Latest / WoT Spoilers / Unexpected Encounters - The Gathering Storm chapter 12 - EP520

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Unexpected Encounters - The Gathering Storm chapter 12 - EP520 · WoT Spoilers

• 0:12
  Speaker 1: This is the Wheel of Time Spoilers podcast.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: You're saying the wind has created an unexpected encounter in
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: the Gulf stream lovely Seguey.
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: You guys can't see it in the recording, but I'm
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: making the most disgusted face Paul right now.
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so today we're doing just one chapter, Unexpected Encounters.
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: The symbol is the dark friend face. And I gotta
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: say I've got some high praise for this chapter. I
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: know you're probably not what you're expecting to hear from
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: me after the previous eleven chapters. This is the first
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: chapter to me except the prologue where I go, oh,
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: shit's happening, We are in it. The writing is good,
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: the characters are good. There's stuff happening in the background.
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: Sanderson does tend to over explain in a few places,
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: and I would like I would cut those lines in
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: order to make it feel a little more mysterious and
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: a little more discoverable. But I really do love this chapter.
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: To me, feels very real of time and very well done.
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: I think I completely agree, and I think part of
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: the reason why that's so said, why that's happening in
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: this chapter, is because this is a plot that has
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: been very very confusing and in the background of all
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: the other books, and so to have Agwaine and Sanderson
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: working together to like just bring it all together, lay
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: it out on the page in one coherent chapter is
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: very relieving. Like we have been building to putting all
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: these pieces together and having all the cards on the
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: table for a long time, and Sanderson's very good at
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: bringing things together, and Agwayne is very good things together.
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: So it just like it's just hitting on all notes.
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: When you get the sleeping bag into the bag after
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: all that stuffing and you just pull it tight. This
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: is that pulling tight moment where just like, yes, cinch
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: down on it, and it was like gotcha, and you're like,
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: now the storyline is compact in this nice little tight bag,
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: and we have all these plot lines. She gets to
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: meet the you have the rebels coming together with the
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: dark a Jaw Hunters coming together with her capture and
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: sort of this goal of saving the tower, and she's
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: making progress on convincing. Instead of just the same punishments
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: over and over and over again, she actually convinces some
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: people to change their mind, which is I mean, oh
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: my god, what, Yeah, it's progress, it's progress. Uh, and
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: and and that's where we're really seeing something happen. And
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: that's where it feels like I love this chapter because
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: we are moving, we are moving through these plot lines
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: to the point where when Aguaine does finally take over
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: at the end of this book, I believe it.
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: Mm hmmmmmm because of this and other similar scenes. Yeah. Absolutely, yeah,
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: it's no, no, no, no, it's so good.
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: So I think it's your reading.
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: Oh, yes, it is, because it's an Agwaine chapter of Wahahaha.
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: Aguaine walked the cavernous halls of the White Tower, lost
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: in thought. Her two Red Keepers trailed along behind. They
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: seemed a little sullen these days. Alida ordered them to
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: stay with Agwain more and more often, though the individuals changed,
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: there were almost always two with her, and yet it
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: seemed they could sense that Agwaine considered them to be
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: attendants rather than rather than guards. It had been well
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: over a month since Swann had conveyed her disturbing news
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: until Irenriod, but still again thought about it. The events
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: were a reminder that the world was coming apart. This
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: was a time when the White Tower should have been
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: a source of stability. Instead, it divided against itself, while
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: Randolphor's men bonded sisters. How could rand have allowed such
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: a thing? There was obviously a little left of the
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: youth with whom she'd grown up. Of course, there was
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: little of the youthful Igwayne left either. Gone were the
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: days when the two of them had seemed destined to
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: end up married, living on a little farm in the
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: two rivers. And I would keep reading except that the
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: next paragraph references Gowin and I will not be doing that.
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: It was like, no, no, Gwain content, just.
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: Y, we're not doing that. I have to have boundaries.
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: This is me ancerning my boundaries for self.
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: Care, which is good. Which is good because there's a
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: lot of Gowaen comming. And you're gonna have to set
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: that boundary high because it's it's a disturbingly large content
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: amount of the content of the next three.
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: Books Memory Hole, Why Why?
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: Why?
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: Five chapters later?
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah? I know, right, So we've got a time lapse
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: of a month, right, I feel like that's pretty important
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: to point out, like she has had a month to
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: worm her way into the tower. Have these meetings talk
• 5:08
  Speaker 2: to a lot of different isidide because there's not that
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: many left, right, like.
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: It's been more than a month since since she's been captured, right,
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: because this is a timestamp since Swan brought her news
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: about Helena and Delana, and that was like a week
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: or two into sure, sure.
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, we're looking like six weeks into this,
• 5:25
  Speaker 2: which I feel like catches her up a little bit
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: in the time stream. I feel like she's been behind
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: in the timeline. And again, I'm mostly going on fields
• 5:32
  Speaker 2: for these three books because there's no really good official
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: timeline I could find because Sanderson didn't really I think
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: keep to one. But to me, this feels like she's
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: caught catching up with some of the other characters, right,
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: Like a month is passing for her, But I don't
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: necessarily think it's passing for all the other characters we've
• 5:47
  Speaker 2: talked to.
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: Right, Like, in the meantime, while all these other things
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: we've been paying attention to happen in the meantime, Agwayne
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: has been having this go on. This is all very
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: internal to the Tower. There's no news, there's no rumors,
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: oh her blow by blows that could get out to
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: the others, so totally different track. So yeah, I think
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: you're totally right.
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: I think they get some rumors that the Ambulan may
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: have been captured or something like that. I think that
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: gets out.
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: Right, but like that's right up there with like the
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: tower has split, right, Like it's not really relevant to
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: her allies per se. Yeah, she's doing her clean the
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: patch of floor in front of you and save the
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: white Tower so that you can save the world. Which, yeah,
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: it is a witting strategy, it turns out. And she's
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: just doing that. And she points out that things have
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: been continuing to change in the tower right, like corridors
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: are swapping constantly, like it's just becoming normal.
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: And a transgender person is just another sign of the
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: end of the world.
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: All right, well, okay.
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: That's surprisingly appropriate for what happened today.
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: Fucking hell, I.
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: Mean, really is. She's like, the only way, the only
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: possible way someone who presents as a woman could channel side.
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: Is if the literal devil is ripping the world apart.
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: It seems thank you for the latent transphobia. You tried,
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: you consciously tried, and you're subconsciously.
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: Saying old no, but I you know, But she's like,
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: this is just another sign.
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel though, in in her.
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: Demense, sounds like someone holding the end of the world.
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: Transgender people are a sign of the apocalypse. Like, really, oh,
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: I know that's not what she's doing. I know this
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: is a forsaken I know this is something the dark
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: One did and corrupted. I understand what he's saying, but
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: oh my god.
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: Oh it's in twenty twenty five.
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: This is just hitting differently, a little differently, a little differently.
• 7:57
  Speaker 3: Oh.
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: I were laughing because you know, today was Trump's inauguration,
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: and we're.
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: Just yesterday was inauguration. Today was his first day, first
• 8:06
  Speaker 1: full day in office, and the fuckery is coming hard
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: and fast. So yes, laughter, because burning things down is
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: frowned upon. Yeah, we're we're not thinking about the damage
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: is doing someone Usay, I'm sorry, we're escaping cleaning the
• 8:21
  Speaker 1: patch of floor, one section of the floor, ATA time clean,
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: but you could reach.
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: And then move off. The greater pain. I really, yeah,
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: I'm not feeling a physical discomfort because right now there
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: is a greater pain of some evil splitting my country.
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: Sorry Tower, White Tower.
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: Yes, splitting us against ourselves when we should be facing
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: the existential crisis that is threatening the literal survival of
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: our species on the planet. We should be united and
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: leading the charge against the devil, I mean, climate change,
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: but now we're divided against ourselves featbreadths. The pain is great.
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: Kind of today kind of feels like they went back,
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: skewed a lighter from the Shan channel and put her
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: back in charge of the tower.
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: Literally literally, like what if a lighter came back and
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: they were like, you know what you did great last time,
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: you just do it again?
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, but yeah, so the okay back to just
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: book content. Agwayne is thinking like obviously this this was
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: her revelation, right that she can laugh through the pain,
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: because the pain of the tower being split is greater
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: than the physical plane. The emotional pain is yeah, so
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: bad that what happens to your body doesn't matter. And
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: I feel like, you know, on some level that's ridiculous,
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: right because pain hurts. But on another level, like we
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: see people do things that they shouldn't be able to
• 9:46
  Speaker 2: do because pain should stop them, because they convinced them,
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: you know, everything from lifting the car off a child
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: to climbing a mountain to getting out of escapes. Like
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: your brain can ignore pain wounds for quite some time, right, Yeah,
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: Just people functioning through chronic pain, Women functioning through chronic
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: pain all the fucking time, right, like.
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: Right, or like I've talked about getting tattooed before, Like
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: that's a great example of like just being like, yeah,
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: hurt me, and I will sit here and just be
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: calm about it, even as you are like etching into
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: my flesh. And also like people who stand up to torture, Yeah, right,
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: there are some people who who go down to figs
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: and mice and they crumble immediately. And there's other people
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: who don't give up their co conspirators up to the
• 10:29
  Speaker 1: point of death, and they die never having given up
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: the names of their co conspirators. Like, people can do
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: some wild shit in the face of torture.
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: The evidence shows that most people will just tell you
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: what you want to hear when you're being tortured, which
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: is why it's not a good source of information.
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: I'm literally talking about people who have gone to the
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: firing squad never having given up the name of their
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: co conspirators throughout history, Like, this is a thing that
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: has happened. They were tortured, they did not give up
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: the names, right, Like that's a documented thing that happens,
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: and then you know most people don't. But it's like, clearly,
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: there are many many instances in which your mind overpowers
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: what your body is experiencing. And you're like, no, I
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: simply judge that insufficient to change my behavior. I mean
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: the effect it hurts, but fuck it, you know, but
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: not even the placebo effect, just like it is possible
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: to decide that the physical pain does not need to
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: change your behavior.
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: Right, I'm the figs and once person.
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: Sure yeah, sure, but like I mean, like you said,
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: mountain climbers, like going to Everest involves being absolutely miserable
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: for several months straight, like literally every second of every day,
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: your body is dying and it sucks. And that starts
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: like on your way into base camp, and it takes
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: months to actually get up to the summit or to
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: the summit attempt, and yet people pay all the money
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: to do it, and it is physically demanding and horrible
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: and miserable, like the whole time, Like the actual experience
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: of being there is miserable.
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: The quote every corpse on non Everest was once a
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: highly motivated person.
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: So motivated and very wealthy too. Well, not every corpse obviously,
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: shirpas die too, but yeah, all the ones in fancy
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: neon climbing gear, very wealthy in addition to being very motivated.
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: We are just morbid today, aren't we.
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: Dude? I have been watching watching videos of the twenty
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: eleven to Hoku tsunami like a bunch lately. Why I
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: My mom has a thing about watching plane crashes. I
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: like to think I'm being very reasonable, like just watching
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: tsunami damage. But that and the Boxing Day tsunami.
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: Do you know how many more tsunamis kill so many
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: more people?
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but they're just so.
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: Or is your excuse? Geology? Is that what you're You're like,
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: it's an earthquake thing.
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: Yep, yeah, yep. Well, and also, I'm fascinated by the
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: physics of water. It always happens since I was a
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: little kid. It's definitely like an autistic stem for me
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: to just watch water flowing over things. So watching a
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: tsunami like decimate a coastal town, just come up into
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: the harbor and destroy everything and then drag it all
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: back out like it just But Yeah, the more stressed
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: I get, the I'm like, I want to watch tsunami videos,
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: and I'm like, I never understood my mom being like
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: I'm really depressed. So I'm gonna watch plane crash videos
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: and suddenly, as of like about a month ago, I
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: suddenly get it because I am just like, yes, an
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: hour of just watching shaky handheld footage of tsunamis coming
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: in is what is doing it for me?
