Latest / The Body Pod / VO2 Max, Testosterone, Bone Health, Power, and Max Strength with the New HHF Programs

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VO2 Max, Testosterone, Bone Health, Power, and Max Strength with the New HHF Programs · The Body Pod

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Hey everyone, This is Haley and I'm Laara and welcome
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: to the Body Pod. Welcome back to the Body Pod everyone.
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: Today I have back on doctor Tony Battage and we
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: are here to talk about two new programs that we're
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: launching next week. Actually, so Tony.
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: Welcome, great to be talking with you.
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: Let's first give give a brief overview of the Foundation program,
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: because that has been by and large, outside of our courses,
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: the Foundation's program is the most popular program that we
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: have and probably will ever have. It's something that's unique
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: to I think our program and our group where I
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: just don't see a lot of it. I haven't myself
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: had any kind of general preparation work or foundation phase
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: for you know, any of the training that I've done,
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: let alone really seen it in other programs. So let's
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: talk about the importance of that Foundation program and then
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: how our original Foundation program, how this Foundation's Advanced or
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: Intermedia Advanced program is different from you know, just a
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: general preparation phase.
• 1:26
  Speaker 3: Firstly, let me say that I think it's such a
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  Speaker 3: great it's great news to hear that it has such
• 1:33
  Speaker 3: been received so well. You would think that when people
• 1:38
  Speaker 3: are doing programs they go straight for the goals, and
• 1:42
  Speaker 3: that could be a muscle or a strength or a
• 1:44
  Speaker 3: power and people go, well, that's what I want, and
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: I'm going to just jump straight into that program. Most
• 1:50
  Speaker 3: people quickly realize that unless you prepare your body for
• 1:54
  Speaker 3: the demands of training, you get unstuck, you get really sore,
• 2:00
  Speaker 3: you get overuse injuries, and that turns a lot of
• 2:04
  Speaker 3: people off exercise. I can't tell you I've been coaching
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  Speaker 3: for thirty years. I cannot tell you how many times
• 2:09
  Speaker 3: close friends of mine who don't want to ask me
• 2:12
  Speaker 3: for advice, but they'll say I'm taking up swimming or
• 2:15
  Speaker 3: I'm taking up running, and then three weeks later they
• 2:17
  Speaker 3: say I've stopped because my shin's hurt or my shoulders
• 2:20
  Speaker 3: hurt because they did too much too soon. As a coach,
• 2:24
  Speaker 3: we already anticipate this. Coaches anticipate this, and we always
• 2:28
  Speaker 3: begin goal specific training, which we love. We spend most
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  Speaker 3: of the year doing it, but we always begin it
• 2:35
  Speaker 3: with a phase of training that is general strength, general stability,
• 2:41
  Speaker 3: general coordination, general mobility, general cardiovascular fitness. And only once
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  Speaker 3: as that foundation, akin to the foundation of a house,
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  Speaker 3: has been laid, then you can go after muscle, glutes, abs,
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  Speaker 3: fat loss, strength, bone density, you name it. So I'm
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  Speaker 3: really happy to hear that the majority of people really
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  Speaker 3: understand that and have embraced it, because a lot of
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  Speaker 3: people think, oh, well, I'm taking a step back. I
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  Speaker 3: don't need to do this. It's about its way underneath
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  Speaker 3: my pay grade. But a well designed preparation phase or
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  Speaker 3: foundational phase will put you in much better position to
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  Speaker 3: train for your goals. So what differs from Foundations two
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  Speaker 3: versus Foundations one. Well, it's just simply one word describes,
• 3:25
  Speaker 3: and that is progression. You have to start somewhere when
• 3:29
  Speaker 3: you do foundational work. So we really do focus on
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  Speaker 3: left to right, balancing, front to back and limb balancing
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  Speaker 3: and bringing up stabilizers. That's the real emphasis in Foundations one.
• 3:42
  Speaker 3: We assume that you've done that to some degree and
• 3:45
  Speaker 3: maybe a year lady, or you've come back after a
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  Speaker 3: few months of specific training, and it's time to because
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  Speaker 3: you can't fix everything in one go. It's time to
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  Speaker 3: go back and rebuild the body again and also give
• 3:56
  Speaker 3: the nervous system a little bit of a break, and
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: we work left to right, front to back, primover to
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: stabilize it. That's always in a GPP, but we do
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  Speaker 3: so with harder exercises, more challenging. They assume you know
• 4:10
  Speaker 3: how to move your body better the use of special
• 4:13
  Speaker 3: methods and special exercises, and what these are are ways
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  Speaker 3: of potentially loading one side of the bar more than
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  Speaker 3: the other, so the bar tries to tip you over,
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  Speaker 3: but you have to use your core muscular jator right yourself.
