
13:15
SPEAKER_01: I, you know, I'm gonna sit on the throne of God.
13:17
SPEAKER_01: And so anytime we start to say, I will, we have to recognize I'm putting my will, I will, over God's will.
13:24
SPEAKER_01: And if it's God's will, God is sovereign, God is control, he's our Lord, he's not just our savior.
13:29
SPEAKER_01: That's the easy evangelical out.
13:31
SPEAKER_01: He's not just my savior, he's my Lord, which means it's his way, not my way, it's his will, not my will.
13:36
SPEAKER_01: That's part of the Lord's prayer.
13:37
SPEAKER_01: Um, let your will be done, not mine, let your will be done on earth, not mine.
13:41
SPEAKER_01: And so anytime we start to put our will over the will of God, that's pride, that's arrogance, and that is what introduced the enemy into this world to be this person we know as Satan.
13:51
SPEAKER_01: And so there's a little bit of enemy in all of us because there's a little bit of pride in all of us.
13:56
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
13:56
SPEAKER_00: And I think taking it from the church standpoint, say we're talking to primarily Christians on the podcast, I think you can see that across the history of just say the American church specifically.
14:09
SPEAKER_00: Like we have um through the years, you kind of talk about that our Lord and our Savior, like the church is at fault in some ways because for so long we preach the savior part without going into the Lord.
14:22
SPEAKER_00: No, there's an obedience, there's a submission here.
14:24
SPEAKER_00: And especially in American culture, we do have this elite, it's my way, I don't, even down to the point if I disagree with something my preacher preaches, I'll just go find one that I agree with.
14:37
SPEAKER_00: That's pride, like that's you knowing better than a spiritual leader that you're called to submit to.
14:43
SPEAKER_00: Um, and so it's interesting that that the enemy has found his way.
14:47
SPEAKER_00: That that's he doesn't need you to not believe in God.
14:51
SPEAKER_00: Like he believes in God.
14:53
SPEAKER_00: The demons believe in God.
14:54
SPEAKER_00: Like, hey, guess what?
14:55
SPEAKER_00: They were they were in heaven with him.
14:57
SPEAKER_00: Um, he just doesn't want you to submit to him, he just doesn't want you to follow him.
15:01
SPEAKER_00: Um and we for so long have preached this you just need to believe, you just need to believe.
15:06
SPEAKER_00: Meanwhile, we've almost empowered people with this prideful, I get to do what I want, you know, mentality and still be a Christ follower all the while we're just sacrificing any effectiveness we would have for the kingdom.
15:20
SPEAKER_01: It's that mentality that gives the enemy a foothold.
15:22
SPEAKER_01: You know, it's um, you know, I don't believe that Christians, true Christ followers, can be possessed by a devil, but you can be oppressed, you can be impressed, where the enemy brings an impression in your heart and your mind that you act on, whether that's a temptation or a lie or deception, uh, or an oppression, man, where you feel, man, uh the a spiritual weight in your life, a season of darkness in your marriage or your home, those are from the enemy.
15:45
SPEAKER_01: And what opens the door to those, now the enemy's always looking for a crack.
15:48
SPEAKER_01: Man, I think all the way back where um, you know, Cain and Abel, you know, man, he got a warning, man, that that that temptation, that sin is creeping, it's crouching at the door.
15:58
SPEAKER_01: It's it's just looking, it's looking for you to crack the door of your life just a little bit.
16:02
SPEAKER_01: And man, the enemy's gonna come in because that is his desire.
16:05
SPEAKER_01: Uh, Peter, man, he says this, he says, man, stay alert.
16:08
SPEAKER_01: This enemy is like a roaring lion.
16:10
SPEAKER_01: He's traveling this world looking for someone to devour.
16:13
SPEAKER_01: So when you open the door of your life, especially to pride and arrogance, you think you know better than God.
16:18
SPEAKER_01: We refuse to submit to his will.
16:20
SPEAKER_01: That is the key door the enemy uses to come into our life and to attack us.
