Latest / Rusty's Garage / Michael Caruso - Part 2

Transcript

Michael Caruso - Part 2 · Rusty's Garage

• 0:02
  A listener production.
• 0:20
  G'day, it's Rusty here, all set for part two of my podcast with Michael Caruso.
• 0:24
  Robbo, as Gary Rogers called him.
• 0:27
  Now, if you've landed here without catching part one, jump back and give it a listen whenever you're ready.
• 0:33
  There is some great stuff in there.
• 0:35
  This is a ripper conversation.
• 0:37
  From contesting the Nationals after only a few races in carts and how daunting that was.
• 0:43
  The influence of the legendary Kevin Bartlett, getting the keys to his dad's race car, memories of Formula 3 in a title-winning season with some gun drivers and magnificent cars, trying F3000 and just how exhilarating that was, plus the insane budget required to pursue that path.
• 1:05
  And what we now know as Super 2, driving for a man he had immense respect for in their karting days.
• 1:13
  We begin part two with the pure joy of getting to race supercars, arriving at a time when the sport was in a golden era.
• 1:25
  So you'd had this wild experience in your dad's car, which may not necessarily have been refined for cornering, but it was awesome in a straight line speed sense.
• 1:33
  Now you're at the wheel of a supercar.
• 1:35
  The sport is going through this unbelievable phase.
• 1:38
  And I was very fortunate to be working at Channel 10 at the time.
• 1:41
  And it was...
• 1:44
  Even the second tier was bubbling along really, really nicely.
• 1:47
  It was a prestigious thing to be a part of, and a pathway had now kind of commenced.
• 1:53
  What did a young Michael Caruso think of racing those things?
• 1:56
  Supercars is really unique, and I feel like I came in at a really good time as well.
• 2:05
  There was so much hype, and there was a lot...
• 2:10
  Obviously, growing up and racing against some household names that were still very much a part of it was pretty surreal because you knew how competitive and how much talent they had.
• 2:26
  And supercars in that era, those cars were so hard to drive.
• 2:32
  They were so unique, and I think we...
• 2:35
  If you look back today and you look at how some of the most talented drivers from Europe and around the world would come over and would struggle and struggle because of the type of race car it was, there was just nothing like on the planet.
• 2:52
  And it was so hard to relate to anything else that you'd done in your whole racing career or to translate from go-karting or Formula Ford or anything you did.
• 3:01
  and translate that speed into a supercar was really, really difficult.
• 3:05
  So get your brain around it and understand it and then be successful at it was really, really hard.
• 3:15
  So a unique time for sure.
• 3:20
  A kind of freakish moment opens a window of opportunity for you at Bathurst.
• 3:29
  In a sad sense, there had been a crash for Mark Porter in the Super 2 race, which people can vividly recall the mountain.
• 3:36
  He was scheduled to drive for Brad Jones that year.
• 3:40
  He would very sadly leave us and BJR needed to find...
• 3:45
  somebody to step in and that's – what happened?
• 3:50
  Can you take us there, mate?
• 3:51
  Was it a case of Kim came to you, Kim Jones?
• 3:54
  It was a strange scenario.
• 3:56
  Obviously, I was in the race where Mark had his accident and I was one of the cars that obviously that went past him and –
• 4:09
  And, you know, obviously we're aware of where it ended.
• 4:12
  But I was at the time when it was all happening in the evening and, you know, no one really knew what was going on.
• 4:19
  I was just sitting up in the truck and Brad Jones came in and said, look, we're not sure what's going on, but we need to start thinking.
• 4:27
  You know, if he's obviously not going to be in a position to drive at this point, you know, being so serious, he was in hospital and what have you.
• 4:35
  Is this something you would consider?
• 4:36
  And...
• 4:38
  Brad was really nice about it in terms of he gave me a full lay of the land and said, look, everyone in the team, there's no pressure here, but, you know, everyone's on the same page.
• 4:50
  You know, we only want to go racing.
• 4:52
  We don't want to disrespect Mark and, you know, just really put it in a good position where it wasn't like there was no pressure and, you know, it was the typical, you know, everyone just sort of tack and get any opportunity they can.
• 5:05
  Yeah.
• 5:06
  So to go from like I'd never – that was my first race at Bavis.
• 5:10
  I'd never raced anything else at all to then on the Saturday having to drive in the car for the first time.
• 5:21
  At that circuit, yeah, it was pretty unique but really professional team.
• 5:26
  I mean that's one team that I'd never –
• 5:30
  got to do anything else with but um I still hold in the highest regard with you know how Brad and and Kim um handled the whole situation and the whole team I mean that yeah they've
• 5:42
  You can see how they've been so successful for such a long time and they're still there to this day.
• 5:48
  So were you just thinking about kind of being, you're still emerging racer, enduros and things like that?
• 5:55
  I think there's a WBS stint here in 2007, is there not, before you ended up at GRM?
• 6:01
  Yep, so WBS.
• 6:06
  interesting year um because obviously i'd first signed up and i was meant to be driving with max um just purely out of height reasons but in saying that bugs was the teammate so you know wouldn't matter who i drove with to be fair but um drove with max we i can't remember where we finished to be honest at sand down um
• 6:28
  And at that time, I was actually driving in a Tickford DVS car.
• 6:33
  So the car was a rocket ship.
• 6:34
  It handled Unreal.
• 6:36
  I was obviously doing a good job in that car.
