Latest / All About The Joy / Blue Wave, Real Talk: Media Literacy, Coalition Politics, and the Cost of Power

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Blue Wave, Real Talk: Media Literacy, Coalition Politics, and the Cost of Power · All About The Joy

0:00
Carmen Lezeth: Hey everyone, welcome to All About the Joy.
0:02
Carmen Lezeth: This is Culture and Consequence with Carmen and Andrea.
0:05
Carmen Lezeth: How are you feeling about yesterday?
0:08
Andrea: Was it yesterday?
0:09
Andrea: It was Tuesday.
0:09
Andrea: I mean, it's been a good week, I think.
0:14
Andrea: I'm just saying.
0:15
Carmen Lezeth: Um But for people who don't know, in case they're watching this at some other time, we well, there was a blue wave.
0:23
Carmen Lezeth: It was the election on Tuesday across the nation.
0:27
Andrea: Well, only in certain places, but yeah, I mean, look, you know, Democrats won in all kinds of places, Mississippi.
0:36
Andrea: You know, I mean, Dick Cheney died.
0:39
Carmen Lezeth: Uh you're good.
0:41
Carmen Lezeth: Well, let's just let's I mean, we're gonna talk about Dick Cheney because I think that was the email I sent you, right?
0:46
Carmen Lezeth: In the text message or whatever.
0:48
Carmen Lezeth: I was like, I know that Dick Cheney meant a lot to you.
0:52
Andrea: Oh, he meant a lot of things to me.
0:54
Andrea: Yes, can't wait to get into them.
0:58
Carmen Lezeth: And I, you know, before we honor what has happened on his passing, I wanted to finish up.
1:06
Carmen Lezeth: Let me just say what I think about the blue wave.
1:08
Carmen Lezeth: I just, I am so proud of New York on so many levels.
1:12
Carmen Lezeth: It wasn't just that, um, and I'm gonna mess up his name until I learn it correctly, but Mom Donnie uh was elected mayor of uh New York.
1:22
Carmen Lezeth: And, you know, I was on Facebook the other day, on that day or whatever, and I saw people and I I just blocked them immediately.
1:32
Carmen Lezeth: So I I want to make this a public service announcement.
1:36
Carmen Lezeth: Somebody wrote on Facebook, I can't believe after 25 years after 9-11, New York elected a Muslim.
1:44
Carmen Lezeth: Like that is racist.
1:47
Carmen Lezeth: So I don't understand.
1:49
Carmen Lezeth: Like, I don't know how people don't understand the simplicity and the cruelty and the nastiness.
1:58
Carmen Lezeth: You know, so I I'm like just blocking people now.
2:01
Carmen Lezeth: I'm not even responding, but I'm just so happy for him and so happy for New York.
2:06
Carmen Lezeth: And um, and I know it probably hurts you to love Gavin Newsom at this moment.
2:12
Andrea: But he's done the right thing.
2:14
Andrea: He did the right thing.
2:15
Carmen Lezeth: That's that's all you can muster.
2:18
Andrea: Let's say that's all I can muster.
2:19
Andrea: That is all I can muster in this moment.
2:22
Andrea: Uh, he did the right thing and it worked, and so that's good.
2:26
Carmen Lezeth: God, you really have no love for that man.
2:28
Andrea: I do not.
2:29
Andrea: We'll see.
2:30
Andrea: We'll see what he does.
2:31
Andrea: Um, you know, but um we we won't go into Gavin today.
2:35
Carmen Lezeth: Okay, we won't go into Gavin today.
2:36
Carmen Lezeth: I'm just very proud of California as well.
2:39
Carmen Lezeth: There was nobody on the ticket, it was just a proposition.
2:43
Andrea: It was a single thing.
2:44
Andrea: Like, I was all I I didn't actually realize it was just one thing.
2:48
Andrea: I thought it, I was like, where's my my pamphlet?
2:51
Andrea: Like, what am I doing here?
2:52
Andrea: And I looked at my sample ballot and I was like, Oh.
2:57
Carmen Lezeth: I know because there have been so many times where you and I will call each other and be like, Who is this judge?
3:02
Carmen Lezeth: Like, because we'll do all this research and try to figure out, and it's a job to vote is a job, but it was only one thing, and I was like, Oh, okay, great.
3:11
Andrea: There were lines.
3:12
Andrea: My husband went to go vote, yeah, you know, in our little local area, and there were lines of people.
3:18
Andrea: He's like a person, he does not like to do mail or drop off or whatever.
3:23
Andrea: It's like his thing, which is good for him, you know.
3:26
Andrea: Yeah, and he took a picture and he was like around the building.
3:30
Carmen Lezeth: It was awesome.
3:31
Carmen Lezeth: I mean, I think that's also what made me so happy and made me shed a tear a bit was that you know, that is what democracy is about.
3:39
Carmen Lezeth: Like, you have to actually go and vote.
3:43
Carmen Lezeth: And all these people, yeah, you actually have to participate.
3:46
Carmen Lezeth: And I I I loathe so many people.
3:49
Carmen Lezeth: We've said this before, I say it all the time now, but I am so sick and tired of people saying I don't do politics.
3:54
Carmen Lezeth: Well, it's motherfucking doing you.
3:55
Carmen Lezeth: I've said that so many times.
3:57
Andrea: Did you see Mamdani's speech where he said politics has been doing you?
4:00
Andrea: I was like meeting.
4:02
Andrea: I was like, Oh my god, why do you watch the show?
4:08
Carmen Lezeth: So funny.
4:09
Carmen Lezeth: I just feel that more people need to be involved.
4:12
Carmen Lezeth: And unfortunately, a lot of people are being involved by force.
4:17
Carmen Lezeth: You know, that's unfortunate.
4:19
Carmen Lezeth: Also, the Latino community who, you know, for what it's worth, a lot of Latino people had voted for that dumbass.
4:26
Carmen Lezeth: And, you know, you made a mistake.
4:29
Carmen Lezeth: You made a huge motherfucking mistake, but you came out in droves and voted blue, which I'm not gonna give you credit for because that's the other thing I want to say.
4:39
Carmen Lezeth: We are at the beginning of this marathon from hell.
