Latest / The Vault: The Epstein Files / Mega Edition: The Sarah Kellen Congressional Transcript ( Part 7-10) (8/16/26)

Transcript

Mega Edition: The Sarah Kellen Congressional Transcript ( Part 7-10) (8/16/26) · The Vault: The Epstein Files

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: What's up everyone, and welcome to another episode of the
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going to get right
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: back to the Sarah Kelln transcript from her meeting with
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: Congress miss An. Sorry, thank you so much for being here.
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: Did you ever hear about Epstein meeting with any prominent individuals?
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: Sarah Kelln? Yes, and sorry? Can you name some of
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: those individuals? Kellen, Bill Clinton, Prince Andrew, Sarah Ferguson, Elwood, Barock,
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: Alan Dershowitz, Leon Black, miss An? Sorry? Are there any
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: specific recollections of these individuals that you could provide or
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: instances where you may have met them as well? Miss Kelln,
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: I was on all the trips with President Clinton in
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: Asia and Africa. I remember seeing Leon Black at New
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: York House come in for meetings. I believe we had
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: dinner with them in Paris one time. Bill Gates was
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: at the New York House, Prince Andrew was at the
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: New York House. We also went to Andrew's private apartment
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: at Buckingham Palace for dinner, and we were at Princess
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: Beatrice's eighteenth birthday party at Windsor Castle, at whod Brock
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: visited quite often. We went to Israel with him one time.
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: He would stay at the guest apartment in New York
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: of Jeffries quite often, Miss Ham, if I can interject,
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: it might be easier for her to remember if there
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: are specific names and we can just take through them,
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: because I'm fairly confident that there are more prominent people
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: than what she's named, and I'm not sure that she
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: can remember them all in the moment, miss An. Sorry,
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: so to get to more specifics, and you may have
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: said these individuals. Were you aware of any meetings between
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: Epstein and Andrew Winsor Kellen? Yes? And sorry. Were you
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: aware of meetings between Epstein and Donald Trump? Kellen? Only
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: the one time that I met him at Mara a
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: Lago for like five minutes. Otherwise I don't recall Donald
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: ever being present. And sorry. What about Epstein and Peter
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: Thiel Kellen? No, and sorry. Epstein and Steve Bannon Kellen,
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: I heard about it, but I have never met Steve Bannon,
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: Miss Ham. Did you hear I'm sorry? Did you hear
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: about it after the fact or at the time? Kellen
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: after the fact? Ham, okay and sorry? While you were
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: working with him though, Kellen after the fact, and sorry
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: it was later on Kellen, yeah and sorry okay. Were
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: you aware of any meetings between Epstein and Elon Musk Kellen,
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: No and sorry okay. And you said yes to Bill
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: Clinton and Bill Gates Kellen, correct and sorry, And for
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: in particular Bill Gates. I'm curious what was your understanding
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: of his relationship with Epstein? Kellen, Jeffrey was very friendly
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: with one of Bill Gates associates, Boris Nikolitch. They were
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: quite friendly, and it's my impression that he was using
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: Boris to get to Bill. I'm not quite sure what
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: the discussion or you know, what he was trying to
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: get from Bill, but he seemed to always, you know,
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: want to be connected to the most powerful people. I
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: remember being present at the New York house when Bill Gates.
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: There's a picture that was online that I actually took
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: of Bill Gates, Jess Staley, Lauren Summers. I don't know
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: if Leon was in the picture, but it was a
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: group of like kind of really powerful men meeting at
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: his house in New York, Miss Ann. Sorry, and did
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: you play a role in scheduling any of those meetings
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: between Epstein and any of these individuals? Miss Kellen, sometimes
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: it depended on like if it was on the weekend,
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: if the New York office was open or not. Leslie
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: did most of the scheduling for his appointments like that.
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: And sorry, okay, so if it wasn't you, it was
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: Leslie Kellen most likely or somebody else in the office,
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: Miss Ann. Sorry. And then could you just describe the
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: process by which you would go about scheduling the meetings Kellen? Myself,
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: if he told me to call somebody and schedule a time,
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: I would I would do it. And sorry, Thank you,
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: mister Frost jumps in next. Thank you, Maxwell Frost. I
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: represent Orlando's Florida tenth. I have a couple of questions
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: for you about mister Epstein's time in jail in Florida.
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: From your perspective, did Epstein get any special treatment while
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: he was in jail in Florida? Kellen? Somehow he was
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: able to skype me from jail before he got work release.
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: He skyped me from a computer and told me to
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: undress for him on camera. I don't know how that happened,
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: mister Frost. That was actually one of my questions as
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: to video. Was it only a skype call or did
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: you recall anymore, Kellen, only one that I remember, Frost.
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: Are you aware of whether this was the common practice
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: in the jail or do you think he was given
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: special treatment to be able to skype someone from within
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: the jail? Kellen? I would assume that he was given
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: special treatment. I don't think that was you know, I'm
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: not familiar with protocol jail's, but that doesn't seem like
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: it would have been one of them. Frost. Do you know,
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: oh how he arranged this or did he ever discuss
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: how it was arranged? Kellen? No, Frost. Was the call
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: out of the blue or was the call scheduled? Kellen?
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: It was out of the blue? Frost. Was it his
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: Skype account or was it a different Skype account? Do
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: you remember, Kellen? That's a good question. I don't remember, Frost.
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: Were you able to ascertain where in the jail he was?
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: Was it like a jail cell or was it like
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: a special room? Kellen? I couldn't really see. It was
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: just kind of like plain white walls, Frost. Are there
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: other ways beyond the Skype call that you think he
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: received special treatment in the jail in Florida? Kellen? I
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: know that he arranged to have cash and like Disneyland
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: tickets taken till one of the officers in the jail,
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: and I'm not sure what he received with that, mister Frost.
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: Do you know the officer's name? Kellen? Michael Fox. Mister Frost,
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: how'd you learn this information? Kellen? The paralegal that worked
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: for him was the one to take the money to him? Frost.
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: Is that something that told you kind of like, oh this,
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: Like what was the nature of them telling you this information?
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: Was it just kind of confide in you that it
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: was weird or was it like part of your job
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: to know? Kellen? He was kind of griping about it
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: because he lived far away and he had to drive
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: in and drop it off. Mister Frost. Do you know
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: that happening with any other officials or officers or people
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: in the justice system as it relates to his time
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: in jail, Kellen, not specifically. I mean he got work
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: release for twelve hours a day. I feel like that
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: seemed like pretty preferential treatment. Frost. Did he ever talk
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: about the process of how he got work release? Kellen.
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: I know that he set up an office in West
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: Palm Beach specifically for him to go to for a
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: work release that didn't exist before the Florida Science Foundation.
