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The FBI vs. Tupac Shakur · Conspiracy! The Show

0:10
Speaker 1: Welcome to Conspiracy The Show with your hosts Adam Todd
0:16
Speaker 1: Brown and Connor mcspaden. Hey, everybody, welcome to Conspiracy the Show.
0:34
Speaker 1: I'm Adam Todd Brown.
0:36
Speaker 2: Who are you? Connor mcspadden. Connor mcspadden's back back in
0:40
Speaker 2: the house.
0:40
Speaker 1: The black van dropped him off safely on the corner.
0:44
Speaker 2: And now whenever I see a three of clubs, I
0:48
Speaker 2: start saying the N words. So we gotta be careful.
0:51
Speaker 2: They're trying to they're trying to deplatform me by the subliminally,
0:54
Speaker 2: they're trying to make me get, you know, unwoke enough
0:57
Speaker 2: that I won't be able to tell people what what
1:00
Speaker 2: they did about Cuba or whatever.
1:03
Speaker 1: Welcome back to the show. What have you been doing
1:05
Speaker 1: since you've been going? I mean I've been telling people anyway.
1:07
Speaker 2: Well, I've started I've started wearing joggers, which is probably
1:10
Speaker 2: the biggest thing in my life is I've bought about
1:12
Speaker 2: four pairs of joggers from various Ross dress for losses
1:15
Speaker 2: around the country. Sure, and I gotta say they're breezy.
1:17
Speaker 2: You know, I don't wear shorts. I have terrible Irish legs, right,
1:21
Speaker 2: But I mean, you get the ventilation of shorts, but
1:24
Speaker 2: they look they look slick. You know, it really pulls
1:28
Speaker 2: a lot. Yeah pull, No, they don't snap off. I
1:30
Speaker 2: will be buying breakaway pants probably at some point, because
1:33
Speaker 2: I have the level of disposable income that I'm I
1:36
Speaker 2: google jet pack prices and shit like I'm not. I'm
1:38
Speaker 2: not doing like my I'm spiraling out of control in life.
1:41
Speaker 2: But I do have a lot of cool jogger jogger pants.
1:44
Speaker 2: And I wrote for some TV shows and stuff and
1:47
Speaker 2: one on the road, No, all the usual, a lot
1:49
Speaker 2: of Indian casinos and you know, the racist jokes for
1:52
Speaker 2: you know, fucking you know, famous people. That was what
1:54
Speaker 2: I've been doing.
1:55
Speaker 1: So that was David Bell joining us today as a guest. Hello,
2:00
Speaker 1: how are you man, I'm well. David Bell co hosts
2:03
Speaker 1: the Best Bad Movie Ever podcast, which that's a plug
2:07
Speaker 1: that makes sense on this show because I think this
2:09
Speaker 1: is one of the few shows where maybe some people
2:11
Speaker 1: just listen to this and don't listen to anything else,
2:13
Speaker 1: but they should. They should should listen to Best Bad
2:16
Speaker 1: Movie Ever.
2:16
Speaker 2: See hardcore mix, bad in heads, you know.
2:21
Speaker 1: The I'm on the episode of Best Bad Movie Ever
2:23
Speaker 1: this week. It's about the remake of National Lampoon's vacation,
2:27
Speaker 1: which is a national treasure.
2:28
Speaker 3: Are you taking heat for that?
2:30
Speaker 1: Because no, I've been getting it's been kind of mixed
2:32
Speaker 1: the Patreon comments so far. Have my my back. Oh
2:39
Speaker 1: that's good, Yeah, because it's a good movie. Why all
2:42
Speaker 1: I've seen on Twitter is people not agree with you. Well,
2:45
Speaker 1: it's because everyone on Twitter is a fucking knots.
2:47
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're all cops. Yeah, Carl and Jack Dorsey's back
2:51
Speaker 2: pocket to delegitimize the crowd funded podcasting network and not
2:56
Speaker 2: on my watch, I'll tell you right. Yeah, we're fighting back.
2:59
Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, we are talking about a thing today
3:03
Speaker 1: that we've sort of talked about on this show before,
3:06
Speaker 1: in that we have an episode called Who Killed Tupac
3:09
Speaker 1: where we run through all the various theories about who
3:14
Speaker 1: actually pulled the trigger.
3:16
Speaker 3: I haven't listened to who it was j R.
3:19
Speaker 2: Yeah, And then Maggie show Maggie'll Coming Together.
3:24
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, there were a few different conclusions there that
3:29
Speaker 1: came up in that episode, and that's almost not what
3:32
Speaker 1: we're talking about here. I'm talking more today. We're talking
3:37
Speaker 1: about the idea that Tupac, for pretty much the entirety
3:43
Speaker 1: of his career was the target of an FBI harassment
3:48
Speaker 1: campaign that could very well have ended in him being
3:52
Speaker 1: murdered at the behest of American intelligence agencies.
3:57
Speaker 2: That's all you can hear about it on the Behest
4:01
Speaker 2: Coop Ever podcast. I love the word behest.
4:06
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's a good word.
4:07
Speaker 2: Well, because yeah, he was on the like just in
4:09
Speaker 2: case kind of watch list, which is something that you
4:12
Speaker 2: kind of learn. It's like, you do you hear, you
4:14
Speaker 2: hear about a lot of things. You're like, well, socialism
4:16
Speaker 2: has never worked. It's like, yeah, it's because we have
4:18
Speaker 2: like a whole like like the floor of the FBI.
4:21
Speaker 2: That's like, all right, guys, go kill socialists and destabilize
4:25
Speaker 2: their their countries from within, you know, with the fucking
4:28
Speaker 2: election rigging and shit.
4:29
Speaker 1: That's that's why. So harch Oh, this guy's getting popular.
4:32
Speaker 2: He's got some pretty good ideas about you know, being
4:34
Speaker 2: nice to your mom and reading books. So it's let's
4:37
Speaker 2: get him shot in the head. Yeah.
4:38
Speaker 1: Look into Venezuela and what role we've had in destabilizing Venezuela. Oh.
4:44
Speaker 2: Yeah, where you need a wheelbarrow full of cash to
4:46
Speaker 2: buy gum.
4:46
Speaker 1: You know, Yeah, and that that's us basically declaring financial
4:50
Speaker 1: war on Venezuela back in twenty fourteen. But hey, we're
4:53
Speaker 1: getting off track. So yeah, the FBI, they have a
4:57
Speaker 1: history of doing this kind of thing. Yeah, And my
5:00
Speaker 1: argument here is that what happened to Tupac for most
5:03
Speaker 1: of his career was just an extension of the FBI's
5:07
Speaker 1: efforts to bring down the Black Panthers.
5:09
Speaker 3: That I mean, that doesn't sound unreasonable. Yeah, I looking
5:13
Speaker 3: at I mean, we'll go through it, but looking at
5:16
Speaker 3: it all, I've been like in the middle on this
5:19
Speaker 3: because I feel like the thing I can't decide.
5:23
Speaker 2: Well, it's like I love rap music, but I also
5:25
Speaker 2: love my female Body Inspector T shirt. I don't know
5:27
Speaker 2: how I choose.
5:29
Speaker 1: Now.
5:29
Speaker 3: The thing I can't decide is whether or not they're
5:31
Speaker 3: doing it extremely intentionally or if it's just this I
5:36
Speaker 3: don't know, like that thing where Congress is like doing
5:39
Speaker 3: meetings about rap music and stuff. It's like I can
5:42
Speaker 3: see some of them thinking that this is a legitimate concern,
5:47
Speaker 3: stupidly thinking that, but thinking that, and then there's others
5:50
Speaker 3: that have a little more like insidious thoughts about it,
5:53
Speaker 3: Like it's it's I'm just I'm on the fence. I'm
5:57
Speaker 3: on the fence.
5:58
Speaker 1: One of my I should point out a lot of
6:00
Speaker 1: what's pretty much most of what's in this episode comes
6:03
Speaker 1: from what might as well be the bible of this podcast,
6:07
Speaker 1: which is the book Drugs as Weapons against Us by
6:10
Speaker 1: a man named John Potash. Well, I'm gonna try and
6:13
Speaker 1: get on the podcast. Oh yeah, I mean we, I
6:16
Speaker 1: mean we have to talk to this dude. He wrote
6:18
Speaker 1: this is possibly my favorite conspiracy theory book. It produces
6:23
Speaker 1: my favorite conspiracy theory, which is that Courtney Love was
6:27
Speaker 1: a CIA operative whose role was to break up budding
6:31
Speaker 1: music scenes with drugs and infighting. Yeah, when they started
6:35
Speaker 1: to get to leftists, which sounds crazy, but it is
6:38
Speaker 1: a compelling fucking theory.
6:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's a good one.
6:43
Speaker 1: So a lot of that, a lot of what we're
6:45
Speaker 1: going to talk about today, comes from that book. And
6:48
Speaker 1: I would suggest, like, if it sounds interesting, read the book,
6:52
Speaker 1: because I am I'm just kind of glossing over the
6:54
Speaker 1: information in there. And also he links to all of
6:57
Speaker 1: his sources, so you can go check the source material
7:00
Speaker 1: for yourself.
7:01
Speaker 2: Now, look his his his domain name has been suspended
7:04
Speaker 2: for lack of payment. I'm assuming you know. So we're trying.
7:08
Speaker 2: We're trying. I think we got his wy mail. We're
7:10
Speaker 2: not sure, but we're the wheels are in motion.
7:13
Speaker 1: This is a good time to do this episode too,
7:15
Speaker 1: because this week marks the twenty second anniversary of the
7:18
Speaker 1: death of Tupac, and the twenty second anniversary is the
7:21
Speaker 1: conspiracy anniversary. That's where you get yeah, by the conspiracy theory.
