Latest / Epic Entrepreneurs / Stop Hiring “Honda Price” Builders For A Mercedes Home with Greg Palmer, Built Up Homes

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Stop Hiring “Honda Price” Builders For A Mercedes Home with Greg Palmer, Built Up Homes · Epic Entrepreneurs

• 0:45
  SPEAKER_01: Hi everyone.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to this week's episode of Epic Entrepreneurs.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_01: I am Cliff McCray with Action Coach Business Growth Partners, where we work for local business owners to turn big ideas into real scalable growth.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_01: Today I'm excited to be joined by Greg Palmer with Built Up Homes.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_02: Greg, how are you doing today?
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_02: Good, Bill.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_02: Really good.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_02: How are you doing?
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_02: I'm doing wonderful.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_02: Really, really, really blessed and really excited to have you on.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_02: So if you don't mind, let's go ahead and jump right into things.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, sounds good.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_02: All right.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, Built Up Homes was built in 2013.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_02: So, what do you provide for Greenville, South Carolina?
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_02: What do you provide for the community?
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_00: I'm primarily a custom home builder.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_00: I do large-scale remodels.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_00: Like last earlier this year, I finished up a whole house remodel for someone, but primarily those two lanes built custom homes.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I also have done a few spec homes for a developer.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_00: So just built something for him to resell himself.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_02: All right.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, that's what you provide for Greenville.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_02: So what about you personally?
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_02: What is who's Greg Palmer and what do you what do you have going on in your personal life?
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_00: Well, the biggest thing right now is my son Luke Palmer is getting married next Monday.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sorry, in a week and a week and a half.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_00: And so that is, yeah, that is taking up most of our bandwidth right now.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_00: And his fiancee just moved up here to settle in their apartment.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_00: And they he will join her after the wedding.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_00: And so they're just kind of down to the last details, and we're starting to.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_00: And then all of a sudden, it's like, oh my goodness, the baby's coming in two weeks, and we're like, it starts to get really real.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: So that's where we're at right now.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, okay.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_02: And again, congratulations, Greg.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_02: That's that's awesome.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_02: I'm glad to hear.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_02: And we had Luke on, you know, a couple of weeks ago, and he was an excellent guy.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, very, very happy to hear everything's moving forward.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_02: So looking looking forward to hearing more about what he's got going on and you know, looking, you know, hope the best for him in the future.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_02: So, Greg, let's go ahead and get to you a little bit as far as what you get going on.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, I know you spent years building homes for other companies before launching your built-up homes in 2013.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_02: Is that correct?
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_00: I worked for Centex Homes.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_00: They were national home builder, they're kind of like a DR Horton.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_00: Them and Centex were competing for the number one and number two usually, and then the crash happened in 08-09, and they ended up getting bought out.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_00: And so I worked for them as superintendent for about four years, learned how to build homes with them.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, okay.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_02: Now, Greg, what made you decide it was finally time to build something that was completely your own?
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it wasn't uh a purposeful decision, I guess.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: It was kind of one of those things where it was almost forced on me.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: Like I was saying, I worked for Centex and the crash happened, and they laid off the whole.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_00: At that time I was in Portland, Oregon.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: And they laid off the whole Portland division, closed it down.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: And early on in the crash, no one knew it was the crash.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_00: And so I just I'd had desire for a long time to I like things having to do with entrepreneurialism, loved the idea of always loved the idea of having my own business.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so it just kind of seemed like the great opportunity at that time to start a construction company, Little Little knowing that we're just at the beginning of heading into the that big recession, so not the not the best time to open a construction business, but that's that's what got it started.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, okay.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_02: Now, I know you've managed everything from production neighborhoods to truly custom homes.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_02: What have you found separates an average builder from one people trust with their dream home?
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I would say one of the biggest things that I hear from people and that I see with other builders is just the communication and personal communication ability, handling how you're gonna handle difficulties, how you're gonna handle maybe challenges with a client or working through a problem, and just how you go about doing that in a professional way, communicating well, and just I, you know, when I go to Home Depot and to get materials, and I see the amount of guys there in construction getting materials like I am that are just dressed like they just rolled out of not showering for a couple weeks, and you know just look look like a mess.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, how in the world do people hire these people?
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_00: And so, I mean, I just hear from my clients that they really appreciate how I communicate with them, how most of the time, you know, we just have a we almost develop a friendship because you're you're kind of semi-married to them for the the uh length of the build.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that's and I see it in other builders too that I meet in networking events and stuff.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_00: You can you can kind of tell the guys that have a just a sense of giving good customer service and and then so I think that's by and large, most good builders have kind of that DNA in them.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, okay.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, I mean you're you're completely right.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_02: Communication is huge.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I probably me personally, you know, because I have a I have kind of a brand new home.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_02: It was built in 2023, so pretty brand new.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_02: But I would use someone who's a little bit more expensive, but I know I could count on, especially when it comes to communication.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_02: Like when it comes to something with my home, I need to know that I can trust you.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_02: I need to know that if I reach out to you, you're gonna respond within a timely fashion.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_02: And I'll pay a little bit more for that kind of work.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I think you could save a little bit of money on cost, right?