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: Mister Frost, Uh huh, Kellen. It was right down the
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: hall from one of his main attorneys in West Palm Beach,
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: Jack Goldberger's office. I'm not sure exactly what the Florida
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: Science Foundation did. Do you know if he ever skyped
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: or video called other women or other people while he
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: was in jail? Kellen, I don't know. Frost. Did you
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: ever visit him while he was in jail? Kellen? Yes,
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: mister Frost. How many times? Kellen? It was once a
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: week until he got work release. Frost. Did you ever
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: meet Michael Fox while you visited him? Kellen? I feel
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: like I did, but I just can't place where Frost.
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: Did he ever talk to you about the preferential treatment
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: at all, or the Disney tickets or the cash or
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: any offhand comments or anything relating to that you remember, Kellen?
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: Michael Fox, Frost, Michael Fox, Kellen, No, Frost. Why did
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: you visit him, Kellen? Because he told me to Frost.
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: He told you to come once a week, Kellen, yup, Frost.
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: What did you guys talk about when you'd go visit him, Kellen.
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: He would just talk about other inmates, kind of notes
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: that they would give him or things that they would
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: say to him. He would mostly try to joke about
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: the situation and like his circumstances, make light of it.
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: I would usually go in with another his girlfriend at
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: the time, and then I would leave early so that
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: they would have some alone time. Frost. Wait, say it again, Kellen.
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: I would usually go in alongside with his girlfriend at
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: the time. We'd go in together, and then I would
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: be there for a shorter period of time, and then
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: I would leave early. Frost. Did you drive together there, Kellen, Yes, Frost.
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: Did she ever talk to you on the ride about
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: the preferential treatment at all or anything relating to his
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: jail time Kellen, not specifically that I can remember, Frost.
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: And when you'd leave a little earlier, would you wait
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: in the car for Kellen, Yes, Frost. Was there anything
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: else that happened during those visits beyond the conversation, Kellen. No.
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: We would just sit outside, like on a picnic bench,
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: and he'd be on one side and we'd be on
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: the other side, Frost. And was anyone else present beside
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: you and the girlfriend on any of the visits Kellen. Occasionally,
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: other people would go visit. I can't remember if we
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: would all go at the same time or if we
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: would space it out in timing, but I do remember
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: that other people going around like at the same time
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: as me. Frost. Do you remember any names, Kellen. I'm
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: pretty sure Jean Luke Brunel. There was another man, Paul Prospery,
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: that went quite often. I think he used to be
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: an attorney, but I'm not sure what he was. I
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: don't think he was like Jeffrey's attorney. I think just
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: a friend. Maybe Igor Znoviev. I know he was like
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: his driver and bodyguard at the time. I don't remember
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: if he went in specifically and saw him in the
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: jail or not. Frost. Anyone that you can recall, Kellen,
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: his paralegal went in every single day story Cals. He
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: was there I think six times a week, all day. Frost.
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: Anyone else Kellen, not that I remember right now, mister Frost. Okay,
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: thank you. Back to mister Submerannium. I'm going to try
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: my best. You'll have to tell me when I'm going
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: outside the bounds. So I guess I have just a
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: general question if the DOJ were to, let's say, reopen
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: the investigation into the matter and offer you immunity, would
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: you sit down with them and tell them everything you know? Kellen?
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: I have sat down with them and told them everything
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: I know Submarannium, okay. And then if the DOJ were
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: to release as you may know, there are some files
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: that have not been released. Do you believe if the
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: DOJ released them we would find out more information and
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: more names of the people who participated in trafficking Kellen?
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: I don't know, Sumaranium. And as far as your job responsibilities,
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: did you ever take passports from anyone when they traveled,
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: particularly survivors? Kellen, I've never taken anyone's passport or held
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: on to it. Occasionally, if we were leaving the island
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: or leaving like an international location, the pilots would need
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: everyone's information ahead of time to pre clear customs. Mister Summaranium,
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: did you ever come across fake passports? Kellen? No, Sumaranium, okay.
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: And then did you ever facilitate any flights or meetings
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: for Sarah Ferguson, particularly Kellen actually organizing meetings at Jeffrey's
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: office in Palm Beach while he was on work release
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: and at the house in pom Beach, Summaranium. I think
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: there was some talk earlier about Indyke and Cohn. Do
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: you believe that they were aware of what was going
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: on as far as the abuse, Miss Ham as far
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: as the abuse, Somemeranium or any of the abuse, But
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: he gets cut off by Kellen. They potentially would have
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: seen my nude photos around the houses if they want
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: to visit Jeffrey or visited some of the houses, mister Submarannium.
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: Did they ever ask you about whether you were encountering
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: any abuse? Kellen? No, Somemaranium. I guess you can say
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: that you won't answer this, But did you ever meet
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: Virginia Roberts Kellen, I think I answered it earlier. I
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: don't remember a meeting her, but I have seen that
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: there were two flights with us on it together. Somemeranium, Okay,
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: and then were you aware of I guess he won't
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: be answering this question, so never mind. I guess that's
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: all I have for now. Thanks. All right, folks, we're
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: going to wrap up right here and in the next
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: episode dealing with the topic, we're gonna pick up where
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: we left off All the information that goes with this
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: episode can be found in the description box. What's up, everyone,
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: and welcome to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: this episode, we're getting right back to the Sarah Kelln
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: interview with Congress. Question by misredacted if we could turn
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: back to New Mexico for just a few minutes just
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: to confirm. You believe that you did book some travel
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: via both private plane and commercial plane to Zoro Ranch,
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: but you don't have a firm recollection for who or
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: what years? Ham can I ask you, do you have
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: the flight logs that might help her job her memory,
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: at least for the Epstein flights redacted, Just trying to
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: get a general sense Kellen, Yeah, I wouldn't have. It's
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: so long ago. I wouldn't have specific like dates or people.
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: Question by misredacted. Did you ever overhear Epstein or Maxwell
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: talk about New Mexico officials in the context of Zoro
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: Ranch and there are operations at Zoro Ranch? Answer? I
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: knew they were friends with Governor Richardson of New Mexico.
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: Question do you remember how you learn that? Answer? It's
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: possible that he came to the ranch to visit I
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: feel like there were some like he. I'm trying to
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: think if there were any connection to him, like owning
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: some of the ranch or property. I might just be
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: getting confused, or that was there was another governor I
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: believe that owned the ranch, but it might not have
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: been the Richardsons. I know that they were friendly. Question
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: do you have any memory of them talking about law
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: enforcement specifically in the context of the ranch and their
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: operations at the ranch? Answer? Not really, But in what capacity?
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: Question generally or potentially you know, providing protection for them
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: or others Kellen, no question, no, okay. Are you aware
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: of any efforts to suppress or delay state level investigations
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: into their operation at Zoro Ranch? Answer no question okay.
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: And then finally, are you aware of any disappearances or
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: deaths related to Zoro Ranch? Answer no question okay. By
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: mister redacted. Ms Kellen, I just had a few follow
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: up questions for you regarding your discussion with the ranking
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: member about your interaction with Donald Trump at mar A Lago.