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  Speaker 3: We do a few funky one arm but opposite leg
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  Speaker 3: exercises and that has the same kind of theme that
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  Speaker 3: we're pushing the stress through the core and the stabilizers,
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  Speaker 3: especially at the hip and the shoulder. So Foundations two
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  Speaker 3: point zero is continuing the theme, but harder, more volume,
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  Speaker 3: harder exercises and special methods.
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  Speaker 1: And definitely there's a lot of because I've been testing
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  Speaker 1: it out well with my good arm that I can
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  Speaker 1: do and anything lower. So I've noticed the balance and
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  Speaker 1: I feel like I work on my balance all the
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  Speaker 1: time through my programs, but this has like an elevated level.
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  Speaker 3: Well, it disappears the balance, and I don't know why,
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  Speaker 3: and I've thought of It's not because I haven't thought
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  Speaker 3: about it. I have thought about this once anyone finishes
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  Speaker 3: foundation work and they go for their goal. They do
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  Speaker 3: muscle building or strength or body composition for the rest
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  Speaker 3: of the year. You'll notice by the end of that
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  Speaker 3: year that phase of training, the body has become imbalanced
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  Speaker 3: again because we tend to favor things we like doing,
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  Speaker 3: and that could be we do more glutes and less abs,
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  Speaker 3: or we do more biking and less swimming, or whatever
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  Speaker 3: it is, but the body. And we noticed this even
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  Speaker 3: just a few weeks ago. I was looking at one
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  Speaker 3: of your videos for a hamstring movement and I saw
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  Speaker 3: a favoring towards one side. And that's just because we
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  Speaker 3: have not been doing foundational work. We've been doing golf
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  Speaker 3: specific training, and it shows that everyone will go back
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  Speaker 3: towards their national natural gravity and that is to be
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  Speaker 3: a little bit imbalanced. And that's why we do so
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  Speaker 3: much balancing work and foundations.
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  Speaker 1: Yes, well, I love it, and I feel like after
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  Speaker 1: the age of thirty, everyone's balance starts to kind of
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  Speaker 1: go down, go down the tube if you don't really
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  Speaker 1: work on it. So something that's really important is we
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  Speaker 1: look at aging females specifically. We know that you know,
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  Speaker 1: we're more at risk for osteoporosis osteopenia falls after the
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  Speaker 1: age of sixty can be really detrimental and you know,
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  Speaker 1: kind of life or death for some women. As deep
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  Speaker 1: as that sounds. So when we're looking at a balanced
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  Speaker 1: program and we're looking at building up these weak links,
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  Speaker 1: and we're looking at if we look at the cardio
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  Speaker 1: portion of foundation, I like how you kind of interweave
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  Speaker 1: different zones in this section. So we're doing some zone
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  Speaker 1: two work, but we're also adding and some hit at
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  Speaker 1: the end. Can you talk about why you like that method?
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  Speaker 3: Zones enable the coach to prescribe the effort really easily,
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: and before heart rate monitors, you would use perceived exertion.
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  Speaker 2: How much?
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  Speaker 3: How hard does this feel? Is it easy? Can you talk?
