Latest / The Insurance Growth Lab / Chad King's M&A Strategy That Grew King Risk Partners to $125 Million
Transcript
- Chad [0:00:00]: Two weeks ago, I was in Pennsylvania meeting with folks in person in New Jersey and the New York, the week before that, I was in New Orleans last week, I was in Nashville. Chad [0:00:09]: So there is an element of the face to face meeting with people, and then there's an element in really taking a genuine interest in them, and I feel like that is a differentiator with king relative to others. Callan [0:00:24]: Welcome to The Insurance Growth Lab. Callan [0:00:26]: Where we go deep on the growth campaigns and strategies driving real results in the insurance industry. Callan [0:00:32]: Uptown Harrington founder of flash growth and in each episode, I sit down with marketing and growth leaders from carriers and shirt tech and top brokers to break down one specific initiative, whether it's highly marketed a product, scale to channel or solve a specific growth challenge. Callan [0:00:49]: It's novo fluff just tactical insights you can apply in your own company. Callan [0:00:54]: So, Chad, where I'd like to kick this off is? Callan [0:01:01]: Tell me about the lesson you learned from your dad. Chad [0:01:06]: Other of any lessons from my dad, one of them that stands out to me it has been very meaningful to me is when I was at kid, I moved the lawn. Chad [0:01:15]: That was one of my responsibilities one of my chores at home. Chad [0:01:18]: And on a particular day, and my my dad was leaving for work in the summer, I was wasn't dragging yet. Chad [0:01:25]: So maybe middle school age or something like that. Chad [0:01:27]: My dad asked me if I would mow the lawn today. Chad [0:01:29]: And I said, yes. Chad [0:01:30]: I would move lawn today. Chad [0:01:31]: And he said, okay. Chad [0:01:32]: On the car, and he left and went to work, and I was at home, and I didn't get out and mow the lawn right away, and later that day as it does and summers in Florida, it started pouring down rain, and it rained, All afternoon into the evening, and I didn't mow the lawn and to me, it seemed well, obviously, I couldn't mow the lawn was pouring down rey afternoon and my dad got home. Chad [0:01:54]: And asked me, he already knew the answer, but he asked me, didn't she mow the lawn today? Chad [0:01:59]: And I said no. Chad [0:02:00]: I didn't. Chad [0:02:01]: It was raining and da. Chad [0:02:02]: And what he told me was all you have is your word. Chad [0:02:07]: And that really stuck with me in that moment. Chad [0:02:10]: The lesson was I had given him my word we had made an agreement. Chad [0:02:13]: I had told him I would mow the lawn, that And as we discussed it that evening, it was a very constructive conversation, but it was about... Chad [0:02:21]: You can mow the lawn in the rain. Chad [0:02:23]: You can mow the lawn earlier in the day. Chad [0:02:25]: Like, you can figure it out if you really want to do it and if their lawn mower was out of gas, you can get on your bike and ride your bike up to the gas station and fill up the gas can at the gas station and ride back home. Chad [0:02:36]: Like, there is no excuse for why you didn't mow the lawn other than you just decided that you weren't going to it was too hard or whatever your excuses were, but those... Chad [0:02:43]: All of those were excuses At the time, it seemed very unreasonable to me, it seemed like he was he was being unreasonable, but with some time to reflect on that and some maturity. Chad [0:02:55]: I learned so much. Chad [0:02:57]: From him that day, and it has really really helped me a lot in life in many, many circumstances having that perspective, and I think with that, the other lessons that come from that are perseverance or even relentless more than perseverance. Chad [0:03:14]: Mh. Chad [0:03:15]: And many other things. Chad [0:03:17]: But there's lots of other examples I could give you but one that's more recent, a couple of years ago, we had an opportunity, an an m and A opportunity to meet with an agency in Cincinnati. Chad [0:03:28]: I live in North Florida. Chad [0:03:29]: This was in Cincinnati, Ohio. Chad [0:03:31]: The plan was to meet with them on a Friday morning at nine Am. Chad [0:03:35]: This was a couple years ago, and if you remember a couple years ago, there were some hurricanes that came through Florida and then went up into the Carolina as one went up into the Midwest. Chad [0:03:44]: Well, it was the week of those hurricanes hitting. Chad [0:03:47]: So on Monday or Tuesday, it occurred to me that those hurricanes gonna come through Florida, and I heard to everyone else too. Chad [0:03:53]: Flights start getting canceled. Chad [0:03:55]: And but that lesson from my dad it still lives within me. Chad [0:03:59]: So what I did was I rented a car on Wednesday, and I drove from North Florida to Cincinnati, Ohio, and I was at the meeting on time. Chad [0:04:10]: I was actually a few minutes early, and the people I been meeting with, they were just blown away. Chad [0:04:14]: Everyone else has canceled. Chad [0:04:15]: Everyone from remember, the flights are canceled in this and that And my perspective was, I gave you my word I would be here at nine o'clock on Friday morning. Chad [0:04:24]: And here I am at nine o'clock on Friday morning. Chad [0:04:27]: And it was very impactful for them too, and ultimately, they decided to go with King and they're current agency partners today, but I think a big piece of that is, this is who you're partnering with, I'm the kind of person that Callan [0:04:40]: if I tell you, I'll be Chad [0:04:41]: there at nine o'clock on Friday morning, Even if there's a hurricane, even if all the flights get canceled even if whatever I will be there at nine o'clock on Friday morning just like I told you, I would pee. Chad [0:04:50]: And I feel like all of that goes back to the lesson mowing the lawn that that day when I was probably in middle school. Callan [0:04:56]: I love that. Callan [0:04:56]: That is a super interesting story. Callan [0:04:59]: And you know what it's it... Callan [0:05:00]: I... Callan [0:05:00]: Got a couple things around this. Callan [0:05:02]: One, this is definitely come back up when we start talking about kind of your growth strategy, how you approach m and A and things like that. Callan [0:05:08]: But I think one of the other interesting things about that is doing the research on York, Career. Callan [0:05:14]: You had a very very interesting journey. Callan [0:05:17]: From being a very high prospect, I think you had got drafted by the reds and you pulled back from that because you thought you'd get drafted higher at a shorter injury that that knocked you out of that. Callan [0:05:29]: Moved into the finance world, and then I remember, you worked for Le and Brothers, Le Brothers was the spot to be before that crash. Chad [0:05:39]: So it wasn't Callan [0:05:41]: And so you get the big finance job, Again, I remember how prestigious Le and brother specifically was, and the crash happened. Callan [0:05:49]: And so that through line, I'm not the relentless, perseverance. Callan [0:05:54]: And so coming back, Speaker_2 [0:05:56]: you know, one of the things Callan [0:05:56]: that I was kinda curious about is what drove that decision to come back to the agency? Callan [0:06:03]: Because it's not like you joined this agency when it was... Callan [0:06:06]: You joined this agency I because I understand it was six people, and three of them were named King. Callan [0:06:10]: Is that correct? Chad [0:06:11]: That's correct. Chad [0:06:12]: Yes. Chad [0:06:12]: Me and mom and dad. Chad [0:06:13]: Yeah. Callan [0:06:14]: What drove that decision? Chad [0:06:16]: I'd like to add one other thing to that previous story if I could the other night, I have a son who is graduating from high school later this month. Chad [0:06:23]: The other night, he was leading to go out with his friends, and I asked him if he'd be home for dinner, And he gave me what I perceived to be sort of about wishy washy answer. Chad [0:06:30]: Yeah. Chad [0:06:31]: Yeah I'll be home for dinner. Chad [0:06:32]: Yeah. Chad [0:06:32]: You know. Chad [0:06:32]: And then he went out... Chad [0:06:33]: Well, it was eight or eight thirty or something like that. Chad [0:06:36]: And he... Chad [0:06:37]: And I'd given up on him coming home for dinner. Chad [0:06:39]: I just figured he was out with his friends. Chad [0:06:41]: Well he comes home and He's hungry. Chad [0:06:44]: And he says, dad what's for dinner, and I said, I didn't think you were coming back for dinner, you know, it's eight thirty. Chad [0:06:49]: I thought you need elsewhere. Chad [0:06:50]: And without missing a beat, says to me, dad, all you got your word. Chad [0:06:54]: I thought. Chad [0:06:56]: Good one. Chad [0:06:57]: So That's that's lesson lives in me and apparently it's made its way to my son. Chad [0:07:03]: So Oh, Callan [0:07:04]: that's a witty answer. Callan [0:07:06]: Yeah. Callan [0:07:07]: I love that. Callan [0:07:08]: That's that's good fantastic too. Callan [0:07:09]: So what was it What drove that to say? Callan [0:07:12]: You know, I'm gonna go join this? Callan [0:07:14]: Was it I'm gonna join this, and I'm gonna grow this thing to be big as possible. Callan [0:07:17]: What was kind of that that decision at that time? Chad [0:07:21]: So I moved out to California. Chad [0:07:23]: I lived in Los Angeles. Chad [0:07:24]: I worked for Le, and even at Le. Chad [0:07:26]: I was doing some entrepreneurial things. Chad [0:07:29]: I suppose I've always had on single bug, and I was doing some real estate ventures and some esoteric real estate things, we can get into that if you like, but maybe that's too much detail for right now. Chad [0:07:39]: And when Le and Brothers dried up, I had a few different options, and I could have worked other places or figured out other things, but then I really thought about what is the best long term decision here, and I felt like what it seemed like at the time was moving back. Chad [0:07:55]: It felt a bit like taking my medicine, You know, saying goodbye to all my friends packing up all my things moving across the country. Chad [0:08:01]: Mh. Chad [0:08:01]: Starting over basically, but that did seem like ten minutes from now, I'm gonna hate this idea. Chad [0:08:06]: Ten years from now. Chad [0:08:07]: I think I'm gonna be really happy with this idea. Chad [0:08:09]: So am I able to view it that way. Chad [0:08:11]: And that's what I decided to do. Chad [0:08:12]: And when I moved back, I didn't know anything at all about insurance. Chad [0:08:16]: So I got my insurance license. Chad [0:08:18]: I got my Cp. Chad [0:08:19]: I started working in the business and learning, how does this work really learning from the ground up? Chad [0:08:25]: But what drove it was a little bit of the entrepreneurial nature within me and working for someone else was going to not be the the ideal fit for me crossed with what is the... Chad [0:08:37]: What's the best long term opportunity here? Callan [0:08:40]: Well, I would say that that bet paid off, if you guys are at a hundred and twenty five million in revenue currently, you were sixty four million at the most recent insurance journal. Callan [0:08:50]: So from the end of twenty twenty four till now that's pretty significant growth for that size. Callan [0:08:56]: Yes. Callan [0:08:56]: And you're over six hundred employees now, that's a lot more than a full hundred times more than when you started, which is pretty impressive by any stretch. Callan [0:09:06]: Chad, one of the areas that I really am excited to dive into specifically is your growth strategy. Callan [0:09:13]: I wanna talk about inorganic, more M and A and then as well as potentially some of the organic, but I think From an inorganic perspective, if you've got a really interesting story. Callan [0:09:22]: In an area where I'd like to start this out, Had heard you say before that your first acquisition strategy was if they have a website, they're too big to acquire. Chad [0:09:34]: Yes. Chad [0:09:34]: That is true. Callan [0:09:35]: Know, and then I think you've got a really interesting story. Callan [0:09:37]: Could you tell me about those first two agencies that you acquired? Chad [0:09:41]: Sure. Chad [0:09:41]: So in twenty, gosh, early twenty fifteen, I decided I would start trying to acquire some agencies, and I didn't have a mentor. Chad [0:09:51]: I didn't have any any feel for how to do this. Chad [0:09:55]: So I was just applying my own common sense to how best to do this and I knew I could get a loan from a, a particular bank, West Bank was the name of the bank. Chad [0:10:05]: I knew that they would loan me money for an acquisition. Chad [0:10:08]: So I started out, honestly spending a lot of time on the phone with the under writers there to learn how to under write alone for an acquisition. Chad [0:10:17]: What are you looking at? Chad [0:10:18]: What are the things that you need? Chad [0:10:19]: Why do you need those things? Chad [0:10:20]: You want the tax returns from the agency? Chad [0:10:23]: Okay. Chad [0:10:23]: What... Chad [0:10:23]: What's on the tax returns that you're looking at? Chad [0:10:25]: Because as I mentioned before? Chad [0:10:27]: I didn't know anything about insurance? Chad [0:10:28]: This is also something else I didn't know but I was able to reach out to a number of people. Chad [0:10:34]: In this case, under reuters at West Bank, and they were all very willing to help me understand how to under underwriting it and my objective was to be as good of an under writer or honestly to be a better under writer than they were. Chad [0:10:49]: So I could get what they need. Chad [0:10:50]: I can under underwriting it myself, I can determine what's a good deal and what's not a good deal. Chad [0:10:54]: And by the time I submitted it to them, this should be a layout for them because it's already under. Chad [0:10:57]: I already have everything they need. Chad [0:10:59]: Whatever questions are gonna have, I've already asked them, I've already got the answer. Chad [0:11:02]: And I could do... Chad [0:11:03]: I could give them exactly what they needed. Chad [0:11:05]: So for no good reason other than whatever I thought common sense looked like. Chad [0:11:11]: I decided if someone had a website, they