Latest / Adventure Sports Podcast / Ep. 1097: Jesse McNeal - Riding a Horse Across America Revisited

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Ep. 1097: Jesse McNeal - Riding a Horse Across America Revisited · Adventure Sports Podcast

0:06
[SPEAKER_03]: We hadn't learned to get along yet.
0:08
[SPEAKER_03]: We hadn't got a scheduled touchdown in yet.
0:11
[SPEAKER_03]: We hadn't got strong enough yet.
0:14
[SPEAKER_03]: And so we left from the Pacific Ocean and Emilio and right in the mountains.
0:20
[SPEAKER_00]: You're listening to the Adventure Sports podcast.
0:22
[SPEAKER_00]: We talk with adventurers from around the globe to bring you the inspiration and motivation you need to get started in the outdoors or to keep you moving if you're already there.
0:31
[SPEAKER_00]: Now here's your host, Kurt Lindville.
0:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Hi friends, thanks for listening today.
0:36
[SPEAKER_01]: Today's episode is from twenty twenty one when Mason interviewed Jessie Nick Niel about writing a horse across America and I love stories that involve the bond, the relationship, the interdependence between humans and animals and I think about amazing events like horseback writing through the wilderness or the idea to ride
1:01
[SPEAKER_01]: Many years ago my family visited Alaska and we signed up for one of these dog sled tours in the summertime where they pull you on a cart and
1:14
[SPEAKER_01]: The dogs were so excited they were so happy to be able to run and pull this cart and this cart had to weigh about a ton.
1:21
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know it was crazy.
1:23
[SPEAKER_01]: But the dogs were so happy and we did this just quick lap around a track with the dogs pulling us and they were having the time of their lives.
1:33
[SPEAKER_01]: There was something about that experience.
1:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Realizing that humans and animals can form special bonds and do amazing things together that are so joyful for the animals and the humans.
1:46
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know I was kind of hooked.
1:48
[SPEAKER_01]: Today's episode is not about dogs, it's about horses, but still the bond between humans and animals and depending on each other to accomplish amazing things and have amazing life experiences.
2:03
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's important to realize it's not about a human having an experience with animals involved.
2:08
[SPEAKER_01]: It's about a human and an animal having an amazing experience as a team together.
2:16
[SPEAKER_01]: So today's episode is going to be a lot of fun.
2:19
[SPEAKER_01]: Before we start the episode though, I was kind of thinking, what is the number one thing that people can do that requires almost no effort, no money, nothing that would really have a positive impact for the Adventure Sports podcast.
2:34
[SPEAKER_01]: And the answer is pretty easy.
2:35
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not Patreon, though we love Patreon.
2:39
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not leaving comments and reviews, although we love comments and reviews.
2:43
[SPEAKER_01]: The easiest number one thing that people can do will make a huge impact is to tell a friend about the adventures for a spotcast.
2:52
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just simply say, hey, dude, I was listening to this episode about this and it blew my mind.
2:57
[SPEAKER_01]: Give it a listen.
2:59
[SPEAKER_01]: That's it.
3:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Just share the joy with someone you care for, and that makes a huge difference for us, but also hopefully for them.
3:08
[SPEAKER_01]: You know how I'm always preaching this, but finding something that you love to do that gets you out into nature and makes you more active and improves your health and your mental health too, just interacting in a peaceful quiet place, burning off some stress, having fun,
3:24
[SPEAKER_01]: It's such a beautiful experience.
3:26
[SPEAKER_01]: So why not share the beauty with people you care about?
3:30
[SPEAKER_01]: Give that some thought.
3:31
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you very much and I hope you enjoy today's episode with Jesse McNill.
3:37
[SPEAKER_02]: All right, folks, welcome to the Adventure Sports podcast.
3:40
[SPEAKER_02]: We've got an episode that I'm pretty excited about.
3:43
[SPEAKER_02]: There is a book that goes along with it that'll be out now as you heard in the intro.
3:47
[SPEAKER_02]: But we're happy to introduce you to this show, Jesse Alexander McNeill.
3:52
[SPEAKER_02]: Also known as Alex Alexander McNeill.
3:54
[SPEAKER_02]: You might have met him as that out on the road, but Jesse, why don't you tell us about what we were just talking about that name distinction and of course, welcome to the show.
4:02
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, hey, thanks a lot, Mason.
4:04
[SPEAKER_03]: Please appreciate me in here and
4:07
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, all your podcasts are really quite interesting and I appreciate joining.
4:12
[SPEAKER_03]: When you get out out on the road or into the woods, some people adopt trail names as they go along.
4:18
[SPEAKER_03]: If they're on the application trail or the Pacific Crest trail and
4:22
[SPEAKER_03]: That kind of becomes their identity.
4:24
[SPEAKER_03]: And for me, I still want to kind of keep my own existence.
4:30
[SPEAKER_03]: But Alex is my middle name.
4:32
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I started going by Alex while I was on the horseback ride as sort of a way of kind of pushing the envelope a little bit on my not my personality and I wanted to.
4:44
[SPEAKER_03]: kind of shed some of the old past a little bit and so sometimes you go by your first name you're always associated with what you did before and not where you're going to next.
4:53
[SPEAKER_03]: So that was my little attempt to kind of like kind of go a little further from myself.
4:59
[SPEAKER_02]: I've never heard of anyone doing that with their actual names, but I love that concept, because you do, anyone that hasn't done an adventure maybe listening to this show is a way to explore what this would be like, but I think that's a big reason trail names exist is just you feel like such a different person out there.
5:20
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean personally, I feel like my primitive and stintual
5:26
[SPEAKER_02]: and very, you know, tuned in version of me comes out.
5:30
[SPEAKER_02]: And then it gets put away and I zip up my civilized self when I get back to quote, normal life.
5:37
[SPEAKER_02]: I've never thought about doing something like that, but that would be, I think that should be a thing.
5:42
[SPEAKER_02]: What's your adventure name?
5:43
[SPEAKER_02]: Not just your trail name, but what's your name?
5:45
[SPEAKER_02]: Right, totally.
5:46
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, no with you, too.
5:48
[SPEAKER_02]: You know what I mean?
5:49
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you know, some random that no one would call you.
5:53
[SPEAKER_02]: Some people might call you Alex or at least they know that's your middle name.
5:57
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
5:57
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
5:58
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's on your driver's license of kissing in the trouble.
6:00
[SPEAKER_02]: There you go.
6:02
[SPEAKER_02]: Your parents, you know, will call you by your name or at least say it once the or you know, doing something wrong.
6:08
[SPEAKER_02]: Tell us about where you grew up and what you grew up doing it and how you started getting into these things.
