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Fictional Women Around the World: Dana Scully · Stuff Mom Never Told You

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha and looking to stuff
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: I never told you production of I Heeart Radio. Welcome
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: to another sub sub sub sub whatever, subsegment of women
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: around the world, fictional women around the world, and oh
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: my goodness, I'm so excited about this one. I'm so
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: glad I chose who I did, which is Dana Scully,
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: because I actually had picked someone else out um for
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: this our our month of October. But then I was
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: thinking about I just saw on the news something about
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: the Skully effect, and I was like, well, I've got
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: to learn more about this and I might as well
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: tie it into work. And I'm so glad perfect I
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: love it. So I know I've talked about my experience
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: grow up watching X Files terrified and terrified me. Uh
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: and in fact, I got so scared by because I
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: have said I'm scared of alien so I this was
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: a real push for me. But also it's the Killer
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: B episode. I got so scared my mom forbid me
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: to watch it ever again. So I just stay up
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: until three am on Sundays and watch it on Fox
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: at the volume way out if you're listening, Mom, Yes,
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: I did that for years, but as I got older,
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: the band was lifted, and my friend and I would
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: watch it and we would both be on our landline
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: phones and we watch at the same time, and her
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: her TV was slightly faster than mind, so she would
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: gas and I'd be like, what is it? And then
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: it would happen like it was such a fun like
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: experience that doesn't really happen anymore. And I know I've
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: talked a lot about how watching this show was one
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: of my first times of like, I had a crush
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: on both Molder and Scully, and I was like, mm hmm,
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: although looking back, I wasn't. I didn't think that was weird.
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: I didn't think it was weird. It was funny. I
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: was telling the story that somebody the other day and
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: I was like, I I used to think it was
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: weird that I had a crush on Luke and Land.
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: She was like, oh, because you you were learning you
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: were by and I was like, no, because they're related.
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: I wasn't sure if that was weird, and she was like, oh, yeah,
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  Speaker 1: So it never struck me as odd, which I do
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  Speaker 1: find interesting. I think I might have just assumed, you know,
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: affictional crushes whatever. But it was it was a very
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: kind of formative. I know a lot of people have
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: said this, this is actually something we're going to talk
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: about in this episode as well, but I was not
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  Speaker 1: the only one who experienced this at all. Also, I
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: didn't realize until I was doing the research for this
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: episode how kind of funny and on the nose. Her
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: name is Scully, but we have a Scully. If you
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: listen to or have seen any of the videos that, um,
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: the stuff they don't want you to know crew have done,
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: they might mention Scully Scully as a skeleton that we
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: have in our office that is always hanging around. But yeah,
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: I didn't realize how kind of funny names there. You go, Yes,
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: all right, so let's get into it. Dana Katherine Scully
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  Speaker 1: is one of the protagonists of The X Files, a
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: sci fi paranormal television show that debuted in nineteen three.
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: She was played by Jillian Anderson and appeared in all
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: but five episodes of the nine seasons of episodes, plus
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: a much shorter two seasons. Some people say there's ten seasons.
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: Some people stay there eleven seasons. I don't know what
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: the deal is with that. But also in all the movies,
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: according to Chris Carter, creator of the series. He immediately
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: wanted to cast Anderson after her audition, but the network
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: was pushing him to cast a quote bombshell um. Their
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: first choice was Pamela Anderson. Carter said he didn't want
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: romance between Moldern and Scully and that he wanted the
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: genders to play against stereotypes. I eat Scully being the
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: more logical, skeptical one. So Scully is an FBI special agent,
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: medical doctor and the skeptic to her partner Fox, I
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: want to believe Moulder. Yes, So I tried to watch this.
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: I've gone through a few episodes, but that's part I
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: didn't know, Like he's trying to convince everybody you need,
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: you need to believe. But do love that She's the
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: all around no it all has to be at the
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: top of her game, typical FBI agent for these shows.
