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SMNTY Classics: Marriage and Disability · Stuff Mom Never Told You

0:05
Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha. Welcome to Stuff I
0:07
Speaker 1: Never Told You production of I Heart Radio. And as
0:19
Speaker 1: this classic comes out, we are in the month of
0:22
Speaker 1: July twenty twenty five, which is Disability Pride Month, having
0:26
Speaker 1: to Net Disability Pride, and we're talking a lot about
0:29
Speaker 1: disability and marriage specifically here in the US. And that
0:34
Speaker 1: is an episode that we have done kind of recently,
0:38
Speaker 1: but we thought, you know, we've been talking about it
0:40
Speaker 1: so much and it's so relevant still to your conversation,
0:44
Speaker 1: why not bring it back. Yes, so please enjoy this
0:47
Speaker 1: classic episode. Hey, this is Annie and Samantha and Longo
0:56
Speaker 1: Stuff Never Told You, a production of iHeart Radio. And
1:08
Speaker 1: today we are doing a listener suggestion from Jude and
1:13
Speaker 1: we'll be reading Jude's message in a second about marriage
1:16
Speaker 1: and disability because it is Disability Pride Month and this
1:20
Speaker 1: is something I think a lot of people don't know about.
1:23
Speaker 1: You can see our recent episode on women in disability,
1:27
Speaker 1: past episodes on the ADA, the past episode we did
1:31
Speaker 1: with Invisible Disability with Eves. We've done a lot of
1:34
Speaker 1: stuff around this, but those are a few that came
1:36
Speaker 1: to my mind. Also, a note about terminology. I know
1:39
Speaker 1: I said this recently. There's not agreement currently on the
1:46
Speaker 1: quote correct way to say people with disabilities or disabled people.
1:52
Speaker 1: So just a note about that. A lot of people
1:54
Speaker 1: use them interchangeably. Some people have really strong opinions and
1:57
Speaker 1: they have great reasoning behind those opinions. We're probably going
2:01
Speaker 1: to use them based on what the articles we use
2:06
Speaker 1: use and also the people are using in context of
2:10
Speaker 1: what we're talking about. So just a note. Also a
2:13
Speaker 1: note we are not legal experts. No, we have never
2:18
Speaker 1: interacted with these services, and they're kind of complicated and
2:23
Speaker 1: I would argue purposely so which we're going to talk about.
2:27
Speaker 1: But note about that, and just a reminder the disabled
2:30
Speaker 1: community is the largest marginalized community in the world and
2:35
Speaker 1: a majority of us will experience a temporary disability at
2:39
Speaker 1: one point. All right, So just to reiterate from our
2:43
Speaker 1: recent Monday many on women in disability from the CDC quote,
2:47
Speaker 1: about thirty six million women in the US have disabilities
2:50
Speaker 1: and the numbers growing. About forty four percent of those
2:53
Speaker 1: aged sixty five years are older are living with the disability.
2:56
Speaker 1: The most common cause of disability for women is arthritis
2:59
Speaker 1: our rheumatism, and from now women with disabilities are particularly
3:04
Speaker 1: disadvantaged when it comes to wage equality. In twenty twenty two,
3:08
Speaker 1: women who are disabled me seventy two cents for every
3:11
Speaker 1: dollar paid to a man who is disabled. Compared to
3:14
Speaker 1: the non disabled community, women with disabilities made sixty eight
3:17
Speaker 1: cents to every dollar earned by able bodied men. If
3:20
Speaker 1: an individual from this community is seeking employment, The current
3:24
Speaker 1: hiring rate of women with disabilities between the ages of
3:26
Speaker 1: sixteen to sixty four stands at thirty seven percent. Throughout
3:30
Speaker 1: the employment process, women can face challenges ranging from organizational
3:34
Speaker 1: readiness and inclusivity to accessible employment processes and workplace inclusivity provisions,
3:41
Speaker 1: and of course, people of color and black people specifically
3:43
Speaker 1: are disproportionately impacted by all of this as well. Okay,
3:49
Speaker 1: so let us get on to this listener mail, so
3:53
Speaker 1: Jude wrote, I apologize if this has been covered in
3:56
Speaker 1: the past. Part of my disability is memory problems from
3:59
Speaker 1: ect medical treatment, and I apologize for not thinking of
4:02
Speaker 1: this before the month started, because I imagine you record
4:05
Speaker 1: a good chunk of episodes significantly in advance. But I
4:08
Speaker 1: hate the fact marriage equality does not exist for disabled people.
4:12
Speaker 1: I mean, while SSI is not ideal, if you am
4:15
Speaker 1: asked more than two thousand dollars in your bank account,
4:18
Speaker 1: they'll cut you off. There's a loophole called able accounts,
4:21
Speaker 1: but I do not know that much about these, though
4:23
Speaker 1: opening one is a goal of mine. It's basically all
4:26
Speaker 1: I got because I can't work a normal job. But
4:29
Speaker 1: part of it is you cannot get married, gay or
4:31
Speaker 1: straight without the risk of losing benefits. I've also heard
4:35
Speaker 1: if the government breaking couples apart, they understood they couldn't
4:38
Speaker 1: get married with this fact. It's not a happy topic,
4:42
Speaker 1: and I apologize for that, but I think it's a
4:44
Speaker 1: topic more people need to know about. I am on
4:46
Speaker 1: the asexual spectrum, but I'm not completely a romantic or anything.
