Latest / KDAV Radio / Podnews Weekly Review - Beehiv podcast ads can make money - while Spreaker steals shows

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Podnews Weekly Review - Beehiv podcast ads can make money - while Spreaker steals shows · KDAV Radio

0:00
James Cridland: Coming up, the worker bees at Beehive have been busy.
0:04
James Cridland: Plus, Spreaker needs a deleter with James Cridland and Sam Sethi.
0:10
Announcer: This is the Podnews Weekly Review with BuzzWith Buzzsprout.
0:15
Announcer: Start podcasting, keep keep keep podcasting.
0:19
Sam Sethi: So James, ah, naughty, naughty, naughty Spreaker.
0:23
Sam Sethi: What have they been doing?
0:24
Sam Sethi: Tell me.
0:25
James Cridland: I have had stories every so often about someone copying a podcast and making money from it and confusing the Apple charts and various other things.
0:36
James Cridland: And there has been one pretty obvious thread between all of these individual shows, and that thread is they've all been on Spreaker.
0:46
James Cridland: And it turns out when you go onto Spreaker and you want to, you know, just import a podcast from somewhere else, it doesn't check.
0:52
James Cridland: It doesn't check that you own that podcast, it just imports it automatically.
0:56
James Cridland: You can click a button that says keep this updated.
0:59
James Cridland: So you can do that.
1:00
James Cridland: You can then click a button that says monetize this show.
1:04
James Cridland: And uh they uh uh turn on monetization even if the show is called test.
1:10
James Cridland: And then finally, you can then add the copy of this podcast, which is now earning you more money because it's got ads at the beginning, ads at the end, so it's earning you money from stuff that isn't yours.
1:23
James Cridland: You can then add that into Apple Podcasts and into uh Spotify and other places, and of course it starts charting there because of the ways that charts work.
1:34
James Cridland: And hey, presto, you start earning lots of money, and everybody's happy apart from the person whose podcast you've stolen.
1:40
James Cridland: That's essentially what's going on with Spreaker.
1:42
James Cridland: Not just a few, but the data that I have discovered says 1,700 shows are duplicated on Spreeker at the moment.
1:53
James Cridland: All kinds of podcast publishers in there, Podcast One and Vox Media and Goldhanger and Sirius XM and all of that kind of stuff.
2:01
James Cridland: I mean, to the point where I've now got individual podcast publishers who are wanting to work together on a new code of conduct for podcast hosting companies, which is, I think, probably a good thing.
2:13
James Cridland: But also we've seen the first company which has sprung up to actually fight this.
2:19
James Cridland: It's a company called Pod Protect, a company produced by somebody called Lisa Lacey, and she discovered a couple of weeks ago that her podcast had been copied by somebody on Spreeker and was earning money and was already charting within a couple of days.
2:34
James Cridland: And so she's actually launched an entire thing.
2:37
James Cridland: So it's been a really interesting couple of days of basically pointing out what's going on on Spreeker and Spreeker doing absolutely nothing apart from give me a nice statement saying, Oh, no, no, no, no, we don't uh we don't condone any of this.
2:52
James Cridland: Well, guess who makes 41% of the money from the advertising?
2:57
James Cridland: It's Spreeker.
2:58
Sam Sethi: They're not the only companies suffering from this copyitis.
3:02
Sam Sethi: RSS.com, you had a story about them having a similar problem, but they dealt with it very differently.
3:09
Sam Sethi: Tell me more.
3:10
James Cridland: Yeah, they dealt with this rather nicely, I think.
3:12
James Cridland: So this is a a podcast that was made by, and this is a weird one.
3:17
James Cridland: This was a podcast made by a man called Sanderson Jones.
3:20
James Cridland: Sanderson Jones made his podcast for a while, people liked it, and but he but he got a bit bored of making it and he stopped making it.
3:30
James Cridland: And so somebody hacked into his ACAST account, moved that show over to RSS.com.
3:37
James Cridland: Once it was on rss.com, which of course you can earn money from, once it was on rss.com, not only did they slap ads at the beginning and at the end of all of this guy's shows, they also started making new shows with a clone of his voice, which was an astonishing thing, and actually turned a non-secular show into a secular show and starting talking about God and everything else, which isn't exactly not what Silas and Jones was talking about.
4:03
James Cridland: Now, RSS I think have done a really good job here.
4:07
James Cridland: They were they they were sort of alerted to this problem by Hyperfixed, which is an excellent podcast, and they ended up uh firstly getting the podcast back to ACAST, but also secondly giving$1,300, which was the amount that it earned in terms of total ad revenue, to Sanderson Jones, to the guy whose podcast it was originally.
4:30
James Cridland: And Sanders and Jones, I think, said, This is the first money that I've earned from this podcast, and thank you very much.
4:35
James Cridland: But my goodness me, that's that's quite the thing, I think.
4:40
Sam Sethi: Okay, a couple of things.
4:42
Sam Sethi: Akos got hacked and he made money.
4:45
Sam Sethi: Shouldn't he just leave it there and let the other guy who's clearly knows how to make money off his podcast and just take a cut?
4:51
James Cridland: I mean Yeah, but he doesn't want his whole point was to make a show which was about you know about spirituality spirituality, but without actually any talk of religion in there.
5:07
James Cridland: And so of course, what the what what the person who then hacked his show started doing is lots of talk about God and Jesus, which was precisely not what Silas and Jones was wanting to talk about.
5:18
James Cridland: So I thought that that's uh yeah, so possibly not, but you know, I mean, I think it I think that's a this is a really weird case because it was very clearly it had been redirected over to RSS.com.
5:32
James Cridland: So uh I think rss.com, they just thought that this this was a a legit show and because his account had been hacked by you know by by this g by this person.
5:44
James Cridland: So, you know, so it's a bit of a weird one, but yeah, all's well that ends well, perhaps.
5:51
Sam Sethi: It also brings to mind again one of the other problems.
5:54
Sam Sethi: You said it was an AI voice.
5:56
Sam Sethi: I mean, again, no flagging of the AI voice, no, no again, we've got quite a few issues here in the industry, James.
6:03
Sam Sethi: How do we stop it?
6:04
Sam Sethi: I mean, I know you talked about you know Lisa starting a copyright, you know, program, but will it have any teeth?
6:12
Sam Sethi: I mean, the problem is how do you really technically stop it?
6:16
Sam Sethi: If it's not technically stopped, it would not be done by manual labour.
6:21
James Cridland: Yeah, there's a couple of things here.
6:23
James Cridland: I think firstly, uh my understanding of what PodProtect is, is it's a way for you to at least know that your podcast has been copied.
6:33
James Cridland: And that that's the first step.
6:35
James Cridland: Actually, quite a lot of people don't realize that their podcast has been has been copied wholesale.
6:41
James Cridland: So firstly, spotting that is a useful thing.
6:44
James Cridland: The second thing, I think personally, I think that we need two things here.
6:48
James Cridland: We need firstly a code of conduct for how we import podcasts from other podcast hosts.
6:58
James Cridland: So the sort of thing that I would suggest is ensuring that the original creator is made aware of the import taking place.
7:06
James Cridland: So send them an email.
7:08
James Cridland: That will be at least a start.
7:10
James Cridland: Secondly, don't allow any monetization until a redirect has been confirmed.
7:14
James Cridland: That's the way that Red Circle do it, I understand.
7:17
James Cridland: Don't also allow one-click distribution to Apple and Spotify and other places until that redirect has been confirmed.
7:26
James Cridland: Because you can only redirect a podcast if the owner of that podcast is wanting to redirect it, unless you do some hacking.
7:35
James Cridland: And then fourthly, do things like, you know, support the podcast lock tag, which Spreaker to their credit do, but also have some form of commitment that any revenue owed will always be paid to the copyright owner if a show is pirated.
7:51
James Cridland: But also the revenue owing to the podcast hosting company should also not stay with the podcast hosting company for as so far as I'm concerned.
8:02
James Cridland: I don't think that the podcast hosting company should be rubbing their hands together and going, great, well, we still own, we still get 41% of the revenue as as uh Spreaker does.
8:11
James Cridland: So some kind of commitment to either give that to charity or to, I don't know, also give that to the copyright owner.
8:20
James Cridland: I don't know.
8:20
James Cridland: But but something that would that stops the podcast hosting company benefiting.
8:27
James Cridland: And if we've got that code of conduct, well, perhaps that code of conduct is something that the good folks at the Podcast Standards Project were to have a look at so that there's just a standard code of conduct which is written up, which has a champion and is there so that all podcast hosting companies can say we abide by the code of conduct.
8:47
James Cridland: Because at the moment there's none of that, none of that actually exists, and there are some good companies in this.
8:53
James Cridland: There are some companies that actually make it far too complicated and far too difficult for themselves.
8:58
James Cridland: And there are also companies like Spreaker who just have absolutely no control over this whatsoever.
9:04
James Cridland: So that's what I think should happen.
9:06
James Cridland: But let's wait and see what actually happens out of this.
9:10
James Cridland: It would be interesting if Spreaker actually did something, because at the moment they've done absolutely nothing.
9:15
Sam Sethi: But uh anyway, we'll find out.
9:18
Sam Sethi: We'll be talking about Instagram later on in the show, but Adam Massiri, the CEO of Instagram, was on Colin and Samir, and in the interview, one thing he was talking about was their challenge of in-platform AI copying the best top 10 reels, shows, whatever, and then putting them straight back out with AI voiced and monetizing on the platform.
9:44
SPEAKER_09: One of the things I'm getting a lot of complaints about right now is stand-ups having their bits stolen and then delivered by AI characters.
9:51
SPEAKER_09: Oh, interesting.
9:52
SPEAKER_09: And it's like, oof, it's like, all right, like, you know, like rights management for jokes is like a thing that isn't a thing, you know, but also like I want to make sure that we're a platform that rewards the people, the original content creators.
10:07
SPEAKER_09: How do we tell the difference?
10:09
SPEAKER_09: Maybe we could treat it as unoriginal content because we're not gonna be able to like censor content for saying the same thing.
10:14
SPEAKER_00: That's what it is, unoriginal content.
10:16
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I've been seeing a lot of these characters are running off of scripts that just pull what are the most viral reels of the past couple months or year and then recreating them with these characters.
10:25
Sam Sethi: Yeah.
10:26
Sam Sethi: So they're not even moving off platform, they're good, they're staying on platform, finding the best stuff and republishing on platform even.
10:33
Sam Sethi: I think this whole thing about AI being able to very quickly replicate and copy and monetize uh is a big thing.
10:42
Sam Sethi: I don't think it's just a podcasting thing.
10:45
Sam Sethi: I think it is a I think YouTube's probably facing the same problems.
10:48
Sam Sethi: I'm sure Spotify has.
10:50
Sam Sethi: Maybe they're not even talking about it.
10:52
Sam Sethi: Because it is that ability to take content quickly and use AI to replicate.
10:59
Sam Sethi: Oh well.
11:00
Sam Sethi: Yes, it's all another whack-a-mole job to get on with.
11:04
James Cridland: It really is.
11:05
James Cridland: And again, unfortunately, it's another fault of RSS.
11:09
James Cridland: And those who want to kill RSS can just stick this on their whiteboard along with all of the other reasons why RSS is is is a dreadful idea.
11:17
James Cridland: And that unfortunately is going to be grist to the mill to some of these people as well.
11:22
Sam Sethi: Moving on then, James.
11:24
Sam Sethi: Uh Supercast, the Red Seat Ventures company that's owned by Fox Media, they've done something.
11:30
Sam Sethi: They've added newsletters, according to Jason Suhoy, the CEO.
11:35
Sam Sethi: What have they done?
11:36
James Cridland: Yes, so uh as we've seen Substack and Beehive, who who run newsletters and add podcasts to their tools, what Supercast, who runs a podcast membership tool, of course, has added newsletters.
11:52
James Cridland: That seems to make an awful lot of sense.
11:53
James Cridland: It's offered as part of the base Supercast tool set.
11:57
James Cridland: What's quite nice is that it offers content gating, tiered subscription levels, segment targeting, much the same as Patreon or something else ends up doing.
12:07
James Cridland: So I think it's a very clever move from Jason's Hugh Hoy, of course, uh owned by Red Seat Ventures now.
12:14
James Cridland: And apparently you can build or bring in your free newsletter right into Supercast right now and yeah, and uh scale that and and work that the way that you want to.
12:26
Sam Sethi: We talked about Goalhanger recently doing newsletters as well.
12:29
Sam Sethi: So it seems that you know what was once old is new.
12:33
Sam Sethi: I mean, talking to a man who does a newsletter, obviously.
12:38
Sam Sethi: Have you seen a new interest in people subscribing to newsletters?
12:43
Sam Sethi: Have you seen an uplift?
12:44
Sam Sethi: Is it the thing that everyone's now turning back to?
12:47
James Cridland: Well, I think I mean newsletters are interesting because I mean some uh quite a lot of people say they get rid of the algorithm and they deliver directly to people.
12:56
James Cridland: They don't.
12:57
James Cridland: There's still an algorithm there, uh, and the algorithm is what the email servers do with your emails.
13:03
James Cridland: And unfortunately, it isn't quite as easy as saying it gets rid of the algorithm because it most certainly doesn't.
