Latest / The Imperfect Impulse w/Bree O'Connor / S 3 Ep 12: A Delicate Transition

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S 3 Ep 12: A Delicate Transition · The Imperfect Impulse w/Bree O'Connor

0:01
SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the Imperfect Impulse with Bree O'Connor.
0:05
SPEAKER_00: Hey, I'm your host, Bree O'Connor.
0:10
SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna just jump right into it today because I feel compelled to talk about
0:15
SPEAKER_00: a very specific transition that happens in the life of a communal
0:22
SPEAKER_00: or collaborative artist.
0:24
SPEAKER_00: Musicians, actors,
0:27
SPEAKER_00: directors,
0:28
SPEAKER_00: Choreographers,
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SPEAKER_00: dancers,
0:31
SPEAKER_00: and I can speak directly from my experience as a theater maker
0:37
SPEAKER_00: because I think it's important to note that this transition happens.
0:42
SPEAKER_00: If we know that it is just a moment in our lives,
0:46
SPEAKER_00: I think we can figure out how to navigate that transition consciously and perhaps
0:52
SPEAKER_00: a little bit better.
0:54
SPEAKER_00: Mike Birbiglia has a film about an improv troupe I always forget the title of this film.
1:02
SPEAKER_00: I'll put it in the show notes after I look it up.
1:06
SPEAKER_00: Because it's worth seeing.
1:07
SPEAKER_00: And I think that his film about this improv troupe that has to navigate one
1:15
SPEAKER_00: of these career transition points as this tight group of friends.
1:21
SPEAKER_00: They live together.
1:22
SPEAKER_00: They work together.
1:24
SPEAKER_00: They are super close.
1:26
SPEAKER_00: They're maybe getting a little lung in the tooth.
1:30
SPEAKER_00: And what is happening to them as they have to manage the progression of their lives
1:38
SPEAKER_00: with the existence of this improv troupe.
1:43
SPEAKER_00: And now let me back up a little bit.
1:45
SPEAKER_00: Because I think most of us who enter these collaborative spaces,
1:51
SPEAKER_00: we're often introduced to them in our Educational realm.
1:56
SPEAKER_00: We're in high school and we get into the high school play or we end up in
2:01
SPEAKER_00: a community theater or somebody drags us into a summer stock or a children's theater
2:07
SPEAKER_00: and all of a sudden we are immersed in this community that is usually very effusive
2:18
SPEAKER_00: and excited and I mean,
2:20
SPEAKER_00: you have never experienced more love and loud camaraderie than at a cast party for
2:30
SPEAKER_00: the first time.
2:31
SPEAKER_00: You are in close quarters with these people and you end up seeing their bodies.
2:37
SPEAKER_00: You end up touching each other.
2:40
SPEAKER_00: You get very, very close very quickly.
2:44
SPEAKER_00: And especially if you enter the theater in your adolescence,
2:49
SPEAKER_00: all of a sudden you have found your tribe.
2:54
SPEAKER_00: You are thrown in with this group of people who are interested in human beings and
3:02
SPEAKER_00: in story and in craft in a way that is exciting and exciting.
3:10
SPEAKER_00: Not shameful.
3:11
SPEAKER_00: I mean, in the outside world,
3:13
SPEAKER_00: outside of that rehearsal space,
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SPEAKER_00: there's so much disdain for showing that you like anything,
3:21
SPEAKER_00: be it music or movies or this superstar or celebrity or whatever,
3:29
SPEAKER_00: that you can be judged for those interests or fascinations very, very quickly.
3:35
SPEAKER_00: But inside the theater space...
3:39
SPEAKER_00: Everything is fair game.
3:42
SPEAKER_00: You are allowed and encouraged to be as excited and wide-eyed as you actually are.
3:52
SPEAKER_00: And that's an amazing feeling.
