Latest / Aspergers & Autism Podcast [The Aspie World] AuDHD / Navigating Autism In Life Insight Into Autistic Lives

Transcript

Navigating Autism In Life Insight Into Autistic Lives · Aspergers & Autism Podcast [The Aspie World] AuDHD

• 0:00
  You have arrived. Welcome to the Aspy world.
• 0:04
  Here's where we talk about anything and everything ASD in
• 0:07
  an upbeat and informative way. And now here's your man on the
• 0:11
  spectrum. Your autism ambassador, Daniel
• 0:15
  Morgan Jones glad what's going on?
• 0:20
  Welcome back to another Saturday live.
• 0:22
  I know it's probably it's not Saturday right now and it it
• 0:25
  should be Saturday when you watch this video.
• 0:26
  But you know me. Hey ho, what's going on?
• 0:28
  It's down here and I have a fantastic guest and they've been
• 0:31
  a friend of mine for quite some time, I think probably since
• 0:34
  they started on social media, right.
• 0:36
  And this it is purple Ella. You probably may have seen some
• 0:41
  of their videos or if you're hiding in a rock somewhere, you
• 0:44
  probably have never seen their videos.
• 0:46
  But great videos, a lot of packed content.
• 0:50
  I want to talk all about their journey and everything to do
• 0:52
  with them. So Ella, would you like to take
• 0:54
  it away and tell us a little bit about you and and who you are?
• 0:57
  Yeah, hi. Thank you for inviting me, Dan.
• 1:00
  Yeah. And so I'm Ella, known commonly
• 1:02
  everywhere on the Internet as purple Ella.
• 1:05
  And I received a late diagnosis of autism after the diagnosis of
• 1:10
  my child, one of those people, and then was diagnosed with ADHD
• 1:15
  about two years ago. So multiply neurodivergent.
• 1:19
  I actually received a dyspraxia diagnosis in childhood as well.
• 1:21
  So I've always been in the neurodivergent camp and I have a
• 1:25
  background as a performer. So it kind of made sense to me
• 1:29
  to combine the skills that I had with my complete and passionate
• 1:34
  interest in autism and then ADHD and kind of put the two together
• 1:38
  and start making videos. Mostly because I, I guess I like
• 1:42
  to think of myself as one of the oldest people talking about
• 1:44
  autism on the Internet. And I feel like that, that
• 1:48
  demographic of people that were diagnosed, you know, really
• 1:50
  late, late 30s, forties, 50s, needed someone who'd been
• 1:55
  through the things that they've been through.
• 1:56
  And so I decided to do it and make that be me.
• 2:00
  And it's it's been a lot of fun. Amazing and it's super
• 2:02
  important. I think that type of, you know,
• 2:06
  I, I was diagnosed at 26, which is still relatively young when
• 2:09
  you consider to people in the faces of folsage, right?
• 2:12
  And so, you know, I have a demographic for those people who
• 2:15
  who listen to my concept, but in, in terms of your, your kind
• 2:18
  of niche demographic, that is still such a voice that needs to
• 2:21
  be heard. You know, I, I hear so many
• 2:23
  stories are so similar to yours. And I just think, Oh my
• 2:26
  goodness, you know, And so it's great that you can share that
• 2:28
  kind of journey and that and the stories of the stuff you've been
• 2:31
  to, because there's so much value to add to people, right?
• 2:33
  And then, and that's really, really good.
• 2:35
  So your main platform, What are your main platforms?
• 2:39
  My main platforms at this point are YouTube and TikTok.
• 2:43
  YouTube kind of deliberately, and I think we actually met in,
• 2:46
  I'm going to say 2016. I remember that what actually
• 2:49
  happened was that I put out a tweet being like, I want to do
• 2:52
  YouTube, but it's too scary and I can't do it.
• 2:54
  And you very kindly came back to me and set up a Zoom session and
• 2:57
  basically helped me have the confidence to go ahead and do
• 3:00
  it. So thanks for that.
• 3:02
  You're welcome. And then I went on Tiktok for
• 3:04
  kind of a laugh, really. I just thought, you know,
• 3:06
  pandemic like everyone else. And that's kind of grown.
• 3:09
  And I'm really enjoying that as well.
• 3:11
  But I also put a reasonable amount of content out onto
• 3:13
  Instagram. I think I, I see most of your
• 3:16
  content on Instagram every now and then I see YouTube stuff
• 3:18
  off, but I think Instagram is kind of like, I don't know what
• 3:21
  it is something like like I feel like you fit really well with
• 3:24
  Instagram and and Tiktok. I don't know what it is.
• 3:27
  Maybe it's maybe it's the type of content because it's quite,
• 3:29
  it's quite diverse across those two platforms, which is really,
• 3:32
  really good. We actually met in real life as
• 3:35
  well. We, we did, we've done quite a
• 3:37
  few things, haven't we? Together now?
• 3:39
  But we were talking in the the Autism Show, I think in.
• 3:43
  It was 2017. I came up to Manchester to
• 3:46
  speak. That was the one, yeah, yeah.
• 3:48
  Manchester. Yeah.
• 3:49
  I'm actually there this weekend. Are you talking in the
• 3:51
  Manchester one this week? No, I managed to completely mess
• 3:54
  that up. I was invited to speak at the
• 3:55
  autism show, got the dates wrong.
• 3:57
  So I was going to be away. I'm actually not going to be
• 3:59
  away. But obviously everything's, you
• 4:01
  know, sorted now. So no, not this year, but I hope
• 4:03
  it goes really well for you. Oh yeah.
• 4:06
  Well, it's first one back since the pandemic, so I'm very
• 4:07
  excited about that. But yeah, it's just, it's all,
• 4:10
  it gets a bit crazy when I do the autism shows because we get,
• 4:12
  so we want to kind of take selfies and talk and stuff and
• 4:15
  that kind of, it takes up a lot of like, especially when we did,
• 4:18
  we did Birmingham the last time, I think it was 2019.
• 4:22
  And, and it was just this like, I don't know, a hundred, 200
• 4:27
  people just like queued up and it was like, Oh my goodness.
• 4:29
  And a national. So it's excited to kind of come
• 4:30
  in and help organise it. It was just a bit crazy, you
• 4:32
  know, it was chaos. And I wasn't burnout for about a
• 4:34
  week afterwards. It was just nuts.