6:13
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm always interested to know was it something you discovered on your own or were you encouraged to do it as a kid?
6:20
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, I grew up in countries so that definitely helps I think for somebody getting out there into the mountains and into the forest if they kind of come from that environment a little bit.
6:32
[SPEAKER_03]: But I grew up in the countryside in New Hampshire and a small town of two thousand.
6:39
[SPEAKER_03]: And from there, I was definitely always an outdoor as kind of running around as a kid.
6:44
[SPEAKER_03]: And then in high school, I got into backpacking and rock climbing and just kept pushing that envelope on that and into the white water canoeing and the white water kayaking and rafting and going into my twenties and guiding trips.
7:01
[SPEAKER_03]: And then more into rock climbing when a broad climb down in Australia and New Zealand for a year on on rock climbing trips and all across the US and.
7:12
[SPEAKER_03]: So, but I was always doing all these journeys by car, right?
7:17
[SPEAKER_03]: Most people would go by car on a big road trip.
7:19
[SPEAKER_03]: And as I was wanting to travel further or kind of more into the zone, I started to take on different modes of transportation than just regular road trips.
7:34
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's kind of how it started to, and we're all these unique ways of travel happened and then it ultimately turned into this into this book I wrote about traveling by horse.
7:47
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, you mentioned, you know, it went from cars to wanting to do things via other means.
7:54
[SPEAKER_02]: What was it for you?
7:55
[SPEAKER_02]: Did you start doing backpack trips or was it on bicycle?
7:59
[SPEAKER_02]: How did you pair down and then build back up to horses or a horse?
8:06
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, I think I'm trying to think here.
8:09
[SPEAKER_03]: So I think the first long distance trip I did was I was fishing up our college and then yeah, that's where it was a couple of weeks after college.
8:20
[SPEAKER_03]: Um, after graduated, I went down to a spring or mountain in Georgia like like so many other people have and uh, started walking the main on the application trail.
8:31
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh yeah.
8:32
[SPEAKER_03]: and left on that trip about a week after graduation.
8:37
[SPEAKER_03]: And that made a lot of sense to me because I grew up in New Hampshire.
8:41
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'd been on that place in trail up the White Mountain so a lot.
8:45
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I knew that area, but I hadn't done hiking down in the south before.
8:52
[SPEAKER_03]: So that was a perfect starting to traveling long distance.
8:59
[SPEAKER_03]: Craggering College and just being done with all of the bookwork and jobs and just getting out for a little bit.
9:07
[SPEAKER_03]: And definitely had to do it on a shoe string, you know, and have a trust fund or anything.
9:12
[SPEAKER_03]: And so it earned a lot of money delivering pizza prior to that.
9:18
[SPEAKER_03]: To get out on the trail for five, six months.
9:22
[SPEAKER_03]: So yeah, that's where it started.
9:25
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it started with like long distance backpacking on that location trail.
9:29
[SPEAKER_03]: And that was from doing other multi-day and we climbed back packing trips during teenagers and in college too.
9:41
[SPEAKER_02]: Man, I tell you what, it's so relatable.
9:43
[SPEAKER_02]: So many of the same things I would do.
9:46
[SPEAKER_02]: Scrubbing toilets before graduating college to take my gap year after graduating.
9:52
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, exactly.
9:54
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, gap year, gap year is a grid.
9:56
[SPEAKER_03]: I did a couple of gap years.
10:01
[SPEAKER_02]: There you go.
10:02
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, that's too funny.
10:03
[SPEAKER_02]: I did many, many gap years in a row.
10:05
[SPEAKER_02]: That's I love that.
10:07
[SPEAKER_02]: So we'll tell us about, you know, when you were on an adventure, at some point, you got the idea to do an adventure by horseback or, you know, on a horse, it could tell us about, you know, what did you experience or what did you see or what started planning that seed for you?
10:24
[SPEAKER_02]: Because that's a little bit unusual, I guess you could say, in today's adventure,
10:31
[SPEAKER_02]: realm.
10:32
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah, totally.
10:34
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, after the application trail, I was out west on multiple rock climbing trips, going out west and end up settling on one of them trips up in the San Juan Islands north of Seattle.
10:52
[SPEAKER_03]: So I had a great time out there, the islands are super beautiful, great for hiking and sailing, on kayaking.
11:00
[SPEAKER_03]: And I did a trip from there to go back to my home state in New Hampshire to see my mom actually as she was still living.
11:10
[SPEAKER_03]: at that the house grew up in, and so I hopped on a just for kicks, and again, I didn't have a lot of money, so money seems to be the kind of like what, like lead leads your experience, and so I bought a little moped, and I just started moped heading back to New Hampshire.
11:30
[SPEAKER_03]: because I thought that would be kind of fun and novel.
11:34
[SPEAKER_03]: And it didn't cost that much in gas either.
11:38
[SPEAKER_03]: Pretty cool.
11:39
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
11:40
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
11:40
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
11:41
[SPEAKER_03]: I think I spent about fifty-two dollars in gas to go from no Pacific Ocean to the Atlantic Ocean.
11:50
[SPEAKER_02]: What was that like?
11:51
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, that's an adventure.
11:52
[SPEAKER_02]: You're not going very fast.
11:55
[SPEAKER_03]: No, it was slow.
11:56
[SPEAKER_03]: I think
11:58
[SPEAKER_03]: I was going about twenty two miles an hour.
12:01
[SPEAKER_03]: And then I got kind of sick of a house slow.
12:04
[SPEAKER_03]: I was going and I was getting up into the mountains and I stopped in Montana.
12:08
[SPEAKER_03]: And I found this moped shot that did like retrofits.
12:13
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I was able to get a bigger exhaust on the moped.
12:19
[SPEAKER_03]: So that allowed me to go like twenty six miles an hour.
12:23
[SPEAKER_02]: over the course of the country that I'll make a few days difference.
12:26
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, yeah.
12:27
[SPEAKER_03]: It was like flying at that point.
12:30
[SPEAKER_03]: Hold on.
12:30
[SPEAKER_02]: Hold on.
12:30
[SPEAKER_02]: Hold on for going to.
12:32
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
12:33
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
12:33
[SPEAKER_03]: This is really flashy exhaust and this is like a little junky moment.
12:37
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, no sense, you know.
12:39
[SPEAKER_02]: Would your, would your mother think you pull up the house and that thing?
12:43
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, she was just like, well, I think she was really concerned because I was always next to the sun at the road, you know?
12:51
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, you can be okay.
12:52
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, yeah, I'm totally fine.
