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Building Second Chances: Sean Stegeman's and Lee Loveall's CMC Journey · Nightmare Success In and Out

• 0:02
  What happens when your worst fear becomes your reality?
• 0:05
  Hi, I'm Brent Cassidy, welcome to the Nightmare Success In and
• 0:08
  Out podcast where we explore how to overcome your fears and
• 0:12
  nightmares that set yourself free.
• 0:14
  We're going to be exploring this topic with guys that was in
• 0:16
  Leavenworth with and others who survived their own nightmare.
• 0:21
  These stories can be inspiring, sometimes sad, there's some
• 0:25
  humor, but hopefully you can come away with a nugget of
• 0:28
  something that'll help you knock down some of the prisons you
• 0:30
  built up in your own mind. All right, welcome back
• 0:37
  nightmare success, In-n-out listeners.
• 0:39
  This is where you come from. What happens when your worst
• 0:41
  fear comes? Your reality?
• 0:42
  How do you adapt, survive, overcome?
• 0:44
  Set yourself free, folks. Don't forget to follow and
• 0:48
  subscribe. If you if you if you like this,
• 0:50
  you know, share it out, like it up.
• 0:52
  I appreciate it. I want to give a big shout out
• 0:57
  to Rodger Faulkner, who is a guy that I met a few years ago and
• 1:02
  he connected me to Sean Stegman. And I want to say Rodger is a
• 1:07
  great man. He when I was trying and just
• 1:11
  getting out of prison, you know, I was all over Google and, and
• 1:16
  so it came up and he said, you know, can we, can we meet and
• 1:21
  talk? And we sat down at this
• 1:23
  restaurant and he said, you know, could you just tell me
• 1:25
  about the story? And so I just told him my story
• 1:28
  and he said, well, great, that's all I wanted to hear.
• 1:31
  And we went on and that's just the way Rodger is.
• 1:35
  And, and Rodger reached out to me a few weeks ago and he said I
• 1:41
  got a great guy and a great company down.
• 1:46
  These guys are doing incredible work down in Springfield, MO.
• 1:49
  And that really caught my attention because that's my old
• 1:51
  stomping grounds growing up as a kid.
• 1:54
  So he started telling me about Sean Stegman.
• 1:59
  And it's, you know, a great story because a lot of people
• 2:04
  have heard me talk about how difficult re entry is.
• 2:09
  You know, we just assume that people when they get out of
• 2:11
  prison, they'll just they'll be able to make it happen.
• 2:14
  And it's it's really tough, really tough.
• 2:17
  And it you'd find it a place to live, finding the right, you
• 2:21
  know, soft abilities to be able to do things that you need to
• 2:29
  do. Just the knowledge of where
• 2:31
  things are and what to do, getting a job.
• 2:34
  And Sean Stegman, when he got out, he was lucky enough to meet
• 2:42
  Lee Lovell. And these guys have taken a
• 2:46
  company and have exploded it over the last few years.
• 2:51
  And the really cool thing that they're doing, it's all about re
• 2:54
  entry. They've got over 187 guys and
• 3:00
  women that are part of CMC creative Modular Construction
• 3:07
  and they do the fabrication and installation for Seven Brews
• 3:11
  Coffee. A lot of you have seen that it's
• 3:13
  a national company kind of like Starbucks.
• 3:17
  It's an incredible story. It's inspiring to me because I
• 3:20
  love it when people not just don't talk about it, they put,
• 3:24
  you know, and their effort and actually, you know, walk the
• 3:27
  walk. And I can't wait to get into all
• 3:29
  this today with Sean. I'm actually going to have Lee
• 3:32
  Level here too when we talk about the reentry stuff and what
• 3:34
  these guys are doing. So before we do that, I want to
• 3:38
  recognize the show sponsor, Auto Plaza Direct.
• 3:40
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  concierge, the new hassle freeway, the car buying
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  experience you deserve. Auto Plaza Direct telling Brent
• 4:16
  from Nightmare Success sent you. Sean Stegman.
• 4:19
  Welcome in my man, how are you? Yes, Sir.
• 4:22
  Thank you. Just want to tell you I
• 4:25
  appreciate the opportunity to be on your show and just talk about
• 4:31
  a message of hope and give God the glory.
• 4:34
  And definitely a shout out to Roger.
• 4:39
  He's he's awesome. He's awesome.
• 4:42
  He is. Awesome.
• 4:43
  He he's just, you know, you for, for those out there, there's you
• 4:48
  can always tell just a good person.
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  Why this is the way he carries himself when he walks in the
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  room. He's always a tenant.
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  He he wants to know about you and he's just a good guy.
• 5:00
  And they've got a great company called RK Excavation.
• 5:05
  It's growing and has family business and and it's done
• 5:08
  really well. And Rodger and Kyle, I know, but
• 5:11
  they're, they're great people. So, Sean, I've, I've been really
• 5:18
  excited about this interview because, you know, I'm in this
• 5:22
  space. I think this is the 158th
• 5:25
  interview I've done and I interview people all across the
• 5:28
  country and you're in Springfield, MO and I'm in Saint
• 5:31
  Louis. I didn't know about all this
• 5:33
  good stuff that you guys were doing down there.
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  And I, I love it when there is a situation that we talked about
• 5:42
  on this show and I can actually go to someone that is actually
• 5:47
  making good things happen with people who are getting out of
• 5:50
  prison. Because it makes all the
• 5:52
  difference in the world from somebody who gets a real second
• 5:55
  chance start to somebody that goes back to prison because the
• 5:58
  recidivism rate, because somebody can't get a job,
• 6:01
  something they can't get set up to find a place to live.
• 6:05
  All the different things that happen and the barriers that
• 6:08
  happen send a lot of people back.
• 6:09
  But when we get in and talk about these programs, it really
• 6:13
  makes a lot of these are the type of programs I'd love to see
• 6:15
  that, you know, we could duplicate and make it national.
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  But I want to take it back, Sean to you because you you've got a
• 6:22
  story here. You know, you're the kind of at
• 6:27
  the top of the food chain now with this growing company, but
• 6:29
  it wasn't always that way. Take take me back to Sean
• 6:33
  growing up, Sean, mom and dad, Sean siblings.
• 6:36
  Where Where were you and how were things?
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  OK, so I'm from Jeff City, Missouri and I am, I'm 40 years
• 6:48
  old. And so my, my childhood, my, my
• 6:53
  parents, you know, they're still in my life.
• 6:55
  My both of them have, you know, it's not a real tragic story or
• 7:01
  a rough childhood or anything like that.
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  It's I mean, we weren't, we were pretty.
• 7:07
  My mom, my parents got divorced. My dad wasn't an alcoholic and
• 7:13
  spent the majority of his life in and out of a A, but he was
• 7:21
  just after my parents got a divorce.
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  He wasn't real super involved every other weekend.
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  Not real, not real intentional about a relationship.
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  As I got older, into my teenage years, I was pretty kind of
• 7:36
  taking my own path, a little rebellious, and I wasn't trying
• 7:40
  to hear anything that. You know, how old were you shot?
• 7:45
  When they got a divorce, were you young?
• 7:46
  I was in. I would say I was in second
• 7:47
  grade, so 7. Year old.
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  So I was, I was pretty young. We, we lived with my mom.
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  My dad didn't, you know, he was he, I, I didn't understand it
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  then. I understand it now through my
• 7:59
  divorce and some of my own experiences, what it did to him
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  and it kind of it broke him, you know, those things that had just
• 8:08
  happened that didn't go. I see it now for what it what it
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  was without a relationship with the Lord.
• 8:14
  These things that happened throughout his life kind of just
• 8:17
  putt, you know, piled on top of him were very heavy and so made
• 8:22
  him somewhat resentful and, you know, and towards just the
• 8:28
  situation or life, you know, maybe that's just kind of my
• 8:31
  perspective. Yeah.
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  And, you know, so he just wasn't real involved me and, you know,
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  in our childhood, in my teenage years, probably when I needed
• 8:44
  him, needed a male role model in my my life the most that he he
• 8:48
  wasn't the one. My mom, she worked a full time
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  job raising me and my brother. She wore night shifts at a
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  factory and then for 20 years and they shut the factory down
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  and she kind of bounced jobs for from there to there.
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  And we, you know, as long as we didn't have the police knocking
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  at the door or people complaining about it, She really
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  didn't. She didn't know what we were
• 9:13
  doing most of the time. Yeah, we kind of just.
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  Everybody was just getting by. Is you and your brother, right?
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  Yeah, yeah. And so I had a stepfather that
• 9:23
  was in the picture for a little while, a few years.
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  He is about the only person in my life that actually, you know,
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  tried to try to teach me some work skills, some habits, You
• 9:38
  know, even he prayed he had a relationship with the Lord.
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  It looked a little questionable now, but you know, when I look
• 9:46
  back on things, but he, you know, he, he prayed with us.
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  He he prayed he talked about the Lord and things like that, which
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  what I, you know, I realize now was stuck out the most.
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  And once I surrendered my life to the Lord and came to the end
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  of myself and the things that he had done and was trying to do in
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  that short period of time that he was in my life had a very big
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  impact on me now. Or or you know, so he was a he
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  was a leader. He was confident in himself.
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  He spoke, you know, and he was a hard worker and he no anyway, so
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  all that was. That at the time, was that the
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  same time period, Sean, that you were a teenager and you were
• 10:26
  kind of rebellious and getting in trouble?
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  So he he, I think my mom married him when I was in 4th grade.
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  And by the time I was a freshman in high school, he was kind of
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  exiting the picture. OK.
