Latest / FINE is a 4-Letter Word / 87. (S3E13) From Nonprofit to Nomad: How Dan Clouser Found the Courage to Follow His Inner Voice

Transcript

87. (S3E13) From Nonprofit to Nomad: How Dan Clouser Found the Courage to Follow His Inner Voice · FINE is a 4-Letter Word

• 0:03
  Lori Saitz: Welcome to FINE is a 4-Letter Word, the podcast that empowers you to say fuck being fine. Tired of being stuck in a place where you say everything's fine when it's really not fine at all. You're not alone. I'm your host, Lori Saitz. I've been there too, and so have my guests. Here's a secret. All it takes is a conscious decision to change and then restructure beliefs so your actions take you in the right direction. That's where FINE is a 4-Letter word comes in. Each week, you'll hear inspiring stories from people who have transformed their lives and businesses and practical tips and takeaways to move you from spinning in place to forward action so you can create a life of joy. Thanks for tuning in. Let's get started. Today's episode is all about taking a leap of faith and making a change the kind you might dream of doing yourself. My guest, Dan Clouser, spent 30 years running a nonprofit youth sports organization. After some solo road trips, he realized it was time to move on and follow that voice inside him that whispered of adventure. He left the organization, published a new book, and now travels the country in an RV with his wife and golden retriever, Youkilis.
• 1:31
  Dan's podcast, Journey of My Mother's Son, is about the people he meets on his travels and their stories. Today, I talk with Dan about his road trip, his books, and the importance of taking time for yourself. This season is all about sabbaticals and what you attract into your life when you allow ease and flow and fun. While I was on my road trip sabbatical with Panther last summer, I attracted an amazing business partnership that has now developed to the point where my partners and I are actively acquiring personal development businesses or assets this year. So quick question for you. Who do you know with a personal development business? Really, anything in the personal development arena that would be interested in a super fun opportunity to make some extra money. Hit me up if you have someone in mind. Oh, and you can still get a copy of the Short Guide to Working Less and Living Better, Also known as the Five Easy Ways to Start Living a Sabbatical life at Zen rabbit.com. Now here's the show. Hello and welcome to FINE is a 4-Letter Word in this episode I am talking to Dan Clouser. Excited to have you here. Thanks for joining me today. Dan?
• 2:52
  Dan Clouser: Looking forward to the conversation. Thanks for having me on the show, Laurie.
• 2:55
  Lori Saitz: Yeah, so am I. So this season has been focused on sabbaticals and people who've taken sabbaticals and how they've managed to do that. And you are still you know, I did a one month road trip. You are extending that to I don't know if it's extreme. I don't know that I would call it extreme levels. But you took it and you took it next level for sure on the road trip. So I'm eager to get into that story.
• 3:24
  Dan Clouser: Absolutely. Looking forward to it.
• 3:26
  Lori Saitz: Yeah. Let's start out with the question that I love asking all of my guests because I'm just so curious, what were the the beliefs and values that you were raised with that contributed to making you who you who you became as a young adult?
• 3:41
  Dan Clouser: I think the biggest thing for me was just being, you know, instilled with the desire to give back and a desire to volunteer and give of myself. My mom was always very giving. She was always volunteering at something, whether it was Meals on Wheels or helping at the Little League concession stand, helping, you know, whatever local organization needed it. She was she was always there to help. You know, my dad, on the other hand, his job was an over-the-road truck driver, so he didn't have as much time to give because he was always out and, you know, on the road. But he was always very willing to give financially. So, you know, if there's an organization or a church that needed a donation, he was very willing to, you know, write a check and help out in that way because he couldn't couldn't give of his time. And I think that's something that just really, you know, instilled in me as a young man and just carried on through my adulthood was to to want to give back and volunteer and give of myself in any way that I could.
• 4:45
  Lori Saitz: Did those values. Contribute to your career decision.
