Latest / The Lone Gunman Podcast : JFK Assassination / JFK Assassination - EP. 275 - The Ins & Outs Of Hugh Aynesworth

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JFK Assassination - EP. 275 - The Ins & Outs Of Hugh Aynesworth · The Lone Gunman Podcast : JFK Assassination

0:01
Here men, Tumba Be and Joey, Joe Me and then Numba Be,
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Mammy and joe Me Hellojna? Why did I'm be and Joby Joby and the
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Man Joby and Joby send drama? Why did Johnny I'm singing pod Jazz in
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the no comment did? And you we go? And here we go?
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What's up? Everybody? Welcome to the show. This is episode two seventy
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five, The Ins and Outs of Hugh Ainsworth. We got an action packed,
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crazy show for you today. We hope you enjoy it. Welcome,
1:03
Welcome. I'm the Triple B Rob Clark, and along with me, of
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course, is my lovely co host Perry Russo aka Joey scars Barelli. What's
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up, joe Hey, how's it going? Rob? It's cool on,
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Buddy Man. I was listening to The Ochili Effect last night and I heard
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a familiar voice, Oh yeah, talking about Carmine. It was the voice
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of you, sir. It was I was tell everybody a little bit about
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your guest appearance, man, your first one. Okay, Yeah, I
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was on a panel with Carmine Savasano with Mike Swanson and Chuck o'chelly as part
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of their revamping of the JFK Myth series and covered some of the stories that
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we have covered a couple episodes of a certain podcast and it was a lot
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of fun. It was great to talk with all of them. I learned
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a lot and had had a good time. So and repped most importantly repped
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the Lone Gunman. Oh sorry, I was picking up some leaf change from
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the floor. Joe. Interesting, that's always cool. Yeah, oh oh
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oh, Bungold is here. How are you sir? And uh, we
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would like to announce that Bungled has been awarded a three month membership to Local
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and he did some digging on some of the topics we covered a couple of
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episodes ago and it intrigued me and we're going to explore more a little more
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over there. So congratulations the uh. He's an executive sound producer for the
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GM podcast. Mister mister Roger Maydard in the house. Good evening, mister
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Roger. Let's say hi to everybody real quick. Joe, Ye, Hi,
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Jacks, Colleen. Yeah, uh, let's just say he might be
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back real real soon Bud on the GM podcast. And yeah, just just
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to follow up a little bit, Chuck is kind of bringing back the uh
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his JFK Myth Myth Myths series where we you know, have on guests to
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bust these long standing myths in the JFK assassination milieu. Uh So, yeah,
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urge everybody to check it out. Stay tuned. You can hear it
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the Chili Effect and I think he uh he streams live over there on the
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website and then also pods everything out after that wherever you can listen to podcasts.
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Uh, Colleen, did you all know mister D is an expert on
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Jimmy Hendrix. Who's mister D? Do you genial? Really? I don't
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know. That's my guess. She'll have to a lot better. Just know
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if we're wrong, Colleen, if it is if it is this guy,
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I it might be this guy. Joe hang On John D. D.
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D Angeel is the writer behind Oliver Stones documentary JFK Revisited. Is that who
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you're talking about? Colleen? Where can we hear it? I think you're
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referring to, uh my appearance last night. I don't think it has been
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uploaded yet on the o'ceelly Effect website, but if you were to google that,
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uh, it would come up in the first couple. Yeah, and
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you can head over to the Chile Effect dot com. He's got all his
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latest episodes there ready to play as well. Get back to the comments real
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quick. Yes, she was referring to. Okay, I just can't see
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him rocking out to hendricks Man. You know, what do you think he
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wrocks out to. Seems more like a Doobie Brothers kind of guy, you
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know, or steely Dan. Maybe I think like a Bruce Springsteen guy.
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Yeah. No, no offense to any Bruce Springsteen fans. I mean he
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could be just like to But I guess she said she was watching it,
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watching a rockumentary and he's they're interviewing him about Hendrick. Oh wow, he's
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branching out. He solved everything, so he's branching out. Barry Man Alo.
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Yeah, he's definitely a Barry man Alo, Neil Diamond kind of guy.
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Oh lord, all right, So Joe, I figured we started off
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a little bit different to the show, and we're going to read some emails
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that we've gotten to the Lone Gum And podcast asked email bag because people email
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us. People do email us normally I just answer them randomly. But you
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know, things happen life comes up, but I don't always have time to
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email everybody back individually. So I figured we'd tackle a couple of these here
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today, or a message back promptly huh, or time to message me back
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promptly sorry. Well you know yeah, Joe. Wait, it raises his
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anxiety through the roof. Yeah, I uh. He gets all anxious when
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I don't answer him. Yeah, Like six hours I don't hear from you.
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I just can't sleep. It's like I say, yeah, i'll see
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about six thirty, and then they say, yeah, i'll see about six
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o'clock. I'm thinking about souff. No, you won't. You'll see me.
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You might see me at six forty, like tonight. All right.
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First up is from Bill Reid says, hey, Rob, I wasn't gonna
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say anything, but after viewing yesterday's show, here are the comments about you
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and Joe, I had to say something. I worked in a professional position
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for thirty four years, and I drew a lot of criticism because of my
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ideas and not being afraid to taking risks. When I heard constructive criticism,
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I took notes and made changes if and where necessary. If it wasn't constructive,
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I viewed it as jealousy from someone without the courage to do what I
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did. Tell Joey, he's doing a great job, and you both are
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working through a difficult process and we'll get there. And then he says about
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Gavin's research. You know the guy we had on a while back about the
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Tipic case. He mentioned that the police car that stopped at the rooming house
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was there to pick him up and eventually did and took him to tenth the
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Marsalis. The police car, that the Marsalis bus and the cab ride have
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contradictions to bother me. Why did he take the cab to the five hundred
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block of Beckley if he expected the police to pick him up, If his
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destination was Tenthed Marsalis, why not have the cab drop him off there.
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So a couple of things. You can either believe he took the cab or
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you believe he expected the police to show up at his roominghouse. I think
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believing one just proves the other. One odd thing about five hundred North Beckley
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is that the El Chico restaurant was a block away. And remember there was
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a report of a man that resembled Oswald sitting in a red car at the
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El Chico Restaurant. Sorry for the length, Bill, so Bill, Yeah,
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thank you, and yeah, we don't let the haters bother us.
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We know this is a sometimes a daunting task and like I said, it's
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new for both of us. We're learning. We'll get better, we promise.
