Latest / Therapy Thursday with Ellen K / Should I Feel Guilty for Taking a Day Off?

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Should I Feel Guilty for Taking a Day Off? · Therapy Thursday with Ellen K

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Why do we always feel like we have to over-explain?
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: You know, it's like, you know, if you just wake
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: up and you go, I don't feel well. Yeah, right.
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: That's it.
• 0:08
  Speaker 3: I think over-explaining implies lying sometimes.
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 0:12
  Speaker 3: It's like, don't give me that. I don't need that.
• 0:15
  Speaker 3: Just tell me.
• 0:16
  Speaker 4: And also just because someone asks us a question doesn't
• 0:19
  Speaker 4: mean we're obligated to answer it.
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: Exactly.
• 0:22
  Speaker 3: You are so right. Look at Ryan Mano. He's doing
• 0:30
  Speaker 3: some self-care. He bought a new linen wardrobe.
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 0:33
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: In Greece.
• 0:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: Oh, how wonderful.
• 0:36
  Speaker 3: Doesn't that feel good?
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: I'm a necklace guy now, apparently, and I've changed my hair. Yeah.
• 0:40
  Speaker 3: You stop doing your hair every day.
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: You want to talk about self-care? Yeah.
• 0:43
  Speaker 4: You know?
• 0:43
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: Sarah, as a therapist, do you, so a lot of
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: times we hear about like the client, the person saying,
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: I don't, it wasn't a fit for me.
• 0:53
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 0:53
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: In terms of self-care, do you ever get to go,
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: you know what? You're not a fit for me.
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: Oh, my God.
• 0:59
  Speaker 4: I'm trying to think if that's ever happened. I don't
• 1:02
  Speaker 4: think it's happened with somebody that I've been seeing long term.
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: Where like one day they're like, okay, you're not a
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: fit for me.
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: But it has happened.
• 1:12
  Speaker 4: God, I can think of this one time with a
• 1:14
  Speaker 4: couple and the– husband was very aggressive like very very
• 1:22
  Speaker 4: loud okay to both his partner and to me whoa
• 1:26
  Speaker 4: it just felt too uh it felt and he said
• 1:28
  Speaker 4: i remember he texted me afterwards and he goes i
• 1:31
  Speaker 4: think we're gonna go in another direction and i was
• 1:34
  Speaker 4: i was truly relieved and i think that may be
• 1:36
  Speaker 4: the only time that that's happened where i was like
• 1:38
  Speaker 4: thank god yeah yeah yeah.
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: Were you wanting to to say the same before he
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: said it I.
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: Don't know if I would have. This was a few
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: years ago. So I don't know if I would have
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: been as direct.
• 1:50
  Speaker 4: I don't know if I was as comfortable as taking
• 1:52
  Speaker 4: care of my own needs in that way as I am.
• 1:55
  Speaker 4: But now I think I'd be okay with saying that
• 2:01
  Speaker 4: I didn't think I was the therapist for them.
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: That's good.
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: Good to know.
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: I didn't know how that worked.
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: Did a therapist say that to you? I'm just kidding.
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: I just think it would be important for that to
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: be a two-way street because if the person can go,
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: you know, this isn't, I'm not gelling, then you should
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: have that same right.
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely.
• 2:20
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: It's like any relationship, you know?
• 2:22
  Speaker 4: Because it is a collaborative relationship.
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 2:26
  Speaker 3: And it could be something as simple as like where
• 2:28
  Speaker 3: you get your nails done. I was at the nail
• 2:30
  Speaker 3: salon and the girl, Tina, who does my nails, one
• 2:35
  Speaker 3: of the girls at the front desk came and said, hey, Tina,
• 2:37
  Speaker 3: will you see this client after Ellen? And she said,
• 2:40
  Speaker 3: let me see the profile. And she looked at the
• 2:42
  Speaker 3: profile and it said banned. The client had been banned
• 2:45
  Speaker 3: because she was never happy and she wouldn't pay sometimes.
• 2:49
  Speaker 3: So Tina's like, no, that's a big hard no. Why
• 2:52
  Speaker 3: would you even ask me for that? Like this person's
• 2:56
  Speaker 3: in our database as banned.
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: So no way. As a difficult client.
