Latest / Houselights: A Film Director Podcast / The Siege (1998) - Edward Zwick | Houselights #171

Transcript

The Siege (1998) - Edward Zwick | Houselights #171 · Houselights: A Film Director Podcast

0:03
Welcome to the ned Palty. Welcome back to House Lights, our director discussion
0:23
show here on the Nerd Party Network. Today, we are continuing with the
0:27
House of Zwick with jumping to the nineteen nineties with ninety eight's The Siege.
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Hey, it's den Zeil's Back. I didn't even have to change that from
0:35
the last time I hosted Denzil's Back yet again, and with this film,
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we're going to see has it aged in both a pre post nine to eleven
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world. I'm Darren Fbi Liaison Moser, and I'm joined again by my friends
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John Microwave Mills and General Tristan Riddell. Gentlemen, what's the chatter? What?
0:58
I'm the bald one? How the hell I got the general here?
1:00
I look on me. Oh, it was the little of microwaven Mills,
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That's what did it. If you haven't right, that's fine because I love
1:10
Tony Shaloub and I love his character in this film. But come on,
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I was made for a bad wig. We all know this. Come on,
1:17
come on, okay, you can be You could both be the bad
1:19
general that resists the temptation to occupy the island of Manhattan but then gives in
1:25
and because the cliche bad guy Caesar had to turn down the crown three times
1:30
before he accepted it. Just remember that, Just remember it. It's very,
1:34
very Shakespeare. It takes a lot of sense well this movie. You
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know, normally when we keep track of things in our spreadsheet, we note
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if we had seen this before, and unless nobody's been updating it, all
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three of us have seen this before this this weekend. So I think the
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main question is was it a more recent viewing or did either of you guys
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see this in ninety eight? Yo, ninety eight right here theater pre ninety
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eight for John? What about you, Tristan? I saw it in ninety
2:07
eight as well, or depending on when it came out ninety nine because this
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was a blockbuster rental for me. Okay, it was a November of ninety
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eight, so probably it might have been, so it's probably ninety nine.
2:17
Yeah, I saw this in ninety nine. I think I did as well.
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This would have been around sort of high school ish time for me.
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I definitely saw it again. I own it. It's a really interesting you
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know, it kind of makes me think of like John Clancy type stuff or
2:37
Peace Baker again, different vibes obviously in quality, but yeah, so interesting.
2:42
So all three of us saw this in the nineties. Yeah, we're
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this post ninety three, pre two thousand, pre two thousand and one.
2:52
Yeah, specifically because, Man, this movie, I'm pretty sure you would
2:57
not make if this was coming out in two thousand or even two thousand,
3:01
If this was November two thousand and one it was meant to come out,
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I think they would have just scrapped the whole thing. They would have just
3:07
I don't release this at all, probably and I'll be the one. I'll
3:12
throw myself right into the line of fire here. I would have thought that
3:15
to be a shame, because this is a movie where the discomfort for me
3:22
watching it this time is the fact that back in ninety eight it was not
3:25
such a radical proposition for Denzel to be talking about warrants and civil liberties and
3:31
all of that. And it's like the conversation changed considerably after two thousand and
3:36
one, and then Boy Boy Howdy when we repealed Smith Munt and then the
3:39
NDAA. And I'm not trying to get radical here or anything, but there
3:44
have been some changes about it. There have been some changes in the laws
3:46
where like you look at this movie and it's like, oh, well that's
3:50
quaint. Look, we were still concerned with those things back then. How
3:53
click. It's like when you watch hobalone and they're like, oh, look
3:55
at them all going together to the airplane gate or you know, basic things
4:00
like that that don't exist anymore, Like is yeah, yeah, well it's
4:04
it's kind of like what you know, you watch this movie and you have
4:11
this huge build up and this huge scene when they're when they're openly discussing,
4:15
man, we're going right into it, openly discussing torturing this individual, like
4:20
right in front of him, and Denzel is just in the corner. He's
4:24
he's kind of playing the audience there. He's like, what what do you
4:27
what are you talking about? Discussing this and it and he reminds them like,
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this is a US citizen, this is just a guy. Yeah,
4:34
that's that's That's the biggest part of it too, is it's like there,
4:39
and I'm not trying to be glib here, but like actually the premise in
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the very beginning where they you know, Bruce Willis orchestrates the abduction of the
4:49
guy, I can't help but sit there in my brain, and I'm like,
4:51
oh, this is a drone strike now, you know, Like,
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and I'm not saying that to be dismissive or to diminish that. That's just
5:00
how this movie would have started this time. It wouldn't have been, Oh,
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we're gonna abduct him to question him. It would be like, oh,
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they blew up his Mercedes and now people are mad about it. Like
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that's that's basically how it goes. And it's again I'm not being I'm not
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being clear and I'm not going for a punchline. The park and they drone
5:14
strike it, and people are more mad about Central Park being destroyed or attacked
5:19
than they are about this person dying, like or what oh look what it
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did to traffic? Like it's it is a It's a fascinating movie too,
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because I think both its strengths and its greatest weaknesses are in how it's trying
5:36
to approach the whole question. Like, and what I mean by that is
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when you deal with Denzel Washington's character Hub and Tony Schlub's character like, that's
5:46
a literal story, that's like, that's what's happening here, that's your procedural
5:49
drama. Yeah, but then when you get to the a net benning part,
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it's clunky and it's clumsy because she's metaphorically representing us foreign poul and it's
6:00
like as a results, it can't pick a lane as as a result,
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and like, I think that's that's the most challenging thing about the movie right
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from the outset, is the net betting stuff works if you're like, Okay,
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this represents something and then you look at the FBI investigation and you're like,
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this is something, right, and it's like two guys right, and
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it's so I mean, like I would ask you, guys, like the
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net betting role is it Should she have been more of a ghost, Should
6:31
she have been more of like a MacGuffin that they're chasing through the movie,
6:35
or like do you think it meshes as well as it needs to well,
6:39
because there's that twist. The twist is that she's been sleeping with the enemy
6:44
and has you know, and they kind of go for the redeeming sacrifice at
6:48
the eleventh hour of like oh she's like she's basically you know, dies for
6:54
her for say, you know, to save the you know, save civilians.
