Latest / The BIG LIFE / NWSL Dumps the Draft; Changes and Navigating the Future of Women's Soccer and an Emotional Senior Night for Jordyn

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NWSL Dumps the Draft; Changes and Navigating the Future of Women's Soccer and an Emotional Senior Night for Jordyn · The BIG LIFE

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Hi, everyone, and welcome back to The Big Life.
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Jordan, the list of our topics are next to me right now, and I am so excited
1:11
to get into a dialogue about all of this, but my biggest question I think of
1:15
the day, how was senior night?
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It was emotional. I think it was emotional for reasons that were expected and
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some reasons that were unexpected.
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You know, third game of the season, it is quite soon in the season to have a
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senior night to kind of honor what's supposed to be the end.
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But yeah, a lot of tears were shed between me and my mom. You know,
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my whole family was there. So it was nice. It was a special night. It was very emotional.
1:45
It, you know, and I think we'll get into it a little bit later about maybe some
1:49
of the reasons it was emotional that were unexpected.
1:51
But my teammates, inspired by you and Iowa, they had written letters this year.
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And I got through maybe three sentences of my first letter before I just turned
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into a puddle before the game.
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And I was like, okay, I need to save these.
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So I couldn't read them until after the game. And.
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It was the nicest thing ever, I think. And it was so amazing because to have
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these people that I think just change your life and you so desperately are trying
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to hang on to and just to have that gratitude and those expressions in words
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and in writing that I get to keep forever,
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I think was such a special moment. And I definitely shed a lot of tears over that.
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And although it's not the end and I'm not saying goodbye yet,
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it does kind of, you know, bring about those that sadness of the reality that
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I'm eventually going to.
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But I think that's may just be like one of the hardest things I'm going to have
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to do because I think they, you know, this group of girls and these teammates
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and my roommates and these friends and this life I created at Michigan State,
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it may just be like the best thing that's ever happened to me.
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And I'm even the idea of saying goodbye is so emotional.
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So it was it was a moment I just yeah
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no it makes total sense if anything I mean
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hey if this podcast has done one thing I'm happy that that Iowa tradition
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went to Michigan State because I remember opening my
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letters and I still have them honestly
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like I probably will bring them back to Sweden in January just
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because like you said like you know your relationships
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and you know in your heart but like when you have it written down
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and people took time to do that for you
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it hits hits different so I'm glad that you
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got that experience because it definitely that's the biggest thing
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I'll ever remember from my senior night oh yeah yeah
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it was really nice and with that though there's
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some big hits this weekend senior nights all over
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but a couple other major things that happened in the big life so let's go to
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big moments in the big life all right let's get it going with UCLA center back
3:48
Lily Real dribbling 85 yards to score the game winner for UCLA to win 1-0 against
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Cal Poly. Jordan, have you seen this video?
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I have. I've seen the clip. It's been posted everywhere, almost as much as the
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next one we're going to talk about.
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But I mean, as a left center back, I'm almost like more impressed that she like
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didn't go and pass the ball.
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Like she was driven to goal the entire time that girl was
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determined it wasn't the prettiest goal I've ever seen but like
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85 yards that is impressive I was
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like I think I was more I know like as a center back sometimes those dribbling
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windows just open and it almost feels like people don't see it coming and so
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like it's oddly open because everyone else is marked but she just took it down
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the middle and then I think the most impressive thing was it wasn't a glory
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shot you know from From upper 90.
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She gets tackled in the box. Gets back up and pulls a total forward move.
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And gets her own rebound.
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This clip was unreal. Obviously UCLA off to a good start. 4-0.
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Everyone predicted big things out of them in the Big Ten this year.
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But that was definitely something special.
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To keep their win over Cal Poly. Who honestly is a very underrated team.
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Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It was quite an impressive goal. Congrats to her and their team.
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You know, I don't think there's, like you said, any much surprise that they're on the streak here.
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They're definitely one of the teams everyone's looking at to make quite the run.
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So yeah and speaking of runs
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you know we have to do it I know you guys know
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we're going to talk about it and I feel like since we are a news source that
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covers women's soccer's week in and week out we have a right to talk about it
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unlike maybe other news sources that don't cover women's soccer but love to
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only publish when things like this happen but Rudd curse women's soccer let's talk about it.
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Jordan, what was your reaction to the viral clip?
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I mean, honestly, I kind of loved it.
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Like, that was awesome. I think you see a lot of that like emotion and aggression
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in men's sports or different things like that.
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I don't know if I've ever really seen a fight in women's soccer.
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And that was like, dirty.
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I mean, we're grabbing hair, they were throwing punches. I mean,
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there There was uppercuts. They were punching down at the girl at one point.
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It was crazy. I want to know. I'm curious to see what the repercussions will
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be for that. Obviously, red cards were given.
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But going into, because this is the first time, like future repercussions,
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what the team will do, how this will be handled.
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Because it was not like, it wasn't an even fight. The girl was on the ground.
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And she was getting kicked and punched and hair pulled and fighting for her life.
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So it was crazy. crazy and there wasn't anything like it was an obvious foul,
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they tried to do a quick restart, girl was in the way like it wasn't,
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anything that would you know call for that sort
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of aggression or anger so I'm curious to see what happened
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prior to that if they were going at it all game or if there's some
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sort of build up to that moment because the actual clip and
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the actual foul that happened in that moment does
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not call it doesn't it's not even on the girl that was fouled so it doesn't
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even call for that to begin with so I'm just curious as to how how things got
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so tense so quickly no honestly I think that's the question on everyone's mind
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so if you've lived under a rock in the 35th minute of the Rutgers versus UMass game this Sunday.
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There was a fistfight on the field between two players or a player on each team.
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And yeah, I think I have a lot of different thoughts on this.
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Like I said, I kind of already said the one.
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I love how I woke up and it was like an ESPN notification.
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And I think like as news sources that don't always focus on women's soccer,
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we only focus on it when like things like this happen. And I think that's really unfortunate.
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And that says a lot. And I think the other thing is like you said,
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i don't obviously don't punch people like
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that's a normal thing but we're not advocating for
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that but there is a sense of the fact that
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women's sports can be as aggressive as men's sports
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and i feel like we expect women's sports to everyone to be friends and we all
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have to love each other and you know like this is a totally different situation
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but i had our rivalry game this weekend and our fans are chanting like you guys
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are better the other team sucks like in swedish obviously but But,
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you know, like they have all these chants about all this.
