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Christian Nationalism · The Living Freed Podcast

0:19
Happy Thursday and thank you so much for tuning
0:22
in to listen to another episode on the Living
0:25
Freed Podcast. I know this podcast is definitely
0:29
my favorite so I hope it's yours because I get
0:32
very entertained making it so I hope you stayed
0:35
entertained listening to it. Speaking of entertainment,
0:39
have y 'all seen Wuthering Heights yet? I mean,
0:42
I did not read the book whatsoever. I'm ashamed
0:44
to say it as someone who's an avid book reader.
0:47
So I had no idea what it was truly about. I knew
0:49
it was like masquerading as a romance but not
0:52
a true romance. Oh my gosh. First off, I don't
0:58
think I can ever see that movie again. I enjoyed
1:01
it. I think. I'm not sure. Honestly. It was kind
1:06
of dark. Or not kind of dark. It was really dark.
1:10
And really gruesome. And then the love story
1:13
was sweet until people started cheating, and
1:16
I'm just not an advocate for cheating, but then
1:19
also Jacob Elordi, big fan of his now. I've always
1:22
loved Margot Robbie, so can't hate on her. The
1:26
art was phenomenal. The dresses, oh my gosh,
1:29
the dresses were amazing. Amazing. I would watch
1:35
it again, honestly, just to look at her dresses.
1:38
They're so phenomenal. But the storyline, I cried.
1:41
I sobbed. And her husband did not deserve to
1:44
be treated that way, y 'all. He didn't. It broke
1:47
my heart. I felt so bad for him. And his little
1:51
ward of a daughter or whatever, hate her. Hate
1:55
her. Phenomenal actress. Hate the character.
1:58
Hate her. What a weirdo. And not just a weirdo,
2:01
like she needed to go to a psych ward and seek
2:04
serious help today's time of a psych ward. Not
2:07
back then. Anyways, and also that author and
2:11
Jane Austen have never met. There's no way they've
2:15
ever met because those romances so different.
2:21
So extremely different. I would say, yeah. I
2:25
don't know. So, I enjoyed it, but I didn't enjoy
2:29
it. If you catch my drift, I don't know. I feel
2:32
like it's one of those things to understand you
2:33
might have to actually see it for yourself and
2:35
not just take my word for it. Also, jumping straight
2:38
into what's in and what's out, what is out? Tell
2:40
me lies. I just watched the last episode of Tell
2:44
Me Lies. What was that? Truly, what was that?
2:48
Did I get the closure I was looking for? Yes
2:51
and no. Did I like the ending? Not really. Do
2:55
I feel like I have unanswered questions? 110%.
2:59
So what was that? Someone needs to talk to the
3:04
writer, the producer, whoever she is. I don't
3:07
know. I just... Ugh. Lucy honestly needs to be
3:13
on medication and Steven needs to go live on
3:15
an island by himself with no one else around
3:17
because he's insane. And I truly think he turned
3:20
Lucy crazy. And Wrigley and Breen, I'm so happy
3:24
to know that they end up happily ever after.
3:26
I did see a note from the producer on that, or
3:28
the writer, whoever, that the shared smile was
3:31
supposed to be them ending up happily ever after.
3:33
So I will take that. I love them. I never thought
3:36
I would root for those two specifically in the
3:38
end. I did. I did. And then Diana and Peppa being
3:42
like, let's dip at the end of this fight. I was
3:46
here for it. I would be, I would. Adios. You
3:49
know, um, Irish goodbye it. Do not deal with
3:53
that. Not my problem. Not my problem. But why
3:57
they were all at that wedding anyways, I didn't
3:58
understand. You would think that they would lead
4:00
it up to them all being friends at the end of
4:03
the season or like that semester and that's why
4:06
they were all at the wedding. It just didn't
4:07
make any sense to me. All that to say, it didn't
4:09
make any sense to me. I didn't understand, but
4:11
whatever. Um, okay. Since I already talked about
4:15
what's out, let's talk about what's in. What
4:17
is in is spring cleaning. Yes, we're in February,
4:21
but I'm spring cleaning y 'all, starting today.