• 3:01
  Speaker 3: Yeah, right. Who wants to invite that into your life?
• 3:05
  Speaker 3: I keep it chill.
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: You know what I did?
• 3:08
  Speaker 4: This was like probably the biggest self-care thing I ever did.
• 3:11
  Speaker 4: One year, I stayed home completely alone for Thanksgiving.
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: Oh, my God.
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: It was amazing.
• 3:20
  Speaker 4: We were living in Detroit. Paul came out here to
• 3:22
  Speaker 4: see his kids. Normally, we would do, like, Thanksgiving separately.
• 3:26
  Speaker 4: I would go down to Atlanta. I was like, you know,
• 3:28
  Speaker 4: I'm going back the next month for Christmas. And I
• 3:31
  Speaker 4: just started my practice, and I just took those three days.
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: Did nothing.
• 3:36
  Speaker 4: Had, like, McDonald's for my Thanksgiving meal.
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: Watched TV. Oh, that's so nice.
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: It was.
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: Fucking amazing.
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 3:43
  Speaker 3: And didn't you run around Europe on your own also?
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: For a couple days.
• 3:47
  Speaker 3: For the first time?
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: It's so, it's just, it's amazing.
• 3:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah. It is, it is like keeping in touch with
• 3:53
  Speaker 3: yourself is so good. You know, it's, it's like, wow.
• 3:58
  Speaker 3: I think that you go, go, go. And as a
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: couple or as a family, and then you don't really know, like, hey,
• 4:04
  Speaker 3: who did I used to be?
• 4:05
  Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
• 4:07
  Speaker 3: All right, let's talk to David. David, welcome to Therapy Thursday,
• 4:11
  Speaker 3: the podcast. How are you?
• 4:13
  Speaker 5: Hey.
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: Hi.
• 4:14
  Speaker 5: So last Friday I called in sick, but I wasn't sick.
• 4:22
  Speaker 5: I just really couldn't do one more meeting, one more deadline,
• 4:27
  Speaker 5: like one more fake smile. And I spent the day hiking,
• 4:33
  Speaker 5: like got lunch by myself. And oh, my God, it
• 4:37
  Speaker 5: was like I turned my phone off. It was just amazing.
• 4:42
  Speaker 5: And yeah, you know, and now I feel really guilty.
• 4:45
  Speaker 5: Everyone's like asking me how I'm feeling. But it's like,
• 4:48
  Speaker 5: you know, I mean, shouldn't mental health be the same
• 4:51
  Speaker 5: as if you're sick? Like I just needed it. It
• 4:53
  Speaker 5: was the happiest I've been in. I've been in months.
• 4:57
  Speaker 4: Well, that tells me a lot, if that's the happiest
• 5:00
  Speaker 4: you've been in months. And I'm curious as to what
• 5:03
  Speaker 4: else is going on in your life. Like, what is
• 5:04
  Speaker 4: your day-to-day life and work? I hear you are completely
• 5:07
  Speaker 4: fed up, but I'd like to know a little bit
• 5:09
  Speaker 4: about what life looks like right now.
• 5:15
  Speaker 5: Well, it's, you know, just a lot of work. I mean,
• 5:21
  Speaker 5: I take it home on the weekends. I take it
• 5:24
  Speaker 5: home on the weekday evenings. And I'm always looking at
• 5:29
  Speaker 5: some kind of screen, too. Like even when I'm trying
• 5:32
  Speaker 5: to relax, I watch TV and like that's a screen.
• 5:35
  Speaker 5: And then I look at my phone and that's a screen.
• 5:38
  Speaker 5: And I like see my friends on social media and stuff.
• 5:41
  Speaker 5: And that's more like screen and people. And, you know,
• 5:44
  Speaker 5: I think turning my phone off for a few hours
• 5:46
  Speaker 5: and being in nature was like such a different and
• 5:49
  Speaker 5: more natural way to exist or something.
• 5:54
  Speaker 4: It sounds like it was actually restorative. As to some
• 5:57
  Speaker 4: of the other things that you're trying to do to
• 6:00
  Speaker 4: feel better, to relax, like, I don't know, going on
• 6:03
  Speaker 4: social media. I hear that that's not working.