3:55
SPEAKER_00: You get sucked in by that sense of camaraderie and And if you are neurodivergent,
4:04
SPEAKER_00: you are finally not putting a damper on the sound of your voice.
4:10
SPEAKER_00: You are able to burst into song if it suits you.
4:16
SPEAKER_00: You can speak in some weird accent and no one is looking at you like you've lost your damn mind.
4:25
SPEAKER_00: And that feels very, very, very good.
4:30
SPEAKER_00: It also feels like the building blocks that you can actually use toward a goal,
4:38
SPEAKER_00: which honestly,
4:39
SPEAKER_00: quoting Monty Python, served
4:44
SPEAKER_00: zero purpose outside of the rehearsal room.
4:48
SPEAKER_00: But suddenly in the rehearsal room,
4:50
SPEAKER_00: someone's like, hey,
4:52
SPEAKER_00: you're really good at that,
4:54
SPEAKER_00: you know,
4:54
SPEAKER_00: whatever that is,
4:55
SPEAKER_00: or that sounds really natural to you,
4:57
SPEAKER_00: or you get the laugh,
4:58
SPEAKER_00: or You find the right moment to say the right reference or what have you
5:06
SPEAKER_00: and suddenly you feel like a part of something.
5:13
SPEAKER_00: And that's a great feeling.
5:16
SPEAKER_00: And if you decide to pursue that outside of your community theater
5:22
SPEAKER_00: or high school theater experience and you decide to go for a formal study,
5:30
SPEAKER_00: you'll often find yourself with a tight-knit cohort that feels very much like
5:36
SPEAKER_00: that insular community that you had when you were doing shows in high school
5:42
SPEAKER_00: or wherever you were doing them.
5:45
SPEAKER_00: You get this sense of building almost a small repertory company.
5:51
SPEAKER_00: If you're in a serious study,
5:54
SPEAKER_00: either in college or at a professional program,
5:58
SPEAKER_00: you can quickly develop those ties because the ground is already set.
6:04
SPEAKER_00: You've already established, hey, we're into this stuff and we're all into this stuff.
6:10
SPEAKER_00: We're in this together.
6:11
SPEAKER_00: We're all geeky for it.
6:13
SPEAKER_00: And you start to watch your peers have not only successful moments, but have revelations.
6:24
SPEAKER_00: When they discover something about the character, they discover something about themselves.
6:31
SPEAKER_00: They discover a hidden capacity.
6:35
SPEAKER_00: They discover a skill set that they can use somewhere else.
6:39
SPEAKER_00: They have discovered something about The human existence that has repercussions down
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SPEAKER_00: the line and it is a very exciting experience.
6:52
SPEAKER_00: And since a lot of this is usually happening at a time
6:56
SPEAKER_00: when our brains are still growing and are still building connections,
7:03
SPEAKER_00: it can feel like your brain is delightfully on fire.
7:10
SPEAKER_00: You can feel your synapses forging new pathways and connections through your brain
7:16
SPEAKER_00: and it is enthralling.
7:22
SPEAKER_00: And you are sharing this experience with your peers.
7:28
SPEAKER_00: And that is an unparalleled experience.
7:33
SPEAKER_00: After the educational period has concluded and now you're set out into the world
7:41
SPEAKER_00: and you have a choice to make.
7:43
SPEAKER_00: You have just spent a few years being wrapped up and part of ensemble
7:52
SPEAKER_00: and you felt supported by your teachers and your,
7:57
SPEAKER_00: you know, at least some of your peers.
7:59
SPEAKER_00: You've found like-minded individuals.
8:02
SPEAKER_00: You've helped each other through not just present rough times,
8:08
SPEAKER_00: but you've helped each other through rough times that resonate
8:14
SPEAKER_00: through your personal experience.
8:17
SPEAKER_00: As an example, I really struggled playing Helena.
8:22
SPEAKER_00: Little did I know how Helena would resonate with me Because she just feels
8:29
SPEAKER_00: so unloved and alone and underappreciated and determined and feisty.