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: What the fuck? So?
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, fucking morbid?
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: So my you know, non educated theory is that like
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: your brain is saying, oh my god, there's a disaster,
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: and you're saying, well, at least it's not a tsunami.
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: You're like recalibrating your brain to be like, oh, it
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: could be a tsunami. Calm down, it's not that bad.
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: And that like that calms your nervous system down a
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: little bit to be like, oh, Okay, this isn't the
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: disaster that's actually going on.
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that could be part of it is it's controllable.
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: I'm not ruminating on what could happen to me. I
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: am focusing on what did happen to someone else? And yeah,
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: like I recently learned about new things about the Boxing
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: Day tsunami. Like I I didn't really know many of
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: the like specific regional things that happened in that tsunami.
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: I just knew a lot of people died in a lot. Well,
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: I knew the thing about the Thai resort towns getting
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: smashed because that's where all the rich foreigners were, but
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: like I had never heard of the town of Akra
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: or the train disaster that happened. But it's like the
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: worst train disaster in all of like rail history, because
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: it got stuck on the tracks when a tsunami came
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: in boxing day. And it's pretty trains generally are a
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: force of nature, but not in the face of a tsunami.
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: No. Tsunamis are crazy and they.
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: Like and they have like one of the rail cars
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: is like in a museum in this town, just like
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: the reporters are just going there and being like here
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: it is. Here's one of the six train cars and
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: it's all twisted and like it's just yeah. So I've
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: been learning new stuff about that because it was a very,
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: very devastating tsunami.
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: This is so off topic, guys. I you know, I
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: wish I could say that American politics didn't affect us
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: on a very deep level, but we're both very political creatures,
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: you know, outside this podcast, and it's hard not to
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: feel a little overwhelmed by what's going on in the country. Today.
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: And by the way, I have all the other stuff
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: going on, which if you want to hear about, it's
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: at the end.
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: I mean, existence is political.
• 15:20
  Speaker 2: Oh god, you can.
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: You cannot do politics all you want. But to paraphrase
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: someone whose name I'm forgetting, politics is going to do you.
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: So you know, existing is a political act, and we
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: are attempting to pay attention, which supposedly makes us political.
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: It's not. Can we please stop talking about the real war?
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: Yes, please, please. We're gonna cut all this right, You're
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: gonna cut all of it all with fire, thank you,
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: good God. Sorry, live people your eurotherapy. I apologize. We
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: should pay you for this.
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: Serious. I'm just gonna wave Patreon for a bile.
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: So we have two encounters that were really kind of matter.
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: There's a couple of more right that show that she's
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: like making progress, But the two that matter, they bring
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: up right here right Medonnie and Beldan Bellane Ben ben
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: I Ben I. Thank you geez. My brain sometimes sees
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: a name and substitutes a name that I know without
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: reading the full name. It's one of the things because
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: like I read and I realized this. Someone said this
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: on TikTok right, So I'm watching TikTok, don't hold out
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: the fucking thing, and he's like, I read novels like
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: blah blah blah, went to Da Da Da and saw
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: mam ma, you know, and I'm not necessarily reading the
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: whole name until it matters.
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: Okay, personally attacked first of all.
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: And so sometimes there's so many many names that are
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: similar in Jordan that my mamma and mama ma are
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: just swap because I don't read the names closely enough.
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: And this is why I love audio books, because someone
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: got paid to do a better job than my brain
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: will do automatically, and I will have the very clear
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: renunciation of ben I now said just in my head,
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: and like I can't fall prey to that exact speed
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: reading pitfall that my brain does.
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: And yeah, and it's it's you know, spin Spinoicable is
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: saying it's a speed reading tactic, and I believe it.
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: It's just something I've developed, you know, something I've always
• 17:31
  Speaker 2: done as a kid, like, but I've always read very quickly.
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: I think, so dyslexia tactic.
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, there is a little bit of that, because Jesus.
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: Because it's like, so the name that starts with X.
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: All right, co co cool the name that starts with P.
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: Anyway, moving on, Oh no, there's two names to start
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: with P. Okay, there's a PA and a pe mm hmm.
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: Oh, there's a P that wears a dress, and there's
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: a P that's a stable handle.
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: Right, yeah, exactly, exactly, yeah, yeah, that's that's why I
• 17:56
  Speaker 2: read names, and that's and that's why when people are
• 17:59
  Speaker 2: you over pronunciation about names, I'm like, ah, I didn't
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: even pronounce it in my head. I never did, like
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: did you say ninive or ninave? I said the N one,
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: the n y one, it's gotten n in it, and
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: then a whine.
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah yeah it was nine. Yeah. It's like the thing
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: where I recently I saw TikTok a couple of weeks ago.
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: That was like a song where they played it was
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: just one verse worth of time, but they played all
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: the verses and the chorus at the same time, and
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: it was daft punk, so it was all, you know,
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: extremely precise, and everything was time SYNCD and it was like,
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: doesn't this sound cool? And all the comments are like
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: that's just how music sounds in my head, Like I'm like, yeah,
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: I hear the whole song at once too. And names
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: are like that, Like I just hear all of the
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: syllables in the name at once, and then you try
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: to ask me to physically make it a linear order,
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: and I'm like, eh, I don't know the order they go.
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: And I just said that they all exist in a
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: word picture that has four dimensions in my head. Like
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: I'm sorry, I can't speak.
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: It, but you know, I really enjoyed reading out loud
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: and that forces me to actually look at the letters
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: in a way that I don't when i'm reading silently. Yeah.
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, No, audiobooking, either as a narrator or a listener,
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: is a really good way to realize what you've been missing.
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: Right, And now you understand why names that start with
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: U s are such a problem for us. Yeah, because
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: there are too many.
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: But yeah, the point here is that may Donnie has
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: finally come through on summoning a Gwaine to talk about everything,
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: and Ben I now said, has finally summoned a Gwaine
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: to talk about the seed that Agwain planted last time
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: she visited her. So it's two different instances of a
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: second meeting with a woman that she has been trying
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: to meet with. They both happen to call for her
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: on the same day even though they have nothing to
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: do with each other since.
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: Knife of Dreams. Right, so these are both follow up
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: meetings that happen in Knife of Dreams, which I think
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: is like a nice little capin that Brandon's writing. This
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: one is where she starts off by performing a bunch
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: to the weaves that she performs, you know, all the
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: time to prove that she's like, you know, the same
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: one she did last time, and she's like, well, what's
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: going on? Which is actually interesting because I was thinking
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: about it. Agwayne gets so much practice channeling with fork
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: Root in her I thought that that was an interesting
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: foreshadowing for when the Shawn Chan attack. Right this all
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: this practice is like, oh well, it makes sense because like,
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: up to this point, fork rout to me has been
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: like you can't you either can't channel at all, or like,
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: once you can, you can channel all your power. Right this,
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: like weak level of brew seems to follow slightly different rules,
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: and I feel like Sanderson's kind of presenting them here
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: to be like, you know, and I know Jordan did
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: it where she was able to do those balls and
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: stuff like that, but like the fact that she's able
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: to create entirely an entire weave with an entire gateway
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: with the weaves just not powerful enough seems a little
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: different to me.
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but I wonder if it does really increase her
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: dexterity and her ability and her capacity within that constraint,
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: Like they're just powering her up.
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: Right that. I'm wondering if she's building up to that. Right, Like,
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: over the last month, she's you know, she's been forced
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: to do a lot with a little and that does
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: mean that when she gets her full power back, oh
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: my god, she's leveled up again in terms of like
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: what she can do with the power available to her.
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: Right right, But yeah, she basically does the same meeting
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: she did with Bennett before. Ben I just kind of
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: tries to pretend that she can just like repeat and
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: then just really casually like pick up the thread. It's
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: like and it grain's like, that was the least casual
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: thing I've ever seen.
• 21:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah, So what if you started a podcast with Patreons
• 21:41
  Speaker 3: and suddenly you had you know, it's like that level
• 21:43
  Speaker 3: of like what you talked me about, we're sitting on
• 21:46
  Speaker 3: in that situation right now.
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: It's a terrible hypothetical you're clearly getting. So she was punished, right,
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: So she went up asked about the secret library, was
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: punished for it basically because they and she's like, I
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: don't understand why I'm being punished for just asking about
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: this thing, and which is okay really first of all
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: and second of all, and so it Wwayne comes back
• 22:07
  Speaker 2: and basically says, you're punished because they're wondering how you
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: found out, right, you didn't tell them, so they're trying
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: to find the source of the league. So they want
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: to keep you out of the way. So you're not
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: going to warn the person who told you. But realistically,
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: if you just tell them it was me, that will
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: solve the problem, right, because they'll know that I got
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: the information from the rebels, not from inside your organization.
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: And then to deal with me, all you have to
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: do is make me one of the keepers of the information.
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: And then I'm not that I'm I mean, I'm on
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: the in group. Just put me on the end group, right.
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: Which is like catnip for a brown, Right. You know
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: how you got in trouble because you were curious, but
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: you know the solution to that could involve you getting
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: the answers one of those questions and even more, and
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: Benna is like, please lead me around by the nose.
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: I am completely smitten because that is how Browns are.
• 22:59
  Speaker 2: I will say, like it. I don't know if it's
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: just doesn't feel that clever, right, but it feels like
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: Bene should have be able to like figure that one out.
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: To me, this whole sequence of meetings that takes place
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: in this chapter gives me that level of like primary
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: color cassio keyboard, Like I thought these women were centuries old, right,
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: and yet they keep having these very unsubtle asks of
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: a childld. I mean, she is twenty twenty, and you're
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: telling me that two hundred year old ass. You're telling
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: me that your two hundred year old ass couldn't think
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: of these common sense things. And I just it's like,
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: I feel like it's Sanderson being like, look, she's able
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: to work with every ADJA on their own terms, speak
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: to them where they are, and that's great. I just
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: wish that he didn't need to diminish the isidize like
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: intelligence so dramatically to do it.
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, agreed. You know there's a lack of cleverness in
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: the writing there.
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: And it is, and we are told to think of
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: it as clever. That's what annoys me.
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: Yes, yes, I think that's that's what throws me. Yeah.
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, these are clever women who do clever things, and
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: they're praising a Gwain for being clever. And I'm not
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: seeing clever, right, seeing common sense and basic human empathy,
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: which I get for Isidaie is a radical concept, but
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: it's not clever.
• 24:26
  Speaker 2: Right, and so maybe that's what it is. Maybe that's
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: what it is. It's like, oh my god, human empathy. Wow,
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: we never thought of that, right, Like isid I really? Yeah?
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: That bits, that bits that has the Ivory Tower does
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: lack in human empathy. That is a very real problem.
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: And also think about the subset of Isidie we're talking about.
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: We're talking about the ones with the least empathy, the
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: ones with the most stubborn. We're gonna do tradition the
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: way it was she got raised. That's the law. This
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: is what we're gonna do, isidi Yeah.
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: Not working with the radical progressive eyes today. She's working
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: with the extremely high bound conservative eyes today.
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: So maybe she's just going in going have you tried empathy?
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: And they're going no, that's brilliant.
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: They're all right, gen Z will save us.
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: No.
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: I think that's actually probably maybe what Sanderson was going for,
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: because that is you want it to be truly clever,
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: but it is it is true that we've been complaining
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: since book one about how the Eyes to Dye are
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: cold and aloof and should be more in the world
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: and existing. And Agwayne is a teenager from a rural
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: village who was raised near the top of that power structure,
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: and it's just kind of like, well, have you tried
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: doing like really basic common sense on the ground things,
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: And they're like, we haven't been there in like two
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: thousand years, like that was the last time we touched grass.
