Latest / Houselights: A Film Director Podcast / Point Break (1991) - Kathryn Bigelow | Houselights #253

Transcript

Point Break (1991) - Kathryn Bigelow | Houselights #253 · Houselights: A Film Director Podcast

0:03
Speaker 1: Welcome to the Net party.
0:20
Speaker 2: Tonight on house Lights, we're jumping out of planes, saving
0:25
Speaker 2: Lori Petty in her ninety and maybe just maybe learning
0:29
Speaker 2: to ride the endless wave of friendship. We're talking Catherine
0:34
Speaker 2: Bigelow's point Break, the nineteen ninety one high speed concoction
0:38
Speaker 2: of surfing, parachuting and reaganing. I am your host, Tristan
0:42
Speaker 2: Rudel and joining me as always as a man who
0:45
Speaker 2: has never ordered just one meet bal sub in his life.
0:49
Speaker 2: John Mills and the incredibly responsible FBI agent who empties
0:54
Speaker 2: an entire clip in the air near a populated area,
0:58
Speaker 2: Darren Moser. It's cops versus surfers, freedom versus order, Keanu
1:04
Speaker 2: versus a flying pitbull. This episode will hit you like
1:07
Speaker 2: a wave against a stunt surfer.
1:10
Speaker 1: Bravo, Bravo, Bravo.
1:13
Speaker 3: Indeed, is two even enough for meatball subs? I say no,
1:19
Speaker 3: It all depends on the type of bread and how
1:20
Speaker 3: much cheese you put on it.
1:22
Speaker 2: Gary Busey was so much fun in this movie, and
1:25
Speaker 2: I know that's a common phrase for most Gary Busey films,
1:28
Speaker 2: but he was especially fun in this one.
1:31
Speaker 3: If there is anybody in the movie who I think
1:33
Speaker 3: completely understood the assignment and the fact that you had
1:38
Speaker 3: to walk a very fine line between earnestness and parody.
1:41
Speaker 1: It was Gary Busey.
1:43
Speaker 3: He totally got what they were doing in this movie
1:46
Speaker 3: and just had a blast.
1:47
Speaker 1: Absolutely.
1:49
Speaker 4: Now, I really enjoyed him in this role. I had
1:52
Speaker 4: just watched Under Siege, as one does when they want
1:55
Speaker 4: to watch fine movies, and so seeing him, you know,
2:00
Speaker 4: he's a villain, he's a bad guy, he's an ass
2:03
Speaker 4: in that movie, and in this one, I'm like, oh,
2:05
Speaker 4: I get to enjoy you. You get to be a
2:07
Speaker 4: nice guy that I want to see do well. Because
2:10
Speaker 4: I think of like Predator too. I think like he
2:12
Speaker 4: doesn't often get this kind of a role like now,
2:17
Speaker 4: maybe if I thought two seconds about it, I'd think
2:19
Speaker 4: of a dozen other options. But I really enjoy.
2:22
Speaker 2: That aspect of his character this time. Now, this was
2:25
Speaker 2: the first time that I watched this movie start to finish.
2:29
Speaker 2: Like I've seen several clips of this online, you know,
2:32
Speaker 2: I've watched big chunks of it while it was on TV,
2:35
Speaker 2: but never from start to finish in one go. And
2:38
Speaker 2: so I was really looking forward to this to finally
2:41
Speaker 2: sitting down because this is a whether you like it
2:44
Speaker 2: or not, this movie is a classic. Whether you think
2:47
Speaker 2: it's good or not is immaterial. This is a chasteric
2:51
Speaker 2: film where it is constantly referenced in pop culture. It
2:57
Speaker 2: is parodied constantly. There's jokes about it constantly. There's even
3:01
Speaker 2: a inspired a parodied play, a live play where people
3:07
Speaker 2: will they'll take an audience member and that audience member
3:11
Speaker 2: plays utah and they read from Q cards.
3:14
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh.
3:15
Speaker 3: The thing is, I would love to have a version
3:17
Speaker 3: of that where they're like, Okay, what you can play
3:19
Speaker 3: Gary Busey's character. I'd be like, if you my life
3:22
Speaker 3: is led to this moment, Please let me play Gary
3:24
Speaker 3: Busey's character.
3:26
Speaker 1: We heard the audience for.
3:27
Speaker 2: That one time Gary Busey showed up to a performance
3:31
Speaker 2: and played Ary Busey Like, I mean he played Papa's
3:35
Speaker 2: I love that y did the same thing another night.
3:39
Speaker 3: Oh Jesus, But see that's that is. I think that
3:43
Speaker 3: speaks to it. And of course you failed to mention
3:46
Speaker 3: that it inadvertently launched another very popular franchise, The Fast
3:51
Speaker 3: and the Furious, Because if you watch The Fast and
3:53
Speaker 3: the Furious after this, there are several sign posts where
3:57
Speaker 3: you're like huh, somebody really watched Point Break a whole
4:00
Speaker 3: lot before they made this movie. There are very similar
4:04
Speaker 3: story beats in that movie.
4:06
Speaker 2: I watched this with my wife and when we got
4:08
Speaker 2: to the bank robbing scene and they're all dressed as
4:11
Speaker 2: I mean, they have the ex president's masks on, I
4:14
Speaker 2: turned her and say, oh, by the way, this is
4:16
Speaker 2: where the bank robbering trope of wearing a presidential mask
4:20
Speaker 2: came from. She's like, really, because that's everywhere.
4:25
Speaker 1: I think that.
4:26
Speaker 3: Supposedly James Cameron did a lot of ghostwriting on the script,
4:30
Speaker 3: and according to at least one source, I mean, this
4:34
Speaker 3: could be just Cameron trying to be a credit hog,
4:37
Speaker 3: which you know would be fitting, but supposedly he's the
4:40
Speaker 3: one that really brought the ex president's concept together. And
4:44
Speaker 3: I'm like, I don't know how true it is, because
4:47
Speaker 3: you know, hearsay people taking credit over time and everything
4:50
Speaker 3: like that, but I'm like, it does seem like a
4:52
Speaker 3: very James Cameron type of thing to come up with
4:56
Speaker 3: something so cinematically pleasing that it just became a thing
5:01
Speaker 3: in cinema for all time after that.
5:03
Speaker 2: And apparently they die in the order of the President's
5:07
Speaker 2: leaving office. Like those guys, and which is interesting, Which
5:13
Speaker 2: is interesting because when body dies at the end, Reagan,
5:18
Speaker 2: Reagan was the last one.
5:19
Speaker 1: Hey, wait a minute, did body die at the end?
5:21
Speaker 2: Yes?
5:22
Speaker 1: Did he?
5:23
Speaker 3: Do you think he really did? Did I see a body?
5:27
Speaker 3: Or did body? Did he find a way and he
5:31
Speaker 3: did that whole thing so that he could get to
5:34
Speaker 3: his underwater submarine and escape with all of the money
5:38
Speaker 3: that could have happened.
5:39
Speaker 2: While we're talking about James Cameron, apparently on the Terminator
5:42
Speaker 2: two director's commentary, he said that body did die at
5:46
Speaker 2: the end, and him and Catherine Bigelow rewrote the original
5:49
Speaker 2: ending to be that way.
5:51
Speaker 1: I you know what, I didn't see a body.
5:53
Speaker 3: We are still open for point break two with body's
5:57
Speaker 3: son or something like that, like coming for revenge against Utah.
6:02
Speaker 3: But then the sudden reverse at the end as you
6:05
Speaker 3: find out that body's been alive the whole time and
6:07
Speaker 3: its father son bonding time to come back after as old.
6:10
Speaker 1: There you go. I just wrote the sequel. You're welcome, everybody.
6:13
Speaker 2: Apparently they were going to make a sequel and they
6:16
Speaker 2: wrote the script. It was gonna come out in ninety three.
6:18
Speaker 2: They wrote the script. They were in pre production and
6:20
Speaker 2: for some reason I got scrapped. Don't know why, Darren.
6:24
Speaker 2: Was this the first time you saw it? Or had
6:27
Speaker 2: you seen it before? What do you know about this film?
6:30
Speaker 1: Yeah?
6:30
Speaker 4: This was also my first time watching it all the
6:32
Speaker 4: way through. The only clips I'd seen, though, are those
6:36
Speaker 4: from the wonderful movie Hot Fuzz, which references this movie
6:41
Speaker 4: all the time. So I knew about the you know,
6:44
Speaker 4: shooting the gun up in the air. I had no
6:46
Speaker 4: context as to why you know that was going to happen.