7:25
Speaker 3: He was like shot in the seventh and died in
7:27
Speaker 3: the hospital on the like thirteenth, right, I was, He's like, yeah,
7:31
Speaker 3: it's like a nine to eleven sandwich where he's the bread.
7:34
Speaker 1: Yeah, hell yeah, yeah. I don't know why people think
7:38
Speaker 1: it's so weird that his death is unsolved. He just
7:41
Speaker 1: so he got shot on the jam packed Vegas strip
7:44
Speaker 1: after a Mike Tyson fight.
7:45
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was in for a circus circus, right, it was.
7:49
Speaker 2: Oh, that was right where I did a porn shoot recently.
7:54
Speaker 1: Which was a parody of Tupac being shot on the face.
7:57
Speaker 2: Oh I wish no, I mean, it was just another
7:58
Speaker 2: fucking ROAs because I have a exactly one goddamn trick.
8:01
Speaker 2: But you know it was I guess did Yeah, I
8:04
Speaker 2: think it's Chappelle. Maybe there's like more people saw Tupac
8:07
Speaker 2: get shot than the fucking Moonland.
8:09
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, there were so many people around and somehow
8:13
Speaker 1: this has never been solved. And like I said, the
8:17
Speaker 1: main theme of this book is that the CIA one
8:21
Speaker 1: sells drugs and two uses music to sell drugs, but
8:26
Speaker 1: also monitors musicians. And when they start getting a little
8:30
Speaker 1: too leftist with their politics, CIA, the FBI, someone is
8:34
Speaker 1: going to go in and see them, because if you
8:36
Speaker 1: have drugs, you become annoying and easy to discredit, right,
8:39
Speaker 1: you know, because they show you the truth exactly. Here's
8:43
Speaker 1: a here's a question. How many far right types have
8:46
Speaker 1: ever been assassinated in this country or just right leaning
8:49
Speaker 1: types at all.
8:51
Speaker 2: Well, I'll tell you what. They need to make another
8:53
Speaker 2: taxi driver soon. You know what I'm saying, all right,
8:56
Speaker 2: the nero just it doesn't have to be good. I mean,
8:58
Speaker 2: you know, people are people flip out about inception, Like
9:02
Speaker 2: let's just you know, let's bring Travis back and we'll
9:04
Speaker 2: see if we can get another uh fucking fat ham
9:07
Speaker 2: sandwich heating guy to you know, get get a gun
9:09
Speaker 2: off of Craigslist.
9:10
Speaker 1: And yeah, that is the the the closest thing to
9:14
Speaker 1: a right ing assassination was Reagan and that didn't work.
9:17
Speaker 2: Yeah, well that's like the old Bill Hicks bit where
9:19
Speaker 2: he's like, Kennedy shot, you know, Kennedy shot King shot,
9:23
Speaker 2: ex shot Reagan wounded the fuck that did.
9:28
Speaker 3: Result in a great punk band name, which was Jodie
9:30
Speaker 3: Foster's Army. Oh yeah, that.
9:34
Speaker 1: Is a good name.
9:35
Speaker 2: Yeah.
9:36
Speaker 1: But yeah, when it comes to like, I don't know,
9:41
Speaker 1: is it still crazy to suggest that maybe that rash
9:44
Speaker 1: of assassinations against left leaning political figures in the sixties
9:48
Speaker 1: and seventies might have been somewhat of a government operation.
9:52
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, I mean the Joint chiefs like didn't fuck
9:55
Speaker 2: with Kennedy at all, and they were just like, well,
9:58
Speaker 2: they're like they're like pretty much to a fucking face,
10:00
Speaker 2: where like you gotta like play ball with us, you know,
10:03
Speaker 2: and keep doing the ship that we've been doing. And
10:04
Speaker 2: it was like no, and they're like, oh, okay, I
10:10
Speaker 2: mean there's an easy way. There is an easy way,
10:13
Speaker 2: And I mean it's I do think someone like pulled
10:16
Speaker 2: Obama aside and was like, look, here's the deal, all right,
10:19
Speaker 2: you can be a lame centrist that governs by executive
10:21
Speaker 2: order and gets a water down version of your healthcare Bill,
10:24
Speaker 2: and you can live to see your daughters graduate from college,
10:27
Speaker 2: or you can try to shake things up. See how
10:29
Speaker 2: it goes. You're a call load to the government, buddy.
10:33
Speaker 1: Like, yeah, it's got I feel like it. Probably it
10:37
Speaker 1: has to be somewhat.
10:38
Speaker 3: Is this about fear of socialism? Because the idea that
10:41
Speaker 3: like that, I mean, everything's accusations of socialism and the
10:45
Speaker 3: idea that the left would go further towards socialism.
10:48
Speaker 2: I mean, these people weren't like they were like they
10:50
Speaker 2: were left leaning, I guess. But it's like the people
10:52
Speaker 2: that killed, like, you know, excluding like King X, were
10:54
Speaker 2: like not even that fucking radical. I mean people can
10:58
Speaker 2: be called Republicans, you know, and Europe, but they're like, oh,
11:01
Speaker 2: it's not enough for us, you know.
11:04
Speaker 1: Yeah, And it does kind of seem like that, Like
11:08
Speaker 1: it it's a means of keeping down communist or socialist
11:14
Speaker 1: ideas and keeping them from going mainstream.
11:18
Speaker 3: I'm going completely off. In an Exiles episode when the
11:21
Speaker 3: Citherette smoking man kills Martin Luther King because he supports socialism.
11:26
Speaker 1: That sounds about right. Yeah, and yeah, the Mark we
11:30
Speaker 1: just did an episode of the about the MLK assassination
11:33
Speaker 1: with Madison Shepherd, and that's the only assassination from the
11:38
Speaker 1: Golden era of assassinations, as I like to call it
11:41
Speaker 1: that I haven't really looked into is Malcolm X. But
11:44
Speaker 1: I bet there's some weirdness behind the assassination of Malcolm
11:48
Speaker 1: X too. There's definitely weird shit behind mlk's assassination. And
11:53
Speaker 1: the thing is, there's a documentary everyone should watch. It's
11:56
Speaker 1: a PBS documentary about the Black Panthers, and where do
12:02
Speaker 1: I have it in It's called the Black Panthers Vanguard
12:06
Speaker 1: of the Revolution.
12:07
Speaker 2: Not to be confused with my Minecraft server the Black Panthers.
12:10
Speaker 2: You know, I got a pretty fun you know, just
12:14
Speaker 2: played by the rules and you're welcome.
12:15
Speaker 1: But the thing about if you watch that documentary, it
12:20
Speaker 1: makes it really clear that the government played a big
12:24
Speaker 1: role in bringing down the Black Panthers, right like it
12:27
Speaker 1: was their main purpose in the late seventies or in
12:31
Speaker 1: the late sixties early seventies was to destroy the Black Panthers.
12:36
Speaker 1: And they did a great job of it, they sure did. Yeah,
12:41
Speaker 1: and they stayed at it.
12:42
Speaker 2: Didn't one of them have like a barbecue sauce now
12:44
Speaker 2: or something.
12:45
Speaker 1: That wouldn't surprise one of the Black Panthers. Yeah, but
12:49
Speaker 1: I don't want to say definitely.
12:51
Speaker 2: Yeah, neither do I. I also feel like probably shouldn't
12:53
Speaker 2: have brought that up with more information. Somebody that was
12:56
Speaker 2: some kind of an activist that sells barbecue sauce now
12:58
Speaker 2: and that I'm probably.
13:00
Speaker 1: He's probably the guy from the Dead candidate Adam put
13:02
Speaker 1: that put that deck of cards away East Ray and
13:06
Speaker 1: Class Fluorides Special punk rock hot Sauce.
13:10
Speaker 3: He was Paul Newman and he was like, why not me?
13:13
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's the.
13:19
Speaker 1: And I bring up the Black Panthers because Tupac is
13:24
Speaker 1: so intrinsically tied to the Black Panthers. His mother was
13:29
Speaker 1: a member of the Black Panther Party in Harlem, a
13:33
Speaker 1: Foene Shakur. He was born to her in nineteen seventy one.
13:36
Speaker 1: His father was a Bronx based Black Panther named Asada Shakur,
13:40
Speaker 1: and his stepfather Matulus Shakur Well.
13:43
Speaker 2: His middle name is Carne Asada.
13:47
Speaker 1: He often took Tupac to activist meetings as a child,
13:51
Speaker 1: and when the FBI put Metulushakur on its most wanted list,
13:54
Speaker 1: they actually visited Tupac at school to ask if he'd
13:57
Speaker 1: seen his stepfather anywhere, And at the age of seventeen,
14:01
Speaker 1: Tupac was made the youngest ever elected national chairman of
14:05
Speaker 1: the New African Panthers, a group that by that point
14:09
Speaker 1: was active in eight cities around the country. So Tupac
14:14
Speaker 1: definitely has deep ties to an organization that has historically
14:18
Speaker 1: been targeted for elimination by the FBI, and the fact that.
14:22
Speaker 3: He became so famous would make him an even bigger target, right.
14:27
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, in that if anyone was going to breathe
14:30
Speaker 1: new life into that movement, it would have been Tupac,
14:33
Speaker 1: right for sure.
14:34
Speaker 2: It's like manifestos, who's reading them? But fucking radio hits?
14:39
Speaker 1: Yeah, oh if you hear me, yeah, yea, what what
14:43
Speaker 1: a fucking great song that is? And there's I left
14:45
Speaker 1: it out of the notes, But there's a lot of
14:48
Speaker 1: this book, man, the allegations it makes will ruin everything
14:54
Speaker 1: you like about music. Yeah, And there's a bit in
14:59
Speaker 1: here about Tupac's second album and about what happens within
15:02
Speaker 1: her Scope Records in between his first and second album
15:05
Speaker 1: that is really fucking interesting. But anyway, let's talk about
15:11
Speaker 1: did anyone watch this prison interview?