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  And, and that was hard on my mom, you know, and I'm sure and
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  so and so she, you know, she drank and partied on the
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  weekends. And I kind of grew up at like
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  flow trips, a lot of adult things that I probably shouldn't
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  have been engaged in, been around, but I was always adults
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  drinking biker rallies every other weekend.
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  Those are kind of the role models that I had in my life.
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  They, the majority of them, they all, they worked hard and they
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  played harder. That was kind of their, their
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  life motto, you know, and that was kind of the direction I, I
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  went. The one, the one person that did
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  take. I had a my best friend called
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  him my cousin. As we grew up, we were, we were
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  pretty close. His dad, he was a, you know, he
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  owned a business. He was kind of like the this
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  outlaw biker, you know, and he was pretty intentional about
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  giving us, you know, little Nuggets of wisdom that now
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  probably questionable, you know, and but he was a role model to
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  me. He was.
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  He. Was tough.
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  He didn't, he didn't take crap from anybody and even what a man
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  was supposed to be in, in, in my eyes at the time.
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  And that's what you know, So I, I took a lot from those people,
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  those men in my life. And whether they knew it or not,
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  they were molding me down a path as I took a little bit from each
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  one of them, made it my own, and then tried to, you know, my
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  pride myself, selfish ambitions, tried to, you know, build up a
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  reputation or an identity in these things that really were
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  founded on nothing and just crumbled.
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  Well, when you got I know that your, your story is Shawn, that
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  you your 20s and early 30s that you were, you were getting in
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  and out of jail, out of prison. What, what was it just petty
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  stuff that you you were hanging with the wrong crowd and, and,
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  and you found yourself just not on not getting into the right
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  lane and just kind of rotating back and forth between the.
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  Well, I am, I guess I, I've always, I've always been, I
• 13:05
  guess I would consider myself always end up in leadership
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  position, some position where people are listening to what I
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  have to say. They're trusting me.
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  I could always somewhat convince people because I would, I would
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  back it up with some action. I was the oldest.
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  I had a younger brother. I had, I have 5 male cousins.
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  So all the boys in my in my, all the the men in my life, the
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  their then kids, they were all boys.
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  I was older than all of them. So they all kind of looked up to
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  me. So I naturally developed into
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  like a leader type role. And so, but the, the kind of, as
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  I grew up, the problem with that was I always, you know, I always
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  started to realize strategically that if I did a little bit more
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  than the people around me, I would excel.
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  I could, you know, put in a little bit more work, a little
• 14:00
  bit more effort, a little more intentionality that I, I just
• 14:07
  ended up in positions of leadership.
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  I was, I was a leader, but I didn't, I didn't really have a
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  moral compass other than what, you know, what got me ahead,
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  taking shortcuts, stealing line, whatever I can make it look like
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  or whatever, you know, at the in the moment that could excel me
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  forward. That was kind of my moral, my
• 14:30
  compass. It was changing.
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  It was nothing solid. And so as I started to use drugs
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  and end up in the spiritual darkness, it developed into
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  something much worse. And it, it, it was all
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  essentially, it was all leadership.
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  I was, and so, but kind of to to back up a little bit when I was,
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  I was 17, I so well, when I was a juvenile, I kind of, I didn't
• 15:02
  fit in in school really. I wasn't real athletic.
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  I didn't I wasn't popular. I didn't have a lot of nice
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  clothes. So I didn't fit in really with
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  the popular. Yeah, my own insecurities.
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  What I navigated to was people that I did fit in, they were
• 15:18
  skipping school, smoking weed. That was really kind of the
• 15:22
  start of things that in my, from the freshman year, I, from
• 15:28
  there, I, I, I stopped going to school.
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  I ended up getting sent to a, a, a juvenile boot camp called
• 15:36
  Shelby Challenge where I got my GED.
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  So I was always around people that were searching for their
• 15:42
  identity, you know, a reputation and and so just kind of.
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  Within the within that group though, Sean, was that where you
• 15:54
  were also a leader? Yeah, yeah.
• 15:57
  Yeah, well, yes, I mean, I, I, I started to pick up a lot of
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  things. It wasn't really until my 20s
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  whenever I so after I got a show me challenge and plan to go to
• 16:07
  the military because it was a quasi military boot camp at Camp
• 16:11
  Nevada. And I don't know if it's still
• 16:13
  around anymore, but I took a lot from it.
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  And I was going to go into the military from there.
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  But I ended up after I graduated, I had gotten a wreck
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  drinking and driving with my best friend.
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  He was 15 and he lost his life in the wreck.
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  And so that changed the course of stuff in my, my life, the
• 16:36
  direction of my life, because I, I literally remember before that
• 16:41
  accident happened, thinking that I was somewhat invincible, you
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  know, that things just didn't happen to me.
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  Like I heard all these tragic things happen to people all the
• 16:51
  time. And I remember thinking about
• 16:52
  this relatively very right before this accident happened
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  after I graduated. Show me challenge and that like
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  I, I can just move through life carelessly and recklessly and
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  nothing happens to me. I, for whatever reason, I'm, you
• 17:08
  know, favored or whatever. And I have this favor with me.
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  And so anyways, the wreck happened, Zach, he was 15.
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  After that, I ended up I got I went to prison, I got a
• 17:24
  involuntary vehicle or manslaughter.
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  They gave me a five. It was my my first time.
• 17:30
  I was 17. You were 17 with A5 year
• 17:34
  sentence. Yeah.
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  And I, I did 2 1/2 years on it. And so I, I went to, I went to
• 17:40
  prison, I mean. That's young.
• 17:41
  That's young, Sean. To be walking into prison at
• 17:45
  that age with 2 1/2 years, what was that?
• 17:48
  What was that like for you at that age?
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  I was very, it was scary. Honestly, it was just a whole
• 17:54
  experience. Like even being in the, even
• 17:57
  whenever I talked about the show me challenge of being around all
• 17:59
  these people that were trying to find their identity and
• 18:01
  everybody's got some sort of reputation they're building.
• 18:04
  I was always able to just kind of get by like unnoticed, not,
• 18:10
  not like being picked on, not like a target.
• 18:15
  You know, I was able to always be like a figure it out, you
• 18:19
  know, be in the woodwork, in the mix of things and, and just, and
• 18:23
  I didn't involve myself in too many things that would get me
• 18:27
  targeted for whatever. And I then I went to prison and
• 18:30
  I kind of learned to adapt in that.
• 18:34
  I just, you know, I, I went through it and it kind of
• 18:40
  actually went through pretty unscathed, relatively.
• 18:44
  No issues. I mean, for the most part, I, I
• 18:46
  learned a lot. I pick up on things very fast
• 18:48
  what not to do and I don't, and I wasn't putting myself in
• 18:53
  positions that I didn't need to be.
• 18:55
  Don't gamble. Don't, you know, run around
• 18:57
  trying to pencil or do some stuff that's going to, you know,
• 19:01
  bleed you into a situation like that.
• 19:03
  So I just, I skated by basically I got out when I was 21 and then
• 19:12
  I just started. I went to work, I walked all my
• 19:15
  probation down the rest of my or my parole down.
• 19:18
  I walked that down no problems, walked it down, had a job.
• 19:23
  In the meantime, I still, I drank on the weekends and I
• 19:26
  partied. I did that.
• 19:29
  My little brother was a senior in high school when I got out.
• 19:31
  So kind of in the little party scene with him, he still looked
• 19:36
  up to me. He had a whole crowd of people
• 19:38
  that looked up to him that all looked up to me.
• 19:42
  So started to try to develop this, you know, this reputation
• 19:47
  or whatever on this identity. And my brother and I, we kind of
• 19:54
  decided that we would go into business.
• 19:56
  My stepfather that I talked about earlier, he had owned a
• 19:59
  couple different businesses in the short time so.
• 20:03
  Manu wanted to learn some skills and work for myself and make
• 20:07
  some money. And that was going to, you know,
• 20:09
  the amount of money and the work that I had that was going to
• 20:11
  give me my my value in life and my identity.
• 20:16
  And so I started working towards that still partied a lot on the
• 20:20
  weekends. And then I, we my brother and I
• 20:25
  started a residential tree business.
• 20:27
  We went to work for a company trimming trees in the power
• 20:30
  lines on the weekend. We did residential, we made
• 20:32
  money, we partied and kind of went through that.
• 20:35
  I started to I met my ex-wife, started having a bunch of bunch
• 20:42
  of babies throughout my 20s. I still drank the, you know, the
• 20:46
  the habit start really honestly as far I made it all the way
• 20:50
  till I was 33 and then I went back to prison.
• 20:54
  The one thing that probably made that I was able to function and
• 20:57
  make it as far as I did was because of her, the stability in
• 21:01
  my life. And so I kind of lived a double
• 21:05
  life with her. She worked, she was with the
• 21:08
  kids and then I I worked and then I did what I want and she
• 21:12
  didn't really question it a whole lot.
• 21:14
  I mean, she, you know, she wanted her marriage to work and
• 21:17
  she was waiting. She saw something in me and was
• 21:19
  waiting for that to happen and till finally she just got fed up
• 21:23
  with it. As things got worse over time,
• 21:26
  as I tried to build this identity and all the things that
• 21:30
  came with it and that misguided path that I was on, the partying
• 21:36
  got more, the drugs got harder, the compromises got bigger, The
• 21:41
  corners that I cut became more and more bigger compromises.
• 21:46
  And essentially it started with drinking the pills, eating
• 21:52
  pills, and then, you know, I did some went through a season of
• 21:58
  heroin and some just some things like that.
• 22:01
  And then it led to meth. And whenever I got to when meth
• 22:05
  stepped in the picture and opened the door for spiritual
• 22:08
  darkness and experience, that was that changed me and
• 22:15
  ultimately it led me to the end of myself and the end of that
• 22:19
  that marriage and led me to the Lord and here.
