Latest / Deep Transformation / Governor Jerry Brown on Life, Power, and the Future of Humanity (Part 2)

Transcript

Governor Jerry Brown on Life, Power, and the Future of Humanity (Part 2) · Deep Transformation

0:00
Dear,
0:01
dear
0:01
listener,
0:02
hi,
0:02
this
0:02
is
0:02
John
0:03
Dupuy.
0:03
I
0:03
want
0:03
to
0:04
ask
0:04
a
0:04
favor
0:04
of
0:04
you.
0:05
If
0:05
you
0:05
like
0:05
the
0:06
podcast
0:06
Deep
0:07
Transformation
0:07
and
0:08
you're
0:08
getting
0:08
a
0:08
lot
0:08
out
0:08
of
0:08
it,
0:09
could
0:09
you
0:09
please
0:09
help
0:10
us
0:10
by
0:10
going
0:10
to
0:11
wherever
0:11
you
0:11
get
0:11
your
0:12
podcast,
0:12
it's
0:12
a
0:13
Spotify
0:13
or
0:13
Apple
0:14
or
0:14
wherever
0:14
it
0:15
is
0:15
and
0:15
write,
0:16
write
0:16
a
0:16
review
0:16
that
0:17
would
0:17
really
0:17
help
0:17
us
0:17
to
0:18
get
0:18
this
0:18
out.
0:18
We
0:19
really
0:19
believe
0:19
in
0:19
what
0:19
we're
0:19
doing
0:20
and
0:20
we're
0:20
really
0:21
praying
0:21
and
0:21
hoping
0:21
this
0:21
is
0:22
helping
0:22
people
0:22
and
0:22
being
0:23
part
0:23
of
0:23
the
0:23
solution.
0:24
So
0:24
if
0:24
you
0:24
could
0:24
do
0:24
that,
0:25
it
0:25
would
0:25
be
0:25
greatly
0:26
appreciated
0:27
by
0:27
Roger,
0:27
myself
0:28
and
0:28
our
0:28
team.
0:28
God
0:29
bless.
0:29
Thank
0:29
you.
0:31
Welcome
0:31
to
0:31
part
0:31
two
0:32
of
0:32
our
0:32
conversation
0:33
with
0:33
former
0:33
California
0:34
Governor
0:35
Jerry
0:35
Brown.
0:35
Although
0:36
Jerry
0:36
is
0:37
in
0:37
his
0:37
80s,
0:38
he
0:38
remains
0:38
a
0:38
force
0:39
to
0:39
be
0:39
reckoned
0:39
with
0:40
and
0:40
brings
0:40
his
0:40
laser
0:41
like
0:41
insights
0:42
into
0:42
the
0:42
national
0:43
and
0:43
planetary
0:44
challenges
0:44
that
0:45
confront
0:45
us
0:46
now.
0:51
Welcome
0:51
to
0:51
Deep
0:53
Transformation
0:53
Self,
0:53
Society,
0:54
Spirit,
0:55
life
0:55
enhancing,
0:56
paradigm
0:56
rattling
0:57
conversations
0:58
with
0:58
cutting
0:58
edge
0:59
thinkers
0:59
contempl
1:00
and
1:00
activists
1:01
with
1:01
Dr.
1:02
Roger
1:02
Walsh
1:02
and
1:02
John
1:03
Dupuy.
1:07
What's
1:07
to
1:07
be
1:07
done
1:08
in
1:08
the
1:08
meantime?
1:09
And
1:10
they
1:10
say,
1:10
what
1:10
are
1:10
you
1:10
talking
1:10
about?
1:11
I
1:11
said
1:11
between
1:11
now
1:12
and
1:12
death
1:13
or
1:13
senility,
1:14
what's
1:14
your
1:15
program?
1:15
So
1:16
I
1:16
think
1:16
you
1:17
have
1:17
to
1:17
sit
1:17
on
1:17
that
1:17
question
1:18
because
1:18
it's
1:19
something
1:19
you
1:19
gotta
1:19
ask
1:19
yourself
1:20
every
1:20
day.
1:21
Absolutely.
1:21
And
1:22
we're
1:22
all,
1:22
we're
1:22
all
1:22
older,
1:23
you
1:23
know,
1:23
the
1:24
three
1:24
of
1:24
us
1:24
sitting
1:24
here.
1:25
So
1:25
you
1:26
know,
1:26
whatever
1:26
happens,
1:27
we
1:27
won't
1:27
have
1:27
to
1:27
go
1:28
through
1:28
it
1:28
for
1:28
too
1:28
long.
1:29
But
1:30
yeah,
1:31
what
1:31
do
1:31
we,
1:31
you
1:31
know,
1:32
why
1:32
do
1:32
you
1:32
get
1:32
up
1:32
in
1:33
the
1:33
morning
1:33
and
1:33
put
1:33
your
1:33
shoes
1:34
on
1:34
and
1:34
why
1:34
are
1:34
you
1:34
here?
1:35
What
1:35
is
1:36
your
1:36
personal
1:37
response
1:38
given
1:38
what
1:39
you
1:39
know?
1:39
And
1:39
it
1:39
says
1:39
in
1:39
Ecclesiastes
1:40
that
1:40
great
1:41
knowledge
1:42
is
1:42
great
1:42
grief.
1:43
So
1:44
how
1:44
in
1:44
the
1:45
face
1:45
of
1:45
that,
1:46
how
1:46
do
1:46
we
1:46
take
1:46
that
1:47
next
1:47
step
1:47
and
1:48
how
1:48
do
1:48
we
1:48
motivate
1:49
ourselves
1:50
just
1:50
to
1:52
be
1:52
present
1:53
and
1:54
attempt
1:55
to
1:55
confront
1:55
the
1:56
darkness
1:56
and
1:56
be
1:56
a
1:56
light,
1:57
a
1:58
candle
1:58
in
1:58
the
1:58
darkness.
1:59
That's
1:59
a
1:59
huge
2:00
key
2:00
ways
2:00
to
2:01
find
2:01
people
2:01
who
2:01
are
2:01
more
2:02
enlightened
2:02
and
2:04
spend
2:04
time
2:05
with
2:05
them,
2:05
pick
2:06
up
2:06
what
2:07
others
2:07
have
2:07
already
2:08
realized.
2:09
I
2:09
have
2:10
reflected
2:10
as
2:10
you
2:10
asked
2:11
me
2:11
about
2:11
what
2:11
values,
2:12
what
2:13
overarching
2:13
vision.
2:14
That
2:14
was
2:14
one
2:15
of
2:15
the
2:15
things
2:15
you
2:16
wrote
2:16
down.
2:16
And
2:17
I
2:17
think
2:17
to
2:17
myself,
2:18
I
2:18
don't
2:18
know
2:18
that
2:18
I,
2:19
I
2:19
can't
2:19
formulate
2:20
an
2:20
overall
2:20
vision.
2:21
But
2:22
every
2:23
morning
2:23
I
2:23
get
2:23
up,
2:24
I'm
2:24
excited,
2:25
I'm
2:25
really
2:25
enthusiastic.
2:26
Boy,
2:27
another
2:28
day.
2:28
Beautiful
2:29
out
2:29
there.
2:29
The
2:29
birds
2:30
are
2:30
chirping,
2:30
the
2:31
sun
2:31
has
2:31
come
2:31
up.
2:32
However,
2:33
I'm
2:33
not
2:33
in
2:34
charge
2:34
of
2:34
that
2:35
feeling.
2:35
It
2:36
just
2:36
shows
2:36
up
2:37
and
2:37
someday
2:37
I
2:38
may
2:38
wake
2:38
up
2:38
totally
2:39
depressed.
2:40
So
2:40
I,
2:41
I
2:41
feel
2:41
as
2:42
if
2:42
I'm
2:42
not
2:43
in
2:43
charge
2:43
Exactly.
2:44
I'm.
2:44
I
2:44
guess
2:45
I
2:45
can
2:45
make
2:45
it
2:45
worse,
2:46
you
2:46
know,
2:46
by
2:47
drinking
2:48
or
2:48
getting
2:48
in
2:48
a
2:49
rut
2:49
of
2:49
some
2:49
kind.
2:50
And
2:50
yet
2:50
by
2:51
living
2:52
an
2:52
active,
2:52
full
2:53
life
2:53
and
2:53
doing
2:54
things
2:54
that
2:55
believe
2:55
are
2:56
valuable,
2:56
that's
2:57
important.
2:57
But
2:58
the
2:58
inherent
2:59
will
3:00
to
3:00
live,
3:00
the
3:01
inherent
3:01
appreciation
3:02
that
3:03
seems
3:03
to
3:03
be
3:03
prior
3:04
to
3:05
my
3:05
awareness,
3:06
it
3:06
just
3:06
is
3:07
something
3:07
that
3:07
I
3:08
am
3:08
in.
3:09
I
3:09
mean,
3:09
some
3:09
larger
3:10
gestalt
3:11
that
3:11
I
3:12
show
3:12
up
3:12
in.
3:13
So,
3:13
so
3:14
far
3:14
so
3:14
good.
3:14
We
3:15
don't
3:15
know
3:15
what
3:15
I'm
3:15
going
3:15
to
3:15
feel
3:16
like
3:16
tomorrow
3:16
or
3:17
the
3:17
next.
3:17
More
3:18
will
3:18
you.
3:19
And
3:19
some
3:19
people
3:19
get
3:19
very
3:20
depressed.
3:21
Some
3:21
people
3:21
have
3:22
bigger
3:22
problems
3:22
than
3:22
others,
3:23
and
3:23
some
3:23
people
3:24
can.
3:24
Can
3:25
respond
3:25
to
3:26
great
3:26
crisis.
3:27
So
3:27
that.
3:27
That's
3:28
just
3:28
what
3:28
being
3:28
human
3:28
is,
3:29
is
3:29
dealing
3:30
with
3:30
that
3:30
whole
3:31
range
3:31
of
3:32
human
3:32
experience.
3:34
And
3:35
to
3:35
go
3:35
to
3:35
your
3:35
question
3:36
of,
3:36
okay,
3:37
between
3:37
now
3:38
and
3:38
then,
3:38
between
3:38
now
3:39
and
3:39
death,
3:40
we
3:40
have
3:40
today.
3:41
So
3:42
is
3:42
there
3:42
something
3:42
you'd
3:43
like
3:43
to
3:43
do?
3:43
You've
3:44
done
3:44
so
3:44
much.
3:45
Is
3:45
there
3:46
something
3:46
you
3:47
really
3:47
like
3:47
to
3:47
do
3:48
now?
3:48
Yes.
3:49
Yes,
3:49
I'm.
3:50
I'm
3:50
trying
3:51
to
3:51
put
3:51
together
3:51
a
3:51
book.
3:52
I
3:53
have
3:53
hundreds
3:53
of
3:53
pages
3:54
from
3:55
various
3:55
periods
3:56
of
3:56
my
3:56
life
3:57
and
3:57
a
3:58
lot,
3:58
a
3:58
lot
3:58
of.
3:59
I've
3:59
encountered
4:00
both
4:01
in
4:01
the
4:01
religious
4:02
life
4:02
and
4:03
in
4:03
the
4:03
political
4:04
world
4:04
and
4:05
from
4:05
an
4:05
era
4:06
that
4:06
is
4:06
past.
4:07
What
4:07
I
4:08
grew
4:08
up
4:08
in
4:08
doesn't
4:09
exist
4:09
anymore.
4:10
Well,
4:10
it
4:11
exists
4:11
in
4:11
some
4:11
sense,
4:12
but
4:12
it
4:12
radically
4:13
changed.
4:13
So
4:14
how
4:14
to
4:14
write
4:15
that?
4:15
You
4:16
know,
4:16
what.
4:16
What
4:17
has
4:17
been
4:17
my
4:17
education?
4:19
And
4:19
I.
4:19
I
4:19
read
4:20
the
4:20
very
4:20
grand
4:21
biography
4:21
of
4:22
Henry
4:22
Adams
4:23
and
4:23
he
4:23
talked
4:24
about
4:24
his
4:24
education.
4:25
Everything
4:25
in
4:26
life,
4:26
this
4:27
is
4:27
education.
4:28
So
4:28
I'm
4:28
thinking
4:29
about
4:29
my
4:29
education,
4:30
how
4:30
I
4:30
could
4:31
probe
4:31
that,
4:32
put
4:32
it
4:33
in
4:33
good,
4:34
clear
4:34
prose
4:35
and
4:35
share
4:36
something
4:36
that,
4:37
that
4:37
I
4:37
would
4:37
find
4:38
of
4:38
interest.
4:39
And
4:39
that's
4:39
what
4:39
I'm
4:39
doing
4:40
now.
4:40
But
4:40
will
4:41
I
4:41
accomplish
4:41
that?
4:41
I
4:42
don't
4:42
know.
4:42
I've
4:42
been
4:42
trying
4:42
to
4:43
write
4:43
a
4:43
book
4:43
for
4:43
40
4:43
years,
4:44
so
4:45
I've
4:45
got
4:45
a
4:45
little
4:45
barrier
4:46
here.
4:46
So
4:46
that's
4:47
my
4:47
goal.
4:47
I
4:47
like
4:48
to.
4:48
In
4:48
the
4:49
meantime,
4:49
that's
4:49
what
4:49
I
4:49
intend
4:50
to
4:50
do,
4:50
besides
4:51
maintaining
4:51
my.
4:52
My
4:52
ranch
4:52
and
4:53
making
4:53
olive
4:53
oil
4:53
and
4:54
talking
4:55
to
4:55
old
4:55
friends
4:56
and
4:56
new
4:56
friends.
