Latest / North Side Territory: A Chicago Cubs Podcast / Making sense of the Shota Imanaga decisions

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Making sense of the Shota Imanaga decisions · North Side Territory: A Chicago Cubs Podcast

0:04
Speaker 1: Welcome into Northside Territory. Foul Territory Networks Cubs Podcast. I'm
0:08
Speaker 1: Sadiv Sharma with my partner Patrick Mooney. We are your
0:12
Speaker 1: Cubs beat writers over at the Athletic. Patrick, we got
0:16
Speaker 1: a little bit of Cubs news this week. The Cubs
0:20
Speaker 1: declined the three year option on showdow Mi Managa's contract
0:26
Speaker 1: and in turn showed him Monaga responded by declining, I
0:30
Speaker 1: believe it was a one year option that he had.
0:35
Speaker 1: After that triggered, you know, his him having the choice
0:38
Speaker 1: of either opting in or opting out, and he opted out.
0:41
Speaker 1: And depending on whether they you know, what happens next
0:47
Speaker 1: as far as a qualifying offer, he's a free agent.
0:51
Speaker 1: Either way, he's a free agent. Showed him Anagua as
0:53
Speaker 1: a free agent. This isn't a shock. I think maybe
0:58
Speaker 1: four months ago it would have been a shock. Maybe
1:02
Speaker 1: less than that shoot, But things changed and I think
1:09
Speaker 1: we got some inklings over the past, you know, over
1:12
Speaker 1: the final MONTHI ish of the season that this could happen,
1:15
Speaker 1: that this wasn't unreasonable, and it started to make sense
1:20
Speaker 1: and we kind of expected this, and I think the
1:23
Speaker 1: chain of events that's happened so far when we record
1:26
Speaker 1: what is a Wednesday morning. This isn't a shock, This
1:30
Speaker 1: isn't a surprise. We kind of expected what has happened
1:33
Speaker 1: to unfold.
1:36
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was just pulling up my notes here, so
1:38
Speaker 2: I have the numbers right, and I think it's a
1:41
Speaker 2: good grounding for how to look at kind of the
1:43
Speaker 2: rest of the off season. The Cubs could have locked
1:46
Speaker 2: him in through twenty twenty eight for fifty seven point
1:49
Speaker 2: seven five million Showda had an option for fifteen point
1:54
Speaker 2: twenty five million and also a player option for twenty
1:57
Speaker 2: twenty seven, so he will be looking to be thirty
2:00
Speaker 2: point five million over the next two seasons. I think clearly,
2:07
Speaker 2: when you don't start Shoda in an elimination game after
2:13
Speaker 2: using an opener in front of him in the previous round,
2:16
Speaker 2: clearly there were question marks.
2:18
Speaker 3: About his.
2:20
Speaker 2: Viability as a frontline starter moving forward. It to me
2:26
Speaker 2: still feels like a little bit of recency bias. You know,
2:31
Speaker 2: if you watch the World Series all of a sudden,
2:34
Speaker 2: like me, you think Addison Barger is like the greatest
2:36
Speaker 2: player in the.
2:37
Speaker 3: History of baseball.
2:38
Speaker 2: At times he's probably not. And I don't think Shoda
2:43
Speaker 2: is as bad as he was during that stretch. But
2:45
Speaker 2: clearly we know how this front office operates, you know,
2:47
Speaker 2: how this ownership group runs the team. They love financial flexibility,
2:53
Speaker 2: they hate making commitments when they don't have to. And
2:59
Speaker 2: if some of those concerns that the baseball industry had
3:03
Speaker 2: about showed in Monaga when he was coming over from
3:05
Speaker 2: Japan start to surface at this particular moment when you
3:10
Speaker 2: have to commit that far into the future, they just
3:13
Speaker 2: weren't going to do it.
3:16
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, we'll see if they give him the
3:18
Speaker 1: qualifying offer. You know, we kind of discussed this beforehand.