• 4:52
  Dan Clouser: Yeah. So, I mean, I, you know, founded and ran a nonprofit youth sports organization for 30 years. So, yeah, it definitely, you know, really even unknowing to me, you know, greatly affected that that decision. And for the first 20 years of that organization, it was volunteer. It was all volunteer. I was still working a regular job in sales and, you know, was working in the building materials industry. But on a weekend I was volunteering for the organization, and then the organization grew. So, you know, to a point where we're so large where we need to we needed to hire staff. And at that point, I decided to leave my career and and become the first full time staff member of the of the organization. So yeah, that like I said, it was just something that was instilled in me and it was something that even though we were a non nonprofit youth sports organization, giving back was a big part of something that we instilled in our players as well, where we always got them involved in giving to other organizations and helping out, because I understood how that affected me as a young man, having it instilled into me as a child that it just felt natural as I grew up to give back. So I knew first hand what that meant to get kids involved and giving back and get kids involved in, you know, wanting to help others.
• 6:21
  Lori Saitz: Very cool. Yeah. And so what happened? You said you ran that organization for 30 years. What happened? Is it still going?
• 6:29
  Dan Clouser: The organization is still going. It's different than what it was. It's not as hands on as what it was when I was there. It's really now a scholarship organization to help underserved youth participate in sports. So it is still living on today, just not exactly the way it was when I was when I was directly involved.
• 6:52
  Lori Saitz: What? What caused you or what inspired you to walk away from it? Or to. I don't know that she walked away. To step away.
• 7:03
  Dan Clouser: Yeah, it's, you know, it's a funny story because if you would have talked to me in 2018, I'd tell you that I would die there, you know, literally, that I would probably never retire. I would die doing something for the organization. Um, and then 2019, I took two solo road trips that year, early that year, one, right. Right around the first of the year, I drove to Dallas to the American Baseball Coaches Association conference, and on my way back, instead of going directly from Dallas back to Pennsylvania, I went down through Louisiana, got together with some friends of mine that we did some some softball camps with down there up at the complex that we were in in Pennsylvania and, you know, went back to Pennsylvania a few months later. I did a similar thing on the to Orlando, Florida. Again, somebody we were working with, with, you know, doing some soccer camps at our complex that upcoming year went down to to meet with them. Um, and both those trips, it was really the first time in my life where I took my time and enjoyed the journey. You know, we traveled a lot as an organization. But it was always very regimented. You know, we had a very strict schedule. You know, we're traveling with anywhere from 20 to 70 teenage kids in tow.
• 8:26
  You know, so we've got some time to be in order there. No doubt. No doubt. So sometimes it's one bus load of kids. Sometimes it's three bus loads of kids. So it's very regimented, very structured, how we traveled. So I never really had much time to enjoy the journey, so to speak. And those two trips in 2019, I really enjoyed the journey. I took my time on the way to Dallas. I stopped in Memphis, spent a day in Memphis on the way to Orlando. I stopped in Atlanta to see one of my old players spend a day with him. And, you know, on the way back, I got off in 95, took some different routes and just enjoyed the journey. And at the end of those two trips I had written, like I hadn't written before, I had published a book in 2012. I was in the process of adding some chapters to it at that time, but it was very, very difficult for me to write just because the time that I was putting in at the organization, I mean, in our in season, for me to put 90 to 100 hours a week in was not beyond the realm of possibility in the off season, in the winter a week.
• 9:38
  Lori Saitz: What's that in the week? A week? Did you say weekend? A week?
• 9:40
  Dan Clouser: Yeah.
• 9:41
  Lori Saitz: I'm like 90, 90 hours in a weekend. Okay. No, no.
• 9:44
  Dan Clouser: Not in a weekend. In a week. In a week. All right. Um. With many of.
• 9:49
  Lori Saitz: Them. That is a lot.
• 9:52
  Dan Clouser: Yeah. Many of them would be on the weekend, though, because we would run youth tournaments, you know. So for me to work, you know, Friday from 8 a.m. till midnight, um, go home, be back at the complex by 530 in the morning and be there Saturday and then on Sunday, be back at 530 in the morning and be there till our last championship game ended, which was usually 930. 10:00 in the evening, was not. That was a very common schedule of mine. So yeah, out of those 90 to 100, a lot of them came in a three day span Friday, Saturday, Sunday.
• 10:30
  Lori Saitz: That is. That is insanity. Yeah, it was. Jeez. And you did that for how many years? That's I did.
• 10:36
  Dan Clouser: That for, you know, that to that scale. You know, ten years when I was full time, really. But.
• 10:42
  Lori Saitz: Wow. So, of course, no wonder you had no time to write. You had no time to think. Yeah.