• 6:07
  Speaker 5: It's definitely not. It makes me more anxious. And I
• 6:10
  Speaker 5: do like watching some good movies or something. But even
• 6:13
  Speaker 5: that is like my eyes are at a screen. Yeah. And,
• 6:17
  Speaker 5: you know, and like, yeah, I mean, you forget. I forget. Like, why?
• 6:22
  Speaker 5: Why am I even doing this job? I mean, you know,
• 6:24
  Speaker 5: why am I? You know, it's like to make money
• 6:26
  Speaker 5: so I can live. Well, how do I want to
• 6:28
  Speaker 5: like the bigger wise?
• 6:29
  Speaker 3: Oh, yeah.
• 6:31
  Speaker 5: You know, so but it's it's hard. It's hard.
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: You know, it's.
• 6:36
  Speaker 4: Do you feel like you're burned out?
• 6:41
  Speaker 5: You know, I mean, redlining.
• 6:43
  Speaker 3: Redlining, so you're getting close. You know, we had a
• 6:46
  Speaker 3: guest not too long ago here on the podcast, and
• 6:50
  Speaker 3: he asked us, like, how do you chill? And I said,
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: I go where nothing can be plugged in.
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's good.
• 6:58
  Speaker 3: I like anything that does not require electricity. I love it.
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: You guys, I flew back from France like three days ago,
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: and it was a 12-hour flight, and the Wi-Fi was
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: out on the plane. That's such a... And I was like,
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: hell yeah. Yes. Yeah. It was great.
• 7:14
  Speaker 3: So, David, maybe it's those type of things that you're
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: in such a habit, like a habitual... You're like a
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: hamster on a wheel, and you don't even realize, but
• 7:25
  Speaker 3: you keep getting on the wheel. Maybe you just need
• 7:28
  Speaker 3: to really change your.
• 7:31
  Speaker 3: Atmosphere and totally.
• 7:35
  Speaker 4: Can you tell us a little bit about the guilt?
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: You say you feel guilty.
• 7:39
  Speaker 4: I'm really curious about that.
• 7:42
  Speaker 5: Oh, just because like, it seems stupid, but you can't like,
• 7:48
  Speaker 5: it's not like, I guess, accepted to say I need
• 7:51
  Speaker 5: a mental health day because everybody would laugh and be like, oh,
• 7:54
  Speaker 5: don't we all? You know, but it was like serious
• 7:57
  Speaker 5: to me that I needed a mental health. They just
• 7:58
  Speaker 5: as serious as if I had like a really bad flu,
• 8:01
  Speaker 5: you know? So, so it's like, I'm lying. I'm like
• 8:06
  Speaker 5: saying that, you know, that I was like, you know,
• 8:09
  Speaker 5: implying that I was physically ill and I'm not, so
• 8:11
  Speaker 5: I feel guilty about lying, but I just, you know,
• 8:14
  Speaker 5: obviously shouldn't have to, but it's just crazy. You know, that's,
• 8:17
  Speaker 5: that's the culture we have.
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: Well, actually in certain.
• 8:20
  Speaker 4: Ways, I don't really hear a lie because I hear
• 8:22
  Speaker 4: that you're being asked if you're feeling better or And
• 8:24
  Speaker 4: the answer is absolutely yes.
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: And if you're saying, if you're calling and going, hey,
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: I don't feel well, that doesn't necessarily mean physical. It
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: can also mean mental.
• 8:33
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you don't feel well. You didn't feel well.
• 8:35
  Speaker 4: And is a sick day only legitimate if you're physically ill?
• 8:39
  Speaker 4: I mean, that's what I'm hearing you're questioning.
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: And why do we, like, think about this. And Ellen,
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: why do we always feel like we have to over-explain?
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: You know, it's like... You know, if you just wake
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: up and you go, I don't feel well. Yeah, right.
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: That's it.
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: That's it.
• 8:53
  Speaker 3: I think over explaining implies lying sometimes.
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 8:56
  Speaker 3: It's like, don't give me that. I don't need that.
• 8:59
  Speaker 3: Just tell me.
• 9:00
  Speaker 4: And also just because someone asks us a question doesn't
• 9:03
  Speaker 4: mean we're obligated to answer it.
