Latest / The Brewery Underground Podcast | Craft Beer Interviews, Reviews and Beer Travel / Great Lakes Brewing: Christmas Ale, Tennessee Distribution & Oktoberfest | Episode 93 Part 2

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Great Lakes Brewing: Christmas Ale, Tennessee Distribution & Oktoberfest | Episode 93 Part 2 · The Brewery Underground Podcast | Craft Beer Interviews, Reviews and Beer Travel

• 0:39
  Well, and I would have to think you guys probably get, I mean,
• 0:43
  even though I feel like you're a destination brewery, we came
• 0:46
  there. So you're you're a destination
• 0:47
  brewery that makes you one, no? You're the reason we went.
• 0:50
  You're the reason. It went, yeah, really.
• 0:52
  But. But I would also have to think
• 0:54
  that you probably get a lot of regulars in there like 3 or 4
• 0:59
  days a week when you're there, how many days you're there, You
• 1:02
  probably see some people there almost every week or every other
• 1:05
  week and they're going, oh, totally, what else you got new
• 1:08
  here? Yeah, well, a lot of regulars
• 1:12
  just order a dorm under, over and over, yeah.
• 1:15
  And that's OK too. And that's OK too.
• 1:17
  But but they're ready for something different, right?
• 1:19
  At times. Yeah, there are some regulars,
• 1:21
  I'm sure, who are looking for the new thing.
• 1:26
  Oh, totally. Yeah, the people who come
• 1:27
  regularly enough. Yeah.
• 1:29
  Yeah. They really the true regulars
• 1:32
  like they were bad when burning river runaway so.
• 1:37
  Yeah, you see certain people walk in, you're already pouring
• 1:40
  their beer because you know exactly what they're.
• 1:42
  Going to, Yeah. I mean, the bartender's like
• 1:44
  they're no, literally, there are some people who, if somebody
• 1:47
  walks in, well, like Ramon, I think it was Ramon.
• 1:50
  Yeah, Ramon, he's, he's been retired from us for a number of
• 1:55
  years, but like, he started three months or so after the
• 1:58
  brewery opened. And it was literally like, I
• 2:01
  mean, obviously early on we only had so many beers we actually
• 2:04
  brewed. But like, I'm pretty sure the
• 2:06
  entire time he worked at Great Lakes, when he went in, he
• 2:08
  walked into the Tavern for a shift, beer bartender just
• 2:11
  poured the dorm under and put it down because there's literally,
• 2:14
  there's no need to ask. So yeah.
• 2:18
  You got to love that too. That's great stuff.
• 2:19
  I love that they. Do I mean all the time, guys, I
• 2:22
  look at the beer board and it's like Midwest, yeah, that's OK.
• 2:29
  So I'm guilty. Yeah.
• 2:31
  But making sure I'm trying the new stuff, too.
• 2:33
  Yeah. Yes, you got to, well, you're
• 2:36
  out there selling it, right. You got to be able to talk about
• 2:38
  it. Yeah, totally.
• 2:39
  Yes. Well, you know, I need to know
• 2:42
  Midwest like the crevices of my hand here, so it's over and over
• 2:48
  again. Let's shift gears a little bit
• 2:55
  and talk about tariffs. Is that have you guys been
• 3:01
  affected by it? Probably it's affected
• 3:02
  everybody. And if so, kind of in what ways?
• 3:06
  And I know that, you know, we kind of see aluminum as being
• 3:09
  the big thing, but we actually talked to the Brews Association,
• 3:13
  Brewers Association the other day and they were telling us
• 3:15
  about some other things too that might possibly affect.
• 3:17
  How has it affected you guys and what are you seeing?
• 3:20
  Yeah, that's a great question. I don't know 100% about the
• 3:27
  nitty gritty, but like the things that we're seeing
• 3:30
  wholesale across the board, like I mean, some things are just a
• 3:33
  little bit more expensive than they were, right?
• 3:36
  I know it's affecting us. I can't say I literally, I don't
• 3:38
  know off the top of my head how you know, percentage wise and
• 3:44
  stuff like that. But like I know that raw
• 3:45
  materials cost a little bit more than they used to.
• 3:48
  I'm sure aluminum's got to be the number one, right?
• 3:51
  Yeah, he had mentioned like buying equipment from overseas,
• 3:58
  like maybe fermenters or bottling lines and things like.
• 4:01
  That right. So like, let's say for us, like,
• 4:06
  I mean, glass I think is more domestic, but of course we don't
• 4:11
  do as much as that as we used to.
• 4:13
  I mean, we we're still in that brewery in Ohio City.
• 4:17
  So like we're not doing any big capital expenditure stuff right
• 4:21
  now. So to a certain extent, I don't
• 4:25
  remember what Steven, the, the code CEO on the OPS side has
• 4:29
  said, but I mean, I would, my gut is compared to some others.
• 4:35
  Maybe it hasn't affected us that much.
• 4:38
  I certainly what I can say is for sure, no, obviously there's
• 4:40
  only so much I could share anyways, but like I haven't
• 4:43
  heard a lot of chatter about it, but also like you guys are
• 4:48
  talking with others too. And like I feel like generally
• 4:51
  impact hasn't fully set in for some stuff.
• 4:55
  So I think there's a little bit of, we'll see.
• 4:58
  Yeah. Does that make?
• 4:59
  Sense to you guys based on conversations you've had.
• 5:02
  Yeah. And a lot of it's, you know,
• 5:03
  we've seen it across the board, too.
• 5:05
  It's like, oh, maybe this thing is coming and maybe it's not,
• 5:08
  you know? Yeah.
• 5:09
  But is this, you know, by August, we'll know something or
• 5:12
  by December, we'll know something.
• 5:13
  And some things just haven't hit.
• 5:14
  So there's a lot of chatter about it.
• 5:16
  So I don't know what real if, if, if there really are some or
• 5:19
  if it's, you know, how much of it is real.
• 5:22
  Yeah. I would say so far, based on,
• 5:24
  based on what I know, like I don't think we've seen a ton of
• 5:29
  effect yet. I think it remains we've seen
• 5:31
  what happens down the road. So we're just kind of taking
• 5:34
  things as they come, yeah. Well, and I recall probably
• 5:38
  maybe two months ago when a lot of this came down, there was
• 5:41
  there's a, a brewery here in Nashville.