4:49
Speaker 1: I would love to date someone someday, but I don't
4:52
Speaker 1: look forward to starting a conversation with Since I'm disabled,
4:55
Speaker 1: I legally can never marry you. If you're looking for
4:58
Speaker 1: that sort of thing, go elsewhere. So because of that,
5:01
Speaker 1: I've never tried dating. A few people have dated me
5:04
Speaker 1: in the sense of my oblivious ass not knowing it
5:06
Speaker 1: was a date until they said something. There's more I
5:09
Speaker 1: could say, like that my government health insurance doesn't cover
5:12
Speaker 1: gender affirming care. So while I am pursuing top surgery.
5:16
Speaker 1: I'm going to have to find another way to pay
5:18
Speaker 1: for it. If you know of a way for me
5:20
Speaker 1: to become a best selling author, you know where to
5:22
Speaker 1: find me. Lol. If I did, I would reach out immediately.
5:29
Speaker 2: And hopefully it would be with you.
5:30
Speaker 1: Hopefully we would be with you. Indeed, please buy her
5:36
Speaker 1: book available wherever you get your books, shameless plug.
5:42
Speaker 2: Thanks dude, that's so sad. I did not realize I was.
5:49
Speaker 2: I've heard many people talk about not getting married for
5:52
Speaker 2: several reasons like this does hurt my benefits for this
5:55
Speaker 2: through the dual income thing, But wow, this is a
5:57
Speaker 2: whole different level.
5:59
Speaker 1: Yes, I had only heard kind of anecdotally about it.
6:03
Speaker 1: I never researched into it. And so thank you very
6:06
Speaker 1: much Jude for sending this to us, because, like I said,
6:10
Speaker 1: I think a lot of people don't know about it.
6:11
Speaker 1: It's very important to talk about. And Jude also sent
6:15
Speaker 1: resources which we are going to be referencing throughout this
6:18
Speaker 1: And like I said, it is a bit of a
6:21
Speaker 1: complicated discussion because it involves a few walls and regulations.
6:25
Speaker 1: So we're going to break down some of the important
6:27
Speaker 1: ones first, all revolving around government benefits, largely federal government benefits.
6:34
Speaker 1: Social Security are otherwise that disabled people in the US
6:37
Speaker 1: can use based on their ability are not to work.
6:41
Speaker 1: Oh and just for fun, the rules aren't consistent, so
6:45
Speaker 1: that's fun. Yeah, But onwards.
6:48
Speaker 2: So this is one of the articles that you sent
6:51
Speaker 2: from the Disability Secrets by Bethany K. Lawrence. So one
6:55
Speaker 2: is Supplementary Security Income SSI for people with disabilities who
7:00
Speaker 2: have very low incomes and those who don't qualify for SSDI,
7:04
Speaker 2: And in twenty twenty four, the SSI income limit for
7:06
Speaker 2: one person is nine hundred and forty three dollars per
7:09
Speaker 2: month and for couples it is fourteen hundred and fifteen
7:11
Speaker 2: dollars a month. That is not a lot. Social Security
7:15
Speaker 2: Disability Insurance SSDI for eligible workers who can't work because
7:19
Speaker 2: of disability, Disabled adult child benefits which are based on
7:23
Speaker 2: your parents' earnings record, and surviving spouse benefits which are
7:27
Speaker 2: based on that record of your deceased spouse or ex spouse.
7:31
Speaker 1: Right, So those are some key terms we're going to
7:33
Speaker 1: be using throughout this. But when it comes to this
7:36
Speaker 1: question of marriage and how marriage impacts these benefits are doesn't,
7:41
Speaker 1: which is what we're specifically looking into We're going to
7:45
Speaker 1: go kind of piece by piece. So let's start with SSI,
7:50
Speaker 1: Supplemental Security Income, which is the most important in terms
7:54
Speaker 1: of this conversation. This was established about fifty years ago.
8:00
Speaker 1: Getting married doesn't impact eligibility for SSI, but the spouse's
8:07
Speaker 1: income does. So if the spouse in question has an
8:11
Speaker 1: income and you live with them, then that does impact
8:15
Speaker 1: those receiving SSI because the Social Security Administration or the
8:19
Speaker 1: s SA will pin some of the spouse's income to
8:22
Speaker 1: the person getting it.
8:24
Speaker 2: Right, And I'm pretty sure we'll probably talk about this,
8:26
Speaker 2: but this is also the conversation of like domestic violence
8:31
Speaker 2: being higher and abuse being higher within the disabled communities
8:35
Speaker 2: because of rules like this. Yeah, just as a reminder,
8:39
Speaker 2: this practice is called deeming spousal income. Basically, they quote
8:43
Speaker 2: deem that a portion of illegally married spouse spouse's income
8:46
Speaker 2: to the disabled person in question. They can essentially lower
8:49
Speaker 2: the SSI or make them ineligible entirely. And reminder, we
8:55
Speaker 2: pay taxes, yeah that go into this. That has been
9:00
Speaker 2: for military use, but not for people in our community.