6:59
But yeah, it's it's a really interesting way of telling the story because
7:03
she's right there in the middle of their investigation and we're kind of meant to
7:06
trust her. But yeah, would that be different if she was more of
7:11
we We never saw them in the same room together, but we saw her
7:14
pulling her strings over here, and our guys are over here and we know
7:16
they're coming to a head at some point. I'm not sure if that would
7:20
be even better. What do you think, Tristan. I feel like a
7:23
Nett Binnings character should have been in the movie, just as much as Bruce
7:27
Willis's character. M I feel like she shouldn't have been. She should have
7:32
not been in the in the picture more than Tony Shalhoub's character. It should
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have been much more on Denzel and Shalub together working the problem from a domestic
7:43
standpoint, and Anette Binnings character still represents what she represents. You know,
7:47
America's foreign policy, the CIA, and you know all the crap that they
7:53
that they do overseas and what they instigate, what they try to cover up
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and at the same time, what they're try to do well. And then
8:01
you have you know, and they just they encounter her along the way in
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the same way that Denzel encounters Bruce Willis along the way, like like you
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know, they have that back and forth with Elisa's character of can we trust
8:15
her? Can we not? Can we trust her? Can we not?
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And then we have you know, General Devereaux, which when we when we
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see him were kind of like, hey, this guy has a good head
8:22
on his shoulders, like he obviously has some sort of cabinet position, you
8:28
know, and that's why he's in a suit all the time. But he's
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still a general kind of like Colon Powell. And but he's and but you
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know his line about how you know, the army is a broadsword, not
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a scalpel. We need to rely on the on the FBI to do their
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job, and they were just like, as the audience, you're like,
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yeah, no, totally makes sense. Yeah, this guy was on d
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have has the best quotable lines of this whole movie, like the scalpel line.
8:50
The whole there's nothing more disrupted to the fabric of a nation of of
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you know, policing, you know, or occupying its own people. You're
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just like, oh man, and he delivers it, and it's it's I
9:03
almost yeah. As far as like how much he's in it. I mean,
9:05
I know he's in a lot of scenes, but it feels like,
9:07
you know, for two weeks, Bruce Willis showed up and shot all of
9:11
his stuff and then was out, Like it's so minor. And that's what
9:15
I feel like should have happened within net Benning because it, like John,
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I agree with you one hundred percent like her aspect, even though I like
9:22
her and I like what she represents, you know, le was Ebert's main
9:28
criticism of the film is that it got clumsy once once we got into the
9:31
investigation, it got really clumsy, And I think that's kind of a main
9:35
detriment to the film is that it tried to do too much with the politics
9:41
with CIA, with the with the military, with the FBI, with the
9:48
Islamic the American Islamic Association, it's just everything. It's just like there was
9:54
so much going on at once, and they could have really fine tuned the
9:56
CIA aspect, I think. I mean, this movie is under two hours.
10:01
It's very fast, and they cover a lot of time, like there's
10:05
several days of things going wrong for them. Well, no, I when
10:11
you said the two hours, it's interesting because that's something we all noted about
10:16
Glory as well, and you know, same director ten years later. Basically
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is this is the type of movie where it's like, wait, why isn't
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this two and a half or three hours? Give it thirty four minutes?
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Yeah, this feels like it needs more. While we're sitting there and we're
10:30
saying, oh, we should pull in that bending out, you could still
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proportionally keep her and Bruce Willis, you know, to the same percentage of
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that two and a half hours and then give instead of having her out with
10:41
everybody drinking and then pseudo seducing Hub or whatever, and instead focus on Tony
10:48
Shaloub pouring out his heart and talking to Hub about his fears and about where
10:54
this is headed, and those sorts of like give more to that. So
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it's like it's almost like it's it's suffering this identity crisis between action film and
11:03
epic drama, right, Like it's almost like those two things are being slacked.
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You. It's like we're trying to use some mirror as this point of
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view when really all of that should have been given to Tony Shaloup to frank
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like make him the representation not of like as a terrorist, but like as
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expanding on what we're already getting from him, where we're seeing his point of
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view. He's he's the man, he's you know, he's an FBI agent,
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but he's also you know, I mean man. The scenes he has
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where he's looking for his son are like the gut rush. Yeah, yeah,
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yep, yeah completely, And I agree with you, I think giving
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some more to the FBI agent sitting there saying, you know when when hub
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Hub could have a moment where he's like, well I don't get it,
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man, and then he could turn them and be like, what what do
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you mean you don't get it? It's like I get it. He's like,
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I chose to be here. I see the good and I'm working for
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the benefit. But like, how could you not understand why you know,
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these people over there are pissed off at us with this movie? This was
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kind of the vibe I got for it, which, let me know,
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if you guys agree, it feels like there are several poignant scenes that were
12:15
for sure like okay, well then this is this is gonna happen, and
12:18
then this is gonna happen, and then everything kind of between them kind of
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just is there. Meaning like, for example, the scene where all the
12:26
pagers start going off and they're in the theater and and you're like, something's
12:33
going down because all of the important people that are here are it's going nuts
12:39
like that. That feels like, okay, we have that scene, and
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then you know, it's like if you're fast forward in the movie and it's
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stopping on all these key moments, you almost don't kind of need the in
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between. Not that obviously you do need the in between, but it kind
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of feels like that. Did you guys either, You guys get kind of
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that vibe of kind of major points strung along a line. I don't know
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if I agree with that one hundred percent. I know what you're I know
13:05
what you're saying, and I get what you're saying because I think there's so
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many moments in this movie that are so great and memorable and cinematic moments,
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yes, very cinematic, And I mean, like, you know, you
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you chose the perfect example, like with the beeper's going off. What a
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brilliant way to convey information cinematically and with tension, and it just it This
13:31
is why movies exist. It's like scenes like this where you can just kind
13:33
of build that moment where nothing is said but everything is understood. And like
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the scene with even though even though this was it was a horribly irresponsible thing
13:45
to do, but when Denzel chose to go in alone to save the children,
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yeah, where he's just like the copter, the news is here.
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He doesn't want to repeat of the bus and he's just like superhero it over
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the barricade. Like but in a movie reality, what a cool scene,
14:03
you know, Like there it's you know, all those things building up to
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it. But I think that like the moments that you have like in between,
14:11
like you know, after Shloub, you know, hits some mirror in
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the face while he's in custody, and then you know, Hubbard takes him
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aside and says like they don't like this isn't the shield, you know,
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this isn't a showing effect again, Like I'm gonna have your badge, Like
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you're done. Like like Hubbard goes in, like he doesn't he doesn't write
14:33
him up, he doesn't fire him, you know, but he's still you
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know, law enforcement, they still cover each other. But he's like you
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do it again, I'm gonna have your badge, And he says like now
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you know you know, pretend I said something funny, you know, like
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we have those kind of moments in between, and so I think the only
14:48
time when I was really kind of like, Okay, what are we doing
14:50
here? Is when a lease was out for drinks with everybody else. That's
14:54
when the moment where I was just kind of like okay, like that type
15:00
I thought they got it right, they thought they got they got the cell,
15:03
or they did, they get one of the cell. He just didn't
15:05
realize there was more. And so there and then again they have the pages
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start to go off again, and it's like, oh, it's not it's
15:11
not over. But see that that all of these scenes, what they touch
15:16
on that I think is the most fascinating, slash uncomfortable sort of thing is
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I know that the one of the writers of the film said that this was
15:26
the most rented movie after nine to eleven or something like that. You know,
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I don't doubt I don't. He doesn't cite any statistics that I could
15:33
challenge in any way, So I'll just accept it as true. That's how
15:37
he gets the exactly sor anything. You can't countradict me. Yeah, I
15:41
can't prove him wrong. But the the The fascinating thing that it gets right
15:48
is everything that led up to nine to eleven is represented in this movie.
