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Exercise and Our Mental Health with Gabriel Villarreal LPC - Episode 2 · Mind & Medicine - A Behavioral Health Podcast by Sentara

• 0:30
  Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to Mind and Medicine, the Sentara Podcast. I am Tommy Bateman, your host, and today we'll be talking with Dr. Gabriel Villarreal about exercise and mental health . Before we begin, here are a few important CME announcements. his episode is accredited for AMA PRA Category 1 credits for full accreditation, designation, and disclosure information, please refer to the show notes. We want your feedback if you have any ideas or questions. Find that form also in the show notes. Now the show. In counseling, we often say it's all about relationship, relationship, relationship.
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: And so, you know, with you in your practice, is the relationship better for all this workout stuff?
• 0:41
  Speaker: Oh, I don't know.
• 0:42
  Speaker: Um, that's a really good question.
• 0:43
  Speaker: I've never been asked that.
• 0:44
  Speaker: Um I don't know.
• 0:46
  Speaker: Because again, uh I got this kid that's on the spectrum that's meal prepping, that's fantastic.
• 0:51
  Speaker: Mom was like, oh yeah, you know, he's he's been doing that all school year.
• 0:55
  Speaker: And you know, at the time we're recording, it's October.
• 0:57
  Speaker: So his first so he's been doing it for two and a half months.
• 1:00
  Speaker: And I was like, no, he didn't tell me nothing.
• 1:02
  Speaker: Like he barely talks to me.
• 1:04
  Speaker: He's on the spectrum, he's got some some some social issues.
• 1:08
  Speaker: Um, I I call him like my silent warrior because he doesn't talk, and everything that I tell him to do, he just does.
• 1:14
  Speaker: Um and so um I don't know.
• 1:17
  Speaker: Um, I think time definitely uh helps those things.
• 1:21
  Speaker: And I bet if I told him to do something, um, whether my coach hat on, is on or my counseling hat is on, I bet he would just do it because trust has been built over so long.
• 1:31
  Speaker: But I think that other thing too, um it I I I feel, and this is coming with age too, right?
• 1:38
  Speaker: I'm gonna be um almost 40.
• 1:40
  Speaker: Um I feel like the buy-in is less, right?
• 1:44
  Speaker: Because I'm getting older, right?
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, what do you mean?
• 1:47
  Speaker: Whereas I so I like I've had clients, uh you know, when I'm doing an intake, what what brought you in to see me?
• 1:54
  Speaker: And and mom and dad say, Well, we showed him a psychology list listing, and he was like, That's the guy I want, because you're young.
• 2:02
  Speaker: I'm not I'm not super young anymore, right?
• 2:04
  Speaker: Like I'm I'm almost 40 and I'm not as young as when we started, right?
• 2:07
  Speaker: We started doing this, I was 27, and I think that was a big draw of like, oh, this guy's close enough to my age where he still gets it.
• 2:14
  Speaker: Yeah, um, I feel like that's not as much the case anymore, but what works in my favor is the kids can tell that I walk the walk.
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, right.
• 2:25
  Speaker: And so I think there's that buy-in.
• 2:26
  Speaker: It is a it is a um, this guy isn't just telling me to do this when he doesn't do it himself.
• 2:32
  unknown: Right.
• 2:33
  Speaker: Like when they come in, I've already worked out for the day, and you could tell.
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
• 2:38
  Speaker: I smell bad, I'm sweaty.
• 2:40
  Speaker: Um, uh, you know, if they're my first session, I'm usually breathing pretty heavy.
• 2:44
  Speaker: Um because I work, I mean, I'm working right up into that thing.
• 2:47
  Speaker: I have a very busy schedule.
• 2:48
  Speaker: Um, and so they can tell I walk the walk.
• 2:51
  Speaker: So it's not a top-down thing.
• 2:52
  Speaker: It's like, no, bro, we're I do this too.
• 2:55
  Speaker: Um, and I think that goes a long way, especially when we pivot.