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: So and I do feel like they're all tied up
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: in their own tradition. They're all, you know, fucked up
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: with Alida and her weird rules and the like the
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: promotions and the demotions, and a Spinedoinkle is making a
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: good point that like, you know, Parent kind of had
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: the same plotline when you went to Two Rivers, which
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: is like, hey, stop trying to defend yourselves and gather together,
• 26:13
  Speaker 2: gir else you're gonna get overwhelmed. And everyone's like, yeah, no.
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: Shit, stop waiting for the others to defend you.
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: The only the only thing I'll say about that is
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: that's more. Paren was the spark that, you know, you
• 26:25
  Speaker 2: need someone to start a movement. No one wants to
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: be the first person to abandon their farm, right, And
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: so that very much had bystander effect to me. And
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: Paren was just overstanding by overcoming bystander effect by saying,
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: come on, let's go like this. This is bad. You
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: need to follow me, right, And he was the first
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: one in and everybody else.
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: Was kind of following him, Yeah, Which I mean that
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: is kind of what Agwainne's doing too. She's going to
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: all the bystanders one by one and saying you need
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: to be the first, right, knowing that if she says
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: that to six different people and one of them even
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: starts to twitch that direction, the other five will all
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: race to beat them to it. And Gay are very
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: similar in so many ways, so that fits they are.
• 27:04
  Speaker 2: I mean, that's yeah, that's true. True. They were paired
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: together after the right.
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they have very similar person I was also, they
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: were the only two raised in town. Right, They're the
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: Tawnis of the.
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: Friend group, right, right. They both went to the He
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: went home to make it a big city and she
• 27:20
  Speaker 2: went to the big city.
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: Right exactly. But they both met in town and like
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: they existed in that space and they're really good friends.
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: So I could totally see them having the same kind
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: of like common sense why are you waiting to take
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: care of yourselves approach and having that be Yeah, for
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: them to be similar in that way makes sense. And
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: parent did it at home, so he had it was
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: a different context. Agwayne is again leaning around women who
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: haven't touched grass in thousands of years, right, Okay, so
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: it's it's they think it's clever. It's not clever, it's
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: common sense. But when you're that isolated from the world,
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: you think common sense is clever. That's the isodize problem.
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: And we did it with rand right with the whole
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: like Kyrie Ann in burning the letter right, like just
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: what is this crazy manipulation? Oh my god, he's brilliant.
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: He's just doing what he says he's going to do.
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: You know, like that level of you're so tied around
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: your own axle that you can't see what's right in
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: front of your face, and it feels clever when someone
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: does what they say, Right, what other experience have I
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: had where its people find it odd when I do
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: exactly what I say and say exactly what I mean honest.
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: So I didn't bait you on that one at all.
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: Like I am a coach now it is catnip to me.
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: I can always get to just.
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: Say it's it's my job. It's literally my job now.
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: So yeah, she has this little unjust punishments cannot be avoided,
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: but it's best never to let others forget that it
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: is unjust. Right, that's that's a point that's come across
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: with the demotion of the woman to Agwayne's punishment to
• 28:55
  Speaker 2: like this idea that if you accept the punishment, it
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: becomes legit, and I don't accept it. It's not legit.
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's the thing I've heard in other contexts of
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: like why are you asking permission from people who don't
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: think that you're worthy? Like why are you giving them
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: the ability to determine your worth? Like fuck them, they
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: don't think you're worthy, Like, don't wait for their approval,
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: Like it doesn't matter if they don't like you, because they.
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: Don't like you, right, and they never will.
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: Exactly, Like they're not going to give you what you
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: want for bending over backwards, or them they don't think
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: you're worthy, Like, so don't don't give them that authority
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: over your peace of mind or over your literal paycheck
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: or whatever the case may be.
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: Like, no, yeah, they try not to, try not to.
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: Sometimes in society you have to put on a mask
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: and go out there and pretend.
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but you really want to be cognizantive when that's
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: happening and find ways to do it as little as possible.
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: But yeah, it's important to remind people of when they're
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: being fucking dumb asses, you know, even if it's just
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: with a silent protest of not, you know, being upset
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: at her beatings, it's still like, I disagree with this.
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: I'm not giving you the power to make me upset
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: about it. That's how she's handling it. And she's telling
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: Ben I like, do a tenth of what I'm doing,
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: you'll be fine. I also love in her room that
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: she's got a model of the sun. Again, this is
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: not a medieval society where there's no scientific literacy and
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: people think the world is fine. This is a post
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: utopia where they knew about science, They knew about other worlds,
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: like the knowledge level is a moth eaten map, right,
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: it was hole once, it was an actual map once.
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: It is absolutely Swiss cheese now. But like there's little
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: bits and pieces of what used to be. And she
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: has a model of the sun.
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: That's so cool. That's good ketch, I didn't see that.
• 30:40
  Speaker 2: What's the quote?
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: Oh, it's just when a grain first enters the room,
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: she just kind of is looking around and Agwain had
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: to duck her head beneath a model of the sun
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: in order to reach the place where ben I stood. Cool,
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: But it's just it's like a model of the sun.
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: How do you how do you model the sun? If
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: you're a Oh right, this isn't medieval, right, this is
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: post technology.
• 31:00
  Speaker 2: Peak and in places it's medieval, right, Like two of
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: hers is pretty damn medieval.
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: Right, But like Ninive knows the word for infection, she
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: doesn't call them demons, right, Like little bits and pieces
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: as necessary have sustained from a place of actually knowing things.
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: So then there's a couple of rapid fire visits where
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: she basically does the same thing right, where she answers
• 31:22
  Speaker 2: a question given a hypothetical. She does it with a
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: white sister. Right, she already done it with Bene, and
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: Benne was brown.
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: And then she does it with a yellow, a yellow
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: who likes herbs. She has the thought that, like Ninive
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: needs to stop being so judgy about all eyes to
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: die hating herbs, because this yellow's room is literally like
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: overflowing with plants. Even with all the plant rot and
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: ridiculousness that the dark ones bringing on the world, this
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: room is bursting with the energy of a garden. So
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: like not all yellows, nineve.
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: And then she ends up in Meidani's which is gray. Yeah,
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: so she's hitting like all the ajas, right, because there's
• 31:57
  Speaker 2: no blue, and she's not gonna do much with the red.
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: She's doing what she's doing with the red on a
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: different front, right, her Sylviana connections. Yeah, red exactuation, but yeah,
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: this is a chance for her to be Omelin right,
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: to touch every Adja with the same vibe, and to
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: show us that all the Adjas are trying to recruit her.
• 32:17
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: This is also when we get the montage of the
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: Adjas really fighting over her in a very polite and right.
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: They're all trying to put a steak on her and
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: it's like proof that she's going to be a good
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: Omereland because every Adja would claim her if they could.
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: And what she's doing is she's going to them and saying, hey,
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: you need to heal the tower because you're gray and
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: the grays negotiate between two sides. You're yellow, and you
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: need to heal the divide you're brown. You need to
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: know that history, doesn't you know, you can't repeat history
• 32:47
  Speaker 2: because you know history. Like she's going to all of
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: these different adjaws and saying you need to heal the
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: tower because of your oddja and putting it in that terms,
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: which they then turn around and go, oh, that's really brilliant.
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: You know, you'd fit in really well here if you
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: can think like that, basically, if you can think of
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: solving the problem in terms of our odd jaws viewpoint, yeah, exactly,
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: then you would fit in well here. And she's she's
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: doing that with everybody because she's trying to convince them
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: to heal the divide. And that's kind of then that
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: convinces people that she is of the sort of all odd.
• 33:19
  Speaker 1: Jaws exactly exactly. She's demonstrating that she can think like
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: any Adja and every Adja. So maybe she is of
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: all adjas and none in the most literal sense.
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: Maybe, And so I think that's part partially what's going
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: towards convincing people because they get together and like, oh no,
• 33:39
  Speaker 2: she was great with us, she would totally be one
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: of us, and everyone's like, wow, all the odd jaws
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: want her. That's interesting. Maybe she is. Yeah, So I
• 33:48
  Speaker 2: think it's it's great foreshadowing for her becoming ambulancey. I
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: like what he's doing here. Yeah. Oh.
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: It definitely factors into the later conversations about like we
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: have to choose her because we know everyone already likes her.
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: This is definitely critical to her ultimate raising. But then
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: when she gets to may Donnie, we're not doing that
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: routine alone. We are also following up on the fact
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: that may Donnie is one of the ferrets.
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, which is a long plot line that's sort
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: of coming to arrest here or at least coming together
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: here with this one. And that's where they there's this
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: argument between may Donnie and mcguayene, where Madonni's like, you're
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: not the amberlan seed anymore and Gwaene's like why not,
• 34:27
  Speaker 2: and m'donna's like, well, you've been overthrown and captured.
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: No, that's not may Donnie. That's that's Ukiri. That's later.
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: May Donnie's already on board by the time that they
• 34:37
  Speaker 1: get to that meeting.
• 34:38
  Speaker 2: No, No, I'm talking about may Donnie. The amberally needs not
• 34:41
  Speaker 2: the regard follower, so long as she is obeyed. You've
• 34:44
  Speaker 2: been captured and overthrown, Agwayn raised an eyebrow meeting may
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: Donnie's gaze captured. True.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, she goes through that conversation twice. We enter may
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: Donnie's room and it's a museum and it's beautiful and
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: its gorgeous and there's tons of artifacts, and may Donnie,
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: a Gray, is given some backstory that we don't usually
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: get with the Gray because the Gray are seen as
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: like the lawyers, so no one cares about that. But
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: may Donnie's given a very fun backstory when you get
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: into her rooms, about how she loves traveling and people
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: always give her cool stuff, and it's just nice to
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: take a moment to develop a character before getting into Yeah,
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: Agwayne actually being clever. On the one hand, obviously Agwaine's
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: being logical, but it's like she is actually dueling words
• 35:26
  Speaker 1: with uys to die in a way that I do
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: think is clever here. And yeah, she does have to
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: convince may Donnie that she's a Marline properly in order
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: to take in order to convince Ma Donnia to take
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: her to women that she can then reiterate those arguments too.
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: And may Donnie ends up being loyal, right, And may
• 35:42
  Speaker 2: Donnie gets rid of Varren's.
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: Body, yes, and then that's the last time we see
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: her really.
• 35:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, she and Varren disappear at the same time. She's
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: not in the last battle or anything like that as
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: far as I can tell.
• 35:55
  Speaker 1: Well, that's upsetting. I disapprove of that. She should have
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: gotten a little bit more closure than go get rid
• 36:03
  Speaker 1: of the body with Varren.
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: But you know, it proves she was loyal to Agwaine
• 36:07
  Speaker 2: through the end, right, That's who she ended up being,
• 36:09
  Speaker 2: is someone who was loyal to Agwaine and you know,
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: helped with her plans and everything like that. But yeah,
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: no no death, no life, no assumptions about where she
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: ended up, just part of the White Tower, who assuming
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: is still around after the last battle. So yeah, Agwaine
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: basically goes all in saying like, hey, I need may
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: Donnie because I need the rebels at least, right, Like,
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: if I'm going to undermine people ferrets, the ferrets, I
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: need the ferrets to at least be loyal to me, right,
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: I need them to admit I'm still their ammelin. They
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: were sent in as part of my group. Right, they
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: are here as part of my group that is loyal
• 36:44
  Speaker 2: to me. They need to stay loyal to me or
• 36:46
  Speaker 2: I'm screwed. So she goes all in on may Donnie
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: and basically says, I am still your mammelin. I'm still
• 36:50
  Speaker 2: in communication with the hall. They have not elected a
• 36:53
  Speaker 2: new leader. What are you going to do? Right? Are you?