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And the other team is like, we love everyone. No hate.
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And there is this big article about like the different fan bases.
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But I was like, that's honestly embarrassing to me. Like you would never be
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at a men's game and be like, oh, my God, everyone is great. And we're all friends and we need to smile.
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But there's an expectation that women's sports need to act that way.
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And I think that's totally unfair and unprecedented.
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And so obviously, I don't think people should get punched. But there is an aggressive
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side of the sport. And I think it's about time we talk about it.
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Absolutely. I'm interested in your take with the coverage because you can go
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one of two ways. You can go like this is unfair.
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You could go all coverage is good coverage. And when you look at like I think
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my take on it, which may differ from yours, is when you look at the WNBA and
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the explosion and you had the Caitlin Clark Angel Reese rivalry,
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you had this type of, you know, going back and forth aggression with it.
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Is that what we need as women's soccer to grow our sport.
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Is this something where you look at and people like the aggression and they
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like how emotional it gets and this helps to grow our sport further with the media coverage?
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Or is this something where you think it's a bad look for the sport and for the program?
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Yeah, that's a fair question. And I don't know, like, I definitely wouldn't
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say it's a bad look or a bad, you know, bad face of the sport.
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I just find it interesting that this is the headlines we get.
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You know, even national championship, you
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still see NCAA double a tournament yes of course angel reese
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caitlin clark that was a whole new heights and that's a
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heights i hope college soccer can get to and i
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think we have the worth and the storylines and everything to get
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there but it's when we have new sources and twitter and this is like when we
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only talk about this perspective then this creates the perception to the average
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person that isn't as invested that this is all it is we only care when stuff
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like this happens like Like,
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how many ESPN headlines has it been when men get in fistfights?
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And we know that happens in men's college soccer all the time.
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So why is it a thing when women do it? And that's where I see a really big disparity.
10:02
Gotcha. I think that makes sense. Yeah. I think it also raises a bigger question.
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And I think this is a question going into the Big Ten is, Rutgers,
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three seasons ago, my junior year, were a Final Four NCAA team.
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Now they're starting off their season 1-1-1, and they have a loss to UMass,
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which frankly is an overly and over highly rated women's college soccer program.
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What do we think has happened to Rutgers in the last three years to get them
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from the high of highs to where they're at maybe now? Yeah, I think.
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I think this is just something you kind of naturally see sometimes in sports
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where, was it something where they're in a low now, they've had a couple bad
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recruiting classes, you have different sorts of funding,
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maybe they're not able to keep up with the competition of NIL money,
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things of that nature where we don't know necessarily.
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I think NIL opened up a lot of questions in terms of how the recruiting process
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works and what schools are able to compete and not.
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I think you'd have to look at sort of the financials of things and the aspect
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that we We don't have that information, too, but we can speculate on maybe it's
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that or did three years ago.
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They just got really lucky and they had some stars in there that they didn't
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expect or maybe weren't supposed to be as good or decided to go to Rutgers.
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You know, I think this is they're definitely better, I think,
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and in better shape than Michigan is.
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But same thing, Michigan won the Big Ten a couple of years ago and now they
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are not doing so hot these past few years. So is it just like a natural turnover
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rate where you have some bad recruiting classes, or is this something that they're
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going to need to look at revamping this program?
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Yeah, it's an interesting question. We've had the same coach there for a while
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who's been there for so, so many highs.
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I think he's a very high-level coach. And, you know, you still have their name-bearing players.
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I mean, when they were a Final Four team, they have Amara Ali,
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Gabby Provozano, Megan McClelland, who are all three professionals right now
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playing in the U.S., two in the NWSL, one in the USL Super League.
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But then you have Riley Tiernan, who was a freshman that year,
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adding so much to that class.
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And maybe I wonder if it's a question of they had so many stars that you couldn't
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handle all of them in some regards.
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And then in others, now you only have a Riley Tiernan, and that's their big
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name. So you can focus on her in a scouting report.
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And so there's definitely a lot of questions going on.
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And I think that the very viral sensation of their last game will kind of put
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a spotlight on them for the rest of the season and see kind of where the trajectory
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goes from here. Thank you.
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Absolutely. So with that, you say being 1-1-1, most teams have had three games thus far.
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However, Indiana and Minnesota have only played two games.
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Do we think this is good, bad, indifferent that they've had,
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you know, one less game than everyone else, maybe two less games than everyone
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else at this point in the season? Yeah, I think it's a really interesting move.
12:43
So for people who don't necessarily know, like obviously you have your conference
12:48
play, which typically starts around the second week of September,
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let's just say around that mid-September timeframe.
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And until then you have non-conference play. I have always seen it in my college
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career personally until last year that we played eight games.
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So it was four weeks, you played two games a week, and that was kind of how
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it was. Last year was the first time we stepped it down to seven games.
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But I have never seen where the first two weeks of season, instead of playing
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the typical four games where UCLA is 4-0, we now have Minnesota and Indiana who are 2-0 each.
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I think the questions of this really come for me is there's a certain point of saving your legs.
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And like I have been there, those late October legs, they can get you.
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And I respect kind of like declining
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those games to really focus on maybe what you see as your big ones.
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But especially in a Minnesota case they have two
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wins but they haven't necessarily played two highly ranked
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opponents so if you're trying to build a resume that if you don't win the big
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10 you're going for an at-large bid in the NCAA tournament having less games
13:52
played and those games played not necessarily being against big opponents I
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think is a huge strike against you absolutely I think.
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I can understand you doing three game style where you have your first game be
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hard, kind of what we did, where your first game's hard, you have a week off
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to your second game, and then you kind of get into those, you know,
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two games a week type of schedule.
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One, prep you for conference play. That's going to be Thursday, Sunday.
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And two, if you're only playing these two games and you're focused on saving
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these legs so much and putting such a large emphasis on it, I'm wondering what
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their substitution rate is.
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Like let's say you want just two
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hard games throw in a third one that you know you
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can win where you can see the depth of your roster and your program get
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them game minutes get maybe some of these freshmen or newer players out
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onto the field where you can actually see what they're capable of because training
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is one thing but I mean you're never going to be able to replicate some of this
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until you get into an actual game you know and there's some players who are
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just game players you know and to be able to see what you're really capable
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of as a roster as a school and as a program,
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I think it's dangerous to not take advantage of all the time you have to really
15:02
get ready for conference season.
