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Can Cardinals close out their surprising first half? · Cardinal Territory: A St. Louis Cardinals Podcast

0:04
Speaker 1: Welcome back to the Cardinals territory. It's Friday, July eleventh.
0:07
Speaker 1: There is one series left before the All Star Break.
0:12
Speaker 1: Time flies when you are having fun. Katie and Bernie
0:15
Speaker 1: back at you for this Friday edition. The Cardinals won
0:19
Speaker 1: a pivotal series over the Washington Nationals on Thursday behind
0:24
Speaker 1: five and two third scoreless sittings from Miles Michaelis and
0:27
Speaker 1: a sixth or excuse me, a five spot in the
0:29
Speaker 1: sixth sitting, and the offense really came to life against
0:31
Speaker 1: that Nets bullpen. All around, a good win for the Cardinals.
0:35
Speaker 1: They really needed it. Bernie, what's your look on the
0:39
Speaker 1: team coming into the final series?
0:41
Speaker 2: I think, listen, before the week started, I spent they've
0:44
Speaker 2: gone through a rough stretch. They've gotten that road trip
0:48
Speaker 2: in Pittsburgh and Chicago and Invergreedy. I'm never saying, well,
0:54
Speaker 2: you got to sweep this team or do that, but
0:56
Speaker 2: I said, just went four out of the next six
0:59
Speaker 2: before the Star break, and then it'll it'll it'll stabilize things,
1:02
Speaker 2: it'll level things out a little, You'll feel better about
1:05
Speaker 2: yourself and when you go get a break at the
1:07
Speaker 2: Star break. So one down. They they did win two
1:11
Speaker 2: out of three. I think, listen, Atlanta, you never can
1:15
Speaker 2: say that they're going to stay in the same type
1:17
Speaker 2: of month that they're in. But they they are really
1:20
Speaker 2: really bad here lately, and I think their last eleven
1:24
Speaker 2: games are averaging three runs. They've lost eight times. My
1:26
Speaker 2: point is that, to say the least, the Braves are
1:30
Speaker 2: very beatable. In fact, the Braves, the Braves record is
1:34
Speaker 2: not all that different than the Nationals record. So the
1:37
Speaker 2: Cardinals I fully expect that they should handle this series
1:41
Speaker 2: by winning. I mean, come on, you know, it's it's
1:44
Speaker 2: a little bit of a low bar. I think the
1:46
Speaker 2: Atlanta name is such an name brand. There's like this assumption,
1:50
Speaker 2: even with us in the media, there's this assumption that
1:53
Speaker 2: they're better than they are. I mean, and they're really
1:55
Speaker 2: not good. So I so the Cardinals should.
1:59
Speaker 1: Win by injury. But you're right, it's the brand, it's
2:03
Speaker 1: the name. The Braves have been such a powerhouse in
2:05
Speaker 1: the National League for so long you just kind of
2:07
Speaker 1: have a little bit of pause because you think, well,
2:10
Speaker 1: still the Braves. And I remember in April, which feels
2:12
Speaker 1: years ago, the Braves were off to a horrific start
2:15
Speaker 1: and then they spanked the Cardinals at Truest Park and
2:18
Speaker 1: we were like, oh, so I said it on our
2:21
Speaker 1: show a couple of days ago. I felt like this
2:24
Speaker 1: National series, this rubber match, was a must win game.
2:26
Speaker 1: You simply cannot drop a series to the Nationals, and
2:30
Speaker 1: based on where the Cardinals are right now, you certainly
2:33
Speaker 1: like them to take two a free at least from
2:35
Speaker 1: the Braves. You'll see Matthew livertore tonight, Eric Fetti on Saturday.
2:39
Speaker 1: We will get to that, and Sunny Gray will take
2:42
Speaker 1: the final star on Sunday. Heading into the All Star break,
2:45
Speaker 1: Bernie and I have a lot of things to break down,
2:47
Speaker 1: but first we also tell you guys about a fun
2:50
Speaker 1: little giveaway we have going on. All right, we have
2:57
Speaker 1: a great giveaway going on right now in our chat
3:00
Speaker 1: BCC group chat thinking o ball prove it our trivia.
3:04
Speaker 1: Prove it in our trivia game for our shot at
3:06
Speaker 1: winning an authentic MLB jersey of your choice worth up
3:10
Speaker 1: to four hundred dollars. Here's how to enter. One sign
3:14
Speaker 1: up at foul Territory dot Chat, Two, play trivia, crush it,
3:20
Speaker 1: and you win. We're picking one winner from the top
3:23
Speaker 1: scores at random. Deadline is July thirteenth, that's Sunday at
3:28
Speaker 1: eleven pm Eastern time. So get in there, play, win
3:34
Speaker 1: and brag again. That's chat BCC. Well, let's chat. Let's
3:39
Speaker 1: chat about Eric Fetti, who will take his scheduled start
3:43
Speaker 1: Saturday against the Braves. Cardinals manager Ali Marble made that
3:46
Speaker 1: announcement on Thursday before the eight to two win. And
3:51
Speaker 1: I will preface this conversation with just because Allie Marmal
3:53
Speaker 1: is the one making the announcement doesn't mean he's the
3:56
Speaker 1: one making the decision here at all. And Bernie, I
4:03
Speaker 1: thought you guys at the Gas House Gang on Tuesday
4:05
Speaker 1: did a really nice job in getting kind of where
4:08
Speaker 1: Allie Marmal thinks about this situation. He can't go out
4:12
Speaker 1: and say what he thinks, all right, because this is
4:15
Speaker 1: so clearly a decision coming from above him and his
4:18
Speaker 1: job is to manage the players that he has been given. Clearly,
4:22
Speaker 1: the front office has decided that Earfetti is going to
4:24
Speaker 1: take that start. And I'll be able to provide you
4:25
Speaker 1: a little bit more context later in the segment. But
4:28
Speaker 1: if I'm looking at Hallowey's find this so sure that's
4:31
Speaker 1: how I just deleted you. Where'd you go?
4:34
Speaker 2: Oh, at least at least I'm small. I lost weight.
4:37
Speaker 2: That's great.
4:38
Speaker 1: Yeah, so small. In this episode of the Gash House Gang,
4:41
Speaker 1: which you can find on the kmox YouTube channel, you'll
4:43
Speaker 1: hear Bernie and Friends. I think Tom Ackerman is on
4:47
Speaker 1: that show The Three of You with your weekly assessment
4:52
Speaker 1: with Alie marmal and it's clear the frustration here on
4:56
Speaker 1: Ericfetti taking the start with Michael McGreevey still waiting in TRIPA.
5:01
Speaker 1: I can't point with the video, but I highly encourage
5:04
Speaker 1: you all to check it out after this podcast because
5:06
Speaker 1: you'll see some insight as to how the manager feels.
5:09
Speaker 1: But let's talk about the organization standpoint all around. We
5:14
Speaker 1: know that the Cardinals are kind of straddling in the
5:17
Speaker 1: events that they're going to be buyers or sellers, and
5:19
Speaker 1: that will ultimately come down to quite possibly the final
5:23
Speaker 1: week or even the final seventy two hours before the deadline.