• 6:41
  And then when we went to Bathurst, I'll never forget saying to the teams, well, at least to the drivers, I'm like, it's easier to drive my DVS car than it is to drive your car.
• 6:55
  which they appreciated, but, um, yeah, it was, it was a difficult car, but then they ended up pairing up myself and Grant Denner, um, the great man himself.
• 7:05
  So that was, that was pretty cool.
• 7:07
  We, um, and again, I can't even remember where we finished that year, but it wasn't, um, it wasn't that successful, unfortunately, but it was, look, you know, you take away something from every single experience that you do.
• 7:18
  Um, and, um, yeah, yeah.
• 7:22
  little bits and pieces somewhere down the track in my my repertoire let's say when i have conversations now with gary rogers around stuff to do with the australian racing group or the broadcast we do and and what have you they're often very short um but they're fun and you know gregory we want you to do this and you know your call might be over in 60 to 90 seconds kind of deal
• 7:45
  How did the call from Gary Rogers to Michael Caruso come about?
• 7:49
  Can you recall that conversation and what transpired?
• 7:53
  I remember lots of things that Gary said to me, this being one of them, but it was like a few days before Christmas and the call to tell me that was driving me so bad.
• 8:07
  Let me take a step back when he said, look,
• 8:12
  I need you to come fly down here and so I want to know who you are and have a chat with you and can you come down and we need you to be here tomorrow.
• 8:25
  It was some ridiculous request like, you know, stop everything and get on the plane sort of thing.
• 8:29
  Okay, righto, Gary.
• 8:31
  So I went down and I know...
• 8:36
  Lee and a few members in the team will kill me if I don't say this bit.
• 8:41
  But I get a hire car, drive down to the team, walk out, and I'm in a suit, Rusty.
• 8:51
  So I get out and go have this interview with Gary in his office with a suit and tie on, and I could...
• 9:00
  Feel the eyes on me everywhere.
• 9:02
  Everyone going, oh, my God, have a look at this guy.
• 9:06
  Who is this tryhard?
• 9:07
  Yeah, yeah.
• 9:08
  Couldn't have asked.
• 9:09
  Couldn't have told him I was trying any harder.
• 9:13
  But, yeah, obviously we had a good chat, which was pretty cool.
• 9:18
  Actually, that day the team were doing a Cummins appearance literally up the road.
• 9:23
  And I didn't think about it until later, but obviously the interview went that well that he's like, jump in the car, we're going for a drive.
• 9:30
  So he takes me up to Cummins.
• 9:33
  And the whole race team are there doing a pit stop challenge thing with the race car.
• 9:37
  And I've turned up and the whole team's there and all the sponsors or the whole Cummins is there.
• 9:42
  So there's like 200 people there.
• 9:45
  Then he starts walking around introducing me and what have you.
• 9:49
  And Holdsy was there.
• 9:53
  And Halsey absolutely pissed himself.
• 9:55
  Like, you know, once he saw me standing in the suit, whatever, and he never lets me forget it to this day.
• 9:59
  But, yeah, that obvious, wind the clock forward a couple more weeks, a couple days before, a few days before Christmas, he rang me up and said, Michael, you've got the drive, but you've got to be here again in a ridiculous time frame.
• 10:12
  Move down.
• 10:13
  You have to be here in two weeks.
• 10:14
  Move to Melbourne.
• 10:15
  And you start work on Monday.
• 10:17
  two weeks time.
• 10:18
  And I'm like, what do you mean?
• 10:19
  And he's like, well, you know, this is what's going to happen, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
• 10:22
  You'll be working here full time, so on and so forth.
• 10:25
  Um, so I jumped on, I don't know if it was realestate.com or something like that and tried to find a little apartment and then yeah, picked up the life and moved down there.
• 10:35
  What was your other nine to five job with them?
• 10:39
  I was lucky.
• 10:40
  I was jack of all trades.
• 10:42
  I'd go through each department within the business.
• 10:45
  So,
• 10:48
  I started off on top.
• 10:50
  Were you selling cars?
• 10:52
  Well, sorry, this is when they just shifted over to where they are right now.
• 10:57
  And so there was no car dealership as such.
• 11:02
  But I was involved...
• 11:06
  Basically, when I first went in there, I had to do all the tyres and wheels and cleaning all of the floor mats.
• 11:12
  And at the time, these floor mats were these tiles and they were so heavy.
• 11:18
  But you had to get them out in the gurney.
• 11:19
  And anyone that's lived in Melbourne or that's living in Melbourne...
• 11:22
  Well, no, winter runs for virtually 11 months of the year.
• 11:27
  But every week, you know, every two weeks getting out all these tiles and gurning them off with degreaser and so on and so forth in the wash bay, then doing the same with the wheels.
• 11:36
  It was... Lee used to love it because he would come in.
• 11:39
  He'd just wrapped up his apprenticeship.
• 11:43
  in quotes, with the team.
• 11:46
  So he went from doing all these jobs to handing it over to me where I had to do them.
• 11:52
  And, yeah, that was the worst part of it, but...
• 11:58
  I was lucky because I got to work on my own race car.
• 12:00
  So I quickly developed a good relationship with everyone in the team because you're working on the car and you're working with them to improve your car and so on and so forth.
• 12:10
  And you learn lots as well when you're actually working on your own race car.