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Uh and uh, Hey what's up, Paul? Yep, and thank
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you for that. I appreciate it. Yeah, and we view it as
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constructive criticism as long as you're not an a hole about it. Like some
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people love to be behind a keyboard trolling us to death. But it's all
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good keyboard warriors. Yeah, all right. Next up, we got one
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from Andrew says, Hey, Rob, just want to drop an email and
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lets you know that I'm fairly new to discovering the Lone Cooming podcast, although
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not new to the case itself, and I'm really enjoying it. Founder Your
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second Frasier episode fascinating, as was the episode about Butch Burrows and the Texas
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Theater. I find the theater to be a particular interest in the case,
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and yet it kind of flies under the radar a bit. I'd love to
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hear your thoughts on what would down there. Anyways, Keep up the good
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work. Thanks Andrew, Well Andrews, your lucky night, because we are
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going to get into the Texas Theater a little bit because the man we're talking
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about here tonight, mister Hugh Ainsworth, was the allegedly in the Texas Theater
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when Oswald was arrested, so we are going to cover a little bit of
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that from his perspective, allegedly. All right, we got two more Joe,
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all right, this one from Ashley Benyon. Gooday, Big Bad Rob
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and Joe. I loved last week's episode and really enjoyed how you only spend
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a small amount of time acknowledging those two. There's two clown farts, Gruber
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and Cuttley. I have wasted time, thankfully not too much listening to those
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two, and they clearly fall into the category of cringeworthy, never letting the
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facts get in the way of their stories. What set you, guys apart
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and easily the best JFK research podcast going around is your in depth Analysis and
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Doug Campbell with Quick Hits and the Dallas Action. Anyone not seriously interested in
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this new research that comes to light that you guys analyze are just not getting
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the full picture. Speaking of which I have always been intrigued about yours and
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Doug's theory of dark complexed man being Felipe Video Santiago and your research into him.
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Have you ever came across any information that he may have injured or you
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may have been injured and had a leg injury forcing him to have a limp?
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Why do I ask? Take a look at the link below, and
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he sends the link to you tube, which I did see. It made
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the rounds recently of supposedly the dark complexed man walking across the middle of the
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grass esplanade there between Maine and elm and away from the knoll. Yeah,
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and he did have a little bit of a pimp walk to him. I
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don't know if you could definitely call it a limp. I mean, the
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ground could have just been uneven for all we know, but sure that that's
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the dark complected man. So uh, it's hard to say. And but
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I'm sure Felipe Video Santiago Ago was banged up. I mean he was,
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you know, going on these raids. He was probably beat up a little
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bit. He ended up getting blown up on a boat in December of nineteen
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sixty three. So if he believed if he did have a limp or walking
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a little funny. It's not not surprising. What's that. I think it
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was sixty four, but don't quote me on that. But where he got
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blown up, where he where he was captured, and that had to do
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with the cannon document you read on Quickheads, right, Yeah, he was
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blown up and captured in December. December. He was killed in sixty four.
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Oh, I got you, gotcha? Yeah, no, he he
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had that. What I was going to say is I was going to make
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a joke. He had that kind of Mahomes walk, you know how Patrick
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Mahomes walks in like this little weird type of way and not the nip twist.
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Yeah, he and he definitely was walking like he either was injured or
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he was carrying something. If that is walkie talkie and his butt cracked,
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Joe, that's what he was doing. That'll make you walk a little funny,
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apparently the size of the walking talking back then, Yeah, definitely,
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all right, you thank you Ashley from down Under. And Ashley is a
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dude, by the way, so don't don't get hot and bothered. Joe.
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Lastly here again bothered, I don't know, just busting your boss I'm
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used to it after especially after the last quickts. Hello. Been currently listening
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to quite a bit of your content, good stuff. Just went through all
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the descriptions of the shows. Did you ever consider doing an episode on perme
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Index? Is there much legit stuff there? I thought I recalled someone up
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there in Canada suing for some documents from the Bloomfield archives. Also, how
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about Arnin Milchan, billionaire former spy and executive producer on JFK. Keep up
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the good work. I thank you. Guys are almost at the only damn
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guard level of excellence. Damn you, Steve. Maybe one day we will
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get there. Sincerely, Steve, thanks for the heads up on tinfoil hat.
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That seemed deliberate. How much more could they muddy the waters? Yeah,
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we agree, Steve. It was definitely a deliberate shunning of us for
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sure. As to the content of your email about doing an episode on perme
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Index, uh, I just don't think there's enough there to go into it.
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That's been researched, like through Helen Helen back going back to the May
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Brussel days, and there's just, I mean, there's just no meat on
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the bone. There's a lot of conjecture that can be made about it,
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but it's been done to death and nothing substantials come from it. That group
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of guys obsessed with Ruth Payn's Lezzie Films. Hey, who wouldn't be Colleen?
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I mean two fine specsmens there, uh now walking in the front and
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talking in the back. That's right, Scott. You know there's a dark
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complexed men Joe or reportedly very well hung, so he could have been really
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off balance walking across that area. Sure. Yeah, and that's you mentioned,
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uh Captain Westbrook as he was kind of the superhero cop that day Worth
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day. That's that's the parent. That's the comparison I'm making here with Hugh
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Ainsworth and being everywhere from in the JFK Weekend even serving as a poll bearer
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to cole bearer to Lee Harvey Oswald's funeral, yes on a Monday. Well,
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nobody else wanted to carry him, Joe, so somebody had to do
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it right. That was maybe where he started getting his eye on Marina.
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I'm surprised Hugh Ainsworth didn't volunteer for that. No, he did, I
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believe you tell me. Hugh Ainsworth was a pall bearer for Lee Harvey Oswald.
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That's what I read. Wow, I did not know that that was
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a that was a fact. I did not know. I did not like
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go into huge depths and research to like confirm it. But I read it
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in pretty solid article. I thought, so, hey, it might be
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true because I confirmed. Look, everybody's heard of Hugh Ainsworth, you know,
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that's that's research into this case at all. You know, he was
18:27
a I want want to say, a lifelong Dallas resident. But he definitely
18:33
held a presence in Dallas for many, many years and was able to interview
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a lot of people connected to this case, including William Wally, the lazy
18:45
cab driver, Marina Oswald, and many many, many many others. And
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as you'll see, and I didn't really know what a lot of this because
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I mean, he'd be like damn okay. So his story starts out that
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morning November twenty second. Joe, he's sitting there eating lunch with Jack Ruby
19:11
at the Dallas Morning News. According to him, he says, at around
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eleven thirty am and he's talking to him and that he's known Jack Ruby for
19:19
years. He said Jack Ruby was always coming down and putting ads in the
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paper. Or doing whatever, and that it was around eleven thirty that Jack
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Ruby got up and went upstairs to put his ad in the paper at the
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Dallas Morning News or whatever. And Hugh had heard that the president was coming.
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At the time, he was a writer on the very happening space beat,
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you know, covering all kinds of space news, rocket news, satellite
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news, things like that. Yep, okay, So he thought it would
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be a good idea too, you know, head down and watch the presidential
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motorcade as they came through Dallas. Yes, Rob, can I interrupt?
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Uh So he actually, according to his oral his living timeline history, oral
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history, he wasn't on duty that day and was very jealous of the reporters
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that were. So that's what made him freelance, decide to freelance, and
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he could not get to the other parts of the parade route because they were
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six seven people deep, which is how he ended up Indie Lee Plaza.
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This was his own words. I listened to earlier today and the six Flour
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Museums interview with him. So good, good, what's up, Dean?
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Thank you for the supersticker. You Dean appreciated my friend, all right,
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So then he decides to go down h and he's making his way, people
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are like six seven people deep on the sidewalk. So he finally he walks
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all the way down and ends up in Deally Plaza. He says, right
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in the middle of Elm Street, right on the corner, like right where
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the towners were. And that tool, the guy with the hard hat that
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says he saw oswald up in the window. I can't remember his name right
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now, but this is allegedly where Hugh Ainsworth was. He was right on
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the opposite corner, he said in his interviews. You know he would have
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just looked up. He probably could have seen him, but he didn't.