5:26
Speaker 1: There's a story up on The Athletic with myself and
5:28
Speaker 1: Patrick Mooney talking about how the Cardinals are from the
5:30
Speaker 1: only team in that mix. So this is not a
5:32
Speaker 1: Saint Louis specific problem. We're seeing this industry wide. Eric
5:35
Speaker 1: Fetti is the player that you can trade regardless if
5:39
Speaker 1: you're buying or selling. And the organizations line of thinking,
5:42
Speaker 1: according to multiple people that I've talked to in the organization,
5:46
Speaker 1: is that by not pitching him, the counter argument, the
5:49
Speaker 1: obvious one, is well, Eric Fetty lately has not really
5:52
Speaker 1: had a lot of trade value because the performance has
5:54
Speaker 1: not been great at all. I believe he's about seventeen
5:57
Speaker 1: earned runs in his last three starts. Those three starts
6:00
Speaker 1: have spanned nine total ends, which is not very competitive.
6:04
Speaker 1: But the Cardinals would like to trade Fetti because when
6:07
Speaker 1: you think about the trade deadline, Bernie, what is the
6:09
Speaker 1: most area that's coveted the highest at the deadline, it's
6:12
Speaker 1: starting pitching. And the thought process is because the pitching market,
6:17
Speaker 1: the trade market in general, is so thin right now
6:19
Speaker 1: and so undefined, the Cardinals could be capitalized and find
6:24
Speaker 1: someone who thinks that they can take a shot a
6:26
Speaker 1: lottery ticket at Fetty in the second half, similar to
6:29
Speaker 1: what the Cardinals did last year, and hope that they
6:31
Speaker 1: can trade for him. Their philosophy is, you can't trade
6:33
Speaker 1: him if he's not pitching, So that's why he's starting Saturday,
6:36
Speaker 1: and they'll hope that they've been able to figure some
6:38
Speaker 1: things out of the last week and to use all
6:40
Speaker 1: in Marminals words come out on the other side of this, Bernie,
6:43
Speaker 1: your thoughts.
6:44
Speaker 2: Well, number one, I really don't know what kind of
6:49
Speaker 2: trade value he has left, if any. Now to your point, Yeah,
6:53
Speaker 2: they're hoping to catch lightning in a bottle. They hope
6:55
Speaker 2: that he has a couple of starts before the All
6:57
Speaker 2: Star break or excuse me, before the trade deadline where
7:00
Speaker 2: he looks good, like he kind of pulls the Miles
7:02
Speaker 2: Michael list, like Miles pulled against the Nationals. So all
7:05
Speaker 2: of a sudden, it's like, whoa what who is this guy?
7:08
Speaker 2: You know? So all of a sudden, my I mean,
7:10
Speaker 2: Miles was brilliant last night. So they're hoping the same
7:12
Speaker 2: thing will happen with Fetty, and then some teams that
7:14
Speaker 2: are desperate will, like all of a sudden, have more
7:16
Speaker 2: enthusiasm about getting Fetty. But yeah, I got so much
7:20
Speaker 2: to say on this, I have to be quick with
7:21
Speaker 2: every point. So that's number one. That's number one. I
7:24
Speaker 2: understand what they're thinking, but I also want to say, well,
7:27
Speaker 2: good luck with that, because his value is way way
7:32
Speaker 2: way down. So you're basically hoping for a miracle that
7:35
Speaker 2: will entice a team to give you something for him, like,
7:38
Speaker 2: you know, the idea that they may get some marginal
7:41
Speaker 2: prospector to where you're like, so what I mean that
7:45
Speaker 2: that's nothing. It's nothing that's really going to help them.
7:48
Speaker 2: I mean it's a tremendous long shot, but nothing. Well,
7:51
Speaker 2: I don't think they're gonna get anything of consequence. So
7:54
Speaker 2: that's number one, and so number Even though I understand
7:56
Speaker 2: the thinking, I just think it's it's it's just a
7:59
Speaker 2: little bit. What's the point if he has no value?
8:03
Speaker 2: Right right?
8:04
Speaker 1: It's the same line thinking from this front office that
8:07
Speaker 1: we've seen for four years, and I guess looks on
8:10
Speaker 1: us if we thought it was going to be any
8:12
Speaker 1: different in the final year. But it's that's the word
8:14
Speaker 1: I've been using.
8:15
Speaker 2: It's a state and then the other I'm sorry, yeah
8:18
Speaker 2: we said, And then it's just I'm really frustrated by
8:21
Speaker 2: this because I was one of the people. And I'm
8:23
Speaker 2: not bragging because I mean, the man, there were there
8:24
Speaker 2: were so many cardinals, fans and other media people whatever.
8:27
Speaker 2: It's like value, you know, the idea. You know, they
8:30
Speaker 2: got Feeddi last year and their intentions were good because
8:33
Speaker 2: he was really terrific for the White Sucks. And that's
8:36
Speaker 2: the point. When he got to the Cardinals, he was tired.
8:39
Speaker 2: And his first month with the Cardinals he did not
8:41
Speaker 2: pitch all that great. He was good in September, but
8:43
Speaker 2: it was too late. But the time to trade Federi
8:45
Speaker 2: Fetti was last winter and to try and by trading
8:49
Speaker 2: him last winter, who who knows what you may have
8:52
Speaker 2: come up with, right, you may have come up with
8:54
Speaker 2: somebody who could have been in the picture to be
8:59
Speaker 2: a decent day starter or what, and you would have
9:02
Speaker 2: opened a slot for McGreevy. And McGreevy I'm going to
9:04
Speaker 2: say McGreevy was ready to pitch in the major leagues
9:07
Speaker 2: this year going into the So so mo bothers me
9:13
Speaker 2: with this because it was, first of all, it was
9:15
Speaker 2: his decision. There's no question.
9:17
Speaker 1: No one's say it, but we know we don't even
9:19
Speaker 1: want to say it. This is a John Mozela and
9:21
Speaker 1: company decision.
9:22
Speaker 2: Right, And so he he missed, He missed a grand
9:24
Speaker 2: opportunity to trade Vetti when Fetty's value was really high.
9:30
Speaker 2: How high maybe it is debatable, but it certainly was
9:33
Speaker 2: a lot higher than it is now. So he missed
9:35
Speaker 2: an opportunity and instead of just sort of putting winning
9:39
Speaker 2: right now first, because fetty this year that the Cardinals
9:42
Speaker 2: have lost thirteen out of his eighteen starts, they've lost
9:44
Speaker 2: eight out of his last ten starts. Katie, I'm not
9:48
Speaker 2: going to bore you or anyone with the numbers. I'll
9:49
Speaker 2: put him in my column on the right later today.
9:51
Speaker 2: It is unbelievable the way left handed hitters have destroyed him.
9:55
Speaker 2: Right So he's kind of a defenseless pitcher right now.