6:50
Speaker 4: So this is one of those like you watch a
6:53
Speaker 4: pop culture movie and you get all those references that
6:56
Speaker 4: have been in movies and television. You're like, oh, okay,
7:00
Speaker 4: that point break is everywhere. But it was fun to
7:03
Speaker 4: see that come together. But no, this I didn't know
7:07
Speaker 4: a lot about it. You know, I knew it was
7:10
Speaker 4: a Keanu Reeves movie, but that was really all I
7:13
Speaker 4: knew of actors wise. Obviously the main actress pop up
7:16
Speaker 4: pretty quick in the very beginning. But yeah, and then
7:20
Speaker 4: again not even knowing much at all, so I'm like,
7:23
Speaker 4: oh surfing, Oh, we're jumping, Like everything was just a turn.
7:27
Speaker 4: I had no idea what to expect in this movie,
7:30
Speaker 4: and it just kept kept running. I mean, I did
7:32
Speaker 4: put together that he would be going towards the fifty
7:35
Speaker 4: year storm, and I saw that coming a mile away.
7:38
Speaker 4: But besides that, it was I just enjoyed the ride.
7:43
Speaker 4: It was really fun.
7:44
Speaker 3: Well, let me ask you a question, says, this is
7:46
Speaker 3: your first time seeing it. I've never seen it on
7:47
Speaker 3: the big screen. Tristan, I know you haven't seen it
7:49
Speaker 3: on the big screen. This is your first time all
7:51
Speaker 3: the way through, I'll put it out to you, you know,
7:53
Speaker 3: like Darren Trista, like this time. While I'm watching it,
7:57
Speaker 3: I sat there and my entire vibe with it was, boy,
8:01
Speaker 3: I wish I could see this on the big screen.
8:03
Speaker 3: This really seems to me a movie that was directed
8:06
Speaker 3: for that in theater experience, where it's like, if you
8:10
Speaker 3: watch it on a TV, I think you're a little
8:12
Speaker 3: more critical of it than if you're in the movie
8:14
Speaker 3: theater surrounded by all of this. I mean, let's be honest,
8:17
Speaker 3: terrific photography of these insane situations like that movies photograph
8:23
Speaker 3: pretty darn well, and it really seems like it's framed
8:26
Speaker 3: for the big screen for you know, the in theater experience.
8:29
Speaker 2: I could see that. I really could. I mean, it
8:32
Speaker 2: was it was a ninety one film, and so that's
8:33
Speaker 2: definitely what they had in mind. And you know, like
8:37
Speaker 2: home video was in its infancy and it was you know,
8:41
Speaker 2: it's it's interesting that you say that because there's so
8:45
Speaker 2: many it's what's the word I'm looking for. It's not
8:48
Speaker 2: it's not scenes, but there's so many not moments, but
8:52
Speaker 2: like there's so much spectacle. There's so much spectacle, Like
8:56
Speaker 2: you're going from moment to moment, moment you going from
9:00
Speaker 2: that the word is eluding me and it's really bothering me.
9:04
Speaker 2: And like you're going surfing and then you're going night surfing,
9:07
Speaker 2: which was totally in the night and not during the day,
9:10
Speaker 2: even though you could see the sun. And then you
9:12
Speaker 2: you know, like then you went skydiving, and then you
9:15
Speaker 2: went in a car chase, and then you did on
9:17
Speaker 2: a foot chase, and then you know, like it was
9:20
Speaker 2: just like and then there was shooting, and then there
9:22
Speaker 2: was that bank robbery and then there was a fight,
9:25
Speaker 2: and then there was a drug rate and you're just
9:27
Speaker 2: like going from moment to moment to moment, and it
9:31
Speaker 2: was I feel like if it was I'm gonna you know,
9:34
Speaker 2: like leak my my rating a little bit. But if
9:38
Speaker 2: I feel like if I was watching this on the
9:40
Speaker 2: big screen and I was enveloped by the screen, you know,
9:43
Speaker 2: like my if I was close to it, and you know,
9:45
Speaker 2: like it was within my peripheral and I got that
9:48
Speaker 2: sound and I got that sub and just to you know,
9:51
Speaker 2: like you during the skydiving, seen everybody's kind of going
9:53
Speaker 2: around you and everything like that, I probably wouldn't have
9:56
Speaker 2: gotten as bored as I did watching this movie. And
10:00
Speaker 2: I know this is going to sound ridiculous, but there
10:02
Speaker 2: was so much going on and there were so many
10:05
Speaker 2: constant events that I was getting tired and so I
10:09
Speaker 2: had to shut down a little bit. Does that make
10:11
Speaker 2: sense at all?
10:12
Speaker 3: I I could see that. I could see that where
10:15
Speaker 3: it's like the movie is so concerned with conveying the
10:20
Speaker 3: spectacle of the adrenaline junkie that you can't participate in it,
10:24
Speaker 3: and so you you're not emotionally invested in what's going on,
10:28
Speaker 3: because let's you know, let's be honest, these are not
10:31
Speaker 3: the most three dimensional characters that have ever been written
10:33
Speaker 3: for the screen, and I think that that probably plays
10:38
Speaker 3: a part to it as well. Right, these are all
10:40
Speaker 3: very much caricatures that are just if anything, I think
10:45
Speaker 3: that what you're talking about speaks to that idea that
10:49
Speaker 3: you can throw you know what it's like the you know,
10:52
Speaker 3: I'll draw a line to like Godzilla, which is about
10:56
Speaker 3: what seven years after this. You can throw as much
11:00
Speaker 3: aduction value and spectacle as you want at the screen,
11:02
Speaker 3: But if you don't care deeply about the characters, you
11:07
Speaker 3: are just done. You're just like, okay, whatever, Like you're
11:10
Speaker 3: not wowed by it anymore. You're just sort of technically
11:13
Speaker 3: admiring it and saying, oh, wow, that's really well shot
11:19
Speaker 3: and well put together, instead of like being in the
11:22
Speaker 3: moment and enjoying it.
11:25
Speaker 4: Yeah, I will say, I see what you're saying, Tristan.
11:28
Speaker 4: I didn't because I was watching for the first time
11:31
Speaker 4: that I wasn't as bored as far as just going
11:34
Speaker 4: along for the ride. And maybe because I I kind
11:38
Speaker 4: of took the posture of like you're sitting back in
11:40
Speaker 4: your chair and you're just like, here we go. You know,
11:43
Speaker 4: I'm not oh, this better do it for me or
11:47
Speaker 4: you know, be my next favorite movie. But I will say,
11:52
Speaker 4: while I like plot wise, the red Hairing of the
11:56
Speaker 4: Drug Bust and the other people it did sack time
12:01
Speaker 4: we could have been spending with our group of surfers
12:05
Speaker 4: and actually getting to know them more than the surface level.
12:09
Speaker 1: Uh.
12:09
Speaker 4: There was also one moment for me that was slightly
12:12
Speaker 4: confusing as far as it was the the It was
12:17
Speaker 4: the moment where he shoots his gun and doesn't kill
12:21
Speaker 4: the bank robber because he looks at him really closely
12:25
Speaker 4: and we see, you know, his blue eyes. For some reason,
12:29
Speaker 4: even though I knew I was wrong, I kept thinking, Oh,
12:33
Speaker 4: is that the girl that he's fallen in love with,
12:35
Speaker 4: which doesn't make any sense, like body type and all
12:38
Speaker 4: that stuff like, but we never see them, you know,
12:40
Speaker 4: without the masks. So for a moment, I thought, oh,
12:44
Speaker 4: is he thinking that's her? Obviously it's not, it's one
12:47
Speaker 4: of the four you know surf surfers, but it was
12:51
Speaker 4: enough to I don't know, there could have been maybe
12:54
Speaker 4: it was just the eyes to make that connection, but
12:58
Speaker 4: I don't know. There could have been other people that
13:00
Speaker 4: didn't quite nail that moment. I'm sure you guys got
13:04
Speaker 4: it right away when you first saw it.
13:06
Speaker 3: Well, I want to go back to the thing you
13:08
Speaker 3: talked about with the whole drug bust thing, right, you
13:11
Speaker 3: know that that raid going wrong? Is I think that
13:15
Speaker 3: that highlights where the film struggles a little bit. Is
13:18
Speaker 3: Bigelow is really really a gifted technical director, I think.
13:24
Speaker 3: But what was puzzling to me about that scene watching
13:26
Speaker 3: it this time is it's a small house, so I
13:30
Speaker 3: should be able to have a sense of place the
13:32
Speaker 3: entire time I'm there. I should know where each room is,
13:35
Speaker 3: it should know where I'm going through. And it's so
13:38
Speaker 3: chaotically put together and shot that I still to this
13:42
Speaker 3: day if you wanted me to diagram where everybody was,
13:44
Speaker 3: I'm like, wherever they needed to be when it happened?
13:47
Speaker 3: And how did the naked girl wind up in two
13:49
Speaker 3: places suddenly? And wait, the girl in their underwear is
13:52
Speaker 3: still over there? And like I was that whole thing.