• 22:24
  So let's talk, let's talk about because you, you, I think at 33
• 22:27
  years old, did I forget how, what the amount of time that you
• 22:32
  spent in prison at that time? But I was, I was cute.
• 22:37
  How? How long was it?
• 22:38
  2 1/2 years at that. 2 1/2 years so Sean, what at that time going
• 22:43
  back in when you were getting near the end of that sentence,
• 22:50
  what were you thinking about how you were going to re enter your
• 22:55
  world, your society, your. Second time or my first time?
• 22:59
  Your your your second time when you were 33 somebody.
• 23:03
  I did, I so I did two years on that time it was completely
• 23:06
  different. Every, well, everything was
• 23:09
  different. I wasn't the same anymore.
• 23:12
  I had whenever I got locked up at that point, I had basically
• 23:19
  that spiritual darkness that I had embraced and and walked in.
• 23:24
  It had turned me into something or someone that pushed every
• 23:28
  person in my life away. They nobody wanted me around
• 23:33
  anymore. Not my wife.
• 23:34
  She had restraining orders on me.
• 23:36
  I got a stocking charge I had in in all of that, just not willing
• 23:43
  to let go or like I heard me do a very, you know.
• 23:48
  What? They call a rock Rock bottle.
• 23:51
  Yeah. I was in a very, very dark place
• 23:53
  and I wasn't willing to take ownership or let go of what I
• 23:58
  had put all my effort and energy in.
• 24:02
  That was mine that I thought was mine.
• 24:05
  And so, and because I thought it was mine and I, I didn't respect
• 24:08
  what it really was. I didn't treat it the way I
• 24:10
  didn't care. I didn't, you know, it's just
• 24:12
  the way I showed love. It was just twisted.
• 24:16
  And I ended up I ended up with a charge with an assault charge
• 24:21
  with a separate incident from my wife, completely separate.
• 24:24
  At that point I was had no filter because she was not in my
• 24:28
  life. And that you know, and that that
• 24:30
  somewhat stability that I had from her.
• 24:32
  Once that was gone, it was only a matter of like six months and
• 24:37
  a complete out of control cycle or or spiral that I end up in
• 24:43
  Cole County jail with several charges throughout the that two
• 24:49
  years of every time they the they had ran into me, they tried
• 24:53
  to pull me off the street. They tried to hit me with
• 24:55
  something. They knew that I was, you know,
• 24:57
  become the kind of knew the situation could never catch me.
• 25:00
  I've always been able to kind of get by and and be somewhat
• 25:05
  slick. I thought probably too slick for
• 25:07
  my own good and get by for too long and until it just, you
• 25:15
  know, compiled crashed down on me.
• 25:18
  But I, I end up in Coal County and I'm at the end of myself.
• 25:22
  I have a, a charge that is 25 year sentence up to 2585%.
• 25:31
  I got a bunch of other little charges that are strung out in
• 25:34
  the three different judges and just that all added up.
• 25:40
  My wife was gone. We have four children at the
• 25:42
  time. One of my youngest was seven
• 25:47
  months old and I didn't know her like she didn't know me.
• 25:50
  And I had. So I was at the end of myself
• 25:54
  and everything that came out of me was just hate and anger and
• 25:59
  resentment and I was done. I've been trying to take my life
• 26:04
  and couldn't do it. I couldn't even do that.
• 26:06
  I was too scared to do it. But finally I'd come to a place
• 26:08
  that I was absolutely done. And I, I, I cried out to the
• 26:16
  Lord like I had a Bible. I had been running from him.
• 26:18
  I could feel in this spiritual darkness, I could hear him and
• 26:22
  see him the whole time. Just wanted nothing to do with
• 26:25
  him. And but I knew he was there
• 26:28
  because I'd experienced this darkness that was real.
• 26:31
  And because of that darkness, if that's real, he's real.
• 26:35
  And so I I I could tell the difference between light and
• 26:38
  dark. The spiritual thing that I was
• 26:40
  had embraced and. You came to that on your own,
• 26:43
  though, Sean. You were in, in jail or in
• 26:45
  prison and you were reading the Bible and that you came to that
• 26:48
  on your own. Nobody else said, hey, check
• 26:50
  this out, Think about this. You.
• 26:52
  You, you experienced that. No, yes, exactly right.
• 26:56
  And even before that up leading up that there were two instances
• 26:59
  that stick out strongly to me because of my mentality or where
• 27:02
  I was at with with the Lord or hearing about him.
• 27:05
  Someone had tried to talk to me whenever I told them that I was
• 27:08
  going to take my life. I they tried to tell me about do
• 27:12
  you know who Jesus is? And I and I flat out told him.
• 27:16
  Don't even bring you know that, that I'm not trying to hear it
• 27:20
  like I'm not the one for that. That's not you know, and I was
• 27:24
  not willing to hear it and whenever and wanted nothing to
• 27:27
  do with it. And when I came to that point
• 27:31
  and I knew even then in my heart that I'm, I'm running from him
• 27:35
  like I like, but I have nothing left.
• 27:37
  So these things that I put my like I have nothing left.
• 27:41
  All these things that I have my identity.
• 27:42
  So why would I, why would I need him now?
• 27:45
  Why, you know, and all this so that blue Gideon's Bible, I
• 27:50
  still have it with been staring at me and having like beaming
• 27:54
  its blue cover at me and so bright that I'm like covering it
• 27:58
  up and like I can't get rid of it.
• 28:01
  And throughout the six months that I've been in and out of
• 28:03
  jail, after, you know, I had the restraining order and this the
• 28:07
  charge, the stocking charge on my wife.
• 28:09
  And just to clarify, you get a stocking charge if you violate a
• 28:12
  restraining order three times. So that's with phone calls, it
• 28:16
  just and excessive communication.
• 28:18
  So I like, I was never mind. I'm not trying to minimize what
• 28:22
  it was, but I just want to clarify that so that, you know,
• 28:27
  every time I went to jail or not a jail got like every time there
• 28:31
  somewhere, he's speaking to me, he's there like writing on the
• 28:35
  wall and or a Bible or someone tells me something and out.
• 28:40
  I didn't want to hear that. I don't care.
• 28:43
  And but it was there and there was no denying it.
• 28:45
  And when I came to that point, I said, all right, listen, Lord,
• 28:50
  I'm going to I'm going to give you one.
• 28:52
  I'm going to read this Bible one time.
• 28:55
  I'll read the whole thing and you got to do something.
• 28:59
  If you don't show me something, I'm I'm taking my life.
• 29:02
  I'm done. Like I don't care.
• 29:04
  I'm already in hell. It's not getting any worse than
• 29:06
  this. You're not going to do anything
• 29:08
  worse to me than the situation I'm in.
• 29:10
  So it doesn't matter. And the moment I opened up, I
• 29:15
  opened up to the book of Proverbs because the one thing I
• 29:17
  did know about about the Bible, there was a king named Solomon,
• 29:21
  the wisest man. If I could take anything from
• 29:23
  anything in this book and that it was going to be out of the
• 29:27
  book of wisdom and I was going to still strategically in my
• 29:31
  mind, I'm going to take some little things and apply them how
• 29:33
  I want. That was my mindset when I
• 29:36
  started reading Proverbs. It was so convicting of the
• 29:41
  reason everything my life looks the way it is because I'm a
• 29:44
  fool, because I shook my fist at God, because I wouldn't listen
• 29:48
  to him, because I chose my own path.
• 29:50
  I have been bought by the world and my own selfish desires and
• 29:53
  lust and my flesh and I had sold myself to the world.
• 29:57
  I I'm not not even intentionally, but it bought me
• 30:01
  and that's what it was and and and I cried out to him.
• 30:07
  I bawled and and even up until that point, I remember thinking
• 30:11
  for years, there's something literally wrong with me because
• 30:13
  I can't even shed a tear not enjoy, not anything got 4 kids.
• 30:17
  I can't even cry enjoy. Why can't I can't cry in pain
• 30:22
  anything. It's my heart was stoned and
• 30:25
  that moment I bawled myself to sleep.
• 30:27
  And when I woke up, it was, I felt light.
• 30:31
  It was different. My up to that point, my face was
• 30:34
  stuck in a frown and people everywhere I went, people were,
• 30:39
  is everything OK, you know, and, and just who I am.
• 30:43
  It's what I've become. And it was gone.
• 30:46
  Like I couldn't stop smiling. I, I started to I couldn't get
• 30:52
  enough of it. I started, I had to get as much
• 30:54
  of it as I could in me. And I read, I read the, the I
• 30:59
  read the entire Bible within almost 30 days.
• 31:02
  I don't know the exact time, but it was under 40 days later on
• 31:06
  that down the road, that number 40 #40 days is very significant
• 31:10
  number in the Bible. But it happened before that and
• 31:13
  I experienced some things in that with the Lord that you
• 31:16
  can't explain now, but I, I could, I read, I was reading it
• 31:22
  so fast that the, the words were coming off like a magic eye.
• 31:26
  And if I was reading out loud, I don't even know what my, it
• 31:30
  would have sounded like to anybody.
• 31:31
  It was happening so fast. I was trying to, I couldn't let
• 31:34
  it down. I couldn't put this, this Bible
• 31:36
  down. It wasn't a book.
• 31:38
  It's something else, something much more than that.
• 31:41
  And that my night, literally my nightmares, the dreams, the
• 31:46
  things that have been haunting me and plaguing me and pursuing
• 31:49
  me, these these demons that I had invoked in my darkness that
• 31:56
  like whenever I put, whenever I put it down the Bible down, they
• 32:01
  start tried to come back in. And it happened like this for a
• 32:04
  period of time until finally I was able to be sustained by my
• 32:08
  relationship and my identity. And these things that I put my
• 32:11
  trust in, I didn't, I didn't need them to hide behind.