9:59
Speaker 2: And you know my frustration with this, and what I
10:02
Speaker 2: guess it's a first guess about this is like, well,
10:05
Speaker 2: wait a minute, now, you set it up as a
10:10
Speaker 2: runway season, but yet you're straddling the line. You know,
10:13
Speaker 2: it's like, well this is a runway season. Well, okay,
10:16
Speaker 2: that means you're kind of writing off you're not going
10:18
Speaker 2: to win this show. Oh no, no, no, no, we think
10:19
Speaker 2: we can win. Well. The state of the Cardinals right
10:22
Speaker 2: now is this mcgravy checks both boxes. He's a runway guy,
10:28
Speaker 2: and he's a better pitcher than Eric Fetti. He's a
10:31
Speaker 2: better pitcher than the guy who when he has started
10:34
Speaker 2: the team has lost thirteen out of eighteen games, so
10:37
Speaker 2: he fits both categories. He helps you win, which they claim
10:40
Speaker 2: they want, and he's also he fits into the to
10:43
Speaker 2: the runway concept, yet he's blocked in Memphis. And then
10:47
Speaker 2: you made me laugh the athletic with your quote the
10:49
Speaker 2: way you edited that story Sunday night, Monday morning whenever
10:54
Speaker 2: it went up, and I know all your readers loved
10:56
Speaker 2: it too, where you you know, said, you know, Mozaeic
10:59
Speaker 2: was face saying, you know, he's really good, but uh,
11:03
Speaker 2: you know he's he's we don't have a spot for him,
11:06
Speaker 2: as if like it it was was someone else's responsibility
11:10
Speaker 2: to open the slot. Right, Well, wait a minute, dude,
11:13
Speaker 2: you run this thing. You're the one that determines if
11:16
Speaker 2: there's a spot. It's like, it's not like, well, what
11:19
Speaker 2: can we do there's not a spot for him? Well
11:22
Speaker 2: that's because that's your decision.
11:24
Speaker 1: And that meme from Parks and rec where the guy's
11:26
Speaker 1: in the hot dogs suit and he's like we're all
11:28
Speaker 1: trying to figure out who did this. That isn't bad
11:30
Speaker 1: what I thought about and that oh yeah, that's funny laughing,
11:34
Speaker 1: So yeah, I got it.
11:35
Speaker 2: So, I mean, I hate to say this, it's harsh,
11:37
Speaker 2: but I said it in a video I did on
11:40
Speaker 2: my own earlier today. But it's like Mo's ego is
11:43
Speaker 2: in the way here, you know, because moment for a
11:45
Speaker 2: guy who wants to see his team win. And by
11:47
Speaker 2: the way, this is a ridiculous situation for any manager
11:50
Speaker 2: to be in, you know, where he has to every day, Well,
11:53
Speaker 2: what's it is our priority winning this game? Or do
11:56
Speaker 2: I have to do or or wait a minute, I
11:58
Speaker 2: got well, I got to take care of the run
12:00
Speaker 2: or like what there's no clearly defined mission and so
12:05
Speaker 2: Ali Marvel is just kind of like, okay, what which
12:08
Speaker 2: way do we go tonight? It's a terrible situation for
12:11
Speaker 2: manager me. And that's why it pains me to see
12:12
Speaker 2: Cardinals fans pile on this guy. And the other thing
12:16
Speaker 2: that really ticked me off yesterday because Ali made the announcement,
12:19
Speaker 2: because hey, hello, when managers meet with the media before
12:23
Speaker 2: the games, they're the ones who speak for the organization
12:26
Speaker 2: about a decision that's just been made. But I but
12:30
Speaker 2: I even saw a couple of comments under your story
12:32
Speaker 2: about this. Well he's see he's most puppet? How is
12:35
Speaker 2: he most puppet? No?
12:36
Speaker 1: I totally disagree, you know.
12:38
Speaker 2: Oli was getting pretty sassy on live radio of making
12:42
Speaker 2: it known without you know, making it known, because unless
12:45
Speaker 2: he wants to be Mike Shilton get fired, he'd like
12:48
Speaker 2: to try to keep his job. He was letting people know,
12:51
Speaker 2: like wink wink, he wanted McGreevy up here, but it
12:55
Speaker 2: wasn't his call. So how does that make him a puppet?
12:57
Speaker 2: He goes on Camo X the rights holders, you know,
13:00
Speaker 2: the team station in terms of broadcast rights, and in
13:04
Speaker 2: like three or four different ways he basically said, I
13:06
Speaker 2: want McGreevy, you know, and uh, he didn't get McGreevy.
13:10
Speaker 2: But so how does that make him a puppet? I
13:12
Speaker 2: want someone to explain that to me. The guy that
13:16
Speaker 2: runs the baseball operation gets to decide on what the
13:19
Speaker 2: roster is. Well, Bernie, but he wanted McGreevy. Oli did, Okay.
13:24
Speaker 2: The only person who can promote McGreevy is John Mozeliak.
13:29
Speaker 2: So what do you want Ali to do? Do you
13:32
Speaker 2: want him to quit? You want him to walk out
13:34
Speaker 2: on his players? Uh? Do you want him to jump
13:38
Speaker 2: Moe in the parking lot? Like start a brawl?
13:41
Speaker 1: Like?
13:41
Speaker 2: Like what exactly would you want him to do? To
13:44
Speaker 2: call him a puppet? When it Actually he's been getting
13:46
Speaker 2: really sassy about this, which Moe hates. By the way,
13:50
Speaker 2: it's the exact puppet oh when managers dare question him
13:57
Speaker 2: about anything, and if it leaks out in the public
13:59
Speaker 2: a little bit, what how is how is that puppet
14:02
Speaker 2: like behavior? You know, it's it's just absurd, you know.
14:07
Speaker 2: And one of the reasons I think Moe thinks he
14:09
Speaker 2: can get away with this, Uh, he's catching heat. But
14:12
Speaker 2: he also he knows that there's a lot of people
14:15
Speaker 2: in the fan base that will blame Ali for everything.
14:18
Speaker 2: So he sort of has covered there because even in
14:20
Speaker 2: this situation when it was one hundred percent obvious who
14:23
Speaker 2: made the decision, somehow Ozzie's getting Olie's getting slapped around
14:28
Speaker 2: most not stupid and.
14:29
Speaker 1: Delivering the message right right, yes, delivering the message to us,
14:32
Speaker 1: to you, And so I know, you know it's I
14:37
Speaker 1: tell Cardinals fans and it's it's difficult because they're not
14:40
Speaker 1: in the room and it's our job as reporters to
14:42
Speaker 1: try to convey the messaging as best as we can.
14:44
Speaker 1: But Olie Marma will tell you what's going on. If
14:46
Speaker 1: you read between the lines. There are things he has
14:49
Speaker 1: to say. The things that he gets paid to do.
14:51
Speaker 1: He gets paid to talk to us as part of
14:53
Speaker 1: his job and be the mouth piece for the organization
14:55
Speaker 1: on a daily basis. John Mozelac will do it every
14:58
Speaker 1: now and then. I for all of our gripe about
15:00
Speaker 1: him at the moment, he remains one of the most
15:02
Speaker 1: accessible gms in baseball, but it's all his job to
15:06
Speaker 1: talk to the media twice a day, So that's why
15:09
Speaker 1: he's getting a lot of pushback for this decision that
15:10
Speaker 1: I think we're all in agreement is not what's best
15:13
Speaker 1: for short term, and I'm going to do my best
15:14
Speaker 1: to be the beat writer here and try to lay
15:17
Speaker 1: this out from the organization's perspective, though I think it's
15:19
Speaker 1: very clear that we don't really agree with it. But
15:21
Speaker 1: it's not my job to agree or disagree. It's my
15:23
Speaker 1: job to explain, so let me try my best. The
15:26
Speaker 1: front office is still looking at the long term view
15:29
Speaker 1: of the organization, and the worst thing the Cardinals can
15:32
Speaker 1: do in this twenty twenty five season is make a
15:35
Speaker 1: move that is going to backtrack or delay the progress
15:38
Speaker 1: they've made to move forward. This year was about runway
15:41
Speaker 1: and transitioning to whords. I hope to never speak again
15:43
Speaker 1: after twenty twenty five. If you are the Cardinals and
15:46
Speaker 1: you get caught up and we need to win right
15:48
Speaker 1: now for this game, which I know what they've been
15:50
Speaker 1: is what most teams should be doing, but that's not
15:52
Speaker 1: the primary focus of the season. You risk making a
15:55
Speaker 1: move that backtracks the progress that you've already made, and
15:59
Speaker 1: come October, we're of twenty twenty five, we are sitting
16:02
Speaker 1: there at the postseason press conference in the exact same
16:05
Speaker 1: spot that we were in October twenty twenty four, and that,
16:08
Speaker 1: to me, is the biggest mistake the organization can make,
16:10
Speaker 1: hands down. You have to keep building on the progress,
16:13
Speaker 1: which is the long term view. And if the what's
16:15
Speaker 1: best for the long term is trying to try or
16:18
Speaker 1: trade Eric Fetti, even though he's not the best pitcher
16:21
Speaker 1: in the organization right now, then that's what you do.
