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Putting the "I" in PI | Political Capital Daily · Political Capital with Rob Shaw

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  Speaker 2: It's Friday, September 18th, 2026, and.
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  Speaker 1: This is Political Capital Daily.
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  Speaker 3: Good morning.
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  Speaker 1: Happy Friday. You've made it through another week in BC politics.
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  Speaker 1: What a week it was. What an incredibly wild and
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  Speaker 1: spectacular week on this rollercoaster we call life. Jeff Ferrier,
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  Speaker 1: joining me from Political Capital Prime, longtime New Democrat strategist, co-founder,
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  Speaker 1: FramePoint Public Affairs. Jeff, how you doing?
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  Speaker 3: I'm doing great, Rob. Happy Friday.
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  Speaker 1: It's a Political Capital double shot today because we'll be
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  Speaker 1: on the Political Capital Prime show coming up later today
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  Speaker 1: so watch uh for that it's kind of one of
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  Speaker 1: those days where you get a lot of political capital
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  Speaker 1: and you get a thick hey get out of my
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  Speaker 1: trash get lost sorry there's just a guy in a
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  Speaker 1: fedora and a trench coat with a magnifying glass in
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  Speaker 1: my trash bin i don't know what's going on there
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  Speaker 1: so i had to get.
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  Speaker 3: Did you look like brent did you look like brent chapman.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah brent chapman with a mustache uh was what it
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  Speaker 1: looked like uh we'll get into that issue the old
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  Speaker 1: private eye issue, the talk of BC politics. In just
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  Speaker 1: a couple of minutes here, we want to run down, firstly,
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  Speaker 1: what's happening today if you want to set your political agenda.
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  Speaker 1: The big news this morning, Premier David Eby will be
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  Speaker 1: addressing the UBCM convention with his speech that closes out
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  Speaker 1: the convention. This is usually a big deal in the
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  Speaker 1: political calendar, Jeff. It's doubly so now because of all
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  Speaker 1: the early election speculation. What are you looking for in
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  Speaker 1: the Premier's speech at 11.20 today?
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  Speaker 3: Well, there's a lot of speculation that he's going to
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  Speaker 3: announce that he's calling a snap election. There are some
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  Speaker 3: saying that he would do it in the speech. Can
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  Speaker 3: you imagine? I don't think that's going to happen because
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  Speaker 3: the UBCM just passed a resolution saying don't call a
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  Speaker 3: snap election in the middle of local government elections.
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  Speaker 1: He'd get booed out of the room if he did that.
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  Speaker 4: Well.
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  Speaker 3: Wouldn't be the first time a politician has been booed
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  Speaker 3: out of a room. I hear that Carolyn Finley got
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  Speaker 3: sparse applause for her speech today, except from Sheldon Clare,
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  Speaker 3: who gave her a standing ovation. But this is an
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  Speaker 3: important speech for him. You will probably hear in it
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  Speaker 3: the contours of what he is going to run a
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  Speaker 3: snap election campaign on. The positioning, the framing, the ballot question,
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  Speaker 3: all going to be laid out there. So if you're
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  Speaker 3: a political... watcher, political fan. And if you're listening to
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  Speaker 3: this podcast, you are. That's a really important speech to
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  Speaker 3: keep your eyes on.
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  Speaker 1: He's got a media availability right afterwards at 12.15, where
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  Speaker 1: I'm sure he's going to get a ton of questions
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  Speaker 1: about trying to tease out some more details on, is
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  Speaker 1: he calling an election?
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  Speaker 3: Is it Friday? Is it Saturday?
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  Speaker 1: Is it next weekend? Is it the first week of
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  Speaker 1: the session?
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  Speaker 3: What's going on?
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  Speaker 1: So everyone and their grandmother's uncle seems to know when
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  Speaker 1: the election's being called. You've been in and around UBCML week, Jeff.
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  Speaker 1: Have you had a thousand different dates thrown at you
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  Speaker 1: by people who swear they know the inside track?
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  Speaker 3: Well, everyone swears they know the inside track to me.
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  Speaker 3: I think the only person who knows it is the Premier,
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  Speaker 3: but a lot of talk from a lot of people,
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  Speaker 3: folks who know a fair bit about the BC NDP
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  Speaker 3: and what's happening in it, who are saying we're on
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  Speaker 3: the way, we're on the road, an election's going to happen.