• 5:44
  They have, they have the most locations tailgate.
• 5:46
  And they were on the news because they were asking, you
• 5:49
  know, them, how did they think this was going to impact them?
• 5:52
  And I think they were more looking at it from a consumer
• 5:55
  standpoint. And I think they were trying to
• 5:57
  figure out was this going to affect the consumer much as far
• 6:00
  as like raising beer prices. And, and it goes back to the
• 6:04
  same thing that you know what you just said, there's a lot of
• 6:07
  wait and see going on right now. No one really is completely sure
• 6:11
  of where what direction it's going to go in.
• 6:14
  Yep, Yeah. I mean things are generally, I
• 6:17
  think you'd say things are generally probably creeping up
• 6:20
  with regards to cost. But also the other tough thing
• 6:22
  is there's already been price raising happening.
• 6:29
  So and there's the perception of economic squeeze on the consumer
• 6:34
  side. So then like, yeah, what do you
• 6:39
  do? Right.
• 6:39
  You know, it's like I don't think people would love seeing
• 6:43
  the six pack go to 1199 from 1099.
• 6:47
  I think that dollar bump happened within the past five
• 6:49
  years because they were in 99999.
• 6:51
  So like, yeah, that's a tricky, that's a tricky thing because
• 6:55
  it's like consumer can only take so much, right.
• 6:59
  Yeah, yeah, costs are going up. And you know, you see some good
• 7:03
  things too, Like, I mean, you read about, OK, there's
• 7:06
  production what's happening in X country and now it's moving
• 7:08
  here. So like, but then so how do you
• 7:11
  navigate and juggle the whole thing so it works out the best,
• 7:14
  right. I think that's the that's the
• 7:17
  the thing for all of us, yeah. You know, the other, the other
• 7:21
  question I wonder, and this just came off the top of my head.
• 7:24
  So when when you're talking about some of the current beers
• 7:29
  that you have, like, you know, expanding them like barrel age
• 7:32
  and mocha, do you think maybe sometimes breweries look at that
• 7:37
  and say instead of us spending the time and resources on trying
• 7:41
  to find an entirely different new beer, let's try to expand on
• 7:46
  this beer because it's a cost efficient way of doing things,
• 7:50
  but yet it still benefits us and it's hopefully will benefit the
• 7:53
  consumer. 100% yeah. Well, there's the element of
• 7:57
  familiarity. So people already know barrel
• 7:59
  aged blackout stout. I think it's important we're
• 8:02
  we're doing both mocha and regular barrel aged blackout
• 8:05
  stout. So there's actually it was
• 8:11
  important to do both and not just do the mocha right.
• 8:14
  Yeah, Yep. Because there are people who
• 8:16
  like they dislike their their beer flavored beer.
• 8:19
  You know, there's a little bit of a bourbon barrel thing, but
• 8:20
  like, yeah, you start at adding flavors and the things and some
• 8:25
  people are like, I don't want it.
• 8:26
  So. And for me, I mean, I'm excited
• 8:29
  to try the, the base against the, the mocha and all that
• 8:32
  stuff. So but yes, I mean, you know,
• 8:37
  you see that with the Midwest's, right?
• 8:39
  So it came out with regular Midwest.
• 8:40
  And of course we, you know, kind of knew from the beginning.
• 8:42
  It's like, though Midwest had some success, he'd be the hazy
• 8:47
  no current plans to extend further off of it.
• 8:49
  But you know, and then you can do with fun limited stuff,
• 8:51
  regular vibrations a couple years ago, then the juicy and
• 8:54
  then do the blood orange. So yeah, I mean, like, I think
• 8:57
  it's you can be transparent. It's like it saves us some work,
• 9:01
  right. Like, yeah, didn't you've?
• 9:03
  Already got the core. And you've already really need a
• 9:05
  beer. And again, we like, that's been
• 9:07
  a thing for years. It's sculpin, grapefruit
• 9:09
  sculpin, habanero sculpin, and so on.
• 9:12
  Right? Like so.
• 9:13
  No, I think it's great and we see other breweries that do that
• 9:15
  too. And then it's cool.
• 9:17
  It's also like someone likes Midwest already.
• 9:19
  There's like, I like Midwest. The hazy's probably good.
• 9:23
  And they try to like, yeah, like, so yeah, because Midwest
• 9:25
  Hazy has the same, you know, the nice, the, the the promise of it
• 9:31
  being a nice IPA just like regular Midwest does.
• 9:34
  Where like Midwest hazy doesn't drink as thick and as heavy as
• 9:37
  as some other hazy's, which thick hazies are are awesome.
• 9:40
  Thick with four CS Cool. I love that if I want to have
• 9:45
  two or three beers, it's a little tougher when they're 4C's
• 9:48
  thick, but Midwest hazy, you can have a, you know, 2-3 cans have
• 9:54
  no problem. So yes, I think the whole
• 9:59
  strategy of like extending ends up being a win win for the most
• 10:05
  part. And for the Brewers who do,
• 10:06
  every beer's a totally new creation, both with regards to
• 10:09
  the the formulation and, you know, the brand and all that
• 10:15
  stuff, that's also great. But especially for something
• 10:19
  where you're taking on the six pack, it seems a little easier
• 10:21
  to like, oh, I like Midwest. You know, I can do Midwest Hazy
• 10:25
  no problem. That kind of thing.
• 10:26
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love and you said, you know,
• 10:29
  you showed us early on the mix packs of different things.
• 10:32
  God, I love that. When I go to a store and can,
• 10:34
  you know, do I get this one or this one?
• 10:36
  Hey, let's get them all. Let's get them all, yeah?
• 10:40
  It's really great. There'll be more variety packs
• 10:43
  in the future. Yeah, so.
• 10:46
  It's a big thing. I mean, it's it's always been
• 10:48
  big for crap here, but. Yeah, especially if I'm, if I'm
• 10:51
  going through and I'm just kind of looking around in the grocery
• 10:53
  store and like, oh, that mix pack has something I haven't had
• 10:56
  yet. Yes, you know, I've had the
• 10:58
  other three. Yeah, I'm gonna grab that
• 11:01
  because I'm gonna try something new and then have the other ones
• 11:04
  that go with it. Totally.
