Latest / Ebbs of History / When Thousands of Children Tried to March to Jerusalem
Transcript
- Jason: Histiography! Lessons we've learned today. Time for the Fun Fact Challenge! This day in History! speaker-1: Welcome to the ebbs of history, the show where we dive into the strangest, wildest, and sometimes downright creepiest stories the past has to offer. From dancing plagues to pirate queens, you'll laugh, you'll gasp, you'll even groan at my impeccable dad jokes. But, most importantly, you'll learn how history is way cooler than your textbook ever told you. speaker-2: We're history loving hosts, Zoe. speaker-1: Gavin. And I'm Jason, and in every episode the three of us will take a quick trip through time and see what lessons we can still learn today. This is the ebbs of history. ⁓ How was everyone's ⁓ speaker-2: It's spring break. speaker-1: Woo woo. speaker-2: So studying for APs speaker-1: Karen? speaker-0: My week was good. Good. Same. It pretty big. Yeah. I'm really excited about that. Not much happened. speaker-1: Yeah, no, that's a good thing no news is good news. It's fine. Heck yeah speaker-0: But that was like a couple weeks ago. speaker-1: we start today I want to bring up something interesting that we learned the other day it is related to our Battle of LA Japanese internment episode. Basically, fortune cookies were made this Japanese chef ⁓ in ⁓ Francisco. ⁓ then when Japanese started restaurants in ⁓ area saw that there was a need for these fortune cookies, so they took over making them and they became ubiquitous with Chinese cuisine. even though the cookie was by a Japanese sushi chef, it's connected to Chinese food, ⁓ because the interment of ⁓ Americans ⁓ during World War II. Isn't that nuts? That's really cool. I mean that's how we think of fortune cookies as Chinese, right? Yeah. Made by a Japanese chef. speaker-2: our whitewash brains. speaker-1: Is that what you learned about in class? speaker-2: ⁓ No, we were just, brought it up because we were talking about Pearl Harbor. ⁓ he brought it up basically just did the ⁓ thing in like ⁓ seconds. was like, ⁓ thought that they were so people wasted a bunch of admission here. ⁓ speaker-1: ⁓ he was talking about the Battle of LA. Yeah. ⁓ nice. OK. You should tell him, say, hey, go check it out. think he'll really be interested in our podcast. I have. Yeah. speaker-2: And I'm like, we don't vlog at them, so. speaker-1: Okay, ⁓ CE. ⁓ across medieval Europe, thousands of kids are leaving their homes, ⁓ families, their entire lives behind. ⁓ why? ⁓ two charismatic teenagers told them that God had spoken to them, ⁓ the seas would part for them, ⁓ that they would accomplish what the greatest knights and kings had failed to do. ⁓ They were going to march to Jerusalem and take back the Holy Land, not with swords or armor, but with pure faith. What could possibly go wrong? Spoiler alert, literally everything. Today, we're diving into one of history's most bizarre and heartbreaking episodes, the Children's Crusade of 1212. Some backstory. Do either of you know anything about the Crusades? speaker-0: Like the children's crusades or just the crusades? Not really. speaker-1: Just in general. No, okay. So Annie, didn't go over it too much because it was in your AP European history because it was kind too early. When did you start? Like 1400? Yeah. So modern, not modern, but like. speaker-2: Like we started a little bit before the Renaissance. Yeah. So we got a little bit of like contextualization of the Renaissance and what led up to it, but nothing too far back. That's probably the world. speaker-0: No. speaker-1: that So the Crusades were a series of religious wars launched by European Christians between the 11th and 13th centuries. Their aim was to reclaim Jerusalem and the Holy Land from Muslim control. Urban II called for the first crusade in 1095, ⁓ spiritual rewards to those who fought. ⁓ the next two centuries, multiple crusades were launched with varying degrees of success and failure, ⁓ shaping ⁓ relations between Christian Europe and the Islamic world. Which basically we still feel today. Alright, but let's the scene for today's story. It's 1212 and the fourth instead of reaching Jerusalem, ⁓ accidentally sacked the wrong city, ⁓ Which was a Christian city. Oops. ⁓ The Holy Land still Muslim control and people back home are getting frustrated. ⁓ Enter our first main character, Stephen of Cloy. ⁓ a shepherd boy from France, probably around 12 years old. So Gavin, same age as you. Yeah. One day, Stephen claims that Jesus Christ appeared to him disguised as a poor pilgrim and gave him a letter to deliver to the King of France. The message? God wanted the innocent and pure of heart, the children, to succeed where adults had failed. Now, did this actually happen? Probably not. Stephen believed it and more importantly he convinced others to believe it too. Do you think Jesus actually appeared to Stephen? No. speaker-0: Imagine if I just went up to you and said I saw Jesus! He told me to do