12:53
[SPEAKER_03]: I got a light sign.
12:54
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I was wearing a backpack.
12:57
[SPEAKER_03]: And I had a gas tank strapped to the back.
13:00
[SPEAKER_03]: And then I had a little like crazy creek wrapped around the the Mopad gas tank.
13:07
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I just, I mean, I brought with me as much as I could, you know, but still wasn't a great deal.
13:13
[SPEAKER_03]: And so it all kind of worked.
13:15
[SPEAKER_03]: I felt a little kind of protected in some ways if something did go sideways.
13:19
[SPEAKER_03]: So like the Moped.
13:22
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it was, it was a pretty, it was a pretty desperate attempt to be easy writer.
13:27
[SPEAKER_02]: I just, as poor Moped, I was like, I wasn't, I wasn't built for this.
13:33
[SPEAKER_02]: No.
13:34
[SPEAKER_02]: Please help.
13:35
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my gosh, that sounds like a few adventure sports podcast episodes right there that adventure.
13:41
[SPEAKER_02]: So at some point, you wanted to go even slower.
13:45
[SPEAKER_02]: I presume.
13:47
[SPEAKER_03]: So yeah, so then after that, after that, I ended up getting a
13:52
[SPEAKER_03]: I ended up moving back to the hamster for a couple of years and started building house and just kind of went down that road for a bit.
14:00
[SPEAKER_03]: But then I was going to go back out west and I bought a motorcycle and I went back out west on a motorcycle.
14:07
[SPEAKER_03]: And so that was that was.
14:09
[SPEAKER_03]: No, is that how well somewhere in there it is.
14:12
[SPEAKER_03]: So I went back on a motorcycle.
14:14
[SPEAKER_03]: And then I'm back in the west coast.
14:17
[SPEAKER_03]: And I, oh, and then I ended up selling the land I had back in New Hampshire and kind of cashed out on that.
14:25
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was able to get my pilot's license.
14:29
[SPEAKER_03]: So I bought a little airplane, learn how to fly it, and then I flew that back to New Hampshire.
14:35
[SPEAKER_03]: And ironically with that trip, that was like took as long as the moped.
14:41
[SPEAKER_03]: because there was so much weather in the way and I always had to land because of clouds and that was like way more expensive like same same thing like the time but it cost me like fifteen hundred dollars and gas so it's just like I could have taken them open you know the way cheaper in the same amount of time but it was really fun it was it was just I mean
15:04
[SPEAKER_03]: You got to be aware and you know, you're going over the mountains and a little hundred horsepower airplane.
15:10
[SPEAKER_03]: So you gotta leave early and make sure the weather's clear and know how high the mountains are.
15:18
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I learned a lot on that one for sure.
15:21
[SPEAKER_03]: And I actually picked up a friend.
15:25
[SPEAKER_03]: So I convinced the friend of mine who actually went on the application trail.
15:31
[SPEAKER_03]: that I was living in Boisie at Thomas said, hey, here's on the Jeff, you should like fly to Seattle and then I'll pick you up and then I'll live you back to Boisie.
15:42
[SPEAKER_03]: He's like, well, what are you doing?
15:43
[SPEAKER_03]: So I can't tell you that, but get to Seattle and I'll pick you up and we'll fly back to Boisie.
15:50
[SPEAKER_03]: So I pick him up in the airplane and he's just like, what the hell?
15:54
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, where'd you get this?
15:55
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, oh, I just start learning how to fly.
15:58
[SPEAKER_03]: And so we like all kind of situated in spend a couple of days in the sandwines.
16:04
[SPEAKER_03]: And then we start flying back to flying to Boise.
16:08
[SPEAKER_03]: And the reason I won him come along was that I wanted somebody to read the maps as we're going over the mountains.
16:14
[SPEAKER_03]: And so, but the charts are a little different.
16:17
[SPEAKER_03]: They're like regular, like, you know, like, maps you'd have for a backpacking.
16:22
[SPEAKER_03]: And so he's looking at the charts.
16:24
[SPEAKER_03]: He's like, I don't really understand all this.
16:26
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm just like pointing to him to look like, just read me that number, read me this number.
16:31
[SPEAKER_03]: And at one point, we're starting to go up over the mountains and I look, look, I'm like, man, this is crazy Jeff.
16:37
[SPEAKER_03]: He's like, what's so crazy?
16:38
[SPEAKER_03]: He's like, I'm like, I've never been this high in an airplane before.
16:41
[SPEAKER_03]: We were at like, four thousand feet.
16:45
[SPEAKER_03]: I just never, we're all my dream practice training is always two thousand feet, you know?
16:49
[SPEAKER_03]: So I'm like, I'm never been this high in an airplane before.
16:52
[SPEAKER_03]: And he's just like, I wish you didn't tell me this stuff.
16:56
[SPEAKER_03]: If we're doing it, you know?
16:58
[SPEAKER_02]: They're flying through the air on the moped of airplanes.
17:02
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, exactly.
17:03
[SPEAKER_02]: It has exactly a scary place to be.
17:06
[SPEAKER_03]: Exactly.
17:08
[SPEAKER_02]: Over the Rocky Mountains.
17:09
[SPEAKER_03]: Over over the Cascades.
17:11
[SPEAKER_03]: Over the Cascades.
17:12
[SPEAKER_02]: Over the Cascades.
17:13
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah.
17:14
[SPEAKER_02]: Even more.
17:14
[SPEAKER_03]: We're too jagged, honestly.
17:16
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
17:17
[SPEAKER_03]: To Boise and then from there it was over the Rockies and Montana.
17:21
[SPEAKER_02]: How did beautiful views?
17:23
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm sure over the Cascades in particular.
17:25
[SPEAKER_02]: Great.
17:26
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, very pretty.
17:28
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my gosh, that is that is wild.
17:30
[SPEAKER_02]: So so at some point you met pepper your horse to tell us what where did that?
17:36
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you're you've got this fascination with taking different mediums across the country back to, you know, hamster to see your mom and fairly and a horse was, you know, is this going to be one of of more or is this kind of where it was all leading to was was horse on the horse.
17:55
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it was all like ultimately leading to it because once I was on the horse trip, it like that made sense to me.
18:02
[SPEAKER_03]: Like that just brought it all home.
18:04
[SPEAKER_03]: It was very, very basic and like, traditional.
18:09
[SPEAKER_03]: And so, so how that came about was I ended up then flying back to the West Coast later on, like a year later, I then then, so how I got into the horse trip was I then, like a year after that, I got a bicycle and I wanted to, so then I started bicycling across Canada.
18:28
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I was basically in cross can and that's when I met a horse on the trip that made me think about.