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He never looked up. I've never seen him in any photos or films from
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the day or identified and you know as being there's Hugh Ainsworth in this photo
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and this movie, you know the type of thing. But that's where he
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says he was shot. Shout yes, I actually you just gave me a
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really good idea. What's that When we talked to mister Alex Harris, where's
22:15
Waldo? When we talked to mister Alex Harris in a future episode, you
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love interrupting me, Uh, we should ask him about that because, as
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you know, he is not only a collector of Dally film, you know,
22:33
assassination footage, but also any photographs were related to any part of the
22:37
parade route. He knows people that have you know. Funny enough, you
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mentioned a reporter from Shreveport, Louisiana. I don't know if you caught that
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on quick hits and thought of me, but uh, one of the guys
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that had the Jack Ruby footage and uh yeah whatever, someone else was there?
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I think Joe, Yeah, in the Gay nineties club. Oh thanks
23:03
a lot. But seriously, that's a good uh, that's a good idea
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to ask Alex if if he could, if he's ever if he has pictures
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from that corner to see if he actually was there. And we have many
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pictures of Hugh Ainsworth at around that time, so I don't think it could.
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It's something that could be debunked possibly. Colleen, thank you very much
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for the supersticker. You rock. So I want to read a little bit
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from this article from the fifteenth anniversary, and Hugh Aane's Worth, in his
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own words, will tell you basically what he did that day, and he
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says he heard a shot, he thought it was a firecracker, a second,
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then a third, and he says, I knew it was the whine
24:15
of a rifle, even though I'm not a shooter. And then we didn't
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know what to do. People went crazy, running around everywhere, and he
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says his journalistic instincts kicked in rather quickly, and he saw a man right
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across from him, sitting on a parapet, and he was gesturing at the
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depository window up there. He said, I saw him. I saw him.
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I ran to him and tried to interview him, but when he found
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out I was a reporter, he got scared to death and asked two cops
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to take me away. I ended up at the depository building where I heard
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the police radio report come in about JD. Tippett being shot in Oak Cliff.
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Now he's jumping lot here because you know, the murder of JD.
25:03
Tippett didn't happen right after the assassination of the president. I mean we're talking
25:11
thirty to forty minutes, you know what I mean. So there's a lot
25:17
he's leaving out here. It seems like, you know, I don't know,
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but he says, I thought somebody shoots at the president here and somebody
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shoots at a cop three or four miles away, it's got to be connected.
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He says. I didn't have time or he says, I didn't have
25:36
a way to get over to Oak Cliff. But I saw two Channel eight
25:40
guys with a mobile unit. So I told one of them how a cop
25:42
had been killed, and he said, get in, and we drove like
25:48
mad men to the scene of the Tippet murder. So he's asked, so
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that's how you got to the theater where they finally arrestedt And he says,
26:03
I heard that on a police radio too while we were at the scene of
26:07
the Tippet murder, that there was a suspect in the Texas Theater. So
26:11
I ran like the devil. As I got up to the theater, I
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saw a woman crying and she kept saying he's in there, he's in there.
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And so I go into theater and there were only maybe fourteen people in
26:26
there. A couple of them were in police uniforms coming up the two aisles,
26:33
stopping people, frisking them. They finally got to Oswald and they later
26:37
told me that he said, well it's all over now. I couldn't hear
26:42
him say that since I was probably fifteen feet away, but I saw them
26:48
jump on him. It was pretty wild that whole weekend, all right.
26:53
And then he was also there in the basement when Jack Ruby shot Lee Harvey
27:03
Oswalt. So apparently he was at a lot of places. He was all
27:12
over the place. Joe, are you muted? Yes, I am.
27:22
I like to joke he was the Forrest Gump of newspaper reporters. Who's banging
27:34
Marina? She was banging a lot. Yes, we'll get to that,
27:42
I promise. So that's the basic gist of Hugh Ainsworth and what he supposedly
27:57
did that day. Now moving forward, being Dallas based, and then you
28:06
know, he took it upon himself as a journalist many witnesses he could and
28:15
start writing stories about them for the Dallas Morning News. And this is where
28:21
we get to the part of the story where things start to get a little
28:22
bit more hot and heavy and interesting. All right, Joe, yes,
28:29
sir, let's get it all right. Do you want me to take it
28:37
away? Yes, all right, there's your super segue, my super segue.
28:47
Well, I have a fun picture to share first, That is Hugh
28:52
Ainsworth and his We are not sure which wife, because there's only one or
28:57
seventh or eighth wife. Yes. Uh, I did go on ancestry of
29:03
course and look at divorce indexes and uh he will get yes, so he
29:10
was. He was a very vigorous man. Yes, uh so one of
29:17
the first. You know, there's been a lot of things hold on before
29:18
I go to that, there's been a lot of things that have been you
29:26
know, Hugh Ainsworth is definitely not someone that hasn't been explored before. Right,
29:32
There's been a lot of articles on him. There's been a lot of
29:33
topics on him. There's been a lot of threads on and swarms about it
29:41
real quick. A lot of people paint this guy as a lone nutter,
29:48
which he was. But now, before he passed, he was active in
29:53
several Facebook groups and I've had interactions with him in the past and he was
29:59
always very factful and very nice in his answers. So I really have nothing
30:04
bad to say about the guy. And in his own words, he basically
30:11
said that he's not anti conspiracy, it's just that he hasn't found a conspiracy
30:18
theory yet, that he in his own way, through his own knowledge and
30:25
research, and that he can't basically debunk you know, there's the Dallas centric
30:33
stuff, and then we move into the Garrison investigation, which yeah, yeah,
30:37
there was a lot to pick on there, you know, and that
30:41
wasn't necessarily his forte you know, New Orleans. He was definitely Dallas based,
30:48
So he's kind of picking at Garrison from afar, which is understandable.
30:56
And of course, you know, he eventually branched out into other things,
31:00
but he always came back to the Kennedy assassination. And as you know,
31:06
folks, I'm not averse to having loan nutters on this show. I will
31:10
give them their their fair say, as long as you can do it in
31:15
a conversational manner and not be a dick basically, you know, oh yeah,
31:23
at the end of the day, this is not life or this stuff.
31:27
We are all human beings. We all believe what we believe because of
31:33
our past to get here, okay, and we're not all at the same
31:37
level. At the same time, a lot of loan nutters started off as
31:41
conspiracy theorists, but because they couldn't figure it out the case, it's a
31:45
lot easier to say well that you know, hey, Oswald did it,
31:49
and you know this is why I think that, And that's fine. We
31:52
can have a difference of opinion. We can have a conversation about it.
31:57
And like I said, we're all humans. This is not life and death
32:00
stuff. You know, It's not like the end of the world because somebody
32:06
believes Lee Harvey Oswall did it alone. You know, it's no different than
32:10
having a friend that is of a different political view than you, that likes
32:16
different kinds of music than you. You know, you're not going to stop
32:20
being their friend because of these things and believing one way or the other.