• 11:06
  Yep. We talked about weather when we
• 11:10
  started this podcast. Yeah.
• 11:12
  And it's fall, but we're headed into Steve.
• 11:16
  You know where I'm going with this.
• 11:17
  And Michael, you probably do too.
• 11:20
  Christmas ale's coming. It's.
• 11:22
  Buddy. Boys, it's coming.
• 11:24
  Yeah, buddy, we kind of. Like where we're are we one
• 11:29
  month away? You are one month from
• 11:31
  yesterday, yes. Right.
• 11:33
  OK. So the 16th is first four.
• 11:34
  Nice. Yes.
• 11:35
  I have the question before stock.
• 11:37
  Continues. You go right ahead, Steve are.
• 11:40
  People already lined up for Christmas.
• 11:45
  One month out. And they are lined up in spirit.
• 11:48
  Yeah. But it'll be like, well, I
• 11:53
  think, Oh my goodness, I think the Die Hard's the first.
• 11:56
  Like, I don't know, couple handfuls of people or show up
• 12:00
  like 6 or 7, they'll be there. It's on my calendar, that's for
• 12:04
  sure. Yeah.
• 12:06
  Well, it was, it was fun because when when we got when we, we
• 12:09
  came there and we took a tour and the guy, I think his name
• 12:13
  was Scott. Right, Scott?
• 12:14
  Yeah. Scott Smith?
• 12:15
  Yep. Yeah, and I asked him.
• 12:17
  I. Guess Lincoln he's he's, he's a
• 12:19
  great dude. Yeah.
• 12:20
  I asked. Him shout out to Scott, he gave
• 12:21
  us a great tour. Shout out for Scott.
• 12:23
  Hey, Scott. We appreciated the tour.
• 12:25
  Awesome tour, by the way. If you're coming to Great Lakes
• 12:28
  and you haven't had the tour, go get that Dang tour.
• 12:31
  It was fantastic. But I asked him, I said where do
• 12:34
  people line up? Like where did they start lining
• 12:36
  up? They're showing me, you know,
• 12:38
  it's like a visual, like outside.
• 12:40
  They're all outside now. The day we were there, thank God
• 12:43
  we weren't there for Christmas Christmas Ale because they had
• 12:46
  the lake effect rain that day in mid.
• 12:47
  May oh boy. But it would.
• 12:49
  Have been snow. Yeah, it would have been
• 12:51
  terrible, but you got people that are lined up.
• 12:54
  It doesn't matter if it's cold outside or raining, they're out
• 12:57
  there waiting for Christmas ale. Totally.
• 13:00
  Yep. Yeah.
• 13:01
  And like that's especially so that's one of the areas where
• 13:03
  it's cool for me having been in a number of different public
• 13:06
  facing roles, including the brew pub, my first.
• 13:11
  I might have mentioned this to you guys, I'm sure I've
• 13:13
  mentioned it. My first actual shift in the pub
• 13:16
  was first pour was 2012. So you guys are cruel.
• 13:21
  Yeah, Grant, I was, I was, I haven't to be assigned to a
• 13:24
  section that wasn't very busy because of how the weather went.
• 13:26
  But but it's a it's a it's a grand day.
• 13:34
  I'm sure we we mentioned it last time, but for those who didn't
• 13:36
  listen to the first podcast, like for us at Great Lakes, you
• 13:40
  know, Christmas sale. If you're listening to this and
• 13:41
  you know Great Lakes, you probably know about Christmas
• 13:43
  sale in some way. And it's a wonderful beer. 7
• 13:46
  1/2% IVV, you know, multi amber rail with honey, cinnamon,
• 13:50
  ginger just channels the spirit of the holidays.
• 13:53
  But what always blows me away is this whole thing that you guys
• 13:56
  are talking about is like Thursday.
• 13:59
  So this year it's Thursday, October 16th.
• 14:05
  We're doing the first pour party when people start lining up, as
• 14:08
  I've been alluding to, at like 6:00 in the morning, and the
• 14:12
  line for real starts forming around 8:00 or so.
• 14:17
  Goes all the way around the block, right?
• 14:19
  We don't know if until 11 and they're doing this and they're
• 14:23
  doing this all, they're doing this all for a beer that they
• 14:26
  can buy at the grocery store on Monday.
• 14:33
  It's just like, it's insane. It's telling.
• 14:36
  Are they, are they? Do they come dressed up in like
• 14:39
  Christmas? Oh, yeah, yeah, there's,
• 14:41
  there's, that's as much the norm as coming.
• 14:46
  That's just showing up in regular clothes.
• 14:48
  Yeah, you know, whatever elf had, and reindeer, you know,
• 14:53
  antlers and all that kind of stuff.
• 14:55
  And how many people would you expect and have you had lining
• 14:58
  up the first day in previous years?
• 15:01
  You know, the exact number of people lining up, I'm not 100%
• 15:05
  sure, but like if you took like a standard city block, like a
• 15:08
  downtown city block and basically the line goes entrance
• 15:18
  to this corner, to that corner, it'll definitely get wrapped
• 15:21
  around another corner. There have been some years where
• 15:23
  it continues to wrap around. There's one year I think where
• 15:25
  it Raptor, you could see the end of the line from the beginning
• 15:30
  of the line. I assume that's a couple 100
• 15:33
  people. Right.
• 15:33
  I was going to say it's enough to be noticeable where people
• 15:36
  are going. What the heck is going on over
• 15:37
  there legally? Our capacity at the brew pub, I
• 15:42
  don't know. You know, it can't be more than
• 15:43
  a couple 100 people, right. So.
• 15:45
  Right. Right.
• 15:47
  So it's a couple 100 people. Yeah.
• 15:48
  And then, like, you know, as the day goes on, there are people,
• 15:51
  you know, usually the people who are lined up early are there for
• 15:53
  the long haul, a couple hours. Yeah.
• 15:56
  That ebb and flow of people in and out.
• 15:59
  You know, there's the slight taper.
• 16:01
  But then once the after work crowd shows up, then this, you
• 16:05
  know, the vibes continue on. The last time we spoke, it would
• 16:09
  have, I mean, last time we were, we did a pot, it would have been
• 16:12
  shortly before, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 16:16
  Because it was mid-october or something like that.