• 4:36
  So we've kind of got a plan for this one.
• 4:37
  So hopefully fingers crossed is going to be a bit more smoother.
• 4:41
  And yeah, but yeah, it was really fun actually when I met
• 4:44
  you and I was like, Oh yeah. And I always remember, yeah, it
• 4:47
  was like, it was like purple. And it was really cool because
• 4:51
  yeah, we did that session on Zoom.
• 4:52
  It's, oh, might even Skype back in the day, not.
• 4:55
  Even have been Skype. Yeah, I remember it was you had
• 4:58
  like really no kind of prior motivation to help out this
• 5:01
  random stranger on the Internet. So that's always kind of stayed
• 5:04
  with me that you put in the time to help me with that.
• 5:06
  Yeah, you know what it it was, I think, you know, because I
• 5:08
  started on YouTube until the 13 and I had no idea what I was
• 5:11
  doing. And I wish somebody had told me.
• 5:13
  And so when I see people who got the the the gap will go and say
• 5:15
  like, I want to do something. I just need a bit of, I'm like,
• 5:18
  look, I'll, I'll help you, you know what I mean?
• 5:20
  Like, why, why wouldn't that, you know what I mean?
• 5:22
  Like if we're all trying to get along in the day against me,
• 5:24
  it's not a competition. No, it's a community.
• 5:27
  And so it's kind of like, how do I, how do I help as many people,
• 5:29
  you know? That's why, you know, I love
• 5:31
  doing that. So yeah, you're more than
• 5:32
  welcome. You can always have a refresher
• 5:34
  if you ever want to catch up again.
• 5:36
  It's so much more stuff to talk about.
• 5:37
  But anyway. I think I'm kind of set.
• 5:40
  I'm kind of happy sitting on YouTube.
• 5:42
  But yeah, yeah, I definitely feel like I ran with the advice
• 5:44
  that you gave me and it wasn't. Yeah, yeah.
• 5:47
  And you know, to be fair, nothing which has changed, you
• 5:49
  know, we do, it's pretty much the same thing.
• 5:51
  Each is basically the same, but we all bore everybody.
• 5:53
  We are technical nonsense. So.
• 5:56
  So tell us about I would also know about the, the, the, the
• 5:58
  autism process that you went through, the diagnosis process
• 6:02
  and what it was like, especially later on in life.
• 6:04
  I mean, like, how did it feel? I don't know, sometimes talking
• 6:07
  about feeling, but like how? What were your thoughts during
• 6:10
  that process, that time period? Well, I guess, I mean, it's kind
• 6:13
  of wild when you think that I, you know, went to university,
• 6:16
  got married, had three children and started a career completely
• 6:19
  unaware that I was autistic. But I was suffering from quite
• 6:23
  significant mental health problems as a lot of people who
• 6:25
  are late diagnosed end up, you know, doing, which is always
• 6:29
  side note, my argument for why diagnosis is important,
• 6:32
  essentially. And every time I'd seen a
• 6:36
  psychiatrist, they'd genuinely been quite puzzled by me because
• 6:40
  as you know, I'm quite an upbeat person.
• 6:42
  But I was telling them that I was struggling and it just kind
• 6:44
  of didn't make sense to them, the things that I was
• 6:46
  describing. And then I had children and my
• 6:50
  eldest child was displaying some real kind of stereotypical
• 6:54
  traits, I guess of autism, you know, lining things up, spinning
• 6:56
  wheels, echolalia, stimming. So she, she was diagnosed and
• 7:03
  even then I didn't really think anything of it because we do
• 7:06
  have older autistic members in our family.
• 7:09
  So I just sort of thought, Oh well, you know, it's, it's kind
• 7:11
  of comes through from, from granddad essentially.
• 7:13
  It was an engineer, shockingly. And yeah.
• 7:17
  And then literally one day I was kind of driving her somewhere
• 7:21
  and I'd, I'd planned on parking in a particular spot.
• 7:25
  And when I got there, the whole of that parking area had been
• 7:28
  turned to residence only parking.
• 7:30
  And I that had what I now recognised as an autistic
• 7:33
  meltdown because I could not figure out what to do in the
• 7:36
  absence of the plan I'd already made.
• 7:38
  And in that moment, literally, I went, Oh my God, I'm autistic.
• 7:41
  It was a real kind of lightning bolt moment.
• 7:43
  And of course then I went through the like, I mean, what
• 7:45
  are you being ridiculous? But you know, state, yeah, yeah,
• 7:50
  exactly. Like, have I lost my marbles and
• 7:55
  spoke to my friends and all my friends were like, Oh my God,
• 7:56
  did you not realize? Thank.
• 7:59
  You so much, yeah. Yeah.
• 8:01
  But then, yeah, I think I was really, really lucky.
• 8:03
  I went from kind of that realization to accessing an
• 8:06
  assessment and a diagnosis within three months, which is,
• 8:09
  you know, on the NHS. Completely miraculous at this.
• 8:12
  Point Yeah, that really is miraculous.
• 8:14
  Yeah, yeah. So I was lucky.
• 8:15
  So I didn't have that period of time where I was kind of self
• 8:19
  diagnosed again, if you like, which is why I really try to
• 8:21
  support the self diagnosed community because I feel like
• 8:24
  that would have been really, really hard.
• 8:26
  And yeah, and the guy that assessed me basically was like,
• 8:28
  well, this is not going to be a hard one, is it?
• 8:31
  You know, read into that what you will.
• 8:33
  And then as I'm sure you know, Dan, then there's a quite a long
• 8:36
  period of time, isn't there a processing that?
• 8:39
  Yeah, yeah, that's, that is a long process.
• 8:41
  And also I feel like there was the, it's not just the
• 8:44
  processing, it's the processing and updating people, you know
• 8:47
  what I mean? And I feel like, and it sounds a
• 8:49
  bit weird of being people, but you know, say to your parents
• 8:51
  or, or seeing kind of like your family members or whatever.
• 8:54
  Like so this is, I've been to see it here and kind of like,
• 8:59
  and then they, they kind of go, oh, you know, it's kind of like
• 9:02
  one of those things, one of the things they found most
• 9:04
  interesting with, with my personal diagnosis.