8:40
SPEAKER_00: I discovered a lot about myself in that role.
8:42
SPEAKER_00: Not only about how I connected to Helena, but about how other people saw me.
8:47
SPEAKER_00: It was a really heady experience.
8:51
SPEAKER_00: And I was lucky enough to have colleagues and my peers who Not only saw me through
8:59
SPEAKER_00: that experience,
9:00
SPEAKER_00: but also encouraged me and held me up and talked me through the times
9:05
SPEAKER_00: that I didn't think I was going to be able to tolerate.
9:10
SPEAKER_00: I learned a lot of resilience through that role.
9:14
SPEAKER_00: And that was really, really exciting.
9:18
SPEAKER_00: Then you graduate and suddenly you've got to hit the streets and try
9:25
SPEAKER_00: and Keep your career going.
9:29
SPEAKER_00: You've got to find an agent or a manager and they're going to take a hefty cut
9:34
SPEAKER_00: of anything you make and you've got to do auditions,
9:37
SPEAKER_00: auditions, auditions, auditions.
9:39
SPEAKER_00: Nobody knows your name.
9:41
SPEAKER_00: You don't have a name for yourself.
9:42
SPEAKER_00: You're going to do showcases and showcases and showcases and a lot of them suck.
9:50
SPEAKER_00: Because let's face it,
9:52
SPEAKER_00: like, you know, the indie space is where young artists often cut their teeth.
9:57
SPEAKER_00: And the rare artist,
10:01
SPEAKER_00: young artist that is coming out of school that's thinking,
10:07
SPEAKER_00: let me find a group of older artists to get in good with.
10:14
SPEAKER_00: Maybe I can learn something from an older troupe.
10:18
SPEAKER_00: That's neither here nor there.
10:20
SPEAKER_00: I think we gravitate toward our peers until we learn something different.
10:26
SPEAKER_00: And a lot of students come out of that experience having heard the call
10:34
SPEAKER_00: to produce your own work, to get yourself seen, to put yourself out there.
10:40
SPEAKER_00: And what happens?
10:42
SPEAKER_00: This group of people come together and they create a company.
10:48
SPEAKER_00: With the intent of getting themselves and their cohorts seen.
10:55
SPEAKER_00: This is totally great.
10:57
SPEAKER_00: It is a necessary part of the practice.
11:01
SPEAKER_00: But here's what you don't necessarily get training in and why this transition can be
11:10
SPEAKER_00: so difficult.
11:11
SPEAKER_00: It's because the way this industry is constructed and the way time
11:15
SPEAKER_00: and space works Is that you either have time and energy to build a company or time
11:25
SPEAKER_00: and energy to build your career.
11:30
SPEAKER_00: Now most of the people went into this company thinking it will help build their career.
11:36
SPEAKER_00: They're not well versed in what it takes to run a company and it is a lot of work.
11:43
SPEAKER_00: It is a lot of admin.
11:46
SPEAKER_00: It is a lot of Robbing Peter to pay Paul.
11:51
SPEAKER_00: It is a lot of paperwork and grants and money.
11:57
SPEAKER_00: We're not really taught how to deal with the financial aspect of the business.
12:05
SPEAKER_00: And as much as you might think, hey, I can do both.
12:10
SPEAKER_00: I can be part of this lovely community full of artists I love and respect.
12:16
SPEAKER_00: And...
12:17
SPEAKER_00: I can go audition for films and do this and I can keep my money job.
12:23
SPEAKER_00: That's a recipe for heartbreak.
12:25
SPEAKER_00: What usually happens is that either the company completely splinters or there's
12:34
SPEAKER_00: a small core or one person who's willing to hold the store and who is committed to
12:41
SPEAKER_00: the company.
12:43
SPEAKER_00: As everyone else goes to pursue what they want to do.
12:51
SPEAKER_00: And this is the first stage.
