Latest / Kenny Wallace Media / Rick Mast Talks Talladega, Dover & More!

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Rick Mast Talks Talladega, Dover & More! · Kenny Wallace Media

0:00
What's up everybody? Welcome to episode one of the Rick
0:04
Mast show. I am Charlie Marla. There
0:06
it is. There he is. Rick
0:08
Mast. This is going to be fun, Rick.
0:09
I'm excited. How
0:10
you doing, buddy? I'm doing good. You
0:12
know, you just mentioned you got mowers in the back
0:15
grailed, right? Messing up this podcast. One
0:18
of the best deals I ever did, one of the best
0:21
pieces of advice I ever gave anybody. We
0:23
were at Daytona. And every year at Daytona, we'd
0:25
run the qualifying races, right? On
0:27
Thursday. And when the races were over,
0:29
they would set up over the in the, well, behind Pit
0:34
Road. Someone was actually on Victor's
0:36
Circle. All the local media from across
0:38
the country would be there, right? So
0:42
like I would go interview after the races, my local,
0:44
Roanoke, Virginia, couple of those stations would be
0:47
there. And then all these other
0:48
stations, right? And we would start doing an
0:50
interview. So everybody would do live
0:52
shots. It'd be like a six o 'clock
0:54
news show. You'd be 620, right? From
0:56
the sport locally. And you would start doing the
0:58
interview. And here come these damn
1:00
lawnmowers down Pit Road. Every
1:02
time they'd be right down Pit Road and out there in
1:04
the infield. I mean, the, you know, the
1:06
travel area doing all that. That
1:08
went on every single time. And
1:10
finally, gosh, what was the guy's name? John
1:12
something or another. He was the president of the
1:14
racetrack at that point. I mean, like after the third
1:17
year I was down there, he came up to me one day. We
1:19
just talked. He said, Rick, you got any
1:21
advice for me from a track? I
1:22
said, yeah, cut these damn lawnmowers off at 620.
1:25
We're trying to do our interviews
1:26
on our local stations. So he did. He
1:30
stopped all that. You know what I mean? So
1:32
I was pretty proud of that. I
1:34
was pretty proud of that. I
1:36
love it. I actually used to work in
1:37
local TV. So the fact that an athlete
1:39
was looking out for one of us is fantastic. And
1:42
also, I think it just speaks to, it really is
1:44
Murphy's law. You and I are sitting here for
1:47
10 minutes talking. And literally the second we
1:49
press record, of course, the lawnmowers come, but
1:52
it's all good. First, first and foremost for
1:55
folks, you know, you did a podcast with Kenny Wallace
1:58
last year. But if people haven't heard
2:00
from Rick Mass in a while, tell all the NASCAR fans,
2:04
by the way, they're very excited because when you
2:06
did that podcast with Kenny, they wanted more and
2:08
more and more. So tell folks what you've been
2:11
up to these days. Man, locally, privately, here at
2:14
home personally, I've actually got a little
2:17
company. Okay. And this company is called
2:19
RKM and ViralClean. We do interstate maintenance
2:25
and instant response work. So
2:27
if you're out on the interstate here in Virginia
2:29
and you have a wreck, well, Rick Mass Butch comes
2:33
up with their little trucks and the flashing lights and
2:35
the signboards and puts out cones and does all that
2:38
stuff to keep people from running into you. You
2:40
know, and then we also pick up trash to make the
2:43
make the scenery beautiful for everybody traveling
2:46
through Virginia. So I do that. And,
2:48
you know, we've got our three children, which
2:51
they're growing now, we do a lot. We
2:53
do a lot with our family. Ricky,
2:55
my son, you know, as we've talked about, he's in
2:57
Atlanta and he runs a social media department and
3:00
does a lot of whatever he does there and a lot of
3:03
stuff with our community. So
3:04
he just had a he just had a baby a couple weeks ago
3:07
says a little preemie our first grandchild. So
3:09
we we've been on preemie watch and that little
3:12
girl's doing real well. She's
3:14
I think she's born like at three pounds and four
3:17
ounces or something. Little tiny thing, man. Have
3:20
you ever seen a preemie? They
3:21
fit me. I mean, but anyhow, she's
3:23
doing good. And then I got my other
3:26
daughter, she's out in Vale doing medical residency. I
3:28
got my other daughter here. She's
3:30
teaching local high school. So
3:31
we do that and basically past that, Charlie, it's
3:35
whatever when I wake up the morning, my bride tells
3:38
me I'm supposed to do for the day. Okay.
3:40
And if there's 10 things to do, you know, if I can
3:43
get one done, she's pretty happy. That's
3:47
kind of what I do. The honey do list. And
3:49
I keep up with the racing pretty, pretty, you know,
3:52
pretty good, you know, the social media lets me keep
3:54
up with a lot of the stuff that's going on. And
3:56
I'll get mad at watching stuff and reading stuff.
3:58
Then I'll get happy, you know,
4:00
but it is what it is. For sure. All
4:02
right, we're going to get to the NASCAR, but I got
4:04
to ask you. So you're a first time grandpa
4:06
and are you going? Are you grandpa? This
4:08
is a big deal. Are you Poppy? I
4:09
know Kenny's Poppy. I have my dad's grandpa. My
4:13
father -in -law is actually he goes by Louis. So
4:16
what's the what's the grandpa name? Yeah,
4:17
man, we really, we really went out for this one. I
4:21
had to think hard. It's called granddaddy. There
4:24
you go. Granddaddy. There you go. I
4:27
love it. All right, well, let's let's
4:28
get to the NASCAR. Let's just start. Let's
4:31
start big picture. We got we got 10 races in to
4:34
the 2024 season. I'm just going to throw it to
4:37
you. Just give me your general
4:38
thoughts. You're watching these races. What
4:40
are you thinking? Man, if it wasn't for social
4:44
media, I might be thinking differently. And
4:48
if I didn't know that we were running half throttle,
4:51
Talladega saving gas, I wouldn't have known on TV.
4:54
I really wouldn't have known.
4:56
And once they pointed out that
4:57
I'm like, oh, OK, see what's going on here.
5:00
Right. The social media has made
5:04
whatever is going to happen at Talladega happen at
5:07
Daytona. And then we've got the short
5:09
track deal that everybody's fussing about with these
5:12
cars, right? And what they're going to do
5:14
to that. And then we've got the
5:15
intermediate deal where everybody likes the cars,
5:18
you know, people in the garage. A
5:20
lot of people in the garage don't like the cars.
5:21
They hate working on them. They
5:22
don't like the way we're working on these cars now
5:24
or they can't work on them. You
5:26
know, I kind of come, you know, and I try to be
5:29
very objective on this stuff, man. I
5:31
read all the stuff. I read the fans. I
5:34
listen to NASCAR. I listen to the drivers. I
5:36
listen to the crew guys, the guys on the inside
5:38
trying to, you know, figure out what's our next move.
5:43
What are we going to do? But
5:46
anyhow, through all this stuff, Charlie, the thing
5:48
is, and I've used this quote many times, it's like
5:52
the great, late baseball player, Ted Weave, said,
5:55
man, you play the sport for the sport, right? And
5:57
racing is the same way. When
6:00
you get into a race car, those drivers strap in, put
6:03
the helmets on, and when they drop the green flag,
6:05
that part doesn't change from the time Curtis Turner
6:09
did it or Edsel Ford did it in 1910 or whatever he
6:12
did it. You're doing everything in your
6:15
power to pass the guy or run as hard as you could
6:18
possibly run every single lap to outrun the guy
6:20
that's around you. No matter what's going on
6:23
outside, when you get out of the car, no matter what
6:25
the dictatorships and in the sports world and the
6:29
fans that everybody that's going on, that part remains
6:32
pure. That's why that's the part to be.
6:35
That's the part that always will
6:36
make our sport relevant. I think it'll always be
6:39
relevant because of that. Now,
6:41
first time ever I've done anything like this to
6:43
happen. We go to Talladega in the
6:45
whole field, join in half throttle. You're
6:47
not doing that, but you are still trying to win
6:49
the race, right? So they've got to fix it.
6:52
They've got to address that.
6:53
There's no doubt. Okay.
6:55
I think you bring up an interesting point with
6:57
social media. Do you think, because NASCAR
7:00
fans are smart, and I monitor a lot of NASCAR
7:03
fan comment sections, and a lot of them have been
7:06
complaining about the stage racing for a while here.
7:09
It does seem like we're really
7:11
hearing from a lot of the drivers, especially Denny
7:14
Hamlin talking about the super speedway package where
7:17
he kind of says, look, it's the most passes ever,
7:20
but everybody's going like this for the first two
7:22
stages. And then the race gets really
7:24
fun in the last 30, 40 laps, whatever it is, like
7:27
we saw at Talladega. Do you think the average
7:30
person watching can understand and see that in
7:33
the first couple of stages that there's maybe not a
7:36
ton of action? As I said, I've been watching
7:39
this thing. I'm 67 years old and I've been
7:43
watching races as a little kid and I didn't pick up
7:47
on it. I did not pick up on that.