4:58
I
4:58
think
4:58
that
4:58
would
4:58
be
4:59
a
4:59
very
4:59
good
4:59
book
5:00
and
5:00
I
5:00
certainly
5:00
would
5:01
read
5:01
it.
5:01
It
5:01
would
5:02
be
5:02
a
5:02
good
5:02
book
5:03
if
5:03
I
5:03
could
5:03
write
5:04
well.
5:04
And
5:04
I've
5:04
written
5:04
many
5:05
things
5:05
and
5:06
I've
5:06
written
5:07
book
5:07
reviews
5:08
and
5:08
I'm
5:09
writing.
5:09
You
5:09
know,
5:09
I
5:10
do
5:10
shortened
5:11
work,
5:11
but
5:11
putting
5:12
together
5:12
a
5:12
larger
5:13
narrative.
5:14
Obviously
5:15
they
5:15
do
5:16
40,000
5:16
books
5:16
a
5:17
year,
5:17
and
5:17
Roger,
5:18
you've
5:18
written
5:18
a
5:18
dozen
5:19
books,
5:19
so
5:20
it
5:20
can't
5:20
be
5:20
an
5:20
impossible
5:21
task.
5:23
Sometimes
5:23
it
5:23
feels
5:24
like
5:24
it,
5:26
but.
5:27
Well,
5:27
yep,
5:29
definitely.
5:30
I
5:31
look
5:31
behind
5:31
you,
5:31
I
5:32
see
5:32
nothing
5:32
but
5:32
books.
5:33
So
5:33
obviously
5:34
the
5:34
book
5:35
is
5:35
not
5:35
some
5:36
rare
5:36
beast.
5:37
Well,
5:37
I
5:38
think
5:38
it
5:38
was
5:38
Ecclesiastes
5:39
of
5:39
the
5:39
making
5:39
of
5:40
books.
5:40
There
5:40
is
5:40
no
5:40
end,
5:41
except
5:41
if
5:41
you're
5:41
an
5:42
author,
5:42
it
5:42
feels
5:42
like
5:43
there's
5:43
definitely
5:44
an
5:44
end
5:44
to
5:44
it.
5:45
So.
5:46
But.
5:46
So
5:47
a
5:47
lot
5:47
of
5:48
threads
5:48
here,
5:48
Jerry.
5:50
I
5:50
want
5:50
to
5:50
just
5:50
touch
5:51
back
5:51
into
5:52
the
5:52
global
5:53
issues
5:53
because
5:54
we've
5:54
talked
5:55
about
5:55
the
5:55
nuclear
5:56
issue,
5:56
which
5:56
is
5:57
a
5:57
big
5:57
one
5:57
and
5:57
you've
5:57
been
5:58
deeply
5:58
concerned
5:58
with
5:58
it.
5:59
And
5:59
you're
5:59
also
6:00
president
6:00
of
6:00
the
6:00
Bulletin
6:01
of
6:01
Atomic
6:01
Scientists,
6:02
which
6:03
was
6:04
actually,
6:04
I
6:04
think,
6:04
founded
6:05
by
6:05
Albert
6:05
Einstein
6:06
on
6:06
the
6:06
original
6:07
Manhattan
6:08
Project
6:08
scientists.
6:10
And
6:10
as
6:11
I
6:11
understand
6:11
it,
6:11
it
6:12
was
6:12
originally
6:12
founded
6:13
centered
6:14
around
6:14
the
6:14
nuclear
6:14
issue,
6:15
but
6:15
has
6:16
since
6:16
broadened
6:16
to
6:17
include
6:18
other
6:18
of
6:18
the
6:19
global
6:19
threats,
6:19
for
6:20
example,
6:21
environmental
6:22
issues.
6:22
And
6:22
I
6:22
think
6:23
of
6:23
the.
6:24
I'll
6:24
just
6:24
give
6:25
my
6:25
2
6:25
cents
6:26
worth
6:26
here.
6:26
I
6:26
think
6:26
of
6:27
multiple
6:28
issues
6:28
here
6:29
and
6:29
kind
6:29
of
6:30
we
6:30
have
6:30
not
6:30
only
6:31
the
6:31
nuclear
6:31
and
6:32
the.
6:32
But
6:33
we
6:33
have
6:34
pollution
6:34
as
6:35
a
6:35
huge
6:35
issue,
6:36
part
6:36
of
6:37
the
6:37
environmental
6:37
issue.
6:38
So
6:38
many
6:39
forms
6:39
of
6:39
pollution
6:40
from,
6:40
you
6:41
know,
6:41
toxins,
6:42
lead
6:42
and
6:43
plastic.
6:43
A
6:43
big
6:44
one.
6:44
Now
6:44
we
6:45
have
6:45
ecological
6:45
degradation.
6:47
Climate
6:47
change,
6:48
you've
6:49
mentioned
6:49
that's
6:50
a
6:50
big
6:50
one,
6:50
gets
6:51
a
6:51
lot
6:51
of
6:51
attention.
6:52
You
6:52
mentioned
6:52
genetic
6:53
engineering,
6:54
you
6:54
mentioned
6:55
artificial
6:55
intelligence,
6:57
and
6:57
you
6:58
mentioned
6:58
the
6:58
complexity
6:59
of
6:59
systems.
7:00
And
7:00
then
7:00
of
7:00
course,
7:00
there
7:01
are
7:01
issues
7:01
we
7:01
don't
7:02
know
7:02
about
7:02
because
7:02
we
7:02
haven't
7:03
recognized
7:03
them
7:03
yet.
7:03
It
7:04
took
7:04
us
7:04
400
7:04
years
7:05
to
7:05
recognize
7:05
that
7:07
running
7:08
internal
7:09
combustion
7:09
machines
7:10
created
7:10
a
7:10
lot
7:10
of
7:11
carbon
7:11
dioxide.
7:12
So
7:12
I'd
7:12
love
7:12
to
7:12
hear
7:13
any
7:13
other,
7:13
other
7:13
reflections
7:14
you'd
7:14
like
7:14
to
7:14
bring
7:14
up
7:15
on
7:15
the
7:15
other
7:16
global
7:16
issues
7:16
we're
7:17
facing.
7:17
I'll
7:18
bring
7:18
up
7:19
the
7:19
matter
7:19
of
7:19
the
7:20
nuclear
7:21
danger
7:21
since
7:22
that
7:23
still
7:24
it's
7:24
as
7:24
important
7:25
as
7:26
it
7:26
is
7:26
under
7:27
reported.
7:29
So
7:29
this
7:29
is
7:30
still
7:30
a
7:30
big
7:30
deal.
7:31
We
7:31
had
7:31
a
7:32
million
7:32
people
7:32
in
7:33
Central
7:33
park
7:34
in
7:34
New
7:34
York
7:34
in
7:35
1982
7:36
on
7:36
the
7:36
freeze
7:36
move,
7:37
freeze.
7:38
A
7:38
number
7:38
of
7:38
nuclear
7:39
weapons.
7:40
Well,
7:40
the
7:40
Pentagon
7:41
and
7:41
the
7:42
Congress
7:42
said,
7:42
no
7:43
way,
7:43
we
7:43
have
7:43
a
7:44
gap
7:44
with
7:44
Russia,
7:45
we
7:45
gotta
7:45
keep
7:45
up.
7:46
So
7:46
we
7:47
kept
7:47
going.
7:47
And
7:48
now
7:48
we
7:48
have.
7:48
Well,
7:49
we
7:49
have
7:49
a
7:49
lot
7:49
of
7:49
nuclear
7:49
weapons.
7:50
As
7:50
it
7:51
turned
7:51
out,
7:51
the
7:51
world
7:52
had
7:52
70
7:52
to
7:52
80,000
7:53
nuclear
7:54
weapons,
7:54
Russia
7:55
and
7:55
the
7:55
United
7:55
States.
7:56
And
7:56
now
7:56
we're
7:56
down
7:56
to
7:57
a
7:57
mere
7:57
12,000.
7:58
But
7:58
it
7:59
only
7:59
takes.
7:59
It
8:00
doesn't
8:00
take
8:00
very
8:00
many
8:01
to
8:01
kill
8:01
millions
8:02
of
8:02
people.
8:03
And
8:03
the
8:04
key
8:04
here
8:04
is
8:05
fear.
8:06
The
8:06
fear
8:07
of
8:08
China,
8:08
the
8:08
fear
8:08
of
8:09
Russia,
8:09
the
8:09
fear
8:09
of
8:10
North
8:10
Korea,
8:11
the
8:11
fear
8:11
of
8:11
the
8:11
Iranians
8:12
is
8:13
so
8:13
strong
8:14
that
8:15
whatever
8:15
the
8:16
people
8:16
want,
8:17
these
8:18
weapons
8:18
systems,
8:19
they
8:19
seem
8:19
to
8:19
get
8:19
them.
8:20
So.
8:21
And
8:21
you
8:21
have
8:22
addition
8:22
to
8:22
the
8:22
fear
8:23
that
8:23
if
8:23
we
8:24
don't
8:24
have
8:24
a
8:24
lot
8:25
of
8:25
nuclear
8:25
weapons,
8:26
then
8:26
that
8:26
we'll
8:26
be
8:27
bombed
8:27
if
8:28
we
8:28
don't
8:28
build
8:28
as
8:29
we're
8:29
doing
8:29
now.
8:29
We're
8:30
rebuilding.
8:31
Our
8:31
intercontinental
8:32
ballistic
8:32
missiles
8:33
cost
8:33
hundreds
8:34
of
8:34
billions.
8:34
We're
8:35
building
8:35
new
8:36
submarines
8:36
for
8:37
delivering
8:37
nuclear
8:38
weapons.
8:38
We're
8:38
getting
8:39
a
8:39
new
8:39
bomber.
8:40
The
8:40
whole
8:41
nuclear
8:41
framework,
8:42
the
8:42
infrastructure,
8:43
it's
8:44
all
8:44
being
8:44
redone.
8:45
It
8:45
cost
8:45
about
8:46
2
8:46
trillion.
8:47
It'll
8:47
take
8:47
about
8:48
30
8:48
years.
8:49
So
8:49
we're
8:49
embarking
8:50
upon
8:50
that
8:50
and
8:51
we
8:51
want
8:51
to
8:51
win,
8:52
we
8:52
want
8:52
to
8:53
beat
8:53
the
8:54
others,
8:54
mostly
8:55
China,
8:55
of
8:55
course.
8:56
China
8:56
is
8:56
building
8:57
up
8:57
theirs
8:57
at
8:57
the
8:57
same
8:58
time.
8:58
We
8:58
don't
8:59
control
8:59
them,
8:59
they
8:59
don't
8:59
control
9:00
us
9:00
in
9:01
the
9:01
middle
9:01
of
9:01
all
9:01
that.
9:02
So
9:02
you
9:02
have
9:02
this
9:02
fear
9:03
and
9:03
you
9:03
have
9:04
difference.
9:04
We're
9:05
democratic.
9:07
Under
9:07
Trump,
9:08
it's
9:08
not
9:08
clear
9:08
what
9:08
we
9:08
are,
9:09
but
9:09
China's
9:10
different.
9:10
And
9:10
China
9:11
wants
9:11
to
9:11
dominate,
9:12
but
9:13
we
9:14
don't
9:14
think
9:14
we
9:14
dominate.
9:15
We
9:15
just
9:15
think
9:15
the
9:15
free
9:15
world
9:16
is
9:16
there
9:16
and
9:16
we're
9:16
trying
9:17
to
9:17
help
9:17
them.
9:17
So
9:17
we
9:18
have
9:18
these
9:18
great
9:18
differences,
9:19
but
9:19
not
9:19
only
9:20
the
9:20
ideas,
9:21
but
9:21
you
9:22
have
9:22
this
9:22
money
9:23
machine,
9:23
the
9:24
Pentagon.
9:24
There's
9:24
a
9:25
recent
9:25
book
9:26
called
9:26
the
9:26
Trillion
9:27
Dollar
9:27
War
9:28
Machine.
9:29
Trillion
9:29
Dollar
9:29
war
9:29
Machine.
9:30
That's
9:30
what
9:30
it
9:30
is.
9:31
The
9:31
Pentagon
9:31
budget
9:32
is
9:32
about
9:33
920
9:33
billion,
9:34
and
9:34
next
9:35
year
9:35
it's
9:35
going
9:35
to
9:35
a
9:36
trillion.
9:37
First
9:37
time,
9:37
a
9:37
trillion.
9:38
And
9:39
America
9:39
is
9:39
selling
9:40
40%
9:40
of
9:40
the
9:41
arms
9:41
in
9:41
the
9:41
world.
9:42
That's
9:42
armaments.
9:43
So
9:44
you
9:44
have
9:44
the.
9:44
And
9:44
people
9:44
are
9:45
making
9:45
money.
9:46
If
9:46
you
9:46
look
9:46
at
9:47
Gaza
9:47
and
9:47
you
9:48
look
9:48
at
9:48
all
9:48
those
9:49
that
9:49
suffering,
9:49
all
9:50
those
9:50
people
9:50
dying,
9:51
they're
9:51
getting
9:52
hit
9:52
with
9:52
metal
9:53
of
9:53
some
9:53
kind,
9:53
some
9:54
kind
9:54
of
9:54
weaponry,
9:55
a
9:55
lot
9:55
of
9:55
that
9:56
is
9:56
paid
9:56
for,
9:57
if
9:57
not
9:57
built
9:58
in
9:58
America.
9:59
And
9:59
people
10:00
are
10:00
getting
10:00
a
10:00
profit.
10:01
Raytheon,
10:01
Boeing,
10:02
General
10:03
Dynamics,
10:04
they're
10:04
making
10:04
money,
10:05
big
10:05
money,
10:05
and
10:06
they're
10:06
going
10:06
to
10:06
make
10:06
more.