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  Speaker 1: The other announcement expected this morning, the merger of Centre
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  Speaker 1: BC and the Peter Party into Peter Centre, I.
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  Speaker 3: Assume, or Centre Peter.
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  Speaker 1: It's really only two ways this can go. But we
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  Speaker 1: covered that on yesterday's show. But basically, this is the
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  Speaker 1: backup plan for Peter Milibar's party because he can't get
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  Speaker 1: the name of his new party, believed to be the
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  Speaker 1: BC Party, registered by Elections BC during the ongoing by-election
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  Speaker 1: in Abbotsford Mission, and if there's an early election by
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  Speaker 1: the Premier, he'd be without a party name, so he's
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  Speaker 1: going to merge with Senator BC and become Senator Peter. Jeff,
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  Speaker 1: Senator Peter, that's a bit of a mouthful. Whatever this
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  Speaker 1: ends up being, is it, like, how, what does this mean,
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  Speaker 1: I guess, this merger, do you think?
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  Speaker 3: I think it's the first sign of consolidation on the
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  Speaker 3: center right of people looking at the situation, not in
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  Speaker 3: abstract terms, but in the real terms that there's a
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  Speaker 3: provincial election perhaps on its way and the need to
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  Speaker 3: bring people together who are now apart. I wonder if
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  Speaker 3: there's going to be a little bit of rock and
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  Speaker 3: roll Prince involved here, if it's going to be center
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  Speaker 3: BC formerly known as BC United or some kind of
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  Speaker 3: ballot trick like that. I've heard some whispers about that.
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  Speaker 3: So we will see what's the party name, party name today,
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  Speaker 3: unveiled excitement.
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  Speaker 1: Peter BC. That's the other one.
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  Speaker 3: You give me Peter BC.
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  Speaker 1: That's anyways, there's a lot of, there's lots of options there.
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  Speaker 1: The only other thing on the agenda, there's a couple events.
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  Speaker 1: The health minister is in Surrey for an Improving and
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  Speaker 1: Investing in Healthcare announcement. And the education minister is in
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  Speaker 1: Maple Ridge Pit Meadows for a school capital project. Both
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  Speaker 1: consequential areas of perhaps a future election campaign, although we're
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  Speaker 1: going to have to start viewing everything through the lens
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  Speaker 1: of an election campaign. Okay, let's take a quick break
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  Speaker 1: before we get into some fascinating topics coming up next.
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  Speaker 3: Back to the show.
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  Speaker 1: All righty, fallout from yesterday with the breaking news that
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  Speaker 1: the BC Conservative Party's former executive director, Elaine Allen, who'd
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  Speaker 1: only been on the job installed there by leader Carrie
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  Speaker 1: Lynn Finlay for less than a month, allegedly hired a
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  Speaker 1: private investigator to dig up dirt on 14 of the
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  Speaker 1: party's critics. The list of people includes MLAs still in
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  Speaker 1: the BC Conservative Caucus, former MLAs who've quit, a staffer
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  Speaker 1: from the NDP caucus team, Lululemon founder Chip Wilson and me.
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  Speaker 1: That's right. Apparently I have been surveilled, probed, if you will,
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  Speaker 1: whatever you want to call it. My guess would be
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  Speaker 1: the leader's long dislike of my coverage of her, dating
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  Speaker 1: back to some stories about her being under Elections Canada
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  Speaker 1: investigation for financial issues from the 2025 federal election bid. Jeff,
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  Speaker 1: I gotta say, I thought being put... under a private investigation,
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  Speaker 1: was going to be cool. I kind of had this
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  Speaker 1: vision of like a 1977 golden Pontiac Firebird and me
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  Speaker 1: with a mustache kind of jumping across the front hood
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  Speaker 1: with a giant tape recorder, sort of like.
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  Speaker 2: Oh, oh, oh.
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  Speaker 1: Not nearly as cool as that. I got to tell
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  Speaker 1: you right now.
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  Speaker 3: That is for the listeners. That is the best TV
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  Speaker 3: theme song that there ever has been. It's the theme
• 8:53
  Speaker 3: from The Rockford File starring James Garner. And the song
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  Speaker 3: is by Mike Post. Mike Post, the guy behind the
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  Speaker 3: Law & Order theme.