• 9:05
  Speaker 3: Exactly. You are so right.
• 9:07
  Speaker 4: No, I mean, it's an old politician's trick. Answer the
• 9:11
  Speaker 4: question you wish was asked of you.
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: Oh my God. I've never heard that.
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: Wow. No, I love that.
• 9:19
  Speaker 5: Interesting.
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: That's a good one. That's a good one.
• 9:21
  Speaker 5: I got to remember that one.
• 9:23
  Speaker 3: And I feel like it's harder for men, I really do,
• 9:25
  Speaker 3: that a man taking a mental health day. I can
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: see why you might feel almost ashamed, David, because it's
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: not something that men really do. Women, I think, maybe
• 9:38
  Speaker 3: because we talk about our feelings more, we just say,
• 9:41
  Speaker 3: I just need a break. I need a mental health day.
• 9:44
  Speaker 4: Well, I think in our culture, we moralize productivity. It's
• 9:48
  Speaker 4: like if you're not constantly producing, even if it's just,
• 9:51
  Speaker 4: you know, people call it busy work, then we feel lazy.
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: Something's wrong.
• 9:56
  Speaker 4: We're letting people down. And that's ridiculous.
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 9:59
  Speaker 4: Because in order to be productive we need to have
• 10:02
  Speaker 4: restorative activity.
• 10:03
  Speaker 5: Yeah it's true wow It's true. Um, actually it's this
• 10:11
  Speaker 5: country too, like in America, especially cause like in, you know, Europe,
• 10:15
  Speaker 5: I know they like, they take like a whole month
• 10:17
  Speaker 5: of vacation and the, you know, like they, like they,
• 10:19
  Speaker 5: I think in Spain they like work in the morning
• 10:21
  Speaker 5: and then have like a three hour, like it's America's
• 10:24
  Speaker 5: like real.
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: Your siesta.
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 10:27
  Speaker 5: Like we like are like, go, go, go, go, go,
• 10:30
  Speaker 5: you know? So there's that too.
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: I think we, we, we still work based on standards
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: of what work was. 40 50 60 70 years ago
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: you know yeah and the rest of life has gotten
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: more challenging more overwhelming more inundating and we're not reacting
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: to that part of it.
• 10:48
  Speaker 5: That's true that's true and it's uh so many screens
• 10:53
  Speaker 5: too i'll tell you.
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah so many screens my husband my husband has a
• 10:59
  Speaker 3: company called third screen Like what's the third screen?
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: I got to tell you this for father's day. Ellen
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: was like, I got this great gift for Roy. Cause
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: this is a guy who's like notorious for having every screens.
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: He's listening to a podcast. He's got the radio show on.
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: He's got this screen, screen, screen. So Ellen's like, I find,
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: I got this thing called like the scroll. It's like
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: a ticker, you know, like the bottom of the scroll
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: on a TV. It gives you news and stocks and sports.
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: And I'm like, this is the last thing.
• 11:30
  Speaker 4: I added another screen to a screens.
• 11:34
  Speaker 5: Oh my God.
• 11:35
  Speaker 3: David, do you have the kind of job where you
• 11:37
  Speaker 3: can carve it up in a different way so that
• 11:39
  Speaker 3: you don't reach burnout? My son, he, um, he has
• 11:44
  Speaker 3: a job and he's doing his job. He, he's a,
• 11:47
  Speaker 3: an AI. So he's coding and you know, he's an engineer.
• 11:51
  Speaker 3: And they're hiring.
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: It's growing.
• 11:52
  Speaker 3: They're hiring a lot of people. And all of a sudden,
• 11:54
  Speaker 3: he's managing four people and training them. And it's not
• 11:59
  Speaker 3: part of his job. But of course, he's doing it
• 12:03
  Speaker 3: because he was asked to take lead on this. So
• 12:06
  Speaker 3: he did. And he reached the point where he was like, wow,
• 12:10
  Speaker 3: I'm really doing a lot. And so he's dealing kind.
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: Of with that. Like, what does he say?
