Latest / 360 with Katie Woolf / NT Police Association President Paul McCue sheds light on how new alcohol restrictions in Alice Springs will impact officers

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NT Police Association President Paul McCue sheds light on how new alcohol restrictions in Alice Springs will impact officers · 360 with Katie Woolf

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: As you've heard, the Prime Minister flew into Alice Springs
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: along with the Chief Minister, announcing alcohol restrictions in an
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: effort to curb some of the issues that the town
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: is experiencing when it comes to crime. We were told
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: this week that it was what the police wanted and
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: the police were at the table when the decision was made.
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: Now joining me on the line is the President of
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: the Northern Territory Police Association, Paul McHugh.
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: Good morning, Paul, Good morning Katie, Thanks for having me.
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: Thanks so much for your time and happy New Year. Paul.
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: Absolutely, what impact.
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: Are these alcohol free days going to have in Alice
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: Springs for our police?
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I think well, they're obviously hoping will be
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: a bit of a circuit breaker, I guess to some
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  Speaker 2: of the excessive alcohol floating around the community down there
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: in Central Australia. But ultimately, you know a lot of
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: the crime being committed to access alcohol is by youths
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: and by premises, not takeaway outlets. So I'm you know, certainly,
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: our immediate feedback from some of our members down there
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: is there they're not convinced it will it will change
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: too much in terms of the crime and the break ins.
• 1:07
  Speaker 2: But certainly I guess it will assist in the short term,
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: I guess to reduce some of the flow of alcohol
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: into the community, albeit at the risk of perhaps secondary
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: supply increasing.
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: Of course, Paul, I know that the Northern Territory Chief
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: Minister told us on the show earlier in the week
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  Speaker 1: that the police were at the table when this decision
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: was made. Was this a push from the Northern Territory
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: Police from your understanding as the president of the association.
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, look, obviously, you know, the situation becomes so dire.
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  Speaker 2: I guess, if you can put it that way, it
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  Speaker 2: was national news. It was as embarrassing for the NT
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: really to see the town has degenerated to that manner
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  Speaker 2: and the amount of crime going on. And so, no
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  Speaker 2: doubt police were always at the table, and we know
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  Speaker 2: the senior executive down there always you know, talking to
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: the members, talking to government around what's needed. But you know,
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: no doubt there was significant influence nationally around this decision
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: because ultimately the NT government hadn't taken that step despite
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: you know, significant increases in crime rates and you know
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  Speaker 2: what we've been seeing on social media and reported in
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  Speaker 2: the media in general, so you know, no doubt there
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  Speaker 2: was a significant national influence, but of course our police
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  Speaker 2: would have been at the table for those discussions.
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: Paul, you and I had spoken before about the Stronger
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: Futures legislation ending and what the impact was going to
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: be as it came to an end. Has this had
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: an impact? I mean, again, we've spoken towards the end
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: of last year about there being an increase in crime,
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  Speaker 1: and the stats don't lie at this point.
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: No, they don't. And of course, you know, with those
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: significant increases in statistics around crime and domestic related harm
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: and olcal related harm generally, I mean, it all initially
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: flows onto the police, doesn't it, and austrained resources that
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: are already struggling to keep up and yet alone the
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: other frontline services as well. But certainly from a policing perspective,
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: you know, our members are stretched far beyond what their
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: capabilities are at the moment. They really are struggling to
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: just fill rosters at the moment. And of course we've
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: seen that influx you know, or forty officers late last
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: year into the town and they've done some incredible work
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  Speaker 2: and of course you know it's on the record how
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: many people have been arrested and those sorts of outcomes
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  Speaker 2: from that, But that's not the long term solution. And
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  Speaker 2: I mean what we've got to see here is a
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  Speaker 2: far broader lens put on put on this problems. There's
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  Speaker 2: only so many places to go around, Katie. And even
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: if the Chief Minister says we want to keep those
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: officers down there, we don't have them sitting around. They've
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: come from other frontline, key areas of our organization across
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  Speaker 2: the whole territory. So the impact is being felt across
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  Speaker 2: the territory.