9:03
Speaker 1: Again, reminder, it's also not limited to legal marriage either.
9:08
Speaker 1: It impacts those quote holding themselves out to be married.
9:13
Speaker 1: This very much confused me, but it essentially means you're
9:17
Speaker 1: presenting yourselves as married and or are essentially married, as
9:21
Speaker 1: we would traditionally judge it. Quote. If there's any evidence
9:25
Speaker 1: that either of you present yourselves to others as married,
9:28
Speaker 1: social security will probe further, asking questions such as, how
9:33
Speaker 1: do you introduce the other person in social situations? How
9:36
Speaker 1: is mail addressed to you and the other person? Do
9:39
Speaker 1: you still use your married name if applicable? Do you
9:42
Speaker 1: own your home jointly? If you rent, are both your
9:46
Speaker 1: names on the lease? Do your bills, bank accounts, and
9:50
Speaker 1: tax returns identify you as married? So the SSA could
9:56
Speaker 1: judge you're pretty much married. I'm guessing that they think
10:00
Speaker 1: you're trying to evade the rules by being married in
10:03
Speaker 1: all but documentation and lower or remove the benefits of SSI.
10:10
Speaker 1: We found a it's a really dry report from two
10:14
Speaker 1: thousand and three from the SSA about this, and it
10:18
Speaker 1: seemed to hilariously be like, Yep, it's better if you
10:21
Speaker 1: don't get married but are living together, but yeah, you
10:25
Speaker 1: can't hold out for marriage. They like saying the quiet
10:29
Speaker 1: part out loud.
10:31
Speaker 2: I mean I think there's a lot of people who
10:33
Speaker 2: have that conversation in general about legalities in marriage in general.
10:38
Speaker 2: And for those who do want to get married, that's
10:40
Speaker 2: so absurd. But for those who don't want to get married,
10:42
Speaker 2: they're like, I'm good with it. I'm one of those
10:43
Speaker 2: people from Disability Secrets. If you're living with someone but
10:47
Speaker 2: not married to that person and we're never married, social
10:50
Speaker 2: Security might count your roommate's income as if you were married.
10:55
Speaker 2: This could lower your SSI benefit or even make you
10:58
Speaker 2: ineligible for benefits. But if you're living with a sibling,
11:01
Speaker 2: a caregiver, or a platonic roommate, the SSA wouldn't consider
11:05
Speaker 2: the other person's income. If someone is getting free re
11:08
Speaker 2: low board from a person that're living with, this can
11:10
Speaker 2: cut their SSI buy one third. Yep.
11:16
Speaker 1: If both that's the people in question receive SSI, their
11:18
Speaker 1: payments are combined and lowered to the couple's rate, which
11:22
Speaker 1: is lower than twice the singles rate. So in other words,
11:27
Speaker 1: two single people together are getting more, but if you
11:31
Speaker 1: become a couple and you get the couple's rate, you're
11:33
Speaker 1: getting less.
11:34
Speaker 2: Just absurd.
11:35
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it has been called the marriage penalty. So
11:41
Speaker 1: This amounts to going from nine hundred and forty three
11:44
Speaker 1: dollars a month, which, as you said, Samantha, is very
11:46
Speaker 1: very low for a single person, to about seven hundred
11:49
Speaker 1: and seven dollars a person a month for a married
11:53
Speaker 1: couple if both are receiving SSI. This also impacts countable
11:58
Speaker 1: resources outside of a car, house, and household goods. This
12:03
Speaker 1: is reportedly because the SSA believes it's cheaper and easier
12:06
Speaker 1: living with another person, but it's basically saying, if you
12:12
Speaker 1: marry someone who is making forty thousand dollars a year,
12:14
Speaker 1: which is about the federal minimum wage, ish they make
12:18
Speaker 1: enough to take care of you completely, which is out
12:20
Speaker 1: of touch and wrong and no, sorry, I wish what
12:28
Speaker 1: And this isn't taking into account so many things, so
12:30
Speaker 1: many things like wage stagnation, the gender pay gap, childcare,
12:35
Speaker 1: numerous unpaid and unseen things that go into care or
12:39
Speaker 1: rent a, housing control, the difficulty of getting a disability
12:43
Speaker 1: friendly job, the difficulty of getting these benefits in the
12:45
Speaker 1: first place, the difficulty of understanding how they work, the
12:50
Speaker 1: paper work. I'm telling you. When I was researching this,
12:56
Speaker 1: my mind was like, oh my gosh, I'm so tired.
13:00
Speaker 2: The amount of people I've had to advise in social
13:03
Speaker 2: work to do their disability paperwork twice and to make
13:07
Speaker 2: sure that you appeal because you will most likely be
13:09
Speaker 2: denied immediately no matter what. Like my parents, who are
13:13
Speaker 2: very staunchly conservative and all like I don't want to
13:16
Speaker 2: take care of anybody else, they had to go for
13:19
Speaker 2: disability paperwork. They got denied and they were very upset
13:22
Speaker 2: because it's like, we would never take advantage of ma'am, ma'am.
