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Colin Padalecki of Surfaces · Caught on the Mike...

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Disclaimer, the views and opinions expressed in this program are those of the speakers and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions of any entities they represent.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_00: Listener discretion is advised.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes a push on the proverbial res button is all we need.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_00: Today's death on the podcast is always analyzing on the fan surfaces to create of course to find some of the most uplifting genre scoring music of the last several years, including the massive global edge on the past.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_00: This conversation goes way beyond streaming numbers or viral moments.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_00: On open stuff about having personal archives, we discovered surface booth music and how the upcoming surfaces album became a reflective appealing, growth, and finding light again.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_00: We also talked about the new title only when you're home, building community with fans during the creative process of what this next era of surfaces truly means.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_00: Ladies and gentlemen, this is Caught on the Mic.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_00: Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to another exciting episode of Caught on the Mic.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: And today on the show, we are joined by Colin Pavalecki from Surfaces, the genre blending band behind the global hit Sunday Best, and billions of streams worldwide.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_00: As Surfaces emerges into a new era, we're gonna talk about the heart of the upcoming seventh album and how fans help shape the brand new single Call Me When You're Home.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_00: This is a really thoughtful conversation about growth, creativity, and finding light.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_00: Again, Colin, welcome to the show, my friend.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_00: What's up, man?
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks for having me.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: Oh man, the pleasure is all mine.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_00: Let's kind of get right into it.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_00: When you first started Surfaces, how long ago was it and kind of what inspired you?
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_01: Oh gosh, I think it was probably around 2014.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like that's like the right year.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, I was in high school.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_01: I had been getting into songwriting and music production.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_01: And the only other person I knew in my life that was musically inclined was my cousin Alexa, who is a singer.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_01: She sang in church a bunch.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_01: She's like the only person I knew who was like musically inclined.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: So I started writing all these like pretty bad songs.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_01: I'd like and uh I would show them to her and I'd like you know make these productions.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_01: I'd be like, hey, like do you think you'd want to sing these?
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_01: And she's like, yeah.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_01: So we essentially started there and uh started posting on SoundCloud a bunch, kind of kept up with it, like was selling like merch in between classes and stuff, like the whole nine yards.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_01: And then in college, I started posting like actual EPs and bodies of work.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_01: And Forrest was going to a neighboring college at the time.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_01: I think I was like a sophomore in college, and he saw the SoundCloud stuff and he really liked it.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_01: And he started driving in from his neighboring college in Texas.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_01: He was going to Baylor, I was going to Texas AM at the time, and we just kind of became friends for like a year, didn't really make anything with each other, but like would just show each other stuff we thought was cool.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_01: But I would still send him all these demos, me and Alexa were making, and then eventually he really liked one like a year later when he took a job in Seattle, and then I flew to Seattle on a whim.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_01: I'd never really left Texas all that much one summer, and I wrote like, gosh, I might have written written written like three or four songs on the flight.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_01: I was so excited just to create with someone else.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_01: I think we recorded like seven or eight songs in one weekend on his houseboat.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_01: And uh at that point I was like, hey man, like I know me and Alexa got this thing going, but would you like it's obviously not just like a one and done feature, would you want to like be a part of this?
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_01: And he goes, Yeah, of course.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_01: And then that was pretty much the concept of our first album.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_01: Amazing, yeah, and then you know, then on it was kind of just rock and roll, you know what I mean?
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_00: So who were some of your earlier influences?