15:13
Speaker 2: I watched more of the first clip.
15:16
Speaker 1: I This is a thing I watched a few years ago,
15:20
Speaker 1: and what really struck me about it It was filmed
15:24
Speaker 1: about a year before Tupac died. It was filmed sometime
15:28
Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety five while he was still in prison.
15:31
Speaker 3: So, I sorry, it didn't even occur to me.
15:33
Speaker 2: He's in movies, like he asks, he's in Jews, right, yeah, yeah,
15:38
Speaker 2: say Juice or Jews Juice Juice, Okay, Yeah, I haven't
15:43
Speaker 2: seen any two movies in Jews.
15:45
Speaker 3: It was like a comp thriller thing.
15:47
Speaker 2: I mean, he fucked streisand a lot of people don't know.
15:51
Speaker 1: He's in a whole bunch of movies. He's in Poetic
15:53
Speaker 1: Justice with Janet Jackson. He's in Above the Rim with
15:58
Speaker 1: Woody Harrelson. Right, He's in Juice, which is like one
16:04
Speaker 1: of his first movies. Yeah, he had a pretty he
16:08
Speaker 1: had almost as successful as an acting career as he
16:11
Speaker 1: did a music career.
16:12
Speaker 3: Yeah, he really did.
16:13
Speaker 1: That never occurred to me, and it started pretty much
16:16
Speaker 1: right away. Like it didn't like he was doing movies
16:19
Speaker 1: before he was Tupac, right, like, because there was a bit.
16:23
Speaker 2: Like acted in high school and shit, he was trained
16:26
Speaker 2: in it.
16:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, he was like a theater kid basically who just
16:29
Speaker 1: happened to grow up around a bunch of black panthers,
16:32
Speaker 1: which in theory makes him probably more dangerous than your
16:37
Speaker 1: average black panther in the eyes of the government.
16:39
Speaker 2: Yeah, you fucking use finishing nails on Luwan to make
16:43
Speaker 2: it set.
16:44
Speaker 1: So this this interview. One thing that comes up in
16:47
Speaker 1: this book a lot as being a thing that the
16:50
Speaker 1: FBI and American intelligence is really wary of is gang conversion,
16:56
Speaker 1: which is the idea that, Okay, there's a lot of
16:58
Speaker 1: street gangs doing bad things right now, but what if,
17:01
Speaker 1: like overnight, they all turned into the black Panthers.
17:04
Speaker 2: Yeah, what if they all had like a unified you know,
17:07
Speaker 2: purpose and yeah.
17:08
Speaker 3: Right, because the infrastructure's there, the organization is there. Yeah,
17:12
Speaker 3: all they need is a reason and a purpose, yeah right,
17:15
Speaker 3: and the right person to guide them in that direction
17:18
Speaker 3: or the right incident. And so this is Let's listen
17:22
Speaker 3: to a couple quick clips from this Tupac prison interview,
17:26
Speaker 3: because I remember watching this a few years ago and
17:28
Speaker 3: being like and just thinking like, this is what the
17:31
Speaker 3: government kills people for, right, And here we go, who
17:36
Speaker 3: had life?
17:37
Speaker 4: Yeah, nothing nothing to lose, you know what I mean?
17:40
Speaker 4: So when you start looking at it like that, you'll
17:42
Speaker 4: start seeing that the it just don't weigh out to
17:46
Speaker 4: be in our favor. So we need to start figuring
17:48
Speaker 4: out another way. Now, if we do want to live
17:50
Speaker 4: a thug life and a gangster life and all of that, okay,
17:53
Speaker 4: so stop being cowards and let's have a revolution.
17:56
Speaker 2: But we don't want to do that.
17:58
Speaker 4: Dudes just want to live up a character. They want
18:02
Speaker 4: to be cartoons. But if they really wanted to do something,
18:05
Speaker 4: was that tough? All right, Let's start our own country,
18:07
Speaker 4: Let's start a revolution, let's get out of here, let's
18:09
Speaker 4: do something. But they don't want to do that. They
18:11
Speaker 4: want to pimp our communities and portray this image that
18:14
Speaker 4: they know we all can survive and make it.
18:16
Speaker 3: And that's what I saw.
18:17
Speaker 1: Even though, so that's one clip, and that's that's a
18:20
Speaker 1: pretty radical statement coming from Oh.
18:23
Speaker 2: Let's anytime you start you talk about starting a new country,
18:25
Speaker 2: it's like ooh.
18:27
Speaker 1: Yeah, like that's I mean, but that is one of
18:30
Speaker 1: If you look at the concentration of hate groups in
18:35
Speaker 1: the United States, California is way up the list. I
18:38
Speaker 1: think we're number one or number two in terms of
18:41
Speaker 1: most hate groups and the thing. One of the things
18:43
Speaker 1: that puts us over the edge, so to speak, when
18:46
Speaker 1: it comes to other states is we have a really
18:48
Speaker 1: high concentration of black separatist groups. And I think it's
18:53
Speaker 1: debatable as to whether a black separatist group should even
18:57
Speaker 1: be considered a fucking hate group. And but that's kind
19:01
Speaker 1: of what Tupac is proposing there, and just the idea
19:04
Speaker 1: that hey, well let's have a revolution then like well yeah.
19:07
Speaker 2: It's like it's kind of the thrust of what he's
19:11
Speaker 2: saying is like, you know, everyone you know likes this
19:13
Speaker 2: image of this lifestyle, but it's like, let's do something
19:15
Speaker 2: with it. You know, we're just kind of turn it.
19:17
Speaker 2: We just kind of have just a bunch of gangsters
19:19
Speaker 2: stickers on, you know, for the for the stake of
19:21
Speaker 2: fun and aesthetics. But it's like, yeah, let's fucking yeah,
19:24
Speaker 2: I don't know, let's fucking yeah.
19:26
Speaker 3: I like how casually casual he is about it, Whereas yeah,
19:30
Speaker 3: yeah you wanna, you wanna you want to fight someone.
19:33
Speaker 2: I'm just picturing a bunch of like dudes and suits
19:35
Speaker 2: that have like wheeled in a cart with like a
19:36
Speaker 2: vc r T TV on it. Like watching this just
19:39
Speaker 2: like we gotta figure out. All right, let's get them
19:41
Speaker 2: tickets to the Tyson for ice. Barry, can you get
19:45
Speaker 2: your guys on this on a chief? All right?
19:47
Speaker 1: Them?
19:47
Speaker 4: Or smarter?
19:48
Speaker 2: All right?
19:48
Speaker 4: Knowing what you know?
19:49
Speaker 1: Another clip, what do you.
19:52
Speaker 4: Think about youth and gang balance in America, especially in
19:57
Speaker 4: the black communities, in Hispanic community, youth and gang violence.
20:04
Speaker 4: I think I'm gonna get a lot of flag for it.
20:06
Speaker 4: I think gangs can be positive. It just has to
20:09
Speaker 4: be organized and has to steer away from being self
20:12
Speaker 4: destructive to being self productive. I think this country was
20:16
Speaker 4: built on gangs, you know. I think this country still
20:19
Speaker 4: is run on gangs. Republicans, Democrats, the police Department, the
20:23
Speaker 4: FBR to see how those are gangs, you know what
20:25
Speaker 4: I mean? The correctional officers. I had a correctional officer
20:28
Speaker 4: tell we straight up, we're the biggest gang in New
20:30
Speaker 4: York State.
20:31
Speaker 1: Straight up?
20:32
Speaker 4: You know.
20:32
Speaker 1: I buy that.
20:33
Speaker 4: Jun Faris he really got it.
20:35
Speaker 1: So that's another clip of him saying, Hey, maybe gangs
20:39
Speaker 1: should just be a good thing.
20:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's right that.
20:41
Speaker 3: The idea that our country was founded on gangs more
20:44
Speaker 3: or less in the sense of a group of people
20:47
Speaker 3: getting together and being.
20:48
Speaker 2: Like you know, back in Thomas Pain's day, pamphlets were
20:51
Speaker 2: like mixtaps see and a little something called common sense
20:54
Speaker 2: got the streets buzzing, and next thing you knew, Yeah,
20:59
Speaker 2: we're reading Hard to Have and starving in Valley Forge.
21:03
Speaker 1: But it is like, if you watch the PBS documentary
21:07
Speaker 1: about the Black Panthers, it seems like the thing that
21:09
Speaker 1: really set the government off was when they started giving
21:12
Speaker 1: kids free breakfast. Oh, you can't do that, Like for
21:15
Speaker 1: some reason at that point the government was like, no, no,
21:19
Speaker 1: those kids will feel good about themselves and do well
21:21
Speaker 1: at school.
21:22
Speaker 2: I didn't have enough calories to learn. We've been over this.
21:27
Speaker 1: And that's kind of the thing. I mean, the box
21:30
Speaker 1: proposing here.
21:31
Speaker 3: The foundation of capitalism is the idea that kids have
21:33
Speaker 3: to like pay for their lunch right early. Yeah.
21:37
Speaker 2: Yeah.
21:39
Speaker 1: And the thing about this ties into we've never done
21:44
Speaker 1: an episode on it because there's just not a ton
21:46
Speaker 1: of other evidence or details about it. But a few
21:51
Speaker 1: years ago there was this Internet post from someone who
21:54
Speaker 1: claimed that he was present at a meeting in the
21:57
Speaker 1: late eighties early nineties somewhere around there where all the
22:03
Speaker 1: heads of all the record labels were brought to this location,
22:06
Speaker 1: and someone came in and was like, Okay, so here's
22:10
Speaker 1: what you're gonna be pushing and promoting for the next
22:12
Speaker 1: few years. Gangster rap. And you're gonna be pushing and
22:15
Speaker 1: promoting that because we have private prisons to fill and
22:19
Speaker 1: we have drugs to sell, and gangster rap will do that.