• 36:57
  Speaker 2: Are you a trader? And she's like no, and it's
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: like okay, then dime your ambulance, zy deal with it, And.
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: In so doing is also able to prove that May
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: Donnie's not black Aja.
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: It's like you're either lying, lying, or cool. And ultimately
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: May Donnie's like, I'm cool, I'm cool.
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry cool? Now are you cool? No? That's good.
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: But in that in that process there's obviously something she
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: can't say.
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: I cannot say. She's like running up against like a
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: computer firewall of like I cannot say I literally magically,
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: those are the three words I can say on the subject,
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: or that I cannot say.
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: My responses are limited. You must ask the right questions.
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: And then Agwaine does a clever thing, genuinely clever, and says,
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: all right, fuck it, let's change mediums. What if we
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: just went there? What if you showed me, Yeah, that whole.
• 37:51
  Speaker 2: Bit, because it's it's good, it's that's the whole clever.
• 37:54
  Speaker 2: It's actually clever. That's the for trying to get clever
• 37:56
  Speaker 2: a GWayne. It's like, oh, how do we get around
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: an oath? And it's like that's something and see and
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: we went back and saw them make her give that oath,
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: and we didn't think about it until now, and yep,
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: very clever. You can't tell me what's wrong. I suspect
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: that the three o's are involved, well, four oaths. The
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: light knows how we can work around the problem. You
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: can't tell me why you've remained in the White Tower,
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: But can you show me may Donny cocked her head.
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: I'm not sure I could take you to little cut off.
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: There's the oaths. That's that's the definitive, Like, yep, someone's
• 38:31
  Speaker 2: been cut off by one of the oaths.
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: Right, It's like there's there's no way to fake that.
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: I mean, obviously we just tried, but like you assume
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: that when you're actually bound by the oaths, that like
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: there's a very specific like inability to move.
• 38:43
  Speaker 2: I wonder if the black ever do that have that,
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: because like, so here's here's here's a question, right, this
• 38:52
  Speaker 2: is interesting. The Black are not allowed to betray their oaths? Right, sure,
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: that's why. I forget exactly what the wording of it,
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: but it's actually they can't reveal that they're black.
• 39:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they can't reveal the existence of the order.
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: So I have to wonder if lying obviously would reveal
• 39:10
  Speaker 2: that they're black. Could they kind of duplicate the effect
• 39:15
  Speaker 2: of the first oath against lying because the Black oath
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: would cut them off because lying would reveal themselves? And
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: could they get that? Like now, obviously black has to
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: be able to lie sometimes, but if they did that,
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: like your dress is green? Thing? Could Varren have said
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: your dress is green if.
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: She hadn't already poisoned herself.
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: If she hadn't already poisoned herself, I don't think she
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: could have. I think she would have said, your dresses.
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: I completely agree. Yeah, she had, and you'll notice I've
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: listened to the chapter and paid attention. She takes a
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: couple of good long SIPs of tea and like has
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: a little bit of conversation with Agwain and just makes
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: conversation and then drops the bombshell, and it's like, yeah,
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: that was to guarantee that the poison was in her
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: and thus allow her to start revealing the order exactly exactly. Yeah.
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: So one imagines that most black Ajia would not end
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: up in that kind of a situation because they're nefarious,
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: evil people and they would find other easier, more expedient
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: ways of resolving the situation. But in theory, yeah, I mean,
• 40:16
  Speaker 1: Varren would have said, your address is white. White, it's white. Yeah,
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: it's definitely white.
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: Wait, because they have to be able to tell lies
• 40:24
  Speaker 2: that hide them to exactly. The black oarth wouldn't stop
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: them from that, but I bet it would stop them
• 40:28
  Speaker 2: from telling oath lies that would reveal them.
• 40:31
  Speaker 1: I lie against telling the truth mm hm, or an
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: oath against telling the truth.
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: They don't want to travel, you know, through the hallways,
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: because the red Ojia will follow them, and that you know,
• 40:54
  Speaker 2: my Daddy's like that will be dangerous because right, that's
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: a discovery moment where that yeah, who knows, you know,
• 41:02
  Speaker 2: then all of a sudden, all these people know about
• 41:04
  Speaker 2: the hunt for the Black and that could be dangerous, right,
• 41:06
  Speaker 2: that is totally legit thing to say. And so she
• 41:09
  Speaker 2: does the thing where she shows the traveling weaves, which
• 41:11
  Speaker 2: is a little crazy to me.
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: With the part that she trusts me Donnie, or the
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: part where she's able to make the weaves despite for
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: being foregrooted the.
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: Lad ladder, thank you the ladder.
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I also thought that, like but like
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: maybe it's like you can do the form of it
• 41:31
  Speaker 1: without putting enough power into it to like make a
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: hit critical mass or something. I don't know. The mechanics
• 41:39
  Speaker 1: of trav of channeling seem like they get fuzzy when
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: they need to for plot, because I thought that sipping
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: forekroot took away your ability to channel. That has been
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: the experience up think too. Now you're telling me that
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: she can do a ghost of the traveling weave. Like
• 41:56
  Speaker 1: I feel like we've had some backsliding or some front sliding,
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: some side slide. I don't know, we're sliding somewhere.
• 42:01
  Speaker 2: But we've never had anyone microdose on fork root T right,
• 42:05
  Speaker 2: Everyone's always been macro dosing. So maybe that's like we're
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: just we're seeing a different effect because everyone's gone up
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: and then come down, right, so the down is as
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: sharp as the up, whereas now we're just existing flatline
• 42:16
  Speaker 2: on a lower level totally.
• 42:19
  Speaker 1: And also, I feel like there's been mention of both
• 42:23
  Speaker 1: T and tincture of fork group.
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: Mmm.
• 42:26
  Speaker 1: I feel like usually it's T, but what at least
• 42:28
  Speaker 1: once there's been a mention of tincture of fork And
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: I'm wondering if different preparations maybe have different levels of effect,
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: because you know t's and tinctures are different for lots
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: of medicines.
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: I don't see tincture in this book as a word.
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: Maybe it's the last one.
• 42:43
  Speaker 2: Am I spelling it right? T, I, N C, T
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: or E.
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: I have no idea how to spell things. Let me go,
• 42:49
  Speaker 1: and I have a terrible time trying to see letters
• 42:52
  Speaker 1: in yeah, thank you pants.
• 42:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah sure, right, So it's not in the book. The
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: word tincture does not appear.
• 43:02
  Speaker 1: Okay, So probably more what you're talking about, it's a
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: matter of dosage, because the dose makes the experience. But
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: I would I would have thought it would be cool
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: if it was like, oh yeah, if you drink it
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: as a tea, then it knocks you out totally. But
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: if you do it as a tincture, that it like
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: is much more attenuated or something. I would have I
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: would have enjoyed that little bit of like herb craft
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: in my way of time.
• 43:24
  Speaker 2: But that means you'd be taking shots all the time
• 43:26
  Speaker 2: of like hard liquor.
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: Just put a little squirt of tincture into some regular tea.
• 43:33
  Speaker 2: Oh okay, but isn't tincture made out of well, I
• 43:35
  Speaker 2: guess depends on what your salts, what your solution is.
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's usually made with alcohol, but like you can
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: get a medicinal dose with significantly less than a shot
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: of ever Clear.
• 43:46
  Speaker 2: Drinking it. I never use before. I've done extractions right
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: with when making alcohol. Yeah, sure, but the point is
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: not for the medicine. The point is for the the
• 43:59
  Speaker 2: booze to be flavored.
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, when you get the little bottles, they're like
• 44:02
  Speaker 1: less than a SHOT's worth total volumes, So you don't
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: drink all of it at once. You take like a
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: dropper of it at a time, and then there's like
• 44:11
  Speaker 1: twenty to fifty. However, I don't know how big things are.
• 44:13
  Speaker 1: I've been putting a grape something extract in my mocktails
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: at night because it just ads an extra pop of
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: purple to my pomegranate juice and bubble water, and it's
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: just it's nice, it's pleasant.
• 44:27
  Speaker 2: That does sound nice. Yeah, we're drinking a lot of
• 44:30
  Speaker 2: we do bubble water and like a cranberry juice concentrate
• 44:34
  Speaker 2: and then because just that's good for other.
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: Things, I'm doing pomegranate. Yeah, same idea.
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so that's that's a frequent drink around that in
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: a little bit of lime, you know, it works great.
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, So, yeah, various tinctures can be extremely pleasant additions
• 44:50
  Speaker 1: to that mocktail bar. But yes, tinctures as medicines are
• 44:54
  Speaker 1: generally taking a dropper or so at a time, not
• 44:57
  Speaker 1: as shots.
• 44:58
  Speaker 2: So me Donnie's reaction to the Gateway traveling is impossible.
• 45:02
  Speaker 2: How the fuck do you think the rebels got there? Like? What?
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it seemed a little.
• 45:08
  Speaker 2: Bit like I thought that and the rumors with the
• 45:11
  Speaker 2: Ashaman and like, what what hole have you been living
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: in May, Donnie? That you think traveling at this point
• 45:19
  Speaker 2: in the army is moving around the Ashman the way
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: Rand has been bouncing around. You've gotten reports on that.
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: Like what Yeah, in the Year of our Dragon nine
• 45:30
  Speaker 1: ninety nine, Like.
• 45:32
  Speaker 2: Traveling is possible.
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: What are you doing?
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: You're not like confused about that anymore. That's not like
• 45:36
  Speaker 2: a secret. You don't know what the weave is. But yeah,
• 45:41
  Speaker 2: oh my god.
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the the awe that she experiences should be you know, traveling,
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: Like that's what the reaction should have been. Is you're
• 45:49
  Speaker 1: showing me. Yeah, not traveling exists.
• 45:53
  Speaker 2: Right, Okay, sure, may don small criticisan.
• 45:57
  Speaker 1: That's what we're here for. The tiniest.
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: No, it's not perfect. I pick it apart because I
• 46:02
  Speaker 2: love it.
• 46:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, this is how we relax.
• 46:06
  Speaker 2: God, we're terrible. People must be awful to be friends with.
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: It must be so people will just be like, oh
• 46:12
  Speaker 2: my god, rolling our eyes at everything we talk about.
• 46:14
  Speaker 1: Well except for the people who actually hang.
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: Out with except for all of you people out there
• 46:18
  Speaker 2: who love us, right.
• 46:19
  Speaker 1: Like, that's that's the thing is, I don't have very
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: many friends who don't think I'm cool, because why would
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: I care about the approval of people who don't think
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: I'm cool. I won't care I don't care. If you
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: don't think I'm cool, then I you have ceased to
• 46:31
  Speaker 1: exist to me. So like, no loss. All I have
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: are friends that are cool.
• 46:36
  Speaker 2: What would happen if I just faded away right there?
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: Just like Homer simpsoning out, just.
• 46:41
  Speaker 2: Like it's like it's like, you know, all I cease
• 46:44
  Speaker 2: to exist if I didn't think you were cool?
• 46:46
  Speaker 1: Right, but you think I'm cool.
• 46:47
  Speaker 2: Well I'm still here on Jesus.
• 46:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so maybe my inner critic could like shut the
• 46:53
  Speaker 1: fuck off for a second, observe any of the data
• 46:58
  Speaker 1: at all.
• 46:59
  Speaker 2: What oh man, we're back in therapy.
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: Stop it all right, all right, all right, I gotta stop.
• 47:05
  Speaker 1: I gotta stop getting my coaching hat on. It's terrible.
• 47:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, this is Tuesday, not Thursday. Tuesday. Remember, like wheel time, not.
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: Therapy, right, it's not therapy. I am legally not a therapist.
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: Nobody looked at me with therapy. I legally have to
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: say I'm not a therapist.
• 47:20
  Speaker 2: But I've said that podcasting is my therapy many times.
• 47:22
  Speaker 2: So that's why.