16:25
Speaker 1: And I don't really think it's about the return here
16:28
Speaker 1: for Fetti. I think it's more of the addition by
16:29
Speaker 1: subtraction role. You create an opening from a grievy and
16:33
Speaker 1: then you go from there and you hope to get something,
16:35
Speaker 1: maybe a lottery ticket for your farm system and bolster it.
16:39
Speaker 1: But by tanking someone's trade value. By not pitching them,
16:42
Speaker 1: you are falling into the habits that got you here
16:45
Speaker 1: in the first place, that required a transition season to
16:47
Speaker 1: begin with. So as frustrating as it is, believe me,
16:51
Speaker 1: it's not a decision I agree with if we haven't
16:54
Speaker 1: made that clear. But I can understand the organization's long
16:57
Speaker 1: term view. It's why the season has been so frustrating
16:59
Speaker 1: for us so many fans, because there's so much mixed messaging.
17:02
Speaker 1: There's been a lack of ability to pin a direction
17:05
Speaker 1: the Cardinals is they approach arguably the most important trade
17:08
Speaker 1: deadline in John Mozelock's tenure, not for this season, but
17:10
Speaker 1: for the traductory of the organization going forward the next
17:13
Speaker 1: three or four years. They have to get it right,
17:16
Speaker 1: and they cannot risk messing up something that results them
17:19
Speaker 1: being in the exact same position they were in October
17:22
Speaker 1: of last year. That cannot happen.
17:25
Speaker 2: It's a tough season to try to make sense of
17:28
Speaker 2: from a standpoint, because I agree with you, my friend,
17:31
Speaker 2: in terms of like, I understand how they feel. The
17:34
Speaker 2: only hope they have to get something trade for Fetti
17:37
Speaker 2: is to have him pitch and just hope that he
17:39
Speaker 2: does a good job. I mean, I understand that as
17:42
Speaker 2: a philosophy, but it contradicts the fact that they have
17:45
Speaker 2: a team that has exceeded expectations, a team that's still
17:48
Speaker 2: only a game out in the race wildcard race. And
17:52
Speaker 2: I know that when they go through their weird phases
17:55
Speaker 2: where they look like they can't do anything right, they
17:57
Speaker 2: always bounce back and they they still have exceeded expectations.
18:02
Speaker 2: I mean, they're hanging in the Wildcard race except for
18:05
Speaker 2: Milwaukee with teams. The teams in the wildcard race other
18:09
Speaker 2: than Milwaukee are spending a fortune more on payroll than
18:13
Speaker 2: the Cardinals, and the Cardinals were the team that everyone
18:15
Speaker 2: forgot about, everyone denigrated non non factor. If they're rebuilding,
18:20
Speaker 2: they don't want to say it, but this is a
18:21
Speaker 2: rebuilding season. So if you try to have some perspective,
18:25
Speaker 2: they have clearly exceeded expectations and these players bust their tails,
18:29
Speaker 2: Ali and a staff despite what others think. No one
18:33
Speaker 2: can convince me that they're doing something other than a
18:35
Speaker 2: good job. They're doing a really good job. So if
18:40
Speaker 2: you have it, if you had listen, and I know
18:42
Speaker 2: they can add at the trade deadline. I get that,
18:45
Speaker 2: But if you have a chance to win, and you
18:47
Speaker 2: really need to win because it's going to be a
18:49
Speaker 2: tough race and a lot of these teams I think
18:51
Speaker 2: are going to play better at some point. You know,
18:56
Speaker 2: winning has to take on more urgency. Es any start
19:01
Speaker 2: that Eric Fetti pitches and gets clobbered and they lose
19:04
Speaker 2: the game. So it's kind of where they put themselves in. See,
19:09
Speaker 2: they created this because they're in the middle. I mean,
19:12
Speaker 2: they're a pretty good team. They're not a great team.
19:15
Speaker 2: They're in this. As you and Patrick Moody wrote today,
19:18
Speaker 2: it was a really good piece. There's a whole big
19:22
Speaker 2: cluster of teams just like the Cardinals. They don't want
19:25
Speaker 2: to give up on the season. They have a chance
19:26
Speaker 2: to make the playoffs. But are they a great team?
19:29
Speaker 1: No?
19:29
Speaker 2: Are they a flawed team? Yeah, but they're pretty good
19:31
Speaker 2: and this team's actually exceeded expectations. But the Cardinals put
19:35
Speaker 2: themselves in this because, well, what is the season really
19:39
Speaker 2: supposed to be about? What if these two missions clash?
19:44
Speaker 2: You know, Runway trying to win, Runway try to win.
19:47
Speaker 2: It's really hard to do both. It's really really difficult
19:50
Speaker 2: to do both. So this is why we're all talking
19:53
Speaker 2: about this because they have created a scenario that has
19:56
Speaker 2: led to this.
19:57
Speaker 1: They have they have spot on Bernie as always uh more.
20:02
Speaker 1: We'll get into it, and we promise we will not
20:04
Speaker 1: spend the entire episode bagging on Eric Fetty, who let
20:06
Speaker 1: the record show. I do hope he goes out there
20:08
Speaker 1: and performs well on Saturday.
20:09
Speaker 2: I mean he's a fine guy. Nobody roots against him exactly.
20:13
Speaker 1: And the way he's handled the last three starts total
20:16
Speaker 1: professionalism through and through. It is not easy to go
20:19
Speaker 1: out there and get your get your butt kicked, and
20:21
Speaker 1: then immediately come after I have to ask questions about
20:23
Speaker 1: why you were not good. And Fetti has been there
20:26
Speaker 1: every single start at his locker, and he does the interview.
20:31
Speaker 1: There's one thing to like, just go through the motions,
20:33
Speaker 1: but he does the interview. He puts thought behind his answers,
20:35
Speaker 1: and he in real time tries to provide some sort
20:37
Speaker 1: of insight. So I, for all parties involved, I hope
20:41
Speaker 1: he goes out there and shoves on Saturday. Do I
20:43
Speaker 1: have a day off on Saturday?
20:44
Speaker 2: I do? So you do that?
20:45
Speaker 1: Stars aligning, Maybe we'll see.
20:47
Speaker 2: Well, who's who's going to be there to write the
20:49
Speaker 2: great story when Fetti shuts out the braves on like
20:52
Speaker 2: four hits, not me.
