Latest / Bless This Mess: A Southern True Crime Podcast / [Florida] The Gainesville Ripper

Transcript

[Florida] The Gainesville Ripper · Bless This Mess: A Southern True Crime Podcast

• 0:08
  Speaker 1: Hey everyone, welcome to Bless This Mess and the True
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: Crime Podcast.
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: I'm Kara, here with Stu. Say hey, Stu.
• 0:24
  Speaker 3: Hey.
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: All right, we are back on the porch, Stu.
• 0:27
  Speaker 3: Are we now?
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: And we are heading to Gainesville, Florida.
• 0:30
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: And this will be in August of 1990. Now, we've
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: been doing this for a long time. I can't remember
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: if we've, we haven't done this whole, if we've done this,
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: we haven't done the whole case. We might have just
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: done one of them, but I don't think we've.
• 0:46
  Speaker 3: Done the whole thing. You didn't put it in the
• 0:48
  Speaker 3: search bar on our episode?
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: Well, I'd already kind of really committed before. Remember that
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: time we did that one that I'd already done?
• 0:55
  Speaker 3: Yes, and you got all the way to the end.
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: I was like, wow.
• 0:57
  Speaker 3: We actually recorded the whole thing.
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: And we put it out, and I said, I'm sorry.
• 1:00
  Speaker 3: And you were like, I think I've already done this.
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and everybody's like, well, I don't really remember it,
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: so it's fine. It's been a long time. So in
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: August of 1990 in Gainesville, Florida, students were moving into
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: apartments and getting ready for the fall semester. Among them
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: were 17-year-old Christina Powell and 18-year-old Sonia Larson, two roommates
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: beginning their first year at the University of Florida.
• 1:21
  Speaker 3: You know who else was also moving in in August 1990? Stu?
• 1:25
  Speaker 3: Saddam Hussein was moving into Kuwait about that time. Remember
• 1:30
  Speaker 3: it well. I was in the school. Okay. And they're like,
• 1:32
  Speaker 3: we're going, boys. We didn't go.
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: You didn't go.
• 1:36
  Speaker 3: I didn't go.
• 1:36
  Speaker 4: All right.
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: Well, thank you, Stu, for that fun world history fact.
• 1:43
  Speaker 3: You're welcome.
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: Appreciate it. Oh, the recording's doing something weird, but I
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: think we're okay. We might have to pause and double
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: check it.
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: Oh, wait a minute. That might have been 91. Was it?
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: Okay, if you're going to give facts about the history,
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: you need to.
• 1:59
  Speaker 3: Don't get it wrong?
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: No, don't get it wrong. All right, so yeah, so
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: they're moving in. They're starting their... They're moving into an
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: apartment together. It is Christina Powell and Sonia Larson. They're
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: going to be roommates and beginning their first year at
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: the University of Florida. But whenever Christina's parents went to
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: Gainesville because they hadn't heard from her in a while,
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: they found a horrible discovery in the apartment. But before
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: we get into today's case, I wanted to give you
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: a quick reminder of our weekly schedule. So on Mondays,
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: we step outside the South for our A Little Less
• 2:36
  Speaker 2: Mess mini-sodes. And then on Thursdays are for our regular
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: full-length cases right here on the main feed. Now, if
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: you want to get those Thursday episodes early and ad-free,
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: plus our Friday bonus show, Sit and Sippin' and Bullshittin',
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: come join our Patreon family. You can also help keep
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: the porch light on by visiting us or buy me
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: a coffee. Link in the show notes. Treat us to
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: a sweet tea, Stu.
• 3:01
  Speaker 3: A sweet tea. Is that what you're drinking?
• 3:04
  Speaker 4: No.
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: And while you're at it, make sure you're following us
• 3:08
  Speaker 2: on TikTok. Stu, your cord is hitting the microphone. If
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: this is your first time here, this is an unprofessional podcast.
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: Just FYI. There is no... If you're like, man, they're
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: kind of noisy and unprofessional.
• 3:23
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: It's because we are.
• 3:25
  Speaker 3: We are in.
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: We used to record this in a closet. We have
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: upgraded to actually in an office. I use that term
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: very loosely because there's just shit everywhere. So while you're
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: at what?
• 3:38
  Speaker 3: If they think this is bad, they can go start
• 3:39
  Speaker 3: at episode one.
• 3:40
  Speaker 4: Oh, yeah.
• 3:41
  Speaker 3: And then they'll be like, man, they're professionals.
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: It sounds so much better, yeah. Okay, so while you're
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: at it, make sure you're following us on TikTok, Facebook, Instagram,
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: and YouTube to catch my True Crime and Dinner Time series,
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: which that's where I cook meals and I tell you
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: a true crime story. Story, and then I also do
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: weekly true crime documentary recommendations. And as always, the absolute
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: best free way to support the show is to take
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: a second to rate, review, and subscribe wherever you're listening
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: right now. All right, that's enough of that. Grab your
• 4:08
  Speaker 2: mason jar, pull up a rocking chair, and if you're
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: also new here, there's a porch theme. If you can tell.
• 4:16
  Speaker 2: And let's get into it. I was going to tell
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: them our weekly pour, though, real quick.
• 4:20
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: So we have a weekly pour on the porch. And
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: this week, in honor of Halloween, we have our... Oh,
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: my God. I've lost the name of it, Stu. I
• 4:30
  Speaker 2: had a cute name for it.
• 4:32
  Speaker 3: I see it. I'm looking at it.
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: You can see it. Then you tell me.
• 4:35
  Speaker 3: Haunted Porch Punch.
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: Oh, the Haunted Porch Punch.
• 4:38
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: So, in your mason jar, you're going to use an
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: ounce and a half of vodka, three ounces of Spooky D.
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: I've had some Spooky D myself. I've had some spooky
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: D myself in my day. What, Stewie? You have so
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: many jokes?
• 5:00
  Speaker 3: I do. I'm just holding them back.
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: Okay, spooky D. If you don't know what spooky D is,
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: it's when you get so drunk in the bar you
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: wake up.
• 5:09
  Speaker 4: No, I'm kidding.
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: Instead of sunny D, they came up with spooky D,
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: and so it's like a mystery flavor. I think it's
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: kind of like pineapple-y tasting a little bit. Anyway, so
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: go get yourself some spooky D. It's limited edition at Walmart,
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: I believe. And if you can't find spooky D, just
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: do regular D. And then do half an ounce of
• 5:32
  Speaker 2: fresh lemon juice and two ounces. And then shake that
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: up and then just top it off with some ginger
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: ale or some sparkling water. It is very, very good.
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: If you're on the wagon, off the wagon, on the wagon,
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: just skip the vodka, okay? What can I tell you?
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: All right. So now let's get into this week's episode.
• 5:54
  Speaker 3: Christina Powell was from Jacksonville, and her family and friends
• 5:57
  Speaker 3: called her Christy. She had graduated from Episcopal High School
• 6:01
  Speaker 3: that spring and enrolled at the University of Florida to
• 6:04
  Speaker 3: study architecture. She wanted to design affordable housing for people
• 6:09
  Speaker 3: with lower incomes. Sonia Larson was from Deerfield Beach, and
• 6:13
  Speaker 3: she had graduated from Eli High School earlier that year
• 6:17
  Speaker 3: and was also starting her first year at Florida. The
• 6:20
  Speaker 3: two young women shared an apartment at Williamsburg Village, just
• 6:23
  Speaker 3: south of the university campus. On Sunday, August 26th, Christina's
• 6:28
  Speaker 3: parents arrived at the apartment looking for their daughter. They
• 6:31
  Speaker 3: had not heard from her for several days. No one
• 6:34
  Speaker 3: answered the door, so they called the police for help
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: checking on the two roommates.
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: I'm glad you could make it through that last couple
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: of words there on your part.
• 6:44
  Speaker 3: I was waiting to get my drink.
