Latest / Rugby Direct / Rugby Direct Episode 263: Fortress Eden delivers again

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Rugby Direct Episode 263: Fortress Eden delivers again · Rugby Direct

• 0:09
  Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from Newstalk ZB. Follow this
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio.
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: Get inside the game from every angle. It's Rugby Direct
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: with Elliot Smith and Liam Napier, powered by Newstalk ZB.
• 0:36
  Speaker 3: Welcome into Rugby Direct, powered by Forklift Solutions, lifting you
• 0:39
  Speaker 3: and your business to a higher level. Elliot Smith with
• 0:43
  Speaker 3: me as always. Liam Napier and Napes. The Bledisloe Cup
• 0:48
  Speaker 3: safe for another year on the side of the Tasman.
• 0:52
  Speaker 3: Australia always come over with high hopes, but really it
• 0:56
  Speaker 3: was the same old story, wasn't it? This Wallabies team,
• 0:59
  Speaker 3: are they going to be the one to break the curse?
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: No.
• 1:02
  Speaker 4: Absolutely not, no. Look, I expected a lot more from
• 1:05
  Speaker 4: the Wallabies, to be honest. They were missing a couple
• 1:08
  Speaker 4: of frontliners, but the All Black team, heavily depleted, down
• 1:14
  Speaker 4: on troops, had some changes throughout the week. We thought
• 1:19
  Speaker 4: they were a bit vulnerable, certainly had that complexion coming
• 1:22
  Speaker 4: off South Africa, three successive defeats, but they got a
• 1:25
  Speaker 4: lot right. and they got the response that everyone demanded.
• 1:30
  Speaker 4: I think they set the tone by the sounds during
• 1:32
  Speaker 4: the week with Tānumanga delivering some pretty pointed messages about
• 1:37
  Speaker 4: what the Bledisloe meant. There was clearly that edge that
• 1:41
  Speaker 4: was required. Look, the game was in the balance at halftime,
• 1:46
  Speaker 4: but it was a very familiar script, wasn't it, in
• 1:49
  Speaker 4: the second half? 24 years with the Bleds, 40 years
• 1:53
  Speaker 4: for the Wallabies without a win at Eden Park. And
• 1:57
  Speaker 4: the Wallabies bubble bursts a bit, I think.
• 2:00
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I think so too.
• 2:02
  Speaker 3: Off the win in South Africa and against South Africa rather.
• 2:06
  Speaker 3: And look, they played some really good rugby that day.
• 2:09
  Speaker 3: But just ultimately, they started well. They finished the first
• 2:13
  Speaker 3: half well. But it was those pockets of play in
• 2:18
  Speaker 3: the first spell that cost them. But then the entire
• 2:19
  Speaker 3: second spell. that they just went missing for, and it
• 2:22
  Speaker 3: felt like in the second spell at one point they
• 2:23
  Speaker 3: didn't have the ball for about 25 minutes, and it
• 2:26
  Speaker 3: wasn't that long, but it just felt like they just
• 2:28
  Speaker 3: drifted out of the game completely and were hopelessly at sea.
• 2:34
  Speaker 4: It really was a contrasting two halves. You know, the Wallabies,
• 2:38
  Speaker 4: they were still down on position in the first half,
• 2:42
  Speaker 4: but they broke the All Blacks open quite easily at
• 2:45
  Speaker 4: times in the two tries that they did score. They
• 2:47
  Speaker 4: stole two lineouts. They defended really well. They made the
• 2:51
  Speaker 4: All Blacks work hard for their points. You think about
• 2:54
  Speaker 4: the All Blacks taking that shot at goal because they
• 2:55
  Speaker 4: couldn't break through. They scored late, and I think there
• 2:59
  Speaker 4: were a few nerves among the crowd.
• 3:01
  Speaker 6: It was a bit quiet.
• 3:03
  Speaker 4: I know even amongst the All Blacks, you know, they
• 3:06
  Speaker 4: were concerned. And the Wallabies started the second half well,
• 3:11
  Speaker 4: Bowdoin Barrett scrambling back to sort of save the day
• 3:13
  Speaker 4: on a couple of occasions. And then the All Blacks
• 3:16
  Speaker 4: just flicked the switch. They dominated physically. They dominated all
• 3:20
  Speaker 4: the stats, the line breaks, the post-contact meters, the carries.
• 3:25
  Speaker 4: And they finished and they were really ruthless. And that's
• 3:29
  Speaker 4: something about Eden Park, something about the Wallabies. I think
• 3:32
  Speaker 4: it does show certainly the golfing class that exists between
• 3:40
  Speaker 4: where the Springboks are at, where the All Blacks are at,
• 3:42
  Speaker 4: and where the Wallabies are still yet to get to.