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_02: Upfront cost, but then, you know, kind of everything else slips in, you know, like I said, I'll pay a little bit more if I know, hey, this guy's gonna reach out to me.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_02: He's going to handle my questions, he's going to make me feel like I'm a special, stuff like that.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_02: I think most people will do that.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_02: What do you what do you see on your end when it comes to that, Greg?
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, uh, the architects that I work with and myself, that is one of the primary things we try to communicate to new clients.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_00: And I would, if any of your listeners are trying to start into this kind of process, I would highly encourage them.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_00: You want to try to pick your builder at the beginning, not after you've gotten all the bids back from your two or three builders that you want to work with.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_00: And the reason is is that in my experience and in the architect's experience, the feedback they've given me, when you're given a bid on a custom home and you're dealing with, you know, most of the architects, they've got their handful of builders that are kind of their go-to that they refer clients to.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_00: And by and large, we're all gonna be, you know, on a$500,000 house, let's say, we're all gonna be within probably$40,000 of each other, maybe even a little bit less.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_00: And so our recommendation is interview the builders before you get down the road too far and pick the one that you really relate to the best, you feel the most comfortable with, you have a rapport with, there's that trust factor.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: Listen to your inner spidey sense of this, you know, this guy, I've got a red flag with this guy.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_00: Listen to all that and make a decision because in the process of drawing up plans, and there's almost always a lot of iterations along the way, and it just doesn't work that efficiently to try to have three different builders give a full estimate, and then everybody take the time to, oh, we got it, we were making this change, so now we need to have three different people talk to their subs to get prices back, and it just takes a lot longer.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_00: And then when someone is invested in the process from the beginning, they have a lot more buy-in on giving you customer service and and just helping make the process succeed.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_00: So that's what I would recommend to people is to try to pick their builder before before they start into the whole process.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, okay.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_02: Now, I know you say you know, you kind of talked about it earlier, but built up homes, I know, emphasizes communication just as much as craftsmanship.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_02: Why is communication such a competitive advantage in construction, would you say?
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it builds trust.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_00: I think, in you know, in so many areas of life, if you're, you know, it's kind of like a marriage, if you're have good communication with your spouse and you're talking regularly, you're dealing with minor issues that come up, then those minor things don't become major things uh when they if they keep happening.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_00: And so it just helps the whole team to be more successful along the way, feedback being given, finding ways to like, you know, maybe talking once a week with your client, having those weekly things like, okay, this is what's coming this week.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, builder Greg, I saw this on my at the house the other day.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_00: What's what's going on with this?
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, just nipping everything in the bud, and it creates a lot more seamless process, and so I just I feel like that helps.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_00: I've in my history of building, I've only really had one client that was just a train wreck, and we can get into some lessons learned from that later, but by and large, good communication, it's just better for everybody.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_00: It helps me to enjoy going to the site better when I know that I'm on good terms with the client, and it it definitely I see it in clients just feeling good about working with me.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_00: So I just, you know, that ties in directly with getting other referrals in the process and after the process from your client for other for other people.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_00: I just finished a custom house a little bit ago, and they were like, you know, any opportunity they had with friends and family that were thinking about building, they were like, man, you got to use our builder.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_00: He's awesome.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_00: And and it was just part of what came out because we had good communication all along the way.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_00: So highly, highly recommend that.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that carries over into, you know, every industry.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: If you're uh whether you're in sales or whatever, is just the good communication, you can't I don't think you can overemphasize that.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_02: Now, I know construction has seen labor shortages, supply chain issues, and fluctuating material costs over the last several years, I'm sure, especially.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_02: How's your has your business adapted to it?
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_02: Have you had to increase your prices?
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_02: Do you work with your clients?
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_02: How does that work with you and kind of the fluctuating material costs over the last couple of years?
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that was that was an interesting just kind of a few several years.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_00: I I would say for the most part, all those issues have been worked out of the system.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_00: Like after during COVID and maybe another year or two after COVID, the supply chain issues were pretty significant.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_00: And then uh material costs did play a factor.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: But we just, you know, I kind of changed my how I did my estimating, where I instead of, you know, when prices were pretty stable, I could give a quote on something and know that, hey, if I started the job in a month, I was still good on that price.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_00: I had to change from doing that to more doing allowances and saying, hey, this is the price right now, but it might and could go up in price.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_00: And so just protecting myself by making it an allowance instead of a lump sum bid.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of builders during that time we had to convert to either cost plus or having a lot of things be allowances.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_00: So that's but I would say a a lot of those things have worked themselves out of the system now.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't see a lot of problems with that anymore.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_02: It's kind of balanced itself out over time.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yep.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_02: Now, when someone walks into one of your finished homes, what's the one thing you hope they immediately notice or feel?