• 6:46
  Speaker 2: Now when officers entered, they found Sonia upstairs on her bed.
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: She had been stabbed and her body had been moved
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: toward the edge of the mattress. Her arms were raised
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: above her head and her legs hung over the side.
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: There were marks on her wrist indicating that she had
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: been restrained with tape that had since been removed. Downstairs,
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: officers found Christina on the living room floor. She had
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: also been stabbed and her body had been deliberately arranged.
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: Investigators believed the women had been dead for two to
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: three days. Police secured the apartment and began examining both floors.
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: Someone had broken into the home through the back door.
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: The women's bodies had been posed after they were killed,
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: leaving investigators with two connected murders inside the same apartment.
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: The autopsies would later reveal that Sonia had stabbed wounds
• 7:37
  Speaker 3: to her chest, along with injuries to her arms and
• 7:40
  Speaker 3: left thigh. Christina had been sexually assaulted and stabbed five
• 7:44
  Speaker 3: times in the back. Investigators also found evidence that tape
• 7:48
  Speaker 3: had been used to restrain Christina and cover her mouth.
• 7:52
  Speaker 3: As investigators worked to establish a timeline, they determined that
• 7:55
  Speaker 3: the women had been killed in the early morning hours
• 7:59
  Speaker 3: of Friday, August 24th. Their bodies had remained in the
• 8:02
  Speaker 3: apartment until police arrived with Christina's parents that Sunday.
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so this was a very violent death. And then
• 8:11
  Speaker 2: for the person to... like stage the bodies afterwards is just.
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: Next level stuff.
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: Yes, next level. Very disturbing. Now, while officers were investigating
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: at Williamsburg Village, 18-year-old Krista Hoyt failed to report for
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: work at the Alachua County Sheriff's Office. Krista was a
• 8:38
  Speaker 2: records clerk and a student at Santa Fe Community College.
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: Her absence concerned the people expecting her for the overnight shift.
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: Early Monday morning, deputies went to her home to check
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: on her. When no one answered, an officer walked around
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: the building and looked through a window with a flashlight. Inside,
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: he was shocked to see Krista's body.
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: It was now August 27th. Krista was supposed to be
• 9:04
  Speaker 3: working the midnight to 8 shift at around 1230 a.m.
• 9:08
  Speaker 3: Dispatchers alerted officers that she had not arrived. and two
• 9:12
  Speaker 3: were sent to her duplex on Southwest 24th Avenue. Through
• 9:16
  Speaker 3: the window, an officer could see Krista sitting on the
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: edge of her bed, her feet were on the floor,
• 9:21
  Speaker 3: and her upper body leaned forward. When officers entered the bedroom,
• 9:26
  Speaker 3: they discovered that she had been decapitated. Her head had
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: been placed on a shelf facing her body. She had
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: also been stabbed and sexually assaulted. as at Christina and
• 9:38
  Speaker 3: Sonia's apartment, someone had deliberately arranged the scene after the murder.
• 9:42
  Speaker 2: Yes, this is like sick.
• 9:46
  Speaker 3: This is a problem. I'm sure the police are like, well,
• 9:48
  Speaker 3: we got a serious problem.
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: Oh, this is like a major, I mean, I can't
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: even imagine the panic that is going through them because
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: that's three young women in a very short period of
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: time that have been found in a very disturbing way. Now,
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: Krista had graduated from Newberry High School in 1989, where
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: she played in the band at Santa Fe Community College.
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: She was an honor student studying chemistry and planned to
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: continue her education at the University of Florida. She was
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: also a police explorer and wanted to work in law enforcement.
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: Along with her classes, she worked overnight at the sheriff's office.
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: It was her absence from that job that brought officers
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: to her door. Investigators initially estimated that she had been
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: dead for one or two days. Now, like we were
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: talking about, police now had three murdered students at two
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: homes in southwest Gainesville. All three had been stabbed, and
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: the bodies had been mutilated or posed. Investigators began comparing
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: the scenes to determine whether the same person was responsible.
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: I mean, I can't imagine.
• 10:48
  Speaker 3: There's two of them?
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: There's two of them. I mean, it's pretty crazy.
• 10:51
  Speaker 3: Unless it's a movie, like Scream or something.
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 10:54
  Speaker 3: As news spread, students began leaving town. Some parents came
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: to get their children. Others stayed in Gainesville, but moved
• 11:02
  Speaker 3: in with friends rather than sleep alone.
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: I would have too. That's like so disturbing.
• 11:08
  Speaker 3: Apartment complexes and sororities hired security guards, and students began
• 11:12
  Speaker 3: buying guns and pepper spray. Locksmiths were busy reinforcing doors
• 11:18
  Speaker 3: and residents installed security systems. The University of Florida expanded
• 11:22
  Speaker 3: its nighttime escort service so students would not have to
• 11:26
  Speaker 3: walk across the campus alone. You going to make an
• 11:28
  Speaker 3: escort service, Jill?
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: I mean, it did sound.
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: So young college co-eds wouldn't have to be alone at night.
• 11:37
  Speaker 3: Yes, we're going to expand our escort service. Among the
• 11:42
  Speaker 3: students living nearby were 23-year-old Tracy Pauls and her roommate,
• 11:47
  Speaker 3: 23-year-old Manuel Taboda. His friends called him Manny. They had
• 11:52
  Speaker 3: known each other since high school in the Miami area
• 11:55
  Speaker 3: and shared a ground floor apartment at Gatorwood Apartments.
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: Gatorwood Apartments. Now Tracy was entering, I bet you they
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: had a big gator on a flag or something on
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: the wall. Tracy was entering her senior year at the
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: University of Florida and planned to attend law school. In
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: high school, she had belonged to the National Honor Society.
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: So was I, Stu. Were you?
• 12:18
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: Played soccer and softball. Oh, I played softball. And had
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: been named homecoming queen. I was homecoming queen.
• 12:25
  Speaker 3: No, you weren't.
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: No, I wasn't. I'm the queen of this double wide. Now,
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: Manny had graduated from the same high school. He played
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: football and was president of the school's theater club. He
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: had attended community college and planned to study architecture at
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: the University of Florida. Well, that's a combo. Football player
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: and president of the school's theater club.
• 12:47
  Speaker 3: And architecture.
• 12:49
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: Now, around 8.30 on Tuesday morning, August 28th, Tracy and
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: Manny were found dead inside their apartment. Tracy was lying
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: in the hallway between the bedrooms. Manny was in his bed.
• 12:58
  Speaker 2: Both had been stabbed repeatedly. So now we've got... Two more. Yeah,
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: two more. And now we've got... A man is involved now.
• 13:09
  Speaker 3: Manny had injuries showing that he had fought the attacker.
• 13:12
  Speaker 3: Tracy had been sexually assaulted and her body had been posed.
• 13:16
  Speaker 3: Unlike the earlier scenes, neither body had been mutilated in
• 13:19
  Speaker 3: the same way. Investigators had to consider whether the struggle
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: with Manny had interrupted the attacker's plans. The murders had
• 13:27
  Speaker 3: happened during the early morning hours of Monday, August 27th.
• 13:31
  Speaker 3: That meant that Tracy and Manny were killed around the
• 13:34
  Speaker 3: same time authorities reported were responding to Krista's misshift and
• 13:38
  Speaker 3: discovering her body across town. By Tuesday morning, five students
• 13:42
  Speaker 3: had been found murdered at three different homes.
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: That's like absolutely insane.
• 13:47
  Speaker 4: It is.
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: That is so crazy.
• 13:49
  Speaker 3: Their apartments were all in the same general area southwest
• 13:52
  Speaker 3: of the university.
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: Now, Manny's death showed that the victims were not all
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: women living alone or with another woman. Tracy had shared
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: her apartment with a longtime male friend, and both of
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: them had been killed. students who had moved in together
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: for safety were now facing news of another double murder.