15:04
Yeah, I completely agree. And obviously, I would never want to speak this to
15:08
existence, but you never know when that player that's been playing all 90 minutes
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might not be able to, whether it be injury, sickness, whatever happens.
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And are you going to throw in someone that has no experience because you haven't
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played the games where you're able to get them experience to then go in?
15:22
So I think you raise a great question in that and
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we'll see if this risk reward that they're doing
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pays off but it's definitely going to be something very interesting to track going
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into Big Ten play as non-conference play is now halfway
15:34
over absolutely speaking of experienced and
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big-time players you have Ohio State's with the first
15:40
half hat trick incredibly impressive she's
15:43
someone I actually got the opportunity to play against a lot growing up back
15:46
in my left outside back days I
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got to mark her a lot and she's someone that you just kind of always watched and
15:53
you knew he was going to be a big name in college so honestly really
15:56
happy for her to see the success she's been having and I
15:59
don't think it comes as much of a surprise that she was able to pull this off
16:02
yeah I think she's unfortunately a player
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that's kind of fallen to scheme of other big names around her whether it be
16:08
Kayla Fisher Emma Sears other big names that have been in the Ohio State program
16:13
so I think she's a very big threat and I think it's really good for her to finally
16:17
see some of her flowers that maybe she hasn't always gotten that recognition
16:21
for and I think it says a lot about the Ohio State program.
16:24
This is another program that I feel like always gets their way into the Big
16:28
Ten tournament, always somehow sneaks their way in there, you know,
16:31
does something to make it happen and always is an NCAA contender team.
16:35
So to see them off to a really great start already this year with some big time
16:39
players, it's going to be it's a program that I feel like isn't always talked
16:42
about, but it's always relevant somehow.
16:44
Yeah, absolutely. I definitely agree with that take. So yeah,
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going to be a very, very interesting one.
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And that is the big moments in the big life.
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But Jordan, this week brought so many other news stories that we have got to cover.
16:59
And I know I've been dying to talk to you about all of this.
17:02
So let's hit it with the big news that dropped this week.
17:05
Okay. I mean, I think the biggest thing that everyone's looking at is the NWSL.
17:10
They they changed a bunch of their rules, but the big one being that they officially
17:13
got rid of the college draft.
17:16
You have everyone speculating what those potential impacts are going to be.
17:19
This was a huge thing for college students and college girls that they looked
17:23
forward to being able to enter their name and go into that draft.
17:27
And you kind of have this speculation of what is this going to look like and
17:31
how is this going to work in the future?
17:33
Yeah. So the new CBA has
17:36
officially been passed by the NWSL Players Association and
17:39
has been signed on by other members of the nwsl and with that brought a few
17:44
changes some of them being significantly that there is free agency when contracts
17:49
are expired players are supposed to be able to be notified and have a conversation
17:53
before trades happen there's supposed to be more.
17:57
Transparency and honoring of contracts which isn't always a thing in the nwsl
18:02
but one of the biggest headlines, as we know, is officially the NWSL college draft is gone.
18:08
And I woke up to this news and immediately started thinking about what this meant.
18:13
And I have a lot of different thoughts. And I think we are two very unique people
18:17
to have it as someone who is a senior in college and has someone who has just gone through the draft.
18:22
And yeah, I think my first initial reaction is honestly, thank God.
18:28
As someone who went through the draft process, I am extremely thankful for the
18:32
opportunities that I was blessed through it.
18:34
That being said, it was one of the worst and probably most unfair processes
18:38
that I've been through in my life.
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And I don't think it is good for any party.
18:45
And so I think because of that, finally, the draft going away,
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which I know is something that's been being pushed for a while, is a pretty good thing.
18:53
What was your instant reaction to this news, Jordan?
18:57
Jordan. Well, I would like to hear a little bit more about your thoughts on
19:00
why it was bad as someone who hasn't been through it and just an outside perspective
19:04
from always hasn't been watching soccer and kind of into that space.
19:09
I thought it was really exciting and a cool moment to get to share with your
19:12
friends and family and all that stuff.
19:14
And it was similar to all the other American sports we've seen where all these
19:19
big sports, you watch the basketball draft, you You watch the football draft.
19:21
Like that's the big thing. You watch these college players or players in general
19:26
enter the draft, enter their name and sign their pro careers.
19:30
So I am interested on your take as someone who has been through it and has been
19:34
watching as to why women's soccer would be different than any of the other sports
19:38
that already have a draft here.
19:39
Yeah. And I think that's a great point. And a great thing to note is that the
19:43
NWSL is officially the first major sporting league in the U.S.
19:47
That had a draft to then get rid of the draft. and I think it's creating a lot of conversation.
19:52
For me, I think the world's changed and I don't necessarily think that women's
19:56
soccer is different than the other sports.
19:57
I think I've seen a push for other sports to also get rid of their draft process,
20:02
especially when we have been professionalizing college sports more and more.
20:07
It feels weird to be professionalizing that avenue and then go through a draft process.
20:12
And here's the issue I have with the draft process. us.
20:15
As someone who went through it, and trust me, my moment of hearing my name called
20:19
and having that, I'm very, very grateful for it.
20:22
And I know if the draft wasn't there, I wouldn't have had that.
20:26
On the outside of the flashiness of it, and you get that big moment,
20:32
and you get everyone texting you, and you get your pictures taken and all this stuff,
20:36
I think there's a very big misconception on what that actually means and how things should work.
20:44
And what I mean by that is the NWSL at this moment, due to roster cap sizes,
20:51
you know, you could not have more than 26 members on a NWSL roster.
20:55
And a recent push, I would say, for the NWSL to really go after big international
21:00
players that have these big international careers and have been professional all their lives,
21:05
that creates less opportunities for college players to get drafted and then make the roster.
21:12
And I think a lot of people see that getting your drafted is means you're on
21:16
the team. And that is not the case at all.
21:18
And I know that, you know, I've talked about my own story and we know that that to be true.
21:22
But it's really hard to tell other people that. And I know people were like
21:26
in my family, like buying racing Louisville stuff. And I was like,
21:29
no, don't. I haven't made the team yet.
21:31
And that was a really big, like misunderstanding in that kind of regard.
21:35
I think with that, you draft 54 new people got drafted last year.
21:39
And I don't know the exact number. I'm not going to pretend like I do,
21:42
but I would venture to bet probably half actually are in the NWSL right now.
