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Zone 7: The Cape Cod Serial Rapist and the Survivor Who Helped Catch Him · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:07
  Speaker 1: Tonight on Zone seven, we have Frank Frederickson. He's a
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: retired chief of police. He's been the director of government
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: Affairs for the Massachusetts Paternal Order of Police. Y'all, that's
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: about five thousand folks that he advocates for right there.
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: He has got a master's degree, he has worked over
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: forty five years. Let me tell y'all something. He started
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: policing in nineteen seventy seven and didn't quit it until
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: twenty twenty two. This man has seen it, he has
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: done it, he has lived it, and I'll tell you
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: I can't think of anybody better to be the executive
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: director of the New England Association of Chiefs of Police.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: Chief welcome to Zone seven.
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: Oh well, thank you for allowing me to be.
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: Yet, you had an unusual care that turned into a
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: serial rapist case started in nineteen eighty eight. Tell us
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: a little bit about that.
• 1:07
  Speaker 2: Oh okay, well, that's going back in time. So that's
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: a time when there were no cell phones, who were
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: no DNA, there were no cameras, a lot of that.
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: So to set the stage a little bit, many of
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: you listeners may not be aware of what cape COD
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: stands for. What it is what it means to the region.
• 1:30
  Speaker 2: But back in nineteen eighty eight, it was a hot
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: spot for Northeast and beyond for the baby boomers to
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: come in have a good time at body, et cetera.
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: It was a real go to place, and so all
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: of our hotels, everything, they all get cranked up starting
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: on Memorial Day weekend. So at that time, I was
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: a detective, only been on a detective for about a year,
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: and of course, you know, nothing good happens after midnight,
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: So of course I get the call around one o'clock
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: in the morning about sexual assault, and I was relatively new.
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: I had very little experience in that. We were supposed
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: to have a female detective train to help with that,
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: but you know, females and policing at that time were
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: not very common and we just didn't have it. So
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: it was me. So I got called in and met
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: this traumatized young woman who was attacked in a very
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: public place whilst she was going back to find a
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: key for a motel room. Violently attacked and fortunately as
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: the perpetrator was taking her, dragging her across a busy roadway,
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: some passivebys came by. I stopped and she lunged onto
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: the car and there was a tugger wall between her
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: and the bad guy, and finally they broke her free
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: and threw her in the car and drove off and
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: he ran the other way. You know, there's a lot
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: more details here that they can't really get into, but
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: that stopped the incident, so that she had to tell
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: me that story in you know detail, do an investigation.
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: We didn't have. We tried cane iin after the fact.
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: We didn't have a lot of evidence to go on,
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: so built a relationship with her and just tried to
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: figure out who was this that chickly assaulted this traumatized
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: young woman. Uh. And then fast forward over the next
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: several weeks, similar incidents were happening in the town of Bonsable,
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: which is right next to us. I am us Uh,
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: you've probably heard of that area. The these sickosaults and
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: rapes were happening on a weekly basis, and you know,
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: we put it together, Hey, this is the same person,
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: and they were getting more violent as time was going on,
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: and we were, uh, we were closing in towards the
• 4:21
  Speaker 2: end of the summer when the victim I had Michelle Lynn.
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: She she had an idea that I I think I
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: want to go out and find this. I know I'm
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: going to know him when I see him. And you know,
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: we had looked at thousands of pictures. We went to Boston.
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: They had a new computer that would come up with
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: the month shots and put them together by description to
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: see if she could identify. Like, we went all around,
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: We did.
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: Everything and had a composite drawn.
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we had a composite. We had all types of things.
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: We did what we could, uh, you know, messages out
• 5:08
  Speaker 2: everywhere looking for similar incidents, et cetera.
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: But Michelle knew she would know him if she saw.
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: It, absolutely, and that was like kind of like, I
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: don't know, you know. So she wanted to go out
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: with us and look for him at the nightclubs. Father
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: and he wanted to He was a hunter and he
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: wanted to go find the guy. And god knows what
• 5:35
  Speaker 2: would have happened if, yes, Sir with us, But we
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: just didn't want to see it. So so anyway we
• 5:47
  Speaker 2: agreed to it. We went through some of the what
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: ifs and we say, hey, these are happening and the
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: summer's coming to an end. If he's from off cape
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: and we're just here on the weekends doing all these things.
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: We might never see him again. I have another chance.