7:50
Once it was explained to me, I
7:52
looked back and I'm like, oh, okay, that's the
7:54
reason, because so many times at Talladega Daytona,
7:57
you get set and you get in the line and you do
7:59
your deal. And now we're all settled down.
8:01
We're going to make laps, right?
8:03
We've seen this happen so many
8:04
times that both race tracks. We're
8:05
going to make laps to get towards the end and try to
8:07
be here. And sometimes it'd be one long
8:10
line. Sometimes it'd be two side by side
8:12
and doing this stuff. The difference this time was
8:15
they were doing it. But before when you're doing
8:18
that here in line, you might be maybe 90 % at
8:22
times. Then you would be 100. If
8:23
you're going to try to make a move, you still try
8:25
to make a move. If you could, if somebody
8:27
messed up a little bit, you were still trying to
8:29
pace yourself, you would still make that move. But
8:32
evidently right now, these guys are just backed out
8:34
of it so far. They're not making any moves. The
8:36
only thing they're looking at is the next pit stop.
8:39
That's what they're looking at.
8:40
And how do I get there to the
8:41
next pit stop? The whole deal with racing is
8:44
how do I get to the checkered flag the quickest
8:47
from when the green flag drops? That's
8:49
an old Mark Martin saying, man, when you guys would
8:53
come in our sport and we'd be running, and you'd be
8:55
running 12th, right? And you would come up on
8:58
somebody to pass him and you'd get hungry. Well,
9:00
this guy, instead of letting you go, he would
9:02
sit there and hold you beside him for 15 laps.
9:06
You're running beside this guy,
9:08
running for 12th place, right? And
9:10
you're racing each other hard, but the people in
9:13
front of you are gone. The people behind you have
9:15
caught you because both of you have slowed down. Mark
9:18
Martin, we'd have to teach guys when they come in our
9:20
sport to know when to race this, right? And
9:23
Mark Martin's famous said was to these guys when
9:25
they mess with him and mess with all of us, he'd
9:28
say, listen, when the green flag starts or drops, our
9:31
objective is to get to the checkered flag as quick as
9:34
we can. And when you sit there and
9:36
hold B up for five laps, a second of lap, you have
9:40
held me up five seconds from getting to that
9:42
checkered flag quicker. So you need to be smarter
9:45
about how you race, okay? That
9:47
really doesn't translate to what's going on at Daytona.
9:49
But that is just kind of the
9:52
way it works. So we're recording here on a
9:54
Friday, but the Talladega finish was so crazy. People
9:58
still want to hear about it. What
10:00
was your take on that at the end? You
10:03
feel like, hey, everybody, final lap was just trying
10:06
to win the race. What did you think about the
10:08
McDowell block? And from your vantage point, do
10:11
you think there was any way that he could have
10:13
still won the race without throwing that aggressive of
10:16
a block at the end? No. Okay. Here's
10:19
your bout take on these deals at the Talladega
10:21
Daytona. When it always happens, you got
10:23
one block. That's the way I look at it. You
10:25
make one move. When that one move, if it
10:28
works, you win. If it don't work, you go to
10:30
settle for wherever you finish. When
10:32
you do the second block, inevitably, I'm going to
10:35
say, I don't know the number, but I'm going to
10:37
say what, over the years, 90 % of the time, you're
10:41
going to get your ass wrecked. The
10:42
second block always leads to the wreck. It
10:45
just always does. Michael, I don't begrudge you, but
10:52
I don't think I'm not going to fuss at it for
10:54
doing that. I mean, he was bound and
10:56
determined he was going to win that race. I
10:58
mean, you could just tell the last 15 or 20 laps,
11:00
what he was doing when he was leading. You
11:02
knew what was going to happen in the last lap.
11:04
You knew he was going to make
11:05
every move that he could possibly make because one
11:07
way or the other, he was going to win that race. In
11:09
his mind, he was going to win that race and do block
11:12
whatever he had to block to make that happen. The
11:15
problem with that is, normally, after the first
11:19
block, the first move you make, it's like going
11:21
through a wreck on a super speedway. I
11:23
used to tell people, well, you're in a super speedway
11:25
and the big one happens. Typically,
11:27
what would go on, you'd be there running and the group
11:29
of cars all around you. Acting
11:31
crazy. The next thing you know, all
11:34
it'd be is this a big plume of smoke. That's
11:36
all you see is a plume of smoke. If
11:38
it's daytime, you would see flashes in front of you.
11:42
What the flashes was, is parts
11:44
of the car. The sun hitting parts of the
11:46
car is or flying off the car or spinning around you.
11:50
Typically, you make one move when you
11:53
see that smoke. You kind of know what's going
11:55
on. You make one move. The
11:56
next thing that happens is, you're looking in your
11:59
mirror at the wreck behind you because nothing you got
12:02
through it. Or you're sitting there
12:04
spinning around hitting the walls and flipping them
12:06
hoping you're not getting hurt. That's
12:07
the way that one move works. The
12:09
one move within the race, but now did, that was the
12:12
chance he had to make that block happen. And
12:14
it didn't work. He made the second move and
12:18
that took him out to the third and ninth and tenth
12:21
heads. So I'm curious just the
12:24
mentality of super speedway racing. When
12:28
you were racing Daytona or Talladega, was it a totally
12:32
different mentality for you both entering the race and
12:36
during the race? Because it seems like, so I
12:38
remember the last couple of years, the drivers will
12:41
basically say, now that the schedule is Daytona and
12:45
then Atlanta, which has become essentially close to
12:47
a super speedway, I've heard the drivers almost
12:50
say that the season kind of starts with Vegas. In
12:54
terms of data and kind of real racing and what they
12:58
can draw from their data and how they drive. Is
13:03
that pretty fair that sometimes you go super
13:06
speedway racing, you know, half the field might get
13:09
cleaned out. There's some luck involved. So
13:11
what's the strategy? How is it different at a super
13:14
speedway for you? If we back up and take
13:17
Daytona, it's separate from Talladega. Daytona,
13:20
separate from Talladega. Daytona
13:22
is only an entity because that's the first race of
13:24
the year. It's our super bowl with so
13:25
much fight, so much going on. I
13:27
used to tell people, man, if you want to stop this
13:28
country, put a bomb in the suites at Daytona because
13:31
90 % of all the CEOs of 4 to 500 companies are in
13:35
these suites at Daytona. Right.
13:36
And so all the pressure and everything is on you.
13:39
You really, at that track, you
13:40
really just trying to do all you can do in those
13:43
days to get in the race. So
13:45
many people would miss that race because we had so
13:47
many entries and then to run good. Of
13:49
course, if you run good, it's just at Daytona, it
13:51
would set you up for the year for so many good
13:53
things to happen. You know, and that's how Rick
13:56
Mask got started with the Daytona in 89 with Travis
13:59
Carter, a white, unsponsured Monte Carlo number 66. And
14:03
it was me and Earnhardt Schrader all day long, man,
14:05
running up front. I led the race, did all
14:07
this, finished good, you know, kind of got me jump
14:09
started. But, you know, that's kind of
14:12
the other you go to Talladega. And
14:14
I'm going to tell you, the guys might not have been
14:17
it to you, but I've had been a bit of been in
14:19
many conversations. A lot of the guys would wake
14:21
up the motorhome lot on Sunday morning at Talladega
14:24
thinking, you know what, if I drive out of here, when
14:28
this race is over, you get by airplane and go home.
14:30
It's a good day. Okay.
14:32
Because you have the Talladega mystique or
14:35
Talladega, the guys in the past that used to get
14:37
killed there and all the unanswered questions that
14:40
would go on at that place. And
14:42
but yeah, back to your point, Daytona Talladega,
14:46
it's an own entity and now even in Atlanta, the way
14:48
they've got Atlanta structured. So
14:50
that's that's a super speedway race. It's
14:52
a complete different animal than it is at all the
14:55
other racetracks. So, you know, whatever happens
14:57
at those places, you know, you run good, the car's
15:00
paired right, you know, the car is fast, you get tore
15:02
up, you win, you don't whatever. But
15:04
when you start at a regular racetrack like a
15:07
Vegas, then those the data you get from the car and
15:10
where the car acts and reacts and what you do the
15:12
car that carries on to all the other racetracks, the
15:15
short tracks, the big tracks or bound half
15:17
tracks. You know, that's really tells
15:19
you tells you what's going on. Of
15:21
course, there's so much luck and bad luck and good
15:22
luck involved at these restricted plates. Yeah.