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I would definitely like want them to uh see a really good product and just be I love the wow factor of just a a new house and especially the custom houses where people put in maybe some unique design options and just see that wow.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: It's always I would say when you walk into a new house or one that's being staged to sell, there's just the it almost carries its own wow factor just looking at it versus you know going over someone's house that they've lived in for five or ten years.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_00: There's something about it.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_00: So I would just love them to have that wow factor.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, usually new homes they're on the cutting edge of design fads or design features.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_00: So there's that aspect of like, oh, this is the you know, the coolest new thing.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_00: And so a wow factor and just seeing good craftsmanship.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, okay.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_02: Now, Greg, what would you say?
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_02: And I need you to be a little bit vulnerable on this, on this next question, but um and I know it's a little tough looking uh from the outside in, but you know, what is the biggest challenge your business is facing right now, would you say?
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_02: What could be better?
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the good question.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_00: I'd say the biggest challenge for me personally is I need to do a better job at marketing, getting new customers.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: Last year was my best year ever.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_00: And it was just the weirdest thing.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't do anything different.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_00: I I do I have a website, I have mostly depended on networking, relationships with architects, that sort of thing.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_00: That means all usually worked out pretty well, keeping just consistent work coming.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_00: But so I was still doing all that stuff, but this year it was the weirdest thing.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_00: Like it seemed like January 1st came and the spigot just turned off, and I haven't had any really meaningful work come my way since the first of the year.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_00: Now, thankfully, I because last year was my best ever, I still had work that I was finishing up from last year that came into like I was still finishing stuff up into April.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, it hasn't really created a lot of problems yet, but I would say trying to do better at my marketing and get a better plan, maybe doing, you know, like you have the idea of multiple income streams.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it's probably better to have multiple marketing streams too, and not just rely on architects.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: Because I, you know, right now with the interest rates, it's really, I would say, I don't know how many months it's been going on now, but it's it's slowed down quite a few people.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_00: So it's I think that's a lot of why I'm not getting more business, is just in general.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_00: I've talked to, you know, the two two main architects I deal with, they're slow.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_00: I hear it from other builders and vendors or subs are slow.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_00: Some are doing great, but some are slow.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I think having multiple marketing streams would be better for me to implement.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I've tried to start doing that.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_00: I've got some Facebook ads going, and that's been getting some views and some interaction.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_00: So better to start that when you have cash flow coming in from jobs than trying to respawn and dig into your savings after you haven't had work for a while.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_02: Now, is is that kind of primary your primary source of clients now?
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_02: What's your primary source right now?
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_00: No, still word of mouth, I would say, and yeah, referrals, networkings, those those kind of things.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_00: But like I said, I mean, I'm still in the last several weeks, I've gotten oh, probably at least five or s or so referrals of people asking about building a house.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_00: So where like before, I would say I'd go maybe a month between inquiries.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_00: So I mean it's starting to pick up.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm I haven't converted any of those to jobs yet, but um I've got one that's looking pretty positive.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, okay.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_02: Now, what do you believe is currently preventing your company from reaching its next level?
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_02: Do you think it's the marketing or do you think it's anything else?
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's uh several factors.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_00: Marketing would be one.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_00: You know, in some there's some aspect of things that are beyond my control.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, if the economy is if interest rates are holding a lot of f beginner buyers and maybe midterm buyers holding them back from pulling the trigger on things, that is that's gonna affect everybody, and there's nothing you can do about that.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_00: So, but one thing I'm pursuing right now is expanding my business.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm in the process of trying to get my commercial license here because I I have, you know, I would say the commercial industry is pretty strong right now with so much infrastructure being built and you know, all the trillions of dollars being invested in America right now, all that's gonna be trickling down.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_00: And the the overall economy is pretty positive right now.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: The interest rates are hurting, I would say, a segment of just in the construction world.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: But being able to not just be residential only, I have in the last several weeks had at least a conversation with an architect I reached out to and another commercial realtor.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_00: And they're like, man, we could we could give you commercial work if you had your license.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_00: So I was like, oh boy, so I'm I'm in that process.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_00: Uh unfortunately, that does take a little bit of time, but um it's just creating another revenue stream that would not make it be a feast or fam thing with res with just residential construction.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, okay, okay.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I appreciate you being honest.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_02: to you know kind of be very transparent about that and not shying away from that kind of question.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_02: But so, you know, let's see, kind of how do I how do I follow up with the next?