• 10:48
  Dan Clouser: Yeah, it was. And, you know, I would justify it by the fact that we were doing incredible work. You know, we were helping kids. You know, we. And I saw I saw the you know, I saw many of those seeds blossom. You know, kids would come back to the organization when they were adults and we would see the impact that we had on on our, you know, on their lives as an organization. So I would use that as justification to literally, you know, grind myself down to, you know, next to nothing, you know, So, um.
• 11:17
  Lori Saitz: Right, right. Because you're doing it for a good cause. So never mind my own well-being, right?
• 11:23
  Dan Clouser: Put that on the back burner because I'm helping all these other people, you know, And yeah, so, so to write was very difficult with that, you know, with that type of workload. And look, I also want to, you know, full disclaimer here. Like it was by choice. You know, it wasn't like my board was saying, look, you got to put in these hours. You know, it was really my choice because I did love what I did. But again, there is kind of this, you know, weird. Justification of why I was doing it, you know? Yeah.
• 11:53
  Lori Saitz: I think far more often people do this to themselves, not an outside source. Even when you're working for somebody else, like a board or a boss in a corporate job, it's our own drive. We're doing this to ourselves. No doubt. No doubt. So.
• 12:11
  Dan Clouser: So when I got back from this trip, man, I wrote like I hadn't written in years. And there really was kind of now like this voice in my head saying, You know what? It's time to turn the page. It's time for a new chapter in your life. And it was really, you know, God's way of speaking to me, you know, saying, okay, it's, you know, you've done enough here. Um, it's time to move on. And, you know, just to give a little background about those trips as well, is, you know, going back to my mother, she did a similar thing in the 80 seconds where she took an old 1967 Plymouth Valiant, took the back seat out of it, put a sheet of plywood in there and a mattress and kind of turned it into a quasi RV and, you know, traveled around the country and did a ton of volunteer work connected with friends and family and just really lived life to the fullest. And, you know, the other thing on those trips. I think I had kind of this aha moment as to wow, you know, like, I think I figured out why mom did this. Like we would have conversations when she was still around. But I never really asked her some of the deep questions as to why she had done it. And it kind of hit me then, you know, and again, taking the time because I know I did a leg with her from Pennsylvania to Florida when I was still in high school and we never saw an interstate. You know, we were always on some back secondary road. And she just she took the time to enjoy it.
• 13:38
  So that was working in my mind. And I love telling people her story. Never at that time of my life would I have envisioned it to be, you know, following her footsteps, so to speak, be part of my story. Um, but this was all kind of happening at the same time now in early 2019, where I'm writing more and, you know, I'm hearing this voice telling me that it's time to, you know, start a new chapter. And, you know, I got to be honest with you, I did not embrace it. You know, at that point. I'm 50 years old. I've been with this organization for 30 years. I started the organization. So literally 60% of my life. You know, when you break it down, 60% of my life on earth was giving to this organization and building this organization and. You know, was like, I don't want to do this. I don't want to walk away. But. I did, I as I kept listening. I understood that it was time to turn a page and that I could actually impact more people through writing more and publishing more books and and, you know, doing a blog and doing some some more speaking engagements and stuff like that. And, you know, after a while, I bought in and finally told my my wife that, you know, it was something I wanted to do. And she she thought I was crazy initially. Of course. And then of course. She was also going through some some of her own trials and tribulations with her employer, where she had worked for a corporation that had laid her off after 23 years.
• 15:19
  They were they were bought out by another corporation. And then she, you know, was now working for, you know, a different corporation that was supposed to be a temporary two full time position. And we were going on two years. And every time she'd have the conversation about, you know, what am I going to be moved to full time? Um, it would be sidestepped or there was a hiring freeze or something was going on. Um, and one day she came home after one of those conversations with her superior and just looked at me and said, okay, I'm in. You know what? What are we going to do? Let's let's sell everything and get this like you want and let's let's see where it takes us. And from that point on, we put plans in motion. I let my board know that I'd be leaving at the end of the year. And, you know, now here we are almost three years in and really loving every minute of it and getting to revisit some of my old players who are scattered throughout the country, which again, is just a, you know. Kind of a affirmation of the seeds we planted through that organization and seeing these young men and women grow up to be incredible human beings. Um, and you know, I've since republished that book I was working on. I've published another book and I've got a children's book coming out at the end of March here. Um, and two other two other books in the works. So I've definitely been able to write without a doubt.