• 3:00
  Speaker: And um, I say, Mom says you're forgetting a lot of your homework.
• 3:05
  Speaker: And he's like, Yeah, I am.
• 3:07
  Speaker: Um, what percentage do you think you're forgetting?
• 3:09
  Speaker: And he's like, probably 50%.
• 3:11
  Speaker: What percentage of that do you think you're remembering?
• 3:15
  Speaker: And then just going, nah, I don't want to do that.
• 3:17
  unknown: Yeah.
• 3:18
  Speaker: And they're like, How do you know I do that?
• 3:20
  Speaker: And it's like, dude, like, I know.
• 3:23
  Speaker: Like, not only have I lived it, but I've been doing this for forever.
• 3:26
  Speaker: Um, and I know your I know your brain.
• 3:28
  Speaker: Um, and I think that is so that light bulb switches for a lot of uh my younger, really my younger boy clients, male clients, but they're like, Oh, okay, this guy not only gets it, he gets it almost to the level of uh he's reading my mind.
• 3:44
  Speaker: Like I do just that.
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: So let's uh I know we're talking to a medical audience here.
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: You know, what would what would you find to be an ideal, ideal situation when it comes to the relationship between well, exercise folks, trainers, mental health, and uh primary care physicians, or just hospital systems in general?
• 4:02
  Speaker: No, I think it's a fantastic question.
• 4:03
  Speaker: And it's the same thing that I tell, you know, again, pre-COVID, I had a whole um a whole platform outlined for what coaches could do.
• 4:13
  Speaker: And and my idea was, hey, coaches, um, I was in the ear with a lot of a lot of coaches.
• 4:19
  Speaker: Um, hey, do you guys see these people three hours a week, maybe six hours a week, right?
• 4:28
  Speaker: They're coming into your gym to work out you're seeing them that much.
• 4:31
  Speaker: That's more than any doctor is gonna see them.
• 4:35
  Speaker: That's more than their therapist, that's more than uh any provider is gonna see them.
• 4:41
  Speaker: And um, you know, trying to train them on some mental health first aid and just saying, hey, you're throwing up late a lot, you look really tired, um, you're not talking well, you're losing weight.
• 4:54
  Speaker: I don't know, like what's going on?
• 4:56
  Speaker: And not say like you're depressed, but like I think maybe you should go talk to somebody and how do you have those conversations?
• 5:02
  Speaker: So to answer your question, that that didn't take off because of what we just talked about.
• 5:07
  Speaker: Um but what I always encourage them to do, and what I still encourage pediatricians and counselors to do is just call up random gyms and trainers and just say, hey, I'm a provider, talk to me about what you do, because I would love for you to be a referral source.
• 5:23
  Speaker: And look, you know, like every now and then we get the dad that is uh like ex-military, um, and it's and I think about who his counselor is, and if it is the uh the counselors that that that we went to school with the that that taught us, uh like the old graybeards.
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: You're being very you're being very uh uh um gentle.
• 5:46
  Speaker: They're all retired.
• 5:47
  Speaker: Um so um I it might be it might not land to say, hey, you should go work out.
• 5:56
  Speaker: But if I know that, hey, this uh warehouse gym is run by ex-military, and uh this is the kind of workouts that they do, I think that would really mesh with you.
• 6:08
  Speaker: They might say, like, yeah, I think I think that that sounds good.
• 6:12
  Speaker: I'm not working out with a civilian, I'm working out with like-minded people.
• 6:16
  Speaker: If I send grandma to that same gym, she might say, This is too intense, this is not what I'm I'm working with.
• 6:24
  Speaker: Or even if I have uh um a um, I don't know, like a middle, not even middle-aged, but a you know, someone in their 30s that has anxiety, maybe that's not the best gym for them either.
• 6:36
  Speaker: Right, right.