13:27
Speaker 2: And me having to talk to them like you have
13:29
Speaker 2: to appeal. I don't think they did. I think they
13:31
Speaker 2: got discouraged and they didn't. I'm like, no, you have
13:34
Speaker 2: to appeal these paperwork because they are literally stacked against you.
13:38
Speaker 2: Any kind of paperwork when it comes to a federal
13:41
Speaker 2: government which for assistance for any of that are probably
13:44
Speaker 2: some of the most complicated paperwork I have ever seen.
13:47
Speaker 2: One of the best things that happened in my college
13:50
Speaker 2: course was us being given a full form and told
13:54
Speaker 2: do this as an assignment, and then coming back and
13:56
Speaker 2: realizing we'd all named mistakes and had to start over again,
13:58
Speaker 2: and that what that process looks like, and this is
14:01
Speaker 2: exactly what they do to try to discourage a person
14:03
Speaker 2: who is in need. So all of these things is
14:07
Speaker 2: such a way to hinder and discourage a person from
14:11
Speaker 2: getting actual assistance which they've probably probably already paid into,
14:16
Speaker 2: which is the other part that's like uh anyway. Also, yeah,
14:19
Speaker 2: with all that, children also factor into the equation here.
14:23
Speaker 2: Each child impacts the numbers in terms of when a
14:25
Speaker 2: spouse's income is attributed to the person receiving SSI.
14:29
Speaker 1: Yes, and speaking of complicated, so it's like a chart
14:33
Speaker 1: how many children you have, how much money you'll get
14:36
Speaker 1: or won't get. Basically, by getting married, a disabled person
14:40
Speaker 1: could receive less or none of the benefits they were
14:43
Speaker 1: receiving before. This can mean a huge difference in quality
14:46
Speaker 1: of life. Are even the difference between life or death,
14:51
Speaker 1: so it's a really big deal. The SSA requires that
14:55
Speaker 1: those receiving SSI contact them within ten days of marriag
15:00
Speaker 1: are new living arrangements. Otherwise they both charge an overpayment,
15:05
Speaker 1: which is usually collected by withholding SSI payments, And if
15:10
Speaker 1: anyone's dealt with stuff like this before, the interest rate
15:15
Speaker 1: if they choose to charge it can be outrageous And
15:20
Speaker 1: I feel ten days you're just so stressed during those times.
15:27
Speaker 1: I can easily see how that would fall through the cracks.
15:30
Speaker 2: Yeah, people don't even go and get their name change
15:33
Speaker 2: or get their status change. Some of them don't even
15:35
Speaker 2: go and get their marriage certificate and turned in. Like
15:39
Speaker 2: I know that it takes a long time. Women changing
15:41
Speaker 2: their last name. Oh my gosh, it's a damn process.
15:45
Speaker 2: So this, Yeah, it.
15:47
Speaker 1: Feels like you would have to with the mail being
15:50
Speaker 1: what it is, so you would have to mail it
15:52
Speaker 1: pretty much immediately right for it to rip in time, right.
15:57
Speaker 2: And they probably don't given you notice that tell you
15:59
Speaker 2: that you did that, because the IRA sure doesn't. So
16:02
Speaker 2: you're like, I don't know if it went in or not.
16:04
Speaker 2: I got I hope.
16:05
Speaker 1: So directors cross a situation.
16:08
Speaker 2: If they want to take home more money from me. Thanks.
16:20
Speaker 2: So here's a quote from nineteenth News. Qualifying for SSI
16:23
Speaker 2: is important even for people with significant disabilities who can work,
16:27
Speaker 2: because eligibility is tied to being able to receive home
16:29
Speaker 2: and community based services covered by Medicaid. In many states,
16:34
Speaker 2: Medicaid is the only health insurance that provides in home care,
16:38
Speaker 2: and the average cost ranges from fifty one thousand to
16:41
Speaker 2: seventy thousand per year. According to the Government Accountability Office,
16:45
Speaker 2: even most people making middle class income and salary jobs
16:48
Speaker 2: cannot afford the level of care out of pocket. And again,
16:52
Speaker 2: as someone who has experienced trying to get care for
16:54
Speaker 2: people and assistance for people, it is incredibly expensive amount
17:00
Speaker 2: of cost per hour, and they charge per hour, and
17:05
Speaker 2: it could be as simply and it's based on the provider.
17:08
Speaker 2: And by the way, it's the limited amount of people
17:10
Speaker 2: that are providers is so small that it's probably one
17:13
Speaker 2: of the most discouraging things I've ever seen in my
17:15
Speaker 2: life because the likelihood that these people are qualified for
17:17
Speaker 2: very specific things are low to zero. I've never been
17:22
Speaker 2: more frustrated in my life than trying to get accessible
17:25
Speaker 2: care for those who are desperately in need who are
17:28
Speaker 2: on Medicaid. And y'all, to get on Medicaid, you have
17:31
Speaker 2: to be in the poverty level essentially, which is also
17:34
Speaker 2: another problem because you want to live and free yourself.