32:24
In this assassination business, it's small potatoes. I can still have friends but
32:30
disagree about, you know, certain details. You know, life will be
32:36
really, really boring if we all believe the same thing. So I just
32:39
wanted to slap that in there because it will come into play towards the end
32:45
of the show when we get back into how Hugh Ainsworth was treated in the
32:51
conspiracy community. But pray continue, Joe. Okay, I I lost my
33:00
train of thought there, But it's okay because I am going to the next
33:05
slide here, which is one of the first or one of the early articles
33:15
he wrote in February twenty ninth, nineteen sixty four in the Dallas Morning News,
33:22
captioned no intention of bowing out, says aids to Marina Oswalts, and
33:28
this article is written by Hugh Ainsworth, states John Martin Thorne and her business
33:35
manager James Martin, according to the article, have indicated they have no intentions
33:40
of bowing out of the contract signed with Marina. Their percentages. We've gone
33:46
over that. They also stated that Martin had said sixty eight thousand dollars had
33:53
been placed in a Fort Worth, Texas bank in Marina's name from contributions that
34:00
would not be touched by Martin or Thornon as part of the contract. Ladies
34:05
and gentlemen, that is six hundred and eighty thousand dollars today it is ten
34:08
times as much. I did the calculations. So as early as February sixty
34:16
four, he is writing our articles in favor of Marina against in this case
34:24
some of our favorite characters, James Herbert Martin and Martin thorn And you have
34:30
to wonder if Hugh Ainsworth is trying to get a little in with Marina and
34:37
get a little good score some points in a sense. On April twenty seventh,
34:45
nineteen sixty four about a month and about two months later he writes an
34:53
article FBI knew Oswalt capable of act reports indicate, So this is not a
35:01
to Rob's point earlier, a really anti conspiracy, although I still think he
35:08
comes to the conclusion of conspiracy in this article. He did piss the FBI
35:14
oft enough that Hoover, which you'll see in the left, wrote a letter
35:22
to mister Rankin about Eansworth and he talks about special Asian hosty and you know
35:34
especially you know, everyone's in cya mode. But it's very interesting because Hugh
35:42
Ainsworth is commonly known as a mocking Bird, so you know, part of
35:50
the CIA mark Operation mocking Bird, which was having media assets in ever a
35:57
lot or all of the major media. And there was a lot of inner
36:04
agency rivalry going on then, and a lot of agencies were trying to cover
36:09
their own assets and blame it on other agencies. So that's something interesting to
36:15
keep in mind here. Let's see. So, of course, Hugh Ainsworth,
36:24
it's known to some, was sleeping with Marina Oswald. He was quite
36:30
the ladies man. And I want you guys so to pay attention to the
36:42
first sentence on June thirtieth, nineteen sixty four, DLT one. So let's
36:49
see if anyone in the chat remembers from a couple episodes what DLT one is.
36:57
And it's funny because the second paragraph starts informant stated that he had no
37:02
personal knowledge, blah blah blah. Third paragraph on July first, sixty four,
37:08
DLT one, again in brackets, telephonically advised, let me check the
37:15
chat here, bungled I'm looking at you to come up with this. Well.
37:23
As we covered two episodes ago, DL one is referred to as d
37:29
L thirty three S, and d L thirty three S is technical surveillance on
37:36
Marina Oswald. So d FBI, who was supposed to cease their surveillance of
37:44
Marina in March of nineteen sixty four, we're still doing it as of July
37:50
of nineteen sixty four. And that's how they were able to find out,
37:57
or at least in the documents, that Hugh Ainsworth was sleeping with Marina.
38:02
So this goes back to paying attention to small little things. And when you
38:12
understand little context like this, you can go back and see DLT one is
38:20
being portrayed as an informant here and Rob when last time we spoke, you
38:28
had a great point where you said they kind of double cod coded it because
38:34
it wasn't particularly legal, right right, And uh so they attributed they attributed
38:42
it to a human, Yes, but they use words like telephonically advised.
38:49
Well they always said that, I know. But it's great because that was
38:52
the telephone tap, right, So it's it's just it's it's FBI fuckery at
38:59
its at it's greatest, right. So I thought that was really interesting.
39:02
I thought that was a great continuation from something that we had put together a
39:08
couple of episodes episodes ago, and it's you know, who knows how long
39:14
this tap was going before you moveing from this slide, Joe sure. Uh.
39:20
First of all, thank you Jack for the super chat and Hill comes
39:22
to play the Bloody Bends for the supersticker. You guys rock We appreciated greatly.
39:30
And just to show you a little bit about what a badass Hugh Ainsworth
39:35
was in the third paragraph of this document when he was in Colorado, he
39:42
was Hugh Ainsworth was messing around with a married woman and her husband came home
39:47
and slashed his neck, requiring thirty three stitches. So he carried that giant
39:58
scar for the rest of his life on his neck. But he lived to
40:04
tell about it, and it's pretty crazy and kept getting it in. Yeah
40:10
and that. Yeah, that is a crazy story. And you have to
40:16
wonder if the wife was just like, yeah, my husband's in prison.
40:20
Maybe then he got out earlier or something. Well, had his throat not
40:24
been slashed like that in Colorado, he likely would have never moved to Texas.
40:30
So it's just crazy how these things work, you know. Yeah,
40:34
Yeah, but it goes back to you know, him being a ladies man
40:38
and maybe even a honey trap of the opposite sex. So I don't think
40:49
he's a honey trap. He's a honey dick. Yeah, whatever, whatever
40:52
the term for that is. I'm not I'm not I'm not certain on that
40:57
one. Rob. This is an Joe. They called him sugar digs.
41:04
This is an okay, sugar dicks. It's interesting. This is an article
41:12
from Newsweek May fifteenth, nineteen sixty seven, written by Hugh Ainsworth the JFK
41:17
Conspiracy. He is continuing to flout the lone Nutter case. But what I
41:27
wanted to briefly read was the last two paragraphs of this article, there are
41:34
still some feeling in New Orleans that Big Jim must have something. But now
41:38
that the facts of the real conspiracy in quotes are beginning to emerge, there,
41:45
Garrison seems to be losing his confidence. He is habil having trouble speaking,
41:51
and he says that he high that a hired torpedo from Havana is stalking
41:55
him. I never heard them about that before. The real question in New
42:01
Orleans is no longer whether Garrison has solved the assassination solved. Also in quotation
42:07
marks, the question is how long the people of the city and the nation's
42:10
press will allow this travesty of justice to continue. So hire a torpedo from
42:19
Havana sounds like the dark complexed Man's coming after And yeah, thank you Scott
42:30
for the supersticker, You fucking rock man. Thank you Scott. This is
42:37
we're going back a little now on the chronology here, And this is memo
42:42
J. Walton Moore wrote, and this it's about Hainsworth And I'm just gonna
42:46
read the second the second paragraph here. Ainsworth has some fifteen experience as a
42:53
reporter, and since nineteen sixty has been in the AVI. Has been the
43:00
science aviation reporter. That's what you were talking before Ron about for the Dallas
43:07
Beat. Yep, he has offered his services to us if it develops that
43:12
he receives a visa. And he's talking about going to Cuba, where he
43:16
eventually did and played basketball with Castro. Yeah. So not only did do
43:22
all this stuff in Dallas and witness all this stuff, he used to Cuba
43:28
and ends up getting to play basketball with Fidel Castro. Yeah. And during
43:36
his oral history thing he said, yeah, you know, we we battled
43:43
over a few rebounds, but I thought we were I was set for an
43:47
interview type of thing, and then Castro ghosted him. He kept boxing me
43:53
out. Yeah, so just in his short shorts. Very interesting that he
44:00
that he's in Cuba too, right, So from Denver to Dallas to Cuba
44:06
or and one of the last things, because I always do this and hold
44:10
on rumor, has it Fidel Castro had very hairy legs. Yes, And
44:20
just to really show that Hugh Ainsworth was a ladies man up into his old
44:24
age, I of course go on ancestry to try to find any extra details
44:30
or newspaper articles. But he was married to a girl thirty nine when he
44:36
was fifty two, and they got divorced after two and a half years.