3:21
Speaker 1: But like unless they just think he's completely overdone here,
3:27
Speaker 1: like if he yeah, if he's cooked and like just
3:30
Speaker 1: cannot if they believe like this guy cannot give you
3:33
Speaker 1: quality starts at least part of the time, then I'd
3:39
Speaker 1: expect a qualifying offer, but maybe maybe not, Like, like
3:44
Speaker 1: what are their projections? What do their projections say? I
3:46
Speaker 1: understand when you look at what he had, what he
3:50
Speaker 1: did and the home runs, which were always a concern,
3:54
Speaker 1: which was something that we talked about the day he signed.
3:58
Speaker 1: H he did a really great job of limiting it
4:00
Speaker 1: in the first year. Obviously struggled the final two months
4:04
Speaker 1: of the season, committing to that, along with the dip
4:10
Speaker 1: in velocity for three years, along with the no trade clause.
4:14
Speaker 3: Look, I get it from their point of view.
4:17
Speaker 1: From the Cubs point of view, I think when you
4:20
Speaker 1: talk about what the Cubs need and talk about twenty
4:23
Speaker 1: twenty six, just purely looking at twenty twenty six, what
4:27
Speaker 1: did we see, what did we hear all October? It's
4:30
Speaker 1: all about pitching. What did Jed talk about at that
4:33
Speaker 1: press conference? It's all about pitching, pitching, pitching, pitching. We've
4:38
Speaker 1: written it, We're going to continue to write it. They
4:41
Speaker 1: are going to be pursuing pitching this winter. So losing
4:45
Speaker 1: a quality starting pitcher if you believe that showda Monaga
4:50
Speaker 1: is a quality starting pitcher. I'm not saying twenty twenty
4:52
Speaker 1: four version, but just a three right, a middle of
4:56
Speaker 1: the rotation guy on a winning team. Losing that is
5:01
Speaker 1: a big hole and they needed pitching on top of him.
5:05
Speaker 1: They do have four starters, viable starters in theory, you know,
5:10
Speaker 1: assuming Justin Steele is healthy to start the season. I
5:14
Speaker 1: think that's a big assumption. But either way, they're getting pitching.
5:19
Speaker 1: We knew this now. It just puts it, you know,
5:23
Speaker 1: puts it in bold top of the list. There's no
5:27
Speaker 1: denying that this has to get done. We'll see, we'll
5:31
Speaker 1: see with the qualifying offer, what if they extend it
5:34
Speaker 1: and what show does camp reaction is, But this is,
5:39
Speaker 1: you know, it just emphasizes a need that we kind
5:42
Speaker 1: of expected already and it's a risk in my opinion,
5:46
Speaker 1: like it just I get it. I get not doing
5:50
Speaker 1: three years, but letting show to walk if that's what
5:53
Speaker 1: it comes to. It just could there's a chance this
5:58
Speaker 1: could bite them obvious. I mean, I guess that's obvious,
6:01
Speaker 1: but you know, it's just like what he's done for
6:05
Speaker 1: them and and the quality innings he's provided, even when
6:09
Speaker 1: he struggled, he did limit.
6:11
Speaker 3: Image for the most part.
6:13
Speaker 1: It was that last start of the season where he
6:15
Speaker 1: didn't and then the playoffs he just wasn't trusted and
6:18
Speaker 1: that was obvious. And I think that's a big sign
6:21
Speaker 1: that that was a big, you know, kind of a
6:23
Speaker 1: red flag and it should have been obvious for everyone
6:26
Speaker 1: like what may be coming.