• 16:46
  Lori Saitz: The floodgates have been opened out back up to when you first started hearing that voice that it was time to leave this nonprofit organization that you had founded and built. And you didn't want to hear because you didn't want to have to take that that step that seemed so crazy and scary, which is happens to a lot of people. You know, they hear. Their inner voice telling them to do something that sounds so outrageous. They're like, No, that can't be right. I know I'm hearing this, but that that's just like some crazy voice talking to me. And they don't listen. So how long were you hearing this before you said, I need to I need to actually do this?
• 17:34
  Dan Clouser: It was I mean, it was a couple months that I kind of went back and forth, you know, in my own mind before I even brought it up to my wife at all. Um, you know, so I want to say a good, you know, two to maybe three months where I just kind of battled back and forth. And again, I mean, the organization was my baby, so it was tough. Yeah, it was tough to see, you know, to to be willing to walk away from something that you had built and something you put so much time into. Even if that time was probably, you know, slowly killing me, you know, I mean, to be right.
• 18:16
  Lori Saitz: Well, and I would imagine. I would imagine because when I had my first business and I ran that for 11 years and ended up shutting it down, you may have had similar feelings. Tell me if you did that, that you're I that was your identity. Like if you walk away from that, who are you now?
• 18:36
  Dan Clouser: Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. That that is absolutely the conversation I was having and. You know, I think if there's a lesson to be learned, you know, similar to what you said, is like, you know, for people listening, like if you listen, you know, if you hear that inner voice, um, you know, listen to it and act on it regardless how tough it is and, and regardless how old you are. Um, like, you're never too late, you know, it's never you're never too old to make that change. I mean, my mom did what she did in her mid 40 seconds. She was working very successfully selling life insurance for a company called Life of Georgia at the time, making good money. And she listened to that inner voice, you know, and she she walked away from that. Um, so it doesn't really matter how old you are or what you know, where you're at in life, you can make that change. And even if you think you're happy, because I thought I was happy and I was, I wasn't unhappy by any stretch of the imagination.
• 19:36
  Lori Saitz: Sure, everything was fine.
• 19:37
  Dan Clouser: Everything was fine. That's absolutely right. But it was fine at a very heavy expense on my stress level and my well-being, which, again, I would I would I would sidestep because of the work we were doing for the kids. Um, but, you know, you can't fall into that trap and, you know, you've got to take that time for yourself. And you know, now with what, what I'm doing with the writing and feedback I get, you know, from a podcast episode that goes out or, you know, somebody that comes up to me after speaking or. Somebody that reads one of my blogs or purchases a book and then emails me. Um, it's, you know, to understand what I'm doing now through that work is very impactful as well.
• 20:30
  Lori Saitz: Allow me a quick moment to thank you for tuning in to. FINE is a 4-Letter word. If you're enjoying the show, please take a second to hit the follow button so you don't miss an episode. And if you haven't already, I'd love it if you would leave me a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or Google Podcasts. Your feedback helps the show reach more listeners like you. FINE is a 4-Letter Word is available on all major podcasting platforms, so no matter where you listen, you can stay up to date with the latest episodes. Now let's get back into the conversation. Yes, I can. I can totally see that. And I will offer that. You were probably a quick listener if you were only going back and forth with this, not to minimize the struggle or the but for 2 or 3 months, because I talked to a lot of people, clients and other podcast guests who for years denied the voice. I'm not that's not what it's saying. That's not what I'm supposed to do for years. And I think to your credit, it didn't take that long. And when you listen to it, like you said, listen to that voice. When you first start hearing it and take action, you're going to get to the the good stuff faster. Yep.
• 21:53
  Dan Clouser: Yeah, without. Without a doubt. But. But you are right. I've. I've met people as well who have told me, you know, it took them years to listen, you know, years of denying, years of saying, I'm sorry, you must be talking to the wrong person. That's not the way I'm going to go. So, yeah, it's, you know, for each of us individually, it's, you know, it's our own timetable of how long that struggle ends up going on for.
• 22:21
  Lori Saitz: Absolutely. So if it does take you years to listen again, it's not about beating yourself up that you didn't listen sooner because you are where you are now. You can't go back and change anything. So let's move forward from here, from this moment today. You mentioned your podcast. What's that? What is that called?
