Latest / CRYPTO 101 / Ep. 754 The TRILLION Dollar Stablecoin Opportunity with Ground

Transcript

Ep. 754 The TRILLION Dollar Stablecoin Opportunity with Ground · CRYPTO 101

• 0:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: All right everybody welcome back to another action packed super high caliber episode here of the crypto 101 podcast I'm your co-host Bryce Paul as always joined by my good compadria across the country Mr. Brendan Veman Brendan how goes it it goes well it goes extra well here today the bulls are on stampede So what a time to be here in crypto, Bryce
• 0:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: green candles equals happy Brendan you're simple man you'll make a great husband one day I'll all she needs is a bull market and you'll just be chipper as ever Now we're we're really excited to have an awesome guest today read coming who's the co-founder of superstate and more recently the co-founder of ground which was spun out of superstate so there's a lot to unpack here but first read welcome to the crypto 101 podcast and how the heck are you
• 1:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: thank you for having me doing really great.
• 1:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: Awesome.
• 1:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so before we dive into ground, so is the bull market back?
• 1:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know.
• 1:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: It kind of feels a little, a little bull market vibes, altcoins are going up big bitcoins, you know, above ADK.
• 1:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: How are you kind of making sense of all this?
• 1:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: I generally do not do not put too much out there for predictions or where are we?
• 1:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's, I think we've all seen too many cycles.
• 1:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: And have said, this is it, we're back.
• 1:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then all of a sudden, we're not back.
• 1:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: But it's good.
• 1:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's really good to see just more enthusiasm kind of coming back into the system and to the space.
• 1:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think there's a lot of tailwinds.
• 1:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this is like another great tailwind for the builders.
• 1:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm thankful for it.
• 1:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: Spoken like a true veteran, somebody who has way too many scars from building crypto over the years Tell us a little bit about how long you kind of been building in crypto.
• 2:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: I know you co-founded a compound as well Which is a you know an awesome project That's been around for a long time kind of the birth of liquidity mining and defy yield farming log kind of stuff So give us just the high level you know 30 second one minute version of where you came from here in crypto
• 2:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.
• 2:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: So spent many years in Fintech before Crypto Building Products at Squares, Stripe and Chine.
• 2:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Kind of don't I toes in a little bit with the Bitcoin build-down at Cashamp way back when?
• 2:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: And got really excited by, you know, DeFi after having to contend with so much opacity and complexity in the Fintech and banking system.
• 2:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I got really excited about Compound, joined the team,
• 2:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I brought it that I actually got an S&P rating which is fascinating for making the yield of that protocol available to corporate treasuries.
• 2:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: But after that, we just kept iterating on the underlying concepts of blockchain-based technology, on-chain finance being just like wildly more dynamic, a lot of the more powerful, than traditional Rails traditional systems.
• 3:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: And super-safe's been an iteration of that thesis and now ground is as well.
• 3:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: So it's really been a kind of building earnestly in the space now for five or six years.
• 3:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: awesome and would you say that you come from it more on the technical side like your coding now vibe coding or you know use the AI bots or you kind of more from the business angle where would you kind of stand?
• 3:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: As a founder, you blend both, but you generally do want to spike more on the business side like how do we have we mold this into a product?
• 3:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: How do we actually package it?
• 3:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, how do we market it?
• 3:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: How do we actually make it accessible to the audience that we want to use it?
• 3:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: My co-founder and CTO at ground definitely is the one kind of digging into some more contracts and solidity and wiring up the systems.
• 3:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's good to have a partner there so we can kind of divide and conquer.
• 4:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: the end in the end, the balance of opposites.
• 4:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: Every good duo needs that.
• 4:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: And look, you know, ground, I just got to start.
• 4:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: Where the name come from?
• 4:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: What is it?
• 4:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: I've actually always liked the name ground in a kind of always had this idea of like I'm going to name a company ground one day Yeah, the opportunity.
• 4:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the opportunity to kind of develop for that.
• 4:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think ground has great connotations, you know Solid firm productive fertile all these great things you want particularly from finance infrastructure So it just really molded really well to the type of product we wanted to build for ground
• 4:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: So ground in a phrase like, what is this thing?
• 4:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: It is a platform that makes cash management of stablecoins incredibly simple.
• 4:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: So you can embed an access of a variety of on-chain functions and resources without having to actually directly touch the smart contracts.
• 4:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: We provide a strike-like API interface.
• 4:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's highly configurable, flexible, and transparent.
• 5:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: to four neo banks, neo finance apps, or exchanges like crossbarer.
• 5:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: My new movement for sentences, payments, providers, to be able to build yield products, wealth products, earning programs, using our WAs, tokenized assets, LSTs, borrowing protocols, and more.
• 5:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: But without having to go through the effort and manage the overhead of maintaining integrations to a variety of these resources orchestrating across block chains normalizing the data, we handle all of that in the system.
• 5:34
  [SPEAKER_00]: So will this work for any and all stable coins, or are you just supporting selected ones, maybe popular ones?