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Agency in fighting, refusal to share information back and forth, puppy guarding,
16:00
chains of custody, and then and then finally you're at the point where the
16:03
only way you can solve it is you have to have one strong presence come
16:07
in and overrule everybody else. And it's like it that's what makes this,
16:11
I think, a movie that, for any of its flaws, to my
16:15
mind, remain ageless because it reminds you of no matter how well you build
16:22
your bureaucracy, it's still a bureaueer rocket. That's what we thought. We
16:26
thought with the changes, well yeah, we thought with the changes we made
16:30
post this era, we were like, that'll solve the problem. And all
16:33
it did was it just made them big problems that were on different levels.
16:37
Like it's like we just added a layer of similar problems on top of it,
16:41
and it's like, you just can't solve it by creating more offices for
16:48
people to sit in and trade emails and get mad at each other about why
16:52
didn't you share your your witness with me? Yeah, well that chocolate bar
16:56
that I left in the park was designed specifically to lure somebody. Well,
16:59
I didn't know that. I was hungry at the time. Like, what
17:02
we need to do is create a new department that could protect right the land
17:06
that is our home. I think that's what we need to do. Like
17:10
if we do that, if we had another agency, maybe we could name
17:12
it something like that. I'm not sure, but that would solve all the
17:15
problems. That was one thing that I really, I think appreciated more as
17:18
I got older about this movie, you know, because I saw this pretty
17:22
young, you know, when it came out in ninety nine, I was
17:25
I was thirteen. You know, I didn't understand anything, you know,
17:30
when it came to the boom yeah school, yeah, yeah, yeah,
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yeah, I didn't. I didn't understand anything when it came to inter office
17:38
bickering or like interagency bickering and everything like that. Because I think this movie
17:42
does it really well, really well where you know, you're rooting for the
17:45
FBI just because they're the protagonists, you know, like we're it's that protagonist
17:51
syndrome where whether you like the FBI or not, that's who you're rooting for
17:53
while watching this movie. But to see the CIA as an antagonist, to
17:57
see the military as an antagonist, to see the White House as an antagonist,
18:02
and how they should all be working together for one common goal. It
18:06
does not work that way. There's not an American goal. It's the like
18:11
I said, it's the White House, CIA, FBI, Military, it's
18:15
everybody's working for themselves. Speaking of the White House, there was a little
18:18
bit of a hubbub in the nineties from movies that started using President Clinton either
18:26
press conferences or in the case of Contact, where they digitally took him out
18:29
and made him appear in the movie and stuff like that. And personally,
18:33
I think they were just angry that he didn't get a SAG card and residuals
18:37
after the film. But like, do you think that helps the movie or
18:42
do you think that it illustrates Like I'm firmly of the opinion that it roots
18:48
a movie so much in its own time that it can never escape it to
18:52
take the actual sitting presence event I can never Like I would prefer a phony
18:59
president that I can just play forty disagree, Oh, I completely disagree.
19:03
Okay, I'm more on John's side, Like it did kind of take me
19:06
out of it a bit because I'm like, oh, oh yeah, okay,
19:08
way back in the Clinton era. Okay, like it it's like in
19:14
love actually where they may year drop. Hey, it's miss dunkin Donut two
19:18
thousand and three. Every time I hear that, I'm like, you just
19:22
pulled this movie into the past. It was just it could have been any
19:26
time in the last couple decades, but you just pulled it to the beginning
19:30
of the millennium. But what do you mean? But I don't think that's
19:33
necessary with this film. I think this is the type of film that is
19:37
very much rooted in the time that it's made. Like even though this movie
19:41
has timeless themes, unfortunately, this is a movie of nineteen ninety eight.
19:48
Like this, this is post ninety three, pre two thousand and one.
19:52
And I think it really goes to show that when we see it and we
19:56
see the Clinton era, you know, this is pre Bush, pre Obama
20:00
and and everything like that, and and post Bush, post Reagan and and
20:04
everything like that. So like when we when we see that, it shows
20:08
us how far we've come and how far we haven't come, And it makes
20:12
it makes you think in a different way, like if this was if they
20:17
didn't tell you what year it took place, if you know, they weren't
20:19
using flip phones or whatever, and they had you know, Morgan Freeman as
20:23
president and you know and everything like that. Like I feel if they tried
20:29
to disguise what year it was, I don't think it would hit the same
20:33
way. I don't think it would. It needs. Some movies need to
20:37
exist in its time, and this is one of them. And I feel
20:40
like there are certain times when if you just use I like it when they
20:45
like just mentioned the president, or we see an image of the president,
20:48
or we just see like a press clipping or something like that, something real
20:51
subtle, not not even that far, not even not even that far,
20:53
like if we just see like him on CNN, and is you know,
20:56
like they repurpose a clip like I think one time they did that Gore where
21:00
like Gore was giving a speech on something completely different, but they used one
21:03
line from it to apply to something else and like in for All Mankind or
21:07
something like that. And you know, I like that because it roots in
21:11
reality. But then every other time that he's mentioned it makes it feel more
21:15
real. It's kind of like when you see a movie uses real anchors.
21:21
Like like from CNN or MSNBC and things like that. I feel like it
21:25
it adds to the realism of it because when you see a fake president,
21:29
you're like, no, that's a fake president. Okay, we're now in
21:30
a fictional reality. I mean, I guess I would follow into the case.