20:55
Speaker 1: That's all right, A quick message from next playground and
20:59
Speaker 1: we'll jump into some von Herrera updates.
21:01
Speaker 3: Okay, Ah, Summer, we almost forgot what it feels like
21:07
Speaker 3: to play, just because, but even Summer needs back up.
21:11
Speaker 3: A little partner in the good kind of chaos. Someone
21:14
Speaker 3: to bring the kung fu kicks. A yeah to train
21:17
Speaker 3: some dragons fly, young dragon writer fly. The kind of
21:21
Speaker 3: fun that keeps the days going, that turns living rooms
21:24
Speaker 3: into playgrounds and reminds us what our body is and
21:27
Speaker 3: our hearts were made for play, that moves you.
21:35
Speaker 1: All right, so Yvonne Herrera, everyone celebrate is should be
21:38
Speaker 1: back with the Cardinals very soon. He started a rehab
21:41
Speaker 1: assignment with Triple A Memphis. He went one for three
21:43
Speaker 1: as the DH. He is planned or it is planned
21:46
Speaker 1: that he will DH for the next three games Friday, Saturday,
21:50
Speaker 1: and Sunday, and the Cardinals will make a decision on
21:52
Speaker 1: what his next week looks like, maybe even after tonight,
21:55
Speaker 1: just seeing how he feels. We talked about it last episode.
21:58
Speaker 1: The Major League All Star Break, Triple A All Star Break,
22:01
Speaker 1: and Double All Star Break are all the same week
22:03
Speaker 1: next week, So Herrera could play four games and then
22:06
Speaker 1: go without game action for four or he could potentially
22:10
Speaker 1: go down to Florida get some live at bats there
22:12
Speaker 1: during the All Star break, or he could just be
22:15
Speaker 1: ready to go. I asked Ollie Marvel if the break
22:17
Speaker 1: would give him any pause about when to bring up Herrera,
22:19
Speaker 1: and he said some players, yes, Herrera, I don't think
22:22
Speaker 1: it impacts him that much. That's not a surprise if
22:24
Speaker 1: grondhirek can do one thing and hit the baseball. So
22:27
Speaker 1: that's the first injury update. The second part to this
22:31
Speaker 1: is that you'll notice I said Herrera will be d
22:33
Speaker 1: eighteen all four games well when he comes back to
22:36
Speaker 1: the Cardinals, which, by the way, a return to kick
22:38
Speaker 1: off the second half on next Friday, a week from
22:41
Speaker 1: today in Arizona, isn't played. When Herra does return, the
22:45
Speaker 1: Cardinals have said his time behind the plate will be limited,
22:49
Speaker 1: and that is to protect his health. The Cardinals or Herrera,
22:52
Speaker 1: excuse me, has already had two lower half injuries this season,
22:56
Speaker 1: and let's be honest, a part of it is also
22:58
Speaker 1: because he is well behind Pedro Pajaz and Joel Poso,
23:02
Speaker 1: who aren't exactly like all star catchers either defensively. So
23:07
Speaker 1: the best thing for her Arah moving forward is to
23:09
Speaker 1: really cut back on his time behind the plate. He
23:11
Speaker 1: will be the everyday DH going forward, and they will
23:15
Speaker 1: reevaluate what Herrera is doing and what position he will
23:18
Speaker 1: be after this season. I think it's the right call
23:22
Speaker 1: from an offensive perspective, because we have seen what this
23:25
Speaker 1: lineup looks like without Herrera's bat and is severely not
23:29
Speaker 1: as good. So a little bit of a weird update.
23:31
Speaker 1: But I also understand when the team is coming from here.
23:33
Speaker 2: You know, Katie, when during his time he's been out
23:37
Speaker 2: and this stat is still fresh because they faced a
23:41
Speaker 2: right handed starting pitcher last night. But you know what,
23:45
Speaker 2: it started June twentieth when they didn't have him. Left
23:49
Speaker 2: end starting pitchers during that time have a two point
23:52
Speaker 2: one five ERA against the Cardinals. I mean, they've just
23:55
Speaker 2: they've just buried the Cardinals because the Cardinals do not have,
23:58
Speaker 2: with all due respect, their right handed hitters. First of all,
24:01
Speaker 2: they have too many left handed hitters. They don't have
24:03
Speaker 2: balance and a lot of and several of their right
24:06
Speaker 2: handed hitters who are capable. You know, just it's been
24:09
Speaker 2: a time where they've struggled a bit. So and I'm
24:12
Speaker 2: not saying everything would have been oh just dandy perfect
24:15
Speaker 2: with herre Era in the lineup, but this guy, just
24:18
Speaker 2: Maul's left handed pitching just destroys it. And clearly some
24:22
Speaker 2: of these games where they scored, you know, no more
24:25
Speaker 2: than two runs, at least a few of those games,
24:27
Speaker 2: they would have gotten more runs than that with him
24:29
Speaker 2: in the lineup. Because this is one of the best
24:33
Speaker 2: right handed hitters. It's a very very small sample, but
24:36
Speaker 2: if you just look at you know, his way to runs, creative.
24:38
Speaker 2: Plus this is like a top five right handed hitter
24:43
Speaker 2: in Major League Baseball. I mean, it sounds crazy, but
24:45
Speaker 2: he really is. So it's a big loss. It's not
24:49
Speaker 2: an excuse, but it's the reality. So they'll be a
24:51
Speaker 2: much better I think they'll be a much better team
24:53
Speaker 2: offensively with with Herrera in there. And yeah, it'll create
24:58
Speaker 2: some bottlenecks. Again, like what does this mean for Gorman?
25:00
Speaker 2: Does he not d h now? I mean, we're gonna
25:02
Speaker 2: go bet it's like you always go back to the
25:04
Speaker 2: beginning with this team. So we'll wait see you know,
25:07
Speaker 2: and listen. I'm definitely on board if they're serious, if
25:12
Speaker 2: it turns out they're serious about in the off season,
25:15
Speaker 2: it's like, all right, let's let's work with him about
25:18
Speaker 2: playing left field. I think the more options they have
25:21
Speaker 2: with him, they're better. They'll be for him and for
25:24
Speaker 2: them going forward. So we'll see what happens. But this
25:27
Speaker 2: is a very special hitter, There's no question about it.
25:30
Speaker 1: I agree, and that's why I'm not at all going
25:32
Speaker 1: to argue with the decision to not put him behind
25:34
Speaker 1: the plate. I mean, he is. If part of this
25:36
Speaker 1: season is to figure out that Evon Herrera is not
25:38
Speaker 1: your catcher of the future, but is your middle of
25:41
Speaker 1: the order bat of the future, that's still a success
25:44
Speaker 1: because we spend this whole season trying to figure out
25:46
Speaker 1: which players we're going to turn into what, and Herrera
25:49
Speaker 1: is a bat that you build your lineup around. I
25:51
Speaker 1: mean he is. The Cardinals that we talked about before
25:55
Speaker 1: don't really have a star. They don't really have anyone
25:57
Speaker 1: that gets you out of your seat, like excited. But
25:59
Speaker 1: I do not want to miss Yvon Herrera at bat
26:02
Speaker 1: because you just don't know what could happen, and you
26:03
Speaker 1: know it's going to be a quality at that and
26:05
Speaker 1: something that he's shown in his limited sample size this season,
26:08
Speaker 1: he's a clutch bat. How many times has he come
26:10
Speaker 1: through with runners in scoring position or lay inning? I mean,
26:13
Speaker 1: he's like the eighth inning hitter for this club. So yes,
26:17
Speaker 1: I get what the Cardinals are doing trying to preserve
26:19
Speaker 1: his health and also acknowledging that he hasn't taken a
26:21
Speaker 1: lot of steps forward behind the plate. He also hasn't
26:22
Speaker 1: had a lot of opportunity to do so. But if
26:25
Speaker 1: you are trying to make a second half push, which
26:27
Speaker 1: it still seems like they are, you need to keep
26:29
Speaker 1: Herrera healthy. Only marmal set as much. So it's about
26:32
Speaker 1: protecting his lower half as much as possible going forward.