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  Speaker 3: When portable heart rate monitors came out, then we could
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  Speaker 3: say let's test your maximum and give you sixty percent
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  Speaker 3: or seventy percent or eighty percent. And now we can
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  Speaker 3: get them on the wrist, we can get them on
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  Speaker 3: our fingers, We can do them with a chest strap,
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  Speaker 3: which appears to still be the most effective or the
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  Speaker 3: most accurate, and we can prescribe the zone that we
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  Speaker 3: want you to be in. Now, why would we want
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  Speaker 3: to do that? Well, each of the accepted five zones
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  Speaker 3: ranging from essentially active recovery which might be walking, to
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  Speaker 3: all out one minute twenty seconds to a minute effort
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  Speaker 3: where you are redlining in zone five. These zones enable
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  Speaker 3: us to do different things, As it makes sense, each
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  Speaker 3: zone will have a different effect on your muscle, your metabolism,
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  Speaker 3: and your cardiovascular system. So clearly a walk is very
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  Speaker 3: different to sprinting up a hill. And when we give
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  Speaker 3: you zone this and zone that, we're doing so with
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  Speaker 3: two purposes in mind. The first is to hit a
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  Speaker 3: target for health and fitness. When we do zone four
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  Speaker 3: and five, your heart is at its maximum or very
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  Speaker 3: close to it, and we know that accumulating time in
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  Speaker 3: zone four and five, or what we call the red zone,
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  Speaker 3: gives you the most potent effect on your cardiac fitness,
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  Speaker 3: chamber size, ability for the heart to pump blood around
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  Speaker 3: the body, anything cardiac oriented. We know that the zone
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  Speaker 3: four and five is the most potent. Zone one and
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  Speaker 3: two has a lesser effect on those cardect parameters, but
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  Speaker 3: it's more at the level of metabolism and muscle, greater
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  Speaker 3: at glucose disposal, greater building mitochondri in muscle which burns
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  Speaker 3: all the fuel. But there's no recovery penalty. In other words,
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  Speaker 3: if you do an hour in zone one or two,
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  Speaker 3: virtually every indicry we can measure of recovery is back
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  Speaker 3: to normal in a few hours. After Zone four and five,
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  Speaker 3: every induicy of recovery is back to normal in a
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  Speaker 3: few days. So it's huge, So coaches, we use this
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  Speaker 3: to where do we spend our time. We love zone
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  Speaker 3: one and two because you can accumulate daily training without
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  Speaker 3: penalizing what you're doing in the weights room, and you
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  Speaker 3: can accumulate volume interval training. We sprinkle on top because
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  Speaker 3: data shows you don't need a lot of it to
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  Speaker 3: gain the benefit and we get bost of both worlds.
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  Speaker 3: So we do twenty thirty forty minutes in Zone two,
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  Speaker 3: depending where you are in your fitness. We work on
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  Speaker 3: mitochondri and muscle metabolism, and then at the end we
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  Speaker 3: sprinkle in some sprint or high intensity interval training and
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  Speaker 3: we only need ten to fifteen maybe twenty minutes, not
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  Speaker 3: a lot, and we rip all the benefits and there's
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  Speaker 3: no interference between the two. They're all cardiovascular. The signaling
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  Speaker 3: pathways are the same. It's not like doing weights and cardio,
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  Speaker 3: where we do have different muscular cellular signaling pathways both
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  Speaker 3: hit sit and zone two steady set. It's all the
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  Speaker 3: same signaling, by and large from a practical perspective, Does
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  Speaker 3: that answer the question?
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  Speaker 1: So that is really killing two birds with one stone?
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  Speaker 2: Yeah? Absolutely, time effective. Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, So let's talk about VO two max. How important
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  Speaker 1: is that for women? And what point do we kind
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  Speaker 1: of like, am I tapped out at forty seven? I'm
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  Speaker 1: not going to get higher?
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  Speaker 2: Yeah.
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  Speaker 3: There's two ways of answering that, and the first is
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  Speaker 3: measuring VO two and knowing what your numbers are. I
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  Speaker 3: know that there's a lot of prominent people, especially people
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  Speaker 3: like Peter or t would say you've got to know
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  Speaker 3: your numbers and you've got to be in the top
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  Speaker 3: ten percent of your age group. Measuring it is not
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  Speaker 3: easy to do. But training at VO two max or
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  Speaker 3: above ninety percent of your heart rate is really important.
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  Speaker 3: So I wouldn't get into the weeds about knowing what
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  Speaker 3: your numbers are. You can't predict them. By the way,
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  Speaker 3: so if you're using a garment or a polar app
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  Speaker 3: and you did X speed, would say your VO two, No,
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  Speaker 3: that is so far off the market's not funny. So
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  Speaker 3: actually measuring it. If it suits your personality, then by
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  Speaker 3: all means go to a lab and test it on
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  Speaker 3: the mode that you train. But the most important thing
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  Speaker 3: is not knowing the number. It's that you're accumulating ten
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  Speaker 3: to twenty minutes a week in zone four or five,
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  Speaker 3: which is your VO two zones, and that means that
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  Speaker 3: your heart will be very very close to maximum that
• 12:02
  Speaker 3: you'll need a few days recovery between it and when
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  Speaker 3: the heart is pumping so high. That's what we call
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  Speaker 3: VO two max training, and it increases your ability to take, in, utilize,
• 12:16
  Speaker 3: and pump blood oxygen around the body. It's strongly associated
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  Speaker 3: with living well and living long.
