Latest / Chef's PSA Podcast / Fermin Nunez | The Bear, Running Multiple Restaurants, Origin Stories : PSA Podcast 120

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Fermin Nunez | The Bear, Running Multiple Restaurants, Origin Stories : PSA Podcast 120 · Chef's PSA Podcast

0:00
Hello chefs, this is Chef's PSA podcast.
0:02
I'm your host Andre Natera. On today's episode, we have
0:05
guest chef Fermin Nunez. He's based out of Austin, TX,
0:09
has two incredible restaurants. We talk about the origins of
0:13
Chef's PSA and how he influenced it, how to run a successful
0:16
restaurant, how to make sure you're getting the right brand
0:19
deals. We call out some sponsors, the
0:22
Michelin Guide coming to Texas. We tell some fun stories.
0:25
Stay tuned. You don't want to miss this one.
0:39
Hey everyone, a quick thanks to MES Footwear for sponsoring the
0:41
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follow them on their Instagram page at meesfootwear Chef.
1:09
It's good to see you man. Very good to see you.
1:11
So I did AQ and a of people that wanted to ask you questions
1:17
before I was like, man, I'm going to have to mean on what's
1:19
the most pressing question on everyone's mind and softer
1:22
heart. Soft soft good good answer.
1:25
Soft is the way to go, like. Taco Bell Soft.
1:26
Soft soft Taco, soft scramble. That's that's the way to to my
1:30
heart. Good.
1:31
You watch. You watch the bear.
1:34
Yeah, I feel like it was my my chef's civic duty to to watch it
1:38
so I can have an opinion on it. Did you finish all three
1:40
seasons? Unfortunately, yes.
1:41
You did see I haven't even finished the third season.
1:43
It was. It's a great thing to watch when
1:45
you're in an airplane. Yeah.
1:46
Just to like, get it over with. What did?
1:48
What did you think? Man, I don't know, I have many
1:52
opinions. I think the, the the, the first
1:56
season was not my favorite. The second one redeemed itself a
1:59
little bit. I think it gave you an input on
2:01
what it truly is to like open a restaurant.
2:04
Obviously it's it's, it's a show they want to make drama, right?
2:07
Like they have a story. But I think it really
2:09
highlighted on like the, the, the struggles of opening a
2:12
restaurant. I think it's a little bit
2:13
unrealistic in some parts. The third one, I don't think
2:17
I'll ever get whatever those hours back in my life.
2:21
The first episode like the first, the first and second
2:24
episode I'm like I, I, I don't think I'm ever going to get this
2:28
hour with the 1st. Episode where they're doing like
2:30
the montage of him working it is.
2:31
So dramatic. It is so dramatic, yeah.
2:34
And that was the one episode I did like, really.
2:37
Yeah. That was the one episode I did
2:38
like of the third season. And then after that, I just kind
2:41
of lost my attention. I mean, it's, it's a show,
2:44
right? It's a drama show.
2:45
It's like it's I'm sure if you ask a doctor what they think
2:48
about Doctor house, they'll be like, it's very dramatic is not
2:52
how it actually works. I'm sure you asked lawyers about
2:54
low and, or they'll be like, that's not how it actually
2:57
happens. Finally we get a show and and we
2:59
get a something to say. And yeah, I don't, I don't, I
3:03
didn't necessarily agree with everything that they do.
3:07
So yeah, I, I that's, that's my kind opinion about it.
3:12
What about you? So the first season, well, in
3:14
general, I think for someone that's a non chef, like I have
3:19
friends that are non chefs, family members that are non
3:21
chefs, they love it. Like, Oh my God, this is so
3:23
cool. And I'm like, it's OK.
3:25
Like the first season when I watched it, it's the first time
3:28
I've ever watched ATV show. And there was a scene where the
3:31
tickets are going, wheels fall off the bus busy while I was
3:34
sitting down watching and I stood up because I wanted to
3:36
call, call tickets. Like I stood up and I was pacing
3:38
and I was like, calm down. What what am I doing?
3:41
The show is getting me worked up.
3:43
That's. Kind of a good sign.
3:45
Yeah, right. So it was in a bad way because
3:47
it's like these guys don't know what the fuck they're doing.
3:49
Those dudes don't even sell food until like the 7th episode.
3:52
It takes them so long. They have somebody on payroll
3:56
that is fixing things. Yeah, that doesn't work.
3:59
Yeah, right. You have to watch like 5
4:01
episodes for him to be in the weeds to like figure out how to
4:05
sell food in to go boxes and he's making sandwiches.
4:07
He's making sandwiches. Relax.
4:09
And and I'm looking at all this and then someone asked me like,
4:12
is it true that all this stuff happens?
4:13
Like yes, it is true, but it doesn't all happen in one day.
4:16
It that like you're seeing chaos that's like a three-year montage
4:20
of every chef's worst stories condensed into an episode.
4:24
It's like it doesn't, it doesn't really happen like that.
4:26
When I got to the second season again, I didn't like the first
4:30
season, to be honest with you. It was OK.
4:31
It was just OK. Second season I was getting a
4:34
little bit into it. Third season, I liked the first
4:36
episode. Unlike you, I did like the first
4:38
episode. Why?
4:39
Why did you like it? Because of chef's PSA, right?
4:43
Because everything that he's doing, like cutting the tape,
4:46
refixing things in the cooler, cleaning with the skewer on the
4:51
stove, like these are all things that I write about.
4:54
I agree, but it's so dramatic in how they're going about it and I
4:57
think it's going, it's taking a step backwards into how we are
5:01
going about. It's cool to cut the tape, it's
5:04
cool to clean between the creases with a toothpick.
5:07
It's not cool to be an asshole and they're highlighting that.
5:10
But did they show the asshole stuff?
5:11
I think they're just like so pretentious on like, you know
5:15
how they're going about it. It's like, oh, this is the way
5:17
and you have to suffer about it. Not like you can cut the tape
5:20
and like still have a good time and you don't have to look like,
5:23
you know, so intense about. It so yeah, he.
5:25
Looks like so dramatic he was. Going to jump off a bridge and
5:28
after cutting the tape, but that was my favorite episode was the
5:31
first one because I I like it right.
5:33
I like seeing Danielle and Thomas and.
5:35
Visually it was it was nice to see and I guess, and I guess
5:39
that's how they got me, right. It's like I didn't love it
5:41
because there was no story to it.
5:42
It was just like shaft live. We're going to clean, we're
5:45
going to scrub, we're going to cut the tape.
5:47
We're going to go over here like we're going to go learn how to
5:49
do this thing and Noma, we're going to go to, you know, the
5:51
French Laundry. We're going to go to New York.
5:53
And it's like, cool. See, but to me, that's what I
5:57
was geeking out about, 'cause I like the story is uninteresting.
6:00
Like I don't care about the girlfriend.
6:02
I don't care about I, I don't remember what it was second
6:04
season or third season where like they're the, I, I think her
6:07
name is Sidney, the sous chef. She's arguing with someone like
6:10
a boyfriend, girlfriend argument in the middle of the like
6:13
opening night. Like that doesn't happen.
6:16
Like what in what restaurant do we allow them to have a personal
6:21
petty argument in the middle of service And he comes up, it's
6:23
like, hey, I know it's now. Now's not a good time.
6:25
Like you think the opening night, and also, I don't
6:29
remember which episode this was, but like opening night, I don't
6:31
know if it's season 2 or season 3 opening night.
6:35
He's gonna try dessert for the first time.
6:36
That's going on the menu. Like come on, you're, you're
6:39
seeing a dessert for the first time that's going on the menu
6:42
for your first restaurant ever 30 minutes before the restaurant
6:46
opens. Like I don't think that's the
6:48
way it works. I'm sure the chef had fucking
6:50
ironed out every single detail before open night.
6:53
So some of that stuff kind of whatever.
6:55
I get it, it's TV, but I haven't finished the third season.
6:59
I've been watching it for like 8 months, 10 months a year.
7:02
I I, I think yeah, I think you have to finish seeing it just.