18:36
[SPEAKER_03]: getting a horse to take writing.
18:39
[SPEAKER_03]: And I had this one moment that really like set the tone.
18:42
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was bicycling across Saskatchewan.
18:45
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, really windy out, big headwind.
18:48
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's just desolate prairie everywhere.
18:51
[SPEAKER_03]: And I kept bicycling on this quiet road into this headwind.
18:56
[SPEAKER_03]: And I came alongside this ranch.
18:57
[SPEAKER_03]: And off to the right, there was this one horse that was in a field.
19:02
[SPEAKER_03]: and his main is getting all blown back and his tail is going up and he was leaning against the fence and he wanted to like he was watching me like dead eyes watching every as I'm inching my way into the headwind and I look back at him and I was like that's it I need to be on a horse you know like that's gonna be way more interesting than being on this bicycle so I kept bicycling and bicycling and kept going cross-cand of and around
19:31
[SPEAKER_03]: main and into the Bay of Fundy and basically down the the main coast and to New Hampshire and what got home to to family homestead and and but the whole time I'm thinking about this horse that I met that are saw Saskatchewan and so when I end up going back to back to the west coast and then started organizing for a horse trip.
19:53
[SPEAKER_02]: That's amazing.
19:54
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, you knew right then that you were a horse person for this existence.
20:01
[SPEAKER_02]: Why just the least?
20:01
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I didn't know anything about it.
20:03
[SPEAKER_03]: I was just so curious.
20:04
[SPEAKER_03]: I was like, I don't know anything about horses, you know?
20:07
[SPEAKER_03]: That's like, that's what to do.
20:09
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, if you're going across like the country, you should go on a horse.
20:13
[SPEAKER_02]: You want a horse and I guess you learn how as you go, you learn some basics, but you really learn a lot as you go.
20:19
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, tell us what was the idea and what were you starting out to do?
20:24
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, I don't like to like plan trips too much.
20:27
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I knew I needed to get a horse.
20:30
[SPEAKER_03]: That was I could go that far in planning.
20:32
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I had to at least get a horse and so so I would have to Alaska and I was the commercial fishing for the summer to come up with money for the
20:43
[SPEAKER_03]: to go by a horse and so I came back and I started researching, I was at the time I was living in Montana, so I went back to Montana, I figured I'd be a good place to get a horse and so I took a couple books out of the Boseman library and basically like, how to write a horse.
21:00
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I was just like, okay, this is it, just how to.
21:04
[SPEAKER_03]: And then I started going around Boseman and the outer other towns.
21:11
[SPEAKER_03]: like checking out horses that were for sale.
21:13
[SPEAKER_03]: So I thought it would be kind of like buying car, you know, like you just kind of go and check out the horse and like keep the tires, you know, and this is what you think.
21:23
[SPEAKER_03]: But I really is first time I turned up at this at this ranch to go check out this horse that I knew nothing about horses.
21:31
[SPEAKER_03]: And so he's like, well, what do you think?
21:33
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, he like brings a horse out and I'm like, look at it.
21:36
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm like,
21:37
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, how old is he, you know, I'm like, think about age, you know, like, hell, it's a car, you know, and then I'm like, why do I pick up the horses feet to look at the, you know, to look at the hooves and yet I know, I didn't know how to do it, you know, and now I've learned you basically lean into the horse, you get the horse to go off balance, and then you didn't use to snatch a hoof and bring it up.
21:56
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, and do it with like authority and the horse will will yield to that.
22:01
[SPEAKER_03]: But at the time I didn't.
22:02
[SPEAKER_03]: So I just kind of like look at the hooves on the ground.
22:04
[SPEAKER_03]: I go, those look look like good hooves.
22:07
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
22:09
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, exactly.
22:11
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
22:12
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I end up like not I looked at all these different horses and different Greeks and I dialed in on a Tennessee Walker and
22:22
[SPEAKER_03]: The reason I dialed on, came in on that particular breed was, because there's two kinds of horses.
22:29
[SPEAKER_03]: There's gated horses and nongated horses.
22:32
[SPEAKER_03]: And a nongated horse is like a quarter horse or saddle bread.
22:36
[SPEAKER_03]: And so it's basically a horse that's just that we'll have a normal four-beat gallop to it.
22:44
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, I'm not sure if I have all of those correct ones been a little bit since I read about it.
22:51
[SPEAKER_03]: A gated horse, when it goes into a trot, it will be a more even keeled trot.
23:00
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not a big up and down, the jolting experience, which you would have to post by going up and down in the saddle.
23:08
[SPEAKER_03]: That's another skill you have to learn or read the horses.
23:10
[SPEAKER_03]: You've got to post up and down at the same time in timing with the horse.
23:16
[SPEAKER_03]: And since I didn't know much about writing at all, I didn't grow up writing or anything.
23:19
[SPEAKER_03]: So I thought, well, if I get this other kind of horse, this gated horse, a Tennessee walker, I don't have to learn how to post.
23:25
[SPEAKER_03]: And it should be like a little more of a comfortable ride.
23:29
[SPEAKER_03]: And so then I started looking at Tennessee walkers.
23:32
[SPEAKER_03]: And after about the third one, I found Pepper.
23:36
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, this is it.
23:38
[SPEAKER_03]: She didn't know much either.
23:39
[SPEAKER_03]: She's a young horse.
23:41
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, this is kind of good.
23:43
[SPEAKER_03]: I can do the first owner and we can let it learn together.
23:48
[SPEAKER_02]: There you go.
23:49
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, an airplane probably seems like the the most preparation because you got to get a license and all that and there's a lot to know there but a horse seems right up there as far as complexity of understanding what you're doing just because you're you're dealing with another living creature.
24:06
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not just a machine that's complicated.
24:08
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a it's a it's a being and that takes
24:13
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm sure some totally different dynamics, especially compared to something like the bicycle or even the moped.
24:21
[SPEAKER_02]: What was it like?
24:22
[SPEAKER_02]: What did you have to do with peppering as far as understanding and what were maybe some of the first few weeks out on the road like?
24:32
[SPEAKER_03]: I came to realize that I was basically always learning.
24:35
[SPEAKER_03]: It wasn't like, oh, let's kind of train up here over a couple weeks or
24:40
[SPEAKER_03]: a month or so and then we'll be all set.
24:43
[SPEAKER_03]: It was constantly learning.
24:45
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I end up getting pepper in December and I trained with her till March.
24:51
[SPEAKER_03]: So we did about three months of training and I would go out to the stable that I kept her at.
24:57
[SPEAKER_03]: I go out there every day regardless of what kind of snow or wind was going on.