• 32:15
  I was hiding behind things. I was hiding behind a job by
• 32:18
  buying a reputation by whatever, just my family, my things, a
• 32:23
  nice truck, you know, or whatever.
• 32:25
  I was hiding behind these things.
• 32:27
  And that was what I put my identity in.
• 32:29
  And so anyways, I, I real that from there that began my
• 32:35
  journey. He, he, I went to, I went to
• 32:38
  prison. I got a five year sentence, got
• 32:40
  all my case in one. I did two years on it.
• 32:43
  And from there I, the Lord had told me that you had been bought
• 32:47
  and you have to give up everything that you you can be
• 32:50
  bought with. You have to give up fighting for
• 32:53
  your family for and I know this may sound it makes a little more
• 32:57
  sense later, but you have to stop fighting the way you have.
• 33:01
  And you have to allow me to work in your life and you have to
• 33:03
  allow me to bring things back in.
• 33:05
  And you need to stop doing things in your own strength
• 33:08
  because every time I grab a hold of it, this.
• 33:10
  Is all things that you're dealing with when you're getting
• 33:13
  ready to make. That's to.
• 33:16
  Be released from your your your five year sentence to prison.
• 33:20
  Well, that's just going into my my prison sentence.
• 33:23
  That's not even before I'm released yet.
• 33:26
  That's just what he's telling me at the beginning of this five
• 33:28
  year bid that I'm going to have to, you know, what to do and and
• 33:33
  I so you're thinking. Going into prison, I'm going to,
• 33:35
  I'm not going to waste. I'm not going to waste my time.
• 33:37
  I'm going to, I'm going to get all different, better.
• 33:42
  Yeah, I you cut out a little bit there on the end.
• 33:47
  Yeah, but. You came back.
• 33:52
  I can hear you. Can you hear me?
• 33:54
  Yeah, I can hear. You.
• 33:55
  Yeah. So, so when you're, when you're
• 33:59
  getting how, what did you do in that time period, this, this
• 34:03
  prison time? So I did you use it.
• 34:06
  I right out of the gate, I started to journal.
• 34:10
  I stopped talking. I stopped being able to because
• 34:13
  I realized that everything that I that who I was and everything
• 34:17
  that came out of my mouth was some sort of fabrication or lie
• 34:21
  based on what I could make it look like.
• 34:24
  The stories that I even would tell weren't even fully truth.
• 34:28
  They were just some sort of fabrication of what it was.
• 34:31
  I couldn't stop. I couldn't stop playing.
• 34:36
  Every time I would talk about my case or what it was, I'd either
• 34:39
  glorify something that I had done that I shouldn't have been
• 34:42
  glorifying, and that was some sort of fabrication, or I played
• 34:46
  a victim. I didn't take ownership for why
• 34:48
  I'm really here. I blame somebody else.
• 34:51
  And I, I stopped talking. I stopped letting that filth
• 34:55
  come out of my mouth of lies and I started to journal and and
• 34:59
  read my Bible and build my relationship with him.
• 35:02
  And as I as I did that, I, I, I got sent to treatment.
• 35:08
  God brought a lot of people into my life.
• 35:10
  And if you wanted to talk about the Lord when I was in prison, I
• 35:13
  was there. I was at the Chapel, I was there
• 35:15
  and wherever it was and it, I wanted to do more of them.
• 35:20
  And I knew that he had put me there.
• 35:24
  I was there for a time to focus on the foundation and
• 35:27
  relationship with him, 'cause I'm going to get back out.
• 35:29
  And when I do, if I'm not founded on something, 'cause it
• 35:33
  all of what I left, it still waits me.
• 35:35
  I mean the the mess that I left waits me.
• 35:38
  And I went to OCC a treatment and for a long term treatment to
• 35:45
  get out. I became the prison chaplain, a
• 35:48
  prison chaplain. I worked up there.
• 35:51
  I started to get to know, look forward, to look towards what it
• 35:56
  looked like when I got out. I did.
• 35:57
  I knew I couldn't go. I know everything in me told me
• 36:00
  I needed to go back to Jeff City.
• 36:02
  I needed to get my my wife back, my children back.
• 36:04
  I needed to fix this. And that time she divorced me,
• 36:08
  went move forward with the divorce.
• 36:10
  She moved on with her life is what it boiled down to.
• 36:15
  And I didn't talk to anybody from the outside for the entire
• 36:19
  time I was locked up until the very end.
• 36:21
  She brought the kids up there. Well, she came up first to talk
• 36:26
  to me to see where I was at. And then, and then she brought
• 36:30
  the kids up to see me. And I had, I wrote, I wrote a
• 36:36
  letter to a guy named John Stroop that has a ministry down
• 36:40
  here, freeway ministry. So I didn't know John
• 36:44
  personally, but I my some of the older, he was older than me from
• 36:48
  Jeff City. And he had given his life to the
• 36:52
  Lord. It's he was a, he was a, he was
• 36:55
  basically a thug and a criminal. And, you know, didn't nothing
• 36:58
  with his like the same path I was on.
• 37:01
  Yeah. You looked up because you saw a.
• 37:02
  Similar conversion transformation.
• 37:06
  Right. And he was the only one that I
• 37:08
  I'd heard of that had got out and, and did something.
• 37:14
  He, he had, he had come to Springfield and started
• 37:23
  something called Freeway Ministry, a recovery ministry.
• 37:26
  I didn't know what it was, honestly, my perception of what
• 37:28
  it was, was a cult or something like that, some religious cult
• 37:32
  on a farm. I had no idea what it was or
• 37:35
  what a relationship with the Lord look like, but I knew when
• 37:37
  I turned in my life to the Lord, God told me, I'm going there.
• 37:41
  You're that's where I'm sending you.
• 37:43
  And so I didn't pursue it. I let it come to me.
• 37:48
  I let, I stopped pursuing anything except for the Lord.
• 37:51
  And I, I ended up, I, I wrote John a letter in a testimony and
• 37:56
  I told him, this is what has happened to me in my darkness.
• 38:00
  This is what God is telling me. But what makes sense to me and
• 38:04
  what I have to do is I have to go back to Jeff City and I have
• 38:07
  to try to get my family back. I can't not do that.
• 38:12
  But God's telling me that I need to come to Springfield.
• 38:15
  I need to, I mean, I need to go somewhere else and the only all
• 38:18
  things point to Springfield. I read his book.
• 38:21
  That's what it was. It was called Pit to the Pulpit.
• 38:23
  And he talked about his story and what was crazy when I read
• 38:27
  it, like we didn't know each other personally, but I knew
• 38:29
  some of the people and some of the things that he had talked
• 38:32
  about. And I start to see his walk.
• 38:34
  And so I read him a letter and I told him and after I wrote that
• 38:40
  letter, I got subpoenaed for the divorce.
• 38:44
  My I didn't know that she was going through with it or
• 38:46
  whatever. And my ex-wife subpoenaed me.
• 38:49
  So that broke that tie for me. Having that would close that
• 38:53
  door. To Springfield.
• 38:55
  Yes. And three days later I got a
• 38:57
  acceptance letter to Freeway Ministry from him without ever
• 39:01
  filling out an application. And so that was very clear to
• 39:05
  me. I even go back there, but you
• 39:08
  know, this is the drag. You make a choice.
• 39:11
  Yeah. And so that was the start of my
• 39:15
  re entry process. So that that wasn't the
• 39:17
  beginning of your re entry that that you you had the you had
• 39:21
  your ex-wife that went for the divorce because that's where you
• 39:24
  thought you were going to go is back to Jeff City to fix
• 39:26
  everything. But you had this pulling and
• 39:29
  this book you read and you end up in Springfield.
• 39:31
  That's where I want to take a break, Sean, because when we get
• 39:34
  back, I want to bring in Lee, the guy that is your boss you
• 39:39
  work with, that you've grown this company with and all the
• 39:42
  stuff that you're doing with the re entering how Springfield, MO
• 39:45
  has become your second chance world.
• 39:49
  So we'll take a break here and I'll recognize a couple show
• 39:52
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• 39:57
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  helping people out with their reputation management and
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  everything else it has to do with the online world.
• 41:05
  And I also want to say Nightmare Success Podcast is sponsored by
• 41:09
  the White Collar Support Group, the world's first support group
• 41:12
  devoted to people navigating the white collar criminal justice
• 41:16
  system. I'm a member of the White Collar
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  Support Group and I can tell you that this is a bunch of people
• 41:22
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• 41:41
  Start here. All right, Sean, we're, we're
• 41:45
  waiting, I think for LEAP and that's OK 'cause we'll what I,
• 41:52
  what I want to do anyway, Sean, is, is when you got that
• 41:56
  acceptance into the freeway ministry that did, did you know
• 42:04
  really much about what you were good, what you're going to or
• 42:08
  was it something that like, well, here it is, it's my offer.
• 42:11
  I'm going to Springfield, MO. I've read about this, but was it
• 42:16
  kind of a bunch of unknowns? It was absolutely a huge
• 42:23
  unknown. I had no idea what I was getting
• 42:25
  into with. With Freeway, I had an idea, but
• 42:30
  I still had my own plans. I still had my own goals, my own
• 42:34
  things that I needed to do. And so, yeah, I had no idea what
• 42:41
  I was going to do for work. I knew what I I knew how to do.
• 42:44
  I had ACDL at the time of Class B.
• 42:46
  So did you get the CDL while you were in?