4:23
As soon as I finish recording this episode, I'm
4:26
supposed to go grocery shopping, so I take that
4:28
back later today, possibly tomorrow. Sometime
4:32
this week, I will start spring cleaning, because
4:34
I need to. I'm gonna take it one closet at a
4:37
time, to one section of the bedroom at a time,
4:40
I need to sell a wedding dress. I'm thinking
4:42
about selling a chandelier. I don't know. My
4:45
aunt gave it to me for Christmas like 10 years
4:47
ago and I feel guilty. I feel like I should keep
4:49
it. But at the same time, that was like 10 years
4:52
ago. Um, so I've got decisions to make and I
4:56
have a really great book I'm trying to finish.
4:58
Wish me luck. I have a lot that I think I'm going
5:01
to accomplish today and I have a massage at three.
5:04
So we'll see. TBD. Um, okay. Anyways. What I've
5:10
been up to, I basically feel like I've told y
5:11
'all. I feel like I gave you my whole life's
5:14
story and what's happened in the last week since
5:16
we've last talked. I hope you loved Serena's
5:19
episodes because I loved re -listening to them
5:22
and editing them as we went. I had the best time.
5:26
Happy post -Valentine's Day. I hope everyone
5:29
had a great Valentine's Day. And all I have left
5:33
coming up is bridal showers. We're hitting wedding
5:36
season. So wish me wish my bank account luck
5:41
because it's brutal out here being single and
5:44
Spending all this money at weddings because you
5:45
have to buy the gift and then you have to buy
5:47
dresses And more sometimes more gifts. It's rough
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Anyways, okay We are gonna take on a really difficult
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subject today so bear with me as we try to breeze
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through it and Let's dive in to this week's episode
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I've personally have been seeing a lot of posts
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and online conversation slash debates taking
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place over Christian nationalism. Crazy subject
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to be seeing so many debates about. From what
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I understood on the subject is stuff that I personally
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didn't agree with and the strong movement that
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has been taking place. I actually posted on Instagram
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a small thing about it and let me tell y 'all,
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no love like Christian hate because that hate
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started rolling in. So first off, gross. If you
6:48
don't like something I say, believe it or not,
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you can move on. You're insta feed like I do.
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Every day I just keep scrolling past. If I don't
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like something you have to say, I scroll on past
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because I have free will. But it did get me thinking.
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Maybe I don't fully understand it. Maybe I've
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only taken a shallow look at it and came up with
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an opinion on the little I understood and maybe
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that opinion needs to change. So I dived into
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the deep end of research. I researched for me
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and you. So this episode will go over the pros
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and the cons made on both sides of the argument
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for Christian nationalism by Christians and pastors.
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And I will As always, have Bible verses to follow.
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Are you ready to jump in with me? Quickly, I
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want to just say that I'm going to use ACLU of
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North Dakota, Pastor Adam Hamlet with the Church
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of Resurrection, Stephen Wolf, who wrote The
7:50
Case for Christian Nationalism, The Christians
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for Social Action, The History Channel, and then,
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as always, the Bible. So to start, I felt like
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I really had to have as close to as an unbiased
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opinion and conversation on this topic as I could.
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To one, start with the pros and to two, commence.
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I mean truly commence myself to believe otherwise.
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So here we are. For those who don't know what
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Christian nationalism is, wow this is going to
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be a tough one. It is a political ideology and
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cultural framework that seeks to merge American
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identity with a specific traditional expression
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of Christianity. Again, it is a political ideology
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and cultural framework that seeks to merge American
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identity with a specific, that means one, doesn't
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mean the whole thing, a specific, traditionalist
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expression of Christianity. It advocates for
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the government to actually promote Christian
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values, which we can all get behind, and often
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aiming a shape of public policy, laws, and social
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life according to the conservative, often white,
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Protestant vision. Now, this is a basic Google
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definition. You can literally Google it. It will
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pop up if you're looking for just the broad definition
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of what is Christian nationalism and why they
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had to state white. I don't know except for a
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lot of Protestants are white, I guess. I could
9:34
be wrong. It's rare, but it happens. Okay. So
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now that you know the definition, let's start
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with the commonly thought of prose for Christians.