7:06
To get it out of my system. Yeah, just to get it out are.
7:07
They going to do a fourth season.
7:09
I think so, maybe. I don't know you're.
7:13
Going to be on it. I don't know.
7:14
I don't. I don't think I'll be doing that
7:16
anytime. Soon, I don't think the montage
7:17
you're. Making not.
7:18
Not with everything I just said about how I feel about it.
7:21
Maybe they'll come like, do an episode where Jeremy Allen
7:24
White's getting grilled on the chef's PSA I.
7:26
Love that. I love that.
7:27
Like why? Why you?
7:28
Why you such a nerd? Why did you so intense?
7:30
Relax relax relax. Your shirt is like $150.00.
7:33
You're doing fine. No.
7:34
Why are you so weird, brother? Exactly.
7:36
No, I'll tell you what I did learn about that, and this is
7:38
what I think a lot of people could learn about the show.
7:41
The Bear is that guy shouldn't be running a restaurant.
7:45
I agree. Like that guy?
7:46
Hers his his sous chef CDC, I forget her name.
7:49
She's the one that's should be doing it.
7:51
Yeah. And I think that's one, one good
7:53
thing that the show highlights. Is it it highlights how much
7:55
like chefs or executive chef, the TV chefs don't actually run
8:00
the show. They they create more problems
8:02
than they fix. Sometimes, right?
8:03
Sometimes, yeah, yeah. So Speaking of creating problems
8:07
that they don't fix and you know the chef running the show, I
8:09
want to ask you about this because I think it's pretty
8:11
cool. You're 1 of you're one of the
8:14
best chefs in Austin. You have two of the best
8:16
restaurants. Very kind of you.
8:18
Well. I mean it, right.
8:20
Two of the best restaurants in Austin with Suete and Este and
8:24
both very similar, but also very different in style and food and
8:27
cuisine. When I first went to S no, when
8:30
I first went to Suete years ago, when you first opened, I
8:34
remember trying the food and I was like, I'm a technique geek.
8:38
Like that's why a chef's PSA. It's like I, I love technique.
8:41
I love to see beautiful technique.
8:43
I love attention to detail. And I remember, and I also love
8:47
Mexican food. Like that's, that's what I grew
8:49
up eating. And I remember when I tried the
8:51
food, I just remember thinking like, you nailed it because this
8:55
is Mexican food with exceptional technique.
8:58
Exceptional technique. And I just, I just remember I
9:00
was sitting back and I was like, man, the onions were cut
9:03
perfect. The sauce was smooth.
9:05
I don't know if you're passing that through a Tammy or what you
9:07
were doing, but everything was just beautiful and technical and
9:10
delicious, but also approachable.
9:13
So anyway, that's neither here nor there.
9:15
I just want to, you know, give you your flower chef.
9:17
Appreciate that. Thank you.
9:18
SO. Two of the best restaurants, but
9:20
you're the chef of both of these restaurants.
9:22
And I mean, they're not that close.
9:25
You can't walk to each one back and forth.
9:27
So what is a day-to-day in the life of you look like?
9:33
Managing two different restaurants?
9:34
Do you have two different chef? The cuisines?
9:36
What? What kind of leadership do you
9:37
give to both of them? What does the operation look
9:39
like? What is your role in this?
9:41
So that's a very good question that I'm trying to figure out
9:43
myself. We have those two amazing
9:46
restaurants. So what's the Este?
9:47
We also have Bartotti, which is right next to Este, which
9:50
started as like an event space when we open Este and then a
9:53
little bit of a bar food that just happened to be open on
9:56
Friday and Saturdays that now turn into a restaurant that is
9:59
seven days a week with the CDC and a sous chef.
10:02
And you know, it's, it's another and it's another thing that I
10:04
that I got to be in charge of. And I think the more I realize
10:08
what my role is, is it's more of like, similar to how you talk
10:14
about when you were running the, the hotel, right?
10:16
Like you had your people in charge.
10:17
And I make the biggest impact on the restaurants through my
10:20
connection with those people. My Tuesdays, which are my
10:23
Mondays, start with meetings with all the key leaders in the
10:27
restaurants because that's how I'm able to know what's going on
10:31
in every kitchen, because I'm not able to be in the kitchen
10:34
every single day, every single time, right?
10:37
I always describe this to the cooks that you know, if, if
10:42
we're in an airplane, the CDC's are the pilots, they're the ones
10:46
that are steering the plane in the right direction.
10:49
They can see everything that's happening on board.
10:51
They can talk to their sous chefs, They can see what's going
10:54
on. They they have the people that
10:55
are in the dining room, they're seeing it down the day-to-day,
10:57
but I'm the one on the ground being able to direct them on how
11:02
we're going to get there. This is what I see ahead.
11:04
This is what we've got to work on.
11:05
This is the thing that I want to us to focus on.
11:08
These are the things that we got to start preparing because we're
11:11
seeing the busy season, right? So I'm not the pilot anymore.
11:14
They're the pilots and they have full control to fly the plane
11:18
with my direction. And that's a little bit more
11:20
what I do on a day-to-day. I always try to have like, oh,
11:23
today I'm going to be at Swarte, today I'm going to be at Este,
11:26
and then to them tomorrow I'm going to be at Bartotti.
11:28
And never really works out that way, right?
11:30
The restaurants tell me where I need to be and they don't care
11:34
about where I want to be, right? So that's, that's a little bit
11:38
of what my role is on the day-to-day and, and checking in
11:41
with those key people. I have ACDC per restaurant and
11:45
not counting Totti, every CDC has three sous chefs.
11:49
And then I have a pastry chef, Jerrick Flynn, who runs the, the
11:53
desserts for all the restaurants, right?
11:55
That's like 8910 people that I have to constantly like be aware
12:00
of. And then I don't know all the
12:02
cooks, right? Like I remember you talk about
12:04
in your podcast about what it was like for you running the
12:07
hotel. And I and I resonate a lot with
12:09
that because it's like you connected with the people that
12:11
were running it so they could then lead on the rest of the
12:14
people that you might not necessarily be interacting with
12:16
a lot. Right?
12:17
So it's, it's, it's getting to a point for me that it's kind of
12:20
weird to like I walk into the restaurant and I don't
12:23
necessarily know the person that just got hired.
12:26
I only know about them through the notes that I've heard about.
12:28
And then I introduce myself to them, where five years ago I was
12:33
the one that was interviewing all those people and I was
12:35
making decisions who was going to get higher.
12:37
And now I get to be like, hey, my name is farming, welcome to
12:39
the team. I'm excited that you're here,
12:41
you know? Do you?
12:42
Do you like it more that way? Yeah, I think so.
12:45
Yeah, I think so. I like it because I get to see
12:51
the growth that I was going through that got me to be where
12:54
I am. And it also allows me to do
12:57
other things that I wasn't able to do because I was just
13:01
focusing on the day-to-day, right?
13:03
So. So you feel like you have more
13:05
growth now in what you're doing, like you're different
13:07
challenges. Different challenges, Yeah,
13:10
different challenges for sure. I focus more on running the
13:14
business than running the kitchens.
13:17
So I was talking with Jacob on a couple of podcasts ago and we
13:21
were talking about advice that I had given him when he had taken
13:24
over as executive chef of Garrison.
13:26
And I was on my way out and I told him I said, look, a chef,
13:29
the cuisine can run a good kitchen.
13:32
An executive chef can run a great restaurant.
13:34
And so there there's a certain point when you're growing as a
13:37
chef that you say, hey, it's not just about the kitchen anymore.
13:40
It's about it's about everything.
13:41
Everything becomes important. So was there one thing when you
13:45
were in the growth phase that was a little bit harder to adapt
13:49
to for you? That part of like understanding
13:55
the big picture, that was really hard for me.
13:57
But you know, like back in the day, things that were harder
14:02
were only harder because I made them harder.