this! speaker-2: Yeah. speaker-1: If you came home from school one day and said that, ⁓ Jesus told me I need to go on a crusade. speaker-2: Maybe if we were in a different time period because I think if we take it in a historical context, the church had such a strong hold on everybody. So that must have been like, if in the context of that, he went home, he'd been like, the parents must have been like, you are a saint, you are a spaz. speaker-0: This is a different time. speaker-1: Yes, and you're this poor peasant child who could be destined for greater things and your parents aren't gonna be like, ⁓ okay, whatever little guy. Yeah, no, they're gonna be like, ⁓ my gosh, you're our ticket to getting out of this poverty. You know, like it's a totally different time for sure. you imagine being a medieval peasant kid ⁓ this from Stephen of Kloy? ⁓ this boy, your own age, ⁓ even younger. ⁓ saying that he's got a direct message from Jesus himself. It's pretty compelling stuff. Why do you think so many kids believed Stephen? speaker-2: Maybe because it's more of like a, hey, I'm almost thinking this because we're reading 1984 right now. So it's kind of like the context of using big brother instead of like big father. It's kind of more like, hey, we can relate. You can tell me anything. Like it's kind of more of a like a sibling bond because you're closer in age. speaker-1: Right? Any ideas, Gavin? Not really. How about like peer pressure? It kind of falls into what you're saying. You want to be cool like the other kids and follow the coolest kid who happens to speak to Jesus. Maybe life isn't all that great anyway and this kid was saying that he spoke to Jesus. I'd follow him back then, you know? follow a cool kid. Yeah, there you go. speaker-2: Awesome. speaker-0: like. speaker-2: medieval social media. speaker-1: Steven starts preaching and the kids start following. talking thousands of them. ⁓ leaving their farms, their villages, and their worried parents. ⁓ wrote about whole communities losing their children to this movement. ⁓ Parents to stop them, but the kids were convinced that they were on a divine mission. ⁓ Some say that even the adults joined, caught up in the fervor. ⁓ Fervor? ⁓ speaker-0: The water? speaker-1: all the hype. speaker-0: Really? speaker-1: The French group, it is a weird word, yeah? speaker-0: and you add that into like a little tab list. speaker-1: There you go. diction. I think it was. It was forever? I so. That's funny. The French group led by Stephen marches south toward the Mediterranean Sea. Their plan? The sea would part for them, just like it did for Moses. and they would walk all the way to Jerusalem. Yes, really. They thought the seas would part for them. They genuinely believed this would happen. Imagine being in that crowd, exhausted, hungry, but still believing that any moment now the waters would split open for you and you could walk through. The medieval mind is a thing to wonder. Meanwhile, across the border in Germany, speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: A similar movement is Nicholas of Cologne, another young charismatic leader, is gathering his own following. Thousands of German kids, some adults, start marching over the Alps towards Italy. Do know what the Alps are like? Cold. Cold? Mountainous. Mountainous. Think of the Winter Olympics that was in the Alps. This past Olympics. much, yeah. speaker-2: mountain. speaker-0: Deep uphill both ways. speaker-2: You could luge down it. speaker-1: They're massive mountains basically. These kids are attempting one of the most difficult journeys in Europe with no real supplies, no proper clothing, definitely no GPS. The German group suffers terribly. Many die from hunger, exhaustion, and exposure. Some chroniclers wrote that the alpine paths were littered with the bodies of children who didn't make it. Those who survived and made it to the Italian city of Genoa had their hopes crushed when, surprise surprise, the sea did not part. The merchants of Genoa probably feeling a mix of pity and alarm told them to go home. Nicholas, the German child leader, wasn't giving up. Some of his group pressed on to Rome, hoping the Pope would bless their crusade and maybe provide some actual help. Pope Innocent III, remember him? speaker-0: I remember the name. Was she part of the three popes? I remember. speaker-1: He was the pope. He was the uncle of the pope that declared war on cats. speaker-2: Mmm. I'm gonna get sounds from earlier. Yeah speaker-1: We've touched on him before. speaker-0: That name before? speaker-1: So Pope Innocent III met with them and to his credit told them to go home. Your kids, ⁓ is dangerous. ⁓ are you doing? You don't have an army. ⁓ don't have supplies or any realistic plan. ⁓ released them from their crusading vows. ⁓ listened. They went Many others far too way away from home, ⁓ too poor too ashamed to return. ⁓ They scattered Italy. Settling in various cities, their crusades, dreams shattered. speaker-0: Where did this start? Where did