13:55
Speaker 3: I was like, what is even where it is?
13:57
Speaker 2: Everybody terrifying? By the way, the woman with the knife
14:01
Speaker 2: was freaking terrifying. That was really well done, Like it
14:05
Speaker 2: could I like, I know what I obviously like with
14:08
Speaker 2: the woman and the thong at the door, and then
14:10
Speaker 2: like we see the woman in the shower, like okay, yes,
14:12
Speaker 2: we get it. They're putting, They're they're putting, you know,
14:15
Speaker 2: beautiful woman's bodies in there to kind of raise your eyebrows.
14:17
Speaker 2: But when she comes out and she's naked and she's
14:20
Speaker 2: she's got the knife, you're not thinking like, oh, what
14:23
Speaker 2: a sexy woman, You're like, oh my god.
14:25
Speaker 3: Well, I enjoyed the fact that they you know, that
14:28
Speaker 3: they had her just beat the living tar out of
14:30
Speaker 3: Utah because that was you know, like it immediately imbued
14:36
Speaker 3: that sense of danger. But I still don't know where
14:37
Speaker 3: that bathroom was in the house, Like, I don't know
14:40
Speaker 3: how anybody got any I was like, are there three
14:43
Speaker 3: doors in each room?
14:44
Speaker 2: Like?
14:44
Speaker 1: What is this an octagonal house? Like what's happening here?
14:47
Speaker 3: And I think that that speaks to it's so concerned
14:52
Speaker 3: with throwing the spectacle together that it's moments like that
14:55
Speaker 3: where you see it stumble and even you know, apply
14:59
Speaker 3: that out to where you know, Utah gets jumped at
15:03
Speaker 3: the shower with Anthony Keatis and everybody you know, uh
15:07
Speaker 3: what's his name?
15:07
Speaker 1: Uh that warhammer, what's his name? War child? War child?
15:12
Speaker 3: And everybody is there and it's still like, wait a minute,
15:16
Speaker 3: where where is that shower? Because he's you know, Papas
15:20
Speaker 3: is viewing him. He sees him go behind a bush,
15:22
Speaker 3: and then when he runs out to him, he's like
15:23
Speaker 3: on the other side of everything, like what where is everyone?
15:27
Speaker 2: But but more to to what Darren was saying about,
15:30
Speaker 2: you know, utilizing that time for the surfers, Darren, I
15:33
Speaker 2: completely agree with you, even though like I'm with you guys,
15:36
Speaker 2: like that scene was great. It was really entertaining, and
15:38
Speaker 2: when like Keanu was getting his face kind of pushed
15:41
Speaker 2: into the lawnmower, I was like, holy crap, like that
15:44
Speaker 2: really that really brought me in, Like it was a
15:46
Speaker 2: really well done scene, but it did sacrifice time because,
15:50
Speaker 2: as you know, we're mentioning the really really famous scene
15:54
Speaker 2: where he's gonna shoot body and then decides not to,
15:58
Speaker 2: Like that's probably the scene that this movie is most
16:00
Speaker 2: widely known for. Uh, when we got to these like yeah,
16:05
Speaker 2: like as like everybody knows that scene. I knew that scene.
16:07
Speaker 2: I've seen that scene, you know, fifty times in my
16:10
Speaker 2: life without seeing the movie. Now that I've seen the
16:12
Speaker 2: movie and like watching the build up, I don't know
16:15
Speaker 2: if it's biased because it's been built up in my
16:18
Speaker 2: mind for the past thirty years or whatever, but it
16:21
Speaker 2: felt completely unearned, completely unearned. Keanu had no reason not
16:28
Speaker 2: to take him down. Zero reason. There was no connection
16:31
Speaker 2: between Utah and Body. There was no emotional connection between
16:35
Speaker 2: the two of them. At no point previous to that
16:38
Speaker 2: scene was there ever a moment where they're like, you
16:42
Speaker 2: know what, maybe we're more than just a cop and
16:45
Speaker 2: a robber. Maybe we're friends on a deep level. No, Like, yes,
16:49
Speaker 2: body saved Keanu's butt from getting the crap kicked out
16:53
Speaker 2: of them, but that's it. That is literally it discussed.
16:57
Speaker 1: Well, it's like a cookie life did.
17:00
Speaker 2: Yeh wookie?
17:02
Speaker 4: Well I was gonna say, you know that, I think
17:05
Speaker 4: is what led to my confusion where I thought it
17:07
Speaker 4: was the girl because that was the only character I
17:10
Speaker 4: could think of that he would be like, Oh, I
17:13
Speaker 4: can't kill her. I'm in love with her because I
17:16
Speaker 4: did not feel that kinship at that moment get with
17:20
Speaker 4: Bodie for him to be like, oh, I'm gonna not
17:24
Speaker 4: try to shoot you in the lay or whatever.
17:26
Speaker 1: I'm going to let you go.
17:28
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that I agree that Keanu doesn't earn
17:32
Speaker 3: enough of a friendship with him by that point for
17:35
Speaker 3: me to say, oh, yeah, this is worth throwing away
17:37
Speaker 3: your entire rookie FBI career for this guy. Sure, sure,
17:40
Speaker 3: and let him get away with with all of this stuff.
17:43
Speaker 3: But I think that that's because of the there's a
17:47
Speaker 3: sort of sense of this being like an old exploitation movie,
17:51
Speaker 3: Like it's almost like another very famous Patrick Swayzee movie
17:54
Speaker 3: from the late eighties Roadhouse, where when you watch it,
17:58
Speaker 3: you're like, what even is going on here? And it's
18:03
Speaker 3: not the best written movie, but if you're willing to
18:07
Speaker 3: let yourself go and go with it, you're like, oh,
18:09
Speaker 3: I understand all of the beats that are happening right now,
18:12
Speaker 3: and so you're willing to let it go and play along.
18:16
Speaker 3: And I think the movie here relies on that, so
18:20
Speaker 3: that it's one of those things where, if anything, I
18:24
Speaker 3: would give Bigelow credit for the fact that she sort
18:28
Speaker 3: of is acknowledging that this is not high art, that
18:33
Speaker 3: she's telling a story that is going to be comfortable
18:39
Speaker 3: with the spectacle being the thing and not trying to
18:43
Speaker 3: make it any deeper. And it says, why does Johnny
18:46
Speaker 3: Utah feel this way at this point? Well, I know
18:48
Speaker 3: he's supposed to by this point in the story, and
18:51
Speaker 3: so we're just going to go along with that.
18:54
Speaker 1: That sort of thing.
18:55
Speaker 4: Yeah, it also not necessarily meaning the in a mean way,
19:00
Speaker 4: but the movie kind of had a this is what
19:04
Speaker 4: the young kids want to see checklist vibe. Yeah, like,
19:08
Speaker 4: we're going to put so much spectacle, as Tristan says,
19:12
Speaker 4: into this movie, But the plot, the drive for the
19:19
Speaker 4: movie didn't feel like I want to tell the story
19:22
Speaker 4: of this rookie and these surfers and all this stuff.
19:25
Speaker 4: It was more like, yeah, that's a nice framing device
19:29
Speaker 4: for all these spectacle events.
19:31
Speaker 1: Sure, but yeah.
19:33
Speaker 3: But the thing is, you know, and I think this
19:36
Speaker 3: can sort of be where some of us more movie
19:40
Speaker 3: snobbish or movie consumer types and everything, right, Like, this
19:45
Speaker 3: is something that an average movie goer. And I'm not
19:49
Speaker 3: saying this in a pejorative sense or a dismissive sense
19:51
Speaker 3: at all, but somebody who's plunking down a couple of
19:54
Speaker 3: bucks to forget their troubles for a Saturday night and
19:58
Speaker 3: they want to see something. I think this is a
20:00
Speaker 3: director who's fully delivering what we would call a popcorn movie,
20:05
Speaker 3: a term that in and of itself now gets abused
20:09
Speaker 3: to now reference movies that they're spending seven hundred and
20:12
Speaker 3: fifty dollars seven hundred and fifty million dollars making and
20:15
Speaker 3: oh my gosh, and look at all this. Oh well,
20:17
Speaker 3: it's a popcorn move. No, no, no, this is a
20:19
Speaker 3: popcorn movie. It's like, hey, I have a limited judge
20:21
Speaker 3: I on one. Yeah, it came out like this was
20:24
Speaker 3: a yeah, but it also came out I want to
20:28
Speaker 3: say it was like a week or two after Terminator two,
20:31
Speaker 3: and which is funny because Bigelow is married to Cameron
20:34
Speaker 3: at the time. And so, yeah, July third, ninety one
20:38
Speaker 3: is when Terminator two came out.
20:40
Speaker 1: Because it was July. I'm pretty sure it was July.