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: And the fact that I'm sure all the women were like, well,
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: I've got my boyfriend's living with me or I've moved in.
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: Like we've had a guy moving with us. We should
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: be safe. But obviously this person doesn't care because it
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: does sound like.
• 14:20
  Speaker 3: Kind of like the Golden State Killer didn't care. Yeah.
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: It sounds like he was attacking Tracy and he did
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: get interrupted, but he was still managed to be able
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: to take out the.
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: The mail that was there to try to protect Tracy. Now,
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: investigators from several agencies joined the case, including the Florida
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: Department of Law Enforcement. They formed a task force and
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: began working through the physical evidence, witness interviews, and incoming tips.
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: Police needed to determine how the attacker was entering the
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: homes and what he was leaving behind. They also had
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: to decide which similarities connected the murders and whether the
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: differences were at Tracy and Manny's apartment could be explained
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: by the struggle. Like, was it supposed to be exactly
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: like the other two, and he had this unknown situation
• 15:10
  Speaker 2: happen with Manny there? Or could it be a different
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: person had done this?
• 15:16
  Speaker 3: Students continued leaving Gainesville. Those who stayed checked in with
• 15:19
  Speaker 3: worried parents, avoided going out alone after dark, and gathered
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: in groups to sleep. Police were searching for someone who
• 15:26
  Speaker 3: had entered three homes and killed five people. but they
• 15:30
  Speaker 3: still had no one to charge with the murders. The
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: investigation would soon focus on a young man by the
• 15:35
  Speaker 3: name of Edward Humphrey. His name and photograph became closely
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: associated with the case, even though he was not the
• 15:42
  Speaker 3: person responsible.
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: Edward Humphrey was 18 and had recently enrolled at the
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: University of Florida. Investigators received several tips about him, including
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: reports that he carried knives. He was also struggling with
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: a mental health condition and had stopped taking his medication. Well,
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: this is not a good combination at all. After an
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: altercation with his grandmother, he was arrested on an assault
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: charge and held on a $ 1 million bond. That is
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: quite a bit. They let people out these days on
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: like no bond for killing people. He was not charged
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: with the student murders, but police were investigating him as
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: a possible suspect. When investigators searched his home, They found
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: magazines about knives and guns. They also examined hairs and
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: fibers that they thought might connect him to the crime scenes.
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: The testing available at the time could not identify those
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: materials as his, but it could not immediately rule him
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: out either. As his name and photograph appeared in the news,
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: the public began connecting him to the killings. Then the
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: lab results raised a serious problem with that theory. Testing
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: of semen recovered from the crime scenes indicated that the
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: attacker had type B blood. Humphrey had type A. The
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: physical evidence did not support the suspicion surrounding him. But
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: he has been, I mean, I don't know how, like, well,
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: thankfully they did find the person who did this. Otherwise,
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: you're just a murderer the rest of your life, whether
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: you did it or not.
• 17:15
  Speaker 3: Kind of like them fellas from the Austin Yogurt Shop.
• 17:19
  Speaker 4: Oh, yeah.
• 17:19
  Speaker 3: They were suspected as murderers.
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: Their lives were pretty much over after that.
• 17:24
  Speaker 3: Well, that one guy, he just snapped.
• 17:27
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 17:27
  Speaker 3: Suicided by a cop.
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: Yep.
• 17:29
  Speaker 3: So there's that. While investigators were following tips about Humphrey,
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: they already had evidence from another Gainesville crime scene sitting
• 17:37
  Speaker 3: in storage. During the same period as the murders, a
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: man had robbed a nearby bank. A teller slipped a
• 17:43
  Speaker 3: red dye pack into the money, which stained the cash
• 17:47
  Speaker 3: after the robber left. So what happens?
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: It just turns red and then they can't use it?
• 17:53
  Speaker 3: No, you can't use the money. It'll be like a blue.
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: Who's going to not take it, though? I wouldn't even know.
• 17:59
  Speaker 2: If I was working at the pizza place and someone
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: came in and paid cash with some red dye, I'd
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: be like, wow, what happened to this?
• 18:06
  Speaker 3: Well, I'm not supposed to take it.
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: Okay, well, nobody knows that.
• 18:11
  Speaker 3: It marks the money.
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: Okay, well, it's not.
• 18:12
  Speaker 3: Everybody knows that.
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: Nobody knows that. I didn't know that. I would just
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: think someone colored on it or whatever.
• 18:18
  Speaker 3: No, I think it's pretty specific. Blots out a bunch
• 18:21
  Speaker 3: of stuff.
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: Oh, like it covers up the, okay.
• 18:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah, like you can't even use it really. All right,
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: where was I?
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I've taken taped together money at the place.
• 18:32
  Speaker 3: Yes, you can do that.
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: Where were you?
• 18:37
  Speaker 3: An officer later followed a man into a wooded area.
• 18:40
  Speaker 3: The man escaped, but the officer discovered a campsite. Among
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: the belongings were the dye-stained money, a gun, a screwdriver,
• 18:49
  Speaker 3: and a cassette player with the tape inside. Police collected
• 18:52
  Speaker 3: the items as evidence in the robbery investigations. At first,
• 18:56
  Speaker 3: they did not connect the campsite to the murders. Investigators
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: had recovered a gun while the students had been stabbed.
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: The cassette went into storage with the other evidence, and
• 19:06
  Speaker 3: no one listened to it for months.
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: Now, the location of the camp would become important. The
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: victims' homes were near wooded areas, giving someone a way
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: to approach the buildings without spending much time on an
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: open street. Investigators also found signs that the attacker had
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: forced his way through rear doors. The screwdriver from the
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: campsite was the same brand and model as the tool
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: crime lab analysts believed to have been used to enter
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: the apartments. The marks left around the doors gave them
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: something to compare with the recovered tool. But investigators still
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: needed to establish who had been staying at the camp
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: and connect the person to the murders. That seems like
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: a bit of a dicey... um you're telling me that
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: the the screwdriver matched the one used to pry like how.
• 19:54
  Speaker 3: Are you good well because it'd be like the same.
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: Same size okay but i think that's probably a lot
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: of screwdrivers i don't know that many screwdrivers that are
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: that big of a difference in size. So it seems
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: a little sketchy to me, but this was the 90s.
• 20:10
  Speaker 3: So you haven't had a bunch of screwdrivers of different sizes.
• 20:18
  Speaker 3: They've all been the same size.
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: Just the spooky D. Okay. All right. Where was.
• 20:28
  Speaker 3: You were talking about how all screwdriver sizes are the same.
• 20:31
  Speaker 4: Uh.
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: Oh, another lead took them outside Florida. Don Maines, an
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: investigator with the Florida Department of Law Enforcement, learned about
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: an unsolved triple murder in Shreveport, Louisiana. Some of the
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: details were similar enough that he went there to examine
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: the case.
• 20:52
  Speaker 3: On November 4th, 1989... What was I doing then? Hmm.
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: Was it Saddam Hussein who invaded Kuwait?
• 21:03
  Speaker 3: No, I was... I was about two days from going
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: to boot camp right about then.
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: Okay, this is not the history of stew. I don't
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: know why all of.
• 21:12
  Speaker 3: A sudden you think this.
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: Is like the thing where you're going to explain.
• 21:16
  Speaker 3: On November 4th.
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: What was I doing in November 4th, 1989?
• 21:19
  Speaker 3: Let's not talk about that.
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 21:22
  Speaker 3: Probably learning how to eat with a spoon or something.
• 21:24
  Speaker 3: I don't know.
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: I would have been.
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: Let's not talk about that. Let's not talk about that.
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: On November 4th, 1989, 55-year-old William Grissom, his 24-year-old. daughter, Julie,
• 21:36
  Speaker 3: and his eight-year-old grandson, Sean, had been killed inside Williams' home.