were too sophisticated and too big, for me to be able to afford them. Chad [0:11:17]: I also figured, you'll never be a hero in your own hometown. Chad [0:11:23]: I once for someone say even Jesus had to move, So I found all of the insurance agencies that were in counties adjacent to my county, but not in my county. Chad [0:11:37]: And then I would Google them and if a website came up, they weren't gonna be a prospect, but if a website did not come up. Chad [0:11:45]: I knew they existed, but I also knew they didn't have a website. Chad [0:11:48]: So then the question is how do you get in touch with these folks and what I assumed was if you're that small, likely the person who owns the place is also the person who's very involved in the day to day operations. Chad [0:11:59]: So I went on different carrier websites like travelers or progressive or whoever, they get a quote page, and I filled up get a quote information, what's my name and my phone number and my email address, and that sort of thing. Chad [0:12:12]: And then in the free form box of where you type in and get a quote. Chad [0:12:16]: I have a ford pickup truck or whatever you're supposed to put in there. Chad [0:12:18]: I would put in there. Chad [0:12:20]: My name Chad King. Chad [0:12:21]: I am King insurance in Gainesville. Chad [0:12:22]: If you're interested in selling your agency. Chad [0:12:25]: I'd love to talk with you about it, and I would just do that over and over and over and over again. Chad [0:12:30]: And since I knew I didn't have a lot of capacity to buy a lot of agencies, I didn't need a lot of yes, One yes, in a year, maybe two in a year would be all I could handle. Chad [0:12:40]: So I did bet for a few months and by March or so, somebody responded and said, yeah, I'm interested. Chad [0:12:47]: And then within a couple of weeks later, a second person also responded to an email I had sent weeks prior. Chad [0:12:54]: So now I had two people that were interested, and I wasn't going to be able to do both of these at the same time. Chad [0:13:00]: I didn't I didn't have that much capability. Chad [0:13:02]: So the first person I went down the normal channels, the under writers at the bank and all of that sort of thing. Chad [0:13:07]: The second person I went to, and I was just honest with her and said, like, here here's the story Here's how we got to where we are. Chad [0:13:14]: I've already agreed with this other person. Chad [0:13:16]: So here's what I can do. Chad [0:13:17]: I can offer you a split of the revenue every dollar that comes in, I'll give you fifty cents, and I'll keep fifty cents, and we'll do that for three years, that'll be one and a half times your revenue. Chad [0:13:26]: And if your revenue grows or shrinks, whatever it looks like it will be one and a half times whatever the revenue is. Chad [0:13:31]: That's all I can do. Chad [0:13:33]: I'm not playing hard ball with you trying to negotiate with you. Chad [0:13:36]: I'm trying to be honest with you and tell you the truth and the truth is, I can't do it any other way. Chad [0:13:40]: And if that doesn't work for you, I understand and I respect that, but that's what I'm able to do. Chad [0:13:45]: And we discussed it and she... Chad [0:13:47]: Her daughter was getting married, and she needed some money, a much smaller amount of money to pay for the wedding. Chad [0:13:53]: And I did have that amount of cash. Chad [0:13:55]: She said, okay. Chad [0:13:56]: If you can write me a check upfront for that amount. Chad [0:13:58]: I can pay for the wedding, and then we'll do the fifty fifty split. Chad [0:14:02]: You got a deal, and I said and then we got a deal. Chad [0:14:04]: And so I ended up closing two transactions within... Chad [0:14:08]: I think it was the same month, maybe one month the next month. Chad [0:14:12]: Basically concurrent, which was an accident serendipity, but that's what got it Started. Chad [0:14:17]: And I closed another one later that year and kept going from there. Callan [0:14:21]: One, I love that it's... Callan [0:14:22]: You see a lot of people bow out when it starts to get a little harder, but it's amazing, even today, you can still get really creative in how you can go about the deal. Callan [0:14:32]: Sometimes you do of, like in the early acquisitions like you have to take a risk. Callan [0:14:36]: You have to probably do something that's gonna be a little abnormal because it's so competitive. Callan [0:14:40]: And it's so difficult. Callan [0:14:41]: And you just may not have the personal assets to be able to put up the loan. Callan [0:14:45]: And I'm not saying that exact structure will work or not work for somebody, but there's different ways I think that you can get creative. Callan [0:14:52]: We've done a ton of acquisitions since then. Speaker_2 [0:14:56]: You know, one of the things Callan [0:14:57]: that I'm curious about is, I've heard you talk about your initial Pe partner. Callan [0:15:02]: And you mentioned specifically, you said when you first met Kevin, who was the the person at the p company, Chad [0:15:08]: From us. Callan [0:15:09]: And you mentioned that when you met Kevin for you, it was obvious for you to work with him. Callan [0:15:17]: Why was that? Callan [0:15:18]: What was it about him specifically that you said, this just makes all the sense. Callan [0:15:22]: I've gotta do this. Chad [0:15:23]: Well, there a variety of things. Chad [0:15:24]: I think the the reason that I chose that word when I was sharing that with you that it was obvious is in my decision making, I'm looking for clarity over confidence. Chad [0:15:37]: I don't wanna be confident this is the right answer I want this to clearly and obviously be the right answer, early on in the M and A process. Chad [0:15:43]: I used to tell people if you need your calculator, it's too close to call. Chad [0:15:47]: This should be so obvious. Chad [0:15:49]: And so clear this is a good decision. Chad [0:15:51]: And those are the only decisions we're going to make. Chad [0:15:53]: And if we need to build a bunch of spreadsheets and cut it back thin, there's too much risk in that. Chad [0:15:58]: Warren Buffett has a saying about, you don't drive a nine thousand pound truck over a ten thousand pound bridge. Chad [0:16:05]: You drive over a twenty thousand pound bridge and give yourself some room in case there's a mistake of some form. Chad [0:16:11]: And that's that's the sort of metrics I was applying. Chad [0:16:14]: With meeting with Kevin Angela at B hms and Tony ra at B hms, what made them the obvious choice for me was a a variety of things, won their track record? Chad [0:16:25]: They have backed four insurance agencies. Chad [0:16:28]: All four of them are top fifty in the country at this point, king being the the fourth and most recent. Chad [0:16:34]: They're very, very good at what they do. Chad [0:16:36]: They are a mile deep in an inch wide. Chad [0:16:39]: And so all of those things were very important, but also they're good people. Chad [0:16:43]: I mean, for me, that's always the metric, but I felt like I I really connected with them and all... Chad [0:16:49]: Through the process, I felt like, these are