• 5:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yep, to start, you kind of go where the, you know, the interest is where the demand is, so we started with USDC and USDT.
• 5:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, we may add more in the future as there's demand from clients, and that could include, you know, PYUSD, AUSD.
• 5:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: the USDG others, but for the time being USDC and USDT has really just been where there's the most desire, and that's also the kind of the denomination that a lot of the source of the yield or leverage or other other functions are resolving toward.
• 6:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: That could change, and our system's flexible enough to change, so it's really kind of driven a little bit by client demand.
• 6:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: I was just going to say the perfect guide to ask this question to because it's something that we kind of get asked a lot here at Crypto 101 and people see, you know, in the traditional world, I have a dollar.
• 6:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's cash, I deposit an ATM, it goes to USD in my bank account.
• 6:37
  [SPEAKER_02]: Now in the crypto world, like what do you want?
• 6:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's like the drug dealer with the trench coat, you want USD, you want USD, you want USD, you want USD, you want USD, you want USD, you want USD, why you want USD, gee, they're like, what is all this?
• 6:49
  [SPEAKER_02]: What makes one different?
• 6:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: And so it's like, there's many things that make all these different stablecoins different, liquidity profiles, ways that they're collateralized, but can you give us the 101 version of like, what are all the differences between the stablecoins?
• 7:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is, obviously, we could probably have an entire There's a litany of these and I think this kind of goes back to, you know, all the experimentation early on with stablecoins Where there's, you know, are they heavily collateralized or how are they denominated?
• 7:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Is it US dollars or is it a non-US dollar stablecoin?
• 7:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then, you know, is there, are there some functions on the back end?
• 7:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, is it a synthetic dollar or is it really something that's more in your directly to the underlying
• 7:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: you know, pegged currency.
• 7:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ultimately, you know, when I kind of view these things when I discuss of someone, I view these things as communication layers.
• 7:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that's one way to look at it.
• 7:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, this is purely just a vehicle to transfer value.
• 7:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of it.
• 7:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Or it is something that actually kind of compresses quite a lot of what you see in traditional banking, the savings account, the checking account, the the wire, the ACH, all of it is kind of like compressed into
• 7:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: fundamentally though.
• 8:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think as we get closer and closer towards more clarity from regulators here in the US, hopefully, fingers crossed, very much fingers crossed.
• 8:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 8:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think we're going to see more more as the recognition of stable coins as a concept as being cash equivalents.
• 8:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And what that means is really cash equivalent in the eyes of an account or of the tax advisor or the auditor or even the regulator who's evaluating what can a bank hold in reserves that are then counted for those reserves.
• 8:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ultimately, the goal is for stablecoin to be treated equivalently to FIA, to digital dollars kind of held in your balance and your checking account.
• 8:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're not there yet, but I think that's the ultimate goal, and I think there'll be different flavors of that kind of what you struck upon going forward to where not every single stablecoin will do that because not every stablecoin will be built the same or have the same use case or intention behind it.
• 9:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: For the products that we're building at ground is very much kind of leaning into the very kind of expected understandable concepts of, oh, this is indominated in government debt entirely, and that government debt is what backs up the equivalent fiat.
• 9:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so it's like, oh, I think of these things as the same.
• 9:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Great.
• 9:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that sort of framework definitely is very well suited to cash management for
• 9:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: for wealth advisors.
• 9:41
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the stablecoin space is fascinating because it has been growing at such a ridiculously fast rate.
• 9:48
  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, to put this in perspective, as of last month, you had stablecoin card spending volumes growing at 200% year over year,
• 9:58
  [SPEAKER_00]: It hit a record last month of just over $1 billion, and you saw 68% of that volume coming from outside the US, which I think is important because a lot of people think, oh, it's just, you know, centralized, but it's really not the case.
• 10:12
  [SPEAKER_00]: On the top of that, like stablecoin growth has been really big, and it is...
• 10:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: been talked about it has been talked about a lot of like hey guys there's this behemoth that that will be stablecoins for all these different reasons and you look at the different areas right is it going to be for agents is it going to be for us as consumers is it going to be this um stablecoin card spending there's a million ways you could look at it but I think it gets people thinking about how can they get involved and then who might be the winner
• 10:47
  [SPEAKER_00]: But maybe before we do that, before we even dive into those, the number one thing that's been at the front of my mind is seeing a lot of these different banks and traditional financial players getting in the stablecoins.
• 10:58
  [SPEAKER_00]: I saw just yesterday, Tvo and I were talking on one of our little segments.
• 11:04
  [SPEAKER_00]: about how like Bank of America and city and Goldman Sachs and Doisha and UBS, they all just came out and said, hey, there's 21 of us major banks and we're going to be committed to launching a joint stablecoin in the first half of next year and they're not the first group to kind of come out and do that.
• 11:20
  [SPEAKER_00]: So what I guess before we even get in any that other things, what do you make of all of these banks and different financial players kind of
• 11:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, I think, always two sides of the coin, ultimately, I think this is positive for the industry, right?
• 11:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Positive for the technology, positive for kind of the resonance of what these things can do.