• 21:41
  Speaker 3: Sean's father, Scott Grissom, had recently married and was back
• 21:45
  Speaker 3: at work after his honeymoon when the murders happened. Julie's
• 21:49
  Speaker 3: body had been posed. Investigators also found evidence that tape
• 21:52
  Speaker 3: had been used and that her body had been cleaned
• 21:55
  Speaker 3: with vinegar. In Gainesville, officers had found tape residue and
• 22:00
  Speaker 3: evidence that the attacker had used soap to clean victims' bodies.
• 22:03
  Speaker 3: The similarities did not prove the same man had committed
• 22:06
  Speaker 3: both sets of murders, but testing of evidence from Shreveport
• 22:10
  Speaker 3: also indicated that the attacker had type B blood. Investigators
• 22:15
  Speaker 3: now had a reason to compare the cases more closely.
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: A woman in Shreveport named Cindy Drackett had been thinking
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: about that connection too. She knew a man named Danny
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: Rowling through her church. He had spent time with her
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: family and eaten meals at their home. When she heard
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: reports about the Gainesville killings while traveling through Florida, she
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: thought of him. I like old Cindy. She's like me.
• 22:44
  Speaker 3: Always.
• 22:44
  Speaker 2: I start off in life and I don't start by
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: trusting people. I start off by assuming you're a serial
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: killer and then you earn my trust. You work your
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: way up from there.
• 22:56
  Speaker 3: Did I have to do that?
• 22:59
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 23:00
  Speaker 4: What?
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: You're still not even at the top level of trust.
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: I'm still working.
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: You did accuse me of being a serial killer, didn't you?
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: Sometimes I'm like, could he be a serial killer? I
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: don't know. Sometimes it's always like, you know, because they
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: say everyone who knows a serial killer, like I never
• 23:17
  Speaker 2: thought they could be a serial killer. And I'm like,
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: so I think maybe everybody could be one, Stu. Now,
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: Rowling had talked about leaving Shreveport and going somewhere he
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: could spend his days in the sun. watching women. Cindy also,
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: which is a weird thing to say to someone that
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: you go to church with.
• 23:37
  Speaker 3: Back in 1990, you think?
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: Cindy also remembered something her husband, Stephen Dobbin, had told her.
• 23:43
  Speaker 2: One evening, Stephen said Rowling could no longer come around
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: their home. According to Cindy, Rowling had told Stephen that
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: he liked sticking knives into people, which is also a
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: strange thing to say to people.
• 23:54
  Speaker 3: That's definitely a strange.
• 23:55
  Speaker 4: Thing to say.
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: Yes. Cindy had not wanted to believe that someone she
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: knew could be involved in the Shreveport murders, but the
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: reports from Gainesville continued to bother her. In November 1990,
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: she called Crime Stoppers and gave investigators Danny Rowling's name.
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: Rowling was 36 and had a long criminal history. He
• 24:15
  Speaker 3: had been convicted of armed robberies in Georgia, Alabama, and Mississippi,
• 24:19
  Speaker 3: and had spent much of the 1980s in prison. His
• 24:23
  Speaker 3: father was a Shreveport police officer. In May 1990, the
• 24:26
  Speaker 3: two had argued, and Rowling returned with a gun and
• 24:30
  Speaker 3: shot his father in the face.
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: Oh, that seems extreme.
• 24:33
  Speaker 3: Yes, seems like he should have been in jail. I'm
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: guessing he.
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: Suspected his dad was a police officer, probably helped in
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: the situation, why he wasn't probably already incarcerated from all
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: the other shit he had done.
• 24:45
  Speaker 3: His father survived with permanent injuries. Rowling fled after police
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: issued a warrant for his arrest. As investigators looked into
• 24:53
  Speaker 3: his background, his robbery convictions brought them back to the
• 24:57
  Speaker 3: Gainesville bank robbery and the campsite. They went through the
• 25:01
  Speaker 3: stored evidence and finally played the cassette. The recording contained
• 25:05
  Speaker 3: a man talking and singing. At one point, he spoke
• 25:08
  Speaker 3: directly to members of his family. Then he identified himself
• 25:12
  Speaker 3: by his full name, Danny Harold Rowling. The tape connected
• 25:17
  Speaker 3: him to the camp where police had found the stolen
• 25:19
  Speaker 3: money and the screwdriver.
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: Investigators did not have to launch a new manhunt. Rowling
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: was already in the Marion County Jail, about 40 miles
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: south of Gainesville. He had been arrested in September for
• 25:33
  Speaker 2: robbing a supermarket, roughly 10 days after Tracy and Manny's
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: bodies were discovered. His blood type was B, consistent with
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: the crime scene evidence. Investigators then obtained DNA comparisons. Testing
• 25:45
  Speaker 2: connected him to biological evidence recovered during the murder investigation
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: and including semen found on a towel. They now had
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: several pieces of evidence pointing to the same man, the
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: campsite recording, the burglary tool, the blood type results, and DNA.
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: On November 15, 1991, a grand jury indicted Rowling on
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: five counts of first-degree murder, three counts of sexual battery,
• 26:13
  Speaker 2: and three counts of armed burglary involving an assault.
• 26:18
  Speaker 3: Rowling initially pleaded not guilty. While awaiting trial, he befriended
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: another prisoner, Bobby Lewis. Rowling began telling Lewis about the
• 26:26
  Speaker 3: Gainesville murders, and Lewis tried to use that information to
• 26:30
  Speaker 3: negotiate a benefit for himself, of course. Through his lawyer,
• 26:35
  Speaker 3: he approached prosecutors about a possible agreement. The state refused
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: to offer him a deal.
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: You know, I always wonder why, if I was in prison.
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: Why do you trust another prisoner with your secrets? I mean,
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: that doesn't make any sense.
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: No, I mean, if you can get something on them,
• 26:56
  Speaker 3: that's better than having money put in your commissary. You
• 26:58
  Speaker 3: can have time taking off your assets.
• 26:59
  Speaker 2: You can get out of, yes.
• 27:02
  Speaker 3: Lewis kept contacting investigators anyway. He said rolling water.
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: He's like, man, I got shit on this guy. Please,
• 27:10
  Speaker 2: I'm begging you. They're like, no, we have his burglary
• 27:13
  Speaker 2: tool that matches. Yes. We got this fucker.
• 27:16
  Speaker 3: We got this craftsman screwdriver. It's eight inches long.
• 27:20
  Speaker 2: Just like every other screwdriver.
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: He said Rowling wanted to confess. Rowling also wanted Lewis
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: involved and had him copy written statements about the murders
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: into Lewis's handwriting. Rowling then took back the originals to
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: destroy them. In January 1993, Rowling requested a meeting with
• 27:40
  Speaker 3: the homicide investigators. An initial attempt fell apart over his conditions.
• 27:45
  Speaker 3: Later that month, they agreed to an unusual arrangement. Lewis
• 27:48
  Speaker 3: would speak for him, and Rowling would confirm whether Lewis'
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: statements were accurate. This is ridiculous.
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: Oh my God. I will not be speaking. Lewis will speak.
• 28:04
  Speaker 4: On behalf of me.
• 28:04
  Speaker 3: You will speak to my prison attorney?
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: Before the interview, investigators reminded Rowling that he had a
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: lawyer and had previously chosen not to speak without one.
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: Rowling agreed to speak without his attorney, as long as
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: he had his prison attorney. They also repeated that Lewis
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: would not receive a promised benefit in exchange for the information.
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: I can just see this. This is like sitting in
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: a room. This is ridiculous.
• 28:26
  Speaker 3: Well, because then the defense would be like, were you
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: promised something for this testimony? You're like, yeah, why, yes,
• 28:31
  Speaker 3: I was.
• 28:32
  Speaker 4: Drink.
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: Drink.
• 28:33
  Speaker 4: Drink.
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: Drink.
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: So I guess he just couldn't control himself.