20:42
Speaker 3: Fourth weekend is when it came out, So it's either
20:45
Speaker 3: late June orarly July something like that. So yeah, no, no,
20:48
Speaker 3: July ninety one is when Terminator two came out, So
20:50
Speaker 3: this would have come out like it, yeah, one or
20:53
Speaker 3: two weeks after that.
20:54
Speaker 1: And so this, though, is the type of movie in.
20:58
Speaker 3: A non Terminator Too summer that would have done I
21:02
Speaker 3: think even better Bank because it would have been, hey,
21:06
Speaker 3: here's your spectacle summer movie, Like this is a summer movie.
21:09
Speaker 3: And this is a director who's comfortable saying this is
21:12
Speaker 3: a summer movie. Guys, let's just have a lot of fun.
21:16
Speaker 3: And I think that's probably why I wind up being
21:19
Speaker 3: you know, Tristan tipped his hand earlier. This is probably
21:21
Speaker 3: why I wind up being a little more generous with
21:23
Speaker 3: it this time than I have been in the past.
21:26
Speaker 3: Is I sort of see it and I go, oh,
21:28
Speaker 3: I okay, I get it. You don't want me to
21:31
Speaker 3: expect the Godfather right now. You want me to expect this.
21:35
Speaker 3: And I'm like, okay, Yeah, if I was expecting this.
21:38
Speaker 1: I'm on board. I you know, like I'm there for
21:40
Speaker 1: the ride. I get it. I get it.
21:43
Speaker 4: Oh. And this movie, I mean, it wasn't Terminator too money,
21:47
Speaker 4: but it made eighty three million on a twenty four
21:49
Speaker 4: million budget. That's not that's more than double your your investment,
21:53
Speaker 4: So that's not terrible.
21:56
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it did very respectably, you know, stateside
22:00
Speaker 3: and worldwide, and you know, everybody refers to it as.
22:03
Speaker 1: A cult movie.
22:04
Speaker 3: But I always get confused because this movie made enough
22:07
Speaker 3: money to be not a flop. And for me, a
22:10
Speaker 3: cult movie is always something that I always took as
22:13
Speaker 3: something that was a flop that found life on home
22:17
Speaker 3: video or something like that.
22:18
Speaker 4: So for instance, like flop first budget wise, but not
22:21
Speaker 4: it right commercial or not social right.
22:25
Speaker 3: A flop, but This sort of like disabuses me of
22:28
Speaker 3: that where I'm like, oh, I must be defining cult
22:31
Speaker 3: movie wrong. In my brain, cult movie just means that
22:34
Speaker 3: it just gets a following. It doesn't matter what the
22:36
Speaker 3: box office was.
22:38
Speaker 2: This is definitely one of those movies that found its
22:41
Speaker 2: following with home video. Like even though it made its
22:45
Speaker 2: budget back and then some like it made good money,
22:48
Speaker 2: it really made decent home video money. Like I think
22:53
Speaker 2: it was like real fast, it made twenty million just
22:57
Speaker 2: in the US just from home video rentals, and that
23:01
Speaker 2: was early on, and I think worldwide it was even
23:03
Speaker 2: more than that. So I think it was enough to
23:06
Speaker 2: make people notice. And I think because of like you,
23:09
Speaker 2: you know, like John you talked about it earlier on
23:12
Speaker 2: about walking the line like Gary Busey walked the line
23:15
Speaker 2: between parody and sincerity or something like that. I think
23:19
Speaker 2: it helps when the movie has an edge of stupidity
23:23
Speaker 2: to it, like it has some prifolity to it, where
23:25
Speaker 2: it's just like, oh, Okay, this is the tone that
23:27
Speaker 2: we're going for. And when you can find an audience
23:30
Speaker 2: that can embrace that, you know, ridiculousness, it I think
23:34
Speaker 2: it really works and it helps add to the cult following. Like,
23:37
Speaker 2: to me, I think the ultimate cult following movie is
23:41
Speaker 2: Rocky Horror Picture Show in my mind, of.
23:43
Speaker 1: Course, yeah, you know, just because it's easy.
23:46
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's so campy, it's so it's so big. But
23:49
Speaker 2: it didn't make that much money when it first came out,
23:52
Speaker 2: but there's midnight showings everywhere. People still celebrate it. We
23:55
Speaker 2: just celebrated i think the fiftieth anniversary and yeah, fiftieth anniversary.
24:01
Speaker 2: But yeah, like it's it's that's the kind of gold standard,
24:04
Speaker 2: like you said, well.
24:05
Speaker 3: And then the Room is the first one to really
24:07
Speaker 3: sort of like be the inheritor. Oh yeah, that's the
24:11
Speaker 3: air to the throne on that one. But here's it, Like,
24:15
Speaker 3: here's a question, because like I'm praising the photography and
24:18
Speaker 3: stuff like that, you know, especially pan and scan video. Like, okay,
24:22
Speaker 3: so it finds its cult following on video, you know, obviously,
24:26
Speaker 3: you know, it does decent money, but in a pre
24:28
Speaker 3: home video era, it becomes a forgotten you know, a
24:32
Speaker 3: budget earner. My question is I'm sitting here praising the photography.
24:37
Speaker 3: Does that just prove that cinematography isn't that important to people?
24:40
Speaker 3: If this did so well in pan and scan er
24:42
Speaker 3: do you think that the way that everything is staged
24:46
Speaker 3: it makes it one of those movies where it's better
24:49
Speaker 3: if you saw it on the big screen, but if
24:50
Speaker 3: you see it cropped, it still doesn't hurt because it's
24:53
Speaker 3: shot so well.
24:56
Speaker 4: I will say it's less about out how you watch
25:02
Speaker 4: a cult movie and more about who you watch it with.
25:05
Speaker 4: I think many of the cult movies that I were
25:07
Speaker 4: as exposed to, I call them like camp movies, like
25:10
Speaker 4: the ones we would see on the giant CRT television
25:13
Speaker 4: cart in the meeting room or maybe a projector so.
25:17
Speaker 4: It's definitely not the best viewing viewing experience, but you're
25:21
Speaker 4: surrounded by people who grew up on it or it's
25:24
Speaker 4: their favorite movie, and so that trand like that's the
25:27
Speaker 4: first time I saw Princess Bride was a camp movie,
25:30
Speaker 4: and like that, which obviously is a great movie in itself,
25:33
Speaker 4: But that experience, Yeah, it's not a cinematic experience as
25:38
Speaker 4: so far as a movie theater, but if you're surrounded
25:41
Speaker 4: by people who really are passionate about a movie, they
25:45
Speaker 4: can elevate that experience.
25:48
Speaker 3: Just as a side note, the cinematographer for this film
25:52
Speaker 3: also was the cinematographer for Star Trek for the Voyage Home.
25:56
Speaker 3: He was also for not just She's having a baby,
26:00
Speaker 3: but planes, trains, and automobiles, and he worked on Men.
26:04
Speaker 2: In Black like Donald Donald Peterman. Yeah, that's honestly pretty
26:08
Speaker 2: well you said when you said voyage Home, and what
26:12
Speaker 2: was the other one that you said.
26:13
Speaker 3: Oh, well there was voyage Home, there was planes, trains
26:16
Speaker 3: on automobiles.
26:18
Speaker 5: Yeah.
26:18
Speaker 2: So if you put if you put a point break
26:20
Speaker 2: voyage Home and planes, trains and automobiles, you can see
26:24
Speaker 2: the visual language. I know that can sound crazy, but
26:26
Speaker 2: I think you can really see it. Like you're just like, oh,
26:29
Speaker 2: that's a Peterman film.
26:30
Speaker 3: Yeah, I agree with you. There's there is something there
26:34
Speaker 3: that's pretty wild. And I guess, especially since those are
26:38
Speaker 3: all movies that you know, people watched on video, like
26:42
Speaker 3: like maybe there's something to the fact that he shot
26:46
Speaker 3: it in such a way that pan and scan didn't
26:48
Speaker 3: kill it that because the thing is, this is uh,
26:51
Speaker 3: I'm trying to remember it was this one two to one,
26:53
Speaker 3: one point six. What was the aspect ratio on this,
26:56
Speaker 3: because I'm pretty.
26:57
Speaker 2: Sure this was one point three nine, I mean two point.
26:59
Speaker 1: Three nine, one point three nine, two point two point.
27:00
Speaker 2: Three Really pretty sure. I'm pretty sure.
27:02
Speaker 1: I don't like, oh wow, was it okay?
27:04
Speaker 3: Well, are you going to be way like maybe it's yeah,
27:07
Speaker 3: but maybe it's just some way that like he knows
27:09
Speaker 3: to keep everything center frame so that pan and scan
27:13
Speaker 3: wound up not hurting it in any way.
27:14
Speaker 2: I don't know. Yeah, well, okay, think about think about it,
27:19
Speaker 2: think about simplifying it.
