Transcript

Credlin | 8 April · Credlin

0:02
Speaker 1: Peter Krandlin live on Sky News Australia.
0:07
Speaker 2: Good evening, welcome to the program. He's what's coming up
0:09
Speaker 2: tonight on Kredlin. Ben Roberts Smith to remain behind bars,
0:13
Speaker 2: but already the war Memorial in Canberra's reviewing the war
0:17
Speaker 2: hero's display despite the fact he hasn't been convicted of anything.
0:21
Speaker 2: I'll get into that in a moment, including speak with
0:24
Speaker 2: the ban responsible for the Defense portfolio during some of
0:27
Speaker 2: the period of his deployment in Afghanistan. Twenty four hours
0:32
Speaker 2: is a long time in politics, but it might be
0:35
Speaker 2: a new record when it comes to Iran. Donald Trump
0:38
Speaker 2: now hailing today is a big day for world peace.
0:41
Speaker 2: There is a two week ceasefire, but what does it mean?
0:45
Speaker 2: Can we trust the Iranians to keep honest with the deal?
0:50
Speaker 2: Last more, reports today that it's the wild West when
0:52
Speaker 2: it comes to the NDS providers smitting barely legible handwritten
0:58
Speaker 2: invoices worth tens of thousands of dollars.
1:01
Speaker 3: I'll get into that a bit later on, as.
1:03
Speaker 2: Well as revelations too that non citizen migrants can buy
1:06
Speaker 2: a new home using Labour's five percent deposit scheme.
1:12
Speaker 3: And he's clearly.
1:12
Speaker 2: Under pressure Chris Bayne giving today perhaps his most unedifying
1:17
Speaker 2: performance yet.
1:19
Speaker 1: You'll totally do he can credit the longs.
1:21
Speaker 4: Okay, that's a comment, not a question.
1:27
Speaker 2: We will stay with that clown, because eventually even the
1:30
Speaker 2: most dogged ideology has to pass the reality test, and
1:34
Speaker 2: under pressure of the world fuel crisis, this whole net
1:39
Speaker 2: zero madness is unraveling fast, even amongst those who until
1:43
Speaker 2: recently were signed up in support. Two events in Canberra
1:47
Speaker 2: to day laid that bear. Chris Bowen doubtless thought the
1:51
Speaker 2: media with air to lap up his reassurances that there
1:54
Speaker 2: was no cause for alarm about fuel supplies.
1:58
Speaker 4: Here he is can be rare short. I think that
2:01
Speaker 4: means that petrol and diesel's going out the door at
2:04
Speaker 4: a rapid rate, but also coming in the door.
2:08
Speaker 3: Instead.
2:09
Speaker 2: He came under sustained pressure for not rethinking the whole
2:12
Speaker 2: so called green energy transition, given how obvious it is
2:16
Speaker 2: that we need access to reliable liquid fuels fossil fuels
2:20
Speaker 2: if the country is to keep moving, the very same
2:23
Speaker 2: fossil fuels, of course, that the Albanezy government thinks.
2:26
Speaker 3: Are destroying the planet.
2:28
Speaker 2: Today Bowen came under relentless questioning from Liam Bartlett, who's
2:32
Speaker 2: been with the ABC and Channel nine, but now front's
2:36
Speaker 2: Channel seven's investigative program called Spotlight, And didn't he spotlight
2:41
Speaker 2: the government's emissions obsession, which is jebardizing attempts to make
2:45
Speaker 2: astray a more fuel self sufficient. Here's just a bit
2:49
Speaker 2: of his relentless pursuit of Chris Bowen.
2:53
Speaker 1: Liam, if this war in Iran has shown us nothing else,
2:58
Speaker 1: hasn't it proved once and for all that you're obsession
3:02
Speaker 1: with renewables, we'll only leave us out of track to
3:05
Speaker 1: another energy crisis.
3:07
Speaker 4: That's a pretty loaded That's a comment, not a question.
3:10
Speaker 1: A question.
3:11
Speaker 4: Well, well, it's a very load.
3:13
Speaker 5: It's a very loaded comment.
3:15
Speaker 4: What it shows is that we need to continue to
3:17
Speaker 4: work on energy security. I make this point. I reject
3:20
Speaker 4: the premise of your question. It's not question, No, no,
3:24
Speaker 4: I reject it's not sorry, are you asking a question
3:27
Speaker 4: or are you having a.
3:28
Speaker 2: DEVELOPE started off a bit friendly, then it deteriorated. Now naturally,
3:34
Speaker 2: Bowen blathered on and on that renewable energy is secure.
3:39
Speaker 4: The Australian Sun cannot be interrupted by a war or
3:43
Speaker 4: anything else. The solar energy has to travel one hundred
3:46
Speaker 4: and fifty million kilometers from the sun. It doesn't have
3:49
Speaker 4: to travel the one hundred and fifty kiometers that are
3:51
Speaker 4: straits or homewards.
3:53
Speaker 2: I'm sure we need secure energy, but we need a
3:55
Speaker 2: twenty four to seven, not just when the wind blows
3:57
Speaker 2: and the sun shines. And how many have trucks and
4:00
Speaker 2: how much farm and mine machinery, and how many planes
4:04
Speaker 2: run a wind and solar Now, plainly, Bartlet's been peppering
4:08
Speaker 2: the bow and office with questions and getting no answers.
4:12
Speaker 3: Today, he wasn't going.
4:13
Speaker 2: To be fogged off by a ministerial pretense that having
4:16
Speaker 2: media conferences is the same thing as bringing transparent I'm.
4:21
Speaker 1: Trying to ask you questions.
4:22
Speaker 6: I'm here, so the twenty fourth of January.
4:25
Speaker 1: I've held an open and honest question about your renewable subsession,
4:29
Speaker 1: and your office has continually thirteen emails, continuous continuously rejected. Now,
4:37
Speaker 1: why can't you sit down and answer open, honest questions.
4:41
Speaker 4: I've held a press conference every day. This is the
4:42
Speaker 4: first press confidence you've been to ask me a question.
4:44
Speaker 4: I've taken one question. I'm going to go to the
4:46
Speaker 4: General's taking one question and I'll come I'll come back.
4:50
Speaker 4: I think you need to show a bit more respect
4:51
Speaker 4: to your colleagues. This is a full room of journalists.
4:53
Speaker 4: Everyone gets one question.
4:54
Speaker 1: I think everyone here we both know the answers.
4:56
Speaker 2: Actually now taking question, Minister is not the same as
5:02
Speaker 2: answering a question. Here's some of the other journalists in
5:06
Speaker 2: the room, as well as more of Bartlett.
5:09
Speaker 5: Would you heed the Chrysopoley government's cause to fast track
5:12
Speaker 5: approvals for oil exploration?
5:15
Speaker 7: Will your government rethink any of the policies it's outlined
5:18
Speaker 7: around the hield?
5:19
Speaker 1: So let me get this right. Your renewable transition policy
5:23
Speaker 1: will not alter one iota so that your focus has
5:26
Speaker 1: been wholly and solely spending billions of dollars. We haven't
5:29
Speaker 1: got one questionable greed infrastructure buying us.
5:32
Speaker 2: To China and look on and on it when I'd
5:36
Speaker 2: have to say it was the most difficult presser that
5:39
Speaker 2: the climate crusading ministers probably ever faced. And why shouldn't
5:43
Speaker 2: he finally be made to face up to the predicament
5:45
Speaker 2: that the Alminezi government's green dream or zealotry has put
5:49
Speaker 2: us in hostage to events in the Persian Gulf that
5:52
Speaker 2: we don't even try to influence, but that we're readily
5:56
Speaker 2: foreseeable and that could and probably will add save cost
6:00
Speaker 2: and inconvenience to almost everything we do. And later on
6:04
Speaker 2: the new National Party leader he didn't miss either at
6:07
Speaker 2: the National Press Club when Canavan said that the government's
6:11
Speaker 2: whole Future Made in Australia program was all based on
6:15
Speaker 2: achieving net zero.