10:07
As
10:07
long
10:07
as
10:08
the
10:08
arms
10:09
race
10:09
continues,
10:10
there's
10:10
a
10:10
big
10:11
payoff.
10:11
So
10:12
you
10:12
got
10:12
greed
10:13
and
10:13
you
10:13
got
10:14
fear,
10:14
all
10:15
working
10:15
toward
10:16
a
10:16
goal
10:17
of
10:17
more
10:17
armaments.
10:18
But
10:18
the
10:18
trouble
10:19
is,
10:19
as
10:19
you
10:20
intensify
10:21
your
10:22
armament,
10:22
you
10:22
engender
10:23
not
10:24
stability
10:25
and
10:25
confidence,
10:25
but
10:26
you
10:26
engender
10:26
fear.
10:27
So
10:27
the
10:28
other
10:28
side,
10:28
they
10:29
do
10:29
the
10:29
same
10:29
damn
10:29
thing.
10:30
And
10:30
as
10:30
they
10:31
do
10:31
that,
10:31
then
10:32
we
10:32
respond.
10:33
So
10:33
you
10:33
have
10:33
this,
10:34
this
10:35
addictive
10:35
process
10:36
of
10:36
escalating
10:38
armaments
10:39
that
10:39
instead
10:39
of
10:40
making
10:40
us
10:41
more
10:42
stable,
10:42
more
10:42
secure,
10:43
does
10:43
the
10:43
opposite.
10:44
On
10:44
the
10:45
other
10:45
hand,
10:45
we've
10:46
been
10:46
around
10:46
since
10:47
Rashima,
10:48
Nagasaki.
10:49
No,
10:49
no
10:49
nuclear
10:50
bomb
10:50
has
10:50
been
10:51
used
10:51
in
10:51
anger
10:52
since
10:52
then.
10:52
We've
10:53
had
10:53
a
10:53
lot
10:53
of
10:53
experiment,
10:54
you
10:55
know,
10:55
tests,
10:55
but
10:56
no
10:56
bombing.
10:57
So
10:57
people
10:57
say
10:58
that's
10:58
because
10:59
we
10:59
have
10:59
our
10:59
weapons.
11:00
And
11:00
to
11:00
maintain
11:01
this
11:01
80
11:02
years
11:02
of
11:02
no
11:03
nuclear
11:04
use,
11:04
we
11:04
got
11:05
to
11:05
keep
11:05
building
11:05
those
11:05
weapons.
11:06
And
11:06
you
11:07
can't
11:07
prove
11:07
it.
11:07
It's
11:08
hard
11:08
logic.
11:09
You
11:09
can
11:09
question
11:09
it,
11:10
but
11:10
there
11:11
we
11:11
are.
11:11
And
11:12
so
11:12
not
11:12
only
11:13
do
11:13
you
11:13
have
11:13
a
11:13
logic,
11:14
the
11:14
nuclear
11:15
logic,
11:15
thinking
11:15
the
11:16
unthinkable,
11:17
theorists
11:17
like
11:17
Herman
11:18
Kahn,
11:19
Kissinger
11:20
in
11:20
his
11:20
early
11:20
days
11:21
and
11:21
other
11:22
people
11:22
have
11:23
a
11:23
whole
11:23
theory
11:23
of
11:24
deterrence,
11:25
very
11:25
sophisticated,
11:26
hard
11:26
to
11:27
follow
11:27
through
11:27
all
11:28
these
11:28
weapons
11:28
systems.
11:29
Are
11:29
we
11:29
ahead?
11:29
Are
11:30
they
11:30
ahead?
11:30
Is
11:30
there
11:30
a
11:31
window
11:31
of
11:31
vulnerability?
11:32
What?
11:32
Okay,
11:33
that's
11:33
one
11:33
level.
11:33
And
11:34
then
11:34
underneath
11:34
it
11:35
you
11:35
have
11:35
people
11:35
who
11:35
make
11:36
real
11:36
money.
11:37
I'll
11:37
give
11:37
you
11:37
an
11:37
example.
11:38
There's
11:38
something
11:39
called
11:39
the
11:39
ICBM
11:40
Caucus.
11:41
That's
11:41
a
11:42
caucus
11:42
of
11:43
representatives
11:44
in
11:44
Congress,
11:45
the
11:45
House
11:45
and
11:45
the
11:46
Senate,
11:46
Representatives
11:47
from
11:47
North
11:48
Dakota,
11:48
from
11:49
Wyoming,
11:50
from
11:50
Montana,
11:51
where
11:51
they
11:52
have
11:52
ICBM
11:53
emplacements.
11:54
And
11:54
they
11:55
are
11:55
dedicated
11:56
to
11:56
maintaining
11:57
the
11:58
ICBM
11:59
force
11:59
and
12:00
make
12:00
sure
12:00
that
12:00
it
12:00
grows
12:01
and
12:01
never
12:01
is
12:02
taken
12:02
away.
12:03
Because
12:03
that's
12:03
money.
12:04
It's
12:04
like
12:04
the
12:04
communities
12:05
are
12:05
like
12:05
prisons
12:06
built
12:06
in
12:06
their
12:07
community.
12:07
It's
12:07
jobs,
12:08
it's
12:08
money,
12:09
it's
12:09
economic
12:10
activity.
12:11
So
12:11
that
12:11
is
12:12
a
12:12
very
12:12
powerful
12:13
force.
12:14
And
12:14
the
12:15
ICBMs,
12:16
Bill
12:16
Perry
12:17
says
12:17
we
12:17
don't
12:17
need
12:17
it.
12:18
And
12:18
they're
12:18
dangerous
12:19
because
12:19
they're
12:20
fixed
12:20
in
12:20
a
12:21
location.
12:21
The
12:22
Russians
12:22
and
12:22
the
12:23
Chinese
12:23
know
12:23
where
12:23
they
12:23
are
12:24
and
12:24
they
12:24
can
12:24
take
12:25
them
12:25
out
12:25
if
12:25
they
12:26
launch
12:26
their
12:26
missile.
12:27
And
12:27
all
12:27
we
12:28
can
12:28
do
12:28
to
12:29
not
12:29
have
12:29
them
12:30
taken
12:30
out
12:30
is
12:31
launch
12:31
on
12:32
the
12:32
warning.
12:32
But
12:33
the
12:33
warning
12:33
may
12:33
be
12:34
false
12:34
because
12:35
we've
12:35
had
12:35
mistaken
12:35
warnings
12:36
in
12:36
the
12:37
past.
12:37
So
12:37
the
12:38
launch
12:38
on
12:38
warning,
12:39
which
12:39
is
12:39
inherent
12:40
in
12:40
the
12:40
international
12:42
Intercontinental
12:43
ballistic
12:43
missile
12:44
icbm,
12:44
it's
12:45
inherited,
12:46
it's
12:46
bad,
12:46
so
12:47
we
12:47
ought
12:47
to
12:47
just
12:47
get
12:47
rid
12:48
of
12:48
it.
12:48
And
12:48
people
12:49
high
12:49
up.
12:49
I've
12:49
talked
12:50
to
12:50
people
12:50
who've
12:51
been
12:51
high
12:51
up
12:52
in
12:52
the
12:52
Pentagon
12:53
and
12:53
they
12:53
admit
12:53
that.
12:54
They
12:54
say
12:54
politically
12:55
we
12:55
can't
12:56
do
12:56
anything
12:56
about
12:56
it.
12:57
And
12:57
this
12:58
organization
12:59
of
13:00
congressmen
13:00
and
13:01
the
13:01
money
13:01
they
13:01
get
13:02
from
13:02
these
13:02
companies
13:03
and
13:03
the
13:03
investments
13:04
these
13:04
companies
13:05
make
13:05
in
13:05
their
13:06
local
13:06
community,
13:07
the
13:07
Chamber
13:07
of
13:08
Commerce,
13:08
the
13:08
Rotary
13:09
Club,
13:09
investment,
13:10
the
13:10
Boys
13:10
Club,
13:11
all
13:11
that
13:12
is
13:12
a
13:12
interconnected
13:14
infrastructure
13:15
of
13:16
maintaining
13:16
and
13:17
enhancing
13:18
Just
13:18
the
13:18
ICBMs.
13:19
And
13:20
you
13:20
can
13:20
talk
13:20
about
13:20
submarines
13:21
and
13:21
all
13:21
the
13:21
rest
13:21
of
13:21
them.
13:22
So
13:22
we're.
13:22
We're
13:23
caught.
13:23
We're
13:23
not
13:23
talking
13:24
ideas
13:25
or
13:25
rhetoric.
13:26
We're
13:26
talking
13:27
jobs,
13:27
dollars
13:28
and
13:28
cents,
13:29
profits
13:29
by
13:30
powerful
13:30
people
13:31
while
13:31
propagandists,
13:32
lobbyists
13:33
and
13:33
lawyers.
13:34
And
13:34
that
13:34
is.
13:35
And
13:35
by
13:35
the
13:35
way,
13:35
you
13:36
don't
13:36
hear
13:36
much
13:36
about
13:36
it.
13:37
You
13:37
don't
13:37
pick
13:37
up
13:37
the
13:37
New
13:37
York
13:38
Times.
13:38
You
13:38
hear
13:39
about
13:39
the
13:39
description
13:40
of
13:40
the
13:40
flow
13:41
of
13:41
money,
13:41
how
13:41
much
13:42
Boeing
13:43
is
13:43
making
13:44
on
13:44
the
13:44
F35,
13:45
even
13:46
though
13:46
it's
13:46
over
13:46
the
13:46
IACBM
13:47
not
13:47
called
13:48
the
13:48
Sentinel.
13:48
It's
13:48
already
13:49
80
13:49
billion
13:49
over
13:50
budget
13:50
or
13:50
something.
13:51
80%.
13:52
So
13:52
these
13:53
are
13:53
dilemmas
13:54
and
13:54
this
13:55
is
13:55
the
13:55
truth.
13:56
But
13:56
that
13:56
truth
13:57
is
13:57
not
13:57
very
13:58
empowering.
13:58
So
13:59
after
13:59
you
13:59
hear
13:59
all
13:59
that,
14:00
what
14:00
the
14:00
hell
14:00
do
14:01
you
14:01
do?
14:01
So
14:02
then
14:02
a
14:02
very
14:03
logical
14:03
response
14:04
is
14:04
to
14:04
shut
14:04
up.
14:05
And
14:05
that's
14:05
basically
14:06
what
14:06
we're
14:06
doing.
14:07
We're
14:07
not
14:07
talking
14:07
about
14:08
it.
14:08
And
14:08
so
14:09
that's
14:09
the
14:09
dilemma.
14:10
To
14:10
talk
14:10
about
14:11
it
14:11
is
14:11
to
14:11
turn
14:12
people
14:12
off.
14:13
But
14:13
not
14:13
to
14:13
talk
14:13
about
14:14
it
14:14
is
14:14
to
14:14
be
14:15
complicit
14:15
in
14:16
a
14:16
very
14:16
dangerous
14:17
tendency
14:18
that
14:19
is
14:19
characterizing
14:20
our
14:20
country
14:20
and
14:21
the
14:21
countries
14:21
elsewhere.
14:22
So
14:23
there
14:23
we
14:23
are.
14:23
And
14:24
you
14:24
may
14:24
conclude,
14:25
well,
14:25
I
14:25
think
14:25
I'm
14:26
just
14:26
going
14:26
to
14:26
take
14:26
care
14:26
of
14:26
my
14:27
own
14:27
transformation.
14:28
We'll
14:28
have
14:28
to
14:28
let
14:28
the
14:29
world
14:29
deal
14:29
with
14:30
it
14:30
as
14:30
best
14:31
they
14:31
can.
14:31
But
14:32
things
14:32
will
14:32
happen.
14:33
There
14:33
are
14:33
organizations
14:34
you
14:34
can
14:34
be
14:34
a
14:34
part
14:34
of.
14:35
I
14:35
think
14:35
the
14:35
Bulletin
14:36
of
14:36
Atomic
14:36
Scientists
14:37
is
14:37
doing
14:37
its
14:38
part.
14:38
We
14:38
have
14:38
the
14:39
Arms
14:39
Control
14:39
Agency,
14:40
we
14:40
have
14:41
the
14:41
Nuclear
14:41
Threat
14:41
Initiative.
14:42
We
14:42
have
14:43
a
14:43
number
14:43
of
14:43
people
14:44
working.
14:44
But
14:45
I
14:45
can
14:45
tell
14:45
you
14:45
at
14:45
this
14:46
point
14:46
the
14:47
pro
14:48
military,
14:48
pro
14:49
escalation
14:50
is
14:51
more
14:51
powerful
14:52
and
14:53
how
14:53
that
14:53
will
14:53
change
14:54
and
14:54
how
14:55
Trump
14:55
plays
14:55
into
14:55
that,
14:56
how
14:56
the
14:56
elections
14:57
complicated.
14:58
But
14:58
these
14:59
are
14:59
worth
15:00
thinking
15:00
about.
15:01
I
15:01
do
15:01
submit
15:01
though
15:02
that
15:02
there
15:02
are
15:03
relatively
15:03
limited
15:04
number
15:04
of
15:04
people
15:04
that
15:04
can
15:05
make
15:05
a
15:05
difference.
15:06
Now
15:06
having
15:07
said
15:07
all
15:07
that,
15:07
we
15:08
know
15:08
From
15:08
Greta,
15:09
a
15:09
12
15:09
year
15:09
old
15:10
was
15:10
able
15:10
to
15:10
make
15:11
a
15:11
big
15:11
impact.