13:09
James Cridland: Uh interestingly, this week I learnt that Google Workspace has a different spam filter than Gmail.
13:17
James Cridland: And you and you'd think that it would be the same, but no, it's just No, no, no, hang on, no.
13:21
James Cridland: Two products from Google being the same.
13:23
James Cridland: Don't be so stupid, James.
13:25
James Cridland: No.
13:26
James Cridland: So, and there's probably reason for that and everything else.
13:29
James Cridland: So, yeah, so I mean, you know, new newsletters are always fascinating, though.
13:34
James Cridland: You can get far, far closer to your readers with a newsletter because, of course, particularly for websites, but also for you know other things as well, people don't always go and visit a website just to check that somebody has posted a new a new article or whatever.
13:51
James Cridland: And so actually a newsletter is you know is really good.
13:55
James Cridland: And you know, and similarly, I think, you know, we'll we'll uh talk about next week a company which is actually sending emails directly to people that want to know when a podcast has updated itself.
14:09
James Cridland: Because actually, you know, again, emails are a good way of doing that sort of thing.
14:13
James Cridland: So, yeah, I think emails are really interesting, and I think what we're seeing here is a move in this space for these large membership companies to be focusing on offering more services, to be focusing on offering more ways of monetization.
14:29
James Cridland: And I think it's a really exciting time for those of us that want to branch out, not just have a podcast, but have all kinds of other things as well.
14:38
Sam Sethi: Now, talking of Beehive, as you did at the beginning of this segment, you did an interview with Ainsley, who runs their podcasting.
14:46
Sam Sethi: What was that one about?
14:47
James Cridland: Yes, indeed.
14:48
James Cridland: Beehive uh have been very busy bees, if you don't mind me saying so.
14:54
James Cridland: And they've launched a bunch of new stuff.
14:57
James Cridland: So I caught up with Ainsley Rosito, their head of podcasts, and asked her what they'd announced.
15:02
SPEAKER_05: Yeah, so we announced a suite of monetization tools.
15:05
SPEAKER_05: We are going to let creators either flight their own campaigns for ads that they've directly sold, or opt into programmatic advertising that comes along with a suite of dynamic ad insertion tools, the ability to drop breaks in the pre-mid and post-roll sections of your episodes, control how many spots can go into those ad breaks.
15:27
SPEAKER_05: If you're running your own campaigns with us, you have the ability to do some targeting, whether that be if you're a multi-show network, particular shows that you want those campaigns to run on, particular spots you want those campaigns to run in, or more technical things like geographical targeting or you know, pacing, frequency targeting, all those types of things.
15:48
James Cridland: That's nice.
15:49
James Cridland: So you support, you know, if I was to join Beehive, you would support the ads that I am selling, first of all, which is something that uh actually quite a lot of podcast hosts don't actually do.
16:00
James Cridland: So that's a great step forward.
16:02
James Cridland: But you also can provide programmatic ads as well.
16:06
SPEAKER_05: Yeah, we we are working with ads with on the supply as well.
16:10
SPEAKER_05: So a tried and tested and true, I think, great partner that a lot of folks work with in the ecosystem.
16:16
SPEAKER_05: So we wanted to kind of with all things beehive, we try and make sure our solutions can fit people who are new to podcasting or new to newsletters, but also enterprise customers.
16:26
SPEAKER_05: And so we want to make sure we can fit if you have a full sales operation or if you're a brand new podcaster just getting started and you want to make a little bit of cash to at least cover your beehive subscription.
16:38
James Cridland: Now there are some podcast hosting companies that they will sell for you, but it it you can sell as well.
16:46
James Cridland: And it ends up being a bit of a fight as to whose ads actually appear in there.
16:51
James Cridland: What what if I've sold something, but so have you?
16:54
James Cridland: How does that work with your system?
16:56
SPEAKER_05: Sure.
16:57
SPEAKER_05: Your ads will always be prioritized in our waterfall.
17:00
SPEAKER_05: So the way that it works is standard.
17:03
SPEAKER_05: If you've trafficked campaigns that are your advertisements you've sold, those will run first and then second in that waterfall, if you've opted into programmatic advertising, which again is totally optional to you.
17:15
SPEAKER_05: But if you have opted in, those will then flow into your unsold inventory.
17:20
SPEAKER_05: And then if you're running any promos, house promos or event promos or things like that, we'll put those in as the final layer.
17:27
SPEAKER_05: But again, it's all kind of pick and mix.
17:30
SPEAKER_05: If you have a sales lull and you don't have direct campaigns running, we might recommend that you opt into programmatic to kind of maximize your revenue potential.
17:40
SPEAKER_05: But if you don't want programmatic ads, you don't have to have them.
17:43
James Cridland: Yeah.
17:43
James Cridland: Yeah.
17:44
James Cridland: And what happens if people don't want ads in their shows from a listener point of view?
17:50
James Cridland: Is there a way that I can pay to get the the same show but ad-free?
17:55
SPEAKER_05: Some of our podcast creators on the platform have created premium subscriptions with us, and ad-free listening is one of the main benefits that we see.
18:04
SPEAKER_05: So you could do it through through that route if the publisher offers it.
18:08
James Cridland: Yeah, yeah.
18:09
James Cridland: And remind me, you're IAB certified as well, aren't you, in terms of in terms of the numbers that you get back?
18:15
SPEAKER_05: Yes, we are IAB certified and have been since early summer.
18:19
James Cridland: Yeah, yeah, which is and it is fascinating seeing that there's a bunch of companies that have done newsletters, but very much getting into podcasting.
18:29
James Cridland: I think from the way that I'm looking at it, I mean you you you were at B uh you were at Podcast Movement earlier on in the year.
18:37
James Cridland: You hang out in all of the places where podcasters hang out, Ainsley.
18:42
James Cridland: So it it does look as if you're taking this really, really seriously, which is great in comparison to perhaps some of them.
18:49
James Cridland: But I'm finding it really interesting seeing just the amount of companies jumping into this space now.
18:57
James Cridland: Is this something that you think we can continue seeing as sort of an amalgam of membership companies getting involved in newsletters, getting involved in podcasting, getting involved in communities and other things?
19:09
SPEAKER_05: Sure.
19:10
SPEAKER_05: I mean, I think that the newsletter is so interesting because unlike the subscription, you don't actually have to charge to bring someone into your newsletter community, but it does give you a direct point of contact with them.
19:24
SPEAKER_05: You have that email, you own that relationship, and it's something that's a little bit more solid than just the download where you're getting a blank number back and you're guessing, you know, was that a person?
19:35
SPEAKER_05: Is it the same person coming back to listen to my weekly episode or not?
19:41
SPEAKER_05: And so I do think like the emergence of, I think we've seen the subscriptions, whether they're Apple Premium subscriptions or other third parties where you're building those around your podcasts, or now newsletters, or you know, maybe both of those things working together is a really strategic move for podcasters to control and own their audience in a way, especially as like platforms continue to make adjustments that can impact your revenue.
20:08
SPEAKER_05: You still need a way to just make sure you know where to get to your audience and how to find them.
20:14
SPEAKER_05: I think that the newsletter also can create other revenue streams, and it can also help you push your audience to different initiatives you might be working on, not just a podcast.
20:23
SPEAKER_05: Like so many of us have live events now that we want to educate our listeners on.
20:27
SPEAKER_05: And sure we can mention them in the episodes, but maybe you want to get there right into their inbox, give them additional information, visuals, videos, all those kinds of things.
20:37
SPEAKER_05: And it's the best way to service them directly.
20:40
James Cridland: Yeah, I mean, hopefully I would be very confident about a newsletter and what that can do.
20:47
SPEAKER_05: Um I don't have to sell you my Yeah, yeah.
20:50
James Cridland: Not not not especially.
20:52
James Cridland: But you also do things like community, and you you've got a st I I think a store as well where you can sell other things on your do you do stupid question, but you must do sort of, you know, if I wanted to put my entire website onto onto Beehive, it would it would it would exist there, I'm I'm assuming as well.
21:15
SPEAKER_05: Exactly.
21:16
SPEAKER_05: So we we do podcast hosting, newsletters, those are the the two primary ones that we've talked about.
21:22
SPEAKER_05: But community came out earlier this summer, and we do have a full web builder, and then you mentioned digital products.
21:29
SPEAKER_05: And so our goal is you know, all of these services are available to you, and however you need an operating system.
21:36
SPEAKER_05: You don't necessarily have to use them all, but if you were to, you could in theory hit publish on a podcast episode.
21:43
SPEAKER_05: We'd automatically generate a landing page for that episode on your website if it's beehive hosted and it would publish there.
21:50
SPEAKER_05: You wouldn't have to copy and paste a bunch of metadata, a bunch of links, embed players for YouTube and all that.
21:56
SPEAKER_05: You can also automatically sync it up to your community so that episode.
22:00
SPEAKER_05: So drops in your community channel.
22:02
SPEAKER_05: You can facilitate dialogue between members right there.
22:05
SPEAKER_05: If you have anything subscription related, you can also manage that in one place and how people access it and what those subscription tiers are and those sorts of things.
22:15
SPEAKER_05: And then as you mentioned, digital products, you can build out a whole source store on Beehive and host those there as well.
22:22
James Cridland: Yeah, I mean it does seem it does seem as if you've got pretty well everything there.
22:26
James Cridland: You also have APIs into much of this stuff, which is always nice.
22:30
James Cridland: And and I noticed MCP access for your imaginary robot friend, you know, as well on there.
22:37
James Cridland: So so there's a bunch there's a bunch of things going on.
22:41
James Cridland: What what what's next for Beehive?
22:43
James Cridland: What what what where are you where are you headed?
22:46
SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I mean on the podcast side of things, we know we still need to get into video hosting and distribution to be able to get up to parity with some of the other podcast hosting platforms in the ecosystem.
22:58
SPEAKER_05: So that's what's next for us.
22:59
SPEAKER_05: We'll be rolling that out before end of year.
23:02
SPEAKER_05: And like everything else in that suite of products that we talked about, it's going to be very interconnected with those other surfaces of video publishing to web, video publishing to community, and and all those sorts of things.
23:14
SPEAKER_05: And we'll be supporting, you know, publishing your content, not just to Apple and Spotify, but to YouTube as well.
23:21
SPEAKER_05: And there will be a whole analytics suite that goes along with that.
23:24
SPEAKER_05: Because we don't just want to make it easier for you to distribute content, we also want to make it easier for you to understand how it's performing and then do things with that data.
23:33
SPEAKER_05: You know, you mentioned our MCP, and I think it's a really cool thing to be able to say, hey, Beehive, you have all of my newsletter and podcast data, what's working well across these two things?
23:44
SPEAKER_05: And how can I maybe turn that into a digital product or facilitate a conversation in my community?
23:50
SPEAKER_05: And so we want to just continue to build on that foundation with all these new feature releases coming out.
23:56
James Cridland: And I've seen you at a ton of events and things.
24:00
James Cridland: How important is it to be part of the wider podcasts community in in terms of what you're building?
24:06
SPEAKER_05: I mean, it's critical.
24:07
SPEAKER_05: Everything that we have baked into the feature set of our monetization tools has come from user feedback and also my own personal experience working with every different hosting platform that's out there throughout the course of my career and even being on some teams that have built one before.
24:25
SPEAKER_05: But it is so critical for us to hear what creators need and their feedback and build on that.
24:31
SPEAKER_05: Because if we're building a feature that doesn't serve them, then you know what is the point ultimately?
24:37
SPEAKER_05: And I think that that's such a big part of our ethos as well.
24:41
SPEAKER_05: Like when you set up a subscription with us as well, we we don't take a revenue share because we want to do right by the creator.
24:48
SPEAKER_05: And I think you know, people also compare us to some of the other more algorithmic-based platforms.
24:54
SPEAKER_05: Whereas when you host your content on Beehive, you really don't know we exist.
24:59
SPEAKER_05: You don't say I'm going to Beehive to look at XYZ.
25:02
SPEAKER_05: You say I'm going to pot news or I'm going to that podcast or that website.
25:08
SPEAKER_05: And so we just try and be, you know, the legs of the duck working very hard below the water for you.
25:14
James Cridland: Yeah, yeah.
25:14
James Cridland: No, it's it's it's certainly looks very cool.
25:17
James Cridland: And I think um there was a conversation in one of the super secret WhatsApp groups that we were in recently about the rise of the everything app.
25:25
James Cridland: And I think quite a lot of people were just like looking at uh apps that do everything, like Grab in in Indonesia, for example, where you can do your grocery shopping on there, you can book uh taxis, you can do banking, you can do all kinds of stuff in there, and actually saying that the world of podcasting is kind of going that way, isn't it?
25:43
James Cridland: It's it's kind of, you know, we're we're seeing people like Spotify and YouTube having, and particularly Spotify, having audiobooks in there, having podcasts in there, having music in there, and that appears to be working.
25:56
James Cridland: And in fact, I suppose that the only company that isn't doing an everything app, but I suppose is doing an everything device, is Apple, where they are keeping these, you know, entirely separate.
26:07
James Cridland: And I think it's it's interesting seeing you know Beehive very much getting involved in as many parts of the creator economy as possible, in kind of an everything app for the creator economy, I suppose.
26:19
SPEAKER_05: Yeah, exactly.