12:53
SPEAKER_00: People start splintering off because life intervenes.
12:59
SPEAKER_00: There are marriages and deaths and moves and family things and job opportunities
13:11
SPEAKER_00: and Sometimes someone's career takes off in another direction.
13:15
SPEAKER_00: Now that's kind of a central focus of the Mike Birbiglia film that I mentioned earlier.
13:22
SPEAKER_00: One of their members,
13:23
SPEAKER_00: played by Keegan-Michael Key,
13:24
SPEAKER_00: gets an opportunity to move up in the world,
13:29
SPEAKER_00: move up in the industry,
13:31
SPEAKER_00: and he has to make certain choices that don't necessarily center the ensemble or
13:39
SPEAKER_00: the health of the ensemble.
13:42
SPEAKER_00: A lot of the way the industry is set up is not to encourage the health of an ensemble.
13:52
SPEAKER_00: So it is really hard, if that's the thing you value, to hold that together.
13:57
SPEAKER_00: Throughout this process,
13:59
SPEAKER_00: as artists mature,
14:01
SPEAKER_00: and this can take weeks, months,
14:04
SPEAKER_00: or years for these structures to sort of fall apart,
14:10
SPEAKER_00: If there is anybody who is dedicated to the company itself and is minding the store,
14:16
SPEAKER_00: that person either burns out completely,
14:24
SPEAKER_00: probably has a bunch of resentment or as they're watching their cohort run off
14:31
SPEAKER_00: when they're trying to hold everything together,
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SPEAKER_00: and either they will quit Or they will be forward thinking enough to say I need
14:43
SPEAKER_00: to open up this company structure to bring in new blood.
14:50
SPEAKER_00: I need to bring in younger people.
14:52
SPEAKER_00: And now that's a great solution.
14:55
SPEAKER_00: But often they are unprepared for those new people who will come in and see
15:02
SPEAKER_00: that person as an elder.
15:05
SPEAKER_00: As a leader.
15:08
SPEAKER_00: And that is a necessary thing.
15:11
SPEAKER_00: They do need to be given deference,
15:14
SPEAKER_00: but it may be uncomfortable for that person or perhaps too comfortable.
15:19
SPEAKER_00: I mean, there's a sweet spot here and it's hard to hit.
15:24
SPEAKER_00: And there's often a bit of an identity crisis that is involved there for
15:29
SPEAKER_00: that administrator slash artist.
15:34
SPEAKER_00: They have to adjust to being treated with that kind of deference
15:39
SPEAKER_00: and sometimes it goes to their head and sometimes they're very resistant and that's
15:47
SPEAKER_00: a transition that is particularly troublesome for that administrator slash artist.
15:53
SPEAKER_00: And they have to decide how do I keep this company alive
15:59
SPEAKER_00: And also satisfy my artistic impulses,
16:02
SPEAKER_00: which is why I got involved here in the first place.
16:05
SPEAKER_00: We have this habit that once we see that someone is good at something,
16:12
SPEAKER_00: we assume that that's what they do, that that's all they do.
16:19
SPEAKER_00: It is a pet peeve of mine,
16:21
SPEAKER_00: having filled just about every role in the theater,
16:24
SPEAKER_00: from box office girl to house manager to actor to director,
16:29
SPEAKER_00: designer, that each time people meet me, they put me in a certain category.
16:36
SPEAKER_00: And often, if I'm in the category of box office girl or toilet scrubber, I don't have a name.
16:45
SPEAKER_00: And that is insulting and infuriating.
16:50
SPEAKER_00: And I'll just leave that there before I go too deep into it.
16:56
SPEAKER_00: So that person who has been pining for that initial community feeling and all of
17:05
SPEAKER_00: that discovery that they had in those early years is now in charge of running things
17:12
SPEAKER_00: and is being treated like a leader And not like a peer or a friend.
17:18
SPEAKER_00: And they can't be.