21:47
So why go through this process where you're drafting players,
21:50
claiming their rights into the NWSL, having some people not look into other
21:55
opportunities where they might actually play and develop and actually make a roster,
21:59
but we're going to claim these 50 players to go to the state where they may
22:03
not necessarily have chosen or see a fit for them and then cut them because
22:10
they don't have other options, but we own their rights.
22:12
And I think this is the inherent issue is right now there's not the space and
22:16
the NWSL to support for the draft class coming in.
22:19
And that hurts those that get
22:20
drafted. I think the also issue is you don't necessarily get to choose.
22:25
I'm very happy and very thankful for my time at Louisville, but who's to say
22:28
if I didn't get drafted somewhere else that my experience would have been different
22:32
or my outcome would have been different.
22:34
But I had no say in that manner. And I think that as an athlete,
22:38
it's the the same. It's going back to college recruiting. It's stocking rosters.
22:41
How many left backs do they have? Who do I want to learn under?
22:44
What coach do I have a relationship? Where is my in?
22:47
And I didn't have any chance to do that research myself.
22:49
And that gave me no say. And I think that that is where players feel like they're
22:53
pawns and they're numbers.
22:55
And I think getting rid of the draft takes away that part of an athlete being
22:58
a number and you're an athlete. And I think that gives a lot of power back to the players.
23:04
That's something I haven't really thought of, but I absolutely love that take.
23:08
And I think that the correlation between the professionalism of college soccer,
23:14
it does, this getting rid of the draft does lead to a smoother transition to
23:18
the NWSL because it's going to be a much similar process to what you already have been through.
23:23
In addition, I think a lot of the girls I've seen sign contracts in the NWSL were not drafted.
23:30
They got to go and they tried out for three, four different teams.
23:33
Games and, you know, do these different things with them.
23:36
And they ended up finding a home there versus people who got drafted,
23:39
had their rights, and then unfortunately didn't make that roster,
23:43
but had nowhere else to go.
23:45
I think the other thing this leads is the NWSL was set up for a lot of success
23:49
for the past four years with the COVID year, because any athlete who needed
23:55
to finish out their academics could do it now in four and a half years.
23:59
And then you would go and in the fall, you would enter the draft and you would
24:02
be done and go ahead and have that pro route.
24:05
Without that COVID year, the academic portion becomes you have to graduate in
24:10
three and a half years, which isn't always necessarily possible.
24:13
So you have girls either deciding to leave without a degree or you have the
24:16
semester where you finished out your degree and now what?
24:20
Because now the NWSL, that period is over. And where do you go?
24:24
You have to go overseas until the USL happen.
24:28
So my curiosity is how this will impact the USL as well.
24:32
If you don't have the NWSL draft, you have girls having these more options,
24:37
and you have the USL that's competing with the NWSL now, are girls going to
24:42
decide to finish out their degree in their four years?
24:44
And then the natural course would be to enter the USL instead of the NWSL because
24:49
that's the way your academic calendar falls.
24:53
And I'll be interested to see how that works out because I think the draft is
24:56
a big portion of why kids left early and they just entered their name into it
25:00
and were hoping to stay in America for it because the NWSL is a big thing.
25:04
Now you have kind of the option to do both even where you could go try out for
25:08
the NWSL if you don't make it, stay in school, and then do the USL.
25:12
Yeah. I actually didn't think of the academic portion. Naturally,
25:16
that part's way out of my brain. Why would I think about academics?
25:18
So I think you raise a really interesting point. And And I think what's going
25:22
to happen is you take your draft class last year, it was 54 people.
25:26
So let's just say 50 people.
25:28
I would venture to guess that we're going to see 12 to 15 max girls go straight to college to the NWSL.
25:36
And I think that the interesting thing that this is going to create is this
25:41
year, specifically, we have a double class.
25:43
Like you were just saying, this is the last year for fifth years.
25:46
Plus you have all the girls that don't have their fifth years, but only our seniors.
25:50
So you have a double class, and you're going to have less girls going to the NWSL than years before.
25:55
The interesting thing that I had thought of, but you completely almost proved
25:59
me wrong with the academic portion, is what are those girls going to do in December?
26:04
Because yes, the USL is around. I think it's a great another option to have
26:08
in the US, but they're going to be mid-season.
26:10
So are we going to see mass turnover rate in the USL rosters bringing in girls
26:16
from college that just got finished?
26:17
Are we going to see girls getting waived from USL rosters?
26:20
Or is there not going to be really spots for girls that are graduating in December
26:25
and looking for that next pro home in the USL either because they're only halfway
26:29
through their season and most of the rosters are all still around?
26:32
And I think it's going to overall create the USL a more competitive environment
26:36
to get that contract in the US in the next season of USL starting in August of next year.
26:43
But I think there's a lot of questions of what those players are going to do,
26:45
because I don't know realistically how many options are going to be open to the USL.
26:50
So is that still going to drive girls that want to play pro to go overseas?
26:55
Because my other thing is we have seen now two weekends of USL play.
26:59
And if you analyze starting lineups, girls who are getting a lot of minutes
27:02
in the USL, it is heavily skewed towards girls who have been professional for
27:07
multiple years beyond girls that are just fresh out of college.
27:10
The girls that are fresh out of college are on the bench in a couple of cases
27:14
starting, don't get me wrong, but others, majority of the people have had pro
27:19
experience and are now staying in the USL or coming back home.
27:23
So I wonder if it's going to almost create the opposite of the intention and
27:28
require girls to go overseas, get that professional experience to then come
27:31
back home to either play in the NWSL or the USL.
27:34
And so I think overall, there's a couple of massive implications long term that
27:39
I really have no idea how they're going to pay out by the draft going away.
27:42
Yeah, I don't think the draft will necessarily impact that because the same
27:47
spots that were available will continue to be available.
27:50
Now you'll just have those people who originally were kind of stuck because
27:55
their rights were held that now have the option to go overseas and will have that ability to.
28:00
I don't necessarily think that more girls will.
28:03
If you wanted to go to the NWSL, that spot is still available to you.
28:06
You'll still have that option to try out and that roster spot that was available
28:10
will continue to be available but yeah I think this will be really interesting
28:14
and again with some of the other rules with it with the ability to have a conversation
28:19
before you go and get traded and things of that nature to see how that pans out.
28:25
But yeah I think there's a lot of changes and it'll be interesting to see how
28:28
this all pans out in addition to girls maybe going pro earlier versus how that
28:34
affects the age in which kids It's transitioned from either sometimes even high
28:39
school to pro or college to pro and what that kind of looks like for an age range,
28:44
especially with the way college athletics is going.