22:23
Speaker 1: And now all of your favorite pioneers of gangster rap
22:26
Speaker 1: have jobs on NBC or in Hollywood.
22:29
Speaker 3: I mean you are You're quoting an internet post, right.
22:31
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's the thing, and there's no other details information,
22:35
Speaker 1: but it's just one of those things that sounds right right.
22:38
Speaker 3: I think this is when it gets like because we
22:41
Speaker 3: see this on both sides, like like like I mean,
22:44
Speaker 3: right now, Trump supporters are using random Internet posts in
22:46
Speaker 3: the idea that the government is just secretly against them
22:49
Speaker 3: to justify bad things, Like I feel like it's it's
22:53
Speaker 3: I can't quite I know what you're saying. No, no, yeah, yeah,
22:57
Speaker 3: I can't quite cross that line.
22:59
Speaker 2: It's yes, Well, I think I wanted everything I needed
23:02
Speaker 2: to know in the hit box office movie Straight out
23:04
Speaker 2: of Compton.
23:06
Speaker 3: That's true.
23:07
Speaker 2: I think, I pretty I mean I don't know about
23:08
Speaker 2: all the yeah, man, I don't know. I mean certainly possible.
23:11
Speaker 1: I guess yeah, it's it's one of it's just such
23:14
Speaker 1: a compelling idea that I wish someone would find some
23:18
Speaker 1: government documents that prove it. That would be that that's right.
23:21
Speaker 3: I believe I believe the idea that record executives like
23:27
Speaker 3: might have pushed that, but not because of any necessary meeting,
23:31
Speaker 3: just because of like the inherent racism in this in
23:35
Speaker 3: the system, Like that's what all the things you're saying
23:37
Speaker 3: is true. I just don't know if I believe there's
23:39
Speaker 3: like set meetings where they sat and said, Okay, we're
23:42
Speaker 3: going to do this, this and this and this, like
23:44
Speaker 3: the Congress having the meetings about rap, like I believe
23:47
Speaker 3: that was they were doing.
23:47
Speaker 2: That, and then the joker walks in and you guys
23:51
Speaker 2: want to know how I got this hard? I'm a gangster.
23:56
Speaker 2: Uh So, listen to mc ice music to.
24:00
Speaker 1: BYC eight eight.
24:03
Speaker 2: I've only seen it. I've only seen it written.
24:07
Speaker 1: So another connection Tupac had between himself and the Black
24:12
Speaker 1: Panthers Geronimo Pratt. He was a Black Panther leader.
24:16
Speaker 2: At one point, father of father of Spencer, and.
24:21
Speaker 1: At one point someone definitely not the police acting on
24:25
Speaker 1: the FBI's behalf tried to kill him while he slept
24:28
Speaker 1: in his bed, Like a sniper just shot at him.
24:31
Speaker 3: That's pretty suspicious while.
24:32
Speaker 2: He was in bed. What and they've been shot in
24:36
Speaker 2: bed like like I do, like when like the the corrupt,
24:40
Speaker 2: like fucking dudes just get lazy and they're just like,
24:43
Speaker 2: I don't know, what if we like, what if we
24:45
Speaker 2: sent him a thing in the mail where he won
24:46
Speaker 2: a Safari and we just like had to meth up
24:49
Speaker 2: an elephant and have him like you know where, It's
24:51
Speaker 2: just like not even they don't even try to like, oh,
24:53
Speaker 2: he's coming out of a nightclub. It was a rival gang.
24:55
Speaker 2: It was just like it was just fucking oops. To
24:57
Speaker 2: drive by from a high pow rifle that you can't
25:01
Speaker 2: get outside of the government, must have been a fucking gang.
25:04
Speaker 3: I mean, the meth elephant elephant thing you just pitched
25:07
Speaker 3: is brilliant.
25:07
Speaker 2: The hell they called it. Yeah, there was something that
25:10
Speaker 2: Hannibal employed on his UH on his march to Rome
25:13
Speaker 2: or something.
25:13
Speaker 3: I gotta say he did it. If it's a sniper
25:16
Speaker 3: shot at a sleeping man and it misses, it might
25:19
Speaker 3: not be a professional at that point. Yeah, I mean
25:22
Speaker 3: I can still see them like giving some guy a
25:26
Speaker 3: sniper rifle and being like, you do this, you get
25:29
Speaker 3: to like keep the r.
25:30
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you get We have a paper bag full
25:33
Speaker 2: of loose cash.
25:35
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know. And they they missed, they didn't hit him.
25:40
Speaker 1: But a few years later he was framed for murder
25:44
Speaker 1: by the FBI in the late sixties. That's his claim,
25:47
Speaker 1: and that's a very bold claim, I know. But here's
25:50
Speaker 1: the thing. His conviction was overturned in nineteen ninety seven
25:54
Speaker 1: because the prosecution failed to disclose that the witness whose
25:57
Speaker 1: testimony sent him to prison was also an FBI informant.
26:02
Speaker 2: Wow, that's awesome, and it's like, well, let's just stack this.
26:07
Speaker 3: And it's not illegal for it to have been an
26:11
Speaker 3: FBI and for like, it's not bad. They just didn't
26:14
Speaker 3: disclose it.
26:14
Speaker 1: They didn't disclose it but didn't think it was relevant. Yeah,
26:18
Speaker 1: And that's the thing. I think. The thinking is that
26:20
Speaker 1: effect that why wouldn't you why would you hide that?
26:25
Speaker 1: And the thing is Tupac actually worked on Geronimo Pratt's
26:28
Speaker 1: defense team in the late eighties, including wrapping at benefits.
26:34
Speaker 2: He wore his formal nose ring at the courtroom.
26:38
Speaker 1: And black Panther leader Huey Newton also started working on
26:41
Speaker 1: Pratt's defense team in nineteen eighty eight. Huey Newton was
26:45
Speaker 1: murdered maybe assassinated in nineteen eighty nine.
26:48
Speaker 2: Well, they wanted this cookie recipe and he wouldn't give
26:50
Speaker 2: it over. He knew how to turn the fig into
26:53
Speaker 2: a delicious, healthy treat.
26:56
Speaker 1: Love a goddamn fig, Newton.
26:58
Speaker 2: It's a pretty good little It's it's like an old person. Yeah,
27:02
Speaker 2: it's good.
27:03
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly of the future.
27:05
Speaker 1: They have a neat texture to them.
27:06
Speaker 3: Yeah.
27:07
Speaker 2: You know, Dippin' Dots has been the ice cream of
27:08
Speaker 2: the future for like what twenty years now, it's the
27:10
Speaker 2: ice cream of now. God. Yeah, and it's not that
27:12
Speaker 2: good time. I had it for the first time recently,
27:15
Speaker 2: and I found it to be so fucking overright because
27:16
Speaker 2: it's been hyped up to me and I'm like, this
27:18
Speaker 2: is just like ice cream that hurts my teeth more.
27:20
Speaker 3: It's just clumpy ice cream.
27:22
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like I want to I want to lick
27:24
Speaker 2: and say, you know, I wanted to melt and you know,
27:26
Speaker 2: change properties as I enjoy it, Like that's part of
27:29
Speaker 2: the fun, you know. It's just it's ice cream with
27:31
Speaker 2: one form. You just made boring ice cream. Suck my
27:35
Speaker 2: dick dippin' dots. I don't know how they get it
27:38
Speaker 2: into the tiny little balls, though, that is impressive. Probably
27:40
Speaker 2: like a little like ice cube trays, like little molds
27:43
Speaker 2: with this because it's so many of them, though, It's
27:45
Speaker 2: got to be some kind of chemical thing that does it. Well. Yeah,
27:48
Speaker 2: I mean, there's gotta be like a silicone bead that
27:51
Speaker 2: makes like a pearl of ice cream or something in
27:54
Speaker 2: the ice cream clams they're enslaving to make dippin' dots.
27:58
Speaker 1: Justice for the ice cream tech. Yeah, a bunch of
28:01
Speaker 1: little drones just drop them on a table.
28:03
Speaker 2: Oh yeah. So they have like tiny people they've shrunken
28:07
Speaker 2: down that have melon ballers and they just scoop them out,
28:10
Speaker 2: you know, while they their fingers bleed.
28:12
Speaker 1: So this is an interesting detail. The framing of Geronimo
28:16
Speaker 1: Pratt and the murder attempt that preceded it were both
28:19
Speaker 1: allegedly done at the direction of a man named Richard Held,
28:24
Speaker 1: who moved to San Francisco to become head of the
28:26
Speaker 1: FBI's field office not long before Tupac and his family
28:30
Speaker 1: also moved there, and again that sounds like crazy talk,
28:35
Speaker 1: like what kind of proof would we have that Richard
28:38
Speaker 1: Held San Francisco Field office agent actually did this. And
28:44
Speaker 1: the thing is, there was a lawsuit filed by Earth
28:47
Speaker 1: First activist Judy Barry because the year after the death
28:51
Speaker 1: of Huey Newton, she was injured in a car bombing
28:54
Speaker 1: that paralyzed her from the waist down. She was asked
28:57
Speaker 1: at a press conference what she thought about the FB
29:00
Speaker 1: searched for the bomber, and this was her reply, I
29:03
Speaker 1: hope the FBI find their man, and when they do,
29:06
Speaker 1: I hope they fire him.
29:07
Speaker 3: That's a pretty great burn, damn.