6:17
Speaker 8: The whole centerpiece of the Future Made and Australia agenda,
6:21
Speaker 8: the whole point of Labour's manufacturing policy is to pursue
6:24
Speaker 8: net zero.
6:26
Speaker 2: And he went on and said that none of the
6:28
Speaker 2: subsidies now being thrown at our heavy industries were necessary
6:32
Speaker 2: when they had access to affordable and reliable coal fired power.
6:38
Speaker 8: In the past year alone, along with that whale a
6:40
Speaker 8: steel plant, they've also provided subsidies to aluminium, to zinc,
6:44
Speaker 8: to copper, more than five billion dollars and another three
6:49
Speaker 8: billion probably for the Tomago aluminium smelter in the weeks
6:52
Speaker 8: to come. And then it's only been since they decided
6:55
Speaker 8: that they would turn their aluminum smelters to green energy
6:59
Speaker 8: to follow renewable energy, that suddenly they've needed massive tax
7:03
Speaker 8: bayer support.
7:05
Speaker 2: And look he's right, we've got one hand of government,
7:07
Speaker 2: one policy arm shutting down all of these fossil fuel
7:11
Speaker 2: industries and power generation on the other hand, subsidizing businesses
7:17
Speaker 2: to keep the lights on quite literally with the same
7:20
Speaker 2: power that they're trying to shut down now. I thought
7:24
Speaker 2: Canavan missed the mark when today he attacked Reagan Thatcher legacy.
7:32
Speaker 8: We still remained trapped in. I think the thinking of
7:34
Speaker 8: the last generation, the thinking of the Thatcher and Reagan era.
7:40
Speaker 8: But I don't think microwaved Milton Friedman is going to
7:44
Speaker 8: save the days.
7:46
Speaker 2: I mean, really Elbow somehow a follower of Reagan and Thatcher,
7:51
Speaker 2: more like Bob Brown and Arthur Skaggle actually. But he
7:55
Speaker 2: redeemed himself when he acknowledged that the free trade world
7:59
Speaker 2: had made us all wealthy, including Australia, but that world
8:03
Speaker 2: had changed that loading up our businesses with extra costs
8:07
Speaker 2: had made Australia uncompetitive.
8:10
Speaker 8: I support free trade too. I'm sad that this era
8:13
Speaker 8: is over, but I live on this planet and have
8:17
Speaker 8: to deal with the reality in front of me. As
8:20
Speaker 8: I said I said earlier, this era of globalization free
8:23
Speaker 8: trade did deliver great benefits for our country and it
8:27
Speaker 8: would be better if we could return to such a world.
8:30
Speaker 8: I can't make wave a magic wand and make free.
8:32
Speaker 3: Trade come back.
8:34
Speaker 2: Matt Canavan's absolutely right. We have to slaughter some sacred cows,
8:39
Speaker 2: not just det and zero, but also the notion that
8:42
Speaker 2: any number of immigrants from anywhere is always beneficial, and
8:46
Speaker 2: this idea that our unis should take any number of
8:48
Speaker 2: foreign students too, and the notion that we don't need
8:52
Speaker 2: more infrastructure, including as we desperately do, more dams. And yes,
8:58
Speaker 2: we do need to recover our our ambition as a
9:00
Speaker 2: nation if we are to ensure that the country as
9:03
Speaker 2: is good to our children as it has been to us.
9:07
Speaker 2: Now the Coalition has a long way to go before
9:10
Speaker 2: it's electorally competitive, but at least now it feels like
9:14
Speaker 2: they're making the effort. And look more today on the
9:21
Speaker 2: serious charges laid against war hero Ben Robert Smith for
9:25
Speaker 2: alleged war crimes, as he remains in custody tonight on
9:29
Speaker 2: remand and set to remain there until the bail hearing
9:33
Speaker 2: that we expect will be next week.
9:36
Speaker 3: Again, these points must be made.
9:39
Speaker 2: First, Australia's most decorated living soldier is innocent until proven guilty,
9:44
Speaker 2: a point that John Howard made in a statement issued
9:48
Speaker 2: this afternoon. Second justice delayed is justice denied. It is
9:53
Speaker 2: a disgrace that the Breton Report has left such a
9:57
Speaker 2: cloud of the hands of our bravest Australians and that
10:00
Speaker 2: still there are men tonight who remain in illegal limbo
10:04
Speaker 2: beyond the case of Ben Roberts Smith and the other
10:07
Speaker 2: soldier who is already three years into his prosecution.
10:12
Speaker 3: That surely, if.
10:13
Speaker 2: There's enough evidence to charge, there's got to be enough
10:16
Speaker 2: evidence to go rapidly to trial. And the third point
10:20
Speaker 2: that needs making is that of the evidentiary burden that
10:22
Speaker 2: will be required in this criminal case beyond reasonable doubt,
10:28
Speaker 2: so a lot more than the earlier defamation case, and
10:32
Speaker 2: the huge challenge that will provide the prosecution given we're
10:36
Speaker 2: almost twenty years on from some of these alleged crimes.
10:39
Speaker 2: We're talking about a foreign war zone to which we
10:41
Speaker 2: have no access, that's now backed under terrorist Taliban control,
10:46
Speaker 2: and where we know that witnesses will contradict each other. Now,
10:51
Speaker 2: if after a decade of media accusations, insinuations, and the
10:56
Speaker 2: expenditure of three hundred million dollars plus, if no conviction
11:02
Speaker 2: is ever sustained, it would be reasonable to conclude that
11:06
Speaker 2: this has been a dreadful vandetta against a group of
11:09
Speaker 2: soldiers who deserved better from the nation. They were trying
11:13
Speaker 2: to protect, a nation that they were willing to die
11:18
Speaker 2: to protect, as tragically forty one of them did. Now,
11:23
Speaker 2: I've had hundreds of messages from viewers and friends last
11:27
Speaker 2: night and again today full of support, your support for
11:31
Speaker 2: our soldiers. Many of you are pleading for the nature
11:34
Speaker 2: of the conflict to be taken into account before adverse
11:38
Speaker 2: moral judgments are made.
11:40
Speaker 3: Now here's just one.
11:43
Speaker 2: I'm just a pledge, she writes, Who's very thankful to
11:46
Speaker 2: those who serve us and keep us safe, all of them,
11:49
Speaker 2: from brs to hasty and everyone who pulls on the uniform.
11:54
Speaker 3: She goes on.
11:55
Speaker 2: My darling mate, who did two tours of Afghanistan, always
11:58
Speaker 2: said they trained these men like animals, to abandon all morality,
12:04
Speaker 2: and then a borroom of bureaucrats get to decide what's
12:07
Speaker 2: right and wrong on the battlefield. And this in the
12:11
Speaker 2: conditions that then prevailed. Deeds were done which in the
12:15
Speaker 2: calm light of day could rightly be condemned, but they
12:18
Speaker 2: were the natural outcome of days in which the nervous
12:21
Speaker 2: system was strained beyond any test.
12:24
Speaker 3: Known before.
12:26
Speaker 2: For long periods men lived in a state in which
12:29
Speaker 2: the customary restraints of civilization were suspended, and life became
12:33
Speaker 2: a continual effort of endurance. No army, however disciplined, could
12:40
Speaker 2: pass through such a time unchanged. Now those words were
12:45
Speaker 2: not written in defense of Ben Robert Smith. They are
12:49
Speaker 2: the words of the Great War historian Charles b when
12:52
Speaker 2: he described the Battle of Lone Pine. You think brutality
12:57
Speaker 2: and knife edge, moral judge.