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  Speaker 4: Oh, yeah.
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  Speaker 3: Great theme. Tremendous show, too. I think it's on Prime
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  Speaker 3: or Crave right now. You should find it because it's
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  Speaker 3: exactly as Rob described it. It's my life.
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  Speaker 1: It's my life to a T. There's lots of gunfights.
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  Speaker 1: I'm rescuing people. solving crimes. I was unaware that I
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  Speaker 1: was being surveilled or whatever the hell it was. No
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  Speaker 1: one is clear on what this private investigator did. He
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  Speaker 1: could have done anything. Really, I was just informed about
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  Speaker 1: this by the party lawyer yesterday that I was one
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  Speaker 1: of the people and the party felt an obligation to
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  Speaker 1: tell me. Before, Jeff, we get your thoughts on this,
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  Speaker 1: here is Carrie Lynn Finley, who was asked about this
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  Speaker 1: by the CBC's Katie DeRosa after her UBCM speech yesterday.
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  Speaker 1: Here's that exchange.
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  Speaker 4: Ms.
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  Speaker 5: Finley, did Elaine Allen hire a private investigator to look
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  Speaker 5: into some of your MLAs, including current MLAs and former MLAs?
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  Speaker 4: I don't know anything about this. This allegation that came
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  Speaker 4: forward just yesterday, I have no details.
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  Speaker 5: But how can MLAs, including some yesterday, clear right to
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  Speaker 5: criticize you for not communicating with them, how can they
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  Speaker 5: trust you when there are these allegations that there's a
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  Speaker 5: private investigator to spy on your own MLAs?
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  Speaker 4: As I said, Katie, I had no knowledge of it.
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  Speaker 4: I was unaware of it. So I can't really respond.
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  Speaker 4: And they are just allegations at the moment. Are you
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  Speaker 4: looking into it? The party is looking into it, yes.
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  Speaker 4: And I'm part of the party.
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  Speaker 1: What do you think of that explanation, Jeff? And what
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  Speaker 1: do you think of this whole thing?
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  Speaker 3: I think the explanation is baloney. She installed the executive
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  Speaker 3: director of the party into that role for the few
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  Speaker 3: days that she took on the role. I remember that
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  Speaker 3: there was talk about her looking into people's emails at
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  Speaker 3: the time, so that sounds certainly consistent with the allegations
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  Speaker 3: we're hearing about spying right now. We can joke about
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  Speaker 3: the Rockford files, but this is a desperate... uh, disturbing, uh,
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  Speaker 3: despicable behavior, uh, speaks to, uh, uh, a party that, uh,
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  Speaker 3: I think, uh, was reading Brad Zubik on Twitter today
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  Speaker 3: and he described it as, uh, paranoia of G Gordon Liddy,
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  Speaker 3: Richard Nixon, Watergate levels. It's, uh, someone who thinks the
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  Speaker 3: world's against them. So they use the, some of the most, uh, um,
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  Speaker 3: disgusting things that they could do, surveilling people, spying on
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  Speaker 3: them using party resources, money that people is giving to
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  Speaker 3: support a party's election efforts, using that money to spy
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  Speaker 3: on former MLAs, current MLAs, political opponents, the founder of Lululemon,
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  Speaker 3: and you. And it's important to understand what you do
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  Speaker 3: this for? You do it to get information that you
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  Speaker 3: can use to intimidate or shut up people who you
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  Speaker 3: don't want speaking out against you. And I hear her
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  Speaker 3: talking about, oh, I had no idea this was going
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  Speaker 3: on without my knowledge. I think that's baloney. I think,
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  Speaker 3: you know, we had these investigations into election finances, whether
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  Speaker 3: she's given Ian Payton inducements to try and get him
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  Speaker 3: to step out of his role so that she could
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  Speaker 3: run in his seat. And those just seem like drops
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  Speaker 3: in a bucket compared to this. So it's a troubling
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  Speaker 3: time for BC politics, and she's got a lot to
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  Speaker 3: answer for, Carrie Lynn Finley.
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  Speaker 1: This would be the third staffer, senior staffer that she's
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  Speaker 1: picked who's been embroiled in immense scandal. Apollo Chung, our
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  Speaker 1: director of operations, she handpicked who turned out to have
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  Speaker 1: audio recordings. He was misusing public money or alleged to
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  Speaker 1: misuse it. Chris Delaney, the chief of staff who had
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  Speaker 1: a big racist rant that was leaked in audio and
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  Speaker 1: did a bunch of weird things involving those alleged inducements.