21:33
I understand what you're saying. Still don't really agree with it because of
21:37
the fact that the having the actual president. I think it just it's for
21:42
my money. If I'm a producer, I'm like, Eddie baby, no,
21:45
no, we're cutting that because I would actually just cut any footage of
21:51
the president because we know the press the president will be there, so like
21:56
have a press secretary or a secretary of Stefon or something bringing down the safe
22:00
room as the president. Don't even mention it. Yeah right, okay,
22:03
yeah I could. I could. I could go with that, Like I
22:06
would go with that more than a fake president person. Yeah, I would
22:08
too. Look at us build and compromiselle, this is good, well building
22:14
bridges there you go. I think they're not putting tanks on them. That
22:18
The thing that you said, though, Tristan, that I think is really
22:21
important in looking at this movie is like you said, it's a post I
22:27
often forget how much of a post Oklahoma City bombing movie it is because it's
22:33
so overshadowed by nine to eleven. Like we started talking about that at the
22:36
very beginning of this podcast, like you can't not but that hasn't happened yet,
22:41
and so yeah, this is six years time, meth You know,
22:45
after six or seven inch years, that's enough time for Hollywood to like make
22:48
a movie about that kind of topic and kind of bring it out, you
22:53
know, of the Oklahoma City bombing, Like I feel not that it didn't
22:57
happen, but nine to eleven so overshadowed Oklahoma like it was off the radar.
23:03
As when I think of like domestic terrorist events in America, I do
23:07
not think of Oklahoma City, like I remember it vaguely from my elementary school
23:11
days. But so yeah, so in that post Oklahoma City era and then
23:18
yeah, they're writing this story, they're taking it up. You're in New
23:22
York now. It is kind of interesting how again, as you're saying,
23:27
not rooting it in an era or a year yet any shot of the skyline
23:33
where you see the two towers, you kind of know that it is pre
23:36
two thousand and one. Some editions digitally removed twin towers. Yep, not
23:41
everyone missions would make it. Apparently there apparently there were, there were no
23:48
post nine to eleven. They did that with movies sometimes where they would oh,
23:51
I thought you're talking about this movie. No, No, they digitally
23:53
removed the twin Towers from the skyline in some of some of the versions they
23:59
release this of the Siege. Yes, I haven't remember that. I hadn't
24:04
heard that. I watched, so I watched the Blu ray of this,
24:08
and I'm still there. I'm sure it's I'm sure that the versions looking at
24:14
now rings probably, but there were that. It's just you know, it's
24:18
I never saw a version where it took them out, but like so weird.
24:25
But the thing is that's that was what they were doing for a while.
24:27
There was a big debate about that when after nine to eleven happened,
24:32
whether it be you know, gosh, I think it was like the Michael
24:36
Douglas remake of like dial M for Murder or something like that, where they
24:38
recut the opening so that you wouldn't see the twin Towers before they released it,
24:42
because I remember the Spider Man changes. But yeah, that's the only
24:47
one I know. Now. You know, obviously they've walked that back with
24:52
the Siege and movies in general. But yeah, that this was one of
24:55
those ones where they tinkered with it for a little bit and then you have
24:57
Spielberg's Munich that slaps you in the face with it in the very last shot.
25:03
Yeah, the Twin Towers where they added in Yeah, yeah, not
25:08
the most. Yeah, this was so as we're since we're still you know,
25:11
we talked a little bit about the story at the beginning. We haven't
25:14
really got into the editing or the direction or acting even really we haven't really
25:18
done that. And I say that, but one more time, we're going
25:22
to talk about the the extra stuff outside of this film. This film did
25:26
not do well financially, I think one of the writers and one of the
25:30
producers. I mean, like you said, it was a flop because people
25:33
were pickting it beforehand, like you know, Muslim Americans were picketing it and
25:37
really pissed that the movie came out and everything like that. And you know,
25:41
both Aswick and the writers and the producers have all commented on it,
25:45
and there's nothing new to say, you know, like movies like this exist,
25:48
you know, like movies like Showcasing. You know, uh, terrorists
25:52
who who is oh oire Islamic you know exist in several movies, and this
25:59
this movie no different to me. It was really interesting to read that after
26:04
the fact, because when I watched this movie, I know that there are
26:08
morons out there who are just looking for an excuse to initiate a hate crime
26:14
and like to get angry at something like, you know, like they'll watch
26:18
something fictitious about a Muslim terrorist and then just you know, go out and
26:22
cos mayhem and strife and everything like that. And I was surprised to see
26:26
this movie cited as a negative because when I watched this movie, I didn't
26:33
see that in the least. I thought this movie went out of its way
26:36
to showcase how the Muslim Americans you know, were persecuted under martial law and
26:45
unrightly unjustly so, and how the leaders of the Muslim community in the movie
26:51
participated to help, you know, like the agencies, you know, to
26:55
find the bad guys. And I was at like, whin two thousand and
26:59
one happened, When nine to eleven happened, I was actually the one who
27:03
was telling my friends and family everybody watched the Siege because this crap could happen,
27:08
and we need to not blame our Muslim American brothers on what like,
27:15
on what terrorists are doing, you know, like it's not synonymous, like
27:18
Muslim America is not synonymous with terrorists, and so like, I thought that
27:21
this movie was was showing a good thing, and so like when you guys
27:25
saw it in ninety eight and when you saw it today, how do you
27:27
interpret that message? And now, granted, people who are listening, we
27:32
are all you know, white, you know, born and bred American Christians
27:37
and so like, we do not have an inside track on that. But
27:40
as that people, as people from those demographics, how do you take that
27:44
message back then to today? No, I I listen. I think that
27:49
this movie you know, your own words, goes out of its way to
27:53
not portray a group in a bad way, to like illustrate and if anything,
28:00
that guy's the general because he's the one that is behind the inciting incident
28:03
for the whole thing, like it lays it at the feet. And every
28:06
time I think we don't have him, I'm like, dude, we saw
28:07
the opening scene. I know you have him, Like and I think I
28:12
think honestly that it's a reaction to This movie is rooted in the same sort
28:22
of reactionary reflex that every time there's a movie that deals with theme about Christian
28:30
faith or any you know, anything at all, and people are like,
28:34
oh, of course, Ollywood's doing their thing again, and it's like,
28:37
well, did you see the movie to judge it? And I think Tristan
28:41
you hit on the fact that people were picketing it before it even came out,
28:45
and it's like, well, how can you picket something? And now
28:48
a full disclosure on the type of guy that's picketing to have anything get released,
28:52
because you know, that's the only way anything good gets made is artists
28:56
have to have the freedom to do whatever the hell they want to. Don't
29:00
like it? And I think that I do. I think it's a reactionary
29:03
reflex that spurred that on and had people with a sober mind sat down and
29:10
watched this film, even if even if they watched like a work print,
29:14
I don't know how you could possibly walk away from this film and be like,
29:17
yep, paint it all all Arab Muslims as bad people. It doesn't
29:22
It very specifically says basically specifically points at Annette Benning and Bruce Willis. It
29:29
is like they're the a holes everybody. They're the ones that caused this problem
29:33
when you really boil it down, and it's like, yeah, is Samir
29:37
also a bad guy? Yeah? He is? Yeah, So like you
29:41
know, there there's the complexity in it, like is anybody more evil than
29:45
anybody else? No? Like that, And that's the point of your protagonists,
29:48
right, you know, Denzel Washington and Tony Shaloub, they're the heroes
29:53
and you see that that in a typical sort of story fashion. They're the
29:59
good people surrounded by evil people and how does the system? You know,
30:03
like they're fighting the system. If anything, I would have liked to see
30:07
them get a little more dispirited by the end to realize that they are the
30:12
exception to the rule. Might be a little bit movie tropeish, might be
30:17
a little bit expected, but yes, this might have been a movie that
30:22
called for Denzel Washington turning in his badge at the end and saying, screw
30:26
this, I'm not going to take any part in this anymore. I don't
30:30
think it's satisfying for the audience because then you really feel like you're lost.