44:44
So yeah, I don't know. I don't think that's the girl on that
44:49
the first picture I showed Rob, But no, I don't think I could
44:54
keep up with a woman. Was it fourteen years my junior at the of
45:00
course you can. You're the big bad Bob. Don't underestimate yourself, man,
45:07
I don't know. So that that is some interesting things I found on
45:17
Ainsworth. It's a little different than the usual things that are talked about from
45:23
him, and it is kind of a continuation on some of the other things
45:29
we have talked about relating to the aftermath and specifically how DLT one was still
45:37
operating in July of sixty four on Marina. Yeah, that's a that's a
45:43
good question, Bungled. If he did it legally, he would have had
45:46
to. You know, there was no direct flights unless David Ferry was flying
45:53
you, Yeah, unless he had a private a private charter, which he
45:58
may have you know right here. Yeah, I'm not sure if that's Yeah,
46:02
I'm not sure if that's ever been revealed. How how we got there,
46:10
we would have to follow up on not what's up, Old slacker?
46:14
Thank you, sir. We are having a fantastic evening, mister Slacker.
46:21
Sometimes cute doesn't matter if it's free Joe, that's true. Words to live
46:30
by Colleen, Thank you, Thank you. Hell comes to play. We
46:39
try to and you know, we also try to put up these documents,
46:43
a lot of them over at the Locals Community. If you want to dive
46:46
in more. It generally takes us a day or two to get them up
46:51
over there. The link is in the description of this very show. So,
46:58
yeah, if you're interested in using the documents that we use here on
47:00
the show, you can find most of them over there. Yeah, Or
47:07
you know, we also have some other let's say literature in our secret TSBD,
47:15
which you guys can figure secret depository. You can figure that out for
47:21
your say, a lot, but you can figure it out. You can
47:23
figure it out, and let me tell you it is way worth the value
47:29
of this gets your library card over at Locals and you can check all as
47:37
many books out of the book depository as you want for free. Yes,
47:42
our library card is free. And then well, well the library card is
47:46
not. Yes, but it will allow you. Well, we can make
47:52
a we can make a virtual library card for them. It's a virtual library
47:57
card. We're speaking in Tong's here and veiled the comments, so yes,
48:04
you know, nobody comes blasting for us. Yes, social outcast. Ainsworth
48:14
did become Fraser's I don't know about babysitter, but he did help Fraser write
48:19
his book. And for that which one? Huh? Which one? The
48:24
only book that he wrote, Steering Truth? The last the most recent one.
48:29
That's the only one Phraser's ever wrote. Oh, for some reason,
48:31
I thought he wrote earlier one. I'm sorry. No, it was rumored
48:35
that he actually ghost wrote that book for Fraser, but I interested for sure.
48:45
And for those who don't know, Hugh Ainsworth passed away in December of
48:49
twenty twenty three. Just let just last year, a little over two months
48:52
ago. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean he would have been kind
48:59
of old to, I mean, to ghost write that, but you never
49:05
know. Yeah, and John, there is a discussion on the Education form
49:08
about this very subject, and it appears that his book will see the light
49:15
of day. There was a rumor that he lost everything in a computer crash,
49:24
but apparently there's enough of it around to basically get a book out eventually.
49:34
And I think that's what's gonna happen. It's just gonna take probably take
49:37
a couple of years, kind of like Albarelli's book took a couple of years
49:40
to come out after him he passed. But you know, Hugh Ainsworth lived
49:50
a pretty crazy and fascinating life, and not just with the Kennedy assassination.
49:54
You know, he went on to h He was instrumental in getting was it
50:02
Is. It was it Otis tools who is a serial killer? And I
50:08
believe it's the only I want. I don't want to say governmental pardon in
50:16
the state of Texas by George W. H. W. Bush when he
50:21
was the governor, But I believe he had his death sentence commuted for whatever
50:29
reason because I think or he kind of proved that Otis Toole had inflated his
50:36
body count, if you will, if he was even a serial killer.
50:45
You know, there's a lot of stories out there, but I think he
50:49
claimed to kill over like one hundred and some people. But I know Ainsworth
50:57
interviewed him and him and Ted Bundy. He actually put out a book about
51:05
Ted his Ted Bundy interviews. In the early eighties. He was also at
51:12
Waco at the siege at Waco with David Koresh and all that, and uh,
51:17
you know, wrote about that as well. So this guy led a
51:24
fascinating Forrest Gump type life, you know. And I encourage everybody out there,
51:32
if you can find audio of his interviews, make sure you listen.
51:37
And even like Joe said at the sixth Floor Museum, I believe we have
51:40
a couple of clips, Joe, don't we We do we do. Let's
51:47
hear a couple of clips from from Hugh Eansworth himself. The first one here
51:54
he's talking about Johnny Brewer, the superhero shoe salesman who pointed Oswald out of
52:02
the theater. Here we go. Have a listen to this, folks.
52:07
And that was a strange thing too, and you really had a hero there,
52:12
I named Johnny Brewer was manager of a shoe store four doors away from
52:19
that theater, and he noticed Oswald cars. Police cars were cruising by,
52:28
screaming sirens everywhere. Nobody knew what was going on or how many people involved
52:35
anything. And he noticed that Oswald, every time a police car would go
52:38
by, he would sort of hide in front of his shoe store. So
52:46
when Oswald left, then the police had obviously driven somewhere else. He watched
52:53
Oswald walked the four blocks and the four stores to the theater, gonna enter
53:00
her, and he knew the Julia Postal, the ticket person, so he
53:06
ran up to her and said, did you see that guy? Did he
53:08
buy a ticket? That? He questioned her. She said, I don't
53:13
know. I don't know, but he's in there. Well, by that
53:16
time, I was just coming up onto that. I didn't know what to
53:22
do. I didn't know whether they had somebody, that they had a suspect
53:28
inside the theater. But I went inside the door. And when you go
53:32
into that theater and it's still there, you can see it first door of
53:37
the rioting, and then there's another door after that. I went to the
53:40
first door, and almost immediately I saw people coming up, policemen, a
53:45
couple of the uniform, a couple or not coming up to two aisles and
53:52
stopping a couple of people and checking him out and everything like that. Well,
53:58
see they Johnny in the meantime, And this is why I think he
54:02
was a hero, because not only did he notice Oswalt, nobody else did,
54:08
but he was behind the curtain telling the cops who would come in the
54:13
back bay where Oswald was sitting. So there you have it, the hero
54:23
Johnny Brewer from Hwansworth's perspective, hiding behind a curtain, pointing out Oswalt of
54:31
the cops. There he is, he's that white guy right there, but
54:37
he's kind of like hiding, like yeah, And I was going to ask
54:43
did you pay to get in, mister Ainsworth or did you walk by?
