Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to Luke Molloy about his choice of The Devil's Chord

Transcript

Talks to Luke Molloy about his choice of The Devil's Chord · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

• 0:23
  None hamster with a blunt pen knife
• 0:35
  for doing Quicker, quicker, quicker.
• 0:40
  There's always A twist. There's always A twist.
• 0:42
  There's always A twist in the end.
• 0:44
  La La La La La La La La La La La La La La la hello and welcome
• 0:51
  back to a hamster with a blunt musical pen knife featuring me,
• 0:56
  Joe Ford, your host and singer extraordinaire and musical
• 1:00
  maestro Luke Malloy. Hello.
• 1:03
  Hello. I've got a dog.
• 1:05
  He's called Joe. Joe's my dog.
• 1:08
  Oh, that's that's a bit rude. Actually isn't.
• 1:12
  It I'm a total dog. You're all right, Luke.
• 1:17
  I have a huge question for you to start this very important
• 1:22
  podcast on The Devil's Chord starring Jinx Monsoon and that
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  is this. How excited were you for Doctor
• 1:30
  Who to come back at midnight on Friday night?
• 1:34
  How good was that? Like that, The build up to the
• 1:37
  event, it felt like a a huge, big midnight showing just for
• 1:41
  just for us, just for the fans and the only people that would
• 1:44
  like it. I yeah, loved it.
• 1:46
  And by God's did pay off. I loved.
• 1:50
  Yeah, I mean cats on the back. Straight away.
• 1:52
  I loved both episodes. I just love this.
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  This had the tone of this show. This is exactly what I want for
• 1:58
  Doctor J. The more I've thought about over
• 2:01
  the past few days, the the first two episodes have been very
• 2:04
  fantasy, very filtered drama. You got a bit of sneakiness of
• 2:08
  the Doctor when he's like scanning Ruby.
• 2:11
  All these things that were in series 5, which is also my
• 2:15
  favorite series. I'm starting to draw quite a lot
• 2:17
  of similarities already. You could actually take,
• 2:20
  couldn't you? That You know, the snow that
• 2:22
  keeps appearing in the cream rooms and things, That's the
• 2:25
  crack. Exactly.
• 2:26
  Amy's crack is Ruby Snow. I mean, I'd say that's a bit
• 2:30
  more subtle than Jukes Monsoon screaming out of a piano The.
• 2:33
  One who waits is coming, but we'll get.
• 2:38
  There, talking about that, a little bit of behind the scenes
• 2:41
  info. Actually, Luke, Mark and I spent
• 2:43
  a bit of a night together on Friday, the hour leading up to
• 2:47
  the episode. Fireworks.
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  There were literal fireworks, weren't we?
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  We spent jacking ourselves up up to the big count at midnight,
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  and we were in a big group chat with a load of boring, serious
• 3:02
  people that didn't like the episodes at all.
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  Me and Luke were like the outliers in that group chat that
• 3:09
  loved it. And an hour later, there were
• 3:11
  space babies. But that's what happens when you
• 3:12
  put me and Joe in the room together.
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  A couple of quick questions before we go in, because
• 3:20
  obviously we're not covering space by business.
• 3:22
  I haven't done a commentary on it yet.
• 3:24
  How did you find that briefly? And were you sold on Shooty and
• 3:29
  Millie Gibson in that episode? Yeah, well I was sold.
• 3:32
  I was sold on Shooty in at Christmas even though I wasn't
• 3:36
  big on Ruby Road and I thought Millie was good and my opinions
• 3:41
  pretty much remain the same apart from I'm sort of just
• 3:44
  blown away by she's in the build up.
• 3:47
  When when you got all them quotes in Doctor Who magazine
• 3:49
  and stuff like that about Shooty, oh you're not prepared
• 3:52
  for how good he's going to be Another I thought we are over
• 3:55
  egging it a bit here. Like there's no there's no way
• 3:58
  it's going to live up to the hype.
• 3:59
  But I mean if I feel sorry for Millie a little bit because I
• 4:04
  actually think she's doing good work but I am just not looking
• 4:06
  at it. I am not watching her right now.
• 4:09
  I'm obsessed with the new shiny Doctor and just how dazzling he
• 4:13
  is. But to be fair, I don't think
• 4:15
  she's she's doing a lot of reacting to stuff at the moment
• 4:18
  where she hasn't had like her Father's Day or anything like
• 4:20
  that, has she? And I think maybe boom is where
• 4:24
  we're going to get long scenes between the two of them.
• 4:26
  It sounds like it's going to be a bit more of a character piece.
• 4:29
  And I do think there's little bits of realism coming out that
• 4:32
  bit in space babies where she's like where she gets the key off
• 4:36
  the doctor and she's like. Come on then, following me.
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  And it just feels quite natural and quite so.
• 4:40
  I sort of like what she's doing. I'm less impressed by her, and
• 4:44
  that's no slight, because I still think she's very good.
• 4:47
  I am so impressed by their chemistry, immediate chemistry
• 4:51
  in that space baby's episode where they're walking around
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  when they're running away from that snot monster together, when
• 4:56
  he's laughing at her, all the snots in her air, all of that.
• 4:59
  But in this episode in particular, the second they
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  start dancing their way into the TARDIS wardrobe and then come
• 5:06
  out in that 60s gear, I was like, I'm sold.
• 5:09
  I just love this pair. They've got like a zest for
• 5:12
  life. It's like when Tennant and Tay
• 5:15
  would jump out of the TARDIS and just embracing life, you know?
• 5:19
  It's that sort of thing. Do you know I'm obviously a huge
• 5:22
  Muffet fan, a Capaldi fan? You know we've had they haven't
• 5:26
  said argument literally on your podcast but watching this I
• 5:30
  thought I have that that Capaldi feels so old.
• 5:34
  We, I feel like actually my my, my old Co host Chris.
• 5:40
  I had a conversation with him last night and he said it feels
• 5:44
  like the Doctor Who's been miserable for 10 years and
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  finally it's it's just enjoying itself again and that's.
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  Why I was nothing about this? What?
• 5:51
  What happens at the end of this episode?
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  Where? And we'll get there, because
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  I've heard people whinging about them playing that Abbey Road
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  piano, which I loved. What you've got is 2 amazingly
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  charismatic leads dancing their way back to the TARDIS after a
• 6:08
  brilliant adventure off into time.
• 6:11
  As, I mean, it's as optimistic as the show's been for fucking
• 6:14
  years. Why are people complaining?
• 6:19
  Don't you like fun people? Do you know what, though?
• 6:22
  Like, I think we've decided to do this quite quickly and quite
• 6:26
  impromptly, because it actually feels like we're the only two
• 6:28
  people in the world that seem to enjoy it.
• 6:30
  Right. Well then let's no, but I just,
• 6:33
  I believe there are there. Are other ones out?
• 6:35
  There, I've seen lots of people being positive, but I have seen
• 6:37
  louder people being negative. Yeah, I And on podcasts and
• 6:41
  things being, it's really negative.
• 6:43
  It shouldn't bother me, but it is bothering me that there's
• 6:46
  such negativity because you know as I say, I'll put something out
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  there that's really good. Saying that this year was good
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  and five people go, yeah, I've really enjoyed them two
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  episodes, but the five that say it's shit, I'm like it's wide to
• 7:00
  me or how you're. Not.
• 7:02
  Did you see now how I felt in the chip?
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  No era like. Yeah, I feel like a chip.
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  No fan. Except it's really good.
• 7:09
  Except. Except the doctors likeable and
• 7:13
  it's doing something new. Yeah, I mean, space babies
• 7:19
  wasn't just because it literally it felt so fresh and yet it just
• 7:23
  repeated the end of the world Sleep no more Father's Day.
• 7:28
  It repeated beats from all of them and somehow it felt fresh.
• 7:31
  And I think as you say, it was just the chemistry between the
• 7:33
  two of them and. I heard that in the reviews,
• 7:36
  everyone going, it's a bit of a slight story, but the the leads
• 7:39
  bring it to life. It was actually.
• 7:41
  Packed with a lot more than I thought.
• 7:43
  Yeah, I like. And the bit where I thought it
• 7:47
  might start lagging was the bit where he suddenly turns to her
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  and it starts snowing. And that's when I was like.
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  Oh bloody hell. What's?
• 7:54
  This and. It just kept.
• 7:56
  The bit that made me die was when I realised that that
• 8:00
  spaceship looked like a massive ass all.
• 8:02
  Along. And then one of my mates online
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  going, this is pure, all nonsense.
• 8:08
  How dare this be Doctor Who? And I'm like.
• 8:10
  You do remember the power of crawl right where they're
• 8:13
  sending off enormous farts to power whole cities?
• 8:17
  Like what's wrong with you people?
• 8:18
  Right now these these are obviously getting criticised by
• 8:22
  people that don't like. I don't think we should give
• 8:24
  them too much heed on this though.
• 8:25
  But also I think in a, you know in a few episodes time these
• 8:29
  will just become normal episodes for people.
• 8:31
  And it's are the amount of times I've seen in the last 10 years
• 8:35
  RIP Doctor Who, the death knell for Doctor Who.
• 8:37
  The end of Doctor Who? Funnily enough, it's still here.
• 8:40
  You know it. Never is it?
• 8:41
  Never. Is.
• 8:42
  But you know what baffles me so much in LIKE?
• 8:45
  How everyone thinks they're ATV producer for Doctor Who because.
• 8:50
  I always do in this podcast. I mean, we're talking about
• 8:54
  episodes, how years and years ago when we do it and you need
• 8:57
  to find your angles about talking about them right now.
• 8:59
  We should just be enjoying brand new dog too if you can, if you
• 9:02
  do like it and I think. People don't don't record a 2
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  hour podcast on it. We don't want to hear it, you
• 9:08
  know. People are sat there thinking.
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  What? Like what's everyone else
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  thinking about this? Or what ratings is it going to
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  get? Or is it going to get cancelled
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  after two seasons? Don't give a fuck.
• 9:17
  Just, I've actually made an active choice.
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  I said to you earlier, didn't I, that after these conversations
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  I'm having tonight, I'm now going to disengage with fan
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  reaction after this and just enjoy the episodes and do my own
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  thing. It's no fun.
• 9:32
  Arguing with these people. It's so hard to ignore.
• 9:35
  But anyway, yeah, you're right. I think that's that's we should
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  do. That's where we should park the
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  moaning. And now let's just talk I.
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  Mean. We're only going to be positive
• 9:42
  when it's on because it's fucking brilliant.
• 9:44
  But like, what baffles me about The Devil's Call is clearly this
• 9:48
  is a very crafted piece of work. It's got a beautiful musical
• 9:52
  soundtrack of of a kind I wasn't expecting.
• 9:55
  I thought it was going to be songs.
• 9:57
  It turned out it's got a huge range of music in it, which
• 10:01
  absolutely fascinated me. I thought we were going to get a
• 10:03
  musical and actually what I got was the death of music and what
• 10:07
  music means to people, which is such an interesting theme.
• 10:11
  Yeah, it's. Actually got something to.
• 10:13
  Say it's really does, and just in terms of the direction, the
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  choreography, the soundtrack, all of it.
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  It's just such a skilled piece of work.
• 10:25
  It's how anyone can criticize. It on that level I don't
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  understand. It's a gorgeously put together
• 10:30
  piece of work. Yeah, like a story.
• 10:34
  It's got something to say. Colourful, inventive, constantly
• 10:37
  turning, constantly varying where we're going.
• 10:41
  And if you say we were expecting a musical and we still sort of
• 10:44
  got one because you got like the bad music from The Beatles,
• 10:47
  you've got Ruby's Waltz, you've got the big number at the end,
• 10:50
  they're just. The battle between the piano and
• 10:53
  the fiddle. Yeah, it's a different type of
• 10:55
  musical. Wonderful, but that's why you
• 10:57
  earn the song at the end. We've seen the consequence of
• 11:01
  taking away music, and then at the end, the Doctor best the
• 11:04
  villain. We've got music back, so of
• 11:06
  course we're going to have a joyful musical now, but that's
• 11:08
  what this has all been about. I know I've seen people
• 11:10
  criticize. Not only the musical number, but
• 11:12
  the fact that it wasn't used to sort of defeat my story.