26:20
SPEAKER_05: And I think that I think that's such an exciting thing.
26:22
SPEAKER_05: I mean, we were talking a little bit before we even got on the phone about how we're now doing video and you know, how podcasting had this big, you know, oh my gosh, we are there there's a kind of a friction of podcasts are really audio.
26:36
SPEAKER_05: Are we gonna really start doing video?
26:38
SPEAKER_05: But it's so much more than that.
26:40
SPEAKER_05: Like seeing podcast content on all these other platforms in all these other ecosystems and different formats just gives so much more opportunity for discovery.
26:49
SPEAKER_05: So I think it's a really exciting thing.
26:51
SPEAKER_05: And I think that platforms who are helping creators extend their content to those different surfaces in different formats are really helping do a service to the creator to help get their content discovered by more audiences.
27:04
SPEAKER_05: So I'm excited by it.
27:06
James Cridland: Yeah, and I think uh certainly self-sustaining creativity is uh is a very good thing.
27:10
James Cridland: So Beehive is it BWEHIIV.com.
27:15
James Cridland: Do you own the proper beehive.com spelling as well?
27:19
James Cridland: You should do.
27:22
James Cridland: So if you want to find out more, you can you can go along there.
27:24
James Cridland: Thank you for your support for the Podnews newsletter as well, Ainsley.
27:27
James Cridland: I really appreciate it, and thank you for your time today.
27:30
SPEAKER_05: Yeah, thank you for your time.
27:31
Announcer: It's great chatting with you.
27:32
Announcer: The Podnews Weekly Review with BuzzSouth with Buzzsprout.
27:36
Announcer: Start podcasting, keep podcasting.
27:40
Sam Sethi: James, now this was a surprise to me.
27:44
Sam Sethi: Instagram has announced their testing.
27:46
Sam Sethi: Note the word testing, because I've seen Adam's post this morning about complaints that Instagram is testing 90-minute horizontal videos of four podcasters.
27:58
Sam Sethi: What what what why have they gone down this road?
28:02
James Cridland: Yes, so they're launching a test of horizontal videos of up to 90 minutes with select creators in the United States.
28:10
James Cridland: Hello from the rest of the world, Instagram! It's a product called features, uh, it's aimed at podcasters very bluntly.
28:18
James Cridland: It's got the ability to refer viewers to the full video from the short form reels on the platform.
28:26
James Cridland: So great.
28:27
James Cridland: Except, well, how does it all work?
28:29
James Cridland: Presumably you'll have to upload your video to somewhere else.
28:32
James Cridland: Great, uh, excellent.
28:34
James Cridland: And secondly, you know, what is the is the HLS involved?
28:39
James Cridland: Is the pass-through involved?
28:40
James Cridland: I wouldn't have thought so.
28:42
James Cridland: You know, how does it all work?
28:43
James Cridland: It's all very, very early doors, I think, for for this.
28:47
James Cridland: They have been quietly testing it with creators in Brazil, so clearly it's worked there, which is why they're now testing it with a few people in the US.
28:56
James Cridland: But is it is it a podcast play?
28:58
James Cridland: I'm not so sure, to be honest, but you know, it's another place, I suppose, for us to put our podcast if we want to.
29:07
Sam Sethi: Yeah, I mean, one of the things for anyone who's interested in hearing more about it in depth, Colin and Samir in their show did a full interview with Adam Massiri.
29:16
Sam Sethi: I mean, the videos will be recommended to users not by followers, not by word of mouth recommendation.
29:24
Sam Sethi: It's algorithmic, and again, we'll be talking more about the problem of that later on.
29:30
Sam Sethi: They also have no exclusivity currently, but Adam did talk about that they will be paying certain brands and certain podcasts to be much more prominent on the platform.
29:43
Sam Sethi: Now, one of the things he did say that I thought was interesting was that the Instagram for TV, which they launched on Samsung, will be on the Apple TV.
29:53
Sam Sethi: They're clearly going after YouTube, they're clearly going after that market space.
29:58
Sam Sethi: And, you know, he talked about the same things we've all talked about for a few weeks.
30:02
Sam Sethi: You know, you start with audio, you get in your car, you're on your way to work, you come home, you put the big screen on, etc.
30:09
Sam Sethi: But what he did say that I found really interesting in the interview is that it could affect the rest of Instagram.
30:16
SPEAKER_09: We're taking a big risk with this long form thing.
30:18
SPEAKER_09: Like I I still am I don't know if it's gonna work, right?
30:21
SPEAKER_09: I still really believe that short form and friends are very adjacent, and long form, I'm trying to figure out a way to like reshape it so it's adjacent.
30:30
SPEAKER_09: But it you know, we could be wrong.
30:32
Sam Sethi: And he worries that the watch time on the long form will affect people doing clips or uploading photos, because let's say you've got one hour of attention available before you have to do the next task you're on to.
30:47
Sam Sethi: Well, if you're watching that long form video, you're not DMing people, you're not uploading photos, you're not creating reels, you're not watching reels even.
30:55
Sam Sethi: So he worries about the bastardisation of the platform, and that's why I think they're very being very cautious right now about what they do.
31:04
Sam Sethi: One of the things that Colin Smear said was they worry that people are gonna invest into the Instagram platform and that 12 months from now Instagram are gonna get bored because it's gonna affect the rest of the platform.
31:15
Sam Sethi: I think again, Adam tried to say, Oh no, no, no, no, no, no, and then they brought back the fact that you know Instagram have brought features in the past and then they've got rid of them.
31:26
Sam Sethi: So I think it's interesting, as you said, James, another place.
31:31
Sam Sethi: But it won't be through RSS, probably, and it will be through an API, and it probably will be manually uploaded, and seems to be the trend which you know Apple, YouTube, Spotify are using.
31:43
Sam Sethi: So worry, worry, worry.
31:46
James Cridland: Indeed, indeed.
31:47
James Cridland: Yes.
31:48
James Cridland: I I will not be hurrying to post stuff onto Instagram, it must be said.
31:53
Announcer: From your daily newsletter, the Pard News Weekly Review.
31:57
James Cridland: So uh Sam, uh I caught up with Kate Cocker earlier on this week.
32:02
James Cridland: So uh Kate, like me, does a daily podcast, but she actually does a proper daily podcast, i.e., she even does Saturdays and Sundays as well.
32:11
James Cridland: And she's done 3,000 consecutive days now, which is quite a thing.
32:16
James Cridland: The podcast is called Everyday Positivity.
32:19
James Cridland: She started doing it quite some time ago.
32:22
James Cridland: 2016 is when she started doing it.
32:25
James Cridland: She's got over eight million all-time downloads.
32:28
James Cridland: And I thought it would be really interesting just to have a quick chat with her to understand a little bit more about what she does, why she does it, and the sorts of things that have really worked for her to make sure that everyday positivity is listened to by a ton of people.
32:45
SPEAKER_06: Hello, my name's Kate Cocker, and I present the Everyday Positivity Podcast.
32:48
SPEAKER_06: We're a podcast that's been going for eight years, and we're all about a nugget of positivity for your day so that we make your life better every single day.
32:56
SPEAKER_06: 3,000 and odd plus episodes old, and we've been going for about eight years.
33:02
SPEAKER_06: And the the the day job is pres hop training presenters how to speak on mic or on stage uh in business and in broadcast.
33:10
James Cridland: Very good.
33:11
James Cridland: So presenters like podcast hosts, but also radio people and that sort of thing.
33:18
James Cridland: So everyday positivity, 3,000 episodes.
33:21
James Cridland: So when did when did the show start and why did the show start?
33:24
SPEAKER_06: So the show started in July 2018, which we know very well now because we've counted the 3,000 episodes.
33:31
SPEAKER_06: Um and we started well, I start I I came up with the idea six months previously because I'd gone through a bout of depression again.
33:38
SPEAKER_06: But this time I was like, I don't really know why.
33:41
SPEAKER_06: Like before it had been, oh, I've maybe lost a job or I'd had the kids and I'd had postnatal depression.
33:46
SPEAKER_06: This time I was like, I don't really know why this is happening.
33:49
SPEAKER_06: And as I came out of that slump, I'd found that daily affirmations in the set in the form of good friends and exercise instructors was really helpful.
34:02
SPEAKER_06: And I sat in a pub with my husband and I said, in the January of that year, I said, I think I could do if I need daily reminding that things are good and everything's okay and I've got to keep a positive mindset, surely everyone else does too.
34:14
SPEAKER_06: And he went, just put a hold on that.
34:16
SPEAKER_06: You know, I don't think it's a priority at the moment.
34:17
SPEAKER_06: I went, Yeah, you're probably right like that.
34:19
SPEAKER_06: Six months later, I got a Facebook note in one of the podcast groups from Company in America saying, We're looking for daily content, short daily content.
34:27
SPEAKER_06: Does anyone have any?
34:27
SPEAKER_06: And I went, I went, I do.
34:29
SPEAKER_06: And that's how we launched.
34:31
SPEAKER_06: So we I said, I said it, I said I wanted it to be called everyday PMA at the beginning.
34:35
SPEAKER_06: And they advised that actually that probably wasn't, you know, people didn't know what PMA was, so let's call it everyday positivity.
34:41
SPEAKER_06: And I was like, okay, fine, I'll do that.
34:43
SPEAKER_06: And then I wrote 27 episodes, and uh and they said, Do you think you could keep going with it?
34:48
SPEAKER_06: And I went, Well, I've written 27 episodes without looking at a book yet.
34:52
SPEAKER_06: So yeah, I think I can.
34:53
SPEAKER_06: And here we are 3,000 episodes later, and I have.
34:56
unknown: Yeah.
34:57
SPEAKER_06: And it works.
34:59
James Cridland: So how do you how do you do a show every day?
35:02
James Cridland: What what's the uh do you do you actually do a show?
35:08
James Cridland: Do you actually do seven shows on Monday?
35:11
James Cridland: Or or do you actually do a show every single day?
35:13
SPEAKER_06: Well, I think it's important to recognise that the show that we're talking about is very low production maintenance.
35:20
SPEAKER_06: You know, it's easy to make.
35:21
SPEAKER_06: So it's often anywhere between two and five minutes or one and a half and five minutes, because it's meant to be, at the time I launched it, I thought, you know, it's just like an Instagram quote.
35:30
SPEAKER_06: It's meant to be like a little just a little drop.
35:33
SPEAKER_06: So it's not like I'm doing an hour a day.
35:35
SPEAKER_06: So let's first of all say that's one of the reasons that this works so well daily.
35:39
SPEAKER_06: Second of all, it depends on the week.
35:43
SPEAKER_06: So largely I adopted a lot of radio methodologies.
35:48
SPEAKER_06: So when we first started doing it, it was like it's here today, gone tomorrow.
35:52
SPEAKER_06: So when I say I've done 3,000 episodes, we can talk a bit about content if you want to, but it's not like I'm I've never repeated an episode.
35:58
SPEAKER_06: I've never picked up an episode and played out the same episode in its audio file again.
36:04
SPEAKER_06: But the same concepts come around and I do tell the same stories because it's here today, gone tomorrow.
36:08
SPEAKER_06: And then to answer your question, the way that we record it is I don't like getting too far ahead because I like the topicality of it.
36:16
SPEAKER_06: Usually in a week, I might do three on one day and four on another in an ideal world.
36:21
SPEAKER_06: But if I'm running out of ideas, it's daily, or if one of us goes on holiday, as in my producer I goes on holiday, we get a good week and a half ahead.
36:28
SPEAKER_06: So it's exactly like having a radio show, right?
36:30
SPEAKER_06: You either pre-record when you need to and you do a few ahead, or you are doing it live, or you know, you're recording it on the day.
36:36
SPEAKER_06: So that's that's usually the way that it goes.
36:38
SPEAKER_06: So it's a bit of both.
36:40
James Cridland: One of the reasons I I I would guess why you try not to get too far ahead is that you you have emails from your audience and you read those emails out.
36:52
James Cridland: And I I talk a lot when I'm talking about radio, I'm talking a lot about communities and communities of common interest.
37:00
James Cridland: And you know, my my current shtick is talking about the coffee shop that I go to every single day.
37:05
James Cridland: I don't really go for the coffee, I go for the for the other people there.
37:09
James Cridland: And I I'm I'm it does sound as if you have that sort of community too, right?
37:16
SPEAKER_06: Yeah, I do.
37:17
SPEAKER_06: And I've got so many things I could I could say about this because there's so many interesting there's so many interesting things.
37:25
SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
37:25
James Cridland: So I think about Kenya, first of all.
37:28
SPEAKER_06: Okay, well Kenya is Kenya came out, so there are oh gosh, yeah.
37:33
SPEAKER_06: So community starts, COVID hits, we start doing live calls.
37:39
SPEAKER_06: So I start putting in place, like, let's just create a space where we can all get together.
37:44
SPEAKER_06: And those went really well, and we just started calling them the hangouts.
37:47
SPEAKER_06: And then I would run some courses around like habit setting or positivity and things like that.
37:52
SPEAKER_06: And so what then happens is you've got listeners that you're starting to draw into your world.
37:56
SPEAKER_06: And I started doing some one-to-one coaching, and one of those people kind of started to become a bit more like a friend, and so she then decided that she was going to renew her wedding vows in Kenya because she's always she loves safari, she knows quite a lot, she's got good connections there.