28:47
And we'll get someone on here to talk more in depth about the way college athletics
28:50
is changing because it is changing very dramatically and very quickly.
28:55
But with it going to more of a professional setup with roster limits at 28 for the college
29:01
level i think it'll it'll be
29:04
interesting to see how this all plays out with both landscapes
29:07
changing so much within this next year you know who's gonna have kind of hold
29:12
more power yeah it's a lot of new territory and i think you know with that i
29:19
think we've hit on the immediate impacts of the draft but i am immediately thinking
29:23
in long term you know and i think just getting rid
29:26
of this college draft, not necessarily that getting rid of the draft makes these
29:30
things possible, but I think it is going to skew what we see the NWSL really doing.
29:36
And I think my prediction is that we're going to shift our soccer to a more European style.
29:42
And I don't think that that's a bad thing at all. I think it's just going to
29:45
be very interesting to see what steps we take with our uniqueness and the world
29:51
of being really the only world where the college soccer is that stepping step.
29:54
And kind of what I mean by this is, as we know, and like you said,
29:58
we're going to talk more as we still even learn about the new changes going into college soccer.
30:02
But we have roster caps of 28 people and scholarships in moments like this are
30:10
also now funded by schools.
30:11
Schools so who's to say that if i'm
30:14
a professional scout and i have tabs on
30:18
joe schmoe in missouri i might
30:21
just have a certain college here's their scholarship money we're gonna have
30:26
them play for you for two years and then we're gonna have them sign pro to get
30:30
that development or how that scampage like i could see a world where college
30:34
almost becomes a feeder team to these professional professional environments
30:37
and kind of use that as a money funneling mechanism.
30:41
Because with NIL, with all these opportunities, nothing really is stopping them
30:45
from using college as a placement hold for the girls that they have their eyes
30:50
on that just need a couple more years or a couple more minutes or whatever that is.
30:54
And because of that, I feel like we're going to see certain universities get
30:59
those opportunities and maybe certain universities not.
31:02
And I think the inherent Transparent naiveness, maybe, of the draft is going
31:08
away of where everyone has a fair shot.
31:10
And everyone puts their name in and we're going to see what happens.
31:13
I know it wasn't exactly the world we lived in, but the draft was a place where
31:16
a girl that played at Iowa who never had anyone drafted could hear her name get called.
31:21
And I think that this officially means that we have moved away from that thinking in a lot of regards.
31:29
So you don't think that in the future, a school that doesn't historically turn
31:34
girls pro will have the option to turn girls pro anymore?
31:37
I think it's going to be a lot harder to get a direct funnel from pro to the NWSL.
31:43
I think it's going to open a lot of doors for either overseas or USL or things like that.
31:48
But my prediction is with this, I
31:52
could see professional professional schools really
31:55
looking at the certain schools that I
31:58
feel like we all can think of that you were your brain would immediately go to
32:01
because if I'm scouting players I'm scouting that school I'm
32:04
scouting the girls committing to that school more than I'm looking at you know
32:08
someone else down the street maybe and so I don't know that's just my prediction
32:11
of where I think that this can go but I feel like it is going to take away from
32:18
those maybe smaller schools where girls are trying to go pro.
32:21
I would have to, I think I agree with that, but not because of the NWSL legislation
32:26
changes, because of the college legislation changes and because college is going
32:30
to become more of a monopoly of those top teams and programs,
32:34
specifically the football teams.
32:36
Because I mean, you know, quickly, like schools that are buying into the media
32:41
rights have to pay their football players $24 million.
32:44
If a university doesn't have that money, which most, Most smaller schools,
32:49
D3, NAIA, they don't have – anyone without a good football team doesn't have that.
32:55
You're creating a monopoly of the top schools and the top programs with the
32:59
best football teams that are then going to funnel down into the rest of your sports.
33:02
With 28 scholarships available now, in theory, they still have to be Title IX
33:07
compliant, whereas the salary basis that you can pay players does not have to be.
33:12
Available that yes I think you can have feeder teams with
33:15
these schools and it will make sense for them to be starting to do
33:18
that and to do those things with those
33:21
kind of top schools that are going to start to separate from the rest and there's
33:24
going to be a lot bigger discrepancy between those top programs and the bottom
33:28
ones where prior everyone could have been on a semi equal playing field now
33:33
I don't even think you're going to get some of those smaller schools to be traveling
33:35
to go play some of the better schools to see where they stand because they can't
33:39
afford forward the travel budget,
33:40
because there will be a lot of budget cuts coming to, I think, everywhere.
33:44
Yeah, no, that's a good point. I think my other question with the NWSL draft
33:48
officially going away, too, is you kind of hit on it, but what age do we really
33:53
think that this is going to make college soccer players go pro?
33:57
And we've seen it more and more, you know, girls after their first or second
34:00
years entering their name in a draft.
34:02
But I feel like you're still looking at the draft pool, evaluating your odds,
34:07
evaluating different things, who's in your class, where's that draft going to
34:11
go, and there's a lot more unknown.
34:13
But if I'm a player and I can have an agent where.
34:17
My pro team is calling me directly saying that they want to offer me this money
34:21
and it's a lot more guaranteed versus the draft and I'm able to have a conversation with that team,
34:27
why wouldn't that leave at 18, at 19, after my first, second year of college
34:31
if I already have a pro team with a contract ready to go.
34:34
There's a lot less risk in girls leaving college early than there was.
34:38
I feel like the girls that left college early were only because they knew that
34:41
they were going to be the first or second draft pick.
34:43
And so I think that this is going to enable girls like who's to say,
34:48
oh, I have a pro offer on the table. My college team isn't doing great. I'm out.
34:52
I feel like those quick decisions are going to happen more too,
34:55
which is going to kind of just open up new terrain in a lot of regards.
35:00
Are you allowed to have an agent now? i'm not
35:02
sure but i think there's going to be a lot of underhand stuff
35:05
legal i think the biggest thing is
35:10
if they open it up because as of right now you're allowed to have an nil agent
35:13
i don't believe you're allowed to have an agent that advocates for your soccer
35:16
ability in any regard still if they open that up where you're allowed to have
35:20
an agent while playing collegiately absolutely i agree 100 that that will be
35:24
happening and with the you know the college landscape turning essentially pro level,
35:31
I do think there's a lot less emphasis on the academic portion where you are here for athletics,
35:36
you're here to play soccer, you're here to be a successful athlete rather than
35:40
a student athlete like it was before.
