Latest / Book Flood Podcast / Tracey Baptiste on Where Stories Begin (E72)
Transcript
- Tom Nixon: Welcome to the Book Flood Podcast. I am your host, Tom Nixon. My guest this week is the amazing author, Tracy Baptiste Tracy is the author of the Jumbies series and Boy 2.0 and is the New York Times bestselling author of 26 books. Welcome, Tracy. Tracey: Thank you, Tom. Thank you for having me on a book flood. Tom Nixon: I appreciate it. So let's get going. What what led you to become an author? Tracey: You know, it's interesting. I I think I always wanted to be an author. I I remember telling my mom when I was very, very young that I wanted to grow up and tell stories. I think I did not know at the time what exactly it meant to be an author, but what I knew was that all of the books that I had had the author's name on the cover. And I really loved all of the books that I had. And so I really wanted to be able to do the same thing that these people were doing and to also have my name on the cover of a book. So I just kind of figured that this was a thing, you know, like people seem to be doing it. So I thought, surely I could grow up and do this. So yeah, I was I was really little when I decided to do this. Tom Nixon: Hmm. So you were born in Trinidad and Tobago. How did that affect your becoming an author? Did it affect you? Tracey: You know, I think that there are a lot of writers that come out of Trinidad and Tobago. I grew up on a lot of local stories. So you'll notice you you mentioned my my series The Jumbies, for example. And Jumbies are creatures from Trinidadian folklore, Caribbean folklore. So I grew up listening to all of these stories about these various creatures. And these stories were told not as stories that, you know, were fictional made-up things. They were told as if these were news reports. Like these things were happening down the street or a couple of towns over. And people talked about jumbies like they could literally be anybody. So it felt very alive to me. So that that's one part of it. The other part of it is that Calypso was also a storytelling vehicle for me growing up internet. It is a form of music that really comes from African oral traditions where people would pass on information and communicate orally and calypso developed from that becoming this way to Satirize things that were happening in popular culture, in politics, and and so on, in these amazing songs that everybody was dancing to, but they definitely had this narrative arc. And from Trinidad, a lot of pretty famous writers came, like V. S. Naipal, for example. But I also read a lot of Caribbean writers As a child growing up in school. Like that was part of my regular required reading, like A House for Mr. Biswas or Miguel Street, which were both V. S. Nypal, or Green Days by the River, which was another, I think also Trinidadian author. And one of the first sort of middle grade stories that I read, which was Escape to Last Man Pete. Which was, I believe, a Jamaican writer. I want to say Middelholzer was the name of the author, but I cannot really remember right now. But also Sam Selvin, Lonely L Lonely Londoners, those were all required reading for me. So the idea of somebody from the Caribbean writing stories that centered the Caribbean was not unusual for me. So it very much solidified the idea. that this was a thing that I could do when I became an adult. Tom Nixon: So do you get back to Trinidad and Tobacco very often? Tracey: I do actually just came I actually just came back maybe two weeks ago and Tom Nixon: well. Tracey: I will probably be back again towards the end of the year. So I still have a lot of family who lives in Trinidad. My husband as well is from Trinidad and his family a lot of his family lives in Trinidad. My mother is back and forth a lot. she lives with us part of the year, she lives in Trinidad part of the year, and so often I go back with her. My kids have been back and forth a lot. So yeah, we are very fortunate in that we still have the family home there and so we're able to Tom Nixon: Nice. Tracey: be there on our own steam, as it were. Tom Nixon: think you have had two books published this year. Am I right with that? Tracey: I did, yes. So one of them was the sequel to Boy Two Po, which is Kid X, which follows what happens after Cole figures out how it is he's able to become invisible and starts dealing with that. Of course, what do you think a twelve year old boy starts to do when he decides that he you know, realizes he can turn invisible at will? shenanigans ensue, of course. And the Tom Nixon: Right. Tracey: second right and the second one is probably the most personal book that I've written, something that really tackles something that I personally dealt with. It's one of the books in the Mrs. Z series. So the the series is called The Kids in Mrs. Z's class. And my book, which is number 12 in the series, is called Fia Hussein Finds Her Beat. So, first of all, Hussein is