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  Speaker 1: Okay, So for someone that doesn't want to do a
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: heart rate monitor, can you go by just like the
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: next best thing? Like we have ideal and then we
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: have the next best thing we could go with just
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  Speaker 1: like hard easy?
• 12:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, remove barriers for exercise? Rule one is exercise rule two?
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  Speaker 3: What kind of exercise? Well, we've got strength and we've
• 12:48
  Speaker 3: got cardio. If I'm doing cardio, I don't have any
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  Speaker 3: way of measuring how I'm doing great use perceived exertion.
• 12:56
  Speaker 3: How does it feel? Do you feel like it's easy?
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  Speaker 3: Could you carry a conversation, maybe a little labored, but
• 13:02
  Speaker 3: can you talk excellent. Most of your training should be
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  Speaker 3: there because you can accumulate lots of it and do
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  Speaker 3: it daily and create relationships and talk and just get
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  Speaker 3: out of your body for a while. If you're in
• 13:15
  Speaker 3: nature when you're doing interval training, no conversation. If you're
• 13:21
  Speaker 3: doing it with a friend, it's just for motivation, but
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  Speaker 3: you're not talking to them. If you're talking to them,
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  Speaker 3: you are not doing Video two max. So it's just
• 13:28
  Speaker 3: for moral support and you don't need to do lots
• 13:32
  Speaker 3: of it. You just need to rev the heart. So
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  Speaker 3: the interesting thing with intensity, and that's what this kind
• 13:38
  Speaker 3: of work is you don't need a lot of intensity.
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: You need a lot of volume, but you don't need
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: a lot of intensity. They're kind of inversely related to
• 13:45
  Speaker 3: each other. So the video two max intervals, if you
• 13:48
  Speaker 3: don't have a heart rate monitor, it should hurt. You
• 13:51
  Speaker 3: want to stop and you can't talk that zone four
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  Speaker 3: and five having a good chat maybe a breath or
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  Speaker 3: so in between that zone one and two.
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: So if somebody was like, we have the zones and
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: then when you pick up this is a question that
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  Speaker 1: I get all the time, in our courses, do you
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  Speaker 1: start like if it's thirty seconds on but you've had
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: whatever time off, do you start the interval like if
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  Speaker 1: you're going from one hundred to three hundred, you know
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: for that and you set it. Do you start the
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  Speaker 1: interval right at the thirty second time or do you
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: rev up and be like one hundred, one hundred and
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: ninety two fifty.
• 14:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there isn't an easy answer to that. It really
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: does depend on how many you're doing, but also how
• 14:39
  Speaker 3: long it takes you to get into the sprint. The
• 14:43
  Speaker 3: rule of thumb is if you're doing sprint interval training,
• 14:47
  Speaker 3: by definition, that will be between ten seconds and probably
• 14:51
  Speaker 3: thirty seconds, because after that you're you're not sprinting. It
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: might hurt, you will be slowing down. Most people when
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: they hear or use the word sprint interval training is
• 15:02
  Speaker 3: twenty thirty seconds. The queue that coaches but also researchers
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: when they do this in the lab, it's once that
• 15:10
  Speaker 3: timer goes, you're going to go as hard as you can,
• 15:14
  Speaker 3: like you're going for your life. Because it's intensity driven,
• 15:18
  Speaker 3: you really do need to drop the hammer, which if
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: you look at a forced time curve, it'll go up
• 15:24
  Speaker 3: like this and then there's no way you're hanging on
• 15:26
  Speaker 3: to that. By twenty seconds you wish you were dead,
• 15:28
  Speaker 3: and thirty seconds there's nothing left. That's what they're doing
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: in studies when we talk about the benefits of sprint
• 15:35
  Speaker 3: interval training there, it's like I'm going to light a
• 15:37
  Speaker 3: firecracker behind you and it's going to fright yet and
• 15:39
  Speaker 3: you're off. That's what they're doing.
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: Now. I'm not as sadistic as that.
• 15:45
  Speaker 3: I will usually get people to ramp up into it,
• 15:47
  Speaker 3: and when they're there twenty thirty seconds that when they
• 15:51
  Speaker 3: can't hold that pace anymore, terminate the interval because you've
• 15:54
  Speaker 3: maxed out.
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so for somebody that's starting out, because there's a
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: lot of women right now that are starting out in intervals,
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: and a lot of the time I'll get well, I
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: didn't need the full rest, so I went sooner. But
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: I was giving everything that I was giving, And I'm like,
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: but you weren't. Then how much of this is a skill?