• 12:14
  As much as everyone gives it slack, there's a lot of benefit to, you know, to actually working in the team.
• 12:22
  And, yeah, there was still something that I'll never forget.
• 12:26
  Actually, one, I need to say it, and I don't know if it's ever been told, but you'll have to ask Jamie Winkup about the story with the paint tin in the ute.
• 12:40
  What's about that?
• 12:40
  Come on.
• 12:41
  Because, you know, one of the good things about going in that team is there's lots of stories of other drivers and, you know, what they used to do and what he stuffed up and so on and so forth.
• 12:52
  But one of the ones they told me about Winkup was he was doing some parts delivery as well and what have you.
• 13:00
  And I'm not sure how there was a paint tin in the back of his car, but he basically painted...
• 13:07
  the whole road from like Dandenong all the way to like Box Hill or somewhere.
• 13:12
  It just ran out, running out the back of the ute, like a big trail.
• 13:18
  So everyone's got a story from there, which is pretty cool.
• 13:22
  There's a few guys that are still there, like Gypsy and what have you, who no doubt you know Rusty.
• 13:27
  He probably has the most stories to be fair.
• 13:28
  No, all those literary stories.
• 13:31
  I can hear the big, deep voiceover now.
• 13:33
  Before he was GM of Triple Eight.
• 13:36
  Now, if you go to work for GRM, if you go to work for Gary, you've got to have a nickname.
• 13:43
  So Lee Holdsworth was lethal, Bargs is Bargs, so on and so on.
• 13:48
  You get Robbo, as in Robinson Caruso.
• 13:53
  How did he came up with that?
• 13:55
  Someone else came up with that?
• 13:56
  And how did you feel about it?
• 13:57
  Only Gary could come up with a nickname like that.
• 14:01
  It's stuck too.
• 14:02
  Well, don't you worry.
• 14:03
  He makes sure it sticks.
• 14:05
  When he gives you a nickname...
• 14:07
  It's, there's no negotiating either because I tried to get rid of it for so long at the beginning.
• 14:13
  I'm like, it's not even, you don't even spell Caruso the same way.
• 14:18
  Yeah, it didn't work to the point.
• 14:19
  I don't know if you'll remember this.
• 14:21
  You would have definitely been there.
• 14:22
  But we went to Darwin the first year and he put Robbo instead of Caruso.
• 14:28
  It had Robbo, right?
• 14:29
  Yeah.
• 14:31
  And we went out in the first practice session and they made us take, he had the shits because they made us take it off.
• 14:36
  They're like, no, that's not his name.
• 14:38
  It has to be by your enter it name and so on and so forth.
• 14:42
  And he was peaking because like when he takes the piss on someone, obviously when it's like, no, no, we're going to make this stick.
• 14:49
  And this is to my point of saying, no, no, when you make sure it sticks, that's why he put it on the car because I was like pushing back on it.
• 14:56
  And he's like, no, no, we're going to put it on the race car now.
• 15:00
  So, if it had been up to him, I would have raced with Robbo on the windows.
• 15:07
  You and Lethal, I mean, you obviously knew each other a bit, but you really hit it off there, mate, didn't you, the pair of you?
• 15:11
  Yeah, Holdsey and I had a great relationship and still do to this day, clearly.
• 15:19
  It's, you know, pretty unique in that scenario where –
• 15:26
  You're in a competitive outfit and you're both trying to win.
• 15:30
  The old saying is very accurate.
• 15:33
  The first person you need to be is your teammate and what have you.
• 15:35
  But where we were at as a team, Lee and I quickly identified that the only way we were going to bring the team forward was by working together.
• 15:47
  So there was a lot of mutual respect for each other in that regard where...
• 15:52
  if we were going to be too busy fighting each other, no one was going to benefit, including the team.
• 15:57
  So we were striving to bring everyone up and push everyone along with the team themselves and they were on the same page.
• 16:08
  So, you know, it was great to be in a position where we didn't feel threatened by each other and we could focus on actually just getting the results that we deserved with the equipment that we had.
• 16:21
  can be a brutal game.
• 16:22
  At what point did you feel like you were kind of safe and solidified in either the sport or at GRM?
• 16:30
  I mean, there's obviously high points made, you know, like Darwin wins and so on.
• 16:34
  But what was the point where you went, right, I'm comfortable here.
• 16:39
  I feel like I have a good direction with the car, with Lee, et cetera, and we're going somewhere.
• 16:47
  I reckon it was my first Baffist with the team.
• 16:49
  Well, yeah.
• 16:53
  We qualified in the 10 and we had a pretty strong day and we got into the last stint and I think we were coming third with like, I don't know, 30 laps to go and the engine broke and what have you and they were never walking away from that weekend going, okay, well, if we can do this now, we can come back and actually fight for something, you know, year in, year out.
• 17:21
  Even Holds, he said to me after, he goes, no, mate, you'll be right.
• 17:24
  The weekend we've just had together, and he knew Gary is not better than me, but it sort of cemented me in because Gary's was very interesting.
• 17:37
  It was Bathurst or nothing for Gary.
• 17:39
  If you were going to be decent or at least be valuable in the team, you had to be competitive at that track and you had to have a...
• 17:49
  particular mindset or at least show that at the event which um yeah it was is still to this day some of the stuff that used to happen is is pretty funny to think about
• 18:00
  Now, did the boys, I think you shared this with my buddy Aaron Noonan in his podcast perhaps, did the boys do a little something to your car?