25:01
[SPEAKER_03]: This is up in Montana.
25:03
[SPEAKER_03]: Sometimes we had big blizzards going on, but I'd still go out and just, you know, I just figured we're going to do this out.
25:09
[SPEAKER_03]: How traveling and results get started here and it was I think we are still we're kind of nervous of each other the whole time at the beginning, you know, we didn't really know
25:22
[SPEAKER_03]: know each other well enough.
25:24
[SPEAKER_03]: And so it was very tentative, you know, we'd kind of test each other, but we were kind of kept as respectful like arms like distance about how to interact.
25:34
[SPEAKER_03]: And she would definitely like let me put the saddle on her and pick up her feet, but even then I'm still learning.
25:41
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm still learning.
25:42
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm still new at it, you know.
25:45
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I would just do a little thing, like one thing at a time, you know, like I'd have like, okay, today's lesson is just like going into a arena with her and try to like ride her around the arena ten times, you know, and some sort of controlled fashion and not fall off.
26:06
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I mean, that's how it basically was like, and if that happened and it was like great, we're good, we're done for the day.
26:13
[SPEAKER_03]: I always tried to end on a positive note.
26:16
[SPEAKER_03]: I definitely treated pepper like a dog.
26:18
[SPEAKER_03]: Like I treated it like this is dog training.
26:20
[SPEAKER_03]: Because that's what I had played around with dog training when I was a kid in four age.
26:27
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think, well, and that was my only like connection to like some large animal that I would have to try to control.
26:34
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I think the more I did that, it actually worked out pretty good, you know.
26:39
[SPEAKER_03]: because then you're not so nervous and because horses pick up on on on people's sensitivities so quickly you know they'll take advantage of the situation quite quite fast if they know that somebody's nervous or is backing up or threatening and they'll back off and so you're not getting them like an authentic
27:01
[SPEAKER_03]: like connection when either they feel like they need to take control or they feel like they have to hide, they have to defend themselves.
27:10
[SPEAKER_03]: And so, kind of being at one with the animal, it was really key.
27:16
[SPEAKER_03]: But it took a lot of practice because, you know, to be around a thousand pound animal, when you never done that, you've got to be kind of build up the confidence yourself.
27:28
[SPEAKER_02]: What were some of the logistics of making this happen initially?
27:32
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, are you just walking on the side of the road?
27:34
[SPEAKER_02]: Are you sticking to smaller roads or dirt roads or how are you navigating across the country on a through a system of roads that aren't built for horses?
27:48
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's definitely, it would have been ways your hundred years ago, right?
27:52
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, let's roll all those roads and fences out there.
27:55
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, probably just as many fences, but let us roads.
27:59
[SPEAKER_03]: I pretty much just set a compass bearing and I just shot it, shot east.
28:04
[SPEAKER_03]: I'd literally just wind east.
28:07
[SPEAKER_03]: And if it was over the mountains, it was over the mountains.
28:09
[SPEAKER_03]: If it was through the desert, if it was alongside a highway that like,
28:14
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I could feel like we could handle the beyond, you know, or then it was alongside highway.
28:21
[SPEAKER_03]: So people's backyards.
28:23
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it was literally like, just you just shot a compass line.
28:28
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I left from Southern Oregon coast in Brookings, Oregon, which is about a mile north of the California border.
28:37
[SPEAKER_03]: And I left from there because I wanted to go just a little further south.
28:42
[SPEAKER_03]: Then leaving up and say around Bellingham, Washington.
28:46
[SPEAKER_03]: I was leaving in mid March and I knew in mid March at that time, it's still be dealing with a lot of snow.
28:54
[SPEAKER_03]: So by leaving a little further south was going to be better weather for departing less snow.
29:00
[SPEAKER_03]: And it was also I knew, so that was the plan there.
29:05
[SPEAKER_03]: And I figured we could have a straighter shot because then it would be coming just below the Great Lakes.
29:11
[SPEAKER_03]: So I'd go just south of Chicago and then turn at an angle up to the hamper at that point.
29:19
[SPEAKER_03]: So that was an, actually, an ancient point when I eventually did turn away from going to East.
29:25
[SPEAKER_03]: So I was spending many months going to East and then all of a sudden my company's wearing shifted and that was like kind of a big moment.
29:33
[SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, that's what I was playing today.
29:35
[SPEAKER_03]: I photocopied Gazetteer Atlas maps and laminated them and bundled them up into two or three states at a time.
29:46
[SPEAKER_03]: and had a couple of people send them to me along the way.
29:50
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I would just look at the maps and shoot a compass bearing, and that was it.
29:56
[SPEAKER_03]: I did have a GPS as like an emergency backup, and also as a record distance.
30:02
[SPEAKER_03]: I was really trying to be careful to not put too much mileage in each day, like unknowingly, because it's easy to keep going with the miles.
30:11
[SPEAKER_03]: With horses, don't tell you that they're done.
30:14
[SPEAKER_03]: they'll just keep riding and riding and riding and they'll.
30:17
[SPEAKER_03]: And so you got to like, you need breaks and that was a lesson that took me a couple of times to learn.
30:25
[SPEAKER_03]: Was was when to stop.
30:26
[SPEAKER_02]: I was looking at this route that you went, you know, just over the California Oregon line, just right there, there is not a lot out there.
30:36
[SPEAKER_02]: Just when you look at the map and all the way over to Idaho, then you're crossing Wyoming.
30:40
[SPEAKER_02]: And parts of Nebraska and Iowa, what were you experiencing?
30:45
[SPEAKER_02]: What was some of the challenges or some of the things you were seeing?
30:49
[SPEAKER_02]: That's a lot of terrain like that's an epic series of mountain ranges and deserts even to get through.
30:57
[SPEAKER_02]: That's legendary terrain out there for some very well known expeditions.
31:03
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah, it was it was actually in a lot of ways I did the hard part first, which which was created even harder.
31:12
[SPEAKER_03]: Because we hadn't we hadn't learned to get along yet.
31:16
[SPEAKER_03]: We hadn't got a scheduled touchdown in yet.
31:19
[SPEAKER_03]: We hadn't got strong enough yet.
31:22
[SPEAKER_03]: And so we left from the Pacific Ocean and Emilio and right in the mountains, we went up into the Cisco Coastal Range.
31:33
[SPEAKER_03]: And Emilio were like crossing rivers and streams and going up bridges and down bridges.
31:39
[SPEAKER_03]: And the first five, six days, I think I covered only like thirty miles in like six days, the first the first chunk.