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: So anyway, we decided to go out just in the
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: Yamathe area. And on the night she wanted to go out,
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: I had an emergency at home and couldn't do it.
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: So my fellow detective took Michelle out and they didn't
• 6:18
  Speaker 2: They went to some of the nightclubs but didn't really
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: find anything, but felt they felt it was a good
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: idea good strategy. And after that we put together that
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: there was one particular nightclub that several of the victims
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: were at in Hyanas on Main Street, super busy. So
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: the next weekend I went out with Michelle and she
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: had one of her friends with her, and we also
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: got two Bonstable detectives and we had a plan to
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: kind of spread out on main Street and we went around,
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: we were walked around. We went to this one nightclub
• 6:58
  Speaker 2: and took a walk inside, you know, super busy, and
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: it was really kind of very hectic. So I said
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: to Michelle, why don't we just go stand outside and
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: be like hunters, let the prey come to us. And
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: so we did. We went outside, no kid, and we
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: were there like five minutes and standing there, Michelle had
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: this you know look on her serious look shaking and says,
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: he's right there, and I'm like, are you kidding me?
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: Literally probably ten feet from us. She said, that's him.
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: And I had this perception of who he was, of
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: what he looked like, and you know, I'm just like,
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: I don't know if it is. It's not certainly not
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: enough to arrest him. So we decided to follow him.
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: I contacted the other detectives that were the other end
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: of Main Street. We followed him to a liquor store
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: where he met up with some young men and ultimately
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: went into the store and bought liquor for them. So
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: that gave us the roofs to confront him. So we
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: had a patrol officer come and you talk to him
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: about that, and we were right there and he showed
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: us his car that cor master description of one of
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: the other victims who said the assailant was in, and
• 8:30
  Speaker 2: all of a sudden, We're like, this has got to
• 8:32
  Speaker 2: be the guy. We did a roust to get him
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: into the police station to talk to him, and we
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: did that and we got him there. And meanwhile, when
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: we were there, they the Bonsbow detectors went upstairs and
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: were working. I was left alone with them in the
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: booking room, not under arrest, still trying to piece together.
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: And remember we didn't have good cell phones to talk
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: to each other, and he started getting nervous, et cetera.
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: And at one moment he decided he was going to leave.
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: Pushed out of the booking room, which is normally locked
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: with an electric buzzer, and the door opened right up,
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: and I was kind of shocked and ran out. So
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: it was a little bit of a foot pursuit. Of course,
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: I'm not going to say I ran and caught him,
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: because I'm not that fast, but some of the other
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: Boonstable police officer has shift changed. They caught him right
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: in the bocking lot as going out, and by that
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: time there were other victims that came in and identified
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: him as the assailant. He was arrested fast forward. Six
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: months later he pled guilty to six different rapes and
• 9:39
  Speaker 2: all thanks to Michelle for her bravery. Never would have
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: had a very unusual, very proud of what she did,
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: how she did it, how she was overcome the trauma
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: of being assaulted in the way that she did. But
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: wasn't going to back down, determined and confident. It was amazing.
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: It was pretty amazing.
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: So again, if you look at these two situations, both instances,
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: it's just you. It fell to you and you alone.
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: You didn't have a female detective to help, so you
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: had to forge that relationship with her because she didn't
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: want to talk to you at first, so you stayed
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: in the game. You know, you helped her understand that
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: you were going to be there for her and help her,
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: and made her feel comfortable enough, so comfortable in fact,
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: that you had surrounding departments help you, just like during
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: your officer down. So there's some parallels there that you know,
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: it fell just to you, you had surrounding departments, and
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: then your advocacy started. And that's what you did here.
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: Because I'm going to tell you by you saying okay,
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: you can help us go hunt this guy. I think
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: that must have done just I can't even fathom what
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: that did for her and her recovery. You said, Michelle
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: taught me to see the case through her eyes.
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: She's an incredible person. I don't know if you want
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: to move on to who she is.
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: I do. I would like to move on and talk
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: to her.
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: Well, I have Michelle sitting here right next to me.
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: Before she says one word, I just want to say
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: the level of bravery, the level of openness and honesty,
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: and your willingness to relive any part of this so
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: people can learn. Michelle, I can't thank you enough, but
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: I'm going to tell you are one bad mama, is
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: all I'm saying. So welcome Michelle to Zone seven.