54:47
Julia Postal as well that that interview must have been like towards the end of
54:52
his life. He sounded a day older than the interview. It was like
54:57
two thousand and it was within the last five fish six years maybe two.
55:01
Lord, But uh, and we got one more here about Beckley, right,
55:07
Joe, Yeah, yeah, because of course, not only did he
55:10
was he inside the Texas Theater on the corner of Houston and elm And and
55:20
the Tip murder scene and the Tip and murder scene. He also went to
55:23
Beckley the rooming house. And when you listen to this it uh clip that's
55:32
gonna come up. It sounds almost like he's a cop. I wonder if
55:37
he slept with Earlene Roberts as well to get information. She was quite the
55:42
looker. Cricket okay, thanks, she's I don't know. Damn, I
55:52
don't know. I can't verify, Uh, everybody a rating? We we
55:57
would have to consult our boop experts. Mister Horney, all right, here
56:04
is Hugh Ainsworth on Beckley. We do have audio thanks to Doug Campbell of
56:14
of Huntley. Disrespectful, not the right close to Dallas conference here, good
56:21
lords, we do not have audio from Hughanesworth about Beckley, so we will
56:27
skip over that one I heard. I heard myself talking. I'm like trapped
56:32
in an infinity mirror. Joe, Yeah, it's okay. How did we
56:43
get in the chat to who owns BUCkies? I have no idea. All
56:52
I know is we're getting one close to where I live finally, about an
56:55
hour away here in Virginia very soon, and I will be there at some
57:02
point. Wow. Thank you psv Odyssey, Yes, Paul, thank you.
57:09
My friend he interviewed, but I don't know if he's caught up in
57:21
the chat here. Okay, do you want me to see if this works?
57:23
If I could play it, you can try, all right. If
57:30
after two seconds you don't hear it, just say I can't hear it.
57:35
I can't hear it. Oh, no, so I did send you the
57:39
wrong clip. Yes, it's all good. Yes. Essentially, he goes
57:46
to Beckley and he uh goes and talks to Arlene Roberts and says, I
57:55
need to see the room that was his quote from the audio, and goes
58:02
in there and looks around and sees nothing. But so as he's about to
58:09
leave, Arlene Roberts goes, wait, do you want to see something and
58:15
brings out the the book, which is the look at the Registrars list of
58:25
you know, the current resident list and who's been paid. And according to
58:31
Hugh Ainsworth in the clip that we were unable to play, Arleen Roberts offered
58:38
that piece of paper with O H lee to Ainsworth, but Ainsworth said,
58:43
no, no, I think that's better in the police's hands. So considering
58:50
all his diary Shenanigan's, you would think as a reporter you would probably take
58:59
that piece of evidence if offered, if you were not aligned with certain government
59:12
or state enforcement. I have no idea what you just said, Joe,
59:19
but we will move on to Hugh Ainsworth is dead. The Grinch is gone.
59:30
Now many many moons ago on quick hits, Doug and I took a
59:37
little offense to the way that this guy, right, which guy John D.
59:50
D d angeel him oh him, uh, the way he just loves
59:59
dancing on people's graves after they've passed. And this is another good example.
1:00:09
Less than a month after Hugh Ainsworth passed away, we get this article on
1:00:14
Kennedy's and King written by Jim Dugenio called Hugh Ainsworth is Dead, The Grinch
1:00:21
Is Gone. Jim D. Eugenio chronicles the horrendous career of the late Hugh
1:00:28
Ainsworth and his reporting on the JFK case. It is a sorry sight to
1:00:32
behold and tells us much about modern American journalism and his role in covering up
1:00:38
the murder of President Kennedy. Okay, so he goes into a little bit
1:00:44
about his background and then proceeds to just take a giant shit on Hugh Ainsworth's
1:00:52
legacy for four pages worth of stuff. And you know, I'm not even
1:01:02
gonna sit here and read it. If you want to read this article,
1:01:06
go to Kennedy's and King search for Human's Worth is Dead and you can see
1:01:10
it for yourself. But to disparage the memory of somebody who recently passes about
1:01:20
you know, the shittiest thing one human being can do to another. Yeah,
1:01:24
mocking bird or not, no matter how well you know, there's no
1:01:29
evidence he was mocking bird. Joe. Oh, but I'm just saying that's
1:01:32
why I said or not. Yeah, you know, it's just I don't
1:01:38
know. It just doesn't sit well with me. I guess you could say,
1:01:43
I mean, just because you didn't agree with you know how he approached
1:01:49
his investigation into the Kennedy assassination and reported on it. You know, it
1:01:54
doesn't give you the right to just shit on them and dance on their grave
1:01:59
once they're gone. He did the same thing when Uh, who's the guy
1:02:05
that used to be on the sixth Floor? Uh, Gary Gears, Gary
1:02:15
Mac, Gary Mack. Oh yeah, yeah. Now. Gary Mack was
1:02:20
a conspiracy theorist for twenty years before he became the curator for the Sixth Floor
1:02:27
Museum. And you know, while publicly he had he maintained, you know,
1:02:31
the Oswalt as alone assassin narrative, privately, in discussions with researchers,
1:02:40
he still believed in a conspiracy and he would help out researchers any way he
1:02:47
could by pointing them in the right direction. Or giving them resources that the
1:02:52
museum had access to that he that he could. And you know, for
1:02:58
for Jim d to do this is just despicable. I mean, it's it's
1:03:06
just a despicable human being. And you wonder why we make fun of him,
1:03:14
not only for his ridiculous claims, but it's stuff like this where you
1:03:19
can't even be a decent, freaking human being to other people who just passed
1:03:23
away. You know, Karma is a bitch and I hope he gets everything
1:03:30
that he deserves because you know, he it's just disgusting to read. And
1:03:38
you know, that's just my opinion on the thing. Joe, What do
1:03:40
you think I agree? And like I said, mockingbird or not, and
1:03:50
whether I believe, you know, he was an asset, a mocking bird
1:03:55
asset, I you know, kind of leaned towards the yes side. But
1:04:04
still he had a pretty illustrious journalistic h and writing career. He was,
1:04:13
like we said a couple of times, the Forrest Gump of reporters. He
1:04:16
was everywhere, and uh, you know, I'm not going to dance.
1:04:23
I'm not gonna I'm not going to dance on his grave, you know,
1:04:29
I he he was doing a job and probably doing what he thought was was
1:04:36
was right. So and like it says, you know, we have no
1:04:41
photographic proof that he was in any of these places, but it doesn't mean
1:04:45
that he wasn't either. You know, absence of evidence is not proof of
1:04:49
anything. So you know, we don't have we don't have pictures of Oswald
1:04:58
leaving the school book depository, but we know he did, you know what
1:05:01
I mean. So I don't know. Are you ready for your surprise?