• 12:16
  Speaker 3: How does he do it? So the way he kind
• 12:19
  Speaker 3: of took charge of it was he told his immediate superior,
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: I'm going to be taking this Friday off. I'm competing
• 12:28
  Speaker 3: in a race. And I'll be back Monday. And he
• 12:31
  Speaker 3: totally just shut it down. And everything was fine. So sometimes, David,
• 12:35
  Speaker 3: you might be putting it on yourself.
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: You know, it is interesting.
• 12:39
  Speaker 4: Because I do believe that employees have a responsibility to
• 12:43
  Speaker 4: communicate their needs to employers. I also think employers have
• 12:47
  Speaker 4: a responsibility to create a psychologically safe workplace where employees
• 12:52
  Speaker 4: can safely, respectfully communicate what's going on with them.
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: Yes. When was the last time any of us, and
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: no matter what you do, heard a boss just go, hey,
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: how are you? You doing okay?
• 13:04
  Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: You know what I mean?
• 13:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: Like, wouldn't that be a cool thing if a boss
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: checked on you?
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah.
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: Rather than you, like, exactly what you're saying, Sarah, where
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: it was like, as a leader, you have to set
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: that tone.
• 13:15
  Speaker 4: What is your workplace culture like regarding, I know you
• 13:18
  Speaker 4: said that it would be kind of mocked if you
• 13:20
  Speaker 4: mentioned Mental Health Day, but as far as asking for support,
• 13:25
  Speaker 4: does that exist in your space?
• 13:29
  Speaker 5: My boss is okay. You know, like, he's... I, you know,
• 13:36
  Speaker 5: definitely a guy's guy. So I don't know if like
• 13:39
  Speaker 5: that would fly exactly. I don't know. I mean, he's
• 13:43
  Speaker 5: not bad boss, but he's also not like, you know,
• 13:46
  Speaker 5: I couldn't, I just don't think culturally like that's like the, uh, the,
• 13:50
  Speaker 5: I think he would look at it as like, I'm just,
• 13:52
  Speaker 5: you know, kind of playing hooky. You want to go, what, uh,
• 13:56
  Speaker 5: you know? Yeah.
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: You're not talking feelings.
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: I'm picturing Don Draper from Mad Men.
• 14:07
  Speaker 4: Oh, man.
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: And you know what?
• 14:09
  Speaker 4: The irony of that is Don Draper took a lot
• 14:11
  Speaker 4: of naps.
• 14:12
  Speaker 5: That's right.
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: That's right.
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: A lot of breaks.
• 14:16
  Speaker 3: Maybe you're putting some of this on yourself, David, and
• 14:20
  Speaker 3: maybe if you take a different approach at work. And
• 14:24
  Speaker 3: kind of relax your standards you set for yourself.
• 14:28
  Speaker 5: Well, this is what I've been thinking about, because it's
• 14:30
  Speaker 5: like the work is never ending. It's like there's always
• 14:34
  Speaker 5: going to be a fire to put out. There's always
• 14:35
  Speaker 5: going to be. You know what I mean? It's like
• 14:37
  Speaker 5: and I try to like tell me if I can
• 14:40
  Speaker 5: just put this one out now and out and get
• 14:42
  Speaker 5: this done, then I can break. But there's always more.
• 14:45
  Speaker 5: you know, stuff coming downhill. So it's like, how do
• 14:49
  Speaker 5: you deal with that? And that's like a mental, that's
• 14:51
  Speaker 5: like a Zen. You've got to, you got to know
• 14:53
  Speaker 5: when to turn it off. Even if, you know, with
• 14:56
  Speaker 5: this feeling that things are incomplete, but that's okay. Cause
• 15:00
  Speaker 5: it's never going to be complete. There's always going to,
• 15:01
  Speaker 5: you know what I mean?
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: Listen, David, really quick. One thing I did, and I
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: want to maybe suggest this to you. And I did
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: this about a year ago and it changed everything. I
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: turned off, you know, on your iPhone, when you get
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: a new email, the number goes up and you can
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: see the number, the badges on your, your mail. I
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: just turned off the number.
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: Oh, okay.
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: I didn't like delete the email. I just, I turned
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: off the number because I know.
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: I love that.
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: The email is still in there.
• 15:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's great.
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: But seeing the number climb is what's giving you constant anxiety.
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a really good.
• 15:30
  Speaker 3: I have a girlfriend who's, she's got numbers on all
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: of her apps.