27:20
Speaker 1: He's worked on some amazing films.
27:22
Speaker 2: But if you if you think about the set pieces,
27:24
Speaker 2: which was the term I was trying to think about earlier,
27:27
Speaker 2: if you think about the set pieces, and you think
27:29
Speaker 2: about the surfing, like you're focused mainly on one surfer
27:32
Speaker 2: at a time, and so even though you have it
27:36
Speaker 2: in widescreen and you're taking in the huge tunnel, the
27:39
Speaker 2: huge wave, you're focusing on the surfer that you can
27:42
Speaker 2: pain and scan. When you're skydiving, you're mainly focusing on
27:46
Speaker 2: one skydiver at a time, but then when they get together,
27:49
Speaker 2: they're in a giant circle, so you can still focus
27:51
Speaker 2: on it in pan and scan. And same with the chase.
27:55
Speaker 2: You know you're utilizing that Z access the most during
27:58
Speaker 2: the chase scene, and and and even think, yeah, even
28:02
Speaker 2: in the bank robbing scenes, there's there's no really wide
28:05
Speaker 2: vistas that you're that you're looking at. It's really just
28:08
Speaker 2: clusters of information that's going on, and they spend a
28:12
Speaker 2: lot of time, Like even in the car chases, it's
28:16
Speaker 2: close together in frenetics. So I think, I think penis game.
28:19
Speaker 2: This is a movie, even though it has huge set
28:22
Speaker 2: pieces and a lot of adrenaline. I think the way
28:25
Speaker 2: that Peterman shot it lends itself to a four x
28:28
Speaker 2: three conversion fascinating.
28:29
Speaker 3: Well, I mean undeniable talent, you know, somebody who knew
28:33
Speaker 3: how to frame a film effectively, no doubt, no doubt.
28:36
Speaker 4: And talking about and shots for one second because for
28:40
Speaker 4: the skydiving, it made me wonder just I don't know
28:44
Speaker 4: if you know the answer to this, but it made
28:46
Speaker 4: me wonder if they did the same technique that they
28:48
Speaker 4: did in Star Trek two thousand and nine, where they
28:53
Speaker 4: basically had them stand on mirrors and shot not for
28:58
Speaker 4: every shot obviously, but for pickup shot of like close
29:00
Speaker 4: ups of the actors where they had them stand on
29:03
Speaker 4: a mirror shot down which show shoots up and then
29:07
Speaker 4: you know, blow wind in their face and it gives
29:10
Speaker 4: the illusion that you're, you know, flaw falling through the
29:14
Speaker 4: clear sky. I know there was a couple of shots
29:16
Speaker 4: where I'm like, this could have been done in that technique.
29:18
Speaker 2: But what they what they did for the close ups
29:21
Speaker 2: was they had Keanu and Swayze on a rig where
29:26
Speaker 2: it was like a gimbal pole, like it was a
29:28
Speaker 2: pole sticking out of the ground. They put their clothes
29:31
Speaker 2: on over this pole, over this rig so that they
29:35
Speaker 2: could rotate them and spin them and they were shooting
29:38
Speaker 2: at an upwards angle to shoot at the sky, and
29:41
Speaker 2: they had tons and tons of wind fans, you know,
29:43
Speaker 2: like blown at them and everything like that. And it's
29:45
Speaker 2: actually it's actually really really noticeable for some like during
29:50
Speaker 2: the first guy diving seen with with Keanu, uh, for
29:55
Speaker 2: like the first two thirds, maybe even three fourths of
29:59
Speaker 2: the sky I've everybody has wide shots of skydiving and
30:03
Speaker 2: we see them floating around and everything like that, and
30:06
Speaker 2: then we the only time we see Keanu is the
30:09
Speaker 2: close ups of him on the rig, and it's it's
30:14
Speaker 2: very obviously spliced in where he's just like, yeah, yeah,
30:17
Speaker 2: way to it go, Like he's like cheering from the
30:20
Speaker 2: sidelines because you're like, oh, okay, Keanu or his stunt
30:23
Speaker 2: double did not want to skydive that day, but apparently
30:26
Speaker 2: Patrick Squeezey did fifty skydiving jumps for the film. Yep,
30:31
Speaker 2: and he's a huge I should say it was. He
30:34
Speaker 2: was a huge skydiver, like he was obsessed with it. Yeah,
30:37
Speaker 2: I actually convinced Gary Busey to do it.
30:39
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that, And I think that's why, like
30:42
Speaker 3: in the scene where you know he's he jumps out
30:47
Speaker 3: at the end like that's really him, Like he was like, yeah,
30:49
Speaker 3: sure I got this and it I mean, the thing
30:52
Speaker 3: is it watching this is one of those movies that
30:55
Speaker 3: reminds me even more than ghost which I can't go
30:58
Speaker 3: back to complicated, but even more than ghosts, this is
31:03
Speaker 3: one of those movies that makes me wax nostalgic about
31:07
Speaker 3: what a talent Patrick Swayze was. He's so charismatic on
31:12
Speaker 3: screen and I think that this movie is a complete
31:16
Speaker 3: dud without him. It is his energy and when he's
31:20
Speaker 3: on screen and when he is with Keanu Reeves, there
31:24
Speaker 3: is something that lights up that happens, and it is
31:28
Speaker 3: that guy just had like a just a natural chemistry
31:32
Speaker 3: with everybody around him that made you want to like him,
31:36
Speaker 3: to spend time with him to learn more about him.
31:40
Speaker 3: And you know, as I think back on his other
31:42
Speaker 3: roles that I've seen and stuff like that, it's like
31:45
Speaker 3: just a guy who he just brought.
31:47
Speaker 1: I mean Body, when you think of body is a
31:50
Speaker 1: bank robbing never do well.
31:53
Speaker 3: As the kids might say, who's He's got this weird
31:57
Speaker 3: philosophy on life, all this stuff, Like everything about this
31:59
Speaker 3: guy screams I wouldn't want to hang out with him,
32:02
Speaker 3: but Patrick Swayzey I would want to hang out with.
32:05
Speaker 3: And so when he's sitting there and he's like, yeah, man,
32:07
Speaker 3: you just got to get the adrenaline, and it's like, yeah,
32:09
Speaker 3: would you charge in and you hold up people at gunpoint?
32:13
Speaker 3: That that's a conflict of character that I can't quite resolve.
32:17
Speaker 3: But I resolve it for him because I'm like, Okay,
32:20
Speaker 3: I could get somebody like wanting to be with him
32:22
Speaker 3: and wanting to, you know, just hang with him and
32:24
Speaker 3: have a good time and to like go along with
32:26
Speaker 3: any crazy idea that he had.
32:28
Speaker 2: Darren, how did you feel about the themes of freedom
32:32
Speaker 2: and identity in this film? Do you feel like it
32:34
Speaker 2: was secondary third fourth? You know, like because there's some people,
32:39
Speaker 2: like people who really really like this film will tell
32:43
Speaker 2: you about you know, Body's philosophy of chasing the edge
32:46
Speaker 2: or living without regret and you know risk as an identity,
32:50
Speaker 2: you know, authority versus one's own rebellion and everything like that.
32:53
Speaker 2: Did that land for you or was it just like
32:56
Speaker 2: you know, sprinkles on a cupcake?
33:00
Speaker 4: Was it was good? I think, Aleka, what John was
33:03
Speaker 4: saying about, you know body is. I mean, look at
33:06
Speaker 4: the poster. It's him and Keanu. It's those two characters.
33:10
Speaker 4: Their dynamic doesn't work, then the movie suffers and his
33:15
Speaker 4: his you know worldview with the yeah, chasing the edge,
33:19
Speaker 4: I guess it worked, but it was writing, it was
33:25
Speaker 4: riding the edge. It was writing the line because there's
33:28
Speaker 4: there were times during the movie where I'm like, why
33:31
Speaker 4: are they letting you know, Utah into this world, Like
33:35
Speaker 4: like there's no way. And then there's times they're like,
33:37
Speaker 4: oh I buy it. Oh yeah, he's you know, he
33:39
Speaker 4: was an old sports guy and they made that connection. Okay,
33:42
Speaker 4: and then it would go again like oh yeah, but
33:44
Speaker 4: now they're like seeing him and that would be suspicious. Oh,
33:48
Speaker 4: but then you know he's hanging out with the girl,
33:50
Speaker 4: he's learning to surf.
33:51
Speaker 1: And and so it was.