• 16:19
  Yeah. Oh, we had.
• 16:20
  That was a magical day for us in Cleveland.
• 16:22
  I mean, are you guys actually baseball fans and all that?
• 16:25
  Yeah, yeah. Do you?
• 16:26
  Remember what happened later that day.
• 16:30
  No freshman. Was in Cleveland, we were in the
• 16:33
  ALCS against the Yankees. Yeah and it was first poor day
• 16:40
  and it was a perfect. It was like it was like one of
• 16:42
  those mid-october days where it's like, oh, it's just
• 16:44
  perfect. It's like low mid 70s or
• 16:46
  whatever. Clear.
• 16:47
  We were able to shut down the street.
• 16:51
  Wish the streets closed permanently anyways, but like
• 16:53
  it's a little side street. But you know that little St.
• 16:55
  outside the pub, We're able to extend the patio in there.
• 16:58
  So there's people everywhere having Christmas sales.
• 17:00
  This great time home American League Championship Series game
• 17:06
  that night. So of course I went to the game.
• 17:09
  So it was a long day and we are down OT against the Yankees and
• 17:14
  bomb in the 9th inning, 2 outs, one guy on on on the base pass.
• 17:22
  And this kid we had brought up a couple months earlier, his name
• 17:26
  is John Kenzie Noel. Have you heard about this the
• 17:28
  big Christmas thing? His nickname John Kenzie Noel.
• 17:33
  So he got the nickname Big Christmas.
• 17:35
  OK, and he hit a freaking game tying 2 run Homer against the
• 17:40
  Yankees closer on 1st Poor day. On 1st poor.
• 17:44
  Nice. And we won the game.
• 17:46
  We walked off and won the game. So it's just like one of those
• 17:48
  synergy moments where I was like, I can't believe this is
• 17:50
  happening, right? And Michael, I don't know if I
• 17:53
  don't know if you realize this, Scott is a Yankees fan.
• 17:58
  All right, I'm gonna log off right now.
• 17:59
  Yeah, that's OK. I gotta go.
• 18:00
  We did win this. I gotta go.
• 18:01
  I gotta go, yeah. You just waited 10 more minutes.
• 18:05
  Dude, Giancarlo was just a menace that series.
• 18:10
  Yeah, he was the only one that got us to the World Series,
• 18:14
  pretty much. But the culmination of
• 18:17
  everything on that one day though, there.
• 18:19
  And then we saw people posted like not kidding people posted
• 18:24
  you know, someone posted a Photoshop of the Christmas sale
• 18:27
  like 6 pack with his face on it and stuff so.
• 18:32
  Did you say too like when you, I don't know if you're always
• 18:34
  there, but when people end up like it's the same faces towards
• 18:37
  the front of the line. Every year it is.
• 18:39
  Yeah. It's pretty cool.
• 18:40
  Yeah, It is. Yeah.
• 18:42
  I mean, they're dedicated. And then there's a certain point
• 18:44
  of pride in keeping that regular thing going.
• 18:48
  Sure, If you're first in line, you get a spot at the bar.
• 18:52
  Yeah, exactly how many spots at the bar?
• 18:54
  15, something like that, yeah. So if you're the 1st 20 or so,
• 18:59
  you can probably get a spot at the bar or you got a, you got a
• 19:03
  table in the bar area. So if you're listening, if
• 19:07
  you're in Cleveland and you're going to go to 1st Port and you
• 19:10
  want to be in the main tap room, you got to get there at like
• 19:12
  7:00 AM. 7:00 AM Pack a bag. When did this all become a a
• 19:18
  thing? Like, do you remember the year
• 19:20
  that it became such a big thing? Well, it precedes my time, but
• 19:24
  the Christmas sale phenomenon part of it's cool.
• 19:28
  I forgot how much we talked about last time, but like, it
• 19:32
  doesn't matter. It bears repeating every time.
• 19:34
  What's amazing about Christmas Ale is that you can't create
• 19:39
  that in a boardroom, you know what I mean?
• 19:41
  You can't make it in a lab, you can't cook it up on a
• 19:45
  spreadsheet or whatever. It's a magical beer.
• 19:49
  There's something about right place, right time and all that.
• 19:53
  Bring in Cleveland. We love Christmas, We have the
• 19:55
  Christmas Story House and all that stuff.
• 19:59
  And then the beer just nails the spear of the holidays, that
• 20:06
  spice presentation just like drives home what Christmas means
• 20:10
  to so many people, you know, in our area especially and beyond.
• 20:14
  And then for those who grew up here, they, you know,
• 20:17
  experienced it when they were younger and all that before they
• 20:19
  moved off or whatever. And then in the markets where
• 20:23
  they live, where we distribute it, that they go for Christmas
• 20:26
  sale and all that stuff. So like it was an organic thing,
• 20:29
  I'm told. I think it was around 2010 ish.
• 20:34
  OK, so like Chris and Sale became this phenomenon.
• 20:37
  And apparently the way First part became a thing was like
• 20:44
  people who went to the brew pub often enough would kind of start
• 20:49
  asking staff like, hey, do you know when they're going to tap
• 20:53
  it and all that stuff? And they're like, yeah, I think
• 20:56
  it's going to be around then and all that.
• 20:58
  And then, I think, you know, like my career, the marketing
• 21:00
  group at certain point was like, yeah, we should make this a
• 21:04
  thing. You know, it's like, yeah.
• 21:06
  So it's like it's just, it's just an event waiting to happen.
• 21:09
  But like, so that's what part of that's part of what makes First
• 21:11
  part special is obviously like, we like market in a certain way.
• 21:14
  But like the, the popularity of the beer and even the popularity
• 21:18
  of like the tapping of the beer at the brew pub was kind of an
• 21:22
  organic thing. And just to the scale that it's
• 21:25
  gotten to which roughly 20% of sales for you, I can't say for
• 21:33
  sure in recent years, but like that's the number you kind of
• 21:35
  rolled with is like Christmas sale is like 20% of our sales in
• 21:38
  any given year, which is crazy because the beer is only sold
• 21:42
  for like 9-10 weeks. So you just again, it's it's
• 21:45
  just not possible to sit down in the marketing department room.
• 21:50
  You like, yes, we're going to do that.