4:43
Carmen Lezeth: We are not done yet.
4:45
Carmen Lezeth: So it was a good night, Tuesday night.
4:48
Andrea: Totally.
4:48
Andrea: We'll see what happens, girls.
4:51
Carmen Lezeth: Right.
4:51
Carmen Lezeth: We we're not done.
4:52
Carmen Lezeth: Like you have to enjoy, enjoy, and then okay, the hour of enjoyment is over.
4:57
Andrea: One hour, and now we're like back to well, and I mean, not to bring the room down, but like you saw Trump had a meltdown that night, and it was like more, more nastiness, more pain, and it's like it's a classic abuser tactic, right?
5:14
Andrea: Like, what's the most dangerous time to, you know, in an abusive relationship when you try to leave, when you try to break it off.
5:21
Andrea: And so he sees oh, everybody doesn't love me.
5:25
Andrea: Everything went against me this night.
5:27
Andrea: So, you know what I mean?
5:28
Andrea: Like bring on the pain, and and I think it will be more.
5:32
Andrea: I think it will be uh, you know, next year, the midterms are gonna be, you know, we are gonna have to be on the ball.
5:41
Andrea: People when you say like people need to get involved, like start getting involved now, right now.
5:48
Andrea: Start, you know, there are unsure everywhere across this country.
5:52
Andrea: There are already people doing community organizing, there, you know, like voter registrations, whatever it is, all you know, voters.
6:00
Andrea: Or just read a book or two.
6:04
Carmen Lezeth: Like, like you're asking, like, I'm not even asking for people to go do anything.
6:08
Carmen Lezeth: I just want people to read.
6:10
Carmen Lezeth: I was listening to someone the other day.
6:12
Carmen Lezeth: I I I don't want to be mean to people because I think in the trying, that's good.
6:20
Carmen Lezeth: That's a good part of it too.
6:22
Carmen Lezeth: But you gotta do more than just try.
6:24
Carmen Lezeth: You gotta do more than just read the headlines, like actually read an article and then investigate that article and then make sure that you understand what it means, you know, like really start becoming a full-fledged citizen of the United States and understand things.
6:38
Carmen Lezeth: An informed person, right?
6:41
Andrea: Like, stop allowing people to feed you what you believe.
6:46
Andrea: Yeah, not to believe in you.
6:48
Carmen Lezeth: No, let's just go listen to us though.
6:51
Carmen Lezeth: No, but you should question us too.
6:54
Andrea: I would never want you to just believe anything.
6:56
Andrea: I'm a total asshole.
6:58
Andrea: Like, definitely question me.
7:01
Carmen Lezeth: For real, though, it's so true.
7:03
Carmen Lezeth: But but I think that's what people get wrapped up in, you know.
7:06
Carmen Lezeth: Like, once like there were a few people that when I listen to them, I'm like, okay, because I know and I've seen, and it's been years.
7:14
Carmen Lezeth: Like, if they say something, I don't have to double triple check them.
7:18
Carmen Lezeth: And yet I still do, because I'm sometimes so beside myself that that cannot be true.
7:24
Carmen Lezeth: I have to just find another couple of sources.
7:26
Andrea: I read something last night.
7:29
Andrea: Um, it was about Chuck Schumer, which whatever, we won't go down that road.
7:33
Andrea: But I read something about and I was like, and it was from somebody who I have a great amount of respect for as a journalist, as a writer, etc.
7:42
Andrea: And I was like, didn't he really say that?
7:45
Andrea: Um, and I looked and it was like, that was an interpretation of what exactly he said, and it is an interpretation one could make, but it's not what he actually meant.
7:59
Andrea: Yeah.
8:00
Andrea: You know what I mean?
8:01
Andrea: And like, again, this is someone whose opinion I trust, who I have read, who I follow, all of those kinds of things.
8:07
Andrea: You have to be, you have to use the critical thinking skills.
8:12
Andrea: That's what critical thinking is.
8:13
Andrea: You read something, you hear something, and you critique it in your head, and you decide, you think to yourself, is that really true?
8:21
Andrea: Maybe I should look into that a little bit more.
8:23
Carmen Lezeth: Or, and here's the thing: their interpretation is a true interpretation.
8:29
Carmen Lezeth: It doesn't mean that's what was meant by Chuck Schumer or whoever the person is.
8:34
Carmen Lezeth: So it's always good to try to follow up and find the actual and decide for yourself.
8:39
Andrea: Is that you know, is that do I feel like that's an accurate interpretation?
8:43
Andrea: What do I think he meant?
8:45
Andrea: You know, those like use your brain.
8:47
Andrea: Use your brain, use it.
8:49
Carmen Lezeth: And also, people make mistakes, people.
8:51
Carmen Lezeth: Like it's not even has to be so intentional, right?
8:55
Carmen Lezeth: It's not like everyone in the media is trying to screw you over for some George Soros or whatever.
9:01
Carmen Lezeth: You know what I mean?
9:02
Carmen Lezeth: Like, I don't think that everyone is out.
9:04
Carmen Lezeth: I just think we are at a point where we're starting to understand there's no such thing as objective journalism.
9:10
Carmen Lezeth: There isn't.
9:11
Carmen Lezeth: There never has been.
9:12
Carmen Lezeth: Sorry, Walter Cronkite.
9:14
Carmen Lezeth: There never has been, because everyone has an edge or an opinion.
9:18
Carmen Lezeth: Like, if I choose to tell you something, that's me making a decision to tell you something from a point of view.
9:26
Carmen Lezeth: Right.
9:26
Carmen Lezeth: Or leave something out.
9:28
Carmen Lezeth: Or leave something out.
9:30
Carmen Lezeth: Exactly.
9:31
Carmen Lezeth: So it's so much more layered and nuanced.
9:35
Carmen Lezeth: And if we can become better people, like the the most wonderful thing that could happen after this stupid ass Trump administration would be that we become more engaged, smarter human beings, and understand our political process.
9:52
Carmen Lezeth: But now I know that might be asking too much, but I'm just saying that could be one of the things that could happen by force, but we really need to be smarter as citizens of this country, as people who live here, you know.