• 9:06
  And I'd love, love to know if you had this kind of experience
• 9:09
  is I told some people I'm like, I love that treat you any
• 9:10
  differently. And they have this kind of weird
• 9:12
  attitude, like they know best for you.
• 9:15
  And it's like you're not listening to the point here, you
• 9:19
  know? And I found it quite, almost
• 9:22
  kind of they dismiss it. They dismissed it, you know,
• 9:24
  they said, oh, you're just you and you just, and that's it.
• 9:26
  I'm not cheating any differently.
• 9:27
  You don't come at me with these labels.
• 9:29
  And I was like, oh, OK. And it was just a bit, that was
• 9:31
  a bit of a backhand slack, really.
• 9:33
  Did you come across anybody like that?
• 9:35
  Yeah, yeah, definitely. I mean, I'd already encountered
• 9:37
  that with having been given kind of mental health diagnosis of
• 9:39
  like, oh, you don't need a label, blah, blah, blah, blah.
• 9:42
  But my take on it, I haven't given it quite a lot of thought,
• 9:44
  is that people are kind of trying to reassure you that
• 9:48
  you're OK and that they accept you in a bit of a backhanded way
• 9:52
  of like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. But you're, but you're fine and
• 9:54
  you're just the same as everyone else when they don't realize
• 9:57
  that what they're actually doing is invalidating the challenges
• 9:59
  that you've had. Yes.
• 10:02
  That's a perfect way to say it. I've I've had that and, and it's
• 10:05
  yeah, nobody says, nobody speaks about that.
• 10:07
  But so thank you so much, Allah, for saying that, that that is a
• 10:10
  perfect. That's exactly what it is.
• 10:12
  They they're, they're, they're they're qualifying your what
• 10:15
  you're saying. But they're also taking away
• 10:17
  the, the, the, the not the power, but the, the, the, the
• 10:21
  accreditation that you've just given, right?
• 10:23
  They qualify and take it away. They'd say, yes, I understand,
• 10:25
  but you know, you're fine, you're OK, you know you're doing
• 10:28
  well, aren't you? You say, what are you talking
• 10:30
  about? Like it's not for you to assess
• 10:31
  really, is it? I think it says more about what
• 10:34
  their view of what autism is is than it does about you, because
• 10:38
  they obviously see autism as being a negative label.
• 10:41
  Yeah, So they don't want to. It's like the equivalent of
• 10:44
  saying, Oh yeah, yeah, but you don't really smell.
• 10:46
  You smell fine, right? But we know that that's not the
• 10:50
  case and that autism is, you know, a positive label for
• 10:53
  people like us. Yeah.
• 10:54
  Yeah, yeah, definitely. And I, but I think a lot of that
• 10:57
  kind of does stem from maybe when, when they think about
• 11:00
  autism, they've probably seen quite, you know, kids with
• 11:02
  severe difficulties or severe needs or they'll have a mixed
• 11:05
  complex, you know, maybe they'll have global learning disorder
• 11:08
  with like physical disability and autism.
• 11:11
  You say it's, it's kind of like, you know, they, they, they don't
• 11:14
  see it from where, where we're coming from.
• 11:17
  And then when we say about it, then they're just like, oh,
• 11:19
  well, that's not what I hear. You know what, it's kind of a
• 11:21
  bit like, well, it's not for you to decide really.
• 11:23
  And I always say those people when they kind of like, oh, I
• 11:25
  wouldn't, I wouldn't know, you know what I mean?
• 11:27
  I wouldn't know what are you talking about?
• 11:29
  Like, are you a clinical psychiatrist?
• 11:30
  Are you a doctor? No, so shut up.
• 11:32
  Like move along, you know what I mean?
• 11:33
  It's like, and I'm quite blunt with things like that.
• 11:35
  You know, I don't really care to be honest with you.
• 11:37
  It's because it's, it's kind of like you either you either
• 11:41
  understand what I'm saying or move on, you know what I mean?
• 11:44
  And that's kind of, that's kind of it really.
• 11:46
  Yeah, absolutely. I agree.
• 11:47
  But I think there's like a wider picture there, isn't there?
• 11:49
  And picking up on something you said earlier of people wanting
• 11:52
  to tell us what we need, I think there's a wider picture there of
• 11:56
  wider society, businesses, you know, hospitals, wherever it is
• 12:00
  that we go kind of going 0. Autism is this and therefore
• 12:03
  autistic people need this without recognizing.
• 12:06
  And I think that the absolutely best autism training we can give
• 12:09
  the world is like, autism is this, but learn about the person
• 12:14
  you're talking to. Don't have assumptions. 100%
• 12:18
  it's the it's the speak to them directly and see what they need.
• 12:21
  It's that that's rough. Really how you'll get the best
• 12:23
  out job was funny. I had I was doing AI think I did
• 12:27
  a presentation. I was doing a consultation with
• 12:29
  somebody and they and they asked what's the best way I can
• 12:32
  support this employee in the city And someone just ask them,
• 12:36
  you know, it doesn't take a genius to figure this out.
• 12:39
  But people have, like you said, they have this pre kind of this
• 12:42
  notion that they think that there's going to be a simpler
• 12:45
  solution to just blanket everybody the same and say, oh,
• 12:47
  this is this is what they need. They'll just do that.
• 12:49
  But there's more, there's more, there's more individual kind of
• 12:52
  like issues that that you'll need to address.
• 12:55
  So moving on slightly, you're you're married and your husband.
• 13:01
  Are they nearer diverse or? No, I'm married to a
• 13:05
  neurotypical person, which is good in that he's really great
• 13:10
  at making phone calls for me and you know, that kind of stuff.
• 13:15
  But it does come with its own set of challenges because, you
• 13:19
  know, if you look at Doctor Damien Milton's theory and the
• 13:22
  double, the double empathy problem, obviously in a marriage
• 13:26
  with someone who is neurotypical, we come across
• 13:28
  that, you know, that communication problem and that
• 13:30
  difference in processing and, and, and that can be
• 13:33
  challenging, but, but it's great.
• 13:36
  You know, we've been married for gosh, I think it'll be 21 years
• 13:38
  next month. Wow.
• 13:39
  Congratulations. Thanks.
• 13:42
  Wow, what a fantastic time. So, so how, how's, how had the,
• 13:46
  how did the diagnosis impact your marriage or your
• 13:50
  relationship? Did it it's all or, or was it
• 13:52
  kind of like a, yeah, let's you know, it's awesome.