• 11:16
  And I thought the whole point is that it's a big joyous moment.
• 11:19
  Music is returned and everyone's happy again.
• 11:22
  I'm the unbearable during those bits of.
• 11:25
  I mean, we do like a song in our Doctor Who knows, you know,
• 11:28
  because literally 10 minutes before Space Babies, we were
• 11:31
  singing the long song Where. We were.
• 11:34
  And also, what is it? It's good to meet you.
• 11:37
  It's good to greet you. It's good to see.
• 11:40
  Literally, did you? Well, come on, let's go in and
• 11:44
  watch this. I'm having a fun day meet my
• 11:46
  friend. She's Ruby Sunday.
• 11:48
  And that's where we start. Having fun.
• 11:54
  I've got one Hope if I've understood that rope.
• 11:58
  Come on, I we just done that bit we did.
• 12:01
  Tell me why we did that. Once I found a stowaway.
• 12:05
  Upon my ship. On Christmas Day.
• 12:08
  What are the other ones? Luke Malloy, you put the devil
• 12:17
  in me. And one last one.
• 12:19
  Because it's the where it all began.
• 12:21
  Ready. Oh, I've forgotten how it goes.
• 12:24
  Well, I woke. Up today.
• 12:28
  And the world seemed a restless play.
• 12:31
  We've literally got enough songs for a soundtrack, let alone
• 12:36
  dealt with the Bannermens. Here's the.
• 12:42
  Future and wait one more if you will indulge me one more right
• 12:47
  back. Towards the start, well fill up
• 12:51
  your glasses and. Join in the fun, the law.
• 12:55
  Is right behind you and it's up my bum.
• 12:59
  We're going to go in quick. OK.
• 13:01
  Would you do me the great honour?
• 13:04
  You've counted us into this exceptional episode.
• 13:06
  I think we're going to be high. Energy and fun here.
• 13:09
  Yeah, 54321. Oh, isn't it?
• 13:15
  Shit. Oh, did you get?
• 13:20
  Did you get The Who in the first bit?
• 13:22
  Yes. Oh, good.
• 13:23
  Yeah. OK, go on.
• 13:24
  So I on the on the night I slightly preferred space babies,
• 13:29
  but I rewatched these on Saturday morning.
• 13:31
  I slightly preferred this one, but I I literally loved them
• 13:33
  both. I think they're both great.
• 13:35
  I had such low expectations of space babies.
• 13:37
  I really found it fun and I had huge expectations of this and
• 13:41
  none of them were mech, because I really thought this was going
• 13:44
  to be full of songs. And then when I watched it the
• 13:46
  next morning, I just thought this was spectacular.
• 13:48
  Yeah, me too. I mean, I've been learning
• 13:51
  keyboard this year. So like now, every single time I
• 13:54
  go on, I'm expecting some camp villain to come out of it.
• 13:57
  Go. Hello.
• 13:59
  Can you play? Even I can play that.
• 14:07
  Did you know that this man here? Yeah, with the glasses on.
• 14:11
  The actor is the son of Roger Lim, the composer of the Peter
• 14:16
  Davidson years, Kate of Andrasani and Revelation of the
• 14:19
  Daleks. Wow.
• 14:20
  That's why people come to hamster for the facts, for the
• 14:24
  fact. Or Dylan's bullshit rumours one
• 14:27
  or the other. Oh dear.
• 14:31
  Now. So this is H Harbinger.
• 14:34
  Yes, I'll have to confess, I did have to Google what a harbinger
• 14:39
  was immediately after. That it's like a harbinger of
• 14:42
  doom isn't. It, Yeah.
• 14:43
  Well, I hadn't heard that. Oh, OK.
• 14:46
  I feel as if we should immediately, because there's so
• 14:49
  much to say. Talk about Jinx Monsoon, who is
• 14:51
  about to climb out of this piano now in the new series.
• 14:56
  Can you imagine a better piece of casting than?
• 14:59
  This. No, this is.
• 15:02
  They're brilliant. And this costume is my favorite
• 15:04
  of the three. By the way.
• 15:05
  The piano one is great, but it's like Missy turned up to
• 15:11
  1,000,000, isn't it? It's I can see why this vibes
• 15:16
  with you personally, because it's Kate.
• 15:18
  O'Mara from time of the brani. This is this is very season 24
• 15:23
  isn't it? But with a bit more, you know,
• 15:25
  money and style and just updated.
• 15:30
  But I think that I think what the difference between this and
• 15:33
  time of the Brani is, is we see in a glorious pyramids of Mars
• 15:38
  steel the consequence if maestro succeeds in killing off all
• 15:44
  music. Yeah, I also think this is camp
• 15:47
  on purpose was I feel like timing around is camp by
• 15:49
  accident. I think Tyler Duran is a big
• 15:52
  pantomime. That's why I love it.
• 15:54
  But all this now I can see why suddenly people that don't like
• 15:57
  cameras. She's going I am music or why
• 16:02
  they're going. What's happening here?
• 16:04
  But do you think that we all get into Dock 2 because it's a bit
• 16:07
  camp and then we all go a bit serious and then we all start
• 16:10
  panicking about what everyone else is thinking and we forget
• 16:13
  why we actually fell off it in the first place?
• 16:15
  Well, yeah. But now there's all these old
• 16:17
  farts doing podcasts. So I'm wondering if you fall, if
• 16:19
  you fall out of love with camp again.
• 16:22
  I mean, I hope not. I mean, I'm 44.
• 16:24
  I'm sort of in 10 years, I'll be their age.
• 16:27
  So I maybe. Maybe it's coming.
• 16:29
  Yeah, it could. But this these two episodes,
• 16:32
  there's the most. I've enjoyed Dock 2 probably
• 16:34
  since early Series 10, and then I think it's the strongest start
• 16:38
  to a season since Series 5. Well, you know, you know, I'm an
• 16:41
  enormous fan of chippers and you're an enormous fan of Steven
• 16:44
  Moffitt. So we both enjoyed intervening
• 16:47
  periods between RTD One and RTD 2, but there is just something
• 16:52
  about the show spearheaded by Rusty Davis.
• 16:54
  There is, there is. There is, I'll keep saying it.
• 16:57
  There's an energy to it and there is just a push of fun.
• 17:01
  Yes. And colour and weight and I I
• 17:04
  can't explain it, it's it's like it's like being 8 again.
• 17:09
  The most unpredictable thing was me and you being totally on the
• 17:12
  same page after two episodes. All that flow out and weren't
• 17:16
  for nothing, was it? Eventually we were going to come
• 17:18
  together. I love how they play the piano
• 17:20
  here. I love.
• 17:21
  I love that like. Well, that's like a mad Disney
• 17:24
  villain now is it? That's like Ursula the Sea
• 17:26
  Witch, isn't it? Yeah, this.
• 17:28
  This image of, like, soaking up the notes in his heart into a
• 17:32
  lollipop and then eating it is genius.
• 17:36
  It's genius. I think all of the CGI with the
• 17:39
  notes, it's all used amazingly well.
• 17:42
  Poor June Hudson being hacked to be to buy him.
• 17:45
  Minnie Gibson being dragged out a corridor by them, all of it is
• 17:49
  just wonderful. And if this is the fantasy LED
• 17:51
  Doctor Who that we've been promised, bring more on baby,
• 17:55
  because I love it. So like when RCD One happened,
• 17:59
  the big thing was the Time War and being lasted Time Lords and
• 18:04
  all that. And then that was his style of
• 18:06
  the show. Then Moffitt came in and Moffitt
• 18:08
  style was very time play with time.
• 18:11
  Time Timey Wimey, Chipnall didn't really have a style and
• 18:14
  then he did. Well.
• 18:16
  It was like naturalist. It was whatever I can Nick from
• 18:20
  Ross, Steve Davis and Steve and Moffett.
• 18:21
  Plagiarize it. Cannibalize them.
• 18:23
  I think they the style of, yeah, RTD two is going to be fantasy,
• 18:27
  and I think people haven't quite adjusted to that yet.
• 18:30
  But I I was never ever bothered about getting the perfect
• 18:34
  answers to science or explanations that work.
• 18:38
  It's about a time shift that travels through time and space
• 18:41
  that's bigger on the inside than the out.
• 18:42
  Scientifically rationalise that for me.
• 18:45
  I think if it's thematically good and and also if if things
• 18:49
  happen and they're cool, that's fine.
• 18:53
  Like you can get away with so much if it's just cool.
• 18:56
  When when David Tennant made them Force Field and the Star
• 18:58
  Beast, no one was bothered because it was so cool.
• 19:02
  I'll tell you what is cool, right?
• 19:03
  What I don't ever buy is that Jodie Whittaker chose to take
• 19:08
  her companions to the most racist place ever as their first
• 19:12
  jaunt in the TARDIS. I don't buy that Peter Capaldi
• 19:15
  took bills to that boring planet in Smile.
• 19:18
  I don't buy. Oh actually, you both like rings
• 19:20
  of acting. I won't go there.
• 19:21
  I do buy that. I keep getting really big.
• 19:25
  Really. Gibson's character's name,
• 19:27
  Maybe? Sunday.
• 19:28
  I keep on. I absolutely buy someone going,
• 19:31
  Oh my God, we've got a time machine.
• 19:33
  Let's check out The Beatles. Yeah, it's the first thing,
• 19:36
  Pretty much the first thing I'd say.
• 19:37
  It makes sense, right? Oh, I've got to confess to you
• 19:39
  though, Luke. I am not much of A Beatles fan.
• 19:42
  Not not a fan. I just don't really know
• 19:45
  anything. Fraser had to tell me who Ringo
• 19:47
  Starr was the other day. OK, but I mean, I I'm from
• 19:52
  Liverpool now. I do really like.
• 19:54
  Oh, you you hide it so well. This bit where they come out
• 19:58
  dressed and the music's play, Were you not just watching this
• 20:01
  like fucking? I was literally.
• 20:03
  Going Oh, yeah, baby. People, people are saying this
• 20:07
  is cringey. Oh my God.
• 20:08
  Someone went somewhere online. Why has he got an Afro?
• 20:10
  Where's he got that from? It's fucking wig.
• 20:12
  All right, get over it. What does?
• 20:16
  What? Can't say that TARDIS doesn't
• 20:17
  have a herring. Machine.
• 20:19
  But watch her. Now what?
• 20:20
  I'll say what I'll say about the chemistry.
• 20:21
  He's walking. Very cool.
• 20:22
  And then watch her just start skipping.
• 20:23
  I mean, gorgeous. Yeah.
• 20:28
  And where else would you land Luke Malloy?
• 20:31
  I mean this obviously them on Abbey Road is pretty cool, but
• 20:34
  we'll talk about that at the end because it's the end bit for me
• 20:37
  that. What I love is the fact that she
• 20:38
  points. Out.
• 20:39
  The cars are in that direction because we're not precisely
• 20:43
  going to do the album cover. It's a little dance to do there.
• 20:47
  So good. Like, look at them together.
• 20:50
  They're so insane. And watch how tactile they are
• 20:53
  with each other in this episode already.
• 20:55
  Is it true that at some point in this episode it's dropped that
• 20:58
  they've been travelling for six months?
• 20:59
  Now. So I've got, yeah, I've got to
• 21:00
  admit, on Friday night it did. I was.
• 21:03
  I was like, why is she saying you don't do this, you don't run
• 21:07
  away from these monsters? And I thought, that's weird.
• 21:09
  She's been going out with her for like a day.
• 21:12
  But yes, she just dropped. It's been six months.
• 21:15
  But. I'd like to say that her line
• 21:18
  here about that there's always a Janet.