• 42:49
  No, I had the CDL before. Because I know that some of the
• 42:52
  places like I was at Leavenworth and some of the guys got their
• 42:56
  CDL license while they were in. Yeah, that's a that's actually a
• 43:00
  big deal now that they do in prison systems for guys.
• 43:03
  And we we're we partner with the re entry process.
• 43:06
  We'll talk about that does that. But yeah, no, I had not.
• 43:12
  I had, no, I had my CDL before and I, I knew, I knew, I knew
• 43:16
  how to trim trees and I could do that.
• 43:19
  Well, but you know, that's not what if God wanted me to do
• 43:23
  that, he's going to send me back to just, I would go back to just
• 43:25
  city and do that. And so I had no idea what I what
• 43:31
  I was about to get into or what it looked like.
• 43:33
  I had an idea, a very narrow vision.
• 43:35
  Narrow vision because you just knew, hey, I've I've got this
• 43:38
  connection I've made. I know this guy and I've been
• 43:41
  given this application. He didn't even put an
• 43:42
  application in. It seems like Jeff City's got a
• 43:45
  closed door. I'm open to Springfield.
• 43:48
  And there you were. So Lee Lovell just joined us and
• 43:54
  he is the founder of CMC, which is that that stands for a
• 44:00
  creative modular construction. And you know, well, let's talk
• 44:07
  about it because I we're talking about Sean.
• 44:09
  You get it now. How did you and and Lee Lee
• 44:14
  welcome in, by the way? Thank.
• 44:16
  You. Appreciate it.
• 44:19
  How did you guys, how did you guys meet up?
• 44:21
  So I I went to when I got out, Base Freeway took me to one of
• 44:27
  their houses in Marshfield, MO. I was there for six months.
• 44:30
  I got a job at Mom's Kitchen cooking and for a part a part
• 44:37
  time job and I just started building relationships with
• 44:41
  people and not focusing on making money or anything like
• 44:45
  that. Just trying to let God to work
• 44:47
  in my life and trusting in him and trusting in the program that
• 44:51
  I was in and, and learning to respect authority, leadership
• 44:58
  and what leadership really look like.
• 44:59
  That was a big deal. I've learned in, in the
• 45:02
  treatment program, I learned that I started to learn those
• 45:07
  foundational principles and then what God wants that to look like
• 45:10
  as we're all called to be leaders in some form or fashion.
• 45:14
  And I then COVID happened when I was out in Marshfield, They shut
• 45:19
  down the, they shut down mom's kitchen, they shut everything
• 45:24
  down. And as soon as that happened,
• 45:29
  the day I lost my job or whatever, I got a call from
• 45:34
  freeway director and asked me to come be the leader of their main
• 45:41
  house in Springfield. And so all because I had been
• 45:48
  while I was in the Marshfield house, I was just, I was driving
• 45:50
  a van. I was making sure people got to
• 45:51
  work on time. That was my role.
• 45:53
  I wasn't doing anything outstanding.
• 45:55
  I was driving a van, making sure making the guys get there on
• 45:58
  time. And so they asked me to be the
• 46:02
  leader up there at the house. And so take on this whole huge,
• 46:06
  huge. It's a discipleship role, being
• 46:08
  responsible for other people actually and starting to apply
• 46:11
  these things that God was showing me in prison of what
• 46:15
  real leadership looks like and what I've been doing my whole
• 46:17
  life and the way he wants it done.
• 46:20
  And so and dropping the ball the entire time.
• 46:23
  Let me say it like I've never been really good at it this the
• 46:27
  whole time. It's very humbling.
• 46:29
  And when I got to Springfield, the director said, hey, we got
• 46:33
  a, a company that we're trying to build a relationship with.
• 46:36
  They reached out to us. They need some workers, probably
• 46:39
  some temp work or whatever. And so I want you to go down
• 46:42
  there. I was, I got to the house.
• 46:45
  They put, they brought 3 new people straight out of Greene
• 46:48
  County Jail into the house. So they were like 2 days behind
• 46:51
  me. And now I'm the leader acting
• 46:54
  like I know what I'm doing and they're following me.
• 46:56
  They're asking me for guidance. I don't know what I'm doing.
• 46:59
  And so we go to, we go to this place, Architectural Design
• 47:06
  Concepts, and it's a custom sheet metal shop.
• 47:11
  And I go in there, I interview with the, the shop lead, Steve.
• 47:17
  And Steve was a youth pastor, had been at the company for 20
• 47:20
  something years. And we interviewed, I got the
• 47:24
  job, I walked outside and I called Casey, the director and I
• 47:28
  said, man, I, I'm not working here.
• 47:31
  Like this is not what my plan is.
• 47:33
  I don't want this job. I'm not working in a factory.
• 47:36
  I'm going to go back to school. I have some resources available
• 47:39
  to me because through they're being locked up or whatever.
• 47:44
  And so I got some resource, I'm going to go back to school.
• 47:48
  I'm going to be a substance abuse counselor and blah, blah,
• 47:51
  blah. And he said, he said, Sean, you
• 47:55
  know, things are for a season, some things are for longer than
• 47:58
  that. But right now this is where God
• 48:00
  has you and this is the opportunity he's giving you.
• 48:02
  So you need to be faithful with that.
• 48:04
  Kind of gave me his story. It was similar.
• 48:06
  And he said another thing, you're not working at a factory.
• 48:09
  It's a it's a shop, It's a fabrication shop.
• 48:12
  He's like, that's where I work. And now I'm the director of
• 48:15
  Freeway. And so I like, I kind of blew
• 48:18
  it. Yeah.
• 48:19
  I OK. And I, I've, I've respected that
• 48:25
  and I submitted to that and that's what led me into ADC.
• 48:31
  What led the phone call on Lee's end and his wife Leanna and had
• 48:38
  reached they had been going through temp services and not
• 48:44
  having very good luck finding people or people that stayed the
• 48:47
  course. And so she reached out to a
• 48:51
  couple Recovery Ministries Freeway was one, another one was
• 48:54
  Freedom City and reached out to them and said if you got some
• 48:58
  guys, we got some work. And she had made that phone call
• 49:03
  and she's got it's a whole powerful testimony when she
• 49:05
  tells it from her view. And that's how I ended up at
• 49:09
  ADC. And then I met Lee.
• 49:12
  And then. So that's how you guys met.
• 49:14
  Well, the, and Lee, I, I always find it interesting because, you
• 49:18
  know, I, I'm a big advocate and people who listen to this show
• 49:21
  know that, you know, it's all about, you know, you can talk
• 49:25
  about trying to help this whole recidivism thing and, and you
• 49:30
  know, it's can rise as high as 75%.
• 49:33
  Three out of four people go back to prison.
• 49:35
  And a lot of it is is because people get out, they can't find
• 49:39
  work, they can't find a place to live.
• 49:42
  They might not have the skills that they need to be able to go
• 49:44
  do an interview or or do a resume or whatever those things
• 49:47
  are, and they can't find the resources to help them do that.
• 49:51
  How in the world did you find yourself in a position of being
• 49:55
  as open that somebody has to be to welcome the idea of growing a
• 50:04
  company where you're giving second chances to people that a
• 50:08
  lot of people are scared of? Yeah, I mean, great question.
• 50:13
  The the Lord works in mysterious ways.
• 50:15
  So we had a farm out in Lockwood, Missouri.
• 50:19
  We sold that farm and moved into the inner city of Springfield in
• 50:23
  kind of a rough neighborhood. And across the street from us
• 50:28
  was basically a halfway house, right.
• 50:30
  Well, I, I've always done St. evangelism and I've always been
• 50:34
  involved in some sort of door knocking, you know, I mean that
• 50:37
  sort of thing. So I started to talk to a few of
• 50:39
  those guys. I noticed they were always out
• 50:41
  on the porch. And what I noticed is, man,
• 50:43
  these guys were like the neighborhood watch over there.
• 50:46
  I mean, they were always out there wasn't any shady stuff on,
• 50:51
  they were just trying to stay out of trouble, right?
• 50:53
  I mean, they were trying to do the thing, you know, and so
• 50:56
  there was, and they had a leader that there that was a Christian.
• 50:59
  And so it kind of opened up our minds a little bit to that.
• 51:05
  And just, you know, I think that a lot of times employers will
• 51:08
  have, you know, the, the, you know, box on there that just
• 51:12
  says, are you a felon? And they kind of just put that
• 51:15
  aside if they see that, you know, there's, they think
• 51:19
  there's string. Put everybody in one box.
• 51:20
  Right, there's string attached with that.
• 51:22
  And and so again, I mean, God is a God of second chances, first
• 51:27
  of all, right. And if everybody was was really
• 51:30
  honest, probably most people would, if they were really held
• 51:33
  accountable for this nonsense they've done, they would
• 51:35
  probably end up in prison at one point or you know, for sure.
• 51:39
  So I just think that there was a a working the plan that the Lord
• 51:45
  had that that really kind of opened Leanna my wife's heart to
• 51:50
  it. You know what I mean?
• 51:52
  And then is that is that kind of cultivated in her.
• 51:56
  It really just, you know, the need was there to to good
• 52:01
  health. And so again, it was like, wow,
• 52:04
  we, we, we love the Lord and Gods have got us second chances.
• 52:08
  Let's see what this looks like. And and then when we got a few
• 52:12
  guys from freeway, we started plugging them in and, and you
• 52:16
  know, Steve Strader, who's our who was with the Sean said for
• 52:21
  over the better part of 20 years, you know, had a heart for
• 52:25
  these men as well. And he prayed every single
• 52:28
  morning for every single person in our company on his way to
• 52:31
  work. And so we had Bible studies
• 52:34
  going on weekly that were paid Bible studies.