10:06
Carmen Lezeth: Um, but yeah, Tuesday night was finally like it's been so long.
10:12
Andrea: It was it was like an inkling, I would say.
10:19
Andrea: The closest maybe like, for example, my kids who were teenagers could get to the feeling that we had in 2008.
10:27
Carmen Lezeth: When Barack Obama was around.
10:29
Andrea: Right, right.
10:29
Andrea: Like, you know, I was like, is that what is what is warming my cold, dark, clinical heart right now?
10:38
Andrea: Is that like the idea of the thing?
10:45
Andrea: Watching his speech, I was like, fuck yes, thank you.
10:49
Andrea: Thank you for being unapologetic.
10:52
Andrea: Thank you for supporting immigrants, trans people, working people.
10:57
Andrea: Like, thank you for being a person.
11:00
Andrea: And we know I do not do hero worship on politicians, right?
11:05
Andrea: Like, but like let's actually believe in something and stand behind it and be our authentic selves.
11:12
Carmen Lezeth: Okay, I'm gonna now, so I'm gonna throw a little wrench in here.
11:15
Carmen Lezeth: So, because I think so.
11:17
Carmen Lezeth: People were talking about how Kamala Harris and Jeffries and Schumer did not back mom Donnie.
11:26
Carmen Lezeth: I I have to be very careful how I say because I keep messing up, but that's right, like mom Donnie.
11:30
Carmen Lezeth: Um, they didn't back him fully and completely.
11:34
Carmen Lezeth: They were kind of doing that wishy-washy thing.
11:36
Carmen Lezeth: Here's what I want to say.
11:38
Carmen Lezeth: I actually don't believe in everything he believes in.
11:40
Carmen Lezeth: I am not a democratic socialist.
11:42
Carmen Lezeth: I'm not.
11:43
Carmen Lezeth: I am I know.
11:44
Carmen Lezeth: Andre is.
11:45
Carmen Lezeth: Here's what I want to say that I think is actually really important is I don't have to believe in everything a politician does or says.
11:53
Carmen Lezeth: We're human beings.
11:55
Carmen Lezeth: This idea that you have to take the litmus test, and if you don't check every one of my boxes, you are not worthy of my vote.
12:03
Carmen Lezeth: That is the other part of this that drives me insane.
12:06
Carmen Lezeth: So people were all in the comments, like, yeah, dismiss all of these people who weren't back.
12:11
Carmen Lezeth: And like, no, no, no, no, no.
12:13
Carmen Lezeth: That's not how we do this.
12:14
Carmen Lezeth: Because you also have to remember it's layered.
12:17
Carmen Lezeth: If Schumer, and and I'm not making excuses for them, but I am justifying why.
12:22
Carmen Lezeth: I know for a fact they wouldn't have full-throatedly, that's probably a bad way to say that, right?
12:27
Carmen Lezeth: They wouldn't fully embrace him, is because the Democratic Party or this side of the world isn't completely on board and they would have lost a lot of those base people.
12:40
Carmen Lezeth: Actually, I think what happened was so much better.
12:43
Carmen Lezeth: New York, this, you know, New York did this thing, and now we're all like, hmm, what does democratic socialists mean?
12:50
Carmen Lezeth: How is that different?
12:51
Carmen Lezeth: You know what I mean?
12:52
Carmen Lezeth: And take the elements of it that we want and need, which is being compassionate and loving and whatever, and being open-minded.
13:00
Carmen Lezeth: And, you know, he's going to supposedly do all these things, which by the way, I don't think he can do them all.
13:04
Carmen Lezeth: He's the mayor.
13:06
Carmen Lezeth: So yeah, so let's bring it down a notch.
13:09
Carmen Lezeth: But that's kind of the other part of this, too, is like, I don't want to say big tent because I'm so sick of that fucking idea, but I think we have to get to this place where we have to stop checking boxes to allow people to become their best selves in office.
13:24
Andrea: They they can't the idea that you don't need to agree, or we don't need to have every single box checked.
13:33
Andrea: Um, I disagree though, with this idea that it was somehow better for them to not endorse Jeff Schumer never endorsed and didn't even wouldn't even say if you voted for him.
13:43
Andrea: Um and Jeffries came out like two days before the election or something.
13:48
Andrea: I think like two hours before.
13:49
Andrea: Yeah, I mean, and so my feeling about that.
13:54
Andrea: I mean, like, are there endorsements, do they matter?
13:57
Andrea: I don't know, maybe, maybe not, but um you do have to support the people.
14:03
Andrea: It's literally our point, right?
14:05
Andrea: Like, he doesn't maybe check every box for you, Jeffries or Schumer or whatever.
14:10
Andrea: Um, but you do have to support the people who are on the democratic ticket if you are a Democratic.
14:16
Carmen Lezeth: But I think that's what you're confusing.
14:18
Carmen Lezeth: I do think they're supporting the Democratic ticket.
14:21
Carmen Lezeth: I think they're not endorsing him so that they don't ruffle feathers for other people.
14:26
Carmen Lezeth: Look at, I look at, I hate Bernie Sanders.
14:28
Carmen Lezeth: Everyone knows I hate Bernie Sanders.
14:30
Carmen Lezeth: I'm not a big fan of AOC.
14:32
Carmen Lezeth: I'm not, because I'm not a democratic socialist.
14:35
Carmen Lezeth: Now, I'm not saying that if Chuck Schumer jumped in and said, you know, I'm for Mom Donnie, I'd have been like, absolutely not.
14:43
Carmen Lezeth: Do you know what I mean?
14:43
Carmen Lezeth: Like, I'm not saying that.
14:45
Carmen Lezeth: What I am saying is that this idea that everyone has to agree and has to show and has to jump up and down, it doesn't have to happen that way.
14:54
Carmen Lezeth: And let me just clarify what I meant by I think it was better it happened this way, because I think you missed, I misspoke.
14:59
Carmen Lezeth: But I think it's better that New York elected a democratic socialist as opposed to everyone who keeps saying Bernie Sanders should have been president back in the day.
15:11
Carmen Lezeth: Do you know what I mean?
15:12
Carmen Lezeth: Like that was never going to happen because the idea of democratic socialism is such a hard thing for people to understand in the United States.