35:43
In with a lot less emphasis on the academics, you're going to have girls leaving
35:47
college a lot easier and a lot sooner because they don't really care about the
35:51
degree that's coming with their education.
35:53
Yeah, I completely agree. I think overall, the biggest thing that this is, is change.
35:57
And you hit the nail on the head and you said the college landscape is changing
36:00
and officially the pro landscape is too.
36:02
And so I hate to be like, oh, there's so much unknown. Like there is clearly
36:06
stuff we do know within this unknown, but I think the next couple of years,
36:10
We're going to see a massive shift in the soccer landscape in general.
36:14
You know, this is a long shot, but I wouldn't be surprised to start seeing NWSL
36:18
teams launch academies.
36:20
Why wouldn't they have a Kansas City Current Academy that they can grow?
36:24
And honestly, in some ways, we're seeing this.
36:26
I've seen on my social media, I'm not necessarily sure what exactly is going
36:30
on, but there's a bunch of youth players that went with Kansas City Current
36:34
to Spain and were playing like professional organizations in Spain,
36:38
and they were just bringing these youth players along. long.
36:40
There are pro teams right now that are scouting the 16, 17-year-olds before they go to college.
36:45
So what's stopping them from just creating an academy where they bring in their
36:49
own talent, they have their rights, they see their trajectory,
36:53
and it makes the pathway to signing pro without even having that college step a lot more feasible.
36:58
So if it's not official, a Kansas City Current or a Portland Thorns or whatever
37:02
it is, academy, I could see partnerships with club teams very much developing, if that makes sense.
37:08
Yeah, yeah, it does. And like you said, I think there's just so much unknown.
37:12
And as someone who is officially out of it, you know, your perspective,
37:18
I think, is unique and can be exciting to kind of watch as someone who is very
37:23
much still in this landscape.
37:24
I think it's been a bit terrifying and it's impacted, even though I'm on my
37:29
way out, it's impacted a lot of my decision making and my career thus far.
37:33
So So it's been a crazy couple
37:37
of years to watch as women's soccer has kind of taken off and grown and come
37:41
to this point where there's going to be so much change and it's going to look
37:44
so different by the time my sister's 10 years younger than me and by the time
37:49
she's going through all of this and she's looking at her future and even the
37:52
way it's trickled down into club levels and things of that nature,
37:56
it's really crazy to watch how quickly it is all changing.
38:00
Changing yeah and I feel like I was
38:04
in college soccer at such a unique age and I'm very very happy I was when I
38:08
am and it's just going to be interesting to watch this trajectory change but
38:12
I think we could all know that five years from now college soccer pro soccer
38:16
even youth soccer we're not going to have the same landscape absolutely.
38:22
Jordan, with that being said, a lot of news has dropped, but also a lot of stuff's
38:27
going on in our lives as college soccer players and in different aspects of that regard.
38:33
Let's talk a little bit more. How was senior night, and what else was some of
38:37
those unexpected emotions that you maybe had during senior night?
38:41
Yeah, yeah. So as we all know, I have struggled with a knee injury.
38:46
I tore my PCL a couple months ago and due to, I think, miscommunication with
38:52
my medical staff and just some unforeseen and unexpected setbacks, I was out for a while.
39:00
I'm fully healthy now, capable to play.
39:03
But a lot of the conversation I had around my coaching staff and in general,
39:09
There was a lot of uncertainty with me coming back and my return to play.
39:14
I sat the first two games. I did not see the field.
39:18
And going into my senior night, it was a conversation of whether or not I should
39:22
have, would have, could have redshirt.
39:24
In a very panicked text I sent to Sam Carey, I was like, what should I do?
39:29
I ultimately decided to play in my senior night.
39:33
I think I made that decision one out of
39:36
fear because we were talking so much about how the landscape is
39:39
changing with 28 person roster caps anywhere I would
39:41
go means someone would have to get cut for a school to take me
39:44
most likely with the way scholarships are changing you don't know how much money
39:49
a school is going to have a school doesn't know how much money they're going
39:51
to have to be able to offer scholarships to you know students and unless I go
39:56
back home to Ohio I am an out-of-state student which would be a huge financial
40:00
burden to take on in addition to figuring
40:02
out the academic portion of it and what that eligibility would look like as an engineering major,
40:06
credits don't really transfer, unfortunately.
40:09
So I would be a little bit stuck there. And there were so many moving aspects.
40:13
In any other year, I had begged the universe.
40:16
This is all I ever wanted was a fifth year.
40:18
I wanted an extra year in college to figure it out, to reach my potential.
40:23
I feel like I'm just starting to become the person and player I'm supposed to be.
40:28
And I'm not ready for it to end and to have such a huge setback in terms of
40:31
my health and to be out for so long and really kind of I feel like missed my shot for this season.
40:38
You know, any other year it would have been a no-brainer. But because of logistics
40:41
and the way the landscape is changing, I chose to play.
40:44
And I think some of the unexpected emotions that came from it was,
40:48
one, the gratitude of this program, what it's meant for me, what it's given for me.
40:52
All of those things that I expected to feel, but also the sadness of that this
40:59
wasn't supposed to be my story.
41:01
That this isn't how it was supposed to end for me.
41:04
And then, honestly, the second I stepped foot on the field, a little bit of regret.
41:08
I wish hindsight, I think I should have taken my red shirt.
41:11
I did not realize quite how far I had fallen on our roster, which is hard because
41:20
one, I have three years of experience.
41:23
I feel like I've done so much and proven so much. And as a player who has always
41:27
played, you know, at most I've been the number three forward,
41:30
still getting good minutes.
41:32
And I've always been on the field.
41:36
You know, last year I started for most of our games. I've been,
41:39
I've had a successful career thus far.
41:42
I feel like I've proven a lot and I didn't realize, like I said,
41:46
quite how far I had fallen.
41:47
And it felt very much so like I got 14 kind of pity minutes on my senior night
41:53
in a game where, you know, Ohio is a good team, but a game where we were dominating
41:58
and we knew we were going to win and should win.