• 3:44
  Speaker 5: Yeah, absolutely.
• 3:46
  Speaker 3: I mean, it was a bit of an illustration as
• 3:47
  Speaker 3: to some of the things, I guess, the All Blacks
• 3:51
  Speaker 3: tried on their tour of South Africa, would have liked
• 3:53
  Speaker 3: to try, and it didn't quite work out. You know,
• 3:55
  Speaker 3: one thing last night was noticeable was obviously that The
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: All Blacks were able to play their game plan a
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: lot more than South Africa were willing to let them do.
• 4:07
  Speaker 3: And Australia just weren't able to stop the flow that
• 4:11
  Speaker 3: New Zealand wanted to get.
• 4:12
  Speaker 5: South Africa did that really well, restricted.
• 4:14
  Speaker 3: The All Blacks, both with the high ball, both with
• 4:17
  Speaker 3: the kind of carries they had, the disruption to the game.
• 4:22
  Speaker 5: It all worked in the All Blacks' favour last night.
• 4:24
  Speaker 4: Yeah, just completely contrasting oppositions. You think about the way
• 4:27
  Speaker 4: South Africa defend their rush. They put you under pressure
• 4:30
  Speaker 4: and make decisions a lot quicker. The Wallabies were quite passive,
• 4:34
  Speaker 4: I thought, on defence. Particularly in that second half, they
• 4:39
  Speaker 4: didn't get the pay they wanted at the breakdown. They
• 4:41
  Speaker 4: couldn't slow the All Blacks' ball. I thought the All
• 4:43
  Speaker 4: Blacks did a great job on Fraser McWright, clearing him
• 4:45
  Speaker 4: out of there. He was very ineffectual. Um, and the
• 4:51
  Speaker 4: high ball, what a transformation, you know, for a team
• 4:54
  Speaker 4: that I think they had 30% of, um, uh, receptions of, uh,
• 5:02
  Speaker 4: the high ball in South Africa. Well, they dominated it and,
• 5:05
  Speaker 4: and how they flicked that switch was Cam Roy guard
• 5:08
  Speaker 4: kicking a lot more from the base. And that puts
• 5:11
  Speaker 4: the pressure on the opposition rather than letting them dictate
• 5:14
  Speaker 4: terms and kick to you receiving the high balls a
• 5:17
  Speaker 4: lot harder than, than trying to contest it. And, That's
• 5:20
  Speaker 4: where the All Blacks are really good. You think about
• 5:22
  Speaker 4: Geordie Barrett, early doors out leaping, Sui Ili, and that
• 5:27
  Speaker 4: really set the tone. So a massive shift in the
• 5:30
  Speaker 4: high ball. I don't think you'd say that that's solved,
• 5:33
  Speaker 4: but I certainly expected the Wallabies to have the edge.
• 5:37
  Speaker 5: In that area.
• 5:38
  Speaker 4: They weren't helped by Iketau losing Iketau and Sui Ili
• 5:41
  Speaker 4: going to the midfield, but You can't take anything away
• 5:45
  Speaker 4: from the All Blacks in that particular area.
• 5:47
  Speaker 3: No, look, there was a demand to work on it
• 5:49
  Speaker 3: and fix it, and that was much, much better last night.
• 5:53
  Speaker 3: I thought they were placed a lot better in those
• 5:56
  Speaker 3: aerial contests. They seemed to know, you know, just positioning-wise,
• 6:02
  Speaker 3: it felt a lot cleaner than it had been in
• 6:04
  Speaker 3: South Africa, where they sort of caught a little bit
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: on the hop of what they were doing. It felt
• 6:09
  Speaker 3: like there was actually a bit of strategy, whether it
• 6:10
  Speaker 3: was Australia kicking or New Zealand kicking, that they're actually
• 6:14
  Speaker 3: in the right spots to potentially retrieve it. And the
• 6:16
  Speaker 3: bounce of the ball and positioning is always going to
• 6:18
  Speaker 3: be somewhat of a 50-50 contest, but it felt like
• 6:22
  Speaker 3: that was a big improvement.
• 6:24
  Speaker 6: Yeah, massively.
• 6:25
  Speaker 4: And that was one area, wasn't it? I thought their
• 6:29
  Speaker 4: physicality and contact, their breakdown work, the scrum was a non-issue.
• 6:35
  Speaker 4: That was a very stable platform. The line had a
• 6:38
  Speaker 4: couple of wobbles early, but.
• 6:41
  Speaker 4: The majority of the areas the All Blacks put the
• 6:43
  Speaker 4: focus on, they amended. That's partly due to the opposition,
• 6:48
  Speaker 4: but you can only play who's in front of you.