30:33
But instead we get him arresting the general, and it's like it all becomes
30:37
jurisdiction. You get the guns aiming at each other, scene of like you
30:41
know, stand down, captain. Yeah, but I think what you said,
30:47
Tristan, it's a cautionary tale really like that that is the Siege pre
30:52
nine to eleven, post nine to eleven, both like it's is the world
30:57
we live in of sticking our fingers into other countries and other people's and and
31:04
I think the fact that it was New York City definitely relates a lot with
31:11
nine to eleven. But it could have been La, it could have been
31:12
Chicago, could have been any other major city with this happening, and it
31:18
still would have been the same message of like you said, that's really the
31:21
message is this isn't everybody, and often the dangers come from within. Absolutely.
31:29
I do want to say that this, in my opinion, is a
31:33
wonderfully edited film. This is like I was just kind of in awe and
31:37
how well this movie was paced from scene to scene, from shot to shot.
31:45
Specifically, how the truck you know, filled with explosives driving to one
31:51
Federal plaza intercut with the tension the you know, the tension building intercut with
31:56
the DC scene where everybody's around the circular table and talking about bringing the military
32:01
in for martial law. Like how that was cut together was just so well
32:06
done. Also ballsy on the producer's point for using a van that way,
32:12
you know, post ninety three in New York. And also like the the
32:17
use of slow motion during the first bus explosion and the non paint explosion,
32:24
and also the use of fake slow motion during the school scene. You know,
32:30
like it just it worked both ways in order to give you a certain
32:35
feeling. And it's just there was never a time when I was watching this
32:38
and I was thinking, oh, you know, I that's why did they
32:40
cut to that shot, or like this scene needs more coverage, or I
32:44
have no idea where I am geographically. This was probably one of the best
32:47
edited films, honestly, I've seen in a long time. Well, and
32:52
especially since a lot of the locations weren't landmarks. It's not like, oh,
32:58
there's a bomb in Time Square. We all know roughly where Times Square
33:01
is, or the Central Park or the Statue of Liberty or but yeah,
33:07
the first actually, like you said, actual bomb on the bus, not
33:12
the paint. I love the it's not Peyton switch, but like the surprise,
33:17
like the fact that it's oh it's working. Oh I'm talking them down.
33:22
Oh they're letting people off, and then boom and just it ups the
33:28
stakes. This movie you said, you know it was well edited. I
33:31
think that just leads into story wise, like the way stakes are risen,
33:36
the way we realize, Like, I think it's good that they have that
33:39
whole discussion about what is it going to be if we bring in the army
33:45
instead of just okay, time for martial law. It's like, no,
33:46
let's talk about this first, and so we as the audience know what this
33:52
is. And then couple that with Bruce Willis's again got all the great lines
33:58
and the great speeches when he's giving that ultimatum to the television cameras and he's
34:02
basically laying out like how we're going to search the city and like you can't
34:07
hide from me. Is terrifying, it is. And yeah, they're just
34:13
so well told in this story, just but maybe a little less little less
34:19
a net betting. I think we're well, let's, you know, go
34:23
through some of the I think we've talked a lot about Bruce Willis let's talk
34:27
about a net betting for a second, because yeah, I think I kind
34:31
of agree with the direction we're kind of going of. More sparingly would have
34:36
been nice. I don't like the ending with her in it personally. I
34:42
feel I don't know if it's overacting or underacting. But when she's like yelling
34:46
at him to shoot her, like I am kind of over the scene,
34:52
and I'm not like, what is going on? What is happening She's it's
34:55
like she's yelling in a in an acting class. It doesn't it falls a
35:00
part for me, and I almost I sound desperate enough it Yeah, it's
35:05
the wrong kind of pain. It's like again we're and they're trying to do
35:08
this whole switch of her redeeming herself by sacrificing herself. I don't know,
35:15
it's too little, too late at that point. I think that's the moment
35:20
where the metaphor struggles, because you know, we all agree she's metaphorical for
35:23
blah blah blah blah blah. And then at the end it's a very real,
35:28
like in that moment she suddenly flips over into the more literal, procedural
35:34
stuff that's going on. I think that a stronger ending would have in all
35:38
honesty, not that I was there and not that I've ever made a big
35:44
budget movie or anything, but if somebody had asked my opinion, I would
35:47
have made her more chilling and had them solve it, have them die,
35:52
and then have somebody be like, well, you know, I know you
35:55
were hooked up with it, and just like e her be ice cold,
35:58
like whatever, he's dead. It's kind of another day at the office kind
36:01
of thing. Yeah. And then like she goes off and you see her
36:04
get in a car with another guy. You know, that's like someone pulls
36:07
up, she gets in a c I you know, it's like and I'm
36:10
not saying like another guy like flippantly, like another semere type of guy,
36:15
where she just like goes off and it's you know, nothing's changed, right
36:19
exactly. She's just moving on to the next samear and whatever problem that causes,
36:23
that's fine that I'll work itself out too. There. Yeah, that's
36:27
the thing. There didn't need to be this story of regret. There didn't
36:31
need to be this oh my gosh, like we left them to die and
36:36
everything like that. It was just that's a lot of telling not showing that
36:38
whole dial like where she's like, oh, well we did like when they
36:42
dropped the shoe towards the very end and she's like, well this, we
36:45
did this, and we did this and then we did this. And I'm
36:46
like, Okay, we're in New York dealing with this right now, but
36:52
sure we can talk all about the past, because I think the scene where
36:58
they just blew up the federal building and Denzel and his crew and his in
37:02
his team, what's left of them is in the hotel and then a lease
37:06
comes in and he is he is just having none of her crap, like
37:09
he is just done with her. He said, He's like it's like you
37:13
know what what time? What time? Twenty four hours to win? You
37:15
know, like he's just he's absolutely fed up with her. That scene is
37:19
way more interesting having an antagonist back and forth with them, like where they're
37:23
supposed to be on the same team but yet they're yelling at each other.