31:48
[SPEAKER_03]: And it was just I mean,
31:51
[SPEAKER_03]: There was one day I think I was we did a quarter mile in an hour or two maybe two hours.
31:58
[SPEAKER_03]: It's just like they're so thick with like brush and finding our way through and super steep and then there was burned out for us to deal with and which makes the ground really like
32:10
[SPEAKER_03]: like like hazard filled with pepper post holding through because of like broken down stumps that were burned out.
32:19
[SPEAKER_03]: And so and there's nobody there.
32:22
[SPEAKER_03]: There's no roads there.
32:24
[SPEAKER_03]: There's nothing there.
32:25
[SPEAKER_03]: And so so right we just jumped into the fire right at the very beginning and does a little bit unknowingly because
32:33
[SPEAKER_03]: I was initially going to be going a little further north up the coast and then in, but we had such a long drive from Montana with the horse trailer that ended up being a really slow drive.
32:47
[SPEAKER_03]: And so in the evening, I ended up being a little bit off at a different spot that I chose about thirty miles before.
32:54
[SPEAKER_03]: I was initially going to kind of be dropped off.
32:58
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, I told the driver, I'm like, hey, let's just stop here.
33:01
[SPEAKER_03]: This is crazy.
33:02
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like a ten thirty a night.
33:03
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's just stop here.
33:04
[SPEAKER_03]: I can get into the mountains from from this this river right here.
33:07
[SPEAKER_03]: It's called the wind truck river range.
33:10
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, I can get in from here.
33:12
[SPEAKER_03]: And so he dropped me off.
33:13
[SPEAKER_03]: And all right, I'm good day.
33:15
[SPEAKER_03]: And there there we are like the horse and me and a pile of gear side the road at ten thirty a night.
33:23
[SPEAKER_03]: And just wondering, okay.
33:26
[SPEAKER_03]: What do I get you know, here we go.
33:28
[SPEAKER_03]: This is it.
33:29
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I dragged all the stuff down down to like a wooded beach area and made camp down there and started sorting through all the gear and started to pack pepper up and I did not actually even pack her for the first time yet.
33:43
[SPEAKER_03]: You know how you like pack your backpack before you go.
33:45
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, yeah.
33:46
[SPEAKER_03]: You go up.
33:47
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, I never I've done so much backpacking that I kind of treated that part like it wasn't necessary.
33:52
[SPEAKER_03]: And so when I eventually pack pepper saddle bags all up, it was just this catastrophe of a arrangement that I had to go on with there.
34:00
[SPEAKER_03]: And ropes are all tied in different directions.
34:04
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, okay, I think everything is on, you know, like
34:08
[SPEAKER_03]: is like, you know, there was a pretty pretty funny affair.
34:12
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I took her down to the beach like, let's walk around and we walked a hundred feet onto the beach and right then I turned around and the rope and tight I turned around and the whole affair had flipped around on her and is hanging upside down under her belly.
34:26
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was just like, holy moly, like, and I'm looking at her, I think she could freak out, you know, and she just looking at me like, what are you doing?
34:36
[SPEAKER_03]: I did take the whole thing apart and drag it all back to the to the camp again and drag her take her back and repack again.
34:44
[SPEAKER_03]: So it took about actually a day and a half to get that sort of doubt and felt right.
34:48
[SPEAKER_03]: You know that it was going to be a controlled way that we're going up into the mountains and not like totally yard ceiling ourselves up there.
34:56
[SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, that was the beginning.
35:00
[SPEAKER_03]: That was the beginning of the trip the first the first week.
35:04
[SPEAKER_02]: What was there anything you came across early on that felt either impassable or an obstacle that really, really challenged, really challenged you.
35:16
[SPEAKER_02]: I know the whole thing is a challenging obstacle, honestly, but anything in particular.
35:20
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, I think actually it was, it was about the fourth day in that there was a river crossing that
35:28
[SPEAKER_03]: I had gone up the river and down the river and I'm looking at other places to go and I realize the only way to keep going east is to forge across this river and I'm looking at the river and I've from from my kayak and raft guide days.
35:44
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, okay, I can figure I can go in through here and across here, but it's like
35:47
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to bring a horse, you know, how is this going to work?
35:51
[SPEAKER_03]: And the water didn't look that deep, but it was fast.
35:53
[SPEAKER_03]: And then it's out in the wilderness.
35:55
[SPEAKER_03]: And so if something goes wrong, it's like nobody's said to save you.
35:59
[SPEAKER_03]: Or even know where you are, you know?
36:01
[SPEAKER_03]: Because I didn't have a spot or any of the GPS, the equipment with me I never used that.
36:10
[SPEAKER_03]: So that was the first thing.
36:12
[SPEAKER_03]: So when I made that commitment to cross this river,
36:15
[SPEAKER_03]: It was like I'm going to keep going was I don't to come back was even more hazardous and so I end up stripping down and I had one rope one in the rope tied to pepper and
36:29
[SPEAKER_03]: I had the other end I'm holding on to the other end and I just jumped in so it's swimming across and I got over to the shallow spot I'm going to get a push down stream a bit and Pepper's looking at me and I give her a tug and she starts walking across and I was like okay this is it we're committed now.
36:47
[SPEAKER_03]: And you know, pull my clothes back on and we started going up up the next mountain range because I was like, we're in it now that there's no turning back now.
37:00
[SPEAKER_03]: And at that point, that was really awesome because that like showed a bonding between course and I, you know, pepper and I seem to really kind of get each other at that point.
37:11
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, because she was going to be like my lifeline in case something went wrong.
37:15
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, it was a group of it was attached to her.
37:20
[SPEAKER_02]: Wow, man, what an experience.
37:23
[SPEAKER_02]: You all had been through it at that point, or at least, you know, forming those very strong ties early on, because I'm sure you'd need it every day.
37:34
[SPEAKER_02]: Was there any concern, or tell me about this actually, what I want to ask about this?
37:38
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, what was it like to camp with Pepper?
37:41
[SPEAKER_02]: What was this the process there?
37:42
[SPEAKER_02]: And that was it just pretty simple or something that was challenging compared to doing trips on your own?
37:51
[SPEAKER_03]: It was at first that that was going to be fairly easy, but horses have a, you know, unlimited need for food.
38:00
[SPEAKER_03]: And so they'll, you know, so I would have you do it.
38:03
[SPEAKER_03]: So it was exactly at first I thought I could just forge a river and pepper would have enough food that way.
38:10
[SPEAKER_03]: But as soon as they soon learned as like after the first month, it's like, wow, we need to really supplement this with
38:15
[SPEAKER_03]: with more hay if I can get someone to come close to a town or to a ranch.