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: That's Yeah, super valid.
• 47:29
  Speaker 2: Rats in the White Tower.
• 47:31
  Speaker 1: Yes, rats Tower, Yes, nasty evil rats. The true Omerlin
• 47:37
  Speaker 1: has finally been alerted to the fact that there are
• 47:39
  Speaker 1: rats in the tower mm hmm.
• 47:41
  Speaker 2: Which they've been for a while. Dark Ones touch has
• 47:45
  Speaker 2: made the words fail. We've heard about that for quite
• 47:48
  Speaker 2: some time now.
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: But Alvaran's Venia snickering to herself about how no one's noticed,
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: and like a couple people have noticed, but there's nothing
• 47:55
  Speaker 1: to do about it. Now Agwayin has noticed, and for
• 47:57
  Speaker 1: some reason, that makes it seem more we're already just
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: because Agwayin is like, hm, put that on the to do, but.
• 48:03
  Speaker 2: There's there's never anything to do about it, because that's
• 48:05
  Speaker 2: that literally is the Dark One, you know, corrupting the
• 48:08
  Speaker 2: world and making the power not function the way it's
• 48:10
  Speaker 2: supposed to, which I think could have played a cooler
• 48:13
  Speaker 2: role in the Last Battle with more unexpected effects, with
• 48:16
  Speaker 2: the Dark One being like, oh, be careful in this region,
• 48:19
  Speaker 2: you know, just like with the way the Bowl of
• 48:21
  Speaker 2: Winds had that like sparky effect where it was used.
• 48:24
  Speaker 2: I think it would have been cool to have more
• 48:25
  Speaker 2: like oh, over here you have to use really giant
• 48:29
  Speaker 2: weaves or over here, like.
• 48:32
  Speaker 1: I don't know, yes, there's some sort of weird like resonance,
• 48:35
  Speaker 1: like you can't use.
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: Air waves, right, yeah, yeah, something like the.
• 48:37
  Speaker 1: Air gets weird if you use air, so only use
• 48:39
  Speaker 1: water and fire or something like that. Yeah, that would
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: have been cool. Or like weaves like turning inside out
• 48:45
  Speaker 1: so they have to like do things backwards or yeah,
• 48:49
  Speaker 1: and they're like trying to do that on the fly
• 48:51
  Speaker 1: while trolks are attacking them and they're like, a, how
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: do I write backwards? This is impossible?
• 48:55
  Speaker 2: Those would be cool. Bubbles of evil, Oh, that would
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: be right, Like bubbles of evil that affect channeling more
• 49:01
  Speaker 2: so than the physical world a little bit.
• 49:03
  Speaker 1: Because like and then non channelers don't see it happening
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: and they're not convinced that a bubble of evil is
• 49:07
  Speaker 1: even occurring until like the extent effects start catching up.
• 49:11
  Speaker 1: Oh that'd be weird. Yeah, oh that'd be cool.
• 49:16
  Speaker 2: All right.
• 49:17
  Speaker 1: So Igwayne is like, why did you pick us to
• 49:20
  Speaker 1: the bowels of the tower. We're gonna waste precious time
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: getting back up to ground level where the important things
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: are and me done. He's like, no, no, no, no,
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: grown down, We're going even farther down into the bowels
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: of the tower.
• 49:29
  Speaker 2: At which point she's like, Okay, what am I in for?
• 49:32
  Speaker 2: I feel like that's the one time when I when
• 49:34
  Speaker 2: I moved to Philly. I remember offering, you know, I
• 49:37
  Speaker 2: was a new kid, and I was like, you know,
• 49:39
  Speaker 2: I'm hungry, you know, can you I need money? And
• 49:41
  Speaker 2: I was like, oh, come with me and I'll buy
• 49:42
  Speaker 2: some food, right like, And she's like, sure, just come
• 49:46
  Speaker 2: down this alleyway to the food cart area where you
• 49:49
  Speaker 2: can buy me some food. And I remember walking two
• 49:52
  Speaker 2: or three blocks and going I think I made a
• 49:55
  Speaker 2: mistake and turning around and walking in the way. This
• 50:03
  Speaker 2: is not the way that I wanted. This is a
• 50:05
  Speaker 2: dark alley, This is not a good idea. I'm somewhere
• 50:10
  Speaker 2: I don't want to go.
• 50:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah. GWayne definitely is having that thought. But she's ambulance,
• 50:14
  Speaker 1: so she has to like extra keep it inside and
• 50:16
  Speaker 1: just keep walking. No, she doesn't really have the choice
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: to turn around and walk away. She's like, I guess
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: I'm finding out. I am fucking around and finding out now,
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: I guess. And you know, at this point, it feels
• 50:28
  Speaker 1: like from where she's sitting, she's pretty sure May Donnie's
• 50:30
  Speaker 1: want a dark friend, But this feels like being taken
• 50:32
  Speaker 1: to a dark friend meeting, right. It feels like that
• 50:36
  Speaker 1: despite the confidence that she has in May Donnie not
• 50:39
  Speaker 1: being a dark friend.
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: It's the horseshoe theory, right, Like, any group hunting dark
• 50:42
  Speaker 2: friends are going to look a lot like dark friends
• 50:44
  Speaker 2: because they're gonna have to be secretive and you know,
• 50:48
  Speaker 2: have a lot of meet in weird places and have
• 50:50
  Speaker 2: codes and make sure that nobody else knows what they're doing. Right, Like,
• 50:54
  Speaker 2: there's a similarity between dark friends and people hunting dark friends.
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: Right, They're very different people. There is a gap.
• 51:00
  Speaker 2: Between the but and Agwayne has even felt this way, right,
• 51:04
  Speaker 2: She and Elaine and I Neive and Moraine and Varren
• 51:08
  Speaker 2: have this little coterie of supporting the Dragon Reborn and
• 51:14
  Speaker 2: hunting the dark Friends, right, they have, and they're kind
• 51:16
  Speaker 2: of separate and have shared information, separate from the rest
• 51:19
  Speaker 2: of the White Tower out in the world, but not
• 51:22
  Speaker 2: in the Tower. But it's a similar sort of.
• 51:23
  Speaker 1: Group, right. They're keeping secrets on behalf of the side
• 51:29
  Speaker 1: of being open and good, and they're keeping dark secrets.
• 51:33
  Speaker 1: They're doing war crimes in the name of the common good.
• 51:36
  Speaker 1: Question mark because I would argue that keeping Mogedda in
• 51:39
  Speaker 1: the way they did is like pretty dumb and bad
• 51:43
  Speaker 1: both at the same time.
• 51:44
  Speaker 2: And yet the skills they learned did save the world
• 51:48
  Speaker 2: multiple times.
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but they couldn't have known that at the time, Like,
• 51:52
  Speaker 1: it's so dumb, it's so dumb.
• 51:53
  Speaker 2: It is it is. Yeah, I'm actually surprised it worked
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: for as long as it did, that she couldn't escape
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: from some but that she never seen the collar before
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: those were made after she was imprisoned. There's some water
• 52:07
  Speaker 2: stuff made Donnie's warders out on an errand no clue
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: what that up ends up being no connection whatsoever. He's
• 52:13
  Speaker 2: just you know, getting groceries or whatever. There's a warder
• 52:16
  Speaker 2: at the door who opens the door and lets them in.
• 52:18
  Speaker 2: That is not made Donnie's warder. It is not also
• 52:21
  Speaker 2: not the order of anybody in the room because no
• 52:22
  Speaker 2: one in the room has warder, So we're assuming it's
• 52:26
  Speaker 2: a order of one of the other conspirators. Again, no
• 52:30
  Speaker 2: idea who.
• 52:31
  Speaker 1: And it never matters or comes up again.
• 52:33
  Speaker 2: We have Ciane doa scene Yukiri and Saren in the room.
• 52:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, our black Aja hunters.
• 52:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the Black Auja Hunters, And I call them the
• 52:45
  Speaker 2: I was thinking of them as the Dull squad, right,
• 52:48
  Speaker 2: because it's like four really dull, like relatively dull colors,
• 52:51
  Speaker 2: white yellow, gray, and brown. It's like they don't have
• 52:55
  Speaker 2: any of the primary Yeah, and that.
• 52:57
  Speaker 1: Is pretty muted.
• 53:00
  Speaker 2: Allow. Yeah, that's definitely like a desert palette, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
• 53:05
  Speaker 2: when I'm talking forrest vibrant greens or anything like that.
• 53:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's that's the color scheme of my brother's wedding
• 53:12
  Speaker 1: out in the desert.
• 53:14
  Speaker 2: So they walk in and these fours basically start yelling
• 53:17
  Speaker 2: at Madonni, being like, well, what the fuck? Why are
• 53:20
  Speaker 2: you bringing Aquaene into our secret meetings? That doesn't make
• 53:23
  Speaker 2: any sense. Why are you doing this? I thought the
• 53:26
  Speaker 2: oath was supposed to prevent you from doing this, And
• 53:28
  Speaker 2: Agwaine's like, what oath.
• 53:30
  Speaker 1: The way that Aguayine handles this situation is amazing, because
• 53:33
  Speaker 1: again she does not wait for permission to be acknowledged
• 53:37
  Speaker 1: as Amberlin. She just owns the situation as Amberlin, cutting it, interrupting,
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: speaking over people, just like I have primacy in this conversation.
• 53:46
  Speaker 1: I'm not asking for it, I'm expecting it, and I'm
• 53:49
  Speaker 1: taking it. And all the women in the room cannot
• 53:52
  Speaker 1: stand and cannot stand in her way, like she's a
• 53:54
  Speaker 1: boulder rolling downhill. They can't stop from taking her seriously
• 53:59
  Speaker 1: because she already takes herself seriously and she just owns them.
• 54:02
  Speaker 2: Right kind of Avien to take a hint a.
• 54:06
  Speaker 1: Tenth of a hint, a tenth of a hint. I
• 54:09
  Speaker 1: thought you two were supposed to be similar. That's why
• 54:11
  Speaker 1: you were friends, Like, come on, and Agwayne also has
• 54:16
  Speaker 1: she has like uncertainty, but not in herself as a
• 54:19
  Speaker 1: young woman. She just has uncertainty. And am I balancing
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: all of these women correctly? And am I handling this
• 54:25
  Speaker 1: like it's a very mature anxiety rather than oh no,
• 54:29
  Speaker 1: are they gonna allow me to keep my stole? Like
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: she's not doing that, She's doing a like shit, I
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: am so happy I have all these women in the
• 54:36
  Speaker 1: same room at once. But also like if I fuck
• 54:38
  Speaker 1: this up, then there's nothing for it, like this is it,
• 54:41
  Speaker 1: this is the test?
• 54:42
  Speaker 2: And yeah, and she calls them out for all the
• 54:44
  Speaker 2: shit that we've been calling them out for, right like
• 54:47
  Speaker 2: secret oaths, meetings in the basement, plotting against the ambulance seat,
• 54:52
  Speaker 2: basically like their crimes.
• 54:55
  Speaker 1: Have we been railing on that for books? I thought
• 54:57
  Speaker 1: we were cheering them on for hunting at the black Aja.
• 55:00
  Speaker 2: I think we always were, like the oath. The fourth
• 55:03
  Speaker 2: oath is bullshit.
• 55:03
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, the fourth oath is bullshit. Yeah, they didn't
• 55:06
  Speaker 1: even they could have just used the third oath to
• 55:08
  Speaker 1: make her promise not to fuck up, because if she's
• 55:10
  Speaker 1: got the first oath in place, that's what I'm saying,
• 55:13
  Speaker 1: like an oath of Fielty's all you fucking need. But yeah, no,
• 55:17
  Speaker 1: the fourth oath, Yes, the fourth oath has always been
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: a problem, and Agwayne leaps right to it, like she
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: doesn't even bother asking them why they're meeting, even though
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: she's really excited by the fact that they're meeting together
• 55:26
  Speaker 1: different women of different adjas. But she's like, well, first
• 55:29
  Speaker 1: and foremost, this fourth oath thing like that has got
• 55:32
  Speaker 1: to be resolved right away, because yeah, you're right, it sucks.