17:38
Speaker 2: So there's so many complications to this, and if you
17:40
Speaker 2: get too much assistance, by the way, it can stack
17:42
Speaker 2: against you. Yes, so much of this So just getting
17:46
Speaker 2: that I can't imagine, because in home camera is probably
17:51
Speaker 2: one of the most expensive ways outside of being in
17:55
Speaker 2: an institution that is actually qualified with true amount of
18:01
Speaker 2: medical professionals who can actually cater to their clientele. So
18:06
Speaker 2: what I mean by that is like having one doctor
18:08
Speaker 2: of per three patients, is that of one doctor per
18:10
Speaker 2: one hundred patients type of thing. So it's incredibly difficult.
18:15
Speaker 2: And the amount of people who the good ones who
18:19
Speaker 2: stop providing services for Medicaid because they've had, god, had
18:22
Speaker 2: so many run arounds with the government and not being
18:25
Speaker 2: able to do that for them for people, as you
18:29
Speaker 2: can tell, I could keep going, but it's one of
18:31
Speaker 2: the most frustrating, disheartening and honestly, it does feel like
18:34
Speaker 2: it's a bit of eugenics within the government when it
18:37
Speaker 2: comes to stuff like this.
18:39
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, we'll touch on that more briefly in a second.
18:43
Speaker 1: But this has been continues to be a big point
18:46
Speaker 1: of conversation because we have people in government that are
18:50
Speaker 1: seeing things like I understand, I can go days without
18:54
Speaker 1: this necessary piece of life. I don't know why we
18:58
Speaker 1: have to.
19:00
Speaker 2: It's not like I go back to my regular life
19:02
Speaker 2: after the one day I tried to see what this
19:04
Speaker 2: felt like.
19:05
Speaker 1: Right, Oh makes me mad? And yeah, like you're saying
19:10
Speaker 1: those those home care hours are huge, and there's so
19:13
Speaker 1: many it's so important, and in many cases it's about
19:17
Speaker 1: like human dignity and the cost of losing that and
19:23
Speaker 1: the cost of providing that. And on top of this,
19:24
Speaker 1: we need to have another conversation about how we pay
19:26
Speaker 1: workers for doing this, because there is a reason there's
19:31
Speaker 1: so much burnout and it's not compensated or respected like
19:37
Speaker 1: it should.
19:37
Speaker 2: Be, you know, as in fact, most of the times
19:40
Speaker 2: that the workers are there, they're unqualified. And I don't
19:44
Speaker 2: see that as I'm not saying that as a slap
19:47
Speaker 2: to those who are in there in the field. What
19:49
Speaker 2: I'm talking about is in general, they're so unwilling to
19:52
Speaker 2: pay the people that what they're worth that they're willing
19:54
Speaker 2: to hire people who are not qualified to do it.
19:57
Speaker 2: So maybe have one or two like ten hour courses
20:01
Speaker 2: and then they come in as an assistant without like
20:05
Speaker 2: any conversations. Like I've had friends who would do part
20:08
Speaker 2: time jobs as college students being pair of pros, so
20:11
Speaker 2: they assist those with disabilities in schools and try to
20:14
Speaker 2: be like active advocates and all that, but they're not
20:18
Speaker 2: really qualified. They're just sometimes college students who just need
20:21
Speaker 2: extra money, which means they're not giving the care. Not
20:25
Speaker 2: not everyone, because there are those who really do care
20:27
Speaker 2: and love their job and love the people they're representing.
20:29
Speaker 2: So not saying that, but the qualifications are so low
20:32
Speaker 2: that any almost anyone can do it. So it's kind
20:34
Speaker 2: of like, is this really helping? Are you just throwing,
20:38
Speaker 2: like you know, a band aid over a huge gap
20:40
Speaker 2: of needs, And which is also often why a lot
20:42
Speaker 2: of the kids in the system that have any type
20:44
Speaker 2: of disabilities, learning disabilities, any of that, are left behind
20:47
Speaker 2: because again, no one is really qualified to represent them
20:51
Speaker 2: and advocate for them, and they don't know how. That's
20:54
Speaker 2: that other conversations like the parents don't know how, so
20:57
Speaker 2: the pair of pros definitely don't know how oftentimes, So
21:00
Speaker 2: I say this with like having seeing that and then
21:05
Speaker 2: although imposing all these things on top of that and
21:07
Speaker 2: not allowing for people with disabilities to have the life
21:11
Speaker 2: that they want. It's just such an odd thing. And
21:14
Speaker 2: so having these workers who are not qualified because they
21:17
Speaker 2: don't care enough to teach and or give them the
21:19
Speaker 2: qualifications that they need, and then the ones that are
21:22
Speaker 2: so good at it, and the ones who are caring
21:24
Speaker 2: and the ones who do go beyond to learn about it,
21:27
Speaker 2: are burned out, like you said, and it's all literal
21:29
Speaker 2: minimum wage because that's the only the most maybe is
21:33
Speaker 2: like twelve dollars an hour. And this is for the
21:37
Speaker 2: sake of someone else's livelihood, Like it's like question mark.
21:41
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, a lot of big question marks in this one.