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Specifically, again, Christians. These are the
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prose that Christians are coming up with. Non
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-Christians would never think of these as prose.
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Okay, starting with Christian nationalism directly
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connects itself to the conservative party. Most
10:00
Christians align with said party. It wants happy
10:04
and hopeful people And how could that ever be
10:08
a bad thing? I love the idea of being happy and
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hopeful, even if I have my own mental health
10:14
issues. It's defending and promoting the ideas
10:18
of families, strictly for man and woman, marriage
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only, as we see in the Bible. It's pro -life.
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It says our government should reflect Christian
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beliefs. It advocates for Christian value for
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the whole country for things like being against
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abortion. It just wants to bring together God
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and country. It believes Christians should retain
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a privileged place in American life and culture,"
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quotes Pastor Adam Hamlet from the Church of
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Resurrection. And Christians should exercise
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greater dominion. So Christian nationalism believes
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that Christians should exercise greater dominion,
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authority, and leadership in America. It also,
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sorry, I'm reading my tabs, it also claims that
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we lost the idea of a Christian nation after
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World War II and that they want it back. Alright,
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all great reasons, I would say, looking at it
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surface level. All things that, for the most
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part, I can personally stand behind. A lot of
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them. I would say a solid 95%. Okay, that's being
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dramatic. Maybe a solid 85%. But again, not about
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me. Because again, they're all really great ideas.
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And if we go back to the thought that some people
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use the phrase of Christian nationalism to mean
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that Christianity should influence the nation
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and laws, which I can stand behind, while others
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mean that the nation and government should actually
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identify as Christian. Going off of that, we
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actually hear a lot of arguments for this movement.
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One being that the US, not America, but the US
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started as a Christian nation. It was founded
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as a Christian nation. And yes, but no. Because
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at that time, whatever main religion came into
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that territory, said territory would fall under
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their religious beliefs. Much like we see happening
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with the Muslims in today's culture. My question
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for you is, do we want to be like the Muslims
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in today's culture? And, side note, nowhere in
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the Bible does Jesus or God command us to conquer
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nations for the sake of making them turn to Christians.
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Jesus does say go make fishers and men and spread
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the gospel but nowhere does God or Jesus say
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conquer the nations around you to turn them into
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Christians. Jesus is big on free will and faith
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just to be very clear on that. But if we go back
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to America or sorry the United States being a
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Christian nation we go back to the pilgrims on
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the Mayfair. Who were seeking religious relief
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from the Church of England? Again, they were
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seeking religious relief from another part of
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Christianity in the Church of England. They were
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separatists that wanted and needed to practice
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their own version of Christianity and from what
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the Church was practicing in its homeland, but
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they also had motivations for economic and social
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factors too. And I do want to say that if you
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look at them, they're still Christians. They
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still believed in God and Jesus, but they needed
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to um how's how do i want to say this they needed
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to practice their own version of christianity
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that was separate from the church and if you
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look at today's nations or today's christianity
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how many denominations are there how can we sit
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under a christian nation if we can't even come
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together under these denominations because they
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do believe separate things they don't all believe
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huge separate things but there are little differences
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that would make an impact on how we run a country
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I do just want to say that. Another argument
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that is made is, would we be a better country
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without separation of church and state? Well,
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our country, when Thomas Jefferson was president,
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was constitutioned under separation of church
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and state in 1786, giving us religious freedom
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for all so that all Christians could practice
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all different types of Christianity. and so on
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for everyone else. And we get to practice that
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Christianity in any font we want. For you, for
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me, for your neighbor. But do you know what countries
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do not allow for separation of their religion
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and state in the year 2026? I will list out just
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a few. Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Iran, and the Maldives.