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_01: Oh man, I grew up like on farmland in South Texas.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_01: Uh believe it or not, uh usually people ask if I'm like from California or like Australia.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, I grew up in South Texas, so a lot of uh a lot of traditional country and like dance halls growing up, um, and uh a lot of classic rock.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_01: So I grew up on Fleawood Mac, Led Zeppelin, Tom Petty, uh just I don't know, everyone.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_01: Elton John, especially.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_01: And then I especially have a fondness for Jack Johnson as a songwriter.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: He's my favorite songwriter, he's the reason I got into songwriting.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_01: I think a lot of people will hear like a lot of his influence, and I'm not ashamed of that at all.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_01: I think he's the goat.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_01: And of course, like, you know, every other thing.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like I grew up in church, so like was into a little bit of like gospel in the beginning, and then um, and then like a ton of hip hop, like growing up in middle school, high school.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, it kind of was just submersion, all kinds of different, you know, music.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I think that's kind of the the musician answer that not everybody kind of realizes.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_00: And I brought this up a million times on the show that you know, back in the day, people would just stay in one lane as far as influence and what they created genre-wise, but most musicians borrow a little bit from everybody to make themselves better.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_00: And don't ever apologize about being a Jack Johnson fan, man.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I'll never apologize for being a Jack Johnson fan.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_01: I will I wear that like a badge of honor.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_01: Hell yes.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_01: I think, yeah, I'll never apologize about Jack.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_01: Jack's amazing.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_00: He's it is amazing.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_00: What's weird is like this last year I've been really getting back into artists like him.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_00: And it's so funny.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_00: You'd you'd think I'd lived near Red Rocks or something because it's all like Cali reggae type stuff that I'm into.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_00: Like I I love the elevators.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_00: I just had uh Jackson Weatherby from the elevators on and sick 311 and Jack Johnson and and slightly stupid and and bands like that, and Dave Matthews band even.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_00: Dave Matthews is my like, I'm not gonna apologize about being a Dave Matthews band fan.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, they're great.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, yes.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_00: So let's talk about this new era.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_00: This new single feels nostalgic, warm, and emotionally grounded at the same time.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_00: What did you know emotionally or creatively that you wanted this next era of surfaces to represent before you even finished the song?
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_01: Man, I went through a pretty tumultuous year of my life in 2024.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_01: It just seemed like a lot of different areas of my life kind of came crashing down.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_01: Honestly, music, I mean, a lot of things brought me out of my funk, music being one of them.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_01: And I would literally just sit at home with a guitar and just write.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_01: Not because I had to, not because I feel like I needed to, but it just it came pouring out of me.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_01: It was like the only way I could, like, not to be corny, but it was like the only way I can under I could understand what I was going through at the time.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_01: And it would make me feel better.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_01: Like a lot of the times it's just me on my couch with my sixth string, and like it just that was enough.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like I was going through such a hard time, and I just started doing that, just sitting with a guitar every single day.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you know, as a songwriter, I, you know, do that a lot, but like at that point in time, I was playing guitar every day, writing almost every day.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I just wanted to capture authenticity and I wanted to capture what I was going through.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_01: But it's not that I was afraid to make a sad song, but I was like, man, how can I turn all this into a positive?
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_01: How can I take what I'm going through and find the light in it and share that light with other people?
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_01: And I think this is all this new album is trying to do.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: I love that, man, because I mean music is so therapeutic.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_00: I talk a lot about how music tends to define seasons of life.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_00: Like it it defines a calendar season too, because I know my tastes change depending upon what time of year it is, but there's also artists that you can kind of earmark certain areas of your life with based on those life experiences.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_00: Did songwriting start to feel different for you because you were using it as a therapeutic device?
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_01: I'm a stream of consciousness writer.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_01: So like I I always draw from whatever real life experiences I've had.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_01: So it's it's not like my songwriting has never not been this.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_01: I think I've just never been this vulnerable, I guess.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_01: At least like in the mind, the mindset that I was currently in when I was writing this, I was extremely vulnerable.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_01: But I don't know.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_01: I I I think it's just it's it's honest and it's very personal to me.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_01: And it feels good to express myself and not blame the world for all my problems, but like invite the world in and be like, hey, I've gone through some stuff, but like here's my silver linings that I've got from it.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I I don't know, it makes me almost prideful of like the truth and like how I'm panning it to be in a better light, I guess.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_00: Dude, I love that.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_00: That that is so amazing because the thing is, is we live in an era where people only put up the best parts of their lives through social media and everything.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, man.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I can relate to that.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_01: Like, there's a lot, there's a lot of the surfaces catalog that was like based in escapism, which is I think escape escapism can be healthy.
• 9:53
  unknown: Right.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_01: But, you know, a lot of people see songs like Sunday Best are like, oh, look at those jolly fellows, like, you know, they're just everything's gravy, they're pretending like everything's fine.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, no, songs like that actually came from like periods of being sad and then finding the light.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_01: But now this time around, I feel like I could interject even more like life experience and like actually talk about it in like the verses and stuff.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: And that's why I feel very transparent and honest about this body of work that I'm about to put out.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_01: Because uh, I don't know.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_01: I sometimes I don't think you can really understand someone's highs if you don't understand their lows, and I want them to understand it all.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: So I love that, dude.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_00: One of the coolest parts of this rollout is how fans got to watch Call Me When You're Home evolve online in real time.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_00: What was it like letting people into the creative process before the song was actually finished?
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: Did fans' reactions actually help shape the final version?