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: She was originally assigned to Molder to debunk his work
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: and report back to her supervisor Narc. Over time, she
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: and Moulder developed a strong trust and respect for each
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: other and later some romantic feelings because you know, he
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: gots to add that in there for drama, Yeah, drama,
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: there was some drama, Alien drama, Scully was born in
• 4:46
  Speaker 1: the sixties in Maryland and was raised Catholic, though her
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: favor movie was The Exorcist. In her ideas and around
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: religion fluctuate. Ultimately, she wants to believe too, but is
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: afraid to. She also she wears a cross throughout the series.
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: Both her parents were supportive, her dad was military, and
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: they moved around a lot. After her Sunday school teacher
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: was murdered in his backyard when she was thirteen, she
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: realized that there was quote true evil in the world.
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: Scully described her childhood like this, Ever since I was
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: a child, I've never allowed myself to get too close
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: to people. I've avoided emotional attachment. Perhaps I've been so
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: afraid of death and dying that any connection just seemed
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: like a bad thing, something that wouldn't last. All right,
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: I need to know. Yes, is Jillian Anderson English? No,
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: But she grew up in London. She was not born there,
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: but from what I understand, spent a good chunk of
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: her childhood growing up there. Okay, you asked, because of
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: the Crown. Yes, Well, not not just because of the Crown,
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: Because like any of the shows they had a BBC
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: series of it was one of the literature remakes. It wasn't,
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: but it was another one. I think it's a Charles
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: Dickens one. And her accident was on point, and it
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: threw me off because her American accident is also on
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: points why she was a Eric and so that was
• 6:01
  Speaker 1: one of those moments of what know her a Scully?
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: So anyway, just at that moment, so she being Scully
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: not Jillian Anderson. She studied at University of Maryland, where
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: one of the doctors above her once said, quote, humans
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: are top carnivores. We sit at the top of the
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: food chain. We reduced other species chances of survival. True.
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: She studied forensic medicine and physics. She was really ambitious,
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: threw herself into her work, pushing herself to accomplish more
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: and more. In n she was recruited by the FBI,
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: where she attended the FBI Academy, later going on to
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: become an instructor. A cut scene described her as quote intelligent,
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  Speaker 1: self assured, with an unblushing sense of her own femininity,
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  Speaker 1: and that she commands attention that she does. Over her
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  Speaker 1: time working with Agent Molder, her beliefs are tested as
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: they encounter phenomena a week after week that are often
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: difficult to explain. I remember even being a kid and
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: being like, wow, so something like this happens like every week.
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: At first, she is often mocking towards Molder and his ideas,
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  Speaker 1: but while the skepticism remains, she doesn't lose that. Her
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: attitude around it kind of shifts um And she is really, really,
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: really skilled. She's quick on her feet, she's smart, she's
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: good under pressure, analytical, good with weapons. Also, she might
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: be immortal, and I totally forgot about that whole plotline.
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: She has a cancer scare. The plotlines are related to
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: this immortality thing and an infertility storyline as well. On
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  Speaker 1: top of that, she has extraterrestrial DNA that she uses
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: to make a vaccine to save humankind. You. She partnered
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: with Agent dogg It when Molder disappeared and gave birth
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: to her and Molder's telekinetic Sun, although the pregnancy how
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: happened mysteriously, but Scully and Molder called William their son.
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: Turns out aliens need William to colonize planet Earth and
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: that he was at one time part alien. In order
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  Speaker 1: to protect him, Scully finds a family to anonymously adopt
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  Speaker 1: him as a baby. Way back in season two. She
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: unknowingly mothered a daughter named Emily, who was adopted to
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  Speaker 1: another family, where she died soon after. Scully reunited with
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  Speaker 1: Molder and they started a life together, her working as
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: a doctor for six years until the charges against Molder
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  Speaker 1: were dropped and the two returned His partners to the
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  Speaker 1: reopened X Files unit. There's a lot, I know, a
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: lot happened in that paragraph, and then there's something else
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  Speaker 1: and wild towards the end. Damn Okay. So it wasn't
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  Speaker 1: until towards the end of the show that her and
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  Speaker 1: Moulder were more consistently shown doing date like activities together,
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: and hint that they were dating or hooking up started
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  Speaker 1: to appear. Molder gave her a love confession, is implied
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  Speaker 1: that she initiated sex, she leaves him at one point,
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  Speaker 1: and then they end up back together, her pregnant with
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  Speaker 1: his child. Yeah, yeah, sure. I mean, obviously, if you've
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: got like, essentially eleven years of stuff and a couple
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: of movies, it's a lot to condense, and it's strange,
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  Speaker 1: I mean a lot of strange. But obviously I did
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: want to talk about the impact of this character had because, um,
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: she was well loved and critically lauded. I found a
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: list of like twenty female characters on TV like now
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  Speaker 1: or recently that we're inspired by her. Like the creators
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: have said, Scully was the inspiration. She had a lasting impact.