• 6:50
  Speaker 5: That's right.
• 6:51
  Speaker 3: You mentioned at the top around this being a response. Now,
• 6:57
  Speaker 3: I'm thinking, you know, is it a response because they're
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: playing Australia who aren't as good as South Africa, or
• 7:02
  Speaker 3: was it, a response to losing the last three test matches.
• 7:08
  Speaker 5: You know what I mean?
• 7:08
  Speaker 3: Like, were they just naturally always going to win a
• 7:11
  Speaker 3: game like this regardless of... because they were playing a
• 7:13
  Speaker 3: lesser opponent?
• 7:14
  Speaker 4: Well, history tells us they were always going to win
• 7:17
  Speaker 4: it at Eden Park. But, look, I thought this was
• 7:22
  Speaker 4: a confident Wallabies team. They're not at full strength, but
• 7:24
  Speaker 4: they came over here having beaten, albeit a second-string Springboks team.
• 7:28
  Speaker 6: They'd won five, six on the bounce. So, it's a.
• 7:34
  Speaker 4: Prior to that game, you'd say it's an improving Wallabies
• 7:37
  Speaker 4: team coming over here with confidence. So I think it
• 7:39
  Speaker 4: is a response. You can only play who's in front
• 7:41
  Speaker 4: of you. They had a number of question marks, so
• 7:44
  Speaker 4: many absentees. Artie Sevilla, Luke Jacobson, Richie Mwanga goes down
• 7:48
  Speaker 4: early in the week. You've still got Caleb Clarke and
• 7:51
  Speaker 4: a number of others. Ruben Love out of the picture.
• 7:56
  Speaker 4: And a number of individuals stepped up in a massive way.
• 8:00
  Speaker 4: And like Geordie Barrett, he's got to go close to
• 8:02
  Speaker 4: World Player of the Year this year.
• 8:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I think it's probably down to him or,
• 8:06
  Speaker 3: I'm trying to think, Malcolm Marks, one of the other
• 8:08
  Speaker 3: South Africans might be in the mix as well. You know,
• 8:11
  Speaker 3: we've still got an autumn series to come, but those
• 8:14
  Speaker 3: two are certainly standing out at the moment. And look,
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: he was exceptional again last night and defensively rock solid,
• 8:22
  Speaker 3: team high, 16 tackles, I think it was, number of carries.
• 8:27
  Speaker 3: high ball work, he was just everywhere and he is
• 8:31
  Speaker 3: just going from strength to strength and you can probably
• 8:34
  Speaker 3: go back to that lens distant he had 18 months
• 8:37
  Speaker 3: ago now and going how vital was that for his
• 8:40
  Speaker 3: development well he's come back a better player and he
• 8:43
  Speaker 3: was the All Blacks best in South Africa and he
• 8:46
  Speaker 3: was the best again last night.
• 8:47
  Speaker 4: He's just everywhere he will make a telling tackle, be
• 8:52
  Speaker 4: trapped at the bottom of a ruck and then A
• 8:56
  Speaker 4: couple of phases later, he'll give a backdoor ball or,
• 9:00
  Speaker 4: like you say, his aerial work, his kicking game. He
• 9:03
  Speaker 4: really does it all. And for me, he is playing like,
• 9:08
  Speaker 4: and he would be, if it was up to me,
• 9:10
  Speaker 4: the All Black captain right now. I just think that
• 9:13
  Speaker 4: was such a follow-me, inspirational performance. It was kind of
• 9:18
  Speaker 4: Artie Sevier-esque at his best. I know not Cody Taylor
• 9:22
  Speaker 4: will be the All Blacks captain, but I just think
• 9:24
  Speaker 4: the way Geordie's playing... But yeah, he is playing like
• 9:30
  Speaker 4: an absolute bolted-on leader. And you're right, he's come back
• 9:33
  Speaker 4: from Leinster. He did that for the Hurricanes. I think
• 9:36
  Speaker 4: his influence there has probably been underplayed somewhat, and he's
• 9:40
  Speaker 4: carried that through to the All Blacks. He was certainly
• 9:42
  Speaker 4: the best in Africa and outstanding last night.
• 9:45
  Speaker 6: But he wasn't alone.
• 9:45
  Speaker 4: There were a number of strong performances, I thought.
• 9:50
  Speaker 6: Wallace Atiti.