15:20
Carmen Lezeth: So here in New York, we have a man, by the way, being a democratic socialist is not a bad thing, but people don't understand the word socialism and they don't understand the difference.
15:30
Carmen Lezeth: Let me give you a quick definition so you understand.
15:33
Carmen Lezeth: Democrats are like Clinton, um, uh Hillary Clinton, Bill Clinton, Barack Obama, and uh Kamala Harris are straight up Democrats.
15:46
Carmen Lezeth: Democratic socialists are like AOC, Bernie Sanders, and Mom Dami.
15:51
Carmen Lezeth: Like that's a good way.
15:52
Carmen Lezeth: They're just very different.
15:53
Carmen Lezeth: There's more of a socialist bend to it.
15:55
Carmen Lezeth: I feel your energy.
15:57
Carmen Lezeth: What's happening?
16:00
Andrea: I just think it's absolute bullshit when you have someone that's that who is is that charismatic, is young, has captured the attention literally of people around the world.
16:11
Andrea: And the leadership of the party is like, I don't think so.
16:15
Carmen Lezeth: No, I know, but because you believe in what he's saying, because you believe in everything, Andrea.
16:20
Carmen Lezeth: That's why you wouldn't feel that way if it was Gavin Newsome.
16:24
Carmen Lezeth: Wait, wait, wait, wait.
16:26
Andrea: You wouldn't feel that way if it was Gavin Newsome.
16:28
Andrea: Gavin Newsom is not that charismatic and exciting and has not captured okay.
16:33
Carmen Lezeth: You know what's so funny?
16:34
Carmen Lezeth: You're absolutely this is my you've just that's the point.
16:37
Carmen Lezeth: Yes, he is.
16:38
Carmen Lezeth: Not to you because you don't like him.
16:41
Carmen Lezeth: You know what I mean?
16:42
Carmen Lezeth: Like, yes, he is.
16:43
Carmen Lezeth: Everyone loves him.
16:44
Carmen Lezeth: That is my point.
16:45
Carmen Lezeth: Is like there again, I I hear you, but I'm I'm going to disagree with you, which is you know, we can disagree, we can agree to disagree.
16:53
Carmen Lezeth: But Gavin Newsom is the exact thing that you just said.
16:58
Carmen Lezeth: And I'm saying for me and for other people, it's uh it there is a part of me, and I see the Bernie part and the AOC part, and that is not something I agree with.
17:08
Carmen Lezeth: You know what I mean?
17:09
Carmen Lezeth: Like I don't like them, you know.
17:11
Carmen Lezeth: I will support them, I will vote for them.
17:14
Andrea: That is my point.
17:16
Carmen Lezeth: They voted for it, but no, that's my point.
17:19
Carmen Lezeth: But I am not gonna sit here and promote Bernie Sanders and AOC.
17:22
Carmen Lezeth: You are not a leader in the Democratic Party.
17:25
Carmen Lezeth: But I understand why they're not doing it because there are people who do listen to them.
17:30
Carmen Lezeth: That's why they're the leaders of the party.
17:32
Carmen Lezeth: Okay.
17:33
Carmen Lezeth: Okay, we go and go, you know what?
17:35
Carmen Lezeth: This is this is our phone call.
17:37
Carmen Lezeth: Okay, this is why I'd be like, bitch, enough.
17:40
Carmen Lezeth: No, I'm just gonna like look it.
17:42
Carmen Lezeth: So let's talk about Nancy Pelosi because she just decided to, at the age of 85, she is finally going to retire.
17:50
Carmen Lezeth: And I can I tell you I'm not agreeing break today.
17:53
Carmen Lezeth: I haven't looked at the news.
17:54
Carmen Lezeth: Yeah, Nancy Pelosi announced today that she's going to retire and not run for office at the age of motherfucking 85.
18:03
Carmen Lezeth: I mean, they didn't say motherfucking 85, but she's been in office since 1987.
18:08
Carmen Lezeth: Look at wow, you can already tell how I feel about it, but I'm like, no, no, I want her.
18:13
Carmen Lezeth: I I think she should have retired 20 years ago.
18:16
Andrea: How do you feel about it?
18:17
Andrea: I don't just look, I mean, um I think she got us through some rough times, right?
18:23
Andrea: I mean, she was when we say 20 years ago, that would erase the Obama years.
18:28
Andrea: I think it was we can thank her for ACA, um, you know, getting that passed.
18:34
Andrea: Uh, but yeah, like honestly, beyond like 70, what are you doing?
18:41
Andrea: Go find some other shit to do.
18:43
Andrea: Why do you need to be there?
18:45
Carmen Lezeth: This podcast is going to be known for being ageist.
18:48
Carmen Lezeth: That's just like we are the worst people in the world when it comes to the city.
18:52
Carmen Lezeth: Like, I've already gotten a couple emails.
18:54
Andrea: We talked about this before though, and it's like these are people who are making decisions for the country, and they have no under no real understanding of the things that are important to people who are 20, 30, 40 years younger than them.
19:17
Andrea: They are making decisions that they will never have to live with the res the consequences of.
19:22
Carmen Lezeth: And and here's the thing, I'm I'm not against them contributing and I'm not against them being a part of being like the, I don't know what the word would be, like uh um elder statesman or elder stateswoman or whatever.
19:34
Carmen Lezeth: But I don't want you in office after I just think like there needs to be, I don't know if term limits would be it or if it would be an age thing.
19:44
Carmen Lezeth: I I go back to this idea that we demonize getting older.
19:49
Carmen Lezeth: So everyone holds on because they don't want to retire, they don't want to be nothing, and that's a cultural thing in the United States where we demonize getting older.
20:00
Carmen Lezeth: Um, and and and we like throw people away the minute they turn 65.
20:05
Carmen Lezeth: That's not what we're saying.
20:06
Carmen Lezeth: I just want to clear.
20:07
Carmen Lezeth: I did get a couple of emails on this.
20:09
Carmen Lezeth: Not at all.
20:10
Andrea: That's not a business partner is 83 years old.
20:12
Andrea: Like there is a lot of wisdom and and you know, but your business partner lets you run the business.