13:00
Speaker 3: Humans are knew to modern war. They are not. Lest
13:05
Speaker 3: we forget.
13:10
Speaker 2: All right, let's got to true in our Triuny Macintosh
13:12
Speaker 2: and Canberra with the headlines.
13:15
Speaker 9: The Prime Minister has welcomed the two week Middle East
13:18
Speaker 9: cease fire as he issued a rare rebuke of President Trump,
13:22
Speaker 9: critical of Donald Trump's truth social threat to end the
13:25
Speaker 9: whole civilization of Iran just hours before his self imposed deadline.
13:30
Speaker 10: I don't think it's appropriate to use language such as that.
13:35
Speaker 8: I think we've got to call a spade a spade
13:37
Speaker 8: at times like these. That was went way too far.
13:40
Speaker 7: Oh look, they're not the words ho would news.
13:42
Speaker 9: More than seventy percent of Australians have told the Sky
13:45
Speaker 9: News Pulse the President has handled the war badly or
13:48
Speaker 9: very badly?
13:50
Speaker 2: Do you worry that this whole episode will undermine the alliance?
13:55
Speaker 10: Well, the United States is our most important ally.
13:58
Speaker 9: The Prime Minister is preparing to fly to Singapore on Thursday.
14:01
Speaker 9: It's the latest attempt to lock in Australia's flow of
14:04
Speaker 9: fuel from one of its biggest suppliers.
14:07
Speaker 10: That we are a reliable supplier of energy and we
14:11
Speaker 10: expect reciprocal arrangements.
14:13
Speaker 8: We should never again as a country be in a
14:15
Speaker 8: position of begging for resources.
14:17
Speaker 9: And today the Nationals leader used a press club address
14:20
Speaker 9: to call for an economic revolution, including tariffs to protect
14:24
Speaker 9: key industries.
14:25
Speaker 8: But everything that is wrong with this country can be
14:27
Speaker 8: fixed with what is right. Everything can be sold if
14:30
Speaker 8: we just do more and more Australia.
14:32
Speaker 7: Let me tell you we need an economic revolution relative
14:36
Speaker 7: to what we're seeing right now, because Australians are going backwards.
14:39
Speaker 9: Trudy Macintosh Sky News camera.
14:43
Speaker 2: Well, that's god to the latest on Ben Robert Smith's
14:46
Speaker 2: and bail hearing happened earlier today without an application submitted,
14:50
Speaker 2: So for now, the war hero remains behind bars on
14:53
Speaker 2: remand at Sydney's Silver Water Prison. A bail review where
14:57
Speaker 2: Todd has been scheduled for Friday weeks so that's the
14:59
Speaker 2: seven tenth of April. We'll watch that closely. Joining me
15:03
Speaker 2: now to discuss this and more, National affairs editor at
15:05
Speaker 2: The Daily Telegraph, Sky News host James Morrow, and the
15:09
Speaker 2: Deputy Executive Director at the IPA, Dan Wilde. Well, gentleman, James,
15:14
Speaker 2: I'll start with you. Actually, according to reports by Aaron
15:17
Speaker 2: Patrick in The Nightly, Robert Smith's lawyers offered in writing
15:22
Speaker 2: and this is to the AFP, to make him available
15:25
Speaker 2: to authorities to be arrested. But instead we got that
15:29
Speaker 2: spectacle yesterday of him arrested, reportedly in front of his daughters.
15:34
Speaker 2: And obviously there was that exclusive footage from Channel nine.
15:38
Speaker 2: There was some footage put out by the AFP, but
15:41
Speaker 2: there was also Channel nine footage which says to me
15:44
Speaker 2: there was a media tip off. Now, the AFP hasn't
15:47
Speaker 2: responded to the story that he offered to make himself
15:50
Speaker 2: available for arrest, but surely we could have handled this
15:55
Speaker 2: in a more dignified way.
15:58
Speaker 11: Peter, that's not even the star of it. I mean,
16:00
Speaker 11: let's think about what the Australian people are being confronted with.
16:04
Speaker 11: On the one hand, they're being told, Australia is a
16:08
Speaker 11: nation of laws, we have a rule book, we have
16:10
Speaker 11: a civilized way that we do things, and that's why
16:13
Speaker 11: allegations of this nature have to be tested in court.
16:16
Speaker 11: And Australians will say, okay, let's be fair minded about it.
16:20
Speaker 11: That's fine. If there's an allegation, you bring it, you
16:22
Speaker 11: test it, and there's a process. That's what a civilized
16:26
Speaker 11: society does. And yet at the same time they are
16:28
Speaker 11: being shown this spectacle of the AFP, which is supposed
16:32
Speaker 11: to be the organization here that is managing the investigatory
16:37
Speaker 11: process that we're talking about behind the rule of law
16:41
Speaker 11: that we all enjoy here in this country, acting like this,
16:46
Speaker 11: this media circus, generating a media circus, the idea that
16:50
Speaker 11: Ben Roberts Smith couldn't be given the opportunity, and this
16:53
Speaker 11: happens regularly with high profile defendants to present himself at
16:58
Speaker 11: a police station, surrender himself with his lawyers, to be arrested,
17:02
Speaker 11: to be processed, to be charged, rather than dragged off
17:06
Speaker 11: a plane like this in front of his children apparently,
17:09
Speaker 11: and with the AFP bringing a media team. I'm told
17:13
Speaker 11: to Sydney to manage all of the media that's going
17:16
Speaker 11: to be around this. This looks so much like the
17:19
Speaker 11: AFP trying to get a headline and not you know,
17:23
Speaker 11: an investigation going in a proper fashion. It's a disgrace
17:27
Speaker 11: and I think people should be really outraged about this, Peter,
17:30
Speaker 11: because if we live in a rule of law society
17:33
Speaker 11: and we test allegations properly, then that process has to
17:36
Speaker 11: be done fairly and judiciously and not like you know,
17:40
Speaker 11: the investigating body is after a headline, because then the
17:44
Speaker 11: whole thing that they're going for falls apart.
17:48
Speaker 3: Yeah, you're not wrong.
17:49
Speaker 2: And if he is being charged, the allegation is that
17:53
Speaker 2: he operated outside an international law, it was an unlawful killing.
17:56
Speaker 2: If that's the allegation of a war crime, then police
18:00
Speaker 2: have to do everything by the book. The police have
18:02
Speaker 2: to be seen to be dealing with this soberly and carefully.
18:06
Speaker 2: And that to me looked like a bit of a
18:08
Speaker 2: show trial, a bit of a show arrest yesterday made
18:11
Speaker 2: for the media. Another institution I want to call out
18:15
Speaker 2: here too, if I can, dan the Australian War Memorial.
18:18
Speaker 2: Now they are changing or looking to review wording they
18:23
Speaker 2: have around a display that involves Ben Robert Smith. They
18:27
Speaker 2: say they won't be taken down the exhibit, but they
18:29
Speaker 2: may change the wording. Now, come on, he hasn't been
18:34
Speaker 2: convicted of.
18:35
Speaker 12: Anything exactly, and as you said in your monologue, innocent
18:40
Speaker 12: until proven guilty. This beggars belief. If there has been
18:44
Speaker 12: a transgression, if he has done something wrong, but then
18:47
Speaker 12: that should be dealt with. I don't understand why this
18:50
Speaker 12: whole thing has taken ten years. Imagine the effect that
18:54
Speaker 12: this must be having on the morale of other troops,
18:58
Speaker 12: of other diggers. Already a problem with morale. There's already
19:02
Speaker 12: a perception among frontline soldiers at the top brass and
19:05
Speaker 12: those at the political level don't have their backs in
19:08
Speaker 12: a conflict. But I can assure you Australians do have
19:11
Speaker 12: their backs in any kind of conflict. We are at
19:14
Speaker 12: a time when we need a bigger army, we need
19:17
Speaker 12: a bigger defense force. We need more people putting their
19:20
Speaker 12: hand up to sign up for what might be a
19:22
Speaker 12: very dangerous, life threatening mission to protect our nation. And
19:26
Speaker 12: we know that there are record numbers of young Australians
19:29
Speaker 12: who are saying they don't want to join up to
19:32
Speaker 12: the arm armed services because they're ashamed of Australia and
19:37
Speaker 12: they don't want to put the uniform on. So you know,
19:39
Speaker 12: this couldn't come at a worse time. As I say,
19:42
Speaker 12: if there have been wrongdoings, then deal with that in
19:45
Speaker 12: a proper way. But I've got to agree with James,
19:47
Speaker 12: this does seem to be more of a media circus
19:50
Speaker 12: than a serious investigation at this point.