6:28
Speaker 2: Yeah, we'll get into showed a side more in the
6:32
Speaker 2: next segment. But my sort of parting thought on this
6:37
Speaker 2: is I'm going to go back even farther than October
6:40
Speaker 2: and you know the trade deadline and Jed Hoyer walking
6:44
Speaker 2: in there, and you know the price was something we
6:48
Speaker 2: could not do to our future, that it was an
6:50
Speaker 2: exorbitant price to acquire a controllable, established starting pitcher at
6:56
Speaker 2: the deadline. Okay, that's fine if it costs match or
7:00
Speaker 2: Kate Horton plus a top one hundred prospect, all right,
7:05
Speaker 2: you go about it different ways, and then you get
7:07
Speaker 2: October and your pitching depth is totally exposed. Basically first
7:13
Speaker 2: pitch of game one of the second round when you
7:16
Speaker 2: have to win four rounds to win a World Series,
7:20
Speaker 2: and then you get a couple of weeks to decompress,
7:22
Speaker 2: and you know, showed Up can't compete with the Cub's imaginations, right,
7:26
Speaker 2: They've been pretty good at finding these starters. But it's like,
7:28
Speaker 2: oh wow, there's all these names out there, and what
7:31
Speaker 2: if we get him in our pitching instructure. We have
7:33
Speaker 2: so many Gold Glove defenders. They just did a bunch
7:35
Speaker 2: of zoom calls after after winning that hardware. Let's just
7:40
Speaker 2: get him at Wrigley Field, which might be an extreme
7:42
Speaker 2: pitchers park again next year. That's great, but like, I
7:47
Speaker 2: don't know, I'm checking how long until like the Angels
7:50
Speaker 2: signed some like bottom uh, you know, back of the
7:54
Speaker 2: rotation starter. It's like a four year, seventy million dollars deal.
7:57
Speaker 2: And then the covers like these prices are crazy, like
7:59
Speaker 2: what what is going on? And like that happened, you
8:02
Speaker 2: know with like Walker Bueller, like, oh, that'll be an
8:04
Speaker 2: interesting name. And then I think the Red Sox gave
8:08
Speaker 2: him what was it more than like the qualifying offerers?
8:10
Speaker 3: Now it was something.
8:12
Speaker 2: There, And you know, it seems like every year there's
8:17
Speaker 2: kind of this sticker shock. So Will showed a beat
8:22
Speaker 2: three and almost fifty eight million. Maybe not, but I
8:28
Speaker 2: don't think like reliable starting pitchers sort of grow on
8:33
Speaker 2: trees or that they are going to come cheap. I mean,
8:40
Speaker 2: Kyle Hendricks didn't throw a hundred, but I think he
8:42
Speaker 2: made more than one hundred million dollars in his career
8:44
Speaker 2: just by being a guy who could post and could
8:47
Speaker 2: give you quality innings. This is also the time of
8:51
Speaker 2: year where you can rattle off all these names.
8:54
Speaker 3: Oh look at all this depth.
8:56
Speaker 2: I mean, maybe Ben Brown figures it out or I
8:59
Speaker 2: don't write off Jordan. It's like, well you you kind
9:01
Speaker 2: of did, like you don't trust these guys in October
9:04
Speaker 2: and I realized show is now in that was in
9:07
Speaker 2: that bucket at like the worst possible time. But we'll see,
9:14
Speaker 2: we'll see what that what the rest of the industry
9:17
Speaker 2: views have showed. And I think that'll be an interesting,
9:19
Speaker 2: really interesting part of that in this story too.
9:21
Speaker 1: Yeah, what the intersty thinks of Shoda and what the
9:26
Speaker 1: industry values pitching in general this winter? Uh, you know,
9:31
Speaker 1: we have a potential lockout looming a year from now.
9:34
Speaker 1: How much does that affect other teams spending? I don't like,
9:37
Speaker 1: It's really hard to predict this stuff. I feel I
9:40
Speaker 1: do feel like oftentimes the Cubs are a little shocked
9:44
Speaker 1: by prices early on, now that they were aggressive and
9:48
Speaker 1: got Matthew Boyd nailed that great, great signing. If if
9:53
Speaker 1: they quickly identify someone like that and and have their
9:57
Speaker 1: sights set on someone and they're going after guy like
10:01
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna throw out like a like a an
10:04
Speaker 1: undervalue guy that that has had a good season, good
10:08
Speaker 1: seasons in the past.
10:09
Speaker 3: Zach Gallen is a name that that comes to mind.
10:12
Speaker 1: H there was someone else we mentioned in our piece
10:14
Speaker 1: that that kind of fits that mold of here's a
10:16
Speaker 1: guy that's coming off a miss season that that has
10:20
Speaker 1: a long history, and I'm forgetting who it is now,
10:23
Speaker 1: but there there were a couple of Michael Michael King
10:25
Speaker 1: or that's exactly who I was thinking of. Michael King
10:28
Speaker 1: and Zach Gallon are like two names that like, these
10:31
Speaker 1: guys could put up cy young caliber seasons if if
10:34
Speaker 1: they you know, are healthy and have the right defense
10:38
Speaker 1: behind them and get the right things whatever it may be.