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  Speaker 1: Top me through that impact and what police officers are
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  Speaker 1: saying to you right now.
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: Well, quite simply. I mean it's not uncommon for several
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: of our oices and in stations up in the top
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  Speaker 2: end here, for example, to get a phone cars on
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  Speaker 2: email saying we need three or four members to get
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  Speaker 2: to Alice Springs in two days time. I mean that
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  Speaker 2: the planning or the lack of numbers is so evident
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  Speaker 2: that we just are really struggling to get any any
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  Speaker 2: members to be able to put their hand up to
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  Speaker 2: do these additional roles because they simply don't have them.
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  Speaker 2: And of course you take four out of Casurina for example,
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: who you know Casurina, Darwin, Palmerston or Catherine or any
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: of these other regions. The impacts immediate, someone else has
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  Speaker 2: to pick up that that you know, those those hours
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  Speaker 2: that are lost to our springs. So I mean I can't.
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  Speaker 2: I could probably talk for hours really about the impact
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  Speaker 2: this is having across the police, but yet alone obviously
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: their ability to service the community, which the community really
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: care about. Of course, Paul, talk.
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: Me through how many palis we've got in Alice Springs
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  Speaker 1: now and whether there's going to be enough to manage
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  Speaker 1: these new restrictions because obviously with these restrictions there are
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: going to be alcohol free days, but there's also going
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: to be a situation where people can only purchase, you know,
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  Speaker 1: can only make one purchase per day and various other things.
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  Speaker 1: Do we have enough palas in Ola Springs?
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  Speaker 2: Well, the short answer that is no, and obviously we need.
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  Speaker 2: There's forty one funded PARI positions down there in Alice Springs,
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  Speaker 2: and I think at the moment we've got less than
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  Speaker 2: twenty available for deployment and twenty in total. So I think,
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  Speaker 2: you know, the numbers are well and truly down. That's
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: been the case for some time, so that slack you know,
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  Speaker 2: twenty odd positions is being picked up by our constables
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  Speaker 2: and above. So that's impacting there immediately in Central Australia.
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  Speaker 2: But of course those other requirements now with the introduction
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  Speaker 2: of these restrictions, the daily purchasing limits, the on premise BDR,
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  Speaker 2: you know who's going to be policing that. I mean,
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  Speaker 2: we don't have you know, we don't have all these
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: additional people sitting around. What's the government's plan there? Because ultimately,
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: you know, they brought these restriction restrictions in immediately, and
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: I know the impact has had on our managers down
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: there in our springs Tron and our workout what this means,
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: you know, in the immediate three months ahead, because you know,
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: when you make these changes overnight, this is trouble with
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: a lack of proper planning. You make these changes overnight,
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  Speaker 2: it impacts our members on the front line immediately, and
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: now they're running around trying to work out where they're
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: going to get the numbers from.
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  Speaker 1: So, Paul, from what you are saying and based on
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  Speaker 1: what you know, we're all witnessing ourselves at this point.
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: Despite the fact that the community has been screaming out
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: for months and months about the issues with crime, not
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: only with alcohol but also with youth crime and everything associated.
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: And despite that, it does very much seem as though
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: the announcement that was made earlier in the week by
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: the Prime Minister and the Chief Minister was a snap decision,
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: and it doesn't sound as though there was a lot
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: of planning when it comes to the way in which
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: the Northern Territory Police are going to implement it.
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: No, and there's no I mean, there's no doubt it
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: was a snap decision. I mean, ultimately, there might have
• 6:58
  Speaker 2: been some discussion in the days leading into that decision
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: being made. But of course when you're talking about workforce planning,
• 7:05
  Speaker 2: you're talking about having numbers on the ground to do
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: the job and get alone rostering in people's lives. You know,
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: this has had an immediate impact overnight for our sergeants,
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: our senior sergeants and of course those on the ground
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  Speaker 2: doing the shifts about what it means for them, because
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: you know, you've gone overnight from having one one role
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: to another role and other requirements that have been put
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: in by the federal government and now the Northern Territory government.