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Believe it or not, because that's my dream vacation
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spot. So random. But these countries often operate
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under a strict interpretation of Sharia law.
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When have we ever wanted to be like, once again,
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the Muslim culture? We have it. That's not what
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we're aiming for. So why are we allowing Christian
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nationalism to kind of gear us towards that?
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Now, I know the argument is that we're so different
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from them. We believe in peace, love, mercy,
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a just God, etc. Babes, they believe the same
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thing about their god and religion. We might
15:16
serve the one true god, but they think they do
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and they enforce those beliefs on the whole country.
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Our god let the Israelites walk away time and
15:25
time again. Our god sent a prophet to Nineveh
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to give them a chance. Daniel didn't conform
15:30
to the religion of Babylon even though they called
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for active idol worship and it was being forced
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on everyone around him. Our God allowed his son
15:40
to die at the hand of religion, enforcement,
15:43
and government. Jesus even said, Give to Caesar
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what is Caesar's, and to God what is God's. And
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I think he knew what he was saying there. It
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wasn't just about money. Did you know that the
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Nazis were seen as and used as a Christian nationalism
15:58
to gain favor for their party? They thought themselves
16:02
a superior race. And then they thought of second
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class, a subhuman race. and then they terminated
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others they didn't believe were worthy of them.
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But Christians would never do that except we
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promoted slavery. Cough cough. And by the way,
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just so you know, the KKK is also seen and they
16:25
see themselves as a religious group. A Christian
16:28
religious group, mind you. Okay, let's quit it
16:31
with the history talk and go to the cons because
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I know the history talk must be so boring for
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most of us. So, the cons. Again, these are all
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quoted by Christian pastors or professors. They
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say that a con of Christian nationalism is its
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main goal is to gain power and control. Another
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con is when people often gain power and control,
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they lose empathy and compassion for those who
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need it. The immigrant, the poor, the young girl
16:59
who got pregnant. So the danger of nationalism
17:02
is idolatry. It wants to be number one. Serving
17:04
the primary god. but that God quickly becomes
17:08
the nation, masquerading as us serving the God.
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I know, I know, I could only come up with three
17:16
cons. Truly, I thought I'd have more cons than
17:19
pros when I started my research. But let me say
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this, every sermon I listened to or watched,
17:26
every Christian based website I read from, every
17:28
podcast or YouTube video I listened to or watched,
17:31
listed the same cons as me. And there might only
17:35
be three, but to me, those are three big ones.
17:39
I did at some point start to convince myself
17:41
of these pros, and I was like, wow, I've been
17:44
on the wrong side of this. But then I went back
17:47
to those cons, again listed by pastors and other
17:50
Christians, and I thought, no, this actually
17:54
doesn't stand for what Jesus says. And you might
17:57
not have a problem with the idea of Christian
18:00
nationalism and that's okay. We live in a free
18:02
country for those opinions. But these are the
18:05
cons that Christian pastors, men, and leaders
18:08
have said and I think it's important to take
18:10
these three very serious. Christian for social
18:15
action says this about it. Christian nationalism
18:18
is a belief that a country and everything it
18:21
includes, law, society, Society, economy, government,
18:25
religion, education, foreign policy, etc. should
18:29
be adhered to a very specific Christian worldview.
18:33
In the United States, the type of Christianity
18:35
fueled by Christian nation is a white supremacist
18:39
movement as old as the country itself. Now, if
18:42
we lived in a world of perfect Christians, Jesus
18:45
loving leaders, I'd be all for them running the
18:49
government. I would be psyched, thrilled, living
18:53
my personal best life, and I think you would
18:56
be too. But we don't live in that world. We live
18:59
in a world where dark masquerades as good and
19:02
light, or hides behind it. We live in a world
19:05
where leaders fail us and fall to selfish sins.