1:05:11
Joe? Oh? Yes, So Rob has teased me for the past couple
1:05:15
of days saying, I have a surprise for you. I'm not going to
1:05:18
tell you what it is, and I'm gonna unveil it on air without telling
1:05:24
you. And this has got me kind of worried. So nothing to worry
1:05:28
about, Nothing to worry about. It's a surprise for you, and it's
1:05:31
a surprise for our lovely listeners and viewers. Because we'll do a brief callback
1:05:41
here to the Martin shows that we were doing okay, in particular the James
1:05:48
Herbert Martin episode Okay, and I believe our friend Larry Hancock pointed us in
1:05:59
the general direction of a very interesting blog Okay. We had questions about the
1:06:11
document were at the bottom of it. You know, it said that there
1:06:15
was a direct line to White House Communications installed in the Martin residence. You
1:06:19
remember that, Joe, of course I do, Okay now, Larry Hancock
1:06:29
shared with us a blog written by former White House Communications officer, an employee,
1:06:39
and he was active in nineteen sixty three and he worked for them for
1:06:43
fifty some years. And he runs a blog where he basically tells a lot
1:06:48
of different stories about what the White House Communications Group did, how they did
1:06:54
it, And a very interesting one was how they wired up Lyndon Baines Johnson's
1:07:03
ranch after the assassination so that they could be in direct communication between d C
1:07:11
and the ranch. Okay, because the LJ liked to spend a lot of
1:07:14
time there, so he wanted to be able to basically do everything that he
1:07:18
could do in d C from his ranch. And he goes through and tells
1:07:23
how they installed all these direct lines. Uh. You know, LBJ wanted
1:07:28
a telephone in the shitter. He wanted a telephone within basically when within arms
1:07:32
reach of you know, all the important places in the house, you know
1:07:36
what I mean, and in it like out in his shed, in his
1:07:42
garage, you know, and and this and that. So it was a
1:07:45
very interesting blog post, you know, explaining how they installed all these different
1:07:49
communications systems and that there was different communications buildings in d C. Because we
1:07:57
were thinking that the address at the bottom of that had it said Washington twenty
1:08:01
five DC, and all these White House communications buildings were numbered and there were
1:08:10
there were I think over one hundred of them, and they were scattered all
1:08:14
over the place, and a lot of them were in d C. So
1:08:18
just because there was a direct line to White House Communications installed, doesn't mean
1:08:24
that it was directly going to the White House. Okay, yep. The
1:08:30
White House communication system was basically monitored mainly by Secret Service. Okay yep,
1:08:38
So that branch Treasury branch. Yeah, did did Larie explain to us how
1:08:45
there were two different switchboards, right, like the one anyone could call and
1:08:49
the one or the one that you call and you give the code that may
1:08:55
have we speculate might have been written on on that. Well we'll get into
1:09:00
that here. And the thing because if you remember, Joe, I told
1:09:04
you I sent this guy an email, right, yes, that that did
1:09:10
the blog and I sent this email back at the beginning of December and just
1:09:15
never heard anything back. You got it back, that's the surprise. Until
1:09:21
now two months later. Okay, I get an answer. So I sent
1:09:29
this. I sent this email here, Liberty Lobbity, You bastard, old
1:09:34
slacker. Yes, yes, the hijacking of Liberty Lobbity. Yes. So
1:09:47
I sent him an email and this is what I said, Joe. Okay,
1:09:50
refresh your memory and let the listeners in on on what I said.
1:09:58
Said mister Cross. My my name is Rob Clark. I host a podcast
1:10:00
about the JFK assassination, and the course of researching some things, I came
1:10:05
across the attached document, which is a Dallas Police detective report to their boss
1:10:11
at the Special Security Criminal Intelligence Division of the DPD on November twenty eighth,
1:10:16
after the assassination, Marina Oswald and her kids were moved into the private family
1:10:21
home of James Herbert Martin. This attached report is dated December second, nineteen
1:10:29
sixty three. However, sometime after the report was typed up, someone added
1:10:32
a handwritten notation at the bottom that states on December third, a direct line
1:10:39
to White House Communications in DC was installed in the house. In between where
1:10:44
it says Washington, d C. Is the number twenty five? Could this
1:10:48
be a receiving building designation number? If so, which one was it?
1:10:54
From your blog? I see many White House Communications buildings were designated by a
1:10:58
number. Have you ever heard of this before? And how common was it
1:11:01
to install a line like this in a private citizen's house. Any insight into
1:11:09
this event and how this all works would be greatly appreciated. Thank you,
1:11:15
sincerely me. Okay, sorry, so that's the email that went out.
1:11:21
So finally, Joe, you ready for this? You're muted? Apparently you're
1:11:30
not okay. I was bouncing up and down in excitement and that's why I
1:11:34
muted. All right, it starts off, mister Clark. Let me apologize
1:11:41
for my slow response. I've been dealing with some health issues that have limited
1:11:46
my activity. I have never heard of w HCA, and that's White House
1:11:51
Communications. I don't know what the AA is administration. Maybe I don't know
1:11:59
installing a local meter business line DA seven sixty five sixty nine at a private
1:12:05
residence. If WHCA did install this circuit, it would have been a full
1:12:13
period FP voice circuit terminating on the White House switchboard. If it was ordered
1:12:20
for the secret service for some reason. It might have been the billing in
1:12:25
dress. As far as I can tell, the Washington twenty five DC is
1:12:30
an old postal zone used prior to ZIP codes, with no reference to any
1:12:34
specific building. I hope this is helpful, Sincerely, John H. So,
1:12:46
what's interesting about that, Joe? Is that all right? In this
1:12:51
document at the bottom it says straight line installed three December sixty three, and
1:13:00
it gives the number DA seven eight eight seven six, White House Communications,
1:13:08
Washington twenty five DC. So, of course his response elicited some more questions
1:13:23
for me. So I decided to write him back last night and I said,
1:13:30
mister Cross, no worries. I'm glad you made it through your health
1:13:32
issues. It was a shot in the dark thing for me, as you
1:13:35
seem to be uniquely qualified to know about this circuit. Your blog post about
1:13:41
the installation at lbj's ranch was fascinating. I do have a couple follow up
1:13:45
questions for you, if you don't mind, and please answer it's your leisure.