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: When did the encounter take place? Answer it was probably
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: two thousand and two or two thousand and three. Question
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: and what was the reason for your being at mar
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: A Lago? Answer? Jeffrey would go and use the gym there.
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: I went with him one time and Donald was there.
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: I don't think he was in the gym, but he was, like,
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: you know, in another room at mar a Lago, and
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: we just went and said hello. Question and then the
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: five minute interaction that you mentioned, What did you talk
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: about with Donald Trump? Answer? I don't remember. It was
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: just kind of more of like nice to meet you,
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: I think type of thing. It wasn't a specific topic.
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: Question was anyone else part of the interaction or was
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: it just the two of you? Answer? Just the two
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: of us or Jeffrey, me and mister Trump. Question my understanding,
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: and it's been publicly reported that Jeffrey was ultimately barred
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: from marl Is that your understanding as well? Answer? Yes.
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: Question do you have any knowledge of the circumstances surrounding
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: the decision? Answer? I believe it was because Jeffrey had
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: hit on another member's daughter and Trump banned him from
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: going back. Question Okay, do you know if that member's
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: daughter was under the age of eighteen? Answer? I don't know.
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: Question you also mentioned during the course of your conversation
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: with a ranking member that Jeffrey Epstein and Donald Trump
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: had a falling out involving a real estate transaction. Was
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: mister Epstein's expulsion from mar A Lago also a factor?
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: And they're falling out? To your understanding? Answer? I think
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: it was probably both. Yeah, twofold kind of yeah. Question.
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: Did Jeffrey Epstein ever talk with you about that? Answer?
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: Which part? Question is falling out? Answer? No, I just
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: knew he was annoyed and that he lost the bit
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: on the house in Palm Beach that Trump won. Question
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: by misredacted? Just really quick on that? Do you recall
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: the name of the member who's daughter he Kellen? No question? Okay,
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: I'm just going to ask a few more questions on
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: Glenn Maxwell. I know you covered some of this earlier,
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: so I'll try to skip those parts. When you began
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: working for Epstein and Maxwell, what was your understanding of
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: their relationship to each other? Answer that they were dating
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: and that she ran all of the houses and stuff. Question,
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: so when you started working there, they were romantically involved?
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: Answer yes. Question and when did that romantic relationship end? Answer?
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: Probably around two thousand and four, is my guests question?
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: And Maxwell continued working for Epstein after they ended their relationship? Answer? Yes. Question,
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: What to your understanding were Maxwell's duties for Epstein. I
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: know that you said earlier that she sort of like
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: ran his life. What did that entail? Answer? She hired
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: all the staff, She oversaw all the houses, the running
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: of the houses. She made a manual that would be
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: distributed to all the staff members, and so she made
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: the max of all the duties to perform. She approved
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: all the building of all the houses. She would have
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: to go and like sign off on all the checks
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: in the office and all the payments and things like that.
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: Question did her role change after the romantic relationship ended?
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: Answer not really, not until she kind of started she
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: mostly started distancing herself. She was around basically until twenty ten.
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: I want to say, during the time he was in jail.
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: She wasn't around so much, Like she came once to
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: visit him on work release at the office, but she
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: was still involved in, like you know, still kind of
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: reported to her. Answer yeah, question at the office was
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: at the Florida Science Foundation office. Answer yes. Question And
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: did you find out at all that she continued working
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: for him after their relationship had ended? Answer no, because
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: they were I mean, they were like the closest to
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: each other and everything, like she knew everything about him,
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: and he had access to everything, and she ran out everything.
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: Question Uh huh. And he said earlier that you took
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: over for redacted, which was her assistant. So when you
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: first started working for them, were you were reporting directly
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: to Glenn Maxwell? Answer yes, question and then after she
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: separated a bit, you started reporting more directly to Epstein
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: answer correct. Question. How did your role differ when you
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: reported directly to Maxwell? Answer? It didn't differ a lot.
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: She would have me doing a lot of personal things
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: for her in addition to all the things that Jeffrey
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: at the time, like picking up her dry cleaning, running
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: errands for her, helping her unpack, things like that. And
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: then with Jeffrey it was more about him. Question. And
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: you said that when you were working for in New York,
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: you were working out of her townhouse. Is that correct? Answer? Yeah,
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: she had an office in the ground floor of her house.
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: Question okay, And could you describe your routine when you
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: were working out of that office in a little bit
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: more detail? Answer? So, I would typically get there at
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: nine in the morning and go up to her office.
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: She had an office on her third or fourth floor,
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: and she would give me a list of things to
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: work on or things to go source her buy different
• 19:07
  Speaker 1: projects and things, and I would go and try and
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: get them done. Question when you were at her apartment,
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: did you see anyone coming in or out of the
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: building or in and out of her apartment? Answer? There
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: were two doors. There was the main door and then
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: a side door. It was like the staff entrance and
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: the entrance to the office, so it was kind of
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: like separate from her main personal part of the house. Questions,
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: so you don't recall seeing anyone from her personal life
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: coming and going? Answer? Not really. Question did you ever
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: see other young women coming and going? Answer? There were
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: other other assistants that worked out of the house as well.
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: Question who were those assistants? Answer? It will have their
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: names redacted because they're not a public question and they
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: were there were assistants or were they victims? Ham, Can
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: we go off the record for a second, they come
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: back on Kellen and their names will be redacted. I'm sorry,
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: I'm just protective. Oh please save it. All of a sudden,
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: you're protective. Huh. Redacted. That's at the discretion of the majority,
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: but that is our request as I noted at the
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: outset of the hour. Question and how old were they
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: at the time? Answer in the twenties, around the same age.
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: Question and did they do similar work for miss Maxwell
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: as you answer? Yeah, question, thank you. Just a few
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: more questions. Are you aware of whether Epstein and Maxwell
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: remained in contact after she stopped working for him? Answer?
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: I'm sorry. Question did Epstein and Maxwell remain in contact
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: after she stopped working for him? Answer? I'm not sure
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: how much contact they had. The last time I remember
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: seeing her was in twenty ten. Jeffrey had a big
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: dinner at his house in New York after he got
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: out of jail for like Yam Kopor, and she was
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: present for that. Question. Okay, so it doesn't seem like
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: they spent much time together from your understanding. Answer not
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: a lot after jail. Question did you remain in contact
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: with miss Maxwell after she stopped working for Epstein? Answer? No, question,
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: and you never spoke to her again? You never saw
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: her again? Answer I don't remember any specific time that
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: I did. I mean potentially an email here or there,
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: but I don't have any like specific recollection. Question and
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: this would have been like after twenty ten, you said,
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: answer right. That's the last time I remember seeing her
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: was in twenty ten at the dinner. Question Okay, and
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: when did you find out that Maxwell was arrested on
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: charges of enticement of miners and sex trafficking of children
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: in twenty twenty? Answer? It was either on the news
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: or my attorneys at the time told me. Question right
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: after it happened. Answer A huh. Question And what was
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: your reaction to that? Answer? Not surprised? Question Why were
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: you not surprised based on your experience? Answer because I
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: knew that she would introduce people to Jeffrey, and I
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: knew that she abused me. I always felt that she
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: was instrumental in Jeffrey becoming who he became. I always
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: felt like she kind of turned him into the monster
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: that he became, that she just fed him and cater
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: to every whim that he wanted. Question. When you say
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: introduce people to Jeffrey, could you describe that in more detail?