• 9:51
  Speaker 4: You know, probably a fine line selection in the loose forwards, carried,
• 9:54
  Speaker 4: very busy. Cam Roygaard from the base. Peter Lakai was
• 10:00
  Speaker 4: good on attack. There was a couple of moments on
• 10:02
  Speaker 4: defence he might want to have again, whether that was
• 10:05
  Speaker 4: a structural thing, not too sure. But, Quinta Pyre as well,
• 10:10
  Speaker 4: carried all day, big presence at the breakdown. I thought
• 10:12
  Speaker 4: he made a big difference after being absent in Baltimore.
• 10:16
  Speaker 4: So some real big-time individual performances from the All Blacks.
• 10:20
  Speaker 4: And that's a lot easier to do when you're on
• 10:22
  Speaker 4: the front foot, when you're dominant.
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: It is.
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: Just on that captaincy, it's interesting that Will Jordan's taking
• 10:27
  Speaker 3: over the captaincy for the last 25, 30 minutes of
• 10:29
  Speaker 3: test matches since Cody Taylor's been appointed rather than Geordie.
• 10:35
  Speaker 3: Scott Barrett, his return, I thought he was very, very good.
• 10:38
  Speaker 3: I wasn't expecting him to play close to the 80
• 10:40
  Speaker 3: minutes that he did get out there. I think it
• 10:42
  Speaker 3: was 75 or so in the end before he went
• 10:43
  Speaker 3: off with the HIA return.
• 10:45
  Speaker 5: And he showed.
• 10:48
  Speaker 3: I guess, not what they were missing because they've got
• 10:49
  Speaker 3: some very good second rowers, but he showed that he's
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: still far from a spent force at test level. I
• 10:55
  Speaker 3: thought it was a really good return from Scott Barrett.
• 10:58
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and it's just that grafting. It's the work rate everywhere, defensively, carrying, breakdown,
• 11:07
  Speaker 4: clean-out work. And you hear people within that squad talk
• 11:11
  Speaker 4: about just– His experience, you know, being able to inject
• 11:15
  Speaker 4: that sort of leadership into a group straightaway is invaluable.
• 11:19
  Speaker 4: And like you, to go 71 minutes before coming off
• 11:23
  Speaker 4: with an HIA, I would have thought they would have
• 11:27
  Speaker 4: pulled him early with Tupou going to lock, but they
• 11:30
  Speaker 4: opted to take Josh Lord off. So I think he's
• 11:34
  Speaker 4: a massive in for the All Blacks and positive for
• 11:38
  Speaker 4: Scott that he passed those hia tests and biol accounts
• 11:42
  Speaker 4: will be available should they want to use them again
• 11:44
  Speaker 4: for sydney.
• 11:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah having to um pass an ha on monday in
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: sydney um to get that final uh clearance uh for
• 11:52
  Speaker 3: them one thing that um stood out to me looking
• 11:54
  Speaker 3: at some of the postgame stats the all blacks had
• 11:57
  Speaker 3: uh 15 entries into the australian 22 average 3.3 points
• 12:01
  Speaker 3: scored australia had six entries and scored 3.1 so The
• 12:05
  Speaker 3: All Blacks had more entries, average points roughly the same,
• 12:08
  Speaker 3: but they were just able to play in that right
• 12:10
  Speaker 3: area of the park more often. And that's one of
• 12:13
  Speaker 3: the key stats. Territory also tells a similar story as well,
• 12:17
  Speaker 3: 59 versus 40. But they were just able to, especially
• 12:22
  Speaker 3: in the second half, camp down that Wallabies into the ground.
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: It felt like it was suffocating the amount of attack
• 12:27
  Speaker 3: that the All Blacks were throwing at the Wallabies.
• 12:29
  Speaker 4: It was just completely dominant, that second half in particular.
• 12:33
  Speaker 4: And the All Blacks gradually got on top, and then
• 12:36
  Speaker 4: it just became a steamroll. And I also think it
• 12:40
  Speaker 4: was borne out the respective benches. Australia needs Tom Hooper,
• 12:45
  Speaker 4: Taniana Tupou, Hunter Paisami, Will Skelton. They need all their
• 12:49
  Speaker 4: best players available to knock over the best teams in
• 12:52
  Speaker 4: the world. And when you started dipping into a bench
• 12:57
  Speaker 4: that largely had single-figure um of test experience man for
• 13:02
  Speaker 4: man the all blacks were far superior um and when
• 13:06
  Speaker 4: you're dominant it allows you to control your bench to
• 13:09
  Speaker 4: to bring them on how you want you know george
• 13:11
  Speaker 4: bauer first and then amour and frazel and uh that
• 13:16
  Speaker 4: just continued the procession so that i think the the
• 13:19
  Speaker 4: respect of benches was a big part of why the
• 13:22
  Speaker 4: all blacks blew the game out completely.