• 6:37
  Speaker: But if I've if I've vetted and I've talked to all these different gyms in the area to see what they're about and what they do and how they do it, that becomes a really good referral system and an extra um support system for that that patient or that client.
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: And before we even get to the to the referral to gym part, it it sounds like you know, the conversation a primary care physician should be having with their patient or could be having with their patient is not just hey, exercise, eat exercise more, eat less.
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: It's you know, what are your needs?
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: And I think I know a place where we can go.
• 7:07
  Speaker: Yeah, and also what do you, you know, at the you know, spoiler alert, but the at the end of Spark, the place where John Rady gets is um don't worry about all this data.
• 7:19
  Speaker: Do what you enjoy.
• 7:22
  Speaker: Because if you enjoy it, you're gonna keep coming back to it.
• 7:25
  Speaker: And maybe you add on to it, but maybe you don't, but at least you're moving, and and at the very least, movement is better than non-movement.
• 7:33
  Speaker: Especially for our doctors, it might just be like, what do you enjoy doing?
• 7:37
  Speaker: What did you do growing up that you wish you'd done more of, or didn't do enough of, or always wanted to get back into?
• 7:44
  Speaker: And how can we fit that in?
• 7:47
  Speaker: Um not go do that.
• 7:50
  Speaker: Right.
• 7:51
  Speaker: How can you fit that into your to your schedule, even if it's just once a week?
• 7:55
  Speaker: Um, and uh see what kind of ideas come up.
• 8:00
  Speaker: It might be like, you know, I was on a swim team, like college swim team, and and I had, you know, three kids and there was no time for that.
• 8:08
  Speaker: But all my kids are in high school now.
• 8:10
  Speaker: I could get to a pool like once a week.
• 8:13
  Speaker: That seems doable.
• 8:14
  Speaker: Um, they're all driving, so yeah, that's that's not a big deal.
• 8:17
  Speaker: All right, cool.
• 8:17
  Speaker: Let's see what we can, you know, knock the rust off.
• 8:20
  Speaker: Um, and I think that is an easier entry point uh to start.
• 8:25
  Speaker: But if you really have a good finger to the pulse on different gyms and trainers and things like that, you might be able to make really, really good connections.
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: I think that's a great idea.
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: Um, you know, I know some concierge doctors that, you know, of course can't find enough therapists that um I mean, even for their, I mean, quote, rich clients that they have, they even they have a backlog finding you know therapists.
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: So I think it's pretty amazing.
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: I can only imagine that's probably the same for trainers as well.
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: Um, so building that network and knowing who's around and what they do as well.
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: Good trainers.
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, good trainers, good coaches.
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: Hey, that's a good that's that actually is a good thought.
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: How do you identify a good trainer?
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: Not just Gabriel, who is also a therapist, but like, you know, how can we find a good trainer?
• 9:10
  Speaker: Yeah, I think it's I think it's interesting.
• 9:12
  Speaker: I think checking out the website, seeing um who goes to the gym, maybe who they have um have trained in the past, if they trained anyone that that might be um familiar in some sort of um maybe even social media sense, like hey, there's this famous athlete that works out at our gym.
• 9:32
  Speaker: Um I always look to see if they have, if you go to my website, my gym website, Lost Boy Strength Conditioning, um, you'll see a bunch of pictures with um world record holders.
• 9:47
  Speaker: Um and that's a really good clue that I probably uh not only know what I'm doing, but but I am at least involved in that world enough where I can make some better decisions and some good conscious decisions.
• 10:01
  Speaker: Um and so I think that also would tell me, oh, this person doesn't just stay in their gym and doesn't go anywhere.
• 10:09
  Speaker: Like this person is like going to far away to visit people, to learn from them, um, and then to bring it back here.
• 10:16
  Speaker: I think that's a really good quality that I don't think um, in many ways, coaches are very similar in that and in to counselors is I'll just do my CEUs online.
• 10:26
  Speaker: Um but if I'm traveling to learn from people that are way better than I could ever hope to be, um, then that's that's someone that has some real knowledge to them.