• 29:04
  Speaker 3: He had to do some more stuff. The interview is
• 29:06
  Speaker 3: also filled in what happened at Tracy and Manny's apartment.
• 29:10
  Speaker 3: Rowling had entered through the sliding glass door and attacked
• 29:13
  Speaker 3: Manny while he was asleep. Manny woke up and fought him.
• 29:18
  Speaker 3: Tracy heard the struggle and approached the bedroom. When she
• 29:21
  Speaker 3: saw Rowling, she ran back to her own room and
• 29:24
  Speaker 3: tried to lock the door. Rowling broke through it. He
• 29:27
  Speaker 3: restrained and sexually assaulted her before stabbing her to death.
• 29:31
  Speaker 3: He then cleaned and posed her body before leaving. The
• 29:34
  Speaker 3: differences between that scene and the earlier murders did not
• 29:38
  Speaker 3: mean another person was responsible. Rowling admitted to all five killings.
• 29:43
  Speaker 3: He also said that he had acted alone and that
• 29:45
  Speaker 3: Edward Humphrey had not been involved. Former state attorney Rod
• 29:50
  Speaker 3: Smith later acknowledged that the investigators had made a mistake
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: in their focus on Humphrey. Humphrey was never charged with
• 29:57
  Speaker 3: the student murders.
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: Rowling offered another explanation for his behavior. So if it
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: wasn't weird, it's about to get weirder, okay? He told
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: investigators about personalities he called Enad, it's Y-N-N-A-D, which was
• 30:12
  Speaker 2: Danny spelled backward, and Gemini. He blamed Gemini for his
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: most violent acts. Psychologist Harry Kropp did not accept the explanation.
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: He believed Rowling was trying to distance himself from his
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: responsibilities by attributing the murders to something else. Prosecutor Rod
• 30:31
  Speaker 2: Smith also challenged the story, pointing out The Exorcist 3,
• 30:36
  Speaker 2: which Rowling had watched, including a killer called Gemini. Those
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: claims became part of the discussion about Rowling's mental condition. Now,
• 30:45
  Speaker 2: remember he watched The Exorcist 3. It's going to come back, okay?
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: I need you guys to remember that. So the claims
• 30:54
  Speaker 2: about Rowling's mental condition, they did not change the physical
• 30:57
  Speaker 2: evidence or his admissions about entering departments and killing students
• 31:00
  Speaker 2: and also going back to get your wallet that you
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: forgot and then mutilating the body. Like, you're not in
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: a state of a frenzy state anymore. You're... You were
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: calm enough to remember you forgot your wallet.
• 31:10
  Speaker 3: Oh, shit. I forgot my wallet.
• 31:12
  Speaker 2: Let me go back in there and.
• 31:13
  Speaker 3: Oh, there's this person here. Let me.
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: That I murdered already.
• 31:16
  Speaker 3: Mutilate this body even further.
• 31:18
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: So you're not in a state of just... like a
• 31:21
  Speaker 2: mental state where you just can't tell right from wrong,
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: you left and were calm. It's not going to work.
• 31:29
  Speaker 3: On February 15, 1994, I was, I'm kidding. The day
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: set for his trial, Rowling changed his plea. He admitted
• 31:38
  Speaker 3: guilt on all 11 charges. Before entering the plea, he
• 31:41
  Speaker 3: told judges that he had spent his life running from things,
• 31:44
  Speaker 3: but this was something he could not run from. The
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: guilty plea meant a jury would not have to decide
• 31:50
  Speaker 3: whether he committed the murders, but because prosecutors were seeking
• 31:53
  Speaker 3: the death penalty, there would still be a sentencing proceeding.
• 31:58
  Speaker 3: Jurors would hear the evidence and recommend whether Rowling should
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: receive life imprisonment or death. For the families, that meant
• 32:06
  Speaker 3: sitting through the details of the crimes. Tracy's sister, Lori Leahy,
• 32:12
  Speaker 3: said she wanted to be there to represent Tracy. Sonia's mother,
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: Ada Larson, said that she needed to know what happened
• 32:19
  Speaker 3: to her daughter.
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: The penalty phase began on March 7th and continued through
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: March 24th. Prosecutors presented evidence about the attacks, Rowling's previous
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: violent crimes, and the planning involved in entering the three homes.
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: The defense presented evidence of abuse during Rowling's childhood and
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: mental illness in his family. His mother, Claudia, testified about
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: his father's treatment of him, including shaking him and holding
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: him against a wall hard enough to leave marks. That
• 32:47
  Speaker 2: doesn't sound that bad, I guess.
• 32:50
  Speaker 3: I've had worse.
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: The defense asked... Shut up, Stu. That is not even true.
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: The defense asked jurors to consider that history when deciding
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: his punishment. The judge ultimately accepted several circumstances in Rowling's favor,
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: including childhood physical and emotional abuse. I was joking about
• 33:09
  Speaker 2: the thing. I'm sure his dad was probably terrible.
• 33:12
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: Was emotionally and physically abusive. It was just a joke, guys. Okay.
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: Well, that's not an excuse to go around slaying people.
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: No, it's not. It's not. I'm just saying, like, they
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: could have used some more extreme examples if we're going
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: to try to make an excuse for why we murdered
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: five people.
• 33:33
  Speaker 3: Decapitated them.
• 33:34
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 33:34
  Speaker 3: Opposed their bodies.
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we're going to need a little something more than that,
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: than that example.
• 33:39
  Speaker 3: So.
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: Where was I? And his cooperation through the confessions and
• 33:45
  Speaker 2: guilty pleas. Those were considered alongside the circumstances supporting a
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: death sentence. I wonder if they had Lewis there with
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: him the whole time. Nodding. He was speaking on behalf
• 33:57
  Speaker 2: of Danny.
• 33:59
  Speaker 3: Like his ventriloquist?
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 34:02
  Speaker 3: The amount of publicity surrounding the case also became an issue.
• 34:06
  Speaker 3: Rowling's lawyers had initially chosen to keep the proceedings in
• 34:10
  Speaker 3: Alachua County. During jury selection, they changed their position and
• 34:15
  Speaker 3: asked to move the case. The judge denied that request.
• 34:19
  Speaker 3: Selecting the jury took three weeks. The court reviewed more
• 34:22
  Speaker 3: than 1,200 questionnaires and questioned prospective jurors about their knowledge
• 34:28
  Speaker 3: of the murders, their opinions about Rowling, and their views
• 34:31
  Speaker 3: on the death penalty. People who could not be impartial
• 34:35
  Speaker 3: were excused. The jury eventually recommended death for each of
• 34:39
  Speaker 3: the five murderers, All 12 jurors agreed on each recommendation.
• 34:44
  Speaker 3: On April 20, 1994, the judge followed those recommendations and imposed.
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: Five death sentences on Mr.
• 34:49
  Speaker 4: Rowlings.
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: The judge found that the murders had been planned, had
• 35:10
  Speaker 2: been committed during burglaries or sexual assaults, and were especially cruel.
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: Rowling's previous violent felony convictions were another factor supporting the sentences.
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: After the sentencing, Manny's brother, Mario Tabota, shouted at Rowling
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: from the courtroom. He later explained that he wanted to
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: have the last word because Rowling had taken control during
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: the crimes. The judge ordered him removed. Come on, judge.
• 35:34
  Speaker 3: Be cool.
• 35:34
  Speaker 2: Don't be all uncool. I bet you don't know who
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: said that, Stu. Don't be cool. Don't be all uncool.
• 35:44
  Speaker 3: Sounds like something more. What's his face? Matthew McConaughey, you
• 35:46
  Speaker 3: would say?
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: No. You know what? I was just thinking about Matthew McConaughey.
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: That's not who said that. It was Luann Deliseps from
• 35:55
  Speaker 2: The Real Housewives of New York.
• 35:56
  Speaker 3: Oh, Jesus.