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: So yeah, not a lot of full planning and this
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  Speaker 2: is a result, no doubt of a lack of planning
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: by the NT government.
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  Speaker 1: Well, would it have been a wise decision from the
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  Speaker 1: Northern Territory government to accept some assistance from the Australian
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  Speaker 1: Federal Police.
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Look, I mean ultimately, you know, we needed forty
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: extra police late last year. We've put them in there.
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: You know, that's ultimately probably a decision for the Commissioner.
• 7:55
  Speaker 2: And you know, we all know how short Allice Springs
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: has been on police for some time, so any assistance
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: would be good assistance. But you know, the practicalities of
• 8:06
  Speaker 2: that and the realities of getting those people there in
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  Speaker 2: the short term is very difficult. But you know, this
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  Speaker 2: has been a Northern Territory problem for decades. This has
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: been something that we, along with other representative bodies in
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  Speaker 2: May of last year, warned would be the outcome had
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: there been some forward planning by the Northern Territory Government
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  Speaker 2: on this issue, we may have already had those resources available,
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  Speaker 2: but we just simply don't at the moment.
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  Speaker 1: Well, I just want to go back to, you know,
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  Speaker 1: the potential impacts of what we may see with these
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: restricted alcohol days and restricted access to alcohol, members saying
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: to you that they're concerned that there will be an
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: increase in crime, or that there could be more people
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  Speaker 1: sort of trying to break into homes and businesses in
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  Speaker 1: an effort to get their hands on alcohol.
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: Look, there's no doubt, I mean that's that's certainly been
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: some of the immediate feedback to us from members on
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  Speaker 2: the ground down there. And you know already see every
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  Speaker 2: day how many unlawful entries or assaults are taking place.
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  Speaker 2: And no doubt with restricted hours, those that are relying
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  Speaker 2: upon alcohol, who are addicted to alcohol, will find whatever
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  Speaker 2: means they can to try and access it, and sadly
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  Speaker 2: that may come at the cost of crime to other
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  Speaker 2: members of the community. And of course police are doing
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: all they can and what they've got, but undoubtedly, undoubtedly
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: there is the risk that the crime will increase.
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: Now, Paul, from a policing perspective and from our Northern
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  Speaker 1: Territory Police, obviously the announcement that we've seen earlier this
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  Speaker 1: week is very much based around alcohol. What are Northern
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: Territory Police officers saying to you that they would like
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: to see at this point, not just in Alice Springs
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  Speaker 1: because obviously we're focusing a lot on Alice Springs right now.
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  Speaker 1: There's a crisis there, there is no doubt about that.
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  Speaker 1: But we've had issues right across the board. I mean,
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: the latest Northern Territory crime statistics tell you that crime
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: is on the rise in some area is and has
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: been for a while. What are member saying to you
• 10:03
  Speaker 1: at the moment that they really.
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: Need Yeah, well, obviously we know it's not just an
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: al Spring centric problem. We know these issues exist in
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  Speaker 2: other areas of the territory. We've known that for some time.
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  Speaker 2: And certainly it's not just alcohol related. We know specifically
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: a lot of the feedback is around youth and youth crime,
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  Speaker 2: and the crime is being committed, you know, in many
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: areas of the territory by youths, and there is a
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: significant problem with that. But of course the family breakdown
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: ultimately where we're seeing us on the street. They don't
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: want to be at home, and you know, the efforts
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: from other agencies, the efforts from other non government organizations
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: have to be at the table to help police. We've
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: only got one thy six hundred if we're lucky. Police
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: in the Northern Territory that is very thin on the
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: ground when we're talking about the social issues we're facing,
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: so certainly from our members perspective, while we know alcohol
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: is one of the most significant factors, it also flows
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: into the amount of youth crime being undertaken at the
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: moment in the territory.
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: Well Police Association President Paul Mchue, we always appreciate your time.
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: Thanks very much for having a chat with me today.
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: Good on you. Thanks Katie, thank you