• 18:08
  What happened to your road car?
• 18:10
  Was it stick it up?
• 18:11
  Was it, I think there was a bit of shenanigans with that, wasn't there?
• 18:15
  I've got a long history of great road vehicles.
• 18:18
  And my Mazda 121 was definitely one of them.
• 18:23
  Beautiful.
• 18:25
  there couldn't have been more of a Barbie car than that thing, although it was, you know, navy blue, but driving around in a bubble, being a supercar driver was pretty unique.
• 18:37
  But we, I'm just, I'm pretty sure it was Gold Coast because we'd done a special livery at Bathurst and we continued that livery on because everyone loved it so much, so on and so forth.
• 18:52
  So...
• 18:53
  We went to Gold Coast and there was only like a round left, but we had a couple of sticker sets left over.
• 18:58
  So they were like, okay, we're not going to use them.
• 19:01
  We've got enough spares left over for the rest of the year.
• 19:04
  And I came home and went to the workshop and my whole car was literally wrapped like the supercar.
• 19:13
  Yeah.
• 19:14
  you know, Caruso on the windows, everything.
• 19:17
  So it wasn't just like Valvoline up the side and what have you, but it literally had my name on it and what have you.
• 19:22
  And we got back to the workshop that night, you know, some ridiculous hour would have been like, you know, 11 o'clock at night.
• 19:28
  So there was no option but to take that car home.
• 19:32
  And I was living in Caulfield in a little unit, a little two-bedder unit at the time, and I remember...
• 19:38
  driving home and parking it out the front on the street just thinking, oh, no, this is a nightmare sort of thing.
• 19:48
  And then we ended up leaving it on there for a while.
• 19:50
  They wouldn't let me take it off.
• 19:52
  And then when I did take it off, it pulled all the paint off.
• 19:56
  So just destroyed the one-to-one anyway.
• 20:01
  Long story short, no one wanted the one-to-one anyway, including me.
• 20:05
  Yeah.
• 20:08
  You have a great support framework around you now, mate, in a beautiful wife and you have kids now as well.
• 20:14
  At what point is she with you on this mission and so on?
• 20:19
  She moved down as soon as I moved down, which I was quite fortunate, to be honest, because I've only been with my wife now, Danny, for about eight months and I said, look, this opportunity's come up.
• 20:37
  I'm moving now.
• 20:38
  you can either come or you don't, you know, you don't come basically.
• 20:44
  And she, she didn't actually, it didn't take her a moment to decide what she wanted to do.
• 20:50
  She said, no, I'm coming.
• 20:52
  She hadn't asked her parents at the time.
• 20:54
  She was only eight, just turned 18, mind you.
• 20:56
  So she went and asked and obviously, yeah, and then moved down.
• 21:01
  Yeah.
• 21:03
  driving down to Melbourne in a Mazda 121A, I was probably more worried we weren't going to make it.
• 21:08
  Then that little five-speed manual on the highway.
• 21:16
  But, yeah, we – yeah, I'm very, very fortunate to have a – I mean, even to this day, you know, we were just talking about the Enduros and my kids were like, oh, are we going to come and watch?
• 21:27
  And, you know, they love coming out to support.
• 21:30
  So I'm pretty lucky that –
• 21:31
  that I've got those people around me.
• 21:35
  Race winner in supercars.
• 21:37
  What did that mean to you?
• 21:39
  What did it mean to your dad and so on after all the years of trying, the very pinnacle of the sport in Australia?
• 21:45
  And, you know, the name Caruso is in the record books.
• 21:48
  Very cool.
• 21:50
  You don't really think about those things until you're sort of at a point where you're
• 21:56
  It's not happening as such.
• 21:59
  And obviously that wasn't until I'd stopped full-time driving.
• 22:01
  But I guess looking at it now...
• 22:06
  Winning in supercars wasn't something that I thought would happen, you know, in only my second year, but particularly when at Darwin where it happened, you know, in that race, I had to race it.
• 22:18
  It was myself and Lowndes that were sort of fighting it out for the win for such a long period of the race and, you know, racing against someone like Craig Lowndes at the time, you know, at his, at arguably one of his best points of his career in Triple Eight.
• 22:36
  to come away with a race win was phenomenal.
• 22:39
  You know, it's...
• 22:43
  In a team like GRM at the time...
• 22:48
  You know, the whole team was built around some misfits fundamentally and still is arguably today.
• 22:56
  Gary giving people, you know, a shot in motorsport, but he seems to be able to get the most out of people.
• 23:02
  And on that day, we clearly had as a group, not just myself individually, but the ability to topple 888.
• 23:12
  in some of their best and most dominant years is just, yeah, amazing, to be honest.
• 23:21
  So to go head-to-head and win, yeah, it was pretty cool.
• 23:27
  I know my dad would have been very happy, although not there that day.
• 23:32
  He was definitely the first person that I spoke to.
• 23:45
  Michael's former teammate and friend Lee Holdsworth scored his first win in the Great Race in 2021.
• 23:51
  But it took a while to sink in after all those years of trying.
• 23:55
  Like at the time, I think I was that stressed and had that much adrenaline that it hadn't sunk in yet.
• 24:02
  Like it was quite strange.
• 24:05
  And I reckon I get more emotional about it now than what I did at the time.
• 24:09
  It was like, we just won Bathurst and it just wasn't registering in my head that we'd actually done it.