20:21
Andrea: Exactly.
20:22
Carmen Lezeth: Step back and elder statesman.
20:25
Carmen Lezeth: That's what I'm saying.
20:26
Carmen Lezeth: Like you become somebody else, you know what I mean?
20:28
Carmen Lezeth: You become a different entity that is more revered, more respected.
20:32
Carmen Lezeth: I lost a lot of respect for Nancy Pelosi.
20:36
Carmen Lezeth: Ironically, you're gonna jump down my throat now.
20:39
Carmen Lezeth: How she treated AOC and the whole group that walked in the door, you know what I mean?
20:45
Carmen Lezeth: Like, because to me, I was like, no, this is the group, this is the young up-and-coming group, and like let them, let them take over.
20:53
Carmen Lezeth: But that's about a weird sense of power, too.
20:57
Carmen Lezeth: You know, that's a weird sense of power.
20:59
Andrea: It's control.
21:00
Andrea: I think, I think definitely when they're sort of in the upper echelons of power in in any of these um institutions, or businesses for that matter, you start to get, they start to get a sense of like, you know, they can't do it without me.
21:15
Andrea: You know, like I'm too important in this process, and I just, you know, I can't let go, they're not ready for it yet.
21:24
Carmen Lezeth: You know, I think if we could change also the culture about, like, I don't know, I'd love to be revered.
21:31
Carmen Lezeth: I'd like to retire and people be like, Carmen, can we call you?
21:34
Andrea: I mean, some of these people, if they let it go earlier, they would be more revered than if they hold on for this long, and literally making enemies along the way, and people who are like, you can't even fucking stand up.
21:46
Andrea: I don't respect you anymore.
21:48
Andrea: Yeah, Diane Beinstein is a great example.
21:50
Carmen Lezeth: Oh my god.
21:50
Carmen Lezeth: I mean, I right, we loved her, and then I'm like, what is going on in the past like 15 years?
21:56
Carmen Lezeth: It was just like so embarrassing.
21:58
Carmen Lezeth: I voted, I loved Diane Feinstein.
22:01
Andrea: First of all, she looked like Diane Beinstein and we can and I voted for her every single time she was on my ballot.
22:06
Andrea: And I'll tell you that last vote I regretted like a mofo because she was not there.
22:12
Andrea: She was not there.
22:14
Andrea: We cannot have the stakes, they are too high at this point on all fronts, even without Trump.
22:22
Andrea: No, of course, of course.
22:24
Andrea: In in where we are in our country right now to have people who can't make coherent decisions, can't even be able to do that.
22:35
Carmen Lezeth: If you really love your country and it really is about the people and it really is about your service, you wouldn't stay for that long.
22:44
Carmen Lezeth: But it actually takes somebody to tell people the truth, right?
22:49
Carmen Lezeth: Like this is part of the problem.
22:50
Carmen Lezeth: And I always think about this with Arlene.
22:52
Carmen Lezeth: I know you worked with Arlene at one point too, and I told you the story.
22:56
Carmen Lezeth: Uh, it was this weird thing where she thought it was okay to keep driving.
23:00
Carmen Lezeth: And she was like in her 80s, and her family, everybody was, and this is somebody who could afford to take an Uber, right?
23:07
Carmen Lezeth: Like it's not an Uber.
23:09
Carmen Lezeth: She had a chauffeur.
23:10
Carmen Lezeth: But it was, it's one of those stories where I went in and I just screamed at her and I made the one comment, and I said, I don't care if you drove and got into an accident and killed yourself, but you would never be able to live with yourself if you killed someone else.
23:26
Carmen Lezeth: And I got the keys that day.
23:28
Carmen Lezeth: And it's like, and and you know, I'm not trying to make this like a big deal, but it's like at some point you have to put that in front of people.
23:36
Carmen Lezeth: And look at I admit right now that as I get older and older, I can't wait to retire.
23:42
Carmen Lezeth: I would retire now if I could, right?
23:45
Andrea: Right.
23:46
Carmen Lezeth: Why do you want to keep working?
23:47
Carmen Lezeth: I'm fucking ready, man.
23:49
Carmen Lezeth: I just ain't got the money.
23:50
Carmen Lezeth: Maybe, maybe they didn't have the money.
23:52
Andrea: Yeah, right.
23:53
Carmen Lezeth: Maybe.
23:53
Carmen Lezeth: Maybe, maybe that's what PayPal.
23:56
Carmen Lezeth: Right.
23:56
Carmen Lezeth: But um, but I just feel like there they need, you know, like I'm like all the tributes are starting, whatever, and I'm like, yeah, you know what though?
24:04
Carmen Lezeth: I'm angry.
24:05
Carmen Lezeth: And I'll I'll never forget the way in which she treated.
24:07
Carmen Lezeth: It's so funny because I I'm not a big fan of AOC and stuff, but I will never forget that.
24:12
Carmen Lezeth: That little group, remember the group of um young people who walked in.
24:15
Carmen Lezeth: Yeah, I can't remember what they're I can't remember all their names, right?
24:18
Carmen Lezeth: Right, right, right.
24:19
Carmen Lezeth: I just remember being like, no, this is not the way it works.
24:23
Carmen Lezeth: I'm sorry, I said it's shitty, and it's almost like kind of mean girlish, right?
24:29
Andrea: Like, not to bring it back to, but it's like, it's not your turn, girl, you know.
24:34
Carmen Lezeth: And I'll decide when it's your turn.
24:36
Carmen Lezeth: Yeah, and I'm more important and better than you.
24:38
Carmen Lezeth: And it's like, yeah, actually, no, you know what I mean?
24:40
Carmen Lezeth: Like, you could be someone who teaches them stuff.
24:43
Carmen Lezeth: Why why can't you just mentor, right?
24:45
Carmen Lezeth: Yeah, yeah.
24:46
Carmen Lezeth: So let's talk about Dick Cheney because I actually, I mean, I was kidding with you, but we both have no respect for Dick Cheney.
24:57
Carmen Lezeth: And I know I'll just so he died on Monday, um November 3rd.
25:03
Carmen Lezeth: Was it Tuesday?