42:00
It became a realization that if I'm not playing against Ohio,
42:04
it's going going to be very hard for me to play anywhere else and to give
42:07
some more insight on it yes the season's long this is only our third game but
42:10
as someone who's been through the college landscape before just a way our schedule
42:15
works is mondays you're off day tuesday it depends how your coach does it and
42:20
how kind of hard your week was some days everyone trains on tuesdays and sometimes
42:25
it's a regen and a non-regen group so essentially all the players that had high
42:29
lows or good minutes for that week will go and do kind of an active recovery
42:32
cool down session while the bottom half of your roster the people who didn't
42:37
play you know according to the coaching staff will go and they'll train.
42:41
And then Wednesday's your pregame, Thursday's our game, Friday's regen,
42:45
non-regen, Saturday's pregame, Sunday's game, Monday's off.
42:49
So once you get through that preseason phase and you start getting in consistent
42:54
gameplay, you are never really on an equal playing field with the players who are playing.
43:00
You never really get an opportunity to prove yourself again because you're not
43:04
playing against them. You're not playing with your whole team, with your whole roster.
43:09
You're out of time almost. like it's it becomes very
43:12
very hard to work your way out of it
43:14
in addition to just from a player perspective like Mondays are
43:18
off and then your Thursday and Sundays are
43:20
off if you're not playing like you have to figure out a way to go
43:23
and run condition lift get on the ball
43:26
and do all the things that the team that is playing is doing on
43:30
those days because you're sitting on the bench like you have to figure out a
43:33
way to not only close that gap but just really try to prevent it from growing
43:37
every day and every week that you're not playing so with that I think you know
43:43
the realization hit me that that this isn't going to go the way I had hoped or expected and.
43:50
In the moment I think you know I've gone through so many
43:53
emotions since then where you're kind of you're sad you're mourning
43:56
it and it becomes a question of and I got a
43:59
question I guess for you you Sam at what point
44:03
does an athlete when I'm looking
44:06
at this I'm at what point
44:09
are you allowed to be sad at what point do you adjust the expectations for your
44:14
season and at what point do you like not necessarily give up but you have to
44:19
stop being devastated over where you stand and look at the facts that are presented
44:23
while it is only the third game knowing everything I know I I do feel like it's.
44:29
It's hard and I don't necessarily like want to give up, but if I'm continuing
44:33
to be sad over my career, every game, then at what point is that selfish of me? Yeah.
44:39
And does that all come out of being a bad teammate?
44:42
It's an amazing question. And first of all, I think you sharing this is a lot
44:48
because we pride ourselves on being authentic and talking about the highs and
44:52
lows of college soccer and there's highs and lows.
44:55
I think the thing that I also
44:58
am hearing from you without hearing from you knowing a college
45:01
experience is not only do you feel like it's game three
45:04
you also feel like your coaching staff has written you
45:07
off and it's a reality and it's a reality I saw time and time again in my college
45:12
career through other college careers your coaches are there to win games it's
45:18
a business and they care about you my college coach cared a lot about me I'm
45:21
not saying anything about that but it's also their job and their livelihood.
45:25
And with that being said, when they're choosing starting lineups,
45:28
when they're choosing minutes, they have to go with what they trust and they
45:33
trust the people that they're going in day in and day out with.
45:35
And not that they don't trust you as a human or anything else.
45:38
I don't want people to misunderstand that, but there is a business side of college athletics.
45:43
And I think a lot of coaches get into this site of when an athlete is no longer
45:51
beneficial to my goal, they get written off and there's no time for a comeback.
45:56
We all love a comeback story. We love the underdog story of the girl who sat
46:00
the bench and waited their time and their time came.
46:02
And frankly, it happens. There's a girl at Iowa who I'm so proud of that's doing
46:06
it right now, who's playing in my spot as a senior, who never really got a shot
46:10
and got her shot her senior year. And that's great.
46:13
But we also know the other stories
46:14
where you very much get written off and then the new blood comes in.
46:18
And why invest in the old blood when the new blood is going to be there for
46:21
four years and get them the experience to keep growing?
46:24
And even because you're old news now and that sounds so mean,
46:28
but it's true. And it's the ugly side of college talker.
46:32
I think to answer your question, you are now in a phase of your life where you proved it on Sunday.
46:40
You had your senior night. you have done
46:43
so much for your program whether it be on
46:46
the field off the field you know the impact you made to that program you
46:49
have proof of the impact you made to that program so
46:53
now you do get to be selfish because you have given yourself and there's a balance
46:58
there and what I mean by you get to be selfish is you get to do what's best
47:03
for you and what is going to make you happy at a certain point like I said I
47:08
know I can hear what you're saying in a lot of regards without hearing what
47:11
you're saying. You've been written off.
47:13
And with that fact comes a new place for you on your team.
47:19
It might not be the girl who scores the game-winning goal in the Penn State
47:23
game to win the Big Ten championship, and that sucks.
47:26
And you have every right to mourn that, to be sad about that,
47:31
and to process that emotionally.
47:33
And no one gets to take that away from you, no matter what.
47:37
You also have an opportunity because there is another side of the roster that you maybe haven't seen.
47:44
And that is the other girls that have been written off, that have been injured,
47:48
that are still writing their story and don't know how.
47:50
So now when you feel ready, you get to be a leader to them.
47:56
And I know it sounds like a pity role. I had this conversation with my college
47:59
roommate a lot, who was another girl that in a lot of regards got written off.
48:03
And a lot of that comes from what do you want your last year to be?
48:07
Because we're in your last year. And that sucks that it's a reality, but it's a reality.
48:11
So now how do we make the most of it? For her, she was the best goddamn cheerleader there was.
48:16
She was the best hype man. And that was her thing.
48:19
She got to be on the bench. Our coach traveled her everywhere because no one was louder than her.
48:26
And she made genuine friendships with people through that. People that she maybe
48:31
not have even talked to that much on the team because they weren't around each other.
48:34
And that was her thing. That might not be your thing.
48:37
Your thing might be that you're going to send and you're going to be the best
48:42
fight person in the pregame locker room and you're going to be the DJ and you're
48:45
going to be dancing and that's going to be your thing.
48:47
You have a right to have a thing. You have given enough to this program to get
48:53
your thing and get an ending, even if it's not the ending you want.
48:56
And to have an impact on the team, knowing you have an impact on the team your senior year.
49:01
And I think that's the biggest thing you hear all the time, everyone has a role,
49:04
everyone's role has value.
49:05
You now have an opportunity to prove to other people that everyone's role has
49:10
value, being someone who has now seen both sides.