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because that that is a thing.
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: I mean, okay, our you're both we're both LPCs.
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: Um that's regulated by the state, you know.
• 10:45
  Speaker: Right.
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: And and whether you like regulation or don't like regulation, at least we can point to our license and say, all right, they've been vetted to a point, you know, at least a little bit.
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: We can get to the point of the quality of that vetting, but you know, we have the credentials.
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: But with with training, strength and conditioning, or anything like that, there's really no governing body, which again, I mean, that could be a benefit and and or a curse, depending on how you're looking at it.
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: But it's hard for laymen, you know, to find those folks.
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: So you mentioned, you know, finding the people that with good reputation, and essentially old school reputational vetting here, but what are things to, I mean, besides the opposite, like these people have no reputation at all.
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: But uh, what are some what are some red flags?
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: So we don't we don't send people that way.
• 11:30
  Speaker: I think red flags are if um if something feels sketchy, it probably is, and not even in a nefarious way, but in a like, if I send my mom who's in her late 60s, um, to a gym and she's like, Yeah, they had me um squatting with a barbell, I'd be like, oof, like not what do you know, absolutely right away.
• 11:52
  Speaker: Never never done a squat with a barbell before, yeah.
• 11:54
  Speaker: Yeah, um and you know, I used to go to a a uh a gym long ago before I owned my gym, and I remember distinctly remember a new couple coming in, um unhealthy, obese, uh, were there to really get healthy.
• 12:10
  Speaker: And they were like, Well, guys, we're all trying to find a new one rep max, so come on in.
• 12:16
  Speaker: And I just remember like, what are we talking about here?
• 12:19
  Speaker: Like, what are we doing?
• 12:20
  Speaker: Um and so like those are the obvious red flags.
• 12:24
  Speaker: But I think if if something feels off, it probably is, and if they don't have a good explanation, and it's uh a really thought-out explanation for this is why we're doing these things, I think it can feel um, I think it can be a red flag.
• 12:40
  Speaker: And I say this especially for my older population, because I think about I think about people that are in there, you know, really who I think about is is uh women over 60.
• 12:52
  Speaker: When you hit 60, like 10% of your bone density goes every 10 every year.
• 12:57
  Speaker: Um so uh you know, you're thinking if if you have a a regular uh boomer mom um who maybe did some uh you know Pilates back in the day and and you know, maybe some uh YMCA classes, uh, their bone density might be 50% at 60.
• 13:16
  Speaker: Um and so do the math.
• 13:18
  Speaker: Where are they gonna be at 65?
• 13:20
  Speaker: Uh and then what happens when they inevitably trip and fall?
• 13:23
  Speaker: Um and I think about them.
• 13:26
  Speaker: And if we are not looking at it from a perspective of, okay, now how do we prevent things and how do we build and and maintain safety?
• 13:33
  Speaker: That's a big really big big red flag to me, too.
• 13:36
  Speaker: Um you know, I uh what I always go back to is my coaches saying, um, if you can't squat, you can't sit on a toilet.
• 13:45
  Speaker: Um and so if grandma is using the hand silver handlebars to sit down, we have a huge problem because not only can they not sit down, can they get up?
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 13:58
  Speaker: Um, do they have the what we call like the thoracic mobility, like the ability to turn around to clean themselves?
• 14:04
  Speaker: Is that a thing?
• 14:05
  Speaker: Um and um those are things that scare me.
• 14:10
  Speaker: And then additionally, like as you get older, if you fall, we have really, really big problems.
• 14:15
  Speaker: Right, right.
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: Which would all lead to a very serious mental health condition of sadness and anxiety and all that stuff from doing that.
• 14:22
  Speaker: Yeah, I don't know anyone that is bedridden that's um like super, super happy.
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, yeah.
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: I would be right now.
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: I'm I need to be bedridden for a couple days, but um not yet.
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: Can't can't do that yet.
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: So very interesting.