14:04
And, and, and navigating that now with my CDCS, it's like,
14:09
Hey, we got to do this catering because this catering is going
14:11
to make sure that we have a, a healthy business when it's slow,
14:15
right? And, and that, that really was a
14:19
big challenge for me to like when I was just running the
14:22
kitchen, when it was just me and, and the few sous chefs, I'd
14:26
be like, now we're too busy to be doing catering, right.
14:28
But now that I can step out of it and look at it as a big
14:31
picture, like you said, I remember when, when, when you
14:34
were talking with Jacob about that, I was like, that's exactly
14:37
how I feel. I am running the, the restaurant
14:40
as a business. And I'm now I'm just not running
14:42
the kitchens. And that was a big thing for me
14:45
to realize and like, Oh, this is, this is what I have to do
14:48
now. This is my role.
14:49
I don't have to worry about who's going to make the schedule
14:51
and who's going to work the grill on Tuesday.
14:53
If the Tuesday Girl Guide or girl doesn't show up, I can help
14:57
out and, you know, fix those problems and I look like a
14:59
badass, right? But that is not my dude anymore.
15:02
I have way too big of a payroll to be focusing on those things.
15:05
I got to focus on the bigger thing to make sure that we have
15:08
a healthy business. It's interesting.
15:10
You bring up a really interesting point.
15:12
How if the grill cook calls out, can you jump on the grill and
15:15
fix it? Yeah.
15:16
Should you? Probably not.
15:17
That's not the best use of your time, but it's interesting when
15:20
sometimes young cooks come in as like, why doesn't chef work the
15:23
grill anymore? Like I thought he's the
15:25
executive chef. Why does why isn't he on the
15:27
grill? We had a call off call Fermin
15:30
and it's like, yeah, I, I, I understand that that's sometimes
15:33
what you think when you're a cook, but it's bigger picture
15:36
that. And when those things happen,
15:37
when it's like when when I give the phone call, I know that
15:42
they've gone through all the things that they have to do to
15:44
like give me the call. And that's exciting to me
15:47
because that to me is like, I put all the things that I'm
15:50
working on, on hold to just focus on like running the pass
15:54
or working a station, right? Or like doing the prep list or
15:57
butchering the fish. That's like, that's the exciting
16:01
days that I don't get a lot of every now and then.
16:03
But when those happen, I'm like this is it.
16:05
When when you're developing menus for the two restaurants,
16:09
how often do you change? We change as needed.
16:13
We don't really have like we change the whole menu every
16:16
three to four months, right. With the seasonality in Austin,
16:21
it doesn't also really happen that way, right?
16:23
It changes based on we have the menu structure to where like we
16:28
have the things that are never going to go away, right.
16:30
We're never going to take this lettos out from sorte like that
16:33
wouldn't be financially a very smart move for us to do that,
16:37
right. But we have a quesadilla on the
16:39
menu, right? In the quesadilla, the feeling
16:41
changes as much as the season changes.
16:44
If we're doing it with a summer squash, we'll run it until one
16:47
or two things happen. We get bored of that set or
16:50
there's no more squash, right, And then we change it to
16:53
whatever we're excited about in the moment.
16:55
And we have little things like that throughout both all the
16:57
restaurants. There's like we have a format
17:00
that works and and the ingredients are the ones that
17:04
change. That is one way when when we
17:07
change menus. And then another thing is like
17:08
the drastic reality of like if somebody doesn't like something
17:11
and if one person doesn't like it, it's OK.
17:15
But if you're getting constant feedback about that one dish
17:18
where it's either getting sent back or like people don't finish
17:21
it or you see it in the notes of this person didn't like this.
17:25
That is that is more of my what role is now.
17:28
It's like, hey, the halibut, we're having issues with it.
17:31
People are not liking it. Maybe we should change the fish
17:33
or we constantly see that the halibut is being returned
17:36
because it's undercooked. People like the the dish as a
17:39
set, but we're having a struggle with cooking it.
17:41
Well, my we, we butcher it a different way and we don't cut
17:44
it a steak. Maybe we push it a little bit
17:47
into that. So it's like those are a little
17:48
bit more like what my day to days are and how the menu is a
17:53
little bit of changing towards towards what the people want.
17:58
Right. You take a very strategic
17:59
approach when doing menu development.
18:02
So you're looking at like, hey, this works like you're saying
18:04
the case idea, but like how do we adjust it to make it either
18:06
more exciting, more seasonal, something like that.
18:09
When you're free spirited, creating a a menu like when,
18:14
when you were doing Este before Este opened.
18:16
What is your creative process when you're thinking about, OK,
18:19
how do we design this restaurant to be what it is?
18:21
I think it's that always starts with a dream, right?
18:24
You always want to start with like what you're passionate
18:26
about. And that was how we did Suerte,
18:29
how we did Este, how we went about Bartoti.
18:33
You start with your dream and then the restaurant, as it
18:38
started to becoming alive and there's people coming in and
18:40
out, it will tell you what needs to change, right?
18:44
We went through that with Suerte.
18:45
We went through that with Este, we went through that with
18:48
Bartotti. I had my dream of what I wanted
18:50
to serve. And then you figure out
18:51
compromises, right? It's like, I love this one dish
18:55
at Este that it was like, so not even controversial.
18:59
Like the people that liked it loved it.
19:01
The people that didn't hated it, they were not about it.
19:04
And it was tuna carnitas. And to me that was a special
19:07
dish that was I had it. It was good.
19:08
That was like really special to me because of like the
19:10
connection that I had to it. Like where I tried in Mexico the
19:13
first time is very like it's not very common.
19:16
You don't associate tuna with cooking in far and and cooking
19:20
in lard. People usually associate tuna
19:23
with like being like raw or like barely see on the outside.
19:26
And the people that liked it loved it.
19:28
The people that didn't didn't. So it was like to why I think
19:30
this dish is better than what it actually is.
19:32
Is it hurting the restaurant more than what it should be?
19:35
Is it time for me to just move on and create something that is
19:37
going to be loved by more people than half and half, you know?
19:42
So that was, that's something too that like I always say, like
19:45
when you open restaurants, like you see what your dream is and
19:49
then you realize what you can afford.
19:50
So talking about opening a restaurant and fresh in your
19:53
memory because how long has they've been?
19:55
Opened This is going to be two in October.
19:57
So still pretty fresh in memory. And then and sweat the before
20:00
that hold. 6 1/2. 6 1/2 So you've opened three restaurants
20:04
in the last six years, give or take.
20:07
For someone that's about to open up their first restaurant never
20:10
opened it before. It's their first time at bat.
20:12
What is some advice that you wish you knew that you're going
20:15
to help this new chef? That's listening.
20:19
I think if it's in Austin, the biggest thing that I've learned
20:22
in the last six years as opposed to before Austin is such a a, a
20:29
more of a seasonal CD than it's ever been.
20:32
And if you're not prepared to be slow, if you're not thinking
20:38
about those four months of the year where they're not going to
20:41
be a lot of people just in Austin, there's going to be a
20:43
lot of people coming in. You got you got to think about
20:45
that. You know, the food, if you're at
20:47
the point where you're like, I'm going to open my restaurant,
20:49
like the food you probably like figured out, right?
20:52
The more restaurants that I've opened, the more I realized that
20:55
the food is the easiest part and is the last thing I think about
20:58
now. It's about how much money I'm
21:00
going to put in to make sure that I get all that money back.
21:03
You know, you might not need the rational to open because those
21:07
$30,000 are going to be better in the bank so you can make
21:09
payroll so you can buy produce, right?
21:12
I swear to say, we open with two Blodgett ovens double stacked.
21:16
You know, the dream was always irrational, but we couldn't
21:18
afford the dream. And that didn't stop me from
21:20
making tasty food, right. There's like that saying, like
21:23
Sam Helman, Mass, who's my business part in the restaurant,
21:26
always says you can get a great pair of scissors.
21:29
Give it to a shitty Barber. You're going to still get a
21:31
shitty haircut. Yeah.
21:32
No, Yeah. That's a good point.
21:35
I think I think a lot of people underestimate how good you have
21:40
to be at cooking before you think about opening your
21:42
restaurant, because the last thing you need to worry about is
21:45
your cooking needs to be on autopilot, right?