29:09
Speaker 1: And she filed a lawsuit that implicated Richard Held in
29:13
Speaker 1: this bombing and this day. Event she eventually won the
29:17
Speaker 1: lawsuit after she died, unfortunately, but her partner, Darryl Charney
29:22
Speaker 1: was eventually awarded four point four million dollars as a
29:26
Speaker 1: result of that lawsuit. And it suspected that this lawsuit
29:30
Speaker 1: led to Richard Held's early retirement in nineteen ninety three.
29:34
Speaker 2: Okay, hold on, no, we can't be sure. He might have.
29:36
Speaker 2: He might have just wanted to spend more time with
29:38
Speaker 2: his family, of course, exactly.
29:39
Speaker 1: You know, he started playing guitar. He wanted to see
29:41
Speaker 1: where his career was take him.
29:42
Speaker 3: When so she was paralyzed, ensued, she sued the FBI.
29:48
Speaker 3: She yeah, she filed, and the lost BI was just
29:52
Speaker 3: after he died. They were like you got us, and
29:55
Speaker 3: they like, how did like what happened? What was the
29:58
Speaker 3: official court ruling on the Well, they're just like, yeah,
30:01
Speaker 3: the FBI did it.
30:02
Speaker 1: Well.
30:02
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, like you back to see the corner.
30:05
Speaker 2: We'll allow the justice system to work after there's no
30:08
Speaker 2: longer a human face to connect to the story, and
30:10
Speaker 2: it'll be forgotten except for on you know, a podcast
30:13
Speaker 2: about the government.
30:14
Speaker 1: Yeah, because this was like the late eighties. I mean
30:17
Speaker 1: I'm sure because.
30:18
Speaker 2: Let me just imagine she was just like, here's I
30:20
Speaker 2: got five million dollars because the FBI blew up my
30:23
Speaker 2: spinal cord. You know, like that's like a bad headline.
30:25
Speaker 2: But it was just her husband, you know, just holding
30:27
Speaker 2: a check. It's like who cares? You know, I want
30:29
Speaker 2: to see the lady. You know, that's how the fucking
30:30
Speaker 2: media cycle works.
30:32
Speaker 3: And I mentioned for the husband too, Like after she
30:35
Speaker 3: died and they just like here's some money, I'd just
30:37
Speaker 3: be like sure, all right, Like yeah, just move on
30:40
Speaker 3: at that point.
30:41
Speaker 1: And the thing is right around this time, Richard held
30:44
Speaker 1: is living in the same area as Tupac, and after
30:48
Speaker 1: Tupac starts working on Geronimo Pratt's defense and Hughey Newton
30:51
Speaker 1: gets assassinated, this is when all of the harassment of
30:55
Speaker 1: Tupac really starts. And the number of incidents that he
31:00
Speaker 1: finds himself involved in over the next few years, it
31:03
Speaker 1: does kind of seem like like the government is just
31:06
Speaker 1: fucking with him, right.
31:07
Speaker 2: Yeah.
31:08
Speaker 1: The first thing that happened right after he released his
31:11
Speaker 1: first music video, two Oakland police officers stopped him for jaywalking,
31:16
Speaker 1: and he claimed they beat him up. His court testimony
31:21
Speaker 1: was that police officer Alexander Boyevich put him in a
31:24
Speaker 1: choke hold and repeatedly slammed his face into the ground.
31:28
Speaker 1: Tupac filed a lawsuit and eventually settled out of court.
31:32
Speaker 3: I don't know cops putting people in choke holds. That
31:34
Speaker 3: doesn't sound like.
31:35
Speaker 1: Yeah, that doesn't sound like.
31:38
Speaker 2: By the way, this is over a crosswalk because he
31:42
Speaker 2: didn't wait for the green guy to go to seven
31:44
Speaker 2: to eleven.
31:45
Speaker 1: And it's worth noting up to this point, Tupac has
31:47
Speaker 1: no arrests. He has no criminal record. Before his first
31:51
Speaker 1: music video comes out, and at a he performed at
31:55
Speaker 1: a benefit concert on the three year anniversary of Huey
31:58
Speaker 1: Newton's death. At that someone named Demetrius, according to witnesses,
32:03
Speaker 1: shows up and punches Tupac in the face while he's
32:05
Speaker 1: signing autographs, at which point a group of men joined
32:08
Speaker 1: in attacking him. A friend of Tupac's fires a warning
32:12
Speaker 1: shot and then the crowd somehow turns on Tupac and
32:17
Speaker 1: he gets basically beaten by this mob, all while police
32:22
Speaker 1: are just kind of standing there watching, just like this is.
32:27
Speaker 2: Not really our jurisdiction here, I mean, And if you
32:30
Speaker 2: look into the I thought this was the new dance
32:33
Speaker 2: the kids are doing. Punch the guy.
32:35
Speaker 1: You like the thing about the FBI, all of their
32:39
Speaker 1: co intel pro shit that happened in the seventies is
32:42
Speaker 1: just available for people to go and read. And this
32:45
Speaker 1: is the kind of shit they would do. They would
32:48
Speaker 1: send someone into a fucking meeting of leftists or a
32:52
Speaker 1: rally or something to like just fucking fire a shot
32:56
Speaker 1: in the air and get the fuck out of there.
32:57
Speaker 1: And we just say it. They caused violence.
33:00
Speaker 3: It doesn't have to be like like a surgical like,
33:04
Speaker 3: it doesn't need precision. They just need to funck shit
33:06
Speaker 3: up right. Yeah.
33:07
Speaker 1: And the thing is, that's what happened here is as
33:11
Speaker 1: soon as this incident happened, Dan Quail, all of a sudden,
33:14
Speaker 1: the Vice President of the fucking United States goes on
33:18
Speaker 1: the in front of the nation to denounce tupac lyrics.
33:22
Speaker 1: At a point where Tupac had sold less than five
33:25
Speaker 1: hundred thousand albums in his career. Oh geez, so he
33:28
Speaker 1: was almost nobody.
33:29
Speaker 3: That seems like it's a solid promotion for two so much.
33:33
Speaker 2: Yeah, just Mike Pence being like this hops and guys
33:36
Speaker 2: gotta go, you know.
33:38
Speaker 1: And after this incident he starts getting arrested all the
33:42
Speaker 1: fucking time. And over the next few years, Tupac is
33:47
Speaker 1: arrested close to a dozen times on mostly dubious charges,
33:52
Speaker 1: most of which are dismissed when they go to court.
33:55
Speaker 1: And over this period of time, also the FBI Field
33:59
Speaker 1: Office in LA compiles a four thousand page file on Tupac.
34:03
Speaker 3: This feels not the same, but similar to that Stormy
34:05
Speaker 3: Daniels getting arrested thing where it's right, She's like she
34:09
Speaker 3: was called out and now there's gonna be cops.
34:12
Speaker 2: Like like, oh yeah, because it was like someone was
34:14
Speaker 2: like she lets someone like touch her tit and like it,
34:16
Speaker 2: don't touch my tit like strip bar, you know, and
34:20
Speaker 2: like she was just like, yeah, this guy was fucking
34:21
Speaker 2: with me and I didn't know what to do. And
34:22
Speaker 2: they're like, well you broke the law, lady.
34:25
Speaker 3: Yeah, and like it yeah, with this much heat on him,
34:28
Speaker 3: Like if the vice president calls you out, then cops
34:31
Speaker 3: are gonna be looking for every fucking reason possible to
34:34
Speaker 3: give you shit.
34:35
Speaker 2: Oh exactly, And it's like, yeah, you want that fucking
34:37
Speaker 2: photo hanging up in the lobby. If you're like like
34:39
Speaker 2: Podunk Police Department, It's like, what he's doing a show
34:42
Speaker 2: and Sinsey, we gotta fucking let's see if his tags
34:46
Speaker 2: are up to date, you know.
34:47
Speaker 1: Yeah, And keep in mind what's happening in the background
34:52
Speaker 1: of all of this. The Rodney King riots had started
34:56
Speaker 1: by this point, and.
34:58
Speaker 2: The Larry King riots when that there was not enough
35:01
Speaker 2: suspenders to go around. So when snapped the man suspenders,
35:05
Speaker 2: I know, and I think a.
35:07
Speaker 1: Lot of people forget. One of the immediate aftermaths of
35:10
Speaker 1: the La riots was a gang truce and that gang
35:15
Speaker 1: truce turned into started turning into a lot of what
35:20
Speaker 1: Tupac was saying in that prison interview, where it was
35:23
Speaker 1: gang leaders coming out and going, Hey, how about instead
35:26
Speaker 1: of being gangsters, how about we be socialists and just
35:29
Speaker 1: put all of this money back into creating a self
35:33
Speaker 1: sustaining community. We can police ourselves. And that's a thing
35:39
Speaker 1: that if you look into it, there are records and
35:42
Speaker 1: documents that show that the various intelligence agencies of the
35:46
Speaker 1: US did infiltrate that and try to break that up also,
35:50
Speaker 1: and they did successfully break it up eventually.
35:53
Speaker 2: Yeah, some guy shut up with Costco sneakers and he
35:55
Speaker 2: was like, I'm here for the radicalism. Yeah.
35:59
Speaker 1: They It was around this time also George Bush declared
36:02
Speaker 1: the Crips and Bloods, along with various other criminal organizations,
36:06
Speaker 1: as having replaced communism as the main domestic subversive threat.
36:11
Speaker 2: Oh hell yeah.
36:12
Speaker 1: And a couple of the people involved in the gang truce.
36:16
Speaker 1: Tony Bogard, he was a gang leader who gained national
36:19
Speaker 1: attention for championing the gang truce, shot and killed in
36:23
Speaker 1: January ninety four by a reputed drug dealer who was
36:26
Speaker 1: released from jail shortly after pleading guilty to involuntary manslaughter,
36:31
Speaker 1: so he murdered the guy and immediately got out of prison.
36:34
Speaker 1: Also Dwayne Holmes, another gang leader.