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_02: So what are your I I guess what are the biggest frustrations you have with your own business right now?
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_02: You know, kind of the things that consistently make ownership harder than it should be.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_00: I guess I would, you know, same thing we've been talking about.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_00: My biggest frustration is kind of the the feast or famine cycles.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_00: So if I could get that figured out and then I think that would take away stress.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_00: It would take away that frustration and you know if you've got a pretty solid pipeline of clients that that takes care of a lot of issues.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_00: So that would be my my biggest frustration.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_02: Now do you have a do you have anybody that works for you or is it just you?
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_00: It's myself.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_00: I'm a just do a general contracting.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_00: That's kind of the way I learned it going back to Centex Homes being, you know, we were managing the neighborhood construction.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_00: And so I tried it the other way for a little bit and just didn't like I could do more work with just myself than trying to stay ahead of a crew and always being focused on man I got to keep them fed or they're going to go find other work.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_00: So I just I just have kept it being myself and managing subs instead of managing a crew and it's worked out well for me.
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_00: Okay okay so yeah so I take it you have no plans on on uh hiring anybody in the near future to be like a a permanent uh I do say I I would like to hire more people but I would want to kind of keep in the GC model where I would be just hiring duplicates of myself as project managers and expanding that way.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_00: So I would love to you know in the commercial if that can get going here soon start bringing in business that way maybe have a commercial project manager and then I would focus on the residential and and just expand the business through proper project managers.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_00: And some you know that would probably need someone in the office but yeah instead of like maybe like a receptionist or something to handle calls.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_00: I mean yeah or like a receptionist slash bookkeeper that sort of thing.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah okay now about how many hours a week are you working in out of the business right now would you say well not very many right now as work has been really slow but when when things are going well it's a it's mostly a full-time job so there's a good I would say even when I'm busy there's a good work life balance I'm not I never have been like work 60 hour week type type guys so try to keep the life balance up really good.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_02: Okay okay all right so and I want you to be as transparent like you can on this next question.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_02: I know this this question is a little tough because obviously you have to you have to praise yourself and you know it's kind of tough because you are you're the owners right so let's say we talk to let's say you did bring on somebody right let's say you brought on another person to work for you like a receptionist or an executive assistant or something like that right and after you're working with them we sit down and we ask them this question what do you think is Greg's greatest strength as a business owner and what do you think they would say well I would say going back to the time that I did have some guys working for me you know I I heard a couple of them saying like Greg you are the best boss I've ever worked for and the reason they gave was just you know the construction world can be pretty how would I say it pretty rough when you're when you're dealing with the actual workers and stuff and there can be a lot of times there can be guys with big egos trying to be the boss and you know all that kind of stuff the drama that goes along with that and I just I guess I have a way of working with people where I'm I'm a firm believer in not yelling and cussing people out.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_00: I I feel like that is a a fail at leadership.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_00: And so I've just I guess I always had a way of even if someone's upset at me having a way of being calm and kind of bringing them back to just talking through the problem and getting out of their emotions and and just treating people with value and caring about people it just comes through.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_00: So that's that's why they like liked working for me.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_02: I love that I love that answer.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_02: So and then let's go on the flip side of that you know if we sat down and talked to one of your you know one of your employees what is one leadership or business go you still need to improve on what would you say I would say from I don't know that a worker would pick up on this but I know I would probably is I I think I need to be more risk embrace risk more and that's just like you know I have a friend that's a builder and he's tearing it up and even you know with so many of my other peers that are slow and he's just tearing it up and he's super good at embracing risk and just going for it.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I you know to be honest I'm like that if I'm dealing with other people's money but when it comes to mine like to do a spec house or something I'd I pull back and second guess and over evaluate and stuff like that.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_00: So that would be that would be one thing and I'm trying to I think the first the first part of it is being aware of your weakness so that you can deal with it.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_00: So being having some self-awareness to recognize okay this is a pattern I'm seeing consistently and what can I do to address it.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_00: So that's that's what I'd work on.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_02: Okay okay now you know let's say a a qualified leads you know somebody that's perfect for you you know comes in right or calls your office or or whatever talks with you how confident are you that it becomes an actual customer?