25:05
Carmen Lezeth: It was Monday, November 3rd at 84.
25:08
Carmen Lezeth: I think we all heard about it on Tuesday, but he actually died on November 3rd.
25:12
Carmen Lezeth: Um, and one of the quotes that I think changed everything.
25:17
Carmen Lezeth: I mean, I I think the George W.
25:20
Carmen Lezeth: Bush administration, again, we've talked about this before, set up where we're at right now on so many levels.
25:27
Carmen Lezeth: But one of the quotes he wrote, uh, one of the quotes he said, Dick Cheney, was simply stated, there is no doubt that Saddam Hussein now has weapons of mass destruction.
25:36
Carmen Lezeth: And he said that in um 2002, justifying the Iraq war, and later was discredited when no WMDs, weapons of mass uh destruction were found.
25:48
Carmen Lezeth: His connection to Halliburton, which is this whole kind of he was the CEO of this company that was just making money.
25:56
Carmen Lezeth: It starts this kind of taking money while you're in office bullshittery.
26:00
Carmen Lezeth: Then the whole thing about never talking about gay people, never saying a word, never he never uttered a single word, even though the Republican Party was so against LGBTQ, was so against uh marriage or whatever.
26:15
Carmen Lezeth: And then during the Kerr debate in 2004, that's when it came out that his daughter Mary Cheney was gay.
26:22
Carmen Lezeth: And it there was a cowardness, being a coward during that time period when you could have advocated for gay marriage or advocated for the rights of people in the LGBTQ community, and you didn't.
26:35
Carmen Lezeth: And then the last I'm gonna let you speak.
26:37
Carmen Lezeth: And then the last thing I'm gonna say that I thought was weird, and I'm not a parent, but I'm thinking I'm not a parent, but I would think this is a cheesy thing.
26:45
Carmen Lezeth: A lot of people were saying was, oh, but he raised his daughter, Liz Cheney, right?
26:50
Carmen Lezeth: You know, because she came out and was voting for Kamala and whatever, and I don't know, found her Jesus moment.
26:57
Carmen Lezeth: I have no idea.
26:57
Carmen Lezeth: But I was like, that can't be, you you can't be a parent who does bad things and then rely on your daughter to like fix your legacy.
27:06
Carmen Lezeth: I have no idea, but yeah, go ahead.
27:09
Andrea: I'm sorry.
27:10
Andrea: Oh, Dick Cheney was an evil motherfucker.
27:14
Andrea: Um, and that is just an objective truth.
27:18
Andrea: He was in the you know uh leadership of every Republican administration from before I was born, which was a long ringing time ago, um, until 2008, 2009, technically.
27:41
Andrea: Um so we're talking Nixon, yeah.
27:46
Andrea: Uh he was I think he was uh Ford's chief of staff, you know, so probably had a hand in the pardon of Nixon.
27:54
Andrea: Uh Reagan, which you know, I could spend 17 hours talking about what an evil motherfucker he was, and uh HW Bush, he was the Secretary of Defense, right?
28:09
Andrea: And then uh, you know, the the wonderful W years uh were with Rumsfeld, with Rumsfeld, who was his mentor, also an evil motherfucker, yeah, um, who I'm glad is dead.
28:22
Andrea: And like there is no possible way to absolve to wipe off the stain of the misery and death that this person caused around the world and here in the United States.
28:41
Carmen Lezeth: Um I don't even I can't even believe anyone would begin to praise or honor this this type of well they are because they're you know I know because later in his life and like and and he voted for Kamala Harris and he talked about that and he I know it's but I do we believe in forgiveness?
29:01
Andrea: Do we believe in Andrea clearly does not, but I just because we voted one time for one person does not wipe off all of the evil that you did throughout your life.
29:16
Carmen Lezeth: I think what's more important for me is the setup of how we're at today, and you know, can I forgive?
29:24
Carmen Lezeth: Sure, whatever.
29:25
Carmen Lezeth: I don't forget, you know what I mean?
29:26
Carmen Lezeth: Like, and I don't absolve people of creating a space where evil continues, you know what I mean?
29:35
Carmen Lezeth: If there was a way in which you stopped it, you know, again, it goes back to this thing about courage.
29:40
Carmen Lezeth: Like if you know that your child is gay and people are demonizing gay people and you have power and you decide not to say a word or even just kind of have it be assumed that you don't like gay people, I it's hard for me to.
29:59
Carmen Lezeth: Have any kind of compassion or thought process that you are a decent human being.
30:05
Carmen Lezeth: I don't like cowards.
30:08
Andrea: He wasn't a decent human being.
30:10
Andrea: You know?
30:11
Andrea: And yeah, he didn't like Trump.
30:14
Andrea: Okay.
30:14
Andrea: Like, you know what I mean?
30:18
Andrea: Like, I alright.
30:20
Andrea: I mean, people are complex, right?
30:24
Andrea: Do multiple things can be true at the same time.
30:27
Andrea: And you know, just because we agree that Trump is, you know, a horrible evil stain on this country, um, doesn't mean that we wipe away all of the bad that he did, which was a very significant lot of bad.
30:44
Carmen Lezeth: That again, I'm going to say, especially if you go back, not you, but if people go back and just look at the history of how it opens this door, these avenues that we're in today, widens them.
30:56
Carmen Lezeth: And um, you know, but this is also thinking about people that might be watching that are still Trump supporters, they're not going to make that connection, you know, because if you're still supporting Trump in this way today, you're probably not watching our show.
31:09
Carmen Lezeth: So you're not watching the show.
31:12
Andrea: Yeah, he was a proponent of this idea of the unitary executive, right?
31:16
Andrea: Which is the executive, there's the three branches of power, and executive is up here at the top, right?
31:22
Carmen Lezeth: Yes, he pushed for radical expansion of presidential authority, which is what does that sound like?
31:30
Andrea: You can do things like go to war without Congress's approval.
31:35
Andrea: You can do things like create enhanced interrogation techniques, which is torture.
31:43
Andrea: You know what I mean?
31:44
Andrea: You can do things like open a guantanamo and have people put there really for life with no due process.
31:52
Andrea: I mean, there's all kinds, and that's just connections, right?