16:24
SPEAKER_01: Um so, man, I we I gave some of the titles.
16:27
SPEAKER_01: Uh, I gave uh really four primary ones, but I just did a quick search, and there's actually about 20 to 30, depending on the translation.
16:34
SPEAKER_01: Uh different names for the enemy, and they're really titles.
16:38
SPEAKER_01: I'm just gonna run through Satan, the devil, Beelzebub, uh, Belial.
16:42
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna talk about those in a couple weeks.
16:44
SPEAKER_01: Um, Abaddon, the tempter, the evil one, the father of lies, the accuser of the brethren, the serpent.
16:51
SPEAKER_01: Um, here's a big one: the God of this world or the God of this age, the prince of the power of the air, um, the angel of light.
16:58
SPEAKER_01: So, man, there's all these different ways.
16:59
SPEAKER_01: The same way God's word helps us understand who God is through the revelation of his titles and names.
17:05
SPEAKER_01: Again, for us to downplay or minimize or reject the idea that there's real spiritual warfare, man, the God God's word goes out of its way to give us 20 or 30 different descriptors to talk about here's your spiritual enemy.
17:17
SPEAKER_01: Again, it's not the person sitting next to you in church, it's not the person voting different than you in the voting booth, it's not the person who lives on the other side of the world.
17:25
SPEAKER_01: It is a spiritual enemy that has this um, these characteristics that his his ability is to come into our life, whether through lies or deceptions or pride, because he does not want us to experience the life that Jesus came to bring.
17:39
SPEAKER_01: He wants to bring you disruption and discouragement and deception and destruction if we let him.
17:45
SPEAKER_01: And the way we're gonna let him is by just acting like he's not there.
17:50
SPEAKER_00: And just understanding too, while all that being true, how good he actually is at it.
17:56
SPEAKER_00: You know, you said it in the message.
17:58
SPEAKER_00: One of the wildest things that you can read in scripture is somehow this uh this being, Lucifer, Satan, um somehow he was able to convince a third of the angels in heaven who see the glory of like they are experiencing the power and glory of God, and yet somehow he was so effective that beings who physically experience the literal presence of God saw him.
18:24
SPEAKER_00: If he could give us a third of those angels to rebel against that God and somehow put themselves ahead, how much easier is it for us who are who are living by faith that we haven't seen?
18:34
unknown: That's right.
18:35
SPEAKER_00: You know, so it's not just who he is, like he's really, really good at doing what he does.
18:42
SPEAKER_00: And it's always interesting to me, kind of almost on the same the same note.
18:46
SPEAKER_00: Um you'll hear a lot of people talk about, you know, the enemy's creative, like he comes at you in all these different ways, and really he's not.
18:53
SPEAKER_00: Like, really, he's he's kind of a one-trick pony.
18:55
SPEAKER_00: He's got he's got one trick, he's got one way of attacking.
18:59
SPEAKER_00: And he's been doing it since the Garden of Eden.
19:01
SPEAKER_00: And and kind of like you talked about it, it's really just that one little hint of did God really mean that?
19:06
SPEAKER_00: Did God really say that?
19:08
SPEAKER_00: And the second you allow that doubt to come in, pride steps in and you start thinking, well, maybe I know better.
19:13
SPEAKER_00: Maybe he didn't, maybe I didn't hear that.
19:15
SPEAKER_00: That's his trick, and it just plays out in a myriad of different ways depending on where we are and what we've allowed ourselves to to experience in life.
19:23
SPEAKER_01: You know, one of the things I said Sunday that um I've never heard anybody say before, which uh either says, like, wow, that was a great thought, or you know, I said something I shouldn't have said.
19:33
SPEAKER_01: Or obviously I've not heard all the preaching of all the world, of all the age, but you know, this idea that um, you know, what is Luke, what is his name?
19:41
SPEAKER_01: And we say the devil, we say Satan, we say all these titles, and that's exactly what many of what we read that I just read, those are titles, those are descriptors of what he does, not who he is.