10:41
Speaker 1: But those are two names, like I don't who knows
10:43
Speaker 1: if they break the bank. I don't expect them to.
10:47
Speaker 1: I just don't know what. Like, this is an especially
10:49
Speaker 1: weird offseason with the lockout, but with the potential CBA
10:53
Speaker 1: and all that stuff coming in a year, so we'll
10:56
Speaker 1: see if the Cubs can judge the market right. It's
10:58
Speaker 1: just not having losing a picture when you had a
11:02
Speaker 1: chance to lock them up. I get all the reasons
11:05
Speaker 1: why you don't pick up that three year option. It's
11:07
Speaker 1: just pitching depth is always something you're on the search for,
11:10
Speaker 1: so it just emphasizes that need once again. Let's let's
11:14
Speaker 1: take a break, and when we come back, we'll talk
11:16
Speaker 1: about the value.
11:18
Speaker 3: Of show to in the past and maybe how teams
11:21
Speaker 3: may view them going.
11:22
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12:24
Speaker 1: Patrick, you talk about recency bias, and I don't want
12:27
Speaker 1: that to color what maybe a two year ten year
12:32
Speaker 1: for showed him and again in Chicago because like, let's
12:37
Speaker 1: not forget what twenty twenty four was. He was a
12:39
Speaker 1: sensation for much of that year. He like kind of
12:45
Speaker 1: jumped onto the scene, was like this huge marketable picture
12:49
Speaker 1: that you know. The fans love him. Remember in the
12:55
Speaker 1: bleachers how much they loved him. He did walk out
12:58
Speaker 1: for his warm ups. Uh, they cheer him on, they
13:01
Speaker 1: had the show to painted on their chests. Obviously delivered
13:08
Speaker 1: like really quality stuff, really quality results. I don't want
13:15
Speaker 1: to ignore that and act like it was nothing because
13:18
Speaker 1: he finished. He got cy Young votes, he got Rookie
13:22
Speaker 1: of the Year votes. He was really impactful pitcher, and
13:26
Speaker 1: he and he came into this season as you know,
13:28
Speaker 1: like a coaes with with Justin Steele starting the opening
13:34
Speaker 1: day in Tokyo, a series that the Cubs probably aren't playing,
13:39
Speaker 1: and showed him and Naga isn't there. Uh So, like
13:43
Speaker 1: he did a lot. If this is the end of
13:46
Speaker 1: his tenure with the Cubs, he did a lot for
13:49
Speaker 1: the Cubs. Yeah, I have some thoughts on on what
13:54
Speaker 1: he may be going for, but but go ahead, and
13:57
Speaker 1: I'm sure you have thoughts on what he was for
13:59
Speaker 1: this team.
14:00
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm just not completely comfortable like trashing Showda's body
14:05
Speaker 2: of work because I think I saw a little bit
14:07
Speaker 2: of that out there, sort of dismissive of what he accomplished.
14:14
Speaker 2: And look what we're talking about, Like the Cubs get
14:17
Speaker 2: credit for being in position to sign showeda to have
14:20
Speaker 2: the relationships and the information to like eventually pounce on
14:26
Speaker 2: that and put put together a plan as well as
14:31
Speaker 2: a support system to help him thrive. And maybe it's
14:37
Speaker 2: a new Japanese picture this offseason. Maybe it's one of
14:40
Speaker 2: those sort of flawed but talented pictures who are free
14:43
Speaker 2: agents now they can go out and do that again,
14:46
Speaker 2: that is the strength of their organization. But Shoda, at
14:52
Speaker 2: least for our purposes, brought something else.
14:55
Speaker 3: And I think you saw it.