• 22:39
  Dan Clouser: So the podcast is called The Journey of my the Journey of my Mother's Son for obvious reasons, because what we're doing is definitely following my mom's footsteps. Um, and it. It's a way for me to tell stories of the people that we've met in our travels. And it's very cool because, you know, one of the reasons I wanted to podcast, I'd been podcasting for the organization actually since 2012, and I really liked, you know, the interaction. I liked having a conversation with someone. It was a different format. It was literally like a ten to, you know, 14, 15 minute conversation. And it could have been with a sponsor for an event we were coming up or anything like that. But as you know, I bought into the idea of of moving on and starting a new chapter. I really wanted to to continue to tell stories. And one of the things that I thought about was reading through my mom's journals after she had passed away and also getting letters from people who she had, you know, in some cases a very short interaction with. But yet she made an incredible impact on their life. And when they heard she passed it, you know, it touched them. So they would reach out to us. And, you know, I thought to myself, man, how cool would have it been, you know, for mom to have social media and some of the technology that we have today to be able to share her story in real time? And that was one of the reasons why I wanted to be able to do this, to share those stories in real time with the people that we've met.
• 24:14
  And, you know, it's it's people that I literally meet face to face. And, you know, we'll connect with them to do a podcast. It's some of my former players that we get to connect with and we'll do a podcast or there's times where I will meet someone virtually so to speak, do a podcast and then find out that we're in their area, you know, a few months later, reach out to them and say, Hey, you know, let's get together for coffee or lunch or dinner or just, you know, swing by the campground if you can or whatever the case is. And it's really neat to be able to to connect with those people and to be able to tell those stories, because I really do think that everyone has a story and that all of those stories can be very inspiring to people. So I love being able to be a platform to help tell those stories, and it's a very wide array of guests from, you know, life coaches to, like I said, some of my former players to, you know, former professional players from go going back to my sports background. Um, but there's always just, you know, an underlying theme of, you know, having a story that's going to be able to inspire others.
• 25:30
  Lori Saitz: Yeah, 100%. I mean, that's part of a lot of the reason why I'm doing this show. And you just mentioned something that I have not talked about yet, so I'm going to make a little bit of a preview potentially right here about meeting, traveling around and meeting up with your past podcast guests. So I've been thinking a lot because I am coming up on episode 100, I believe if I've done the math right, which is questionable, but July 6th will be episode public Publishing of Episode 100. And I've been thinking like, what could I do to celebrate that? And so I have this idea of percolating in the back of my head, of going back out on another road trip and maybe visiting some areas and stopping in. All right, I'm not going to show up at anybody's house like unannounced, like, Hey, I'm here. Can I sleep over? Not like that. But but going out and and getting together with some past podcast guests, that would be super fun.
• 26:30
  Dan Clouser: Yeah, it would be. And I can say that for a fact. It would be. When we came up through Texas, I had the opportunity to meet with three of my former guests and everyone. It was like, honestly, as if we were friends for life, you know? And that's what I think is so cool. You have a conversation, you know, 30, 40 minute conversation with someone that you record and then you throw out there for the world to listen to and you feel this real, real connection with that person and you stay in contact with them and then you meet them face to face. And it again, it's affirmation as to, yes, we we really did connect. It wasn't something that I just imagined. Like we really did connect. And you find yourself sitting there at a coffee shop in 2.5 hours go by and you're like, Oh, wow, it's now 330. It's time to go.
• 27:18
  Lori Saitz: Yeah, Well, and I think it happens because you're in this you're in this recording studio and even virtually recording studio like we are, and it's this intimate space and you're sharing stories and sharing memories and emotions, and there's a bond that happens.
• 27:37
  Dan Clouser: Yeah, it really is. Really is.
• 27:39
  Lori Saitz: Yeah. So you're on the road, What? Indefinitely?
• 27:45
  Dan Clouser: Yeah. We have no exit plan whatsoever, you know, So I know some people, they start out on this and they'll be like, Hey, we're going to do it for. Two years or three years or ten years, whatever it is, and then we'll find our forever home or whatever. We have absolutely no exit plan at this point. We're literally living in the moment, taking it one day at a time and just enjoying the journey. You know, for for once in our lives, enjoying the journey and and loving every second of it.