17:19
SPEAKER_00: That's something you have to embrace if you're in that position.
17:23
SPEAKER_00: You have to embrace the fact that you are actually a leader.
17:29
SPEAKER_00: And you need to behave accordingly.
17:32
SPEAKER_00: Otherwise, you are buying some trouble.
17:37
SPEAKER_00: Because let's face it, as artists we can be a bunch of libertines.
17:42
SPEAKER_00: And we need structure and expectation or we can harm ourselves and
17:50
SPEAKER_00: by harming ourselves we end up messing with the ensemble and that needs a grown-up
17:57
SPEAKER_00: at the helm.
18:01
SPEAKER_00: I think we are frequently searching for that initial experience
18:05
SPEAKER_00: which is quite specific to that time in our lives.
18:11
SPEAKER_00: To that adolescent experience of having our brains on fire.
18:17
SPEAKER_00: We can fall into a trap of chasing that and often we do get snippets of it.
18:24
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
18:26
SPEAKER_00: I'm still here 35 years later still doing the thing because I do get hits of it
18:36
SPEAKER_00: in rehearsal or in a reading where We can all make a discovery together
18:43
SPEAKER_00: and it's intoxicating.
18:44
SPEAKER_00: It's fun and I can't wait to share that discovery with an audience.
18:52
SPEAKER_00: Like that's the magic I'm looking for all the time.
18:56
SPEAKER_00: It's elusive, but it's why we're here.
19:00
SPEAKER_00: However,
19:00
SPEAKER_00: I think we need to temper our expectations about what is accessible here in
19:10
SPEAKER_00: The communal creation space as adults.
19:14
SPEAKER_00: So here is where I'm going to kind of depart a little bit and dream, if you will.
19:21
SPEAKER_00: To me, I feel that that loss of community and,
19:30
SPEAKER_00: you know,
19:32
SPEAKER_00: the nomenclature being your tribe,
19:36
SPEAKER_00: finding those people, Doesn't have to be solely an experience in young adulthood.
19:46
SPEAKER_00: I do think that it is a shame that the industry is built upon solo careers when
19:56
SPEAKER_00: by definition the art form is communal and that it is really really hard To build
20:06
SPEAKER_00: a communal art form when the emphasis is so built on star power and the individual.
20:17
SPEAKER_00: And that is to me antithetical to the art form.
20:24
SPEAKER_00: So I look toward a repertory ideal.
20:29
SPEAKER_00: My dear colleague,
20:30
SPEAKER_00: Jerry Polner,
20:31
SPEAKER_00: has laid out a wonderful plan that he calls bigger plays, bigger audiences.
20:39
SPEAKER_00: And he lays out this really interesting plan for how
20:43
SPEAKER_00: an ensemble
20:47
SPEAKER_00: can actually be supported outside of the nonprofit structure,
20:55
SPEAKER_00: which has its own difficulties.
20:59
SPEAKER_00: I could get into the weeds on the commercial versus not-for-profit and what that means.
21:06
SPEAKER_00: And maybe I'll do another episode on that some other day because I do think it's important.
21:12
SPEAKER_00: But let me just say that the challenges of not-for-profit rely on the existence
21:20
SPEAKER_00: of capital and financial wherewithal that Very few of us leave
21:30
SPEAKER_00: the school environment with those skills in hand.
21:35
SPEAKER_00: We are not well prepared for that.
21:39
SPEAKER_00: And quite frequently don't have access to the tools
21:44
SPEAKER_00: that would make us more financially prepared either as a business entity or as
21:51
SPEAKER_00: an individual artist unless we get into a union.
21:55
SPEAKER_00: And that's a whole other struggle.
21:59
SPEAKER_00: A lot of us, really it's about staying power.
22:03
SPEAKER_00: It's about how long can you keep this up.
22:06
SPEAKER_00: Usually you have to have some other resources at your back.