37:25
That is way more interesting than her pouring out her heart and soul, you
37:30
know in the car where she's talking about how like like we didn't we didn't
37:34
kill them directly, we just left them to die or something like that.
37:37
Like that scene I think John, I think you hit it on the head
37:39
where instead of making her emotional, even in that scene where she's talking about
37:45
like how we just left them to die and she said like yeah, I
37:47
mean like we didn't, we didn't drop the bombs, you know, like
37:51
it was we just had no use for them anymore, or something like that,
37:53
like have her be like, yeah, that's that's my sociopath. Yes,
37:58
a sociopath. Yeah. Yeah, that would have been far more interesting
38:00
and realistic and representative of our foreign policy. Yeah, I mean, it's
38:07
it's the tricky line that I think that this walks though, is the fact
38:12
that it does allow you to know that it's a function of I mean,
38:16
I think that would go even more to the fact that these levers of power,
38:22
when operated by somebody like Denzel Washington, are perfectly fine. It's when
38:27
somebody like Elise is pulling the lever that things are wrong and illustrating that like,
38:34
none of these people that were interacting with were elected by anybody. They're
38:37
just there. This is just their career, and it's like, oh god,
38:40
if if you hire the wrong person, oh no, what are the
38:45
cut you know, like you know, I mean, it's it's one of
38:51
those things where it's like, you know, I just there's so much about
38:54
it that I want to love in this in this film, but it's just
38:59
it's that one character that struggles with I also think that it the jump for
39:06
Bruce willis it's not as clean as it could be, Like he's very very
39:12
much human being, doesn't want to do it sort of thing I would have
39:16
to iye am probably well. I would have probably had him go in a
39:22
little more humanely gently into Brooklyn and then have something bad happen where some of
39:27
his troops got hurt and that's the moment where he's like, fine, I
39:30
tried being nice. Now I'm a dictator and everybody goes suffer. Like I
39:36
needed an inciting moment to flip him. Instead, it's just he gets power
39:40
and then all of a sudden he's nuts and it's like, yeah, no,
39:44
let's let's give him something where we play on that fact we've seen him
39:49
as a reasonable human being, something that pushes him over and you realize that
39:52
because he's military, right, he has two modes human or bomb them.
39:58
And it's like and then they somebody does something that pushes him over. I'm
40:01
gonna I'm going to go ahead because I feel like this is one of those
40:08
things where because I okay, okay, I'm gonna like have disagree, have
40:13
agree, and I'll explain myself. So the like him going in full force,
40:17
putting tanks on the Brooklyn Bridge, announcing his plan to the entire world
40:22
and via the news, that's so bad ass to say, like this is
40:25
how we're gonna do it, this is how we're gonna find you. He's
40:28
not being coy because he doesn't have to be. The United States Military doesn't
40:32
need to be coy because he is the broadsword, he's not the scalpel,
40:37
and he's not worried about them hiding because they're already hiding. He's going to
40:39
find him. So to me, the idea that he is that individual he
40:45
is like you don't want to do this, you know, like the M
40:46
sixteen is lousy, is noisy, Like it's going to be in your it's
40:51
going to be in front of your bowling alley, in front of your church
40:53
and everything like that. You don't you don't want it there, You don't
40:55
want me to do this. But to me, like he's that type of
40:59
person is like I truly did believe him when he said that, But then
41:02
when the president orders him to declare martial law on Brooklyn, He's like,
41:07
Okay, I am going to declare martial law on Brooklyn. That's how I'm
41:12
I'm not gonna half asset like I have all of this and this is how
41:15
I'm gonna do it. What I don't agree with with the character is when
41:19
he tortures the guy, not by not using non invasive means like this is
41:24
this is going to sound so disgusting, and I hope you guys just stay
41:28
with me. But the idea that he could have tortured him by wad aboarding
41:32
him instead of cutting him and making a mess and then killing him, why
41:37
they kill him? Why they kill him? You know, like like that,
41:39
That's what really doesn't make sense to me. And why did Bruce willis
41:43
general gender role freakin' Devereux put have literally bloody hands, Like why did he
41:50
need to do that himself? And why did he pull the trigger to kill
41:53
him? That's what felt weird to me. That was a story trying to
41:59
make it so that Denzel could get the general at the end, but see
42:02
Wayne handcuffs. I think maybe either I over communicated what I what I meant
42:07
by him going in a little bit softer, I'm talking about, sure he
42:12
can declare martial law. I'm going to go in and get and then maybe
42:15
give him a scene where he's like, look, I don't really want to
42:17
do this, Guys, this I'm you know, like he steps off of
42:21
stage basically and he's like, ah, you know this, this really sucks,
42:24
and then have something that makes him that guy that the inciting incident I'm
42:29
talking about that turns him into the guy that shoots someone in Okay, saying
42:35
the same thing I think Tristan is saying in the movie that part was kind
42:39
of portrayed by the before he takes over. That's his resistance, his or
42:44
his reluctance. And John, you're saying even after they put him on boots
42:49
on the ground, an extra scene that kind of like flips that switch.
42:52
And I agree. I mean, it's kind of what we got and what
42:53
we would like, you know. So I think I understand what you're saying.
42:58
Now we are saying the same thing like that, Like you're not talking
43:00
about like once martial law begins, it's once he gets to the torturous point.
43:05
There needed to be something that pushed him to that edge. Yes,
43:07
Okay, okay, yeah, we are saying the same thing. Yes,
43:10
but just like my questions when I'm hosting, you're just stating it in a
43:14
better way. So it's true exactly. That's why I'm here. And it's
43:17
interesting, Like I don't know about you guys, the vibe I was getting
43:22
from Frank and hub as the FBI agents in a way like the CIA slash
43:30
government or the CIA slash military. They were kind of like the FEDS,
43:35
and the FEDS were kind of like or like the FBI was kind of like
43:38
the New York cops, you know what I mean, Like they like like
43:42
they're kind of trying to act like they're just working the beat, but they're
43:45
FBI agents. They're not like they're not just detectives. Like we're just gonna
43:51
take every player of you know, NYPD Blue. We're just gonna up it
43:53
a couple of notches in like political power. That's basically what they did.