38:21
[SPEAKER_03]: So I started like looking out for hay and then later on, it's like okay, we need to really start to add in more grain too.
38:29
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I started getting rid of my own stuff to pack more grain that's so she could eat more.
38:35
[SPEAKER_03]: And that end up being really crucial part of the journey to was changing that up.
38:43
[SPEAKER_03]: But in regards to packing, to camping with horses, basically I always had to make sure wherever I tied her to that she wouldn't get wrapped around nearby trees.
38:54
[SPEAKER_03]: or or or sagebrush or fence posts and so I would always so I had this fifty foot rope that I'd be just tighter to just like a dog and I just she just I just and I knock it a aluminum pick it in the ground and Hopefully out in the field and then she can just raise in the big circle and I get tied around anything
39:20
[SPEAKER_03]: When we're in the woods, I'd have to tie up the rope short to a tree and then keep moving her from tree to tree so that she can keep grazing on like the brush and the grass that's around.
39:33
[SPEAKER_03]: Or even just in the middle of the night, I'd have to move her again sometimes should find a way to get a raptor on a tree.
39:41
[SPEAKER_03]: So I'd wake up a couple times a night and have to go check on her.
39:47
[SPEAKER_03]: So, and then it was definitely easier to be out in fields or ranch or go to ranches or people's backyards where it's open and grassy, but that wasn't always the case.
39:59
[SPEAKER_03]: In the desert, I basically looked for the largest sagebrush I could find, and I would tire to that.
40:07
[SPEAKER_03]: because the roots on those are so much deeper than what, and then the aluminum picket that I would knock in the ground with a rock, which in like crackly dry ground or often pull, it would be easy to pull out.
40:21
[SPEAKER_03]: So, this sagebrush was a key, but then you keep it twist around other sagebrush.
40:27
[SPEAKER_03]: So, sometimes I go riding around in the desert to try to find a spot that would work for us overnight.
40:36
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, that's one thing when you're out west and you have that space.
40:41
[SPEAKER_02]: What were some of the challenges as you got closer to home with either, you know, I'm sure that was pretty lush, a little maybe a little more greenery, but more congested too, especially around places like Chicago.
40:53
[SPEAKER_03]: Yo, yeah, definitely.
40:55
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, definitely the further east you got, the more the less public space and the more private properties.
41:00
[SPEAKER_03]: But ironically, actually, when the worst private property areas that I'd deal with was an Eastern Wyoming, the way to let the layoff offenses were and people's property, it was I kept getting pushed on the highways around that area.
41:14
[SPEAKER_03]: And so that was always made it pretty dodgy to be going along a highway with
41:19
[SPEAKER_03]: Cars go by at eighty miles an hour, but the further east I got it was it was basically hard to find a spot that you weren't like getting called by the cops Yeah horse in my yard or there's like a horse in the park
41:37
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's like, you know, and then the park ranger turned off and I'm like, what a horse is not allowed there.
41:43
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, well, they are, but they never come around.
41:46
[SPEAKER_03]: So that's why the cops are called again.
41:48
[SPEAKER_03]: Sorry about this.
41:49
[SPEAKER_03]: And you're going to have to keep moving.
41:51
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, we're not going to keep it in calls by the locals, but by you being here.
41:57
[SPEAKER_03]: And but then that's how the people to come up and maybe all excited and bring their kids and want to pet the horse.
42:03
[SPEAKER_03]: So yeah, you're constantly on on parade is what it felt like.
42:08
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm sure you felt like just in anomaly across everything you went.
42:13
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and so in the evenings, I'd actually try to find a spot to camp before town.
42:20
[SPEAKER_03]: out in the fields, out in some fields like a corn field or something on the edge of a corn field that might be close to a stream or creek and just camp kind of stealth camp in the woods with the horse.
42:31
[SPEAKER_03]: And then the morning I could ride in the town, get coffee and get some grain for pepper, hay, or something from the supply store or nearby farm.
42:40
[SPEAKER_03]: And then keep going, because I've ended up in town that night, I might find a place to camp with the horse, but it was, you know, off in the middle of the night in some
42:50
[SPEAKER_03]: cop card come around and there'd be lights on my tent you know asking why there's a horse next to me and so I would be like oh I didn't see a sign that horses are in loud here like well we just don't know what's going on here so
43:08
[SPEAKER_03]: I get your license and registration.
43:10
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not driving a car.
43:13
[SPEAKER_02]: What do you feel like the experience taught you as you started approaching the end?
43:18
[SPEAKER_02]: What did you feel that you feel like you went out and achieved what you were trying to achieve in every aspect?
43:25
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think I did.
43:26
[SPEAKER_03]: It took me a long time though.
43:28
[SPEAKER_03]: I thought I'd have a dialed in in the first month or a month and a half.
43:32
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, like, from what I've learned in the past is that the first two weeks of like any new trip is always going to be the hardest.
43:39
[SPEAKER_03]: So I figured after with this one, like after the first month, I'll get a kind of dialed in.
43:44
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, after a month, I'd actually, it took a whole month to go across Oregon and I'd done six, six hundred miles across Oregon and I still didn't feel like I knew what was going on.
43:56
[SPEAKER_03]: I felt like every day it was desperate.
43:58
[SPEAKER_03]: I felt like
43:59
[SPEAKER_03]: Like pepper was getting more tired.
44:01
[SPEAKER_03]: I was getting more and more anxious and I'd like short tempered and I was like, man, this is going to, this is hard.
44:09
[SPEAKER_03]: This is going to, this is going to take me a lot longer to figure out than I thought.
44:14
[SPEAKER_03]: And then after I did another twelve hundred miles,
44:19
[SPEAKER_03]: by horseback and then I train pepper to a cart to pull me so she'd be in a single horse cart like to call a sulky.
44:30
[SPEAKER_03]: And I would sit in the back and look like a bit like a ski chair lift with two wheels attached and I drove her from Nebraska to Pennsylvania.
44:41
[SPEAKER_03]: And so that kind of like the whole thing, the whole trip took a whole new left turn with like learning a whole new way of doing things.
44:51
[SPEAKER_03]: So I felt like I was just constantly learning.
44:54
[SPEAKER_03]: and forced to like like how to you know deal with like taking pepper down the side you know a busy road in a cart with tractor trailers going by that I couldn't see until they were coming up alongside me and it's like
45:09
[SPEAKER_03]: And everybody in like where I could like, you know, stop her for the moment and try to get in between other cars.
45:16
[SPEAKER_03]: And it was just really, it was constantly like a constant test every day.
45:21
[SPEAKER_03]: It was a test.