19:52
SPEAKER_01: Um, and some people say Lucifer, and I want to read this.
19:55
SPEAKER_01: Isaiah 14, 12 says, How you are fallen from heaven, oh shining star, son of the morning.
20:00
SPEAKER_01: And that Hebrew phrase is Halel benchar.
20:03
SPEAKER_01: And that's what's originally written in the Hebrew, and when it was translated by Jerome in uh in around around 3300 or so A.D.
20:12
SPEAKER_01: out of Hebrew into Latin, the Latin Vulgate, um, he was reading this Hebrew and recognized this idea of the sun of the morning.
20:22
SPEAKER_01: Well, that was synonymous at that time and still in the first century, and now still today, that what we call the planet Venus is also called the morning star.
20:31
SPEAKER_01: It's it's typically the brightest, it's typically one of the brightest objects in the sky, and it's typically the brightest in the morning, like kind of the pre-dawn hour.
20:38
SPEAKER_01: So for generations, for millennia, people have recognized the planet Venus as the morning star.
20:44
SPEAKER_01: And so that's the translation.
20:46
SPEAKER_01: That's what Lucifer, who we call Lucifer, that's how he was described as the morning star, the light bringer.
20:51
SPEAKER_01: And so um, the Latin Vulgate translated that phrase as Lucifer.
20:56
SPEAKER_01: So God's word never really caused him Lucifer.
20:58
SPEAKER_01: We trans, we translated that phrase or that idea morning star into the name Lucifer.
21:03
SPEAKER_01: So that tells me his name isn't Lucifer, his name isn't Satan, his name isn't devil, deceiver, slander, all these other things.
21:10
SPEAKER_01: We don't know his name.
21:12
SPEAKER_01: We know his nature.
21:13
SPEAKER_01: And that is the most important thing is to understand not just that he's out there somewhere, but but what is his nature?
21:18
SPEAKER_01: His nature at the heart is to lie, is to deceive, is to accuse, is to take, and this is what I said.
21:25
SPEAKER_01: This was the kind of the culmination of what I wanted to get to Sunday is um is being a light bringer.
21:31
SPEAKER_01: He wants to cover what God has revealed, he wants to reveal what God has covered.
21:34
SPEAKER_01: And I just want to talk about that for a minute.
21:36
SPEAKER_01: When I say he wants to reveal what's God, what God's covered, the main thing God's covered in our life is our sin.
21:41
SPEAKER_01: That's what this amazing word atonement means.
21:44
SPEAKER_01: Um, it's a biblical word, it's a word not used a lot in culture, but it is foundational to our faith that that we were sinners.
21:50
SPEAKER_01: And Jesus basically came and stood in front of us on the cross of Calvary.
21:54
SPEAKER_01: He took our sin.
21:55
SPEAKER_01: He is our atonement.
21:57
SPEAKER_01: He is the one who took upon, he covered our sin and it went.
22:00
SPEAKER_01: On him.
22:01
SPEAKER_01: And um, but what does the enemy do, man?
22:03
SPEAKER_01: The enemy comes and slanders.
22:04
SPEAKER_01: He said, Yeah, but you still did it.
22:05
SPEAKER_01: You know, you still sinned, you still messed up.
22:07
SPEAKER_01: And he wants us to walk in guilt and in shame and in condemnation because that's what draws us back from the Father.
22:13
SPEAKER_01: Well, the whole point of this amazing thing we call Christianity was to draw us back to the Father, was to make a way to bridge the gap that sin had created.
22:21
SPEAKER_01: So what the enemy wants to do is to rob us from our relationship by lying to us and deceiving us, slandering us and accusing us.
22:27
SPEAKER_01: Why?
22:28
SPEAKER_01: Because he wants to reveal what God's covered.
22:32
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think even hearing that, like it's one of the titles, it's the accuser, you know, and like it's it's the condemnation for who we are.