• 21:20
  There is a Janet at my work. Yeah, well, my mom's called
• 21:23
  Janet, so I'll. But the the big sort of all the
• 21:31
  the hype leading up to this, all the advertising, all Doctor Who
• 21:34
  Magazine, all of it was leading us to think this was a celebrity
• 21:37
  historical about The Beatles. Yeah, Was it, I mean.
• 21:42
  You're right, no. You are right.
• 21:45
  No, no, you are right. But I think it gets the balance
• 21:49
  exactly right. If you came here to watch the
• 21:51
  Doctor episode about The Beatles, you get a bit of
• 21:53
  Beatles, but it keeps it, keeps it to integrity as a Doctor Who
• 21:58
  episode because I'm not the biggest fan of them.
• 22:00
  Celebrity historicals where it just becomes the Shakespeare one
• 22:03
  or, you know, the the Dickens one because it feels less like a
• 22:07
  Doctor Who episode and more about peace on someone.
• 22:09
  So as time went along, when they did the God, I want to say
• 22:14
  Florence Nightingale, that wasn't her name at all, was it?
• 22:16
  What was her name in war? Of the Santara Mary sequel.
• 22:18
  Yeah, they did. But they put in a Santara
• 22:20
  invasion as well. You.
• 22:21
  Know. Yeah.
• 22:22
  See, that's more Doctor Who, So I like mix.
• 22:23
  It up, Yeah. Yeah.
• 22:25
  My God, what did you say? What?
• 22:28
  You liked Shibnoy episode? No, I liked the in the
• 22:32
  historical. You like War of the Santara?
• 22:34
  I do, yeah. No, it is one of the good ones.
• 22:38
  I really like that sort of Beatles.
• 22:40
  I've got a dog thing because it, and it honestly sounds like
• 22:43
  their early album stuff, but done slightly bad.
• 22:46
  Murray has hit its spot on it. I mean, Murray calls.
• 22:49
  I. Love him anyway, but he's
• 22:52
  smashed this out of the park. But like I've, I've heard the
• 22:55
  criticism many times. They don't know anything like
• 22:58
  The Beatles. Well, guess what guys?
• 23:00
  They're not The Beatles. They're actors playing The
• 23:02
  Beatles. And what is more important, OK,
• 23:05
  that that they can act and sing, or that they look like The
• 23:08
  Beatles. I think people expect better
• 23:12
  because it's on TV like it. They don't look like The Beatles
• 23:16
  like it does. It does slightly jaw.
• 23:18
  But it's one of those things. If it was on stage, you wouldn't
• 23:21
  think twice about it. You know, there are quite a few
• 23:24
  celebrity historicals where the celebrity historical characters.
• 23:28
  I think The Beatles are so recent and so big, and two of
• 23:32
  them are still alive. Can I?
• 23:33
  Can we just have a quick? Moment for Shooty's comic
• 23:36
  reactions to all the dreadful songs and music.
• 23:39
  It's so funny. We are two, We are not 3.
• 23:43
  Oh, it's that Susan Twist I see behind me and watch how cleverly
• 23:48
  this is directed. He never looks.
• 23:49
  He never looks. Yeah.
• 23:50
  Yeah, No. She turns away exactly when he
• 23:53
  turns around. Which makes me think if he does
• 23:56
  see it, he will recognise it. So I will now want to go back
• 23:59
  and watch the previous episodes and see does he actually look?
• 24:02
  No, it's just in the face. You know he doesn't see it, No.
• 24:05
  So you've got that, you've got the snow coming in and Ruby's
• 24:09
  back story, and you've got this Pantheon of God, So there's a
• 24:11
  lot of running stuff coming, so. Yeah, when when Ruby roaded, I
• 24:16
  was like, I'm not too fussed to. Ruby's mother is like, if that's
• 24:20
  the big if, that's the bad wolf for the season.
• 24:23
  What Russell's done this time is Chuck in about 20 things so that
• 24:27
  you actually can't piece the ones together.
• 24:30
  Yeah. I want her mum to turn that to
• 24:32
  be male, just cause. Well, you've got you've got a
• 24:37
  season twist. You got Ruby's mother.
• 24:39
  The one who waits. Mrs. floods the boss.
• 24:44
  The person who picked up the teeth.
• 24:46
  There's there's so much. There's the snow.
• 24:50
  Yeah, there's just I. Think it all works?
• 24:52
  I think it's all intriguing enough and none of it is getting
• 24:54
  in the way of the storytelling. I think if there was like three
• 24:57
  of them, you'd be quiet, you'd be able to piece it together.
• 25:00
  Right now, I'm. I'm so engaged.
• 25:02
  Honestly, when when Christmas finished, I was like, I don't
• 25:05
  care who Mrs. Flood is now I'm like season twist is the monk.
• 25:09
  It's the only answer. Well, well, we're we're going to
• 25:12
  talk about the scene on the roof in a minute where he talks about
• 25:14
  Susan because I swear we're leading up to Caroline Ford
• 25:17
  making a return appearance to. Doctor Who actually got to be
• 25:19
  out of it. Well, she was there at the 60th
• 25:21
  specials. Yeah, I can.
• 25:24
  I just say it the most niche bit of.
• 25:26
  Trivia I could possibly give you and Dilla Reef will get a stiffy
• 25:30
  for this as well because it's about spit off media, but Susan
• 25:33
  twist. Just said about the Wicked Lady,
• 25:36
  OK, an actress in a film called The Wicked Lady and in the
• 25:41
  Trouton years, John Bertwy is outside.
• 25:45
  I think it's Riverside Studios or plywood or something.
• 25:47
  And he goes many British films, including The Wicked Lady.
• 25:50
  Were done here and I've seen people go online saying I bet
• 25:53
  that wicked lady is a reference to the trout in years.
• 25:56
  Now that's fucking niche if. It is, I'm telling you.
• 26:00
  Anyway, I'm I'm distracting us from.
• 26:02
  This is one of the most vital scenes in the episode where
• 26:05
  we're talking about what music means.
• 26:08
  Also, if if they don't look like The Beatles, I actually think
• 26:11
  their accents are pretty good. They're great.
• 26:13
  Yeah, I and he's got the, you know what people say about David
• 26:17
  Bradley on Big Finish. He's definitely got the essence
• 26:20
  of John Leonard. I'm not sure about the McCartney
• 26:23
  guy. The guy in the glasses is really
• 26:25
  hot. I don't know.
• 26:26
  Why but he? Really is.
• 26:27
  But here you get Gibson and Shootie both bringing their
• 26:32
  performances right down. The energy's gone and they're
• 26:35
  trying to sell a soulful scene. And it works.
• 26:38
  And it's also given us a moment with The Beatles in an episode
• 26:41
  that's not particularly going to be about them.
• 26:43
  So if you did come for The Beatles, it's it's here.
• 26:46
  I love it when Shooty says about You know, don't you have that
• 26:49
  secret song in your heart? Yeah.
• 26:52
  Desperate to sing, which we've all got inside of us, This is
• 26:55
  basically, I know we get to see the blasted London and that's
• 26:59
  the consequence of losing music. Actually, this is the
• 27:02
  consequence of losing music is that everyone's muted and a bit
• 27:05
  dead inside because. Music.
• 27:07
  Brings us alive. And this just criticised him for
• 27:11
  not feeling like Paul McCartney. He's a good actor because he
• 27:14
  sells this bit about putting notes together and it is like
• 27:19
  he's just released and in a bit of his heart.
• 27:21
  And then he then he kicks off about it and obviously then that
• 27:24
  line about putting notes two and three and four and five together
• 27:29
  is what you get right at the end to save the day.
• 27:31
  I did think it was very interesting that they had him
• 27:35
  say you're disgusting. I got to be honest that that did
• 27:40
  go through my mind. I think that's got to be
• 27:42
  intentional, hasn't. It yeah, I think so.
• 27:44
  And I and shooting has said, you know, you can't afford my
• 27:47
  chocolatiness. So we will be talking about race
• 27:50
  this season. Yeah, nice show in the speed.
• 27:57
  No, but it's the Scream where it just got you know, Do you
• 28:00
  remember when they picked up the ball in the Spice Girl sequence
• 28:03
  and and there was this. It's kind of like takes you
• 28:05
  back. Rachel said.
• 28:07
  That's a girlfriend, Rachel said she thought it was all quite
• 28:11
  creepy. My show in the Spoon and and the
• 28:13
  stuff like it was actually quite creepy.
• 28:15
  You can see jigs also lovely. It's all going.
• 28:20
  OK, we're going up on the roof. So back to the Susan thing
• 28:24
  though, like I do. I do think it would make sense
• 28:28
  if, say, Ruby was Susan's daughter or something like that.
• 28:35
  So she's actually the Doctor's great granddaughter, only
• 28:38
  because the series has started, he's come in talking about time
• 28:41
  loads from the off. She's obviously got some sort of
• 28:47
  weird back story and then and it's all about them being alone
• 28:50
  in orphans and not having a family, so it'd actually make a
• 28:53
  lot of sense if they're connected by being actual
• 28:56
  family. Yeah, I I'm not disagreeing with
• 28:59
  any point. You're saying I think that's a a
• 29:01
  solid? Thing for once, the poster on
• 29:05
  the edge of that roof there, did you see it advertising?
• 29:07
  Chris Waits. Yeah, no, this.
• 29:09
  One reference to Aubrey waits in an Unearthly Child.
• 29:13
  But then I've also heard it could be the one who waits,
• 29:18
  Yeah? See, we're back doing this
• 29:20
  again, aren't we? Taking the pieces and going what
• 29:23
  does it all? Mean.
• 29:24
  And I'm actually invested. I'm actually bothered because
• 29:27
  I'm I'm invested in the doctor and I haven't.
• 29:29
  Been chippers did that once, did he?
• 29:31
  He didn't do like. Well, he had like flux and
• 29:33
  stuff, but so personally, I didn't have any faith that he
• 29:37
  would put them together. And I was right to.
• 29:39
  I was. You were wrong.
• 29:41
  It was great. No, you can't say that the
• 29:43
  threads that Chip Bill dropped in flux are actually satisfying
• 29:46
  by the end. No, that's what Rusty Davis
• 29:48
  doing with him now. He's getting all the emotional
• 29:50
  worth out of him. That he can.
• 29:52
  Yeah, exactly. And I think, I think they say,
• 29:54
  do you know what else about this series?
• 29:56
  I think it feels like things have happened in these two
• 30:00
  episodes that no one's clicked on to yet.
• 30:03
  Like I can't say oh. For sure don't I get the bit
• 30:06
  when they come out the TARDIS and he goes to the TARDIS and
• 30:08
  and it it says he's not happy about you coming out or what's
• 30:11
  that? And how was that all about?
• 30:12
  I just get that feeling that we're going to see in a few
• 30:15
  episodes, time scenes recontextualised a bit later on.
• 30:18
  I wonder if this will be relevant.
• 30:20
  The talk of her, her lesbian friend and the the song that she
• 30:23
  made. Are we going to meet that person
• 30:25
  later? It could be Susan Twist, for all
• 30:27
  we know. Oh, she's in there.
• 30:30
  Susan twisters in this scene. Is she?
• 30:33
  Yeah, she's she's. In yeah, of course.
• 30:35
  Oh God, does he look hot as a cowboy?
• 30:38
  I mean, I have obscene thoughts about shooting at war.
• 30:41
  I've got to. Be I'm not surprised.
• 30:43
  I mean, it's about time, really. I could do that with somebody in
• 30:45
  Doctor. Wears a very very tight jeans
• 30:48
  and trousers. Doesn't.
• 30:49
  He. That ass in space babies was
• 30:52
  absolutely possible. One Occasionally, you know, if
• 30:55
  you was in the room with shooting at war, I might not
• 30:57
  choose you. What I know that is for.
• 31:00
  Yeah, you know, take, take, still take the compliment,
• 31:04
  Millie Gibson said in the What's it Called These Days Unleashed.
• 31:08
  This costume was her favorite of the episode, not surprising.
• 31:12
  And she chose the colours. So they did the design.