31:55
Carmen Lezeth: Right?
31:55
Carmen Lezeth: There are connections all over the place.
31:56
Carmen Lezeth: This is what's happening now and what he did.
31:59
Andrea: Exactly.
31:59
Andrea: It's a direct thread, a line that you can draw that's like Dick Chaney had his hands in this, and here's Trump.
32:06
Andrea: And it's like, oh, I don't like the way you're doing that.
32:09
Andrea: I only liked it when I was doing that.
32:12
Andrea: So I'm gonna vote for this lady.
32:13
Andrea: I don't believe in anything she actually proposes, I don't believe in any of her policies.
32:19
Andrea: And the minute I can, I will get a Republican there who believes in exactly the same things I do, but just isn't Trump.
32:26
Carmen Lezeth: Right.
32:26
Carmen Lezeth: Yeah, fuck that.
32:27
Carmen Lezeth: It's just an interesting thing.
32:29
Carmen Lezeth: And so I I mean I I really did want to talk about it a little bit because I thought it was um fascinating.
32:35
Carmen Lezeth: And I'm always fascinated by how we revise, right?
32:38
Carmen Lezeth: It's always a people in power that revise the actual truth.
32:42
Carmen Lezeth: And here's something that I know a lot of people get upset about.
32:45
Carmen Lezeth: I can hate whoever I want to hate.
32:48
Andrea: You know what I mean?
32:49
Carmen Lezeth: Like, I can despise whoever I want to despise.
32:52
Carmen Lezeth: It's not it's not hurting my soul, it's not making my life cheaper, it's not, it's not doing anything to me.
32:58
Carmen Lezeth: I just think that we've gotten into this thing where, like, oh no, you cannot hate anybody.
33:03
Carmen Lezeth: Yet your behavior is positive for you.
33:06
Carmen Lezeth: That is, you know what it's not eating at my soul.
33:10
Carmen Lezeth: It's not eating at my soul.
33:12
Carmen Lezeth: Like, I love the isms that we've grown up and we've just accepted.
33:15
Carmen Lezeth: That's one of them, right?
33:16
Carmen Lezeth: That people are like, um, you know, you you have to forgive for your no, no, I I really don't have to forgive anybody.
33:24
Carmen Lezeth: Um, but it makes you feel better.
33:26
Carmen Lezeth: I forgive, you know what I mean?
33:27
Andrea: Like, but I don't forget.
33:29
Andrea: Right.
33:29
Andrea: Like I've I have people in my actual life who I'm like, yeah, I don't need to forgive them, but I can like put them off to the side and like live my life happy and joyous and whatever, you know.
33:41
Carmen Lezeth: No, but enjoy forgiveness is for you, it's not for them.
33:45
Andrea: It's actually not fine.
33:48
Carmen Lezeth: Yeah, that's part of my book that I'm working on, too, is all these isms that we've grown up to believe in and yet they don't really mean anything.
33:56
Carmen Lezeth: Like, let go and let God the entire AA community is gonna come and beat the crap out of me.
34:04
Carmen Lezeth: But like that's one of my favorite because what what does that mean?
34:07
Carmen Lezeth: Seriously, what does it mean?
34:09
Carmen Lezeth: Release yourself from responsibility.
34:11
Carmen Lezeth: Like, okay, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna Yeah, don't be disappointed, but I'm just saying, but but it's the isms, right?
34:16
Carmen Lezeth: It's all the isms, you know, like you have to forgive for yourself.
34:19
Carmen Lezeth: Yeah, no, I I'm good.
34:21
Carmen Lezeth: I'm good, not forgiving them.
34:23
Carmen Lezeth: I'm good.
34:24
Carmen Lezeth: There's so many of those.
34:25
Carmen Lezeth: Um, I said one the other day, I'm sorry.
34:29
Andrea: I have standards, damn it.
34:32
Carmen Lezeth: I think it's I like that actually.
34:35
Carmen Lezeth: I never thought about it.
34:36
Carmen Lezeth: It is standards, isn't it?
34:38
Andrea: I have people that I allow into my life, whether that's actual people that I know or like Barack Obama.
34:48
Andrea: Yeah, yeah, exactly.
34:49
Andrea: It's like people would I allow into my life, and I have a I have boundaries, right?
34:53
Andrea: I have standards.
34:54
Andrea: Like, no, you you do not get to be a part of my world.
35:01
Carmen Lezeth: Well, I think it's kind of like you know, like like the whole Charlie Kirk thing that you know, he was murdered or whatever.
35:07
Carmen Lezeth: I think there's one thing to have compassion for his child or whatever, you know what I mean?
35:12
Carmen Lezeth: Uh clearly I don't know what's happening with his wife and JD Vance, but I don't know what that's about.
35:18
Carmen Lezeth: Oh no, there's something weird happening there, but but you know, he he was murdered by someone that is weird and odd and horrible and whatever.
35:29
Carmen Lezeth: But I'm not gonna sit here and be like, oh, but now I'm thinking he's a great guy or whatever.
35:33
Carmen Lezeth: He was a horrible person, and he did he did a lot of damage to people, and it's kind of that same thing.
35:39
Carmen Lezeth: Like I can have more than one feeling about a situation because I'm a complex human being that can deal with nuance and understand the layers of how the world works, you know?
35:51
Carmen Lezeth: Right.
35:52
Carmen Lezeth: So it's that kind of thing too.
35:54
Carmen Lezeth: It's like I I think when people say let go and let God, first of all, not everyone believes in God, so let whatever it is.
36:00
Carmen Lezeth: When you do that, you are absolving yourself of kind of responsibility.
36:04
Carmen Lezeth: I never thought about it that way, but I'm gonna use that.
36:07
Carmen Lezeth: That's a good one, you know?
36:09
Andrea: Well, and I think it's this you know, I'm not to go back to this, but it's like people want things to be black and white.
36:18
Andrea: It's like this or this, yes or no.
36:21
Andrea: And that is not the human experience, particularly if you are a thoughtful, educated, critical thinking person, right?
36:32
Andrea: You can have a person or a topic or whatever where you have competing ideas about it.