• 11:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Instead of there being kind of a dismissiveness to it or even like in-house, right?
• 11:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Hostility to these things, embracing them, I think is good, ultimately.
• 11:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's always hard to tell, okay, what does that embrace look like?
• 11:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: If instead of incumbents creating a consortium, you kind of start to get a little bit worried.
• 12:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, okay, what's really going to happen here?
• 12:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, how great is this going to be for everyone?
• 12:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: How's this going to change?
• 12:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think ultimately, though, it is for telling, really kind of a an acceptance of these technologies of these assets as a part of the financial system.
• 12:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: That doesn't mean that there's going to be one winner.
• 12:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think we're still in that place where there's still an opportunity to experiment to really figure out what works well.
• 12:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think those stable points from like consortiums, like the one you're mentioning from City Group, and the one from Stripe, and others, we'll see what happens there.
• 12:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: We've not seen consortiums have be wildly successful historically.
• 12:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: They've kind of, at least for stable points, it's been very hard to get those things going.
• 12:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think what you could see is that, you know, that what comes from that really is this kind of similar sort of setup we have to where USDC and USDT and others to where this one works really really well for this use case or for these types of participants.
• 12:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: Whereas USDC and USDT are very well suited towards
• 13:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: retail and even SMB is particularly outside of the US, but really trying to access dollars to hedge against inflation and then they want to build products on top of that.
• 13:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: Here, it could be just, okay, maybe this is actually geared more toward institutional flows.
• 13:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And in that case, it makes sending wires wildly faster than it's been before, which is generally great.
• 13:29
  [SPEAKER_02]: And she for, yes, unless you're having to a test, like, you know, what you're doing this for and, you know, calling somebody on the phone, why are you sending, you know, $50,000 to this account and you're just like, if my money doing what I want, damn, you know, back.
• 13:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, like, please, please come by the the brick and mortar.
• 13:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's just at some point to confirm.
• 13:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we'll see, it's great to see the experimentation.
• 13:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I think we should also be just kind of mindful of, you know, those behind it, you know, as with any technology that you kind of promote the organizational structure, where the culture of those people building.
• 14:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that can be good, that can be maybe suboptimal, but I think generally the fact that we're having these types of participants dive in to different aspects of blockchain is very good, very healthy, and we'll ultimately not outposs it for all of us.
• 14:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so tell us what ground is from the ground up in a sense.
• 14:29
  [SPEAKER_02]: Is it kind of an amalgamation of different defy protocols?
• 14:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: How do you guys help with cash management and tell us what it looks like inside?
• 14:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 14:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: So a lot of our clients, we're kind of maybe starting on the ground floor of their development or a little bit older, a little bit more mature.
• 14:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Both of them kind of serve two different groups.
• 14:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of B to B and B to B to C. In both instances, they're really looking to make stable coins that they have kind of hold of more productive.
• 15:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they generally come with different types of requirements on what type of APY they need, what type of risk they can absorb, what sort of liquidity constraints they can contend with.
• 15:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then this is where we're really leaning into this side of these things, for the larger ones, those that have more regulatory burdens, they really take risk, security, and compliance very, very seriously.
• 15:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: We built ground to accommodate kind of the spectrum.
• 15:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Where there are those, they just hit the max risk button.
• 15:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't really care.
• 15:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's dive into curfnative sources, view, defy, looping of LSTs, looping of structured products.
• 15:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's kind of what they want.
• 15:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then the more conservative side, where I want to access to tokenized funds that are really just T-Bills or H-Locks, or R-R.
• 15:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: CLOs.
• 15:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I want those, I want to have a blended portfolio that is risk-adjusted and meets my liquidity constraints.
• 16:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: We make it very easy to kind of accommodate all of these.
• 16:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And in many cases, what we're seeing is really you see the development of an earning or rewards product for a Neobank, B2B2C, or it's the making more productive.
• 16:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: stablecoins kind of being held at a cross-border money mover or a stablecoin orchestrator who's gotten such scale that their clients are now asking, well I don't want to complete the stablecoin sandwich.
• 16:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'd rather keep some of my cash on chain in USDC or USDT, but I don't want that to just sit there and do nothing.
• 16:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to be protected.
• 16:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: I also wanted to earn to
• 16:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Very conservative portfolios can be developed for those groups as well, but it really all comes down to matching the use case and the constraints when it comes to liquidity risk in compliance for our clients
• 16:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, makes it ton of sense.
• 16:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: Would you say that there's any extra layers of risk that ground is is taking on yourselves or is it like purely an aggregation and routing layer?
• 17:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: How do you kind of think about that?
• 17:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 17:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: We are technology platform, so we really are making an interface that is highly, highly ergonomic and a universal gateway to access, tokenized funds, tokenized assets, LSTs, bar lending protocols, structure products.
• 17:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: But more and more, we're leaning into certain licenses we may want to go pursue, that
• 17:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: provide us more flexibility to work on behalf of our clients, but would also thereby take on more liability, more risk.