• 31:14
  They said you can choose the colours and she said I want
• 31:16
  black and white, I just want classic.
• 31:18
  Did you know what, though? When they released the pictures
• 31:20
  of them, what feels like about five years ago now, then
• 31:22
  Polaroids on Twitter, I was like, I want, I need to see that
• 31:26
  now. When I started seeing him in
• 31:28
  different costumes and things like that, and I was like, yeah,
• 31:30
  we're not just doing the same costume every week, we're going
• 31:33
  to jazz it all up a. Bit it's so much.
• 31:35
  Better the Bridgeton look, I mean.
• 31:37
  Bring it on, baby. Romantic hero and I like.
• 31:41
  That I like that we just slow down here for the walls.
• 31:44
  And look at him, just looking sort of mournfully across London
• 31:47
  and London. Thinking about Susan.
• 31:50
  Thinking, but yeah, no, this and it's actually telling a story,
• 31:54
  isn't? It he's thinking more about
• 31:56
  Susan there than when Peter Davidson was staring her in the
• 31:59
  face of the console. In the five doctors.
• 32:01
  Who the hell are you? I was also think he literally
• 32:04
  name drops. Sure.
• 32:05
  That should have been. How's that going down with the
• 32:07
  Americans? How do you know what sure that
• 32:10
  she is? Because I've seen Remembrance of
• 32:11
  the Daleks. I love, I love watching all
• 32:14
  these reactions to, you know, the first bit of music they've
• 32:17
  heard in ages. You know, it's touching.
• 32:19
  People's It's not just a slow scene for no reason, it's
• 32:21
  telling a story. Excuse me?
• 32:23
  It's not just a slow scene for no reason.
• 32:25
  It's June fucking Hudson, all right?
• 32:27
  Well, I'm not. Costume designer extraordinaire,
• 32:30
  she she did the the costumes. For horns of diamond.
• 32:33
  And then she goes to a little piano.
• 32:35
  She goes and. Then she gets murdered.
• 32:40
  Hardly. Just how we like to remember
• 32:42
  people that worked on Classic Who.
• 32:45
  Well, that does make him more memorable than the other three
• 32:47
  agency. Although I do like this old guy
• 32:49
  who's just like just taking it. Oh, it's sniffing it in.
• 32:52
  But have you never heard? And when I first heard Max
• 32:55
  Wright's spring, yeah, which is The Four Seasons remastered for
• 33:00
  like a a modern generation. When I first heard that after my
• 33:04
  mum died, it touched me in such a profound way I felt as if I
• 33:08
  was flying up there with my mother.
• 33:11
  And that sounds ridiculous, but music can do that to you of.
• 33:14
  Course it can. I mean, I've genuinely got it
• 33:17
  with this piece of music because when we went to the 60th
• 33:21
  celebration, they played Ruby's theme and I always like an
• 33:26
  ethereal moment because, I mean they they were like, this is,
• 33:30
  this is brand new Dog 2 music. They hadn't done the new theme
• 33:32
  yet or anything. And they were like, yeah, Ruby,
• 33:35
  she's complicated. She's like a puzzle.
• 33:37
  So I've, I've, I've wrote her a waltz.
• 33:39
  It's what Murray Gold said. And they played that and I
• 33:42
  thought, Oh my God, that is it. There's that clip with me.
• 33:45
  So the God, oh, Ruby's waltz is fresh.
• 33:47
  It's new. It was that I was so talking.
• 33:49
  About Honestly, they lit you beautifully in that clip as
• 33:52
  well. I've never seen you look more
• 33:54
  beautiful. What?
• 33:56
  Oh, I love this. I love him running away as well.
• 33:58
  He's properly scared. Like this is something I can't
• 34:02
  be. Although admittedly, he did run
• 34:03
  away. It's space babies as well.
• 34:04
  Little crybaby he. Did actually yeah both both
• 34:08
  times to explain. But but look at the range
• 34:12
  they're giving him. You know, the fun in the TARDIS
• 34:14
  and then the mournful scene with The Beatles and now fear with
• 34:18
  Maestro. Like, he's just getting to play
• 34:20
  all these emotions. Well, I mean, he won't be able
• 34:23
  to run away next week, really. Literally he's got, oh, I think
• 34:29
  that's gonna be wonderful, Luke. You know that episode?
• 34:31
  So the early reviews are not reviews, but the early sort of
• 34:34
  murmurs are coming out and they're like, it is fucking
• 34:37
  fantastic. When Moffett does 1A year and
• 34:41
  Rusty Davis is some of the best Doctor Who you're ever going to
• 34:44
  see. I think it's going to be
• 34:45
  special, yeah. Me too.
• 34:47
  I think I think this. Season is very.
• 34:48
  Special. I think these are special in the
• 34:51
  in their own words. Like we have this argue all the
• 34:53
  time about fun and serious and what how you can compare the
• 34:57
  two. I because I I think I slightly
• 35:00
  prefer shoot, eat in space babies because he makes me laugh
• 35:03
  a lot more because he's got, he's got a lot more of that
• 35:05
  stuff to do. I I prefer this though just for
• 35:08
  the production value of it. I mean, I was.
• 35:11
  Just. Drinking it in.
• 35:13
  Later on when they're having the battle and the musical notes are
• 35:15
  coming out flying about out of all the.
• 35:18
  Instruments, I was just in heaven.
• 35:19
  Because even when you're shit at music, that's how you feel when
• 35:22
  you play, you feel like you're just smacking it out.
• 35:26
  I mean, you heard me sing at the beginning of the episode.
• 35:28
  What I hear is Catherine Jenkins in A Christmas Carol.
• 35:31
  We didn't sing that one. This sequence where we all of
• 35:42
  the sound bled out and all you could hear was a win.
• 35:44
  You've recently been going through Buffy and there's an
• 35:47
  episode of Buffy called Hush which where it's all it's music
• 35:51
  but there's no dialogue at all. I was getting such vibes of Hush
• 35:55
  for a second I thought to myself, are we going to do like
• 35:57
  a 10 minute sequence in the middle of this episode with no
• 36:00
  sound it? Is cool, isn't it?
• 36:02
  I've seen a lot of people like this sequence.
• 36:04
  I thought it was great. And what?
• 36:05
  And do you know what? Why I really liked it is because
• 36:09
  Jinx Monsoon now can't just be loud and camp.
• 36:14
  The direction has to make her sinister because there's no
• 36:16
  sound. Yeah, and it achieves it
• 36:18
  brilliantly. It's it's the only time that's
• 36:21
  serious in the whole like, in a way.
• 36:25
  No, I like the bit where the tables are turned on on maestro
• 36:28
  later when Ruby starts singing. Oh yeah, And she goes, and she
• 36:34
  sort of backs away and she goes, you are wrong and I.
• 36:39
  Like the bit when she's about to get drawn into the piano and
• 36:42
  she's running away from it. Like.
• 36:44
  Yeah, yeah. Well, no.
• 36:46
  And there's a bit as well where she's crawling towards the
• 36:48
  camera like the thing out of that bloody grudge.
• 36:51
  Yes, yeah, quite creepy. I mean, I I I just want an eagle
• 36:54
  mouse figurine already of her in this costume.
• 36:58
  Just and you know, Jinx Monsoon is so self styled she must have
• 37:02
  had an input into how she looks. Yeah.
• 37:05
  There's no way anyone, any make up designer was putting that
• 37:08
  slap on her face. So she's killing Jude Hudson.
• 37:12
  Yes, Die. Jude Hudson.
• 37:14
  Die. Oh my God.
• 37:16
  Look at her walking away, going. The little wink of the camera.
• 37:20
  So these like 4 fall breaks and stuff are are becoming more
• 37:23
  natural because we're now in a universe where the the laws of
• 37:27
  science. They're breaking down.
• 37:29
  I know that you see people that, but people that like ambassadors
• 37:33
  of death, you know, military, normal invasions of Earth, all
• 37:37
  very serious, all make sense, all scientific.
• 37:40
  I can't understand why they're pushing away from this sort of
• 37:43
  stuff, but we have. We've had that and I don't think
• 37:46
  that's totally gone. I think when we get the Unit 1
• 37:48
  later on the series, it might be a bit of fantasy, but I think
• 37:51
  it'll be serious. But, you know, I was brought up
• 37:53
  on Disney Pixar. I was brought up on Mary Poppins
• 37:56
  where bloody birds come in and start singing in the window.
• 37:59
  Like, I love this stuff. If Doctor Who's going to do this
• 38:02
  for a season or two, just go with it.
• 38:04
  But you know why? Because it's fun.
• 38:06
  Yeah, and and it's interested like.
• 38:10
  Whoa. And it's visually arresting as
• 38:13
  how like Luke, why would you resist this?
• 38:16
  I don't know, Russell said. That thing hasn't he of, like,
• 38:20
  we should be going, we should be doing the things that we've
• 38:22
  never done or people say don't do.
• 38:24
  And I'm like. Yeah, of.
• 38:26
  Course we should. New.
• 38:27
  Faces new areas. If everybody's having too much
• 38:30
  fun watching these episodes, you know, and finding it a bit
• 38:33
  puerile, go and watch Heaven Sent again and watch that old
• 38:35
  man walking around the castle. There is, Yeah, I like.
• 38:43
  It's a different tone. It is I.
• 38:44
  Just probably believe how fun it is.
• 38:46
  But yeah, I might be coming round.
• 38:49
  I might. Be coming round.
• 38:49
  I know you love Heaven sent for all the reasons you described.
• 38:52
  And I get it, Ellie. It's all out and it's very
• 38:55
  worthy. But it's not fun.
• 38:58
  Yeah, yeah. And what RTD has is incredibly
• 39:02
  watchable. But the episodes he makes rights
• 39:05
  incredibly watchable. Oh.
• 39:07
  I think he paces his episodes brilliantly.
• 39:10
  Yeah, and that thing I was saying before, every time you
• 39:13
  think that I might get bored in a second or this is gone, this
• 39:17
  is about to go on a bit too long, It just suddenly throws
• 39:20
  something new at you like like that.
• 39:23
  It's like the runaway from a monster.
• 39:24
  OK, we're 20 minutes in and suddenly get the mute muted
• 39:27
  scene and now suddenly we're going to get the pyramids and
• 39:29
  mod scene. And then even in that point the
• 39:31
  whole curtain drops and you get the whole thing on the and it
• 39:34
  you can't like stop and get bored.
• 39:37
  It is just continually driving you.
• 39:40
  So much to say about that Pyramidism.
• 39:42
  I'll see. But, and I do love.
• 39:44
  I love the whole sequence where the drapes come down and it's
• 39:47
  the Doctor and maestro, yeah, having like a verbal jewel.
• 39:52
  But I'm like so close to that all happening in the giggle.
• 39:56
  I'm like that that was the one point where I was.
• 39:59
  Like. This feels a bit say me.
• 40:02
  Which which happened in the giggle.
• 40:03
  Well, it was a bit, wasn't it? Where suddenly we're in this
• 40:06
  dream world and that you got the puppet show, the drapes come
• 40:09
  down and it's like being on a stage and I'm like, but that's
• 40:12
  it is his. Daughter So.
• 40:14
  Sort of putting them in the same spot anyway.
• 40:18
  And what a great little you know that you know RTD is great then
• 40:21
  little bit of world building tidbits that that in itself that
• 40:25
  the toy maker's got a daughter it's it's my what.
• 40:28
  I loved as well. What's the crazy song that comes
• 40:31
  up where she's like? Daddy's bad, Daddy's bad.
• 40:34
  Daddy make me very sad or whatever.
• 40:37
  I was like, you're fucking. Crazy.
• 40:40
  He does feel the Doctor feels incredibly out of his depth with
• 40:43
  these gods, isn't it? Because then she starts playing
• 40:46
  the tortoise. Yeah.
• 40:48
  So we've seen the consequence of what happens if he doesn't
• 40:51
  defeat it, and now the instrument in order to defeat it
• 40:55
  has taken off him. That's what's really exciting
• 40:57
  about it. Can you please Great here can.