• 28:16
  Lori Saitz: That is so cool. So where have you been that you would recommend people if they were going somewhere? Like, where should where is the place that you would recommend that most people wouldn't think of?
• 28:31
  Dan Clouser: It's a question that I get often, and it is you. I'm trying to.
• 28:35
  Lori Saitz: Be original, damn it.
• 28:37
  Dan Clouser: Well, it's so. It's so tough, you know, It's so tough to answer because, man, we we live in a beautiful, beautiful country. Yes. And, you know, if I give you if I give you a five on a list, like I'll immediately think of five others that are like-
• 28:53
  Lori Saitz: How about in the past month?
• 28:55
  Dan Clouser: So in the past month, I mean, I'd just finished up a book tour, so we did a lot of a lot of Texas, a lot of Louisiana. Lake Charles, Louisiana is a spot that's actually very special to me and my wife because we've got friends there. Um, they were the friends I visited on that trip on the way back to Dallas. So it's kind of become a, you know, another home for us. We've actually been there on multiple occasions to help with hurricane relief efforts. Right after Hurricane Laura came through, we'd helped and we helped with a state park. Um, so Lake Charles is just a beautiful area. Lake Charles Sulphur, beautiful area. Galveston, Texas is absolutely beautiful. It's one of our, you know, one of our favorites. And then just going back, you know, once you get out to the West Coast, Long Beach, Washington, was beautiful. Um, you know, Kentucky blew us away. We just completely exceeded our expectations. And we went to Kentucky. We stayed at a really cool state park there and we stayed at Mammoth Cave National Park and again, just completely exceeded our, our expectations. Um, you know, and again, it's just so many. And I think the coolest part of, of this journey is not just the place we've been, but the people we've met.
• 30:13
  You know, it just goes to show again, if you sit down and have a conversation with someone, you're going to find out you have a lot more in common with them than what you don't. And there's so many different cultures in this country. Yes. And we live in such a polarized climate. But like, if we just take five minutes and sit down and have a conversation and that was one of the cool things about the book signings I was doing wasn't so much about selling books and signing books, but had some real connections with people who would come up and they might not even bought a book, but we would stand there and talk for, you know, ten, 15 minutes. And again, it was it was a very special time. And, you know, hearing their story and them listening to my story, um, you know, it was very cool. So I think if we all just take time and listen to people, talk to people and understand their perspective, it would make the world a much better place.
• 31:04
  Lori Saitz: Oh, 100%. And that's what most people. Deeply, deeply desire is for someone to listen to them. And when we do that, like you said, we have far more in common. Then we do indifference. It's just a matter of taking the time to sit down and have that conversation. And you don't have to walk away from that conversation agreeing with their point of view. You just come away with an understanding of how they got to it and why they're why they have it.
• 31:37
  Dan Clouser: Yeah. Yeah, no, no doubt about it. Listening is such an incredible skill. It really.
• 31:43
  Speaker3: Is. Listening.
• 31:44
  Lori Saitz: Yeah. And, you know, it's funny because people think that storytelling is about you talking, but storytelling is really more about you listening to hear the stories to be able to then. Retell them or craft them in a different way to then put it out there again. But you have to be very aware of other characters in the play of your life to be able to put together good stories.
• 32:15
  Dan Clouser: Yeah, yeah, no doubt about it. Because, I mean, even in an interaction like this, mean I just did a podcast that I had hosted not too long ago where my guest at the end had mentioned to me. She said, you know, this this was so much better than the last podcast that I did because the last podcast the host gave me like ten questions scripted, and I would answer the question and he would not then expand upon it. It would just he's on to the next question. And I was like, Yeah, like I never give guests questions. I don't, you know, and even when I'm on a, you know, if someone gives me questions ahead of time, I glance at them. But then I kind of put them to the side because I want it to be a conversation. You know, it's not you know, it's not just about like you said, it's not about me. It's not about you as the host. It's about collectively. You know what what are we going to come to collectively that that other people can listen to and be inspired by?