• 17:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: we've really what we do try to do is work very closely with our clients to know exactly what they need and not just provide them, you know, the fragmented pantheon of all the available options, no matter how, you know, new or fragile those things are.
• 18:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: We don't want to say, hey, go use this new protocol or test out this new, highly risky tokenized asset.
• 18:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: It'll be great.
• 18:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: We kind of want to have some
• 18:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: some opinion of what we place on the platform, so that those things do work well on behalf of our clients, so that they don't have to kind of navigate again the kind of always evolving landscape of options.
• 18:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like these are options that are generally tested that have proven themselves that are understandable and you can and they're so understandable that they can be
• 18:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: compressed into an API so that you can actually interact with them that way versus trying to grow kind of some new implementation of a smart contract.
• 18:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: We really wanted to be, we want the interface and the interaction to be very understandable, very trustworthy, and something that is accessible, not just to the integrator or client directly, but any of their end users that may be interacting with it as well.
• 19:02
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so I think I've seen you frame this and really just the current state of doing things as just a loose, loose, for triad-fi platforms at the moment, right?
• 19:12
  [SPEAKER_00]: If they're trying to come in here, do it themselves.
• 19:16
  [SPEAKER_00]: It hasn't tended to work that well for them, right?
• 19:20
  [SPEAKER_00]: Whether that's just like leaving cash idle or burning budgets or trying to absorb the risks that are involved with it.
• 19:27
  [SPEAKER_00]: Like, why has that been?
• 19:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: Can you walk us through what actually breaks first when some sort of bank or neo bank tries to go through and do all of this themselves and why it doesn't always work out the best for them?
• 19:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 19:41
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think there's a great question.
• 19:42
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think in many cases there, well,
• 19:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's a spicy take, and then there's kind of a work.
• 19:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: I should give us a bit of a... Yeah, it's crazy with it.
• 19:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: The spicy take is a lot of institutions that want to try to think upon their size or have you They get really excited about kind of the new thing.
• 20:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe has a lot of incentives, and there's a tight coupling with the foundation of a protocol or a blockchain.
• 20:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: or an issue of the token.
• 20:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then they really excited about that and they kind of almost kind of paid themselves to a corner.
• 20:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, and then now what?
• 20:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, well, now you have this one thing and it's now hard to break away from that.
• 20:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Without committed concerted effort to then, you know, okay, what else do you want to do to make this more more more
• 20:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: more exciting, more useful for you or your clients, you kind of wall yourself off a little bit.
• 20:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so I think that to avoid that requires kind of a jumping in to maybe the harder areas or the maybe the more expensive areas where you don't have the nice glide path to incentives or kind of the programs that are kind of designed to kind of bring you in and kind of trap you in some way.
• 20:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: But outside of that, I think in many cases there's a little bit of a, okay, one and done, you know, I integrated this one role or integrated this one token.
• 21:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Great, it's working fantastic.
• 21:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's move on to the things without recognizing that there's the the ability to really.
• 21:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: really makes something unique by interacting with the variety of blockchains or touching a variety of options so that you can differentiate your product or diversify against risk or really target outcomes that are highly relevant to you or your end users.
• 21:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's what's happened quite a bit is there's a lot of excitement about one thing you get it done and six once later you kind of forgot about it or you haven't really committed enough and it's just kind of since they're collecting dust and you don't really pick it back up.
• 21:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I think that's kind of what's happened quite a bit the the very you know rapid enthusiasm kind of giving way to all right we have other other things we need to do or.
• 21:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, this is what we agreed to do with this foundation or this other group, and we did it now.
• 21:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: I guess we need to wait for them to do something else.
• 22:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that's what's really kind of been a bit of a problem.
• 22:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so what we get to solve here at Ground is really just saying, you don't need to commit to one thing.
• 22:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: You don't need to kind of isolate yourself from the other options.
• 22:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: You can use this one interface that allows you to touch a variety of things.
• 22:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: So that you can, in fact, very easily maneuver across a plane of options to find those that are suited to you and then adjust over time without having to kind of do all of the effort to, oh, you know, I integrated this thing over here now I got to integrate this one this is a completely new technology like slotted does not look like a theorem and does not operate like monad or something like that and you're like now I have to think about this completely differently.
• 22:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: We kind of remove all of that overhead so that you can really focus on the outcomes.
• 22:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, what do you really care about versus the implementation and then the constant maintenance of that implementation?
• 22:53
  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, that was that kind of answers the next question I was going to ask you, which is like, why is API middleware the fix for this rather than the bank just partnering with Ave or Morpho or someone like that?
• 23:06
  [SPEAKER_00]: And it sounds like,
• 23:08
  [SPEAKER_00]: It allows them to really focus on what they know and what they're good at as opposed to them getting themselves into deeper waters that they just aren't as familiar with.
• 23:18
  [SPEAKER_00]: Is that right?
• 23:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's exactly right, and it allows someone to really kind of make their own assessment on what works best for them, you know, maybe more folks really great under some conditions and but it's not as great under other conditions.
• 23:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's an obvious little bit better.
• 23:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's also this ability to now you can act as both very easily, along with other protocols, other assets.