19:54
Speaker 2: Right, let's go back to the circus that was their
19:57
Speaker 2: press conference with Chris Bowen today.
20:01
Speaker 4: I think you need to show a bit more respect
20:02
Speaker 4: for your colleagues. This is a full room a journalist.
20:06
Speaker 2: And he kept banging on about respect Dan, I mean,
20:08
Speaker 2: how about some respect for the regional communities that he's
20:10
Speaker 2: running roughshot over with you all of his renewable rollouts.
20:15
Speaker 2: He doesn't like it when he gets a few tough questions,
20:18
Speaker 2: and Liam Bartler just kept going at him and Adim
20:21
Speaker 2: met nowhere to hide.
20:24
Speaker 12: Yeah, I enjoyed watching that very much. It's very rare
20:28
Speaker 12: that I enjoy a press conference because often it's a
20:30
Speaker 12: bunch of soft questions that have been teed up earlier.
20:34
Speaker 12: So good on, Liam Bartlan and the others were actually
20:37
Speaker 12: asking proper questions on this occasion. It was also such
20:40
Speaker 12: a Canberra bubble moment where he Chris Bong was more
20:43
Speaker 12: focused on so you know, the collegiate atmosphere of the
20:46
Speaker 12: journalists and the politicians, and they're all supposed to get along,
20:49
Speaker 12: as you say, where's his respect for the regional communities,
20:51
Speaker 12: Where's his respect for Australians when it comes to the
20:54
Speaker 12: power bills, when it comes to the broken promises, when
20:57
Speaker 12: it comes to the fact that the only solution they
20:59
Speaker 12: have is to throw more taxpayer moneies at manufacturing facilities
21:04
Speaker 12: that are closing because of their own policies. You know,
21:06
Speaker 12: it is net zero policies that is causing these facilities
21:09
Speaker 12: to shut down. And they here, go, here's a billion
21:11
Speaker 12: dollars to put some solar panels on your roof. That's
21:14
Speaker 12: the best answer that they have. So, you know, I
21:16
Speaker 12: thought it was very revealing in the more Australian sea
21:18
Speaker 12: of this, the less confidence they have.
21:22
Speaker 3: You're right, it's a club.
21:23
Speaker 2: I found that out when I went down and confronted
21:25
Speaker 2: Dan Andrews and COVID. They were hissing and building, not
21:28
Speaker 2: the Labor Party people, all the other journalists. I don't
21:30
Speaker 2: like it when you show them up. Let's go to
21:32
Speaker 2: that speech the other speech today by Matt cannav at
21:34
Speaker 2: of course at the Press Club, he talked about his
21:37
Speaker 2: patriot agenda James. He says, I'm open to getting rid
21:40
Speaker 2: of tariffs and restrictions on immigration. We'd all agree with
21:43
Speaker 2: that last one. And I want to say on tariffs,
21:46
Speaker 2: I know a lot of limbs where the free trade
21:49
Speaker 2: badge so proudly. But free trade works when there is
21:53
Speaker 2: a level playing field, when the world operates in a
21:56
Speaker 2: free trade environment. But often Australia is the one that
22:00
Speaker 2: cops tariffs at the other end, or you know, subsidies
22:04
Speaker 2: as we know in the EU to farmers that are
22:06
Speaker 2: not subsidized here.
22:08
Speaker 3: So it's not a level playing field.
22:10
Speaker 11: Yeah, no, it's not a level playing field. And I mean,
22:12
Speaker 11: you know, Australia does cop in Australia. I think it's
22:14
Speaker 11: probably been copying it on the world trade front ever
22:17
Speaker 11: since at least China was allowed into the WTO. But
22:20
Speaker 11: I think the other really interesting thing here with Matt
22:23
Speaker 11: Canavan's speech here is that he's out there putting out,
22:26
Speaker 11: you know, ideas, policies, taking stances on things. You know,
22:31
Speaker 11: I wouldn't be so quite so protectionist as Matt. I'd
22:34
Speaker 11: be more about comparative advantage. But you know, these are quibbles,
22:37
Speaker 11: these are discussions, but he's setting out real points of
22:40
Speaker 11: intellectual discussion. And one of the things that I'm concerned
22:43
Speaker 11: about here for the Liberal Party is that he's out
22:46
Speaker 11: there giving very strong, very firm, big ideas on this.
22:51
Speaker 11: The shift of leadership from Susan Lee to Angus Taylor
22:54
Speaker 11: was supposed to start generating more policies and more ideas
22:58
Speaker 11: out of the Liberal Party. We still don't have, you know,
23:00
Speaker 11: an immigration policy, which everybody's been waiting for. We still
23:03
Speaker 11: don't have a lot of policies on a lot of things.
23:06
Speaker 11: And Taylor has been looking a bit you know, dearing
23:09
Speaker 11: the headlights here on a lot of these things. Hasn't
23:11
Speaker 11: really come out said much about Ben Roberts Smith. He
23:14
Speaker 11: hasn't come out on a lot of these sort of
23:15
Speaker 11: issues that are running hard at the moment. And I
23:19
Speaker 11: think that Matt Canavan, there's going to be a lot
23:21
Speaker 11: of people looking at Canavan and what he's seeing and
23:24
Speaker 11: comparing I think where the Liberals are on this, you know,
23:27
Speaker 11: not entirely favorably.
23:30
Speaker 2: I think we're looking to the budget address in replies
23:33
Speaker 2: at the Thursday after the Tuesday Budget nine speech, Frangez Taylor,
23:37
Speaker 2: as you rightly point out, to hit the mark on
23:39
Speaker 2: all of those things, because if he doesn't do it,
23:41
Speaker 2: then I'm not saying he has to have fully worked
23:43
Speaker 2: up policies, but he has to have very clear convictions,
23:47
Speaker 2: particularly economic ones and budget ones. Otherwise we'll absolutely say
23:51
Speaker 2: James and it is found wanting and that he is
23:54
Speaker 2: being shown up by the National Party. Alive it there, gentlemen,
23:57
Speaker 2: thank you. Let's go out on what's been a whirlwind
24:00
Speaker 2: twenty four hours. When it comes to the war in Iran.
24:03
Speaker 2: Around ten o'clock last night, President Trump posted a whole civilization,
24:08
Speaker 2: he said, we'll die tonight. Then here in Australia, of course,
24:11
Speaker 2: we woke up to the news that Iran and the
24:13
Speaker 2: US that agreed to a two week ceasefire, during which
24:16
Speaker 2: time we're told that shipping will recommence through the straight
24:20
Speaker 2: off hermus That was followed up at two o'clock today
24:23
Speaker 2: with a president declaring and I quote, a big day
24:26
Speaker 2: for world peace. Iran wants it to happen. They've had enough. Likewise,
24:30
Speaker 2: so has everyone else. Well, twenty four hours, it says
24:33
Speaker 2: a long time in politics but this is a new record.
24:36
Speaker 2: Perhaps joining me now in the Australians Foreign Editor Greg Sheridan, Okay,
24:41
Speaker 2: you know, it's a bit like reading the tea leaves here,
24:44
Speaker 2: but we've got those statements from the president. We've told
24:48
Speaker 2: that we now have this two week ceasefire.