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: Like think of the first time you used you did
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: an interval and then to where you are now. It's
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: a different animal.
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 16:23
  Speaker 3: In fact, all strength training and sprint training, interval training
• 16:28
  Speaker 3: is a skill in pacing. The high intensity interval training
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: is much easier to pace because what we're doing is
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: we're asking for relative best for one minute, two minutes,
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: three minutes, something like that. And that's once you've done
• 16:43
  Speaker 3: at once you know I overpitched it or underpitched it,
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: and you can pretty much get it right. From my clients,
• 16:50
  Speaker 3: I make it even easier again and say, well, let's
• 16:51
  Speaker 3: just measure what your max is. So every minute we
• 16:54
  Speaker 3: go up until they can't do anymore. Then I say, great,
• 16:57
  Speaker 3: now hold three minutes at eighty percent of that, and
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: I tell them what to do. And in programs that
• 17:02
  Speaker 3: are write clients, once I know that, I'll say two
• 17:04
  Speaker 3: minutes at two hundred and sixty five watts and then
• 17:07
  Speaker 3: a minute at sixty watts, and I actually tell them
• 17:09
  Speaker 3: what to do. If you don't have that information, high
• 17:13
  Speaker 3: intensity interval training should just be categorized as hard to
• 17:17
  Speaker 3: very hard for the duration that you're doing it, and yes,
• 17:21
  Speaker 3: your heart rate will hit ninety percent of maximum for
• 17:23
  Speaker 3: that Sprinterful interval training, as you were alluding to, really
• 17:27
  Speaker 3: is a skill. And if you do it as hard
• 17:29
  Speaker 3: as you can, and then you say, well, I know
• 17:32
  Speaker 3: you told me to rest four minutes, but I'm feeling
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: pretty good at a minute. You did not go as
• 17:37
  Speaker 3: hard as you could because if you went as hard
• 17:39
  Speaker 3: as you could, then you would want to stop and
• 17:42
  Speaker 3: get off the bike. And I cannot tell you how
• 17:45
  Speaker 3: many people in situations where I'm teaching personal trainers, they
• 17:50
  Speaker 3: don't get through the warm up. So at the end
• 17:53
  Speaker 3: of the warm up, then they tapping out. And if
• 17:54
  Speaker 3: they get through the warm up and do the first
• 17:56
  Speaker 3: thirty many of the guys, because they're showing off to
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: see how many wants they can do, they go to
• 18:01
  Speaker 3: the bathroom and expunge.
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Okay, moving on to our other program, the jump program,
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: which is max strength. We're calling it agility. Happens max
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: strength and power. So what does that look like and
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: what's the skill that you have to have in there?
• 18:26
  Speaker 3: When we look at what happens to us as we
• 18:30
  Speaker 3: age our bone and our muscle and our strength, it
• 18:34
  Speaker 3: peaks all things being equal, around twenty to thirty years
• 18:38
  Speaker 3: of age. In fact, there's data to show that your
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: bone mass that you have in your late teens as
• 18:43
  Speaker 3: a female is probably the peak that you're going to
• 18:45
  Speaker 3: get after menopause and the protective effect of estrogen on
• 18:50
  Speaker 3: bone is no longer with us. We need other ways
• 18:55
  Speaker 3: to affect muscle and bone, and the most effective way,
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: more effective than medication, is bone loading. And there are
• 19:04
  Speaker 3: two ways that we can load bone. We can put
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: it under a bending force, which is what happens with
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: weight training, and we can put it under a compression
• 19:13
  Speaker 3: force or a collision force is maybe another way to
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: think of it. And that's what happens when we jump.
• 19:20
  Speaker 3: So that's one aspect. The other aspect is that as
• 19:24
  Speaker 3: we age, we have muscle fibers that start to deteriorate
• 19:29
  Speaker 3: and then eventually die, and we've got slow and fastwitch.
• 19:32
  Speaker 3: I think most people appreciate that, but we don't lose
• 19:35
  Speaker 3: them at the same rate. We lose fast twitch first
• 19:39
  Speaker 3: and slow twitch rarely. We tend to die with our
• 19:43
  Speaker 3: slow twitch, but we absolutely lose our fastwitch. Why is
• 19:47
  Speaker 3: this important? And studies that go across longitudinal data, they
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: look across the years, so that the first indicity of
• 19:56
  Speaker 3: performance that change after menopause is power by a long way,
• 20:02
  Speaker 3: and then strength and then muscle mass. So we often
• 20:05
  Speaker 3: talk about protecting muscle as we age very important, but
• 20:10
  Speaker 3: we lose power at double the rate of that, and
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: power is the ability of muscle to generate force quickly.