36:36
Speaker 2: I just had a revolving door like a fucking department
36:38
Speaker 2: store New York City, just like all right in and out,
36:41
Speaker 2: thank you very much. Here's your paperback for yeah.
36:43
Speaker 3: Sure.
36:45
Speaker 1: Another gang leader, Dwayne Holmes, he helped finalize the ninety
36:48
Speaker 1: two gang truce. He was arrested for allegedly committing a
36:51
Speaker 1: ten dollars robbery at a gang unity dance.
36:56
Speaker 2: I still more than that every time I go to target,
36:58
Speaker 2: you know.
37:00
Speaker 1: And this was like the era of the three strikes laws.
37:03
Speaker 1: So he had a couple convictions, so he basically went
37:05
Speaker 1: to prison for life for that. And these were like
37:08
Speaker 1: the two heads of the gang truce, and.
37:11
Speaker 2: He's like, can I just put back the vitamin waters?
37:14
Speaker 2: Like I got the money like And around this.
37:19
Speaker 1: Time, also Matulu Shakur, Tupac's stepfather, who we mentioned earlier,
37:22
Speaker 1: was transferred to the highest security prison in the country,
37:26
Speaker 1: located underground in Florence, Colorado. A warden's memo says it
37:31
Speaker 1: was done due to concern over his quote outside contacts
37:35
Speaker 1: and influence over the younger black element.
37:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh yeah, and you're just like, oh no, someone
37:47
Speaker 2: gave him a saxophone. He's gonna tear down the walls
37:49
Speaker 2: with the power of spirits crumbling around him.
37:57
Speaker 1: So it's around this time nineteen ninety three is the
38:01
Speaker 1: first time Tupac is almost shot. And it's a it's
38:05
Speaker 1: a weird situation. He's coming home from a show in Atlanta.
38:10
Speaker 2: It's always like, well, Tupac was on his way back
38:12
Speaker 2: from a bake sale to raise money for, you know,
38:14
Speaker 2: a woman who was beaten to death for a looking
38:17
Speaker 2: at a candy bar too long, and at this point
38:20
Speaker 2: someone said that he raped them, so or whatever. You know,
38:23
Speaker 2: it's just it's just so fucking silly.
38:26
Speaker 1: Yeah. The weird thing about this He's coming back from
38:29
Speaker 1: a show in Atlanta and his car stops next to
38:34
Speaker 1: a parking lot where he sees two white dudes beating
38:38
Speaker 1: up a black dude in his car, and Tupac stops
38:42
Speaker 1: and is like, hey, guys, what's going on.
38:45
Speaker 3: I like the idea of him like driving by, like
38:47
Speaker 3: that's a little weird.
38:48
Speaker 1: Huh. Well, I like the idea of someone on a
38:50
Speaker 1: walk talk going all right, he's coming start fighting, No,
38:53
Speaker 1: they well, they have.
38:54
Speaker 2: Like six dudes stationed at different like, well, I don't
38:56
Speaker 2: know if he's gonna take I don't know if he's
38:58
Speaker 2: gonna take Pico or Foothill. Let's just have a bunch
39:01
Speaker 2: of guys ready to beat up a you know, a minority,
39:04
Speaker 2: you know, just ready to go, and then we'll he'll
39:06
Speaker 2: see one of them and he's gotta do something. You know.
39:08
Speaker 1: The black dude was a cop too.
39:11
Speaker 2: It's just like such an obvious trap. It's like this
39:14
Speaker 2: is like a like a like a stick underneath a
39:17
Speaker 2: box with a jar of honey to get a bear.
39:18
Speaker 2: Like it's just like, oh, how do we like? This
39:21
Speaker 2: is something that a white guy with a crew cut
39:22
Speaker 2: I thought of, you know, and he was just like
39:24
Speaker 2: it's genius.
39:27
Speaker 1: And it almost worked because Tupac stopped and when he
39:31
Speaker 1: asked what's happening, one of the men pointed a gun
39:34
Speaker 1: in the direction of Tupac's group and shouted get down,
39:37
Speaker 1: which sounds like a cop yep. And another witness says
39:41
Speaker 1: he quote saw Mark Whitwell smashed the Mercedes front passenger
39:45
Speaker 1: window with the handle butt of a gun and shoot
39:48
Speaker 1: at Tupac, who was sitting behind the driver. Another bystander
39:53
Speaker 1: said he saw quote one of the white males pull
39:55
Speaker 1: out and point a black handgun and then fired one
39:59
Speaker 1: shot into the Mercedes. Those attackers, Mark and Scott Wentwell,
40:03
Speaker 1: were off duty Atlanta police. In their Jesus. In their report,
40:07
Speaker 1: they described the incident thusly. N words came by and
40:11
Speaker 1: did a drive by shooting. Tupac was arrested for attempted murder,
40:15
Speaker 1: tried and acquitted because he shot back. I don't know
40:19
Speaker 1: how I left that out of the notes, but he
40:21
Speaker 1: shot back at that hit one of them in the
40:23
Speaker 1: ass and I think hit the other one in the arm.
40:26
Speaker 3: Wait, so they were two off duty cops attacking this guy.
40:30
Speaker 1: They Tupac seized two white dudes punching a black dude
40:33
Speaker 1: in his cause it.
40:34
Speaker 3: Feels like they didn't. They weren't trying to kill him.
40:36
Speaker 3: They were trying to get him to kill one.
40:38
Speaker 1: Yeah, they were trying. They were trying to get him
40:40
Speaker 1: arrested for attempted murder. Yeah, and they got him arrested.
40:45
Speaker 2: Well, we all dream we all drew Straws at the precinct,
40:47
Speaker 2: and it looks like you guys are going to have
40:49
Speaker 2: to maybe get shot so we can stop this guy
40:52
Speaker 2: from rapping about sharing.
40:56
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's kind of mean, because I don't think see again,
41:00
Speaker 3: I don't think it's like it was that planned. I
41:03
Speaker 3: think it must have been facilitated in a way to
41:06
Speaker 3: end like Yeah, that's that's how I think about it.
41:08
Speaker 3: And I don't know exactly. How were the idea that
41:10
Speaker 3: the cops they found the most racist fucking cops they
41:12
Speaker 3: could put him in this situation. Yeah, one of them
41:16
Speaker 3: will get shot.
41:18
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm sure finding racist cops in Atlanta.
41:22
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh god, everyone here is just that.
41:25
Speaker 1: They're all They probably had to promise applicants that there
41:29
Speaker 1: would be other rappers they could target your future. Yeah, yeah,
41:32
Speaker 1: there were just too many people applying to target.
41:34
Speaker 2: Can this be? Can this be my beat? Can I
41:36
Speaker 2: just be the cool j and trapman squad?
41:40
Speaker 3: And this is all it's basically in Tupac. So he
41:43
Speaker 3: shot back at these people who are shooting at him.
41:45
Speaker 1: Yeah.
41:46
Speaker 3: So basically he did like the staniard ground stuff that
41:48
Speaker 3: people are getting away right now, and a jury found
41:52
Speaker 3: him not guilty I as a result, yeah, good in
41:55
Speaker 3: this instance.
41:56
Speaker 2: Yeah. Oh, it's just fucking I mean, it's the same
41:58
Speaker 2: ship that happens today. It's like some of those protests
42:01
Speaker 2: and stuff. It's like there are people that are just
42:03
Speaker 2: like this is like the like I'm trying to look,
42:06
Speaker 2: I'm looking for an excuse to do what i want
42:09
Speaker 2: to do anyways, which is like fight you know, a
42:12
Speaker 2: socialist or a black person or both or what the
42:14
Speaker 2: fuck ever. Like then they just they just show up
42:17
Speaker 2: and like wait, like, well he had a he pulled
42:20
Speaker 2: a cell phone out of his pocket. I thought it
42:23
Speaker 2: was a guy. I had to do it, you know,
42:24
Speaker 2: and they just like going out cruising for it, you
42:27
Speaker 2: know what I mean?
42:28
Speaker 1: And what's crazy is it? I agree that it does
42:32
Speaker 1: seem like they were trying to get him arrested and
42:35
Speaker 1: you know, maybe get him sent to prison, and they do.
42:39
Speaker 1: He does eventually go to prison on a rape charge.
42:43
Speaker 1: And I know this isn't a popular thing to say
42:45
Speaker 1: in these political times, but I think that rape charge
42:48
Speaker 1: was the government targeting him and trying to get him arrested.
42:51
Speaker 2: Also, I haven't I haven't. I don't know much about
42:54
Speaker 2: it or I haven't read into it. What's what's the
42:57
Speaker 2: argument there.
42:57
Speaker 1: Well, it happened in nineteen ninety again, so basically like
43:01
Speaker 1: a month after this police shooting the same year as
43:04
Speaker 1: the Atlanta shooting. While he's filming above the rim, he.
43:08
Speaker 2: Named Jocelyn mcspadt, and that just brought their beautiful baby
43:10
Speaker 2: boy home from the hospital.
43:12
Speaker 1: He meets a Oh damn it. I don't think I
43:14
Speaker 1: put the link in here, but he mentions this guy
43:16
Speaker 1: in a song on the Machavelli album. The song's called
43:19
Speaker 1: Against All Odds. He meets a Haitian music promoter named
43:24
Speaker 1: Jacques Agnot and agno intradition name, yeah, and he's on
43:30
Speaker 1: this Tupac song. He calls him Haitian Jack and goes
43:33
Speaker 1: into this long verse about how Haitian Jack was a
43:37
Speaker 1: snitch working for the government who set Tupac up to
43:40
Speaker 1: be arrested and eventually set him up to be shot.