• 41:02
  You please tell everybody how crazy they are to criticize this
• 41:06
  effect sequence. What is anything?
• 41:09
  Yeah, because I've heard. People say you know when you see
• 41:11
  them from. Behind and they're clearly
• 41:13
  matted in. Yes, they're they're clearly not
• 41:16
  on the diasteres. London.
• 41:19
  But look at the detail in it. It's it's one of those things,
• 41:22
  isn't it? We're all so used to CTI now
• 41:25
  that we know it's not real, like we just look at it and we know
• 41:28
  it's not real. But if you, if you're in a
• 41:31
  theatre and and you're in a destroyed world that it's
• 41:34
  literally just like a backdrop with a with a broken car on the
• 41:38
  stage, it doesn't take you out of it anymore.
• 41:41
  Do you know what I mean? People just like to winch, but I
• 41:44
  I really like the use of the London bus because I think that
• 41:47
  tells the kids in America precisely where we are very
• 41:51
  quickly. Yeah true true.
• 41:53
  I mean how do you feel about sort of repeating scenes because
• 41:58
  I'll I'll go straight away because people are not happy to
• 42:01
  like space babies repeated end of the world quite a bit.
• 42:04
  But I I think we all need to remember the end of the world is
• 42:07
  20 years ago and and. But also as well, it did it
• 42:13
  very, very quickly, very succinctly, you know, Yeah.
• 42:17
  It wasn't a laboured. Scene, it was about 30 seconds.
• 42:19
  In the end of the world, it's about 3 minutes.
• 42:22
  I Don't you love how the snow turns to?
• 42:25
  And the staging as well, with the spotlights coming down, it's
• 42:28
  so stark. Yes.
• 42:30
  And look at Jinx, looking gorgeous.
• 42:32
  I thought that's a bit of a Matt Lucas look about.
• 42:35
  Jinx Monsoon in this scene. I don't know.
• 42:38
  I don't see that but. Have you ever seen bubbles from
• 42:41
  Little Britain? Yes, You can't be bubbles,
• 42:44
  darling. I Every time I think about
• 42:46
  Lucas, I just think of him. That coat in Nadal's red tartan
• 42:49
  coat. I know.
• 42:50
  I always think of him inside that spacesuit going, I don't
• 42:53
  like it, I don't like it. But no, this was.
• 42:57
  I mean, they pushed the psychosis a lot throughout the
• 43:00
  episode, but this was the scene where I'm like, oh, there's no
• 43:03
  reason with you when she. Starts screaming her head off
• 43:07
  singing exposition. Oh my God.
• 43:10
  So I think the next God, or the one who waits, whichever one
• 43:14
  comes first, is going to be very muted and still and silent
• 43:18
  because we've had two sorts of over the top ones now.
• 43:22
  And if these are scared of the one who waits, then I think it's
• 43:25
  got to be a really intimidating, slow figure.
• 43:28
  Did you see the line of the song there as well?
• 43:31
  Very, very disturbing, she goes. Daddy was so tough.
• 43:36
  Daddy daddied me and that was quite enough.
• 43:40
  I don't know what that means, but it sounds very disturbing
• 43:44
  speaking as somebody that was daddied quite a lot when he was
• 43:47
  younger. It doesn't always mean nor
• 43:49
  things. But he does.
• 43:51
  He will. He will come in with a scalpel
• 43:54
  at times and surprise. You.
• 43:56
  But it's it's in the it's in the moment.
• 43:57
  She always don't click, You know, it's it's quite suddenly
• 44:01
  done. Look at Jinx.
• 44:02
  Just owning this like you think you wouldn't be able to take
• 44:05
  your eyes off shooting at Wall, but unfortunately Jinx Monsoon's
• 44:08
  in the room. It's it's one of those words at
• 44:11
  the end of the episode. You just want the back straight
• 44:13
  away. I mean, it's a great move from
• 44:17
  RCD to have new original villains in these two episodes
• 44:20
  because that makes it feel fresh.
• 44:22
  You know, we're not hopping in with the Dalek straight away or
• 44:25
  anything like that. I do also think I thought the
• 44:27
  bogeyman. Looked amazing in in episode.
• 44:30
  So great. And I've seen in the pictures
• 44:31
  I've seen since that the stills, I mean, is think back to that
• 44:36
  great creature in what was it before the flood and all of
• 44:39
  that, that thing. Wobbling along, You know people
• 44:43
  have short memories. Luke Beloy the.
• 44:45
  Fishy king. But I think as well, and like
• 44:48
  people might shoot me down since I don't give a fuck.
• 44:50
  I think it's so great. The representation is a positive
• 44:54
  thing and he started it with the star based and he's continuing
• 44:58
  it now and he said we are doing this because this is something
• 45:02
  that people need to be educated about.
• 45:04
  Especially when you you're proving that it's it's exactly
• 45:08
  the right thing to do. If Graham Lineham is pissed off,
• 45:12
  I think RTD is making sound choices.
• 45:15
  But you can't imagine anyone else playing my Treasure role,
• 45:18
  so it's exactly the right casting choice regardless
• 45:22
  anything else. When he goes.
• 45:24
  You're a very clever man, but genius?
• 45:27
  I don't think so. Let's just Did you not say like
• 45:32
  you're so clever, you're so hot, but genius?
• 45:35
  Yeah, wonderful. I'm playing the Tardis like an
• 45:39
  instrument. To the Doctor Who theme.
• 45:43
  I mean, we got, yeah, we got over that, the opening.
• 45:46
  I thought that was so clever. And then coming out of the.
• 45:48
  Radio as. Well, yeah, so.
• 45:50
  Good. But, and it of course, they're
• 45:53
  like people are kind of, oh, it's also meta.
• 45:55
  It's an episode about fucking music.
• 45:57
  You can't do this really at any other time.
• 46:01
  I mean, they're getting the use out of the TARDIS LED lights
• 46:04
  too, aren't they? Because when they built that
• 46:07
  TARDIS, they said each light can be controlled separately.
• 46:10
  So look at them go. Very quickly look at this shot,
• 46:13
  this long shot of the TARDIS console.
• 46:16
  Do you see it on an angle? I mean, that is just one
• 46:20
  example. It's a very quick shot and they
• 46:22
  wouldn't have to set up for that to get that two second shot.
• 46:26
  There's so much style in this, but it's almost like there's so
• 46:29
  much you sort of have to slow it down to see all of it.
• 46:33
  But that's all right, because people who care will They'll
• 46:36
  watch you over and over again. I'm wondering, you know that
• 46:38
  song at the end where it's like, cut, cut, cut, cut, cut, cut,
• 46:41
  cut. If people are just a bit old,
• 46:42
  they can't keep up, you know? Like, where are we now?
• 46:45
  Why? Why are we there?
• 46:46
  We're in the corridor. Why is it raining?
• 46:47
  What's going on, you know? Just go with it.
• 46:51
  I I mean, if they ever seen a musical.
• 46:55
  I love a musical me. I love a musical.
• 46:57
  I mean, so we're clear. We are on the same page.
• 46:59
  We clearly like stuff like this, whereas I know some people
• 47:02
  don't. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 47:04
  But this isn't. That's the.
• 47:07
  Thing because I've backed myself.
• 47:08
  I'm like, how can you not like this?
• 47:10
  This is bloody great. Oh, here, now another moment
• 47:13
  here where she's going to. Follow him out of the room and
• 47:15
  he goes, No, no. No, no, you stay there.
• 47:17
  It's just this instant chemistry between the two of them.
• 47:22
  It's electric. I can't explain it.
• 47:23
  When they're together that something just comes off the
• 47:25
  screen. I'm I'm surprised I am sold this
• 47:31
  early with the two of them because the only other time
• 47:34
  that's happened to me, I know it happened to you with Karen
• 47:36
  Gillan and Matt Smith. The only other time that hit me
• 47:38
  straight away the chemistry was Tate and Tennant.
• 47:42
  That's it. I've I've not even had that sort
• 47:45
  of moment where I've been like, OK, like when shit, you go go to
• 47:50
  like really get that moment to become the Doctor as soon as he
• 47:53
  was in the giggle. I was, I was just like, it's
• 47:55
  Doctor Who. I've not even had to like
• 47:58
  recontextualize. So to laugh.
• 48:01
  I'm so sorry, but this bit where Ruby was dragged down the
• 48:04
  corridor by the notes, Mark was howling so loud at the screen
• 48:08
  and every time it cut back to her, he got loud and honest to
• 48:11
  God, right He he doesn't laugh out loud too much at TV.
• 48:14
  He laughed out loud. Five times in space babies and
• 48:18
  three times in this episode. When that baby.
• 48:22
  Turned when the when the baby turned up but then drove off and
• 48:25
  it went side to side. In the prime I was every.
• 48:27
  Time. The rats were moving.
• 48:30
  He was in fist. I said.
• 48:33
  Are you all right? It's.
• 48:35
  Just like people getting dragged down corridors.
• 48:39
  This is more sex life you're talking about, all right?
• 48:43
  Oh, this is another lovely costume though, that Jinx is
• 48:45
  wearing here. Well, this is quite toy maker,
• 48:48
  isn't it? There's something different
• 48:51
  about the eyes now. Is it different contacts?
• 48:55
  Oh, I don't know. They look different in H3
• 48:59
  costumes. This.
• 49:00
  I mean the image of just what's happening to Ruby in the back I.
• 49:03
  Remember that being in the publicity.
• 49:05
  In the trailer and thinking. But I have to say to you, one of
• 49:08
  my favorite all time favorite songs, I'm not bullshitting you
• 49:11
  is Carol of the Bells. I.
• 49:13
  There was a year where I listened to it on a loop for
• 49:16
  days. So whenever this goes, I love
• 49:21
  it. It's it's kind of magical and a
• 49:24
  bit haunting at. The yeah, I was just about to
• 49:26
  say haunting. Yeah, it's it's the first time
• 49:30
  Maestro looks good. Yeah.
• 49:33
  I mean, I did. The doctor might be shuffling
• 49:35
  with someone even more powerful than these people.
• 49:37
  That's. Wrong, she says.
• 49:40
  There's a song hidden deep in her soul.
• 49:44
  I'll do a good jinx monsoon. But you do.
• 49:48
  Oh, it's so good. I mean, I was like, oh, what's
• 49:51
  happening? It's snowing again.
• 49:52
  Like I was so invested in the ARC already.
• 49:54
  Do you know what this reminds me of?
• 49:56
  The the notes all coming out of it like that.
• 49:58
  Do you remember when we first saw the controller in Bad Wolf
• 50:02
  and it was visually arresting, wasn't it?
• 50:03
  I was like, well, I've not seen anything like that on TV before.
• 50:06
  And here we are again. This.
• 50:08
  This is obviously 20 years of CGI.
• 50:11
  Later this. And the snow coming down.
• 50:14
  Because I'm. I really.
• 50:15
  I want snow. In every episode I want snow.
• 50:18
  I love it and it's such a such a simple vision.
• 50:21
  Plue this is ARC stuff pay. Attention, we need that now the
• 50:27
  TikTok generation are watching. I mean, do you think kids are
• 50:32
  watching this? Do you think kids are loving
• 50:33
  this? I don't care.
• 50:35
  That's what I'm saying. Don't care.
• 50:36
  I'm enjoying it. I'm not going to get worried
• 50:38
  about anyone else. I.
• 50:39
  Hope so though. I hope.
• 50:41
  So who's it for? Well, I know little girl who
• 50:43
  was. Because she was drawing her
• 50:45
  pictures straight afterwards at. Gunpoint.
• 50:52
  Oh, now this whole sequence. This is so beautifully
• 50:55
  choreographed him on the piano. Chinks on the violin.
• 50:59
  It's great stuff, but just like the the music of it, it's like a
• 51:04
  verbal duel with music and the pace gets faster and faster
• 51:08
  until the bloody fiddle explodes.