15:12
So
15:12
if
15:12
somebody
15:13
can
15:13
sense
15:14
this,
15:14
can
15:15
really
15:15
take
15:15
it
15:16
into
15:16
themselves
15:16
and
15:16
feel
15:17
it
15:17
and
15:17
get
15:17
enough
15:18
internal
15:19
power,
15:20
they
15:20
can
15:21
excite
15:21
a
15:22
movement
15:22
and
15:22
effort.
15:23
So
15:23
we're
15:23
kind
15:23
of
15:24
waiting
15:24
for
15:24
a
15:24
Greta
15:25
or
15:25
Martin
15:25
Luther
15:26
King.
15:27
We've
15:27
had
15:27
some
15:27
of
15:27
those
15:27
people
15:28
like
15:28
Dan
15:28
Ellsberg,
15:29
but
15:29
their
15:30
impact
15:30
is
15:31
relatively
15:31
limited.
15:32
So
15:32
that's
15:33
kind
15:33
of
15:33
the
15:33
brutal
15:34
truth
15:35
from
15:35
the
15:35
front.
15:36
And
15:36
I
15:36
can
15:36
tell
15:37
you
15:37
that's
15:38
the
15:38
way
15:38
it
15:38
is.
15:39
You
15:39
know,
15:39
I'm
15:40
not
15:40
discouraged.
15:41
I
15:41
tell
15:41
you,
15:41
I
15:42
get
15:42
up
15:42
every
15:42
day.
15:42
It's
15:43
fantastic
15:44
to
15:44
be
15:44
alive
15:45
and
15:45
we
15:45
can
15:46
work
15:46
on
15:46
our
15:46
own
15:47
little
15:47
lives.
15:47
And
15:48
those
15:48
little
15:48
lives
15:48
is
15:49
all
15:49
we
15:49
got.
15:49
So
15:50
that's
15:50
good.
15:50
But
15:51
at
15:51
the
15:51
same
15:51
time,
15:51
I
15:52
think
15:52
you
15:52
gotta
15:52
keep
15:53
your
15:53
eyes
15:53
open
15:54
and
15:54
we
15:54
should
15:54
not
15:55
sleep
15:56
in
15:56
the
15:56
delusion
15:57
of
15:58
that
15:58
things
15:58
are
15:58
better
15:58
than
15:59
they
15:59
are.
15:59
They're
16:00
good
16:00
in
16:00
many
16:00
respects,
16:01
but
16:01
they're
16:02
horrible
16:02
in
16:03
other
16:03
respects.
16:04
That's
16:04
just
16:04
the
16:04
way
16:04
it
16:05
is.
16:05
Yeah.
16:06
I'm
16:06
reminded
16:06
of
16:06
the
16:07
line
16:07
from,
16:08
I
16:08
think
16:08
where
16:08
it
16:08
came
16:09
from,
16:09
it
16:09
was
16:09
the
16:09
best
16:10
of
16:10
times,
16:10
it
16:10
was
16:10
the
16:10
worst
16:11
of
16:11
times.
16:12
And
16:12
I
16:12
appreciate
16:13
your
16:13
pointing
16:14
out
16:14
the
16:14
stark
16:15
realities
16:15
we're
16:16
up
16:16
against.
16:16
And
16:16
yes,
16:17
it's
16:17
nice
16:17
to
16:17
have
16:17
these
16:18
ideas
16:19
and
16:19
it's
16:19
very
16:20
important
16:20
we
16:20
do
16:21
something
16:22
and
16:22
it's
16:22
also
16:23
very
16:23
important
16:23
we
16:23
realize
16:24
exactly
16:25
just
16:26
how
16:26
powerful
16:26
the
16:27
juggernaut
16:27
we're
16:27
up
16:28
against
16:28
is?
16:29
And
16:29
I
16:29
come
16:29
back
16:30
to
16:30
three
16:31
questions
16:31
I
16:31
often
16:32
come
16:32
back
16:32
to
16:32
in
16:33
the
16:33
face
16:33
of
16:33
this
16:33
kind
16:34
of
16:34
thing
16:34
is
16:35
given
16:35
these
16:36
enormous
16:36
challenges
16:37
we're
16:37
facing,
16:37
the
16:38
question
16:38
that
16:38
comes
16:38
up
16:38
for
16:39
all
16:39
of
16:39
us
16:39
is
16:40
what
16:40
can
16:40
I
16:40
do?
16:41
But
16:42
below
16:42
that
16:43
is
16:43
another
16:43
question.
16:44
You
16:45
know,
16:45
there's
16:45
so
16:45
many
16:46
challenges,
16:47
I
16:47
can't
16:47
work
16:48
on
16:48
all
16:48
of
16:48
them.
16:49
So
16:49
what
16:49
is
16:50
what
16:50
calls
16:51
me,
16:51
what
16:51
issue,
16:52
what
16:52
suffering
16:53
speaks
16:53
to
16:53
me
16:53
and
16:53
what
16:54
actually,
16:55
what
16:55
area
16:55
of
16:55
focus
16:56
really
16:57
calls
16:57
to
16:57
me
16:57
and
16:58
is
16:58
where
16:59
I
16:59
want
16:59
to
16:59
turn
16:59
my
16:59
attention?
17:00
And
17:01
then
17:01
third
17:01
one
17:01
is,
17:02
what's
17:02
the
17:02
most
17:02
strategic
17:03
thing
17:03
I
17:03
can
17:03
do
17:04
given
17:04
my
17:05
situation,
17:05
my
17:06
connections,
17:06
et
17:07
cetera?
17:08
What,
17:08
how
17:08
can
17:08
I
17:08
trim
17:09
tab
17:09
most
17:10
effectively?
17:10
How
17:10
can
17:11
I
17:11
leverage
17:12
myself?
17:12
To
17:13
quote
17:13
Archimedes,
17:14
give
17:14
me
17:15
a
17:15
lever
17:15
long
17:15
enough
17:16
and
17:16
a
17:16
place
17:16
to
17:16
stand
17:16
and
17:17
I'll
17:17
move
17:17
the
17:17
earth.
17:17
Well,
17:18
okay,
17:19
how
17:19
can
17:19
I,
17:19
in
17:19
my
17:20
little
17:20
way,
17:20
move
17:20
the
17:21
earth
17:21
in
17:21
some
17:21
small
17:22
way
17:23
and
17:23
make
17:23
a
17:23
contribution?
17:24
And
17:24
these
17:25
are
17:25
cons.
17:26
It's
17:26
not
17:26
like
17:26
it's
17:27
a.
17:27
Oh,
17:27
that's
17:28
the
17:28
answer.
17:28
It's
17:29
like
17:30
these
17:30
are
17:30
things
17:31
to
17:31
questions
17:31
to
17:32
really
17:32
sit
17:32
with
17:32
over
17:33
time
17:34
and
17:35
feel
17:35
into
17:35
and
17:36
allow
17:36
ourselves
17:37
to
17:37
first
17:38
to
17:38
appreciate
17:38
the
17:39
enormity
17:39
and
17:40
the
17:40
complexity
17:40
and
17:41
urgency
17:41
of
17:41
the
17:41
issue
17:42
and
17:42
the
17:43
challenge
17:43
of
17:43
effective
17:44
responses.
17:44
And
17:45
still,
17:46
still
17:47
to
17:49
look,
17:49
what
17:50
can
17:50
I
17:50
do?
17:51
Yeah,
17:51
well,
17:52
look,
17:52
you
17:52
can't.
17:53
By
17:53
doing
17:54
something,
17:54
whether
17:54
working
17:55
on
17:55
the
17:55
nuclear
17:56
matter,
17:56
there
17:56
are
17:57
groups
17:57
that
17:58
are
17:58
fighting
17:58
the
17:59
nuclear
17:59
buildup
18:00
or
18:00
in
18:00
climate,
18:01
there
18:01
are
18:01
even
18:01
many
18:02
more
18:02
groups
18:03
fighting
18:03
for
18:04
stabilizing
18:04
the
18:05
climate,
18:05
reducing
18:06
and
18:06
eliminating
18:07
carbon
18:07
emissions.
18:08
And
18:08
then
18:08
not
18:08
so
18:09
much
18:09
the
18:10
whole
18:10
bio
18:11
business,
18:11
the
18:11
bio
18:12
threat,
18:12
any
18:13
of
18:13
these
18:13
things,
18:14
if
18:14
efforts
18:15
are
18:15
made
18:15
and
18:16
become
18:16
effective
18:17
to
18:17
slow
18:18
it
18:18
down,
18:18
that
18:19
indicates
18:19
there's
18:20
a
18:20
social,
18:21
political
18:21
recognition
18:22
of
18:23
danger.
18:23
And
18:23
that
18:24
is
18:24
very
18:24
important
18:25
to
18:25
me.
18:25
I
18:26
think
18:26
you
18:26
shouldn't
18:27
think
18:27
that
18:28
you
18:28
don't
18:28
have
18:28
impact
18:29
if
18:29
you
18:29
organize
18:30
just
18:30
where
18:30
you
18:31
are
18:31
in
18:31
the
18:31
Bay
18:32
Area.
18:32
And
18:32
that
18:33
grows
18:34
through
18:34
the
18:34
Internet,
18:35
through
18:35
the
18:36
connection
18:36
that
18:36
people
18:36
have,
18:37
that
18:37
will
18:38
be
18:38
taken
18:38
up
18:38
in
18:38
other
18:39
places
18:40
in
18:40
New
18:40
York,
18:41
in
18:41
Washington
18:42
and
18:43
throughout
18:43
the
18:43
world.
18:44
So
18:44
because
18:45
with
18:45
the
18:45
Internet,
18:45
so
18:46
it's
18:46
doing
18:46
what
18:47
you
18:47
can,
18:48
trusting
18:49
that
18:49
there
18:49
will
18:49
be
18:50
a
18:50
spread
18:51
of
18:51
these
18:51
idea.
18:52
We're
18:52
on
18:53
a
18:53
collision
18:53
course.
18:54
We're
18:54
on
18:54
a,
18:54
on
18:55
a
18:55
trajectory
18:56
that
18:56
I
18:56
don't
18:57
think,
18:57
as
18:57
a
18:58
lot
18:58
of
18:58
other
18:58
people
18:58
think,
18:59
cannot
18:59
end
18:59
well.
19:00
So
19:00
we're
19:00
on
19:00
the,
19:01
we
19:01
have
19:01
to
19:01
turn
19:02
and
19:02
everybody
19:03
can
19:03
contribute
19:04
in
19:04
some
19:04
minute
19:05
way
19:05
to
19:06
that
19:06
turn.
19:06
It's
19:07
not
19:07
just
19:07
you,
19:08
but
19:08
as
19:08
you
19:09
gather
19:09
with
19:09
others,
19:10
that
19:10
then
19:11
ripples
19:11
out,
19:12
the
19:12
communication
19:13
is
19:13
made
19:13
and
19:14
other
19:14
people
19:14
are
19:15
Inspired
19:15
and
19:15
you
19:15
never
19:16
know
19:16
who
19:16
will
19:17
have
19:17
the
19:17
energy.
19:18
It's
19:18
amazing
19:18
how
19:19
people
19:19
who
19:21
Dennis
19:21
Hayes
19:22
started
19:22
Earth
19:22
Day
19:23
1970
19:24
just
19:24
out
19:24
of
19:25
nowhere
19:25
we
19:25
got
19:25
an
19:25
Earth
19:26
Day.
19:26
So
19:27
and
19:27
Greta
19:27
just
19:28
said
19:28
started
19:28
talking
19:29
about
19:29
it
19:29
and
19:29
for
19:29
a
19:29
few
19:30
years
19:30
ready
19:30
to
19:30
big
19:31
impact.
19:32
So
19:32
you
19:33
can't
19:33
tell
19:33
depending
19:34
on
19:34
where
19:34
you
19:34
are.
19:35
I
19:35
believe
19:36
you
19:36
know,
19:37
joining
19:37
the
19:37
Bulletin
19:38
of
19:38
Atomic
19:38
Scientists
19:39
join
19:39
supporting
19:40
Greenpeace,
19:41
the
19:41
Sierra
19:41
Club.
19:42
There
19:42
are
19:43
things
19:44
you
19:44
can
19:44
do
19:45
and
19:45
in
19:45
following
19:46
activities
19:47
through
19:47
the
19:47
Internet.
19:48
It's
19:48
small.
19:49
So
19:49
you
19:49
know
19:50
that.
19:50
But
19:50
that's
19:51
what
19:51
being
19:51
a
19:51
human
19:52
being
19:52
is.
19:52
But
19:53
we
19:53
don't
19:53
know
19:54
how
19:54
that
19:54
smallness
19:55
can
19:56
be
19:56
amplified
19:57
by
19:57
the
19:57
shared
19:58
sense
19:58
that
19:59
we
19:59
need
19:59
to
19:59
change,
20:00
we
20:00
need
20:01
to
20:01
make
20:01
a
20:01
turn.
20:02
And
20:02
I
20:03
certainly
20:03
think
20:03
that's
20:03
possible.
20:04
We
20:04
don't
20:05
know.
20:05
And
20:05
when
20:05
I
20:05
asked
20:06
Bill
20:06
Perry
20:06
what
20:07
gives
20:07
you
20:07
optimism
20:08
and
20:09
I
20:09
think
20:09
the
20:09
answer
20:10
is
20:10
worth
20:11
on
20:11
he
20:11
said
20:12
the
20:12
future
20:13
is
20:13
unknowable,
20:15
unknown.
20:16
So
20:16
we
20:16
don't
20:17
know
20:17
is
20:17
it
20:17
bad
20:18
or
20:18
is
20:18
it
20:19
good?