• 23:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: If there is a concern about the liquidity somewhere or about the performance of a particular vault or asset, you can easily move somewhere else.
• 23:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: You don't have to know, oh, now I need to go figure out what to move to and integrate with it or understand what the parameters are of that thing.
• 23:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: Instead, we have that kind of pre-built.
• 24:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's in the API, it's accessible to available.
• 24:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that's the big kind of conundrum that a lot of people have.
• 24:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this is, I think, unfortunately, kind of revealed itself with some of the exploits earlier in the year within DeFi of, if you adhere yourself so closely to one implementation or one source or one solution,
• 24:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: You really do kind of introduce some fragility to yourself for your system or your product.
• 24:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: If something fails there, that's now a single point failure.
• 24:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now you now have to go kind of resolve that.
• 24:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: With ground, you're able to really access of a variety of options to steal yourself against these sort of long-tail risks as well as other risks that you may be concerned with.
• 24:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's what's important, especially in finance.
• 24:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: You really do want to have optionality and the ability
• 24:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: move in and out of positions rapidly based upon conditions that are relevant to you.
• 24:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: So is that our spicy answer?
• 25:00
  [SPEAKER_00]: Was that you holding back on us?
• 25:03
  [SPEAKER_00]: A little bit of a little bit of a thing.
• 25:06
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think I messed it.
• 25:08
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'll say this.
• 25:09
  [SPEAKER_00]: I like it.
• 25:10
  [SPEAKER_00]: Now I like it.
• 25:11
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'll tell you what, it's really great getting to hear about what's going on, right?
• 25:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: Because when we talk about stable coins, and even us when we report on it, you can only go so deep and let's you're talking to the people who are in the background working with this, building the bridges,
• 25:28
  [SPEAKER_00]: Just putting into motion how we can use crypto and stablecoins and services moving forward, which is always a fascinating topic.
• 25:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: I am curious, like, what a US bank even be allowed to touch this today.
• 25:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a good question.
• 25:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: We've had a lot of conversations with some bass providers, you know, recognizable names in the sponsor bank space, as well as some of the newer groups that have gotten OCC charters, and there's been really interesting conversations.
• 26:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: They, they very much do want to make stable coins work and they're finding kind of immediate product market fit in certain contexts, you know, if they serve some clients that are outside of the US or they have clients in the US, they're sending sending assets or sending value or dollars overseas, they're finding stable coins to be fantastic.
• 26:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, well, obviously.
• 26:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Really, really great for cross-border money movement.
• 26:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: And there's this kind of growing kind of consideration on, okay, are we, are we, is our client base starting to change to where they, there is an interest to hold accounts, are to nominate accounts in stablecoins.
• 26:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's where things really begin to change.
• 26:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: When you start to see that happen, not, not all banks were created the same.
• 26:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: We've had some conversations with others where they have clients that have no, no one's expressed any interest whatsoever.
• 26:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Then we have a competitor of theirs basically saying, every single one of our clients
• 26:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: So it really depends on who that bank is and who their clients are more so than anything else.
• 27:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, we're definitely kind of getting to the point where I think it's going to be interested in nominating accounts to hold assets and stable ones, not just use it as a vehicle for transference.
• 27:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: But there's still some unanswered questions.
• 27:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: Even after genius and clarity for instance here in the US, there's still a question of,
• 27:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, does this table coin get countered against me for the Durban Amendment?
• 27:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Do I do I maintain compliance with the Durban thresholds?
• 27:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Or does this even meet my requirements as an OCSG charter bank for reserves?
• 27:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: How do I, what is the IRS going to do for me?
• 27:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Since the IRS treat this as a cash-equivalent?
• 27:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's still questions that have not been fully resolved.
• 27:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: That I think have to be resolved for very traditional banks, even those that are more on the cutting edge that do have to
• 27:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: that do need answers before there's like real like oh yeah let's do it full full board.
• 27:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think they'll be able to do it particularly if they have clients outside of the US.
• 27:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think there's a little bit more flexibility there but when you're looking directly in the US I think there's definitely still some unnecessary questions that have to be answered.
• 28:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we're still early, there's still opportunity, still early, you know, it's definitely early.
• 28:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like when you look at the total value of the blockchain or even stablecoins, then you look at like, okay, you know, how many dollars have been printed or in circulation, like what is the total value of capital markets?
• 28:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're like, wow, there's a lot of ground to cover still.
• 28:29
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, absolutely.
• 28:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, yeah, that's a great segue to like the current market.
• 28:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: I think stablecoins, you know, it fluctuates, but right around 300 billion, let's call it, of stablecoin value out there.
• 28:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I did notice that only about $5 billion or, you know, a little under 2% of that is yield bearing.
• 28:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I just wanted to kind of get your take on maybe why that is.
• 28:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: Is it like the regulations?
• 28:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: Is it something technical?
• 28:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: And from there like, you know, 300 billion big number, but how big can that number get?
• 29:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: I know Treasury Secretary Scott Besson, who's pounding the table, you know, to get stable coins bigger and more proliferated and all that kind of stuff.