• 51:10
  So. At at this point, I had no idea
• 51:14
  I was so immersed in the story, I had no idea how far in we
• 51:17
  were. Like, you know when you just
• 51:19
  sometimes, you know, you've got 10 minutes left or whatever.
• 51:22
  I had no idea. I was just so in there.
• 51:24
  On my first watch, at this point, I was going, where's the
• 51:27
  songs? On my second watch, I was like,
• 51:30
  I don't want this to end. No, this is so.
• 51:34
  Beautiful. The violin just flies into.
• 51:41
  It's like Jinx has been waiting for this role.
• 51:43
  Do you know what the Jinx Monsoon interview in Doctor Who
• 51:46
  Magazine is the best thing I've read in that magazine for ages?
• 51:49
  It was so it was almost controversial, the thing she was
• 51:53
  saying and I've I appreciated that because it actually made me
• 51:55
  sit up for once for a bit of journalism in that rag that.
• 51:58
  One or the season twist. One where she just doesn't say
• 52:02
  anything. It's brilliant.
• 52:03
  Like she acts as if she's not even in Doctor.
• 52:07
  But Jigs Monsoon said in that interview.
• 52:09
  Yeah, all those other drag queen bitches are so jealous.
• 52:15
  She goes, I'm. I'm keeping my eye out
• 52:17
  everywhere I go because they're trying to kill me in various
• 52:20
  spectacular ways. I love that.
• 52:23
  I love the image of notes flying out of the instruments.
• 52:27
  If there was, if there was a visual representation of the
• 52:31
  fantasy in this season, that's kind of it, isn't it?
• 52:33
  The snow, the notes. And we've not mentioned yet, but
• 52:37
  I think the director in this entire episode, it's just
• 52:40
  gorgeous. It's such, she said.
• 52:42
  It's such a perfectly crafted piece of work.
• 52:46
  Now that's one thing, no? Doctor Who episode like this?
• 52:48
  No. No, I'm not.
• 52:50
  Close that tomorrow when it finished, I said that that
• 52:52
  weirdly, for a 60 year old show, that is a unique piece of Doctor
• 52:55
  Who. Yeah.
• 52:57
  And I'm not sure you could have said that for some time before
• 53:01
  this. No, I haven't sent.
• 53:07
  Maybe, yeah. I mean, I don't think they've
• 53:09
  done something like Rosa since series one.
• 53:11
  Oh, no, no. I'd definitely give you Rosa,
• 53:14
  actually, because at the time I thought, that's good, That is
• 53:17
  going somewhere new. Maybe.
• 53:19
  Maybe. Each era does one unique
• 53:20
  episode. Two out of three episodes in.
• 53:24
  There was. There's been nothing quite like
• 53:26
  Listen either, I don't think. Yeah.
• 53:30
  No, that hasn't. That hasn't.
• 53:31
  But some of them really stand out, I think.
• 53:34
  Yeah, I agree. Are you enough of a genial?
• 53:39
  So on on 1st watch I've got, I was genuinely dobsmacked when he
• 53:45
  hit when she goes, but no and he actually gets it wrong.
• 53:48
  Yeah, because I was convinced that how she was going to go.
• 53:51
  It's really built up to this is how it's going to end.
• 53:55
  Yeah, and then? I you know, I could just imagine
• 53:57
  those people that have been pissed off by everything else so
• 53:59
  far the the two of them ending up in dimensionally
• 54:02
  transcendental musical instruments.
• 54:04
  Was going to end the way them even more.
• 54:06
  And I just love seeing them inside, like squashed.
• 54:09
  Yeah, and when she's in the drum, she's just like Bang Bang.
• 54:13
  Bang. That's the best bit.
• 54:16
  I'm so jealous. I want to play Jinx for Sue's
• 54:18
  role so badly. You better watch out for me,
• 54:20
  bitch. All right, I'm.
• 54:24
  Going. I mean, she's got a tone, right?
• 54:27
  So not oh God, yeah, God. I mean, you could so see the
• 54:31
  finale being like Toymaker, Maestro, and the one who waits
• 54:35
  like the Trilogy of The Three. Yeah.
• 54:38
  Oh, look at those glass notes in the air.
• 54:40
  How the hell you were. You were meant to be fine.
• 54:43
  How the hell you would fight the toy maker, maestro and a big
• 54:46
  bottle at the same time, I have no idea.
• 54:49
  I was asked on another podcast tonight, which is going out
• 54:52
  soon. So don't worry folks, you'll
• 54:54
  hear that soon. Why those musical notes would
• 54:56
  appear in the air? Because Maestro has been
• 54:59
  manipulating everything previous to this.
• 55:01
  And so why when the doctors playing the instruments and
• 55:03
  maestro's being killed, would those notes appear?
• 55:07
  And I just basically said, well, one chill out and two, two,
• 55:11
  moisture is a massive drama queen.
• 55:13
  Of course, she knows he's never going to hit that note, so she's
• 55:15
  going to build up the tension as much as she possibly can.
• 55:19
  Well, it's also this thing at the end of people who need an
• 55:22
  explanation, physical explanation for the song and
• 55:25
  dance number in the Abbey Road thing.
• 55:27
  It it there's a line in the giggle about what the toy makers
• 55:32
  domain still being in play. That's how they get the TARDIS,
• 55:35
  the second TARDIS it. It's the same here.
• 55:38
  Even though Maestro's defeated, the musical world is still in
• 55:42
  play for a bit, and so you can. Have that single, but I'm glad
• 55:45
  that line. Me too, because it makes.
• 55:47
  It, Russell obviously said. You know what, That shit.
• 55:50
  Let's just have it. Yeah, because he's already said
• 55:53
  it in the giggle, and it makes it feel so much more special
• 55:55
  that just for a second it might have actually happened.
• 55:59
  But at this point, at this point.
• 56:01
  We're Maestro's using the musical notes as a whip and
• 56:05
  playing the bloody horn, and they're coming out of.
• 56:07
  The top of it. I'm like, who the fuck are The
• 56:10
  Beatles? Who cares?
• 56:12
  It's. Great.
• 56:12
  Sometimes you do dance like in the road and it feels like the
• 56:16
  roads lighting up underneath it. You don't need a a line of
• 56:18
  techno bubble to explain why you you you feel that way.
• 56:22
  And if you are a fan of The Beatles, then they do save the
• 56:26
  time. Well, so yeah, I do really like
• 56:28
  this. As a as a fan of The Beatles,
• 56:30
  I'm glad that it just it's quite a nice way if it all being sold
• 56:35
  because the doctors basically done the notes, they've just got
• 56:38
  to come together and play it. I think it's really neat
• 56:41
  storytelling and it's bringing The Beatles back in.
• 56:44
  Which beat was that with the glasses again?
• 56:46
  That's John. God, he's really pretty.
• 56:48
  And he's wearing tight trousers as well.
• 56:50
  In fact, I love how they all wear those cotton shirts that
• 56:53
  show off their chests. Little shaky cello.
• 56:57
  My show is just dancing around the room having a wonderful
• 57:00
  time. I actually think, oh, I'm going
• 57:03
  to be a bit controversial. I think Maestro is a more
• 57:08
  impressive character in this than the toy maker was in The
• 57:10
  Giggle. It's just it's because we've
• 57:14
  seen the toy maker before as like a concept.
• 57:17
  This is a brand new concept music.
• 57:20
  I I I think Neil Patrick Harris is brilliant in that episode,
• 57:24
  but he doesn't lose himself as much as this.
• 57:29
  Well, he sort of has to go a bit serious at the end.
• 57:30
  Doesn't need to do the big laser gun thing because there there is
• 57:35
  something about that ending on that helipad that sort of
• 57:38
  deflates the atmosphere. This pill is is to get attracted
• 57:41
  to. The piano.
• 57:42
  Oh, it's. Wonderful.
• 57:45
  Exactly the same. As the Rani being pushed into
• 57:47
  that booth in time and the Rani, you know.
• 57:51
  But there's still time for one last enigmatic insult at the.
• 57:56
  End. Yeah, but we're the one who
• 57:58
  waits. Is it?
• 58:01
  Is. Is that not subtle enough?
• 58:04
  Is that too much? But it doesn't.
• 58:07
  It doesn't matter because you can't guess it, because there's
• 58:09
  ten other mysteries going on the same time.
• 58:11
  Oh my. God, my favorite part of the
• 58:15
  episode's coming up. I I assume the one who waits is
• 58:18
  a new villain. I want it to be a new villain,
• 58:20
  like a new big bad. Wait, I think it's going to be
• 58:23
  part of this Pantheon, isn't it? Yeah, they're building it all
• 58:26
  out to be. And surely it's going to be the
• 58:28
  big buzz. And the carols, when you can
• 58:31
  hear they when the music comes back, it's cars blaring their
• 58:35
  horns and all sorts that you can get music from anything.
• 58:39
  Here we go. It's coming.
• 58:42
  There's one thing I should warn you about Luke, and this is
• 58:45
  really very serious. With all of my adventures
• 58:49
  through podcasting and space, I have to tell you there's always
• 58:54
  A twist in the end go. There's always A twist.
• 58:59
  There's always A twist. There's always A twist at the
• 59:04
  oh, it's joyous, the whole. He looks so fucking cool on that
• 59:08
  stage, doesn't he? Yeah, he looks so good.
• 59:11
  And look at the colour now. Now we've had an episode of sort
• 59:14
  of been a bit devoid of colour apart from Jinx.
• 59:17
  Now suddenly it's just bursting off the screen with all the
• 59:19
  costumes. The whole, the whole frame in
• 59:21
  the choreography, the cable costumes.
• 59:25
  This is this is what I want for my.
• 59:28
  Doctor, I love it. The waltz and the schmaltz and
• 59:31
  the penalties for faults it. Feels like a reward for getting
• 59:35
  rid of maestro. No, it is.
• 59:37
  It's the it's the pay off for the episode.
• 59:39
  We've got music back. There's.
• 59:40
  Murray Gold Murray Gold on on keyboard.
• 59:43
  Oh yeah. Looking very serious, man, I'll
• 59:45
  say. Oh, I've heard people.
• 59:46
  Really laying into the lyrics? Who cares?
• 59:49
  It's Groovy. Yeah, I know.
• 59:52
  Oh, and I liked it when we cut to The Beatles.
• 59:54
  They do sound like The Beatles, don't you think?
• 59:56
  Yeah, I honestly think it's so it's really good.
• 59:58
  We ain't no fools from Liverpool.
• 1:00:00
  I heard that Cilla Black got quite a lot of her scenes cut.
• 1:00:03
  Oh, isn't it great with him and all them in the booth just
• 1:00:07
  rocking? Away.
• 1:00:08
  Oh, that's so cool. I mean, that as a screenshot
• 1:00:10
  there is beautiful, isn't it? Yeah.
• 1:00:13
  And then look Shirley and Shirley Johannes from Strictly
• 1:00:16
  come. Dancing.
• 1:00:17
  Oh, wonderful. But I I can't express this
• 1:00:19
  enough the amount of sheer life in Shooty Gatwa right now.
• 1:00:24
  Yeah, he is the perfect doctor. I mean, watching this, yet why
• 1:00:29
  would on earth would you reject this when you can just enjoy it?
• 1:00:32
  I don't actually was sat there angry.
• 1:00:33
  But there was plenty. There were plenty.
• 1:00:37
  Don't get it, Why is it suddenly raining?
• 1:00:39
  Who cares? It looks great.
• 1:00:40
  It. Looks.
• 1:00:41
  Amazing. It's a musical.
• 1:00:42
  It's a musical. When I saw that in the trailer
• 1:00:45
  that they were dancing in the rain, I was like, oh, it's going
• 1:00:47
  to be fabulous. Yeah.
• 1:00:49
  And all the bit where they come down the stairs in a minute and
• 1:00:52
  then. Both throw up their brollies at
• 1:00:54
  the same time. And then there's Harbinger.
• 1:00:58
  And I do it La La La La La La La La La La La La.
• 1:01:04
  Always, always a twisty in the end and the balloons coming,
• 1:01:10
  people going where did the. Balloons come from.