38:12
SPEAKER_06: And so she was like, I'd really love you to come.
38:15
SPEAKER_06: And I was like, I can't, you know, this is this is weird.
38:17
SPEAKER_06: You're a listener, you can't invite me to Kenya.
38:19
SPEAKER_06: Like, that's odd.
38:20
SPEAKER_06: And I said, Well, I need a job if I'm coming, I can take pictures or I can I can cook.
38:25
SPEAKER_06: I'm really good like that.
38:25
SPEAKER_06: And she went, Will you officiate?
38:27
SPEAKER_06: And I was like, Isn't that cool?
38:29
SPEAKER_06: Like your favourite podcast host is officiated.
38:32
SPEAKER_06: And I was like, But I'm not ordained.
38:33
SPEAKER_06: She goes, We're already married, we're just renewing our vows.
38:36
SPEAKER_06: Yes.
38:36
SPEAKER_06: So uh, so yeah, so me and the my producer Will, we went to Kenya.
38:40
SPEAKER_06: And you know, she's a really good friend now.
38:42
SPEAKER_06: And I've got a couple of people like that who have been with me since the beginning, who the other day I had another, literally this week I had another woman that has been having one-to-one coaching, and she's sort of come to the end of it, and I went, Can we just be friends?
38:56
SPEAKER_06: And so, yeah, so she she and I are gonna continue speaking regularly because you know there's a there's a lovely benefit to it.
39:03
SPEAKER_06: But what I really got out of the community, I suppose, I think the first and foremost, the thing that I've got out of the community the most is that they drive the content and the need and the desires.
39:14
SPEAKER_06: So actually, those monthly hangouts were a great place for us to connect, just like you said.
39:20
SPEAKER_06: I've got friends all around the world now.
39:22
SPEAKER_06: It's it's wonderful, right?
39:23
SPEAKER_06: I've got I've got this sense of this being that I speak to that is a group of people.
39:28
SPEAKER_06: But also they remind me that, you know, just because I'm wanging on positively every single day, and just because I think, oh, that must mean everybody's got it, people are still people have still got their backs to carry.
39:39
SPEAKER_06: They've still got stuff going on in their lives that they're having to manage while they go out into the real world and work and be in front of people.
39:47
SPEAKER_06: And, you know, helping people to maintain that mindset is a constant thing.
39:51
SPEAKER_06: So, you know, it gives me a lot of confidence around those 3,000 days as well.
39:54
James Cridland: Yeah, yeah.
39:55
James Cridland: I mean, 3,000 episodes is uh is is quite a thing.
39:59
James Cridland: What what are some of the changes that you've seen in podcasting since 2018?
40:04
SPEAKER_06: I thought you might ask me this because the fundamental change is video, right?
40:08
SPEAKER_06: The biggest change is we all jumped on our microphones and went, yay, we'll pee, this is really cheap to do, and we can do it, and it's really great, and we're connecting with people and people are listening.
40:15
James Cridland: But you are you are sitting in a fancy studio with a nice camera.
40:21
James Cridland: You've got the regulation bookshelf with one book behind you.
40:24
James Cridland: You've got the regulation.
40:28
James Cridland: Oh, it's a pillow.
40:29
James Cridland: Oh, I know.
40:31
James Cridland: I know where you got that.
40:33
James Cridland: And you've also got and you've also got the wooden slats that everybody has now.
40:37
SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
40:38
SPEAKER_06: And I've also got I've got I've got an office where I've put the wooden slats, and my husband's got an office where he's put the wooden slats, so it all looks like we're in the same room if we're in a different place as well.
40:48
James Cridland: Very nice.
40:49
SPEAKER_06: Which is very clever.
40:50
SPEAKER_06: So yeah, so video, and we don't do it for everyday positivity.
40:55
SPEAKER_06: Like you'll have noticed, we're not on YouTube every single day.
40:58
SPEAKER_06: And it's one of those in the back of your mind where you're like, we should really be on YouTube every single day.
41:03
SPEAKER_06: We really should.
41:04
SPEAKER_06: The truth is, we tried it a couple a few years ago.
41:07
SPEAKER_06: We just went too early.
41:08
SPEAKER_06: And when we did it, we were like, oh, this isn't really worth the traction that it's getting versus the work and the cost that it's taking.
41:17
SPEAKER_06: I think now it's a bit different, but really there are some weeks where you know the beauty is that we can do it this quickly on on microphone and we turn it out and turn it round.
41:28
SPEAKER_06: So it is something that is in the pipeline.
41:30
SPEAKER_06: We said to the listeners on day 3000 that over the next hundred days we would we would evolve, you know, and improve the the podcast.
41:38
SPEAKER_06: So that's one of the things that we'll be starting to put in.
41:41
SPEAKER_06: So we just haven't got to it yet.
41:43
SPEAKER_06: That's the truth of it.
41:44
SPEAKER_06: I think there's something to be said as well.
41:46
SPEAKER_06: I think, and I suspect there are other podcasters listening who are also in this, which is you've got a really good community doing it the way that you've done it.
41:54
SPEAKER_06: You don't think, oh, I need to now build that community, or the moment will come when I can put more time in to build that community up.
42:00
SPEAKER_06: Actually, we you know, we you know, we might be guilty of resting on our laurels a little bit, you know, being a bit complacent.
42:06
SPEAKER_06: But I think, you know, we know that we've got that community there and we know that they are listening rather than watching.
42:11
SPEAKER_06: So it's a bit of a way up, I think.
42:13
SPEAKER_06: You you juggle what what what is possible at the time.
42:16
James Cridland: Yeah, and I think, you know, one of the things that we've found on this show is, you know, we have our power supporters, we have 25 of those people.
42:26
James Cridland: We all talk in a WhatsApp group.
42:28
James Cridland: Nice.
42:28
James Cridland: Because I've learnt that there's a thing in the world called time zones.
42:32
James Cridland: And time zones, time zones make it very difficult to actually have a face-to-face, you know, conversation at a time that actually suits.
42:40
James Cridland: And that's one of the things Sam keeps on talking to me about doing the show live.
42:44
James Cridland: Uh, and I'm saying, I you know, it's it's not gonna work live because you know, the only time that Sam and I can talk, all of the Americans are asleep.
42:54
James Cridland: And so actually, you know, none of that bit works.
42:57
James Cridland: So it's interesting that we've all sort of found our way round how to do a community, how those communities work, but specifically done for this particular type of, you know, for our particular community and our, you know, the people who we who we have there.
43:14
James Cridland: I I think that that's a really interesting thing.
43:16
SPEAKER_06: Gosh, it's really true, you know.
43:19
SPEAKER_06: I we are definitely American leading because when we started with Volley, they're not called Volley anymore, they're called weekend.
43:25
SPEAKER_06: They had the American audience because they're in San Francisco.
43:28
SPEAKER_06: Right.
43:28
SPEAKER_06: And so her heritagely, we have we have more American audience higher American audience than we do a UK audience.
43:34
SPEAKER_06: The UK audience has grown over the years, but I'm I think it's very minimal what we have over in your part of the world, in Australia.
43:42
SPEAKER_06: And so you're right, because we work to those two time zones.
43:46
SPEAKER_06: We, you know, when my hangouts are on a Sunday afternoon, late Sunday afternoons, so I've got Pacific time, that's 10am, you know, and UK time it's 6 p.m.
43:54
SPEAKER_06: So that makes it work as a Sunday, but then anything else, anytime I'm trying to do anything else, I'm in people's work.
44:00
SPEAKER_06: Days, all of that.
44:01
SPEAKER_06: So yeah, you are right when you say yeah, time zones is a whole thing.
44:05
SPEAKER_06: It's a whole thing.
44:07
James Cridland: So how how sticky are your are your audience?
44:10
James Cridland: I'm not talking about uh physically how sticky are they.
44:14
James Cridland: I'm talking more about how long have they stuck with you?
44:17
James Cridland: Because I think you've done a survey, haven't you?
44:20
SPEAKER_06: I have.
44:22
SPEAKER_06: And I can't remember the answer on that bit of a survey.
44:25
SPEAKER_06: Okay.
44:26
James Cridland: Quite a lot of people have have stuck around by the looks of things.
44:29
James Cridland: 44.
44:30
SPEAKER_06: I mean that is the answer.
44:31
SPEAKER_06: I couldn't give you the number.
44:32
SPEAKER_06: But the the the answer is that lots of them.
44:36
SPEAKER_06: No, I what I was going to say, which I think is a really interesting thing to see with community, is that you get people who come in, really love it, stay for a bit, and then they obviously have, you know, they're on to the next thing.
44:48
SPEAKER_06: So I definitely have noticed these waves over time where you get this sort of you've got these names that come up in the Facebook group or names that come up on the comments a lot, or they turn up to the hangout.
44:57
SPEAKER_06: But we do have a core that really have listened for a very long time.
45:01
SPEAKER_06: And, you know, they will say we listen for five, six, seven, eight years, you know, more than five years.
45:06
SPEAKER_06: So yeah, we do have a a loyal following, which to your po which to the point of video, it's like you sort of are always weighing up.
45:14
SPEAKER_06: If you do something new, will they like it?
45:17
SPEAKER_07: Yes.
45:17
unknown: Yes.
45:18
SPEAKER_06: You know, is that actually an addition or is it a detraction?
45:20
SPEAKER_06: And you know, how how are we serving them best?
45:23
SPEAKER_06: So we're really reviewing that in the moment.
45:25
James Cridland: So Well, our total hours for this for this podcast have have have gone down since we added video.
45:31
James Cridland: So I'm not quite sure what that tells you.
45:33
James Cridland: Yeah, right.
45:34
SPEAKER_06: Okay, that's really interesting.
45:36
James Cridland: So maybe they're seeing you.
45:38
James Cridland: Yeah, well, maybe that's it.
45:40
James Cridland: Maybe it's not me, maybe it's Sam.
45:43
James Cridland: That's what I think is the is what's going on.
45:46
James Cridland: To ask a stupid question, then, are you are you earning money from this?
45:49
James Cridland: And and if so, how does the business work?
45:52
SPEAKER_06: So the stupid question is not a stupid question.
45:55
SPEAKER_06: It's we do two things now.
45:57
SPEAKER_06: We have ads on ACAST and we have the Patreon community.
46:01
SPEAKER_06: Would when we say do we earn money on it?
46:06
SPEAKER_06: I think we've ever, you know, I look at other podcasts and go, gosh, wow, that would be amazing to earn that much money.
46:11
SPEAKER_06: We're more of a, you know, we can put that back in and afford, you know, for the part we're gonna do a listener party online, for example, and we were talking the other day and going, actually, do you remember that time we bought everyone coffee?
46:21
SPEAKER_06: Let's do something like that again, because you can just do the QR code on the Starbucks.
46:25
SPEAKER_06: So it is, it's still a bit beer money, I'd say, but it drives so many other opportunities and so many other things, and we really love doing it.
46:33
SPEAKER_06: So, in terms of it as its own business, it probably it it holds its own, but it's not making, it's not like we're walking away going skip, skip, let's get some some.
46:42
James Cridland: But I mean it's marketing for you, right?
46:43
James Cridland: And it's marketing for other things that you do.
46:46
SPEAKER_06: Exactly right.
46:47
SPEAKER_06: And, you know, with the presenter coach, what we talk about is great communication will change your life, including the way you talk to yourself.
46:53
SPEAKER_06: And mindset's a really important part of what we do.
46:56
SPEAKER_06: So this is a great resource because I push people this way and go, you know, listen to this podcast.
47:00
SPEAKER_06: And I get clients in that sphere who go, Oh, I listened to the podcast this morning, which is another reason I don't like to get too far ahead, because then I go, What did I say?
47:09
SPEAKER_07: What was I talking about?
47:10
SPEAKER_06: Oh God, because they talk to me like it's today, and I like, I'm like, yeah, what did I say?
47:15
SPEAKER_06: So uh so yeah, I try and keep try and keep it close.
47:18
SPEAKER_06: But what I would say has been part of our challenge is with ads.
47:24
SPEAKER_06: So we're like two to five minutes long, right?
47:27
SPEAKER_06: And if an ad is running at 30 to 60 seconds, that's like 25% of our podcast.
47:34
SPEAKER_06: So so putting an ad on the front of the oh irate.
47:38
SPEAKER_06: We didn't meet we did it by accident when we first joined ACAST.
47:40
SPEAKER_06: Oh, they were irate.
47:41
SPEAKER_06: The listeners hated us, and we were like, I'm like, I'm so sorry, I didn't mean to do it.
47:44
SPEAKER_06: I was like on everything, going, I'm so sorry like this.
47:47
SPEAKER_06: Um so we we do make sure it goes on the end.
47:51
SPEAKER_06: And we got an email the other day saying, you know, we're gonna be putting this in this place.
47:54
SPEAKER_06: We're like, don't do that, put it on the end, you know, we can't have it at the beginning.
47:58
SPEAKER_06: Because there's no, not even with a skip function that you don't want to listen to a two-minute podcast and have to skip at the beginning.
48:03
SPEAKER_06: It's it's it's a it's it's a that's been one of the challenges.