• 29:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: because it's a great place to stuff his bonds in and his bills and export the world dominance of the US dollar to every nook and cranny of the world.
• 29:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: But how big could that $300 billion market grow into as well as that yield bearing part of the market?
• 29:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, no, it's a very question.
• 29:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: A lot of stable coins are not held in yield bearing assets because they're held on exchanges, centralized or decks, you know, for margin or for
• 29:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: collateral for those purposes, as well as, you know, in syntax really just kind of sitting there and not really doing a whole lot.
• 29:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so it's kind of, in many cases, stablecoins are kind of viewed as dry powder or working capital or collateral.
• 29:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's where a lot of stablecoins kind of ended up being used, which makes sense, given, you know, given the nature of those use cases.
• 30:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think we're going to see more and more and more is particularly with kind of building on the effect of dollarization to desire to hold dollars in inflationary currency.
• 30:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: What's better than just holding dollars?
• 30:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's being able to spend better than being able to spend them, save them, and earn some money on it.
• 30:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was better than that, investing.
• 30:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: And if we're going to see this kind of build up more and more on top of stablecoins, that will introduce a, you know, it will attack more and more.
• 30:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we'll see 300 billion grow, and we'll see all that 300 billion.
• 30:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Some of those also begin to be focused entirely on earning.
• 30:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think there's going to be another interesting component here of, when you think of, okay, how do stablecoins earn, in many cases, that's like, okay, you go to a bar or any protocol, you earn that way, or you exchange it for something else, like a crypto native asset of some kind, but then that stablecoin is still kind of floating around.
• 31:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think there's this interesting moment of,
• 31:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: will it be possible particularly for tokenized assets to be able to access those without having to burn a stable coin particularly like tokenized funds?
• 31:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're not there yet, but I think that will be very, very interesting when we get to get to that sort of world.
• 31:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ultimately, I think we're just going to see the
• 31:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: TVL, if you all are the value of stablecoins, kind of just increase because of all these trends that we, I think you alluded to early on, like a lot of payments being developed more and more.
• 31:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: And there's going to be just more needed interest for the use of stablecoins.
• 31:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: But there are going to be some that we're going to be idling and being able to make those more productive.
• 31:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's going to be increasingly desirable as we really do see, I think, over time where it is being held idle.
• 32:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's interesting to desire to just extract more but to make the idling more useful.
• 32:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: If it's idling from marginers, idling for dry powder or for its idling as a float or at idling there simply because you haven't come up with something better, there will be these more and more options to make those stable coins more useful and to make it more useful for the platform building on top of it.
• 32:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Always think about the economics of what's going on for stable points.
• 32:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: When you look at cross-border and mind movement, or you look at stablecoin orchestration or remittances or payments, there's a lot of compression of fees.
• 32:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think there's going to be this interesting moment of, well, if we can offset that a little bit by earning yield on any assets that idle, even if it's only not 100%, maybe it's 20% of assets
• 33:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: on platform, that will offset a lot of the fee compression and then allow for a a lot of growth of that platform more dramatically than what they've been able to do historically.
• 33:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah.
• 33:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 33:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: No, I was going to say amidst all of this, the one thing we haven't mentioned so far and I'm curious if you guys are building with any of this in mind, or if you have any more spicy takes on agents using stable coins, right?
• 33:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: Everybody's talking about, you know, you got your grock, but you got chat, GPT, all this kind of stuff, and cloud flair is getting pretty deep into this world.
• 33:37
  [SPEAKER_02]: As well, where do you stand on, you know, agentic payments using stable coins and is it necessary or are you kind of more in the camp?
• 33:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, hey, there's going to be C-Fi or centralized financial components that will specialize in that.
• 33:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I do have a, I will tone down the spice, but I kind of, I view this a little bit like,
• 34:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's a little bit like a decentralized AI on channel kind of like I don't that doesn't that does not seem like a thing like that these technologies are generally not geared toward that and it sounds loosely and there seems to be an affinity of some kind, but it doesn't it's not really revealing itself and even sort of like product market fit or usage or interest or desire.
• 34:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that there's a lot of great narrative around this, but we've not really seen a lot of growth.
• 34:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: Just not a whole lot of happening with X4 or two, not what happened with ancient departments.
• 34:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe I'm wrong.
• 34:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe I'm wrong.
• 34:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe they'll be this Cambrian explosion of use and interests, but as a kind of...
• 34:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: just you really haven't seen it and I've worked in payments long enough for him like I don't understand, like why, like if anything these agents will act on behalf of someone and they'll use like stripe link or they'll use their credit card.
• 35:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think this idea of like agents just paying themselves to access different things is
• 35:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: more sci-fi from, you know, exciting sci-fi books, and it is like real world.
• 35:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: Right now, maybe that changes, but I do not see that as like, oh, this is how, this is like the next, you know, you know, rocket booster reattach the scale of stablecoin adoption.
• 35:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think so.
• 35:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it really is more stablecoin seeping into existing financial infrastructure.
• 35:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: and bank accounts and flows of funds less so novel use cases using AI.