36:38
Andrea: Like, I think this is good, but this part of it I don't really agree with.
36:42
Andrea: But this is a, you know, I need to find out more about this, whatever it is, you can have multiple thoughts and feelings about multiple different things and people.
36:52
Andrea: Yeah, but if you are not a person who is comfortable with that, then it's like I either like this or I don't.
37:01
Carmen Lezeth: Yeah, you know, and and and that's kind of part of the problem, too, is that we're just I always say nuanced, you know, but it's also how our politics has been set up.
37:11
Carmen Lezeth: How I mean it's dumbed down.
37:14
Carmen Lezeth: I mean, that's really what it is.
37:15
Carmen Lezeth: It's dumbed down, but it's also like we're so accepting, like there's this meme that's been going around, and I'm not gonna do it correctly, but this idea like you're mad at the world at the person getting SNAP benefits or the person making $8 an hour, but you're not mad at, you know, Jeff Bezos or any of the big time people who don't pay taxes, who get tax benefits and credits, and you you're they've done such a good job of convincing us that the problem is all the brown and black people who are running around, uh, you know, landscaping.
37:50
Carmen Lezeth: And they just arrested ICE just arrested a preschool teacher yesterday.
37:55
Carmen Lezeth: Yeah.
37:55
Carmen Lezeth: Uh in front of the kids.
37:57
Carmen Lezeth: At the school, in front of the kids.
37:58
Carmen Lezeth: At the school, in front of the kids, right?
38:00
Carmen Lezeth: And like they've convinced you that those are the people that are the problem as to why your life isn't the way that it could be.
38:08
Carmen Lezeth: Like, you don't understand nuance at all.
38:11
Carmen Lezeth: Like, you don't even understand what they're doing because you're not even seeing so easily how rich people are just stomping and laughing at us.
38:20
Carmen Lezeth: Like, just that's why that's why Tuesday's vote was incredible.
38:25
Carmen Lezeth: Yeah, that's why it was amazing.
38:27
Andrea: All of the money spent.
38:29
Andrea: Oh, that was awesome.
38:32
Andrea: It's like just light your millions on fire.
38:35
Carmen Lezeth: You know, yeah.
38:36
Carmen Lezeth: But here's the here's we'll just kind of wind this down a bit.
38:39
Carmen Lezeth: But the White House East Wing, like, have you noticed that's not in the news anymore, right?
38:44
Carmen Lezeth: The destruction.
38:45
Carmen Lezeth: Because they have gone out of their way to make sure that all the media doesn't keep talking about it because they understand that the public is not okay with it.
38:55
Carmen Lezeth: Okay, we don't like it.
38:56
Carmen Lezeth: We don't like it, so it's out of you know what else is not in the news anymore?
38:59
Carmen Lezeth: Epstein files.
39:00
Carmen Lezeth: This is corporate America, all the bigwigs, the people that are financing the destruction of the East Wing or the building of the ballroom, however you choose to look at it, are corporate America.
39:16
Carmen Lezeth: Corporate America is funding all of that.
39:19
Carmen Lezeth: And then they're turning around and laughing at us because they're gonna be sitting at that dinner table.
39:23
Carmen Lezeth: And then we're going to have to pay as taxpayers anything that isn't covered by it and all the maintenance for it afterwards.
39:29
Carmen Lezeth: Our tax dollars for a ballroom we didn't need.
39:33
Andrea: Right.
39:33
Carmen Lezeth: And again, where are the Epstein files?
39:35
Andrea: I'm just wondering.
39:36
Andrea: Well, and the media, which is now corporate America.
39:39
Andrea: Corporate America, completely.
39:40
Andrea: Any type of real national media is is is not you know serving the interest of the public at this point.
39:48
Carmen Lezeth: No, and I keep telling people this all the time.
39:50
Carmen Lezeth: Stop following networks and papers or whatever.
39:54
Carmen Lezeth: Find those journalists that are doing good work, like Jacob Soberoff.
40:00
Carmen Lezeth: Is that how you say his last name?
40:01
Carmen Lezeth: Soberoff.
40:02
Carmen Lezeth: It's such an interesting last name, right?
40:04
Carmen Lezeth: Sober off.
40:05
Carmen Lezeth: I've never heard of it, but I love him.
40:07
Carmen Lezeth: He's so handsome too.
40:08
Carmen Lezeth: Love him, but like he's a great journalist.
40:12
Carmen Lezeth: And the reason he's an investigative journalist, he's just really good and he's just so smart.
40:17
Carmen Lezeth: It's like I follow him.
40:19
Carmen Lezeth: I want to know what he's doing and what he's saying.
40:21
Carmen Lezeth: And the reason why I like him so much is because he also comes with receipts all the time.
40:25
Carmen Lezeth: He has receipts, all the time, you know.
40:28
Carmen Lezeth: As a journalist, yeah.
40:30
Carmen Lezeth: Which is you know what it just dawned on me?
40:32
Carmen Lezeth: I can't believe I'm saying that because that's what journalists usually do.
40:36
Carmen Lezeth: Well, yes, they do.
40:39
Carmen Lezeth: Yeah, they do.
40:41
Carmen Lezeth: All right, cool.
40:42
Carmen Lezeth: Well, look at um, that was an interesting conversation, and it's getting more and more like our actual phone conversations.
40:49
Carmen Lezeth: And like you don't seem to understand that you are wrong.
40:53
Carmen Lezeth: Do you know what I mean?
40:54
Carmen Lezeth: Like it's like I love you, but you're always wrong, and I'm always right.
40:58
Carmen Lezeth: That's what it is.
40:58
Andrea: Yeah, we'll see.
41:01
Carmen Lezeth: Um, all right, everyone.
41:03
Carmen Lezeth: Well, thank you so much for hanging out with us, and we'll see you again next week.
41:06
Carmen Lezeth: And remember, at the end of the day, it really is all about the joy.
41:08
Carmen Lezeth: Bye, everyone.
41:11
Carmen Lezeth: Thanks for stopping by.
41:12
Carmen Lezeth: All about the joy.
41:14
Carmen Lezeth: Be better and stay beautiful, folks.
41:16
Carmen Lezeth: Have a sweet day.