26:35
Speaker 1: So if we're looking for off season storylines in July,
26:38
Speaker 1: I'm not quite sure what that says about us, but
26:39
Speaker 1: this will be one. Where will Herrera play in twenty
26:42
Speaker 1: twenty six We don't know, but we do know that
26:44
Speaker 1: when he does return, hopefully in just a matter of days,
26:46
Speaker 1: he will be the everyday DH. What that means for
26:49
Speaker 1: Nolan Gorman, Who's to say what that means for Jordan
26:52
Speaker 1: Walker when he comes back for his rehab assignment. Who
26:54
Speaker 1: is to say? My gut feeling tells me that Jordan
26:57
Speaker 1: Walker will be relegated to a ventual going forward. But hey,
27:00
Speaker 1: we'll see.
27:01
Speaker 2: I don't know, but I just gotta I gotta warn
27:04
Speaker 2: you about something, you know, some older so I can
27:07
Speaker 2: give advice right rolled my eyes there. Anyway, do not
27:12
Speaker 2: make any vacation plans this offseason. Seriously, you do not
27:17
Speaker 2: make any well you know what, this this offseason, and
27:21
Speaker 2: this old man here has been around a long time
27:23
Speaker 2: with the Cardinals, this is gonna be one of the
27:25
Speaker 2: craziest offseasons they've ever had. You have hein blue take
27:28
Speaker 2: it over, right, and let's be honest here. We don't
27:31
Speaker 2: have to do let's make a deal now, but let's
27:33
Speaker 2: be honest here, for there is no way that they
27:36
Speaker 2: can keep the same team in place, not from a
27:39
Speaker 2: standpoint where they hate all the players, but they have
27:42
Speaker 2: all these log jams everywhere. They're overloaded with left handed bats.
27:46
Speaker 2: They you know, they have like I'm exaggerating, they have
27:50
Speaker 2: like ten guys who can play in the middle infield.
27:52
Speaker 2: You know, they have got it right, and there's just
27:55
Speaker 2: no way. They have to make some really tough roster decisions,
28:00
Speaker 2: and those tough roster decisions will mean trades. You know.
28:03
Speaker 2: I mean seriously, because all these players, these are not
28:07
Speaker 2: guys you just like designate for assignment. They're all major
28:09
Speaker 2: league players. But you you have too many of them
28:12
Speaker 2: and hit left handed, and you have too many of
28:14
Speaker 2: them to play the same position, so you got to
28:17
Speaker 2: thin out the roster. So what that means is you
28:20
Speaker 2: will be working all off season. You will not.
28:23
Speaker 1: Get a break, no, And you know what, it's funny
28:25
Speaker 1: because you're spot on for all of that. And actually,
28:28
Speaker 1: you know, talking to a couple of anonymous executives over
28:31
Speaker 1: the last week, the Cardinals have so many players that
28:35
Speaker 1: other teams are interested in. One exec said that the
28:37
Speaker 1: Cardinals are going to be a lynch pin at the deadline.
28:40
Speaker 1: I saw that if they decide to sell. I don't
28:42
Speaker 1: think they're going to decide to sell. Going back to
28:44
Speaker 1: my aforementioned stale comment about how the organization Baseball operations
28:48
Speaker 1: is being run. But you are spot on about the
28:50
Speaker 1: off season, and I've already thought about it because not
28:52
Speaker 1: only where there'll be a ton of changes taking place,
28:54
Speaker 1: we're dealing with a brand new front office and we
28:57
Speaker 1: don't know how Heim Bloom navigates or works. You can
29:00
Speaker 1: go into an off season when you've worked for as
29:02
Speaker 1: long as we have with John Mozaelak and kind of
29:03
Speaker 1: have a basic understanding of how his operations are going
29:06
Speaker 1: to work. If anything, he has been consistent, and I
29:08
Speaker 1: don't want to diminish his track record. We know that
29:10
Speaker 1: he has accomplished a lot for this game. I know
29:11
Speaker 1: it's happened a great week at the moment from morale
29:13
Speaker 1: around him, But I don't want to like just diminish
29:16
Speaker 1: the fact of what he's done throughout his career. We
29:18
Speaker 1: don't know hein Bloom is going to be completely different.
29:20
Speaker 1: So not only is it going to be a very
29:22
Speaker 1: busy offseason, it's going to be unpredictable because we are
29:24
Speaker 1: going to learn how he navigates with a new organization
29:27
Speaker 1: and a new ownership. So this is my karma for
29:30
Speaker 1: having to do exactly zero things over last off season.
29:33
Speaker 1: It's going to be I'm well prepared. I don't know
29:35
Speaker 1: how much work I'm going to have to do with
29:37
Speaker 1: the trade deadline, to be honest, I don't know, But
29:39
Speaker 1: I do know that come November or the five days
29:41
Speaker 1: after the World Series, when the off season officially begins,
29:44
Speaker 1: it will just kind of feel like a continuation of
29:46
Speaker 1: this season, so we won't be bored.
29:48
Speaker 2: We at least we have that. I know it'll the
29:52
Speaker 2: off season will be just as crazy and maybe even
29:54
Speaker 2: more more action packed than the actual regular season. And
29:58
Speaker 2: the Cardinals have had some really good storylines this season too,
30:01
Speaker 2: So yeah, have fun. I'm going to just sit back
30:05
Speaker 2: and kind of watch and just watch all you guys
30:07
Speaker 2: do the beat reporting and just sit back and so,
30:09
Speaker 2: oh that's interesting. Let me write a column on that. Oh,
30:12
Speaker 2: let me let me put my my analysis on that.
30:15
Speaker 1: Right, So and I can just Stevens where like I
30:19
Speaker 1: never leave without my iPad. So that's healthy.
30:21
Speaker 2: That's right, that's right.
30:22
Speaker 1: Hey, let's get into them. We have a Draft King segment. Oh,
30:26
Speaker 1: let's go, all right, let's get into our player to
30:34
Speaker 1: watch this series presented by Draft Kings. I am going
30:39
Speaker 1: to go with tonight's starting pitcher, Matthew Libertour. So he's
30:43
Speaker 1: about to make his final start of the first half.
30:45
Speaker 1: Let's do a quick run through of his stats. He's
30:48
Speaker 1: made all seventeen of his starts. He's gone six and six,
30:52
Speaker 1: he's logged ninety seven and the third Indians a three
30:54
Speaker 1: seven zero era. He has been the Cardinal's second best
30:58
Speaker 1: picture in that rotation. I know he went through a
31:00
Speaker 1: little bit of a clunker, but guys, that's going to happen.