21:46
You got to be able to create food and like you were talking
21:49
earlier, you got to be nimble enough to adjust and say, hey,
21:51
the halibut's not selling or too many complaints because it's
21:54
undercooked like it's let's adjust.
21:55
And then what's interesting about a restaurant is you've, I
22:01
know you know what I'm talking about.
22:02
Like when you first open, it's, it's not, you're not performing
22:07
at your best because you need more cooks in the kitchen.
22:10
And a lot of them are going to quit because it gets hard,
22:12
right? There's, there's attrition,
22:13
there's turnover, and then you get more efficient.
22:16
So what you opened with, I'm just making this up.
22:17
If you open with 12 cooks on the line, you might end up with
22:19
eight when you're efficient, right?
22:23
And you really hit your stride a couple months in, but it sucks
22:26
because a lot of people come into a restaurant, they try you
22:29
in your first month and say that wasn't great, I'm or yeah, I got
22:31
it, I'm not coming back. No, no, try it at first.
22:33
Come back after they got their seed legs and then come back
22:37
maybe even a year later and it's not the same wrestling.
22:38
I've got a very hot take on that.
22:41
You know, like everybody only wants to ever talk about the
22:44
best new restaurant, the hot new restaurants in town, right?
22:47
And there's all these lists that are driven by that.
22:50
And those things are like such a good thing and a bad thing in my
22:54
opinion, right? They're a good thing because if
22:56
you're in that list is going to make sure that your restaurant
22:59
is successful because people are going to be excited to try it,
23:02
right? But why there's not like a best
23:05
5 year old enough restaurant, right?
23:07
Because a lot of those, those restaurants that are on those
23:10
lists, five years later, they're not even open no matter how
23:13
great they were at cooking, right?
23:15
And I think it's like, it's so hard to judge a restaurant the
23:20
first three, six months because I always described as like the
23:24
first year of opening a restaurant.
23:25
You're gathering your data. Like you said, you overstab with
23:28
with with cooks. You overstab with savage juice
23:31
because you never put away the sugar for the first time.
23:34
You don't get better at something by doing it only one
23:37
time. You get better at it by doing it
23:39
over and over again. You figure out where the sugar
23:42
is going to be, where the onions are going to be, right.
23:43
So you need a lot more people to do that.
23:45
And people have never done the recipes more than once, right?
23:49
So you gather all your data. You also know what people are
23:52
going to order after that year, right?
23:53
You figure out when the busiest time of the day, like how you
23:56
structure the prep cooks coming in the the line cooks coming in,
23:59
like the dishwashers, right? You gather all your data in the
24:02
first year and then the second year you implement that to be
24:05
better. So it's like year three, you're
24:07
like you're hitting your stride. You know, I always feel like
24:09
Suerte is as best it's ever been right now because of all the
24:13
five years before it that got us to where we are.
24:16
I think benzene restaurants are cool but like 5 year old
24:19
restaurants and up are way cooler in my opinion.
24:22
Yeah, it's, it's interesting that you bring this up because I
24:25
did a podcast, I don't know, let's let's call it eight months
24:28
ago. It was called Best old
24:30
restaurant. I was at, I think it was at Este
24:33
and I was with Emmanuel La Roche from Flavors Unknown, the host
24:36
of the podcast. And we were talking, you came to
24:38
the table and we talked about Best Old restaurant.
24:40
I was like, I'm going to do a whole podcast on, I don't know
24:42
if you heard it, but I did a whole podcast based on the
24:44
conversation that we had Best Old restaurant.
24:47
It's about 20 or so episodes back, but you should go listen
24:50
to. It I, I will.
24:51
Because I, I, I did mention, I don't know if I mentioned that I
24:53
got the idea from you, but I mentioned like I was talking to
24:55
someone and I don't always say who I get, you know, unless you
24:58
give permission. One thing that I also want to
25:01
touch on that before we move on and, and just because I have the
25:05
microphone or just PSA, you know, I think one thing that you
25:07
touched on is like to open a restaurant, you can not be good
25:10
at the basis of cooking. And one of the things that I've
25:13
been recently talking about at lineups with all the cooks,
25:15
right? It's like every restaurant has
25:17
this issue. People forget to fill out their
25:19
prep list correctly. People forget to pull the
25:21
shrimp. People forget to pull the thing
25:23
from the freezer that is going to make sure that the prep list
25:25
is is great the next day soaking the beans to make bean puree.
25:29
It's like every restaurant has these problems, right?
25:31
And I always tell these cookers, like every single person in this
25:34
kitchen most likely wants to be a chef.
25:37
How can I trust you to order the produce for the restaurant if
25:41
you can't order the things that you need for your prep list to
25:43
be successful? So all the people that are
25:46
watching Chef's VSA, if you want to be a good chef, like focus on
25:49
the things when you're cooking that are going to be the
25:52
building blocks of being a great chef by knowing how to
25:56
prioritize your day, how to fill out a prep list correctly, how
25:59
to do the things that are going to make the next day easier.
26:01
Because when you're a chef, those are all the building
26:04
blocks. If you, if you don't know how to
26:07
order the right amount of Vermont A or whatever it is that
26:10
you're asking for the next day, how are you as a chef going to
26:13
know how many pounds of onions to order?
26:16
For the restaurant to be successful, you can't have your
26:18
station because it gets full. That's it.
26:20
You can use AI I'm. Just kidding.
26:22
I'm just kidding. Your favorite?
26:24
Use AI to write your prep list. Yeah, I mean, I do use AI.
26:27
What do you use AI at all in the restaurant right?
26:30
Now, no, I think I'm too, like, dumb to figure that out.
26:33
Really. Yeah.
26:34
You're not. I don't.
26:35
Technology is not my Forte. Yeah, but it's like your.
26:38
Social media for people that are listening your social media is
26:40
one of the my favorite ones to watch.
26:42
It has nothing to do with AII. Mean it's you know how to use
26:44
your phone. You, you.
26:45
If you can have a conversation with me, you can have a
26:47
conversation with a robot. I, this is my, this is my thing
26:51
with AII think. I think it's something that we
26:54
got to be able to know where to drive on and how to take
26:58
advantage. You know you've worked with
27:01
rational Ovens, right? I always give this analogy with
27:06
with our cooks, right? Let's make sure that we take
27:10
advantage of all these things like the rational ovens can
27:12
clean themselves. You put a tablet, you push a
27:15
button and it cleans itself. That is time that we're gaining
27:18
as humans that we're not spending scrubbing the oven that
27:22
we can make sure to be better at utilizing that time creating or
27:26
like cutting the onions a little bit nicer, like all those
27:29
things. Let's take advantage of that.
27:31
And I think AI is a tool that we can have to be able to help us
27:36
balance that on the time of like, maybe if AI can help us
27:40
figure out how to like do the schedule, we gain that hour into
27:45
being more creative on making new dishes, right?
27:48
If AI can help us making sure that we structure the prep list
27:52
a little bit better, that is like, you fill out this thing
27:54
and it just generates what you need for the next day.
27:56
We gain 30 minutes, 20 minutes, an hour for whatever else we can
28:03
do that AI can. Yeah, I'll, I'll tell you as
28:06
someone who uses AIA lot because Chef's PSA almost a one person
28:10
operation and I do a lot. And I got to the point about a
28:15
year ago where in order for me to grow the podcast, write more
28:20
books, create more content, do more consulting, public
28:23
speaking, like everything that I do with this business, I was
28:26
like, I need to probably hire like 4 people.
28:29
And I was like, I was at a crossroads.
28:30
It was like, I don't, I don't know what how I'm going to scale
28:32
this business by myself. And it wasn't generated enough
28:36
money for me to hire four people to help me.
28:38
Then AI comes along and what used to take me 10 hours a day
28:43
probably takes me like 3. With AI, the amount of writing
28:46
that I have to do, editing, formatting, it's exponentially
28:49
more efficient. And so now that extra 7 hours,
28:53
sometimes I use it just to fuck off.