• 20:19
  Speaker 3: When we say, well, why do we care, that's what
• 20:23
  Speaker 3: prevents all falls. So strength and power is your ability.
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: If you're walking along a street and the street is
• 20:30
  Speaker 3: slightly edged upwards, if you hit that and trip, that's
• 20:35
  Speaker 3: the strength and power of your hip flexes and the
• 20:37
  Speaker 3: extenses to hip flex the extends put your foot down
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: or out to the side. And as you said, it
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: was a bit grim. But as we age, if you
• 20:46
  Speaker 3: break the hip, which is a side would fall, it's
• 20:49
  Speaker 3: about our one in two points something chance of dying
• 20:53
  Speaker 3: within a year because you've lost complete independence. There's considerable
• 20:58
  Speaker 3: bed rest and people just don't look cover from it.
• 21:01
  Speaker 3: So we are really interested in as early as possible.
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: When's the best time to start yesterday of increasing muscle, Yes,
• 21:09
  Speaker 3: increasing strength definitely, and increasing power. And the best way
• 21:13
  Speaker 3: to improve power is with lighter loaded, explosive, jumping, dynamic movements.
• 21:20
  Speaker 3: And that's why we've designed agility happens.
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: So how do we when we look at bone and
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: if we're taking someone let's just give an example of
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: someone that is osteopinia, so they're kind of they're they're
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: clearly at risk. How long does it take to change
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: the bone. I'm guessing it's not a couple of sessions.
• 21:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, let's look at it in the time course changes
• 21:48
  Speaker 3: of the metrics that matter. Strength changes really quickly, and
• 21:53
  Speaker 3: you will all know this. If you've not lifted weights
• 21:56
  Speaker 3: and you do something and then a few weeks later
• 21:58
  Speaker 3: you realize you've gone up twenty five to fifty percent
• 22:01
  Speaker 3: in just a few weeks. We automatically think, wow, the
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: muscle did that, and it's not. It's as we said before,
• 22:07
  Speaker 3: your brain learns what you're doing, so strength goes up,
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: then muscle follows afterwards, but we don't see appreciable change
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: in muscle from maybe ten to twelve weeks. So anything
• 22:19
  Speaker 3: under that is what we call neural. That's your brain
• 22:23
  Speaker 3: coordinating your muscle. So strength neural gains very quick. Muscle
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: true architectural change. Call it three months bone a year.
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: But the good news is if your strength and muscle
• 22:38
  Speaker 3: are going up, you know your bone is going up.
• 22:40
  Speaker 3: What we just need enough time and often what you'll
• 22:44
  Speaker 3: see is if you measured it with DEXA, you would
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: see a very small change in bone. It goes up,
• 22:50
  Speaker 3: but that's not the story. The story is if you
• 22:52
  Speaker 3: were sedentary and didn't train, your bone actually goes down.
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: So we're looking at this gap because you would have
• 22:59
  Speaker 3: ordinarily gone down. And this is often lost when you
• 23:02
  Speaker 3: read studies to say they did bone loading. If you
• 23:06
  Speaker 3: look at the lift more study, Lift more one and
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: lift more two heavy strength training, and they improved bone densities, right,
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: but it didn't look like a lot, but the controller
• 23:17
  Speaker 3: lost bone. So when you look at that gap, that's huge,
• 23:20
  Speaker 3: that's absolutely significant.
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: Okay, I'm going to put you on the spot here.
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: You always can answer the questions. So are you aware
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: of any study? I'm just curious about the post metal
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: puzzle crowd, and you know, is there a study on
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: women that like how much muscle they're able to gain?
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: Because it's significantly harder once once we're post metal puzzle
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: to gain muscle. We know that we can do it,
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: but is there any kind of ballpark with that as
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: far as like growing muscle for someone that is just
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: like getting into it.
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we always are looking at the three metrics that
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: we want to monitor and improve, and that is muscle, mass, strength,
• 24:09
  Speaker 3: and bone.
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: Bone.