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: Uh, you know, within you know the mental health field, of course, we have therapists of different strokes.
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: You know, I mentioned that I come from a theoretical background, you do as well.
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: Others, our professors came from others.
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: Um does I'm sure that exists within the strength training world as well, or just the personal training world.
• 14:54
  Speaker: Well, yeah, you have different coaches that specialize in different things.
• 14:57
  Speaker: Um, and I think really the um the higher, and it probably would be the higher level they coach, they could probably do um, they could probably do the what we would call like easier stuff.
• 15:11
  Speaker: Um, like I think about my buddy Travis Mash, who you you and I have talked about in the past, he's a world record powerlifter, he coaches a bunch of uh nationally and internationally ranked athletes.
• 15:21
  Speaker: He's taken a couple kids to the Olympic trials.
• 15:24
  Speaker: He was in the Olympics himself when he was younger.
• 15:27
  Speaker: Like, if I said, Hey, can you program for my mom who's in her late 60s?
• 15:31
  Speaker: He'd be like, Yeah, that's easy.
• 15:32
  Speaker: Like, give me 10 minutes.
• 15:33
  Speaker: Um and at the same time, it's like, hey, this kid is really good.
• 15:38
  Speaker: He could be on team USA next summer Olympics.
• 15:42
  Speaker: Can you program for him?
• 15:43
  Speaker: He'd be like, Yeah.
• 15:44
  Speaker: Give me, you know, 15 minutes, right?
• 15:48
  Speaker: Um, and so I think it really is kind of what we talked about before is what do you like to do as the patient?
• 15:55
  Speaker: What do you want to do?
• 15:56
  Speaker: What do you want to get better at?
• 15:57
  Speaker: What's important to you?
• 15:58
  Speaker: I always say um to people as they pass their 40s, you gotta get strong.
• 16:05
  Speaker: You just gotta get strong.
• 16:08
  Speaker: And uh you are not going to regret uh the muscle you put on after 40.
• 16:14
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 16:15
  Speaker: You know, and there's no way that you're going to get too jacked.
• 16:23
  Speaker: You know, like it that's just not gonna happen.
• 16:26
  Speaker: Not because of any kind of deficiency, but it is so hard to get really jacked.
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: Um, and those guys are eating like 1200 calories a day and all that stuff on top.
• 16:37
  Speaker: Yes, yeah, and in the gym, way more than than uh, you know, I'm in the gym.
• 16:42
  Speaker: I love to work out.
• 16:43
  Speaker: I have 30 minutes a day, like a hard 30 minutes every day.
• 16:48
  Speaker: Yeah, um, and so it's no more than that.
• 16:50
  Speaker: I just don't, there's just no time.
• 16:51
  Speaker: I got two kids, got too many jobs.
• 16:54
  Speaker: Um, and so um, you're just not gonna regret that stuff.
• 16:58
  Speaker: And so it really is what do you want to do?
• 17:01
  Speaker: What does this sort of season of life hold for you?
• 17:05
  Speaker: And then how can you find someone that that can help you achieve that goal?
• 17:08
  Speaker: Um, and so yeah, like yeah, it's may sound like a joke, but it but I would wonder if you could find if you were that 60-year-old grandma who I keep um uh uh ragging on, uh, and we're like, I do, I I don't I want to be able to go to Disney World with my grandkids and spend the whole day in the park and walk 15 miles uh in the park with them, because that sounds great.
• 17:34
  Speaker: Um, I need to be in shape and I cannot trip or fall, and so I need to be stronger.
• 17:41
  Speaker: And so I wonder what would happen.
• 17:43
  Speaker: Like, truly, I wonder what would happen if you walked into a Gold's gym as that lady and said, I need to get really, really strong because this is what I want out of the last you know, hopefully 40 years of my life.
• 17:55
  Speaker: Um, and what they would put together for you, like a good, you know, it might that person might even be like a figure competitive coach, right?