15:25
So I think what you said was fascinating about
15:28
Talladega specifically. And I remember before the race
15:32
started on Sunday, I saw a tweet from Delaney Harvick,
15:35
and obviously Kevin Harvick who retired last year now
15:38
he's broadcasting. But she said she tweeted
15:40
something along the lines of this is the first time
15:43
I can watch a Talladega race without chugging Pepto
15:46
Bismol the whole the whole day. So
15:49
is is Talladega really even different from Daytona? It
15:53
sounds like in the sense of, I mean, you guys, you
15:55
guys know that you are putting your lives on the
15:57
line every time that you get in the race car and
16:00
put the helmet on. But is it truly different where
16:02
Talladega you are really, really more concerned about
16:05
your your safety when you're racing? Yeah,
16:08
it is. And it's the aura of Talladega.
16:11
What I first came in, man, so
16:14
many things about Talladega that in the old days that.
16:18
Crew chiefs especially couldn't
16:20
answer. You would go out there in your
16:23
car and be fast and you'd be in a draft and
16:25
everything be perfect. And they'd start the race on
16:27
Sunday. Well, heck, you couldn't run with
16:29
anybody, right? And I'm talking good experience
16:32
winning crew chiefs. And you would do that or your
16:36
luck would just be horrendous there. And,
16:39
you know, it would just by the time I got to the
16:42
sport, Talladega, when guys would talk to me all the
16:45
old time or all the guys there really, they would
16:47
just. It would be like a mystic
16:49
thing, man. Listen to these guys talking about
16:51
Talladega because they couldn't. There's
16:53
so many things they couldn't answer and explain.
16:55
Now, a lot of the stuff that
16:56
went on has been answered over the years with with
17:00
engineers, okay, and computer systems, everything
17:04
would do the cars. A lot of this unanswered
17:06
stuff that would go on. But,
17:08
you know, I think I really truly believe a lot of
17:10
this. This the voodoo stuff started at
17:13
Talladega. You know, you know, you don't
17:15
wear you don't have green, right? You
17:17
don't use $50 bills. I think a great story man
17:21
one time they were asking Ricky Rudd, Ricky or a lot
17:25
of these drivers are or, you know, puts the word
17:29
I'm looking for they. Superstitious.
17:32
Yeah, they're superstitious and are you superstitious?
17:35
Oh, no, no, I don't I ban I
17:37
don't buy it in that stuff. I
17:38
don't buy it. Of course, you know, I don't
17:39
walk under ladders or anything obvious like that,
17:41
but I'm not superstitious. Right.
17:45
But it's just a it's an aura. It's
17:47
funny. The Talladega race, we were
17:50
just watching at home part of it. My
17:51
wife came through Sharon and she sat down and
17:53
watched a little bit of it. And
17:55
she just right out of the blue, she said that place
17:57
used to scare me to death. You
17:59
know, I've heard her say that before. She
18:01
says that's a one race track that was always super
18:04
scared and super nervous. So
18:06
now she watched me one time on she was doing her
18:09
score to time or scored on her pit box and she
18:11
watched me go by the trial upside down. Right.
18:14
And so that that may have added to her fear of that
18:18
place. But, you know, we just you
18:20
witnessed so many bad things going at that track
18:23
and unanswered things. And then, and then finally what
18:26
they did they decided somewhere before I got
18:29
there that because as an Indian barrel grounds, you
18:32
know, that's what causes all the they honus will we
18:34
go there. You know, you go down and you
18:36
piss off whoever's buried and the spirits, you know,
18:39
they're going to raise rear their ugly heads and all
18:43
this unexplained stuff happened. You
18:45
know, and so it was it was quite an experience. I
18:48
don't know now that if that still goes around like
18:51
it used to I know it does with some of the guys.
18:53
Right. But yeah, you enter that
18:57
track you enter that race with a different mentality
18:59
as a driver than you do. And
19:00
I don't know what we've lost as many people they
19:02
don't I guess is we have it. A
19:04
talla digger maybe more, you know, but it's just
19:06
the aura of that place. It is what it is. So
19:10
I didn't know about all this stuff. So
19:11
what else you said what you're not supposed to wear
19:13
green no $50 bills. Do you know where this stuff
19:16
started or other things that that's involved there.
19:19
I don't know where it
19:19
started. I'm going to assume a lot of
19:22
it came from Talladega. Maybe
19:23
maybe it was going on before then we'd have to
19:25
ask guys or didn't go on I guess or where it got
19:27
started. No, you did not. You
19:29
did not walk around the garage or give give anybody
19:33
you didn't have a $50 bill in your billfold. You
19:35
just didn't do that. You know, I don't know what
19:37
what I don't know what originated that you did not
19:40
do anything with green. Hey,
19:42
man, I've seen people with green sharpies right. I've
19:45
seen crew chiefs. I mean, like he'll be a tire
19:48
guy or somebody working in the pit to have a green
19:50
sharpie. And I have seen your crew
19:52
chiefs literally lambast these poor guys. And
19:56
take that pit take these green sharpies and break
19:59
them and throw them into trash right and then make
20:01
people take that trash out of the racetrack because it
20:04
had that friggin green sharpie in it. You
20:06
know, it was, you know, and of course peanuts
20:09
everybody knows about peanuts you do not you do
20:12
not eat a peanut in the garage area. You
20:15
just don't do that. You know, and where this crap
20:18
started and where it came from and whatever it is. I
20:21
don't know dude. I don't know. You
20:24
know, but it kind of goes in line with the thing I
20:25
told you on the Kitty Wallace show about the
20:27
Elvira at our P that time, you know, or maybe
20:30
something you just would use blow bubbles all over
20:32
the car. So we do that story again or
20:34
just let that go. I mean, that no go ahead, go
20:36
ahead. Yeah, the story goes and I've
20:38
said this many times 1990 run the Bush Gray National
20:41
series and my sponsor had left was probably two
20:45
thirds of the way through the year. My
20:46
sponsor left in the middle of the night left me
20:48
holding like $50 ,000 worth of bills right and we're
20:51
down to basically you're still rubbing nickels
20:54
together. Try to make a dollar and you
20:57
know you didn't really have anything we were out of
20:59
money pretty much go to our P Bush Gray National
21:02
race. I take a lead with like 18
21:04
laps to go. I think I passed truck bail
21:06
like man, our car was perfect. All
21:08
you do is get to the end of the race right go down
21:10
in the turn and go back around a lap car he mostly
21:12
be the outside I go around and he turned right for
21:15
some reason. Puts me into all wreck my car
21:17
and I come in and mad and all this other stuff goes
21:20
on. But anyhow, we're trying to get
21:21
the car loaded up on the trailer we're taking stuff
21:23
off the front end. The car is tore up. A
21:26
woman walks up dressed exactly like Vell via. I
21:30
mean exactly cut down and cut up. She
21:33
has a purse she sets down on the front. She
21:35
sits down on which left the front of a race car.
21:38
And we're all working on the
21:39
car like what's going on here. She
21:40
opens up a purse pulls out this tube. Right.
21:44
And pops the top off and in the tube she pulls out
21:47
another tube, a metal tube like this big screws the
21:51
top off reaches there pulls out this thing. You
21:54
know like the kids the blow bubbles thing we did
21:57
but you blow the bubble right. Well
21:59
she she dips this thing and she turns around and
22:02
she blows bubbles all over my car. And
22:04
me and my guys are all sitting here watching this
22:06
like what is the hell is she does this three times
22:09
those bubbles three times puts the two back together
22:11
puts that tube in there puts it back in this in a
22:13
purse gets up and starts walking away we're all
22:16
sitting with her mouth I get open and she stops she
22:19
turns around and says boys your hard times are over.