• 21:53
  I mean, we can try as best as we can.
• 21:54
  We hope cold Rush blows up and like everyone in Cleveland and,
• 21:58
  you know, northern Ohio or whatever is drinking cold Rush.
• 22:02
  But sometimes it takes a little bit of magic and stuff like that
• 22:04
  to actually make that happen. So yeah, a lot of times that's
• 22:08
  that's the best things that come out of it when you realize
• 22:11
  organically this has become a thing.
• 22:13
  So let's capitalize on it and make it an annual event.
• 22:17
  And now you have. Right.
• 22:19
  Yep. You said the words, the event
• 22:22
  like, you know, and with the ups and downs of craft beer the last
• 22:25
  four or five years, just in general, it's great to see
• 22:29
  people getting in line for something.
• 22:31
  Yes, that's amazing. It definitely gives us, you
• 22:35
  know, I'm not being doom and gloom about everything, but
• 22:38
  like, you know, to still see that year after year after year,
• 22:41
  that's a consistent stable, you know.
• 22:43
  Yeah, it's pretty much always a record setting.
• 22:45
  Yeah, certainly for the year and at times overall record setting
• 22:49
  day for the pub and all that. But yeah, that stuff's going
• 22:54
  full swing. I mean, we announced that last
• 22:57
  week, right, One week ago. So we got the whole, you know,
• 23:01
  if you're listening, you're Northeast Ohio, you got till the
• 23:03
  end of September to like enter the first Port VIP thing.
• 23:07
  Yeah, you guys can enter the first port VIP thing.
• 23:09
  You never know. Yeah, I was sorry I started
• 23:13
  right. Yeah, we're already, we were in
• 23:15
  at last year. We were a year ahead.
• 23:17
  No, it's, it's cool just to think there are people right now
• 23:21
  that have it on their calendars and have gotten with a group of
• 23:23
  friends going, you know what, we're showing up.
• 23:26
  We're taking off. They're taking off work that
• 23:28
  day. They're taking off, they're
• 23:30
  taking off work that day or taking off school that day to
• 23:33
  stand in line to, to get that Christmas ale because they want
• 23:38
  to be the first ones. I mean, how many?
• 23:40
  Breweries Friday off, too. Do you know?
• 23:43
  OK, I'm putting you on the spot. You may not know.
• 23:45
  It's OK if you don't know. Do you know of anything like
• 23:49
  this that goes on in any other breweries across the country?
• 23:52
  Anything similar? Not not a Christmas ale, but
• 23:55
  maybe a release of some sort. Yeah, well, I think plenty of
• 24:00
  the younger probably has that right.
• 24:02
  Yeah, right. Yep, my understanding and I
• 24:07
  would love to get out there for I've had a taste of younger
• 24:09
  before. I like to go out there and
• 24:12
  experience the the day right sounds pretty cool.
• 24:18
  That's the main thing that comes to mind.
• 24:20
  Like the actual my understanding is that there's actual lining up
• 24:23
  like outside their their tap room, the Russian River for that
• 24:29
  one. But it's a pretty I think it's a
• 24:32
  pretty especially today, like late twenty 10s yeah, release
• 24:37
  parties were all the rage, you know, and that's just waned and
• 24:42
  COVID, not some of that off the tracks.
• 24:44
  But we we're blessed to have so much wonderful craft beer all
• 24:50
  the time now that like the special release only goes so far
• 24:54
  these days. So that's part of what makes
• 24:56
  Christian say a little bit of a Unicorn younger.
• 25:00
  There got to be some others, but it's it's not nearly as much as
• 25:02
  there used to be, right, Right. I mean, do you guys see that in
• 25:06
  Nashville? Not in Nashville, but Knoxville
• 25:08
  does it. So Zul Beer Company, when they
• 25:11
  release their PBJ mix tape, when they do like a new release, they
• 25:15
  just did a mark later, there's some two hours.
• 25:17
  People are staying out in line for two hours because it's
• 25:20
  release day or something. So that's one of those.
• 25:22
  Somebody actually, someone on Steph mentioned them recently.
• 25:24
  So like that actually had Yeah, they even noticed it up here,
• 25:28
  so. Yeah, cool.
• 25:30
  Yeah, they, they do amazing stuff with, with that PB and Ji
• 25:34
  know the recipe is the same right, Of a Christmas sale year
• 25:37
  after year. It's the same recipe, right?
• 25:38
  Yeah. And they're probably variants
• 25:40
  that make it. Do you get people though, that
• 25:42
  say it's not better, it's different year over year?
• 25:45
  Do you get people that say that even though, you know, you make
• 25:47
  it the same way and, you know, at the same time?
• 25:49
  But do you get people that say, hey, this year was better than
• 25:51
  last year or vice versa? Or that they they pick up
• 25:54
  differences. They do Yep.
• 25:56
  So the the big things we get are the the flavored rift thing,
• 26:02
  which that's the classic. Haven't had the beer for 10
• 26:06
  months. You know, do you actually 100%
• 26:09
  remember I may have mentioned it to you guys last time, but also
• 26:12
  like I like and actually this past.
• 26:14
  Well, it would have been really after after we spoke last time,
• 26:17
  But like I found myself this last Christmas sales season
• 26:22
  drinking a lot more of it than I had in the past, which we got
• 26:28
  the little girly I can hear. I just hear on the other side
• 26:31
  bedtime right now. So I think Christmas hit a
• 26:35
  little bit harder this past year.
• 26:36
  So I wasn't doing Christmas sale and all the nostalgia that comes
• 26:39
  with it. But like generally speaking, the
• 26:42
  Christmas sale fans drink a lot more Christmas sale than I do.
• 26:45
  So like, there are times where I want to be like, Hey, you drink
• 26:48
  the beer more than me. I'm just an advanced, advanced
• 26:51
  Cicerone. What do I know?
• 26:53
  What do I know? I haven't had any training or
• 26:56
  anything. Yeah, but there are people, no,
• 26:58
  there are people who seriously, they drink it all the time and
• 27:00
  like, and there are people like there are people where you can
• 27:04
  put the, you got a Bud Light drinker and you put down the
• 27:07
  Miller Lite and they're like, Nope, they know, right.