22:40
SPEAKER_00: But scripture's clear.
22:41
SPEAKER_00: There is now, therefore, no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.
22:44
SPEAKER_00: And so understanding the difference in the condemnation that we feel from the enemy and the conviction that we feel from the spirit to bring us back, um, and just seeing how that plays out um goes back to our idea of like understanding what spiritual warfare is.
23:00
SPEAKER_00: Like when you're feeling condemnation and he's revealing all those things that you did and all the past, you know, I don't remember who it was.
23:07
SPEAKER_00: I'm a 90s Christian kid.
23:09
SPEAKER_00: So the old uh the old is it Carmen that uh, you know, when uh when Satan reminds you of your past, you remind him of his future.
23:16
SPEAKER_00: I mean, that still preaches.
23:18
SPEAKER_00: It's it's kind of corny, but it still preaches.
23:20
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the old Satan bite the devil.
23:22
SPEAKER_00: That's right.
23:23
SPEAKER_00: You know, the um, but that is how you attack it.
23:26
SPEAKER_00: You attack the lies with the truth.
23:28
SPEAKER_00: But like you said, you have to understand he's trying to cover what or he's trying to reveal what the Lord has covered already.
23:35
SPEAKER_00: Like, don't allow him to speak those lies.
23:37
SPEAKER_01: But I think again, most people, and I've been subject myself, when that happens, when I feel guilt, when I feel shame, now again, the Holy Spirit wants us to sense conviction because that's what turns our hearts to repentance to go back to God and and to put that back under the blood.
23:51
SPEAKER_01: But when we feel the shame or guilt to a level we feel like we need to run from God, we need to hide from God, just like Adam did in Genesis, that is the enemy.
23:59
SPEAKER_01: That is the work of the enemy.
24:01
SPEAKER_01: And I think that's what we don't recognize is spiritual warfare.
24:03
SPEAKER_01: Again, man, going back to what you said earlier.
24:05
SPEAKER_01: Spiritual warfare is not sitting at home watching the exorcist, where which I don't think really probably you should watch that, but that's my own personal opinion.
24:13
SPEAKER_01: Spiritual warfare is the enemy trying to rob you of the relationship you have with God.
24:16
SPEAKER_01: So rather than running to our Father, we run out of fear and shame and guilt.
24:21
SPEAKER_01: And that's the enemy saying, no, God still sees that, God still holds you accountable for that, which is not just an attack on us, but really that's an attack on Christ because he is the atoning sacrifice.
24:32
SPEAKER_01: He is the Lamb of God slain from the foundation of the world.
24:35
SPEAKER_01: And so we're not just doubting ourselves, we're doubting who Jesus has revealed himself to be.
24:40
SPEAKER_01: So that's why it's a spiritual attack, because it is the principle of scripture of who ultimately Jesus is to us that we're calling that into question.
24:48
SPEAKER_01: And man, that's what I think should wake us up and say, man, we got to fight this fight because we need to honor who God is, honor what Christ has done, and walk in what he wants us to live in.
24:58
SPEAKER_00: Yep.
24:58
SPEAKER_00: But I think the only way you can truly do that, which is again a weakness for for most Christ followers in in the modern day church, is the only way you can recognize and defeat a lie is to replace it with the truth.
25:11
SPEAKER_00: And you have to know the truth for that to be the case.
25:13
SPEAKER_00: So, like, do you know the word?
25:15
SPEAKER_00: You know, when you see Jesus in the wilderness literally in spiritual warfare, you know, say battling it out with with Satan, I mean it was never a fair fight.
25:25
SPEAKER_00: But Satan is is accusing him, he's bringing these and you mentioned it a few weeks ago.
25:31
SPEAKER_00: It's not when he said, I'll give you the kingdoms of the world.
25:33
SPEAKER_00: Jesus never said you can't do that.
25:36
SPEAKER_00: You know, again, going back to the power that he truly has of this world.