48:07
SPEAKER_06: So you have to really think about that context, I think, of of what the adverts are bringing.
48:11
SPEAKER_06: So yeah, we put them on the end.
48:13
James Cridland: What's the future for everyday positivity?
48:16
James Cridland: What have you got planned?
48:17
James Cridland: What are your thoughts?
48:19
SPEAKER_06: So planned.
48:22
SPEAKER_06: I want to we'll drive the community some more because I think we need to put in some energy into that.
48:29
SPEAKER_06: So we're gonna drive the community more, we're gonna do some more long-form stuff.
48:32
SPEAKER_06: So we're looking to the I think the YouTube channel is where we start putting long-form content.
48:36
SPEAKER_06: So rather than trying to post there every single day short form content, we're looking at having more interviews, building, uh, having more guests, and building that YouTube community in that way.
48:45
SPEAKER_06: You know, I'm not against YouTube at all.
48:47
SPEAKER_06: I think it's such a great platform, and obviously the search engine element and blah blah blah.
48:50
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
48:50
SPEAKER_06: So yeah, so but I just we've for forever we've been like, people the listers have been saying we want more long form.
48:55
SPEAKER_06: And then we do this long form and then we put it behind the paywall at Patreon, and I'm like, it just doesn't feel quite right.
49:00
SPEAKER_06: So the epiphany has been like, right, let's use YouTube for longer form content.
49:04
SPEAKER_06: So there's that.
49:05
SPEAKER_06: So that's guest-wise, but we've got to start booking some guests.
49:07
SPEAKER_06: So if anyone wants to come on, come chat.
49:09
SPEAKER_06: We've got a comedian book lined up, and that's probably about it at the moment.
49:11
SPEAKER_06: So we're we're on our way to doing that.
49:13
SPEAKER_06: The hangout I'd like to turn into a journaling club because we know that every Sunday we do a journal prompt.
49:19
SPEAKER_06: And the idea is that you you can you can write and journal if you want, or you're just mulling over.
49:24
SPEAKER_06: And the journal prompt is always really popular, so we want to move into proper, you know, journal clubs rather than so we do guided journaling rather than just having a hangout.
49:34
SPEAKER_06: And with that, hopefully, then we can start developing some journaling.
49:37
SPEAKER_06: And then the really interesting thing that's going on in the background that you'll love is that we're working with a company at the moment who is trying to build positive mental health toolkits, if you like, via AI.
49:49
SPEAKER_06: So we've got then, and we've been working with them for a long time.
49:53
SPEAKER_06: So that we maybe in the new, it's a bit, you know, it's one of those, it's in development, so it's a bit, but in the new year, we want to be able to for people to be able to make their own visualizations, make their own meditation tracks, make their own journal, you know.
50:05
SPEAKER_06: So that's all coming down the line.
50:07
SPEAKER_06: We've always had a little eye on what you can do in that technical world.
50:11
SPEAKER_06: Like really, we we did many, many years ago.
50:14
SPEAKER_06: I had they when D script first started doing the overdub stuff, they used my voice because there was so much online.
50:20
SPEAKER_06: Right.
50:20
SPEAKER_06: So yeah, we used my voice.
50:21
SPEAKER_06: So I hope I was like one of the first times I ever heard myself back.
50:24
SPEAKER_06: I was like, whoa, it's really quite scary.
50:26
SPEAKER_06: What's possible?
50:27
SPEAKER_06: So yeah, it was really weird.
50:29
SPEAKER_06: I threw my phone across the room because it was the only thing that said it wasn't me was the crackle that was behind, and now they've got rid of that stuff, right?
50:35
SPEAKER_06: So you can but my inflection, everything, it was bizarre.
50:38
SPEAKER_07: Wow.
50:39
SPEAKER_06: So yeah, so we've always kind of had an eye on what's the technology that's coming and how can we use it to serve the community.
50:45
SPEAKER_06: And I do think that idea that people who love doing vision boards, or people who love doing journaling, or you know, or love making visualizations or meditations, or that there's an AI tool that we we are working with the company that build that to bring everyday positivity community into that.
51:02
SPEAKER_06: So yeah, so that's a lit, that's an interesting little space as well.
51:06
SPEAKER_06: So yeah, big big interviews online, journal club, AI, you know, beyond it just telling you you're a really great parent, which is basically what I do these days.
51:15
SPEAKER_06: I'm like go to Gemini and go, why does my teenager hate me?
51:19
SPEAKER_06: And it goes, it's not you, don't worry, they're just and I'm like, thanks, like that.
51:22
James Cridland: So yes, yes, gosh, I know that feeling.
51:26
James Cridland: So everyday positivity is available wherever you get your podcasts.
51:30
James Cridland: Tell us where we can find the presenter coach and other things that you do, Kate.
51:34
SPEAKER_06: So the presenter coach is the website is thepresentercoach.co.uk.
51:38
SPEAKER_06: And or you can find I am on LinkedIn, it's my key place, I have to say.
51:42
SPEAKER_06: I'm just limited to one.
51:44
SPEAKER_06: But I try and avoid being a twat on LinkedIn.
51:47
SPEAKER_06: Yes.
51:47
SPEAKER_06: So uh yeah, so just find me there, Kate Tucker.
51:50
SPEAKER_06: And you can sign up too.
51:51
SPEAKER_06: We're now running a monthly webinar, if you like, or community space in the presenter coach called the sounding board, an opportunity to hear from like great communicators and and hear their expertise.
52:03
SPEAKER_06: So you can sign up for that.
52:04
SPEAKER_06: Again, that's at the presentercoach.co.uk forward slash sign up.
52:07
SPEAKER_06: But if you just sign up there, then you can help communicate better at work, basically.
52:11
James Cridland: All good.
52:12
James Cridland: Kate, it's uh great to great to uh to uh catch up and we'll speak again soon, I'm sure.
52:16
SPEAKER_06: Yeah, lovely to speak to you.
52:17
SPEAKER_06: See you later.
52:18
Sam Sethi: Last week's guest was Professor Stephen Goldstein, and he said something that you clipped out, which was There's romance for legacy podcasters in the RSS feed.
52:29
SPEAKER_04: I don't care.
52:30
SPEAKER_04: I want to put content in front of you wherever you are, and I don't care what the platform is.
52:36
SPEAKER_04: If it's something that you're interested in, we'll figure out how to get the content there.
52:40
SPEAKER_04: I don't think we can be tethered to the RSS feed.
52:43
SPEAKER_04: I mean, there's something so magical about being able to publish at once and have it go to every platform.
52:48
SPEAKER_04: Love that.
52:49
SPEAKER_04: This will not stand the test of time, I don't think.
52:52
SPEAKER_04: That's not so great for us.
52:54
SPEAKER_04: But let's be realistic about where things are going.
52:57
SPEAKER_04: And we're renting space on other people's platforms.
53:01
Sam Sethi: I think for you and I and for many in the podcasting to-do community, that's that's five years of work putting the metadata into the RSS feed.
53:09
Sam Sethi: It feels a little bit sort of oh my god.
53:12
Sam Sethi: But we have talked on this show extensively, James, about the worry that people trying to define a podcast never define the podcast as and RSS.
53:22
Sam Sethi: And I've always said that it's not a podcast unless it has RSS.
53:26
Sam Sethi: It's something else if you upload it via an API.
53:29
Sam Sethi: It's not a podcast.
53:31
Sam Sethi: That's my line, but you know, others will say no, just just get over yourself, Sam, because you know, it's a podcast, it's a podcast, right?
53:39
Sam Sethi: But Stephen's gone one stage further this week.
53:42
Sam Sethi: He's now said the death of the follower in his latest newsletter.
53:48
Sam Sethi: So now we don't have RSS and we don't have followers, according to Stephen.
53:52
Sam Sethi: He said basically, are we now seeing the death of the follower?
53:56
Sam Sethi: Because the algorithmic level of podcast.
54:00
Sam Sethi: Now we've always talked about podcasting being word of mouth, you know.
54:03
Sam Sethi: Um hey, have you heard about this?
54:06
Sam Sethi: And you follow people and you subscribe to feeds, and that's all been the great way of doing it.
54:11
Sam Sethi: But actually, when I read the article, I did stop and think.
54:15
Sam Sethi: If I look at my TikTok usage, I don't use the follower.
54:20
Sam Sethi: I really f I don't follow people on TikTok, I don't see the point.
54:23
Sam Sethi: The 4U feed, according to CUSO.ai, I've never heard of them, they analyzed 31,000 creators and they said that 85% of views were from the 4U feed.
54:36
Sam Sethi: And I thought about it for myself.
54:38
Sam Sethi: I don't actually look at the follower tab.
54:40
Sam Sethi: I don't.
54:40
Sam Sethi: I just don't.
54:41
James Cridland: So how many views were from the the following feed rather than the algorithmic 4U feed?
54:50
James Cridland: Wow.
54:52
Sam Sethi: That's that's quite a difference, isn't it?
54:55
Sam Sethi: Yeah.
54:56
Sam Sethi: And I don't really follow people on YouTube.
54:59
Sam Sethi: I don't really follow pe so again, I'm just wondering, has Stephen come across something?
55:04
Sam Sethi: What's your thoughts?
55:06
James Cridland: Well, I think I think a few things.
55:08
James Cridland: I think firstly, just to come back to the RSS is dead thing.
55:11
James Cridland: I think RSS is great as a d distribution medium, even for video.
55:16
James Cridland: It was built to keep media content free.
55:19
James Cridland: It was built to keep media content available to everybody.
55:23
James Cridland: But where RSS falls down is the analytics.
55:26
James Cridland: So for downloaded media, obviously, there's no way to know whether the ad that's 30 minutes into this show was ever watched.
55:33
James Cridland: There isn't an ad 30 minutes into the show, but you know what I mean.
55:35
James Cridland: HLS video does go to some way towards fixing that, but only some way.
55:40
James Cridland: The problem is that the people that want to make money from consumption data are not the people that believe in free open media.
55:49
James Cridland: And those salespeople would happily close everything off and happily have podcasts in two or three places, not you know, over 160 different podcast apps that now exist.
56:02
James Cridland: So I think, you know, we we've got two sets of people.
56:06
James Cridland: One set of people that comes from the New York City make money, make money, hustle, hustle, hustle culture, and one set of people that are not doing it quite for money, and that are actually doing it because of ideas and let the ideas be free, man.
56:20
James Cridland: And so I think we've got that sort of, you know, as one sort of side.
56:24
James Cridland: I think then you've got this whole follower thing and the you know, it's perfectly possible, for example, to use YouTube without subscribing to a single channel.
56:36
James Cridland: Perfectly possible because YouTube still understands what you like, still wants to make sure that what you do is, you know, is is to watch more stuff.
56:46
James Cridland: So it'll still recommend things that it thinks you will find interesting, regardless of who you subscribe to or not.
56:53
James Cridland: And you know, podcasting is beginning to go that way, and particularly Apple Podcasts, if you start looking at some of the changes that they've done in the new version of iOS 27.2, which has uh come out this week, you can very clearly see in there that there's much more algorithmic stuff in there in their homepage to get you to keep on listening to stuff that you started to and all of that kind of uh thing.
57:18
James Cridland: So you know, you can argue that the death of the follower is one thing, but you can also say that they do do different things.
57:26
James Cridland: And you do the difference, I suppose, with a podcast is that you are kind of following creators and wanting to hear that same show every single week.
57:39
James Cridland: That's what podcasting has historically always been about.
57:43
James Cridland: YouTube, not actually as much.
57:46
James Cridland: YouTube you can f flit from topic to topic to topic and still get very engaged and involved.
57:53
James Cridland: Podcasting has never really had that concept of topics within episodes.
57:59
James Cridland: We don't have that rich metadata.
58:01
James Cridland: And so actually, you know, the the thing that we have been doing is following people rather than anything else.
58:07
James Cridland: So I think time will tell.
58:09
James Cridland: I'm not sure necessarily that I agree with everything that the professor says, but I think, you know, certainly you can certainly see that um, you know, part of the benefit for podcasting on YouTube is that there is that algorithm, and that algorithm throws new and interesting things, you know, in front of you.
58:30
Sam Sethi: Yeah, I mean I remember back in the bad old days of early Facebook where everyone was chasing likes and brands were chasing likes, and then good old Facebook, once you'd got a great follower count, throttle that access until you paid them to give more access to your followers.
58:49
Sam Sethi: I see the same on LinkedIn today.
58:51
Sam Sethi: You know, I've got over 5,000 followers currently on LinkedIn.
58:55
Sam Sethi: I'll put a post about what we're doing here.
58:58
Sam Sethi: I reckon it'll reach probably a couple of hundred in that five thousand, I'm pretty sure.
59:02
Sam Sethi: And yeah, every time after I post, it's like boost, pay us, pay us to get more reach.
59:08
Sam Sethi: Yes, exactly.
59:09
James Cridland: Well, that's Microsoft for you.
59:11
James Cridland: Uh that's Microsoft Meta and all of them.
59:15
James Cridland: Now, no, you're right.
59:16
James Cridland: You're right.
59:17
James Cridland: But but you know, I mean, but but you can but you can also have a look at I, you know, I found it interesting that this week we've seen two new podcast apps launch that have algorithms, but they have algorithms in very different ways.