• 13:54
  We understand it now. It wasn't kind of like a, was
• 13:56
  there a transitional period where they had to kind of like
• 13:58
  your husband had to really understand what was going on?
• 14:00
  Because when I was diagnosed, I actually didn't know anything
• 14:03
  about autism, which is really funny because I literally knew
• 14:06
  nothing about it. And I was like, oh, you know,
• 14:07
  stressed upon this thing. I'm like, you know, there's
• 14:09
  always panic attacks. And then to my partner, it was
• 14:12
  kind of like, what does that mean?
• 14:13
  You know what I mean? So we had an interesting time.
• 14:15
  What was it like for you? Yeah, so.
• 14:17
  Oh, sorry, just to be switching the board.
• 14:20
  So you're you're you were with your current partner before you
• 14:23
  were diagnosed. OK.
• 14:24
  So you went through kind of a similar thing?
• 14:26
  Yes. Well, I mean, I would say I'm
• 14:29
  not sure we'd still be married if I hadn't been diagnosed.
• 14:32
  It's definitely been that kind of significant because you know
• 14:35
  you can't, you keep hitting those same communication
• 14:38
  barriers without really realizing you're hitting them
• 14:41
  because you're both misunderstanding each other, but
• 14:43
  not necessarily recognizing you're misunderstanding each
• 14:45
  other. So just rowing essentially.
• 14:48
  Once we were diagnosed, he was able to learn about autism.
• 14:52
  He went to us through a few autism support group things for
• 14:56
  like partners of autistic people and he didn't really kind of
• 15:00
  find that very helpful because he was like, I don't really want
• 15:02
  to go and moan about you once a week in a room with a bunch of
• 15:04
  other people. So that was reassuring that, you
• 15:07
  know, he obviously enjoys being with me.
• 15:10
  But yeah, I mean, it's been, it's been a very long learning
• 15:13
  process. I've had my diagnosis now, but
• 15:15
  what is it? 7 years maybe.
• 15:17
  And we're still learning about how that works between us.
• 15:22
  But but with that learning and with that, like, energy comes
• 15:26
  like a really great, deep understanding and love for each
• 15:29
  other That's, you know, that's amazing.
• 15:30
  And he always says, my husband is someone who gets bored
• 15:33
  really, really easily. So he always says that, you
• 15:36
  know, I'm like, oh, my gosh, you could have married someone
• 15:38
  really much more straightforward than me.
• 15:40
  And he's like, yeah. But then I just got bored.
• 15:42
  You always keep it interesting. So that's.
• 15:44
  Good, that's awesome. Much Made in heaven, sounds
• 15:47
  like. Yeah, for sure.
• 15:48
  Oh. Definitely.
• 15:50
  So how do you, like, how do you get stuff done?
• 15:54
  Like I'll be blunt, how do you get shit done in a day?
• 15:56
  I have ADHD and a Nordson diagnosis and I have OCD as well
• 16:01
  and I'm dyslexic. I mean, it's just a whole kind
• 16:03
  of cake of nonsense. Sometimes I'm just like, I just
• 16:05
  carry it out. But yeah, so to like, you know,
• 16:10
  things like executive function and an organization and getting
• 16:13
  things done and, and meeting appointments and getting work
• 16:15
  done and organizing my team and it's our family, you know, going
• 16:19
  to eat. How do you do all these things?
• 16:21
  What? What are your kind of hacks?
• 16:22
  Oh gosh, I wish I had a magic cancer.
• 16:24
  If you I really did, I would say getting that ADHD diagnosis has
• 16:27
  been really helpful so I did. Wasn't diagnosed with ADHD till
• 16:30
  two years ago, even though I had such a classic ADHD.
• 16:33
  Really, really strongly getting that diagnosis and to be honest
• 16:38
  with you, getting the meds that accompany that diagnosis has
• 16:40
  been really, really helpful. Because before, what I recognize
• 16:44
  now is before I was spending three times as long to do the
• 16:48
  same amount of stuff because I was so chaotic in my approach.
• 16:52
  So when I got my ADHD diagnosis, I spent like a year trying to
• 16:55
  develop the perfect organizational system.
• 16:57
  Like every IDHD, it does, right? We actually do stuff.
• 17:00
  I'll just work on the system that will.
• 17:02
  Make lists for lists. Yeah, yeah, exactly.
• 17:04
  I tried all the computer programs, you know, Notion and
• 17:06
  then bullet journaling and all this and that.
• 17:09
  And essentially what I've come up with is the really most
• 17:13
  straightforward thing in the world.
• 17:14
  I literally get up in the morning and I write a manageable
• 17:17
  To Do List and I write my schedule and I figure out where
• 17:20
  that stuff's going to fit in. And I use Pomodoro technique,
• 17:23
  which is where you set a timer for a certain amount of time,
• 17:26
  turn your phone off, don't do anything other than what you're
• 17:28
  doing. And I kind of do that and chunk
• 17:30
  the day like that. And there are days when that
• 17:33
  works and I'm really efficient. And there are days when I find
• 17:35
  myself suddenly doing something that was not in the plan and go,
• 17:39
  hang on. Well, I just lost two hours in
• 17:41
  Stardew Valley. This was not what I was supposed
• 17:43
  to be doing. It's like rolling with the
• 17:45
  punches. I think.
• 17:46
  And have myself compassion that you're going to get it wrong
• 17:49
  sometimes. Yeah, yeah, Don't beat yourself
• 17:51
  up right, right. Yeah, I get, I get that.
• 17:53
  And I, I totally, I sympathize as well.
• 17:55
  And I, I'm very much a tech guy, so I have to use, even though I
• 17:58
  have made analog lists to kind of get stuff done.
• 18:00
  But, but, but one of these apps I use called streaks.
• 18:04
  It's fantastic. Actually.
• 18:04
  It kind of like it does that thing you put a task on and it
• 18:07
  makes this timer for you. And so it kind of locks your
• 18:09
  phone to Oh, I do, I put a focus mode on my phone and I and I
• 18:12
  have this visual like task countdown thing so I can get so
• 18:16
  that, that is really good. I think that, you know, since
• 18:20
  you're doing that as well, I think that's probably is where
• 18:22
  we kind of most the ADHD peeps will kind of go to that form of
• 18:28
  procedure to kind of get things done.