my maiden name. And the the issue that Fia is dealing with, the central issue to that book is that her accent is starting to change and she is having difficulty with that. And I, as a young person moving to the United States, did have to deal with that because I had a very thick Trinidadian accent at first, and then now My accent is very North American. Tom Nixon: Yes, yes. I was on an airplane a long time ago and and met some people from Trinidad and Tobago. and and yes, a very different kind of accent for sure. Lovely people too. Tracey: Yeah. I will say that we're all very for the most part very like have a very sunny disposition Tom Nixon: Mm. Tracey: to be sure. everything is an opportunity for humor in Trinidad. You find that very much part of the culture there. Tom Nixon: Yeah, I remember one of them saying, you know, one of these phrases that now you'll probably tell me, well that's not really from Trinidad and Tobago, but we'll we'll see. that and the face of God you won't ever see. Tracey: yeah. Yeah. there's a there's a lot of phrases that are like that. Tom Nixon: Mm. Tracey: also one of my favorite ones is behind God's back, when somebody lives really far away and Tom Nixon: Mm. Tracey: somebody will say, yeah, they live behind God's back because it's it's just impossible to get to so far. So th there are a lot of phrases that are like that. Tom Nixon: I love that. I love that. What is your next book? Tracey: Well, that's a good question, actually. So I have a picture book that is coming out. I wanna say it's early next year. I'm not a hundred percent sure. But it is called Love Is Like That. It is coming out from Penguin, and it is about a girl who has lost her dog, and she is dealing with the the near aftermath of having lost her dog when her dog comes back as a ghost. And so she is engaging with her her lost puppy in this way, but over the course of the story learns how to how to say goodbye to her beloved puppy. Tom Nixon: Hm. Is this your only book out in twenty twenty seven? Tracey: Yes, I believe it is. I think I have a short story in an anthology that's also coming out so it's not my book per se. It's a collaborative book. It is one of the we need diverse books anthologies, which Tom Nixon: Mm. Tracey: is called Monster Moon Rising. And I believe we're gonna have a cover reveal very soon. I'm very, very excited. It's a Very beautiful cover. And the premise of that book is that all of the stories take place on the night of a blood moon. And what happens on the night of the blood moon is that each of these characters are experiencing some kind of weird supernatural happening. over the course of the night that they have to deal with. This was a way that African peoples would tell stories, would pass on information, would communicate with each other. And In Trinidad and Tobago, this then becomes Calypso, which was used to contextualize things that were happening in the public sphere, to parody the politicians, to make sense out of nonsense in in some ways. And it was something that everybody absolutely enjoyed. So because of that, storytelling was this huge part of growing up intranet and Tobago. There was the calypso element. There was certainly an oral storytelling element where people would talk about jumbies, which is one of my Probably one of my best known series or is the Jumby series. And people would talk about jumbies as if they could be literally anybody. So this was not a feeling of stories that had happened or somebody had made up. This was a feeling of somebody telling you current events. So a jumbie story might be something that happened across the street or in the next town or something like that. But you did also get the sense that they were in fact stories, but it just felt more immediate. So between all of those things, I think Trinidad has produced a good number of writers. V. S. Nypaul, of course, being the most famous Tom Nixon: Mm-hmm. Tracey: of the writers that come out of Trinidad and Tobago. But yeah, the idea of being a storyteller was not something that felt unfamiliar to me. because I felt like I was surrounded by storytellers my entire time growing up. Tom Nixon: You have had two books come out in twenty twenty six, I believe. tell us about those. Tracey: So Kid X was the first one that came out, and that is the sequel to Boy 2.0. Boy 2.0 is the story of a boy named Cole who discovers that he has the ability to make himself invisible. And in Kid X, of course, he's now a 12 year old who knows that he can turn himself invisible. So what does a 12-year-old boy do with that information? Well, he gets into a lot of trouble. There's a lot of shenanigans. Nothing good. Tom Nixon: Yeah, nothing good. Nothing good. Tracey: Nothing good comes out of what Cole decides to do. And the second book is one of the books in the Mrs. Z series. This is a series of books that is authored by different people, each one authoring a different child in the class. So the