22:22
That's a good times down the road
22:23
and she walks away and I'm like what in the world was
22:27
that all about four weeks later I had won two races
22:30
and assigned to with my first winston cup deal for
22:33
the next year. Right. And I tell people that
22:35
story they're like man you need to find that one
22:38
again get your look good I said no no no no she can
22:40
give it to you that way she can take it away from
22:42
never saw her again never heard a story about it
22:45
never heard anybody talk about it you know and the
22:47
funny thing we were at Caledega one time years
22:50
later setting in the press room and just set around
22:53
shooting crap and I'm telling the press guys this
22:56
story and I'm getting that dear the headlight look
22:58
right they're like master saw master saw this some
23:02
kind of crap right and a guy his name was Ed Shaw
23:05
everybody in ratio does it show he was there he was
23:08
a rep for Stokely van caps Gatorade right he kept it
23:11
all Gatorade and all of a sudden he spoke up said
23:14
dog guys that's true and they looked at him and
23:16
said hey hey dude what are you doing he said that's
23:19
true I said you remember that he said yeah I
23:22
remember that I was watching that crap at night
23:24
I said I didn't know that he said yeah I watched
23:26
that he said I didn't know what it was we never
23:28
talked about it I said but anyhow that's that's the
23:32
you know what I mean that's the mindset some of
23:35
these guys used when we couldn't answer questions as
23:38
good as well as we can today about our race cars
23:40
that stuff that stuff would come up because the crew
23:42
chief should be like you know I'm the best crew
23:45
chief it is out here I know everything about this
23:47
sport I know everything about these cars there's no
23:50
way that car just did what it did it's not possible
23:53
it's got to be the Indians coming back at Haulton this
23:56
out of the barrel or that my crew guy just walked by
24:00
and he bought something with a $50 bill or did
24:03
you see the tire changer he walked around and went
24:05
under that ladder right before that race started
24:07
right that's what these guys they would actually
24:11
revert to that because they could not come up with an
24:14
answer in their mind as to why the car did what it
24:18
did right because it just wasn't there and it was
24:24
you know and when I got there in 1989 88 89 and
24:27
started cup races that that stuff was still prominent I
24:30
mean it was very probably and it kind of went away
24:34
a little bit ties it into my career but still you
24:36
didn't even when I left an O2 you still did not use
24:40
a green magic marker or $50 bill or peanuts now
24:44
the one thing that that crossed this whole thing up
24:47
that really screwed everybody up is when
24:49
Stokely vancamps came in and had the green Gatorade
24:52
car right and then there a wall trip drove the
24:56
Mountain Dew car was Junior Johnson it was green that
24:58
that really really really caused some heartburn with
25:02
a lot of people but you can you look at the record
25:04
you Kate as a green didn't hurt that deal you know
25:07
and then you can't be tips and all they did so it's
25:10
just it's just interested it was always interested to
25:13
be the way these guys did you know and again it was
25:17
because they couldn't answer a question why this
25:20
happened. Okay I got a couple a couple
25:23
of follow ups now first of all were you a
25:25
superstitious driver because I'm thinking if Elvira
25:28
comes over blows the bubbles and all of a
25:31
sudden you have great success next week are you
25:33
looking for another woman or are your crew guys
25:36
going a we should blow some bubbles on this car
25:38
but you said you don't want to mess with it but
25:39
did you have other superstitions. Dave
25:42
a race or maybe maybe you ran good you're gonna do
25:44
the same thing you ran bad you're gonna you're gonna
25:46
change it up anything. I did not I did not I just
25:50
you know for whatever reason I never did now I
25:53
will say this I would not allow my guys to use green
25:56
sharpies in the pit area I didn't do that and I
25:59
honestly if I went to the back and got money and all
26:02
they gave me a 50 I'd make them change that
26:04
right. I mean I don't know I'm not
26:07
superstitious but you're telling you I'm
26:09
superstitious like Ricky Rudd just don't stop like
26:12
no I'm not superstitious of course you know I don't
26:14
walk under ladders or something obvious like that.
26:19
But no I didn't like Kyle
26:20
Petty one those races and kept the same underwear for
26:23
each race and all that no I never did I never did
26:25
do that stuff. Okay so wait but the the green
26:29
and the $50 bill was this just Talladega for those or
26:33
is this okay so I'm curious that's that's all
26:36
tracks or did different tracks were there any
26:40
different quirks or superstitions at different
26:42
tracks. Oh God so I'm not sure it
26:45
was I can't remember what it was there was some
26:47
track what was that you had to go around this way
26:52
to go out to the garage you didn't walk that way
26:55
and I remember where that was. Somewhere
26:57
you didn't want to walk around this way you had to
26:59
walk around that hey dude we had a guy there's a
27:01
guy when I first started when I was a teenager the
27:03
guy and everybody in Virginia know this guy in
27:06
Richmond and he was up his name was Billy Hicks he's
27:10
passed down but if you go to see him. He
27:15
was a big guy and he had a very distinct face and
27:21
he would put what they called the hex on you he
27:25
would do this if he put the hex on you buddy you
27:28
were done right and Darrell I know Darrell paid him.
27:35
I'm wanting to say Bobby did
27:38
how much I'm not sure the amount would be probably
27:42
like a hundred dollar bill or something but Darrell
27:44
would always do that right he would always give and
27:47
you talk to anybody in the Richmond area right down
27:49
around the south side the Ray Henry but Sunday
27:51
hunting but they'll tell you everybody knows Billy
27:54
Hicks right and I remember the first time I went
27:56
south side I was a teenager. First
27:58
time I ever been there and my dad came up to me and
28:01
pulled this guy out he says you see that guy
28:03
standing over I said where is it later I looked I
28:05
said yeah he said you stay the hell away from him
28:07
Rick don't even get close to him I said what's wrong
28:09
with me. No no he's the hex guy he
28:12
put the hex on right and everybody was bought into
28:15
this guy you know Billy Hicks looking back I think
28:18
he's probably on the internet still but. Yeah
28:20
it was it was a true deal I don't know like with
28:23
Darrell and those guys if they just played along with
28:26
it and you know help the guy finance you a little
28:30
bit but that may have been probably what they said it
28:33
was about but they weren't taking any chances because
28:36
they didn't know either they you know there's a
28:38
lot of stuff in this world we cannot explain even
28:40
today a lot of stuff goes on we can't explain Charlie
28:42
right so for sure. I take your chances with
28:45
Billy Hicks give us a hundred right go have a
28:48
good race. I hear it's funny what you
28:50
said about Ricky Rudd this literally happened two three
28:52
days ago I'm walking into my radio station and there
28:56
was a ladder right there and you're not walking
28:58
under that and it's funny because you don't even you
29:01
don't even feel like you are superstitious because
29:03
that's one that's so obvious that just just
29:05
nobody does it right. You know. I
29:09
don't know. So you were superstitious and
29:13
so how about this I've heard Kenny talk about this
29:17
and with other drivers what about as you're about ready
29:21
to to get in the car or you're getting ready to
29:24
start was there something you did to calm yourself.
29:27
Kenny has said he'd maybe sing a
29:29
song he'd say a prayer did you have a routine where
29:33
as you're ready to get locked in and really start
29:35
like how did you get mentally ready right before
29:37
green flag. I didn't do that I would I
29:41
would spend all of my time when I got in the car.
29:45
The time sitting in the car
29:46
waiting to start your engines and after the
29:48
engine started already knew from starting lineup who
29:50
was around me. My whole concentration was who
29:54
was around me in front of him side and behind me
29:56
what what the track conditions were what to do
30:00
when I drop the green flag. Okay
30:02
what was I going to do the first going in the
30:05
first turn right the first corner the first few laps
30:08
who was I around who was a not around and it goes
30:12
back to a lot it encompasses a lot of a lot
30:16
of things dude. It's like a tall digger or like
30:18
everywhere you race anywhere you race you when you race
30:22
guys you know you learn how each guy races right
30:25
you know each guy's personality you know what
30:27
you what you can get away with what you can't get
30:29
away with. You know areas to get on the
30:32
racetrack don't get on his right rear in turn three
30:34
or whatever because you're more likely you're gonna
30:37
get right and we have squirrel because squirrels
30:40
guys that really not that good but you had to kind
30:43
of stay away from him and do different things she had
30:46
all this going on in your mind. The
30:47
part about tell a day that's what screws up tell
30:50
a day you're in the pack you cannot get away from
30:53
those guys I mean we would you know you literally work
30:56
at every race track to not be in a position with a
30:59
certain driver. That you do is go to increase
31:01
your chances of record or taking you out so you work
31:04
things around not to be around that driver certain
31:06
areas of the racetrack. Tell
31:07
a day you can't do that you're stuck you're right
31:10
there you right behind beside in front of the guy
31:13
that you. At Charlotte is no way you
31:16
didn't put yourself this position right and that's
31:18
what that's another thing that's just a little side
31:20
thing about telling a guy that always messes the
31:23
driver so far you had to think about but as far as
31:26
starting the race I didn't you know. It
31:30
just never I was so concentrated on what I was
31:33
around and what I was going to do when the race
31:35
started and. You know you have your typical
31:38
deal what was cool you always have the. I
31:43
got the crew guy that would always be with you
31:45
when you got in the car and you strap in and he
31:48
would check your connections do all your things and.