• 35:57
  Speaker 2: A classic Real Housewives. Not this new bullshit. Anyways, Matthew
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: McConaughey died. If you're out there and you're a parent,
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: don't buy his stupid children's book. Remember that book? I
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: just saw it in there. Remember it was like.
• 36:09
  Speaker 2: It was like... I can't remember what... But none of
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: it made sense.
• 36:12
  Speaker 3: Sounded like AI wrote it or something?
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: Well, no, it didn't even sound like AI wrote it.
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: It sounded like somebody trying to be philosophical, but was
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: a guy who says like, all right, all right, all right,
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: or naked playing bongos. Smoking weed? Yes, wrote the children's book.
• 36:26
  Speaker 2: It's terrible. So, rolling... Appealed, his lawyers challenged several issues,
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: including the refusal to move the proceedings, the search of
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: his campsite, and the admission of his statements through Bobby Lewis.
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: In March 1997, the Florida Supreme Court upheld all five
• 36:44
  Speaker 2: death sentences. Yeah, you can't be using Bobby Lewis as
• 36:47
  Speaker 2: your scapegoat now.
• 36:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you waived your attorney privileges.
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you're like, Bobby can speak for me, okay. Yes.
• 36:55
  Speaker 3: The legal proceedings continued for years. Rowling sought further review
• 36:59
  Speaker 3: of his convictions and sentences, but the challenges did not
• 37:03
  Speaker 3: prevent Florida from carrying out the execution. He was put
• 37:06
  Speaker 3: to death by lethal injection on October 25, 2006. What
• 37:10
  Speaker 3: was I doing on October 25, 2006?
• 37:16
  Speaker 2: I was in... I think I might have been in Australia.
• 37:22
  Speaker 3: Getting ready for your birthday?
• 37:23
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: Uh, was it Australia then? Yeah, I think it was.
• 37:27
  Speaker 2: I think I went to Australia and I studied abroad
• 37:30
  Speaker 2: in Australia.
• 37:31
  Speaker 3: This ain't about you.
• 37:32
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: Why did this fucker, what I want to know is
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: why did he go and plead guilty and then spend
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: all of his time trying to undo it?
• 37:41
  Speaker 3: Well, the guy in the Mickey Shunick case, he bled
• 37:45
  Speaker 3: him to her body so that he could avoid the
• 37:47
  Speaker 3: death penalty. And then he was like, oh no, I
• 37:50
  Speaker 3: didn't do it. I need another trial. I need to
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: get out of this. So he tried to renege on that.
• 37:54
  Speaker 2: I know, but I just don't understand it. Like, why
• 37:57
  Speaker 2: say you did it in the first place then?
• 37:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know what these people think sometimes. They
• 38:01
  Speaker 3: murder people, so. Anyway, he did not use his final
• 38:07
  Speaker 3: statement to address the victims' families. Instead, he sang a
• 38:10
  Speaker 3: religious song. Some relatives of the Gainesville victims attended the
• 38:14
  Speaker 3: execution after waiting more than 16 years from the murders
• 38:19
  Speaker 3: of their family and loved ones. Shortly before his death,
• 38:22
  Speaker 3: Rowling gave a spiritual advisor a written statement admitting responsibilities
• 38:26
  Speaker 3: for the murders of William, Julie, and Sean Grissom in Shreveport.
• 38:31
  Speaker 3: Investigators had long believed he was responsible, but he had
• 38:34
  Speaker 3: not admitted those killings during the earlier questioning about the
• 38:38
  Speaker 3: Gainesville murders.
• 38:40
  Speaker 2: The confession identified three more victims beyond the five students.
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: Rowling was convicted and sentenced to death for the Gainesville murders.
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: His admission to the Shreveport killings came before his execution,
• 38:51
  Speaker 2: not through a separate Louisiana murder trial. Scott Grissom had
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: lost his father, his sister, and his son. He said
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: investigators had been certain of Rowling's involvement and had told
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: him the Florida case would result in an execution sooner.
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: Rowling remained in Florida.
• 39:11
  Speaker 3: Edward Humphrey also had to live with the consequences from
• 39:14
  Speaker 3: the investigation. His photograph had been tied to the murders
• 39:17
  Speaker 3: before investigators established who was responsible. He later continued his
• 39:22
  Speaker 3: education and graduated from the University of Central Florida.
• 39:26
  Speaker 4: In 2000.
• 39:26
  Speaker 2: He's like, I can't go to the University of Florida anymore.
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: We're going to need to move.
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: We're going to move.
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: We're going to move 20 miles down the road to
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: the University of Central Florida. They'll never recognize me here.
• 39:38
  Speaker 4: Alright, so.
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: We do have, remember I told you about The Exorcist?
• 39:46
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 39:46
  Speaker 2: Okay. That he was watching it prior. Yes. So this
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: is why we're doing it close to Halloween. Because there's
• 39:57
  Speaker 2: a connection to Scream came from Rowling. So it's connected
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: to the movie Scream. Did we already mention that? No.
• 40:05
  Speaker 2: We haven't. Okay. I meant to mention it. I think
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: I meant to mention it at the beginning.
• 40:08
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: So the movie Scream, if you haven't seen it, it
• 40:12
  Speaker 2: was made in 1996, I believe. Anyways, it came while
• 40:18
  Speaker 2: Rowling's case was still making news. In 1994, Kevin Williamson
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: watched a television program about the Gainesville murders. It frightened
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: him and helped him inspire the screenplay that became the
• 40:29
  Speaker 2: 1996 movie.
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: I thought the actual murder things were the inspiration for that.
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: What murder things?
• 40:37
  Speaker 3: The Scream murder. Huh?
• 40:41
  Speaker 2: The screen murder.
• 40:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there's some murders that supposedly inspired that.
• 40:48
  Speaker 2: Oh, there is another one up in Casey Joe Stoddard.
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: They claim inspired the screen movies. I don't know if
• 40:59
  Speaker 2: he got parts of that from it or not. I'm
• 41:01
  Speaker 2: going to have to look that one up because there
• 41:02
  Speaker 2: is a theory that that did help influence as well.
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: Because that was the one where The two friends stayed
• 41:10
  Speaker 2: and murdered her in the house after her boyfriend left.
• 41:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: And they said, oh, no, they were, I'm sorry, they
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: were inspired by the Scream movie.
• 41:20
  Speaker 3: Oh.
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: He was inspired by this for the Scream movie. They
• 41:25
  Speaker 2: watched the Scream movie and blamed it and said that's
• 41:28
  Speaker 2: what inspired them to do this to this Casey Jo Stoddard,
• 41:32
  Speaker 2: I believe was her name.
• 41:33
  Speaker 4: Oh.
• 41:34
  Speaker 2: So, William did not write a direct retelling of the
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: five students' murders. The fictional town, the mass killer, the
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: phone calls, and the movie's characters belonged to the screenplay.
• 41:42
  Speaker 2: The real case helped inspire it, but Scream is not
• 41:45
  Speaker 2: like a reenactment of the Gainesville murders. It was mainly
• 41:48
  Speaker 2: that he had watched The Exorcist and then carried out
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: these murders. If you remember in Scream, they're obsessed with
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: scary movies, and that's why they carried out these murders.
• 42:01
  Speaker 2: All right, that's it for our case this week. Stu,
• 42:03
  Speaker 2: do you have your Y'all Need Jesus?
• 42:06
  Speaker 3: Of course I do.
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: If you haven't seen Scream, which I can't imagine nobody's
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: seen Scream.
• 42:10
  Speaker 3: Well, some people might not have.
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: Okay, if you haven't.
• 42:12
  Speaker 3: They might be 18 years.
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: Old and just hearing about it for the first time.
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: That's definitely one of the ones that we'll watch this
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: week for Halloween, me and Stu. We always watch Scream.
• 42:21
  Speaker 2: We always watch I Know What You Did Last Summer.