43:43
Speaker 1: And Agnot introduced Tupac to Ayana Jackson or Aana Jackson,
43:48
Speaker 1: the woman who eventually accused him of assault. First night
43:51
Speaker 1: they met, they had consensual sex. She said in court
43:55
Speaker 1: records that she quote kissed his penis on the dance floor,
43:58
Speaker 1: and then they had sex in his hotel room. Yeah,
44:01
Speaker 1: just a little more. And she came back a few
44:03
Speaker 1: nights later and had consensual sex with Tupac again, but
44:07
Speaker 1: then claimed that after that Tupac and a few associates
44:10
Speaker 1: assaulted her. And what Tupac says and said in court
44:15
Speaker 1: was that he was hanging out with this Jacques Agnot
44:20
Speaker 1: when he called. When Agnott calls for Ayana Jackson to
44:24
Speaker 1: come to the hotel room again, he says he got
44:26
Speaker 1: oral sex from her and then went in the other
44:29
Speaker 1: room and passed out, and he said when he woke
44:31
Speaker 1: up it felt like he had been drugged. And in
44:35
Speaker 1: the months between the and after that, she claimed that
44:40
Speaker 1: he and Agnot basically sexually assaulted her. He was charged
44:44
Speaker 1: with forced sodomy and forced oral sex, I believe. And
44:50
Speaker 1: so then when the trial starts, in the months between
44:55
Speaker 1: that and the trial, the FBI somehow loses voicemail recordings
44:59
Speaker 1: from jack that it's claimed would have implied all the
45:03
Speaker 1: encounters were consensual. Meanwhile, jacquagnot one was bailed out by
45:09
Speaker 1: a Policeman's Benevolent Association lawyer who also represented him in court,
45:15
Speaker 1: and Tupac's trial lawyer obtained ANNCE rap sheet which showed
45:19
Speaker 1: a long list of major charges up and down the
45:22
Speaker 1: East Coast, all dismissed, which is a really good sign
45:26
Speaker 1: if anyone has seen the Departed that someone is probably
45:30
Speaker 1: working for the FBI or for the government.
45:32
Speaker 2: Oh so he was kind of their guy, like do
45:34
Speaker 2: some dirt, we'll get you off right, okay.
45:37
Speaker 1: And it sounds like a crazy suggestion, but we know
45:40
Speaker 1: the FBI has informant.
45:42
Speaker 3: He's the way. He's the other guy who she accused.
45:45
Speaker 3: Is that what's going right? So it's not that she
45:47
Speaker 3: made anything up so much as this guy was you're
45:51
Speaker 3: saying was paid to assault her.
45:55
Speaker 1: Either that or or she and him were working together
46:00
Speaker 1: as part of some sort of law enforcement operation to
46:04
Speaker 1: entrap Tupac.
46:06
Speaker 2: What's interesting about that theory is that that means that
46:08
Speaker 2: there's a casting process where it's just like, all right,
46:10
Speaker 2: we're bringing in ten people, which one do you think
46:12
Speaker 2: Tupac would find the hottest? And they they to like, well,
46:16
Speaker 2: I don't know, I mean, I you know, like I
46:18
Speaker 2: got this. So there's like there's again a bunch of
46:20
Speaker 2: guys and crew cuts wearing Costco shoes. Just well, I mean,
46:24
Speaker 2: she has the booty, but does she have the certain
46:27
Speaker 2: gin I say, quah that would attractive man of mister
46:29
Speaker 2: Shakur's stature.
46:31
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's definitely the hardest pill to swallow, just because
46:34
Speaker 3: I mean, this is more of course with the Internet
46:36
Speaker 3: and stuff. But like women who who come out and
46:40
Speaker 3: say that they were raped or assaulted by a celebrity
46:43
Speaker 3: do not have a good time with that. Yeah, right
46:47
Speaker 3: of obviously, yeah this is before the Internet.
46:50
Speaker 1: But there's more to the trial. Near the end of
46:53
Speaker 1: the trial, the prosecution apparently at one point offered to
46:56
Speaker 1: accept a mistrial for having withheld evidence, and that evidence
47:00
Speaker 1: was photos of Ayana Jackson at the scene that could
47:04
Speaker 1: have cleared Tupac. He rejected the offer, wanting to completely
47:09
Speaker 1: clear his name. And while the jury was still out
47:14
Speaker 1: and associate of Jacques Agnaut, Jimmy Henchman Rosemand, reached out
47:19
Speaker 1: to Tupac and offered him three thousand dollars to record
47:22
Speaker 1: a song with another rapper. So this is like when
47:25
Speaker 1: the jury goes to deliberate, this associate of the guy
47:30
Speaker 1: and I didn't put in the notes. Also, this Jaquagnot
47:33
Speaker 1: also somehow manages to get his trial separated from Tupacs,
47:37
Speaker 1: which isn't a common thing. It is a thing that
47:41
Speaker 1: takes a very good lawyer. And this associate of Agnount
47:45
Speaker 1: reaches out and offers Tupac three thousand dollars to record
47:48
Speaker 1: a song. And this is a quote from Tupac. I
47:51
Speaker 1: felt nervous because this guy knew somebody I had major
47:54
Speaker 1: beef with Nigel, which is a gnant had introduced me
47:57
Speaker 1: to Booker, which is Roseman. Everybody knew while I was
48:00
Speaker 1: short on money, all my shows were being canceled. So
48:04
Speaker 1: the guy who was maybe an FBI asset is tied
48:08
Speaker 1: to the recording session that ultimately gets Tupac shot, which
48:14
Speaker 1: it's a it's an impossible thing to prove at this point.
48:17
Speaker 2: Know is this when he's is this that song he
48:19
Speaker 2: did that was kind of about the Tyson match that
48:21
Speaker 2: came out. That was like the last thing he recorded.
48:23
Speaker 2: And if I'm not mistaken, no, this.
48:25
Speaker 1: Was before he even joins Death Row Records. Okay, this
48:28
Speaker 1: is when he finally goes to prison and the incarceration
48:33
Speaker 1: where Suge Knight finally bails him out.
48:35
Speaker 2: Gotcha.
48:36
Speaker 1: And what Tupac said is as he was approaching the studio,
48:40
Speaker 1: a thirty something black man was hanging out in army
48:42
Speaker 1: fatigues and didn't acknowledge him. He said he was too
48:45
Speaker 1: stoned to realize at the time. How weird that was
48:49
Speaker 1: because normally, as visible as Tupac was at the time,
48:52
Speaker 1: if someone was a rap fan and saw him walking
48:54
Speaker 1: up to a studio where rap songs are recorded, they
48:57
Speaker 1: probably would have said something yeah. When he got in
49:00
Speaker 1: the building, that man and another who'd been waiting inside
49:02
Speaker 1: shot and robbed him. Years later, a man named Dexter
49:06
Speaker 1: Isaac signed a letter saying quote, James Roseman hired me
49:09
Speaker 1: to rob Tupac Shakur at Quad Studios. He gave me
49:12
Speaker 1: twenty five hundred dollars plus all the jewelry I took.
49:17
Speaker 1: And government documents show rose Mint had been charged with
49:20
Speaker 1: a crime in nineteen ninety four, right before Tupac's shooting.
49:24
Speaker 1: He met with US prosecutors as an informant from that
49:27
Speaker 1: time until at least June of nineteen ninety eight, and
49:31
Speaker 1: those documents included an agreement saying his statements to the
49:34
Speaker 1: DA and US State's attorney would not be used against
49:37
Speaker 1: him regarding the ninety four criminal case.
49:40
Speaker 2: So shit, so like you scratch our back, right, And this.
49:45
Speaker 1: Was another common FBI tactic. When they wanted to break
49:49
Speaker 1: up a subversive organization, they would go to someone who'd
49:51
Speaker 1: been arrested and say, hey, if you show up here
49:55
Speaker 1: and get us information about these people, we won't prosecute
50:00
Speaker 1: for that crime. And so Tupac he gets shot five
50:06
Speaker 1: times and still shows up in court the next day.
50:09
Speaker 1: He's found not guilty on most of the charges, including
50:12
Speaker 1: force sodomy and assisting force sodomy. The charge he's found
50:16
Speaker 1: guilty on amounted to and this is a quote from
50:18
Speaker 1: the jury, touching Jackson's butt against her will. He received
50:24
Speaker 1: a one to four year prison sentence. Jacquesagnot for basically
50:28
Speaker 1: the same charges, had his indictment dismissed and pled guilty
50:32
Speaker 1: to two misdemeanors.
50:34
Speaker 2: Wow, that's weird.
50:36
Speaker 1: It's definitely odd, and it would take a whole other
50:40
Speaker 1: episode to keep going. But we will do another episode
50:44
Speaker 1: on it at some point because the next and this
50:46
Speaker 1: is where I need to get the guy who wrote
50:48
Speaker 1: this book on this show, because the next chapter is
50:51
Speaker 1: about how death Row Records was a CIA front operation.
50:55
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, you haven't even actually gotten to like the killing,
51:00
Speaker 3: the killing, Yeah yeah, yeah.
51:02
Speaker 1: Well, the the name of the episode is the FBI
51:04
Speaker 1: Versus Tupac. Okay, so it's when you get like we
51:08
Speaker 1: did an episode on the actual killing, right, And there's
51:12
Speaker 1: so many theories as to who would have actually pulled
51:16
Speaker 1: the trigger. And the thing is it's any one of
51:20
Speaker 1: them could have been working for the FBI at that point.
51:23
Speaker 3: Well that's the thing is again like going back to
51:26
Speaker 3: like it feels like the FBI has a lot of
51:28
Speaker 3: patsies more than anything else, right, Like, it feels like
51:32
Speaker 3: what the most realistic scenario is them like not staging
51:36
Speaker 3: these things, but just putting money in the right places
51:40
Speaker 3: and suggesting he could, Yeah, if you could do this,
51:44
Speaker 3: you'll get money for this.