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  Speaker 1: And now Elaine Allen. And in each case, the leader says,
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  Speaker 1: despite having picked these people and put them in their
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  Speaker 1: roles and empowered them, she has no knowledge of anything
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  Speaker 1: they did or did not do and is completely in
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  Speaker 1: the dark about that. So even if that was true,
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  Speaker 1: that would probably be a a concerning thing as well.
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  Speaker 1: But the full list here, Angelo Isidoro, political capital prime,
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  Speaker 1: former executive.
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  Speaker 3: Half of the political capital prime panel and host are
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  Speaker 3: being surveilled by the Conservative Party of British Columbia. I'm
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  Speaker 3: not sure if that's a badge of honor, but it's something. Well,
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  Speaker 3: we're on something. It is, yeah. The most surveilled podcast
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  Speaker 3: in British Columbia.
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  Speaker 1: There's still time. I could hire someone between now and
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  Speaker 1: political capital prime for you and Jillian and then just
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  Speaker 1: get everyone under surveillance.
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  Speaker 3: Who knows what that Jillian's up to.
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  Speaker 1: I know. Philip Depnar, who is the former managing director
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  Speaker 1: of the party, Isidoro's communications firm, Fountainhead Communications, Asha Esty,
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  Speaker 1: the former party president, Claire Ratte and Mandeep Dhaliwal, who
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: are current and sitting BC conservative MLAs in caucus still,
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  Speaker 1: investigated by their own party with a private investigator. Rosalind Byrd,
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  Speaker 1: Brennan Day, and Alia Warbus, who are independents now, and
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  Speaker 1: other folks on here as well. So it's kind of like,
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  Speaker 1: it's an interesting list. I, you know, I've never, to
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  Speaker 1: my knowledge, been surveilled or had someone go through my
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  Speaker 1: trash or anything, but I don't know. No one is
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  Speaker 1: quite clear exactly what happened and where it's gone.
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  Speaker 3: And where we're going. Maybe she should just put forward,
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  Speaker 3: Carolyn Finley should just put forward a positive vision for
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  Speaker 3: British Columbia and where she wants to take it instead
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  Speaker 3: of engaging in dirty tricks that have resulted in pretty
• 15:15
  Speaker 3: much everyone involved lawyering up. Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: Well, and a chilling effect on the media, too. You know,
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  Speaker 1: it's one thing politicians in their own party, I guess,
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  Speaker 1: are one thing, the media is another. And that's certainly
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  Speaker 1: something that I've been thinking about as well. But a
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  Speaker 1: question that, you know, we'll ask on Political Capital Prime
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  Speaker 1: later today is the difference between maybe opposition research that
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: kind of gets done about people, you go through their
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: Twitter feeds and their Facebook pages, and then a private investigator,
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: and you and Jillian can maybe talk a bit about
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  Speaker 1: the differences and the lines that exist in politics on that.
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  Speaker 1: You've both worked in opposition parties and you in government
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: and kind of the difference there. So we'll bring that
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: up on Political Capital Prime as well. One more topic
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  Speaker 1: I want to get to here.
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  Speaker 3: I've done opposition research in the past, but you're going
• 16:03
  Speaker 3: to have to find out what I think about that
• 16:06
  Speaker 3: by tuning in to Political Capital Prime. It's called a tease.
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: One other topic before we finish here. UBCM President Corey
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: Ramsey out with a statement. We talked a bit about
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: this on the top on an emergency resolution demanding that
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: the premier hold off on any snap election to not
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: disrupt the scheduled municipal election campaign that runs September 19th
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: to October 17th, saying that their municipal election said in
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: law EB is choosing to go early. and that it
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: could disrupt the 188 communities and 3,500 candidates who want
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: to talk about local issues to have a municipal campaign
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  Speaker 1: tossed under a giant, expensive provincial campaign that will confuse people.
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: Here's what she had to say about that.
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  Speaker 6: You know, having an overlapping election does not serve British Columbians.
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  Speaker 6: There's many reasons why these are statutorily dated. And so,
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  Speaker 6: you know, that reason is because it does confuse the electorate.