59:30
James Cridland: And they're specifically there for discovery.
59:33
James Cridland: And I and again, I don't think that there's a problem with that.
59:36
James Cridland: So if you did i if you haven't seen both of them, one of them that we covered on Monday, I think, was a thing called Dial Flipper, and it works a bit like an old-fashioned radio.
59:45
James Cridland: So you tell it some of the shows that you like, and then it will just play stuff that it thinks that you're into.
59:52
James Cridland: But it does two very interesting things.
59:54
James Cridland: Firstly, it drops you into the middle of a podcast right rather than right at the beginning.
59:59
James Cridland: So you actually get the middle of a conversation, and you can go, oh, this is interesting.
1:00:04
James Cridland: I'll I'll restart this show and have a listen to it properly.
1:00:07
James Cridland: Or you can go, this isn't really for me.
1:00:09
James Cridland: I'll just flip the dial again, and it flips it again and takes you to another show that it thinks you might like and begins to learn from what you stick with and what you don't.
1:00:17
James Cridland: I think that's a really interesting model.
1:00:19
James Cridland: There's nothing wrong with that model.
1:00:21
James Cridland: Uh it works with uh OpenRSS, you know, and why not?
1:00:24
James Cridland: The other one is one that we mentioned in yesterday's newsletter, something called Static Radio.
1:00:31
James Cridland: Static radio I thought was really interesting and very similar to what Adam and Dave are doing with Godcaster in a sense.
1:00:38
James Cridland: If you if you use the Static Radio app, it gives you eight radio stations, which are made up of independent podcasts, direct from the RSS feed, of course.
1:00:48
James Cridland: Everyone hears the shows at the same time, so you can actually see you know other people listening to the same shows as you.
1:00:56
James Cridland: And you know, it it it it just feels like it's got a room full of people in it, and you might stumble onto a show that you've never thought to search for.
1:01:06
James Cridland: So these aren't necessarily, you know, follow-based, but they are certainly pushing new stuff in front of you.
1:01:14
James Cridland: But perhaps these tools are discovery tools, but not consumption tools, in the same way that we're seeing with with YouTube.
1:01:21
James Cridland: We're seeing YouTube in many cases being used as a discovery mechanism for you to then follow shows on Apple Podcasts or on Overcast or or on TrueFans or or anywhere else that you actually get your podcasts, I suppose.
1:01:37
Sam Sethi: A couple of weeks ago we had Adam on the show, and Adam's been talking about AI agenc personalized apps and using them for discovery.
1:01:47
Sam Sethi: He's admonished us several times now by saying that it's not about removing ads, it's about discovery.
1:01:54
Sam Sethi: Get it right.
1:01:55
Sam Sethi: So let me get it right.
1:01:57
Sam Sethi: It is about discovery, and that's what Adam's saying, that his AI agenc is going off and finding himself.
1:02:03
Sam Sethi: So again, I think a lot of people are building stuff to go and find other ways of discovering more content.
1:02:12
James Cridland: Yeah.
1:02:13
James Cridland: Yeah.
1:02:14
James Cridland: I I I mean, I think you can certainly you can certainly see that if Muse or you know Claude knows so much about me because I've given it access to so much stuff, because what could go wrong with that?
1:02:29
James Cridland: If it knows so much about me, then actually asking, hey, is is there a podcast you would you would recommend?
1:02:36
James Cridland: You know, normies might do that.
1:02:38
James Cridland: I don't think normies will build an app.
1:02:41
James Cridland: But I think that normies would certainly at least ask, okay, knowing what you know about me, r recommend a podcast that I might like.
1:02:49
James Cridland: And that's interesting because I've got no idea where the where the data would end up coming from.
1:02:54
James Cridland: And I'm sure the answer will be Joe Rogan anyway.
1:02:56
James Cridland: So uh, you know, who knows?
1:02:59
Sam Sethi: Anyway, uh if you want also to hear a really interesting discussion around some of these challenges and also some of the problems around RSS and some of the problems around analytics and video.
1:03:11
Sam Sethi: There's a great discussion on Buzzsprout's buzzcast this week's.
1:03:15
Sam Sethi: They talk about the analytics mess and measuring downloads and plays.
1:03:19
Sam Sethi: It's a good listen.
1:03:20
Sam Sethi: So again, if you want more of this stuff, go and have a look and listen to look and listen, James, noted to uh Buzzsprouse video.
1:03:29
Sam Sethi: Yes, they have in video.
1:03:31
Sam Sethi: So yeah.
1:03:32
James Cridland: Yes, indeed.
1:03:33
James Cridland: And BuzzPrat is our sponsor, of course.
1:03:35
James Cridland: Talking about Muse, as I was interesting to read in Spotify's financial update.
1:03:42
James Cridland: Good things about ad revenue, up 10% year on year, it's all automated stuff, and all their own stuff is what they're making money out of.
1:03:51
James Cridland: Uh interesting also, just to point out that ad revenue is only 10.7% of total company revenue, uh, which is where those skip buttons have come from, although uh weirdly that wasn't mentioned to investors.
1:04:02
James Cridland: Can't think why that might be.
1:04:04
James Cridland: But the the there was an interesting thing from Gustav Serdestrum, wasn't there, about AI agents and what effects AI agents might have on Spotify, Sam?
1:04:15
Sam Sethi: Well, it was a question posed by one of the investors which said given AI, if it was given the task of go and check all my subscriptions and unsubscribe me from you know costly subscriptions that I might have forgotten about.
1:04:29
Sam Sethi: Was Spotify in danger of being unsubscribed from?
1:04:34
Sam Sethi: Because they get more money from their premium subscription users than they do through advertising.
1:04:40
Sam Sethi: And clearly Gustav is not going to say, oh yes, we're in pre-trouble now.
1:04:44
Sam Sethi: Yes, yes, yes, that's it.
1:04:46
Sam Sethi: Now his answer was clearly no, no, we're so important and valuable that no one would ever unsubscribe from us.
1:04:53
Sam Sethi: But I think we've talked on this show about the elasticity of the price of the subscription.
1:04:59
Sam Sethi: And I worry that as the slowdown in new users comes to the platform, it has to at some point, there will be saturation.
1:05:09
Sam Sethi: Yeah, and the metrics will have to change to time spent on platform and and the ARPU, that the subscription number will become more important to them.
1:05:20
Sam Sethi: And it becomes when they have to increase the price, you will start to see people naturally say, I'm gonna unsubscribe.
1:05:28
Sam Sethi: Now you could actually build into the AI if the price goes to$20 or$25, just unsubscribe me.
1:05:35
Sam Sethi: And nothing that Spotify could do to stop that.
1:05:38
Sam Sethi: So I do think, again, personal agents working on our behalf will be useful in the future.
1:05:45
Sam Sethi: I think it's early days.
1:05:46
Sam Sethi: I always say that one of the reasons why Alexa's voice commerce failed was because the AI was not working for me, it was working for Amazon.
1:05:56
Sam Sethi: I never trusted the AI to find me the best price.
1:06:00
Sam Sethi: And the best price.
1:06:01
James Cridland: Yeah.
1:06:02
Sam Sethi: I always felt that it was going to give me Amazon basics was the answer.
1:06:05
Sam Sethi: What was the question?
1:06:07
Sam Sethi: And and it often did.
1:06:10
Sam Sethi: You know, it never gave me duracell batteries.
1:06:12
Sam Sethi: It would just say Amazon batteries, right?
1:06:14
Sam Sethi: And I never trusted it.
1:06:15
Sam Sethi: And I think that's why Voice Commerce failed on the Alexas and other platforms.
1:06:20
Sam Sethi: I think when you get a trust in your personalized AI agent, it will be interesting.
1:06:27
Sam Sethi: But it goes back to, you know, we said Reddit's closed the door to it, Amazon, Apple.
1:06:33
Sam Sethi: People can see the danger of this, and Spotify are obviously not going to tell investors there's a danger, but there is a danger there for them.
1:06:41
James Cridland: No, no, indeed.
1:06:42
James Cridland: Well, as as we hear more of AI tools turning off new subscriptions, Global in the UK is just starting their own.
1:06:52
James Cridland: Interestingly, starting subscriptions for ad-free podcasts for$2.99 a month, which is about$3.99 for ad-free episodes.
1:07:03
James Cridland: And a little bit more if you want the some of the shows with exclusive content in there.
1:07:08
James Cridland: I say interestingly because interestingly, they are available for they're available ad-free on Global Player and on YouTube.
1:07:18
James Cridland: So there is a subscription tie-in that they've done with YouTube in some way, shape, or form.
1:07:24
James Cridland: Or maybe it's a separate subscription on YouTube.
1:07:26
James Cridland: I don't know.
1:07:27
James Cridland: But anyway, worth a look at that.
1:07:30
James Cridland: What where uh what do you think?
1:07:32
James Cridland: Because I know you've been banging the drum about subscriptions and premium content for a long time, Sam.
1:07:39
James Cridland: What do you think of Global's new uh plans here?
1:07:43
Sam Sethi: No, it's great.
1:07:43
Sam Sethi: I think I think it goes back to what you said earlier in this show about you know consumption data and advertisers, they're not getting what they want.
1:07:51
Sam Sethi: I think Spotify's making more money from premium than advertising.
1:07:55
Sam Sethi: I think we're seeing people moving.
1:07:58
Sam Sethi: We've educated the market that you know paying a little bit for ad-free content and supporting the creator is the right model.
1:08:05
Sam Sethi: We we tried with micropayments, that didn't quite work.
1:08:08
Sam Sethi: But I think people are using fiat currency and happily doing so, you know, 399, 299.
1:08:14
Sam Sethi: We're seeing that with Substack, Patreon paying out billions, I mean Substack making millions.
1:08:20
Sam Sethi: I mean, the numbers are significant, they're not, you know, a drop in the ocean.
1:08:25
Sam Sethi: I think one of my biggest disappointments has been in our own community, the podcasting 2.0 community.
1:08:30
Sam Sethi: It's not adopted a universal payment.
1:08:33
Sam Sethi: There is a GitHub post that has been ignored and left to rot about how we could include premium and freemium within the RSS feed.
1:08:42
Sam Sethi: There are technologies like L402 and X402.
1:08:46
Sam Sethi: They work.
1:08:47
Sam Sethi: I've got working examples in TrueFans.
1:08:49
Sam Sethi: This is not ethereal, this is not would we, could we, should we?
1:08:53
Sam Sethi: This is it works, and here's an example.
1:08:56
Sam Sethi: But no, there's no uptake, there's no interest, there's no desire to do it.
1:09:01
Sam Sethi: We've subjugated it again one more time to other platforms.
1:09:05
Sam Sethi: I banged the drum about creator portals, I think, for three years plus, and we're seeing them now here.
1:09:11
Sam Sethi: You know, we've got some good interviews with networks next week.
1:09:15
Sam Sethi: I mean, this is where it's going.
1:09:17
Sam Sethi: Those networks aren't ad driven, they're subscription driven.
1:09:20
Sam Sethi: Global's going subscription driven.
1:09:21
Sam Sethi: Goal hanger makes seven dollars a month from its subscribers making significant ad revenue is being affected.
1:09:30
Sam Sethi: Now, I don't know whether we are going to be able to turn this around.
1:09:35
Sam Sethi: I have no idea, but I do think we need to pull our finger out.
1:09:40
Sam Sethi: Again, it's the slowness of adopting video.
1:09:42
Sam Sethi: We were late to the party, and I think we're slow and late to the party on payments.
1:09:48
Sam Sethi: Sorry, but I think we are.
1:09:51
James Cridland: Yes, I think you're right.
1:09:52
James Cridland: And I d I think it's just a shame that we've not that we've not worked out a simple, straightforward way of actually doing that throughout all podcast apps.
1:10:04
James Cridland: At the moment we have private feeds, then the Spotify's thing, which everybody is talking about, as if it's brand new, it's not.
1:10:10
James Cridland: We've got Apple's weird thing where they keep 30% and they don't share any of your uh subscriber information, which is uh not very good for anybody.
1:10:20
James Cridland: And all that we really need is uh is for a standard to be there, and it's a bit of a shame that there isn't actually a standard there.
1:10:28
James Cridland: Let's finish off with some good news though.
1:10:30
James Cridland: Good news! I've got some news.
1:10:33
James Cridland: Go for it.
1:10:34
James Cridland: Back in back in December 2021, the National Association of the Deaf, do you remember they took Sirius XM to court for not having transcripts in the app?
1:10:43
James Cridland: And that court case has been going on for nearly five years.
1:10:46
James Cridland: But the good news is that the two parties have told the judge that they are working on an agreement now.
1:10:53
James Cridland: They're working on a settlement of that case, so that case will finally go away.
1:10:58
James Cridland: I think um good for the National Association of the Deaf to go after someone in podcasting, which essentially forced all of us to do that.
1:11:07
James Cridland: I think it's uh really helpful that we've got transcripts now in pretty well everything, which is really good.
1:11:13
James Cridland: It would be great if it was the creator produced transcripts and everything, but you know, there we are.
1:11:19
James Cridland: But I think certainly that's good news, and good news that they are now settling their differences and moving on, not uh making the lawyers any more rich.
1:11:28
James Cridland: So hurrah for them.