51:45
Speaker 2: And well it's like kind of their whole deal where
51:47
Speaker 2: it's just like if you just sort of like blow
51:50
Speaker 2: on the fucking sales and it's like, well we'll arm
51:53
Speaker 2: the insurgents or whatever, you know, and like they kind
51:55
Speaker 2: of just try to try to let it all fucking
51:58
Speaker 2: and it also turns everything into a preposterous clusterfuck, which
52:02
Speaker 2: makes it harder to trace back to them, right yeah.
52:04
Speaker 3: Because they're not trying to necessarily achieve a specific goal
52:07
Speaker 3: like that. They're just like they it's not extremely important
52:11
Speaker 3: they succeed in doing something specific. They're just trying to
52:14
Speaker 3: destabilize this or trying to hurt one person.
52:18
Speaker 1: Yeah, it seemed like for a good part of this
52:21
Speaker 1: it was them. Like my main point here is that
52:23
Speaker 1: it feels like a continuation of them targeting the black panthers, right,
52:28
Speaker 1: and just movements of that nature in general.
52:32
Speaker 2: Yeah, like you know, the idea of a gang trust
52:34
Speaker 2: and just people like, okay, what if this is now
52:37
Speaker 2: an active as voting block as opposed to you know,
52:40
Speaker 2: a source of crime. Yeah, they're just like, well, we
52:42
Speaker 2: can't have that.
52:43
Speaker 1: Which, given what I know about the history of both
52:46
Speaker 1: of these entities, the government and Notorious Big, I feel
52:51
Speaker 1: like I feel more comfortable saying yeah, it was probably
52:54
Speaker 1: the government, certain because one of the other prevailing theories
52:57
Speaker 1: is that Notorious Big set to rock up to be killed.
53:00
Speaker 2: You never.
53:02
Speaker 3: It's tough because it's also this is also an attitude
53:06
Speaker 3: that I don't like right now, again with going to
53:09
Speaker 3: the Trump stuff, is that there's a group of people
53:11
Speaker 3: it's easier to concoc to conspiracy theory than admit that
53:14
Speaker 3: this one person might be bad or be at fault.
53:19
Speaker 3: So like, I feel the same way as you about this. Yeah,
53:25
Speaker 3: I have to recognize the fact that I get mad
53:28
Speaker 3: when I see like Trump people talking about large conspiracy, yeah,
53:32
Speaker 3: where the FBI is against Trump. Yeah, because I mean
53:36
Speaker 3: not all the same thing.
53:38
Speaker 1: Not all conspiracy theories can be true, like that we
53:41
Speaker 1: have both conspiracy theories that there are secret structures we
53:45
Speaker 1: found on the moon, right, and that we've never been
53:48
Speaker 1: to the moon, And I weigh like the secret structures better,
53:52
Speaker 1: so I choose to disregard the moon.
53:56
Speaker 3: I think it can also all be like because I
53:59
Speaker 3: I did. I was doing a lot of research on
54:01
Speaker 3: the concept of the deep state, which would be the
54:04
Speaker 3: FBI and CIA, and that there's there is that that's
54:08
Speaker 3: not so much an insidious thing as it is a
54:10
Speaker 3: status quo thing, like the war or tear of the
54:12
Speaker 3: Patriot Act, maintaining that today is more people we are like, well,
54:16
Speaker 3: you know, I got a mortgage, so I want to
54:19
Speaker 3: keep selling these this product to Guantanamo bet you know.
54:22
Speaker 3: Like it's it's a system that they don't want to change,
54:25
Speaker 3: and it becomes insidious because they don't want to change anything,
54:29
Speaker 3: and that could be targeted against people like TUPAC. That
54:32
Speaker 3: could be targeted against people like Trump for good or bad.
54:35
Speaker 2: Like it's like, once the infrastructure is in place, it
54:38
Speaker 2: exists to perpetuate itself. Yeah, you know what I mean,
54:41
Speaker 2: Like once they once they have all these people, you know,
54:44
Speaker 2: employed within something, it's very hard to like it's easier
54:47
Speaker 2: to make a new government agency than it is to
54:49
Speaker 2: fucking shut one down. Like you know, I think if
54:51
Speaker 2: you looked at it, I'm sure a few have been consolidated.
54:54
Speaker 2: But it's like, well, yeah, it's like a yea, we're
54:56
Speaker 2: gonna make a space force and then there's a good
54:57
Speaker 2: luck fucking defunding space Force. Once they're like, well you
55:00
Speaker 2: don't think these brave men, you know, like it's just
55:02
Speaker 2: impossible to fucking undo this shit, Like once you let
55:05
Speaker 2: the cat out of the bag, it's like it's like
55:07
Speaker 2: the old third rail of politics, like with you know,
55:09
Speaker 2: social Security and you know, Medicare and shit. It's like,
55:11
Speaker 2: well like once you do it, it's like now you
55:13
Speaker 2: if you take it away, then people get fucking but hurt.
55:15
Speaker 2: Like that's so like if you give them anything good,
55:18
Speaker 2: it's hard to take that away. If you give them
55:20
Speaker 2: any if you give them anything bad, it's harder to
55:22
Speaker 2: take that away. So it's like they just want shit
55:25
Speaker 2: to keep moving because it's like it's a very precarious
55:28
Speaker 2: Rube Goldberg machine of society, and it's like if you
55:31
Speaker 2: and they're just like if we fucking tax the rich,
55:34
Speaker 2: it's gonna be a whole thing.
55:36
Speaker 1: You know.
55:37
Speaker 2: They're like anyone at a job. They don't want to
55:38
Speaker 2: deal with it, right, you know.
55:39
Speaker 3: I've always compared it to like an old house or
55:41
Speaker 3: an old car, where it's like, well, if we fucking
55:44
Speaker 3: fix the wiring here, we're gonna have to gut the
55:46
Speaker 3: whole thing. Yeah, Like they're just like trying to keep
55:48
Speaker 3: it together, but they don't want to like start over.
55:52
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah. So, like I said, we're gonna end there,
55:56
Speaker 1: but I will. I'm gonna try and get this guy
55:58
Speaker 1: on the show for when we finish this story, because
56:03
Speaker 1: the next part of this, of course, is Shuge Knight
56:05
Speaker 1: bailing Tupac out of prison right and signing him to
56:10
Speaker 1: death Row Records. And this book asserts that death Row
56:14
Speaker 1: Records was a CIA front operation, Which what does that
56:18
Speaker 1: add a whole new level to this story?
56:21
Speaker 2: Which I like the idea that the guy that's featured
56:23
Speaker 2: on the real motherfucking G's dis track that Isn't Easy
56:26
Speaker 2: E is a is an FBI informant and they had
56:29
Speaker 2: like again a bunch of a bunch of white guys
56:31
Speaker 2: sit down and write like, uh, but it was a
56:33
Speaker 2: g thing, but not a g thing, a pussy thing.
56:38
Speaker 2: Bitch like that would wherever that guy is that just
56:42
Speaker 2: picked the wrong fucking side so hard. I love that guy.
56:46
Speaker 2: I forget his name.
56:48
Speaker 1: So so that's our episode. I feel like if people
56:52
Speaker 1: want to be really if nothing else thoroughly entertained, go
56:55
Speaker 1: out and read drugs as Weapons against Us by John Potash,
57:00
Speaker 1: and we're gonna try and get him on this show
57:01
Speaker 1: at some point.
57:02
Speaker 3: It's great names potato and mustache.
57:04
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, just don't tweet at him. I
57:07
Speaker 1: went out and looked at his Twitter. He tweeted one
57:09
Speaker 1: thing in twenty eleven. Oh okay, it's been the end
57:12
Speaker 1: of that. So what do we have to plug before
57:17
Speaker 1: we get the fuck out of here? Connor?
57:20
Speaker 2: Oh, guys, this weekend, I'm gonn Last in Tucson in Arizona.
57:23
Speaker 2: If you're in the area, hit me up. We'll hang out.
57:25
Speaker 2: If you want to come to the show or whatever.
57:26
Speaker 2: I'll go to a diner with you. September twenty six,
57:29
Speaker 2: I'm headline the Ontario Improv In nine to eleven. I'm
57:31
Speaker 2: headlining with Stats in San Diegos. Will all be fun shows.
57:33
Speaker 2: If you want to come see me, come hang out
57:35
Speaker 2: again and hit me up if you want to hang afterwards,
57:37
Speaker 2: because I was hanging with people. And then first we
57:39
Speaker 2: can November Big Old Meme Boys tour all through Texas
57:41
Speaker 2: and the good old American South. So if you're not
57:44
Speaker 2: on our email list, go sign off, and you the
57:46
Speaker 2: first I know when the tickets are live. Some of
57:47
Speaker 2: them are up right now, so go fuck with that.
57:50
Speaker 1: Nice Dave, what do you got to plug?
57:52
Speaker 3: I got a streaming and podcast network called Gamefully Unemployed.
57:57
Speaker 3: You can give us money or see what we're up
57:59
Speaker 3: to at Patreon dot com slash Gamefully Unemployed g A
58:02
Speaker 3: M E f U L y uh Uh. I co
58:07
Speaker 3: host Best Bad Movie Ever on this of the Popular
58:10
Speaker 3: Opinion uh uh network. It's fair, Yeah you do, And
58:14
Speaker 3: I write for Bunnyears dot com, so check that out.
58:16
Speaker 3: It's a mcaulay culkin's lifestyle site.
58:19
Speaker 1: Dave knows Macaulay Culkin.
58:20
Speaker 3: Yeah fair, and I'm his personal guru.
58:23
Speaker 1: Hell yeah, all right, let's get the fuck out here. Dave,
58:26
Speaker 1: say goodbye, goodbye, Connor, say goodbye goodbye. Everybody. We love you,
58:35
Speaker 1: people of a s