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: You're not going to know unless you have a DEXA scan,
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: say once a year or once every two years. My
• 24:16
  Speaker 3: bone expert friends would say, unless there's something to worry about,
• 24:19
  Speaker 3: every two years is just fine for a DEXA scan
• 24:23
  Speaker 3: for looking at bone. Luckily we look at muscle in
• 24:26
  Speaker 3: the same way. But if we have other methods as well,
• 24:29
  Speaker 3: you can use bioelectrical impedance, which is cheap as chips,
• 24:33
  Speaker 3: and you can do it all the time. There's downsides
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: to that. Of course, the DEXA would be better, So
• 24:40
  Speaker 3: you might then choose to get a DEXA scan once
• 24:42
  Speaker 3: a year and get information on bone and muscle at
• 24:44
  Speaker 3: the same time. Your question is, well, how much could
• 24:47
  Speaker 3: we expect to see well in studies that have looked
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: at the postmenopausal women, which by the way, is my
• 24:53
  Speaker 3: absolute favorite population group to work with, because the benefit
• 24:58
  Speaker 3: of exercise across the spectrum from intervals to Zone two
• 25:02
  Speaker 3: to weight training to power training is so profound for
• 25:06
  Speaker 3: healthy aging, so profound, So it's my absolute favorite population
• 25:09
  Speaker 3: to work with. In studies, they show from minimal change
• 25:14
  Speaker 3: in muscle to going up a number of pounds in
• 25:18
  Speaker 3: twelve sixteen weeks, depending on how long the study is.
• 25:22
  Speaker 3: The problem here is that when you compare that to
• 25:24
  Speaker 3: studies of men, it's the same. In other words, sometimes
• 25:29
  Speaker 3: men show very little change in muscle, and some remarkable.
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: There are huge into individual.
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: Differences in growing muscle.
• 25:38
  Speaker 3: What interests the coach is, well, why didn't you respond?
• 25:41
  Speaker 2: Do you need more volume? Do you need more frequency?
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: Are you under eating? And so forth?
• 25:46
  Speaker 3: And that's where the coach gets involved where the researcher can't.
• 25:50
  Speaker 3: But I look at the data like every other person
• 25:53
  Speaker 3: doesn't say, well, there is huge variation. But Haley, it
• 25:57
  Speaker 3: doesn't so much matter about the muscle. It matters about
• 26:00
  Speaker 3: the strength and the power and the bone. Everyone improves strength, power,
• 26:04
  Speaker 3: and bone even if muscle cross sectional surface area doesn't
• 26:09
  Speaker 3: improve significantly.
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: Okay, So last question before we wrap this up, and
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: this may be just your opinion if there's not a
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: good study, but is there is there a study? Number one?
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: Number two? Like, how relevant would it be for if
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: women are like what if it if you take a
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: group of menopausal women and you put some on HRT
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: and you put like the other group is not? Is
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: there a difference? Are you aware of a study and
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: the difference of how much muscle or bone or whatever?
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: We just talked about versus maybe just like that not
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: doing anything, or maybe your opinion if there's not a study.
• 26:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there isn't robust data yet on this field, not
• 27:02
  Speaker 3: that I'm aware. So if I've missed something, I'm sure
• 27:06
  Speaker 3: someone will send it into us. It's been a really
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: difficult area to study because of the historical views on
• 27:14
  Speaker 3: hormone replacement therapy and by the time that the tides
• 27:18
  Speaker 3: are certainly changing, but it takes a while for research
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: to catch up and get the ethics approval. Now, I'm
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: in a fortunate position that I've trained a number of
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: females through menopause, and I have a number who are
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: now approaching seventy or in their seventies, and I started
• 27:33
  Speaker 3: training them when they're in their forties, So we went
• 27:36
  Speaker 3: through it all. Also, as luck would have it, about
• 27:40
  Speaker 3: fifty percent chose HRT and fifty percent did not.
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: Interesting, really interesting.
• 27:49
  Speaker 3: I am a fan of HRT in the right scenarios
• 27:55
  Speaker 3: for the right person. Weight training does wonders full stop,
• 28:00
  Speaker 3: because it is mechanically inducing what estrogen was doing, and
• 28:05
  Speaker 3: we have the hormonal protection of bone and muscle, but
• 28:08
  Speaker 3: we also have the mechanically induced effect on bone muscle
• 28:11
  Speaker 3: interacting with protein in the diet, and we can get
• 28:15
  Speaker 3: stunning results without hormone replacement therapy. Let's be clear, if
• 28:19
  Speaker 3: you choose to not do this and the vasomotor symptoms
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: don't concern you and you're happy to go without hormonal therapy,
• 28:25
  Speaker 3: there is no reason why you can't improve muscle strength
• 28:30
  Speaker 3: and bone until your marginal years in life. There's no question,
• 28:34
  Speaker 3: and that has been absolutely studied that that is beyond dispute.