• 55:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and then talk is making a point, you know.
• 55:38
  Speaker 2: Also the other people you've seen with the fourth oath, right,
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: like Galina.
• 55:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, Elida proposes it.
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: Not not a good idea, not a good idea. Right,
• 55:50
  Speaker 2: We're not going to break the you know three rules
• 55:53
  Speaker 2: of robotics, right, yeah, the rule three oaths, right, the
• 55:57
  Speaker 2: rules of three Right. If you're gonna do a magic oath,
• 55:59
  Speaker 2: there's always got to eat the wishes, like, don't break it.
• 56:02
  Speaker 1: Three's the number you can't. No, three is the strongest shape,
• 56:06
  Speaker 1: don't fuck it up.
• 56:07
  Speaker 2: I also, you know, it does seem that more oaths
• 56:10
  Speaker 2: create more of an effect. And I wonder if three
• 56:13
  Speaker 2: oaths shorten their lives by half and four oaths would
• 56:16
  Speaker 2: shorten it by like more than.
• 56:17
  Speaker 1: That, I would assume sort of a yeah, like logar
• 56:20
  Speaker 1: arrhythmic stacking, the more oads you have, the faster you
• 56:23
  Speaker 1: come down to normal mortal lifespan, and like at ten
• 56:27
  Speaker 1: you're like making sure to cap yourself off at eighty years.
• 56:30
  Speaker 1: It's like, Nope, can't go any farther than that.
• 56:33
  Speaker 2: It's a couple of pages here that I was kind
• 56:34
  Speaker 2: of like, oh, this feels like summary where he says, oh,
• 56:37
  Speaker 2: if you take each sister or move her ods and
• 56:39
  Speaker 2: make her rear swear them, you could ask her. It's like, yes,
• 56:41
  Speaker 2: that's what they've been doing. Like that's the whole blot
• 56:44
  Speaker 2: line here.
• 56:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's it's repetitive. The line that I really
• 56:48
  Speaker 1: think summarizes how she approaches all of them is still me,
• 56:52
  Speaker 1: execute me or beat me, and the tower will yet
• 56:54
  Speaker 1: be in shambles. That's the thrust of this whole conversation
• 56:57
  Speaker 1: is these women keep trying to say, well, you can't
• 56:59
  Speaker 1: be armor, you can't be in power, you're the cause
• 57:01
  Speaker 1: of the problem. And she's like, I'm literally not though,
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: and you all know it, and you're wasting time, Like
• 57:07
  Speaker 1: just get kill me. Then if I'm the problem, fine.
• 57:11
  Speaker 2: Like, no, it wouldn't get rid of the rebels, it
• 57:13
  Speaker 2: wouldn't get rid of eyelight as terrible leadership, it wouldn't
• 57:17
  Speaker 2: get rid of the split between the odd jaws, it
• 57:19
  Speaker 2: wouldn't get rid of the lack of novices exactly.
• 57:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, there's just all these things, and they bow to
• 57:25
  Speaker 1: that logic, and we just do a lot of exposition
• 57:27
  Speaker 1: and recap in the act of having that conversation. But
• 57:30
  Speaker 1: that sentenced to me sums up the point. So when
• 57:33
  Speaker 1: she gets to the fourth hoast discussion and she's able
• 57:36
  Speaker 1: to like force them into immediately proving that they're being
• 57:39
  Speaker 1: inhumane about it, I do kind of love that. She's like,
• 57:42
  Speaker 1: Maydannie won't portray me. She's like, well, we'll just order
• 57:44
  Speaker 1: her too. It's like, literally five minutes ago you said
• 57:47
  Speaker 1: that you were doing this for holnorable purposes.
• 57:49
  Speaker 2: Like you're literally taking away her free will by doing that,
• 57:52
  Speaker 2: like you're not just helping, and it took one push.
• 57:55
  Speaker 1: It took one push for you to immediately start abusing
• 57:59
  Speaker 1: it and taking away her human rights like not in theory,
• 58:02
  Speaker 1: but in practice.
• 58:03
  Speaker 2: Come on, and then makes a point like you you're
• 58:06
  Speaker 2: that's compulsion. You've recreated a compulsion, right, which is forbidden.
• 58:10
  Speaker 1: It's like bad, bad, real bad, right, And then she
• 58:14
  Speaker 1: even says like I get why you did it, and
• 58:16
  Speaker 1: I may choose to forgive you in the long run
• 58:19
  Speaker 1: if you stop it. Right the fuck now, like write
• 58:23
  Speaker 1: the fuck now?
• 58:23
  Speaker 2: And GWayne knows using the power to force you to
• 58:27
  Speaker 2: do something you don't want to do, even when it's
• 58:29
  Speaker 2: not compulsion, right, she had the collar on, yeah, right,
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: and that used pain, but similar sort of thing where
• 58:35
  Speaker 2: it's like, yeah, we're forcing you to do something. It's
• 58:38
  Speaker 2: not technically compulsion, but it's something that you just can't break. Yeah.
• 58:42
  Speaker 1: I mean, if if magic is being used to take
• 58:46
  Speaker 1: away if magic is being used to take away your
• 58:49
  Speaker 1: ability to choose things, it really doesn't matter what you
• 58:52
  Speaker 1: call it. We all know what that is.
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And here's the the second place where she has
• 58:55
  Speaker 2: that conversation. She had earlier with Maydannie, which is like,
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: you know, is my authority and my ability to channel
• 59:01
  Speaker 2: if i'm you know, I have no one can demote
• 59:05
  Speaker 2: the ambulance seat. That's a ridiculous point.
• 59:07
  Speaker 1: She is the authority, Yeah, and her strength, her objective strength,
• 59:11
  Speaker 1: doesn't matter because it is not a dick measuring contest. No, Like,
• 59:14
  Speaker 1: it's just not.
• 59:15
  Speaker 2: Ambulance seats tend to be strong, but they don't have
• 59:17
  Speaker 2: to be. Their authority doesn't come from the strength in
• 59:19
  Speaker 2: the one power.
• 59:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it comes from the strength of will, which often
• 59:22
  Speaker 1: comes with strength and the power. But yeah, being artificially
• 59:25
  Speaker 1: shackled in one does not automatically diminish the other.
• 59:29
  Speaker 2: And then I really love this argument, right, this following
• 59:32
  Speaker 2: one where she's they're like, besides, you're not even the
• 59:35
  Speaker 2: legitimate ambulin Elida is and she goes, really because she
• 59:38
  Speaker 2: was elected with the bare minimum, and that means if
• 59:42
  Speaker 2: a single person who elected her was black, ajah, the
• 59:46
  Speaker 2: whole thing's invalid. And they're like, well, then you could
• 59:48
  Speaker 2: question any election. She's like, no, because she was only
• 59:53
  Speaker 2: had the minimum number of people there, right, which is
• 59:56
  Speaker 2: sort of a deep cut into like how the politics work, right,
• 59:58
  Speaker 2: Like with the quorum and stuff like that. But like essentially,
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 2: you need a certain number because you can't have everybody
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 2: there all the time. You need a certain number minimum
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 2: with people to be there to make the vote legit.
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 2: And they were right at that line, not over it.
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 2: And so in any other election, yeah, if one or
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 2: two people are proven to be black, probably doesn't matter
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 2: because there's more than enough people there, you know, one
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 2: or two votes wouldn't change the outcome. However, in this one,
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 2: the fact that a single person is black and they
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 2: have found someone who is black. It was Teleene mainly,
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 2: she was a black sitter. She voted. Now we know
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 2: there was a couple of other black sitters and a
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 2: fucking Forsaken on there as well, right, alvi arn the
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 2: Dannell thank you, Yeah Dannell who ended up being Messana. Right, So,
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 2: no way that vote was legit because there's at least
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 2: we know three votes that were you know, either forsaken
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 2: or black auja minimum And it's hard to say a
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 2: lot it was exactly shall we say neutral in that mode.
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, for sure, for sure.
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 2: But the point holds.
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 1: It is important to have the larger consensus, not the
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 1: bare minimum consensus. For exactly this kind of reason, and
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 1: I think that.
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 2: Is one of the best really well written political cleverness
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 2: that Brandon puts in with Agway. I think that now
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 2: feels like it was definitely set up by Jordan really well,
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 2: like it was a well executed spike, but the setup
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 2: was really really good, and this feels like the inevitable
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 2: thing for him to do.
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure, for sure, this was definitely set up
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 1: by Jordan, but it is executed love wonderfully by Sanderson.
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 1: And then you know, we get into the purity politics
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 1: where it's like, well, if you're saying that we did that,
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 1: then are you calling us all black Dodger, are you
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 1: saying that we're all terrible people? And Queen's like, shut
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 1: the fuck up, that's not the damn question. I think
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 1: we're all serving the interest of the shadow so long
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 1: as we allow ourselves to remain divided. How do you
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 1: imagine the black reacted to the near secret deposing of
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 1: an ombreland seat followed by a division among the eyes
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 1: to die like heads, remove it from asses. This is
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 1: not about me calling you a black Aja, This is
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 1: about us acknowledging that we have some repair to do.
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 2: You got manipulated. You got scammed, right, it was not
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 2: a Nigerian prince, Okay, and we can admit it's not
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 2: a Nigerian prince and stop sending him money, right, Like
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 2: you are never going to get that fortune back. It
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 2: feels like talking to your boomer grandparents after they like
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 2: buy into a scheme and they're like, but he promised
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 2: he'd be sending me money. He's not going to the
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 2: check's not coming. Stop sending him money.
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, like yeah.
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 2: We all got scammed together. We're all in this together,
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 2: Like it's all of our money and you're sending it
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 2: out do an internet scam? Please stop. Yeah. Meanwhile, the
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 2: scammers in the corner going no, no, no, no, no, no,
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 2: no no, that's not what's happening at all, you know, like.
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly exactly, Like maybe believe the situation rather than
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 1: what the person blowing to smoke up your ass keeps saying.
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 1: Maybe believe like the broader evidence, and it's and it's
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: just oh, it's so obvious. Why do you think the
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 1: black raja wants more than you to be fighting amongst
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 1: each other over your purity politics?
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you want that minority olargarchs to be fighting over politics,
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 2: so you don't pay attention to who's actually seizing power
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 2: and go, God, why is today awful? All right?
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 1: I charge you to continue your work with these women.
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 1: They are not our enemies and they never were. Sending
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 1: you back as a spy was a mistake, like the
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 1: way Agwayne is just like, yeah, no, we have all
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 1: lost the fucking plot.
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 2: Because she wasn't part of that. That was that was
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 2: That was again a black sister, right, who sent in
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 2: the spies. That was Shariam, And it was Shariam the
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 2: six Seriam six, right, wasn't.
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Sheiriam was very much in charge of them
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 1: at that point.
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, so she's the one who sent in the spies, which,
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 2: of course, when discovered, would would sow more you know,
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 2: disillusionment and fear and distrust between the two sides. Of course,
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 2: the Black Aja sent spies into the other side.
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, of course, of course, because anything that we imagined
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 1: they would do, they clearly are doing right. And we're
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 1: not telling on ourselves when we spend these paranoid fantasies
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 1: and work ourselves up into a frenzy, we're not telling
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 1: on ourselves. No, no, no, we're just clearly divining what
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 1: the enemy would do to us, because that's what.
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 2: No, no, no, no, yeah, yeah, they don't have the oath Rod.
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 2: I think that's important. It's difficult to sneak away, even
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 2: though they do end up sneaking it away when Varren
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 2: comes for it.