24:50
Speaker 3: Greg, where does this leave us?
24:53
Speaker 2: And can we trust the Iranians to negotiate in good faith?
24:59
Speaker 13: Please? It's great to be with you. We certainly can't
25:02
Speaker 13: trust the Iranians, but in a sense there's no moral
25:05
Speaker 13: equivalence between Trump and the Iranians. Of course Trump's a
25:08
Speaker 13: democratically elected leader, but you can't really trust anything that
25:11
Speaker 13: Trump says either. I remember covering the press conference he
25:15
Speaker 13: gave in Singapore in twenty eighteen where he said he
25:17
Speaker 13: had solved the nuclear problem in North Korea and North
25:20
Speaker 13: Korea had promised to de nuclear rise and that there
25:23
Speaker 13: was no longer a nuclear threat. Of course, North Korea
25:25
Speaker 13: has kept getting more nuclear weapons ever since. And do
25:28
Speaker 13: you remember, more recently, all the provisions of the Gaza
25:31
Speaker 13: peace settlement, You know, Harmas was going to disarm and
25:35
Speaker 13: the neutral technocratic government or so. Trump has a very
25:39
Speaker 13: bad record of announcing fabulous peace deals and then they
25:43
Speaker 13: turn out to be anything. But now the peace deal
25:47
Speaker 13: Trump is the ceasefire that Trump is describing and the
25:50
Speaker 13: ceasefire that Iran is describing simply in contradictory universes. The
25:55
Speaker 13: key question for me will be whether the Iranians get
25:59
Speaker 13: to charge a toll for ships going through the Straight
26:03
Speaker 13: of hor Moves. If this ceasefire means Iran controls the
26:06
Speaker 13: Straight of Horror moves, that's a tremendous defeat and strategic
26:10
Speaker 13: setback for the US and the allies. If there is
26:14
Speaker 13: free passage through the Straight of hor moves, I don't
26:17
Speaker 13: think Iran's going to give America or anything on the
26:19
Speaker 13: nuclear question. But then that would mean Trump has, you know,
26:24
Speaker 13: got out of it. I mean, Trump clearly wanted to
26:26
Speaker 13: run away from this circumstance, and I think he's got
26:29
Speaker 13: out of it with a barely defensible deal so long
26:31
Speaker 13: as there is free passage in the Straight of Horror moves.
26:34
Speaker 13: But that's the key sixty four million dollar question will
26:37
Speaker 13: work out in the next week or so.
26:40
Speaker 2: Okay, you know my view. I'd much prefer the US
26:43
Speaker 2: finish the job. I don't think you start this stuff
26:46
Speaker 2: unless you're prepared to finish it. But you know, I
26:49
Speaker 2: know a lot of people are critical that he's belly coast,
26:51
Speaker 2: that he's said some stuff that are beyond the palalo
26:54
Speaker 2: or type, some stuff that's beyond the pile with those
26:57
Speaker 2: posts in the last.
26:58
Speaker 3: Twenty four hours.
26:59
Speaker 2: But clearly this sort of approaching it, it's the way
27:02
Speaker 2: he plays the game of politics from day one. It
27:05
Speaker 2: has brought the Uranians to the table. So can't we
27:08
Speaker 2: at least say that we're in a position that we
27:11
Speaker 2: are far better off today than we were yesterday.
27:15
Speaker 13: No, Peter, I'd have to respectfully disagree with you there.
27:18
Speaker 13: I think the Iranians Trump interpret Trump's bizarre social media
27:23
Speaker 13: posts as a sign of his desperation. They are used
27:29
Speaker 13: to being threatened by Americans. That's that's absolutely routine. And
27:34
Speaker 13: Trump has clearly been in a big mess on this
27:37
Speaker 13: stuff because his economy is suffering and his political position
27:42
Speaker 13: in the US is suffering, and he wanted a way out. Now,
27:45
Speaker 13: Trump makes all these kinds of threats to everybody. Remember
27:48
Speaker 13: he was going to rain fire and fury on the
27:50
Speaker 13: North Koreans and if the Hammas didn't disarm, he would
27:54
Speaker 13: disarm for them, and.
27:55
Speaker 7: All that.
27:57
Speaker 2: Jump in the thought me just jump in there though.
28:00
Speaker 2: But I mean, we had Obama, we had Biden. I mean,
28:04
Speaker 2: I think history is replete with US leaders, world leaders
28:07
Speaker 2: declaring world peace in the Middle East and it never
28:09
Speaker 2: ever comes off. So, yes, he's threatened, Yes he's threatened Iran,
28:14
Speaker 2: but it's also bombed the crap out of them. Now,
28:16
Speaker 2: not many people have done that. They've threatened Iran. They've
28:18
Speaker 2: had red lines in the sand, as you know, with Obama,
28:21
Speaker 2: those red lines get crossed. Biden pays them six billion dollars.
28:25
Speaker 2: I mean, this is the first time there has been
28:28
Speaker 2: a position put to the Iranians and then there's been
28:31
Speaker 2: a consequence when they've failed to meet.
28:34
Speaker 3: The Western end.
28:36
Speaker 13: Talking about we've got to be talking about Trump's no, no, Well,
28:41
Speaker 13: I think we've got to be. We've got to stick
28:42
Speaker 13: to the facts. So Trump says this war is finished
28:47
Speaker 13: after about three days. Last week, he said in a
28:50
Speaker 13: solemn address to the American people, we don't care about
28:52
Speaker 13: the straight up war moves. It means nothing to us.
28:54
Speaker 13: It will open up automatically. We're finished. We can go home,
28:57
Speaker 13: the Europeans can look after it. Then he said we're
29:00
Speaker 13: going to bomb the Iranians into the Stone Age unless
29:03
Speaker 13: they open the Straight of hor Moves. Now the Iranians
29:06
Speaker 13: have If they control the Straight of hor Moves, They've
29:09
Speaker 13: won an enormous strategic victory because they have withstood the
29:13
Speaker 13: worst that Trump can give and they haven't buckled. Their
29:17
Speaker 13: regime is intact. They're still firing missiles and drones at
29:21
Speaker 13: Israel and at the Gulf. The Islamic Revolutionary Guard is
29:25
Speaker 13: still in control of Iran. They haven't given up there
29:28
Speaker 13: enriched uranium. And if they charge a toll on ships
29:31
Speaker 13: going through the Straight of hor Moves, that is a
29:34
Speaker 13: big victory. Now, Trump's extreme rhetoric has damaged the US
29:39
Speaker 13: alliance system all over the world. Australia is one of
29:42
Speaker 13: the most pro American countries in the world, but according
29:45
Speaker 13: to Sky's own polling, more than seventy percent of Australians
29:48
Speaker 13: think Trump has handled this very badly. Now, previous presidents
29:52
Speaker 13: of George W. Bush they understood they needed to win
29:56
Speaker 13: support from their own public, they needed to win permis
30:00
Speaker 13: to take this action from their own public, and they
30:02
Speaker 13: needed to win some approval from Allied publics. But any
30:06
Speaker 13: Allied leader now would have to go against the wishes
30:10
Speaker 13: of his own public or her own public to support Trump.
30:14
Speaker 13: So I think this has been really a mess. I mean,
30:17
Speaker 13: Trump has shown resolve in taking the military action, but
30:21
Speaker 13: he has messed up every tactical element of this matter.
30:25
Speaker 13: And as I say, if Iran ends up controlling the
30:28
Speaker 13: straight of holl moves, that's a big victory for them.
30:32
Speaker 2: Well over there, Greg, I think the big game is
30:34
Speaker 2: putting around under some pressure and neutralizing the nuclear threat.