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: Turn them off.
• 15:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah. That's nuts.
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: That's a really good tip. I really like that.
• 15:39
  Speaker 3: I turned all the notifications off my husband's phone.
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: There you go.
• 15:42
  Speaker 3: It's pinging constantly.
• 15:44
  Speaker 4: I'm like, no.
• 15:45
  Speaker 3: How do you live with this?
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: Seriously. Yeah.
• 15:50
  Speaker 3: There's a button. You just go to notifications and you
• 15:53
  Speaker 3: turn it off. Yeah.
• 15:56
  Speaker 5: Yeah. That's turning, turning that thing off is so crucial.
• 16:00
  Speaker 5: I mean, that was the best feeling when I was
• 16:02
  Speaker 5: turned it off the other day. It was like, I
• 16:04
  Speaker 5: had a little panic. And then after a couple of hours,
• 16:07
  Speaker 5: it was like something I hadn't felt in a long time,
• 16:09
  Speaker 5: you know.
• 16:10
  Speaker 4: I mean, I think this has given you a lot
• 16:12
  Speaker 4: of information about what you need in order to feel better.
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: It's not necessarily vacation.
• 16:17
  Speaker 4: It's just more time in nature to take some time
• 16:21
  Speaker 4: away from your electronics. So I don't think it sounds
• 16:26
  Speaker 4: like it's that complicated. And I would take the information back.
• 16:31
  Speaker 4: that you glean from this experience and go forward with
• 16:34
  Speaker 4: more restorative activities. And that's really good because you know
• 16:37
  Speaker 4: what's restoring for you.
• 16:40
  Speaker 5: You're right. It's pretty simple when you put it that way.
• 16:43
  Speaker 5: And I agree. I think that I just got to
• 16:45
  Speaker 5: listen to that, make time, make time for it, you know?
• 16:48
  Speaker 3: Sounds great.
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: You'll be better at your job if you do.
• 16:54
  Speaker 5: It's true. So thank you all so much.
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: Thank you. Thank you, David. Thanks for reaching out.
• 16:59
  Speaker 5: Of course.
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: There you go. Why do we make it so hard,
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: you guys?
• 17:04
  Speaker 3: I don't know. But don't we make everything hard?
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 17:06
  Speaker 3: I mean, relationships. So I'm afraid if I say this,
• 17:09
  Speaker 3: then this will happen. Or you know what I mean?
• 17:10
  Speaker 3: It's like, why can't we just.
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 17:13
  Speaker 3: I don't know. Why do we make it hard, Sarah?
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: I think because.
• 17:15
  Speaker 4: I think we don't trust that everything's going to be okay.
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right.
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: Like, if we know that.
• 17:20
  Speaker 4: We can handle whatever happens, then we're not trying to
• 17:24
  Speaker 4: control so many factors.
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: Because that is overwhelming. It is exhausting.
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: Do we... do we fantasize about our importance in a
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: situation too? Is that, does that come into play where
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: it's like, if I'm not there, it won't work well. Right.
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 17:41
  Speaker 4: So we then, you know, I think that that is
• 17:44
  Speaker 4: an important question. I think it requires us being humble
• 17:47
  Speaker 4: enough to ask that question. I believe that if we
• 17:54
  Speaker 4: think that we're in control, we think we have this impact.
• 17:57
  Speaker 4: It can give us a sense of safety because, Because
• 18:00
  Speaker 4: then it's like I.
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: Have this much responsibility. I am this important.
• 18:03
  Speaker 4: Therefore, if I do all the right things, then nothing
• 18:05
  Speaker 4: bad will happen. You see that a lot with people
• 18:08
  Speaker 4: who are parentified as kids when they took on adult roles.
• 18:12
  Speaker 4: I should say were assigned adult roles. That they kind
• 18:16
  Speaker 4: of carry that forward into adulthood. Yeah.
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: But really, if you're not there, it's okay. The world
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: keeps turning.
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: It's going to keep turning.
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: You know?
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: His company's not going to close.
• 18:27
  Speaker 4: Nope. Yeah.
• 18:30
  Speaker 3: And he'll feel better for it.
• 18:31
  Speaker 4: And he'll be sane.