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm confused by that statement, since they apparently raised
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 1: like one eyes Sadaia year at this point, I'm not sure,
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 1: like what the busy traffic, the busy social schedule of
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 1: the oath rod could pass.
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 2: I mean maybe just because it's like, why would you
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 2: need it? And so they have to justify checking it
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 2: out for some reason they have to be and like so.
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 1: Like so how are they justified checking it out? And again,
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 1: the only reason they use it is to raise new sisters,
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 1: and everyone knows when a new sister comes around, because
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 1: there's one a year.
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 2: Maybe somebody wants to study I'm studying Tarran Greoll, let
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 2: me check out the oath rod.
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 1: Everyone makes such a big deal out about how no
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 1: one's been doing that since Korean and deal until a
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 1: lane tra canned and the whole checking out the oath
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 1: plot subplot detail has always bothered me and felt very incomplete.
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 2: Honestly the whole Terrangriall storage, checking out who has access
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 2: to them, how they're secured ever since the Apprentice came
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 2: to the alarm that sounded when Pad and Vane was
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 2: in there, and then al Vrn showed up, and it
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 2: seems like the Black Auja had access to the storerooms,
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 2: but yet they didn't. The Forsaken can't seem to find
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 2: any of the ongre All, the songre All, even though
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 2: they're sitting right there on the shelf. And Gwain just, yeah,
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 2: there's there's a sort of this big long plot hole
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 2: about the Angreoll storage in the White Tower.
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, multiple plot holes that are all just leading into
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 1: the gaping, chaotic maw of Tarungrial storage.
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 2: Mm hmm. And like it's kind of solved the plot
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 2: hole of Aguayin being able to get down there is
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 2: she asks Suon to tell her where they're stored, which
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 2: is information that only a few people have, and so
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 2: that's how she's able to make a gateway down there, right,
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 2: Like that's the solution that he comes up with. But
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 2: like hiding Tearangriol through obscurity in the tower when you
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 2: have a Forsaken just living there who could ask or
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 2: compel any of the ice ad Eye to just show
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 2: her where the trongreoal just it doesn't make sense to me.
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 2: It doesn't make sense how the Foresacond don't have a
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 2: shit ton of ongreol that they're using against rand all
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 2: the time.
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and it makes no sense to me that the
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 1: oth Throg can go missing sometimes but not all the time.
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 1: It just it doesn't It doesn't fit with the use
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 1: case scenario of what the Othroad does. So that's annoying.
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 1: And yeah, Agwayin sort of does her little mic drop
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 1: and then takes may Donnie and heads out because she
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 1: has decided that the audience is over again, not asking permission,
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 1: simply taking it.
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 2: Well, because all these people are working outside the power
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 2: structure of the White Tower and Alida right at this point,
• 1:07:18
  Speaker 2: even though they technically were told to start by her,
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 2: they I think at this point that they realize that
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 2: it's no longer. Yeah, I believe they know. I think
• 1:07:26
  Speaker 2: at this point they know that they're doing this outside
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 2: of the authority structure of the White Tower. And Agwaine
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 2: realizes they're working outside of the authority structure. So she's like,
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 2: I don't have to in any way acknowledge the power
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 2: structure of the White Tower at this point, because you're
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 2: operating outside of it, and so am I. But I'm
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 2: the Amerlin.
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 1: Well, it's more than that she is operating within the
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 1: power structure of the true White Tower, which is that
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 1: she is on top and they are.
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 2: Her subordinates, right right right.
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 1: She's like, you're not working for Elida, so you're working
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 1: for me, Like this is a binary state of AFA.
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 1: You were either with Alida or you were with Agwain,
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 1: Like that's how you are, as I sauld I.
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 2: And you've already done something that could be considered rebellious
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 2: or traitorous by having these meetings, by swearing the Fourth Oath,
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 2: you are outside that power structure. You are being you
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 2: are basically rebelling as much as I am, right.
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 1: Right exactly, So like, clearly you would rather work towards
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 1: my ends because you're working against Alida and so am I.
• 1:08:23
  Speaker 1: And that's all we need to know right now. And yeah,
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 1: she takes may Donnie and they just flounced the fuck
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 1: out and it's great. I love it.
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 2: Do you want? And I think, yeah, that's the readout.
• 1:08:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I'll just read as on out. I can't
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 1: believe you succeeded. The Gray said they should have strung
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 1: you up by your heels and had you howling. They
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 1: are too wise for that. Agwaine said, they're the only
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 1: ones in this blasted tower, besides maybe Sylviana, who have
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 1: anything resembling heads sitting atop their shoulders. Sylviana may Donnie asked,
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 1: with surprise. Doesn't she beat you every day, several times
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 1: a day, Agwayne said, absently, she's very dutiful, not to
• 1:09:03
  Speaker 1: mention thoughtful. If we had more like her, the tower
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 1: wouldn't have gotten to the state in the first place.
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 1: Meydani regarded away an odd expression on her face. You
• 1:09:13
  Speaker 1: really are the amreline, She finally said, it was an
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 1: odd comment. Hadn't she just sworn that she accepted Agwaine's authority?
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 1: Come on again, said hastening her pace. I need to
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 1: get back before those reds grow suspicious.
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 2: The logic mind versus the actual emotional mind mm hmmm,
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 2: discovering she's oh yeah, Accepting logically that you're the ammeline
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 2: is different than emotionally realizing that you are truly someone
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 2: who's a leader.
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 1: And Swan literally had this conversation with her a while
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 1: back where she said, you really are amorline and Agwayne says,
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 1: I thought you believed in me months ago, and Swan says, no,
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 1: I believed in your potential. I am saying that you
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 1: are achieving your potential so much.
• 1:09:54
  Speaker 2: Faster than right.
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 1: And that's that's what this is again, is it's like
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 1: moved on. She can't imagine someone thinking of her as
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 1: not having power, but may Donnie is going through the
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 1: process of realizing that she thinks of Agwayne as someone
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 1: with power, and she's kind of surprised by that. It's
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 1: not just she's politically aligned because she hates Alida. It's like, no,
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 1: she respects your power intrinsically, subconsciously, she is finding herself
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 1: happy to be subordinate to you, and she's surprised. Agwayne's
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 1: not surprised, but she's been living in that space for months,
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 1: whereas may Donnie is, you know, coming around to it today.
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 1: And that was a fun, meaty chapter. We definitely had
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 1: some horrible tangents that are going to be excised that
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 1: will cut the runtime down significantly, but I think it
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 1: was a good recording overall.
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 2: All Right, Well, that was a fun recording that was
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 2: one of the best chapters I think we've had so
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 2: far in this book, and I'm excited to have more
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 2: crunchy chapters like that. I feel like he does get
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 2: into it a little bit. We're saying. The first few
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 2: chapters were a little soft and a little recappy and
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 2: a little simplistic, and I think we finally got into
• 1:11:03
  Speaker 2: he got his feet underneath him, and now he's running.
• 1:11:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, excited to be here, excited to be at this
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 1: point in the book. And yeah, we will see you
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 1: all when we see you next bye bye. Tell the
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 1: people all the fun things, all.
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 2: The fun things.
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 2: So, you know, you ever have one of those weeks
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 2: that you look back and go, oh, it's been three months. Nope, nope,
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 2: six days. Fuck it's hmmm. So y'all know, I just
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 2: went on my honeymoon, which was amazing, loved it. Definitely
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 2: caught some sort of flu possibly COVID yet to be
• 1:12:27
  Speaker 2: seen two week long virus on that trip. So I
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 2: have been, you know, probably not feeling well during the
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 2: last recording, but pretty much sick in bed since then.
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 2: Well not in bed because some other stuff happened. Uh,
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 2: sick and should have been in bed right that level
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 2: of that level of flu that you're just like you
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 2: can't breathe, you're coughing. You know, you really shouldn't be
• 1:12:50
  Speaker 2: around anybody else. So I worked, I work one day
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 2: because I don't really I don't want to admit that
• 1:12:54
  Speaker 2: I'm sick yet, right, So I worked that one day,
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 2: you know, get the next morning, start to go to
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 2: work and go, oh, nope, nope, I'm I'm not going
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 2: to make that. I'm going back to bed. That night,
• 1:13:04
  Speaker 2: our cat doesn't eat his food, which eventually evolves into
• 1:13:09
  Speaker 2: him being quite sick, taking him to the hospital and
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 2: having him at the hospital all weekend. So we're coming
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 2: and going to and from the VET hospital. He appears
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 2: to be getting better, so good news right as of
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 2: this moment, he's been given antibiotics and he's been given
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 2: twenty four hour care and he is healthy but you know,
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 2: and appears to be a better and alert. The VET
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 2: has not ruled out anything chronic going on to cause disinfection.
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 2: They never found the source of it, but we're gonna
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 2: go with random infection, so you know, keep you updated
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 2: on that as time goes on. So that wasn't fun.
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 2: But that night, Travis, my good friend, Travis, such a
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 2: good friend, such a good friend. He acquired a dog
• 1:13:56
  Speaker 2: his neighbor, who I don't I'm hearing this story second hand, right,
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 2: So essentially has you know, was given this dog by
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 2: her drug dealer, and as someone who was on drugs
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 2: and was somewhat you know, was probably doing okay for
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 2: a while, but has since relapsed a little bit. And so,
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 2: in basically a confrontation with the neighbors, threw the dog
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 2: out of her house and said somebody please take this dog, right,
• 1:14:22
  Speaker 2: And so Travis saw that and took the dog. Now
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 2: he has two other dogs in his location. And so
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 2: called me up at you know, after I'd gone to
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 2: bed at nine thirty at night and said, hey, I
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 2: need a favor.
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 1: I have a puppy nine thirty at night. You're so
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 1: old nine at that point too.
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 2: Our cat's sick, We're sick. We are in the middle
• 1:14:46
  Speaker 2: of moving, I am. I have movers coming in six days.
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 2: Everything is in boxes. So I said, okay, drop the
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 2: puppy off.
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 1: Of course you did.
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 2: Of course I did. Of course I did, right Like
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 2: I'm not going to because he's got two dogs, he's got,
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 2: you know, leases he can't take care of the dog. Right,
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 2: dog stays with us, very sweet. We find out, you know,
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 2: basically a little bit of his backstory. We skid his
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 2: chip scanned, so we find we're like trying to find
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 2: his original owners. Right, maybe this somebody who you know,
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 2: because it doesn't appear that the woman who had him
• 1:15:19
  Speaker 2: was his original owner. Right, So talk to the Humane Society.
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 2: Turns out he was adopted from the Oregon Humane Society,
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 2: so we know his age, right, So he is eight
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 2: months old. He has been spade and neutered. His vaccinations
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 2: are not up to dates, so he definitely need to
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 2: do that. But yeah, it We called up the original owners.
• 1:15:38
  Speaker 2: They said they lost him within a day or or
• 1:15:40
  Speaker 2: within a week of getting him and haven't had him since.
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 2: So he has been probably in the possession of somebody
• 1:15:45
  Speaker 2: who either stole him out of the yard or didn't
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 2: bother trying to return him to the original owner. And
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 2: they said we.
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 1: Could keep him because they hadn't really bonded with him
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 1: or okay, wow, yeah.
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So I acquired a dog was literally dropped into
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 2: my lap this week.
• 1:16:00
  Speaker 1: The dog distribution system heard your need.
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 2: The dog distribution system fucked up the timing the timing
• 1:16:07
  Speaker 2: was awful. The timing was so bad. Oh my god,
• 1:16:12
  Speaker 2: I couldn't tell you how freaking bad the timing was.
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 1: And I am this is like a divine typo, like
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 1: the angel organizing this, like their fingers slipped and hit
• 1:16:20
  Speaker 1: the wrong character.