• 35:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that's a little more hype and narrative and not necessarily something that has a lot behind it right now.
• 35:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: So some wishful thinking, some marketing hype potentially.
• 35:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, yes.
• 35:50
  [SPEAKER_00]: But Reed, I want to be able to tell my AI agent go make me a millionaire by the end of the year.
• 35:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: And I want it to outperform the markets and do that.
• 36:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're telling me, well, you forgot one part of the prompts.
• 36:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, make no mistakes.
• 36:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Make no mistakes.
• 36:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 36:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: Thank hard, you know, uh, you know, you burn all the tokens.
• 36:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, yeah, yeah, it's uh, you know, it's,
• 36:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: it is an exciting time right and I don't want to like throw like all kinds of cold water onto these things because I think it's the experimentation's really great because you just don't know what comes out of the experimentation at the end of the day like you could very everyone dumped on you know defying for the longest time and everyone said a chat GPT was just a dumb chat bot and you know now it's just doing all the coding so it's
• 36:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's, I think that there's maybe something there that hasn't been fully formed or there hasn't been like, you know, the exact implementation or the exact kind of like, oh, if you do it, if you use it for this and all of a sudden, oh, wow, everything changes so we'll see, but I, I just don't know, it's like, you know, payments are really fast already.
• 37:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: High frequency trading is really fast already.
• 37:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: I just don't know if these sort of like,
• 37:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, fractions of a sense to get access to a New York Times article is exactly kind of the future that we see for the agent kind of doing research on someone's behalf.
• 37:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: It seems a little, it just doesn't seem, again, it could be wrong, but it doesn't seem like there's a lot, a lot of, uh,
• 37:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: a lot of there there, but could be right.
• 37:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: I think to play Devil's Advocate and just for my own learning, you know, when people the proponents of that argument are like, well, credit cards have like, you know, minimums and high fees and stable coins could kind of like, you know, ameliorate that.
• 37:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: Is that valid or, I mean, your payments expert like you're like, that's just not true.
• 37:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's definitely valid, like Stephen, or as Nostipos.
• 37:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, card networks can do have like significant fees.
• 37:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: They, you know, they generally work really, really well, right?
• 38:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, visas, fantastic, mastercards, fantastic.
• 38:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: These things all work.
• 38:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Discovered works.
• 38:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: But the fee structure, yeah, it can be painful if you go and talk to a merchant, for instance, someone who's you taking credit card payments, they're just like, yeah, like three to five percent of my revenues kind of gone to the card processing, like that's a lot.
• 38:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: So Stablecoins theoretically should be able to like, help change that.
• 38:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I, you know, again, it's like a little bit one of these things like we don't know how it's going to shake out.
• 38:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe it's just the existence of Stablecoins.
• 38:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: We'll just apply pressure to existing card networks to lower the fees because they have to compete now with this alternative network.
• 38:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I do think that's actually really exciting when we think about
• 38:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: The dynamics of this, like, is it a full replacement, or does it just introduce enough competition and pressure to where incumbents now have to adapt if not adopt these technologies to make themselves more competitive, whether it's for price or speed or flexibility.
• 39:04
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's actually really, really exciting.
• 39:07
  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I've got, correct me if I'm wrong here.
• 39:09
  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't believe you all have a plan to launch a token or have a token yet for ground.
• 39:16
  [SPEAKER_00]: Are there any plans to do something like that?
• 39:19
  [SPEAKER_00]: Or can you have no plan?
• 39:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, no plans.
• 39:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you can say like, no plans.
• 39:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: I've not really considered this as part of the company, the product, the business in any real way.
• 39:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe that changes.
• 39:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: We did get this great SEC rules around ICOs, which we're super pretty, which is exciting.
• 39:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a little late, but I guess better late than never.
• 39:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: I hope we get more from them over the following months.
• 39:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: I haven't really considered that.
• 39:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: I do think there's some interesting things happening in the token ice space.
• 39:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: For instance, center fuses recent proposal to really convert tokens to equity is pretty interesting.
• 40:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we'll see.
• 40:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: But for ground right now, no token, no not really exploring that.
• 40:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: with any sort of seriousness.
• 40:11
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's important to just put that out there for the audience, because what we don't want is for us to talk about this and someone say, oh, I think this is cool.
• 40:18
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to go by ground token or something, and then that just not even be the case.
• 40:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: For me, for the listeners out there, pay extra attention to what Reach has said there is no token.
• 40:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, don't, don't buy the ground token thinking it's ground.
• 40:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what's definitely not us.
• 40:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
• 40:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: It wouldn't be the first time somebody did that.
• 40:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I know, I know.
• 40:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: Actually, it's a good point to kind of like round at the conversation.
• 40:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: The equity to token and token to equity conversion thing is like, actually, starting to get pretty interesting.
• 40:49
  [SPEAKER_02]: I've heard several different, you know, initiatives.
• 40:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: Do you think, you know, like, how does that work out for the token holders?
• 40:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, you know, you hold this token and now you're on the
• 40:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: Captable and like you got to get a brokerage account and they got to send it over to you or do they use something like super state where you could just have this token But it represents equity.