22:10
SPEAKER_00: If you are doing this when you're already living hand to mouth
22:14
SPEAKER_00: and you don't have any other support, this is going to be pretty inaccessible.
22:19
SPEAKER_00: I feel like that needs to change.
22:22
SPEAKER_00: The repertory model,
22:24
SPEAKER_00: whether you're doing it as Jerry prescribes,
22:27
SPEAKER_00: which is actually more of a commercial model that takes out fundraising as a need
22:35
SPEAKER_00: and takes out the sort of not-for-profit dance that you have to do
22:40
SPEAKER_00: of grant applications and all of that stuff,
22:44
SPEAKER_00: and looks at more of a self-sustaining model that pays every member
22:50
SPEAKER_00: And pays every member to do all of the work that is required to keep
22:56
SPEAKER_00: the company going.
22:58
SPEAKER_00: Now, honestly,
22:59
SPEAKER_00: I do think that if those companies who came right out of school had access
23:06
SPEAKER_00: to capital and could pay themselves to focus,
23:12
SPEAKER_00: then the story of that theater company would be very, very different.
23:18
SPEAKER_00: However,
23:19
SPEAKER_00: one of the things that I have to be cautious of is that a lot
23:27
SPEAKER_00: of artists are not particularly interested in doing the unsexy labor
23:33
SPEAKER_00: of behind-the-scenes work.
23:36
SPEAKER_00: Even though they're being paid to do it, I hope that that would be enough, but it might not be.
23:43
SPEAKER_00: And that's where I have reticence.
23:45
SPEAKER_00: I don't quite trust that based on my own experience.
23:52
SPEAKER_00: So all of this is to say that,
23:54
SPEAKER_00: you know,
23:54
SPEAKER_00: I don't really have a lot of answers for improving the industry as a whole.
24:00
SPEAKER_00: I just know that the industry does not support what to me is the fundamental purpose
24:10
SPEAKER_00: of this form, which is It's a communal art form.
24:16
SPEAKER_00: And so we don't go out into the world faced with our realities of paying rent
24:22
SPEAKER_00: and figuring out actual lives without having to give up a little bit of the thing
24:30
SPEAKER_00: that brought us to the practice in the first place.
24:35
SPEAKER_00: I wish I had full answers for that,
24:37
SPEAKER_00: but I do think it's important that you know This transition exists,
24:45
SPEAKER_00: and if you're committed to yourself in the art,
24:49
SPEAKER_00: then you're going to have to find ways in the midst of all the struggles of creating
24:56
SPEAKER_00: a space for yourself to feed yourself with community,
25:05
SPEAKER_00: with artistic practice, with a sense of real friendships.
25:12
SPEAKER_00: I think a lot suffers with our emphasis on the individual in this particular industry.
25:18
SPEAKER_00: But one of the things that is personally detrimental is
25:23
SPEAKER_00: that you can develop relationships very,
25:27
SPEAKER_00: very quickly because that's what we're supposed to do in order to put on
25:32
SPEAKER_00: a show is we have to be able to trust each other.
25:35
SPEAKER_00: We have to make sure that people can trust us.
25:37
SPEAKER_00: We're Once again, in close quarters with one another.
25:41
SPEAKER_00: We have to touch each other.
25:42
SPEAKER_00: We have to look into each other's eyes.
25:45
SPEAKER_00: We have to do all kinds of intimate things with people we just met.
25:50
SPEAKER_00: We get very close.
25:52
SPEAKER_00: We get very enmeshed with our characters and with the given circumstances of the play.
26:01
SPEAKER_00: And then when that experience is over,
26:05
SPEAKER_00: when your contract is up,
26:08
SPEAKER_00: It can be out of sight,
26:10
SPEAKER_00: out of mind,
26:12
SPEAKER_00: and that experience can be very detrimental to an artist who,
26:21
SPEAKER_00: let's say,
26:21
SPEAKER_00: you know,
26:23
SPEAKER_00: there's a load of neurodivergent people in this practice,
26:27
SPEAKER_00: and a lot of neurodivergent people suffer from rejection sensitivity dysphoria,
26:35
SPEAKER_00: so that sudden Pulling away can encourage a negative inner monologue that we have
26:45
SPEAKER_00: to learn to fight.