• 27:10
  So like, right, if there's any ever like ever any flavored
• 27:13
  drift and there's a regular Christmas sale drinker, then
• 27:16
  like I would totally trust them. So and with the raw materials,
• 27:19
  you know, the natural ingredients that go into the
• 27:22
  beer, especially the honey and 600 plus pons of honey, like
• 27:26
  there's going to be a little bit of flavor variation.
• 27:28
  It's always within a certain specification that we set for
• 27:31
  ourselves. But like there's going to be a
• 27:33
  very minor amount of flavor drift.
• 27:36
  The ferment, like one of our Brewers thinks it's the
• 27:40
  fermentability of the honey. Like if it's more fermentable
• 27:43
  than the spices might pop a little bit more because the beer
• 27:46
  is drier. If the honey is less
• 27:47
  fermentable, you might get more sweetness because there's more
• 27:51
  residual sugar. But that's just, it's just about
• 27:53
  the way the bees produce the hype.
• 27:55
  So, so minor variation. But there's also of course, you
• 27:59
  know, when's the last time you actually drank the beer?
• 28:02
  Did you cellar Christmas ale throughout the summertime and
• 28:06
  the spices oxidized? So sure you didn't get the
• 28:10
  spices in the most recent one you had, but that's because it
• 28:12
  was a an 8 month old can or something.
• 28:15
  Right, Yeah, right. It's not going to be as fresh
• 28:17
  and stuff. So yeah, I would just find that
• 28:19
  interesting cuz I could never remember.
• 28:21
  And like you said, if you kept one for 10 months, it's not as
• 28:24
  good as it was when it first came out anyway, so.
• 28:28
  It's just a beer. Like, honestly, it's not an IPA.
• 28:30
  You guys know, Drink your IPA is fresh.
• 28:32
  Just do it. Yeah, but like, I'm all for a
• 28:35
  beer. It's not the end of the world if
• 28:38
  you if someone sellers a six pack of Christmas sale and they
• 28:41
  enjoy it, like we're not going to stop them or anything like
• 28:43
  that. Right, right.
• 28:45
  Sugar, cinnamon, rim the glass. We're not going to stop.
• 28:48
  It's all. Good.
• 28:49
  Any way you want to drink it? Yeah.
• 28:50
  Well, and so from Christmas Ale to the barrel aged, because I
• 28:56
  was in Cincinnati where you can find Great Lakes visiting,
• 29:00
  visiting family around the holidays last year.
• 29:03
  And I went into a store and I looked up and I'm like, yeah,
• 29:06
  I'm bringing this home and I had it and I really loved it.
• 29:11
  Can you talk about the barrel aged and how long you've been
• 29:13
  doing that? Man, Barrel Edge has been going
• 29:17
  for quite a long time. I want to say it's been about a
• 29:19
  decade. Yeah, Yep.
• 29:22
  And for what we do for barrel age is generally for our BA
• 29:27
  beers, we do about half a year of aging time.
• 29:30
  We're not a brewery that like specializes in barrel aged.
• 29:32
  There's some beer, you know, some breweries that do barrel
• 29:34
  aged beers that will age stock for 2-3 years or whatever.
• 29:38
  And that's amazing. But for us a great, it's like,
• 29:43
  it's, it's a nice complimentary flavor profile to a beer that we
• 29:46
  already make often enough. And see if you're drinking the,
• 29:50
  the, the BA Imperial part is kind of like an imperial Edmund
• 29:53
  Fitzgerald recipe basically with the barrel treatment.
• 29:56
  But like, Yep. So like for Christmas sale, it's
• 29:59
  really more about like, so it's a six month, you know, 678 month
• 30:03
  contact time in the barrel and it's regular Christmas sale.
• 30:08
  So we do brew kind of like actually right after the the
• 30:14
  regular Christmas sale brewing season ends, we brew maybe it's
• 30:21
  a couple batches of regular Christmas sale and put it into
• 30:24
  the barrels and it's a mix of stock that we get from a broker.
• 30:27
  So it could be Heaven Hill, Wild Turkey, things like that.
• 30:33
  And then we just go for a blended target flavor profile.
• 30:35
  So, so it's really like that base embryo with the spices and
• 30:39
  then with the vanilla and the oak notes.
• 30:42
  And then it adds a little bit of the warming, the alcohol warming
• 30:44
  because of course, as with any other barrel aged beer, it's
• 30:47
  absorbing residual bourbon that was in the barrel.
• 30:53
  So there's going to be some alcohol uptake.
• 30:56
  So the target is 10% for the barrel aged Christmas sale.
• 30:59
  So it goes from 7% up to 10%. So we have a pretty good, pretty
• 31:04
  good extraction of, of alcohol and and of course the flavors
• 31:08
  from the barrel. So that makes an extra special
• 31:11
  treat these days. We're doing it in a, a 16 ounce
• 31:15
  can, 4 pack. So you know the 16 ounce can,
• 31:18
  let's just share it with a couple people or enjoy it by the
• 31:23
  fireside by yourself. There you go, the.
• 31:26
  Glow of the tree. And the glow of the tree which
• 31:30
  is. One of my favorite things to do
• 31:31
  is cancel, yeah. I'm sitting at work today and I
• 31:35
  work north of Nashville. This is which is why I was kind
• 31:37
  of thinking, I was thinking about this podcast today and
• 31:40
  kind of maybe some additional questions.
• 31:41
  And I'm sitting here, I'm like, how I could get to Bowling
• 31:45
  Green, KY because I work N pretty quickly.
• 31:49
  So I'm thinking of making a trip to Bowling Green, KY, because I
• 31:52
  know they got a really good liquor store.
• 31:53
  They and they're always loaded down with Christmas Ale.
• 31:56
  Yeah, and they'll probably have the barrel a stuff too.
• 31:58
  So Steve, if I go, I'll let you know and I'll bring us back a
• 32:01
  ton. Well, that's OK.
• 32:02
  I'm going to Ohio in December, so.
• 32:06
  If there's any left if there's any.
• 32:07
  Left. If there's any left, I'm sure
• 32:08
  they'll be. Mike, I know we're running down.
• 32:13
  Yeah. Oh, go ahead.
• 32:14
  I was gonna say hopefully just enough, right?
• 32:16
  Just. That's the.
• 32:17
  Goal. That's the goal.