• 41:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: How does that work?
• 41:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's really interesting, right?
• 41:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I think there's a little bit of, back in the earlier days of when tokens were first and they're not necessarily ICO craze, which was almost indicative of, or like a foretelling of the mean coin craze in some ways.
• 41:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: But tokens from protocols, tokens from L1s, tokens from like actual, you know, had something behind it.
• 41:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: There was always this kind of thought of like,
• 41:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Are these actual equity in the technology, equity in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in
• 41:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: But it didn't really come with all of the, you know, protections of an equity folder, right?
• 42:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: If you own like a stock from your brokerage in like Apple, it's like, well, you get, you get voting chairs.
• 42:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: You get, uh, you get right to various various things that a equity holder gets right to and you get distributions and all these things.
• 42:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: That wasn't necessarily always the case with tokens, but there is this always kind of desire to replicate some of those,
• 42:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: some of those functions, some of those rights from like governance or from, you know, share and be the outcomes or outputs of a protocol or of a, of a, of a blockchain.
• 42:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think
• 42:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: it's interesting to kind of see this kind of come back kind of loosely in the desire to say like, yeah, maybe a token for political could be equity in something versus just being a crypto native asset.
• 42:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that's actually really interesting because that would be really kind of
• 43:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, fliffy, it's a full circle moment, it's a full circle moment, you know, it's like what are stablecoins?
• 43:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Why can't they just be treated equivalently to Fiat?
• 43:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, well, what are tokens?
• 43:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: Why can't they be treated equivalently to the kind of equity in a thing?
• 43:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think there's kind of something there and we've seen the experimentation of this.
• 43:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: You look at x stocks.
• 43:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: You click on those global markets stocks.
• 43:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: even some of the tokenized funds.
• 43:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's been this desire to make the actual on-chain token.
• 43:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's close to equivalent to being an equity holder as possible, while still holding on to all of the great superpowers of the blockchain itself.
• 43:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's not been a perfect implementation of this just yet for all kinds of generally regulatory reasons.
• 43:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: But it's going to be pretty cool to see,
• 43:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: the restrictions are kind of coming off to where you could probably see, you know, a company issue shares of their, their, of themselves, that you can be bought and sold them in Mazdeck, as well as on Slot.
• 44:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they are the same.
• 44:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 44:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think I've got a really, really interesting.
• 44:09
  [SPEAKER_02]: it's going to be an interesting bull market.
• 44:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: A lot of new changes, a lot of updates, a lot of different tokenomics and structures.
• 44:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: So we're excited.
• 44:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: We really appreciate you spending the 45 minutes here with us today on the crypto 101 podcast.
• 44:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: Just final question is what's kind of next on the road map for you guys that you're able to publicly discuss.
• 44:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: What is it that you're really looking forward to releasing over the course of the next few months?
• 44:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now, we're going to be partnering very closely with a few kind of recognizable names in this space.
• 44:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's really power, more earning programs, we're going to introduce more interesting rear-world assets, tokenized funds as well as equities that have income associated with them so that it is possible to build these really interesting wealth or earning products kind of wherever you are and then importing with the regulatory burdens that you have.
• 45:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: One area that we're really pushing into that can be very, very interesting is not just having an arguably way, a tokenized asset or a tokenized fund, but being able to leverage a decentralized finance.
• 45:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: So you can get way more out of it.
• 45:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think the concept of looping historically has been proven.
• 45:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: It works, you can loop the LST.
• 45:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: You can loop something that has some sort of income stream.
• 45:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think being able to do that with tokenized assets is going to be really, really exciting.
• 45:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: You can go from four or five percent to 15 percent.
• 45:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: And if managed really, really well by reputable people,
• 45:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Fairly safe, it can be very understandable, the risks and very controllable, and I think that's going to be really, really exciting to kind of bring more and more of the power of the blockchain to these traditional assets and grounds, definitely going to play a part of that.
• 46:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: awesome.
• 46:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, we are hopeful that you'll come back onto the crypto 101 podcast here over the course of the next couple quarters and give us some updates on the new product releases and all the exciting ways that our listeners can get involved.
• 46:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: Everybody, we hope you enjoyed read.
• 46:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: We hope you enjoyed the show.
• 46:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: What is the the website that people can go to check out and we'll link that in the show notes.
• 46:29
  [SPEAKER_02]: Fantastic.
• 46:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Round to tech.co.
• 46:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's our website.
• 46:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: Get everything there.
• 46:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Good find us on Twitter and LinkedIn at the bottom.
• 46:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: And if you'd like, you can even sign it for the product.
• 46:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: You get a good access to the product relatively quickly.
• 46:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: So you can really experiment with it and tell us what you think.
• 46:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you so much, Mr. Reedcoming, co-founder of Superstate, co-founder of Ground.
• 46:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: Come back again, don't be a stranger, and everybody listening at home or watching, hope you enjoyed, come back same time, same place next week, we'll have some more great guests for you.
• 47:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: Take care.