series is called The Kids in Mrs. Z's class, and my book is called Fia Hussein Finds Her Beat. And it is probably the most personal, like directly personal story that I've ever written because first of all, Hussein is my maiden name. And second of all, it is about Fia moving to the United States and losing her accent, which is something that I dealt with as a young person who recently moved, when I recently moved to to Brooklyn, New York from Trinidad. Tom Nixon: Do you get back there often? Tracey: I do. So I just came back a couple of weeks ago and we still have a family house there where my mom lives there, but she's back and forth a lot. So sometimes she's here, sometimes she's there. My husband's family is also from Trinidad, from a different part of Trinidad, but we use my family house as the base. My kids are Tom Nixon: Mm. Tracey: often back and forth. So yeah, we are we spend a a fair amount of time in Trinidad every year. Tom Nixon: Do you have a book coming out in twenty twenty seven? Tracey: Yes. So the book I have coming out is I'm not sure exactly what the date is, but it is a picture book. It is called Love Is Like That. And it is about a girl who has recently lost her dog. And he comes back one day as a ghost. And it is about her learning to deal with the loss of her dog. And about her being able to say goodbye by the end of the story. But it is also a little bit of a I mean, there there obviously is that supernatural element, but it's also this element of what exactly is it that happens after after we go? That's sort of a big question that is layered into this very sweet picture Tom Nixon: Mm. Tracey: book. And that was written because I I have a lot of dogs in my life and we had recently lost one of our dogs and this Tom Nixon: Yeah. Tracey: is how I was dealing with the grief from from that. Tom Nixon: You have written many, many books, twenty six books, I believe. Tracey: Maybe more than that at this point. It's it's possible Tom Nixon: Yeah. Tracey: that it's more than that at this point, yes. Tom Nixon: Is there is there one that stands out either because it was interesting to write, fun to write, more so than any other book? Tracey: You know, they are all very different in how I came to each of these stories and how I executed each of these books. It is always a different experience. I I often tell people that it is really hard for me to describe my process of writing because I feel like. Every time I'm writing a book, I am learning how to write that book. And so there's Tom Nixon: Mm. Tracey: not a lot of things that cross over. But I will say that the one book that kind of now stands out for me, I never used to be able to pick out one out of my list. But the book that sort of stands out to me the most now is Super Gold Girl, which came out last year. summer at the beginning of last summer. And it is an absolutely unhinged science fiction story about a goat who is in a class full of superheroes, and she does not feel like she has anything to offer as a superhero. And so it's a little bit of it's a little bit about imposter syndrome. It's a little bit Tom Nixon: Mm. Tracey: about how silly can you possibly make a story without it going completely off the rails. And I think I had so much fun writing this story. And the illustrator, Dappo Ariola, had so much fun doing the illustrations for the story that I think it is. probably now my favorite just because when I look at it, I immediately think joy. You know, there was there were no hard parts in the in the process for this particular book. And it is probably feels like my it definitely feels like my personality more than any other book. Tom Nixon: Hmm. I I noticed when I was looking over your your list of books, and I mean this in the nicest possible way, but but you're a little bit all over the place. In in terms of often if someone is a picture book writer, that's what they do. If someone is a middle grade author, that's what they do, and you have no problem sort of jumping from project to project. Tracey: That is true. I also will write fiction, will write nonfiction. And I think that comes from my background as a classroom teacher. So I taught my my degree, my master's degree is in education, and my certification is pre-K to six. I taught mostly second grade. In my years in the classroom, but I did teach pre-K and I did teach all the way up to sixth grade as well. And these elementary school teachers have to be into everything. You have to know all of the things. You have to know all the topics, all the subjects, all the nuances of a whole bunch of different things. And I think because of that training, it has made me a person who is curious about. a lot of things, but not surface curious, but like deeply curious about a lot of different things. And that comes out in the kinds of projects that I take on. I'm just deeply curious about like a million different kinds of things. Like right now, when I was while I was in