• 24:20
  You can finally hold Twirth in the Rusty's Garage Library.
• 24:23
  Surely he wasn't involved in the ambush sticker job on Michael's cute little road car at Gary Rogers Motorsport.
• 24:29
  Now back to the pod.
• 24:32
  Your career has two really solid chapters, mate, and I think that's an indicator of your loyalty.
• 24:37
  So there is the GRM chapter, and we'll get to Kelly's slash Nismo slash Ultima in a second here.
• 24:44
  Was it difficult to leave Gary's, and was there a deal that perhaps people don't know about that could have sent you somewhere else, another high-profile opportunity perhaps that didn't come to pass?
• 24:53
  It was difficult to leave Gary's.
• 24:56
  It was, but I feel like I needed the personal growth as well.
• 24:59
  It wasn't...
• 25:01
  It wasn't just about winning.
• 25:04
  I wanted to change.
• 25:06
  And obviously for me, I didn't contemplate anything other than Nissan.
• 25:15
  Them coming back into the sport, although some other opportunities, that was sort of something...
• 25:21
  from a personal point of view was, okay, this is different enough.
• 25:24
  What they're trying to evolve and change is something that I wanted to be a part of and I don't know if it's probably more to my technical...
• 25:34
  enjoyment of motorsport, but something to sort of utilise what I enjoy doing, not just the driving side, but to be a part of and help build and grow was something.
• 25:46
  But it was extremely difficult to leave Gary's and, you know, he'd obviously given me my shot, been there for five years.
• 25:56
  Yeah, you know, you just don't...
• 26:01
  You can only make the decisions, and I always say this, and still some of my friends in supercars now who ask me about some, you know, ask me for their opinions on changes and ideas around teams and moving, but you can only make the decision at the time with the information that you have, and that's, you know, something I'll never look back on or regret, but, you know, I needed that change as well.
• 26:28
  Now, Charlie Schwerkalt tells me you're very good with pit tours.
• 26:32
  You're very good in a corporate sense.
• 26:33
  I know we've worked together on television, so that doesn't surprise me.
• 26:36
  But Rico does tell me he had trouble, I think, with you and James Moffat wearing the factory pants.
• 26:42
  Oh, absolutely.
• 26:43
  Is this true at Nissan?
• 26:44
  It's one thing that the Nissan Motorsport factory pants were not good, and they had zero style.
• 26:51
  It was horrendous.
• 26:52
  Yeah.
• 26:55
  He'll take that to heart because he was the one that used to organise all the merchandise and everything.
• 27:03
  But his level of detail is second to none, I might add.
• 27:07
  Like we had this in motorsports, socks and shoes and bags and backpacks.
• 27:13
  And gosh, the list goes on and on and on.
• 27:15
  But the cargo pants was definitely not saying James and I were going to take two.
• 27:23
  We were the coolest side of the garage, Rusty.
• 27:26
  It did open up opportunities for you beyond the Ultima program, which I think is really cool.
• 27:31
  I reckon you and I ran into one another at Fox Sports at one stage and you were off overseas with Nissan.
• 27:36
  It might have been to one of their events in Japan, perhaps.
• 27:38
  So you did some other sporting activity with them.
• 27:41
  There was 12-hour and all sorts, mate, wasn't there?
• 27:44
  Yeah, and that's the extension of what I want to do as well, you know, opening up avenues to things that I never would have had the opportunity at the time with GRM.
• 27:53
  So being with a global brand and having that presence and evolving myself outside of the race car was a part of that.
• 28:02
  And, you know, we did, you know, the Nismo Festival is, it's hard to describe if you've never been, but it's basically...
• 28:14
  I'd picture it like one of our most successful race meetings, let's call it like the Sandown 500, the stands for, I think there was 65,000 people there, literally just to celebrate Nissan.
• 28:25
  Nothing else.
• 28:26
  Purely that.
• 28:28
  Every single, you know, all their historically winning race cars and good or bad cars.
• 28:33
  And then literally a double-decker bus taking people around the racetrack while their race cars are on the racetrack.
• 28:41
  You know, some of the things you just think, wow, we talk about health and safety over here and how strict we are.
• 28:47
  And they've got race cars going around flat out, like as fast as they can.
• 28:51
  There's...
• 28:52
  There's one thing that most of those drivers over there do is they only have one speed and it's qualifying speed, nothing else.
• 29:02
  Now, Rico says you were the world champion gear shifter, gear changer.
• 29:07
  He said, but you know what?
• 29:08
  They might have looked rushed, but he had this way of not upsetting the car in the process when he did that.
• 29:14
  It was a crazy thing to watch on the onboards when we would get it.
• 29:18
  And he said, and then Mike would be so smooth in other parts of the lap where you weren't so busy.
• 29:25
  It worked for you, mate, didn't it?
• 29:27
  Yeah.
• 29:28
  I don't know how.
• 29:31
  No, it's funny.
• 29:32
  Was it just a feel thing?
• 29:33
  I don't know.
• 29:33
  It's funny.
• 29:34
  Everyone, when I drive, it doesn't feel like I'm doing it that fast, to be honest.
• 29:41
  I know that sounds silly, but I don't know if it's a reaction or what it is, but...
• 29:49
  Feeling's clearly a big thing in motorsport, isn't it?
• 29:51
  You know, at the end of the day, that's all you've got to go off to know how much grip you have and so on and so forth.