people I can work with. Chad [0:16:53]: These are people that I trust. Chad [0:16:54]: Invariably, there's gonna come a time when someone thinks we should turn left and someone thinks we should turn right and how do we work this out? Chad [0:17:01]: That's true in any relationship. Chad [0:17:03]: And how how do you work that out is is really for me a big piece of what does the relationship look like? Chad [0:17:09]: And can can we work together or can this work? Chad [0:17:11]: And I haven't never had any kind of issue with either of them ever. Chad [0:17:16]: I mean, there's been time for we disagree on something, and that's that's the way it's supposed to be. Chad [0:17:19]: That's how any relationship works? Chad [0:17:21]: But I don't have anything but nice things to say about Kevin Or Or tony. Chad [0:17:25]: It was great. Chad [0:17:26]: Has been great. Chad [0:17:27]: Still is great. Callan [0:17:29]: What was the point when you said, okay. Callan [0:17:30]: I do need to get an institutional investor? Callan [0:17:33]: As I understand that you were doing this, you were financing these in all sorts of different ways from mortgages, bank notes, seller all, pretty much any of the financing ways that you could do. Callan [0:17:44]: It sound like you would you did it. Chad [0:17:47]: Have done all of those seller finance. Chad [0:17:48]: I still haven't paid off my mother in fact. Chad [0:17:50]: I I still mail her a check on the first of every month. Chad [0:17:53]: King insurance, the original is still not not free and clear. Chad [0:17:56]: Yeah. Chad [0:17:57]: That's between me and. Chad [0:17:58]: But, yeah. Chad [0:17:58]: Seller finance splits with people at mortgage my house don't know them many time. Chad [0:18:01]: More than was lots of time to buy an insurance agency, bank, loans, Sba loans. Chad [0:18:06]: I mean, in anything I could come up with within that margin of safety that I I don't want to be reckless. Chad [0:18:12]: Yeah. Chad [0:18:12]: But, You know, sometimes you you mortgage your house. Chad [0:18:15]: So that's what you kinda do. Chad [0:18:16]: If you want it, if you want it bag enough, you're you'll do what you gotta do. Callan [0:18:21]: And so what was the point when you said, okay. Callan [0:18:24]: I wanna do this? Callan [0:18:25]: I mean, I know there's you know, it sounded like, this is just kind of my theory. Callan [0:18:29]: I'm curious if fit tracks at all or if I'm way off on this. Callan [0:18:32]: It sounded like, from what I've seen or what I've heard in from... Callan [0:18:36]: There's the articles that have been out there. Callan [0:18:37]: It almost feels like This was the piece of the business that you personally really enjoy doing, and it just so happened, it was a great growth strategy. Callan [0:18:48]: Is that fair to say or am I off on that? Chad [0:18:51]: Yes. Chad [0:18:51]: That's fair to say, and I feel like even with these other scenarios that I've described to you, the... Chad [0:18:58]: If you have a website, you're too big for me or the split with the other person, what made those people want to come with me was the connection that I could build with them. Chad [0:19:09]: This is a very emotional transaction for people and I don't think everyone sees it that way. Chad [0:19:15]: This is somebody's life work, but I I lived it with my father and my dad's insurance agency and working their so I have an insight that maybe not everyone does, but I hear people say things like deals. Chad [0:19:26]: They referred to them as deals. Chad [0:19:27]: And I think about, like, when I bought my dad's agency from my dad. Chad [0:19:31]: My dad built it it started at nineteen seventy four sold it to me in twenty the very end last day of twenty thirteen. Chad [0:19:38]: So forty years roughly. Chad [0:19:40]: He sold its me. Chad [0:19:41]: He put forty years of his life into this business. Chad [0:19:44]: He raised his two kids. Chad [0:19:45]: He supported his family, etcetera, etcetera, Like, to refer to that as a deal, it just seems so insensitive. Chad [0:19:50]: I feel like it's there's no bedside manner, the analogy I've given people is, delivering babies, you know, if you're the ob attrition, you know, for you, it's Monday. Chad [0:19:59]: But for this other person that's having a baby. Chad [0:20:01]: This is a day that they will never ever forget. Chad [0:20:03]: They'll have birthdays and, like, they will celebrate this day for the rest of their lives. Chad [0:20:08]: Yeah. Chad [0:20:09]: But for you, the ob. Chad [0:20:10]: It's just Monday. Chad [0:20:11]: You're gonna go to lunch after this, then tonight, you gotta remember stuff by... Chad [0:20:15]: Like, it's just Monday for you. Chad [0:20:16]: But, like, if you can bear in mind, how big of a deal this is to this other person, it can change your side me, and I feel like with those other... Chad [0:20:23]: They were acquisitions. Chad [0:20:25]: That's why I use that word because these folks wanted to walk away and pursue other things. Chad [0:20:28]: So they were selling and it wasn't... Chad [0:20:30]: I wouldn't use the word acquisition in every case. Chad [0:20:32]: But I think building that connection with the sellers in these cases really made all the difference, and it really helped that I had this background. Chad [0:20:43]: I can think of another one that I another agency I purchased in that same county where the first one was, and the connection was the seller went to Florida State. Chad [0:20:52]: Well, my brother and my parents. Chad [0:20:54]: And, you know, they went to Florida State, and they were... Chad [0:20:56]: You know, there was this personal connection outside of take the highest bidder sort of approach, and I've lunch to that to this day. Chad [0:21:02]: We don't we don't win auctions, but we really have that connection with people and it's really valuable to me. Chad [0:21:08]: But what we can talk more about that I suppose it's things unfold, but it really is about the people. Chad [0:21:12]: It really is about connection. Callan [0:21:14]: No. Callan [0:21:14]: I'd love to dive into that. Callan [0:21:15]: How do you do that at this size? Callan [0:21:18]: When I think of those early days make sense. Callan [0:21:21]: Right? Callan [0:21:21]: Because and I'm not undermining it by any means, But you want, like, you will do anything to with the exception of over paying and everything else. Callan [0:21:30]: Right? Callan [0:21:30]: It let's just say all the table stakes stuff are there. Callan [0:21:33]: But you'll do a lot to build that relationship, whatever that might be to get those first couple agencies because that's the kickoff off of your vision. Callan [0:21:42]: Even if you... Callan [0:21:43]: Let's just say sixty, seventy plus acquisitions later, probably more than that. Callan [0:21:47]: How do you maintain that today? Callan [0:21:49]: How do you still maintain that personal feel. Callan [0:21:53]: Because I've heard you talk a lot about this And and how critical people are And you could hear it just when you're saying it right now, but how do you operate that at scale? Callan [0:22:00]: What does that look like? Chad [0:22:02]: Well, I think number one, it's gotta be sincere. Chad [0:22:05]: It's gotta be genuine when you really have to mean it. Chad [0:22:08]: You gotta pay attention. Chad [0:22:09]: But I think all of that comes from, like, really meaning it, really genuinely caring. Chad [0:22:15]: To answer your question more specifically, two weeks ago, I was in Pennsylvania meeting with folks in person ended in New Jersey and the New York, the week before that, I was in New Orleans last week, I was in Nashville. Chad [0:22:27]: So there is an element of the face to face meeting with people, and then there's an element in really taking a genuine interest in them, and I feel like that is a differentiator with king relative to others. Chad [0:22:40]: That's not to imply that King is better than someone else. Chad [0:22:43]: It's just to say it's king is different than someone else. Chad [0:22:46]: So for example, what I met... Chad [0:22:48]: I met with someone recently, and I was reading through their semi beginning to know this person, his best I could reading through the the, the confidential information, memorandum. Chad [0:22:56]: Yep. Chad [0:22:57]: And in there had referenced that his father was a coin collector, and he was a coin collector. Chad [0:23:03]: And a lot of times when you sit down at these dinners, people will want to get into the numbers and the growth strategy and, you know, the multiples and all of that jazz and I sat down and said, tell me about your coin collection. Chad [0:23:14]: Why is that important to you? Chad [0:23:15]: Tell me about how your dad got into that. Chad [0:23:17]: And so we have this whole conversation about coins and coin collecting. Chad [0:23:22]: And I don't know anything about coin collecting. Chad [0:23:24]: So I'm like, I find this very interesting. Chad [0:23:26]: I know nothing about it. Chad [0:23:27]: Teach me about it. Chad [0:23:28]: So he's teaching me about it and telling me all about in the connection to his dad and the coins and important. Chad [0:23:32]: This one coin and that other coin and whatever, but you can really forge this connection, and I feel pretty confident that no one read that and thought, I'm gonna ask about this because I care. Chad [0:23:43]: And whether or not we work together or or whatever that looks like. Chad [0:23:46]: I'm not here to close a deal. Chad [0:23:48]: I'm here to, like, really genuinely sincerely get to know you. Chad [0:23:52]: How do you how do you think and what's important to you and why? Chad [0:23:55]: And it's a connection in a way that I think most people are going to talk about these other things. Chad [0:24:02]: If you, like, go back to the earlier point if someone spent forty years, building this, their whole life and raise their family and all of that sort of thing. Chad [0:24:11]: There's a lot more going on here than what's your revenue and what's your margins and how much is commercial versus personal and much growth rate and Is that really what this is about? Chad [0:24:21]: And Callan [0:24:22]: for me, it's not. Callan [0:24:23]: What drives the clarity in that scenario because, you know, you put a big emphasis on people? Callan [0:24:28]: This is a very people heavy business for sure? Callan [0:24:31]: Mh. Callan [0:24:32]: What makes it clear that they're the right person or group of people from a business that this is one that makes sense for you to partner with. Chad [0:24:44]: Well, it's the people, but what makes it clear. Chad [0:24:46]: So here's one example that happened to me at one time that made it clear this was not the right person. Chad [0:24:51]: We started talking about growing and my history and his history and all this stuff. Chad [0:24:56]: And when we got in a little bit deeper. Chad [0:24:58]: He said, I don't wanna hear a story about beans and Beans stock. Chad [0:25:01]: I wanna talk about money. Chad [0:25:02]: And I thought. Chad [0:25:04]: Okay? Chad [0:25:04]: Well, I'm not your guy, but you'll find your person, but I'm not them. Chad [0:25:09]: And so that's one extreme, and I think there are others where we will talk about what's really important to them. Chad [0:25:15]: And it doesn't have to be about work. Chad [0:25:17]: I just... Chad [0:25:18]: What's important to you or or how... Chad [0:25:20]: One question that I'm fond of asking is what does success look like for you. Chad [0:25:23]: And I'm not talking about money. Chad [0:25:24]: Everything except money. Chad [0:25:25]: What what does success look like for you. Chad [0:25:27]: And people will tell me what success looks like And... Chad [0:25:30]: There's no wrong answer there. Chad [0:25:31]: I just would like to know what it is. Chad [0:25:33]: And sometimes they'll say, well my son works at the agency and I want him to have a career path ahead of him or I want my clients to be taken care of, or I want my staff to be taken care of or or I don't wanna get chopped up. Chad [0:25:45]: I don't wanna be part of some big agency that's gonna chop us up and move us call centers or, you know, whatever that looks like... Chad [0:25:50]: And I'm listening trying to figure out trying to understand what are the priorities for this person? Chad [0:25:56]: And how do we achieve that for them. Chad [0:25:57]: But what I'm looking for is somebody who is really genuinely invested in to building something create together that we can't build alone, and I think there... Chad [0:26:07]: There's a lot of soft elements to that that's not all spreadsheets and numbers. Chad [0:26:11]: One time I met with someone in after I met with him. Chad [0:26:15]: He emailed me a thank you note. Chad [0:26:17]: Well, you... Chad [0:26:18]: That doesn't happen every day, and I thought this... Chad [0:26:20]: He's he's an agency partner now, but that's a really good indication of things, or or I've gotten a a few think. Chad [0:26:26]: You know, it's email version. Chad [0:26:27]: This was like a handwritten and old fashioned Thank you. Chad [0:26:29]: But if someone's... Chad [0:26:30]: If someone is emailing something like that. Chad [0:26:33]: I think it's more indicative of of who they are, though, it's not so much what they do. Chad [0:26:37]: They send a. Chad [0:26:37]: You know who they are kind of a an evaluation and really seem how valuable that connection the personal touch is rather than top bidder sort of approach. Callan [0:26:50]: Yeah. Callan [0:26:50]: I mean, what I'm hearing you say is essentially, you're prioritizing that connection. Callan [0:26:55]: You're... Callan [0:26:56]: You're looking to see if you have a connection Even if it's the... Callan [0:27:00]: Let's use the one example that you mentioned with, you know, just saying, like, I just wanna talk about money. Callan [0:27:04]: Even if that's the best asset that's on the market. Callan [0:27:07]: For you, you're saying that's not gonna fit our culture, maybe it does, honestly, maybe it won't even do that great with us. Callan [0:27:15]: Maybe it's better off going somewhere else and it could do better somewhere else. Callan [0:27:18]: But for us, probably not gonna be a a fit. Callan [0:27:20]: Am I am I right on that? Chad [0:27:22]: The way that I present to make that complex idea more concise. Chad [0:27:26]: I'm looking for patriots. Chad [0:27:27]: Not mercenaries. Chad [0:27:28]: Patriots went worse. Callan [0:27:31]: Yeah. Callan [0:27:31]: Absolutely. Callan [0:27:32]: You know, one of the things I'm curious about is many agencies have had that... Callan [0:27:37]: And I and I think I personally think that a lot of platform agencies get a bad ra. Callan [0:27:42]: More so from the saying, you know, people say, oh, well, this agency is gonna come in and they are gonna get all your people. Callan [0:27:48]: And they're gonna say that they're gonna do all these things. Callan [0:27:50]: And some will for sure. Callan [0:27:52]: There's no question about it. Callan [0:27:54]: And when you're smaller, that's probably a lot easier to have that conversation and to provide confidence that you're not gonna do those things. Callan [0:28:02]: Just because likely, you didn't. Chad [0:28:04]: Mh. Callan [0:28:05]: And as you've reached a much larger scale, how do you provide that confidence that that's not going to happen? Callan [0:28:10]: Mike can hear you. Callan [0:28:11]: You sound very sincere a hundred percent. Callan [0:28:13]: But how do you do that in practice? Chad [0:28:15]: There's a few different ways. Chad [0:28:16]: One, well, I guess, upfront, I connect to them with other agency partners, and they... Chad [0:28:23]: I tell them I'm an open but You can talk to every single one of them, if that's what you want. Chad [0:28:26]: He can talk to as many of them as you would like, and I'll connect you with them directly, and then the two of you can speak in private without me around. Chad [0:28:32]: And ask your honest questions. Chad [0:28:34]: What was it like? Chad [0:28:35]: What's integration like, did they keep your staff? Chad [0:28:37]: You know, I don't know whatever question you have, Ask it, and you can ask it of a whole bunch of people. Chad [0:28:43]: As I said, You can ask it to every single one of them if that's what you'd like, no secret. Chad [0:28:46]: So that's that's one way. Chad [0:28:48]: Two, we have an annual gathering every year, and we just had one in Nashville last week, and I invite our agency partners. Chad [0:28:57]: We we also have a video company there, and we record these testimonials. Chad [0:29:00]: And they're asked to speak, and they're asked these questions. Chad [0:29:04]: What was the integration like? Chad [0:29:05]: How about your staff? Chad [0:29:06]: Has your staff stuck around? Chad [0:29:08]: If you could do it over again. Chad [0:29:09]: Would you? Chad [0:29:09]: What's the best thing? Chad [0:29:11]: Give me a success story? Chad [0:29:12]: You wrote some account you wouldn't have otherwise written because King has some expertise or whatever? Chad [0:29:16]: But this is from their own mouth, but these just stack up, and I've created this video and I'll share it with sellers to say, here's a bunch of people speaking on these exact topics. Chad [0:29:25]: Did we give them the resources I told you that we would and is their staff still there? Chad [0:29:29]: Are they writing accounts they wouldn't otherwise write? Chad [0:29:31]: How's the stock performing? Chad [0:29:33]: What's the culture like? Chad [0:29:34]: You, does the other shoe drop at some point and everybody's mean to you or something like that? Chad [0:29:38]: So there's this video upfront offering that, but then also, you can talk to that exact person who send us, maybe they changed their mind since they recorded that. Chad [0:29:46]: So let's call them. Chad [0:29:47]: I ask them. Chad [0:29:48]: You can ask them right now. Chad [0:29:49]: That's two, and then three, I stay in touch with these people. Chad [0:29:52]: I had two calls just today with two different agency partners, and I have a regular cadence with all of them. Chad [0:29:59]: And the agenda very simple. Chad [0:30:01]: How's it going? Chad [0:30:02]: Is there anything I can do for you? Chad [0:30:04]: And sometimes they do have some challenge and they wanna talk about, hey I've asked about this thing and no one's gotten back to me or whatever. Chad [0:30:09]: And other times they say everything's great? Chad [0:30:11]: I don't have any complaints at all. Chad [0:30:13]: But from my perspective, when we close is not the finish line. Chad [0:30:17]: That's the starting line. Chad [0:30:17]: At the beginning of our relationship together, and I want us to have that. Chad [0:30:21]: I want us to have that relationship, and I want them to have my cell phone, text me call me, email me whatever if if there's some reason that your blood pressure's is going up, let me know. Chad [0:30:30]: I'm your biggest fan. Chad [0:30:32]: Nobody wants to see you succeed more than I do. Chad [0:30:34]: So if I can do something to help you, let me know. Chad [0:30:36]: I want to help you. Chad [0:30:37]: Your success is my success. Chad [0:30:39]: My success is your success. Chad [0:30:40]: It's all the same thing. Chad [0:30:41]: So let me know what I can do. Callan [0:30:44]: Yeah. Callan [0:30:44]: So putting a huge emphasis on that feedback loop. Callan [0:30:47]: And transparency. Callan [0:30:47]: I mean, Love the idea of what you mentioned you know, talk with any of these partners. Callan [0:30:51]: Me not on the call, you talk to them, get the raw answer to help kinda call many fears that might happen as a result of selling to a bigger agency as opposed to, know, selling local. Callan [0:31:05]: And it's not that you... Callan [0:31:05]: They couldn't sell local and not have the staff be like, Probably less likely as a whole, but doesn't mean it can happen for sure. Chad [0:31:14]: I think the balance I tried to strike is, yes, you can sell local to the local person but I... Chad [0:31:20]: I'm not the guy that went to the the Ivy league school, and then got a job in a big city, and I work in a tall building, and I'm gonna tell you how to do it. Chad [0:31:28]: I'm the guy who was the receptionist. Chad [0:31:30]: And then I was an account manager, and then I was an agent, and I filled out forms and I've made cold calls and I've gotten stood up on appointments. Chad [0:31:37]: And I've called someone say your claims not covered. Chad [0:31:39]: Whatever it is. Chad [0:31:40]: Somebody does. Chad [0:31:41]: I've done it. Chad [0:31:42]: I've done a lot of it every single person in your office. Chad [0:31:44]: I have a great deal of respect for what they do because I have sat in their desk. Chad [0:31:48]: I have done their job. Chad [0:31:48]: And that... Chad [0:31:50]: That's a different type of a connection than someone who used to be a big executive at some big company or they went to the right school, and now they're in a tall building in a big city and they're gonna tell you how to do it. Chad [0:32:00]: But they've never done it. Chad [0:32:01]: They've never made a cold call. Chad [0:32:02]: They've never been an account manager and filled out an accord. Chad [0:32:05]: They've never been the receptionist and gotten yelled at about something or I've done all of those things. Speaker_2 [0:32:10]: You know, to that point, one Callan [0:32:12]: of the things I'm curious about is You did start at the the ground floor, and you built this into a very large business. Callan [0:32:19]: What were some of those things that what how did you have to evolve as a leader to be the to continue to be the right leader for the business as it's scaled. Callan [0:32:31]: Because often times are almost two totally different profiles as you're much bigger and much smaller Chad [0:32:38]: At least to. Chad [0:32:38]: Yeah. Callan [0:32:39]: Yeah. Callan [0:32:39]: So you said at least two, What are those what are those to you? Callan [0:32:42]: What are those stage gates? Chad [0:32:44]: Oh, gosh. Chad [0:32:45]: In the beginning, it's a lot of doing. Chad [0:32:48]: The answer to your problems is make more cold calls and go on more appointments and write more insurance business. Chad [0:32:53]: And then as you grow, that's not the answer anymore. Chad [0:32:57]: I feel like one thing I have learned is if you're successful today, that means that you know what you used to need to do to be successful. Chad [0:33:04]: But this is constantly evolving. Chad [0:33:06]: So... Chad [0:33:07]: Yeah. Chad [0:33:07]: One time, it was going more appointments to write more accounts, than it was start hiring people and training them. Chad [0:33:13]: And then it was start hiring people to train the other people that they're now gonna hire, and and you keep, like, putting yourself out of a job is is one way of putting it, but you're evolving to the next thing so that other people can take on the other things and then refining it to where you're doing less and less and less. Chad [0:33:32]: I think that's how I would describe it, but I think there's also a difference between knowing which way to go and then actually going that way or or driving the bus versus knowing which way the bus should be going. Chad [0:33:47]: Those are two different things, and I feel like for me, my pro preliminary has been towards the the vision of this, What should this look like where should we be going and other people can are better candidly at driving the bus. Chad [0:34:01]: Executing on the plan, getting as to where it is we need to go, but that's a different still set than which way do we go, even if you know how to how to go, you don't know where to go. Chad [0:34:11]: Does that make sense? Callan [0:34:13]: Yeah, it makes it makes complete sets. Callan [0:34:14]: So I'm actually curious. Callan [0:34:15]: Was there anything as you moved into this role and we're continuing to grow as a as a business? Callan [0:34:22]: Was there anything that you struggled to kinda give up that you had to stop doing in order to you're laughing. Callan [0:34:29]: So I'm excited to hear it. Callan [0:34:30]: What was kinda of like the main thing that you said, I I've gotta get. Callan [0:34:33]: I have to stop doing this. Callan [0:34:34]: Even though you may not even want to? Chad [0:34:37]: I think what what was tough for me is with those connections with the people. Chad [0:34:40]: Sometimes as you grow, you have to let go of some stuff and clients, for example I used to have a book of business. Chad [0:34:47]: I was a producer. Chad [0:34:48]: Well, as the business has evolved, I can't take phone calls about someone's upset about their bill or their claim or their audit or whatever, and that was tough because I I really do care about those people, and Really do want them to Callan [0:35:01]: do well. Callan [0:35:01]: I would put them Chad [0:35:02]: in good hands and say this person can take care of you, and if things get sideways, you know, let me know, but I don't think that's gonna happen. Chad [0:35:08]: I think you're gonna be in good hands of this person, but that was difficult for me. Chad [0:35:12]: And I think as I came up, I was so involved in everything, even, like, in the M and A stories we talked out with the... Chad [0:35:20]: If you have a website, you're too big of that kind of thing. Chad [0:35:22]: After I would generate the opportunity, then I'm in the middle of underwriting it. Chad [0:35:29]: Then after that, I'm I'm the one sourcing the attorney. Chad [0:35:32]: I'm reading over all the legal documents to make sure that they're consistent with what the handshake agreement was that this was in the days before we were doing before I was doing letters of intense. Chad [0:35:41]: And then getting out of that and letting someone else read the legal documents and, you know, you're the attorney, and so I'm the trust that you got this. Chad [0:35:48]: Or the private equity sponsor whoever it is, but getting out Callan [0:35:52]: of that and just more thirty thousand fee. Callan [0:35:55]: Well, kinda ties back to something you said earlier, now I'm super curious about it. Callan [0:35:59]: You mentioned that it was for you, Like, when you did find you know, you kinda of found that zone of genius. Callan [0:36:04]: Like, this was your area... Callan [0:36:06]: Like, you were uniquely good at M and A. Callan [0:36:09]: And you and it gave you energy. Callan [0:36:11]: It gave you energy. Callan [0:36:12]: You were good at it. Callan [0:36:13]: It was a very high leverage activity. Callan [0:36:14]: So it's, you know, kind of the perfect Gold lock zone How much did things change when you really started to put all of your time in that area personally and let go of some of those other areas to things start to really roll at that point where other things that were needed to be in place before that happened? Chad [0:36:33]: Things started to really roll... Chad [0:36:34]: Roll that point. Chad [0:36:35]: We we have a great team. Chad [0:36:36]: We've always had a great team and even back in, say, twenty fourteen, twenty fifteen. Chad [0:36:41]: We had a really good team. Chad [0:36:43]: And maybe all of those people or many of those people are still with us. Chad [0:36:47]: Today. Chad [0:36:48]: Certainly, the the top performers out of that group are with us today for sure. Chad [0:36:52]: And all of that always comes back to the people, and I think it really comes back to the connection. Chad [0:36:57]: But I'll tell you, Colin, I had a lot of help from a lot of people, and I think an element of it was having the humility to ask for the help to be honest to call that under underwater at West field Bank and say, teach me how to do this? Chad [0:37:10]: What are you looking at? Chad [0:37:11]: Why are you looking at? Chad [0:37:11]: What difference does this make But when I first moved back to Florida, I picked out some of the largest most successful insurance agencies in Florida, and I would call them. Chad [0:37:20]: I mean, this happened. Chad [0:37:21]: I can probably think of five or six of these were King was maybe a million of revenue or something like that, and I was calling agencies that were ten million twenty million of revenue and saying, hi. Chad [0:37:32]: You don't know me. Chad [0:37:33]: My name Chad King. Chad [0:37:34]: I own this little agency in Gainesville. Chad [0:37:35]: You've never heard of us. Chad [0:37:37]: I'd like to come visit you, and I'd like to ask You guys a whole bunch of questions. Chad [0:37:42]: How do you handle renewal? Chad [0:37:43]: How do you hire people what metrics do you have in place for salespeople people. Chad [0:37:47]: How do you just... Chad [0:37:48]: I mean, I had pages of questions. Chad [0:37:49]: And I will tell you a hundred percent of the people said, yeah, No problem, and they made time for me. Chad [0:37:55]: And I forged these relationships in these friendships with these people in Florida, and it was just me asking for help and people saying, yeah, we'll help you, and they did. Chad [0:38:04]: And I can tell you I have had that over and over again whether it was with those folks With with the private equity with Kevin and and Tony, B hms, the private equity sponsor, our first private equity sponsor, we had no business getting private equity money. Chad [0:38:18]: We were about four million dollars of top line revenue at that time, maybe not even that much three point something. Chad [0:38:24]: You probably need to be what people tell me is twenty million twenty five million, something, like I mean, on the on the bottom bottom end. Chad [0:38:31]: Yeah. Chad [0:38:32]: We're a tiny fraction of that. Chad [0:38:34]: Twenty percent, not even twenty percent of that. Chad [0:38:36]: But It never occurred me that I couldn't do it, and no one told me that that you have to be that big. Chad [0:38:41]: So I didn't know any better, but I just went and I tried, and I talked to Tony. Chad [0:38:45]: And I talked to Kevin, and and others, and Tony Kevin with the obvious choice, but I just... Chad [0:38:51]: I really believe, and I had a great deal of success with being humble, working hard, doing your best, telling the truth. Chad [0:38:58]: Candidly, it's, like things that require no talent. Chad [0:39:01]: You don't need any talent to be on time or have a good attitude or do your very best. Chad [0:39:05]: Your best might be better than my best but it's still my best, and there's no reason I can't do my best or tell truth or be on time or have a good attitude to be coach or, like, there's all of these things you can do with no talent. Chad [0:39:17]: And I feel like that has served me so well. Chad [0:39:20]: And I think it comes back to wanting it. Chad [0:39:23]: Honestly, it comes back Callan [0:39:24]: to that story about my dad and and the law and mowing the lawn Chad [0:39:27]: that, like, if you really want it, you can do it and even if it's raining and even if you don't have gas and even if a million things, like, you really want this. Chad [0:39:34]: You can do it and you can do it with a good attitude, and you can do a good job and you don't need talent for that. Callan [0:39:40]: You know, Ice funny. Callan [0:39:41]: I normally ask a question of, if you could look back and have a conversation with your younger self what would that conversation be, probably just answer that to the t. Callan [0:39:50]: So I don't not gonna make a redundant. Callan [0:39:53]: That's that again. Callan [0:39:54]: You one of the things I am curious about though, is, and this will be the question. Callan [0:39:58]: Last question I asked to wrap it up. Callan [0:40:00]: You've grown this significantly. Callan [0:40:02]: I think it's probably fair to say. Callan [0:40:05]: You've had a recap event. Callan [0:40:07]: So yeah. Callan [0:40:07]: It's not like you're doing this for money at this point. Callan [0:40:10]: You've probably made the last dollar you've ever spent. Chad [0:40:12]: I never was. Chad [0:40:13]: Cow. Chad [0:40:13]: I think that's that's another thing. Chad [0:40:15]: I never was. Chad [0:40:16]: I don't mean to hijack your story, but I never was doing it for the money. Callan [0:40:20]: No, Plea... Callan [0:40:20]: I mean, please do. Callan [0:40:21]: And well, one of the things I'm curious about is then, let's even say that. Callan [0:40:25]: Right? Callan [0:40:26]: Okay. Callan [0:40:26]: Made the last star you've ever spent. Callan [0:40:27]: Don't care about money doesn't even matter. Callan [0:40:29]: You've had a significant impact on a lot of people's lives. Callan [0:40:32]: You've talked about with that with the testimonials and everything else, so that's been validated. Callan [0:40:35]: Oh, you look over the next ten years? Callan [0:40:38]: What are you doing? Callan [0:40:39]: What is it that's driving you over the next ten years? Callan [0:40:42]: What is this gonna look like in ten years for you personally? Chad [0:40:46]: What does my life personally look like over the next ten years? Callan [0:40:49]: Yeah. Callan [0:40:49]: What is your life? Callan [0:40:50]: What is, like, you're involvement within the business or whatever that might be? Callan [0:40:52]: What is it? Chad [0:40:53]: I would love to stay involved in the business? Chad [0:40:55]: I tell people that all the time. Chad [0:40:56]: I'm forty nine years old. Chad [0:40:58]: So God willing. Chad [0:40:59]: I'm not going anywhere. Chad [0:41:00]: Yeah. Chad [0:41:01]: I don't wanna go anywhere. Chad [0:41:02]: I would likely remain out of the weeds, but I love our team. Chad [0:41:09]: I love our agency partners, I like meeting with people, if we find the right partners, we really really can build something great together. Chad [0:41:17]: If that's the focus. Chad [0:41:19]: If the focus is building something great together, the the patriots versus mercenaries sort of approach. Chad [0:41:24]: But if we can if we can gather a bunch of patriots to really want to build something great. Chad [0:41:28]: And that's the focus of it is to build this great culture, opportunities for people. Chad [0:41:33]: I mean, the money will come and and every... Chad [0:41:36]: That's important not to some degree to everyone, and we all have a budget and have bills and have to buy groceries and things like that. Chad [0:41:41]: That's fine. Chad [0:41:41]: Pay But if if we really can stick with that culture, it's so great. Chad [0:41:46]: It's so rewarding, and we're attracting more and more good people. Chad [0:41:49]: We just added by Christian to our Board of directors, Mike started risk strategies years ago. Chad [0:41:55]: Mike's a great guy. Chad [0:41:57]: I'm really happy he's on our board, but he's not doing it for the money. Chad [0:42:01]: He's doing it because this is where he wants to be, and how do you attract more great people who are doing it like that for the right reasons and wanna build something great. Chad [0:42:09]: And it's not about making more money. Chad [0:42:13]: And that'll take care of itself. Chad [0:42:14]: But I think I'd love to to remain involved indefinitely for forever candidly and keep building something great that we can all be proud of. Chad [0:42:22]: We can all enjoy and we all have a lot of fun together. Chad [0:42:24]: Being being surrounded by great people. Chad [0:42:26]: It's better than that. Callan [0:42:28]: I think that is the absolute perfect place to wrap. Callan [0:42:31]: The passion is so clear, and I think it's awesome. Callan [0:42:35]: So Chad, thanks for coming on today. Callan [0:42:37]: This was a lot of fun. Chad [0:42:38]: Thank you so much, Callhan. Chad [0:42:39]: I appreciate your time. Callan [0:42:40]: Yeah. Callan [0:42:40]: A hundred percent.