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: Miss Ham? You can speak about your own experiences with
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: her and things that she asked you to do for Epstein,
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: but we're not going to talk about other victims. Okay,
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: you don't want to talk about it might be helpful
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: to explain, and I know you've talked about it. I
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: know it's not my time to ask questions, but it
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: might be helpful for you to explain in how she
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: interacted with you when you first met her, and why
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: that colored your perception of her actions. Kellen, I mean,
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: she would, you know, always reiterate how powerful Jeffrey was
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: and that I should listen to him and do what
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: he says because he clearly he knows best and he
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: can help me. She was part you know, present and
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: participated in my abuse. At least on one occasion I
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: can remember, on the island, she would show me how
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: to please Jeffrey, how to massage his feet. That was
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: one one of my major tasks. I had to have
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: a bottle of lotion in my bag so I could
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: massage his feet at any given moment. From what I
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: had read about other reports online of accusations against her,
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: I was not surprised. Question okay, thank you. And last question,
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: did miss Maxwell ever reach out to you after she
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: was arrested? Miss Kellen? No, Miss Ham, can we get
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: a time check if you don't mind? Redacted? Five minutes,
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: Miss Ham, five minutes, thank you, redacted. I think this
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: would be a good time for us to end our hour.
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: Miss Ham Okay, so we'll go off the record, all right.
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: We're gonna wrap up right here as well, and in
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: the next episode we're gonna pick up where we left off.
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: All the information that goes with this episode can be
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: found in the description box. What's up, everyone, and welcome
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode,
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: we're picking up where we left off with the Sarah
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: Kellen interview with Congress Miss Brignac. We're ready to go
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: back on the record. The time is one oh five
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: and the majority begins their second Miss Brynac question. Miss Kellen,
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: we briefly discussed your compensation, but can you describe how
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: it fluctuated throughout your time working for mister Epstein. Answer.
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: I started at twenty five thousand a year. I believe
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: it got up to one hundred thousand a year at
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: one point, and then he cut everyone's pay when he
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: went to jail, and it ended at seventy five thousand
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: a year at the end of my employment. Question how
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: much did he cut your pay? By answer? I guess
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: it would have been twenty five percent If it was
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: one hundred thousand and then seventy five thousand. Question did
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: you receive compensation beyond that salary? Answer? He would give
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: me a few gifts though through the years. Question did
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: he pay for your housing? Answer? He gave me an
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: apartment to live in. He had maybe ten apartments that
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: different staff members. Timmins. Was that at three oh one Kellen? Yes, Timmins, Okay,
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: thank you, Brignac. And did anyone live with you at
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: three oh one East sixty six Street Kellen, No, Brignac.
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: Who were your neighbors Kellen? In relation to Jeffrey, the
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: pilots all had an apartment, his girlfriend had an apartment.
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: The chef had an apartment while he had a private
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: chef Jean lu Brunel had an apartment, Timmins. When did
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: you move out of the apartment Kellen? Twenty twelve, when
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: I became engaged to my second husband, Timmins. By twenty fourteen,
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: there were several different women living there. Did you overlap
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: with any of them? Kellen? I wasn't there in twenty fourteen,
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: so I wouldn't have known who was there. Timmins. I
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: don't know if any of them were still there. They
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: came right around that time, but there were no other
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: women in your orbit while you were there? In twenty twelve,
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: there were no other assistants Kellen. I know one of
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: his girlfriends was still living there that I knew. Timmins,
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: do you recall the name Kellen redacted Brignac? Question and
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: that's redacted correct answer yes. Question What were the names
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: of the other pilots and chefs that lived at the address?
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: Answer Larry Sask, David Rodgers, Larry Morrison, Adam Perry Lang,
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: and I believe Darren Endyke had an apartment there as well.
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: In the beginning of my employment. I don't remember if
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: any other chefs lived there. And then at one point
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: they used two of the apartments as offices when he
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: was in jail to save money. Question were you abused
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: at this apartment? Answer no. Question Did he, mister Epstein,
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: pay your rent at the apartment or did he place
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: the apartment in your name? Answer? He never put it
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: in my name, although he always dangled that carrot in
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: front of me. In the beginning of my employment, he said,
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: if you make it working five years with me, I'll
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: put the apartment in your name, And that never happened.
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: And then he kind of continued it in the later
• 26:42
  Speaker 1: years as well. He kept saying he was gonna put
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: the apartment in my name, and it never happened. And
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: then when he was kind of like pushing me out
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: of the apartment when I was engaged to Brian, I
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: reminded him of his promise, and he just sort of
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: ignored it. Question Brian being Brian Vickers answer correct? Question,
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: thank you? Did he pay for your medical appointments? Answer yes.
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: Question did mister Epstein pay for your education? Answer? I
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: don't believe I got any extra education when I was
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: working with him. Question did mister Epstein offer you any
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: personal loans? Answer? He gave me gifts. I didn't understand
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: them to be loans. Question did you ever ask him
• 27:20
  Speaker 1: for a personal loan? Answer? No? Question Did any other
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: associate of mister Epstein receive personal loans? Answer? Any other
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: associates receive loans? I'm not sure. Ham. Can we pause
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: for a second, they go off record, they come back, Kellen. Sorry.
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: She wanted me to mention that he in the very
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: beginning before I started working, he asked if I had
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: any debt and he paid off my credit cards during
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: like the very first interview I had with him that
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: first week, Miss Brynac, thank you Timmins. Approximately how much
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: was that, Kellen? Like fifteen hundred, Miss Ham. I'm sorry
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: clarify one more thing. On the medical appointments, you also
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: received health insurance, right, so he would pay for the
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: doctor's appointments and he provided medical insurance. Is that right, Kellen? Uh?
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: Huh Ham okay, Tolan, And you mentioned gifts. What type
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: of gifts did you receive Kellen. He bought me jewelry, clothing.
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: He gave me money onto accounts that I remember. He
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: gave me a mini moke for my birthday, one year luggage,
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: that sort of thing, Tolan. And was the money that
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: was just a gift. It was for no purpose specifically, Kellen.
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: So one was to help pay for my wedding. And
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: then there was one I went to see him in
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: New York and that was expressing how stressed I was
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: at the time. My husband and I gutted our apartment
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: in New York and a few months after that he
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: was in the hospital with emergency open heart surgery and
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: he couldn't race anymore. He was a professional race car driver,
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: so like basically he had no more income and he
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: had to pay, like he used his entire life savings
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: to try and rebuild the apartment, but we couldn't get
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: it back to livable, and we couldn't refinance without it
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: being livable. And it was just like ike, super stressful time.