• 29:56
  But gear shifting, especially because, you know, the year that I'd got in, obviously they went to the sequential gearbox, as you'd be aware.
• 30:06
  So Gorm was the old H pattern and into that.
• 30:10
  So I don't know if it's something that...
• 30:14
  I never really had a sequential that worked that way.
• 30:17
  The sequential in our Formula 3 car was very, very different.
• 30:21
  So, I mean, I'd always been known in my karting days for being very, very smooth.
• 30:28
  But I know the focus was always on my gear shifting being very, very rough.
• 30:32
  So, I guess I just needed a lever in my go-kart to bang.
• 30:37
  When you look back on it, when you frame that Altima chapter...
• 30:41
  I mean, critics will go it was an unloved road car.
• 30:44
  You only ever found them as, you know, maybe a rental car and so on.
• 30:49
  A lot of love, heart and soul went into it from the Kelly operation.
• 30:53
  It yielded some stuff, but in truth, probably not what we hoped it would.
• 30:58
  When you look back on it now, how do you sort of think about that whole phase?
• 31:03
  If you look at what's going on in the current supercars paddock and we talk about parity and what have you, and they make changes virtually every weekend at the moment to keep parity, we would go seasons without any changes, which made it difficult, you know, and multiple reasons, mind you, but...
• 31:27
  It still blows me away.
• 31:29
  You know, there was lots of promises, let's say, that were, you know, to Nissan and so on and so forth or the hierarchy of Nissan about getting them up to speed.
• 31:38
  But they were invested.
• 31:41
  I mean, they did, what, six or seven years in the sport, which was pretty good.
• 31:45
  We saw others come and go in that period.
• 31:49
  But, you know, they're very much...
• 31:52
  love motor racing and I think the history that they had in Australia has clearly drawn them to supercars and to that fact, you know, some of the stuff we used to do, you know, Jim Richards for that fact, who I'm obviously a massive fan of, you know, getting to do some cool PR stuff with him, which was good.
• 32:13
  I mean, but is there a more cool or relaxed race car driver than Jim Richards?
• 32:19
  I'd highly doubt it.
• 32:20
  Jim Richards, yeah.
• 32:22
  Awesome.
• 32:23
  Very cool you got to do that.
• 32:25
  Now, you are about to pair up with Frosty for the Enduros Gen 3.
• 32:31
  We'll get your thoughts on that in a second.
• 32:33
  Was it tough to kind of stop the full-time supercars driving and how did you...
• 32:40
  compartmentalise that?
• 32:41
  What did you... Because you now live back in Sydney.
• 32:44
  You've moved, as I said, at the top of the pod here, kind of gone full circle back to Sydney.
• 32:50
  There's a job that we should probably ask you about and what you're doing now as well.
• 32:53
  But how did you cope with that kind of move or were you ready?
• 32:57
  I don't think you're ever ready for when it's over, full-time driving.
• 33:04
  And obviously, I didn't think I...
• 33:09
  It should have been my end, but, and you know, everyone has, will have their own opinion, whatever you, which is fair.
• 33:14
  But, um, I just wasn't happy with how it ended.
• 33:17
  You know, we went 10, I think, or 12 races in a row with mechanical failures.
• 33:22
  And so it was just a, you know, it was a nightmare year.
• 33:25
  So it wasn't like, oh, okay, we give it, we gave it our all and, you know, it just didn't happen the following year, but fundamentally when.
• 33:34
  when the funding or at least the sponsorship runs dry, you know, something's got to change.
• 33:39
  So, and, you know, and I can appreciate that now looking back on it.
• 33:43
  But...
• 33:45
  It was, you know, obviously a difficult transition to go from doing something every single day that you love and having a full-time job to having a family and then going, okay, what do I do now?
• 33:54
  Because you quickly shift your mentality of I can't just think about me and, you know, if I was single and didn't have kids and a mortgage or anything like that.
• 34:05
  You could put everything on the line and try to get back in and so on and so forth.
• 34:09
  But when you have a responsibility as you get older, you know, sometimes you've got to think of others.
• 34:16
  And that's ultimately the big shift in the headspace is putting my family first and focusing on that.
• 34:26
  So you are talking to us from the office late in the afternoon.
• 34:30
  It's in a cool little quiet space there.
• 34:33
  And I think if what you said to me before we clicked go on this, before we started recording, the company has a bit of a motor racing connection for you too, does it not?
• 34:43
  Quite lucky.
• 34:44
  So when I moved back to Sydney just after COVID or during COVID rather,
• 34:51
  Some long-time family friends of ours who we went carding with, the Lumbu's family, they had their own successful family business.
• 35:00
  And Lyndon, one of the brothers, said, hey, I'm running the business now.
• 35:06
  And we're out cycling.
• 35:07
  We both love cycling.
• 35:08
  All the whole family does.
• 35:09
  So we're out cycling together.
• 35:10
  And he said, look, do you want to come and try sales in the corporate landscape?
• 35:14
  Yeah.
• 35:16
  And you might have mentioned a bit earlier the commercial side of the business is something that I clearly enjoyed while it's, you know, motor racing and had a strong connection too.
• 35:26
  So the transition was quite easy for me to sort of come into the corporate landscape and particularly in the sales side because, as you would be, appreciate, Rusty.
• 35:38
  You're around it all the time and know how well a race car driver can sell themselves.