31:02
Speaker 1: Not every pitcher is going to notch thirty five stellar starts.
31:05
Speaker 1: But in his last four starts, we're seeing Libertor kind
31:07
Speaker 1: of unlock a new level of his game. He's four
31:10
Speaker 1: and oh twenty four innings, three out of four quality starts,
31:13
Speaker 1: eighteen strikeouts in a two two five era. Matthew Libertor
31:18
Speaker 1: has a chance to finish out what has been a
31:20
Speaker 1: very impressive first half, very encouraging. There will be some
31:24
Speaker 1: concern over his innings going forward because it will be
31:27
Speaker 1: his first time notching, you know, thirty plus starts in
31:30
Speaker 1: the major leagues in his career. But there is a difference,
31:33
Speaker 1: and I think the way that Ali Marmel describes this
31:35
Speaker 1: and Dusty Blake describes this makes a lot of sense.
31:38
Speaker 1: There's a difference between the quantity of innings and the
31:40
Speaker 1: quality of innings. Matthew Libertor has not had a ton
31:42
Speaker 1: of high stress innings, so yeah, we'll be mindful as
31:46
Speaker 1: he reaches that point. But I'm not super worried about
31:50
Speaker 1: the overall innings because most of them have been pretty easy.
31:55
Speaker 1: We've talked about this with how the Cardinals have been
31:58
Speaker 1: so diligent with his work usage and how to use
32:03
Speaker 1: him going forward as they figure out what kind of
32:04
Speaker 1: starter he's going to be for them. And I think
32:06
Speaker 1: as we sit here in the middle of the season,
32:09
Speaker 1: we can count on Matthew Libertre being a middle of
32:11
Speaker 1: the rotation starter for them next year and homegrown pitching,
32:14
Speaker 1: developing pitching inside your organization is so hard to do,
32:16
Speaker 1: so credit to Matthew Libertor for doing that. I'm excited
32:19
Speaker 1: to see how he profiles against the Braves lineup that,
32:21
Speaker 1: as we talked about earlier in the show, is kind
32:23
Speaker 1: of going through it. But he has a chance to
32:26
Speaker 1: round out what has been a very encouraging first half.
32:30
Speaker 2: I'm going to follow your lead, but I'm going to
32:32
Speaker 2: throw one in about like a specific stat line tonight
32:35
Speaker 2: for Matthew Libertur draft Gangs pick six a fantasy game,
32:40
Speaker 2: they list him with like four and a half strikeouts.
32:44
Speaker 2: So in other words, if you think Lebby will get
32:46
Speaker 2: five strikeouts and you go with the higher total, you
32:49
Speaker 2: would win. Now I would say that there is a
32:54
Speaker 2: reason to go with the higher I mean, I'm again,
32:57
Speaker 2: everyone do what you want, because you can find all
32:58
Speaker 2: the information DraftKings you and look up stats and everything else.
33:01
Speaker 2: But here's why I think Libby is a guy that's
33:05
Speaker 2: got a really good chance of getting five strikeouts because
33:08
Speaker 2: to your point, he's really rounding back into form after
33:11
Speaker 2: a little turbulence. But here, here's the deal. The Atlanta
33:15
Speaker 2: Braves hitters this year have the fourth highest strikeout rate
33:19
Speaker 2: in the National League against left handed pitchers. Okay, and
33:24
Speaker 2: they have individual players, including some of their very best hitters,
33:27
Speaker 2: have these huge strikeout rates against lefties right and the
33:31
Speaker 2: Braves in their last eleven games they have struck out
33:37
Speaker 2: ten times or more. So Libby has been around that
33:40
Speaker 2: five strikeout range right tonight. He's getting a team that
33:44
Speaker 2: seems to be, based on their track record, vulnerable against
33:48
Speaker 2: left handed starters like him. So that one caught my eye.
33:53
Speaker 2: The other one I like is this, even though Holmes
33:55
Speaker 2: is a really good pitcher for the Braves, he's really
33:57
Speaker 2: really good. Wilson a terres heating up, and you know
34:00
Speaker 2: what that means. When he starts to heat up, he
34:02
Speaker 2: sort of goes on a spree. Draftkinks pick six has
34:06
Speaker 2: him listed with a line of one point five hits,
34:09
Speaker 2: runs and RBI's combination of those things tonight one point
34:13
Speaker 2: five hits run scored RBIs So all he's got to
34:17
Speaker 2: do is have a combination of those three things that
34:19
Speaker 2: gets you to two. I mean, he has done that
34:23
Speaker 2: in four of his last five games, and he's he's
34:25
Speaker 2: actually getting hotter. So that is my other Pick six
34:29
Speaker 2: DraftKings Pick six Fantasy game alert to you all. So anyway,
34:35
Speaker 2: I like it, Bernie.
34:36
Speaker 1: I mean, Wilson Conturra's is going well. Anytime he hits
34:39
Speaker 1: the ball to right center. He barreled that solo homer
34:41
Speaker 1: in the seventh last night, so good indication he is
34:45
Speaker 1: seeing it. Download the DraftKings Pick six app now and
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34:53
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Speaker 1: All Right, one last segment before we head out, because
35:22
Speaker 1: it is almost time for me to go to the ballpark.
35:25
Speaker 1: The Cardinals are fifty and forty four. They won their
35:28
Speaker 1: fiftieth game yesterday. It's July eleventh, as we know, just
35:33
Speaker 1: three games before the All Star Break. Here's a fun fact.
35:37
Speaker 1: And twenty twenty two, July sixteenth, the final day before
35:41
Speaker 1: the All Star Break, the Cardinals were fifty and forty
35:44
Speaker 1: four and today Cardinals are fifty and forty four. So
35:48
Speaker 1: why does it feel different? Why does this feel different?
35:51
Speaker 1: Conversion twenty two, Bernie.
35:53
Speaker 2: That's a great stat Thank you. I like that one. Wow,
35:57
Speaker 2: that's a great question. Well that's it doesn't make any sense. Well,
36:03
Speaker 2: what makes sense is they were drawing big crowds to
36:05
Speaker 2: Bush Stadium. They're not doing that this year because they
36:07
Speaker 2: had star power. Goldie was the MVP that year. Aronatto
36:11
Speaker 2: could have been the MVP. He finished third in the voting.
36:13
Speaker 2: Both of them were fantastic. Oh and then you had
36:17
Speaker 2: the final chapter of are maybe the greatest right handed
36:22
Speaker 2: hitter in the history of the game, and a fellow
36:25
Speaker 2: named Albert Poolhols who just went berserk like in the
36:29
Speaker 2: final three months. And so that team, Waynwright was really
36:34
Speaker 2: good that year. I mean, that team was just so
36:36
Speaker 2: much fun to watch. So the fans really really responded
36:40
Speaker 2: as you would expect them to the final year of
36:42
Speaker 2: Yadda r. Malina. But that's why your stat that's why
36:46
Speaker 2: I had that reaction. I did not remember that they
36:49
Speaker 2: were kind of like, eh, you know, at this time
36:52
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty two, which makes what Ali Marmel and
36:55
Speaker 2: this team has done, it makes it even more impressive.
36:58
Speaker 2: It really does. Hockey Brewers are good, The Cubs are good.
37:02
Speaker 2: Those two teams are Yeah, those two teams are better
37:06
Speaker 2: this year than they were in twenty twenty two. So
37:10
Speaker 2: I think I'm I'm actually despite the fact that I
37:13
Speaker 2: get ticked off by some of the things the Cardinals do.