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: And I was telling Jeffrey about that, and he just
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: got on the phone and told his accountant to wire
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: me money, which I assume was to help alleviate some
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: of my stress. Brignac. Question, Miss Kellen, back to the
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: payment on the apartment, did you understand that the other
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: associates of mister Epstein that lived there also had their
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: rent paid or was the apartment placed in any of
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: their names? Answer? I'm not aware of them being placed
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: in any of their names, And I never really understood
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: like how it was Like I assumed Jeffrey own the
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: apartments the way he liked acted with him, but I
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: never really understood who properly owned them. I think his
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: brother and another they had a partner in the building,
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: Anthony Barrett, who Jeffrey was friendly with. But I didn't
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: quite understand the dynamics of all of that. Question did
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: mister Epstein ever assist in setting up a business for you? Answer?
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: Mister Endyke helped set up my SLK Design interior design company.
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: Question did mister Epstein ever use SLK Design to help
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: young women or girls acquire visas or passports? Answer? He
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: had me hire an assistant that helped me with design
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: a design project. She was an assistant and she was
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: hired under SLK Designs. Question can you describe the conversation
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: to me that came out of that taking place? Who
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: told you to hire her? Answer Jeffrey. Question who was
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: the assistant? Answer redacted? Question Okay, did you express any
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: concerns about the hiring decision? Answer no, because she had
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: gone to school for interior design and she was helping
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: a lot with sourcing furniture and fabrics and interior design projects.
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: Question Miss Kellen, you've described your previous husband, Brian Vickers,
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: and documents that the committee has reviewed revealed that mister
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: Vickers did communicate with mister Epstein. What was mister Epstein's
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: involvement in your relationship? Answer? I had not told Brian
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: about the abuse in the beginning and positioned Jeffrey as
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: more of a father figure to him because I was
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: ashamed of disclosing what had happened to him. So that's
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: kind of the context of that. Brian Viudeman. I think he,
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: like Jeff wanted to be involved with our pre nup
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: and was giving advice on that. I don't think they
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: had a lot of communication. I mean I saw some
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: of the emails online. Some of them I weren't aware of.
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: Question who introduced you to mister Vickers? Answer? I met
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: him through one of my friends. Her husband was friends
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: with Brian, and we met out a brunch in New York. Tolin,
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: and what was mister Epstein's reaction to you getting engaged
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: and leaving your job as his assistant? Kellen? He started
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: getting more difficult towards me and being more dismissive of me.
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: He you know, was like when can you When are
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: you going to move out of the apartment, and was
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: trying to kick me out of the apartment pretty quickly.
• 31:39
  Speaker 1: He kept saying, when are you going to go to
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: Brian's health insurance? And I was like, we're not married yet.
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: I can't go on as insurance until we're married. When
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: I wasn't traveling with Jeffrey twenty four to seven like
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: I typically was, he was like, this isn't working. We're
• 31:52
  Speaker 1: going to have to cut your pay or you know,
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: he just became more hostile towards me just because I
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: wasn't at his beck and call twenty four to seven anymore?
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: Brignac question, Miss Kellen. I will now read a list
• 32:04
  Speaker 1: of individuals that the Committee has identified as associated with
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: mister Epstein and that the request of your counsel. This
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: will be a list. Some of these might be repetitive
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: from the minorities hour, but for clarity on the record,
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: I'm going to run through them again. For each name,
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: please state whether you witnessed any inappropriate behavior from the individual.
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: If the answer is yes, I will not ask you
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: to give information about the victim. Ham, I'm so sorry.
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: Can I just clarify? You mean, like inappropriate sexual behavior?
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: Brignac correct? Am being rude? Okay? Inappropriate sexual behavior? Question?
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: Glenne Maxwell yes with myself question. Les Wexner answer no question,
• 32:45
  Speaker 1: Bill Gates answer no question. Lee I'm Black answer no,
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: Andrew mount Batten Windsor answer no, Sultan Achmed Bin Solium
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: answer no question. Larry Page no, Sergey Brynn no, Larry
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: Summers no, Just Dally no, Doug Band answer. I'm sorry,
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: Just to clarify anything, that I saw or was aware
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: of any inappropriate question. The question was anything you witnessed?
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: Answer witnessed? Okay question. Doug Band answer no question. Elon
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: Musk answer no question. Steve Bannon answer no question. Richard
• 33:19
  Speaker 1: Branson answer no. Glenn Dubin answered no. Sandy Berger answered no.
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: Ham Can we stop there? Can you just clarify which
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: Sandy Burger for her? Are you talking about the Clinton official?
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: Sandy Berger Toland, Yes, Ham Burger. There's somebody else in
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: the files that we've seen, So I just wanted to
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: clarify for Totlan the Clinton official. Yeah, Ham, okay, thank you. Question.
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: Woody Allen, no question, Riet Hoffman answer no question. Alan
• 33:46
  Speaker 1: Dershowitz answer no question. Jean Luke Burnell answer no. Whood
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: Brock answer no. President Bill Clinton answered no. Steven Sinofsky
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: answer no question. Are there any others that you witness
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: conduct engage in sexual conduct? Answer only towards myself, Philip
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: Levine and Frederick Fukai. Mister Timmins, can I jump in? So,
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: Philip Levine, when did you first encounter him? What year?
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: Miss Kellen? Pretty much right away? The instance that I
• 34:15
  Speaker 1: referenced was in two thousand and two, two thousand and three,
• 34:19
  Speaker 1: Jeffrey and Glane rented a house in San Trope for
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: the summer, and Philip came to stay with them part
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: of the time. Timmins. And that's when the first instance occurred, Kellen.
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: Uh huh, Timmins. And he sexually assaulted you. Is that
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: what you said earlier? Kellen? Correct? At the house and
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: then again on the beach, we were kind of walking
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: and I think it was Jeffrey and Glane were walking
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: ahead of us, and there was me and Philip, and
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: then there was like this wooden kind of shack on
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: the beach, and he just kind of grabbed my hand
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: and pulled me into the shack. Timmins. Okay, so that's
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: two thousand and two, Kellen, two thousand and two or
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: two thousand and three. It was pretty early on in
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: my employment, Burlason. Was this on the island? Timmins? No,
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: this was Kellen jumps in in santro Pe. Timmins. What
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: other further contact did you have with Philip Levine after
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: two thousand and three, Kellen, I don't remember any specific
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: contact that I had. I just knew that him and
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: Glaine were very friendly. Timmins. So you never saw him
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: again after two thousand and three. Kellen, It's possible, but
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: I don't remember Timmins. But in two thousand and three
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: in santro Pe. I hate to ask you to do this,
• 35:26
  Speaker 1: but can you give me additional details about the interaction? Kellen?