• 35:43
  So I'd not say by any means I'm an extremely good salesperson, but clearly you have to have that knack and communication and relationship ability or at least the ability to connect with people.
• 35:58
  And see opportunities.
• 36:00
  Yeah, and be optimistic, you know, all the sales things, lots of crossover.
• 36:05
  So, yeah, quite fortunate because Lyndon obviously saw that in me, you know, in what I – the tools that I had, let's say, in the shed to use.
• 36:17
  Yeah, now two years down the track, I'm our director of sales at Syndeticom and looking after a team of 11 people, salespeople and yeah, having a good time.
• 36:30
  Charlie Schwerkalt said to me, if I've done this right, you've had a couple of hours in the car, in the Gen 3 car earlier this year.
• 36:37
  Ride day at Sydney Motorsport Park.
• 36:39
  There'll be a chance to test before sand down and maybe another ride day prior to Bathurst, if I'm right.
• 36:44
  So give us your impressions of Gen 3, how much you're looking forward to the Enduros, hooking up with your buddy in Mark Winterbottom and running this competition.
• 36:52
  I can't talk highly enough of the Gen 3 car, to be honest.
• 36:57
  It's definitely a driver's race car.
• 36:59
  There is no doubt about it.
• 37:01
  And, you know, when I was watching the first few events, I think, I don't know if anyone noticed, but you could see the driver's race car.
• 37:08
  were having a hard time adjusting, and that was locking brakes, going off the road, spinning out, so on and so forth.
• 37:14
  And you rarely used to see mistakes from drivers the past few years, particularly in supercars, and that was purely down to a refined piece of machinery.
• 37:26
  Everyone understood what they were trying to get out of the car.
• 37:28
  The cars had been worked, you know, to get the most out of them from a mechanical point of view as well.
• 37:34
  These cars, now particularly because the aero's come off quite a bit,
• 37:38
  Yes, the tyre grip has come up, but you've really got to drive the car well and it's very easy to make a mistake.
• 37:46
  which brings a bit of enjoyment back for the driver, in my opinion.
• 37:50
  It's harder to drive.
• 37:52
  So you have to be more accurate, precise.
• 37:55
  You have to, you can't, and it's not going to be the same every lap.
• 37:58
  So it allows you the opportunity to rely on your skills, let's say, to ensure that you're consistent and you can understand what the car is delivering in terms of feel and how you generate the most out of it.
• 38:15
  I think they definitely went down the right path of removing the aero and clearly it's got the engines a bit faster as well.
• 38:22
  So it's fast in a straight line.
• 38:24
  Yeah, so I'm looking forward to Sandow will be a good event.
• 38:28
  I think as well, you know, having a bunch of co-drivers who aren't really experienced, it's sort of bringing that experience
• 38:35
  nacked of what we saw in the first couple of events where the drivers were struggling and or, you know, come into grips with the new car.
• 38:42
  So it should be an exciting event, I think, the 500.
• 38:46
  Do you think it'll be, from a fan point of view, genuinely kind of unpredictable in that sense?
• 38:51
  And what is the secret?
• 38:53
  If you and Frosty are in sync in what you want with the car and minimizing the mistakes you talk about, is that the kind of thing you're really going to need to be successful?
• 38:59
  It could be very much like 2013, if you're fortunate enough for those listening to remember what that race was like.
• 39:07
  It was, when I say Bathurst is what I'm referring to, but it was chaotic.
• 39:11
  There was so much going on.
• 39:14
  And I think it has all those elements.
• 39:16
  There's so many unknowns as well.
• 39:17
  You know, we talk about fuel stops where they've slowed the fuel up.
• 39:21
  I mean...
• 39:23
  I think they were predicting like a 55-second fuel stop just to go from empty to full.
• 39:28
  How much that changes the race is yet to be seen.
• 39:32
  But from my knowledge, you talk about sand down, it's a minute eight, minute ten a lap, let's say.
• 39:40
  And if people are doing virtually, it's going to take them a lap to fuel the car up.
• 39:44
  It changes the whole strategic approach to the race, let alone dealing with Melbourne weather, Rusty.
• 39:53
  So, yeah, it's got all the elements to be intriguing.
• 40:00
  You know, how many different race winners we've seen this year as well.
• 40:04
  I think it'll be a great couple of events.
• 40:08
  Let's just hope they extend it to Gold Coast or something as well for the enduro drivers.
• 40:13
  Cool, cool.
• 40:14
  Proper enduro cup again.
• 40:15
  I'd love to see that.
• 40:16
  Cup will finish.
• 40:17
  You've been super with your time here, and we want to get you home to your beautiful family.
• 40:21
  You did come and play with us in TCR for a while, so it would be remiss of me not to talk about that.
• 40:25
  Carouse on the loose in television was a great deal of fun.
• 40:29
  I love that, the rawness of it and just barrelling up to people with a microphone and going for it.
• 40:36
  That was ace.
• 40:37
  And you got to run in the Alfa Romeo too as well, which might have had its frustrations at times.
• 40:42
  Did you enjoy that car?
• 40:43
  I mean, diametrically different to what we've just been talking about with Gen 3.
• 40:46
  Yeah.
• 40:46
  Very different, but can I tell you before I dive into that what I did enjoy most?
• 40:51
  It was absolutely my pieces with yourself, Rossi.
• 40:56
  Because... Oh, cool.