the first child see Jesus? speaker-1: Well the first one was France, and the second one was in Germany. So it was... speaker-0: Okay. speaker-2: Steven of Clow. speaker-1: Cloy. So it was in Cloy, France. C-L-O-Y-E-S, by the way. C-L-Y-E-S. And then Nicholas in Germany was from Cologne, Germany. C-O-L-O-G-N-E. Yeah. Good question. speaker-2: C... C... O... speaker-0: Okay. speaker-1: So Nicholas has gone to the pope and the pope has told him to go home, all that kind of stuff. What do you think Nicholas is feeling at that moment, standing there before the pope, his divine mission was over? speaker-2: defeated. speaker-1: pressed falling right like ⁓ my gosh we we marched over the Alps and now the person that sanctions these crusades got on earth just told you no exactly exactly back in France Stephen's group reached the port city of ⁓ speaker-2: God you. speaker-1: Once again, the sea stubbornly refused to part. where the takes this podcast's obligatory dark turn. ⁓ According to accounts, two merchants offered to help. ⁓ They said would transport the children to the Holy Land for free, ⁓ out of goodness of their hearts. That ⁓ sounds too to be true, ⁓ It was way too to be true. ⁓ speaker-2: So. speaker-1: The traditional story says that these merchants loaded the children onto seven ships. Two of the ships sank in a storm near the island of San Pietro, drowning everyone on board. The other five ships didn't even sail to Jerusalem. They sailed to North Africa, where the merchants sold the children into slavery to Muslim traders. Right? Hundreds, thousands of kids who set out to free the Holy Land ended up enslaved in it. speaker-0: tab. speaker-1: The two merchants, they were supposedly later identified and executed, but by then the damage was already done. here's where get bit murky. Some modern historians aren't sure that this slavery story actually happened. ⁓ The sources that it were written decades later and might have been exaggerated or even invented. ⁓ But what we know for sure ⁓ is that thousands young people left their homes in 1212 ⁓ and very few it back. ⁓ Whether they died the journey, were sold into slavery, ⁓ or simply settled and never returned, ⁓ Children's Crusade was an absolute disaster. is medieval chroniclers themselves seem confused by this event. ⁓ Some barely it. ⁓ Others treat as a minor footnote between the 4th and 5th Crusades. ⁓ It wasn't sanctioned by the Church, so technically it wasn't even a real crusade. but the name because the story was just so strange and tragic. How do you think parents felt watching their children leave? Would you have tried to stop them or let them go? speaker-2: Well, I'm thinking in the context of what it is now, of what it was then. Your child tells you you're going on a mission. Are you going on a crusade? I would have said, yeah, go ahead. You're going for God. Yeah, go ahead. Do what you need to do. you know. speaker-0: I do with me, like I was gonna say the same thing, like yeah, go. It's like a religious mission, you know? And like everyone was religious. speaker-1: And beside that, I'm poor. I don't gotta feed you anymore if you leave, so get on out of speaker-2: But if I'm thinking in the context of like me now, yeah, I would be really, it's just really sad. speaker-1: The Crusade is one of those historical events where separating fact from fiction is nearly impossible. ⁓ Main ⁓ Very contemporary sources mention it, ⁓ and that do are brief and sometimes contradictory. ⁓ Most what we think we know comes from accounts written years or decades later, ⁓ when and myth had already started to blend. ⁓ It's important thing for you guys to ⁓ grasp onto in this historiography portion is that that blending of the myth and fact. Yeah. You know, 10 years later, 50 years later, 100 years later, this time period. And why we usually focus on it so much is because there wasn't much it down. It was the dockages. Exactly. ⁓ They were writing in a course and, you know, there wasn't actually the dark ages. Yeah. But there's few ⁓ primary sources. Yeah. Right? speaker-0: It's kind of like rumors at school. Yes. they can be bended so easily. That's correct. Like the truth. speaker-2: they just they ⁓ just ⁓ speaker-1: Gavin. You are part of a perfect example of this. Yes. You know what I'm talking about? Yep. speaker-0: at the ⁓ lockdown at school. We were the class that saw the guy, like the suspect, and were the class that reported it. ⁓ There so much rumors. I thought, ⁓ personally, he a gun, but he didn't. ⁓ He a microwave. ⁓ He had a microwave. speaker-1: That's right. But everything that you were telling us, that everybody was talking about that wasn't even there, saying this stuff happened like it was the truth. So that's a perfect example, a little microcosm of trying to look back on history. And you know, there's stories that go around even today that aren't true, but they kind of meld into the truth and being part of the truth, whether they are or not. Perfect example. speaker-0: Yes. speaker-2: group think, like one person thinks that and it's like hey you're pretty cool I'll think that too. speaker-1: Yeah. Crazy. Alright, back to our story. Sorry for the tangent. Modern historians have debated whether the Children's Crusade even happened as described. Some, like scholar Peter Rates, argues that it was likely a movement of poor young people, not necessarily children, who were caught up in the religious fervor of the time. Others suggest that the story was exaggerated by later writers to criticize the crusading movement or the church. So there you go, there's another aspect of it written later on to criticize. We have no idea if this actually happened. It's good story though. narrative in particular is questionable. ⁓ It appears in sources from the ⁓ 1230s ⁓ 1240s, decades the supposed events. ⁓ Some think it might have been borrowed from other stories or legends circulating at the time. ⁓ Something definitely happened in 1212. Multiple independent sources from France and Germany mentioned large groups of young people leaving their homes, which suggests a real historical event even if the details have been lost or distorted over time. So, ⁓ can learn from this tragic tale? ⁓ speaker-2: It kind of screams like hopping on a trend to me. Like bandwagon? And bandwagoning. like I said earlier, like groupthink, it's kind of just like one person says it and it's back to the charismatic leaders of even like, ⁓ this is kind crazy, of Nazi Germany and how Hitler, he was a charismatic leader so everyone believed in him and he had a message that everyone wanted to hear. So that's why he had all the followers he did. But it's kind of like that on a way smaller scale with just a child being charismatic and just being, hey, let's come on, let's do it. speaker-1: It's really funny. My first one literally says charismatic leaders can inspire movements. Yeah, that's my lesson learned speaker-2: And then same with same with ⁓ Mussolini in Italy and just all in that portion of history, just like all of the fascist dictators, that's how they got their following. speaker-1: charisma that's right being good at speaking there is right ⁓ speaker-2: Not in that context. speaker-0: people believe the popular one. this, like a school scenario, if like the quiet kid no one really talks to said something like crazy, no one would believe it. Like, no one would really care. But if the popular kid said it, they would. speaker-2: And that kind of reminds me of In Lord of the Flies when Piggy would have an idea but he would have to tell Ralph and then Ralph would have to tell the group instead because Piggy, ⁓ he wasn't like as valuable as Ralph. So he would have to give his message to Ralph for the group to hear it. And most of time the group would agree and be like, that's a really good idea Ralph, but it would come from Piggy. speaker-1: It's an interesting take, So, if you have a charismatic leader, can, no matter what their narrative is or what they're pushing for, can go with the rule because they're charismatic and people listen to them. Just based on their charisma. speaker-2: At least in the beginning of War on the Flies, not speaking to the end. speaker-1: I see a parallel to today in the Trump administration. ⁓ Charismatic leader that somehow ⁓ people follow. ⁓ No plan beyond his own power and wealth. ⁓ owes the American people at least followers more than just hope. ⁓ Right. The story reminds us to question the authority and promises that sound too good to be true. That's a big one. Those merchants in Mersey offered free passage. The kids desperate and far from home had no reason to trust them, but they did. Critical thinking, even when you're desperate, can save your life. Yeah. Right? something seems too good to be true, ⁓ probably is. ⁓ yet when you gotta critically think about what's going on here. Okay, what is this person's agenda? What is his end game? He can't just be here wanting to give me a ride to the Holy Land for free when he's a merchant who runs a business and I'm taking away money out of his pocket. There's something's not right here. Something doesn't smell right. speaker-0: I feel like this really ties to like today. There's so much ads out there like, gems in this game. We like, robux or something. And it's almost always fake. Like it's always fake. speaker-1: What do I always say? Nothing's free. Yeah. It may say free game, but guess what? You're going to be watching ads. Someone's paying for it. Someone's paying for it. You're paying for it with your time and possibly buying that game that's an ad or that shirt that you saw on Instagram. know, that's free is not free. Always. speaker-0: There's only the catch. speaker-1: guys know the rules. First of three wins. I'm gonna read the question and as soon as I finish the question, you lock in. Question one. In what year did the Children's Truce Aid take place? 