25:40
SPEAKER_00: Um but the way Jesus overcame every one of those lies was he just spoke the word.
25:44
SPEAKER_00: He just replied like you say it this, but this is what's written, you know, and scripture goes on to say, like that's speak the word, you know, flee from the devil.
25:54
SPEAKER_00: Like it, he can't beat that.
25:57
SPEAKER_01: Uh Ephesians six and this, you know, this idea, which I'm gonna get into this in I think week three, um, how we f one of the ways we fight our spiritual battles we're talking about right now is with the word of God.
26:06
SPEAKER_01: We have to respond with truth.
26:07
SPEAKER_01: We defeat lies with the truth.
26:09
SPEAKER_01: Um, Ephesians six, and in this idea of spiritual um armor, the only offensive weapon we have is the sword of the spirit, which is the word of God.
26:18
SPEAKER_01: The guy who disciple discipled me, he used to always say, A soldier without a sword is dead meat.
26:22
SPEAKER_01: If I would show up at his house without my Bible, he'd say, Where's your Bible at?
26:25
SPEAKER_01: Ah man, I left it at home.
26:26
SPEAKER_01: He said, Man, a soldier without a sword is dead meat.
26:28
SPEAKER_01: And that's literally true.
26:30
SPEAKER_01: Now, again, you don't have to carry a physical copy of the Bible.
26:33
SPEAKER_01: Um, David said in Psalm 119 that I've hidden your word in my heart that I might not sin against you.
26:39
SPEAKER_01: So until you get enough of it hidden in your heart, you need to keep a physical copy close.
26:42
SPEAKER_00: So keep a quick reference.
26:44
SPEAKER_01: So again, here's here's the idea.
26:45
SPEAKER_01: Again, we don't know his name, we know his nature.
26:47
SPEAKER_01: His nature is he's a lightbringer.
26:49
SPEAKER_01: So when he was in heaven, we believe he was at least central in bringing worship to God.
26:53
SPEAKER_01: He was, he, he shined a light on the glory of God.
26:56
SPEAKER_01: So when he fell because of his pride, he didn't lose his nature.
27:00
SPEAKER_01: He's still a light bringer.
27:01
SPEAKER_01: He's just chosen to focus his light on something else.
27:03
SPEAKER_01: So he does it by focusing his light, revealing our sin.
27:07
SPEAKER_01: Again, God's covered it.
27:08
SPEAKER_01: He wants to uncover it, he wants to reveal it.
27:10
SPEAKER_01: But then I talked about this other this idea on the other side.
27:12
SPEAKER_01: He wants to, he wants to reveal, um, or I'm sorry, he wants to cover what God's revealed.
27:18
SPEAKER_01: So God has covered our sin and the enemy wants to reveal it, but God has revealed his nature.
27:24
SPEAKER_01: Man, who is God?
27:26
SPEAKER_01: What do you think about God?
27:27
SPEAKER_01: When you, when you hear the word God, what do you like, what's your takeaway?
27:31
SPEAKER_01: What do you, what's your first go-to?
27:33
SPEAKER_01: And if it doesn't line up with the way God's revealed himself in scripture, you've been lied to.
27:37
SPEAKER_01: And so God has made himself known that he is good, he is merciful, he is kind, he is just.
27:43
SPEAKER_01: Um, and the enemy wants to attack that.
27:45
SPEAKER_01: He does not want us to buy into this idea that he is merciful.
27:49
SPEAKER_01: He wants us to think, man, no, he's this atrocious, wicked, vile, hate-filled, judgment-filled, whatever.
27:56
SPEAKER_01: Uh, in the enemy, part of his work is he wants to come and try to cover that over.
28:00
SPEAKER_01: And all of us, man, walk under this where we buy the lie and we contradict in our mind or confuse in our hearts or buy the lie that, man, God is not who he said he is.
28:10
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
28:10
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
28:10
SPEAKER_00: And people will use even scripture for that.