• 42:23
  Speaker 2: We always watch the original Halloween. We usually always watch
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: Hocus Pocus. I've already seen that.
• 42:30
  Speaker 3: Like five times already.
• 42:31
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 42:31
  Speaker 3: Both of them.
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: And I got the kids asking for it too now. So,
• 42:34
  Speaker 2: I mean, when?
• 42:34
  Speaker 3: Oh, they're asking for it.
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: I usually watch, I like to watch all the Harry Potters,
• 42:40
  Speaker 2: but I don't know if I'm out of time because
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: we are very busy here in the next week. So,
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: but Harry Potter is, there's three times a year that
• 42:48
  Speaker 2: you can do a Harry Potter movie marathon. There's Halloween,
• 42:52
  Speaker 2: of course. Christmas.
• 42:54
  Speaker 3: Why Halloween?
• 42:55
  Speaker 2: Because it's about witches and wizards.
• 42:57
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: Christmas, because there's always a Christmas element in every Harry
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: Potter movie. And then the other time, Harry Potter's birthday week,
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: July 31st.
• 43:08
  Speaker 3: He's not a real person, so.
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: You're not a real person. Don't have me get Bobby
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: Lewis over here to speak on my behalf. Anyways.
• 43:21
  Speaker 3: And Saddam Hussein did invade Kuwait on August 2nd, 1990. Um.
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: I can think of some other bad things Saddam Hussein did, Stu.
• 43:32
  Speaker 3: I'm just saying. It happened when I was in one
• 43:34
  Speaker 3: of my schools, carried on to my next school, my
• 43:36
  Speaker 3: next two schools.
• 43:37
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 43:38
  Speaker 2: That's great. Glad you had to look that one up.
• 43:41
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 43:42
  Speaker 3: All right.
• 43:42
  Speaker 2: Do y'all need Jesus?
• 43:43
  Speaker 3: Yes, I do.
• 43:44
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 43:45
  Speaker 3: Fox 10. Well, let's go. Burglar steals empty Mac mini
• 43:52
  Speaker 3: boxes instead of computers. Florida or not Florida.
• 43:57
  Speaker 2: Not Florida.
• 43:58
  Speaker 3: Fox 10 Phoenix. Published October 6, 2025 from Taylor Wirtz.
• 44:06
  Speaker 3: A man broke the window of a Tempe tech company
• 44:09
  Speaker 3: and stole what he likely thought were computers. Security cameras
• 44:13
  Speaker 3: captured the suspect shoving dozens of Mac mini boxes out
• 44:17
  Speaker 3: of the window, leaving the actual computers behind. The business
• 44:21
  Speaker 3: owner is offering a $ 1, 500 reward for information leading to
• 44:25
  Speaker 3: an arrest. A would-be thief was caught on camera not
• 44:28
  Speaker 3: checking his inventory. Security video shows the moment a man
• 44:32
  Speaker 3: shatters the window of a Tempe business before scooping armfuls
• 44:36
  Speaker 3: of boxes out with him. But the company says he
• 44:39
  Speaker 3: should have paid more attention to what he was taking.
• 44:42
  Speaker 3: The tech company security cameras captured the moment that the
• 44:46
  Speaker 3: man in the black plaid shirt and baseball hat shattered
• 44:49
  Speaker 3: the window at whatever University Drive and State Route 143, Karam.
• 44:55
  Speaker 3: If you're local.
• 44:56
  Speaker 2: If you're local.
• 44:57
  Speaker 3: I come in. The window was smashed to pieces. Employee
• 45:02
  Speaker 3: Curran Rose said. That's a name right there. I've never
• 45:07
  Speaker 3: heard of Curran before. Curran. C-U-R-R-A-N.
• 45:11
  Speaker 2: I think I've seen that before.
• 45:12
  Speaker 3: Have you now? The man in the footage doesn't even
• 45:15
  Speaker 3: fully enter the building. Instead, sticking half his body through
• 45:18
  Speaker 3: the blinds and shoving dozens of mini Mac computer boxes
• 45:21
  Speaker 3: out of the window. Just grabbing the boxes and taking
• 45:24
  Speaker 3: them out with him.
• 45:28
  Speaker 2: Can you forget how to read?
• 45:29
  Speaker 3: Well, this story is written kind of wacky. This is
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: the first time I'm reading it.
• 45:36
  Speaker 2: Oh, I thought you were going to say this is
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: the first time I've read. That's what it sounds like.
• 45:40
  Speaker 3: A lot of people may think that. But these are
• 45:43
  Speaker 3: the Hebs. They've stuck through from the beginning to now.
• 45:46
  Speaker 3: Box 10 asked Rose what the man in the video
• 45:49
  Speaker 3: got away with and if it was anything of value. Nope,
• 45:53
  Speaker 3: just empty boxes, Rose said. Our computers were right there
• 45:56
  Speaker 3: in front of them. They just steal boxes instead. Really
• 46:00
  Speaker 3: low IQ. And for that, the business is grateful. They
• 46:04
  Speaker 3: stole empty boxes. Everyone was laughing about it. I'm just
• 46:06
  Speaker 3: glad no one was hurt. Blah, blah, blah, blah. So anyway,
• 46:11
  Speaker 3: there's a dum-dum running around out there in Tempe, Arizona,
• 46:13
  Speaker 3: if you know who it is. $ 1, 500 reward. There was
• 46:16
  Speaker 3: a guy at the distribution center where I did some
• 46:22
  Speaker 3: work at, and he did something similar. He stole a
• 46:27
  Speaker 3: bunch of Apple phones, like a whole case of them.
• 46:32
  Speaker 3: Turns out they were just the display boxes.
• 46:37
  Speaker 2: Oh, my God.
• 46:37
  Speaker 3: They were all display models. So none of the phones
• 46:40
  Speaker 3: in the boxes actually worked. No, they were display phones.
• 46:44
  Speaker 3: So he lost a $ 25 an hour job stealing display phones.
• 46:50
  Speaker 2: All right. Well, that's a fun story.
• 46:54
  Speaker 3: It doesn't sound that fun, Kara. You're just on your
• 46:56
  Speaker 3: phone over there scrolling TikTok.
• 46:58
  Speaker 2: I was looking for something. I was looking for something.
• 47:04
  Speaker 3: Looking for trouble.
• 47:04
  Speaker 1: No.
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: We were hoping that Stu might have had to....
• 47:11
  Speaker 3: Die?
• 47:11
  Speaker 2: Poop in a box.
• 47:14
  Speaker 3: Poop in a box?
• 47:16
  Speaker 2: You had to poop in a box?
• 47:17
  Speaker 3: Remind me of that Justin Timberlake song.
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: And we were really hoping, we were kind of hoping
• 47:21
  Speaker 2: someone would, Porch Pirate would steal that one. I was surprised,
• 47:25
  Speaker 2: but they didn't. No one steals anything in this neighborhood.
• 47:28
  Speaker 3: Well, thank goodness.
• 47:29
  Speaker 2: I know, but it would have been funny.
• 47:32
  Speaker 3: They would have taken it.
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: I'm not even going to get into why he had
• 47:37
  Speaker 2: to do it a second time.
• 47:39
  Speaker 3: Poop in a box. Two.
• 47:44
  Speaker 2: It's so gross.
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: Anyway. All right.
• 47:48
  Speaker 2: So, I was going to talk about.
• 47:50
  Speaker 3: Me pooping in a box?
• 47:53
  Speaker 4: No. No.
• 47:55
  Speaker 2: No, I was trying to talk about, so like we mentioned,
• 47:57
  Speaker 2: we do have our Friday episode.
• 47:59
  Speaker 3: Wait till you got to do a home pap smear
• 48:01
  Speaker 3: and I'll tell everybody about that.
• 48:03
  Speaker 2: Ew, what is wrong with you?
• 48:04
  Speaker 4: What?