21:47
Speaker 1: So that is SSI. Let us talk about SSDI or
21:53
Speaker 1: Social Security Disability Insurance. Okay, So, if someone has worked
21:57
Speaker 1: long enough to qualify for SSDI, getting married shouldn't affect
22:03
Speaker 1: There are their spouse's benefit payments. There aren't income limits,
22:08
Speaker 1: There aren't property limits like there are with SSI. Now,
22:12
Speaker 1: if someone gets both SSDI and SSI, that can change
22:16
Speaker 1: the answer that being said. If a person is collecting
22:20
Speaker 1: SSDI from someone else based on their work, marrying or
22:25
Speaker 1: other things can impact the benefit amount. So here are
22:29
Speaker 1: a couple of common examples of that. An adult child
22:33
Speaker 1: receiving benefits from their parents SSDI based on their parents
22:37
Speaker 1: work record will probably lose the SSDI benefits. By getting married.
22:42
Speaker 1: Children can lose their parents SSDI dependence benefits based on
22:46
Speaker 1: a couple of things, including turning eighteen or nineteen depending
22:49
Speaker 1: or getting married. Another big example, widowers are eligible for
22:54
Speaker 1: receiving their partners SSDI if they were eligible. However, if
22:59
Speaker 1: you're young longer than sixty, are younger than fifty and
23:03
Speaker 1: don't have a disability, and you remarry those benefits, stop,
23:07
Speaker 1: which I think again is ridiculous because yeah, like you said,
23:13
Speaker 1: you put work and money into this, Like wow, okay,
23:16
Speaker 1: it goes away right all right? And just to note here,
23:22
Speaker 1: I know we joke about it on the show. You
23:23
Speaker 1: can hear it in our voices because we laugh when
23:26
Speaker 1: we feel helpless. Our healthcare system in the US is
23:30
Speaker 1: a mess at best at best. And this isn't to
23:35
Speaker 1: say there aren't amazing people working in it, working to
23:38
Speaker 1: change it. We've heard from some of you, we know
23:40
Speaker 1: some of you, and you're amazing, and you do so
23:43
Speaker 1: much in the face of so much. But in this case,
23:46
Speaker 1: what we're talking about specifically here is some of the
23:50
Speaker 1: routine medications and procedures or visits for people receiving SSI
23:54
Speaker 1: or SSDI are thousands, if not tens of thousands of
23:58
Speaker 1: dollars a month. And we know all about private insurance
24:02
Speaker 1: and how they try to get around covering people with
24:04
Speaker 1: pre existing conditions, legal or not. It's not supposed to
24:07
Speaker 1: be legal, but I feel like they still get away
24:10
Speaker 1: with it. And this includes a spouse's insurance, which seems
24:13
Speaker 1: to be a big part of what underpins this marriage penalty.
24:16
Speaker 1: Which we also know if you're depending on your spouse's
24:19
Speaker 1: private insurance, that that can look pretty grim as well.
24:25
Speaker 1: So it's really really expensive ultimately, as what I'm saying,
24:32
Speaker 1: and most of us, I would say almost all of
24:35
Speaker 1: us couldn't afford it. So Jude also sent us an
24:40
Speaker 1: NPR story from twenty twenty two called millions of disabled
24:43
Speaker 1: Americans could lose federal benefits if they get married, by
24:47
Speaker 1: Erica Mahoney that, in very MPR fashion, has a very
24:50
Speaker 1: specific personal story while also telling like a much larger
24:54
Speaker 1: story in it, Mahoney interviews Congressman Jimmy Panetta of California,
24:59
Speaker 1: who had recently introduced the Marriage Equality for Disabled Built
25:03
Speaker 1: Act in the US House of Representatives. Other states like
25:06
Speaker 1: Ohio and Louisiana fallis suit. I feel like all of
25:10
Speaker 1: them have been stalled. But please let me know if
25:14
Speaker 1: that's not true, and they dive into how these laws
25:18
Speaker 1: and rules were written. It was just assumed people with
25:20
Speaker 1: disabilities wouldn't get married, which is an incredibly ablest idea
25:24
Speaker 1: that we've talked about before and also holds the kind
25:30
Speaker 1: of infantilizing and desexualizing of people with disabilities within it,
25:34
Speaker 1: but also a long history of violence and control. It's
25:39
Speaker 1: also true the idea used to be that one person,
25:43
Speaker 1: the man in a very heterosexual sense, was the breadwinner
25:47
Speaker 1: who took care of the wife, who did all the housekeeping.
25:50
Speaker 1: This is no longer the case and really not possible
25:54
Speaker 1: for a lot of people. Almost everyone I know that's
25:57
Speaker 1: in a couple can only exist based on dual income.
26:02
Speaker 1: It's just really antiquated. And yes, we need to address
26:05
Speaker 1: why single income homes are so unrealistic now too, and
26:09
Speaker 1: pay people who take care of kids. Having kids is.
26:12
Speaker 2: Expensive, right, I think it's just such a weird fault
26:16
Speaker 2: of like again in a world where our country specifically
26:20
Speaker 2: is like we need to care for the children, but
26:22
Speaker 2: not really few and you take it on your own.
26:24
Speaker 2: You're on your own. It's gotten like this level of
26:29
Speaker 2: disconnect where you think, well, now they have children, and
26:32
Speaker 2: you're pushes for more children to be born because that's
26:35
Speaker 2: your thing. Apparently, how are you going to help?