26:47
SPEAKER_00: And we have to learn how to choose which relationships deserve nurturing outside of
26:55
SPEAKER_00: the theater, outside of that space.
27:00
SPEAKER_00: Because those are the relationships that are going to help you stay connected
27:05
SPEAKER_00: to yourself and to your art.
27:07
SPEAKER_00: But you're also going to have to learn which relationships can go at the end of the show.
27:14
SPEAKER_00: Not everybody is your friend.
27:17
SPEAKER_00: And that's okay.
27:19
SPEAKER_00: You don't have to be in love with everybody all the time.
27:25
SPEAKER_00: And that is also true when you are a leader of an organization and
27:32
SPEAKER_00: The new blood that's coming in is looking to you for guidance and looking to you
27:36
SPEAKER_00: for direction and is treating you as a leader,
27:40
SPEAKER_00: as an elder,
27:41
SPEAKER_00: that you have to recognize that very few of those people are going
27:45
SPEAKER_00: to be your close friends.
27:47
SPEAKER_00: There is a difference between a colleague and a friend.
27:50
SPEAKER_00: They can feel very close and that's actually wonderful and honestly ideal.
27:58
SPEAKER_00: But it's very,
27:59
SPEAKER_00: very good to be able to know the difference between those people that have access
28:07
SPEAKER_00: to your heart and soul and those people who have access to your work.
28:13
SPEAKER_00: Not that you don't put your whole of yourself into your work,
28:16
SPEAKER_00: but nobody has to know about your dead dog for you to be understanding a role
28:22
SPEAKER_00: through your experience with your dead dog, right?
28:26
SPEAKER_00: We don't need to broadcast.
28:28
SPEAKER_00: Some things can be just for us and that's okay.
28:32
SPEAKER_00: Sometimes you are an elder and that is also okay.
28:39
SPEAKER_00: In fact,
28:40
SPEAKER_00: you're needed in that capacity because the youngins who are coming out of school
28:47
SPEAKER_00: with stars in their eyes need to be given a soft place to fall when they hit
28:54
SPEAKER_00: that transition and They see what it's like.
28:59
SPEAKER_00: And they have to contend with what it means to be an actual person in this world.
29:06
SPEAKER_00: Outside of that safe, warm, and, well, touchy-feely environment.
29:16
SPEAKER_00: I wish I had more answers.
29:18
SPEAKER_00: I would love to change the industry as it is.
29:22
SPEAKER_00: Because I think it's stupid.
29:24
SPEAKER_00: But...
29:26
SPEAKER_00: We are where we are and I think it's really important to know that these are
29:31
SPEAKER_00: the actual choices in front of us and we can make better choices if we are aware
29:38
SPEAKER_00: that we're not the first ones to be experiencing this phase.
29:44
SPEAKER_00: And that being able to make conscious decisions about where you want to go
29:49
SPEAKER_00: and how you want to get there is invaluable knowledge.
29:55
SPEAKER_00: If you have thoughts, comments, questions, want to share an experience, anything, I'm all ears.
30:04
SPEAKER_00: Like I said, I don't exactly have answers, but I do think knowledge is power.
30:10
SPEAKER_00: And if you have some thoughts on how you manage this transition,
30:16
SPEAKER_00: advice you would give to younger artists, you know, shout out.
30:20
SPEAKER_00: Let's talk about it.
30:23
SPEAKER_00: Until then...
30:25
SPEAKER_00: Thank you for joining me on the Imperfect Impulse.
30:31
SPEAKER_00: I can't wait to talk to you next week.
30:34
[music]