33:52
Speaker 4: It was just walking that tightrope the whole movie, not
33:56
Speaker 4: not in a bad way, but so all that to say, like,
34:01
Speaker 4: when that is not the view point of your main
34:05
Speaker 4: character of Keanu, and he's being kind of inducted into
34:10
Speaker 4: that worldview, it's a harder sell than if your main
34:15
Speaker 4: character is the one pitching you that universe, because now
34:20
Speaker 4: body has to convince him and the audience. So I
34:24
Speaker 4: think that's that's like you said, people who are already
34:28
Speaker 4: right in that line, right in that high are like, oh, yeah,
34:31
Speaker 4: he's speaking to me, and everyone else is like, yeah,
34:34
Speaker 4: maybe you convinced Johnny Utah, who sounds like a video
34:37
Speaker 4: game character name, you know. But but I'm gonna take
34:41
Speaker 4: a little more convincing, you know, just.
34:44
Speaker 1: Because you know Johnny Utah. The FBI, I have to
34:48
Speaker 1: believe that.
34:48
Speaker 3: Now, there's an old joke that FBI stands for famous
34:51
Speaker 3: but incompetent. I'm not saying that's my joke. I've heard
34:54
Speaker 3: it said having grown up in the DC area, but
34:57
Speaker 3: no law enforcement agency on the face of the planet
35:01
Speaker 3: would take somebody who was a very famous college quarterback
35:06
Speaker 3: and be like, you're the one to go under cover.
35:09
Speaker 3: Nobody's gonna know who you are. You're a freaking household name.
35:13
Speaker 3: In some quarters, it's like, oh, you know, let's get
35:16
Speaker 3: Nick Saban and have him infiltrate the surfing do what
35:20
Speaker 3: was like, No, no, that's not gonna work too well.
35:24
Speaker 2: Other ish to be fair, that's why it worked because
35:29
Speaker 2: he was a famous quarterback.
35:31
Speaker 3: Oh I see, it's a double reverse. Okay, you'd never
35:34
Speaker 3: expect the world famous quarterback.
35:36
Speaker 2: I know, I know, honestly, yeah, I mean, like, okay,
35:39
Speaker 2: but that's like what got him in because you know,
35:42
Speaker 2: like in the surfer world with him being so green
35:45
Speaker 2: and you know, like surfers are some of the worst
35:49
Speaker 2: people I've ever met on the planet and to get
35:52
Speaker 2: into their house listeners.
35:53
Speaker 3: Tristan Raddell is speaking for himself during this segment. Neither
35:57
Speaker 3: Aaron Moser nor John Mills are represented by the statements
36:00
Speaker 3: that are about to come out of mister Radelle's mouth.
36:03
Speaker 2: Man Surfer, Tristan, how dare you if surfers knew how
36:08
Speaker 2: to read, I'm sure I would get crazy emails from them.
36:12
Speaker 1: They don't need to. This is a podcast, an audio.
36:15
Speaker 4: Medium, Tristan.
36:19
Speaker 2: But in order to infiltrate they had to, he had
36:21
Speaker 2: to have some sort of standing elsewhere outside of the
36:24
Speaker 2: surfer world. So I personally think it works. Did everything
36:27
Speaker 2: in this movie work? No, not at all. Oh, but
36:28
Speaker 2: I think that one thing, I think, I don't know,
36:31
Speaker 2: I'm going to defend that one.
36:33
Speaker 3: I I think it speaks more to the fact that
36:35
Speaker 3: the movie is just having fun with it, and it's like,
36:37
Speaker 3: you know, I don't think that there was any logical
36:40
Speaker 3: thought behind it necessarily. It was just like and now
36:43
Speaker 3: it's like, if anything, the script feels like it was
36:45
Speaker 3: written by a child, And I mean that in the
36:48
Speaker 3: best possible way.
36:49
Speaker 1: This sounds like a story that my.
36:50
Speaker 2: Young name James Cameron film before.
36:53
Speaker 3: Yeah, but but like it feels like a story that
36:56
Speaker 3: my kid would have written. And rereading it, I was like,
36:58
Speaker 3: you know, for it's a lot of imagination here, I admire. Yeah,
37:02
Speaker 3: why wouldn't he be a high school and they're bank
37:05
Speaker 3: robbers too?
37:06
Speaker 4: Oh?
37:06
Speaker 1: And they and they Oh they're skydivers, of course they are.
37:10
Speaker 1: Why not? Like everything and.
37:12
Speaker 6: Then and then there's skydivers and then they jump out
37:15
Speaker 6: of the plane. But he doesn't know if his if
37:17
Speaker 6: his parachute is is good but it is. But now
37:21
Speaker 6: and now we're in Mexico, and and then exactly, Yeah, I.
37:26
Speaker 2: Love that, and now we're in Mexico. Okay, so okay,
37:30
Speaker 2: so it's so Darren. Okay. One thing that I love
37:33
Speaker 2: to repeat is something from Trey Parker and Matt Stone
37:37
Speaker 2: where they said, poor poor stelly storytelling is and this happens,
37:45
Speaker 2: and then this happens, and then this happens. That's poor storytelling.
37:49
Speaker 2: Good storytelling is this happened, Therefore this happened. Therefore this happened,
37:57
Speaker 2: and because of that this happened. Point Break is the
38:01
Speaker 2: epitome of and then this happened, and then this happened,
38:06
Speaker 2: and didn they're in Mexico.
38:08
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, I would say that is a fair criticism
38:11
Speaker 3: of the film.
38:13
Speaker 5: This is, you know.
38:14
Speaker 3: I don't think it's any mistake that this was not
38:17
Speaker 3: nominated for Best Original Screenplay. I think that is not
38:22
Speaker 3: an oversight by the Academy for this year in film.
38:26
Speaker 3: But I think that what's crazy about it is it
38:30
Speaker 3: really I look at it as part of this retrospective.
38:34
Speaker 3: I didn't care for Blue Steel. I see Point Break
38:38
Speaker 3: as the director of Near Dark. This feels more like
38:41
Speaker 3: the sophomore effort. To me, I see a connection between
38:44
Speaker 3: Near Dark and this in the sense that, like you
38:47
Speaker 3: have this sort of crazy outsider group, you have the
38:52
Speaker 3: decent guy who's caught up, you have the love interest
38:55
Speaker 3: that doesn't want to be part of the evil people,
38:58
Speaker 3: and all of those sorts of things. And it's not
39:00
Speaker 3: a one to one, obviously, but I see it as
39:03
Speaker 3: that sort of thing. I can see a direct line
39:07
Speaker 3: for the director between Near Dark and Point Break. Unquestionably
39:11
Speaker 3: this is the same director, but I think this is
39:14
Speaker 3: a director who, between Near Dark and Point Break said
39:18
Speaker 3: screw it, I'm gonna have fun with it. I'm not
39:21
Speaker 3: going to be super earnest about it. And I think
39:23
Speaker 3: that the absolute epitome of that is that John c McGinley,
39:31
Speaker 3: one of my favorite actors on the planet ever, absolutely.
39:34
Speaker 2: Such a good note.
39:35
Speaker 3: But the thing is he seemed just to get the
39:38
Speaker 3: note between takes of but could you do it even
39:41
Speaker 3: more unhinged? And then they just got him as far
39:44
Speaker 3: as it go, and usually usually you go that far
39:46
Speaker 3: and then the director says, now, pull it back a
39:49
Speaker 3: little bit. I don't feel that anybody pulled anything back,
39:52
Speaker 3: because he would just walk in and just start shouting
39:55
Speaker 3: like it was.
39:56
Speaker 5: It was a parody character, but it works because Kennu
40:00
Speaker 5: is so low key in those scenes that you're like, somehow,
40:06
Speaker 5: this weird alchemy happens. And that's where I got to
40:10
Speaker 5: give big Low credit because she's not She's not doing
40:14
Speaker 5: anything other than I have these these two extreme forces,
40:17
Speaker 5: and I'm just going to play it in such a
40:19
Speaker 5: way that they wind up balancing each other out instead
40:22
Speaker 5: of having both of these people act like sane human
40:25
Speaker 5: beings that actually exists in the world.
40:27
Speaker 1: And I really admire that about the movie. I don't
40:30
Speaker 1: know it worked for me this time while I was
40:33
Speaker 1: watching it.
40:34
Speaker 4: Yeah, McGinley is definitely channeling the police chief from Last
40:38
Speaker 4: Action Hero vibes. Yes, he is almost.
40:43
Speaker 2: I never get tired of that trope. I really don't.
40:47
Speaker 4: Trop you crush twenty cars, give me your badge and
40:53
Speaker 4: your gun, but you're two dag valuable. So here's your
40:57
Speaker 4: gun and your badge back.
40:58
Speaker 1: Sure you broke the bad is.
41:00
Speaker 3: Sure you broke twenty five loss, and maybe there are
41:03
Speaker 3: twenty deaths that we can attribute to you.
41:05
Speaker 1: But you know what, I think you're gonna get the
41:07
Speaker 1: job done. Yeah it's the mayor's chewing my ass out.
41:13
Speaker 2: Yeah, my ass is on the line for you.