• 48:05
  Speaker 2: They don't do those at home, okay?
• 48:07
  Speaker 3: What did you have me do the other day? What
• 48:09
  Speaker 3: was that?
• 48:10
  Speaker 1: What is wrong with you?
• 48:12
  Speaker 2: Oh my God, stop talking. You are disgusting. Okay, so
• 48:17
  Speaker 2: if you come, if you're still here and you're thinking
• 48:20
  Speaker 2: about joining.
• 48:20
  Speaker 3: The Patreon, Just.
• 48:23
  Speaker 2: Know that we have reigned in our weekly regular episodes.
• 48:30
  Speaker 2: We really stay on point. We keep it. We try to.
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: But on Friday, we are unhinged, if you will. So
• 48:39
  Speaker 2: if you come over there, just remember, that's a different
• 48:43
  Speaker 2: carrot and stew over there. And you can't. You got
• 48:47
  Speaker 2: to be cool. You can't be all uncool. You can't
• 48:49
  Speaker 2: be like that judge. You kicked that guy out for
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: yelling at him. So, no, I was thinking, I feel,
• 48:56
  Speaker 2: I was thinking that we had a comment on Patreon.
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: Why I got distracted was we had a comment on
• 49:03
  Speaker 2: Patreon from Salisa. And, oh, wait, she told us how
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: to pronounce it and I didn't, remember, didn't she tell
• 49:13
  Speaker 2: us how to pronounce it? C-E-L-I-S-A when you said it
• 49:16
  Speaker 2: the first time?
• 49:17
  Speaker 3: Salissa.
• 49:17
  Speaker 2: Salissa.
• 49:18
  Speaker 4: Wow.
• 49:19
  Speaker 2: Is that how she?
• 49:20
  Speaker 4: Wow. What?
• 49:21
  Speaker 2: I couldn't remember.
• 49:22
  Speaker 3: I don't remember that. Now you got me on the spot,
• 49:24
  Speaker 3: I'm going.
• 49:24
  Speaker 2: To have to go back and look. Okay, no, you
• 49:25
  Speaker 2: don't have to go back and look. She knows what
• 49:27
  Speaker 2: we're talking about. She said, oh, this is one that
• 49:29
  Speaker 2: needs your commentary. And I was thinking, and I put
• 49:32
  Speaker 2: a laughy face. I was like, oh, yeah, you're right.
• 49:36
  Speaker 2: I don't know why because I do the True Crime
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: and Dinner Times and I do the mini episodes. She
• 49:41
  Speaker 2: was talking about the mini episode that I did. And
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: it definitely did not deserve a laughy face. And say, yeah,
• 49:49
  Speaker 2: I was thinking that. Maybe we'll talk about it on Friday.
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: Because it was a very sad story or whatever. This
• 49:55
  Speaker 2: other one, this is the one I thought she was
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: talking about. So this is the one we might talk
• 49:59
  Speaker 2: about on Friday. So this is about a... It happened
• 50:02
  Speaker 2: on Halloween. This guy... Named Peter Fabiano. He gets shot.
• 50:10
  Speaker 2: Someone shows up at his door on Halloween night and
• 50:12
  Speaker 2: shoots him or whatever. But it's just like weird. I
• 50:15
  Speaker 2: want to do more research into this one because this
• 50:17
  Speaker 2: is like some weird situation where these three women, so
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: he's got this wife. They were like separated for a
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: little bit. So she moves in with this other lady. Well,
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: then her and the husband, Peter, they reconcile or whatever.
• 50:32
  Speaker 2: She moves back in with him. But it really was...
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: the lady that she was staying with, and another lady
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: went and killed him. Like, it's such a weird story.
• 50:43
  Speaker 2: And I'm like, I need to get more information about
• 50:45
  Speaker 2: this because this is, like, crazy.
• 50:46
  Speaker 3: You need more details.
• 50:47
  Speaker 2: I need more details. Drink. So, anyway, so whenever I
• 50:50
  Speaker 2: responded to her, I put the laugh fix. I thought
• 50:52
  Speaker 2: she was talking about this because this is a wild story.
• 50:53
  Speaker 2: I mean, Peter did die. I mean, I get it.
• 50:55
  Speaker 2: It's sad. But I'm just saying it's a weird situation
• 50:58
  Speaker 2: where these women all got together and decided to murder
• 51:01
  Speaker 2: this guy. The other one was not a laughy face situation.
• 51:04
  Speaker 2: Monday's was very traumatic. So I just wanted to... For you? No,
• 51:11
  Speaker 2: it was just like a really disturbing case. You don't
• 51:15
  Speaker 2: listen to my mini episodes, obviously.
• 51:18
  Speaker 3: I don't have TikTok.
• 51:19
  Speaker 2: No, this wasn't on TikTok. This was on the podcast.
• 51:22
  Speaker 3: You do another podcast?
• 51:23
  Speaker 2: This was the podcast mini episode.
• 51:24
  Speaker 3: You do another podcast besides this one?
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: I do the one, our mini episodes. Stuart, you're so
• 51:29
  Speaker 2: full of shit. Anyways... That's why I got distracted when
• 51:32
  Speaker 2: you were telling your yawning. Because I started thinking, I
• 51:35
  Speaker 2: was like, oh my God, I put a laughy face
• 51:37
  Speaker 2: on that. That was not a laughy face. So I
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: went and edited it and took it out just now.
• 51:40
  Speaker 2: Because I was like, I need... She probably thinks I'm
• 51:42
  Speaker 2: like a psychopath.
• 51:43
  Speaker 3: Well, everybody that listens to this knows you are.
• 51:46
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: Anyway, so we might talk about this one. But she
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: did want our commentary on the other one. So we might...
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: Maybe we'll touch.
• 51:54
  Speaker 4: Both of them.
• 51:54
  Speaker 3: That sounds very sad.
• 51:56
  Speaker 2: It was sad.
• 51:57
  Speaker 3: Well, how do I make fun of a killer if
• 51:58
  Speaker 3: it's that sad?
• 51:59
  Speaker 4: Well....
• 52:01
  Speaker 2: Probably because he was a pastor. So, you know, we
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: got all.
• 52:05
  Speaker 3: And the pastor?
• 52:07
  Speaker 2: We got all... Oh, he had like a... Oh, probably
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: because he was a pastor. He had like a congregation
• 52:12
  Speaker 2: of 14 people. I mean, it's very... Hitting very close
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: to home, if you know what I mean.
• 52:16
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 52:16
  Speaker 2: Hitting very close to home. So, probably that's why. Because
• 52:21
  Speaker 2: it was... He was a.
• 52:24
  Speaker 2: He was, you know... Nodding my head.
• 52:27
  Speaker 3: Doing.
• 52:28
  Speaker 2: Back across the street.
• 52:29
  Speaker 3: Doing home.
• 52:29
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 52:32
  Speaker 3: Ministries.
• 52:33
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 52:33
  Speaker 2: So, anyways, all right. Well, that is all. Don't forget
• 52:37
  Speaker 2: to rate, review, subscribe, TikTok, Instagram, Facebook. I think that's it.
• 52:46
  Speaker 2: Do you have anything else?
• 52:47
  Speaker 3: Do you want me to have anything else?
• 52:49
  Speaker 4: All right.
• 52:49
  Speaker 2: We'll be back on Friday with our sitting, sipping, and bullshitting.
• 52:53
  Speaker 2: Until then, stay safe, lock your doors, and keep that
• 52:57
  Speaker 2: porch light on. Bye, everyone. Say bye, Stu.
• 52:59
  Speaker 3: Bye, Stu.
• 53:01
  Speaker 4: Don't you know it's bad luck To be superstitious But
• 53:09
  Speaker 4: nothing else is working And my head is really hurting
• 53:16
  Speaker 4: And I'm sick of all this worrying About things I
• 53:21
  Speaker 4: can't control These things I can't control