• 18:30
  But I do agree as well, medication is a godsend.
• 18:33
  I mean, like honest to God, like I, I started medication really
• 18:37
  late in my diagnosis. I started in 1020.
• 18:42
  At the same time as me then. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, just
• 18:45
  January 2020. And I, I've never honestly like
• 18:50
  the, it's like night and day, you know, like, so I, and I get,
• 18:53
  and another thing is like, because I couldn't get focused
• 18:56
  on stuff, I get, I get really depressed because I couldn't
• 18:59
  learn the things I wanted to learn.
• 19:00
  And, and I get really kind of like a little tone of mood.
• 19:04
  And so it, it was just like this horrible cycle of kind of going
• 19:07
  in and out of the crash. It was horrible.
• 19:09
  And then as soon as the medication kicked in and I kind
• 19:11
  of documented it on YouTube, I was like, I'm going to start it
• 19:13
  now. I'm not like, I'm being
• 19:14
  skeptical of medicine. It's just, I didn't want to take
• 19:16
  metaphor, but I didn't really feel like I needed to.
• 19:17
  But they came to a point where I was like, OK, something's got to
• 19:21
  give, you know? And, and I just, and my son was
• 19:23
  born in 2018. So I had this little kid who
• 19:25
  really needed me to really be focused, you know?
• 19:28
  And so I was like, oh goodness. So I was like, let's try
• 19:31
  medication. And you're not amazing.
• 19:33
  Like I can't even, I'm just like, wow.
• 19:35
  And I'm not advocating for people to take medication, just
• 19:37
  saying that if it works for you, it works for you, you know, And
• 19:39
  I think that to me, and I, and I agree with what you're saying,
• 19:41
  like the same people that work well with it.
• 19:43
  And I think, I think that's a good thing.
• 19:45
  I think that's a really tricky thing when you talk about meds,
• 19:47
  don't you? Because for me, as well as the
• 19:49
  sort of focus aspect, I've also been given a level of emotional
• 19:52
  regulation that I've never had before, which has enabled me to
• 19:55
  stay calm enough to do work. So I suppose it helps me focus
• 19:58
  as well because I'm not weeping on the floor twice a day.
• 20:01
  But when you talk about medication, you've got to be so
• 20:03
  careful. Haven't you just sort of say,
• 20:04
  you know, it's not for everyone? I'm not a doctor, I'm not
• 20:07
  advising people to take meds. There is definitely anecdotal
• 20:10
  lot of people on a on ADHD meds kind of saying yes, it has
• 20:14
  changed my life. So it's it's OK to share that,
• 20:17
  right? Yeah, of course there's the
• 20:18
  reason it exists, doesn't it? I mean, if it didn't work and if
• 20:20
  it didn't work for anybody, then it wouldn't exist.
• 20:22
  But, and that's the thing, like, and I always say it's like, it
• 20:26
  may work for some people, may not work for us.
• 20:27
  And it's, it's a personal, personal journey, but it's nice
• 20:29
  to share that with other people who've been on a similar
• 20:31
  journey. So changing the, the Cedric
• 20:34
  slightly. I, I was reading an article
• 20:37
  recently about the autistic community and how that 74% of
• 20:44
  the autistic community roughly are part of the LGBTQ plus
• 20:50
  community, right? And I was like, wow, this is
• 20:52
  super interesting. Now I came across some of your
• 20:55
  videos. I think it was one of your
• 20:56
  videos. I think I had coincided and I
• 20:58
  was like, wow, this is awesome. You said that you had come up as
• 21:00
  being non binary and I was like, wow, this is so powering.
• 21:04
  This is so cool. And and I commented I think on
• 21:07
  that saying, you know, this is awesome, This is great stuff.
• 21:10
  And so I was really intrigued and, and wanted to kind of talk
• 21:13
  to you a little bit about that and talk about, you know, how
• 21:16
  has, how has coming, coming out as non binary or, or finding
• 21:20
  that identity for you? How, how you, how have you found
• 21:24
  that, you know, publicly and, and how, and how do you feel
• 21:27
  about it within the autism community?
• 21:29
  Have you found that there's a lot of this type of crossover in
• 21:32
  the autism community? Yeah, well, I mean, it's been a,
• 21:35
  it's been a real journey. I would say.
• 21:36
  Actually, my journey through to discovering my gender identity
• 21:39
  has been more intense and overwhelming than discovering I
• 21:42
  was neurodivergent, to be honest.
• 21:45
  Because I think that as a neurodivergent person, I learned
• 21:50
  quite early on that people would be more comfortable if I masked
• 21:53
  a more traditionally feminine persona, right?
• 21:58
  And so I think even in my early days on YouTube, I was very much
• 22:01
  trying to be, I suppose, the girl next door, if you like, you
• 22:04
  know, quite a wholesome girl because I felt like that's what
• 22:08
  people wanted from me. And I felt like if I and then
• 22:11
  when I started to realize I was non binary, I basically realized
• 22:13
  I was non binary because my eldest child came out as trans,
• 22:17
  she is trans. And through that I obviously
• 22:21
  ended up meeting non binary people, learning about different
• 22:24
  gender identities, like going in deep into the whole kind of
• 22:27
  gender identity stuff stuff. Yeah.
• 22:30
  And my initial reaction to non binary identities, I'm ashamed
• 22:33
  to say was, well that's not a thing because everybody feels
• 22:35
  like that, which is such a like in the closet.
• 22:39
  Because yeah. And over a couple of years I
• 22:44
  explored that more just inside my head, you know, and kind of
• 22:46
  realized that, yes, the person who wore a suit to university
• 22:50
  balls would not wear anything feminine until the age of 25 and
• 22:53
  basically hated the feminization of my body.
• 22:57
  It was probably non binary. But even when I realized that, I
• 23:00
  didn't make it public for another couple of years.
• 23:02
  So I've known for a long time, but I felt more scared to put
• 23:06
  that out on the Internet than I did talking really openly about
• 23:11
  autism, ADHD and mental health struggles because there is so
• 23:14
  much backlash. So yes, I made a video about
• 23:18
  autism and gender identity because that was the next
• 23:21
  logical step in which I came out as non binary.