28:13
SPEAKER_00: They'll try to compare the old testament God versus the new, like, look at him destroying entire peoples, and like, what loving God would do that, or even the idea of hell itself, you know, God's not love.
28:23
SPEAKER_00: Like, you think a loving God would do that?
28:26
SPEAKER_00: Um, you're just calling into question the heart of the Father, and that's demonic, that's satanic.
28:32
SPEAKER_00: Um, when you experience that, when you have those thoughts, like, God wouldn't do that, would he?
28:37
SPEAKER_00: You're you're under attack.
28:39
SPEAKER_00: Um, and it's just if we were, you know, in a battle in the physical world right now, and you're getting gunshots ringing off the back wall behind you, you've got a realization of like I'm in it right now.
28:51
SPEAKER_00: Um, but the same things happen in the spiritual world, and we just go about our life acting like nothing's happening.
28:57
SPEAKER_01: I would say it this way when you when you start to begin to experience a question in your heart or in your mind, like, is God good?
29:04
SPEAKER_01: Um, did God really forgive my sin?
29:06
SPEAKER_01: When you start to experience the question, that is the beginning of a spiritual attack.
29:10
SPEAKER_01: And when you have the answer, and that answer is contrary to the word of God, you've lost the battle.
29:14
SPEAKER_01: So, man, no, God isn't good.
29:16
SPEAKER_01: God has abandoned me.
29:17
SPEAKER_01: God is not gonna, God's not gonna forgive me.
29:19
SPEAKER_01: I can't count on him.
29:21
SPEAKER_01: Um, or man, my sin's not forgiven.
29:23
SPEAKER_01: It's too great.
29:23
SPEAKER_01: You know, God, there's no way God could forgive a sinner like me.
29:26
SPEAKER_01: So ask having questions, now there's nothing wrong with questions, but we need to recognize when we start to ask questions in our mind or start to sense those questions creep in, uh, man, that's the enemy trying to find a stronghold in, find a way in.
29:39
SPEAKER_01: But again, when we get the answer, and that answer is contrary to the word of God, we've been deceived, we've lost the battle, and that we got to find our way back.
29:46
SPEAKER_01: And uh, so we I talk about this, I think this is so crazy.
29:49
SPEAKER_01: This is another conversation, but the technology that is existing in our world, holy bananas, the AI, we talked about this last week with uh Pastor Austin, and I know you and I have engaged in this, but uh I've read several articles about the ability right now that we currently have in our military to take large objects like tanks and basically make them disappear.
30:09
SPEAKER_01: That you could look at that tank and know it's there, and then the capacity and ability to bend light, it just vanishes.
30:16
SPEAKER_01: So I'm thinking it made me think of the enemy.
30:19
SPEAKER_01: Again, what does the enemy do?
30:20
SPEAKER_01: The enemy um reveals what God has covered and he covers what God has revealed because he's still a light bringer, he's got the capacity.
30:26
SPEAKER_01: Now, I'm not saying he's a scientist bending light, but I'm just referring to that nature that being a light bringer somehow he makes us miss what is obviously right in front of us, and that is the goodness and the mercy of God.
30:37
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
30:38
SPEAKER_00: And I think at the same time, while he wants us to question and not acknowledge who God is in our life and the power that God brings and and his nature, um, at the same time, he doesn't want us to see our own nature and what God said about us and who we've been created to be, and the power that we carry, that Jesus himself said that that you'll do greater things than even I did.
31:00
SPEAKER_00: And so when we allow the enemy to question our abilities and the callings and the abilities that God has given us, like I can't do that.
31:07
SPEAKER_00: I'll never be able to.
31:08
SPEAKER_00: I can't, I can't.
31:10
SPEAKER_00: Scripture says you can do all things through Christ who strengthens you, you know.
31:13
SPEAKER_00: And when you understand who your God is, you walk in a different confidence.
31:19
SPEAKER_00: And that you can see people that carry that in the way that they live their lives, in the way they speak, and the way they uh deal with conflict and the conflict in their lives because they understand the source of their strength.