20:19
We
20:19
don't
20:20
know.
20:20
So
20:20
don't
20:21
derive
20:21
a
20:21
conclusion
20:22
from
20:22
something
20:23
you
20:23
don't
20:23
know.
20:24
So
20:24
that
20:24
then
20:25
emphasizes
20:26
present
20:26
moment
20:27
and
20:27
what
20:27
is
20:28
within
20:28
our
20:28
grasp
20:29
to
20:29
do
20:29
the
20:29
best
20:30
we
20:30
can.
20:31
And
20:32
Jerry,
20:32
what
20:32
would
20:32
you
20:32
recommend
20:33
to
20:33
a
20:33
young
20:33
person
20:34
growing
20:35
up
20:35
into
20:35
this
20:35
world?
20:36
You
20:37
know,
20:37
what
20:37
would
20:37
you.
20:39
I
20:39
don't
20:39
know
20:39
as
20:40
a
20:40
general.
20:40
I
20:41
don't
20:41
know
20:41
if
20:41
I
20:41
have
20:42
any
20:42
general
20:42
recommendations,
20:43
but
20:43
that's
20:44
so
20:44
broad.
20:45
You
20:45
know
20:45
what
20:46
people's.
20:46
We
20:46
all
20:47
have
20:47
to
20:47
live
20:47
our
20:47
lives,
20:48
you
20:48
know,
20:48
I
20:48
don't
20:48
know.
20:49
I
20:49
guess
20:50
the
20:50
question
20:50
is,
20:50
given
20:51
this,
20:51
how
20:51
do
20:51
we.
20:51
How
20:52
do
20:52
we
20:52
live
20:52
our
20:52
lives?
20:52
You
20:53
know,
20:53
how
20:53
do
20:53
we
20:53
put
20:53
the
20:53
next
20:54
foot?
20:54
Well,
20:54
I
20:54
would
20:54
recommend
20:56
having
20:56
a
20:56
father
20:57
who
20:57
gets
20:57
elected
20:57
governor
20:58
because
20:58
that
20:59
really
20:59
helps
20:59
you
21:00
become
21:00
governor
21:00
yourself.
21:01
Yeah.
21:02
It's
21:02
also
21:03
nice
21:03
to
21:03
have
21:03
a
21:04
great
21:04
grandfather
21:05
that
21:05
starts
21:06
a
21:06
ranch
21:07
and
21:08
gives
21:08
it
21:08
to
21:08
a
21:09
son
21:09
and
21:09
his
21:09
son
21:09
doesn't
21:10
have
21:10
any
21:10
children.
21:11
So
21:11
then
21:11
my
21:12
father
21:12
picks
21:12
it
21:12
up
21:13
with
21:13
his
21:13
brother
21:13
and
21:13
so
21:13
there
21:14
I
21:14
am.
21:14
So
21:15
there's
21:15
a
21:15
lot
21:15
of
21:15
stuff
21:16
that
21:16
we
21:16
don't
21:17
control.
21:18
And
21:18
so
21:18
it's
21:18
hard.
21:19
I
21:19
don't
21:19
think
21:19
there
21:19
is
21:20
a
21:20
general
21:20
recommendation.
21:22
Life
21:22
is
21:22
too.
21:23
Various
21:23
people
21:24
become
21:24
carpenters,
21:25
they
21:25
become
21:26
coders,
21:27
they
21:27
become
21:28
college
21:28
students.
21:29
The
21:30
range
21:30
is
21:30
just,
21:31
you
21:32
know,
21:32
unlimited.
21:33
So
21:33
I
21:33
think
21:33
we
21:33
have
21:34
to
21:34
narrow
21:35
cast
21:35
a
21:35
little
21:35
bit.
21:36
You
21:36
have
21:36
to.
21:36
If
21:36
someone
21:37
came
21:37
to
21:37
me
21:37
and
21:37
they
21:38
had
21:38
a
21:38
specific
21:39
question,
21:39
I
21:40
would
21:40
have
21:40
a
21:40
thought
21:41
and
21:41
I
21:41
would
21:41
give
21:41
them
21:42
recommendation.
21:43
But
21:43
as
21:43
at
21:43
a
21:44
generic
21:44
level,
21:45
I
21:45
don't
21:45
have.
21:46
I
21:46
don't
21:46
think
21:47
this.
21:47
I
21:47
can't
21:47
say
21:48
anything.
21:49
I
21:49
think
21:50
we
21:50
might
21:50
say
21:50
that
21:51
to
21:51
those
21:52
of
21:52
us
21:53
to
21:53
whom
21:53
much
21:54
has
21:54
Been
21:54
given,
21:55
much
21:55
is
21:55
required.
21:57
And
21:57
I
21:57
feel
21:58
I
21:58
had
21:58
a
21:58
very,
21:58
very.
21:59
I've
21:59
given
21:59
a
22:00
lot
22:00
in
22:00
my
22:00
life,
22:00
a
22:00
lot
22:00
of
22:00
opportunities,
22:01
and
22:01
therefore
22:02
I
22:02
tried
22:02
to
22:02
give
22:02
back.
22:03
I
22:03
think
22:03
you
22:04
had
22:05
a
22:05
very
22:06
gifted
22:07
life.
22:07
You
22:07
went
22:07
to
22:07
the
22:08
best
22:08
schools
22:08
and
22:08
you
22:09
had
22:09
a
22:09
good
22:10
father
22:10
who
22:10
was
22:10
a
22:10
politician.
22:11
And
22:12
just
22:12
from
22:13
the
22:13
outside,
22:14
it
22:14
seems
22:14
that
22:14
you
22:15
tried
22:15
to
22:15
live
22:15
your
22:15
life
22:16
in
22:17
service,
22:17
not
22:18
just
22:18
to
22:18
accumulate
22:19
stuff
22:19
and
22:20
power
22:20
and
22:21
to
22:21
sage
22:21
your
22:21
ego.
22:22
So
22:23
I
22:23
think
22:23
to
22:24
me
22:24
you're
22:25
a
22:25
noble
22:25
example
22:26
of
22:26
how
22:28
to
22:28
whom
22:28
much
22:28
has
22:29
been
22:29
given,
22:29
let's
22:29
give
22:30
back.
22:30
And
22:30
I
22:31
don't
22:31
know,
22:31
only
22:32
history
22:32
will
22:32
say
22:32
how
22:33
effective
22:33
it's
22:33
been.
22:34
But
22:34
it
22:34
certainly
22:34
seems
22:35
to
22:35
me
22:35
that
22:35
you
22:35
worked
22:36
hard
22:37
at
22:37
trying
22:37
to
22:38
do
22:38
that.
22:39
So
22:39
thank
22:40
you.
22:40
I
22:40
would
22:41
give
22:41
you
22:41
a
22:41
slightly
22:42
different
22:43
service.
22:44
I
22:44
haven't
22:45
thought
22:45
of
22:45
myself
22:45
as
22:46
living
22:47
in
22:47
service.
22:48
I
22:48
think
22:48
of
22:49
myself
22:49
as
22:49
living
22:50
in
22:50
inquiry.
22:52
And
22:52
even
22:52
when
22:53
I
22:53
joined
22:53
the
22:53
Jesuits,
22:54
my
22:55
goal
22:55
was
22:55
what
22:55
a
22:55
good
22:56
place
22:56
to
22:56
go
22:57
to
22:57
understand
22:58
what
22:58
is
22:58
God?
22:59
Where
22:59
do
22:59
you
23:00
find
23:00
God?
23:00
What's
23:01
that
23:01
all
23:01
about?
23:02
That's
23:02
an
23:02
inquiry.
23:03
That
23:03
is,
23:04
I
23:04
wasn't
23:05
going
23:05
to
23:05
Jesuits
23:06
to
23:07
save
23:07
the
23:07
world
23:07
and
23:08
that
23:08
was
23:08
part
23:08
of
23:08
it,
23:08
to
23:09
save
23:09
souls,
23:10
as
23:10
we
23:10
talked
23:10
about.
23:11
But
23:11
the
23:11
big
23:11
driver
23:13
is
23:14
the
23:14
quest
23:15
for
23:15
what
23:16
is.
23:16
For
23:16
truth.
23:17
Truth
23:18
seeking.
23:19
We
23:19
say
23:20
the
23:20
truth
23:20
will
23:21
make
23:21
you
23:21
free.
23:21
Well,
23:22
the
23:22
truth's
23:22
pretty
23:22
important.
23:23
Well,
23:23
maybe
23:24
it's
23:24
all
23:24
that's
23:25
important.
23:25
Well,
23:25
not
23:26
just
23:26
the
23:26
truth,
23:26
because
23:27
there's
23:27
charity,
23:28
there's
23:29
love,
23:29
there's
23:30
camaraderie,
23:31
there's
23:31
helping
23:32
is
23:32
doing
23:32
good.
23:33
But
23:34
primarily
23:36
my
23:36
interest
23:37
has
23:37
been,
23:38
as
23:38
I
23:38
frame
23:39
it
23:39
now,
23:39
I
23:39
probably
23:40
don't
23:40
fully
23:40
understand
23:41
certainly
23:42
what
23:42
motivates
23:42
me,
23:43
but
23:43
inquiry,
23:44
learning,
23:45
just
23:45
even
23:46
working.
23:46
I
23:46
emphasize.
23:47
I
23:48
do
23:48
have
23:48
specifics
23:49
though.
23:49
Why
23:50
did
23:50
I
23:50
get
23:50
interested
23:50
in
23:51
the
23:51
environment?
23:51
Why
23:52
did
23:52
I
23:52
emphasize
23:53
climate?
23:53
Well,
23:54
part
23:54
of
23:54
it
23:55
comes
23:55
from
23:55
why
23:55
I
23:55
went
23:55
in
23:56
the
23:56
seminary.
23:56
I
23:57
wanted
23:57
something
23:57
that's
23:57
important.
23:59
We're
23:59
sitting
23:59
around,
23:59
what
24:00
the
24:00
hell
24:00
does
24:00
life
24:00
mean?
24:01
I
24:01
had
24:01
a
24:01
sense
24:02
it
24:02
was
24:02
empty
24:03
and
24:03
meaningless
24:03
when
24:04
I
24:04
was
24:04
18.
24:05
So
24:05
what
24:05
do
24:05
you
24:05
do
24:05
in
24:06
that
24:06
case?
24:07
Well,
24:07
you
24:07
join
24:08
the
24:08
Jesuits.
24:08
That's
24:09
meaning.
24:09
And
24:10
then
24:10
the
24:10
Jesuits,
24:11
they
24:11
tell
24:12
you
24:12
you're
24:13
doing
24:13
God's
24:13
will.
24:14
If
24:14
you
24:15
follow
24:15
the
24:15
rules,
24:16
you
24:17
follow
24:17
the
24:18
commands,
24:18
the
24:19
orders
24:19
of
24:19
your
24:19
superior,
24:20
the
24:20
way
24:20
of
24:20
life,
24:21
that's
24:21
what
24:21
God
24:22
wills
24:23
for
24:23
you.
24:23
It's
24:23
an
24:24
interesting
24:24
concept.
24:25
I'd
24:25
never
24:25
heard
24:25
of
24:26
it
24:26
before.
24:26
But
24:26
you
24:27
have
24:27
God
24:28
who
24:28
becomes
24:28
man
24:29
with
24:29
Jesus
24:30
Christ.
24:30
He
24:31
starts
24:31
the
24:31
Catholic
24:32
Church.
24:32
The
24:32
Catholic
24:33
Church
24:33
authorized
24:34
the
24:34
Jesuits.
24:34
The
24:35
Jesuits
24:35
are
24:36
still
24:36
existing
24:37
400
24:37
years
24:37
later.
24:38
I
24:38
join
24:39
and
24:39
so
24:40
the
24:40
order
24:42
tells
24:42
you
24:42
how
24:43
to
24:43
live
24:44
and
24:44
then
24:44
doing
24:45
that
24:45
you're
24:46
doing
24:46
God's
24:46
will.
24:46
You
24:47
can't
24:47
do
24:47
any
24:47
better
24:47
than
24:48
that.
24:48
The
24:48
creator
24:49
of
24:49
the
24:49
universe
24:49
as
24:50
a
24:50
program.
24:51
So
24:51
that
24:51
was
24:51
a
24:52
very.
24:52
Well,
24:53
comforting.
24:53
So
24:53
that
24:54
was
24:54
a
24:54
theory.
24:54
All
24:55
right,
24:55
so
24:55
now
24:55
you.
24:56
I
24:56
leave
24:56
all
24:56
that.
24:56
Okay,
24:57
I've
24:57
take
24:58
that.
24:58
That
24:59
only
24:59
goes
24:59
so
25:00
far.
25:00
So
25:00
now
25:00
I'm
25:01
going
25:01
to
25:01
go
25:01
out
25:01
into
25:01
the
25:01
world.
25:02
Now
25:03
we're
25:03
not
25:03
in
25:03
the
25:03
world
25:03
of
25:03
theology
25:04
anymore,
25:04
we're
25:04
in
25:05
the
25:05
world
25:05
of
25:05
politics.
25:06
So
25:06
the
25:06
question
25:07
is,
25:07
what's
25:07
important?
25:08
And
25:09
when
25:09
I
25:09
read,
25:10
I
25:10
think
25:10
it
25:10
was
25:10
in
25:10
the
25:10
70s,
25:11
I
25:11
remember
25:12
reading
25:12
an
25:12
article
25:12
about
25:13
the
25:14
fragility
25:14
of
25:15
the
25:15
atmosphere
25:16
above
25:16
and
25:17
the
25:17
thin
25:17
soil
25:18
below.