28:55
But now I use it to to work on more things.
28:57
So I'm exponentially more productive now with AI than I
29:01
was without it. It didn't replace my creativity
29:04
because I think that's some of the arguments that I get from
29:06
chefs like, oh, it's going to replace your creativity.
29:08
It's not, It opens. Up more.
29:09
Creativity. I'm actually.
29:11
On the opposite. I'm actually more creative with
29:13
AI because I'll, if I'm consulting for a restaurant
29:17
which not build AI chat bots for them, like recipe development,
29:22
I'll say, yeah, I want my recipes to look like this in
29:25
grams listed with the first ingredient and the first method.
29:29
I want a short sentence and maybe I need a recipe for a
29:32
mole, right? It's like, give me a mole, make
29:35
sure it has this type of chilas in it, Make sure it has these
29:39
spices in it, and make sure it yields this.
29:41
Like the recipe's not perfect when I get it, but I could hand
29:45
it off to a cook in the kitchen and say, use this as a base,
29:48
adjust with your notes and what your intuition tells you when
29:51
you're using the force, chef force, right?
29:54
And then bring it back to me. And it's like that in itself.
29:57
And I could scale that out with 20 recipes and hand it to 20
30:00
different cooks. The amount of time that it would
30:02
have taken me to write 20 recipes is like, I mean, I type
30:05
with two fingers. So yeah, AI has made me
30:08
exponentially more efficient. And one of the things I was
30:11
talking to someone, it's like, you could also create food
30:14
images, right? And how good AI is now, like you
30:17
can't tell the difference between is it a real photograph
30:20
or was that created with AI? And so if like, if you're like,
30:24
hey, I have this menu idea. It's like, OK, so you plug it
30:27
into an image generating software and you're like, make
30:30
me a sea bass with peas and, you know, pea tendrils or whatever
30:36
and a green sauce and a green oil.
30:38
And then it pops it out. And you said played it like a
30:39
Michelin 3 star chef or you could say played it like a
30:43
Michelin 3 star chef in Tokyo, right?
30:45
So it'll spit out a different. View you should do a little like
30:49
this or that on Instagram and see and see if people know which
30:52
ones AI. Which was 50. 50, yeah. 5050 and
30:55
and what's funny is people know I use AI and it's like come on I
30:59
I shouldn't be fooling you guys this easy like you guys know
31:02
it's it's gonna most likely be AI but a lot of people still
31:05
fall for it and so you can take these images now it's like OK it
31:09
gives you an idea like it's a good starting point I was
31:12
telling I don't know if I should share this on the podcast do.
31:17
It. 'Cause I'm gonna talk shit.
31:20
So I'm not a big fan of apron companies.
31:22
OK. Right, I'm not.
31:23
I'm not a huge fan of expensive aprons.
31:26
I'm a give me the blue Brigard apron.
31:28
They're not spending. $5. Yeah, like give me the blue
31:32
apron and I'm set, right? I'm not gonna pay 100 whatever
31:37
dollars to look cool with an apron.
31:39
I always say. Like no one ever comes into the
31:41
restaurant and says hey their food would be better if they
31:43
only had cooler aprons. Like a goes back to the scissor
31:46
comment, right? Back to the scissor comment.
31:48
And so I created some AI images of chefs and these chefs were
31:54
wearing cool aprons. I was like, these fucking aprons
31:56
are pretty cool, right? So I sent it to our mutual
31:58
friends over at Maiden. I was like, if you ever want to
32:01
get at the apron game like. This is the one.
32:03
This is the one but. And I said we'll make a fish
32:05
basket instead. Yeah, yeah, so, so which leads
32:08
to an interesting thing, right, 'cause there's a fish basket
32:11
story. There's a fish basket in the
32:13
world. I want to ask you about one of
32:16
the things that I think is very important for chefs is aligning
32:18
themselves and position themselves as a chef for
32:21
marketing, for branding and who they are as a chef, right?
32:24
So I think this is very important who you are on social
32:26
media, you're telling a story always, right?
32:30
Your personal brand is out there.
32:31
You've done a really good job at this.
32:34
I want some advice for the people that are listening.
32:37
How do you position yourself with marketing, branding and
32:39
allow all that? But before you get into that,
32:40
tell us the fish basket story for people that.
32:42
The fish basket story started with their friends are made and
32:47
they, you know, I think they're just like, it's always very
32:50
polite when people are like, Oh yeah, I want to help you out.
32:52
Like, you know, what are you? What do you think?
32:54
It's out there that is, that is not great.
32:57
And without thinking, I always, I I've never seen a good fish
33:00
basket out there that was like of quality.
33:02
So I told them fish basket and then I just started like Long
33:05
story short, I just started poking at them for like over a
33:08
year to like make a fish baskets because in my mind I was like,
33:10
you already make pens. You know, where to get the steel
33:13
from. Just make a thing that closes
33:15
and it doesn't break and like put over charcoal and it and it
33:19
and it's and it's done right. So I just started poking at them
33:21
like when is a fish basket, you know, and like they would be
33:23
very generous and bring saute pants to the to the restaurant,
33:27
bring pots for the cooks. And I'd be like, yeah, this is
33:30
cool, but it's not a fish basket, right?
33:31
So it just kind of like went on and on and it became this bit
33:35
that it actually turned into something.
33:37
And through being part of that process, I realized that making
33:41
a quality fish basket is way harder than it seems like.
33:44
But now that's a fish basket that we use at the restaurant
33:47
and we use a lot of it because we have dishes that I said that
33:51
are required to like be in a basket and be cooked directly in
33:54
colds. And we love it.
33:56
And now you can also buy one too online if you want to do you.
34:00
Have royalties. I do not.
34:01
I'm not. Gonna don't sell it by the
34:03
Heston Fish Basket. I'm, I'm just kidding, I don't
34:06
know if Heston makes a fish basket.
34:08
But anyway, so the second part to that question is how do you,
34:15
how do you position yourself as a chef today?
34:17
Like what would be advice to people that are listening of how
34:20
they should position themselves for marketing and branding and
34:24
creating an identity online? Because I mean, everything's
34:26
online right now and then. So how would they do it?
34:29
But also how do you do it? Man, I think that's, that's
34:32
something that it's very new, right?
34:35
When, when you and I started cooking, like social media was
34:37
not a thing, you know, it was you, if you wanted to learn
34:41
about chefs, like you'd go on the Internet and then maybe
34:43
order a book and then have to wait actually two weeks for it
34:46
to get there or go to library. So like now it's very different
34:50
and to like you can see what every chef is up to and pretty
34:53
much as social media is your, your, your, your new resume,
34:57
right? If, if you're a chef and you
34:58
wanna do things of quality and, and, and all those things.
35:02
And I think the biggest thing I've learned along the way with
35:06
all the recognition from the restaurants that I've gotten is
35:09
it's, it's 2 main things, right? It's those things of
35:13
partnerships and marketing only come from, well, in my, in my
35:17
case, come from the success of the restaurant.
35:20
So it's something that I never want to forget, right?
35:21
I never want to just be like an Instagram chef and people come
35:25
to the restaurant, they're like, oh, that's not good, right?
35:26
Because the opportunities that come my way have all come
35:29
because of the restaurant that my name is attached to.
35:32
And I'm very proud of that. And another big thing that I
35:35
think it's, it's more for everybody out there, not every
35:39
opportunity. It's a good opportunity.
35:41
And that's hard to digest sometimes because you might see
35:46
an e-mail that might pop in your inbox or on Instagram that is
35:51
like, we're going to give you this many $1000 to do a video
35:55
promoting, I don't know, sour cream, right?
36:00
It's a nice paycheck. You've worked, you know,
36:04
multiple hours making 912 fifteen, $20.00 an hour.
36:09
And now this company is giving you, let's say $10,000 just to
36:14
like do a post about how amazing their sour cream is.
36:18
That sounds very tempting, right?