• 23:24
  And I learned from that video that yes, it does appear that
• 23:28
  there are a larger number of people who are autistic or
• 23:32
  neurodivergent in some way and don't have a traditional don't
• 23:37
  identify with their sex assigned at birth.
• 23:41
  But we have no idea why at this point, essentially there has not
• 23:45
  been the research done. So it's kind of my theory, which
• 23:49
  is based entirely not on science, is that we tend to
• 23:54
  conform less generally to social constructs, and gender is a
• 23:58
  social construct. So it makes sense on that level
• 24:01
  that autistic people would be a little bit as confused by gender
• 24:05
  as a social construct as we are by the notion of saying, hi, how
• 24:08
  are you? I'm fine, thank you.
• 24:10
  You know, Yeah. So.
• 24:13
  But I did get a lot of backlash. I would say I've had a lot more
• 24:15
  hate from the Internet on account of talking about my
• 24:18
  gender identity than I have on account talking about my autism.
• 24:22
  Holy smokes, have you found that it's people from the autism
• 24:25
  community or people outside of that that are giving?
• 24:27
  You the hate. I mean, I don't really delve too
• 24:29
  far into who it is when I get the nasty comments.
• 24:31
  I just kind of go, oh, gosh, OK. And initially.
• 24:34
  So I think it's probably both because I always say it is
• 24:37
  possible to be both autistic and a Dick.
• 24:40
  Sorry. Can I say yeah, Of course you
• 24:41
  go. You say that.
• 24:42
  Yeah. No, no, it's fine.
• 24:43
  It's fine. Yeah, I love.
• 24:45
  It so you know, it doesn't mean that because you're autistic,
• 24:47
  you're going to not judge another minority group, right,
• 24:50
  especially one that you don't understand.
• 24:52
  So I would say it's probably like in the real world, it's
• 24:54
  probably both, but the general kind of I think it's a similar
• 24:59
  kind of hate to the hate associate.
• 25:01
  It was all as you get in a way which you trying to special or
• 25:09
  trying to the, you know, you want attention, you're doing
• 25:13
  this for attention and you're doing it to be special.
• 25:15
  And that's really, really hard when you're talking about
• 25:17
  something that essentially I had an eating disorder because of my
• 25:21
  non binary identity. So it you know, it wasn't like
• 25:24
  this will be fun. It was I have to do this to feel
• 25:27
  kind of in my own skin, you know?
• 25:29
  Yeah, I, you know, it's, it's so, it's so interesting because
• 25:32
  like up until like a few years ago, we, we really didn't know
• 25:36
  about kind of like gender densities and, and what could be
• 25:38
  possible. So it must have been so
• 25:40
  difficult for a lot of people who were like, huh, what's going
• 25:44
  on here? And and feeling quite ostracised
• 25:46
  from society because they didn't know how to envision themselves
• 25:51
  on a social kind of level, Which is it?
• 25:52
  Which is how you, you know, come, you know, how, how do you
• 25:54
  intensify? Like you're a punk rock scene or
• 25:57
  a skating scene, You know, you jocks or sports people are all
• 26:00
  the freaks in school, you know, all this kind of stuff.
• 26:02
  And then you have these, these outside of kind of like
• 26:05
  childhood in school, you have, you have a bigger issue.
• 26:09
  Where am I in the world? You know, who, who, who am I as
• 26:13
  a affronted human being? Because we're all inherently
• 26:16
  human. I mean, that's just the basic
• 26:18
  notion of being alive. But where do you where do you
• 26:21
  identify? I think like, that is seriously
• 26:23
  super interesting and it just absolutely fascinates the heck
• 26:26
  out of me. So here's a question.
• 26:28
  How did your husband respond to that?
• 26:30
  Because it's like another thing, you know, he also doesn't,
• 26:33
  Anderson, don't buy anything. He's like, Oh my goodness, what
• 26:35
  else is next? Yeah, that's basically, Yeah.
• 26:38
  Well, before I I kind of came out to my husband and the
• 26:41
  Internet on the same day, being an ADHD or I was like, well,
• 26:45
  right, I couldn't. What?
• 26:46
  Yeah. What's the best time?
• 26:47
  Yeah, What's the best time right now?
• 26:49
  Yeah, but I was really, really nervous about approaching that
• 26:51
  conversation because like you've just said, it was just like, Oh
• 26:53
  my gosh, could this get anywhere for him?
• 26:58
  But, you know, I don't think it's that surprising.
• 27:01
  When he met me, I was a Skinhead who wore suits to university
• 27:05
  balls. So it's not like I've ever been
• 27:08
  a traditionally femme person, and it's not like he ever.
• 27:11
  I was also in a relationship with a woman when he met, so
• 27:14
  it's not like he's ever no, he always knew that was on the
• 27:16
  LGBTQ plus kind of community, but I was a little bit worried
• 27:20
  about that. But he, you know, continues to
• 27:23
  amaze me with his support and was basically like, you know,
• 27:26
  you do you. I, you know, have absolutely no
• 27:30
  problem. I want to support you.
• 27:31
  I understand. I've seen the struggles you've
• 27:33
  had with your body dysphoria. And if this makes you feel more
• 27:37
  comfortable, I'm absolutely going to embrace it.
• 27:40
  So yeah, I just feel really fortunate in that respect.
• 27:43
  Love it. He sounds like a great guy.
• 27:46
  Well, you can see where you guys revised.
• 27:47
  It's so, so long. That's beautiful and you know
• 27:50
  it's all about being happy at the end of the day.
• 27:51
  I mean, I shouldn't care what anybody wants to identify as
• 27:54
  really, as long as they're happy and not hurt anybody.
• 27:56
  Just do it. You know, like who you are, who
• 27:59
  you are, Just just embrace that and just be like, yeah, I'm
• 28:01
  going to do me. Hopefully everyone just deals
• 28:03
  with it and it's great. So I think it's AI think it's a
• 28:06
  beautiful thing. So so I got a question and this,
• 28:09
  this, I have no idea. So I get the pronouns for like,
• 28:14
  you know, sometimes people want to be he, she, they or just they
• 28:16
  them and whatever. And I get all that.
• 28:18
  So I can get I say, and when I meet a lot of people, I assist,
• 28:20
  I'm like, Hey, you know, worry profiles, profile pronouns,
• 28:23
  because I can tell, you know, you can you're in your presence
• 28:25
  of people who are non binary. You can typically tell.