• 28:39
  Speaker 3: The question I think that you're teasing out is could
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: you get better benefits with HRT. That is yet to
• 28:45
  Speaker 3: be determined in science, but I have most certainly seen
• 28:48
  Speaker 3: that in practice.
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so have I, and I honestly would change my
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: tune as well. I don't obviously I don't have a say,
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: but I support my clients with what choice they have.
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: I'm not there yet, but it is really interesting just
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: from my you know, my own observations. But I love
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: that you said, you know, the mechanical what muscle is
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: doing with weight training really brings that into play, and
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: I think it's an exciting space to watch because over
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: the next five ten years, we're going to have more
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: information than we've ever had on this population absolutely.
• 29:30
  Speaker 3: Unfortunately, a lot of the studies that are coming out
• 29:34
  Speaker 3: are using week. What we're really interested in is the androgens,
• 29:39
  Speaker 3: and the androgen has the most effect on muscle mass,
• 29:44
  Speaker 3: and that's what we're really interested in. But every time
• 29:48
  Speaker 3: we send away blood work on the non the postmenopausal
• 29:52
  Speaker 3: and just clarify, you said menopausal woman, but you obviously
• 29:55
  Speaker 3: met postmenopausal woman when we look at testostera often comes
• 30:00
  Speaker 3: back as unmeasurable. In other words, the lab can't find
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: it in the system. Yes, you can mechanically by other means,
• 30:09
  Speaker 3: not hormonal related, improve bone muscle strength, no question. Again,
• 30:14
  Speaker 3: that is beyond dispute, and they've done studies in the
• 30:17
  Speaker 3: ninety year old female population group, so we know this
• 30:21
  Speaker 3: to be the case. We are advocates of lifting at
• 30:23
  Speaker 3: all ages, but it doesn't make sense to me that
• 30:27
  Speaker 3: you can't support the system from the other side. So
• 30:30
  Speaker 3: what is mechanical tension lifting jumping the other is by
• 30:35
  Speaker 3: creating a hormonal environment that is anabolic, and that's where
• 30:39
  Speaker 3: we see quite remarkable changes across the spectrum, not just
• 30:43
  Speaker 3: from mood and libido and well being, but also its
• 30:46
  Speaker 3: effect on the ability to lift more load and recover
• 30:50
  Speaker 3: faster between sessions, and we can prop that testosterone. The
• 30:53
  Speaker 3: physician can take testosterone from zero unmeasurable up to one
• 30:57
  Speaker 3: and a half to two that's what it would have
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: been like in your twenties, and then we just say
• 31:03
  Speaker 3: this enormous jump up in strength and they hold that through.
• 31:06
  Speaker 3: So I think that that conversation should be also not
• 31:10
  Speaker 3: just estrogen progesterone related, but should also be what about
• 31:15
  Speaker 3: testosterone as well?
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: One million percent? And I do have to say it's
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: a doozy in the United States of America because you
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: cannot get it unless you go in for low libido.
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: That is the only reason. And then when you get it,
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: it's just not like you know, the Pellette versus.
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: The Korean Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: So lots to get through. But I feel like once
• 31:39
  Speaker 1: we get through some of those hurdles, because this conversation
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: is not going away, that we can maybe start having
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: those tests that provide better feedback for us and women
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: in this sage group.
• 31:51
  Speaker 3: Yeah, which is remarkable. In Australia, it's not really under
• 31:55
  Speaker 3: debate anymore.
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: So.
• 31:57
  Speaker 3: The estrogens and the testosterones, uh hand it out freely
• 32:03
  Speaker 3: for the postmenopausal woman and It is so great that
• 32:08
  Speaker 3: my female clientele able to have access to hormonal therapy
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: that will help them age.
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: Well.
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: Well, another thing, another reason I'm coming down there, pick up,
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: pick up all the drugs that you can't get or
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: in America we can later the drugs. All right, well, great,
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much, Tony. This is fantastic. I'm so
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: excited for these courses to launch next week and we
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: would love to hear what you have to say about
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: them once you have given them a go. As the
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: Aussies would say, thanks for listening. If you enjoyed this episode,
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: please consider giving us a five star review and sharing
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: the body Pod with your friends. Until next time, I
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: am