Trinidad, there was this deep sea exploration that was happening off of the coast of the island. And I became completely fascinated by that. And so now I think I'm gonna write probably at least one book from from the the deep dive pun intended that I am doing based on the work that these scientists have been doing, because I was following the dives live as they were doing it, and now As they are analyzing the data, they are releasing videos and other bits of information about that deep sea exploration. And I find it so fascinating that it is bringing up a lot of ideas for stories. And I think that that's what happens, you know. And I don't know. If these stories are going to lean towards nonfiction or fiction. I don't know where it's going to lead me. But because I'm so fascinated at the moment, I'm basically like glued to my YouTube channel, to like the YouTube channel watching like this, like with complete awe, because I know that there's something in there that I'm going to take away and I'm going to want to create something with it. Tom Nixon: Is that how you get most of your ideas a little bit they life presents them to you? Tracey: Most of the time, yeah, I think so. I feel like there are things that I come across in the world that I find really fascinating, and I wonder, ooh, what would happen if? How would this work if? you know, and I find my way into a story like that. But there are also times when I feel like I've been brooding on something for a really long time. It may not be a new thing that is coming into my life. It may be something that I have experienced or something I read or a long past experience that I've just been ruminating on for a an exceptionally long time. And then eventually I will see my way into a story. So Boy 2.0 actually started like that. Boy 2.0 began in, I want to say I was thinking about that book starting right after I had finished writ writing the first Jumpies book. I had Tom Nixon: Yeah. Tracey: this idea of what would happen if in fairy tales, which is often where I start, I I really Have a very deep love of fairy tales. And so a lot of the work that I do connects back to fairy tales in a way. And it occurred to me that in a lot of fairy tales, there is this deep fear of the woods. And I thought it would be really interesting to know that there was some kind of technology that was keeping people deliberately from the woods. And what would that look like and what would who would be doing that and what kind of society would that be in and who would be the people populating it and that's actually where boy 2.0 started it's not where boy 2.0 ended up but that was the that was the first set of thoughts in my head that eventually led to boy 2.0 so it often is just some piece of the world that I am trying to grapple with, trying to figure out that I am really fascinated with that eventually finds its way into a story that I'm trying to tell. Tom Nixon: You going back to something you mentioned a little earlier, you were a classroom teacher, and then you transitioned to to being an author. Did that overlap or you moved from one to the other, or or what was your thinking there? Tracey: So the well, it depends on how you think about it. So I was a classroom teacher in elementary school, and then I left the classroom and I so there was a period where I was a curriculum designer for a textbook company. And while I was doing that work, I started writing. So I had always known that I wanted to write, but teachers Have so much to do. And you Tom Nixon: Yes. Tracey: may think that the day ends at three o'clock and it really doesn't. Like the day is super, super long. And you may feel like a lot of people feel like, they have summers off, but they really don't. They're still they're still working. It is a very labor intensive kind of job. And I just did not have time to write stories while I was in the elementary classroom. But I did have time to write while I was a curriculum designer. And then eventually I transitioned from being an editor and curriculum designer to writing full-time. But then I went back to the classroom because now I teach in an MFA program. So I am still in the classroom technically, but this time my students are master's degree students, writers. rather than little kits. Funny enough, I am still using the tools that I learned as a classroom teacher that I use in the MFA classes that I teach. Tom Nixon: I I have been an elementary school teacher and I have taught graduate students and it's amazing how much carryover there is or at least can be for sure. so you teach at University of San Francisco. what's the best advice you offer those potential authors there or potential authors in general? Tracey: Feel like the best advice for any author is to read a lot, but also to read widely. I think a lot of people tend to think that if they want to read picture books, they should just read picture books and learn how picture books work, what people are doing