• 11:49
  Speaker 3: Thank you, thank you so much for having me.
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: Well, I don't even know where you might want to
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: start or what you might want to talk about. We
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: know what happened. But the night that you you actually
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: went hunting and found him, how quickly did you know?
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: Was it instantaneous as soon as you saw him, did
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: you know? Or did it take a second.
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: I didn't know him immediately.
• 12:13
  Speaker 4: That night before we went out to look for him,
• 12:17
  Speaker 4: they had me in a conference room and were showing
• 12:20
  Speaker 4: me some of the information from the other victims, and
• 12:23
  Speaker 4: including some of the composites, because we did have a composite,
• 12:27
  Speaker 4: but it was made very roughly and you wouldn't have
• 12:33
  Speaker 4: even known it was the same person if you looked
• 12:35
  Speaker 4: at each of the different victims composites.
• 12:37
  Speaker 3: They just weren't very reliable. But I looked at those and.
• 12:40
  Speaker 4: One thing that I noticed when I first had seen
• 12:44
  Speaker 4: him that night that had happened. He was smoking a cigarette,
• 12:48
  Speaker 4: and a couple of the people mentioned that he had
• 12:52
  Speaker 4: Marlborough cigarettes in his back pocket. So that was one
• 12:56
  Speaker 4: of the first things I noticed when I saw I
• 12:58
  Speaker 4: saw a profile of someone smoking a cigarette, and it
• 13:02
  Speaker 4: was the same exact profile. He was standing exactly the
• 13:05
  Speaker 4: same way it was that night. And then I looked
• 13:08
  Speaker 4: down and I saw that he had Marlborough sticking out
• 13:11
  Speaker 4: of his pocket, Marlboro cigarettes, And I just knew the
• 13:17
  Speaker 4: second I saw that, I knew it was him because
• 13:20
  Speaker 4: that matched what other people were saying.
• 13:22
  Speaker 3: So I think I felt like I wasn't.
• 13:24
  Speaker 4: Just relying on my own recollection, but it was what
• 13:27
  Speaker 4: others had said as well, and it made me more confident.
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: Great yep. But you know, like the Golden State Killer,
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: all those composites looked completely different too, and they all
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: I mean, you know, it depends people see people in
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: different lighting. They are attacked at different you know, vantage points,
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: so your field division is going to be different, so
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: it would make sense that they would be somewhat different
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: and you know, you're not expecting this to happen, so
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: it's not like you're trying to look at every single
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: scar and tattoo and color.
• 14:01
  Speaker 4: True, I honestly couldn't really remember what he looked like.
• 14:05
  Speaker 4: I blocked him out of my mind, and I could
• 14:07
  Speaker 4: not remember what he looked like at all, and the
• 14:09
  Speaker 4: composite didn't even look like him. So my mother actually
• 14:13
  Speaker 4: took me to a hypnotist to try to help me
• 14:15
  Speaker 4: remember what he looked like, because all I could remember
• 14:19
  Speaker 4: was his hair, that his hair was kind of curly,
• 14:21
  Speaker 4: and that was everything I could really remember. But I
• 14:26
  Speaker 4: knew I would know him if I saw him, even
• 14:28
  Speaker 4: though I couldn't remember. I kept telling Frank, you know,
• 14:31
  Speaker 4: we're looking at pictures, and I kept saying, I will
• 14:33
  Speaker 4: know him if I see him. And I could look
• 14:36
  Speaker 4: at you show me what like fifteen pictures or whatever
• 14:38
  Speaker 4: at a time, and I could just lance on just
• 14:41
  Speaker 4: like be positive that none of them were him, because
• 14:43
  Speaker 4: I was so sure that I would know him if
• 14:46
  Speaker 4: I saw him, and I did.
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we had a photo line up made of another
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: suspect that we had developed that night, and the funny
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: thing is we had it all done up beautiful with like,
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: oh this, hopefully this was him, and of course she
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: goes right to that picture but says, that's definitely not.
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 15:09
  Speaker 4: Well, he was very nice looking, that guy, and I
• 15:12
  Speaker 4: would have remembered him better probably.
• 15:14
  Speaker 3: If he was as nicelf sure, but.
• 15:20
  Speaker 4: Just going back, you know, and you mentioned this earlier
• 15:24
  Speaker 4: that I didn't even want to be working with me.
• 15:26
  Speaker 3: I didn't even want to report the crime first.