• 1:01:14
  It's a musical. It's a musical.
• 1:01:17
  You want to. Shoot, you say.
• 1:01:18
  Go outside and touch the grass. Oh look, a big sigh.
• 1:01:23
  I see this is the image that I'm going to think of for years and
• 1:01:27
  years and years. I do.
• 1:01:28
  You know they said on the on the behind the scenes that they only
• 1:01:31
  got, they only did it in the brollies because it was actually
• 1:01:33
  raining. I think this is so much better
• 1:01:35
  because they got them colourful brollies in their hair.
• 1:01:38
  Why was it? Would be a bit muted colour
• 1:01:40
  wise, wouldn't it? Yeah, I want, I want artwork of
• 1:01:43
  this straight away on my wall, them to dancing the the zebra
• 1:01:46
  cross and lit up. How, after watching these two
• 1:01:49
  Dalton across this live piano, they can't be completely in love
• 1:01:53
  with the pair of them is beyond me.
• 1:01:55
  Is mental, Is mental. How is that over so quickly?
• 1:01:58
  I just think. I just think that is the most
• 1:02:00
  uplifting end to a Doctor Who episode I can ever remember.
• 1:02:03
  Maybe since Partners in Crime do you?
• 1:02:05
  Remember when they're waving at Wilf?
• 1:02:07
  Yes. You know, oh look, Steven
• 1:02:10
  Moffitt's back. Mark Cochran's coming in his
• 1:02:13
  pants as we talk. And do you know, like a huge
• 1:02:16
  thing for me, before going in to Friday night, I was like, I'm
• 1:02:21
  really happy they haven't dropped the whole series at once
• 1:02:23
  because then it'd all be over in one day.
• 1:02:25
  When this ended, I was like, where is it?
• 1:02:29
  That's all the mysteries we were getting.
• 1:02:30
  I'm so ready for boom. Give me boom now.
• 1:02:33
  No, 2:00 I was ready for bed. I am 44.
• 1:02:38
  But I was just a good sign. I was so excited for the next
• 1:02:41
  one. Do you know, You know, we don't
• 1:02:44
  really know any of the upcoming monsters apart from a big slug.
• 1:02:48
  That's that's exciting. Well, all I know is I know more
• 1:02:52
  about the, what's it called 73 Yards because tell me that the
• 1:02:56
  synopsis has been released for the target novel.
• 1:03:00
  So I know that's sort of going to be a folk horror sort of down
• 1:03:02
  on Earth. OK, I I'd heard the word.
• 1:03:04
  Rich Witchcraft. Yeah.
• 1:03:06
  And Boom's obviously on an alien planet.
• 1:03:10
  Do you know what I've heard about Boom, Right.
• 1:03:12
  And this is. No, no, no.
• 1:03:13
  It's not smaller. It's not smaller.
• 1:03:16
  Come on, let me just tell you this.
• 1:03:17
  It's about. Technology.
• 1:03:18
  It's so bad with spoilers. It's about technology.
• 1:03:20
  It's nothing about storytelling. Oh, is it about the back jaw?
• 1:03:24
  Yeah, that they had to. They had to build one of those
• 1:03:27
  walls in Cardiff because the last scene of Boom was so
• 1:03:33
  ambitious They couldn't realise it.
• 1:03:35
  They just couldn't realise it without the wall.
• 1:03:37
  But that is the hole. That's what it said in Doctor
• 1:03:41
  Who Magazine. It was the last scene because
• 1:03:43
  otherwise they were looking at doing it on location.
• 1:03:46
  They were looking at actually, genuinely, they said Doctor Who
• 1:03:48
  Magazine, they were looking at doing it classic Who's star with
• 1:03:51
  sort of unconvincing backdrops. Seriously.
• 1:03:54
  And then they were looking at doing it in the studio and they
• 1:03:56
  were like, no, no, no. That last shot is so, so
• 1:03:59
  ambitious. We need the wall.
• 1:04:01
  So they did it. And apparently there was big.
• 1:04:04
  Arguments because it was a hell of an expense.
• 1:04:06
  OK, cool. Finally, you're going to see
• 1:04:10
  something. That fucking Disney money.
• 1:04:11
  Dylan Reece, we've. Just seen it.
• 1:04:15
  We've just seen 50 minutes of it dancing and singing as well.
• 1:04:19
  You know, I mean, I feel as if we've been fused quite enough
• 1:04:22
  for everybody today, but we do need to conclude this with our
• 1:04:26
  free, fabulous reasons why people should go and watch The
• 1:04:31
  Devil's Court again, because that two point, whatever
• 1:04:34
  million, is obviously not going to be the final figure on that
• 1:04:38
  episode. Don't mention figures.
• 1:04:40
  No, no, no, no. But it's so bullshit, isn't it?
• 1:04:43
  Like there's there's going to be so many watches of this, it's
• 1:04:45
  going to hit 78 million, I promise you anyway.
• 1:04:48
  It's worldwide. We don't need the overnights,
• 1:04:52
  the. Literally is.
• 1:04:53
  I know it's those old people again.
• 1:04:55
  Feel for them. What's your reason #1 then?
• 1:04:59
  Luke Malloy. I'm going to go with that scene
• 1:05:04
  on the rooftop where Ruby's playing the waltz, because it
• 1:05:07
  does take me back to when I first heard the waltz in that
• 1:05:11
  that musical 60th celebration and just being blown away by the
• 1:05:15
  freshness and the puzzle of it and and I never knew that was
• 1:05:20
  going to be the context around it.
• 1:05:22
  But there is something just beautifully intriguing and oh,
• 1:05:30
  it's And then you've got the Doctor just wistfully looking on
• 1:05:33
  and he's just spoke about Susan. So he's thinking it's just a
• 1:05:36
  quiet moment in what is quite a loud episode in many ways and
• 1:05:43
  and it just makes you remember how important music can be,
• 1:05:47
  which is the whole theme of the episode.
• 1:05:48
  Cut into those people listening to it, being so moved by it.
• 1:05:52
  That's what this episode is about, yeah.
• 1:05:55
  Anyone who thinks that, you know, wasting a minute in the
• 1:05:57
  middle to to have Ruby Sunday playing a lament on the piano is
• 1:06:02
  missing the point entirely. My first thing that I really
• 1:06:07
  want to highlight Judy Gatwa, but I don't want to dismiss
• 1:06:11
  Millie Gibson in this one. If it was space babies, my first
• 1:06:14
  thing would have been Judy Gatwa.
• 1:06:16
  But I want to just say my first thing is the chemistry between
• 1:06:19
  Gibson and Gatwa and just how instant and electric it is, how
• 1:06:24
  fun it is to watch who. I totally believe that they've
• 1:06:27
  been travelling together for some time and just how they can
• 1:06:31
  play comedy. They can play drama because they
• 1:06:33
  do all of it in this. They can play crazy, camp danger
• 1:06:37
  together. I just think they're wonderful.
• 1:06:39
  I'm I'm. I'm a little bit baffled by my
• 1:06:43
  own reaction of how much I love the two of them together,
• 1:06:47
  because I was less sure during Ruby Rd. and even though I
• 1:06:52
  thought they were good together. No, I was the same, yeah.
• 1:06:54
  Now I'm desperate to see more of them together.
• 1:06:58
  So yeah, that's my first thing. OK, second thing I'm going to go
• 1:07:03
  all the mysteries we're getting, but specifically Susan Twist the
• 1:07:07
  the human bad wolf that is just appearing in every episode that
• 1:07:12
  any normal person wouldn't ever notice.
• 1:07:15
  But like what? Wouldn't it be great if there
• 1:07:22
  was something in the last episode called The Tail and
• 1:07:25
  Susan Twist is in it? Twist the tail.
• 1:07:28
  Something like that. It's got to be something like
• 1:07:30
  that, right? To be honest, I was quite
• 1:07:32
  surprised they're singing This is a twist at the end, and I
• 1:07:36
  know they're doing A twist dance, but I was expecting it to
• 1:07:39
  work on 2 levels where there would actually be another twist.
• 1:07:43
  I don't know. You've got the kid who sort of
• 1:07:44
  stood in the background, but I felt like there might have been
• 1:07:48
  something else in there. Now this is the you are not
• 1:07:52
  alone of this season, isn't it? It's absolutely pointing to the
• 1:07:57
  end of the season. The twist and the tale is coming
• 1:07:59
  and it's just pointing in that direction.
• 1:08:01
  Yeah, I for now it's just a groovy number.
• 1:08:04
  Yeah, I think there's something there that is going to be.
• 1:08:07
  We're going to go back in six weeks time.
• 1:08:09
  Oh my God, the devil chord is even better than we feel.
• 1:08:14
  But I'd love it if the Big Susan Twist bit comes out and.
• 1:08:17
  Whilst I was going, there's only twist in the tail.
• 1:08:20
  I did. That.
• 1:08:21
  I did that to IMDb Susan Twist, just to actually make sure that
• 1:08:25
  that name was real, because it's just too good, isn't it?
• 1:08:29
  It's Susan Twist. So where has this character
• 1:08:32
  appeared so far in? Was she?
• 1:08:35
  Was she in the store based? No, There's been Wild blue on
• 1:08:38
  the Ruby Rd. She was in the audience of the
• 1:08:44
  she appeared in Space Babies, but I did not spot her.
• 1:08:47
  On the screen, yeah. I've seen it now, the picture
• 1:08:50
  from the screen and then here, and I think, I think there might
• 1:08:55
  be a chance that she's actually in both the Giggle and Star
• 1:08:59
  Beast, and no one's found it yet.
• 1:09:01
  Oh. Would that be great?
• 1:09:02
  If they do a flashback? We're like, oh shit, how do we
• 1:09:04
  not spot that? Yeah, I I just got some sort of
• 1:09:07
  feeling that there's you know mentioned that there's a woman
• 1:09:10
  in Abu Dhabi that was buying the toys like I have a feeling it
• 1:09:15
  could be Susan Twist because you to mention that.
• 1:09:19
  Bit of trivia and. I think there might be something
• 1:09:23
  similar. With the giggle where?
• 1:09:24
  Someone's mentioned a woman somewhere, and actually we'll
• 1:09:27
  see it a bit later on. It's actually Susan Twist.
• 1:09:29
  But next week, yeah, I'm going to be enjoying boom, whatever's
• 1:09:32
  coming, I'm going to have one eye out just because that's
• 1:09:35
  that's really exciting at the moment is where's Susan this
• 1:09:38
  week Knowledge. Right.
• 1:09:40
  Is that we'll? Get the same sort of feeling we
• 1:09:43
  did with Bad Wolf, Do you ever sort of the middle of the season
• 1:09:45
  when you're going, well, where's Bad Wolf going to turn up now?
• 1:09:48
  And we got really excited when the helicopter came down in
• 1:09:50
  Dalek or whatever it was, middle of the season.
• 1:09:56
  The naysayers will be going. Oh, we're doing bad wolf again,
• 1:09:58
  are we? Nothing original.
• 1:10:02
  This is she is the most. Exciting story, I can think
• 1:10:06
  because it's just like, who the fuck is this?
• 1:10:09
  No, I'm. Genuinely sold on the mystery.
• 1:10:11
  Of who left the baby now just because of how?
• 1:10:14
  Because of how many culprits it could be.
• 1:10:17
  Well, not just that as well, but just how they're they're
• 1:10:19
  bringing. That up in the episodes with the
• 1:10:22
  snow coming down, I think it's so effective because after we
• 1:10:25
  wrote it, it just didn't do much for.
• 1:10:27
  Me. But it actually feels it's been
• 1:10:28
  made important, doesn't it? It like it is.
• 1:10:31
  It is definitely the it's important.
• 1:10:34
  You could have done this with Avkolos all.
• 1:10:36
  Right. You had two more seats.
• 1:10:40
  Whose tone is it? It's you.
• 1:10:42
  Oh, OK. Mysteries, then, because I I
• 1:10:45
  think we mentioned it, but we didn't mention it enough.