36:20
But do you want your name to be associated with sour cream If
36:24
you don't even like sour cream, if you don't use sour cream at
36:27
your restaurant, right? It's like the price that you're
36:29
paying for that is way more expensive than the $10,000 that
36:32
you're getting immediately. So I think it's better to
36:37
understand what you believe in and commit to those things and
36:41
the right opportunity will come. Money is such a like evil thing
36:47
that when people start reaching out to you just to throw it at
36:49
you, you have to be very strong minded on what you believe in
36:54
because that's your brand. It's it's something that like
36:58
that's what people are following you for, right, Right.
37:01
If you start just selling yourself short for the bigger
37:04
paycheck immediately, then you're not going to get maybe
37:07
the bigger opportunity later on, right?
37:10
We're maiden slits under DMS and it's like, Hey, we're going to
37:12
give you roll teeth for every huge basket we got.
37:14
To be an influencer, right? Made in money.
37:17
So it's like they don't. Sponsor the podcast Maiden.
37:19
I'm going to look directly into the camera for for Jake and
37:22
Chip. That's that's I think there's a.
37:25
There's a local Austin podcast up the street from the Maiden
37:27
office that Maiden doesn't sponsor.
37:30
You're here to hear it for his hot take.
37:33
That's, that's the hard part, right?
37:34
It's like you don't know what you're missing out of by signing
37:37
a deal with somebody that you might not be super pumped to to
37:41
be a part of just to get an initial paycheck.
37:43
The Biggest Chef's podcast is in Austin, up the street from
37:47
Maiden with your old friend, your old friend Andre, who
37:51
you've known. Former customer.
37:52
Former customer set you up anyway.
37:56
No, I'm just kidding. I love those guys.
37:57
I'm just give them shit. I'm trying to get a fish basket
37:59
deal. Maybe a a free fish basket?
38:01
We'll get you a fish basket. We'll get you a fish basket.
38:03
We did a Like an Oyster demo for them once they you can find it
38:06
on. YouTube.
38:06
Yeah, I saw that. Yeah.
38:07
Yeah. Very, very, very good hands.
38:10
Very good hands, right? So now they're putting out
38:12
oyster videos like where's my video?
38:16
Where's my video? Where?
38:17
Where are the royalties for the where?
38:18
Are the royalties for my video made it?
38:19
Come on, what's going on? All joking aside, I agree with
38:23
what you're saying. For people that are listening.
38:26
I would only be sponsored by people that I actually like
38:31
their product and use. If you want to hang out with
38:32
them on a Sunday afternoon, that's the people you want to be
38:35
doing deals with. Yeah, I, I, I don't want a
38:37
sponsor that's, you know, no offense to Daisy Sour Cream.
38:42
I mean, I do eat it at home, but but I'm not gonna I'm not gonna
38:45
like sit up here and say like go buy this brand of sour cream or
38:48
whatever, right? But like, I smoke these cigars.
38:51
I will, I, I will. Glad.
38:52
Something that feels natural, right?
38:54
And and then thing even then, like looking at the contract and
38:57
having a professional lawyer look for it, 'cause you know,
39:02
when do you see just like, oh, this is how much money they want
39:04
to pay me. And you don't see the fine
39:06
print. And that fine print, they might
39:08
own your name, which is called likeness for perpetuity, which
39:12
means forever. And they can have it for
39:15
whatever use they have because you signed a piece of paper that
39:17
said that they could. So understanding that, right,
39:19
Like understanding all those terms and the best way to do
39:22
that, if you're a chef, you probably didn't go to law
39:24
school. If you did, then you're saving
39:26
some money, but have a professional lawyer look for it.
39:30
Because another thing that I've learned too, just kind of like
39:33
with not every opportunity is a good opportunity.
39:36
Every time somebody reaches out to you with those things in
39:39
mind, they have you, you have negotiating power.
39:43
Yeah, right. It's like, oh, maybe maybe it's
39:45
not in the money wise one, maybe it's in the contract.
39:47
Maybe you don't have my image and likeness for six months.
39:50
Maybe they'll just keep it at three months, you know.
39:52
So there's always room for negotiation when you are looking
39:56
at those branches like, well, there's always room for
39:57
negotiation when you're looking for a new job.
40:00
So I put out a podcast the other day and I talked about Michelin
40:04
and inspections. And then I've brought it up a
40:06
couple of Times Now since on some different podcasts that I
40:09
was in a restaurant and I'm like 90% sure I sat next to a
40:11
Michelin inspector. But people don't know is that
40:14
was your restaurant And it was me texting you saying, Hey, I
40:18
think I sat next to a Michelin inspector.
40:19
You're like, ha ha. You would say that, but with
40:22
Michelin coming, I guess my first question is, was that a
40:25
Michelin inspector? Do you know?
40:26
I have no idea. Second question is what do you
40:28
think of Michelin? So I mean, a little bit of
40:31
background, I, I listen to your podcasts and I text you every
40:34
now and you know, like, so it's, it's, it's on my rotation of
40:37
things I listen to. And I was listening to that and
40:40
I was like, Oh, that's funny. Like I, I know the back story
40:42
that it right. And then, and then you went into
40:44
like, how would you go about opening a restaurant Michelin
40:47
star, right? And I have my, my opinions on
40:49
that. But I think 1st and to talk
40:51
about the Michelin Guide, I think generally it's a good
40:54
thing that is coming to Texas, right?
40:57
I'm nervous about some things that might happen from it coming
41:01
to Texas, about some negative things that might happen.
41:04
You know, where it disrupts the, the community, you know, where
41:07
people might be mad about some people getting something or
41:11
cities being like talking shit amongst each other, which I
41:15
don't think is there's anything positive from that.
41:17
I think there's positive things that come from it where
41:19
attracting new talent, attracting new customers, those
41:23
are always positive things. And I think, you know, it's
41:26
like, I never thought that Texas would be in the Michelin Guide.
41:30
And that's that's kind of cool. Do.
41:31
You think a Michelin star in Texas dangles a carrot for a lot
41:36
of chefs to change the way that we operate restaurants?
41:40
And the reason I ask that is because I've been to Michelin
41:43
star restaurants, I've eaten a Michelin star restaurant, have a
41:45
lot of friends that are Michelin * chefs.
41:48
And when you go to these restaurants, there's a there's,
41:52
there's a difference. There's a difference in the way
41:54
the restaurant feels in the terms of the elements of luxury
41:57
of the China, the glassware, the stemware, the flow of service
42:01
tasting menu only. Like I did AI did a report when
42:04
I was still a chef of restaurants that had stars that
42:08
offered tasting menu only. And it was like, I don't
42:11
remember what it was off top of my head, but I think it was like
42:13
90% of all of them have a tasting menu something like
42:16
that. It was a ridiculous number.
42:18
Like when, when you start getting into that category, do
42:21
you think it's going to incentivize chefs for the for
42:25
the, for the thrill of the star to change who they are?
42:30
That's my biggest fear, that people start cooking for the
42:33
guide and not with a true, honest point of view.
42:38
And that was a little bit of my hot take on how you would go
42:40
about going for a Michelin star in Texas, right?
42:44
That is my biggest fear, that people change everything about
42:47
what they might believe in that they might already be doing just
42:51
to cook for a few people that might come throughout the year
42:54
to maybe give you something maybe not, right.
42:56
And I think also based on the information or not the
43:00
information, just what's out there from the guide now, it's
43:02
changed a lot. And I think they are looking for
43:07
a stronger point of view that is unique rather than the fine
43:14
dining and the fork and the water and the coffee service,
43:19
right? And the tasting menu.
43:20
I think just like just seen the the the latest guides, the
43:24
California one just released where a Marisco's restaurant got
43:28
a star, right? I.
43:30
Don't know that restaurant. But it's in a, it's in a food
43:33
stall. Mexico City.
43:35
They got a star. Yeah, they got a star.
43:36
OK. And they're not a tasting menu
43:38
restaurant, but they have a very strong point of view, whole
43:41
books. They have a very strong point of
43:44
view on what they're serving. And it's not just necessarily
43:47
tasting menu. And so the Taco shop in.