25:19
I
25:19
never
25:19
thought
25:20
of
25:20
that,
25:20
the
25:21
vulnerability
25:22
and
25:22
that
25:23
that
25:23
idea
25:24
resonated
25:25
because
25:26
it
25:26
was
25:26
about
25:26
something
25:27
that
25:28
was
25:28
absolute.
25:29
This
25:29
is,
25:29
this
25:29
is
25:30
not
25:30
opinion.
25:30
This
25:31
is
25:31
not
25:31
a
25:31
Democrat,
25:32
Republican,
25:33
progressive,
25:34
unprogressive,
25:35
ice,
25:35
chocolate
25:36
or
25:36
vanilla.
25:37
This
25:37
is.
25:38
We
25:38
can
25:38
rely
25:39
on
25:39
the
25:39
fact
25:40
that
25:40
the
25:40
environment
25:41
is
25:42
there.
25:42
It
25:42
has
25:42
rules,
25:43
it
25:43
has.
25:43
We
25:43
can
25:44
cause
25:44
more
25:44
damage
25:45
or
25:45
we
25:45
can
25:45
cause
25:46
less
25:46
damage.
25:46
So
25:47
that
25:47
then
25:47
becomes
25:48
almost
25:48
theological.
25:49
It's
25:49
an
25:49
absolute,
25:50
it's
25:50
a
25:51
very
25:51
firm
25:52
foundation
25:53
and
25:53
that's
25:53
why
25:53
I'm
25:54
drawn
25:54
to
25:54
the
25:55
environment.
25:55
There's
25:55
a
25:55
lot
25:56
of
25:56
other
25:56
things,
25:56
like
25:57
in
25:57
education,
25:58
like
25:58
in
25:58
Crime
25:59
and
25:59
Punishment,
25:59
there's
26:00
a
26:00
lot
26:00
of
26:00
opinions
26:01
there.
26:01
But
26:02
you
26:02
know
26:02
that
26:03
parts
26:03
per
26:04
million
26:04
CO2
26:05
building
26:06
up
26:06
is
26:07
not
26:07
good.
26:08
And
26:08
it.
26:09
1.5%
26:10
growth
26:11
from
26:11
the
26:11
industrial
26:12
period
26:12
of
26:12
150
26:13
years
26:13
ago,
26:14
that's
26:14
not
26:14
good.
26:15
And
26:15
2%
26:16
growth
26:17
or
26:17
2
26:17
degrees
26:18
rather,
26:18
that's
26:19
bad.
26:19
And
26:19
that's
26:19
where
26:20
we're
26:20
headed.
26:20
So
26:21
that
26:21
then
26:21
becomes
26:22
something
26:23
you,
26:23
you
26:23
don't
26:23
have
26:24
to
26:24
doubt.
26:24
There's
26:25
no
26:25
agnosticism
26:26
here.
26:27
We
26:27
may
26:27
not
26:27
know
26:27
all
26:28
the
26:28
ins
26:28
and
26:28
outs
26:29
of
26:29
the
26:30
carbon
26:30
emissions,
26:31
what
26:31
they're
26:31
going
26:31
to
26:31
do,
26:32
but
26:32
we
26:32
know
26:32
it's
26:32
bad.
26:33
We
26:33
know
26:34
stopping
26:34
it
26:34
is
26:35
an
26:35
absolute
26:35
good
26:36
and
26:36
that's
26:36
why.
26:37
But
26:37
that
26:37
flows
26:38
from
26:39
inquiry,
26:39
what's
26:40
important.
26:41
And
26:41
I
26:41
do
26:41
think
26:42
respecting
26:42
our
26:43
environment
26:43
is
26:44
important.
26:44
Of
26:44
course,
26:45
same
26:45
thing
26:45
as
26:45
human
26:45
beings.
26:46
I
26:46
worked
26:47
hard
26:47
to
26:48
allow
26:48
people
26:48
who've
26:49
been
26:49
in
26:49
prison
26:49
a
26:50
long
26:50
time
26:50
to
26:51
be.
26:51
To
26:51
earn
26:51
their
26:52
release
26:53
from
26:53
a.
26:53
And
26:53
they've
26:54
been
26:54
locked
26:54
in
26:54
there
26:55
with
26:55
no
26:55
parole,
26:56
no
26:56
hope.
26:56
And
26:57
I
26:57
was
26:57
able
26:57
to
26:58
enable
26:58
5,000,
26:59
6,000
27:00
people
27:00
to
27:01
get
27:01
out.
27:01
So
27:02
those
27:02
are
27:02
all
27:02
things
27:03
I
27:03
did.
27:04
But
27:04
I
27:04
somehow
27:06
the
27:06
idea
27:07
of
27:08
giving
27:08
back
27:09
or
27:09
doing
27:09
service,
27:11
I
27:11
find
27:12
just
27:12
doing
27:12
what
27:13
I'm
27:13
doing,
27:14
that's
27:15
what
27:15
I'm
27:15
doing,
27:15
why
27:16
I'm
27:16
doing
27:16
it.
27:17
I
27:17
obviously,
27:17
I
27:18
think
27:18
this
27:18
is
27:18
what
27:18
needs
27:19
to
27:19
be
27:19
done.
27:19
What
27:19
I
27:20
can
27:20
do
27:20
is
27:21
what
27:21
I
27:21
want
27:21
to
27:21
do.
27:21
Is
27:21
what
27:22
I
27:22
should
27:22
do.
27:22
So
27:22
I
27:22
do
27:23
it.
27:23
But
27:23
putting
27:24
more
27:24
labels
27:25
of
27:25
theories
27:26
on
27:26
it.
27:26
That
27:27
then,
27:27
then
27:27
is
27:28
another
27:28
exercise
27:29
which
27:30
I'll
27:30
leave
27:30
to
27:30
you
27:30
guys.
27:32
Thanks.
27:32
Thanks
27:33
for
27:33
that.
27:33
Yeah,
27:34
that's
27:35
a
27:35
big
27:35
question.
27:36
And
27:37
clearly
27:37
inquiry
27:38
has
27:38
been
27:39
a
27:39
central
27:39
dynamic
27:40
view.
27:41
Really.
27:42
You
27:42
have
27:42
questioned
27:43
every
27:44
sacred
27:44
cow
27:46
I
27:46
can
27:46
think
27:46
of
27:47
and
27:48
come
27:49
out
27:49
of
27:49
that
27:49
questioning
27:50
with
27:50
really
27:51
concrete
27:52
responses
27:53
that
27:53
you've
27:53
been
27:53
called
27:53
to.
27:54
But
27:54
you've
27:55
also,
27:55
you
27:55
started
27:55
to
27:56
inquire,
27:56
you
27:56
say
27:57
with
27:57
the
27:57
Jesuits,
27:58
but
27:58
of
27:58
course,
27:58
obviously
27:59
it
27:59
was
27:59
a
27:59
personal
28:00
inquiry
28:01
before
28:01
then,
28:02
but
28:02
you
28:02
also
28:03
did
28:03
deep
28:04
inquiry
28:05
and
28:05
reflection,
28:06
et
28:06
cetera,
28:06
in
28:06
Zen
28:08
and
28:08
other
28:08
ways
28:09
too
28:09
philosophical.
28:10
Can
28:10
you
28:11
speak
28:11
to
28:11
those?
28:12
Well,
28:12
let
28:12
me
28:13
just
28:13
speak
28:13
to
28:13
Jesuits.
28:15
When
28:15
I
28:15
was
28:15
in
28:15
the
28:16
Jesuits,
28:17
we
28:17
had
28:17
probably
28:19
in
28:19
our
28:19
class,
28:19
we
28:20
started
28:20
with
28:20
30,
28:21
went
28:22
down
28:22
10,
28:23
12
28:23
in
28:24
base
28:24
of
28:24
two
28:25
years.
28:25
I
28:25
was
28:25
there
28:26
almost
28:26
four
28:26
years
28:27
in
28:28
that.
28:28
We
28:28
had
28:29
common
28:29
beliefs.
28:30
You
28:30
know,
28:31
we
28:31
believed
28:31
in
28:32
heaven
28:32
and
28:32
hell,
28:33
God
28:33
and
28:33
the
28:34
devil.
28:34
We
28:35
believed
28:35
in
28:35
eternal
28:35
damnation.
28:37
We
28:37
believed
28:37
if
28:38
you
28:38
committed
28:38
a
28:38
moral
28:38
sin
28:39
and
28:39
you
28:40
didn't
28:40
go
28:40
to
28:40
confession
28:41
and
28:41
get
28:41
forgiven
28:42
and
28:42
you
28:42
die,
28:43
you
28:43
go
28:43
into
28:43
heaven,
28:44
I
28:44
go
28:44
into
28:44
hell
28:45
and
28:45
hell
28:45
will
28:46
be
28:46
eternal
28:48
torment
28:48
forever.
28:49
Not
28:49
just
28:50
for
28:50
10
28:50
years
28:51
or
28:51
five
28:51
years
28:51
like
28:52
the
28:52
Holocaust.
28:53
No,
28:53
forever,
28:54
okay?
28:55
Everybody
28:56
I
28:56
think
28:57
believes
28:57
that,
28:58
including
28:58
me.
28:59
Then,
29:00
fine.
29:01
Morning.
29:01
Hey,
29:02
wait
29:02
a
29:02
minute.
29:02
I
29:03
don't
29:03
think
29:03
I.
29:03
That
29:04
can't
29:04
be.
29:04
How
29:05
can
29:05
there
29:05
be
29:06
an
29:06
all
29:06
loving
29:06
God
29:07
that
29:07
has
29:08
created
29:08
eternal
29:09
damnation
29:10
or,
29:11
you
29:11
know,
29:11
for
29:11
eating
29:12
meat
29:12
on
29:12
Friday
29:12
or
29:13
for,
29:13
even
29:13
for
29:15
killing
29:15
somebody?
29:15
I
29:16
mean,
29:16
it's
29:16
one
29:17
thing
29:17
to
29:17
kill
29:17
somebody
29:18
and
29:18
get
29:18
a
29:18
prison
29:18
sentence.
29:18
It's
29:19
another
29:19
thing
29:19
to
29:19
go
29:19
to
29:20
hell,
29:20
if
29:20
such
29:21
could
29:21
be
29:22
so.
29:22
But
29:23
everybody
29:24
believed
29:24
it,
29:25
no
29:25
doubt.
29:26
No
29:26
question.
29:27
That's
29:28
the
29:28
world.
29:29
We
29:29
had
29:29
no
29:29
communication
29:30
with
29:30
the
29:30
outside
29:31
world.
29:32
No
29:32
visitors
29:32
except
29:33
your
29:33
parents
29:33
for
29:34
two
29:34
hours
29:34
once
29:35
a
29:35
month.
29:35
We
29:35
had
29:36
no
29:36
television,
29:37
no
29:37
radio,
29:37
no
29:38
newspapers,
29:38
no
29:39
secular
29:39
books.
29:40
It
29:40
was
29:40
one
29:41
world
29:41
where
29:41
everybody
29:42
believed
29:42
that,
29:43
okay,
29:44
so
29:44
now,
29:45
hey,
29:45
I
29:45
don't
29:45
believe
29:46
a
29:46
lot
29:46
of
29:46
that,
29:47
okay?
29:48
What
29:48
today
29:49
are
29:49
beliefs
29:50
that
29:50
everybody
29:51
shares
29:52
but
29:52
are
29:52
wrong.
29:53
So
29:54
that
29:54
sense
29:55
of
29:55
being
29:56
in
29:56
the
29:56
midst
29:57
of
29:57
unquestioning
29:58
belief
29:59
and
29:59
nice
30:00
people,
30:01
good
30:01
people,
30:01
smart
30:02
people,
30:03
highly
30:03
educated
30:04
people,
30:04
they
30:04
believe
30:05
it.
30:05
So
30:05
that
30:05
has
30:06
led
30:06
me
30:06
to
30:07
be
30:07
very
30:07
skeptical,
30:08
skeptical
30:09
myself.
30:10
I
30:10
don't
30:10
believe
30:11
most
30:11
of
30:11
what
30:11
people
30:11
say,
30:12
or
30:13
I
30:13
want
30:13
to
30:13
say,
30:13
well,
30:14
prove
30:14
it
30:15
or
30:15
let's
30:16
go
30:16
a
30:16
little
30:16
deeper
30:17
into
30:17
that.
30:17
What
30:17
are
30:18
we
30:18
talking
30:18
about
30:18
here?
30:19
So
30:19
that
30:20
inquiry
30:20
has
30:21
been
30:21
a
30:21
very
30:21
powerful,
30:22
powerful
30:23
driving
30:24
force.
30:24
Even
30:25
as
30:25
governor,
30:25
when
30:26
people
30:26
say,
30:26
well,
30:27
this
30:27
is
30:27
the
30:27
law,
30:28
I
30:28
said,
30:28
well,
30:28
could
30:29
you
30:29
show
30:29
it
30:29
to
30:29
me?
30:30
Well,
30:30
no
30:30
way.
30:31
And
30:31
they
30:31
can't
30:31
Find
30:31
the
30:31
law.
30:32
Well,
30:32
it's
30:33
a
30:33
regulation.
30:33
Well,
30:34
show
30:34
me
30:34
the
30:34
regulation.
30:35
Well,
30:35
they
30:35
can't
30:35
find
30:35
the
30:36
regulation.
30:36
Well,
30:36
we've
30:36
just
30:36
been
30:37
doing
30:37
it.
30:37
Well,
30:38
why
30:38
have
30:38
we
30:38
been
30:38
doing
30:38
it?