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so I've never really done that before.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_01: Not not like consciously.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_01: It's kind of just like uncharted territory for me.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not like just being transparent.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not a big online guy.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I'm not I'm like, I feel like most people could tell if like from my personal profile or like from like past videos of me.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I'm not like here's my face, like here's me posting and talking all the time.
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_01: It's not like I'm like too good for the internet and I want to keep it private, it's just like it's not me.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_01: But it's it's cool to like you know break ground on something like this song where it's like I think I was just so excited about the melodies and the lyrics that were just like coming out that I was like, oh, like I might you know throw a video up today.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like my managers would love that.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_01: Because you know, like it's just the day and age, it's like if you write a song cool, if you post a song, cool.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_01: If you I mean if you release a song cool, but like can you post about it?
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like unfortunately, it's just the way it is.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm trying to get better at it.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_01: So this was me trying to get better at it.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, to answer your question, it didn't really change the end product for me.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_01: I like letting people in, and I feel like maybe we can do some more cool stuff with that.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_01: And it's not that I don't value other people's opinion, I ask so many people's opinion in so many different circles, including friends, family, whatever, because I I do value it.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_01: But I I think it's a fine line when you do that, because like then I don't want to subject myself to like the affirmation of like if enough people don't think this is cool or think it could go different, then I'm gonna just drastically change how I create music or how this song is made.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_01: And I feel like you kind of lose the essence of what that song was supposed to be and why it came out because of who you are.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_01: So it's not like I don't take criticism.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_01: I love constructive criticism and I like hearing opinions, but I I I'm careful with it.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: So I don't think it changed all that much, but I I do love sharing it with fans and I love their support, and I love taking an outside perspective.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, dude, social media is like the golden handcuffs of the creative world.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_00: Man, you have no idea.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_00: No, I do have an idea.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, sorry.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_00: Because I can tell you what, man, as podcaster guy, there's nothing, and this is the most shocking thing in the world, but there's nothing I hate more than putting a damn phone in front of my face and making a TikTok video saying, hey, go watch the other video of my ugly face on YouTube, you know, and go listen to my voice, but at the same time, it's kind of a necessary evil.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I try not to be closed-minded about it.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just like, sometimes I have ideas pop in my head where like, you know, I'll write a song and then I want to put the song out.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, hmm, what would look what would give this song better meaning and a video outlet?
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_01: Like what could make this song connect with people more depending on visually what I ate it with?
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_01: And I try to take it from that perspective instead of like gotcha stuff or like look at like me balancing like you know, a bowling ball on my head or something.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know, like it, you know, like shock factor stuff.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_01: Not not that there's anything wrong with that.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_01: Like to each their own, I don't think, you know, any differently of people who do that.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_01: But like when it comes to me, I just I'm like so afraid of like coming off in a what's not me.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_01: So I just want to capture what's made and what's authentic, and hopefully I can continue to find ways where it's like I don't feel like awkward or cagey or like forced.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_01: So I don't know.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's a road of progress for me.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, it's kind of weird because you don't want to like throw up the online pity party either, but it's like it's almost like you almost want to lead with the negative stuff first.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_00: Just okay, I've I went through it today, guys, you know, but this is how I'm kind of solving the problem.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_00: But at the same time, that can also be considered engagement bait.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_00: So it's it's really it is a slippery slope.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I I mean it's crazy you bring that up.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I, you know, talking about 2024 was such a rough year for me.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_01: I definitely didn't want to like, you know, either then or now or the time in between, just be like, oh guys, I was like so sad.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_01: Feel sorry for me.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_01: Here's some songs I wrote when I was sad, and I found the light in them, but like listen to them because I was sad and because I was going through things.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_01: It's like it it doesn't feel genuine to me to like bait people into listening to music.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_01: Like I think it's it's it's truthful and it's honest and good to like maybe like acknowledge it.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's what I try to do.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_01: I try to acknowledge things that happen, find the good light in them.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_01: Because everyone has stuff, right?
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's everyone has their things they're going through, everyone has problems, the world has a ton of them.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and like the world doesn't need me babbling online about oh, feel sorry for me, listen to my song in the description.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_01: It just kind of feels ingenuine to me.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_01: So I try to like do the right thing and like bring people the fruits of a product of an honest past, but you know, it's here is me talking about it just to give you some background.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I I totally get that.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_00: Well, let's address the surfaces sound a little bit.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_00: Surfaces of always blended pop, jazz, soul, surf rock, hip-hop, and feel good energy into something instantly recognizable as trends in the music industry constantly shift.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_00: How do you protect the DNA of surfaces while still pushing yourself creatively album to album?