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: Of all, Like when it was happening, I got through
• 15:30
  Speaker 4: it by telling myself, no one will ever know this happened.
• 15:34
  Speaker 3: I will never tell when this happened. I said that
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: to myself.
• 15:36
  Speaker 4: Over and over the whole time it was happening, and
• 15:41
  Speaker 4: I didn't plan to tell anyone.
• 15:42
  Speaker 3: I went home back to my room. You know, I
• 15:46
  Speaker 3: escaped these guys.
• 15:47
  Speaker 4: I was able to get in this car with these
• 15:50
  Speaker 4: guys who were driving by and got away because after
• 15:52
  Speaker 4: he finished, he told me he was going to take
• 15:55
  Speaker 4: me home and keep doing this to me and then
• 15:58
  Speaker 4: kill me, was what he said. And he made me
• 16:01
  Speaker 4: put my clothes back on and then was dragging me
• 16:04
  Speaker 4: across the street. When I was able to stop that
• 16:08
  Speaker 4: car and get in, and then my friends took me
• 16:11
  Speaker 4: back to my room when I got out when I
• 16:14
  Speaker 4: finally found my hotel again, and I immediately got in
• 16:20
  Speaker 4: the shower and one of my friends wasn't there, my
• 16:23
  Speaker 4: friend Paul, because he was driving around looking for me,
• 16:26
  Speaker 4: because at this point they realized I was missing because
• 16:28
  Speaker 4: I was just going to get a key, so and then,
• 16:31
  Speaker 4: you know, half an hour later, I still wasn't back,
• 16:33
  Speaker 4: so he was driving around looking for me. And my
• 16:36
  Speaker 4: other two friends they helped me, you know, helped me
• 16:41
  Speaker 4: get into the shower, and I was just trying to
• 16:44
  Speaker 4: forget about it and like, you know, wash.
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: It all away.
• 16:47
  Speaker 4: And then Paul came back and he tried to convince
• 16:51
  Speaker 4: me to report it. And it was when he said,
• 16:55
  Speaker 4: if you don't report this, Michelle, he'll do it to
• 16:57
  Speaker 4: somebody else. That was when I finally decided he's right,
• 17:02
  Speaker 4: you know, one thing to do this to me, but
• 17:04
  Speaker 4: he could do this to my sister, or my friend
• 17:07
  Speaker 4: or someone else.
• 17:08
  Speaker 3: And that was what really drove me to report it.
• 17:13
  Speaker 4: Then when I got there, I told him I would
• 17:15
  Speaker 4: only speak to a female, and we waited a little while.
• 17:20
  Speaker 3: I don't know if they were looking for someone. I
• 17:22
  Speaker 3: have no idea, because there wasn't even a female.
• 17:24
  Speaker 4: But they finally said, you know, can you just try
• 17:28
  Speaker 4: talking to Detective Frederickson and see how you feel? And
• 17:33
  Speaker 4: Frank just has this way of making people instantly feel
• 17:36
  Speaker 4: comfortable with them, and that was how I felt. And somehow,
• 17:39
  Speaker 4: the next thing I knew, I was giving him all
• 17:41
  Speaker 4: the details of what happened.
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: I mean, again, it's unbelievable. It's unbelievable that he was
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: the one that was there that night and was able
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: to connect with you. Because again, I think everybody listening understands,
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: I'm never going to say a word. I don't want
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: anybody to know, and I certainly don't want to tell
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: that guy. You know, I don't even know him, you know,
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: so I understand. But I think once, especially Frank, once
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: he knew these other victims were every week happening, he
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: knew who he was dealing with. Because one thing, you know,
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: your assailant said to you, I think puts him in
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: a different category, because he said to you, I want
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: to keep you, I mean, my God, So that lets
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: you know. To me, I mean, you know, there's to me,
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: there's levels of all of it, but he certainly, to me,
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: is at a higher level of just depravity Yep.
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: Absolutely, he was very sick person.
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah. There's something to remember that I don't know if
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: you picked up on it in the article is after
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: he was arrested, there was search wine on his home
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: and he was taking the underwear of some of the victims.
• 19:02
  Speaker 4: Well, that was the first thing he said to me
• 19:04
  Speaker 4: was I asked him to help me find I told
• 19:08
  Speaker 4: him I was locked out of my room. He asked
• 19:10
  Speaker 4: if he could help me, and I said I was
• 19:12
  Speaker 4: locked out of my room and he said, I can
• 19:14
  Speaker 4: help you. Come over here, and he grabbed me in
• 19:16
  Speaker 4: the first thing he said was I want your underwear.