30:39
So
30:39
you
30:39
can
30:40
go
30:40
down
30:40
that
30:40
path
30:41
and
30:41
really
30:42
illuminate
30:43
the
30:43
context,
30:44
the
30:44
situation.
30:45
So
30:45
without
30:46
being
30:46
total
30:47
skeptic,
30:48
leading
30:48
to
30:48
cynicism,
30:49
or
30:49
rather
30:50
inquiry,
30:51
leading
30:52
to
30:52
illumination,
30:53
leading
30:53
to
30:53
a
30:54
grasping
30:55
of
30:55
deeper
30:55
truths,
30:56
that's
30:56
the
30:57
path
30:57
that
30:58
I'm
30:58
drawn
30:58
to.
31:00
The
31:00
love
31:00
of
31:00
truth,
31:00
the
31:01
pursuit
31:01
of
31:01
truth.
31:02
Yes,
31:02
but
31:02
I
31:03
mean,
31:03
it
31:03
sounds
31:03
a
31:03
little
31:03
grandiose,
31:04
but
31:05
our
31:05
curiosity
31:06
might
31:06
be
31:06
a
31:06
little
31:06
more
31:06
humble
31:07
way
31:07
to
31:07
put
31:07
it.
31:07
I'm
31:08
very
31:08
curious.
31:09
How
31:09
do
31:09
things
31:09
work?
31:10
Where
31:10
the
31:10
hell
31:11
are
31:11
we
31:11
going
31:12
now?
31:12
Zen,
31:13
as
31:13
I
31:13
understand
31:14
Zen
31:14
practice,
31:15
it's
31:15
not
31:15
studying,
31:16
it's
31:16
sit
31:17
on
31:17
your
31:17
cushion,
31:18
follow
31:18
your
31:18
breathing,
31:19
follow,
31:20
move,
31:21
breathe
31:21
in,
31:22
breathe
31:22
out.
31:22
That's
31:23
all.
31:23
Don't
31:23
have
31:24
it.
31:24
Don't.
31:25
That's
31:25
it.
31:26
Just
31:26
shut
31:27
up
31:27
and
31:27
focus.
31:28
And
31:29
whatever
31:29
it
31:29
is,
31:29
it
31:30
is.
31:30
So
31:30
I
31:31
don't
31:31
know
31:31
what
31:31
you
31:32
can
31:32
derive
31:32
from
31:32
Zen,
31:33
although
31:33
the
31:33
art,
31:34
the
31:34
tea
31:35
ceremony,
31:35
the.
31:36
So
31:36
many
31:36
things
31:37
that
31:37
flower
31:38
arranging,
31:38
all
31:38
the
31:39
different
31:39
ways
31:40
that
31:40
have
31:41
been
31:41
the
31:41
product
31:41
of
31:42
Zen
31:42
is
31:42
quite
31:43
remarkable.
31:43
So
31:44
just
31:44
being
31:45
present
31:46
in
31:46
that
31:47
form
31:47
leads
31:48
to
31:48
many
31:48
things.
31:49
But
31:49
of
31:49
course,
31:50
if
31:50
that's
31:50
your
31:50
idea,
31:51
that's
31:51
called
31:51
a
31:51
gaining
31:52
idea
31:52
and
31:53
that's
31:53
bad.
31:54
So
31:54
that's
31:54
the
31:54
issue.
31:55
Emptiness
31:56
doesn't,
31:57
I
31:57
don't
31:57
know
31:57
how
31:57
you
31:57
use
31:58
emptiness.
31:58
It
31:58
doesn't
31:59
add
31:59
to
31:59
the
31:59
gross
32:00
domestic
32:00
product,
32:01
it
32:01
doesn't
32:01
increase
32:01
your
32:02
wealth.
32:04
And
32:04
accepting
32:05
that
32:05
in
32:06
our
32:06
world,
32:06
it's
32:07
very
32:07
hard
32:07
because
32:07
we're
32:08
very
32:08
oriented
32:09
towards
32:09
success,
32:10
toward
32:11
making
32:11
something
32:11
happen.
32:12
Well,
32:13
awareness,
32:15
Kenjo
32:16
Satori,
32:17
that's
32:17
not
32:17
a
32:18
commodity
32:18
that
32:18
you
32:19
could
32:19
exploit.
32:21
No,
32:21
but
32:21
hopefully
32:22
it
32:22
does
32:23
provide
32:23
an
32:24
opening
32:24
of
32:24
space
32:25
and
32:25
awareness
32:25
in
32:26
which
32:26
we
32:26
can
32:26
live
32:26
more
32:27
fully,
32:27
be
32:27
more
32:28
alive,
32:28
and
32:29
hopefully
32:30
respond
32:30
more
32:30
effectively
32:31
to
32:31
the
32:31
very
32:32
issues
32:32
you've
32:32
been
32:33
raising.
32:33
I'd
32:34
rather
32:34
know
32:35
and
32:35
see
32:36
than
32:36
not
32:37
know
32:37
and
32:37
not
32:38
see.
32:39
Understanding,
32:40
that's
32:41
the
32:41
most
32:41
of
32:41
the
32:41
time
32:42
we're,
32:42
we're
32:42
wandering
32:43
around
32:43
in,
32:44
in
32:44
half
32:44
baked
32:45
ideas
32:45
and
32:46
prejudices
32:47
and
32:47
of
32:47
course
32:48
we
32:48
have,
32:48
we
32:48
have
32:48
to
32:49
have
32:49
a
32:49
lot
32:49
of
32:49
half
32:50
baked
32:50
ideas
32:50
because
32:51
you
32:51
can't
32:51
figure
32:51
everything
32:51
out
32:52
all
32:52
the
32:53
time.
32:53
So
32:53
well,
32:53
you
32:54
don't
32:54
get
32:54
baked
32:54
unless
32:54
you
32:55
start
32:55
off
32:55
half
32:55
baked.
32:56
Right?
32:56
So
32:56
that
32:57
maybe
32:57
that's
32:57
just
32:57
a
32:58
way
32:58
through.
32:58
So
32:59
that's
32:59
what,
32:59
that's
32:59
being
33:00
human.
33:00
So
33:01
understanding,
33:03
very
33:03
important
33:04
understanding
33:04
of,
33:05
of
33:05
the
33:05
world,
33:06
of
33:06
ourselves
33:07
or
33:07
our
33:08
neighbors,
33:08
what's
33:09
needed,
33:09
that's,
33:10
that's
33:10
quite
33:11
a
33:11
lot
33:11
just
33:11
to
33:12
focus,
33:13
dedicate
33:13
yourself
33:13
to
33:14
that.
33:14
It's
33:15
A
33:15
lot.
33:15
And
33:15
I
33:15
want
33:16
to
33:16
put
33:16
it
33:16
in
33:16
a
33:16
psychological
33:17
frame,
33:17
Jerry,
33:17
because
33:18
you're
33:18
talking
33:18
about.
33:19
You've
33:19
described
33:20
in
33:20
your
33:20
own
33:20
life
33:21
a.
33:21
A
33:21
developmental
33:22
progression
33:23
which
33:23
is.
33:23
Which
33:24
our
33:24
culture
33:24
is
33:25
still
33:25
wrestling
33:25
with.
33:26
And
33:26
that
33:26
is
33:26
the.
33:27
That
33:27
we
33:28
start
33:28
off
33:28
at
33:29
a
33:30
conventional,
33:31
conventional
33:32
level,
33:32
or
33:33
in
33:33
terms
33:33
of
33:33
development
33:34
of
33:34
faith,
33:34
fallow
33:35
stages
33:35
of
33:35
faith,
33:36
conventional,
33:37
mythic,
33:37
where
33:38
we
33:38
just
33:38
believe
33:38
and
33:39
take
33:39
for
33:39
granted
33:40
the
33:40
stories
33:41
and
33:41
narratives
33:41
and
33:42
myths
33:42
we've
33:42
been
33:42
given.
33:43
But
33:43
then
33:44
hopefully
33:44
we
33:44
mature
33:45
to
33:45
what's
33:45
called
33:46
individuated,
33:46
reflective,
33:47
where
33:47
we
33:47
begin
33:48
to
33:48
reflect
33:48
and
33:49
question
33:49
for
33:49
ourselves
33:50
and
33:51
become
33:51
an
33:52
individuate
33:52
as
33:53
separate
33:54
people
33:55
in
33:55
which
33:56
our
33:56
ideas
33:57
and
33:57
lives
33:57
are
33:57
based
33:58
on
33:58
inquiry
33:59
and
33:59
personal
34:00
reflection
34:01
rather
34:01
than
34:02
just
34:02
a
34:02
blind
34:03
acceptance
34:03
of
34:03
what
34:03
we've
34:04
been
34:04
given.
34:05
And
34:05
it
34:05
feels
34:05
like
34:05
our
34:06
culture
34:06
is
34:06
still
34:06
resting
34:07
with
34:07
that
34:07
transition.
34:09
But
34:09
every
34:10
culture
34:10
is.
34:11
And
34:11
there's
34:12
just
34:12
a
34:12
lot
34:12
to
34:12
learn.
34:12
As
34:12
I
34:13
say,
34:13
there's
34:13
40,000
34:14
books.
34:15
I
34:15
get
34:15
the
34:15
New
34:15
York
34:16
Review
34:16
of
34:16
Books
34:17
and
34:17
the
34:17
Times
34:17
Literary
34:18
Supplement.
34:19
They
34:19
come
34:19
out.
34:19
One
34:20
comes
34:20
out
34:20
twice
34:21
a
34:21
month,
34:21
one
34:21
comes
34:21
out
34:22
four
34:22
times
34:23
a
34:23
month.
34:23
So.
34:24
And
34:24
there's
34:24
always
34:24
plenty
34:25
of
34:25
books,
34:26
plenty
34:26
of
34:26
ideas,
34:27
plenty
34:27
of
34:28
essays
34:28
on
34:29
all
34:29
these
34:29
different
34:29
questions.
34:30
So
34:32
there
34:32
it
34:32
is.
34:32
Of
34:33
course,
34:33
when
34:33
you're
34:33
younger,
34:34
you
34:34
think
34:34
there's
34:34
more
34:34
to
34:35
learn.
34:35
And
34:36
luckily,
34:36
as
34:36
you
34:36
get
34:36
older,
34:37
your
34:38
brain
34:38
tires,
34:39
you
34:39
begin
34:40
to
34:41
seek
34:41
less
34:42
because
34:42
you
34:42
have
34:42
less
34:43
energy.
34:43
And
34:44
maybe
34:44
that's
34:44
a
34:44
comfort
34:45
as
34:45
you
34:45
slowly
34:46
fade
34:47
into
34:47
the
34:48
sunset.
34:49
Well,
34:50
looking
34:50
back
34:50
over.
34:51
Since
34:51
you've
34:52
mentioned
34:52
looking
34:52
back
34:53
and
34:53
aging,
34:53
Jerry,
34:54
as
34:55
you
34:55
look
34:55
back,
34:56
what
34:57
do
34:57
you
34:57
wish
34:57
you'd
34:57
known
34:58
earlier?
34:59
I
34:59
saw
34:59
that
34:59
question.
35:00
You
35:00
wrote
35:00
it
35:00
down
35:00
in
35:00
the
35:01
email
35:01
to
35:01
me.
35:01
I
35:02
don't
35:02
know
35:02
what
35:02
to
35:02
say.
35:03
If
35:03
I'd
35:03
known.
35:05
That's
35:05
a
35:05
fun.
35:05
What
35:06
do
35:06
they
35:06
call
35:06
it?
35:07
Counterfactual.
35:08
Hey,
35:09
if
35:09
I'd
35:09
known
35:10
what
35:10
I
35:10
know
35:10
now,
35:11
I
35:11
might
35:11
have
35:11
got
35:11
elected
35:12
president.
35:13
Might
35:13
or
35:13
might
35:14
not
35:14
have.
35:14
And
35:14
even
35:14
if.
35:14
Would
35:15
that
35:15
have
35:15
been
35:15
good?
35:16
So
35:17
if
35:17
I'd
35:17
known
35:17
how
35:18
good
35:18
my
35:18
wife
35:18
was,
35:18
I
35:19
would
35:19
have
35:19
married
35:19
her
35:19
a
35:19
lot
35:20
sooner.
35:22
I
35:22
can
35:22
say
35:22
the
35:22
same
35:22
about
35:23
my.
35:25
That's
35:25
one
35:26
thing
35:26
I
35:26
would
35:26
say.
35:27
Yeah.
35:28
Oh,
35:29
yeah.
35:29
What
35:30
I
35:30
would
35:30
know,
35:30
I
35:30
would
35:31
have
35:31
asked
35:31
my
35:31
grandmother
35:32
more.
35:32
I.
35:33
I'm
35:33
very
35:33
sorry.
35:34
I've
35:34
talked
35:34
about
35:34
a
35:35
lot
35:35
of
35:35
things,
35:35
but
35:36
she
35:36
lived
35:37
before
35:37
the
35:37
car.
35:38
Born
35:38
in
35:38
1878
35:40
and
35:41
she
35:41
was
35:41
around
35:42
in
35:42
1950.
35:43
1960,
35:44
1970.
35:45
So,
35:46
boy,
35:46
what
35:46
transition.
35:48
And
35:48
she
35:48
was
35:48
the
35:48
seeker.
35:49
She
35:49
used
35:49
to
35:49
take
35:50
my
35:50
father
35:50
when
35:51
he
35:51
was
35:51
a
35:51
little
35:51
boy
35:52
to
35:53
different
35:53
churches
35:54
in
35:54
San
35:54
Francisco,
35:55
different
35:55
lectures
35:56
to
35:56
hear.
35:57
She
35:57
was.