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's that's what I love about albums.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_01: There, they're just puzzles, man.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_01: It's like it, how do you get, you know, 14, 16, however big your album, how do you get a collection of songs to feel like they belong to each other, but not a redundant pattern of like, wow, that's 16 of the same song.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's this beautiful problem to have.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_01: And that's why I love albums, because it's like, how can because I I've listened to some albums where I'm like, wow, those fit together really nicely with still giving people a variety.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_01: And I've listened to an album where it's like, wow, that's the same song 15 times.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I try to find the fine line with that every single season.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_01: And as far as like the you know, DNA integrity, I I try not to think about genres when I make music.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_01: I try not to box myself into a certain instrument or a certain uh songwriting topic.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and it's what I like about not being a writer who I don't I never have song titles on my phone.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not one of those writers.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: And again, this has like whoever is like that, that's just them and I'm me, and I don't judge them.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_01: I probably love a lot of songs that came from that road, but me personally, I'm stream of consciousness, so I I never walk into a room with like a you know an idea of like the song topic or the idea of the chorus.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_01: I just like kind of let it spill out and just see where my subconscious takes me.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: So I feel like as long as I continue to do that in like a thorough way, the songs will continue to be grounded in the same kind of palette that has always been.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_01: And that's like the only way I can explain it.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you touch on a good point, and again, I feel like I bring this up on almost every single damn episode of the show, but you came into the music industry as streaming was just kind of starting to emerge.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_00: True.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the things that, you know, we can we can crap on streaming all day long if we wanted to, but one of the silver linings about streaming is I think modern audiences look at music as just being music as opposed to different genres and different lanes of music anymore.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_00: And maybe that's an area where surfaces is benefited, is you you're not tying yourself down to one sound.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean, I I don't know, I'm not afraid to, you know, blend stuff.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not like I am all we are as artists are just like a musical mixing pot of all the the genres and the songs of the artists that we've ever listened to, whether we'll admit it or not.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_01: I think subconsciously that's how the mind works.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like the mind is always in taking that and always filtering it and trying to create something new.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_01: And I I mean, everything has like its its pros and cons with streaming.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_01: Obviously, there's a ton on each side, but I do like the beauty of like, you know, back in you know, pre-2016, 2017, uh, like if you weren't signed to a label, uh, you couldn't put out music on the internet.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_01: And I thought that was a travesty.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_01: And I do think it's beautiful that nowadays, you know, there's all these websites and companies where like any kid from their bedroom can upload music to the internet and become a musician now.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_01: And I I think that's great.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, that comes with this complications of like, you know, some people take it more seriously than others, some people, you know.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_01: But I think I like that it gives everyone an equal opportunity to be an artist to release music that they're very passionate about.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: And I I really like that because I I don't know, I feel like all these bedroom mics have become the ears of the world somehow.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_01: And I love that.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's beautiful that anybody can like catch their own wave now and not need like so much infrastructure.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense, man.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_00: Well, moving into your story a little bit, you handled a big transition within the band with a lot of grace publicly, and it's clear that there's no bad blood there.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_00: As Surfaces enters this new configuration, what's been the most exciting or creatively freeing thing about stepping into this next chapter while still honoring everything that got you here?
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_01: Just, I don't know, just just writing music.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_01: And and like I love working with other people.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_01: It's one of my favorite things about music.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_01: I love feeling like a team.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, it's why you know I love playing, you know, rec sports.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_01: It's like I like the feeling of a team.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_01: I like the the feeling of collaborating and and writing a song in a room with other people.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_01: You know, there's a period of that that'll end with, you know, certain people that I've worked with in the past, like Forest, obviously, namely, because we made a ton of really good music together, but it never closed the door on collaboration as an effort.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_01: And I I still treat that as like one of the best qualities of music because one of the things that got me out of like my worst days is community in music.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so appreciative of community and I love it.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I still write with a lot of people I've written with in the past, and I still share ideas with people I still have shared ideas with in the past, and that'll never get old to me.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm I'm always excited about that.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like I write a lot of these songs on my own, but I love working with like other producers that I've met in Los Angeles and Nashville and Texas, and I don't know.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_01: I I love bringing a song to someone, seeing what they think, and seeing like how they could help me bring it to life.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_01: And just because like one of those chapters is closed doesn't mean like surfaces won't continue to be a coalition of just like amazing people that help me bring these songs to life, and I'll be forever grateful for that.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_00: So Well put, man.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_00: So well put.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like I like that term coalition, coalition of artists.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_00: I and it's it's crazy because it's it's an odd parallel for me to make, but like some of the best hip-hop albums are open-ended collaborations.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_00: Like the Wu-Tang clan, man.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_00: You think there's nine members, but you configure everybody else that's Wu-Tang adjacent, you know?