• 32:19
  Yep. We promised only to keep you 3
• 32:21
  hours. We're approaching you 3 hours,
• 32:23
  four hours. But I, I really have two kind of
• 32:27
  questions. How has your life changed since
• 32:29
  you've been on the podcast last? Like, like, you get all this
• 32:34
  notoriety and attention. It's weird, like I'm walking
• 32:36
  down the street and people are just like running up to me and
• 32:39
  stuff. Yeah, we should have warned you
• 32:40
  about that. I really like I I have the
• 32:46
  tinted windows in my car and a lot, yeah.
• 32:48
  Yeah, you can't go anywhere and not be noticed.
• 32:50
  Now get it? Secret Service out there, you
• 32:52
  know, protecting. It's like me and then Taylor
• 32:55
  Swift and. Trevor Yeah, yeah.
• 32:58
  And Joe Flacco. Yeah, he's number three.
• 33:02
  Yeah. Yeah, no.
• 33:04
  There is one more I didn't like. I had more, but I'll I'll end up
• 33:06
  with this. I'll end with this is I did have
• 33:10
  a Taylor Swift thing in here too, but you guys recently, I
• 33:15
  don't think I didn't notice you guys recently expanded to Puerto
• 33:18
  Rico. Yeah, there we.
• 33:20
  Go. And I'm just curious, do you
• 33:21
  have any other plans to expand to any other states?
• 33:26
  We're looking at a lot of options.
• 33:27
  Right now, yeah. Yeah, I like it.
• 33:29
  I like the sound of it OK. Yeah, we did.
• 33:32
  We've been doing kind of some little things here and there.
• 33:38
  You guys knew. I think last time we talked we
• 33:40
  had done the Mass, the Mass and Rhode Island thing, so.
• 33:43
  Yeah, I think Indiana too. Yeah, Yeah, OK.
• 33:47
  But yeah, just Puerto Rico thing astute.
• 33:48
  I right there with the Puerto Rico, I mean, yeah, we saw that.
• 33:52
  I think we really shared that one story, so.
• 33:54
  It's like, wait a minute. Yeah, you know what I hear
• 34:02
  there? I hear that There's this
• 34:05
  Instagram account or whatever that is really pushing for
• 34:09
  greatly experience. I've seen this.
• 34:11
  Those guys are really passionate about.
• 34:12
  It Come on, come on, they. Should post.
• 34:14
  They should post a few more things, but they're really
• 34:16
  determined, I promise. That's right here there's a
• 34:18
  petition. They will.
• 34:20
  They will be appreciative. We may be following the truck in
• 34:24
  the Tennessee doing an Instagram live.
• 34:26
  Yeah, when? It happens if it.
• 34:27
  Happens, you know, we're hoping it happens.
• 34:30
  I mean, it says #1 Great Lakes fan right there.
• 34:32
  Both of us right there. That's right.
• 34:33
  That's right. Are you guys the ones who do the
• 34:36
  account? Yeah, you got us, You got.
• 34:42
  Us how we figure it out, yeah. He's on to us.
• 34:45
  You never know, guys. You never know as long as.
• 34:48
  You never know. You never.
• 34:49
  Know we're gonna keep. It's all in fun, but we're gonna
• 34:51
  keep pushing. Just know the desire, the want
• 34:55
  is here, is there. I wanna make you guys happy.
• 34:59
  We appreciate that. Yeah.
• 35:01
  We want we would really appreciate that.
• 35:06
  Steve, you want to wrap with anything, anything else you've
• 35:08
  got for? My team, you know, the only
• 35:10
  thing, the only thing we we could have mentioned this in the
• 35:12
  beginning and you know, I may, I'm the one that is editing this
• 35:17
  particular podcast. So we may, I may have to redo
• 35:19
  some things where we're talking about bringing Great Lakes
• 35:23
  Tennessee on the the end, but we haven't talked about Oktoberfest
• 35:28
  yet and Oktoberfest season is here.
• 35:30
  Oh yeah, we're, I think the Oktoberfest itself kicks off on
• 35:36
  Saturday, right in Munich. So it is Oktoberfest season.
• 35:41
  So no, we always got to live. Got to give some love to
• 35:44
  Christmas ale. But our other seasonals are big
• 35:47
  too. We're actually kind of forgot
• 35:50
  how much we talked about last time, but a lot of other
• 35:53
  Brewers, like seasonal hasn't been as big for them.
• 35:57
  But like just like with Christmas sale where it's like
• 36:01
  people love Christmas in Northeast Ohio so much.
• 36:05
  And you know, we're then impacted by the release of
• 36:07
  Christmas sale after that. I think like there's something
• 36:09
  about the cultural mix in the Cleveland area where like we've
• 36:15
  got that strong long running German population here.
• 36:19
  So Oktoberfest is big. We've got the Conways Irish Ale
• 36:23
  early in the year leading up Saint Patrick's Day.
• 36:25
  And of course the, you know, the Co owners are Irish and all that
• 36:28
  stuff too. So like it is Oktoberfest
• 36:30
  season. The seasonal beers are still so
• 36:32
  important for us. I still got some Mexican lager
• 36:34
  with lime, the summer seasonal in the fridge.
• 36:37
  But you know, we're kind of phasing out of that.
• 36:39
  But it's full on. I mean, we're halfway through
• 36:41
  September. So for anyone out there who's
• 36:43
  still holding out and thinks it's too early for the
• 36:46
  Oktoberfest, it's time. It's time to our great beer.
• 36:52
  If you wait much longer, you're going to miss the whole thing
• 36:54
  anyway, so. You might already be sold out
• 36:56
  some places. Yeah, that's it.
• 36:58
  You've got adapt it. We we didn't, we never hold out,
• 37:01
  but we we always kind of complain about it at the
• 37:03
  beginning of the season. Then we're just you know what,
• 37:05
  just go with it. Just get it, drink it.
• 37:06
  Here it is. Another one to think of it is,
• 37:10
  you know, technically guys, I know we've kind of said it's
• 37:12
  it's fun depending on on what standard you use.
• 37:15
  I'm a summer boy, so I go by the sun and for So it's not summer
• 37:21
  until after the autumnal equinox, which is Monday.
• 37:24
  So like, Yep. And it's 75°.