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  Speaker 1: She has a Barbie. I don't know what that really means.
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: I mean she had a big impact. She regularly lands
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  Speaker 1: on list of best and most iconic heroines and provided
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  Speaker 1: inspiration for yes, a bunch of fictional characters that followed
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  Speaker 1: after her. And the words of Liz Shannon Miller at Indiewier,
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  Speaker 1: Scully's legacy is so important in so many ways, from
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  Speaker 1: giving us the gift of Jillian Anderson's acting to inspiring
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  Speaker 1: an entire generation of young women to pursue careers in
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  Speaker 1: Stem Intelligent, loyal, flawed, and brave, Scully was the show's
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  Speaker 1: beating heart and saving grace even in its lowest years.
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  Speaker 1: As Chris Carter himself has said, it's Scullies show. So
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: let's talk about the Scully effect. Tell let's write down
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: that stem bed. We've mentioned it before, but this is
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: something called the Scully effect. The popularity of this character
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: is thought to have inspired a whole generation of women
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  Speaker 1: to pursue careers in STEM, and it's a term still
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: in use today. When asked about this in Jillian Anderson
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: actually said, what, we got a lot of letters all
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  Speaker 1: the time. And I was told quite frequently by girls
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  Speaker 1: who are going into the medical world or the science world,
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: or the FBI world or other worlds that I reigned
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: that they were pursuing this pursuit because of the character
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: of Scully. And I said, yea, I love it. Um.
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  Speaker 1: This whole thing has actually been academically studied, including by
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: the Gina Davis Institute. Among two thousand women surveyed, they found, quote,
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: among the women who are familiar with the character say
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: Scully increased their interest in STEM, and Forte say they
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: considered working in STEM because of her, that knew of her,
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: said she was a good role model. And there are
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: so many heartwarming stories of women's scientists sitting around with
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: friends to watch the show and being inspired to do
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: what they do in part by Scully. Now, all this
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: is to say, like, well, I think that article that
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: brought this character to my attention that came up the
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: other day was saying, like, you know, how big actually
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: is this effect, like can we really measure it? Is
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: it a real seeing? But I mean I think that
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: you can certainly say even if she wasn't the main
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: reason by this survey, she did like maybe you know,
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: get you interested, or like maybe you thought about it
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: when you had before, which I think is great. So
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: when I initially heard the Scully effect, I thought it
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: was a sexual connotation. Oh well, we're going to talk
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: about that. Yes, many women were like, oh hello Scully
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: in that level and then being interested in threesomes because
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: of the X file. That's what I thought. It was
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: no context to it. It was, however, interesting. Actually we
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: are going to talk about that kind of in a second,
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: but first we got to talk about the pants suits. Okay,
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: so one thing people love about this character is her
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: dang pants suits. Like a lot of the articles I
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: found were like ranking Scullies fashion. It was great how
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: many people were like, no, it's horrible fashion, but I
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: love it, and other people being like no, this is
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: the top of the fat, like, but I love it.
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: And when the show was coming out, this was like
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: when pant suits were becoming a thing and his third
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: weight feminism, and it was interesting to see the evolution
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: of that through this character. While she is introduced in
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: this iconic outfit simple to the point, and you probably
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: it's when you think of Scully, you probably think of
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: it where the white and the black baser and kind
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: of the black pencil skirt. Throughout the show, she wears
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: some slacks, some shoulder plats, some patterns to the point.