• 28:27
  And so I'm just like, oh, do you want to get your pronouns right?
• 28:29
  And people find that really, it's really nice to actually
• 28:31
  just say that because rather than just kind of start
• 28:33
  offending somebody from day dot when you don't even want to or
• 28:35
  try to. It's nice.
• 28:37
  But one of the things I don't understand is where does the
• 28:40
  term because you did a video? I think I saw it yesterday.
• 28:43
  It was about USA like 'cause I'm on Friday, I'd also dressed like
• 28:46
  a 12 year old boy. I laughed so much.
• 28:48
  It was so great. It was a great video.
• 28:49
  Anybody hasn't seen go check out Ella's Instagram page.
• 28:53
  It's absolutely great. But yeah, I do love watching
• 28:57
  videos and then and so I have a question.
• 28:59
  How do your children respond to? Is it mother, mum, parents like
• 29:06
  and how does your husband's wife the life partner?
• 29:10
  How does this work? How do those ones work?
• 29:11
  Yeah, that's a really interesting question and what I
• 29:13
  definitely had to figure out for myself.
• 29:14
  So with my kids, I have continued to be called mom
• 29:19
  because not through not through personal choice, I guess, but
• 29:22
  because I came out when my kids were 1513 and 10 and they had
• 29:28
  known me and called me mom their entire lives.
• 29:31
  And it felt too much at that time to ask them to change that.
• 29:35
  But moving forwards when they're older, maybe I'm going to ask
• 29:38
  them. I have come up with a word.
• 29:39
  I was thinking that it might be nice for them to call me Ren
• 29:42
  like parent. There's a bird.
• 29:46
  I thought that was quite cute. They might be up for that.
• 29:49
  I mean, obviously my transdaughter is a massive
• 29:51
  advocate for me and we'll probably adopt that straight
• 29:53
  away. With my husband, it's been a
• 29:55
  little bit trickier. And this is quite an interesting
• 29:57
  question in that respect. So we went to a thing and he
• 30:00
  introduced me as his wife and I said, I really, really don't
• 30:03
  like that. Would you mind introducing me as
• 30:05
  your partner? Which he started to do, but then
• 30:08
  he came to me a little bit later and was like, when I introduced
• 30:11
  you as my partner and you're not there.
• 30:13
  I'm a little bit concerned that people think I'm gay, which I
• 30:16
  thought was really interesting because it was like, well, why
• 30:17
  would that be a problem? Firstly, is there some
• 30:19
  internalized homophobia? You know, we, my husband is, is
• 30:24
  10 years, 11 years older than me.
• 30:26
  So, you know, like at the time that he was a young man growing
• 30:30
  up, homophobia was right. And he's not homophobic openly.
• 30:33
  But we do internalize some of those things, don't we?
• 30:35
  Yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's within that kind of time period
• 30:38
  of people, isn't it? Like, it's not inherently
• 30:40
  hopeful, but it's just that it was the society they were around
• 30:43
  the site, wasn't it? Exactly.
• 30:44
  So we so because I'm all about, you know, if you've ever watched
• 30:47
  any of my content, you'll know I'm all about finding a way to
• 30:50
  make things work in which everyone feels comfortable.
• 30:52
  I suggested that he call me partner when I'm there or when I
• 30:56
  can hear him, and if it made him feel more comfortable to tell
• 30:59
  people he was going home to his wife when I'm not there and I'm
• 31:02
  not even going to hear it, that was fine because what difference
• 31:05
  does it make to me, right? Yeah, exactly right.
• 31:06
  Yeah. You don't even know where you've
• 31:08
  like how how useful. So unless he comes back and
• 31:09
  says, right, here's a report that's about four people and,
• 31:11
  you know, he's like, no, I totally get that.
• 31:13
  That's super interesting because I was really, I was really
• 31:16
  confused by it because I was like, oh, wow.
• 31:18
  What what what would be the. Do you say that like I'm a
• 31:20
  mother to three kids? No, I, I would say I'm a parent,
• 31:24
  so I would never use female gendered pronouns to talk about
• 31:27
  myself. But as I said, my, my kids still
• 31:30
  use mom, but I would say I'm a parent of three children.
• 31:34
  But I have to say, even for me, it has taken some adjustment to
• 31:39
  not absentmindedly. I I use those I accidentally
• 31:42
  misgender myself, hear it, feel uncomfortable and have to
• 31:44
  correct myself. Which is why I do understand
• 31:47
  that it's, you know, tricky for everyone else to get it right as
• 31:49
  well sometimes. That's super interesting.
• 31:52
  Like I, I feel it's just so fascinating, like because I'm
• 31:55
  just the CIS white male, right? And so, and I, I, you know, and
• 32:02
  so I, I had, you know, I'm comfortable.
• 32:04
  People call me, do they them him, whatever.
• 32:06
  I really care. Even if people call me a shit, I
• 32:07
  wouldn't care. Like that makes no difference to
• 32:09
  me, right? And so I'm not offended like
• 32:12
  because I used to have like super long hair.
• 32:14
  And so if somebody would refer to me, you know, as female, if
• 32:20
  they kind of just like, you know, like just mistaking me for
• 32:25
  having long hair, like stereotypically female and, and
• 32:27
  just call me she, I, I'd be like, that's OK.
• 32:30
  You know, we all make mistakes, but I feel like a lot of people
• 32:33
  who are who, who are like non binary or whatever, they would
• 32:38
  get super offended the other way around, you know what I mean?
• 32:41
  And I find that that's a really interesting.
• 32:43
  I like, why, why is it? Why is it such an issue if
• 32:47
  somebody calls you she or her? Like, is it, is it painful?
• 32:51
  Like what? What?
• 32:52
  What is it? I'd love to just know that it
• 32:53
  might be a bit of a deep answer. Maybe we don't even want to
• 32:55
  answer it, but I would just love to.
• 32:56
  Know no, that's fine. I think it's I think it's very
• 32:59
  individual. There are actually a lot of
• 33:01
  gender non conforming people, you know, and non binary people
• 33:04
  who are completely comfortable with all pronouns.
• 33:07
  That is that that is a thing. And then there's the other
• 33:09
  extreme of sort of people that use, I think they call them Z.