41:16
Speaker 3: But the thing is, that's what makes such that that's
41:18
Speaker 3: what makes certain scene so much fun where this insanely
41:24
Speaker 3: tragic bank robbery has happened, but the caper to it
41:28
Speaker 3: is is Gary Busey saying, uh, you know what you
41:32
Speaker 3: never learned and knocking his supervisor out and saying respect
41:35
Speaker 3: for your elders. I'm like, that's so crazy, it's so insane.
41:40
Speaker 3: It's such an embrace of every awful trope we lived
41:44
Speaker 3: with in the eighties.
41:44
Speaker 4: And then the other cops will let him leave, like right,
41:47
Speaker 4: nobody says, you just think thebi director.
41:52
Speaker 2: But yeah, but that's why they allowed him to leave.
41:55
Speaker 2: Like it's just like cuff the director said you can't leave,
41:58
Speaker 2: but he just punched him out. It's a card at Trump's,
42:02
Speaker 2: you know, Darren, Darren, tell me about tell me about
42:05
Speaker 2: Lori Petty. What did you think about Lorry Petty's performance
42:08
Speaker 2: in this.
42:10
Speaker 4: No, I mean, I like what John was saying about
42:13
Speaker 4: the similar elements to uh was it until dawn? There's
42:18
Speaker 4: dang it? Oh dawn near dark, near dark. It's dawn
42:21
Speaker 4: and dark for these movies. I gotta keep them straight.
42:24
Speaker 2: But no, like you you confused until dark or near
42:27
Speaker 2: dark and dust till dawn. Yeah, and then I probably
42:31
Speaker 2: do some of other third movie. I don't know, but yeah, No,
42:34
Speaker 2: I think her performance was great.
42:36
Speaker 4: She you know, she's the love interest, she's the inn,
42:40
Speaker 4: you know, and it's textbook of like you didn't tell
42:44
Speaker 4: me the truth and now I hate you, but I
42:46
Speaker 4: actually love you. And then I think story wise, I
42:52
Speaker 4: think it went a little far with her being the
42:55
Speaker 4: hostage because yeah, it all worked out, but it practically didn't.
43:01
Speaker 4: Like she should be dead. There's there's no real reason
43:06
Speaker 4: that she should be alive right now.
43:08
Speaker 3: Like I I think that Lori Petty brings a very
43:11
Speaker 3: necessary energy to the role. I think she does very
43:14
Speaker 3: well with it.
43:15
Speaker 1: I think that.
43:17
Speaker 3: Before that whole ending thing, though, the the kind of
43:21
Speaker 3: dysfunctional relationships that Hollywood modeled for us over time were
43:26
Speaker 3: very interesting because the minute, regardless of what the inciting
43:33
Speaker 3: sort of thing is, I know, the minute, the minute
43:36
Speaker 3: somebody fires a gun at me while I'm asleep, I'm
43:40
Speaker 3: going to kind of bail at that. I'm gonna be like,
43:42
Speaker 3: you know what, I don't think we're going to resolve
43:44
Speaker 3: the personality issues that are that are underlying here. I
43:48
Speaker 3: think maybe, just maybe we should.
43:51
Speaker 1: Call it off at this point. There's something fundamental there.
43:54
Speaker 2: Even within the world of Point Break, that was too far,
43:59
Speaker 2: Like Keanu was very much, way too forgiving of that moment,
44:07
Speaker 2: Like he was the one who was trying to apologize
44:10
Speaker 2: and trying to explain himself. No, in that moment, that's
44:13
Speaker 2: when you go, No, miss Petty, you are the one
44:17
Speaker 2: I'm kicking out. You are the one who should be apologizing,
44:20
Speaker 2: not me. I don't care how much I lie to you.
44:23
Speaker 2: You fired a pistol in my pillow while I was sleeping.
44:28
Speaker 2: We are done. You should be thankful I'm not falling
44:31
Speaker 2: charges against you.
44:34
Speaker 3: Yeah, and never mind the fact that distance she was at.
44:37
Speaker 3: You know, thank god that gun didn't pull.
44:39
Speaker 1: Right a little bit, because that was a little close
44:44
Speaker 1: for the liking.
44:46
Speaker 2: I'm a big fan of Lori Petty. I loved her
44:50
Speaker 2: in Tank Girl, I loved her in a League of
44:53
Speaker 2: their own, and I loved her in her performance and
44:57
Speaker 2: Voyager and I I was so happy to see her
45:00
Speaker 2: again in this. I feel like she gives this this
45:03
Speaker 2: different kind of energy that's very unique to her, Like
45:06
Speaker 2: her voice is unique, her look is unique, and I
45:10
Speaker 2: just love her acting style. I really do, because it
45:13
Speaker 2: gives this this raw vulnerability to every role that she's in,
45:18
Speaker 2: Like you just feel like as an actress, she puts
45:21
Speaker 2: everything out there, and I feel like this this movie
45:25
Speaker 2: is no different.
45:26
Speaker 1: I think I agree with you. I haven't seen I
45:29
Speaker 1: saw a Tank Girl in the theater. I don't remember
45:31
Speaker 1: loving it.
45:32
Speaker 2: Oh it's crazy, it's crazy, it's it's unhinged. I'm not
45:35
Speaker 2: saying it's a good movie. It's a fun movie, yeah,
45:39
Speaker 2: like in a bad way.
45:41
Speaker 1: Yeah.
45:41
Speaker 3: I think that it's if I remember correctly, it was
45:44
Speaker 3: a lot like ang Lee's Hulk, where it was like these.
45:47
Speaker 1: Are images and it's a film. I'm not sure if
45:50
Speaker 1: it really makes sense.
45:52
Speaker 2: Listen, I didn't say I liked Tank Girl. I said
45:54
Speaker 2: I liked Lori Petty in Tank Girl.
45:57
Speaker 1: Fair enough, Free Willie, Yeah, there you go.
46:00
Speaker 2: I don't remember that.
46:01
Speaker 3: I never saw Free Willy. That does not mean we
46:04
Speaker 3: are going to discuss the director of Free Willy as
46:07
Speaker 3: an excuse for me to see Free Willy. I'm willing
46:09
Speaker 3: to live with the l on that one. At that's
46:11
Speaker 3: fine point. It's fine, it's good, it's good, it's good.
46:14
Speaker 1: You know.
46:15
Speaker 3: I think that I think that the biggest accomplishment for
46:19
Speaker 3: Bigelow is that she gives Petty the space to be
46:24
Speaker 3: I think, the one three dimensional character that exists for
46:28
Speaker 3: all of her flaws, like for like, I think if anything,
46:32
Speaker 3: that might that might be the biggest clue that there
46:36
Speaker 3: is a woman behind the camera in that the female character,
46:40
Speaker 3: the main female character, actually seems to have a presence
46:44
Speaker 3: on screen as opposed to just existing as a side note.
46:50
Speaker 3: And I think that that probably has something to do
46:52
Speaker 3: with Bigelow, right because you know, maybe maybe there, maybe
46:56
Speaker 3: there's an effort from her to give a little extra
47:00
Speaker 3: attention to a character that in a movie like this
47:02
Speaker 3: typically is nothing more than set dressing.
47:05
Speaker 2: It's interesting because Bigelow, I feel like sometimes sometimes gets
47:10
Speaker 2: a lot of heat for having very masculine energy in
47:14
Speaker 2: her movies. And it's there. I mean, it's it's it's there.
47:18
Speaker 2: Like it's true. That's that's not up for debate. She
47:20
Speaker 2: has very she has a very masculine energy to her
47:23
Speaker 2: characters and to her story. And I feel like up
47:26
Speaker 2: until zero dark thirty, we're getting primarily machismo on the screen.
47:34
Speaker 2: Even with Blue Steel, even though Jamie Lee was the protagonist,
47:39
Speaker 2: you still had protagonist confused, and you had you still
47:42
Speaker 2: had very male toxicity on the screen and machisma on
47:45
Speaker 2: the screen and everything like that, and Point Break is
47:47
Speaker 2: very much no different. But you were one ondred percent
47:50
Speaker 2: right that even in the midst of that, even in
47:53
Speaker 2: this cloud, this fog of machismo, Lori Petty, is able
47:58
Speaker 2: to shine. I think because you have that that female
48:03
Speaker 2: lens behind the lens and yeah, like behind the camera.
48:08
Speaker 2: I think there's definitely some credence to that.
48:11
Speaker 1: And I will say for anybody that waxes nostalgic about
48:14
Speaker 1: nineties fashion, watching Point Break should completely disabuse you of
48:18
Speaker 1: that and just.
48:20
Speaker 2: The Okay, so speaking of like as we as we
48:23
Speaker 2: round third, John, I want you to answer this question
48:26
Speaker 2: as a part of your answer as to what rating
48:30
Speaker 2: you're giving this And Darren, I'm giving you a break
48:33
Speaker 2: for not and I'm not going to have you go
48:35
Speaker 2: first with your rating. But John, you are what I
48:39
Speaker 2: would call an officionado of eighties action films.