31:30
SPEAKER_00: But at the same time, you can see those people who who struggle, that's oh, oh, weary me, I'm worthless, I can't do this.
31:36
SPEAKER_00: This this depression and anxiety and fear that has overtaken our world, that people question themselves, self-harm.
31:44
SPEAKER_00: That's Satan, you know, attacking what God has said that you are wonder beautiful, that you're wonderfully made, that you're a masterpiece.
31:51
SPEAKER_00: If he can get us to question ourselves in the same way, he's getting us to question the creator that created us the way we are.
31:59
SPEAKER_01: The uh the the goodness of God that he's revealed that the enemy wants to cover.
32:03
SPEAKER_01: You know, I just I think I mentioned the second service.
32:05
SPEAKER_01: I didn't mention at first.
32:07
SPEAKER_01: You know, God is holy and God calls us to be holy.
32:10
SPEAKER_01: And I think the enemy loves covering that over.
32:12
SPEAKER_01: Man, God has revealed himself.
32:14
SPEAKER_01: He does have a standard.
32:15
SPEAKER_01: God hates sin, but uh man, we're okay.
32:18
SPEAKER_01: And I don't speak this to speak condemnation and shame on anybody.
32:21
SPEAKER_01: I got God forbid I play the enemy's part for them.
32:24
SPEAKER_01: But man, we've so embraced and minimized divorce.
32:27
SPEAKER_01: Like it's just it's just a part of our world.
32:29
SPEAKER_01: Well, God's word says he hates divorce.
32:30
SPEAKER_01: So God has revealed that in his heart for communion, for unity, for the power of a covenant marriage, that he hates divorce.
32:38
SPEAKER_01: But man, we've accepted it as a society.
32:41
SPEAKER_01: Uh, people, and I know there's some struggling with the identity or the temptations of LGBTQ, but there's those that have just embraced it, like, well, God's okay with it.
32:49
SPEAKER_01: God's not okay with it.
32:51
SPEAKER_01: Again, he is the enemy has taken the hearts and the minds of those people, and this generation has covered over what God's revealed.
32:57
SPEAKER_01: Man, God is opposed to that.
32:59
SPEAKER_01: God is for one man and one woman in the context of marriage for life.
33:02
SPEAKER_01: Um, again, things we allow in our life, things we make excuses for.
33:06
SPEAKER_01: Man, we're living with people we're not married to, we're sleeping with whoever we want, we're watching stuff that is absolutely vile and dishonors the heart of God.
33:14
SPEAKER_01: And why do we do that?
33:15
SPEAKER_01: It's because we're the enemy has successfully deceived us and lied to us and said, Oh, God doesn't care, that God's okay with that.
33:21
SPEAKER_01: No, man, what's happened is the enemy has covered over what God has clearly revealed.
33:25
SPEAKER_01: He is holy, he is righteous, and he wants us to be sons and daughters of light and to walk in light the way he's the light.
33:31
SPEAKER_01: And so, uh man, we we have to get back to it.
33:33
SPEAKER_01: And the way we're gonna get back to the being the people God's called us to be is to recognize not just who God is, but who is the enemy, man, that's leading us astray, that's lying to us and deceiving us.
33:42
SPEAKER_01: And so I just want to end with this thought.
33:44
SPEAKER_01: And, you know, if you want to respond to it, you you can you I'll give you the closing word.
33:48
SPEAKER_01: But from my side, I always go back to something my dad said.
33:51
SPEAKER_01: There, there are no, there are no victims, there's only volunteers.
33:54
SPEAKER_01: And his mindset was like, if you leave your front door open and someone comes in and takes your stuff, like you're not really a victim, you know, you should have locked your door.
34:01
SPEAKER_01: If you're the type of person that leaves your car running at the gas station while you run into pay and someone takes your car, like, I mean, you are a victim, but you volunteer for that because there are people looking for those opportunities.