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_00: I would say most of the time if I if now again there are some just people that are kicking tires.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_00: So I would and they're not really ready but if I had a client that was ready and they were needing a project done and you know they were serious.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_00: They were going to go with someone it's just a matter who it seems like I land about maybe somewhere around three clients that I talked to in that scenario from over over the the last years it seemed like that's about the way it is.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_02: So let's go ahead ahead into the this or that portion.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_02: So basically how this works is I'm going to give you a choice between this or that and I just want you to choose one and then tell me why you chose it.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_02: It's a good way to kind of you know break up the monotony and kind of get into a little bit of a person your personal side a little bit more.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_02: I love asking these because it's just a great way to kind of learn about what you got going on in your personal life a little bit.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_00: All right so first thing mountains or beach and why oh god you picked my two favorite ones yeah these are tougher than you think yeah well I'm from I'm from the West Coast so we had both and I like that's the biggest thing I miss but I guess if it came down to it I would choose the beach and the reason why is I know it for the people here on the east coast you may most of you not have experienced the west coast ocean but there is you know most it's just a continual waves breaking with a lot of power and just the you see the the videos of these huge waves crashing against a rock and when you're when you're standing next to that it's like you feel that power in your chest like when it hits against a rock and there's just this whoop and it's it's just so cool to see and the coast is so beautiful out there with the the the kind of the coastal mountains come right down to the shoreline and oh I love it.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I would choose ocean.
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_02: Okay okay now okay so since you said that a little bit about uh being from the west coast maybe I've been out to the west coast too so you're right the waves there you can't beat them but uh let's say if it was over here on this side so would you pick an east coast beach over mountains over like the Appalachian Mountains or does that change things a little bit yeah that that's harder.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_00: I would I would probably still choose the the beach out here.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_00: Okay there's you know one another thing I love about the ocean is if you go out there fishing you're kind of like you could hook into Moby Dick or you could hook into a little panfish.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_00: So you just never know it's it's kind of like this sense of adventure and so there's kind of like that unknown of what's actually there and I I kind of like that.
• 32:57
  unknown: Okay.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_00: Coffee or tea?
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_00: Coffee pretty easy no doubt about that early bird or night owl I'm early bird oh yeah early morning is my time to shine uh sweet or salty sweet how can you pass a nice donut or something got a little bit of sweet tooth okay dogs or cats dogs yeah I won't dogs for sure okay any particular reason why oh the reason why sorry you asked so I I say dogs are just a lot more interactive they're you can go play with them and stuff like that cats are like if they feel like it they'll play with you but if not they're leave me alone and so I like to dogs just are a lot more enjoyable to me.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah yeah they're kind of like kids yeah they're kind of like little kids little five year old kids whatever um summer or winter oh boy I would say summer I like them both a lot but overall summer and because just it's easier being outside I like being outside as much as possible and it's a lot easier to be out you know my wife is not the biggest cold lover so just and I love being outside so there's just a lot more opportunity with more people seems like more you know more of the city events and everything like that are focused around the warm weather months and so yep summer but I I do love winter okay okay yeah yeah unless you know since you brought it up what do you what do you like about winter?
• 34:55
  SPEAKER_00: We kind of excite you about it I love storms winter storms a good thunder summer thunderstorms so I kind of live for the snowstorms in the winter I you know from being out west you in the winter time you got the snow covered mountains that are there all winter and they're just so beautiful so love that about snow is my favorite part of winter so where I can and I'm seem and then just the cold too and one pleasant surprise I had moving from California I was in northern California but moving from there to here is the winters here are actually colder than where I was so I I'm really grateful for that.
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah yeah they're great and this past winter we had that really really nice snowstorm.
• 35:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yep I don't know about where where you're at how much you got but me in particular I got 13 inches of snow.
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah nice yeah it was pretty good yeah the the first year we moved here literally like I think it was this day or two after we moved here they had a six inch snowstorm which and I was just like oh this is awesome and you know turned out I guess it was a little more rare event than I was hoping for but it was it was a nice welcome to South Carolina present for me.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah hopefully we have another good one here with this El Nino I guess you know they're talking about so yeah we'll have another good snowstorm or two I'd love it cook at home or eat out cook at home oh I am a big steak lover and I'm like I can either go to a restaurant and pay fifty to seventy five dollars for a good steak or I can go to Whole Foods and buy two ribeyes for 50 bucks and have twice as much steak and and it also just seems to come out a little bit better on my own grill than it does on someone else's restaurant grill.
• 37:03
  SPEAKER_02: So yep don't eat out a whole lot yeah yeah yeah it's I've noticed a trend here man it's it's just uh I've noticed because I've asked this question now for a couple of times and I've noticed that uh a lot of people especially business owners you guys like to cook at home so that's pretty okay yeah cook at home is kind of a thing I don't know if that's just overall trend based on pricing and everything I know it's kind of expensive to eat out these days a lot cheaper to eat that at home you know and but yeah cook at home i i definitely am that way too I love to cook at home I probably can make what they make out there a little bit better at home like you said yeah I feel I feel like that it always somehow home home cooking always tastes better seems like than plus I know what's in it that's right that's right and I know I wash my hands and you know all that stuff you know you see people going out of the bathroom not washing their hands handling your food so that's like yeah goodness I I know and like I I did some commercial work years ago and did some restaurant work and I was like I will never eat at that restaurant like there's some scary stuff back behind the counter you know see yep Apple or Android I've had both right now I'm Apple there are some I would say there are pros and cons of both I'm not I'm not like sold on either one I like the the Apple for some of its convenient features the biggest frustration of Apple to me is their keyboard sucks and switching multiple screens to do punctuation and stuff like that where Android it's all right there.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah I don't I wouldn't go either way on that it's just kind of the reason I switched to iPhone was most of my family had switched and it was just more convenient to do FaceTime and that sort of thing than so I I made the switch.