14:56
Speaker 2: I think fans recognize that of there was some charisma
15:01
Speaker 2: there even though he wasn't in his home country and
15:03
Speaker 2: it wasn't his English, wasn't his first language. You saw
15:08
Speaker 2: the show to Jerseys everywhere, I mean Show to Mania
15:10
Speaker 2: was a thing. I mean he was the best picture
15:12
Speaker 2: on the planet for a stretch there in twenty twenty four,
15:15
Speaker 2: and it was just like, how is he doing this,
15:17
Speaker 2: he forced a lot of teams to answer questions from
15:21
Speaker 2: US and Ken Rosenthal, our colleague here at Felt Territory
15:24
Speaker 2: in the athletic of like, did the industry totally miss
15:27
Speaker 2: this guy?
15:28
Speaker 3: And I don't know.
15:30
Speaker 2: I think with a lot of these things, you still
15:32
Speaker 2: have to bet on the person. And I do think
15:36
Speaker 2: show does baseball IQ his competitiveness, his pride. I think
15:41
Speaker 2: a lot of those things will help him moving forward.
15:45
Speaker 2: I'm not sure how you put a dollar amount on that,
15:50
Speaker 2: or I don't know how many teams really operate that
15:53
Speaker 2: way anymore, but certainly like kind of jump starting this
16:02
Speaker 2: rebuild and like taking it to the next level, taking
16:06
Speaker 2: pressure off team, I mean basically almost single handedly making
16:11
Speaker 2: twenty twenty four a competitive season. Like without him, how
16:15
Speaker 2: bad does that look? And are they in a position
16:20
Speaker 2: to make the leap to ninety plus wins this year?
16:22
Speaker 2: I don't know.
16:25
Speaker 1: As far as what showed it can be going forward. Look,
16:28
Speaker 1: the end of his season was concerning the like there
16:32
Speaker 1: were signs all season long his velocity was down, especially
16:35
Speaker 1: after the injury.
16:37
Speaker 3: He was never a velo guy.
16:39
Speaker 1: He's a command guy with some unique characteristics on his fastball.
16:44
Speaker 3: The fastball velocity dipped a tick or two. That's not that.
16:48
Speaker 1: That's rough for him, and he wasn't the command wasn't pristine,
16:54
Speaker 1: and they were started to hammer those pitches and then
16:57
Speaker 1: it started to be with men on base, and that's
16:59
Speaker 1: when it got really ugly. Got ugly in that final
17:02
Speaker 1: start of the regular season and then his final start
17:06
Speaker 1: against his final appearance right against the Brewers that like,
17:11
Speaker 1: I don't I think what I would have liked to
17:14
Speaker 1: have seen with him potentially heading into free or I
17:17
Speaker 1: guess heading into free agency.
17:20
Speaker 3: For his side, what you wanted to see was him.
17:24
Speaker 3: I guess he got punched in the mouth, and.
17:26
Speaker 1: We don't know fully how he's going to react, because
17:30
Speaker 1: that's that's really the first time that month and a
17:33
Speaker 1: half of poor play was the first time he didn't
17:38
Speaker 1: respond positively. Yet is he going to uh? Is he
17:44
Speaker 1: going to get that tick or two back on his
17:46
Speaker 1: on his stuff? He's going to be thirty two or
17:50
Speaker 1: he is thirty two, thirty two, thirty three, thirty four.
17:54
Speaker 1: That'd be rough to give that type of money for
17:56
Speaker 1: someone that may be giving up thirty plus homers a
17:59
Speaker 1: year and can't really control the you know, the opposition
18:03
Speaker 1: if you can't get deep into a game. That's Look,
18:06
Speaker 1: I don't know what his future holds. I don't know
18:09
Speaker 1: how much the end of this season kind of tells
18:12
Speaker 1: us what is coming. And I think that that's what
18:15
Speaker 1: makes everything so uncomfortable about it and why you had
18:18
Speaker 1: to why the Cubs had to make the decision they did.
18:21
Speaker 1: I would have liked to have seen something from him
18:24
Speaker 1: where he kind of rebounded in some way, but the
18:27
Speaker 1: end of the season really colors the way you feel.
18:30
Speaker 3: About him, and I under so I understand.
18:32
Speaker 1: I don't agree with this completely trashing his tenure, Like,
18:36
Speaker 1: if that's the choice you want to make, I don't.