31:50
The winner that up is always
31:52
the same guy every week right and you know always
31:56
after a period of time you got a little you got you
31:58
took a little comfort from that right there's my man
32:01
look at after me right and that's not a superstitious
32:04
thing but superstitious thing but that was a cool
32:07
deal and then when you go down pit road. The
32:10
crew guys from other teams would reach out to you and
32:14
give you a thumbs up right that that I always thought
32:18
that was pretty cool because in a lot of the
32:20
crews would do it for a lot of the drivers but man
32:22
when we go down pit road I'd have half the crew
32:24
guys would be out giving me a thumbs up you know
32:27
to start the race and that would always give you a
32:29
little comfort right because those days those guys knew
32:33
you you know we all knew each other and they all
32:36
really wanted you do well they really just wanted you
32:38
to come back. You know the race and go hold
32:41
that that's what a lot of that stuff was but the
32:43
superstitious start now I didn't really have a I
32:45
didn't really have a thing for that. Alright
32:48
let's let's flip it ahead to dover now just give us
32:51
give us your thoughts on dover the monster mile
32:54
what's what's the strategy did you like that track
32:57
and any kind of memory stick out for you. Yeah,
33:02
that was one of my favorite tracks Charlie it
33:05
always was I don't you know every driver has a
33:07
track that you like and what that mean I tell you
33:11
what that means you have drivers have certain tracks
33:13
that they always talk about they run well or they like
33:15
what that really means is as a driver. You
33:18
know for some reason you you already know after
33:22
running there you know what the car needs to feel like
33:25
out of the gas the first part of the entry into the
33:29
apex through the apex getting in the gas out of
33:32
the apex three quarters of the way off the turn and
33:35
then getting off the turn. You
33:37
know what the car has to feel like and all those
33:39
little spots to be able to make the fastest lap right
33:43
so you're able to communicate to the crew
33:45
chief. Here's what it's doing here here's
33:47
what I want it to do here's what I want it to
33:49
do here here's what I want to do here now you
33:52
couldn't always get that outcome right but you knew
33:56
what it had to be and when you got close to all
33:58
that stuff you could run good. That's
34:01
an ending racetrack and Dover is one of those
34:03
tracks for me is just like man you know I know what
34:05
it has to feel like here and you could always run
34:07
good there and the thing about Dover here's the
34:11
whole thing about Dover with that concrete. For
34:15
whatever reason the thing is stuck I mean the tire
34:18
is stuck to that racetrack and you're running
34:20
tremendous amount of speed man you're fast this
34:22
racetrack. In fact the right front good
34:25
year I don't what the data is now but when our day
34:27
the data showed the right front load on the tire is
34:31
higher than the loads at Daytona on the right front
34:34
tire. So that's how much it squished
34:36
and that's how much stick and now they call grip we
34:39
didn't have you didn't use grip in the day it was
34:40
just stuck. And so excuse me so you would
34:44
be stuck the car the tire be stuck but the downside
34:47
is when it would break loose when the tire would
34:50
lose the script right you would just take off man it
34:54
would just take off flying just like golly you didn't
34:58
realize how fast you're going until when the tires
35:01
lost grip you lost the nose or you lost the back
35:03
end you start sliding and then inevitably when you
35:07
start that crap when you stop you were going to hit
35:10
something hard. You know that it's just in the
35:13
track is straight away is a bank a lot and you
35:15
would you'd always sweep down you hit those inside
35:17
walls. We were at Dover one time.
35:21
And Steve Park was in front of
35:23
me and he got crossed up coming off to it he did
35:26
this right in front of me right and hit hit my front
35:30
end and turn me left into the inside wall. Okay,
35:34
yeah it broke by ankle on that deal. God
35:36
leave that hurt. But that's the big thing about
35:39
Dover but man, if you get in a rhythm at Dover and
35:42
your car is working good and you know kind of what
35:43
you're doing. It's a very, very, very fun
35:46
race track. And another thing they got this
35:48
walkway across there. Right. We used to get hung up in
35:51
this day in place you you start the race the fifth
35:53
lap, you get tore up in your wreck right. Well
35:57
it's a 500 friggin lap race. And
36:00
you're stuck in there all day you can't get out and
36:02
go home but they got this walkway across now and
36:05
people I think you sell tickets for a few people
36:07
get in this walkway. If you ever go to Dover
36:09
folks, it's the auto try to do it it's cool
36:11
experience. And on the walkway when the
36:13
cars come by you can feel the walkway go whoop whoop.
36:16
It's like the air from the cars
36:18
pushes this thing up a little bit. It's
36:20
real by and you can feel it and it's a pretty cool
36:24
deal pretty cool deal the way that works. But
36:26
man when you use direct that place we used to get
36:28
hung up in there. Godly that was most visible
36:31
experience because you couldn't go to work. You
36:33
just couldn't leave. Dang. So you said you talked
36:37
about the feel of the track. I'm
36:38
wondering is there ever also is it a visual thing
36:41
sometimes with with NASCAR drivers because I've heard
36:45
for example golfers will talk about they like to
36:48
look of a course kind of like a car. And
36:49
I think that's kind of the way it sets up to their
36:51
eyes. I played a little bit of
36:53
baseball but you also hear baseball players certain
36:55
stadiums whether it's the batter's eye how they can
36:58
pick up the ball. Is that is that similar with
37:01
racing are there just certain tracks. I
37:03
know you have spotters and all that but are there
37:05
certain tracks where you just visually kind of feel
37:07
better when you're on the track. Yeah,
37:09
yeah it is. There's no doubt and I don't I
37:12
don't know what causes that Charles. It's
37:14
it's your own psyche. Like in my deal for some reason
37:18
whenever we've got whatever we go to a new track and
37:21
this went on back in the most great asshole days
37:24
whenever we go to a new track. I
37:26
always excelled. Right. Like practicing and
37:30
qualifying and racing. You know I would I would just
37:32
for some reason like we we went to road Atlanta for
37:36
some other been a road course right we qualified
37:39
like for we had top guys there. I
37:41
think Terry was there and there are Walker up and
37:44
Neil. I forget who it was but
37:46
anyhow I was running these guys that are at a road
37:48
race or a court right but just did well. We
37:51
went to Milwaukee. I think I ran second with
37:53
Jack Andrew. First time we've been there ran
37:55
good there. We go to the Hickory's South
37:57
Balsas. I couldn't get out of my way
37:58
half of that track you go to all the time but you
38:01
go to these new tracks and we go to these new tracks.
38:04
Same way like the house of
38:05
Pennsylvania. First time we went up there I
38:06
kicked everybody's butt right. We've
38:08
never been in that before but just getting there and
38:10
we're riding around the track look they're like man
38:12
it's cool. It's cool track right and and
38:15
it's not I don't know that it's something same way at
38:17
Indy. Right. First time we all go to
38:20
Indy. I mean we sit on the pole
38:21
and beat 80 some friggin cars there right and I
38:26
don't know but like any when I went around that
38:29
track it's a man it's a cool place but it's just
38:31
big you know and and I don't know what that is
38:34
but it is there. You're exactly right and I don't
38:37
much think about this over the next few months on our
38:40
podcast. I might be able to come up
38:42
with an answer for that at some point. If
38:44
I do I'll tell you I like it. I
38:47
love it. Um so a couple weeks ago I
38:51
saw your tweet. You're great on Twitter. Do
38:53
you enjoy Twitter or acts by the way whatever we
38:55
call it. I do. I
38:56
do. I just have to get myself
38:57
thralled about so bad. You know that's the issue. I
39:00
mean God I always said if this thing was around in
39:03
the 90s I know what I got fired but cause I always I
39:06
was always one of those guys in the garage area
39:09
man I had to know what was going on. I
39:11
mean Larry. I mean Larry. One
39:14
time I read one of the publications he said well
39:16
if you want to know what's going on the grads. I
39:18
mean I'm not a grad Jerry. I
39:18
asked you to talk Rick Mast. Right.
39:20
So but social media and me in the 90s. I
39:25
don't know if I'd have became famous or got fired.
39:28
It would have been one of the
39:29
other. It would have been one of the
39:30
other. But that's what. No
39:33
that's why I was going to ask because I think it was
39:34
after the Denny Hamlin Marcus Smith little they
39:38
had their little exchange and everybody in the NASCAR
39:40
world was talking about it. I
39:41
think your tweet was something like man if we
39:44
had social media back in my day. You
39:46
look I'm 41 and I'm even glad I didn't have social
39:49
media when I was a teenager and in college. So
39:53
do you feel like was it could you could you have
39:57
more fun and we're not we're not talking about
39:59
doing things illegally. But you know nowadays it just
40:03
seems like anything you do you're at a bar you got a
40:06
beer in your hand. Everything
40:07
is on camera phones. Man I wouldn't want to live. I
40:11
wouldn't want to live like that as a teenager or in
40:13
my 20s or in NASCAR. Do you feel like it was kind
40:15
of more fun because you had a little more freedom
40:17
and privacy back then. I do. I
40:20
do. These guys now are such scrutiny.
40:22
Everybody's got a frigging cell phone.
40:24
You know I mean honestly and
40:27
and my guys in my in my era my guys number one
40:32
they're my heroes right and they were marijuana. They
40:35
were part of marijuana with fans. They
40:37
were fans heroes and they were a good guy. Basically
40:41
all of them were good guys but all of them had us
40:43
most of them had a side to them you know a wild
40:47
side that if they were in our sport today and it was
40:50
reported on probably the sponsors wouldn't wouldn't
40:53
want them you know. But they were able to project
40:57
themselves in a way that came across as heroes to
41:02
Americans you know it's just I mean everybody could
41:05
relate to Harry Gantt. You know hanging sheetrock
41:07
right. Everybody could relate their own
41:09
heart out there throwing bales of hay and not
41:11
having a pot to pee in right which most of the
41:14
guys were that way they came through the sport and.