• 39:08
  SPEAKER_00: Okay okay unlimited referrals or unlimited marketing budget oh I would do unlimited referrals that that way to me the marketing is already done you're getting referrals from marketing so I would go unlimited referrals and I would be able to have the interaction with the people right away okay custom home or major renovation oh boy I I think I would go with the major renovation just because and now I love a good custom home build but there's something about a major home renovation that just gets me firing on all cylinders just because I like taking something that kind of looks ugly and doesn't function well and being able to turn that into something that's beautiful and so there's a lot more I guess job satisfaction in doing an extensive remodel than a custom home.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_00: So yep.
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_00: And then also there's a lot more you know with a custom home you've got a set of plans and for the for the most part you're just sticking with the plan.
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_00: With the remodel you can get all into all kinds of creative things like the one I just finished you know it was almost a full gut and we tore apart this floor of an attic and exposed you know it's basically exposed from the rafters down to the main level floor and just had an aha moment at that time I'm like oh my goodness we've kind of got a blank canvas now of what we maybe want to do with the living room downstairs as far as the ceiling how we want it to look and it we hadn't really thought about that at the beginning.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_00: And so we did a whole pivot and raised the ceiling and you know it turned out just really made the downstairs way better than before.
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_00: So when you do a whole house remodel you can you have more opportunity to make it even better than how you were starting out thinking it'd be okay okay one large custom project or three smaller projects I would go one larger it's just a lot more efficient you know I'm doing I'm doing almost the same amount of work with every project regardless if it's maybe a hundred and fifty thousand dollar remodel to eight hundred thousand dollar custom home it's almost the same amount of work for me because I'm still managing all the subs.
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_00: They're just you know the plumber might only be in the house for a day with with smaller one versus a couple days on a larger one but I'm still the whole process is the same so I would rather be billing on a larger project than three smaller ones.
• 42:39
  SPEAKER_00: Okay okay higher revenue or higher profit margin oh that's a good question well I guess I would want higher revenue because you know if I'm only making a hundred thousand with a higher profit margin that's still less than a million dollars at a decent profit margin so I would go with a higher prof higher dollar higher revenue yep okay okay new construction or transforming an older home well that gets back to the remodel question so or or a new home so I'd rather I'd rather do a remodel of a whole home as long as it's extensive truck or sports car I love my truck so I would say with a truck yeah yeah it's more and plus it's more practical you can actually fit stuff in it sports car you can't can't do too much with it you can't really fit much people in there too and uh a sports car is great for like a you know saturday drive a great weekend thing but yeah um overall practicality obviously a truck you can't beat it yep Netflix or YouTube boy I I would say I'm probably 95% on YouTube versus Netflix so I'm not a big movie watcher I'm more like seeing like sports highlights or you know a little educational thing like to TED talk or something like that.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm I'm more like just give me 10 15 minutes of specific topic instead of watching a movie.
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm uh I I don't watch I maybe watch a movie once a month or two at the most.
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_00: So mostly YouTube.
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, okay.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_02: And the last one is dream home or dream vacation?
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I would do a dream home.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, because you got that for for years and years where dream vacation is over.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, no, totally agree.
• 44:55
  SPEAKER_02: Because you're home, that's I mean, that's where you're at every day.
• 44:57
  SPEAKER_02: That's you know what you're gonna do.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_02: So dream vacation is only two weeks.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_02: But some people like, you know, they want to go to Japan or something like that.
• 45:04
  SPEAKER_02: So I get that side too.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah.
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yep.
• 45:09
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, and I appreciate you getting over that, uh, you know, getting through that, you know, this or that.
• 45:14
  SPEAKER_02: So a couple of last things, you know, what's uh what's next for built-up homes?
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_02: What should people be excited about coming up in the near future for your company?
• 45:23
  SPEAKER_00: Well, just kind of mentioned it with uh commercial construction uh years ago.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_00: I was commercial project manager before I had my own company, and I really enjoyed commercial construction.
• 45:35
  SPEAKER_00: I just where I was living in California, I was able to do out there your construction license.
• 45:45
  SPEAKER_00: You can do both without differentiating.
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_00: Out here, you have to either, I mean, you can still get both, but it's two separate licenses.