• 52:37
  And we already had for years been trying to disciple men and
• 52:42
  a lot of problem men, men, the problems and issues just like we
• 52:45
  all have. But it really kind of became a
• 52:48
  passion. And it became something that we
• 52:51
  saw the Lord giving us some favor in, you know, And then
• 52:56
  once we saw that, we started seeing guys like Sean come in.
• 53:00
  And it was really interesting because when Sean first came in,
• 53:04
  I'd walk past Sean in the shop and he would just have this
• 53:07
  smile on his face. And I would just kind of
• 53:10
  thinking, what's up with this guy?
• 53:12
  You know, he's just got this smile.
• 53:14
  And I got to know him. And it was kind of awkward at
• 53:17
  first because I'm a, I'm more of an introvert.
• 53:20
  I'm not a real extrovert type person.
• 53:22
  And, and so, you know, I thought, OK, I'm going to talk
• 53:25
  to him. So Sean kind of instigated some
• 53:27
  conversations with me, and right off the bat, they were kind of a
• 53:31
  prophetic nature. And that intrigued me, you know,
• 53:34
  because they were really like, he was saying things like, God's
• 53:38
  got a plan for this, and it was like an insinuation that there's
• 53:42
  a plan here that's bigger than you realize.
• 53:44
  Lee I was listening and I was very focused on what Sean was
• 53:50
  saying and it, it just kind of resonated And it it was
• 53:54
  something that I started to recognize because I had been
• 53:59
  trying to mentor men at different phases.
• 54:01
  You know, I would try to take, always have somebody under my
• 54:05
  winging that I would be, you know, praying for and witnessing
• 54:09
  to and apologetics and all kinds of stuff, just trying to, you
• 54:13
  know, help them understand how to interpret Scripture, whatever
• 54:15
  it is. And so then Sean, when he got on
• 54:18
  my radar, you know, I just fell in love with him.
• 54:22
  I mean, I really felt like this man is a kindred spirit.
• 54:25
  You know, I saw his heart and when I saw his heart and then I
• 54:30
  think he got to see my heart and realized that this is genuine,
• 54:36
  that just that just started to to really cultivate, you know, a
• 54:41
  deep friendship, you know, and then out of that friendship, it
• 54:44
  was it was an iron sharpening iron, like what Scripture talks
• 54:48
  about, You know, I'm trying to pour into his life.
• 54:49
  I mean, I'm probably. Yeah, well, and, and you know,
• 54:52
  the the ironic thing is the Bible is all about prison.
• 54:56
  I mean, if you, if you see prison is comes in and out, in
• 54:59
  and out, in and out all the way through, through disciples and
• 55:02
  everybody else. But it's, it's always
• 55:05
  interesting when you, when you, when you blend in where we are
• 55:09
  today and you look back at the Bible and you look at prison
• 55:12
  and, and how it affects people as you read the Bible and how
• 55:16
  people who are part of the Bible experienced that come out into
• 55:20
  the world. And, and, and they're obviously,
• 55:24
  I mean, Jesus himself was, was someone who experienced that
• 55:30
  persecution. But I, I think it's just
• 55:32
  interesting for so many different reasons, because you
• 55:36
  guys have one of the things about people who are getting out
• 55:40
  of prison, you know, the, the unfortunate thing is, is that
• 55:44
  that for most people, they put them all in one box.
• 55:47
  You know, that persons an ex felon, they check the box and,
• 55:52
  and they're, they're dangerous for the most part.
• 55:56
  People who are getting out of prison are desperate to start it
• 55:58
  for a second chance. They're starved for it.
• 56:00
  They want to prove that this can be right this time and and
• 56:04
  they've had time to think about it.
• 56:05
  And, and a lot of people just don't get that to understand how
• 56:08
  great of, of an individual that can be for you, for a company
• 56:12
  that, that might be more hungry or starving for it then maybe
• 56:17
  anyone else that you could interview because they have a
• 56:19
  whole different mindset. But I, I, I think it's really
• 56:22
  something though, Lee, how you've been able to take this
• 56:25
  concept and you've also, you guys are building a really
• 56:29
  successful business. I mean, 7 brews coffee is
• 56:32
  something that you're seeing everywhere.
• 56:35
  You guys are fabricating those locations all across the
• 56:38
  country. And you know, from the time that
• 56:40
  I read the Springfield Business Journal article that was written
• 56:44
  back in 2022, I mean you guys are basically tripled in size
• 56:48
  and you know of your workforce of 100 and 85190 people.
• 56:54
  You know, you got a large percentage of guys that you're
• 56:56
  given second chances to that are part of your operation that are
• 57:02
  living out their second chance stream with you and and what you
• 57:05
  guys are doing and you're a big part of apply which is going in
• 57:13
  partnering and getting. Can you talk a little bit about
• 57:15
  that? Yeah.
• 57:17
  You guys talk a little bit about Apply and how that works and how
• 57:20
  it goes into prisons and how you guys work back and forth and how
• 57:24
  that works for you guys. This was something that I think
• 57:27
  really Sean kind of brought to the table and kind of made us
• 57:29
  aware of. And then once once I was able to
• 57:33
  go to the to the prison in Portland, MO.
• 57:37
  And really it was a job fair kind of a situation where we
• 57:41
  went in and sat down and talked with them.
• 57:43
  And then it really kind of was, it was really neat because we
• 57:47
  walked in there, we saw these guys get together and huddle up
• 57:50
  and pray right before they walked out on the floor where
• 57:55
  the where really the job fair was.
• 57:59
  So that I thought these guys, they're searching, they're
• 58:03
  looking for opportunities, exactly what you're saying.
• 58:06
  They're trying to, and you can see it, you can hear it.
• 58:08
  They they, they desperately want to change.
• 58:12
  They want to, you know, they want to make a change.
• 58:13
  And, and they recognize that that work is part of that
• 58:17
  equation, right? And and and really work is
• 58:21
  worship, right? I mean, whatever your hands fine
• 58:23
  to do, whether it's, you know, eating, drinking, whatever it
• 58:26
  is, it's, it's worship. And so to me, that really,
• 58:30
  really kind of my philosophy all along is, you know, if you're
• 58:34
  going to work, you want it to have an eternal value.
• 58:38
  Life is too short to go through pouring your life into something
• 58:42
  that doesn't actually have eternal purpose, eternal value.
• 58:45
  And So what this did, was it it coupled, you know, building 7
• 58:50
  brews and doing module reconstruction with this idea
• 58:54
  that there's no separation between secular and sacred.
• 58:58
  It's all one. You know, God Almighty has
• 59:00
  created us to work, you know, and said it was very good.
• 59:04
  And he created us to be innovators.
• 59:06
  He created us to be creative. I mean, we're his children and
• 59:09
  what what father wants a lazy child, right?
• 59:12
  I mean, what father doesn't wants to see their children not
• 59:16
  not thriving. And the Bible says all hard work
• 59:19
  brings a profit, but you know, idleness and laziness just
• 59:22
  brings it leads to poverty. And so, you know, a lot of guys
• 59:28
  that I saw coming out of really were on fire.
• 59:31
  They, a lot of them had relationships with the Lord
• 59:33
  already. And those who didn't, they,
• 59:35
  they're influenced by the ones who the guys who do.
• 59:39
  And so really it's just like a flywheel that just gains
• 59:42
  momentum over time. And now I mean 80% roughly of
• 59:47
  our employees are, are all, you know, we're convicted felons.
• 59:51
  It's, it's, it's an incredible number and I'm not run across
• 59:54
  it, Lee. That's what's like, I was so
• 59:57
  excited for this interview because this, this, this goes
• 1:00:00
  into 1100 prisons across the United States and, and you know,
• 1:00:04
  this, this show is about hope, but it's also about taking
• 1:00:07
  action. You know, talking is so easy for
• 1:00:10
  so many people to talk, but people who actually take action
• 1:00:13
  and you see real results. I you know, I'm wondering
• 1:00:17
  because Sean and I were talking earlier about.
• 1:00:20
  Springfield, MO has really become a Center for re entry and
• 1:00:24
  transitioning and and and job training and and and places to
• 1:00:29
  place people for jobs. Is that something Lee, that you
• 1:00:34
  think could or Sean, do you think could be duplicated that?
• 1:00:37
  Is that a is that a thing that that has a template to it?
• 1:00:40
  That could be. It needs to be everywhere.
• 1:00:44
  Could it be? Absolutely.
• 1:00:45
  I'm talking to business owners all the time about this.
• 1:00:47
  I've got today actually I have a potential investor in a company
• 1:00:53
  called Sun Solar that's coming into our facility to see what
• 1:00:56
  we're doing. So I'm always, I'm always
• 1:00:58
  inviting business leaders to come in and do our we every
• 1:01:02
  every month. We have kind of a, we have a
• 1:01:05
  Bible study every week and then one, one week out of the month
• 1:01:09
  we have, it's really a lunch in, but it's a, it's a milestones
• 1:01:13
  lunch in and we celebrate the victories in these men's lives,
• 1:01:16
  women's lives. And it's something like, hey,
• 1:01:20
  you know, they've got visitation rights for the first time.
• 1:01:23
  Some of them get their first car.
• 1:01:24
  When people recognize the small wins.
• 1:01:27
  That are big ones, those victories.
• 1:01:28
  And a lot of times it's just being sober for six months or
• 1:01:31
  being sober for a year, being sober for 3:00.
• 1:01:34
  So we constantly are celebrating the victories that we know the
• 1:01:37
  Lord is is doing, He's actually doing.
• 1:01:39
  That's such a big deal, Lee, because you know a lot of these
• 1:01:43
  guys don't have that to celebrate with and that you
• 1:01:46
  know, having that community, that family togetherness of
• 1:01:49
  knowing that somebody cares and somebody'd paying attention.