41:19
You know me personally I had
41:23
had had fun with it. If I got a blackmail guys
41:26
what I did that is blackmail. Five
41:28
left to go you gonna let me win this race or I'm
41:30
gonna post this crap right now I would have never
41:32
done that. I would never done that but
41:35
yeah it would have been I don't know it depends on
41:40
how far the guys would have taken it then right
41:42
because you know we're not but our sport we were not
41:47
buttoned up the way it is now. You
41:49
know in the 90s you walk through the garage area and
41:52
at the back of each truck set the driver right in a
41:55
chair and you look there'd be two or three drivers
41:58
and two or three crew chiefs they'd all be
41:59
sitting there talking right. I
42:01
mean I did this for over a decade myself and you
42:05
used to be walking through you want to chat you look
42:07
over there's three or four guys chatting right you
42:10
just go over and start chatting right and you talk
42:12
and you. Relive last night stories and what
42:15
this guy got into what that crew member did and
42:18
what's going on tomorrow and what what the you know
42:22
not necessarily all race and stuff just personal
42:26
stuff and things that going on in the world right. I
42:29
said Harry again Harry again would be our he was
42:32
like our court gesture right most of the time he
42:35
give you a quick story man we were some racetrack and
42:39
Harry was holding court and you know it'd be Harry
42:42
sitting in his chair and Michael was there. Kyle
42:45
was there. I was there and a couple
42:48
other guys and they got to talking about the work I
42:52
started doing these workout routines right to get in
42:55
shape and ever talk about going to the gym and doing
42:57
this step down and Harry says let me tell you all
42:59
boys which I need to do. You
43:00
need in and what got Harry is when they told him they
43:03
were paying people to do this stuff right Harry
43:06
couldn't understand that why are you going to give
43:08
somebody money to make you work. You
43:11
get you get paid to work right. The
43:14
greatest one of the great Harry getting stored. He
43:16
said, I think it was Michael he looked at in
43:19
all of us really he said Michael where you live in
43:22
the backyard he says you got a shovel. Michael
43:25
says yeah I got a shovel. He
43:26
said go get you some of that paint that marker
43:28
paint he said that they used to mark the ground
43:31
and the roads that orange stuff. He
43:33
said get you a tape measure. He
43:35
said make you a mark pull that tape measure 20 feet
43:37
down through there and run a straight line with that
43:39
paint. Go over two feet with a line
43:42
come back 20 feet with a line and come over. So
43:45
basically you've made a 20 by two square in the
43:48
ground right now take your shovel. Measure
43:51
up set the shovel on the ground measure up two feet
43:55
and put you some duct tape around the handle where you
43:58
do two feet is take that shovel and dig down two
44:01
feet right there. Inside of that mark so you get
44:04
to that mark on your shovel two feet. He
44:06
said dig across he said go all the way down that 20
44:10
foot long patch and dig a two foot of dirt out two
44:14
foot wide 20 feet long. He said when you get done
44:18
down there start on that end and start putting that
44:20
dirt back and when you get done on this end. He
44:25
says you're either going to be dead or you'll never go
44:29
to a other workout gym in your life. That's
44:31
all the workouts you gotta have. Right.
44:34
That was a hairy get workout routine and he you
44:37
know and he's right you ever try to dig a hole
44:38
you dig a hole. It's hard to do that you will
44:41
get in shape digging a hole but that was the kind
44:43
of wisdom that we had as drivers to get from these
44:48
guys. Right. Do you do you think so
44:52
you mentioned the sponsors do you think the reason
44:54
the guys are more buttoned up these days is because
44:57
of the sponsors. I'm just thinking because look
45:00
I think we both agree there's there's things
45:02
clearly you wouldn't want a driver to do that. That's
45:04
OK. That's that's a bad look but if
45:06
you're talking about a guy who likes to drink a
45:08
little bit maybe smoke some cigarettes if he's a single
45:10
guy and he likes some ladies. I
45:12
just I feel like I feel like we're missing some of
45:15
that and that's why to me my favorite drivers and
45:20
then I'm also kind of in the content business so I'm
45:22
not going to lie like the controversy is good for
45:25
business but to me Denny Hamlin like him or not
45:27
he's interesting Kyle Bush like him or not he's
45:30
interesting they say interesting things they make
45:33
you laugh and I feel like that's why your generation
45:36
is so beloved and do you think we've lost that is
45:40
it because of corporate America and the sponsors.
45:42
Is there something else that
45:43
I'm missing or what. No I think it's buttoned up
45:45
corporates. I think it's corporate
45:46
buttoned up. I truly think that's the
45:49
driving force behind all this is like like Jimmy
45:52
Johnson man Jimmy Johnson. I
45:53
love Jimmy. He's my friend. He's
45:56
definitely was the top drivers that ever drove in
45:58
our sport. Right. And you know but Jimmy and
46:01
he makes it all those years he was he was born
46:04
or sport but leading to cut the TV on an Air
46:06
Force 48 car a half lap ahead. Right.
46:08
We saw that for years and then he would get out and
46:10
do do his corporate status and what he's supposed to
46:13
do you know and Jimmy towards the latter part you
46:16
know the writer started picking up on that right
46:19
about that with Jimmy with Jimmy. Jimmy
46:22
then did that deal you know and he got on a golf
46:24
cart and grew a beard. He was drinking on a golf
46:28
cart and wrecked a golf cart. Remember
46:29
all that so the media played that up a good
46:32
little bit. But you know to me that stuff
46:36
has to be that was almost like it was made. You
46:40
know what I mean it's not a natural thing. Right.
46:43
Yeah. Not organic. Not
46:44
organic and I'm not I'm not knocking Jimmy of
46:47
course I love him. I think he's a great guy. I
46:49
think if everybody knew Jimmy the way we all know
46:51
him it'd be a different take on but that image of
46:55
Jimmy with the fans that's that was the take a
46:59
buttoned up born personality. Right.
47:02
Like a bat kinship like those guys. You
47:04
know I think about that a lot. Now
47:07
look at that a lot. And I'm like well man how do
47:09
we how do we do this because we have
47:11
personalities. I mean like with any doing
47:13
his thing and Kyle doing his thing what they're
47:15
doing I guarantee you they're pushing the
47:17
boundaries. You know what I mean they're
47:19
pushing the bandage. I remember when Shay when
47:21
Trump was running for president the first time
47:24
you know Bill and Chase he was in Atlanta somewhere
47:26
and Bill and Chase went on stage at one of the
47:28
rallies and you know said who got Trump or whatever.
47:31
Well you know that caused more
47:36
uproar with his alliance with partners. Right.
47:41
Then probably anything you could have done. And
47:46
I often think about that back in our day. You
47:49
know if we'd have done that. I
47:51
don't think it'd have been that big a deal. You
47:52
know what I mean. Yeah. He's supporting a political
47:55
deal. Hey dude I remember Bill
47:57
Clinton ran. We were darlings and when he
48:00
ran the first time and running against old man
48:04
Bush and we're all right there on Pit Road getting
48:08
ready to get in our cars. Somebody
48:11
says here comes that Clinton guy that's running
48:13
for president. I look down and sure enough
48:15
I see him and his entourage at the low in
48:17
the pit road coming up. Well
48:19
I had been explained to me not to be catched by self
48:23
in any pictures with this political candidate. Okay.
48:30
So I jump across the wall and I get behind the
48:33
toolbox stand there and I look over here. Here's
48:36
that's Terry Lubani. I look over here. Here's
48:38
that's Kyle Petty. Right. And I look and Clinton
48:42
comes up through there. The only two people out there
48:44
were Morgan Shepherd and Mark Martin. But
48:47
Mark had just did a deal. They
48:49
just did an ad campaign with Mark Martin for Mark
48:52
and Saul because he's from Mark Saul Clinton from Mark
48:54
and Saul. They had did a deal together.
48:56
So he met Mr. Clinton
48:58
and Morgan was out there. He
48:59
met him. But dude here's here's the
49:01
tape. These people in the grandstand
49:03
and they don't even know Clinton. How
49:05
did he know him? I didn't know who he was.
49:07
They were throwing stuff. The
49:09
grandstands they were throwing stuff over that
49:12
fence out on the racetrack trying to get stuff to
49:15
this Clinton guy. And I remember thinking to
49:21
myself if this guy gets elected he's going to cut
49:24
out racist. Racist is going to be gone. You
49:26
know what I mean? Because he did not have a warm
49:28
reception at this place. But
49:31
I don't know what the hell that has to do with what
49:33
we're talking about. Well you know what? Okay.
49:36
It's funny you bring that up. And
49:38
you know I'm not trying to turn this into a political
49:40
podcast. But you know you mentioned
49:42
that. I'm wondering because Clinton is
49:44
from Arkansas. Go back to Jimmy Carter is
49:48
from Georgia. Now obviously they're Democrats
49:50
but I'm curious because now we all know if a Democrat
49:54
president were to go to a racetrack they're going to
49:55
get booed. If a Republican goes they're
49:57
going to get cheered. It sounds like because Clinton
49:59
was 30 plus years ago. So has that kind of always
50:02
been the case unfortunately? Or
50:04
was there more decorum 40, 50 years ago where you
50:06
could just applaud either side? I
50:08
think it was. But for some reason in the
50:11
garage area man it's like races and everything else.