43:48
Mexico, the Taco shop in Mexico probably doesn't, doesn't even
43:50
have a restroom. They have like 3 things on the
43:53
menu, right? So I think for me like that is
43:57
more of what they are looking for just based on the things
44:00
that I'm seeing on who's getting the stars.
44:02
Then maybe the old school way of going about it.
44:05
And like I've heard stories of restaurant remodeling just so
44:10
they could have a nicer restroom, so they could get
44:11
their thirst star. To me, that changes the reason
44:14
of why we get into cooking for, for in the 1st place.
44:17
And also we're in Texas, you know, I, it's, it's, it's not
44:21
New York, it's not, it's not Madrid, it's not Barcelona, it's
44:24
not Tokyo. We, we got to cook for the
44:26
people that are going to come in on Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday.
44:30
And those are probably not going to be Michelin inspectors year
44:34
round. Can I, can I push back on
44:35
something that you said? Yeah.
44:36
So you mentioned the, the bathroom, right?
44:40
And I know that's not why we got into cooking, but when we're
44:43
talking about creating a restaurant, sometimes when you
44:47
go to a restaurant that you want to say is exceptional in all
44:51
regards. And when you when you think
44:53
about excellence in the terms of all regards, nothing is off off
44:56
the table. That means is it 2 ply or is it
45:00
single ply, right? So I mean, sometimes, like I
45:03
could see why some of these chefs are thinking about like,
45:05
OK, should we remodel the restroom?
45:07
Because sometimes it's a razor's edge of, of the experience.
45:13
But sometimes when you're enhancing that something that's
45:16
on the razor's edge, sometimes it's for nothing more than your
45:19
own mindset. It, it, it creates the culture
45:21
and the restaurant of nothing's off limits.
45:23
Think about, think about the soap, think about the incense or
45:26
the incense, the scent sticks, you know, is it the right smell
45:29
when they walk in? And so I think to a certain
45:33
regard in, in my mind, I think there's a place for both.
45:40
There's there's a, there's a place for exceptional food that
45:44
I think I want to go there and I want to eat there every single
45:46
day because the food is delicious.
45:48
But there's also a place where maybe the food isn't so great,
45:51
but it's good food. But everything else like the,
45:54
you know, I want to feel, I want the pomp and circumstance.
45:57
I want to roll up as a baller. And is that a three star
46:00
restaurant or a one star? I don't know.
46:03
And that to me, to me, it's like I've been lucky enough to eat at
46:06
one stars, bibs at two stars and three stars.
46:11
And I agree with these like the Ditto.
46:12
It's at that point it's like it's service wise.
46:14
Yeah. Because you know where the cook
46:17
that is working the sautee station at a three million star
46:21
is putting their mies and plazas the other night in the same
46:23
cambaro that the big gourmand that the one star that the two
46:27
star puts it in. The only thing that's different
46:30
is the service, in my opinion, at at a certain point, like the
46:32
food can only be so good, right? And it's all about the rest of
46:35
the theater, right? And to me, I I'm more passionate
46:39
about the food and having a healthy, successful restaurant
46:45
that is busy constantly year round than something that is so
46:50
special that you only go once a year, once every other year.
46:56
That's just my personal thing. I.
46:58
Mean it's it's, it's a good point of view.
47:00
I, I think it's when people are in it just for the stars.
47:05
So I, I talked about this on the podcast the the one that you're
47:08
referencing is like, you could do all this and then hope and
47:12
then hope and then nothing and then the restaurant closes and
47:14
you're out of business right. So man, it's a slippery slope
47:19
to. Say, that's what I'm worried
47:20
about. Yeah, like if you're if you're
47:22
cooking just for the star and anyone that has Michelin stars
47:26
that I know that's a friend of mine will tell you the exact
47:30
same thing. It's like focus on making a
47:32
great restaurant. Don't focus on the stars, focus
47:35
on making a great restaurant. That's what they all say.
47:37
And it's true because if you just are solely curating an
47:40
environment thinking that it's going to get a star, I mean,
47:44
like you, like you were saying earlier, Michelin might be
47:46
pivoting and no one knows. All these lists, right?
47:48
You know what's the most important list in a restaurant?
47:50
Full restaurant? The reservation list.
47:52
Yeah, there you go. That's the most important one.
47:54
Yeah, that's a good point. But do you want a Michelin star?
47:59
I mean, it would be nice, right? But it's not going to.
48:02
Make me Is it on your fed mean bucket list?
48:04
No, no, not in my bucket list. It would be a nice addition and
48:07
I'll like to me, like awards and recognition are a byproduct of
48:12
the things that we do, not the reason why we do the things we
48:15
do. As well said, when I first
48:18
started Chef's PSAI, would I have a personal Instagram
48:21
account, right, which is now private.
48:23
It doesn't really exist because because if people knew me in
48:26
real life, like I like jokes and I'm funny.
48:29
So if they'd follow that, they'd be like, this is not, this is
48:32
not the culinary content we want, right?
48:37
But I first started doing chef's Psas and I would put them up on
48:40
my Instagram stories. And it was just like for my
48:42
friends and for jokes. I didn't intend anything with it
48:47
other than to make a couple of people laugh and maybe call out
48:49
some bad behavior. But you were the first one.
48:52
You messaged me and you're like, hey, turn these into a book and
48:54
I'll buy it. And I thought, well, how hard
48:57
could it be to write? And you did.
48:58
I did. I was like, so I'll start.
48:59
I started the chef's PSA page. I wrote the book for people that
49:02
don't know. The first book I ever wrote is
49:04
how not to be the biggest idiot in the kitchen.
49:06
And it's like the original 51st chefs PSA's that I ever wrote.
49:12
And the book's dedicated to you for people that don't know, like
49:16
you're welcome. I don't remember what I wrote,
49:17
but it was something like, you know, that means DM and he was
49:22
the inspiration behind this book.
49:24
Because if you hadn't messaged me, I'd still just be posting
49:27
shitty memes on my own, right. But no, it's, it's a true story.
49:31
But so I want to. For people that don't know, this
49:33
is the man that nudged me to go start Chef's PSA and write the
49:38
1st. You did it all, and then you did
49:40
it. But but like I said, I never
49:41
wrote well. No, I think like I was really
49:44
drawn to that in a way that it's like it was geared towards cook
49:50
and chef's. It wasn't geared to like the the
49:53
general population. It was very unique to what our
49:56
industry needed at the time. And I think it's awesome what
50:00
you've done. I was just listening on the way
50:02
here, the one that you just did with all the culinary students.
50:05
I can't think of another podcast right at the top of my head
50:07
that's in the food industry that like has given the microphone to
50:10
those people. And, and, and you're like, maybe
50:15
correct me if I'm wrong, but like you're taking more into a
50:17
mentorship role for all these people that might not
50:20
necessarily have the opportunity to like have that person in, in,
50:25
in their kitchen, or maybe they're thinking about going to,
50:27
going to school, right? I think that's the, or maybe
50:30
going into cooking, like not even just culinary school.
50:32
And I think that's important to have in our industry because
50:35
there's not a lot of those things happening right now.
50:37
Well, I'll tell you what, when I first started Chef's PSA, it was
50:41
like I said, it was for it was for you.
50:43
It was for my friends. And for shit talking.
50:46
And it was for talking shit. It wasn't intended for anything.
50:50
It wasn't, it was intended more for laughs with some education.
50:56
But the people that I was targeting were all my friends
50:58
that all kind of understood like we all think like this.
51:01
We all kind of talk like this. And when I started Chef's PSA
51:05
and it started getting bigger, I realized that the people that I
51:08
was in my audience weren't the people that are necessarily in
51:11
in these kitchens of my friends. I had opened it up to a whole
51:15
new world that maybe didn't fully understand the sarcasm and
51:20
some of the posts that I was making.
51:21
So I had to I had to repackage it a little bit to say, Oh,
51:25
we're not here. Like I'm speaking with A1 size
51:29
fits all all the time, but it's there's some Gray in there.