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_00: So I would I'm looking forward to getting my commercial license and getting back into those kind of projects.
• 46:03
  SPEAKER_00: Those are they're a lot of fun because every every single one is is different, you know, whether it's no two restaurants are the same, and there's a lot more variety than residential construction.
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_00: So looking forward to that.
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, okay.
• 46:21
  SPEAKER_02: Now, are you under?
• 46:22
  SPEAKER_02: I know you said last year was your best year ever.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_02: Well, were you over seven figures last year?
• 46:27
  SPEAKER_02: Are we under that amount?
• 46:30
  SPEAKER_00: Let's see.
• 46:31
  SPEAKER_00: I did I think my revenue was over two million last year.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I'm a small, small builder.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_00: I had about three or four projects last year.
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, it was it was a good year though.
• 46:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's awesome.
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_02: Two million for four projects is pretty good.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_02: That's really good, actually.
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_02: Two they were probably larger, right?
• 46:56
  SPEAKER_02: Obviously.
• 46:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 46:57
  SPEAKER_00: They were all new homes or you know, my my house remodel was half a million, so it was a large, they were large projects.
• 47:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, okay, okay.
• 47:08
  SPEAKER_02: Now, you know, and we have a pretty large entrepreneur audience.
• 47:12
  SPEAKER_02: Like we have a lot of business owners that listen to the podcast weekly.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, I want you to be as candid and as honest as you can on the answer to this next question here.
• 47:20
  SPEAKER_02: But, you know, let's say if uh small business owners listening to the podcast episode with you today, and you know, let's say they, you know, unfortunately had to, you know, they hired a guy, been working there for 10 years, and they just unfortunately had to lay the guy off because there's just not enough work for them.
• 47:35
  SPEAKER_02: They're just having a hard go of 2026, it's just not going well, they're feeling stuck or overwhelmed.
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_02: What piece of advice would you give to that small entrepreneur today?
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_00: Good question.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_00: I would say look for, you know, definitely evaluate like, okay, is this hard time something that I can control or something that is outside of my control?
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_00: Like for me, you know, and the crash in 08-09, I had no control over that.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_00: That city I was in, they had maybe five new construction permits that whole year.
• 48:13
  SPEAKER_00: So there was absolutely no nothing happening beyond my control.
• 48:17
  SPEAKER_00: And if you can't control it, then don't beat yourself up for it.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_00: But so evaluate that and then maybe reassess sometimes.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_00: There's hidden blessings in having downtime.
• 48:33
  SPEAKER_00: You can you have time to look inside and kind of reassess, okay, or are am I liking what are the aspects of the business I really like, what I don't like?
• 48:47
  SPEAKER_00: You can there's better times, those times can be better to pivot to something different, to realize, you know, if I last year when it was my best year ever, I wasn't thinking about going into commercial construction because I had, you know, things were just flowing really well.
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_00: So there wasn't really, but now that it's lean, I'm like, you know, here's an opportunity.
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_00: I and I've loved it in the past.
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna go for it again.
• 49:20
  SPEAKER_00: So in the long wall haul, it's I think gonna be a lot better for the business, but it wouldn't have come through unless I'd had this lean time.
• 49:33
  SPEAKER_00: So don't maybe uh semi-embrace the the hard times and use it as a time to evaluate, look for ways to pivot, lessons that are learned, that kind of thing.
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_00: Go back through your systems, say like, okay, what can I do better?
• 49:55
  SPEAKER_00: You know, when when things are are busy and no one is, you know, you're like, hey, it's successful, so it's harder to correct things or fine-tune them or change things in those times because you're not really you're being successful, so you're not really uh evaluating things too critiquely with Bill.
• 50:22
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, okay.
• 50:23
  SPEAKER_02: I appreciate that advice.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_02: I think that's really good advice.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_02: You're right.
• 50:27
  SPEAKER_02: Uh so and then last thing here, you know, Greg, if there was one thing, and I really want you to think about this, if there's one thing you could change about your business in the next 90 days, what would it be and why?
• 50:38
  SPEAKER_02: And and 90 days from today's it would be we're we're recording this early August, so I guess it that would be around Halloween.
• 50:44
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, if there's one thing you could change about your business by Halloween, what would you what would it be and why?
• 50:51
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I would I would have better marketing going on.
• 50:59
  SPEAKER_00: I would have my commercial license by then, so I would have doubled my revenue stream potential.
• 51:11
  SPEAKER_00: And those would be the two, those are the two biggest changes that I'm uh currently looking at, and so I would want them to have been implemented by then.
• 51:24
  SPEAKER_03: Yep.
• 51:25
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, okay.
• 51:26
  SPEAKER_02: All right, good deal.