37:16
Speaker 2: They're inconsistent. Consistency is maddening and bewildering and frustrating. They're
37:22
Speaker 2: doing better than I thought, so I you know, so
37:27
Speaker 2: I look at the attendance rankings and I'm not ripping
37:30
Speaker 2: on fans. I'm not because fans can do what they want.
37:32
Speaker 2: It's their decision, it's their time, it's their money. But
37:36
Speaker 2: it's still a little weird for me. Like when I
37:38
Speaker 2: checked the other day and the Cardinals were ranked fifteenth
37:42
Speaker 2: in average tickets sold to home games this year. They
37:47
Speaker 2: were behind the Colorado Rockies, and it's like, I can't
37:54
Speaker 2: understand that that a team. I don't know if the
37:58
Speaker 2: Rockies won last night or played, but they were twenty
38:00
Speaker 2: one and seventy two at the time. I, you know,
38:05
Speaker 2: kind of put a note in about that a twenty
38:08
Speaker 2: one and seventy two team is outdrawing a team that,
38:14
Speaker 2: by universal agreement, has exceeded expectations. It's a young team,
38:20
Speaker 2: it's a hungry team. I think they're pretty entertaining. They're
38:23
Speaker 2: not entertaining when they're scoring one run like five games
38:26
Speaker 2: in a row. Listen, no one's saying they're a super team.
38:28
Speaker 2: But I find the team. Yeah, I find them appealing.
38:32
Speaker 2: I also find their struggles appealing. And that'll was it?
38:35
Speaker 2: What do you mean by that? Because there's always drama.
38:38
Speaker 2: That's why there's always drama. You know, they're very they're
38:42
Speaker 2: very yeah, they're very extreme great or like what what happened.
38:46
Speaker 1: Very dramatic. We love that they're not boring. What else
38:51
Speaker 1: for except maybe a couple more wins? But I did
38:53
Speaker 1: thinking to compare these two teams. You are right about
38:57
Speaker 1: the stars. You had two MVP candidates, you had two
39:01
Speaker 1: Hall of Famers, And let's not pretend the messaging around
39:05
Speaker 1: the team in twenty twenty two was it was the
39:07
Speaker 1: same as it is right now is far better. I
39:09
Speaker 1: think what you're seeing here is a fan base that
39:11
Speaker 1: is just kind of fed up, like, show me some change.
39:13
Speaker 2: I get it.
39:14
Speaker 1: And I think if the Cardinals going to make a
39:16
Speaker 1: run come September, the city will rally. But right now
39:19
Speaker 1: it's the same apathy for that we've seen all season.
39:24
Speaker 1: I guess the record isn't going to change that. The
39:26
Speaker 1: only thing that's really going to change is, I think
39:28
Speaker 1: change from within the organization. But that's not coming to October.
39:33
Speaker 2: And I again not to drag this out, and I apologize,
39:36
Speaker 2: and then you have a situation where you know, with
39:39
Speaker 2: people who are who were trying to be objective. You know,
39:41
Speaker 2: he's done a good job. I'm not saying he's the
39:43
Speaker 2: greatest manager ever. He's done a good job working in
39:45
Speaker 2: this strange situation, and you know, he's he's probably going
39:51
Speaker 2: to have a second winning season in a row after
39:54
Speaker 2: recovering from seventy one to ninety one what certainly wasn't
39:58
Speaker 2: his fault and one of them mind everyone too. And
40:01
Speaker 2: I know I'm a repeat this all the time, but
40:04
Speaker 2: at the end of this season, Ali Marmel will have
40:07
Speaker 2: a better winning percentage than Tony Larusa had in his
40:10
Speaker 2: first four seasons as the Cardinal manager. And Tony Larusa
40:13
Speaker 2: was a guy who had already won a World Series
40:15
Speaker 2: and two Pennants, and he also led to White Sox
40:17
Speaker 2: in eighty three to this out of nowhere ninety nine
40:20
Speaker 2: win season or whatever it was, So he had all
40:23
Speaker 2: kinds of experience. Ali did not. So I have a
40:26
Speaker 2: hard time knowing what I know. You know, having covered
40:28
Speaker 2: those Larusa teams, I have a really hard time understanding
40:32
Speaker 2: this notion that he is some kind of awful manager.
40:35
Speaker 2: Was Tony Larusa an awful manager? And de Witt and
40:39
Speaker 2: Walt Jacket he went out and gave him everything he
40:42
Speaker 2: wanted in terms of the roster before nineteen.
40:45
Speaker 1: That happened in the last couple of years.
40:48
Speaker 2: So how I don't know. I have a hard time
40:50
Speaker 2: recordciling he's the worst manager who ever lived, or whatever,
40:53
Speaker 2: you know. But when he's going to have a four
40:57
Speaker 2: year body of record, a four year body of work
40:59
Speaker 2: in the first four scenes as a manager, that's going
41:01
Speaker 2: to be better than Tony LaRussa. It's going to be
41:03
Speaker 2: better by Tony LaRussa by not just a smidge either.
41:06
Speaker 2: It's going to be better than Larusa's first four seasons.
41:09
Speaker 2: Winning percentage difference is going to be somewhere around twelve
41:12
Speaker 2: thirteen percentage points. So I actually I wonder how many
41:18
Speaker 2: fans will even if they bring Ali back, We'll have
41:22
Speaker 2: a fit, have a tantrum. I'm not going down there.
41:24
Speaker 1: Oh no, that always happened. But anyway, look, there are
41:28
Speaker 1: reasons you havetimistic I know it's going to frustrating start
41:30
Speaker 1: to July. Let's just collectively get to the All Star
41:34
Speaker 1: break reset, because I think we could have a really
41:37
Speaker 1: exciting second half, or at least, at least bare minimum,
41:40
Speaker 1: a really exciting first two weeks of the second half.
41:43
Speaker 1: If they keep winning, we'll see some trade deadline action
41:46
Speaker 1: and we'll see just how how much the Cardinals want
41:49
Speaker 1: to commit to going toward for it this year. If
41:51
Speaker 1: they have a bad two weeks, they will sell, so
41:55
Speaker 1: I guess that is something. But there is a chance
41:57
Speaker 1: here as we sit here with the St. Louis Cardinals
42:00
Speaker 1: games over five hundred with three games to go before
42:02
Speaker 1: the All Star Break, that no matter what your frustration
42:05
Speaker 1: level is with some of the decision making, some of
42:07
Speaker 1: the personnel, this team is in a much better spot
42:10
Speaker 1: than we thought they were going to be. And that's exciting.
42:12
Speaker 1: So Bernie and I will I'll be back, Bernie. I
42:15
Speaker 1: haven't go talk to you yet, but hopefully we will.
42:16
Speaker 1: We will have something for you at Cardinal Territory right
42:19
Speaker 1: after the draft on Sunday, and then I'm taking a
42:21
Speaker 1: couple of days off for the All Star breaks. Again
42:23
Speaker 1: collectively as a unit, you guys, let's just get through Sunday.
42:26
Speaker 1: We can do it.
42:27
Speaker 2: Not right, thank you?
42:29
Speaker 1: All right? For Bernie, I'm Katie. This is Cardinal Territory.
42:32
Speaker 1: We'll talk to you at the end of the week.