48:43
Speaker 1: Thank you. That's one of the nicest things you've ever said.
48:47
Speaker 2: With this coming out in ninety one. What makes this
48:52
Speaker 2: movie different? What makes this action film different from what
48:57
Speaker 2: came before in the previous decade and give us your rating.
49:00
Speaker 1: In that answer, I.
49:02
Speaker 3: Would say that very little, if anything. Honestly, I think
49:05
Speaker 3: that probably the extreme sports that it highlights are that's
49:10
Speaker 3: more nineties than eighties. If this came out in the eighties,
49:14
Speaker 3: it would have probably been like motorbike racing and you
49:19
Speaker 3: know some other stuff.
49:21
Speaker 2: You were, you know, God, dang it, you were.
49:24
Speaker 1: You're welcome, sough and that's that's why you gave me
49:28
Speaker 1: the title of aficionado. I appreciate that.
49:31
Speaker 2: You right, It's very painfully right. It would have been
49:34
Speaker 2: a BMX race. It would have been a dirt bike race.
49:40
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, Yes, I just I gotta give you. I
49:42
Speaker 2: gotta give credit on that one. I can't even I
49:44
Speaker 2: can't even say anymore. Please continue.
49:45
Speaker 1: I'm so high, corrupted, high point of my week.
49:48
Speaker 3: Honestly, it's all downhill from here, and I'm going to
49:51
Speaker 3: say that the I actually looked this up on letterbox
49:54
Speaker 3: at what I rated it the last time I watched it.
49:56
Speaker 3: I did not care for this movie the last time
49:58
Speaker 3: I watched it, recognizing it's you know, impact, all of
50:01
Speaker 3: that stuff. I kind of dragged it the last time
50:03
Speaker 3: I watched it. But I gotta be honest, I don't
50:06
Speaker 3: know if I was just in a better mood when
50:07
Speaker 3: I watched it this time, but I was having fun
50:10
Speaker 3: the way I think Bigelow wanted me to have fun
50:12
Speaker 3: with this, and so my rating definitely was better. This
50:17
Speaker 3: is low art of the highest caliber. This is people
50:22
Speaker 3: showing up to work and saying, I am not trying
50:25
Speaker 3: to win an Oscar. I am just trying to make
50:27
Speaker 3: it so that, you know, Johnny Blue Jeans is having
50:31
Speaker 3: a rough week at the factory and he's just got
50:34
Speaker 3: to unplug and he wants to have fun, and he's
50:38
Speaker 3: never gonna get to do these things. He's never gonna
50:40
Speaker 3: get to skydive, he's never going to get to surf,
50:42
Speaker 3: he's never gonna get to live like a beach bum.
50:44
Speaker 3: He's never gonna have beautiful girls around him. You know what,
50:46
Speaker 3: I'm gonna throw it all.
50:47
Speaker 1: In his face, and I'm gonna do it in such
50:50
Speaker 1: a way that he's gonna walk out and be like, oh,
50:52
Speaker 1: that was so cool. So I got to give this
50:55
Speaker 1: a solid four this time.
50:56
Speaker 3: This is a director who has grown so that by
51:00
Speaker 3: this entry, I think if you give this script to
51:03
Speaker 3: Bigelow at near Dark, you get near Dark if you
51:06
Speaker 3: give this script to Bigelow after she has two films
51:09
Speaker 3: behind her, you get Point Break. And yes, it benefits
51:13
Speaker 3: from Swayzey's energy, But I think that Swayzey's been in
51:18
Speaker 3: some bad movies too, where with directors who didn't know
51:22
Speaker 3: what to do with them, and I think that this
51:24
Speaker 3: is not one of those movies. I think this is
51:26
Speaker 3: a director who knew who was on screen, and so
51:29
Speaker 3: that is a solid four for me for Point Break.
51:34
Speaker 2: Darren, I want to hear why you think this is
51:39
Speaker 2: a cult classic wrapped in with your answer.
51:43
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, besides the obviously definition I gave of
51:48
Speaker 4: cult classic being which who you watch this movie with?
51:52
Speaker 4: And I will say in tangent, watching it technically with
51:55
Speaker 4: you guys, you know, being able to have this discussion,
51:58
Speaker 4: that's part of that experience. But I think, yeah, it's
52:02
Speaker 4: in ninety one. You know, you also don't have there's
52:07
Speaker 4: no social media. There's no way to get the love
52:12
Speaker 4: of these extreme sports out there, you know, besides movies
52:18
Speaker 4: or things like that. So it became a touchstone of
52:20
Speaker 4: people who, yeah, as John says, they're never gonna go skydiving,
52:25
Speaker 4: They're gonna go surfing, you know, but to watch an
52:28
Speaker 4: awesome movie of friends. You know, they're never gonna rob Banks,
52:32
Speaker 4: but maybe they want it. But all that, yeah, it's
52:36
Speaker 4: a I think that is the reason and why. You know,
52:40
Speaker 4: as we're discussing this movie, it feels like set dressing
52:43
Speaker 4: between these set pieces of you know, because that is
52:47
Speaker 4: the point of the movie. And it's not horribly told
52:51
Speaker 4: the in between bits, but it's definitely has that vibe.
52:55
Speaker 4: It is not a story first, it is a action
52:58
Speaker 4: set first by a margin, by a thin margin. So
53:03
Speaker 4: I'm going to give this one a three overall. I think,
53:06
Speaker 4: you know, she's improving. You know, we're on an upward trajectory.
53:11
Speaker 4: I think I really resonate with what we said about
53:14
Speaker 4: this feels like the next chapter after Near Dark as
53:18
Speaker 4: far as the forming and the groups of individuals. And
53:23
Speaker 4: I'm not quite sure where Strange Days is going to go,
53:26
Speaker 4: but I think she's only getting better. So that's gonna
53:32
Speaker 4: be that's gonna be great. So three wipeouts from me.
53:38
Speaker 2: Well, I'm giving it three flying piples. I'm with you, Darren.
53:43
Speaker 2: I wanted to give this this more. I wanted to
53:45
Speaker 2: give it, like at least a three point five. But
53:47
Speaker 2: as I was talking about it. There was just you know,
53:50
Speaker 2: I just I had a real hard time connecting with
53:53
Speaker 2: this film. And I think it's hard because it's so
53:57
Speaker 2: freaking nineties. I mean, we're talking Keanu Surfing, extreme sports,
54:02
Speaker 2: Crazy Swayze, you know, like it's it's very much an
54:06
Speaker 2: encapsulation of its time. And so I give it full
54:10
Speaker 2: credit for what it is. I give it full credit
54:13
Speaker 2: for being a cult film with a cult following. I
54:16
Speaker 2: love that people love this. I love that it's been
54:19
Speaker 2: in pop culture. I think it deserves to be in
54:21
Speaker 2: pop culture. I think there is I think I probably
54:24
Speaker 2: I will revisit this again, Like I will watch this
54:27
Speaker 2: film again.
54:28
Speaker 1: I will.
54:30
Speaker 2: I will watch it, and I hope I will. I
54:33
Speaker 2: will watch it with a buddy of mine and you know,
54:36
Speaker 2: like maybe we'll have a few drinks and eat a
54:37
Speaker 2: pizza and just kind of just like you know, riff
54:40
Speaker 2: on it. I think it very much. This is a
54:42
Speaker 2: movie that I should have watched with a male buddy
54:45
Speaker 2: of mine. You know, I should have had my hot
54:47
Speaker 2: fuzz moment with you know, like you know, with Nick
54:50
Speaker 2: Frost and and Peg and everything like that. I think
54:54
Speaker 2: I would have enjoyed it more so I'm giving it
54:57
Speaker 2: a three just because I think for all the things
55:00
Speaker 2: that we like, I think there's a lot wrong technically.
55:03
Speaker 2: I think it's just set piece to set piece to
55:05
Speaker 2: set piece. I would have liked to have had a
55:06
Speaker 2: little bit more emotion and connective tissue. Will I watch
55:09
Speaker 2: the remake? No, but I will revisit this. And so
55:14
Speaker 2: I'm excited to continue on with Bigelow's career because I mean,
55:21
Speaker 2: like soon, like in a couple of movies, we're going
55:23
Speaker 2: to get an Oscar performance. Here, we're going to get
55:25
Speaker 2: an Oscar nominated and winning movie. And so, Darren, what
55:29
Speaker 2: are we doing next?
55:31
Speaker 4: Well, next week we're going forward a couple of years
55:34
Speaker 4: to nineteen ninety five's Strange Days.
55:38
Speaker 2: Next on House Sits, Join the Revolution, Join the Net Party.