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_02: Well, Jeff, again, thank you again for coming on and joining us and sharing your real story behind uh, you know, your business here, Built Up Homes.
• 51:36
  SPEAKER_02: To everyone listening, be sure to connect with our guests using the information shared today.
• 51:40
  SPEAKER_02: All of his social media will be in the description.
• 51:43
  SPEAKER_02: And please follow us on Epic Entrepreneur for more conversations with people building businesses and communities every day.
• 51:49
  SPEAKER_02: So, yeah, Greg, any last words for the audience before we go ahead and sign off?
• 51:53
  SPEAKER_02: It's a great conversation.
• 51:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, if you don't mind, I would love to share maybe one or two lessons that I've learned that I would really encourage listeners to take to heart.
• 52:07
  SPEAKER_00: One of the biggest lessons I learned that, well, a couple lessons.
• 52:14
  SPEAKER_00: When I was early on, before I had my residential license back in California, I was just trying to do something to earn income.
• 52:24
  SPEAKER_00: We were in the crash and all that, and I was doing handyman work.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_00: And I remember I was charging like 25, 30 bucks an hour and hardly making it ends meet, always stressed out.
• 52:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I had a client that was a friend of mine, and I was talking to him about it, and he's like, Greg, if you charged me 40 to 50 bucks an hour, I would I would not blink an eye at paying that for you because I know you know you do good work, you care about it, and I know I'm gonna get a the job is gonna be done right.
• 53:01
  SPEAKER_00: And so he said, I would recommend that you increase your wage.
• 53:06
  SPEAKER_00: And what you're gonna find is that the people that are kind of the nickel and dime type clients that want a Mercedes product for a Honda price, they're gonna fall away, and you're gonna keep the clients that you really enjoy working with that can that have money.
• 53:25
  SPEAKER_00: And so I took his advice and it was so helpful.
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_00: My stress level went way down.
• 53:31
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't see, I actually, I believe I saw an increase.
• 53:35
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I was you almost think maybe, well, if I increase my prices, I'm gonna lose clients.
• 53:41
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it was it didn't work that way.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_00: I I stayed just as busy, but now I was work making twice as much, and my financial problems went away.
• 53:51
  SPEAKER_00: So that was that was a really important lesson that I learned early on in business.
• 53:57
  SPEAKER_00: That don't be afraid to don't feel like you have to be the low-cost leader.
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_00: You know, just I tried to before I would send an estimate, I just kind of tried to have a little introspection and like, okay, do I feel stress about sending this in this bid?
• 54:15
  SPEAKER_00: If I if they say yes, am I gonna be stressed the whole time?
• 54:19
  SPEAKER_00: Because if one thing goes wrong, I haven't accounted for it in the estimate because I'm trying to give them a good deal.
• 54:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so I would I worked at changing that so that I knew, hey, even if something goes wrong, if there's a mistake, I'm gonna be covered, I'm still gonna make money on this job.
• 54:38
  SPEAKER_00: And it just really helped my stress level go away and my margins increase.
• 54:45
  SPEAKER_00: The second thing that I would really encourage the listeners to pay attention to is that internal caution that is kind of like a conscience.
• 55:01
  SPEAKER_00: But if one of the biggest mistakes I made was taking that job for that I the client I mentioned earlier that was just a train wreck, when I met them for the first time, my red flag meter was just pegged all the way.
• 55:19
  SPEAKER_00: And I I ignored it and I took the job because it was a substantial new construction build, and I kind of let my ego get in the way of listening to that inner caution, and I took the job and I ended up basically building their house for free because I made just a number of reasons, but it was and it was just a train wreck with the person because I, you know, I didn't listen to those red flags of like these are not gonna be good people to work with.
• 55:59
  SPEAKER_00: And so I would I would really encourage people to, you know, you're not in business to have to work for every client.
• 56:12
  SPEAKER_00: Be selective on who you work with.
• 56:15
  SPEAKER_00: If you've been around in your business for any sort of time, you you kind of know what good clients are and what bad clients are.
• 56:25
  SPEAKER_00: And just give yourself the freedom to say no to the bad clients because it's it's going to be a drag on your business and yourself personally.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_00: So that's what those are two things that I would love for people to learn from my mistakes.
• 56:43
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, okay.
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, really, really appreciate that, Greg.
• 56:46
  SPEAKER_02: I thought you had you had some really, really great nuggets today.
• 56:48
  SPEAKER_02: Felt like a lot of entrepreneurs can definitely take some insight from this conversation.
• 56:52
  SPEAKER_02: So definitely recommend this episode.
• 56:54
  SPEAKER_02: So again, Greg, thank you for coming on.
• 56:56
  SPEAKER_02: This is Cliff McCray with Action Coach Business Growth Partners.
• 56:59
  SPEAKER_02: We'll see you next time.