1:13:49
My conspiratorial mind immediately went to this thing being nefarious. Could a line
1:13:56
like this be installed secretly? Is an FP line a direct pickup line as
1:14:02
in no operator needed. Could contact be initiated from both ends or was this
1:14:09
a one way type thing? In the attached document entitled Carte Blanche PNG,
1:14:15
it lists the Martin's phone number from the Dallas directory as being DA seven sixty
1:14:19
five sixty nine. Wait, stop right there, Yeah, carte Blanche what
1:14:27
dot PNG? That was just the name of the document. Okay, interesting
1:14:31
because it talked about him working for the Carte Blanche thing. Okay, okay,
1:14:35
gotcha, gotcha? So it kind of goes. I went into the
1:14:41
whole spiel about the Martins and the mans Dam and all this other crap for
1:14:45
him, and uh, I basically laid it all out. I said,
1:14:49
uh, you know, the CIA, the FBI, the Secret Service,
1:14:56
and the Dallas Police would have most certainly wanted to keep tabs covertly on Marina
1:15:00
during this crucial time after the assassination and learn whatever they could. I believe
1:15:05
the Secret Service would have shared info with the FBI at the time, but
1:15:09
not necessarily with the CIA. Or did the CIA have informants in the Secret
1:15:14
Service to obtain said information. That's where it gets murky for me. It's
1:15:18
like a puzzle with one piece not meaning much on its own. But combined
1:15:21
with others, the picture becomes more clear. Sorry for the long and rambling
1:15:26
email, but I just wanted to give you as much info as possible as
1:15:29
to why I'm asking these questions. I have attached some documents for your perusal
1:15:33
the support what I'm telling you. If this kind of thing interests you,
1:15:38
Thank you for your time and knowledge. It as much appreciated, and I
1:15:41
you wish you continued good health and happiness. All the best, Rob So
1:15:45
I sent along a bunch of documents supporting everything that I told him about the
1:15:50
Martins, and we will await his response if we get one in the future.
1:15:58
But I just figured I would share that with you and the listeners to
1:16:01
know that we are still Yes, thank you, Tony Dancer. Uh now
1:16:09
long I am, I am the A and that uh that that's a hole
1:16:14
bro. Oh you keep your notes at on but uh yeah, so very
1:16:20
interesting uh information from the emailer I thought i'd share with you, and I
1:16:30
know that Larry Hancock will be interested in that and hopefully he clarifies some of
1:16:35
the things that he said to me in his response, because you know,
1:16:40
I don't know what half of what he's talking about. There. You know
1:16:44
that the FP voice line or whatever. I don't even know what that means.
1:16:48
I even tried googling, and it's nothing out there about it. It's
1:16:51
probably some type of like internal lingo. Right. And uh, Larry did
1:17:00
mentioned during our very long conversation with him about this that the caller would have
1:17:10
had to given a specific code to the switchboard to be routed to, say,
1:17:16
building twenty five. Right, that was his thoughts on it, and
1:17:29
very interesting that he said twenty five was kind of an undesignated building, right,
1:17:35
or something of the sort like a NOD It was an early ZIP code
1:17:41
before ZIP codes, like a billing address. I don't know, Okay,
1:17:47
So maybe the DPD was trying to actually build something to them. Well,
1:17:53
the more I think about it, Joe, you know, because the Secret
1:17:57
Service had custody of Marino and the mother and Robert while they were six flags
1:18:05
from the twenty the night of the twenty fourth to the twenty ninth. Some
1:18:10
reports say the thirtieth, November thirtieth, So the Marina moves in to the
1:18:15
Martin's home on the twenty eighth, twenty ninth, and twenty ninth, Marguerite
1:18:18
and Robert go back home wherever they came from, and it would make sense
1:18:29
that the Secret Service would want to keep tabs on what was going on in
1:18:33
the Martin house. You know, they may have pulled him aside and said,
1:18:39
look, you know, we want to still be able to We want
1:18:42
you to still be able to communicate with us. If you hear anything,
1:18:45
if she says anything that we should know about, all you have to do
1:18:50
is pick the phone up, let us know blah blah blah, you know,
1:18:55
or if we find if we find out something you need to know about,
1:18:58
because she's in your home with your family, we have a way to
1:19:00
get to you, you know, type of thing. It kind of makes
1:19:03
sense, It does so, especially when you consider the document we found in
1:19:15
I think it was June or this year, the Project Die circuit where James
1:19:21
Herber Martin's wife had an oral contract to be a wire intercept. So there
1:19:28
are a lot of clues here. So FP apparently stands for Federal Protection Joe,
1:19:32
Tiny Dancers clearance and things up for us, but we're not allowed to
1:19:36
ask her how she knows this. But okay, thank you though, thank
1:19:43
you, though, Tiny Dancer, are you tapping our phones right now?
1:19:46
Tiny Dancer, So it is it nefarious, tiny Dancer? Is this or
1:19:58
is it just this under protocol type of thing that you you would think that
1:20:03
this is something that the Secret Service would do at the time, just asking
1:20:10
Yeah, well, Secret Service had always kept agent Gapods there, who was
1:20:20
one of the only people who could speak Russian. He actually translated during FBI
1:20:27
interviews of Marina in the early stages because the FBI didn't have someone that could
1:20:31
speak Russian in Dallas. And it's very very fascinating and interesting and the Secret
1:20:42
Service, and this goes back to what we have been talking about with Larry
1:20:47
with the aspect of control, and we have demonstrated in previous episodes the lenks
1:20:55
the FBI went to to surveil Marina the Fordes residents after at our apartments in
1:21:01
Richardson. So what do you think they would have tried to do before she
1:21:06
testified to the Warm Commission. And I've said this before, but it's a
1:21:11
crucial period. I don't think it's a coincidence. I think it. You
1:21:18
know, LBJ could have very well been kind of paranoid about Marina or what
1:21:27
she could say. A lot of suspicion came out about Marina Onrina after the
1:21:36
Walker nut was found, right, because it pretty much signified her having pre
1:21:45
knowledge of Oswalt's alleged attempt on General Edward Walker. And you know, they
1:21:58
they interviewed her a lot, and I'm talking about every day for weeks and
1:22:05
it's so I yeah, it's I. I don't believe that, even as
1:22:14
if James Herbert was the most connected guy in the world, how he could
1:22:18
have finagled his way into this type of situation to thanks for clearing that up,
1:22:25
Tiny Dancer their dual purpose intelligence collecting and protective agent detail. So there
1:22:30
you go, Joe. Nothing nefarious. It was standard protocol and not something
1:22:36
initiated by the Martins more than likely, but not initiated, of course,
1:22:45
but probably aware and witting. Oh yeah, it least their house. Yeah,
1:22:56
but that's about it for this week, folks. We're running a little
1:23:00
long. We apologize, but thank you guys for hanging around, hanging out
1:23:04
with us on a Friday night with you boys, and uh, we think
1:23:11
it was an awesome show. And thank everybody for the super sticker super chats
1:23:15
much appreciated. Yes, and uh we shall be back next week live as
1:23:23
well, same bat time. Same BAT channel on the same BAT phone.
1:23:30
We'll have a direct line installed from my house to Joe's house to your house.
1:23:34
Prom yes, song as it doesn't go directly to the White House.
1:23:41
That's right, they're probably already listening anyway. Oh yeah, but uh again,
1:23:45
thank you everyone for hanging out with us. We hope you enjoyed the
1:23:48
show and we'll see you again next week. And until then, pop up,
1:23:58
Peace, And where's my music? Joe? I don't know, that's
1:24:05
a good question. Thank you, Colleen, have a great weekend as well.
1:24:12
Yes, thank you Bungled, Thank you Tiny Dancer for your insights.
1:24:17
Thank you Scott Edwards. Thank you old slacker there. We can gotta love
1:24:30
technical difficulties, folks. And if you haven't already, go get yourself some
1:24:35
damn hot sauce. Spice up your life a little bit. Just eat e
1:24:41
jacket. Until next time, folks, we love you, see you these
1:24:48
guys. Peace. Have a good weekend. Protect contact provided the cottage putte
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the contract Protect Perfected Energy Product PEC