43:59
But but see that that would have a longer film, would have given at
44:04
least a scene to the local. Right, there was enough officers, you
44:07
know, it's like we're gonna come a here, We're gonna do this and
44:09
then the police shaef be like shut up, police chief. At least I
44:13
get that scene where it's like he tried to say something but they just told
44:16
him to shut up. So he's like, well, what do we do
44:19
with this, you know, martial law, Like well consider it a break,
44:22
go on vacation, go go chill. It's like, what of course
44:25
not, it's play Dominant's over there. Their said he's getting bobbed, like
44:30
they're going to react. One thing, one thing that I liked was during
44:34
the bust scenes, they were trying to say like, okay, get the
44:37
negotiator here, and he's like, oh, he's stuck in the bridge,
44:39
right, like he's stuck in the tunnel or something like that. And so
44:43
that's why they got Denzel to do it, Like they weren't trying to say
44:45
that. You're like, oh no, like he would he would negotiate this.
44:49
So like, no, no, like that's that's not would they give
44:52
a plausible reason for that. And he's obviously our protagonist, so that's that's
44:55
the real reason why he's doing it, and it connects him to that moment.
45:00
But also at the same time, like when they raid the house that
45:06
Elise is holding the mule in party. Was just like, would the members
45:09
of this counter terrorism team be the ones, you know, like knocking down
45:15
the door and like having like, you know, having the machine guns.
45:20
He always does everything on if that's the level of the show we're watching,
45:23
it's like they get to do everything, and it's like this is h so
45:27
they get to do everything. It's one of those things where I'm just like,
45:29
now, I'm pretty sure they have people who are devoted to that kind
45:31
of thing. Like you know, at the FBI, they're in the tunnel.
45:35
Gotta go. Everybody's in the goddang tunnel. Why do we build so
45:39
many tunnels? Well, the Lincoln Tunnel is pretty intense. From what I
45:43
understand. It's like in Dark Knight Rises, send every cop underground, every
45:47
single policeman in the entire Gotham city. That's not a good idea, sir,
45:52
I don't care, go do it all right? Well, yeah,
45:57
it was so funny. It's like, last time I checked, we were
45:59
all twenty five minutes in. It felt like we talked about everything in the
46:01
broadstrokes of this movie. And now but we before before we close up,
46:07
before we close up, we got I gotta ask the question, where did
46:09
you guys sees Wick in this because some of us knows Wick better than others.
46:15
But you know, we have one, we have one movie so far
46:19
before we watch this, so now we have two that was almost twenty years
46:22
before, right, So like, is there is there any you know?
46:27
John, I'm gonna ask you this question because I know that you you've seen
46:30
your fair Shriff's Wick movies. Is there anything that screams out to you when
46:35
you watch The Siege where you go, Yes, that is Edward Zwick.
46:39
That that is good old Ed's wiki. I this movie. I would never
46:44
call him Ed's Wiki, but if I'm looking, I would say that if
46:49
just going with with the text of these two films is he's definitely a fan
46:55
of I don't know how else to put it, but like the the protagonist
47:01
thinking expression shot if that makes sense, you know, like there's a consistency
47:08
in that you look at Youl Matthew Broderick's character is, and the way that
47:14
Denzel Washington's character is, and when we know who clearly our main character is,
47:20
so to speak, he's sure to give that person time to expressively reflect
47:27
that there's an inner monologue and so he picks certain moments in certain shots to
47:34
make sure we focus on what they're telling us with their face nonverbally. That's
47:38
what. That's where I would see something. This isn't something where like I
47:43
could sit down with a Christopher Nolan movie and'd be like, well, the
47:45
way he saturates the colors here and blah blah blah blah blah blah, and
47:47
the way we like our cool cyan wa wash here and blah blah blah.
47:51
Like it's nothing like that. This is this is something where it would be
47:57
that. That would be the thing that I would say if I were to
48:00
be looking really hard for a calling card, that would be it with Zwick.
48:06
Yeah. Also, I want to say I'm terrible with time math.
48:08
Nine years later, not twenty. I don't know what I was thinking early
48:12
nineties, late nighties all that to say, yeah, I'd say you kind
48:16
of nailed it earlier, Tristan. As far as just kind of the basics,
48:22
like knowing where we're at, Like we talked a lot about that in
48:25
Glory, Like you never felt like where are we now? We're over here,
48:30
we're crossing the line. So are the guys over there? Are they
48:32
over here? Like I always and I didn't think about it at the time,
48:37
but looking back on the siege, Yeah, even though we're not in
48:40
highly recognizable New York locations, we realized like where we are and what's going
48:45
on, and there's tunnels everywhere that we got to get out of, you
48:50
know, all that stuff. But yeah, I'd say Wick is just an
48:53
excellent visual storyteller and building tension. I mean, there's a lot of tension
49:00
in Glory. There's a lot of like unspoken tension. Like he's like the
49:05
master of that of really just showing certain things. Be at the pagers,
49:09
be it, you know, just I don't know, I kept I kept
49:15
kind of flashbacking to Diehard Free as far as the big broad strokes of someone's
49:22
terrorizing and we're trying to find them, and you know, and like they
49:25
had like going after the school. Like again, lots a lot of similarities
49:30
in that, but in this it it was so well done in how he
49:37
communicates just the tension of the moment, the way people are feeling. And
49:43
I mean we mentioned on it with frank Tony Salub's character. Give that guy
49:47
ten more minutes, ten more minutes of amazing period of time. And you
49:52
would have and you would have given some nominations or something because he was nailing
49:57
it. He brought so much heart, an energy and even at times levity,
50:02
you know, like he was just less Benning marshal loop. Yeah,
50:08
it's pretty that's my review. That's pretty much it. Have you liked how'd
50:14
you like the Siege? Well, less Benning more Shalup. I don't know
50:15
what that means, but well, listen to house Lights you'll you'll get it.
50:20
Benning wasn't even in the marvelous Missus Mazel. Why are you even saying,
50:24
let's Benning Morshaloup. This is strange? Ah? Well yeah, and
50:30
again like that was fun this seeing this again now that I've seen shows like
50:35
Miss Mazel or Monk where Tony Shloub's had like powerhouse acting turnive forces, and
50:43
it's just like, yeah, put the guy in more things, you know,
50:45
from Galaxy Quest to Siege. He just will not let you down ever.
50:50
Yeah. He he is absolutely one of those actors that I think gets
50:53
gets when people know who he is, recognize him as an actor, They
50:59
love him, they adore him, and he gets plenty of recognition from people
51:02
who pay attention on that level. But to the general public where you're like,
51:07
hey, don't you like Tony Shaloub who like in essence, it's uh,
51:12
I would put him in the same category as And trust me, I
51:15
mean this is high, high, high praise, but the late great JT.