30:38
Speaker 2: As I say, I wish they would do more, not
30:40
Speaker 2: less here, but that's where we are tonight, and I'll
30:42
Speaker 2: leave it there, thank you.
30:44
Speaker 11: All.
30:44
Speaker 3: Right after the break, I want.
30:45
Speaker 2: To speak to a bloke who held the Defense portfolio
30:48
Speaker 2: during the time that it's alleged, Ben Robert Smith committed
30:52
Speaker 2: some of his crimes, certainly when he was in Afghanistan.
30:55
Speaker 2: His reaction to the Chargers facing the VC recipient.
31:00
Speaker 3: And coming up welcome back still to come.
31:06
Speaker 2: More reports of widespread raughting across the NDIS.
31:10
Speaker 3: Will get to that in.
31:11
Speaker 2: A moment, but let's now return to Ben Robert Smith,
31:15
Speaker 2: because this is already taking a huge toll on veterans
31:18
Speaker 2: and their families. My next guest, Joel Fitzgiven was Defense
31:22
Speaker 2: Minister during the first rd government for two years until
31:25
Speaker 2: two thousand and nine, the same period of time that
31:28
Speaker 2: Ben Robert Smith was in Afghanistan. He's also the dad
31:32
Speaker 2: of a soldier himself, his late son, Lance Corporal Jack Fitzgibbon,
31:37
Speaker 2: who was tragically killed in a training accident with the
31:40
Speaker 2: two Commando Regiment.
31:42
Speaker 3: Joel Fitzgibbon. Welcome.
31:44
Speaker 2: None of this I suspect to given your history and
31:47
Speaker 2: defense and the wonderful service of your son. None of
31:52
Speaker 2: this is easy. You're a dad who's the father of
31:55
Speaker 2: a veteran, but also Defense Minister. I've got to ask you,
32:00
Speaker 2: in a broad sense, what's this doing to the veteran
32:04
Speaker 2: community around Australia and the family members are veterans.
32:12
Speaker 14: It is having an enormous impact, Peter, not just on
32:15
Speaker 14: the veterans community, but the community more generally. I've spent
32:19
Speaker 14: the last twenty four hours talking to people both in
32:23
Speaker 14: my communities but also people around the country, people who,
32:27
Speaker 14: by the way, who have called me thanking me, congratulating
32:32
Speaker 14: me on my contribution or my response to Ben's arrest.
32:37
Speaker 14: This is growing very, very big, and I wouldn't be
32:41
Speaker 14: surprised if at some point we see sort of community
32:45
Speaker 14: rallies based around this cause people are upset now. I
32:49
Speaker 14: think most fair minded Australians expect us as a country
32:52
Speaker 14: to maintain high standards in defense and you know, take
32:58
Speaker 14: appropriate action where we think think things have gone off
33:01
Speaker 14: the rails. But Ben Robert Smith is entitled to the
33:07
Speaker 14: resumption of innocence. As you said earlier, he should not
33:11
Speaker 14: be in jail tonight. He's not a fright risk, he's
33:16
Speaker 14: not a threat to the community. There's no chance he's
33:18
Speaker 14: not going to front up for future appearances at court.
33:25
Speaker 14: There's no chance he's going to be somehow tampering with
33:29
Speaker 14: evidence or witnesses, etc. I think we owe him nothing
33:33
Speaker 14: if we don't owe him his freedom at this time.
33:37
Speaker 14: He'll have his day in court, but he shouldn't be
33:40
Speaker 14: sitting in a jail cell tonight.
33:43
Speaker 2: I made comments about how poorly I think it was
33:46
Speaker 2: handled yesterday. There are reports published in the media in
33:49
Speaker 2: the Nightly newspaper that his lawyers offered the AFP for
33:53
Speaker 2: him to front a police station if there was interest
33:55
Speaker 2: in arresting him. Instead, they did it the way they
33:58
Speaker 2: did in the full there at the media spotlight. It
34:03
Speaker 2: seems like, you know, as a nation, we send these
34:06
Speaker 2: young men off to war. We had them at the
34:09
Speaker 2: pointing end of the spear. As you know, there were
34:11
Speaker 2: our special forces doing some of the toughest jobs that
34:14
Speaker 2: any soldier can do, and they were behind enemy lines.
34:17
Speaker 2: And it was a brutal twenty year war. And you
34:21
Speaker 2: know better than anyone, Joel, you would have got the
34:24
Speaker 2: briefings that I got when I was there with Tony
34:26
Speaker 2: Abbott about the catch and release program and what that
34:29
Speaker 2: did to their morale. I mean, I think we all
34:32
Speaker 2: bear a responsibility for that. I mean, this catch and
34:35
Speaker 2: release program was shocking for soldiers to live under.
34:42
Speaker 14: Well, the favorite, my favorite cartoon in my collection from
34:45
Speaker 14: my time in politics, Peter is one which depicts an
34:49
Speaker 14: Australian tank going up the front steps of Natail and
34:55
Speaker 14: one European looking through the window. I asked the other
34:58
Speaker 14: what's got into the Aussie and he said, regime change.
35:02
Speaker 14: I was most upset when I became Minister by the
35:06
Speaker 14: strategy or lack thereof in Afghanistan, the things that our
35:11
Speaker 14: boys weren't getting, like medivacs and close air combat support,
35:15
Speaker 14: et cetera, but overall just a plan to win. When
35:20
Speaker 14: we were sending our boys into the most dangerous parts
35:24
Speaker 14: of the world in complex camera insurgency situations, under fire,
35:29
Speaker 14: risking their lives, constrained by rules of engagement, domestic law,
35:36
Speaker 14: international law, fighting an enemy that fought to no rules
35:41
Speaker 14: or laws or no uniform, used kids as human shields,
35:46
Speaker 14: used in our improvised explosive devices in every day breaking
35:52
Speaker 14: the normal laws of conflict. Yet no one in Afghanistan
35:56
Speaker 14: is being held to account for any of that.
36:01
Speaker 2: What about the accountability of the senior command, because it
36:04
Speaker 2: does strike me as implausible that no one in senior
36:09
Speaker 2: command are the senior commanders who were there on the ground,
36:11
Speaker 2: And again you and I have met them, who then
36:14
Speaker 2: turned up higher up the ranks when they got back
36:16
Speaker 2: to Canberra.
36:17
Speaker 3: They were promoted, Some.
36:19
Speaker 2: Ended up as Chief of Army or Chief of Defense Force,
36:21
Speaker 2: very very senior ranked positions. None of them are accountable
36:25
Speaker 2: for any of this, that their names are not smeared
36:28
Speaker 2: in the Brereton report. Again, that's implausible to me.
36:35
Speaker 14: Well, you know, Peter, youve you as might not know
36:38
Speaker 14: that you can as an officer, you can sit in
36:41
Speaker 14: HQ Jock in Buyundor and receive a medal for operations
36:45
Speaker 14: in Afghanistan so they can take the win. And of
36:49
Speaker 14: course all of us should be taking more responsibility for
36:53
Speaker 14: many of the things that went wrong there. I'm not
36:55
Speaker 14: talking about war crimes now, I'm talking about the lack
36:58
Speaker 14: of coordination support our people sometimes had. We sent them there,
37:05
Speaker 14: not our fault in time, because it was an international
37:07
Speaker 14: force and we didn't have much control over the planning
37:11
Speaker 14: and strategic direction. But we sent them there without a
37:15
Speaker 14: plan to win, and we didn't win, notwithstanding the fact
37:19
Speaker 14: that our people did some amazing things on the battlefield
37:23
Speaker 14: and had some enormous victories. But you must understand that
37:27
Speaker 14: they knew there wasn't a plan to win. They knew
37:30
Speaker 14: they were playing at an un level playing field, and
37:34
Speaker 14: of course, in the fog of wars, things do go wrong,
37:39
Speaker 14: and that doesn't mean people shouldn't be held to account.