• 33:12
  Zan, zan, Yeah. There are specific name, type of
• 33:16
  pronouns, and everything in between.
• 33:19
  For me, when someone misgenders me, it feels like it just, it
• 33:24
  doesn't hurt. It feels like they're talking
• 33:26
  about someone else. Oh, oh, interesting.
• 33:29
  So I think it's, I think it's a very different experience
• 33:31
  depending like with autism, I guess.
• 33:33
  Yeah, wow. It's super interesting.
• 33:35
  I'm so I'm fascinated. I don't really know.
• 33:37
  You know, my brother's a homosexual male, you know, and,
• 33:42
  and he, he said he and his partner, you know, that that
• 33:45
  they're a couple and they're both he and and so and I have a
• 33:49
  trans friend who is completely transformed Jess.
• 33:52
  She's great. And like, so they're the only
• 33:54
  people I know in that type of community, But I don't really
• 33:57
  have friends who are non binary in, in the way of I can ask some
• 34:00
  questions about it, you know, because it was so I just found
• 34:02
  it so interesting. But I hear time and time again,
• 34:05
  excuse me, that the autumn community is super, super has
• 34:10
  large numbers of LGBTQ plus community.
• 34:13
  And I think it's super interesting about kind of what
• 34:14
  it needs to be addressed. And I think that it's so it's so
• 34:18
  interesting. I'm like the, the, the question
• 34:20
  is why? You know what, how come?
• 34:22
  But is it because just like any other portion of the, of the
• 34:26
  population, you're going to have large percentages of, of people
• 34:29
  who are in that community because we're all people, you
• 34:32
  know what I mean? It's such an interesting
• 34:34
  concept. Like I, I wanted to know is it
• 34:36
  something that's kind of specific to an individual brain
• 34:39
  type or a phenotype? Or is it something just because
• 34:42
  it's a population, you know what I mean?
• 34:44
  I. Think, I think it's a bunch of
• 34:45
  things. I think it's partly because
• 34:47
  we're all human. I think it's partly because, as
• 34:49
  I've said earlier, we don't necessarily feel the need to
• 34:51
  conform to societal standards anyway.
• 34:54
  So and I think it's partly that more of us know, like I wonder
• 34:58
  whether more of us know because if you think about it, if you're
• 35:00
  exploring your divergent, you're thinking more deeply about your
• 35:03
  identity generally, right? So you might and also you're
• 35:05
  going to be mixing in circles where you're more likely to come
• 35:08
  across gender non conforming people.
• 35:10
  And so you might be more likely to realize, like if I hadn't
• 35:13
  been in the autism world and I hadn't had an autistic child and
• 35:16
  I hadn't, you know, done what I did, I might have never found
• 35:20
  out that I was non binary because I wouldn't have ever.
• 35:24
  You know, if I had to come across it, right?
• 35:25
  Yeah, yeah. And it was still have been non
• 35:28
  binary. I'd have just been.
• 35:28
  Yeah, but you would never longer, Yeah, so is it, do you
• 35:32
  feel way more comfortable now that.
• 35:34
  Yeah, I mean, I'm getting there. I'd say the first, how long have
• 35:37
  I been out now? About a year, I would say the
• 35:40
  first six months I was just, I wouldn't have been out to have
• 35:42
  talked to on a podcast about it like this.
• 35:44
  It was, it was so deeply personal and difficult to talk
• 35:47
  about. And then in the last few months,
• 35:49
  I've really explored what that means for me in terms of that.
• 35:54
  You know, I've started making some physical changes that have
• 35:57
  made me feel more comfortable and I've started being more
• 36:00
  confident asking for people to use my pronouns and less
• 36:02
  apologetic about it. So I feel like I am getting
• 36:06
  there, but I'm not there yet. But thanks to the work of some
• 36:10
  amazing, you know, gender non conforming influencers, like off
• 36:14
  the top of my head, there's an amazing woman on TikTok called
• 36:16
  Dylan who is charting her transition in like first day of
• 36:20
  being adult, second day of being adult and she awesome.
• 36:24
  So people like her, who are just unapologetically who they are,
• 36:28
  inspire me that I can do the same thing.
• 36:31
  And that's been a really. Fun, self-confidence, right, and
• 36:35
  self belief. And I think that's a beautiful
• 36:36
  thing and we all need that. And I think it's nice to hear
• 36:39
  stories like yours. And thank you so much for
• 36:41
  sharing it because I think it will allow other people who are
• 36:43
  on a similar journey or a similar path or a similar, kind
• 36:45
  of like maybe they lack confidence.
• 36:47
  They needed to hear your story. I think that's brilliant as
• 36:49
  well. No hate in the comments, please.
• 36:54
  But we get him. We get him.
• 36:56
  But you know, love is love the end of the day and that's it.
• 36:58
  So yeah, it's, it's pride month, So half a pride month.
• 37:01
  And hopefully this episode will be out this Saturday, I think.
• 37:06
  Oh, no, no, wait, no week's out because we'll be out on the 7th,
• 37:09
  18th, 18th. So we're out on the 7th, 18th.
• 37:13
  So, oh, before we, before we disappear, is there anything
• 37:15
  you'd like to share with my audience?
• 37:17
  Maybe a line or a quote or where they can find you online.
• 37:21
  Yeah, you can find me on YouTube as Purple Ella, on TikTok and
• 37:26
  Instagram as Purple Ella and Coco and or throw a carrier
• 37:31
  pigeon into the ether with a message and maybe it'll reach
• 37:33
  me. I'm going to try that and see
• 37:36
  what happens. Thank you so much.
• 37:38
  You know, it's an absolute pleasure catching up.
• 37:41
  Just just interesting, fascinating, brilliant as
• 37:43
  always. And I wish you the best of luck
• 37:45
  in life. You're definitely one of the
• 37:47
  most interesting people I know. And.
• 37:49
  Yeah, it's really brave. So thank you so much for sharing
• 37:52
  everything. Thank you for having me.
• 37:54
  You're welcome. Hey guys, thank you so much for
• 37:58
  checking out this podcast. Make sure you are subscribed
• 38:01
  because there are people listening right now who are not
• 38:02
  subscribe to this podcast. I can see you.
• 38:05
  Make sure you subscribe. Okay guys, see you in the next
• 38:07
  one. Peace.