51:20
Walsh, because when that guy showed up on screen, I was like,
51:22
all right, all right, I got at least one fantastic performance in
51:25
this movie. Awesome. I know that guy showed up to work. Good,
51:30
thank you. That sort of thing. Also, any movie, every
51:35
movie is better with Lance Riddick than it would have been without Lance Riddick.
51:39
That is true, that that is an accurate statement. I love seeing him.
51:44
I forgot he was in this and seeing him walk on, I was
51:46
like, yeah, just another character actor that you know. Again, Yeah,
51:51
every time you see him, you're like, oh, okay, you
51:52
guys, you're like you knew who you needed to bring in and again,
51:58
like it ever leading guy that I can think of, but totally committed every
52:04
time. And if you ever need more Lance Reddick in your life, especially
52:07
you know, since his passing and we find out that he's a huge Star
52:10
Trek fan, it's a crime that he was never in Star Trek watch Fringe.
52:15
He is freakantastic in French. Yeah, I agree with you, he's
52:21
fantastic in Fringe. But for me, I The Wire was the first time
52:24
I ever encountered him, and he was freaking amazing in that show, Like,
52:30
ridiculously amazing in that show. I mean even in Young Sheldon, Like
52:34
he's just Yeah, he's been in so many things. You got me thinking
52:37
now putting him in Star Trek. I think he would have been amazing in
52:44
the opening of Star Trek two thousand and nine as the original captain of He
52:50
would have been great of that ship. On the name Farragut. Yeah,
52:53
the Farragut, like the guy. No, it was the Kelvin, not
52:58
the Kelvin comes Kelvin. Yeah, I don't know. You're right, Okay,
53:04
yeah, I know why I said, I yes, you're I know
53:07
you're right. But Darren's making a point. Who cares? But I mean
53:10
not just because he's bald as well, but I think he would have been
53:15
amazing in that in that role, you know, a tiny blip role,
53:17
but yeah, more Now, now you want me to talking about two thousand
53:22
and nine and like I love that guy, like I love that guy who
53:25
plays no, nothing wrong with But if I had to insert this is the
53:30
game we're playing in certain lands into other movies, oh listen, I I'd
53:36
say, go big or go home. If you want to put him in
53:37
a Kelvin Timeline movie, and I know people roll their eyes, they'll grown.
53:42
I had have cast him as Cohn before Benedict Cumberbatch. He'd have been
53:45
a fantastic I thought you were going to say, Pike, are you going
53:49
to put him as Pike? I would work there too. But see,
53:51
this is the testament to Reddick is like put him in I'm like, yeah,
53:55
I would have made him a vulcan and we would have I think science
54:01
mystry dropping some vulcan logic. That would have been a solid choice too.
54:06
But again, right, what attestament to the guy's skill is like, there's
54:09
none of us going like no, I don't see that. We're all like
54:12
yeah, that one too, that one too, that one to No,
54:14
we were I feel like I've pissed myself off because I feel like we were
54:17
robbed culturally of him not being a vulcan in Star Trek. But this is
54:22
why he'd be smiling too much, because he'd be having so much fun being
54:25
on Star Trek that he could help it. But see this, this is
54:30
why the AI video generator has been created. Is now Tristan, we can
54:35
live the dream and put him into every Star Trek movie that we want to.
54:38
Oh on that note, that's the age. All right, let's any
54:46
let's do final thoughts and ratings on this movie. We're going to start with
54:51
you, Tristan. It sounds like there are some highs and lows and some
54:54
questionable thoughts on this. Well, we're going to rank the Siege. We're
55:00
coming up on an hour here, so I'm gonna keep it really brief.
55:02
I love this movie. I think it's fantastic. I think this is a
55:06
great film. This is justice. It's still family favorite. Sorry, this
55:08
is not a family fri of it. Oh my gosh, No, my
55:12
mother would not be watching this film. She'd be too stressed out. No,
55:15
with this film, I loved the first time I saw it. If
55:20
I was to give this an emotional rating, it would be a four and
55:23
a half and a five. And I kind of came into this conversation with
55:29
a four. But after talking with you guys and kind of like, you
55:31
know, kind of disconnecting my emotional brain from my moral analytical brain, I'm
55:37
given this a really solid three and a half. Like on letterbox, it's
55:42
going to be a three and a half in a heart like I love this
55:44
film. I think it's fantastic. I think it's really powerful. But there's
55:46
a lot of core things that are wrong with it. I think that's the
55:51
thing. Like if it was just like a few things or just like oh,
55:53
you know, like oh this line was kind of weird, or we
55:55
didn't need this scene, or the pacement was kind of off, it could
55:58
have been a four or more. But the fact that there's some like really
56:02
clumsy stuff with the metaphors and with a netpinning and everything like that, it's
56:07
just like, yeah, three and a half for me, I agree the
56:10
whole is greater than the sum of its parts. In this case, I
56:14
will return to this. I will always rewatch it. I will always have
56:17
deep affection. And I think Denzel Washington is fantastic. And I don't know
56:22
what I'm gonna do the next with the next movie, because he's not going
56:25
to be in it, and it's gonna be like it's gonna be it's us.
56:30
It's gonna be like somebody not showing up to a party where I'm gonna
56:32
be like, where is he anyway? Like what's going on? Man?
56:37
But so But yes, like Tristan said, with analytical brain instead of emotional
56:42
brain, three and a half. Yeah, looking back at our statistics,
56:45
this is the sixth movie in a row that's at Denzel Washington, and it
56:51
has been a hell of a run. It has not a single bad performance
56:57
in the lot. Well, so I still don't give half stars. So
57:01
for me, that three and a half I would ticket up to four.
57:06
I can't take it down to three. It's I think that's just also for
57:09
the fact that, like I could pick out a dozen scenes from this movie
57:15
and show in a teaching film class and be like, this is how you
57:17
build tension, this is how you introduce a villain, this is how you
57:22
get people on the side of protagging. It's like all it's all there,
57:25
like it's wonderfully wonderfully told. Yes. Does it have missteps? Yes?
57:30
Is it too short? Do we want you know, want more of this
57:32
actor list of this actress. Yeah, that's all true, But I can't
57:37
give it a three. That's too middle of the road for this. I
57:40
own it. That always gives it a little bit of a pump just if
57:44
I'm willing to purchase it to watch. So yeah, that's that's the siege.
57:50
So next week we're gonna jump into the next decade as we're doing our
57:53
decade by decade with Edward Zwick and we're going to oh three, the Last
57:59
Sammer, sadly not with Denzil Washington. Here on house Lights. Join the
58:06
Revolution, Join the nerd Party.