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: It was at night, Jeffrey and Glane had gone to bed,
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: and their bedroom was upstairs, and then Philip was staying
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: in a bedroom downstairs, and we were both still awake,
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: and he brought me into his bedroom and said, you know,
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: you must be so lonely, always with them and never
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: not having your own life, and kind of not being
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: able to do or be with anyone, kind of was
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: basically forced himself on me. Question, Miss Brignac, Now, Miss Kellen.
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: The question was whether you witnessed any of those individuals
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: engage in sexual activity when you had prompted whether I
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: was asking of your general awareness. Can you answer whether
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: you were aware of any of those individuals having engaged
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: in sexual misconduct? Ham aware at the time that she
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: was employed for Epstein. Brignac correct, Kellen, I wasn't aware, Brignac.
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: Did you ever witness mister Epstein given cash to young
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: women or girls? Ham, this is where we understand that
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: some of the allegations are so I don't want to
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: speak about the victims, Kellen. Okay, Brignac and understanding the
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: scope for clarity on the record, are you refusing to
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: answer that question? Ham? Yeah, I'm asking her based on
• 36:35
  Speaker 1: the parameters that we that she's prepared to discuss today
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: that we don't want to get into other victims. Kellen,
• 36:41
  Speaker 1: and I would like to be able to answer all
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: the questions, but I just need to like listen to
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: my counsel. Timmins. If you were given immunity by the
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: Department of Justice or this committee, would you be willing
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: to answer more questions? Kellen one hundred percent? Timmins, Do
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: you think that the answers to those questions would result
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: in additional people being indicted or held accountable? Kellen? I
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: don't know. I mean I don't Timmins. Can I direct
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: that to your lawyer? Kellen? Sure? Ham Yeah. I think
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: it's hard because I'm not sure what she the DOJ knows. Honestly,
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: Brignac and I understand the scope, but for clarity on
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: the record, we have a few more questions. Did miss
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: Maxwell or mister Epstein ever ask you to introduce young
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: women to girls or clients or friends of Epstein. Ham.
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: I think you can answer that, Kellen, No, I'm sorry,
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: could you reask? I'm sorry? Sure, did miss Maxwell or
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: mister Epstein ever ask you to introduce young women or
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: girls to clients or friends of mister Epstein? Kellen, no question, Brignac.
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: Did you ever witness mister Epstein have sexual contact of
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: any kind with young women or girls? Ham? You can
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: answer for yourself, Kellen, myself in three instances I mentioned
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: before with Glaine and then to other women. Brignac, Thank you,
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: but that wasn't the question. Did you ever witness mister
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: Epstein have sexual contact of any kind with other young
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: women or girls? Ham? Yeah, we're not talking about that.
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: I don't want to put her in a position to
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: talk about other victims, but she is able to talk
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: about her own experience being victimized by him with other
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: people present. If you want information, Brignac, and just for
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: clarity on the record, you're refusing to answer that question, Kellen,
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: I'm listening to my attorney. Brignac. Thank you, Ham, I
• 38:21
  Speaker 1: mean this was the scope. I appreciate the committee's position,
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: but this is voluntary and coming in here. We wanted
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: to make sure that she was able to provide information
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: to be helpful to the committee while protecting herself and
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: understanding that sustained questioning on some of these topics is
• 38:36
  Speaker 1: very difficult for her to get through. All right, folks,
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: We're going to wrap up right here, and then the
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: next episode dealing with the topic, we're going to pick
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: up where we left off. All the information that goes
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: with this episode can be found in the description box.
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're picking up where we
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: left off with the Sarah Kellen conversation with congress Mister Timmins.
• 39:02
  Speaker 1: So pre two thousand and seven, hundreds of people have
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: been identified as victims, many of them under age, somewhere
• 39:08
  Speaker 1: between sex assault, solicitation, whatnot. He went to jail substantially
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: for that. Afterwards, it seems that he did not pursue
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: underage women, but he created a cult like environment for
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: a dozen women. You've been named as a victim, and
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: you've received compensation from the estate and from many other
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: legal settlements. Is that fair Kellen from the estate in
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: a class action suit Timmins, Okay. The purpose of this endeavor,
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: which I'm sure is very unpleasant to be a part of,
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: is to try to find additional culpable individuals, to hold
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: them accountable, to give the American people the trust that
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: we're taking this matter very seriously, and to make sure
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: it doesn't happen again. So you have given us a
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: new name that I did not have before, which is
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: the man that later became the mayor and ran for
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: governor and is worth hundreds of millions of dollars. So
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: we got a new name of somebody that we can
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: pursue accountability with. I think a lot of people think
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: that the lawyer and the accountant are also culpable. Do
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: you believe that the lawyer and accountant Konnen Endyke have
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: culpability related to the crimes that Jeffrey Epstein was being
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: prosecuted for and that Glenn Maxwell is currently serving twenty
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: years in prison for. Do you believe that they have
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: some responsibility for facilitating those for allowing those to happen? Kellen,
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: I don't know exactly what they would have known or
• 40:24
  Speaker 1: not known. I feel like Darren would be mostly the
• 40:27
  Speaker 1: one to be aware of kind of all the inner
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: workings because he kind of like had his hands and
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: all things legal. He was kind of involved in all
• 40:35
  Speaker 1: the civil suits and hiring attorneys for me. Timmins. Was
• 40:39
  Speaker 1: there a black bag of cash when you were in
• 40:41
  Speaker 1: his orbit at the time, Kellen, Jeffrey traveled with a
• 40:44
  Speaker 1: black bag kind of like his briefcase, Timmins. Did he
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: pay people out of the bag in cash? Ham If
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: it doesn't implicate victims, you can answer to the extent
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: it doesn't implicate victims, Kellen, I don't know what all
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: he used for cash, Timmins, You don't have to answer,
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: That's fine, Kelln. Yeah, Timmins. Did you ever witness were
• 41:04
  Speaker 1: there other powerful people that were in your orbit that
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: you had witness with that were in a situation that
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: caused you to question their presence around Epstein? Did people
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: come to the island and leave with someone and come back.
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: I mean, you can only say what you've seen, but
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: you've seen other women that possibly would be victims having
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: encounters with people of power of influence. Have you seen
• 41:25
  Speaker 1: anything like that? Kellen's I did not, Timmins, Okay, have
• 41:29
  Speaker 1: you considered suing or pursuing criminal charges against the former
• 41:33
  Speaker 1: mayor of Miami that you say sexually assaulted you. Kellen, No, Timmins,
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: He'll probably write you a check. Go ahead, Burlison. In
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: your deposition, you said that being in Epstein's orbit, that
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: you were in a situation were you even feared for
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: your life, or that you thought that you knew that
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: every time everything would end everything you knew in the world,
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: even your life. Later you said that there were two
• 41:56
  Speaker 1: FBI agents that kind of validated Jeffrey's claim that were
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: not validating it when you witness his interaction with those agents,
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: in your mind, was validation of his claim or the
• 42:05
  Speaker 1: appearance that he could control any law enforcement agency. Kellen,
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: Uh huh, mister Burlison, So I kind of want to
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: dive into that. Can you go into greater detail about
• 42:14
  Speaker 1: that event at the airport with the two FBI agents.