45:23
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think I don't then eventually I got her back into the saddle because I got too hilly in Pennsylvania.
45:30
[SPEAKER_03]: And we took a month off at that point because Pepper really needed a month to like just be out in the field and like fat enough a bit because we we're working a lot of miles.
45:42
[SPEAKER_03]: And so it wasn't until I was probably in the middle Pennsylvania that I started to get it.
45:46
[SPEAKER_03]: that started to become more patient and I understood that it wasn't just about me, it was about us about peppers happiness and how pepper was going along and how we should get along and just patience, patience is huge.
46:03
[SPEAKER_03]: And then after a while, I didn't even feel like I needed to go to the ocean anymore.
46:06
[SPEAKER_03]: I didn't want to, I was like,
46:08
[SPEAKER_03]: There was no point to go to the finish.
46:10
[SPEAKER_03]: I could just keep riding out, just take a left turn and go up to Canada.
46:16
[SPEAKER_03]: It was nice, the feeling of the destination war away.
46:19
[SPEAKER_03]: And I just actually enjoyed being out there.
46:23
[SPEAKER_03]: But it took a good three thousand miles to figure that out.
46:28
[SPEAKER_02]: Hey, if you got you got the time, you got the ability to put in the miles.
46:32
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a great way to figure things out to me being out there on an adventure.
46:38
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, tell us what folks could expect with reading the book, what can they expect it to learn from you and learn from the book and and where are they going to be able to find it, you know, once once it comes out.
46:51
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so the book is called On the Huff Pacific to Atlanta, a three day hundred mile adventure, and it's going to be available at on Amazon, but it'll also be available in bookshelves.
47:04
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, in bookstores all around, it's put out by a great press called Travel Group Square Press.
47:11
[SPEAKER_03]: that have done other equine-based books, but it's also a kind of a good crossover read.
47:17
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not just about horseback riding, it's really an adventure book.
47:21
[SPEAKER_03]: So it's traveling with the horses is definitely the mode, but it's really adventure and soul-seeking and kind of being comfortable in your own shoes and
47:37
[SPEAKER_03]: And not meeting your goals, you know, you don't always meet your goals and how to deal with that.
47:44
[SPEAKER_03]: And so yeah, it'll be available in August fifth.
47:48
[SPEAKER_03]: So August fifth, it should be available on Amazon and anywhere else.
47:53
[SPEAKER_03]: So definitely check it out and you can also check out.
47:56
[SPEAKER_03]: I have a Facebook page called on the hoof.
48:00
[SPEAKER_03]: Also Jesse McNeill dot com shows links on there on on how to buy the book directly or to the Facebook page.
48:09
[SPEAKER_03]: And I did a Facebook page while I was on the journey so there's a lot of photos on there.
48:16
[SPEAKER_03]: people that have met along the way, and one thing we didn't talk about, which was actually critical, was the people that have met along the way.
48:24
[SPEAKER_03]: If it wasn't for all the kind people, and even the stern ones that were like, what are you doing?
48:31
[SPEAKER_03]: I went to learn this much, because you don't really travel alone.
48:38
[SPEAKER_03]: It might be a solo journey, but
48:41
[SPEAKER_03]: and you don't really travel on.
48:43
[SPEAKER_02]: So I hated for the people that don't know that.
48:46
[SPEAKER_02]: If you're listening to this show and you have a negative perspective on the world and on people, put yourself out there in the middle of nowhere, doing something, adventure breaks down barriers.
48:58
[SPEAKER_02]: It really does, especially when you have a medium
49:01
[SPEAKER_02]: as cute as pepper, where it's like, or as approachable as pepper, where it's okay, oh my god, this guy's on a horse.
49:08
[SPEAKER_02]: I need to dock to him.
49:09
[SPEAKER_02]: I haven't seen someone ride through our town on a horse ever.
49:12
[SPEAKER_02]: I've got to go on.
49:13
[SPEAKER_03]: Totally.
49:14
[SPEAKER_03]: I went up into an old mining ghost town up in Idaho, and I wrote up into this rundown mining town that had like a few people that would still live up there in the summer.
49:26
[SPEAKER_03]: and I'm riding up on pepper and they're like the old turn turn around looking me there having to barbecue and they're like oh my god we haven't seen a horse ride in the town in a long time and it just kind of set the whole new tone and yeah horses definitely become like quick ambassadors to to bonding with with strangers
49:47
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, man.
49:48
[SPEAKER_02]: I love it.
49:48
[SPEAKER_02]: It's, uh, that's adventure.
49:50
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, the bicycle will do the same thing.
49:52
[SPEAKER_02]: I guarantee, uh, Moped will do it.
49:54
[SPEAKER_02]: And I promise you a small engine, uh, plane will do the same thing too.
49:58
[SPEAKER_02]: All right.
50:00
[SPEAKER_02]: No, no, uh, no hesitation there for folks wanting to come up to you.
50:04
[SPEAKER_02]: You're, you're the anomaly of their day.
50:06
[SPEAKER_02]: That's for sure.
50:08
[SPEAKER_02]: But yeah.
50:08
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
50:09
[SPEAKER_03]: And you are for them, too, because sometimes that they're the only person I saw for the whole day.
50:13
[SPEAKER_03]: after it was likely a desert, you know, and so it was like as much as I enjoyed seeing me, I enjoyed seeing them, and it was even nicer when that, like a water-stick in nearby.
50:23
[SPEAKER_02]: It was grass.
50:27
[SPEAKER_02]: That's awesome.
50:28
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, Jesse, this has been absolutely fantastic.
50:32
[SPEAKER_02]: Is there anything else you want to share before he head out, or is it just, tell me when we get the button?
50:37
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, just go ahead and get the book and we're definitely going to keep putting more updates on Facebook and on my website.
50:46
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I'm sure there'll be other ventures to come and there's a lot of wonderful people out there.
50:53
[SPEAKER_03]: So don't know, we're the only way you'll get to meet them as if you forget out there.
50:57
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, that's awesome.
50:59
[SPEAKER_02]: Fantastic.
51:00
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, thanks for joining the show and yeah, we'll be in touch when it comes out.
51:05
[SPEAKER_03]: Cool, thanks, Mason, appreciate the time.
51:08
[SPEAKER_01]: Hey, friends, thanks so much for listening in again today and just a little tickler.
51:13
[SPEAKER_01]: I have a big announcement coming up, not yet, but how the Adventure Sports podcast family can make a very real difference in the world.
51:23
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm looking forward to sharing that in the future.
51:26
[SPEAKER_01]: And until then, please tell your friends about the Adventure Sports podcast.
51:31
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, everyone, get out there and have some fun.