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: Her outfits spawned passionate early days internet discussions, because yes,
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: this was also the early days on the internet. Her
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: style is sometimes called competence core. Her style is both
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: mocked and praised. Yes, her outfits both display femininity while
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: leaning into masculinity, a strategy that many women in masculine
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: fields employed. Um As the show progresses, her clothes become
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: more tailored to show off her shape more. But it
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: wasentially you can find articles like talking about the symbolism
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: of her outfit and what it says about, like where
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: women in the workplace where at the time, and how
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: yeh being in the smack and field, she she was
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: kind of like trying to lean into that with these
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: box these outfits, but then also still remain feminine. Interesting, Yeah,
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: I remember those suits. Even though I didn't know much
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: of the show, I remember those suits. So from Megan
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: Garber at The Atlantic, she stays as she shears layers
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: of clothes season after season. As blouses go unbuttoned, they
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: give away to tight T shirts and slight chemistles, As
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: blazers get belted and nipped and shortened, as coach shrieked
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: to fit her form. Schooley shows something else as well,
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: her belief and indeed her default trust and all that
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: she has taken for granted, the big things so many
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: of us take for granted, government, religion, culture, carefully constructed
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: intellectual infrastructures that give the world it's order. All of those,
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: As the X Files goes on get called into question.
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: Scully's clothes become a metaphor for her willingness to believe
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: in disbelief. They become a visual symbol of how far
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: her rationality has taken her. Scully, her clothes suggests her
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: weighty coats and bulky pants and jettison in favor for
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: more freeing options, might finally be able to share Molder's
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: faith and faithlessness. Oh I love it. I also remember
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: asking my mom before I the band came in place,
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: why Molder always wore ties? Because he always is getting
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: strangled by that, and I'm like, this seems pointless. Why,
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: I mean, I guess good enough for women with long hair.
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: Why you know you're gonna that's true. That's true. So
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: going back to what you were talking about, Samantha, there
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: is a thing called I am an X File as
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: lesbian and I know, yes, I have told the story
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: million times being attracted to both Molder and Scully. I
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: didn't know this was like a whole thing, but apparently
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: it is. I am not alone in it. There's no
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: threesome elelement as far as I know, but Scully is
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: sometimes jokingly referred to as the quote gateway lesbian of choice.
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: Academic research has been done on this on the quote
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: Gillian Anderson, Dana Scully made me gay movement from the nineties. Again,
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: effect was wow, I did I didn't know. It was
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: like being studied and I did read it. There's only
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: as far as I know, there's only one academic paper,
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: but I did read it. I was like, whoa man?
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: But also yes, early days of the internet, X Files
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: was one of the first shows to foster an online
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: fan fiction community, to the point Scotland Yard investigated, believing
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: the writers were involved in a cult. Oh Scotland yard,
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: you silly guys, you know. Yeah, what's so funny is it?
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: We will soon see a reference to this in sects
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: in the city in that fantasy A level excited very quick.
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: But because I for you to hear to see how
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: you react to it. Oh, I am excited. Okay, well
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: I got that to look forward to. I have a friend, actually,
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: the friend I used to watch at the same time
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: on the phone with us, and she's rewatching X files
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: right now and I've been very much enjoying her updates.
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: Yea of where she is and out of context it
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: can sound quite bizarre, which I love. But she's saying
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: like when she was younger, she had a bigger crush
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: on Moulder, but she also had a crush on Scully.
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: But now she had the bigger crush on Scully. Yeah,
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: still a crush on Molder, the bigger on Scully. Yep.
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: It's fair, ye yes, fair. Oh it has been so fun,
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: not one, but two effects we get to talk about.
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: As always, listeners, if you have a suggestion for someone
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: we should feature on fictional women around the world, here's
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: any suggestion at all for something we should talk about.
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: You can email us our email Stuff Media mom Stuff
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: at i heeart media dot com. You can find us
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: on Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast or on Instagram at
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: stuff Whatever told you I thinks It's always to our
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: super producer Christie you know. Thank you and thanks to
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: you for listening. Spondver told you his prediction of iHeart Radio.
• 18:04
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