• 1:01:54
  You know that. Hey, I'm doing some things now.
• 1:01:56
  We. Have we've had senators, command
• 1:01:59
  commissioners, we've had, I mean, we've really, you know,
• 1:02:02
  we've had a drug court judge come in and speak to our men.
• 1:02:05
  And what's amazing about that is he'd actually sentenced several
• 1:02:10
  of the men that he was standing before.
• 1:02:12
  And he was, you know, he was opening the word of God and
• 1:02:15
  explaining how it was so difficult to send them to
• 1:02:18
  prison. But now he sees the fruit of
• 1:02:22
  what God has done in their lives and it's just amazing.
• 1:02:26
  So we, we have some people that have taken notice.
• 1:02:29
  I was able to speak at the the Springfield Business Journals.
• 1:02:34
  They have a symposium every year.
• 1:02:36
  I was able to speak there and talk about the applied program
• 1:02:39
  and really try to ignite a fire into some of these business
• 1:02:43
  leaders that, that love the Lord and know the Lord.
• 1:02:46
  But they have this, they have this kind of idea that business
• 1:02:50
  is business and and it's separate somehow from what, From
• 1:02:55
  your Christianity. That's not true.
• 1:02:58
  I mean it's. Well, the other thing too, Lee,
• 1:03:01
  is it, you know, business owners also know it's really hard to
• 1:03:04
  get people to work right now and has been for the last 2-3 years.
• 1:03:08
  The pandemic's been, you know, put it on steroids.
• 1:03:12
  This is a job market that if, if done properly and, and what you
• 1:03:16
  guys are doing and how the Springfield world is doing in
• 1:03:21
  Southwest Missouri, it's a process that you guys have put
• 1:03:24
  in place and partnered with the right people that, that these
• 1:03:29
  people that are coming out from 180 days in, from prison all the
• 1:03:33
  way through. Those are legitimate job market
• 1:03:39
  people that, that are desperately looking for an
• 1:03:44
  opportunity. And you guys are creating an
• 1:03:46
  environment that is not just a, you know, flash in the pan, but
• 1:03:49
  it's a real process. And that's what I love about it.
• 1:03:52
  Frank, can I, I want to hit on a couple of things about the re
• 1:03:56
  entry, just the process and, and everything like from my own
• 1:04:02
  experience, and you probably know just as well from being in
• 1:04:05
  prison yourself. The, the biggest scary obstacle
• 1:04:10
  in front of you is having a job. What am I going to do?
• 1:04:14
  Where am I going to? If you don't have that for you,
• 1:04:16
  you have you automatically coming out of prison or, or in
• 1:04:21
  this cycle, you're in a revolving cycle.
• 1:04:24
  And what's waiting for you is what what you left.
• 1:04:27
  That's what's waiting. That's what you know, and our,
• 1:04:30
  our spirit, our flesh and that it draws us back.
• 1:04:34
  The darkness is waiting for us to entice us.
• 1:04:38
  It's going to lure us back and it's going to prey on our, our
• 1:04:41
  vulnerability, our weakness, our insecurities.
• 1:04:44
  You're already in a, in a very vulnerable, insecure place,
• 1:04:48
  coming out of prison, trying to step back into the real world
• 1:04:51
  with nothing. I mean, the majority of people
• 1:04:53
  have nothing in their names in a new environment and to come out
• 1:04:58
  with a job already, you know, a job that's paying you $20.00 an
• 1:05:03
  hour walking out the door, you already have that solidified.
• 1:05:06
  That's a, that's a game changer. And instead of and that, that's
• 1:05:12
  where my heart has been with this the whole time.
• 1:05:14
  You know, the darkness stands there and waits for you to come
• 1:05:17
  back, come out of here. Well, so does the light.
• 1:05:20
  And we're, we're here waiting, you know, And that's what this,
• 1:05:22
  this place, we want it to be a place of accountability.
• 1:05:27
  I don't want to just skip over Sean is that I think it is such
• 1:05:30
  a big deal, Lee, that you are advocating to other business
• 1:05:34
  guys because you are having success and your company is
• 1:05:39
  growing and you're growing the way that that you guys have
• 1:05:42
  designed it to grow and that opens up people's mind.
• 1:05:45
  It's not a theory you're talking about.
• 1:05:48
  You're talking about real things that have happened with your
• 1:05:50
  company and real things that you're doing.
• 1:05:53
  Those are the things that make a difference to business owners is
• 1:05:57
  OK, that guy's doing it the way that maybe I could do it if I
• 1:06:01
  just did it that way. Exactly the way that they're
• 1:06:04
  doing it. The answers to the test I've
• 1:06:06
  just gotten before the test. All I got to do it is that way.
• 1:06:09
  But without your voice out there saying this is what I'm doing,
• 1:06:13
  guys, open your eyes to this. This is a real opportunity for
• 1:06:16
  both sides. It's a win win.
• 1:06:18
  That's the biggest that's a game changer and Sean, what you're
• 1:06:22
  saying is a is a game changer. But those two things going
• 1:06:25
  together are the things that really, you know, put put gas on
• 1:06:29
  the fire to make it burn. I, I want to also say, Brett,
• 1:06:33
  that just to clarify, this is not for any of us, not on my
• 1:06:38
  end, not on Lee's end. Been easy.
• 1:06:41
  It's a sacrifice that has to, you have to be able to step in
• 1:06:45
  faith and trust. It doesn't always go to, to
• 1:06:48
  plan. We've lost people.
• 1:06:51
  People come and go. We've had to have hold people
• 1:06:54
  accountable, hold their selves accountable.
• 1:06:56
  You really have to examine who you are and you have to change
• 1:07:00
  with it. You have to grow with it.
• 1:07:02
  And as long as you don't quit on it, right, That's I mean, that's
• 1:07:06
  the key. We, we have, we have a set of
• 1:07:08
  core values that we found it. But like I told you, we started
• 1:07:11
  as ADC. That was a we, this company
• 1:07:14
  created modular construction, the modular bin with seven brew.
• 1:07:17
  We founded it on a vision leaves vision and core values.
• 1:07:21
  The acronym is Christ, creative, honorable, respectful,
• 1:07:25
  innovative, synergistic and total ownership.
• 1:07:28
  And that's the foundation that this company moves forward in
• 1:07:33
  and applying those things into our work life, our home life,
• 1:07:37
  every bit of our life and teaching it.
• 1:07:40
  Our motto is we build buildings and we build people.
• 1:07:44
  And with the re re entry process, we've had to it's it's
• 1:07:48
  very expensive to train people. It's a there's a learning curve
• 1:07:52
  that comes with that and we've had to we're still, we still
• 1:07:55
  don't have to figure it out. We're still trying to weekly
• 1:07:58
  implement a structured training program.
• 1:08:02
  The re entry process, the applied program is a federal
• 1:08:05
  grant for because what's happened is people have realized
• 1:08:09
  in Missouri, Missouri at one point had the second or third
• 1:08:12
  most prisons in the United States.
• 1:08:15
  And so people are stuck in a cycle.
• 1:08:18
  They're building prisons and sending everybody to prison and
• 1:08:21
  there's no kind of real, real treatment.
• 1:08:23
  What you get is you get some connections and a network to go
• 1:08:26
  back out there and be worse than you were.
• 1:08:29
  And it used to be a. Worse, absolutely.
• 1:08:32
  You build more connect, you just build it builds on itself and
• 1:08:37
  there's not. And so the this grant for the
• 1:08:41
  apply program, they, they pay for half of the wages for up to
• 1:08:46
  180 days for us to be intentional with 20 people, but
• 1:08:50
  but they wouldn't. They wouldn't be willing to do
• 1:08:51
  that, Sean, if they weren't seeing results of the the
• 1:08:54
  positivity that comes from that. And that's.
• 1:08:57
  Absolutely. That's the thing, you know,
• 1:08:58
  having the willingness to put this thing in place, it takes a
• 1:09:01
  lot. You know, You, you guys are
• 1:09:04
  doing a lot. It takes a lot of effort.
• 1:09:06
  Like you said, you haven't figured it out yet, but as
• 1:09:07
  you're figuring out the company's growing, people are
• 1:09:10
  getting opportunities. It's changing people's lives.
• 1:09:13
  I'm sure it's filling you guys up seeing, you know, the lives
• 1:09:16
  that is changing and that's what this is about.
• 1:09:20
  You know, these things on re entry.
• 1:09:23
  I it's always so frustrating because I get to interview
• 1:09:27
  people of all across the country and I see different pockets of
• 1:09:31
  places that are doing good things.
• 1:09:33
  And if we could ever link up all those good things so that we can
• 1:09:37
  put an umbrella over the top of this thing, it would be very,
• 1:09:40
  very powerful. But these are the things that
• 1:09:42
  need to be duplicated. What you guys are doing.
• 1:09:45
  Got to find people that want to take the effort though, You
• 1:09:47
  know, it's it's Sean, your your points well taken.
• 1:09:49
  You got to keep figuring it out. You can't quit on it.
• 1:09:53
  There's going to be setbacks and there's always setbacks.
• 1:09:55
  There's setbacks in business, there's setbacks with anything
• 1:09:58
  in life. But if as long as you don't give
• 1:10:00
  up on it, you'll find some solutions for it.
• 1:10:03
  And that's, that's what I see you guys are doing.
• 1:10:05
  And it's if, if people want to reach out to you guys, they want
• 1:10:10
  to help, they want to find out more.
• 1:10:12
  What? How do we how do we do that?