• 33:08
  Lori Saitz: Yeah, that's what all the best interviewers do and have done. You listen to I was going to say podcasts, but Larry King didn't do podcasts. Larry King was doing radio and TV interviews, but the best interviewers. Are listening and helping. Uh, how what's the word? I'm, like, pulling out those stories. I was going to say help developing. They're not developing them. They are. They're. They're pulling them out of people by asking those questions. And the only way you can ask the good questions is by listening. So, yeah, that's what that's what the good interviewers do. So we'll pat ourselves on the back. So a moment of self self appreciation. It's one of the so you know I do people who've listened to the show, they know I do ask that one question at the beginning about your beliefs. That's like a standard go to because I'm just so curious about how people have been raised. And then the last question of what's your hype song? And that goes back to when I was doing my radio days and I'm so still so into music. So again, Curiosity, What's your hype song when you're out on the road and you've been driving for a long time and you're just like, I need some energy, what do you listen to?
• 34:34
  Dan Clouser: Yeah. So when I saw that question, I loved it because, like, You mean music has played such an incredible, you know. Part of my life. It's been so, you know, such a big part of it. And it was a tough question for me at first. I really had to to think because I think it kind of depends on where I'm at. But my go to, you know, really right now is starting over by Chris Stapleton, you know, just listening to those lyrics and, you know, with what my wife and I are doing right now and talking about, you know, you can be my lucky penny and I can be your four leaf clover. And, you know, yeah, just kind of rolling it out there. It's kind of been, you know, our hype song since we've been on this journey. But, you know, I could have went with so many others, like when I was coaching, you know, on a game day. Like Crazy Train was, you know, my big hype song on the way to the ballpark. If we had a big game like I would make sure I was playing that loudly in the truck as I'm heading to the ball. Well, that.
• 35:30
  Lori Saitz: Definitely sounds like what you were writing during those Days.
• 35:34
  Dan Clouser: Yeah. So, but yeah, starting over by Chris Stapleton, definitely be I think, what our hype song is today for sure.
• 35:43
  Lori Saitz: Excellent choice. Excellent choice. So. If people want to continue a conversation with you or they want to know where you're going to show up next, maybe if you're going to be in their town or something, how do they how do they get in touch with you or how do they follow you?
• 35:59
  Dan Clouser: Best way is go to my website, which is journey my mother son.com or Danclouser.com. If you know sometimes journey my mother's son gets to be quite a mouthful so make it easy and also have Danclouser.com. There's both URLs. Go to the same website and everything that I have from there is there. So Facebook page. Linkedin page Instagram. Um, links to the podcast, a link to email me. And I do love hearing from people. I absolutely love hearing from people, you know, whether it's through email, whether it's through a message on Instagram or Facebook. I enjoyed doing that and connecting. And yeah, if we're, you know, if we're in the area, I have no problem connecting with someone I've never met in person before.
• 36:46
  Lori Saitz: Excellent. I will put links to all those places. In the show notes, so it'll be really easy. You can just go to the show notes and click on it instead of having to type out Journey of my mother's son.com and yeah, and then people can reach out and follow along as I have been doing on Facebook. Thank you so much for joining me today Dan on FINE is a 4-Letter Word.
• 37:11
  Dan Clouser: Thanks a lot Laura really enjoyed the conversation.
• 37:19
  Lori Saitz: Rv life is becoming more and more common. Or maybe I'm just attracting more people who are doing it into my life these days. Remember Elaine Blaize back in episode four of this season? She's doing the same and traveling with her dog as well. Here are today's key takeaways. Number one, traveling from place to place is cool, and it's important to take your time and enjoy the journey. That's a cliche for a reason. Number two, it's easy to fall into the trap of justifying overwork when you believe in the cause you're supporting. But grinding yourself down to nothing isn't going to allow you to make any kind of positive impact on the world. Number three, when you hear that inner voice prompting you to make a change, listen to it. It doesn't matter how old you are, there is always time to make that change. You're never too old and it's never too late. Number four, everyone has a story, and each story has the power to influence and inspire people. Find the courage to share your story. Number five, When you sit down and have a conversation with someone, you're going to find you have so much more in common than you could ever imagine. Thanks for listening to FINE is a 4-Letter Word. If you've enjoyed the show, please follow and share it with a friend. Leave a review on Apple Podcasts or your favorite platform to help others discover it too. You can find links to my socials on my website Zen rabbit.com. And before you go, take a moment to reflect on what you're grateful for today. Remember, you have the power to create a life you love, and I'm proud of you. Thanks for joining me. Take care.