35:57
Even
35:58
though
35:58
she
35:58
had
35:58
limited
35:59
education,
36:00
she
36:00
was
36:01
very
36:01
interested
36:02
in
36:02
the
36:03
spiritual.
36:04
Not
36:05
Dogmatic,
36:06
but
36:06
more
36:06
of
36:07
what
36:07
we're
36:07
talking
36:08
about,
36:08
an
36:08
inquiry
36:09
into
36:10
the
36:10
depths
36:11
of
36:12
our
36:12
reality.
36:13
So,
36:14
yeah,
36:15
I
36:15
wish
36:15
I'd
36:15
have
36:15
more
36:16
conversations
36:17
about
36:18
what
36:18
that
36:18
was
36:19
to
36:19
live
36:19
with.
36:20
No
36:20
electricity,
36:21
no
36:21
car,
36:22
no
36:22
running
36:23
water.
36:24
What
36:24
was
36:24
that
36:24
about?
36:25
And
36:25
then
36:25
you
36:25
come.
36:26
She
36:27
leaves
36:27
the
36:27
ranch
36:27
when
36:27
she's
36:28
18,
36:28
comes
36:29
to
36:29
San
36:29
Francisco
36:30
in
36:30
1896,
36:32
and
36:32
she
36:32
lived
36:33
here
36:33
ever
36:33
since
36:33
till
36:34
she
36:34
died
36:34
in
36:34
1974.
36:35
So
36:36
that's
36:36
quite.
36:36
There's
36:37
probably
36:37
a
36:37
lot
36:37
of
36:37
wisdom
36:38
there.
36:38
A
36:38
lot
36:38
of
36:39
that
36:39
I
36:39
never
36:39
really
36:40
tapped
36:40
into.
36:41
So,
36:41
yeah,
36:42
if
36:42
I
36:43
known
36:43
that,
36:43
I
36:43
would
36:44
have
36:44
dealt
36:44
with
36:44
that.
36:45
So
36:45
even
36:45
your.
36:47
These
36:47
are
36:47
more
36:47
personal
36:48
things.
36:49
So
36:49
I
36:49
can
36:49
think
36:49
of
36:49
political
36:50
things.
36:51
My
36:51
eye
36:52
for
36:52
the
36:52
political
36:53
is
36:53
clear,
36:54
having
36:55
gone
36:55
through
36:55
it
36:56
for
36:56
50
36:56
years,
36:58
so.
36:58
And.
36:58
But
36:58
personally,
36:59
we
36:59
have
36:59
the
36:59
same
37:00
thing
37:00
and
37:00
have
37:01
things
37:01
that
37:01
we
37:01
learned,
37:02
but
37:02
life
37:02
is
37:02
going
37:02
from
37:03
ignorance
37:04
and
37:04
darkness
37:05
into
37:06
hopefully,
37:06
greater
37:06
illumination
37:09
and.
37:10
And
37:10
mystery
37:11
always
37:11
remains.
37:13
Right.
37:13
Always
37:14
mystery.
37:15
Yeah.
37:16
Terry,
37:16
this
37:16
has
37:17
been
37:17
so
37:17
rich
37:17
and
37:18
so
37:19
just
37:19
beautiful
37:20
and
37:20
so
37:21
multifaceted,
37:22
you.
37:23
Know,
37:23
I
37:23
want
37:23
to
37:23
add
37:24
one
37:24
more
37:24
thing
37:24
just
37:24
to
37:24
throw.
37:25
Good.
37:26
Throw
37:27
something
37:27
on
37:27
the
37:27
table
37:27
that
37:27
you're
37:28
not
37:28
going
37:28
to
37:28
have.
37:28
One
37:29
of
37:29
the
37:29
meditations
37:30
and
37:30
the
37:31
famous
37:31
spiritual
37:31
exercise
37:32
of
37:32
Sagnatius,
37:33
it
37:33
has
37:33
but
37:33
divided
37:34
into
37:34
four
37:34
weeks.
37:35
First
37:35
week
37:35
you
37:35
meditate
37:36
on
37:36
hell
37:37
and
37:37
damnation.
37:38
Then
37:39
ultimately
37:39
the
37:39
fourth
37:40
week,
37:40
you
37:41
meditate
37:41
on
37:42
the
37:42
beauty
37:42
of
37:42
God
37:43
and
37:44
the
37:44
world
37:44
and
37:45
everything
37:45
that's
37:45
good.
37:46
But
37:46
you
37:46
start
37:46
out
37:47
on
37:47
the
37:47
negative,
37:48
the
37:48
negative
37:49
path.
37:50
And
37:50
one
37:50
of
37:50
the
37:50
meditations
37:51
is
37:51
to
37:52
meditate
37:53
on
37:53
one
37:54
sinner.
37:55
A
37:55
sinner
37:55
who
37:55
committed
37:56
a
37:56
mortal
37:56
sin
37:57
and
37:58
died
37:58
is
37:58
now
37:59
burning
38:00
in
38:00
hell.
38:01
And
38:01
you
38:02
who've
38:02
committed
38:02
a
38:03
mortal
38:03
sin,
38:03
you
38:04
are
38:04
not
38:05
in
38:05
hell
38:05
and
38:06
God
38:06
has
38:06
saved
38:07
you.
38:07
And
38:08
how
38:08
wonderful,
38:09
how
38:09
merciful
38:10
God
38:10
has
38:10
been.
38:11
And
38:11
I
38:11
made
38:12
that
38:12
meditation.
38:13
I
38:13
did.
38:13
It
38:14
wasn't
38:14
until
38:14
recently
38:14
I
38:15
thought,
38:15
wait
38:15
a
38:15
minute,
38:16
that's
38:17
not
38:17
equal
38:17
protection.
38:18
God's
38:19
putting
38:19
somebody
38:19
in
38:20
hell
38:20
for
38:21
one
38:21
sin,
38:21
and
38:22
he's
38:22
not
38:22
putting
38:22
me
38:22
in
38:23
hell.
38:23
We're
38:23
doing
38:23
the
38:24
same
38:24
damn
38:24
thing.
38:25
Instead
38:25
of
38:26
gratitude
38:27
at
38:27
the
38:27
mercy
38:27
of
38:27
God,
38:28
it's
38:28
horror
38:29
at
38:30
the
38:31
inequality.
38:32
So
38:32
here's
38:33
an
38:33
interesting
38:33
point.
38:34
I
38:34
didn't
38:34
think
38:34
of
38:35
that
38:35
at
38:35
the
38:36
time
38:36
when
38:36
I'm
38:37
doing
38:37
that
38:37
meditation,
38:38
1956,
38:40
and
38:40
nobody
38:40
brought
38:41
that
38:41
point
38:41
up.
38:42
Hey,
38:42
wait
38:42
a
38:42
minute.
38:43
Would
38:43
God
38:43
really
38:44
do
38:44
that?
38:44
And
38:45
is
38:45
that
38:45
really
38:45
a
38:46
good
38:46
thing,
38:46
that
38:46
we're
38:47
saved
38:47
and
38:47
somebody
38:48
else
38:48
isn't?
38:48
That
38:49
thought
38:49
never
38:50
came
38:50
to
38:50
mind.
38:51
Well,
38:51
if
38:52
that
38:52
thought
38:52
didn't
38:52
come
38:53
to
38:53
mind,
38:53
what
38:54
thoughts
38:54
today
38:55
are
38:55
not
38:55
coming
38:55
to
38:56
mind.
38:56
That
38:56
down
38:57
the
38:57
road
38:57
we're
38:57
going
38:57
to
38:57
look
38:58
back
38:58
and
38:58
say,
38:58
boy,
38:58
I
38:59
never
38:59
quite
38:59
understood
39:00
that
39:00
the
39:00
way
39:00
I
39:00
do
39:00
now.
39:01
So
39:02
that's
39:02
a
39:03
point
39:03
that
39:03
we
39:03
can
39:03
know.
39:04
There's
39:04
more
39:04
to
39:04
be
39:04
known,
39:05
more
39:06
to
39:06
be
39:06
found.
39:08
Yeah.
39:08
Learning
39:09
is
39:09
endless
39:09
and
39:10
mystery
39:11
always
39:11
remains.
39:12
Yeah.
39:13
Beautiful.
39:14
Jerry,
39:14
this
39:15
has
39:15
been
39:15
so
39:15
rich.
39:16
Anything
39:16
else
39:16
you
39:17
want
39:17
to
39:17
add,
39:18
though?
39:18
I
39:18
think
39:18
I've
39:18
said
39:18
more
39:19
than
39:19
I
39:19
should
39:19
have.
39:21
I
39:21
know
39:21
that
39:21
feeling.
39:22
I
39:22
know
39:22
that
39:22
feeling
39:22
well.
39:24
Yeah,
39:24
No,
39:25
I
39:25
think
39:25
you've
39:25
said
39:26
what
39:26
you
39:26
should,
39:27
and
39:27
it's
39:27
just.
39:27
And
39:28
it's
39:28
been
39:28
a
39:28
real
39:28
gift
39:28
just
39:29
to
39:29
have
39:29
this
39:29
dialogue
39:30
with
39:30
you,
39:30
Jerry,
39:30
personally.
39:31
It's
39:31
always
39:32
a
39:32
gift
39:32
to
39:33
engage
39:33
with
39:34
you
39:34
and
39:34
to
39:35
wrestle
39:35
with
39:35
some
39:36
of
39:36
these
39:36
questions
39:37
and
39:37
really
39:37
a
39:38
gift
39:38
for
39:38
our
39:38
listeners.
39:39
And
39:39
hopefully
39:40
your
39:40
words
39:41
will
39:41
reach
39:42
out
39:42
through
39:43
the
39:43
listeners
39:43
to
39:44
other
39:44
people
39:44
and
39:45
hopefully
39:45
contribute
39:46
to
39:47
some
39:47
of
39:47
the
39:47
healing
39:47
we
39:48
so
39:48
desperately
39:48
need
39:48
and
39:49
some
39:49
of
39:49
the
39:49
wiser
39:50
responses
39:50
we
39:51
desperately
39:51
need.
39:52
So.
39:52
And
39:53
finish
39:53
the
39:53
book.
39:55
Finish
39:55
the
39:55
book.
39:56
Exactly.
39:57
And
39:57
remember
39:58
the
39:58
great
39:58
comfort
39:59
that
39:59
future
39:59
is
40:00
unknown.
40:01
So
40:02
don't
40:02
conclude
40:03
that
40:04
all
40:04
is
40:04
dark
40:05
or
40:05
that
40:05
all
40:05
is
40:06
bright.
40:06
It's
40:07
unknown.
40:08
So
40:08
as
40:08
long
40:09
as
40:09
we're
40:09
breathing
40:10
and
40:10
functioning,
40:11
we
40:11
have
40:11
a
40:11
lot
40:12
to
40:12
do.
40:13
Beautiful.
40:14
Thank
40:14
you.
40:15
Wonderful
40:15
place
40:15
to
40:16
end.
40:16
Thanks
40:17
so
40:17
much,
40:17
Jerry.
40:18
Thank
40:18
you.
40:19
I
40:19
thoroughly
40:20
enjoyed
40:20
it.
40:21
Yeah.
40:23
Thank
40:23
you
40:23
very
40:23
much
40:24
for
40:24
being
40:24
a
40:25
part
40:25
of
40:25
this
40:25
conversation.
40:26
We
40:26
hope
40:26
that
40:27
you
40:27
were
40:27
moved,
40:27
as
40:28
we
40:28
are
40:28
moved,
40:29
being
40:29
part
40:29
of
40:29
it
40:29
ourselves.
40:30
We'd
40:31
also
40:31
like
40:31
to
40:31
say
40:31
that
40:32
this
40:32
is
40:32
being
40:32
funded
40:33
by
40:33
Roger
40:34
and
40:34
myself.
40:34
It
40:34
comes
40:34
out
40:34
of
40:35
our
40:35
pockets.
40:35
So
40:35
if
40:36
you
40:36
would
40:36
like
40:36
to
40:36
help
40:36
us
40:37
to
40:37
make.
40:38
Mainly
40:38
to
40:38
get
40:38
this
40:39
podcast
40:39
out
40:39
to
40:39
more
40:40
people,
40:40
because
40:40
the
40:40
bigger
40:41
audience
40:41
have.
40:41
Which
40:41
is
40:42
steadily
40:42
growing,
40:42
but
40:42
the
40:43
more
40:43
people
40:43
we
40:43
can
40:43
reach
40:44
and
40:44
the
40:44
more
40:44
marketing
40:45
we
40:45
can
40:45
do,
40:45
the
40:46
more
40:46
positive
40:46
effect
40:47
we
40:47
can
40:47
have
40:47
on
40:47
the
40:47
world.
40:48
So
40:48
we've
40:48
done
40:48
that
40:49
a
40:49
couple
40:49
of
40:49
ways,
40:49
but
40:49
we'd
40:50
like
40:50
you
40:50
to
40:50
buy
40:50
us
40:51
a
40:51
cup
40:51
of
40:51
coffee.
40:51
Very
40:52
simple.
40:52
And
40:52
I
40:52
do
40:53
that
40:53
with
40:53
podcasts
40:54
that
40:54
I
40:54
support,
40:55
and
40:55
I
40:56
find
40:56
it's
40:56
very
40:56
satisfying.
40:57
So
40:57
thank
40:58
you
40:58
for
40:58
your
40:58
help,
40:58
thank
40:59
you
40:59
for
40:59
your
40:59
presence,
41:00
and
41:00
thank
41:00
you
41:00
for
41:00
all
41:01
you
41:01
are
41:01
and
41:01
all
41:02
you
41:02
do.
40:23
We
40:42
love
40:52
you.