34:12
SPEAKER_01: And here's what we need to know is there is a real enemy and he's looking for victims.
34:17
SPEAKER_01: And if you're either not guarding your heart, either through number one awareness, number two, preparing to fight through knowing the word of God, you're volunteering, you know.
34:24
SPEAKER_01: So there are only victors or victims.
34:28
SPEAKER_01: There's you're gonna have a fight.
34:29
SPEAKER_01: You're gonna be in a spiritual battle, you're probably in one right now, and either you're gonna be a victim when it's over because you didn't fight back or you didn't think there was a battle, or you're gonna be a victor.
34:39
SPEAKER_01: Man, you've learned to fight in who you are in Jesus, knowing the truth of God, knowing the power of God, so we can overcome the plan of the enemy.
34:46
SPEAKER_01: So there are one or two options.
34:47
SPEAKER_01: There's no no battle, it's you're in one.
34:49
SPEAKER_01: Either you're a victim or you're gonna be a victor.
34:51
SPEAKER_01: You choose.
34:52
SPEAKER_00: Yep.
34:52
SPEAKER_00: And I think it's important, just you know, kind of my closing thought, I guess, is to also understand that while you're absolutely in a battle, you are in a fight, you're not fighting for victory, you're fighting from victory.
35:03
SPEAKER_00: You know, like the the corny bumper stickers and Christian t-shirts we see, and you referenced it in the message of, you know, it's not Jesus and Satan with boxing gloves on.
35:14
SPEAKER_00: This isn't a boxing match, you know, where they're swapping blows and eventually Jesus is gonna land the final punch.
35:20
SPEAKER_00: Like that that fight's over.
35:21
SPEAKER_00: That's right, he landed it already.
35:23
SPEAKER_00: This isn't a boxing match, you know.
35:24
SPEAKER_00: This is I don't remember who said it first, but it's not a boxing match.
35:27
SPEAKER_00: This is a wrestling match, you know, and I don't know where people land on wrestling these days.
35:32
SPEAKER_00: Uh I'm also I said I'm a 90s kid.
35:35
SPEAKER_00: Um, but you know, the the fight in a wrestling match, and I'm talking old school wrestling, macho man, Hulk Hogan, the wrestling itself is real.
35:45
SPEAKER_00: Like the pain is real, the violence that like the injuries that they like, the pain.
35:49
SPEAKER_00: The there were people whose entire lives were altered because of the damage that was done to them in those fights.
35:56
SPEAKER_00: Um wrestling is real, it's just predetermined.
36:00
SPEAKER_00: Like they knew who was gonna win before they went in, but it doesn't minimize the pain and the anguish and the fight and the blood, sweat, and tears that are gonna happen while you're in the ring.
36:10
SPEAKER_00: Um so yet the fight's over.
36:13
SPEAKER_00: It's ultimately won.
36:14
SPEAKER_00: We just have to see it through and understand that we're fighting from victory, that Jesus has already won the battle for us, that the battle is not ours, the battle is the Lord's.
36:22
SPEAKER_00: Um, and we just have to walk in that, having confidence that He is the one, but you can absolutely step out and you can still get you can still get your bell rung and take a metal chair across the back if you're not prepared for yourself.
36:37
SPEAKER_01: I love it, man.
36:37
SPEAKER_01: I love that illustration.
36:38
SPEAKER_01: That's such a great way to close.
36:40
SPEAKER_01: You know, hey, if you're watching this, I would encourage you, man, to go back and watch the entire message from Sunday if you didn't and make sure you're here for the rest of this series.
36:46
SPEAKER_01: Again, there is a God who radically loves you, and there is an enemy who radically hates you, and he's looking for any opportunity he can to find a way into your life to rob you from the plan and the purpose and the salvation that God has for all of us.
36:57
SPEAKER_01: And so we need to learn to fight the fight.
36:59
SPEAKER_01: So hope you join us next week for the XML podcast.
37:01
SPEAKER_01: We'll see you next week.