• 1:10:48
  I feel the direction of this episode.
• 1:10:50
  I think it's something completely new to Doctor Who.
• 1:10:53
  Ben Chesil. That's the one.
• 1:10:55
  And I mentioned at the start of. How crafted this felt?
• 1:10:58
  And that's because he is clearly a master Craftsman.
• 1:11:01
  I hope he's doing more this year.
• 1:11:03
  I was going to say, is he doing any more?
• 1:11:04
  He's probably exhausted after this.
• 1:11:06
  But because. There's so I mean just the
• 1:11:08
  musical. Number at the end had an insane
• 1:11:11
  amount of scenes. I'm always complaining about
• 1:11:13
  those Steven Moffett Pre title sequences, wasting all the money
• 1:11:17
  on several occasions, but in that 5 minutes we I think
• 1:11:21
  there's about 70 scenes or something.
• 1:11:22
  It's crazy, yeah. But the whole thing just flows
• 1:11:26
  beautifully with potent imagery, genuine emotion, beautiful
• 1:11:31
  music. And above all of that, he
• 1:11:35
  doesn't forget to highlight the actors 1st.
• 1:11:38
  And they all get a chance to shine.
• 1:11:40
  Yeah, yeah. OK, my third one then would be
• 1:11:47
  This whole thing looks gorgeous. But that that final image of
• 1:11:51
  them dancing on Abbey Road as it lights up, as a Beatles fan, as
• 1:11:55
  a musical fan, as someone that's loving Doctor Who, that is just
• 1:11:59
  the most beautiful image on so many levels that I want it on
• 1:12:02
  the wall and I've been thinking about all day.
• 1:12:06
  They're like the musicals encapsulated with the umbrellas
• 1:12:08
  the the Abbey Road is encapsulating.
• 1:12:12
  The Beatles and then them 22, fresh, sexy, new Doctor and
• 1:12:17
  companion, dancing the way early in the tenure to many, many more
• 1:12:21
  adventures. It's so exciting again.
• 1:12:25
  Is that one of those? Is that one of those images?
• 1:12:28
  That makes you glad to be a Doctor Who fan like that you're
• 1:12:32
  not going to get anywhere else. Yeah, both of these episodes.
• 1:12:36
  I think that's what made me really happy as well.
• 1:12:38
  I came away from both of them going, what would The show
• 1:12:41
  fucking does that. That that is what I love.
• 1:12:45
  Although. The day says OK, what other?
• 1:12:47
  Fucking show does that over 2 hour podcast.
• 1:12:52
  I'd rather it be unique. You know, oh, A.
• 1:12:55
  Million times over. Ben Chester is is directing.
• 1:12:59
  Rogue, which is episode 6 as well.
• 1:13:02
  I then for my last one. Oh, what's episode 6?
• 1:13:06
  Rogue the the Bridgeton one is. Oh, it's going.
• 1:13:09
  To be. Gorgeous.
• 1:13:11
  It's going to. Be Bridgeton up to 11, though,
• 1:13:13
  isn't it? Oh, my Bridgeton, Can we not
• 1:13:16
  have? Jolie Adwar turn up.
• 1:13:18
  From her as her character from Bridgeton.
• 1:13:20
  Please. Because she was fabulous.
• 1:13:22
  Yeah, I I fear, Yeah, I did notice.
• 1:13:25
  Martha Jones turning up in the Huniverse.
• 1:13:29
  Image, You know, Oh yeah, she's doing that and she wasn't.
• 1:13:33
  And now she is. My mum is in.
• 1:13:35
  Bridgeton, isn't she? Yeah.
• 1:13:37
  Anyway, so. My last thing is my last thing.
• 1:13:41
  Yeah, it is my last thing. I feel the way we're at.
• 1:13:45
  Oh God, you go. You go well, my.
• 1:13:47
  My next thing. Is.
• 1:13:49
  Define expectations. Because as I said, I went in
• 1:13:52
  expecting this to be full of musical numbers and just camp
• 1:13:56
  all the way through and basically the last five minutes
• 1:13:59
  I expected it to be all the way through.
• 1:14:01
  And actually making this about what music means, means this has
• 1:14:09
  re watchability value over just it being a load of song and
• 1:14:12
  dance numbers. Yeah, and it makes that. 5
• 1:14:17
  minutes at. The end really punch because we
• 1:14:20
  fought hard for music and here it is baby.
• 1:14:24
  Yeah, I agree. That's the masterstroke of.
• 1:14:26
  This is actually giving it, giving, just saying something
• 1:14:30
  about music. I was going to say that we've
• 1:14:33
  both said three each and neither of us have mentioned Maestro,
• 1:14:37
  which is let's both mention. It just shows how.
• 1:14:40
  Fucking good this episode. Is.
• 1:14:42
  But yeah, what a new stylist original villain for for 2024.
• 1:14:49
  May they come back many, many times.
• 1:14:51
  I want more musical battles. I want me up more song and dance
• 1:14:56
  numbers. If it's anything like this.
• 1:14:59
  I I saw a tweet. By Jack Reese, who frequently
• 1:15:03
  makes far more sense than his brother in my eyes about Jinx
• 1:15:08
  Monsoon. Sorry, dude, you know I love
• 1:15:10
  you, right? I I adore you.
• 1:15:12
  But insulting you on this is great fun.
• 1:15:14
  And he said that every now and again you get a perfect bit of
• 1:15:19
  casting in Doctor Who. Like somebody who was made not
• 1:15:23
  for the role, but for Doctor Who and James.
• 1:15:28
  Yeah, it's that. It's that sort of camp,
• 1:15:30
  theatrical, crazy psychosis that you only get in a very few
• 1:15:36
  people. And frankly, it would have been
• 1:15:38
  a terrible waste if we'd never seen James.
• 1:15:41
  And boy, am I biting for a return.
• 1:15:45
  And I don't. I really.
• 1:15:47
  Don't want to jug some Chip Nelson doing right at the end
• 1:15:50
  because that's just like, but do you remember when it was like
• 1:15:53
  season 11 started and it was we're going to do fresh new
• 1:15:56
  monsters, going to be great and then they're all a bit chip.
• 1:16:01
  We've had an amazing looking bogeyman last week and then a
• 1:16:05
  fantastic new original villain, God God of music this week and
• 1:16:11
  it just feels so great and fresh again.
• 1:16:13
  I will counter that you know. You knew I would though.
• 1:16:15
  Right, it's saying that I think she hadn't got there in the end,
• 1:16:19
  because his last season was basically Swarm and Azure, who
• 1:16:23
  were camp and wonderful and Dewan's master.
• 1:16:26
  Well, even a broken clock is right.
• 1:16:28
  Twice a. Day I'm just saying he got.
• 1:16:32
  There. All right.
• 1:16:32
  I think he did create a memorable villains.
• 1:16:34
  It took him a few years. Yeah, it's just more that
• 1:16:38
  specific. I think it's a good mentality to
• 1:16:40
  have new show, new beginnings, Let's do new villains.
• 1:16:44
  But the villains have actually got to be good.
• 1:16:47
  I've got one last point to make about The Devil's Court.
• 1:16:50
  Before we sign off, and that is, this could so easily have tried
• 1:16:54
  to have been once more with Feeling from Buffy.
• 1:16:58
  I don't think anything will ever best once more with Feeling for
• 1:17:02
  what it does, which is creating a musical within a season whilst
• 1:17:08
  telling story and character arcs within the songs and just
• 1:17:14
  presenting it in such an impressive way.
• 1:17:17
  So Rusty Davis didn't do that. Instead, as we've already said,
• 1:17:21
  he made this a treatise on music itself and made the song the
• 1:17:25
  reward at the end. And I think that was a really
• 1:17:27
  savvy move because the comparisons are just there to be
• 1:17:30
  made. Yeah, well, the thing we once
• 1:17:32
  more were feeling is that it's actually quite.
• 1:17:34
  Inherent to all the characters in The Rocks to that point where
• 1:17:38
  say that's too early, isn't it for for shitty really.
• 1:17:41
  So I don't think it would have worked anyway.
• 1:17:43
  I think the big question is, because we obviously knew we
• 1:17:46
  knew there's a musical number Christmas and we knew that this
• 1:17:48
  is going to be some sort of music episode.
• 1:17:51
  Do you think we'll see more musical numbers in the future?
• 1:17:54
  Oh please. But do you think just love?
• 1:17:57
  Them I I don't care if people. Don't like them I love.
• 1:17:59
  Them do I think we will? Yes, I do.
• 1:18:01
  I think I don't know where, but it does.
• 1:18:04
  Feel like we'll get one more this season?
• 1:18:07
  We had what every Christmas? What's the problem?
• 1:18:10
  And we'll. Definitely get one at Christmas.
• 1:18:12
  Joy to the world. Actually we we went in singing.
• 1:18:19
  So let's leave singing. I'll just want to sing to you a
• 1:18:22
  lyric from once more feeling. If I may, Yeah.
• 1:18:26
  Now I'm. Bathed in light.
• 1:18:29
  I can feel you inside. God, you're 7.
• 1:18:35
  Oh no. I've only watched it.
• 1:18:36
  Once. My favorite, my favorite one in
• 1:18:39
  that offer offer quick watch was the the one with Xander and Anna
• 1:18:46
  doing the What They Hate About Each Other.
• 1:18:48
  That was great. It's Peter's got diseases from a
• 1:18:51
  Schumach. Tribe.
• 1:18:53
  You know, I could quote anything, right?
• 1:18:55
  Yeah, I do. I do.
• 1:18:58
  Love. I'm under your spell though.
• 1:18:59
  I'm. Under your spell and she starts
• 1:19:03
  licking her out on the bed could.
• 1:19:04
  You believe it? She starts floating.
• 1:19:06
  You don't get her in. Doctor Who.
• 1:19:07
  Oh my God, you. Didn't imagine it's gone too.
• 1:19:10
  Woke Luke Molloy, thank. You for your company.
• 1:19:15
  Thank you for loving this. We two of us are.
• 1:19:18
  We're the bastions of positivity in Doctor Who right now.
• 1:19:21
  It's great. It's great to watch it.
• 1:19:22
  Again, I'm probably going to watch it at.
• 1:19:24
  Least two more times before Friday and Space babies Pretty
• 1:19:28
  great. I'd like to.
• 1:19:29
  Be a Top 2 fan in case everyone else is a boring fart.
• 1:19:34
  Space babies, Pun intended. I may have to ask you back
• 1:19:38
  before the end of the season if you're they are the only one
• 1:19:41
  being positive about this. Are you at the end?
• 1:19:44
  Of the phone, of course, yeah. Hopefully it's not going to fall
• 1:19:49
  off a Cliff. Imagine if we all we end up
• 1:19:51
  painting it now and everyone else starts loving it.
• 1:19:54
  I think it would have to work very hard.
• 1:19:56
  Indeed, to let me down now. So the best.
• 1:19:59
  Thing I can say, Chris. Said it to me and I was like,
• 1:20:03
  yeah, that's it. Finishes off with this sentiment
• 1:20:05
  is that. You can.
• 1:20:08
  You can. I can already tell.
• 1:20:09
  He can already tell. You can put Shitty and Millie
• 1:20:12
  into a bad story and a bad script, and I don't think I'd
• 1:20:15
  find it a bad episode of Doctor Who because they're just too
• 1:20:18
  sort of gripping. And Matt for me, Matt Smith had
• 1:20:21
  that of like, there was some bad episodes, but I like them all
• 1:20:24
  basically because Matt Smith said it.
• 1:20:26
  I know these have got it for me and and next week they're saying
• 1:20:31
  Steven. Moffett lines.
• 1:20:32
  So you'll be happier. I know.
• 1:20:34
  We're going to get a browser history line, aren't we?
• 1:20:36
  Oh for. Sure.
• 1:20:39
  Look, thank you very much. Thank you.
• 1:20:42
  Enjoy. Boom boom.
• 1:20:47
  I'll cut it there. I'll boom with you anytime.