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  Speaker 6: There may be overlapping candidates that are considering running in
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  Speaker 6: a provincial campaign. And that is going to take away
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  Speaker 6: from the conversation about the local general election. This is
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  Speaker 6: going to change the focus from local issues to provincial politics.
• 17:24
  Speaker 6: And we need to respect the local election process.
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  Speaker 1: What do you think of that argument, Jeff? I don't.
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  Speaker 1: imagine the NDP is paying a lot of attention to it.
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  Speaker 1: But there are a lot of folks who in provincial politics,
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: including in the NDP cabinet, who came from local governments
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: who maybe have an opinion on this. Do you think
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: the government's paying any attention to that?
• 17:43
  Speaker 3: I'm sure they are. They take what UBCM has to
• 17:46
  Speaker 3: say seriously. I think it's why you're not going to
• 17:49
  Speaker 3: see an election call made at UBCM. I think one
• 17:55
  Speaker 3: thing that just struck me listening to that is that
• 17:57
  Speaker 3: we already have overlapping election campaigns this time of year.
• 18:02
  Speaker 3: You have mayoral and councillor, but you also have school board.
• 18:06
  Speaker 3: In some places, you have park boards. There's already that
• 18:10
  Speaker 3: level of complexity there. Add a provincial campaign and it
• 18:14
  Speaker 3: might get more people engaged in talking about local issues
• 18:18
  Speaker 3: because a lot of provincial issues are local issues. You
• 18:22
  Speaker 3: go to the sessions at UBCM, they talk about They
• 18:26
  Speaker 3: talk about housing. They talk about indigenous relations. They talk
• 18:29
  Speaker 3: about health care. So it might end up with a bigger, broader,
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  Speaker 3: more engaged electorate conversations happening.
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  Speaker 1: It's an optimistic view. The other side of it would
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  Speaker 1: be you end up with citizens with these giant ballots
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  Speaker 1: who don't know anything about any of the people on it,
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  Speaker 1: even the municipal one. I know, and I'm pretty engaged.
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  Speaker 1: I wander in there into the municipal ballot, and I
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: look at the school board names.
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  Speaker 3: And I have no clue.
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  Speaker 1: I have no idea who most of the school board
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: people are. And so then you put in a whole
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  Speaker 1: bunch of councillors, a group running for mayor, school boards,
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  Speaker 1: and then your local MLA from the Senator Peter Party
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  Speaker 1: and the Conservatives, 1BC, the NDP, the Greens, And whoever
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  Speaker 1: else is running, that's a long, and especially in Vancouver
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  Speaker 1: at the park board, that's a long ballot. That's like,
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  Speaker 1: that's a lot of, you'd have to be pretty educated
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  Speaker 1: to work your way through that ballot. It's like a,
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: it becomes like a, you know, MCAT test at a
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: certain point to get into med school.
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  Speaker 3: These are all fair comments. You make a good argument.
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  Speaker 3: I think the one part of their emergency resolution that
• 19:43
  Speaker 3: I definitely do not support is they wanted legislation to
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: ban provincial elections from happening at the same time as
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: local government elections. I think you don't want to tie
• 19:55
  Speaker 3: the hands of governments about when they are able to
• 19:58
  Speaker 3: call elections because circumstances change, global conditions change. There are
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: lots of variables and you don't want to tie the
• 20:09
  Speaker 3: hands of government to call.
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: I remember they challenged this. Uh, there was a challenge
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: to the court, uh, the 2020 snap election by democracy watch.
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: And they determined that the fixed election law in BC
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: doesn't preclude the Lieutenant governor on behalf of the crown
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: from taking advice from the first minister and having an
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: election whenever. So I don't know if you can legislate
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: things that can't be broken by the provincial government when
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: it needs to go. But again, not a lawyer, uh,
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: I might need to retain one.
• 20:38
  Speaker 3: But you have a lawyer.
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: I do now, but I am not a lawyer. So
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: good times, good times. This is usually where we end
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: the show with a slow fade out of Political Capital
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: and the beautiful music. But we're not doing that, Jeff.
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: We're going straight to the Rockford Files. Thanks for being
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: on the show. See you on Political Capital Prime.
• 20:57
  Speaker 3: You betcha. Take care, Rob.
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: Thank you.