• 40:57
  And this isn't just to pump you up, mate, but I honestly enjoy them because they're so natural.
• 41:02
  And when you're working with someone that you can bounce off without having to think, wait, what's that person going to say next or what are they going to do next so you can be prepared or at least position yourself appropriately, you know,
• 41:16
  Yeah, I had some of the best fun in TV that I've ever had working alongside yourself.
• 41:22
  And I hold you in one of the highest regards in terms of personalities and terms of the job itself, your knowledge.
• 41:28
  And clearly today you come absolutely loaded, as I should have expected, being the professional you are.
• 41:35
  So yeah, I really love the TV side of it and that working alongside yourself and others.
• 41:41
  You did it well too, mate.
• 41:42
  It was cool.
• 41:42
  Very, very cool.
• 41:43
  You did it well.
• 41:44
  Back to your question with the Alpha and particularly in TCR, they're a very different car to drive to anything else that I've ever driven, much so to the point where you have to really reposition your brain.
• 42:00
  to do all the opposite of anything you've ever done because majority of the time, you know, for me at least, has been rear-wheel drive car.
• 42:08
  So I'll never forget going to Phillip Island and getting a bit of oversteer and you just instantly, you know, you get out of the throttle.
• 42:17
  You know, that's just the normal thing, you know, because you don't want to go that way anymore.
• 42:22
  But...
• 42:23
  to reprogram your brain to go full throttle or put more throttle in as you get oversteer is, is just really hard to come to grips with.
• 42:31
  So it took me a little bit to get around that, but once you get around that, um, lots of fun to drive, obviously.
• 42:38
  Um,
• 42:39
  Yeah, they're fast.
• 42:41
  You've got to wheel them really hard as well.
• 42:43
  You've physically got to drive them quite hard.
• 42:47
  Yeah, it's good.
• 42:48
  When it's going well, it's good fun to drive.
• 42:51
  Fans would love us to finish with the car.
• 42:54
  Now, it might be an emotional attachment to a car that you won something in.
• 42:57
  It might be the beautiful recollection you shared before of driving the F3000 car.
• 43:02
  What's the one that maybe makes the hairs on the back of your neck come up that you've got a connection to?
• 43:08
  I think my dad's sports sedan car, to be honest, purely from a sentimental point of view.
• 43:13
  You know, obviously not the best handling car, but from the point of view that, you know, that was...
• 43:19
  It was my dad's heart and soul in that car, and you could feel that when you drive it.
• 43:23
  You know, it was so raw.
• 43:26
  He knew the whole thing inside out clearly, and for him to sort of...
• 43:31
  It felt like it was a little bit of a...
• 43:36
  you know, passing of the torch, let's say, you know, in terms of, okay, it's time for you to move on into motor racing and...
• 43:47
  Yeah, to drive that was cool because I know a lot of my competitors, their fathers raced as well and what have you.
• 43:54
  And to be able to share that experience with Dad, I know, I just wish we had cameras at the time.
• 44:02
  I think I had a Nokia 3110 or whatever the hell they were back in the end, the little bricks.
• 44:07
  But you know what I mean?
• 44:08
  Like to be able to take a photo of him while I was out there driving because I know he would have enjoyed it probably more than I did, to be fair.
• 44:17
  um so yeah that's it's funny they're the little moments in my mind that i look back now um and talking about cameras we didn't really focus on taking photos and videos and things like that when i was growing up obviously because we're always in the now and this is what's in front of us let's get this done so um anyhow that's uh definitely the car that i enjoyed
• 44:41
  Thank you so much.
• 44:42
  90 minutes of walking down memory lane with you, and it probably doesn't do it justice because there's more things I know.
• 44:49
  Congratulations on everything so far.
• 44:51
  Have an awesome time in that Gen 3 machine with Mark Winterbottom and Team 18.
• 44:57
  Congratulations on what you've done in...
• 45:00
  your career on a personal note i think it's an absolute crime that you are not in a full-time drive but that's my that's my personal view and hopefully we get to do some stuff together in the media again and have a good laugh about our mate davy reynolds and some craziness about you guys doing podcasts i promise you if we get um we get this job and running mate we need to get you on because um we need someone like you that can slap us around a little bit and keep us in the line
• 45:26
  But no, thank you for having me on, Rusty.
• 45:28
  Yeah, absolute pleasure to be able to spend the time with you that I have.
• 45:33
  And even to be honest, I'm chuffed that you've reached out to have me on the show because, as I said, I hold you very highly and clearly you have a knack for what you do.
• 45:45
  You can't be as successful as you are and go as long as you have with respects, mate.
• 45:52
  So congratulations and thank you again, mate.
• 45:55
  Happy to come on anytime and work with you anytime I can.
• 45:59
  There is only one problem here.
• 46:00
  You haven't tried to sell me anything in this podcast.
• 46:03
  I thought you were in sales now.
• 46:04
  Thanks, mate.
• 46:05
  Have I got a deal for you?
• 46:07
  Thank you, mate.
• 46:08
  Cheers.
• 46:16
  Rusty's Garage is written and presented by me, Greg Rust.
• 46:20
  Series editor and producer is Thomas Dullard.
• 46:23
  Audio production by Link Kelly.
• 46:26
  If you've got a guest suggestion, get in touch with me via social media.
• 46:30
  The Garage, that's where a journey begins with a tank full of passion-fuelled stories.