• 18:03
  Speaker: Or a bodybuilding coach.
• 18:05
  Speaker: I wonder what they would do.
• 18:06
  Speaker: I wonder if they would say, like, yeah, that's super easy.
• 18:08
  Speaker: We can get you um, you know, we can put all the puzzle pieces together as it relates to your your boundaries.
• 18:15
  Speaker: You're not gonna be in the gym for four hours.
• 18:16
  Speaker: You have 45 minutes, um, and you're probably not going to eat chicken and rice for every meal.
• 18:23
  Speaker: And so we can work around that.
• 18:25
  Speaker: Um, I would venture to say that that I don't know, maybe 80% of the time it's probably gonna work out just fine.
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: I I love this.
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: Um, I know we we ventured more into the physical effects and and the physical benefits, medical benefits of this, but you know, we started with the mental health benefits.
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: We, you know, it obviously, not obviously, it's not obvious.
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: We become our own medicine makers, you know.
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: We have our own opio receptors for a reason, our own cannabinoid cannabinoid receptors for a reason because we create things that hit those receptors inside our own bodies, right?
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: Uh, which affect our mood, affect our mental health.
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: It but it just sounds like this particular thing goes so beyond, it does go beyond mental health.
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: Um, but also it circles back to mental health because if you have a stronger body, you're able to play with your kids more, you're able to do more things, you're gonna be your your your quality of life's gonna be better, you're gonna enjoy some.
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: I just you know where I'm getting at.
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: This is like a keystone thing that we that sounds like you know, step one, even as a therapist, right?
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: Step one, hey, what are you doing to take care of your body?
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: Are you first I go, I I have the and I know you probably asked this too.
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: How much are you do you drink enough water?
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: Do you get enough sleep?
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: Um, what do you do for fun?
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: Are you do you anything, any movement that you do?
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: Half the time I've real after I've talked to the did an intake like that, I go, let's let's talk about depression here in a little bit, you know, after we get some time uh hydration.
• 19:53
  Speaker: I call it the lowest hanging fruit, right?
• 19:55
  Speaker: Yeah, um, and in my intake, I I ask those questions, and then I have a uh a bullet point that says, which do you want to learn more about?
• 20:02
  Speaker: Counseling.
• 20:03
  Speaker: Um, I'm not an N MD, but medicine is on there.
• 20:07
  Speaker: Um exercise, nutrition, dietetics, right?
• 20:11
  Speaker: Um, and that tells me they're open to a conversation because as many of your listeners are gonna know, talking to someone about their nutrition and dietetics is like asking them to convert to a different religion.
• 20:22
  Speaker: Um and so um we open the door that way.
• 20:26
  Speaker: But then I'm also saying, look, guys, you could never come see me again if you get enough water, if you dial in your sleep.
• 20:36
  Speaker: And for many of our ADHDers, if you eat a what I think we would standardize as like a uh a high protein diet, which in the strength conditioning world is just like a gram per pound of body uh per pound of protein, um somewhere around there, you're gonna do really well, especially as an ADHDer.
• 20:56
  Speaker: Um for other reasons we can talk about later if you want to.
• 20:59
  Speaker: Um, but like if you just start there, you you're gonna be pretty good.
• 21:04
  Speaker: And you're you're exercising, you know.
• 21:06
  Speaker: Um you're gonna be fine.
• 21:08
  Speaker: You can never see me again.
• 21:09
  Speaker: And and I would venture to say that like 30% of the issues you're having are gonna go away.
• 21:13
  Speaker: If you're an adult, if you're a kid, you know, I joke that ADHD is is only an issue because of school.
• 21:20
  Speaker: It's not true, but it's a funny joke.
• 21:22
  Speaker: Um and so uh yeah, it's the lowest hanging fruit, and all of which you don't have to pay anyone to do.
• 21:30
  Speaker: You can go for a walk, you can go for a run, you can go to a pool or jump rope or do lunges in your backyard, work out in your basement.