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_00: And that's how some of the best music has been put together.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_01: I dude, I think it's romantic, man.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_01: Like I grew up hearing all the stories, the classic rock stories of like people like Fleawood Mac, like walking up and down Laurel Canyon, hopping in house to house and just making insane bangers in the 60s and 70s.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_01: Like I to me, I love those stories, and I love that part of music.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_01: And I love I love getting to know like I meet a different artist or I'm in a different room like every other week, whether I'm in LA or Nashville, becoming friends with them and then seeing them win on their own and seeing them right with other people that I know from over here.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_01: And it's just like like any job or career, like it's turns into a small world.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_01: And I I don't know, I can really a hundred percent say that like music community is like so important to me, and it's brought me out of like some of my darkest days, and I'll I just I don't know.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_01: I love it.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's it's a very unique in our our field.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_00: So well, talking about probably your most well-known song, uh Sunday Best, I remember the very first time I heard it.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_00: It was a day I go to the gym, and everybody dreads this day when they go to the gym where they reach into their gym bag and they forget their headphones.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_00: But here I am on a treadmill, I'm running, and it was the very first time I and I remember hearing it because I remember seeing the video for it in the gym while listening to it, and I absolutely loved the song.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_00: It became a massive cultural moment and eventually surpassed a billion that's B streams on Spotify and after exploding on TikTok.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_00: Looking back now, what do you think people were truly connecting to in that song beyond just the feel-good vibe?
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_01: I think people were ready to latch on to something that was a little different because I remember, you know, 2019 going into 2020, it was just very popular uh to like write like sad songs.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_01: And I love sad songs.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, speaking as someone who has a ton of sad songs on his iPod, hey man, like you know, I think happy music's great and sad music is great, and stuff that blends in between.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but I do think what made that song stand out is like it was a fusion of genres, I feel like, which was like a little different.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, a lot of people fuse genres, but I think just for the time, it was like a little different.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_01: And like I think beach music, Sunny Best is like kind of beachy, not as beachy as our other work, but you know, it was just like different enough, and it was like happy and graceful enough in a period where like sad songs were kind of trending up.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_01: And it wasn't something that we ever chalkboarded.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_01: We're like, hmm, like the market is like a lot of sad songs, so I think we should chalkboard a happy song.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_01: They just again it just kind of spilled out, and then people would give us their opinions on it.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, oh, that makes sense for like why I guess it's connecting to a wide audience at this certain time, and especially during COVID, where everyone was locked up and kind of like cagey and and like afraid and and sad.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_01: And like I feel like that song is just kind of like freeing and happy, and I was trying to look on the brighter side of things.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_00: I think that is such a well-put explanation because it really did cut through some of the gloominess of the early days of the pandemic for sure, in in a place where it was hard to kind of cut through some of the crap that was going on at that point in time.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_00: But again, it's one good songs withstand the test of time.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, like I was telling you, I I was driving around listening to your whole catalog this afternoon, and when that song particularly came up, I was like, man, and and the thing is you gotta listen to it with the with the speakers up, man, and listen to all the production value and everything that went into that song, and it's withstood the test of time for sure.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean, yeah, it was I remember it being an especially sunny day.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_01: I we recorded that song in my college house.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_01: I had a middle bedroom that like didn't have like a window or anything, and I remember like opening up the closet, putting my clothes on each side, and then sticking a microphone in the middle.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_01: And that was our vocal booth.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, we recorded it in like probably under an hour, and then literally I I kid you not, we recorded an hour, stepped outside, put it on a blue, put the demo on a Bluetooth speaker, and we were just throwing frisbee.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_01: And I remember like throwing the frisbee, especially I don't know why I remember this so vividly.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_01: I remember throwing the frisbee like back and forth, and we were both nodding like this is a good one.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like not even being corny, like it's actually what happened, and I was like, yeah, like this one, it's a good feeling.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it felt like it was we were supposed to be outside doing that, and it felt like we had just made something that was meant for outside.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_00: That's great, that's fantastic.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_00: Well, let's talk about the new single.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_00: It was produced by Anderson East, and you've also invited more people into the creative pop process, both vocally and collaboratively, to your point about a coalition.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_00: What have you learned recently about collaboration that maybe younger Colin wouldn't have understood yet?