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: And that's what you asked Frank to go find because
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: you thought it was in the woods.
• 19:23
  Speaker 3: Yeah, well I swear it was there when we left.
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: But yeah, but so we did the search mark and
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: between the matters in his bed were five pair of
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: underwear and we only identified Michelle's, ironically.
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: But she was very clear hers was green with white
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: boga dot.
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: She knew no doubt the other. So the point is
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: there's other victims out there, and it fits all the
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: other data that's out there on sexual assault.
• 19:54
  Speaker 4: Right statistics say one in three, and honestly, it's probably
• 19:58
  Speaker 4: even more.
• 20:01
  Speaker 3: Is that what it is?
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: One in three? Yeah.
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: But Michelle, that's another thing that I was so impressed
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: by you because you asked Frank straight up, do you
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: think he took him as a trophy? Like you knew
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: all of it. You knew the terminology, you understood what
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: was critical in this case, and you knew how to help.
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: Well.
• 20:22
  Speaker 3: I don't know how I knew anything.
• 20:23
  Speaker 4: I mean, honestly, I had like zero exposure to police.
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: I grew up in a tiny town.
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: I think we had one full time police officer who
• 20:31
  Speaker 4: was just this nice man who lived on my street
• 20:34
  Speaker 4: that I barely knew.
• 20:35
  Speaker 3: I had never even spoken to police officers before. I
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: had absolutely no experience in that world. I did always
• 20:44
  Speaker 3: like reading crime novels, So maybe it I have no idea,
• 20:49
  Speaker 3: but you know, I think a lot of it was
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: learning and a learning experience and figuring out how it
• 20:58
  Speaker 3: all went and how it all worked, because Frank had
• 21:02
  Speaker 3: to explain a lot of things to me that they
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: were doing, you know, like doing the lineup.
• 21:06
  Speaker 4: I thought I was going to be seeing people lined up,
• 21:08
  Speaker 4: but it was photos, which was much easier, but it
• 21:13
  Speaker 4: was there was a lot for me to learn.
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: Well, it's funny listening to you now say I'd never
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: even spoken to a police officer. Well, honey, you've talked
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: to one, now, hadn't you Got so y'all were going
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: to end on some happy news. So Frank, why don't
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: you tell them what happened after the trial?
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: Well after the trial, well, it wasn't even a trial.
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: He got convicted. He did twenty years. He actually did
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: a little bit more than twenty years. So there's a
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: couple of pieces of news. But I think the one
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: you want to talk about is that, you know, our
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: lives go on. You know, life's going, and you know
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: I ended up divorced, and in two thousand and four
• 22:04
  Speaker 2: Michelle reached out to me for some advice. We barely
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: talked to each other since then. Some communications by from
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: parole information we shared all the time, maybe a Christmas
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: card here and there. But anyway, in two thousand and
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: four she sent me some an email asking me if
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: I we could talk for some advice. I'd been that
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: was in two thousand and four. I had been divorced
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: in two thousand and six, so I agreed, went and
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: met with her. We had our discussion, and of course
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: I'm a.
• 22:46
  Speaker 3: Little huh, what did I need advice about?
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: She needed advice about how to co parent because he
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: knew that I was divorced and had two kids and
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: was going on and you can finish it up rhead.
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: So anyway, we ended up meeting, and then we ended
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: up dating, and two thousand and seven we ended up
• 23:19
  Speaker 2: married through each other and I still married.
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: Wonderful congratulations. That is a happy ending. Chief. I can't
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: thank you enough, Michelle. I cannot thank you enough. I
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: think y'all's story is. I mean, it's got to be
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: one in about nine billion, I would think, But I
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: just I love the way the story ends. So thank
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: you both for being on Zone seven.
• 23:45
  Speaker 3: Thank you, Thank you, y'all.
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: I'm going to end Zone seven the way that I
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: always do with a quote. Frederickson was given an award
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: by the Mass Police Association for his leadership during Bannon's day.
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: His wife beamed with admiration from the crowd. She was
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: the only one who knew how he had really gotten there.
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: Casey Sherman, Boston Magazine. I'm Cheryl McCollum, and this is
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: Zone seven.