1:11:29
Announcer: The tech stuff on the Podnews Weekly Review.
1:11:34
James Cridland: Yes, it's the stuff you'll find every Monday in the Podnews newsletter, and here's where Sam talks technology.
1:11:40
James Cridland: Yeah, again.
1:11:41
James Cridland: Sam, anything exciting?
1:11:42
James Cridland: Oh, this look this this looks exciting.
1:11:45
Sam Sethi: Well, our sponsors Bos Sprout announced on their buscar show they've got a new iOS and Android app.
1:11:51
Sam Sethi: It's uh it's for the administration, not a client-side app.
1:11:57
Sam Sethi: And it does things like allows you to do sound bites now on the mobile app, and it also shows you your achievements and many more things.
1:12:06
Sam Sethi: So they're really excited about this new app.
1:12:09
Sam Sethi: So again, go and download it.
1:12:11
Sam Sethi: It should be available now in both stores, and yeah, Kevin's worked hard on this one.
1:12:16
James Cridland: So this is an update, right?
1:12:18
James Cridland: To the current BuzzSprite app that exists at the moment.
1:12:21
James Cridland: Correct.
1:12:22
James Cridland: Yeah.
1:12:23
James Cridland: So go in and mash that update button, and you'll doubtless see that appear in there.
1:12:28
James Cridland: Very good.
1:12:29
James Cridland: What else is going on?
1:12:31
Sam Sethi: Riverside, which we are currently using to record this show with, have released a set of agents, a new team for AI production.
1:12:41
Sam Sethi: Go on, James, you use Riverside, I use D Script.
1:12:44
Sam Sethi: What what's what's this gonna do for you?
1:12:46
James Cridland: So, firstly, do you remember Rice Krispies?
1:12:49
James Cridland: Or I think they're called rice crackles in the US, or they're called rice pops here in the here in Australia.
1:12:55
James Cridland: And and you you remember that that they've got these three playful faces, snap, crackle, and pop, in their advertising?
1:13:02
James Cridland: Yes.
1:13:03
James Cridland: I think somebody Riverside saw that and thought, that's a great way of of of showing off our agents.
1:13:10
James Cridland: And so it does look a bit like Rice Krispies, to be honest.
1:13:15
James Cridland: But yes, so four agents that you get uh access to.
1:13:19
James Cridland: And you one of them is a producer, so it helps you with planning what you're going to say and what stories you're going to cover.
1:13:26
James Cridland: One of them is an editor, so uh edits the show to however you want it to.
1:13:31
James Cridland: Then you've got a clipper who takes bits of your show and clips it up, and then you've got a marketer who tells you where you should be posting some of these posts and so on and so forth.
1:13:40
James Cridland: Obviously, a human creator needs to be directing all of these, but it's a nice way.
1:13:45
James Cridland: I'm not quite sure how much additional functionality that they've added in terms of this, but it's a nice way of, you know, obviously humanizing the whole thing, making it a little bit more clear what you can do with certain parts of that particular product and uh quite nice.
1:14:02
James Cridland: So you will notice this week, for example, that this show, if you're watching it, that this show is now not just a Sam and James in a box, but is actually a little bit more interestingly edited because R Riverside is actually choosing which particular camera angle to end up showing.
1:14:22
James Cridland: So that's quite a nice plan, for example, on that.
1:14:25
James Cridland: So yeah, I think that it's an it's a nice plan.
1:14:28
James Cridland: Yeah, worth while taking a look at.
1:14:30
Sam Sethi: In our WhatsApp group for the power supporters, there was a good discussion around this, you know, what what what's D Script doing?
1:14:37
Sam Sethi: I think Jim James had a meeting with D Script, and you know, there are pros and cons.
1:14:46
Sam Sethi: I mean, Claire Wait Brown, who does a lot for TrueFans, who uses Riverside, doesn't like Snapcrackle on Pop.
1:14:52
Sam Sethi: She thinks they get in the way.
1:14:55
Sam Sethi: I think, you know, it reminds me of Clippy from uh Microsoft Office a little bit.
1:15:01
Sam Sethi: You know, people might like it, might not.
1:15:04
Sam Sethi: I use D Script with Underlord.
1:15:06
Sam Sethi: It comes up with suggestions.
1:15:08
Sam Sethi: I think D Script don't go far enough with it because it comes up with 10 suggestions and then doesn't tell you how to do them.
1:15:15
Sam Sethi: It says, here's ten things you can do.
1:15:17
Sam Sethi: Great, how do I find that feature?
1:15:19
Sam Sethi: It'd be really nice to have a little button that says do this thing now, right?
1:15:22
Sam Sethi: But it doesn't.
1:15:23
Sam Sethi: So the way I do it is I cut and paste the suggestion into the prompt box and then it does it.
1:15:28
Sam Sethi: Really silly, but that's what I have to do.
1:15:30
Sam Sethi: I don't know.
1:15:31
James Cridland: Yeah, no, I th uh, you know, I mean I think I think uh so Riverside, you can basically set up a number of things and you can say do this every show I record or every interview that I record, don't do that, don't do that, which is actually quite useful.
1:15:45
James Cridland: So yeah, I think it's a it's a pretty good thing.
1:15:48
James Cridland: So yeah, and they also have an MCP server as well, so you can play around with that, as do a bunch of other people.
1:15:56
James Cridland: So Poddig has just launched their MCP server a couple of weeks ago.
1:16:02
James Cridland: They've now added connections to it in the Claude Connectors directory and the chat GPT plugin directory, whatever they are.
1:16:10
James Cridland: And Podbean has added a MCP server as well in there to uh allow you to do all kinds of stuff, help prepare and optimize episode content and analyze podcast performance and so on and so forth.
1:16:23
James Cridland: So every everybody's certainly jumping into the AI stuff here.
1:16:28
James Cridland: So, yes, uh expect more of that, I suppose, to come.
1:16:31
James Cridland: A couple of other things just to uh mention.
1:16:33
James Cridland: One of them is Podcorn.
1:16:35
James Cridland: Podcorn used to be called the Odyssey Creator Studio for a little bit, and that was an analytics prefix that's going away on November the 1st.
1:16:44
James Cridland: I found 13,300 shows with the Podcorn URL still in them, which is a bit of a worry because they will all stop running on November the 1st.
1:16:55
James Cridland: Um, so I posted a list of them.
1:16:59
James Cridland: Now, some people say that was an old list.
1:17:02
James Cridland: It came from a very recent podcast index data dump.
1:17:07
James Cridland: So perhaps the podcast index URLs haven't necessarily updated entirely, but who knows?
1:17:14
James Cridland: But anyway, if you are using Podcorn in your podcast, take it out, because your podcast will stop working without that.
1:17:22
James Cridland: You have been getting very excited about Apple, because Apple have been announcing all kinds of all kinds of new hardware.
1:17:30
James Cridland: Are you buying one of these new touch screen MacBooks, Sam?
1:17:34
Sam Sethi: No, Steve Jobs is rolling in his grave right now.
1:17:38
Sam Sethi: He's like, oh my god, why I said never.
1:17:42
Sam Sethi: So yeah, so clearly, clearly, never meant never.
1:17:45
James Cridland: I think they've done a very good job.
1:17:47
James Cridland: I so firstly, I think I think Steve Jobs was wrong.
1:17:50
James Cridland: I I was playing around with a touchscreen computer 10 years ago, Google Chromebook, as it happened, and you end up using the touch screen a little bit when you want to, you know, move Windows around or if you want to scroll a web page.
1:18:07
James Cridland: A touch screen is quite nice.
1:18:08
James Cridland: I think what Apple have done, which is very clever, is if you open a menu bar with your trackpad, for example, then the menu bar is it looks like it normally does.
1:18:21
James Cridland: If you open a menu bar with your finger, then all of the space between the menu bar is much larger.
1:18:28
James Cridland: So you can actually click on the icons in that menu.
1:18:32
James Cridland: So I think Apple have have done their customary thing of sat on their hands for 10 years to work out how they could do it properly and are now launching this stuff properly, and also to give you know Steve Steve Steve Jobs' body, you know, a bit of a chance to um to cool down and decompose prior to actually going against what he said.
1:18:53
James Cridland: But I do believe that he was wrong.
1:18:54
James Cridland: I think that you don't nobody wants to see the end of a keyboard, for example, on a MacBook.
1:19:01
James Cridland: Of course.
1:19:02
James Cridland: And so Steve Steve Jobs is absolutely right in terms of that.
1:19:06
James Cridland: But I don't think that adding touch to a MacBook is a bad idea at all.
1:19:12
James Cridland: And so uh although I won't be buying I won't be buying one of those one of those computers, apart from anything else, Sam, we we were looking at the costs of them here in the Australian Apple store.
1:19:25
James Cridland: And the cost for a good, well-spec' MacBook is$16,000.
1:19:33
James Cridland: You can buy a car for that.
1:19:36
James Cridland: So not sure.
1:19:38
James Cridland: Wow, I'm gonna not sure I'm going for that.
1:19:41
James Cridland: Uh everything is so expensive these days in terms of in terms of computers and things.
1:19:46
James Cridland: So yeah, not sure I'm gonna be going for that, but still, but there we are.
1:19:50
Sam Sethi: Audi has just partnered with Spotify to launch Spotify's native in-car app.
1:19:56
Sam Sethi: This is not on CarPlay, this is not on Android Auto, this is Spotify's own software.
1:20:02
Sam Sethi: And I think it's interesting.
1:20:03
James Cridland: We we we saw I thought you said Aldi there, and I was thinking, wow, that's not the market.
1:20:12
unknown: Yeah.
1:20:13
SPEAKER_11: Every trolley has a Spotify interface on it.
1:20:17
James Cridland: Weird, but could be an idea.
1:20:19
James Cridland: No, that that that is that is interesting, isn't it?
1:20:22
James Cridland: I mean, I know that car manufacturers think that they're trying to be software developers as well, but yeah, interesting that Audi would actually get Spotify to make them that sort of thing.
1:20:32
James Cridland: If, of course, that's what that's what's happened.
1:20:35
unknown: Yeah.
1:20:35
Sam Sethi: Well, the problem was with CarPlay, CarPlay was overtaking the manufacturers in the interface and everything else.
1:20:43
Sam Sethi: You know, you know, the Aston Martin DBS was going to actually allow CarPlay Plus to do everything, uh speedometers everything for you.
1:20:52
Sam Sethi: So I think it's this pullback.
1:20:54
Sam Sethi: Okay, it's our car, not your software.
1:20:57
Sam Sethi: Anyway, we'll see.
1:20:58
Sam Sethi: Yes, no, indeed.
1:21:00
Announcer: Fan mail mail and voicemail, our favorite time of the week.
1:21:04
Announcer: It's the Podnews Weekly Review inbox.
1:21:08
James Cridland: Yeah, so many different ways to get in touch with us.
1:21:10
James Cridland: Voicemail by using the link in our show notes or email too.
1:21:14
James Cridland: We've got some fan mail.
1:21:15
James Cridland: Thank you for leaving fan mail.
1:21:17
James Cridland: Thank you for leaving voicemail, which we'll get to in just a second.
1:21:19
James Cridland: Hello to you if you are 7372 in Alhambra in California.
1:21:25
James Cridland: Some very good curries uh just up the road from Alhambra, but that's the Alhambra in Bradford, not Alhambra in California.
1:21:32
James Cridland: Anyway, they say James was on a tear this week.
1:21:35
James Cridland: Everything okay?
1:21:36
James Cridland: Yeah, everything's fine.
1:21:39
James Cridland: Don't worry.
1:21:39
James Cridland: Uh thank you so much.
1:21:41
SPEAKER_11: He's flight, he's flight bound.
1:21:43
SPEAKER_11: He's he's got stir crazy.
1:21:45
James Cridland: No, I'm I'm absolutely not missing any of that.
1:21:49
James Cridland: Here's a voicemail from Lena LaRue.
1:21:52
SPEAKER_01: You know what really stinks is the fact that the only podcast listening app where someone can leave a written review is Apple Podcasts.
1:22:03
SPEAKER_01: Can't do it on Spotify, can't do it on Pocket Cast, can't do it on Player FM.
1:22:08
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I haven't used that one in years, but as far as I know, you can't do it.
1:22:13
SPEAKER_01: Why is it that only Apple Podcasts offers the ability to leave a rating as well as a written review?
1:22:19
SPEAKER_01: It doesn't seem fair.
1:22:20
SPEAKER_01: Especially for those of us who use Android, who don't have Apple products, who don't have a Mac, it just doesn't seem very fair to me.
1:22:29
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
1:22:29
SPEAKER_01: Is there like some secret do they have like control over that or something?
1:22:34
SPEAKER_01: I I don't know.
1:22:36
SPEAKER_01: Also, why is it that ratings on Apple why do they carry more weight?
1:22:44
SPEAKER_01: Why is it that every every podcaster says, oh yeah, go rate on Apple?
1:22:48
SPEAKER_01: Why not the smaller apps?
1:22:50
SPEAKER_01: There you go.
1:22:50
SPEAKER_01: Lena.
1:22:51
Sam Sethi: Uh yeah, thanks for that.
1:22:53
Sam Sethi: Are reviews important, James?
1:22:54
Sam Sethi: I guess.
1:22:55
Sam Sethi: You've always said ratings and reviews aren't that important.