26:38
Speaker 1: Yeah, And there's like so many things that we've talked
26:43
Speaker 1: about very briefly or mentioned very briefly in this that
26:46
Speaker 1: I'm like, well, at the very least, you could do
26:49
Speaker 1: something to raise the like our pay what we get.
26:54
Speaker 1: You could do something to prevent housing and rent going wild.
27:00
Speaker 1: They're like so many small things.
27:02
Speaker 2: How about what you can do We save the environment
27:05
Speaker 2: and help the environment so our children don't grow into
27:08
Speaker 2: this horrible, horrible healthscape with no access to anything because
27:11
Speaker 2: you know, beaches are being closed off because of bacteria
27:14
Speaker 2: that's growing because of climate change and pollution. We can
27:18
Speaker 2: do about that, y'all. But yeah, on top of that,
27:20
Speaker 2: if every child is special and unique and has all
27:24
Speaker 2: these things, then we need to treat each child as
27:27
Speaker 2: a special case and provide exactly what is needed, including
27:31
Speaker 2: whatever medical care they need, and without grumbling and without
27:36
Speaker 2: fighting and without overcharging. Mm hmmm, that would be awesome too.
27:41
Speaker 2: And here and just like one more reminder here, disability
27:45
Speaker 2: in this country is expensive and very very expensive. Another
27:51
Speaker 2: story we read estimated that without Medicaid provided through SSI,
27:56
Speaker 2: the person in question would have to pay one hundred
27:58
Speaker 2: thousand to two hundred thousand a year for in home business. Yeah,
28:01
Speaker 2: that's the number. I was looking for, honestly, because fifty
28:05
Speaker 2: to seventy with medicaid is pretty generous. I think even
28:10
Speaker 2: with Medicaid it would probably hit to the one hundred
28:12
Speaker 2: thousand grand a year, especially if it's like in home care,
28:17
Speaker 2: consistent in home care.
28:21
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it depends on so many factors too, but
28:26
Speaker 1: it's expensive that we can say for sure. And going
28:40
Speaker 1: back to another point that you mentioned, Samantha, another part
28:45
Speaker 1: of this whole thing is this overblown and politicized fear
28:51
Speaker 1: of fraud that people are essentially trying to gain the
28:54
Speaker 1: system and that people with disabilities are lazy and aren't trustworthy,
28:59
Speaker 1: not worthy. Honestly, and not only is that completely wrong,
29:04
Speaker 1: it was clear and doing this research, as I said,
29:06
Speaker 1: how difficult every step of this is, from getting the
29:10
Speaker 1: benefits to proving that you need them, to keeping them right.
29:13
Speaker 2: Just as a reminder, to lose disability, it doesn't pay anything, literally,
29:17
Speaker 2: like you have to be so on top of everything
29:21
Speaker 2: that you may not even get a notice that you're
29:23
Speaker 2: about to be dropped.
29:24
Speaker 1: Yes, there have been a lot of news stories about
29:26
Speaker 1: that lately. Here's a quote from Forbes. As disability scholar
29:30
Speaker 1: Ari Niemann recently noted In a New York Times article
29:33
Speaker 1: on how benefits are confusing by design, the sheer complexity
29:36
Speaker 1: of these different rules are, like most disability benefits rules,
29:40
Speaker 1: kafka esque, Intentionally or not, they further penalize people who
29:45
Speaker 1: have less access to accurate information and less ability to
29:48
Speaker 1: strategically plan out their finances and legal arrangements. Because obviously,
29:52
Speaker 1: if you know about these penalties ahead of time, you
29:54
Speaker 1: can avoid them by simply not getting married. It's a
29:59
Speaker 1: terrible position and a gut wrenching decision, as anyone who
30:02
Speaker 1: is married or has wanted to marry well knows. But
30:05
Speaker 1: the penalty itself and the supposed savings to the taxpayer
30:09
Speaker 1: is easily avoided. But it's also easily triggered if the
30:13
Speaker 1: people involved don't know about it, or if they get
30:15
Speaker 1: bad advice about it. In a sense, the government hopes
30:19
Speaker 1: in part to save money by disabled people accidentally triggering
30:23
Speaker 1: these benefits reductions.
30:26
Speaker 2: Right again, a guy actor. But they also hope they
30:29
Speaker 2: can just kill them off. It's eugenics legitimately anyway. Can
30:33
Speaker 2: continue on another. Times articles from twenty sixteen quotes Philip Cohen,
30:38
Speaker 2: a sociologist at the University of Maryland, College Park, who
30:41
Speaker 2: knows the overall first marriage rate in the United States
30:45
Speaker 2: for people age eighteen to forty nine is forty eight
30:47
Speaker 2: point nine per one thousand, for people with disability is
30:51
Speaker 2: just twenty four point four.
30:55
Speaker 1: And yes, as you said, some have even brought up
30:57
Speaker 1: the dark history of eugenics in this and how this
31:00
Speaker 1: intentionally or not seems to discourage disabled people from getting married,
31:04
Speaker 1: which is something many people do before I have kids,
31:07
Speaker 1: not everybody. It even seems to incentivize divorce, which, when
31:12
Speaker 1: you put it in context of the whole Christian conservative
31:15
Speaker 1: push for the nuclear family, seems a little off. Something
31:22
Speaker 1: is not right.