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_01: Man, that's a good question.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_01: I love Anderson.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_01: Anderson's awesome.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_01: He's like one of the first people I met in music when I started hanging around Nashville a bunch.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um I think one of honestly, I don't know if this is me learning too much, but I I remember like in the very beginning, I considered myself kind of like a producer, but then I I think songwriting just kind of stole my heart from uh from the very early days and just progressively got, you know, more and more near and dear to me.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_01: And one thing I realized is when because we used to, you know, produce, write everything ourselves in our you know, houses in Texas.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_01: And then I think a couple years ago, I started going out to Los Angeles and started working with other people, and I was like, oh, so these are like real producers.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_01: He's like, these are these are kids from like Berkeley who play 11 different instruments, and I was like, you know what?
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna stick to writing.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_01: Cause like I didn't grow up with a music background, and I was always like so ashamed of that.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_01: Every like room I'd walk in, they'd be like, oh, so like, you know, did you have like lessons or did you have classes?
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_01: Did you go to school for it?
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, I I didn't grow up with an instrument in my household, but I I loved music so much, and I used to write a ton and journal a ton.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_01: And so when I was 14, I just tried started trying to take stabs at it.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_01: And then I learned that like, I don't know, like you choose your own superpowers, and you can choose what makes you happy and what you feel like you can really sink your teeth into and really be passionate about.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_01: And for me, that's always been songwriting.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't think I'm like the best songwriter in the world, but I think I'm really good at tuning into myself and my thoughts and what drives me and getting the best songs I know how from myself.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_01: So I I learned not to be ashamed of that.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_01: And and you know, I I guitar is usually my tool to get songs out.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I play a little piano, but um, I don't know.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_01: For a long time I I blame myself with like imposter syndrome of like, man, am I really a musician?
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, am I really a musician?
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_01: But I stopped being ashamed of that because I was like, and this it brings me to like back to community.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, you know, a lot of people somehow turn music into like competing against each other, and I think it's the opposite.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_01: I've I love going to a room and I see a guy shredding on piano or has like a melodic idea, or and I love building off of that, and I love riding in the room.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_01: I my favorite thing to do in music is to melody find in a room with someone, and and just like that initial, like it's like throwing like a fishing pole into like a lake, and there's nothing like feeling like that first little jitter, and you're like, oh man, there's something here, and then you just want to reel it in as fast as you can.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_01: I don't even fish that much, but I feel like that's I that's how excited I get.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, you throw it out into that thought pool, and then you reel it in, you're like, oh man, like this is this is something here.
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_00: Uh but yeah.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_00: I I think people do struggle with that scarcity versus abundance mindset, no matter what type of community you're in creatively.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_00: I maybe it's traditional modes of thinking.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_00: It's like not everything has to be the Highlander that can there can be only one out there.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_00: You know, collaboration happens at the top, competition happens at the bottom, you know?
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I don't I don't know.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_01: I love making music with my friends.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_01: Some of my favorite songs I have a fondness for because of how and when we made it.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_01: And I love that.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_01: I love making music with my friends.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_01: I love sharing those moments with them and then giving them to the world and then sharing them again on a broader scale.
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_01: I think there's nothing like it.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's I'll be grateful for it forever.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_00: You know, drifting back to 2024 and the genesis of this next batch of music, 15 songs that tell the story of feeling good again, without spoiling too much.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_00: What emotional journey do you hope listeners walk away with after hearing the full album front to back once it drops?
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_01: I think my MO for this album, by the way, I think it's gonna be 16, and you're the first to hear that.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_01: Uh yes.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I feel bad because I think I made in like a public post that said 15, but I'm like, there's one song that I was like, man, I love this song.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_01: So it's it's probably gonna be 16.
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_01: Do it for you, brother.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_01: Right, exactly.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_01: Uh no, but to answer your question, um I don't know, with this album, there was kind of like the central message that was living with within myself when I was creating these songs, where it's like the best way I can put it is like when I when I was going through all those things, um, and my mental health was like in a really bad place, and I was recovering, I have this pattern of like, ah, maybe enough days have passed, like measuring it by time.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_01: And that that's just never how it works.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_01: Like, it's like, ah, maybe three months now, six months now, six months have passed, I'm probably okay now.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I always used to tell myself, Colin, you're sad right now, but you have so much to be grateful for.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_01: So be happy.