in picture books, and so on. And that is absolutely vitally important to understand the genre that you most want to write in. But Tom Nixon: Mm-hmm. Tracey: there is so much to be gained from reading just things that you will never attempt in a in a picture book, for example. Like reading checkoff is is vitally important because it teaches you how to write. It teaches you what good writing looks like. It teaches you what's possible. Sometimes the thing that works in a picture book. Is something that nobody has ever tried before in a picture book. And that kind of writing or the impetus to do something like that might exist in a science article that you read out of a magazine. You just don't know where you are going to find the little bit of information, the little tool that you can use to tweak your own writing. So I tell people to read. As much as you possibly can, as often as you possibly can, and to read absolutely everything that you can get your hands on, even if it's not something that you would typically pick up. I actually think that's important too, to read things that you don't normally read, because it gives you another way of thinking about language that you're not used to, and it So but it's also it's it really is about reading as widely as possible, reading absolutely everything you can get your hands on, reading magazines, reading science articles, reading poetry, reading you know, ancient Greek texts as well as, you know, contemporary poetry or going to listen to poetry slams. You want to consume language in a lot of different ways and in whatever manner that you can, because it is one of those things that keeps your mind pliant. It lets you see how language can be manipulated. It lets you see what is possible in language and focusing on. Just one kind of writing or just the kind of writing that you want to do will teach you a lot about that particular genre and its good, vital work, but it does not allow you to expand past that. Because a lot of the time, what's really interesting in a story is when somebody pushes the boundaries a little bit. And it's not really possible Tom Nixon: Yeah. Tracey: to push the boundaries unless. you are looking past those boundaries. So if you hem yourself in, you're only gonna be able to do that kind of writing. So y you have to think expansively. To be able to think expansively, you have to read expansively. Tom Nixon: Tell us about the importance of having diverse characters. Tracey: Well, I mean the w the the the whole thing about diversity in storytelling is that we live in a diverse world. There are a lot of different types of people. People come from all kinds of different places. They have all kinds of different experiences. They see the world in a lot of different ways. Their culture makes certain assertions about the world and how the world can or should work. That are different, and that's interesting. And if you want to have an interesting story, keeping it homogenized is not interesting at all. Often where stories get interesting is when things start to collide. And diversity of character makes that possible, not just as a plot device, not just as story propulsion. But because people are interesting. And it's interesting in a story to have people do things that are different and against the grain. And that really requires the author to deeply understand people, not just to place characters for the sake of placing them because they look different or they have a slightly different culture, but to like really do a deep dive into Why is their culture different? What is the what are the textures of this culture that are interesting that can really add something interesting to the story? That's really where the interest comes from. It's not just that the character is Indian, for example. and it it really has a lot to do with, you know, how deeply you dive into that culture. And the you know, these are things that I love because growing up in Trinidad, well, for example, you know, half of my family is of African descent, half of my family is of Indian descent. We have a lot of indigenous like kids who were, you know, of the indigenous Carib people, a lot of different cultures come together in Trinidad in like a very kind of major way. And so it's really interesting. So for me, That's just kind of what my world was like growing up. When you take a picture of my family, it's just it is all over the place. But getting deeply into each of those characters and understanding where it is they really come from, and having that be part of the story, of the interconnectedness of the story, that's really what's so interesting about stories. And I love stories that really explain. explore how people can have completely different cultures and how they can still come together on these very, very deep levels. It's really fascinating to me. Tom Nixon: Hmm. What are you working on now? Tracey: So, so I think right now, because I'm so fascinated by that