1:22:58
Sam Sethi: Some people hold bigger stores by it.
1:23:00
Sam Sethi: I mean, my own platform does offer ratings and reviews.
1:23:03
Sam Sethi: I don't know about other platforms.
1:23:05
Sam Sethi: Are they important, James?
1:23:07
James Cridland: Yeah, I think I think they're they're not important for Apple.
1:23:12
James Cridland: But they are important, weirdly, for other places.
1:23:15
James Cridland: So Podscribe, for example, or Rephonic, two large tools that a lot of ad buyers use to buy advertising, they estimate how many people are listening to your show based on the number of reviews that you have, which seems a ridiculous thing.
1:23:30
James Cridland: But anyway, that's how they they do it.
1:23:33
James Cridland: And because I've very overtly said that ratings and reviews don't matter, the fewer people leave ratings and reviews for this show, which means that if you go on to Podscribe, for example, and you ask how many people tune in to this show, the the end-up figure is about half the size that it really is, because they're looking at the number of reviews that we have.
1:23:57
James Cridland: And so, A, please leave us a review, go hard on the five stars, but also B, yeah, I mean they're they're they're still important.
1:24:04
James Cridland: But I completely agree with Lena.
1:24:06
James Cridland: If you use Android, you don't have an Apple product, then tough because you're not going to be leaving a review, and that's just the way that Apple works, unfortunately.
1:24:17
James Cridland: And why do they carry more weight?
1:24:19
James Cridland: Well, you know, it is Apple, I suppose.
1:24:22
James Cridland: And so from that point of view, at least we know in terms of how Apple's ratings work, that people can't leave more than one, for example, you can't spoof those very easily, at least.
1:24:35
James Cridland: So yeah, I think all of that is all of that is an interesting thing.
1:24:39
James Cridland: Now, here's another voicemail, this one from Adelaide in South Australia.
1:24:43
SPEAKER_10: I felt so sorry for you boys.
1:24:45
SPEAKER_10: You had no voicemail.
1:24:46
SPEAKER_10: So David John Clark, the actor and host of the Late Bloomer Actor podcast, calling in just to make you feel a little bit better.
1:24:53
SPEAKER_10: But no, on a serious note, half the reason is is because I'm listening with my ears whilst driving, and then I can't leave a message or comment when I get really pent up on something that you guys say or something happens in a podcast, and then by the time you're out of the car, it's too late and you forget.
1:25:09
SPEAKER_10: But here we are from my Tesla, a message for you, gentlemen.
1:25:12
SPEAKER_10: Love your work, cheers.
1:25:13
James Cridland: David John Clark, thank you so much.
1:25:15
James Cridland: Yes, we had no voicemail for a couple of weeks.
1:25:17
James Cridland: So it's lovely to hear your Del Cit South Australian times, mate.
1:25:22
James Cridland: And uh thank you for leaving.
1:25:24
James Cridland: Thank you for leaving that.
1:25:25
James Cridland: Most appreciated, and most appreciated if you would like to send us a voicemail as well.
1:25:30
James Cridland: You're more than welcome.
1:25:31
James Cridland: Weekly.podnews.net uh is where you can leave us a voicemail, or you can just email a voice note if you like.
1:25:38
James Cridland: Weekly at podnews.net is where you would end up doing that.
1:25:42
James Cridland: And our 25 supporters, we heard from Kate Cocker earlier on, of course.
1:25:47
James Cridland: Who else is in that list?
1:25:48
James Cridland: Well, people like Neil Velio, people like Wait Brown is in that list, and other people as well.
1:25:55
James Cridland: But Sam has made the list so small I can't read it from here.
1:25:59
James Cridland: Um to spec savers.
1:26:02
James Cridland: I should upgrade those glasses.
1:26:05
James Cridland: I should say.
1:26:06
James Cridland: Neil Vellio, many congratulations to him, one of our power supporters.
1:26:11
James Cridland: He produces a podcast called Podmastery, podcasting insights and advice for indie creators.
1:26:16
James Cridland: And he has celebrated a hundred episodes of the podcast this week with a free podcast health check for every listener.
1:26:23
James Cridland: So go and uh check out Pod Mastery, which you'll find in your favourite podcast app and also in Spotify.
1:26:31
James Cridland: Uh, and congratulations to David John Clark on listening to over 1,000 hours on TrueFans.
1:26:38
James Cridland: Oh, yes.
1:26:38
James Cridland: Yeah.
1:26:39
James Cridland: Well, well, there's a thing.
1:26:40
James Cridland: There's a thing.
1:26:41
Sam Sethi: Past his milestone.
1:26:42
Sam Sethi: Well done, Teddy.
1:26:43
James Cridland: Yes.
1:26:43
James Cridland: Yes.
1:26:44
James Cridland: So what's happened for you this week, Sam?
1:26:46
Sam Sethi: Uh we are launching uh we talked about newsletters.
1:26:50
Sam Sethi: I've talked about it before.
1:26:52
Sam Sethi: We we will be launching.
1:26:53
James Cridland: One thing I didn't I didn't ask is I bet TrueFans is just about to launch a newsletter feature.
1:26:58
Sam Sethi: I thought I couldn't say it earlier.
1:26:59
Sam Sethi: I really couldn't.
1:27:00
Sam Sethi: I thought I'd have to save it till later.
1:27:02
Sam Sethi: This is not the TrueFans show, this is a Podnews show.
1:27:05
Sam Sethi: Correct.
1:27:06
James Cridland: Sponsored by Buzzsprout.
1:27:07
James Cridland: Exactly, not TrueFans.
1:27:09
Sam Sethi: So keep it to yourself, mate.
1:27:12
James Cridland: So you're launching one.
1:27:13
James Cridland: You're launching one.
1:27:14
James Cridland: Excellent.
1:27:14
Sam Sethi: We've launched our newsletter and we're launching the feature for uh users, creators to do that as well.
1:27:21
Sam Sethi: So look, that'll come.
1:27:22
Sam Sethi: Good luck with that.
1:27:24
Sam Sethi: We've been playing with the web MCP integration, not the MCP, and I think that is really interesting.
1:27:32
Sam Sethi: It's brand new out of Google as a spec.
1:27:36
Sam Sethi: It's in every browser the support.
1:27:38
Sam Sethi: And what's neat about it is you as an individual can be on the same web page with your AI agent and interact together.
1:27:45
Sam Sethi: So it it's got some interesting ideas.
1:27:47
Sam Sethi: We we haven't got anything really formed yet, but I think it's something people should look at.
1:27:52
Sam Sethi: Still building our native apps, so we'll see.
1:27:55
Sam Sethi: And uh Claire and I did an event yesterday about networking fees.
1:28:00
Sam Sethi: We had about 40 people turn up for it, so that was nice.
1:28:04
Sam Sethi: As I said, I am loving the iPhone Giro apart from the problems they've had.
1:28:08
Sam Sethi: Some of the screenshots of the new Netflix app looks really cool, and some of the ways that you can have comments on one side of the screen and the app running on the other.
1:28:18
Sam Sethi: I can see podcasts doing this.
1:28:20
Sam Sethi: I can imagine, you know, full screen video, you know, on the left hand side and comments, live comments on the right.
1:28:27
Sam Sethi: So I think there's things I love about that thing, but I'm gonna wait.
1:28:31
Sam Sethi: I talked about Colin Samir's podcast, I highly recommend if you want to know more about Instagram.
1:28:37
Sam Sethi: And the Bill Gates one on the verge is really good.
1:28:41
Sam Sethi: Again, talks about the future of AI, but he also really got challenged about COVID and also Epstein.
1:28:50
Sam Sethi: He was a little, a little fidgety in his seat when those ones came out.
1:28:54
James Cridland: Well, Epstein, I'm sure.
1:28:55
Sam Sethi: I I I'm not quite sure about COVID, though, but he's been accused by Andreas Norowitz, one of their partners, has accused him of manufacturing a global crisis.
1:29:09
Sam Sethi: And that was presented to him in the video.
1:29:12
Sam Sethi: I think it's it's look, it's a really interesting video.
1:29:14
Sam Sethi: He used to be, you know, obviously the CEO of Microsoft, smart guy.
1:29:18
Sam Sethi: I some of the things he wrote in The Road Ahead have come to light.
1:29:22
Sam Sethi: I think he's had some really good insights.
1:29:24
Sam Sethi: He's talked about a robot tax many years ago, and that may be the way that we remove people from the workplace, but still corporate companies pay us so we can have UBI.
1:29:35
Sam Sethi: I mean, look, there's loads of ideas in there.
1:29:37
Sam Sethi: Well worth listening to, I say.
1:29:38
Sam Sethi: Well, we'll see.
1:29:39
James Cridland: We will see.
1:29:41
Sam Sethi: Indeed.
1:29:41
Sam Sethi: Now, James, what's happened for you, my friend?
1:29:44
James Cridland: Uh I uh so I've lived in Australia now for ten years, and there's one thing in Australia that is very confusing to me, Sam.
1:29:51
James Cridland: Very confusing indeed.
1:29:53
James Cridland: The idea of Christmas t-shirts.
1:29:56
James Cridland: Christmas t-shirts.
1:30:00
James Cridland: Wow.
1:30:01
James Cridland: Yeah, so you know how the Northern Hemisphere has Christmas jumpers and amusing Christmas jumpers.
1:30:07
James Cridland: We have Christmas jumpers, but they are t-shirts, and it's the it's the it's the knitting pattern printed onto a t-shirt because it's so bloody hot down here during during December.
1:30:21
James Cridland: And so Christmas t-shirts is a thing.
1:30:23
James Cridland: I've not got used to that, nor have I got used to walking around the the shopping centres hearing you know songs about snow falling, and maybe it's cold outside while you're there, desperately trying to keep cool.
1:30:37
James Cridland: So uh yes, very, very strange.
1:30:39
James Cridland: So that's been that's been an entertainment.
1:30:42
James Cridland: So I've been playing around with that sort of thing.
1:30:46
James Cridland: And uh yes, and and and so what with that, and uh it's been nice uh having a week here.
1:30:52
James Cridland: It's been pouring it down with rain.
1:30:55
James Cridland: And one of the things of being in a subtropical climate, which I've I've learnt, is that if it's humid, then it typically rains at about three o'clock in the afternoon.
1:31:04
James Cridland: If you go to Singapore, you know this.
1:31:06
James Cridland: It it rains for about half an hour, three o'clock in the afternoon, and it buckets it down, absolutely buckets it down.
1:31:12
James Cridland: Well, guess what?
1:31:12
James Cridland: It does that here as well.
1:31:14
James Cridland: And for the last couple of days, I've been going out to because I jump in the car and drive 20 minutes to pick up my daughter from school, and always this week it's been pelting it down with rain for the exact time that I'm in the car.
1:31:30
James Cridland: I get to school, uh, the rain is gone, it's all lovely, and the sun is out and everything else.
1:31:35
James Cridland: We get into the car, I then start driving home, and again, the rain just keeps on coming down and coming down and coming down.
1:31:42
James Cridland: It's the most bizarre thing.
1:31:43
James Cridland: And as soon as I get home, the rain stops again, and I'm getting a bit bored of it.
1:31:47
James Cridland: So uh if you wouldn't mind fixing that, that would be that would be good.
1:31:51
James Cridland: But uh, yes, it's a it's a strange world down here, I'll tell you that.
1:31:55
Sam Sethi: Well, I was gonna say, talking of Aussies and summer stroke Christmas, my daughter's gone to Whistler for ski season and she's got five Aussies in the house.
1:32:08
Sam Sethi: None of them have ever seen snow.
1:32:11
James Cridland: Yes, yes.
1:32:13
James Cridland: So that uh like how how my daughter was a couple of years ago until we took her to Iceland for Christmas.
1:32:19
James Cridland: Uh that was a sure.
1:32:21
James Cridland: That's pretty poor.
1:32:25
James Cridland: That was a baptism of fire, I'll tell you.
1:32:27
James Cridland: Uh and the other uh the other news from Australia, because this is clearly news from Australia, the other the other news from Australia this week is that the Australian court has passed a ruling on Apple that Apple has to allow other app stores in this country.
1:32:42
James Cridland: And so that's gonna be interesting to uh see what happens.
1:32:45
James Cridland: 27%.
1:32:46
James Cridland: 27%.
1:32:48
James Cridland: So that's gonna be interesting to see what happens there.
1:32:51
James Cridland: My assumption is that yeah, they'll they'll do something, but they're only they're only you know 25 million people who live here, and so hey, who cares at the end of the day?
1:33:00
James Cridland: But yes, so we will watch and wait and see what happens there.
1:33:04
James Cridland: And that's it for this week.
1:33:06
James Cridland: All of our podcast stories taken from the Podnews Daily Newsletter at Podnews.net.
1:33:10
Sam Sethi: You can give us feedback using the Buzzsprout voicemail link like David and Lena did this week.
1:33:14
Sam Sethi: In our show notes, you'll find a link or become a monthly power supporter like the 25 Power Supporters at weekly.podnews.net.
1:33:22
James Cridland: Our music's from TM Studios, our voiceover Sheila D.
1:33:25
James Cridland: We use Riverside to record this week, and we're hosted and sponsored by Buzzsprout.
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