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_01: Or like, Colin, you're happy, but all this stuff that happened to you happened like three months ago.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_01: So like maybe you need to grieve more.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_01: And all of a sudden I was in this teeter-totter with myself, and it it just felt so like dizzying, and it it felt like I couldn't find my feet, and it f it felt like I wasn't actually progressing.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_01: I just kept on going back and forth with stuff that wasn't really real.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_01: And what I found on this album is like it's okay to be in the middle, it's okay to be human, like it's okay to be a mix of both.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_01: It's okay to not feel guilt about telling people that you've been in a bad mental place, and it's okay to be happy and not feel guilty about not being sad.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like, it's okay to be human again.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_01: And I think this album kind of taught me how to be human again.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_01: And I hope when people listen to it, they'll be like, wow, these are pretty happy songs for the most part, but I can tell in the undertones and in the writing and the lyrics that like he has gone through some things, but he's somehow starting to find the balance within himself.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_01: And I hope they can take that away and maybe implicate it into their own lives and find that it's okay to be human, that you don't need to be sad for the sake of feeling sad.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_01: You don't need to be happy for the the sake of feeling happy.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_01: You can just be okay and just breathe and talk to people and like not shut everyone out, because like that's what I did and I regret it because I community like really helped me find my feet again and helped me find myself again.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't know, I think life is a beautiful thing, and I think music should be a beautiful thing.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_01: So this is my take on both.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_00: You know, talking about Sunday Best being a bright ray of light during dark times and the start of the pandemic, one of the things that I think gets missed a lot about that era is that while we're going through a global pandemic, a secondary pandemic was starting, and that was the mental health pandemic.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_00: But again, finding silver linings where silver linings might not exist, people are more transparent about their mental health, at least from what I've observed now than they were six years ago.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_00: And I I think it's great that you were able to lean into that and create art and create a form of expression and an outlet that will probably resonate with other people in hard times in their own life as well.
• 35:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I I think it's just the times, man.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_01: I think like, you know, the older generation, like no one went to therapy and like men wouldn't talk about their feelings and men wouldn't talk about their mental health, and because it was like it wasn't okay for them to do that, or it wasn't okay for people in general.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_01: Like it wasn't like a popular thing, like you know, it doesn't matter male or female.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm glad that, you know, newer generations feel okay to talk about their feelings, they feel okay to go to therapy, and they I don't know.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_01: I I think it's it's it's good.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_01: I I feel like I'm never ashamed of being in tune with my emotions.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_01: I've always been an emotional kid growing up in my friendships and my family.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_01: And I used to be like a little timid about it, feeling like, is it okay that like I cry?
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_01: Is it okay that I write super emotional songs?
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_01: And I've kind of just like found a way to turn into my superpower, and I don't feel ashamed about it.
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_01: And like, yeah, I've made some like emotional, I've had some emotional moments before that like I could have probably held better, but it's that's part of growing up, it's part of maturity.
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't know, I think people should voice how they feel.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_01: And I feel like, you know, growing in South Texas, growing up in South Texas, it's like it's not like a very like manly thing to like, you know, talk about your feelings and like you know why, why, why isn't it?
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like, why can't we just say what we feel and like why can we just like be open with each other and not hold stuff over each other's head?
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I certainly needed uh I had a long journey with that process, you know, where I'm from and growing up, and now I feel like you know, if I ever need to voice anything with anyone for good or bad reasons, then I I try to be transparent about it and I try to be open and loving and communicative and you know I don't know.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, you know, building on that, surfaces has already achieved what most artists dream of global tours, charting records, billions of streams.
• 36:59
  SPEAKER_00: At this stage, what feels more fulfilling to you now?
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_00: Is it success metrics or hearing how the music genuinely helped people through parts of their lives?
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, with metrics, it's I always take it from a point of uh grace from like the support of the people who um supported me.
• 37:18
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I take it as like I'm not ashamed of my accomplishments.
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_01: I love celebrating them because people supported me to get me to the places that I've accomplished.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_01: But I I that's all they are to me.
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_01: They're just numbers on a page.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_01: That's where I try to live.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_01: It's like being an artist nowadays, it's like this juggle of like you don't need to dive into the affirmation and the statistics too hard because then your mental health will kind of suffer, and you'll be like, okay, all my happiness is tied to an algorithm or is tied to a Spotify graph.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_01: There's a juggle, right, with anything.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like I understand that's my way of living and that you know I need to be aware of those things, but for me, the true happiness relies in like, does this feel like an authentic song to you know the extension of myself?
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_01: And am I being authentic?
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_01: Am I working with people I enjoy?
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_01: Am I am I living life like I think I should?
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_01: And the rest will follow, you know, and it's I don't know.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_01: The best way I can put it is like I've been comparing songwriting and song making a lot to being a woodworker.