• 21:39
  Speaker: If you really had to, if you really had to, you could do those things.
• 21:42
  Speaker: Um and uh if you knew better, you could say, look, I'm I'm going to to drink this many cups of water every day.
• 21:53
  Speaker: Uh I'm going to intentionally set a bedtime alarm so that I go to bed and make sure I wake up and I've gotten.
• 21:59
  Speaker: eight hours four or more, whatever I need.
• 22:03
  Speaker: And so um yeah, having those conversations can be really, really helpful and just say, these are the lowest hanging fruit, and you would do really well to start dialing those in.
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: I'm hearing that we all need to work together a whole lot better too.
• 22:22
  Speaker: I I you know I I I call it my kitchen sink approach um when I have a parent that come in and says what do you recommend?
• 22:28
  Speaker: What do you recommend we start?
• 22:29
  Speaker: Medication, uh an IEP, uh a nutrition, um therapy, uh a sport.
• 22:37
  Speaker: I say we're gonna if you want to, we're gonna do the kitchen sink approach, which is throw everything at your kid.
• 22:44
  Speaker: And as time goes on, we'll take stuff away.
• 22:48
  Speaker: Right.
• 22:49
  Speaker: Especially if it's a really severe case.
• 22:52
  Speaker: If the kid is failing, having behavioral issues, suspensions, it's like let's throw the kitchen sink at this kid.
• 22:58
  Speaker: And then in time, then we can correct um and then find what that right dose of everything is right.
• 23:07
  Speaker: What is the right dose of exercise for this kid?
• 23:10
  Speaker: It it might be and I've had the kids I've had the kids that are super hyperactive where the stuff we do in the gym, I'm like, I don't I don't know how he's standing and then the kid runs up the stairs okay bye Gabriel.
• 23:24
  Speaker: See you next week.
• 23:25
  Speaker: And he's taking the stairs two steps at a time and I'm like I don't even I don't know I don't know how he's doing that.
• 23:30
  Speaker: This is insane.
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: We're obviously gonna have to weigh him down a little bit more next time.
• 23:34
  Speaker: So yeah oh my god the kid that I'm thinking of literally literally I had him dragging a hundred pound sled and carrying a 45 pound sandbag like on his chest yeah for like too long for too long and then I remember his dad saying like after we did that I took him to the uh to the pump track so like where you bike and then you like bike up and then you go you ride hard down he's like yeah we did that for an hour afterwards and I was like Lord like he just needs like his dose of exercise is just huge um and then some kids you know they come to my class twice a week and that's all the activity they do and mom and dad are like he sleeps so much better that he's coming to you now.
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: I think this is this is wonderful because I I'm I've interviewed a lot of people so far and one of the things we keep coming back to is uh there's no one specialty.
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: Now you happen to be a unicorn that is a trainer and a um and a therapist at the same time but that doesn't exist quite too often right um and it just sounds like don't kitchen sink ourselves yeah and I and to that point um I have met counselors that have exercise equipment in their spaces that is open to clients I've had therapists that are very into the research I have yet to meet myself.
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah yeah yeah yeah but you are a good test case to show that perhaps if we start bringing all these disciplines together more often that um that that that should be helpful.
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: So Gabriel I I have a feeling I'm gonna bring you back to start going down some other rabbit holes um absolutely so let's let's think about that one uh but I really appreciate you coming today before we sign off what's one thing you want the audience to know what what can we what can we leave them with you know I I think that the the best thing to do is for yourself or for your patients or for your clients you know really asking um what do you enjoy doing uh that's movement based um and how can you do a little bit more of it um I think once we get in our foot uh in the door of that or even the client gets their own foot in their own door for that activity um that's even that is good enough thank you for listening to Mind in Medicine please remember check the show notes for details on how to claim credits provide feedback on the podcast and find any resources mentioned that's it for now but keep an eye out for another episode for more evidence based education for healthcare providers on the go.
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: Be well