50:14
So the garage area we didn't
50:15
care. We didn't. We
50:17
were just trying to do our thing and win the race.
50:21
You know anything that went on
50:23
politically or whatnot that came down from somewhere
50:26
above us. We were aware of or had to
50:29
deal with. You know I was taught well
50:32
with Skull. I mean we had you know Skull
50:34
was fighting the tobacco deal with the government.
50:36
But you know and we had to be
50:39
very careful with Skull. I mean like me I couldn't
50:43
get what when I do an interview I couldn't thank
50:45
my Skull. I couldn't thank Skull. Ever?
50:48
I was told you can't say the word Skull. The
50:52
time I got there they used to do it. You
50:54
know when I got there in 92 as a Skull driver that
50:57
was one of the things they told me. You
50:58
know when you do an interview you don't thank
50:59
Skull. I mean we couldn't sell
51:01
merchandise. We couldn't sell anything. Any
51:04
kids stuff. Any cars. Any
51:06
of that stuff. You couldn't sell to anybody
51:08
under 18 years of age. And I remember one time they
51:12
sent we got forewarned they were sending an
51:15
investigative reporter to Talladega and he was on
51:18
the anti -tabacco side. He may have been he was
51:21
working for a lobbyist or some lobbyist firm up there
51:23
was trying to get rid of the back of it and they
51:25
sent this guy and we were forewarned about this guy.
51:28
And sure enough Talladega he
51:30
walks up to me. He says Mr. Bass
51:33
I'm so and so we'll talk to you. I
51:34
said all right. And one of the first questions
51:37
out of his mouth was if I get if I get this right.
51:40
Are you do you feel threatened
51:45
or offended when you're on or threatened when you're
51:50
on that racetrack. And he said your sponsor is
51:53
Skull and you got another Skull car out there. Do
51:56
you feel that you're threatened. You're
51:58
threatened. You're threatened by or you're
52:01
threatening people. You know that you're well
52:03
-fertile. Do you feel scared about that.
52:06
I said yeah yeah I do. And
52:09
he started writing. I said just like that car
52:12
about that time Michael Walter goes by the country
52:14
time car right. He goes by see that guy right
52:16
there. See a country time on that
52:18
car. He said yeah. I
52:20
said that's Michael Walter driving that car. I
52:21
said he scares me to death every time I get around
52:24
him out there. I'm threatened to death. You
52:26
know and I'm something to look at that country time.
52:28
I'm like man I am threatened
52:29
and about that time if somebody else come by. I
52:31
said I'm threatened by that right there. I
52:33
did like three or four like that in a row. His
52:35
cars come by and threatened to have the world. Whatever
52:38
the word he yeah. He looked at me just turned
52:42
around and walked away. He was getting anything out of
52:46
Rick Nass. So you know the political
52:49
thing you know there's always politics in that and
52:52
then you go to national politics. I'm
52:55
telling you dude we just didn't we just didn't worry
52:59
about that stuff. Yeah. Think about it. Was
53:02
it prominent. You know what I mean. I'll
53:06
go to racism racism. I mean in the 80s I guess
53:12
and looking back I never even dawned on me to have
53:14
this all stuff come up with started racism crap
53:16
started with going on with what was going on with Bob
53:19
and all that. I went back and somebody
53:21
showed me a picture one day and I had to go back
53:22
and I remember all this. I had in the 80s running up
53:26
and down the East Coast with a bus grand national
53:28
car right. And I mean that's just as blue
53:30
collars you're going to be in those days. Rough
53:32
pretty rough and double and that's where I learned my
53:35
trade. I had two black guys on my
53:38
crew Paul and Pee Wee. Right.
53:40
And it was never it was never a thought with me
53:46
that I got two black guys. It
53:48
was never thought with anybody within my team.
53:52
These two black guys these long
53:54
two black guys in the garage. I'm
53:56
sure with them maybe they felt it but they were
53:59
welcomed in our garage area from our fellow competitors
54:03
though differently than anybody in there. Right.
54:07
They will never any draw between marks. Everything
54:10
said because we were all doing the same thing. We're
54:13
all trying to take this bucket of boats and went
54:15
up Bush Grand National Race. Right.
54:16
And if we had help help we had people help us.
54:19
That's what we did and we would
54:21
help other teams other teams would help us. That's
54:23
the way it worked in those days. And
54:25
plus if anybody would have said anything about one of
54:29
my guys it wouldn't work because I had a big pit
54:31
crew and they're very very low. You
54:33
know it wouldn't be fun for whoever would make a
54:35
drawing mark. Right. And then I watch it and
54:39
then I think I think all through the 90s all the
54:41
times in the cup deal. You know I can't tell you
54:45
what's going on in grandstands. I
54:47
can't tell you the feelings or what's been said. But
54:50
I can tell you what's going on in that garage
54:51
area as far as racism thing goes. Right.
54:54
And it just it wasn't it wasn't it wasn't good or
54:57
bad. It just wasn't even a thought.
54:58
Yeah. You follow what I'm saying.
55:00
It just wasn't you know if
55:01
you come in if you're black and you come in
55:03
you're on the team would it be there. Yeah
55:04
fine. Did you maybe be able to do
55:06
what you want to do. You better be able to work.
55:07
You like everybody else. You
55:09
know it's just I don't know it's weird. It's
55:11
a weird. I think our sport and I've
55:14
always. This is me off. You
55:16
need to start doing a segment each week. What's
55:18
pissed Rick off this week. I
55:19
love it. But it always pissed me off as
55:22
us being categorized as a racist sport. Right.
55:26
Again I cannot speak for the for the fans. I'm
55:30
not out there every week. But
55:32
I could speak to the hierarchy. I
55:35
could speak to that garage area which encompasses
55:38
everybody in our sport from the working side. It's
55:41
just it's not there. It's just it's not good. It's
55:46
not bad. It's just it's not prevalent.
55:47
You know it's not it may be
55:50
the stuff that I'll be more pro trying to help
55:53
you know trying to help this stuff. I
55:55
get that but man it just always pissed me off when
55:59
people would categorize us as that you know because
56:01
it's it just it was unfair. It's
56:03
still unfair. It's not true. And
56:06
you mentioned the Skoll thing. I've
56:08
always thought this is pretty hypocritical and
56:10
we've talked about this on our radio show to me. You
56:13
know if these things are legal and you could spin
56:16
it now to you know legalize marijuana but I've
56:19
always thought it's weird with NASCAR that you can
56:21
have kind of the alcohol everywhere but not the
56:24
tobacco and this is not a critique on any of that to
56:30
me if you want to drink or not if you want to
56:32
smoke or not if you want to smoke marijuana now it's
56:34
legal but it's not legal. It
56:35
was always odd to me that they kind of got rid of
56:37
the tobacco but they kept the alcohol and to me you
56:40
know it's a free country do what you want. I
56:43
think we all agree you should do most of the
56:44
stuff in moderation but I always thought it was weird
56:46
that OK alcohol can be everywhere but the tobacco
56:49
can anymore. Yeah and it really and again
56:53
that comes from the federal government. I
56:54
mean that was a deal. Oh what was that guy's name.
56:58
He was a senator from
56:59
California. I used to hate him. He
57:01
had to be the eyes and thick glasses and I had a
57:04
few bunch of mustache thing going. He
57:06
was proposed. He's the one that got behind
57:08
all this stuff and drove this years and years ago.
57:11
I can't remember his name.
57:12
I'm going to look it up right
57:13
now. Yeah but he's the one that
57:14
drove it and he he was basically his baby right.
57:20
He got he got the lobbyist
57:22
behind him and of course the back end she had big
57:24
lobbyist man. It was strong. It
57:26
really was but you know they just got they got the
57:29
government. This guy got everybody behind
57:32
him. You know soon as for disease
57:34
and all the medical institutions and all. I
57:37
mean it's proven what tobacco does. We
57:38
all know that's bad for you but but to to take it
57:42
to the extreme of not being able to be in the
57:45
sport. I'm with you on that one. I
57:48
just I didn't ever think I never felt that that was.
57:52
I don't know if you want to
57:53
go this far but constitutionally if that was
57:55
really constitutional and it can do that. Right.
57:58
I mean where do you draw the line. You
58:00
know. It's kind of like a horse.
58:02
Where do you draw the line. Is
58:04
it a baby at five weeks is a baby at six months
58:06
right. You know with tobacco and
58:09
alcohol. I mean work you know. Country
58:11
time has that was that's bad stuff in it. You
58:14
know that they found figured out was bad for. I
58:17
mean all products. I'll be a sucrose or the sugar
58:20
whatever it's called. Yeah that stuff is fake sugar.
58:22
Expert team. That's
58:23
it. That's it. Yeah.
58:25
So I mean these products all these things have these
58:27
products in them and I you know but that that the
58:30
biggest thing was skull and went with me. It
58:32
just became political. You know once it became
58:34
political. You know it was over. It
58:36
was a national political thing. It
58:38
was over. You know so. So.