18:39
Speaker 1: That's right, Like he was he had some great moments,
18:42
Speaker 1: but there are some major questions here. I like, you
18:46
Speaker 1: want to see him bounce back in Like if it's
18:48
Speaker 1: the hamstring, if that's what it was, okay, fine, but
18:52
Speaker 1: you need like you need more information than you need
18:54
Speaker 1: to see.
18:54
Speaker 3: And that's why I think it.
18:56
Speaker 1: You know, if it's the qualifying offer and it's like
18:59
Speaker 1: twenty some thing million, that's a that's a risk that
19:02
Speaker 1: a team like the Cubs for one year. They shouldn't
19:05
Speaker 1: be overthinking that, Like that's an easy decision. But if
19:09
Speaker 1: we we don't know what their numbers are going to
19:11
Speaker 1: be this year. As far as payroll, we don't know
19:13
Speaker 1: how tight payroll will be.
19:16
Speaker 3: Uh. They have holes to fill obviously, both they have
19:19
Speaker 3: to rebuild an entire bullpen.
19:21
Speaker 2: Uh.
19:21
Speaker 1: They're gonna have to add another bat some sort of
19:24
Speaker 1: like at least a right handed bat and then probably
19:26
Speaker 1: like a starting caliber bat. Uh. And then and then
19:30
Speaker 1: obviously we've talked about their rotation. So there's there's money
19:33
Speaker 1: to be spent that they have to spend some money.
19:35
Speaker 1: You can't fill it all with kids.
19:37
Speaker 3: Uh.
19:38
Speaker 1: So look, I I I think qualifying offer is a
19:42
Speaker 1: very simple thing that the Cubs should do.
19:44
Speaker 3: Like, like you said, Walker.
19:47
Speaker 1: Bueler signed for a little bit more than the qualifying
19:50
Speaker 1: offer last year, right, and he wasn't he wasn't ave
19:54
Speaker 1: like he was a starter for a.
19:59
Speaker 3: Yeah. So if you can, if the Red Sox can
20:02
Speaker 3: do that and.
20:02
Speaker 1: Get over it and make the playoffs and do that,
20:04
Speaker 1: like you should be able to take that risk with Shoda.
20:08
Speaker 3: That's how I look at it.
20:09
Speaker 1: But I do think it's gotten to the point where
20:12
Speaker 1: it's a little bit of a risk now, and that's
20:13
Speaker 1: unfortunate because I don't like all that stuff you said, charisma, intelligence.
20:19
Speaker 1: He works so well with hot Tobe and Casey Jacobson
20:22
Speaker 1: and these guys in the Cubs pitching infrastructure. He really
20:27
Speaker 1: seemed to enjoy working with them. He seemed to enjoy Chicago. So,
20:33
Speaker 1: you know, I hope it's not like I hope fans
20:36
Speaker 1: don't look at it as a negative thing, which showed
20:39
Speaker 1: it brought to this town and to this game, because
20:41
Speaker 1: there was so much positive and there were little things.
20:45
Speaker 1: Remember how often Craig Counsel would talk about how smart
20:48
Speaker 1: he is and how he knows how to do certain
20:50
Speaker 1: things defensively, he seems so confident out there, so comfortable
20:56
Speaker 1: ability to adjust and pitch this pitch isn't working today,
20:59
Speaker 1: I'm going did this and like quickly adjust mid game.
21:03
Speaker 3: He seemed to do that for about a year and
21:05
Speaker 3: a half.
21:05
Speaker 1: With like like without missing a beat, and then that
21:10
Speaker 1: final month and a half two months, it.
21:12
Speaker 3: Just kind of fell apart on him.
21:13
Speaker 1: And that's you know, it's unfortunate that that's how the
21:18
Speaker 1: season ended for him, But it may be just like
21:21
Speaker 1: what I guess, I'm very curious to see what's to
21:25
Speaker 1: come for him, what type of picture.
21:27
Speaker 3: Can he be, you know, as he enters his mid thirties.
21:31
Speaker 3: I guess I.