31:23
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, if we follow along those lines and
31:26
Speaker 2: we know that it comes from an area and background,
31:28
Speaker 2: it makes a lot more sense. It's true, we laugh
31:33
Speaker 2: because we're in vain, but yeah, but that's just real.
31:37
Speaker 1: Yeah, yep. And of course there are a lot of
31:40
Speaker 1: discussions and disagreements around marriage, but for many it does
31:44
Speaker 1: signify acceptance by society, a legal recognition of commitment, something
31:49
Speaker 1: someone may have wanted their whole life. And for a
31:51
Speaker 1: lot of folks there are substantial government benefits for getting married,
31:55
Speaker 1: and it seems pretty dup that in this case it's
31:59
Speaker 1: the opposite sit If it's a choice between living and
32:04
Speaker 1: functioning in marriage, then there's no real choices there. And
32:07
Speaker 1: I feel like the fact that they have that kind
32:10
Speaker 1: of holding out for marriage really drives home the point, right,
32:18
Speaker 1: it doesn't even matter if they think that you're basically
32:22
Speaker 1: a married couple, then that they're going to take those
32:27
Speaker 1: benefits away anyway.
32:29
Speaker 2: Right, literally trying to find any reason to take the
32:32
Speaker 2: benefits away.
32:33
Speaker 1: Yeah, mm hmm uh. And as I said, for some people,
32:38
Speaker 1: this is yeah, this is life or death. This is right.
32:41
Speaker 2: So for a chunk of people, this is life or
32:44
Speaker 2: death like endpoint. Because as we've talked about before, and
32:48
Speaker 2: as it's been said it stated by many disability activists,
32:53
Speaker 2: being abled body is temporary, whether it's age or whatever whatnot,
32:59
Speaker 2: being disabled is a reality is going to happen. We
33:03
Speaker 2: see that again. Like you know, we've talked to you
33:05
Speaker 2: and I have talked about the fact that our parents
33:06
Speaker 2: recently had gone to the hospital for different incidents, and
33:10
Speaker 2: we fear when they fall or when they do something
33:12
Speaker 2: and are no longer able to care for themselves. The
33:14
Speaker 2: cost of money just in trying to find in living
33:18
Speaker 2: care for elderly Yeah, is absurd, and if you if
33:22
Speaker 2: they are not already like provided by medicare, which is great,
33:26
Speaker 2: but they're still trying to cut medicare. We saw that
33:28
Speaker 2: in the state of Georgia. They're trying to cut Medicare
33:31
Speaker 2: and trying to reason with my parents about like your
33:34
Speaker 2: governor has done this, but they don't quite see it.
33:37
Speaker 2: Like they have come to the realization that Medicare is
33:40
Speaker 2: allowed for them to go get examinations, which I'm really
33:42
Speaker 2: glad that they have actually taken the opportunity to use
33:46
Speaker 2: those benefits, but like trying to remind them this is
33:49
Speaker 2: very very we're on a very like thin line on
33:51
Speaker 2: whether or not this is going to be accessible in
33:54
Speaker 2: the future.
33:55
Speaker 1: Yes, and just to note again not legal, but a
34:00
Speaker 1: lot of this does relate to in the US when
34:05
Speaker 1: you get like social Security as an older person as well,
34:07
Speaker 1: so a lot of it does.
34:08
Speaker 2: Have right, they're all interlocking.
34:10
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's just please don't look up do your own research.
34:15
Speaker 1: I hope this is a good starting off point, but
34:20
Speaker 1: like we said, it's confusing. It's purposely designed to be confusing,
34:23
Speaker 1: and it changes often. It changes often, so I believe
34:26
Speaker 1: the numbers be quoted in this was as of twenty
34:29
Speaker 1: twenty three or twenty twenty four, so it was a
34:31
Speaker 1: recent change. But yeah, I'm thank you so much, Jude,
34:39
Speaker 1: yeah for suggesting this. And if there's anything we got
34:43
Speaker 1: wrong or could have phrased better, because I was a
34:47
Speaker 1: little like, wow, this is some dense documentation. Yes, please
34:52
Speaker 1: let us know and if there are any resources or
34:56
Speaker 1: if you have any stories you would like us to share.
34:59
Speaker 1: I would love to hear here from all of you.
35:03
Speaker 1: You can email us at Stuffmedia, moom Stuff at iHeartMedia
35:06
Speaker 1: dot com. You can find us on Twitter at mom
35:07
Speaker 1: Stuff Podcast. We're also on Instagram and TikTok at stuff
35:11
Speaker 1: I Never Told You. We're on YouTube and we are
35:13
Speaker 1: on public and we have a book you can get
35:16
Speaker 1: wherever you get your books, where we did talk about
35:18
Speaker 1: some of this stuff in there. Thanks as always to
35:21
Speaker 1: our super producer Christina, our executive producer Maya, and our
35:23
Speaker 1: contributor Joey.
35:24
Speaker 2: Thank you.
35:25
Speaker 1: Thanks to you for listening Stuff I Never Told yous
35:26
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