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: What did they look like? Did you overhear the conversation?
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: What exactly happened? Kellen? So, we were leaving the island
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: and we have pre clear customs Saint Thomas in the airport,
• 42:28
  Speaker 1: and there was a handler that usually like will bring
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: us in and handle our luggage and we give our IDs,
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: and I just remember standing there it was like me,
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: Jeffrey and his girlfriend and I think one other guest,
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: and the handler comes up and says, there's FBI agents
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: that want to talk to Sarah and redacted. And I
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: feel like I could. I saw them from a distance,
• 42:47
  Speaker 1: but they were kind of far away, and Jeffrey's like,
• 42:50
  Speaker 1: wait here, and then he went to speak with him,
• 42:52
  Speaker 1: and then ten minutes later he comes back and he's like, okay,
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: let's go, and like then we all just walk on
• 42:59
  Speaker 1: the plane and then he never says anything else about it,
• 43:02
  Speaker 1: and nothing else happened. Burlison, what do you think those
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: agents wanted to talk to Sarah and redacted? Kellen? I
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: knew he was being investigated at the time, Burlison. Were
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: they under age at the time, Kellen? Who Ham, No,
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: it wasn't. They wanted to talk to bur Listen to you.
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: I'm sorry to Sarah and redacted. Burlson. Okay, did you
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: ever schedule any meetings, any calls with Epstein with individuals
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: who might have been in any intelligence agencies from the
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: United States? Well, that's weird because Bill Burns was at
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein's house. Mister Burleson might want to check on that. Kellen, No, Burlison.
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: Did Epstein have other interactions that you were aware of
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: with other government officials, whether it's FBI CIA, Kellen, I
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: mean other than like Bill Clinton or Prince I mean
• 43:51
  Speaker 1: that's not us. I know he was friends with George Mitchell.
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: He remained friendly with Matt Menchell after his jail time,
• 43:56
  Speaker 1: who I think was one of the prosecutors in his
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: first case. Burlison, Okay, any foreign contacts, I know that
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: you mentioned he had. There were multiple interactions with Edwood Barrock.
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: Did those visits include security? Were there other officials at
• 44:10
  Speaker 1: the meetings as well? Kellen, who definitely had security. He
• 44:14
  Speaker 1: would visit the house at New York and a who
• 44:17
  Speaker 1: had also stayed at one of the apartments at three
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: oh one when he visited Burlison. Did any of those
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: Were any of those meetings of a business nature? Were
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: they just personal or social in nature? Kellen, I'm not
• 44:30
  Speaker 1: sure what the nature was exactly. I also remember that
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: there was an associate of that Yannie Koryn I believe
• 44:36
  Speaker 1: was his name, that Jeffrey was paying for his medical
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: bills in New York and then he had me go
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: to the hospital and pay cash for his procedure on
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: behalf of Yanni Kryn Burlissen. Did Jeffrey ever discuss or
• 44:48
  Speaker 1: reference working with being protected by like intelligence services or
• 44:52
  Speaker 1: other governments? Kellen? No, burtherson. Okay, how did he handle
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: his own personal security during travel? Kellen? He didn't really
• 44:59
  Speaker 1: have security in the beginning. When he went to jail
• 45:02
  Speaker 1: the first time, he had his personal trainer, Igor Zinoviev
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: kind of become like a driver slash bodyguard for a
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: while after, but other than that, he didn't really have
• 45:11
  Speaker 1: like a proper security detail. Burlison was Glennin's father, Robert Maxwell.
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: Was it ever brought up in that relationship, Kellen, not
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: that I remember. I remember Glaine there was like a
• 45:23
  Speaker 1: book about her father, and she gave a copy to
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: Fidel Castro when we were in Cuba. But I don't
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: know that there was a lot of conversation necessarily, Like
• 45:31
  Speaker 1: I knew that they had a yacht. His yacht was
• 45:33
  Speaker 1: named after her. I didn't even really like kind of
• 45:36
  Speaker 1: research or understand who he was or what you know.
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: He was accused of stealing money from his employees, and
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: they weren't sure it was either a suicide or a murder.
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: In his death on the boat, Burlison. Were there any
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: other any other meetings with people from the Middle East?
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: Were there any transfers, any kind of information or tech? Kellen,
• 45:55
  Speaker 1: He was very friendly with Sultan bin Suleiman. I think
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: that they were both invested in like a yacht company.
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: I don't know if this was like particular information. I
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: think they were both invested like American yacht company. Burlison.
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: Thank you, miss Bobert. So you had testified that you
• 46:11
  Speaker 1: had fairly extensive interactions with President Clinton. Did President Clinton
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: know that you were being abused by Jeffrey Epstein Kellen, No, Bobert.
• 46:19
  Speaker 1: In your testimony, it seems that you were made to
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: be available at all times at Jeffrey Epstein's pleasure. He
• 46:25
  Speaker 1: would wake you up in the middle of the night
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: even and so did those interactions happen on the plane Kellen, yes, Bobert.
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: And were other people present on the plane when the
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: abuse occurred Kellen, It wasn't in front of them. He
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: had a bedroom in the back with a door on it, Bobert.
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: And was anyone suspicious of what was of the interactions
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: that were happening behind the closed doors? Kellen, I don't know.
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: No one ever really spoke about things like that, Like
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: he kind of made sure we were all kind of
• 46:52
  Speaker 1: separate and didn't like talk to each other, and he
• 46:55
  Speaker 1: was very strategic about that, Bobert. Were you allowed, Were you,
• 46:58
  Speaker 1: specifically or anyone working with Jeffrey Epstein not allowed to
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: speak with the guests or friends that he had on
• 47:04
  Speaker 1: the plane or no one talks on the plane? How
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: was that separation made, Kellen? I mean, we would just
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: talk about service things, but nobody spoke about anything private, Bobert.
• 47:15
  Speaker 1: And did anything sexual ever happen in the presence of
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: Bill Clinton, Kellen, no Bobert. Was he on the plane
• 47:21
  Speaker 1: at the time when he would bring you into a
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: room and abuse you? Was President Clinton on the plane
• 47:26
  Speaker 1: when Jeffrey Epstein would bring you in the room and
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: abuse you? Kellen, no Bobert. Never once were you abused
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: on a plane while President Trump or excuse me, President
• 47:35
  Speaker 1: Clinton was a board, Kellen no Bobert. President Clinton testified
• 47:41
  Speaker 1: that he did not have a friendship with Jeffrey Epstein.