51:31
And I like when I say, I don't know if I say don't wear a chili
51:34
pepper pants and they're like, how dare you say that?
51:37
It's like, well, I really don't care.
51:38
Like if you want to wear a chili pepper pants, I truly don't
51:40
care. I'm just saying like if you were
51:42
in these restaurants with these chefs, most like you don't wanna
51:45
wear chili pepper pants. So I've adjusted this because
51:48
what I realized is you and me, we're gonna sit down, We're
51:50
gonna have this conversation on the air.
51:52
We're gonna have another conversation off the air.
51:54
And there's gonna be a lot of other chefs, a who's who of
51:56
chefs that we're gonna have conversations with that no one's
51:59
ever gonna hear. No one's ever gonna be in the
52:00
room and no one's gonna ever understand the way that these
52:04
chefs think because they're they don't have access to them.
52:06
They don't have access to the mentorship.
52:07
It's easy for you to pick up the phone with a Michelin star chef
52:11
and shoot the ship, but to the cook that's coming up, I
52:15
recognize that they don't all have that access.
52:17
So this podcast, the whole chef's PSA, the books and
52:21
everything else was intended to invite them in to to make it
52:25
more inclusive for everyone that's in the culinary industry.
52:29
Like hey, come join the gang, even if it's at a distance.
52:33
Come join the gang, see what we're talking about.
52:34
Talk some shit, have some fun, take it easy.
52:37
Not everything I say is intended to be 100%.
52:40
It's the only way. Well, you give good advice and
52:42
you are very good at giving the advice that is not necessarily
52:46
out there. And you're very good with the
52:47
words and how you're choosing to communicate that to where like
52:50
you're not being a Dick, but you're not also like being too
52:54
soft on people to hear the things that I need to hear.
52:57
Right. And I think for me, it hit me
52:59
where the podcast was or is when you started coming to the
53:03
restaurant and cooks would be like, is that the chef's PSA
53:06
guy? And I'd be like, Oh yeah, I
53:11
guess like the, the audience is like way bigger than than it was
53:14
when when you just started. And that's amazing to see.
53:17
Congratulations. I'll tell you, it's Jake Chip
53:22
Maiden, the biggest podcast. In the universe, the universe.
53:26
Billions of people listening. No, but it, it is big.
53:29
And, and it's funny because when I go to restaurants now and I
53:31
talk to chefs, you know, friends of friends are just happen to go
53:35
to a restaurant because I'm travelling, sometimes I sit by
53:38
myself in the corner and kind of like, I don't want anyone to see
53:40
me and someone will come up to me.
53:42
Like, are you chef's PSA? He's like, I have a name.
53:45
It's Andre. But yeah, that's me.
53:47
But yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's definitely been interesting
53:50
because I was always like AC minus celebrity chef C minus
53:53
maybe, maybe, maybe. When when, When people don't
53:56
know your name, but they know the brand that you associate,
53:59
that you made it. Yeah, yeah.
54:00
So now, like, I don't even have a name anymore.
54:02
It's oh, you're chef's PSA. Someone messaged me yesterday,
54:05
but when this comes out, it won't be yesterday.
54:07
Someone messaged me yesterday on Instagram.
54:08
I do my Sunday Q&A and they're like, wow, I've been following
54:12
your page. I didn't know you were a real
54:14
person. I thought you were a bot.
54:17
I'm sure you love that. No, I'm a real person.
54:19
But anyway, it's an honor to people think I'm a robot.
54:22
They didn't know how to real. No, it's amazing what you build
54:24
and and very thankful to be a part of this today.
54:28
Well, like I said, you nudged, you nudged me.
54:29
So for, for people that are listening, I want to give like
54:33
chef, that means chef's PSA, chef's PSA, chef's PSA.
54:36
So like, if you had a chef's PSA out there, like what to stop
54:39
doing or what people need to start doing, what would you say?
54:43
I thought about this yes, Sir, in the phone call where you're
54:45
like, we got to fucking prepare for this podcast and and I think
54:49
one I have kind of two right. I think the first one is show
54:52
me, don't tell me telling me can only open the door so far on a
54:57
resume before I met you. I have this many years
55:00
experience. I've worked as a grill showing
55:02
me is going to keep the door open and it's going to pull out
55:05
the red carpet. You see all these people now
55:07
trying to tell you all these things that they want, all these
55:10
things that they've done, but they don't really show you,
55:13
right? So word speaks louder than mouse
55:16
that I mean, then words. People have said that for a lot
55:19
of years. Show me, don't tell me you know,
55:22
don't, don't, don't tell me you want to work the grill.
55:24
Show me you're hungry to move on stations and work the grill.
55:28
Don't tell me you want to be a chef.
55:30
Show me that you can fill out a prep list that you are actively
55:33
looking at what's ahead of you. Those things are are are way
55:38
better than telling me something.
55:40
If you could go back early in your career when you were a new
55:43
cook, what advice would you have wished someone told you when you
55:46
first stepped into the kitchen? I think I would have taken
55:54
better care of myself. Yeah.
55:56
Like, physically. Physically, Yeah.
55:59
I it's like this like balance, right?
56:02
Of like you're young. You can afford to be broke.
56:04
You can afford to like treat your body not so great you.
56:07
Feel like Wolverine. But then but yeah, but then like
56:09
all those, all those bad decisions end up taking account.
56:13
So it's like trying to find that balance and not losing yourself
56:19
in the process. If if someone wanted to work in
56:24
your kitchen, what would be the best way for them to get their
56:27
foot in the door? Honestly, the best people that
56:32
have have been or are a part of the restaurant right now, the
56:37
restaurants, it's people that reached out to me just like cold
56:42
emailing the generic Ola at Este Ola at Suerte Oliver Toti.
56:47
Like those are the people that have now been in leadership
56:50
roles when we were in hiring and they just started opening
56:53
conversation, right? People that reached out to me on
56:56
on, on social media, hey, I've always wanted to like be a part
57:00
of what you're doing. Are you hiring right?
57:03
That is the best way to get in the kitchen rather other than
57:07
like replying to an ad. If you had to think about like
57:11
the most iconic dish ever created, someone asked me this
57:14
yesterday, so I thought I'm going to ask you this.
57:16
Do you think about the most iconic dish ever created?
57:19
There's a lot of them, right? You could say the beef
57:21
Wellington, the Caesar salad, You know Thomas colors oysters
57:24
and pearls, right? Maybe it's the potato skills
57:27
from Paul Bacuse. What is the most iconic dish
57:30
ever created for you? Tortillas.
57:32
There you go. You knew it.
57:33
Yeah, I knew it like like we should end it right there, but
57:35
we're not going to end it right there.
57:36
So chef, where can people find you if they want to know more
57:39
about you and and follow along the journey?
57:42
My personal social media at Chief Nunez, the restaurants at
57:46
Suerte, ATX at Estate, ATX at Bordeaux.
57:49
You come on whenever you want. I'll I'll be here whenever you
57:52
want me or invite myself again. Well, I hope you enjoyed the
57:55
show. If you want more Chef's PSA,
57:57
make sure you go to Sub stack and subscribe to get early
57:59
access to all the podcasts as well as a whole bunch of other
58:02
things including books, discounts on the merch.
58:05
Go to chefspsa.com where you get everything, including the new
58:08
book I just put out, Bad Cooks Everywhere, as well as the other
58:12
books that I've written, Culinary Leadership
58:13
Fundamentals, Line Cook, Survival Manual, Bad Suit, Good
58:16
Chef Kitchen, Art of War Go check them out.
58:19
And the very first book I ever wrote, How Not to Be the Biggest
58:22
Idiot in the Kitchen, dedicated to Fermin, was just a guest.
58:25
If you're listed on Spotify, make sure you leave five stars.
58:28
And if you're watching on YouTube, hit the like and
58:30
subscribe button. We'll see you next week.
58:32
Hit the porno music. In the kitchen, mix it.
58:36
Drop the chef Dallas No fiction, stirring up the beats.
58:39
Heat enough the session. Listen.
58:42
Close classes in session.