deep-sea exploration that happened off of the coast of Trinidad, I am completely immersed in those videos at the moment. And I'm pretty sure something will come of it. I'm not sure exactly. what it is. Like I said, I'm not sure whether or not this is gonna work out to be fiction or nonfiction, or whether it'll be both, because it, you know, it it does not have to be either or. I I do enjoy writing both fiction and nonfiction. So it might be both. But I find myself right now absolutely glued to the Schmidt Ocean YouTube channel watching all of the videos of those dives. And the dives are like, These are like day-long dives. So like I'm talking, these videos are like seven, eight hours long. And I'm just, you know, deep diving into each of these, reading all of the comments, because the scientists themselves are not doing a lot of commentary during the dives, but there are a lot of comments Tom Nixon: Mm. Tracey: from people who were watching them live, especially when they come across a creature and there's like a lot of discussion. And so I'm watching those, I'm reading the comments and then I'm also on the side looking up like what each of the creatures looks like and I started to do I have it here I might have it here it might be underneath I'm gonna shift my little camera just a tiny bit so that you can see because it's like literally in one of I have like a million notebooks. And so I started to draw some of the creatures that I was seeing. Some like doing notes, drawing pictures, about all of the things that I'm seeing in these extremely lengthy videos that I find really fascinating. And I think that this will eventually become something. I don't know what it'll be, but I am very diligently going down this rabbit hole and I I am really enjoying it right now. Tom Nixon: Do you visit a lot of schools, libraries? Is that part of your work as well? Tracey: Yes, it is. it and it it is one of my favorite things to do because as a classroom teacher, you never quite get the classroom out of your system. And you probably know this. You you you were also a classroom teacher. And it's a lot of fun for me to go into the classroom and know that I am giving Teachers and students something that they would not ord ordinarily get. But also knowing that I know exactly what teachers and those kids in those classrooms are looking for. And being able to deliver that exactly because I do understand it from both sides is a lot of fun for me. But probably the most fun for me as a former teacher is that it involves no paperwork. And no dealing with the administration. Yeah. Tom Nixon: Right. Tracey: So so yeah, so I I love doing classroom visits and yeah, I love I love being able to walk away at the end of the day and know that I don't have anything else to do. Tom Nixon: That that is the be best of all possible worlds for sure. Is there a book or a series of books from your childhood that still resonates with you? Tracey: You know, there was a book by a series of books by Edith Blyton called The Naughtyest Girl at School. And it was one of those school stories where there was a girl who was in a boarding school. So I I grew up in a lot of British literature because Trindad and Tobago is a British colony or was a British colony. And so a lot of the literature we got was from the from the UK. And I loved this series. So this was what would have been I I guess the best comparison I can make is to like a wayward school series where there's like a series of of books or there was another book series with with a school, but I can't remember, but anyway. But this is what it was like. It was realistic fiction. the books were fairly short. And I feel like they came out either one a year or maybe twice a year, maybe spring and fall they came out. And I ate these books up. I loved them so much. The the main character, she tried her best, but she really was incredibly clumsy and was prone to getting into trouble, but boy, she tried her hardest and she was very easy to relate to. Tom Nixon: What are you reading now? Tracey: So I am reading this great book by Chonda Prescott-Weinstein, which is called The The Edge of Space-Time. So I am, I guess, an amateur cosmologist. I really find astronomy fascinating, to astrophysics absolutely fascinating. And I do read probably one or two books. on astrophysics a year, not because I understand it, but because I am constantly seeking to understand this world and these ideas. And there are some books that I I have read a couple of times. But yeah, I saw I just started Dr. Actually it's Weinstein, Dr. Weinstein's book, Chanda Prescott Weinstein. And yeah, I already don't understand it, but I'm I'm gonna dig it. Tom Nixon: Well I want to thank you so much, Tracy, for being on the podcast. For our listeners and watchers, please remember to like, subscribe, and share. And again, thank you so much, Tracy. Tracey: Thank you so much for having me, Tom. Really appreciate it. Tom Nixon: absolutely.