• 47:43
  Speaker 1: Do you believe that Jeffrey Epstein and Bill Clinton were
• 47:46
  Speaker 1: friendly and did have a friendship, Kellen? They seemed to
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: be friendly for a short period of time around the
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: times that Jeffrey flew him to Africa and Asia. But
• 47:54
  Speaker 1: I didn't see like at last it or was anything
• 47:57
  Speaker 1: kind of more beyond that time period, Bobert. Were you
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: ever in contact with President Clinton in arranging flights or meetings? Kellen,
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: I was on all the flights with mister Clinton, President Clinton. Bobert,
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: were you ever part of Were you ever the one
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: to arrange meetings with Bill Clinton and Jeffrey Epstein Kellen, No,
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: Like for those particular trips, it would have been I
• 48:18
  Speaker 1: think Lane mostly organized with the staff and the scheduling
• 48:21
  Speaker 1: for those, Miss Bobert. While Jeffrey Epstein and Bill Clinton
• 48:25
  Speaker 1: were friendly during that short period of time, did you
• 48:28
  Speaker 1: see them together and witness their interaction? Kellen, Yes, Bobert.
• 48:32
  Speaker 1: What was it if you can recall that they had
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: spoken about Kellen, I don't remember specific so what they
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: spoke about. I mean I was present with them on
• 48:40
  Speaker 1: the plains and various like the Sultan of Brunei's house,
• 48:43
  Speaker 1: we went and had lunch there. We were together in
• 48:45
  Speaker 1: President Clinton's hotel room in Brunei in the pool, Miss Bolbert,
• 48:50
  Speaker 1: were you abused in the hotel room at the time
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: while Bill Clinton was there. Kellen No, definitely, not when
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: Bill Clinton was there. I don't remember if anything happened
• 48:58
  Speaker 1: privately with Jeffrey on that trip, Bobert, did any did
• 49:02
  Speaker 1: any other men ever approach you with a desire to
• 49:04
  Speaker 1: be connected with other women or girls? Kellen No, Bobert,
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: you had mentioned that there was at least three other abusers.
• 49:11
  Speaker 1: Are those the only other three abusers? Or were you
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: abused by anyone else, Miss Kellen, Jeffrey Glaine, Philip Levine
• 49:19
  Speaker 1: and Frederick Focai, Patrick de Martier. Nothing happened, but he
• 49:23
  Speaker 1: tried Burlsen. What was that name again, Patrick de Martier?
• 49:28
  Speaker 1: He is a famous fashion photographer, Bobert, And you said
• 49:31
  Speaker 1: nothing happened. He tried, Kellen. He walked over to me
• 49:33
  Speaker 1: with his pants down, and I refused, Miss Bolbert, and
• 49:37
  Speaker 1: he accepted your refusal. I'm sorry, I know that's uncomfortable
• 49:40
  Speaker 1: for you to relive. I'm not trying to be harsh
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: on my questioning. And in any of these did you
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: you said you never connected with any men with girls ever,
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: Kellen no Ham. Sorry to clarify, you never connected any
• 49:52
  Speaker 1: of Jeffrey Epstein's associates, with other girls Kellen correct, Ham Yeah, Okay, Bobert.
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: When I made the statement, I did mean associates to
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein. Thank you for clarifying, Burlison. Can you describe
• 50:05
  Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein's relationship with Hillary Clinton? Kellen. I never met her,
• 50:10
  Speaker 1: so I'm not sure. I'm not aware of what relationship
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: they would have had, Burlison. Did you ever schedule any
• 50:15
  Speaker 1: meetings between the two Kellen? No, Berlisen, Okay, Bobert. I
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: think that's all I have for now. Question Okay, thanks,
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: miss Kellen. In two thousand and five, police in Palm Beach,
• 50:26
  Speaker 1: Florida began investigating mister Epstein, and in July of two
• 50:30
  Speaker 1: thousand and six, mister Epstein was arrested for the first
• 50:32
  Speaker 1: time for soliciting prostitution from minors. When did you first
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: become aware of the investigation into mister Epstein? Answer two
• 50:40
  Speaker 1: thousand and five question how did you become aware? Answer?
• 50:44
  Speaker 1: I don't think I can say, Ham, Yeah, I think
• 50:46
  Speaker 1: that implicates another victim unfortunately. But why don't we give
• 50:50
  Speaker 1: you their approximate time period? Was it before or after
• 50:53
  Speaker 1: the search warrant? Kellen? Before Brignac? Did someone tell you
• 50:56
  Speaker 1: about the investigation, Ham, I think she can't discuss specifics.
• 51:01
  Speaker 1: Question did someone tell you about the investigation? Answer? Yes,
• 51:05
  Speaker 1: question it was a victim? Ham. We think this may,
• 51:09
  Speaker 1: based on allegations, implicate a victim, but I think you
• 51:11
  Speaker 1: can say generally how the information got to you? Was
• 51:14
  Speaker 1: a by phone? Was by email? Did somebody come and
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: talk to you Kellen? It was by phone? Brignac. Okay,
• 51:19
  Speaker 1: did you believe that at the time that the allegations
• 51:22
  Speaker 1: were true? Ham? I don't think at the time she
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: knew the allegations Kellen, exactly. I wasn't sure what the
• 51:28
  Speaker 1: allegations were. Brignac. I'm sorry, could you repeat that quite? Answer?
• 51:33
  Speaker 1: I didn't know what the allegations were at the time.
• 51:35
  Speaker 1: Question when did you first hear about the allegations? Answer?
• 51:39
  Speaker 1: I don't know exactly. Jeffrey kind of presented it all
• 51:42
  Speaker 1: that he was the victim, that he was being taken
• 51:45
  Speaker 1: advantage of, like unscrupulous women that were out to get
• 51:48
  Speaker 1: his money and in cahoots with each other, that their
• 51:50
  Speaker 1: attorneys were out to extort them. He would give me
• 51:53
  Speaker 1: examples of Scott Rothstein making up false civil suits that
• 51:57
  Speaker 1: he forged. The judge's signature and like was committing fraud
• 52:00
  Speaker 1: and was like getting investors to pay off these settlements
• 52:03
  Speaker 1: that didn't exist. And he was like, see they're making
• 52:05
  Speaker 1: it up. Question did you believe them? Answer? I did question?
• 52:09
  Speaker 1: Why answer? Because I only had his side, his reference.
• 52:14
  Speaker 1: Nobody questioned me, nobody approached me, so I only had
• 52:17
  Speaker 1: his narrative. Question, given that he was abusing you at
• 52:20
  Speaker 1: the time, why did you think that these other victims
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: were not being truthful? Answer? I didn't view my abuse
• 52:26
  Speaker 1: at the time. I didn't blame them. I blame myself
• 52:29
  Speaker 1: because I never spoke up. I never said no. I
• 52:31
  Speaker 1: never thought. I chose I know, like trauma response is
• 52:35
  Speaker 1: usually fight flight or flee or freeze, and I chose
• 52:38
  Speaker 1: fawn to kind of appease them to stay on his
• 52:40
  Speaker 1: good side and be safe. All right, folks, we're gonna
• 52:43
  Speaker 1: wrap up right here, and in the next episode dealing
• 52:45
  Speaker 1: with the topic, we're gonna pick up where we left off.
• 52:48
  Speaker 1: All the information that goes with this episode can be
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: found in the description box.