• 1:16:23
  Speaker 2: Uh huh. So I am dropping the pictures in now
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 2: again because of No, I completely black the one I
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 2: was gonna.
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 1: Say, no, idea where you're going with that?
• 1:16:34
  Speaker 2: I expect my puppy pictures. He's cute, No, he's cute.
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 2: Oh so he is a he's about just the stats.
• 1:16:41
  Speaker 2: He's forty five pounds at eight months old. That gives
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 2: a predictive weight of somewhere around sixty to seventy pounds. Right,
• 1:16:50
  Speaker 2: so he's going to be a big boy, but not
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 2: a giant boy. Despite the fact that his paws are huge.
• 1:16:56
  Speaker 2: He appears to be some sort of pit mastiff mix
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 2: would be my guess. But that's just based on his
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 2: his coloring and his size. Right. So, he has a
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 2: fairly fawn body and a very white neck, and but
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 2: the white and the fawn never touched. There's always a
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 2: black line between the white and the fawn. And then
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 2: his face is a very typical pit face coloring, which
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 2: a white stripe down the forehead and then around the nose.
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 2: The one thing is going on is then his whole
• 1:17:28
  Speaker 2: face is a black mask and his body is fawn, right,
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 2: So he's got the white stripe surrounded by the black
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 2: mask that then ends at the top of his head,
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 2: so it looks like he's wearing a mask. Does but
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 2: it really does look like it looks like he's got
• 1:17:41
  Speaker 2: a mask on. And then from there back he's fawn
• 1:17:44
  Speaker 2: so it looks like a mastiff in a pit bull mask.
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 1: So cute.
• 1:17:49
  Speaker 2: So he's very cute. Let me get some more pictures
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 2: for a live chat, because.
• 1:17:53
  Speaker 1: Live chat is clamoring clamoring for the puppy tacks on
• 1:17:59
  Speaker 1: mastiffs are like they're so big, their lems are so long,
• 1:18:03
  Speaker 1: they're just such like massive.
• 1:18:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he's he's a long legged boy, for sure.
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 1: Let me like the one I knew for a while.
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 1: It was just like he would come over and like
• 1:18:13
  Speaker 1: sit next to you and producing. He'd be sitting on
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 1: your foot and producing. He'd be like leaning over onto
• 1:18:17
  Speaker 1: your leg and producing. He's in your lap and he's
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 1: like an eighty pound mastive, And it was ridiculous. Oh yeah,
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 1: look at this pictures. Oh my god. Yeah, the way
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 1: his head is just so dark compared to the rest
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 1: of him, but then that bright white stripe.
• 1:18:31
  Speaker 2: Ah.
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 1: But yeah, he does have big pause. Can attest to that.
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, giant pause. Yeah, it's probably a bit of term.
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 2: And you know he's clearly a mutt, right, So I'm
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 2: not gonna just you know, I'm just sort of saying
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 2: what he looks.
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 1: Like he's gonna take after the Mastiff part of his heritage.
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 1: It seems you know, he's got that and he's expressing it.
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 2: So yeah, a couple of a couple. I mean, you know,
• 1:18:53
  Speaker 2: he is certainly he likes to nip for atension, which
• 1:18:57
  Speaker 2: I am not a fan of, so that is something
• 1:18:58
  Speaker 2: we need to train him out of. So far, he's
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 2: very good on leash. He's very good with the basic commands,
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 2: the sits, the downs, the weights, the great training is
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 2: going really well. So you know, we we we're working
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 2: on a lot of things. And like I said, I've
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 2: had him for what seventy two hours at this point,
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 2: so while I'm moving, so it's while we've been sick
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 2: to the hospital. So yeah, yeah, his house training definitely
• 1:19:27
  Speaker 2: needs some work, but I found just switching him off
• 1:19:29
  Speaker 2: his original Sorry, guys, I'm going into this way too deep.
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 2: You can cut this down to something reasonable. I'm obviously
• 1:19:35
  Speaker 2: very happy and enthusiastic.
• 1:19:36
  Speaker 1: The dog people are not going to want me to
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 1: cut a single drop of this. It'll be at the
• 1:19:42
  Speaker 1: end of the episodes of Your Dog Person, You're welcome.
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 2: H Yeah, So there's definitely some training. Like I said,
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 2: he's got the behavior more of a four year old puppy.
• 1:19:48
  Speaker 2: He clearly was not trained well for the last few months.
• 1:19:52
  Speaker 2: He likes to nip to get my attention, and that's
• 1:19:55
  Speaker 2: something that I am worried about because I have a
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 2: few bruises from where he's just you know, he's he's
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 2: clearly been trained to grab ankles and wrists to get attention,
• 1:20:04
  Speaker 2: and so we're redirecting him towards toys and that appears
• 1:20:07
  Speaker 2: to be working, but it ish, but it is. It's
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 2: a process. It's process. And then also the separation anxiety
• 1:20:14
  Speaker 2: is pretty bad. Right. He is just already bonded to
• 1:20:17
  Speaker 2: me in a way where he cannot be in a
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 2: room separate from me, and I think Never is a
• 1:20:21
  Speaker 2: little bit jealous already. She's like wait a minute, how
• 1:20:25
  Speaker 2: did you come ond it? It's like we've both been home,
• 1:20:27
  Speaker 2: and she's honestly been so much sicker than I have.
• 1:20:30
  Speaker 2: I've been doing a lot of the like puppy work
• 1:20:32
  Speaker 2: for the first few days just because she's been just
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 2: totally bedbound, and then and she's really been more on
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 2: the cat side of stuff, so her energy's been going
• 1:20:39
  Speaker 2: towards the cat. Mine's been more so. He clearly, you know,
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 2: will work on that. But uh oh man, I mean
• 1:20:47
  Speaker 2: he he's adorable, He's cute, he's cuddly, he's very very sweet.
• 1:20:53
  Speaker 2: He loves to nibble on my ear lobe, which again
• 1:20:55
  Speaker 2: I'm also trying to nip in the butt. And he
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 2: just he looks up with the cutest, the cutest face,
• 1:21:01
  Speaker 2: and you know, he won our hearts really really quickly.
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 2: I think, let's do I have I have a video
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 2: of him sleeping on my shoulder.
• 1:21:08
  Speaker 1: I love that the Live channel now has everyone contributing
• 1:21:11
  Speaker 1: their dog pictures. I am super pleased with this. This
• 1:21:13
  Speaker 1: is fantastic.
• 1:21:14
  Speaker 2: Oh, it's fantastic.
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 1: I want a dog.
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 2: Oh, here's the best picture. This is the first day.
• 1:21:21
  Speaker 1: Oh, the sunlit dog.
• 1:21:23
  Speaker 2: The sunlet dog. That's that's the best photo I think
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 2: I've taken of him so far. It's not you know,
• 1:21:27
  Speaker 2: you know, it's not the best talk it. It takes
• 1:21:30
  Speaker 2: a lot of photos to get to get a good
• 1:21:32
  Speaker 2: one or two. Oh yeah, here's here's another one that
• 1:21:34
  Speaker 2: I took right on the first day. Talk.
• 1:21:37
  Speaker 1: Well, his parents do, so you know it's genetic you know,
• 1:21:41
  Speaker 1: human human parents, I mean, because that's how genetics work.
• 1:21:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you know, I'm pretty sure once you adopt them,
• 1:21:46
  Speaker 2: they take on your gen x. That's how that works.
• 1:21:48
  Speaker 1: Every good human dog combo I've seen there has clearly
• 1:21:52
  Speaker 1: become a horizontal transfer of genes happening between the two species.
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 1: M Oh, he's so cute.
• 1:21:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:22:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the way that the stripe goes around his nose.
• 1:22:04
  Speaker 2: Mm hmmmmm. That last picture gives you a really good
• 1:22:07
  Speaker 2: idea of what his face looks like.
• 1:22:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he does definitely have some of that like soulful
• 1:22:11
  Speaker 1: pity look in his face, like the way that like,
• 1:22:14
  Speaker 1: I mean all dogs have that like soulful look, but
• 1:22:17
  Speaker 1: there's something about the way that pitbull faces just like
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 1: really just go for it.
• 1:22:21
  Speaker 2: It's so cute and you can see in the background all.
• 1:22:24
  Speaker 1: Those photos chaotic.
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 2: On the ground. It's not great. It's not great. God,
• 1:22:31
  Speaker 2: I love the dog photos.
• 1:22:33
  Speaker 1: It's fantastic.
• 1:22:34
  Speaker 2: So cute.
• 1:22:35
  Speaker 1: Is that a cat in that picture? We've got a
• 1:22:36
  Speaker 1: dog and a cat. Oh, they've made truce over the
• 1:22:38
  Speaker 1: heat lamp. That's what that is.
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, neither one seems that happy about it, but
• 1:22:45
  Speaker 2: they're like fine.
• 1:22:45
  Speaker 1: You can see when it gets a certain amount of cold,
• 1:22:48
  Speaker 1: like the rules of the feud change.
• 1:22:52
  Speaker 2: It's like predators and pray at the rules are.
• 1:22:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, the same with a too hot too. There
• 1:23:01
  Speaker 1: was a heat wave one year that I remember where
• 1:23:04
  Speaker 1: this I had a you know, my mom had a
• 1:23:06
  Speaker 1: dog and a cat that they those two in particular
• 1:23:09
  Speaker 1: really did not like each other. Like the dog didn't
• 1:23:12
  Speaker 1: like any of the cats, but that one cat in particular,
• 1:23:14
  Speaker 1: and like they were totally fine, laying right next to
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 1: each other on the cement like pad that was in
• 1:23:20
  Speaker 1: the shade. This one summer was just too fucking hot.
• 1:23:22
  Speaker 1: It was just like, no, we're way too hot to fight.
• 1:23:24
  Speaker 1: We're both just gonna enjoy the thermal math of concrete now.
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 1: And it's like you two have never been that close
• 1:23:30
  Speaker 1: together without fighting ever. But thermal extremes they will make
• 1:23:35
  Speaker 1: strange bedfellows.
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 2: It's true in cities too. I tell you that cities
• 1:23:42
  Speaker 2: change when they go to either too hot or too
• 1:23:45
  Speaker 2: cold over their extreme like what they can handle, right,
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 2: like whatever that extreme is in your local city.
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 2: I don't want to give a number, because everybody's different, right, like, right, But.
• 1:23:54
  Speaker 1: When it pushes the bounds of yours exact.
• 1:23:56
  Speaker 2: Right, right, Because like England was going down because it
• 1:23:59
  Speaker 2: got blow freezing, just like we do. Right. It's because
• 1:24:01
  Speaker 2: we're on the west coasts of sea, and then there's
• 1:24:05
  Speaker 2: a sea that keeps our environment very warm and very
• 1:24:08
  Speaker 2: stable because we're getting all that wind coming off the sea.
• 1:24:11
  Speaker 1: Well, our Pacific Ocean is really interesting actually, because the
• 1:24:14
  Speaker 1: ocean water is so cold because of how much wind
• 1:24:17
  Speaker 1: we have. It creates a cold upwelling. But a lot
• 1:24:21
  Speaker 1: of the wind that does come is coming from the
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 1: lower latitudes, which is the same thing as the Gulf Stream.
• 1:24:26
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 1: You get that tropical heat energy and then you just
• 1:24:31
  Speaker 1: fire hose it north.
• 1:24:33
  Speaker 2: It helps.
• 1:24:33
  Speaker 1: But England is much farther north than us, and it's
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 1: because they have a much more consistent atmosphere river in
• 1:24:40
  Speaker 1: the Gulf Stream than we do.
• 1:24:42
  Speaker 2: Serious silent you're saying the wind has created a unexpected encounter.
• 1:24:51
  Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to the Wheel of Time Spoiler's podcast.
• 1:24:54
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• 1:24:57
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• 1:25:01
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• 1:25:05
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• 1:25:08
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