• 37:28
  I mean, in Cleveland where we brew this beer, it's like 75
• 37:31
  during the day. So it's a late summer beer.
• 37:33
  Yeah, it's a late summer beer. It's also a fall beer, but it's
• 37:36
  very much a late summer beer. So yeah, I've been I've been
• 37:39
  enjoying my steins of Oktoberfest for sure.
• 37:42
  Yeah, that perfect just nails that multi flavor.
• 37:45
  We had the guys on from Hopping Frog not long ago because we had
• 37:49
  stopped in there on our way. Up.
• 37:50
  And they were even complimenting you guys because we were talking
• 37:54
  about, because I've had their Oktoberfest, I've had yours and
• 37:57
  they were even complimenting on, you know, your style of
• 38:00
  Oktoberfest as well. Has has the Oktoberfest that you
• 38:03
  all have. Is it has it changed ever do you
• 38:06
  know or is it always pretty much stayed the same with the same
• 38:09
  ingredients? That one in particular, I, I
• 38:13
  don't know of any really no grains the same.
• 38:20
  Like we've we've swapped in some crystal malts here and there for
• 38:23
  certain brands. But Yep, as far as what I can
• 38:26
  remember, Oktoberfest is still the same.
• 38:29
  We do this modified decoction mash for it where we kind of
• 38:32
  pull 1/3 of it into the latter ton.
• 38:35
  We pull 2/3 in the louder and we leave a third back in the mash
• 38:38
  and then we raise the temp of the mash up.
• 38:40
  So it kind of does that caramelizing.
• 38:43
  You know, my yard reaction thing, my yard reaction thing to
• 38:48
  give it that extra multi oomph to it.
• 38:50
  Yep, we're still doing that stuff for now.
• 38:54
  I mean, that beer is pretty much remain the same.
• 38:56
  So that's perennial. Been a favorite of mine I always
• 39:01
  love having the low fills around the 4th of July.
• 39:03
  You know at least when we start making it start packaging the
• 39:07
  mirror. It's just the nature of packaged
• 39:10
  goods always being ahead of time.
• 39:11
  But. Yeah.
• 39:13
  But you know, like having from Hob and who's on from Hob and
• 39:15
  Frog? Fred, Zachary.
• 39:17
  And John? Yeah, yeah, it's cool.
• 39:21
  Really listen to that. Yeah, please.
• 39:22
  There's really fun. Those guys are really fun and.
• 39:25
  Yeah, that was with them. That was a when we came up there
• 39:30
  and before we hit Cleveland, we were trying to figure out would
• 39:33
  we have time to go there and we stopped in there for like an
• 39:36
  hour and a half and we had a lot of fun.
• 39:38
  Thank God we did. That was a great time.
• 39:41
  I mean all the Boris and stuff like that, you know.
• 39:44
  Yeah, we learned a lot from that too, just kind of how they did
• 39:49
  things and kind of their base. You know, the turbo shanty is a
• 39:53
  base for a lot of things and we learned a lot from that.
• 39:55
  Was a great, we enjoyed that one a lot.
• 39:57
  Very cool, yeah. Yeah, Michael, anything you want
• 40:00
  to summarize or wrap up or anything we didn't get to that
• 40:03
  you'd like to touch on? Oh, guys, I think we had
• 40:07
  everything this is. It's a pretty well oiled
• 40:11
  machine, Yeah. At this point we just, we do
• 40:13
  this in our sleep, can't we? Yeah, yeah.
• 40:16
  I mean, it's we we had all the salient topics.
• 40:20
  Like we still got that the focus on tradition, but like the new
• 40:23
  stuff called I'm glad we talked about cold Rush Midwest hazy a
• 40:26
  little bit, you know, didn't get a ton into did we talk about
• 40:30
  hazy last time? Yes, we would.
• 40:32
  Very, very well. You talked about it.
• 40:34
  You talked about it was going to be rolled out.
• 40:36
  Yeah. So, you know, yeah, same, same
• 40:39
  approach, but as Midwest, but just in hazy for him.
• 40:42
  So guys, I think we we pretty much we, we, we covered things.
• 40:46
  There's always going to be more to talk about in the future,
• 40:48
  too. I'm going to I'm going to put
• 40:50
  you on the spot real quick for Oktoberfest.
• 40:53
  On your website. It talks about the best food
• 40:56
  pairing for Oktoberfest. Do you know what it is?
• 41:02
  We used to say Wiener dog races on it, but we we switched that
• 41:05
  one out. Yeah, we used to have a cheeky
• 41:07
  pairing in there. Roast pork loin, potato pancakes
• 41:11
  and something else. Yeah, right.
• 41:13
  Spicy mustard. You got it, man.
• 41:16
  Yeah, all. Right.
• 41:19
  I've said it bajillion times, you know.
• 41:21
  I love it. I, I love, I love the food
• 41:24
  bearing, you know, conversation. I think it's really funny.
• 41:28
  It's fun. We try to even too, like I was
• 41:30
  October Fest is easy, but like Midwest IPA, we're like Perogy,
• 41:34
  you know, corn cuz it's the Midwest, you know?
• 41:37
  Yep, there's some seriousness, and there's a little bit of
• 41:40
  cheekiness in there, too. I love it.
• 41:43
  Cuz it's all fun. It's all it's all craft beer,
• 41:47
  right? It's all supposed to be fun,
• 41:49
  indeed. Well, Michael, we've got stuff
• 41:51
  that we'll save till next time and then we'll add to that for
• 41:54
  next time you come on hopefully. Perfect.
• 41:56
  You'll you'll join us again. Well, that's why I told you guys
• 41:59
  we're only doing 90 minutes and not 3 hours.
• 42:03
  We have more time next time that's.
• 42:05
  Right, until until next time, Michael Williams, a great wait.
• 42:08
  For me, we appreciate it man, leave him one anymore.
• 42:11
  I'm gonna hold up the cans. The Big Three.
• 42:13
  Yes. Oh, that's terrible.
• 42:16
  Let's try that again. Great beer, by the way.
• 42:20
  Great beer. Cheers guys.
• 42:22
  Cheers, beer, but I got the glasses.
• 42:24
  Cheers, Michael. Thanks for joining us man.
• 42:26
  Thanks guys. It's always.
• 42:27
  Cheers.