• 1:10:15
  So you can go to thecmcmod.com. So the website seems so they can
• 1:10:23
  go there and essentially there's opportunities for employment
• 1:10:28
  they can click on. There's lots of opportunities to
• 1:10:30
  kind of get involved with that. And I'd say that really a lot of
• 1:10:37
  a lot of our, the guys that we're bringing in now, gals that
• 1:10:40
  we're bringing in through apply, we, we have a lot of
• 1:10:43
  applications, but we also interview a lot of people that
• 1:10:47
  are just coming in off the street, You know, so if you're
• 1:10:50
  in Springfield and you look up, you know, creative modular
• 1:10:54
  construction, you're going to find us and you'd be able to
• 1:10:56
  come in and God has brought us. This is the step of faith to go
• 1:11:01
  along with what you're saying. It's really, you know, it's a
• 1:11:05
  step of faith to say, OK, I'll deal with the time off to go to
• 1:11:10
  court dates to POS and do all those things that you have to do
• 1:11:14
  to comply. And at the same time, it's like
• 1:11:18
  those are so negligible to us because we're looking at the big
• 1:11:22
  picture, right? We understand where the source
• 1:11:24
  of the source of life is and who's the source of who
• 1:11:27
  establishes the work of our hands.
• 1:11:29
  And if you truly are, you know, in a situation where you put
• 1:11:33
  your faith and trust in Christ over profits and you realize the
• 1:11:36
  byproduct of hard work is is, you know, is always going to be
• 1:11:41
  some some sort of financial gain, right?
• 1:11:44
  You just can't go in it for the financial gain, right?
• 1:11:48
  You can't go into it thinking, OK, this thought they're going
• 1:11:51
  to pay half the salary for 1040 hours.
• 1:11:53
  And somehow that's going to it does help and it's huge and
• 1:11:57
  helping you pour into people to be able to, you know, invest in
• 1:12:02
  them, you know, right. And you but you got to have
• 1:12:05
  their best interests in heart over your own.
• 1:12:07
  Yeah, that's. The whole well, both sides are
• 1:12:09
  investing time, yes, and trust the time and trust is is
• 1:12:12
  something that's a big equation to this what you guys are doing.
• 1:12:16
  Yeah, yeah. I think it's easier in some ways
• 1:12:18
  to just try to hire someone qualified that doesn't.
• 1:12:22
  It's not going to maybe have some of the drama or some of the
• 1:12:24
  history, but man, I love seeing God work in peoples lives.
• 1:12:30
  I mean it's. Yeah, the turn around and.
• 1:12:31
  When you're doing your work unto the Lord and not just for for
• 1:12:35
  financial gain or for yourself, you don't burn out the same you
• 1:12:40
  have power behind. It's better you have the Lord.
• 1:12:43
  You know, strength behind you and that's what drives us.
• 1:12:45
  And now what I see in all, all our leaders at CMC is they've
• 1:12:50
  got the passion that comes from God Almighty himself.
• 1:12:54
  Holy Spirit's flowing through the veins of the leadership
• 1:12:57
  here. And they're, they're investing
• 1:13:00
  and pouring into the lives of the men around them.
• 1:13:03
  And it's not just one, it's every.
• 1:13:05
  Every single leader I know of has someone that they're
• 1:13:08
  mentoring. I love that.
• 1:13:11
  Constant, it's a constant thing. Lord, what are you saying?
• 1:13:14
  How do we get involved? How do you know?
• 1:13:16
  It's just like the Old Testament.
• 1:13:18
  You think about before the kings, God ruled that nation
• 1:13:23
  through the prophets. God ruled.
• 1:13:24
  I mean, he was the he was it. And and when, when Samuel was
• 1:13:29
  upset about the fact that they were going to that they wanted a
• 1:13:32
  king, God said, Hey, they're not rejecting you, they're rejecting
• 1:13:35
  me. You know, so we don't want to
• 1:13:37
  reach. We invite the Lord in.
• 1:13:40
  We have no apologies for being Christians.
• 1:13:43
  We tell, we warn people before they come in that.
• 1:13:47
  You've warned them. But there's people.
• 1:13:49
  Watch out. Yeah, there's people that have.
• 1:13:52
  Been in church in 20 years and I see their lives changing because
• 1:13:57
  of really the, the, the, the good infection, right?
• 1:14:01
  That, yeah, God is doing. And so it's.
• 1:14:05
  Well, I mean, God bless you, Lee, for, for being who you are
• 1:14:08
  and, and, and your wife. It sounds like to, to, to be in
• 1:14:12
  the position you're in to, to recognize the opportunities that
• 1:14:16
  you can provide. And, and then you get that, you
• 1:14:20
  get the, you know, the feedback that probably fills you out to
• 1:14:23
  see these lives changed. And it's just, it's just
• 1:14:25
  fantastic. I was going to ask you, Sean,
• 1:14:29
  this big transformation that's happened in your life and what
• 1:14:32
  you're and where you sit now, What do you think's your biggest
• 1:14:36
  take away through all this? Well, just in general and
• 1:14:43
  whenever I, I, I believe for all of us and a lot of the people
• 1:14:47
  that I deal with and I talk to and I listen and I try to give
• 1:14:50
  advice to is that the just taking ownership and everything
• 1:14:58
  is a like a choice. We're not in control of, we're
• 1:15:01
  not in control of what happens around us.
• 1:15:04
  The majority of the time. The only thing that we are in
• 1:15:07
  control of is the choice we make or how we react.
• 1:15:10
  And you know, there was, I listened to a lot of people and
• 1:15:14
  myself and at one point where I sound like a victim and I don't
• 1:15:19
  take ownership. And until you can finally, until
• 1:15:23
  you come to that point or a person comes to that point and
• 1:15:25
  they take ownership, not like, yes, some people legitimately
• 1:15:29
  are a victim, but we all play a part.
• 1:15:32
  We play a part in how that plays out, whether we and it's usually
• 1:15:35
  by establishing boundaries. We have to learn to say no.
• 1:15:40
  We have to learn to say no for other people.
• 1:15:42
  We have to learn to speak truth and we have to not run from
• 1:15:46
  things, but just make a stand. And these boundaries that we
• 1:15:50
  that we establish, they define who we are.
• 1:15:54
  They and the Lord gives us the strength to be confident.
• 1:15:57
  I don't need this in my life. I don't want it.
• 1:15:59
  I don't have to have that. I don't have to do that, you
• 1:16:03
  know, and I don't have to say this or like what's what's about
• 1:16:07
  to come out of my mouth right now.
• 1:16:09
  Just examine it, you know, is it the truth?
• 1:16:11
  Is it edifying? Is it building people up and
• 1:16:14
  just taking responsibility and ownership for that and our
• 1:16:17
  choices and the boundaries that we establish it, it changes
• 1:16:24
  everything. That is a great unbelievable
• 1:16:26
  take away. Shot everything you just said
• 1:16:30
  cause and and one of the big points you made there is about
• 1:16:33
  being a victim and and, and if you take if you're not if you're
• 1:16:36
  a victim, you're pointing fingers you're blaming people
• 1:16:38
  you're curling yourself up into a fetal position taking
• 1:16:41
  responsibility, saying you're a survivor stepping through the
• 1:16:44
  unknowns that scare you or the things that make you you know
• 1:16:47
  not give up and and and improve yourself.
• 1:16:51
  Lee, I thank you so much for doing what you're doing and,
• 1:16:55
  and, and giving people opportunities that you know,
• 1:17:01
  and, and not only that you're giving people opportunities, but
• 1:17:04
  you're also advocating why it works.
• 1:17:07
  What, how it can work to people who are outside of your bubble
• 1:17:11
  and the business community to try to grow it and duplicate it.
• 1:17:15
  Because it, you know, if you guys can do that, I, I got to
• 1:17:18
  tell you, I, it makes me so proud, Lee, that you guys are
• 1:17:21
  doing this in my, my childhood hometown.
• 1:17:24
  Because if this could be done, you know what's going on in
• 1:17:28
  Springfield and it goes and could be nationwide, it could
• 1:17:32
  really change so many people's lives for the better And, and,
• 1:17:35
  and it'd be good for business. Anyway, I was getting back to
• 1:17:41
  you guys as far as getting a hold.
• 1:17:43
  It's, is it CMC? The website is CMC mod yes.
• 1:17:50
  Dot com Yeah, creative modular, Creative modular construction,
• 1:17:54
  OK. And talking about being
• 1:17:57
  grateful, I, I've, I have all these fancy lights and cameras
• 1:18:01
  and stuff here at Homestead financial.
• 1:18:03
  They let me use this here. And, and it's a, it's home
• 1:18:06
  mortgage, Homestead financial. And if you've got home mortgage
• 1:18:09
  needs, Greg FDF is your guy. He knows everything.
• 1:18:12
  He just knows everything about it.
• 1:18:15
  If you're looking for a book out there, I've got one nightmare
• 1:18:17
  success. Check it out.
• 1:18:19
  It's Barnes and Noble and Amazon.
• 1:18:20
  Hey, it's, it's getting close to Christmas season.
• 1:18:22
  Just go ahead and buy them a book.
• 1:18:24
  I'd love it and if you got time, I know it's a hassle, but if you
• 1:18:28
  got time to leave a, a review on Apple, it helps the show grow.
• 1:18:33
  Check out my website, brentcassidy.com.
• 1:18:35
  I spell it wrong. I spell it with ATY, not a DY as
• 1:18:38
  I used to say to my people when I was writing my emails back and
• 1:18:42
  forth from Leavenworth. Stay strong.
• 1:18:45
  I'll do the same. Lee, Sean, you guys are great.
• 1:18:49
  Thank you so much for being here today.
• 1:18:51
  Thank you, Brent. Thank you for what you're doing.
• 1:18:54
  I'm your success in and out.