12-12. ⁓ you should have taken notes. ⁓ You purposely didn't ⁓ take notes this Why? I don't ⁓ speaker-2: hope that he can win the fun fact challenge without a note. Please. speaker-1: Watch it. Question two. What were the names of the two young leaders who inspired the French and German groups? Locked in. ⁓ I think I heard Gavin. speaker-0: The one from Julie was Nicholas? speaker-1: Okay. Hold on, I just... speaker-2: of what? speaker-0: to the ones with hands, it was something cool way. It's all I have. speaker-1: I don't think so either. So we go for it. speaker-2: France, Stephen of Coy, and from Germany, Necklace of Cologne. speaker-1: Correct. Alright, here's the extra bonus one because Zoe already won. Question 3. What Pope told them to go home when they reached Rome? speaker-2: That's Gavin. The what? speaker-0: Listen. speaker-1: I need a- I need a regular number. What? Hey, you got it. Innocent the third. Good job, guys. speaker-0: I'm speaker-2: in speaker-1: Today, ⁓ April 9th. ⁓ On April 9th, 1413, Henry V of England was crowned at Westminster Abbey, beginning a reign that would become inseparable from the Hundred Years War. Within two years, he launched the campaign that led to Agincourt reshaping English identity and France for generations. speaker-2: Who's pooping there? speaker-1: His rule fused chivalric legend with hard-nosed statecraft. you remember the surrounding English flipping you off? speaker-0: ⁓ yeah. speaker-2: Yeah, because they were cut off. speaker-1: So they would show the backwards V to show that I still got my two fingers to pull the bow. Agincourt is where that comes from. April 9, 1865, Confederate General Robert E. Lee surrendered at the Appomattox Courthouse to Union General Ulysses S. Grant. speaker-2: Fun fact, ⁓ the Appalachian Courthouse is a town. The Appomattox Courthouse is town, it is not a place. speaker-1: Are you serious? Mm-hmm. Well, that's interesting. speaker-2: I remember my teacher, she drilled us in that it wasn't a place, was a town. That's a name? Yeah. And it's confusing. So she drilled it into us that it was a town and not a place. speaker-1: ⁓ that's so weird. interesting, one of the judges that we have in federal court, her name is, her last name is Court. ⁓ So, but she also uses, I don't know if it's her maiden name or what, but she uses her maiden name along with Court. And so like, I thought it was a typo, and so I took it off one of our papers that we filed. And when I submitted it and I looked I'm like, ⁓ no, that's her actual name. I completely took off her last name from the paper. Anyway. Speedface. Same type of deal. ⁓ He surrendered at the Epimetics Courthouse. The terms were generous, allowing soldiers to return home, but the symbolic impact was enormous. The Confederacy's main army was finished and the Civil War's end became inevitable. And finally, April 9th, 1942, Bataan Death March began in the Philippines. You guys ever heard of this? I have. What do you know, Zola? speaker-2: Yeah. speaker-0: I have no speaker-2: wasn't it the- okay it's kind of foggy cuz it's been a little bit but was it the prisoner of wars like the POWs marching to somewhere to get rights? somewhere? I don't think they marched somewhere speaker-1: Vroom speaker-0: We're here. speaker-1: So they're marching to get rights. because they're POWs. So after the fall of Butan, tens of thousands of Filipino and American prisoners were forced to march under brutal conditions. speaker-2: Yeah, or like for freedom or something I knew they were marching for some, for some reason. speaker-1: Starvation, dehydration, and executions killed thousands. The march became one of the Pacific War's most notorious atrocities and later fueled war crime prosecutions and enduring US-Philippine remembrance. speaker-2: Now at nine minutes. speaker-1: The ⁓ Crusade of 1212 reminds us that history's most memorable lessons often come from its failures, ⁓ its triumphs. ⁓ of young people fueled by faith and charismatic leadership set out to accomplish the impossible. ⁓ speaker-2: We learned it last year. It's all- it is American speaker-1: They believed their innocence and purity would succeed where armies had failed. Instead, they faced starvation, death, and possibly slavery. Their story caught somewhere between fact and legend teaches us that the passion must be tempered with planning, that good intentions need realistic strategies, and that critical thinking can save lives. Even 800 years later, we can still learn from their tragic journey. That's it for this episode. Thanks for traveling through time with us on the ebbs of history. If you like today's story, share it with a teacher, a friend, or your family on Instagram at ebbsofhistory. If you have any show ideas, corrections, or questions, can contact us at questions at ebbsofhistory.com. speaker-0: Sign up, this is Penny Coho's Gabby. speaker-2: So speaker-1: and me, Jason, reminding you that history is not just about dates and battles, it's about people, curiosity, and the weird wonderful choices that shaped our world. Until next time, keep wondering, keep laughing, and keep learning through the ebbs of history.