49:13
And that's not going to be easy. And you're going to have to show true strength
49:17
and true leadership and true commitment to do that because that role kind of sucks. Let's be real.
49:23
But now you have a platform and an opportunity to do that.
49:29
And I a lot longer of an impact than scoring that goal against Penn State that's
49:33
a lifelong impact that you're going to make on your teammates in your program
49:36
that's not a one game impact yeah I think when you said like you know I'm obviously
49:42
a little emotional this isn't how I expected,
49:45
my senior year to go with such high hopes and expectations and you know you
49:49
have two sides of it where I am so happy for my team and we win and we do these
49:53
things and we do have a lot of those hero stories, like the people had me,
49:58
you know, I got to play over for so many years and now they're finally getting
50:02
their shot and opportunity and you have that excitement for them while still
50:06
being sad about your own ambitions, goals and careers and kind of starting to
50:10
mourn the death of something that isn't over yet.
50:13
And it's a very weird feeling because I'm still here showing up,
50:16
training and doing all these things while balancing the reality that it is not
50:21
going to go the way I wish it would.
50:24
You know, and I think my roommate put it best, who she said,
50:27
it's like it's it's like doing drugs.
50:30
Like the highs are so high and the lows are so low.
50:36
But once once you have that moment, like the lows are so devastating low because
50:40
you you tie your identity into it.
50:42
This is all I've ever known is to be an athlete, is to be a soccer player,
50:46
is to be someone who has an impact on the field.
50:51
And it's it's hard and when you
50:54
when you get that strip from you you know those lows where
50:57
you lose that sense of self and you lose that part of you
50:59
that you you love so much it was one of my favorite parts of
51:02
me was being an athlete and being a good one you know and you start to lose
51:08
that and you you chase these moments where i can still feel myself looking out
51:12
onto a sold out you know to Martin Stadium and scoring a goal and running over to those teams and,
51:20
you know, having them all hug me and getting to stand there and embrace it and
51:23
to really take in that moment.
51:25
Like the highs are so high and you chase them for the rest of your career trying to get to that.
51:30
And it's like doing drugs. And I feel like I'm going through like some severe withdrawals right now.
51:37
Like it's hard and it's sad. And it is something where I have to learn what
51:42
that new identity looks like,
51:43
you know because we are recording this on Tuesday Sunday was this kind of abrupt
51:49
realization of where I'm going to be so I haven't necessarily processed all
51:53
this or figured it out yet,
51:55
but it is it is the unfortunate reality
51:58
of college athletics it is not all you know sunshine and rainbows and as successful
52:04
as a career I have had like I'm I'm at a new point in it where I I unfortunately
52:09
am at one of those lows in my drug addiction of soccer and of being an athlete here.
52:17
Yeah, I think, you know, it opens itself to a bigger conversation about our identity as athletes.
52:22
And it's one that I know is happening more and more and thankfully at a younger and younger level.
52:28
But I think, you know, if I were to sit here and be on my high horse and say,
52:34
Jordan, you are so much more than an athlete and you have so many other,
52:38
you know, and I know you know this and if I can say it to you all you want,
52:42
but I'm going to be so honest if I were in the exact same situation with you
52:45
right now, I wouldn't be feeling any different.
52:47
You know, we like to all act like we're emotionally healthy and we can handle
52:51
all these things and we know everything and we know that we're more than an athlete.
52:55
And yes, in my brain, I know, but in my heart, I don't.
52:58
And we can think and we can say all these things, but until you truly know it, you don't, you don't.
53:02
And I am well aware that if I were in your shoes, I would be feeling the exact same way.
53:07
So I definitely do not want this to come off of like here's jordan How everything
53:10
you can do and now you can fix it and be happy because it's not And I think
53:15
the best part about this is how willing and open you're willing to be about
53:19
this And it's going to be documented.
53:22
I'm very sorry But other people are going to know the highs and the lows and
53:26
the process that this is because it is a process.
53:29
And it's a grieving and it's a morning and it's a high and it's a crash and
53:34
so So I think the best thing is we're going to ride out this season together
53:38
and it's going to be a journey no matter what it is.
53:41
And but I think the best thing that you have is the impact that you have on
53:45
the program and you have physical evidence of that.
53:48
So you've hit your legacy on the field, but what's your legacy off the field?
53:51
And that's now the question you get to answer. But it doesn't have to be answered this week.
53:55
It doesn't have to be answered this month.
53:57
You know, I think it's it's a journey for you in the next couple of weeks,
54:00
in the next month or months.
54:02
And we'll do it together. Yeah. Lucky you guys. We'll keep you updated on it.
54:07
Like I said, I definitely don't have it figured out yet.
54:10
And it is something that is, you know, I feel like I've hit every single aspect
54:14
you can hit in a career here at college.
54:16
You know, I think this is the last step.
54:20
Last chapter for me to close here so absolutely well
54:24
with that what does Michigan State have this week
54:27
what are we what what games do we have going on this week what
54:29
is our preview for all listeners as we should
54:32
tune into college soccer this weekend yeah well
54:36
I mean obviously our expectation as a team and as a program
54:39
is always to win so we plan
54:41
on doing that but we have another Thursday sign Thursday Sunday
54:45
lineup both at home with Ole Miss
54:48
and then Xavier so should be
54:51
a pretty good week here at times some big games going
54:54
out of Michigan State that'll be super exciting I'll definitely have to try
54:56
to tune into that Ole Miss one that'll be a fun little SEC Big Ten matchup going
55:01
into Swedish Domos Vonsken play I mean I know we all are keeping up with the
55:06
season and doing everything there we will travel down to Trelleborg which I
55:10
know you all know where it is and it just you know, check it off the map, duh, name recognition.
55:17
But no, we are currently still sitting fifth place in the league.
55:19
And as a team moving that table, unfortunately got the tie in the Derby this
55:25
last weekend, but we did get to play in front of around 6,000 fans.
55:28
And so huge environment to be in very, very thankful to be getting pro minutes
55:32
here and playing and experiencing life in Sweden.
55:36
But yeah, a lot of big games, a lot of big matchups this weekend,
55:39
Again, Big Ten Plus is always where you can find Big Ten play,
55:42
but ESPN Plus as well as your streaming Big Ten network, SEC network,
55:47
ACC network, there's always college soccer games going on on Thursdays and Sundays,
55:51
and we very, very much encourage you guys to tune in and keep up with the conversation
55:56
and what's going on with college soccer. Thanks, guys.