19:08
We live in a world where people use God as a
19:10
mask to hide who they truly are and their motives.
19:13
If we lived in a world, heck, a country where
19:16
a church was properly churchy? I would be all
19:20
for the leaders rising into government. But we
19:22
don't. You turn on the news and another pastor
19:25
was arrested for hurting a child, to put it lightly.
19:28
We aren't taking care of the needy, the poor,
19:31
the orphan. We don't serve justice in our own
19:34
church. So why would we do it in our government?
19:37
As the Bible says, he who is faithful with little
19:39
will be faithful with much. And if we brought
19:41
it into schools, what would that look like? The
19:44
idea of it sounds amazing, like yes, let's pray
19:48
over classes with our children and them. Let's
19:51
teach them to serve and show grace. But which
19:54
version of Christianity would we want forced?
19:57
Not the liberals, not MAGA, maybe not the Catholics,
20:02
or the Pentecostals, etc. I feel like you're
20:06
getting the point. We should want to exercise
20:09
authority, but not to have control or dominion.
20:12
but to have an impact in positive ways on our
20:15
culture. We can't force people to believe something,
20:18
but can you create conditions where it's easier
20:21
to compel them to believe in something? The fear
20:23
that is trying to be installed in us that the
20:26
Christian church is going away as being persecuted
20:29
in the United States is such a tool of the enemy.
20:33
Fear isn't from God, trust me. Christianity isn't
20:37
going anywhere anytime soon. As of 2025, 90 %
20:43
of religious buildings in the US are Christian
20:46
churches. But approximately 48 % of the US congregation,
20:51
so that's over 150 ,000 churches, operate their
20:56
own food distribution program. Or they support
20:59
external efforts like food pantries and soup
21:02
kitchens. But again, that's only 48%. Around
21:06
44 % of the U .S. Protestant churchgoers report
21:10
that their congregation is actively involved
21:12
in adoption, foster care, or orphan care. That's
21:16
according though to LifeWay Research data. Supposedly,
21:20
75 % of widows report that their church has no
21:23
organized ministry for them. That is so sad.
21:26
We're letting our widows just sit there being
21:28
uncared for in our community, whether that's
21:31
physically, emotionally, mentally. And did you
21:34
know approximately 30 % of US adults attend church
21:38
or religious service nearly every week or more?
21:42
Now that data though is only from 2023 to 2024.
21:47
Pastor Adam Hamlett says, the goal is not to
21:49
just pray for the kingdom to come, but to work
21:52
so that the kingdom would come. But Jesus says
21:55
in Mark 1 -15, The time is fulfilled and the
21:58
kingdom of God is at hand. The key action given
22:01
to us when it comes to our country is to pray
22:04
for it, obey the laws, advocate for justice,
22:07
and to serve our communities, being a representation
22:10
of the bride of Christ. That's it. That's how
22:14
we got hospitals. That's how we got schools.
22:17
And in the 21st century, that's how we got nonprofits
22:20
and mission groups. It seems to me if we did
22:23
those things as the church, we could raise those
22:25
numbers in the previous stats and have an impact
22:28
on culture, community, and the government so
22:31
that no one has to have the feeling of needing
22:34
to force anything, but so that just maybe we
22:38
can create the environment that compels people
22:41
to want to know Jesus and change our nation through
22:44
action into being known as a Christian nation.
23:00
Thanks so much for listening to the Living Freed
23:02
podcast. I hope that you enjoyed it. Let's stay
23:05
connected. You can message me or follow me on
23:08
Instagram at Hannah Liz D or you can email me
23:12
at livingfreedpod at gmail .com. If you're loving
23:16
the podcast, I'd be so honored if you'd go ahead
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and hit that subscribe button and leave me a
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review. And if you have any feedback or a subject
23:23
you'd like me to cover, please go ahead and email
23:25
me or DM me on Instagram. Again, thank you so
23:29
much for listening. I hope you feel encouraged
23:31
and lighter today. Bye, y 'all.