21:33
Speaker 2: Think back to when the Cubs signed you Darvish and
21:36
Speaker 2: THEO Epstein was asked about the twenty seventeen World Series,
21:40
Speaker 2: and at that time we didn't know the astros cheating
21:46
Speaker 2: system that they had set up, but yeah, THEO said
21:49
Speaker 2: something along the lines of, well, we look at that
21:52
Speaker 2: as an opportunity that you know, that experience or that
21:57
Speaker 2: disappointment might have scared off some teams and that you know,
22:03
Speaker 2: allowed Darvish to get to a place where they felt
22:06
Speaker 2: comfortable doing a deal with him. And now twenty eighteen
22:10
Speaker 2: was bad. Darvis was hurt, wound up being hurt, but
22:16
Speaker 2: he had several good seasons after that. Darvis is also
22:20
Speaker 2: on my mind too of you know, his his surgery
22:22
Speaker 2: and the fact that he missed next season, and you know,
22:24
Speaker 2: I'm kind of dating myself with that reference. But that
22:27
Speaker 2: was just kind of a pertinent way of like, you know,
22:30
Speaker 2: we put so much emphasis on these playoff games, and
22:32
Speaker 2: rightly so, but you know, Council talks about how seasons
22:37
Speaker 2: are sort of unfold or just the sequencing of them.
22:41
Speaker 2: Jameson Tyn was not good on the front end of
22:43
Speaker 2: his contract those first couple of months. Maybe it's been
22:47
Speaker 2: an excellent, reliable starter for them since then. I mean,
22:54
Speaker 2: like Matthew Boyd towards the end of September, it looked
22:57
Speaker 2: like he was kind of eating a bit and he
23:01
Speaker 2: wound up when he was pitching on normal rest put
23:04
Speaker 2: together some nice playoff starts for them. I mean it
23:10
Speaker 2: just yeah, we'll we'll see where this goes. I think
23:16
Speaker 2: there's a cultural element of this too that I'm not
23:18
Speaker 2: fully able to explain or maybe understand. I just don't
23:23
Speaker 2: know how show to may take this news right of yeah,
23:25
Speaker 2: that's a good point. They don't want me. I think
23:31
Speaker 2: I don't know how you explain like the CUPS data
23:34
Speaker 2: model and like their projections and their logarithms, like you
23:37
Speaker 2: three years out into the future, and then like their
23:40
Speaker 2: CBT payment, like.
23:41
Speaker 5: All of that together.
23:44
Speaker 2: But I also i'd like showda on one you do.
23:47
Speaker 2: I would feel pretty comfortable about that. Giving him twenty
23:49
Speaker 2: million dollars roughly to put up a two war season,
23:53
Speaker 2: I think that's a pretty relatively easy bar for him
23:57
Speaker 2: to clear, and all it takes is one t him
24:00
Speaker 2: out there to be like, hey, you know, our pitching
24:02
Speaker 2: analyst has this one thought that we want to give
24:05
Speaker 2: to show, to give him full off season to work
24:09
Speaker 2: on whatever, to get fully healthy, to get up to
24:12
Speaker 2: full full strength, and sort of let him loose. We'll see,
24:19
Speaker 2: but yeah, it's I think he is going to be
24:23
Speaker 2: one of those fascinating guys to watch this offseason. I
24:25
Speaker 2: think that entire pitching market, the Cubs are just going
24:27
Speaker 2: to be around that all off season and maybe into
24:31
Speaker 2: spring training looking at how the calendar has unfolded previous
24:35
Speaker 2: off seasons.
24:36
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean we're going to be watching pitching for
24:39
Speaker 1: the next few months.
24:40
Speaker 3: I think that's going to be our main.
24:42
Speaker 1: Job that they obviously have other needs, but starting pitching,
24:47
Speaker 1: relief pitching, I think that's going to be a lot
24:50
Speaker 1: of what we talk about over the next few months.
24:52
Speaker 3: So we will do that.
24:54
Speaker 1: We will have another episode this week. Make sure to
24:58
Speaker 1: tune in for that. Thanks so much, Thanks for listening
25:00
Speaker 1: to everyone. This is North Side Territory. Make sure to rate, review, subscribe,
25:04
Speaker 1: subscribe to the YouTube channel, and subscribe to The Athletic
25:06
Speaker 1: where Patrick and Iron top of all things Cubs.
25:09
Speaker 3: Thanks for listening to everyone. Take care