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_01: So when I was going through all my stuff, I really enjoyed playing songs for my friends with just a guitar.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_01: I loved doing it.
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_01: I I would have like these almost like open mics at my house or at the you know at the lake.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_01: And it was so fun because like any one of my friends would grab the mic and we'd just sing songs, whether they're mine or you know, the millions of others that we all love.
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_01: And it kind of felt like I was this woodworker at my house.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_01: Like I would I could create these chairs, these benches out of wood, and I could make them as artisanal as I wanted them to.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_01: And then I would invite my friends over, and then they could, you know, sit in these metaphorical chairs, and we could all just enjoy each other's company and be communal.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_01: Because my favorite thing about music is being communal.
• 39:10
  SPEAKER_01: It's a reason to talk to each other, it's a reason to share stories, it's a reason to sing.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_01: And I feel like as long as I still have that in my life, that communal presence, then I will always be happy with music.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_01: And I I it's never let me down in that aspect.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_01: And I think as long as I'm tied to that and not some graph or some algorithm I'm trying to please or then I'll be okay.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_00: Dude, that's so well put.
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_00: That leads me to my closing question, man, because first of all, I have enjoyed so much of your perspectives.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_00: And I gotta give you a ton of respect, man.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_00: But my closing question kind of falls along those same lines.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_00: Given your experience, specifically in the past six, seven years, and through your eyes, what's your advice for making the world a better place tomorrow than what it is today?
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_00: Moderation.
• 40:03
  SPEAKER_01: I think that I mean, I'm I'm not into like the politics or like I'm not gonna sit on my soapbox and like preach to people.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_01: I'm I'm the last person to preach to anyone.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but I do think that like this world is so polarized with everything.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_01: It's like it's either people getting people to be polarized or people being polarized themselves.
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like, I know we don't live in this fantasy world where it's like, oh, world peace is so easy, everyone can just share the same opinion and be happy.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_01: No, we're all from different backgrounds and we're all from regionally different places that have different values, and that's okay.
• 40:41
  SPEAKER_01: We don't need to hate each other for it.
• 40:43
  SPEAKER_01: There's a middle ground or closer than a middle ground than being on complete opposite sides more than people think.
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_01: And like I pride myself on being opinionated, sure, but also like seeing different perspectives, hearing them and listening and then taking them.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_01: And like, that's why I love making music because I feel like you can make music that's like you know, it stands for something.
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_01: Because I know a lot of people are like, oh, well, if you're like so moderate, then you don't have an opinion at all.
• 41:13
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think that's true.
• 41:14
  SPEAKER_01: I I think that you can still be opinionated, but you can still also hear someone out and not block them or use hate to get what you want.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like, let's find the middle.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_01: That's my take of the day.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_00: Ladies and gentlemen, call me when your home is now streaming on all streaming platforms.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_00: Colin, why don't you tell everybody where they can find you and surfaces online?
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_01: You can find us on Instagram, Services Music, TikTok, all the goodies on digital streaming platforms everywhere.
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_01: Give us a listen and I hope you dig it, relate to it, and makes it your life a little better.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_01: Love it.
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_01: Is there gonna be a supporting tour for this album?
• 41:54
  SPEAKER_01: Man, we're in talks.
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_01: We're figuring some stuff out, and I can't wait to get back on the road.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_01: So I don't know when that is, but it's it's being planned and it's real.
• 42:03
  SPEAKER_01: And my desire to be on the road is very real.
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_01: So it is a uh it's gonna happen.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_00: Love it.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_00: Well, Colin, thank you so much for doing the show, man.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_00: The world's a much better place with you in it.
• 42:14
  SPEAKER_00: Appreciate it, Mike.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_00: I think you too.
• 42:16
  SPEAKER_00: Once again, I'd like to thank Colin from Surfaces for joining me on the podcast today.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_00: Make sure you follow Surfaces on Instagram at SurfacesMusic.
• 42:28
  SPEAKER_00: Call me when you're home.
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's available on all streaming platforms now.
• 42:33
  SPEAKER_00: Go check it out and look for the album to drop later on.
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_00: While you're being generous with the follows, make sure you are following at caughthe on all social media platforms.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_00: Give my YouTube channel a subscribe, it would mean the world to me.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_00: And as always, share an episode that you've enjoyed with one of your best friends.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_00: You can also visit me www.cotonhe.com or shoot me an email, caught on the mic at gmail.com.
• 43:03
  SPEAKER_00: This has been caught on the mic with Michael Clark.
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Michael Clark.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_00: Until next time, thank you.