37:41
Speaker 14: But I think that we need to be sensible about this.
37:44
Speaker 14: And I don't think many Australians would believe we should
37:46
Speaker 14: be spending up to three hundred million dollars in pursuit
37:51
Speaker 14: of our Australian heroes. I think they believe there are
37:54
Speaker 14: better things to spend that money on.
37:57
Speaker 3: Just quickly, Joel, before you go.
37:59
Speaker 2: They are desperate for a voice, someone with standing, someone
38:03
Speaker 2: of your caliber, not just as a defense dat as
38:05
Speaker 2: I said, but also someone has held a defense portfolio.
38:09
Speaker 2: I know Ben Robert Smith. His case will go through
38:11
Speaker 2: the course. I'm not talking necessarily about him. But are
38:14
Speaker 2: you going to keep speaking up in defense of these boys?
38:20
Speaker 14: Yeah, yeah, of course I am, because they deserve to
38:23
Speaker 14: be defended. You know, these guys protected me in Afghanistan
38:28
Speaker 14: on a number of occasions. I know them well because
38:31
Speaker 14: of the loss of our son Jack, I know them
38:34
Speaker 14: even better. In fact, I still spend time with them
38:38
Speaker 14: on a regular basis, although most of them I spend
38:40
Speaker 14: time with now have transitioned out. These are good people, Peter,
38:45
Speaker 14: who went to Afghanistan to do the right things. Now,
38:49
Speaker 14: if some things went wrong and the fog of war
38:51
Speaker 14: under fire in the chaos of a counterinsurgency, of course
38:55
Speaker 14: we should be asking the questions and holding people to account.
38:59
Speaker 14: These guys have been relentlessly pursued with big dollars. Why
39:05
Speaker 14: is that so, Peter? Journalistic activism and the response to it.
39:12
Speaker 14: You know, people who are going hard because they think
39:15
Speaker 14: that they're going to get a bad headline out of it. Well,
39:17
Speaker 14: I think they'll get more bad headlines if they don't
39:21
Speaker 14: treat our heroes with respect.
39:25
Speaker 3: Could not agree more.
39:26
Speaker 2: Good on your Joel, Good on you and please keep
39:28
Speaker 2: speaking up as I look here and I know others
39:31
Speaker 2: will too. Thank you or a quick break after the
39:33
Speaker 2: break the panel and then Kel, welcome.
39:41
Speaker 3: Back, let's get into it.
39:42
Speaker 2: I didn't want to cover that interview with Joel if
39:44
Speaker 2: it's given short, so I'll move quickly through the panel.
39:47
Speaker 2: But the story that's interesting me today is this story
39:51
Speaker 2: that nearly fifty thousand migrants who are non citizens have
39:56
Speaker 2: purchased you home since mid twenty twenty three under the
40:00
Speaker 2: government scheme that is available to citizens, of course, but
40:04
Speaker 2: also non citizens. Here to discuss this, the more head
40:07
Speaker 2: of advocacy at the Australian Women's Forums Definite Bastian and
40:11
Speaker 2: Liberal and p Tony Passen or Tony Passon. I was
40:15
Speaker 2: not aware of that detail as a taxpayer. I'm not
40:19
Speaker 2: that happy about it.
40:22
Speaker 6: You and me both, Peter, and thanks for having me.
40:26
Speaker 6: It came as news to me that non residents could
40:28
Speaker 6: avail themselves to this scheme. This is a scheme that's
40:30
Speaker 6: meant to support young Australians into their first home, not
40:35
Speaker 6: young non Australians. It just smacks of duplicity. And I
40:41
Speaker 6: was as shocked as you were to read the reports today.
40:45
Speaker 3: This is the stuff that fuels one nation, staff, doesn't
40:48
Speaker 3: it absolutely?
40:50
Speaker 5: I mean, these programs are meant to support Australian citizens,
40:53
Speaker 5: they're taxpayer funded. They should be prioritizing them. And when
40:56
Speaker 5: you have a housing crisis such as we do now,
40:59
Speaker 5: they should be limiting eligibility, not expanding it.
41:03
Speaker 2: And of course we've got the Ndis Tony. We read
41:06
Speaker 2: every single day there's a different story about some new wrought,
41:09
Speaker 2: but we read that there are invoices where entities are
41:13
Speaker 2: paid tens of thousands of dollars and they're not even
41:16
Speaker 2: digitized at they're handwritten scraps of paper that suffices for
41:20
Speaker 2: an invoice into the government. They get their money, they
41:24
Speaker 2: walk away, and many of these they look very dubious,
41:28
Speaker 2: say the least.
41:30
Speaker 6: Well, Peter, we've got to stop the roots and rip off.
41:32
Speaker 6: So this is a fifty billion dollar scheme now that's
41:35
Speaker 6: running at a ten percent growth rate, and we learn today,
41:39
Speaker 6: as you point out, about thirty percent of the invoices
41:42
Speaker 6: that are submitted to the scheme in handwriting, and many
41:45
Speaker 6: of them illegible. It opens up the scope for fraud
41:49
Speaker 6: and grift and it's not good enough. We need to
41:51
Speaker 6: get on top of the growth of this scheme, but
41:54
Speaker 6: we also need to make sure measures to ensure the
41:58
Speaker 6: efficacy of the scheme is tied as possible. And the
42:00
Speaker 6: very first thing we should expect is that invoices are digitized,
42:04
Speaker 6: that they're in a form that can be read and
42:07
Speaker 6: processed and assessed. Because this isn't a small scheme. It's
42:10
Speaker 6: now bigger than Medicare, and it's close to defense in
42:13
Speaker 6: terms of our annual spend. It's losing its social license quickly,
42:18
Speaker 6: news report, afternoon report, and that's the problem. I don't
42:22
Speaker 6: want it to because it needs to operate for the
42:24
Speaker 6: most vulnerable Australians. But if we allow it just to
42:27
Speaker 6: expand and run wrought upon wrought, then it just will
42:33
Speaker 6: completely collapse on itself.
42:36
Speaker 2: Hey, a big wins Stephanie against the taxpayer fund at
42:39
Speaker 2: ABC for using our money involved in diversity and inclusion groups.
42:46
Speaker 2: After the media has shone a bit of a light
42:48
Speaker 2: on this, isn't it?
42:50
Speaker 3: Oh?
42:50
Speaker 5: Absolutely, I mean this has been a long time coming.
42:52
Speaker 5: Their influence over the ABC has been diabolical in the
42:56
Speaker 5: sense that they haven't been impartial in reporting on the
42:59
Speaker 5: harms of things like gender ideology, all the harms to
43:02
Speaker 5: women being done through the loss of their sex base
43:04
Speaker 5: rights in sports and prisons. This really mirrors what happened
43:08
Speaker 5: with the BBC and Stonewall. They withdrew following Also the
43:12
Speaker 5: NHS withdrew and so did the Crown Prosecution.
43:16
Speaker 3: So I think Australia also.
43:18
Speaker 5: Needs to look at their government departments azo health and
43:21
Speaker 5: also withdraw them. And I think the ABC also probably
43:24
Speaker 5: needs to do a little bit of reprogramming in the
43:26
Speaker 5: sense that they've had such a long relationship with ACON,
43:29
Speaker 5: they need to root out the harm that it's done
43:32
Speaker 5: and how it's affected its reporting.
43:36
Speaker 2: Let's go to the city of Sydney because of building
43:38
Speaker 2: that they are they own. I think they're not necessarily
43:41
Speaker 2: involved in the event, but they certainly link to it.