58:41
Some of the same people up there in DC were also the
58:45
ones that that made us or behind rather put the stop
58:49
to doing the flowers at the racetracks. Right.
58:53
You're some of the same group of people. You
58:55
know. It was it was it was it was
58:59
it Nicholas Petrus Petrus. Okay.
59:02
Let's say what somebody I tried to look it up
59:04
somebody here that's watching they're going to
59:06
they're going to comment in the comments and let us
59:07
know that what do you you call them a BDI. Yeah
59:11
BDI got here. The little bus that's been
59:14
going. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah
59:17
he was. I don't remember what side he
59:20
was on. Yeah I do too but it was not
59:22
it was I don't know I just stayed pissed off that
59:25
guy for a long time because I knew what it was
59:27
doing there sport and he was he was one ramrod that
59:30
getting it running down everybody's throats and
59:32
something like that what you get going politically
59:34
with it get enough people behind you DC that it's
59:37
over with right. Yeah so you mentioned flyovers.
59:41
So for a while they they were
59:42
not allowed in NASCAR. Oh yeah. If
59:45
you look now you don't get flowers like you when they
59:48
cut that out they they. It was some senator in
59:53
Wisconsin or somebody or somewhere was fussing about.
59:58
taxpayer money being used to fly
1:00:00
these frigate jets over these race tracks. Right.
1:00:03
And I can't remember his name and he started this
1:00:07
thing and even it even got to some of the
1:00:10
appropriations things. On Capitol Hill because
1:00:14
military you know going doing their budget right or
1:00:17
he'll give you this budget because you waste the money
1:00:20
flying over race tracks. I mean that's how far the
1:00:23
stupid thing got. Right. So they had to stop. They
1:00:26
just stopped going flyovers and if you notice for
1:00:29
years you'd be local guys flying it'd be either old
1:00:33
B 52s or the old bombers and old smoke planes. You
1:00:37
know what I mean. And that still goes on a lot.
1:00:39
I've noticed I probably shouldn't
1:00:41
be saying this on here because they're sneaking
1:00:43
these flyovers back in. Yeah.
1:00:45
And over the last couple of years I've noticed that
1:00:47
that I probably shouldn't be running my mouth because
1:00:49
it's open this thing back up for these people to
1:00:52
come back and attack us again. Right.
1:00:54
No more flyovers. You know but those types of
1:00:58
things man and just used to hurt me just leave us
1:01:01
alone. We're providing great entertainment
1:01:03
for millions of people. We're
1:01:05
very patriotic. This all just fits into
1:01:08
everything we do. The fans love when the planes
1:01:11
of jets and fly over everybody loves that. Right.
1:01:14
It's just part of the show. Yes.
1:01:16
Part of it's part of I mean yeah we pay all our
1:01:19
taxes for the military to protect us but you know
1:01:22
why can't we have them doing this. You
1:01:25
know it's it's by you. It's
1:01:27
by you. If you go to any Air Force
1:01:29
base or anywhere around and watch the planes flying all
1:01:31
the time and all the fuel they're burning you know
1:01:34
fly it over Martin'sville Speedway from Fort Bragg.
1:01:37
It takes 15 minutes to get
1:01:38
there. No no it's not a big deal.
1:01:41
It's all political bull crap.
1:01:43
Yeah I mean and also I would
1:01:45
think it's it's good for recruitment to see some
1:01:47
cool planes if you're a kid looking up seeing the
1:01:50
planes fly over. I'm from Toledo Ohio. I
1:01:53
remember taking field trips to Wright Patterson Air
1:01:55
Force Base when we were in elementary school. That
1:01:57
was cool as hell. You got to think there's a lot
1:01:59
of kids who see some of this military stuff and go
1:02:02
hey maybe that's what I want to do someday.
1:02:04
Exactly. And these guys we'd always
1:02:05
welcome. They they would do the flyovers
1:02:07
and then they would be how did this how did it work
1:02:12
so many times these these these these flyboys would
1:02:16
be in our drivers meeting. Right.
1:02:18
They would they would come into our drivers meeting
1:02:20
before the two of you know drivers always two hours
1:02:25
before anyhow they would come in and we treat them
1:02:27
like dignitaries. They'd be recognized in the
1:02:29
drivers meeting you know then when it was over
1:02:31
they'd go to the base or whatever they fly over. Go
1:02:33
on you know and in fact I've got a buddy's in
1:02:36
National Guard. He did a flyover one time and
1:02:38
after after they did the flyover they landed they
1:02:41
came back in the track treated the VIP experience.
1:02:43
That's what we used to do with
1:02:45
these guys right nobody I don't guess pretty many
1:02:47
people knew that but these fly guys would come and
1:02:50
they would get the VIP treatment at the racetrack
1:02:53
you know beforehand or after the race or after
1:02:55
the flyover. So it was a good deal for
1:02:58
those guys too. I mean they're up there risk
1:03:00
their lives and them stupid things flying around good
1:03:03
Lord and to be able to recognize them and you know
1:03:06
just kind of thank them for what they do. It's
1:03:09
a cool deal but no you got some politics and no
1:03:12
if you spend their tax money for the scams. You
1:03:15
like to get a frigging life. God
1:03:17
almighty. I hear you stupid here here.
1:03:21
So okay we're over an hour
1:03:23
here you know we could we could go we could probably
1:03:25
go 90 minutes two hours every week and maybe maybe
1:03:27
we do let's let's keep this first one. You
1:03:30
know if you want to of course anything as we as
1:03:33
we end here that I didn't ask that you want to get
1:03:36
off your chest here. Yeah no well we need to dive
1:03:39
into this more later on but you know we just start
1:03:42
probably do we probably need to make a segment but
1:03:44
got Rick pissed off this week and we could probably
1:03:48
do one of those all the time top of my list right
1:03:50
now is words product. It's not a product it's frigging
1:03:58
racing. I think it's not a product
1:04:00
and the other one is pace. It's
1:04:05
replaced speed. I hate it. I
1:04:07
think juniors probably lead to charge on pace. But
1:04:10
I hate it. I just hate it. Yeah
1:04:12
we got a product on the racetrack. Yes
1:04:14
it is a product but it's frigging racing. Right
1:04:16
now as we go with this podcast you'll people pick
1:04:20
up on you there's a certain reason that our
1:04:23
that our sport just exploded in the 90s. There
1:04:27
are reasons that it has exploded and there are
1:04:30
reasons that some of that went away. And
1:04:33
as time as we go on with this podcast I'm going to
1:04:35
explain to you guys that everybody out there in
1:04:38
social media land what caused this explosion and
1:04:43
what caused us to kind of implode a little bit and
1:04:46
where we're at now right. And
1:04:49
along with this thing is this stupid name stupid
1:04:51
word called product. God I hear that. What
1:04:54
do that another time Mr. Producer.
1:04:57
I love it. You know it's funny how words
1:04:59
like that will tick you off and in the sports
1:05:02
realm. So growing up you'd always say
1:05:05
that guy had skills. He was skilled. And
1:05:08
then 20 years ago 15 years ago everybody started saying
1:05:11
no he has a skill set. He has a skill set. And
1:05:14
no it's just he has skills. You
1:05:16
know you're just you're adding words. Another
1:05:18
one. So I'm a big baseball guy.
1:05:19
Yeah. I played a little bit in
1:05:22
college. Wasn't that great. But
1:05:23
I noticed this when I was in college instead of
1:05:27
instead of taking swings and you hear analysts say
1:05:30
this now. They'll say no you took a pass.
1:05:33
You took good passes at the
1:05:34
ball. No no it's a swing. It's
1:05:36
not a pass. It's not football. It
1:05:37
is a swing. You're swinging the bat. That's
1:05:39
right. That's right. That's
1:05:41
exactly right. Mr. Producer Charlie. Love
1:05:44
it. Love it man. This
1:05:46
has been fun dude. We're going to have fun with
1:05:49
this and people are going to learn a lot of stuff.
1:05:50
People are going to find out
1:05:51
stuff they had no idea as this thing goes on for. Oh
1:05:54
I love it. You know what. We
1:05:56
can't dump it all in one shot. 100%. And
1:05:59
I didn't grow up a huge NASCAR fan. So
1:06:02
I've really got into NASCAR the last three years when
1:06:05
I've been doing this with Kenny. But
1:06:06
I'm telling you when I'm asking you some of these
1:06:08
questions I'm learning along with the audience. So
1:06:10
it's fantastic. Rick this was awesome. Episode
1:06:13
one. We're going to do it. We
1:06:15
tell people every week most weeks. You
1:06:17
know if there's a week you're on vacation. I'm
1:06:19
on vacation. People don't complain. Most
1:06:21
weeks we're going to do one. We're
1:06:22
going to do a lot of them and they're going to be
1:06:23
fantastic. This was awesome Rick. Appreciate
1:06:26
it. See you next week guys. Peace
1:06:28
out. All right. See
1:06:29
ya.