43:44
Speaker 2: They've involved around this event, which is basically a call
43:48
Speaker 2: to justify the intero farda or the cause for an
43:52
Speaker 2: inter farder. Now we're only a couple of months on
43:54
Speaker 2: now from the Bondai attack. I know Chris men said
43:58
Speaker 2: that he wanted to ban the phrase in relation to
44:01
Speaker 2: an into fada, and we saw that outcry against Grace Tamee,
44:04
Speaker 2: but we still haven't got the legislation and we've got
44:06
Speaker 2: Clover Moore's mob Tony allowing this.
44:11
Speaker 6: Unbelievable. This is hateful, violent rhetoric and it's got no
44:15
Speaker 6: place in Australian society. And you would expect elected officials
44:19
Speaker 6: like those at the City of Sydney wouldn't make spaces
44:23
Speaker 6: that are funded by the public available for these kind
44:26
Speaker 6: of purposes. I mean, I hate this idea that it's
44:30
Speaker 6: all about social cohesion. This is just disgusting behavior. Whether
44:34
Speaker 6: it's about social cohesion or not, the reality is it
44:38
Speaker 6: should be ruled out because it's hateful, violent rhetoric and
44:42
Speaker 6: that's not the society we want to live in.
44:45
Speaker 2: Steph, I know you're in South Australia now, but you've
44:49
Speaker 2: got a long connection with Victorian Liberals. There's now twenty,
44:53
Speaker 2: sorry seventy people who are delegates to State Council who
44:57
Speaker 2: have signed a letter demanding the resignation of the President
45:00
Speaker 2: Phil Davis. They want to give Jess Wilson the best
45:03
Speaker 2: chance to beat labor in November. That's what they're arguing
45:07
Speaker 2: for and they say Head Office under Davis can't run
45:11
Speaker 2: the sort of campaign that needs to be run and
45:13
Speaker 2: they want the place cleaned out.
45:16
Speaker 6: Absolutely.
45:17
Speaker 5: And I think it was on your show last week
45:18
Speaker 5: that I also called for his resignation. We have a
45:21
Speaker 5: new leader in Victoria. The Victorian government needs to be
45:25
Speaker 5: turfed and under his leadership it has been an absolute shocker.
45:30
Speaker 3: It has been.
45:30
Speaker 5: Leaking and briefing and the Liberals have been in the
45:33
Speaker 5: press for all the wrong reasons. Throughout the entire preselection process,
45:36
Speaker 5: he has said nothing, He's pulled no one into line.
45:39
Speaker 5: He's allowed it to go on and quite frankly, he
45:41
Speaker 5: should take responsibility and resign.
45:45
Speaker 2: That Stevie does. I'll over there, Thank you both. All right,
45:48
Speaker 2: quick break coming up, Kel Richards, welcome back. Let's bring
45:56
Speaker 2: in the matter of the moment. Kel Richards. Dude joins
45:58
Speaker 2: me here every Wednesday, and we've got some phrases this week,
46:03
Speaker 2: phrases from our viewers. The first ones from Debra, who says,
46:07
Speaker 2: what does to vent your spleen mean?
46:10
Speaker 3: And where does it come from?
46:12
Speaker 7: The spleen is an organ near the stomach which controls
46:15
Speaker 7: the quality of your blood. But back in the old days,
46:19
Speaker 7: in the ancient days when they thought the body was
46:20
Speaker 7: controlled by the four humors blood, phlegm, bile, and black bile.
46:25
Speaker 7: They thought back in the ancient world that the what
46:29
Speaker 7: the spleen did was to produce a bile. Now it
46:33
Speaker 7: doesn't it's the kidneys that produce urine or yellow bile
46:36
Speaker 7: is that they call it in the ancient world. But
46:38
Speaker 7: they thought it came from the spleen, and they thought
46:40
Speaker 7: that yellow bile is what made people irritable and upset.
46:43
Speaker 7: They also called it collar, which is why irritable people
46:46
Speaker 7: are called choleric. Anyway, that's where they thought it came from.
46:49
Speaker 7: So the idea of letting all of the bile out
46:53
Speaker 7: of your out of your system was venting your spleen.
46:57
Speaker 7: And it appears the first person to say it was
46:59
Speaker 7: none On of Hippocrates about four hundred BC, although he
47:03
Speaker 7: said it in Greek, not in English.
47:06
Speaker 2: You know, I use it all the time, benure splant
47:09
Speaker 2: and get it up your chest and beat your splant.
47:11
Speaker 2: And now I know what it means. I didn't know
47:12
Speaker 2: any of that myself. Susie wants to know the origin
47:15
Speaker 2: of the phrase in the neck of.
47:17
Speaker 7: The woods when it first appeared in America around sixteen thirty.
47:21
Speaker 7: Neck meant narrow, so it referred to a narrow bit
47:24
Speaker 7: of geography, narrow pasture lands, narrow woodlands, any sort of
47:29
Speaker 7: narrow neighborhood was your neck of the woods because it
47:32
Speaker 7: was narrow. And then over the next two hundred years,
47:34
Speaker 7: the meaning of neck was just forgotten somehow in the language,
47:38
Speaker 7: so by the mid eighteen hundreds it simply meant any
47:41
Speaker 7: particular locality. Your neck of the woods was just where
47:44
Speaker 7: you lived. So the narrowness was there originally and then forgotten.
47:50
Speaker 2: What about a bitter end, because Albert's interested in that.
47:54
Speaker 7: Phrase, Interestingly, this is yet another nautical expression. There's a
47:58
Speaker 7: lot of them in our language. And the bitter end
48:02
Speaker 7: was the end of the rope on which the anchor
48:04
Speaker 7: was held, and sailors would be letting out the rope
48:07
Speaker 7: and they know what they were getting towards the end,
48:08
Speaker 7: because they tended to be rags tied around it to
48:12
Speaker 7: let them know they were getting towards the end. The
48:14
Speaker 7: rope was tied to the bollards on the deck of
48:16
Speaker 7: the ship, and the bollards were called bits, so they
48:19
Speaker 7: were getting to the bitter end or the bitter end
48:22
Speaker 7: when they saw the rags starting to appear. So we
48:25
Speaker 7: still use it to mean to the very end. But
48:29
Speaker 7: I had no idea until I did the research a
48:31
Speaker 7: little deep dive on that. I didn't know that's where
48:33
Speaker 7: it came from. It's fascinating, isn't it. Yeah?
48:37
Speaker 2: What about this one from Seoux? She wants to know
48:40
Speaker 2: the origin of the expression frog marched.
48:44
Speaker 7: The Oxford says it is pushing someone who's resisting or
48:47
Speaker 7: reluctant are usually by grabbing their collar or pitting their
48:51
Speaker 7: arms behind their back and pushing them along, sort of
48:54
Speaker 7: with their head and face pushed down. And apparently this
48:58
Speaker 7: was thought to resemble a frog marching on its belly,
49:02
Speaker 7: because they'll blow a pushdown though facing the ground like
49:05
Speaker 7: a frog marching on it. But now it's used for
49:08
Speaker 7: any scheme metaphorically to represent anyone who's rightidly pushed into something.
49:14
Speaker 9: Ye.
49:16
Speaker 3: Excellent, excellent. We'll get to ward next week. Thank you
49:20
Speaker 3: for those phrases.
49:21
Speaker 2: Do, my wonderful viewers, just a quick one, A bit
49:24
Speaker 2: of homework for you tonight. I want you to google
49:26
Speaker 2: Ben Roberts Smith VC citation. I want you to read
49:31
Speaker 2: the citation for his award of Victoria Cross.
49:35
Speaker 3: And that's sort of award.
49:36
Speaker 2: You don't win it, anyone who says you'll win it. No,
49:38
Speaker 2: he didn't win it.
49:39
Speaker 3: He was awarded it.
49:40
Speaker 2: He is a recipient. Please read it. We'll come back
49:43
Speaker 2: to that tomorrow night. That's it for me, see you tomorrow.
49:46
Speaker 3: He's Andrew