• 13:24
  Speaker 3: Indeed um Easy to sit here, you know, with 150
• 13:28
  Speaker 3: points to 19. There were some things to work.
• 13:31
  Speaker 5: On out of that.
• 13:31
  Speaker 3: The line-out didn't start very well. The All Blacks didn't
• 13:33
  Speaker 3: start the game very well. They kind of fixed both
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: of those issues, but the line-out was a little bit shaky.
• 13:39
  Speaker 3: Australia can take that to Sydney, I suppose, as a
• 13:42
  Speaker 3: minor win that they did have. And then a couple
• 13:45
  Speaker 3: of times they were just opened up a little bit
• 13:47
  Speaker 3: too easy, as you mentioned. Now, I think that Harry
• 13:49
  Speaker 3: Olsen tried. There was a hint of obstruction there that,
• 13:52
  Speaker 3: I know one of the sky frames in our monitor
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: sort of showed the potential obstruction. Didn't get looked at.
• 13:57
  Speaker 3: The All Blacks didn't seem to query it. Cody with
• 14:01
  Speaker 3: the referee, Andrew Brace. And then the mall drive at
• 14:07
  Speaker 3: the end will be one that hurts for the All
• 14:08
  Speaker 3: Blacks and it'll sting a little bit because they were
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: so dominant. But a couple of those tries were relatively
• 14:14
  Speaker 3: soft from an All Blacks perspective to concede.
• 14:17
  Speaker 4: You need to force your opposition to work harder for
• 14:20
  Speaker 4: their points, and the All Blacks had to do that
• 14:22
  Speaker 4: in the first half, and I didn't feel like the
• 14:23
  Speaker 4: Wallabies did. Like you say, they opened them up far
• 14:27
  Speaker 4: too easily, and the line-out needs to function better, particularly
• 14:32
  Speaker 4: when you've got three locks. Effectively, there's no excuse for that.
• 14:37
  Speaker 4: To lose your own ball has been a strength of
• 14:39
  Speaker 4: the Wallabies, but It's also interesting that the All Blacks
• 14:44
  Speaker 4: aren't contesting on opposition ball generally, and I assume that's
• 14:49
  Speaker 4: to defend the rolling ball, but that's not so relevant
• 14:53
  Speaker 4: if you're on the halfway.
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: Well, yeah, there was one point in the second, I
• 14:57
  Speaker 3: think it was the second half, where Australia were deep
• 14:59
  Speaker 3: inside their own half. In fact, it might have been
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: the first half, actually, and they had a line out
• 15:02
  Speaker 3: and the All Blacks didn't contest. And obviously there's a
• 15:05
  Speaker 3: tactical reason behind it, but it was interesting that they
• 15:08
  Speaker 3: didn't want to go up and try and attack the
• 15:10
  Speaker 3: ball in the year fit for whatever reason.
• 15:12
  Speaker 4: And the All Blacks aren't generally, um, they did on
• 15:16
  Speaker 4: maybe one occasion in the second half, but they aren't
• 15:18
  Speaker 4: using their more a lot. Um, they're looking to shift
• 15:21
  Speaker 4: the ball and use set moves off that. So maybe
• 15:26
  Speaker 4: they don't see that, um, as one of their strengths,
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: but yeah, a couple of areas there to work on,
• 15:31
  Speaker 4: particularly just the, those defensive, um, lapses, whether it's individual
• 15:36
  Speaker 4: or structural, not too sure, but, um, Yeah, with a
• 15:40
  Speaker 4: scoreline like that, we are picking the bones a wee bit.
• 15:42
  Speaker 5: That's right.
• 15:43
  Speaker 3: Got to fill in a podcast somehow. Leroy Carter's injury
• 15:47
  Speaker 3: as well. Look, when I was calling it live, I
• 15:52
  Speaker 3: did say hip drop. I think it was not necessarily
• 15:55
  Speaker 3: like a rugby league style hip drop, but there was
• 15:57
  Speaker 3: certainly a pulling motion from Valentini. Now, I don't think
• 16:00
  Speaker 3: there was anything malicious in it. He was trying to
• 16:02
  Speaker 3: stop the act of a try, and that's a common
• 16:04
  Speaker 3: technique to do so.
• 16:05
  Speaker 5: World Rugby have....
• 16:08
  Speaker 3: Outlawed or about to outlaw hip drop and knee drop
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: tackles from November 1st so for the next 20 odd
• 16:13
  Speaker 3: days get in your hip drop tackles while you can
• 16:16
  Speaker 3: boys because um you can still do those so there's
• 16:19
  Speaker 3: a bit of chatter maybe about a sighting or whatever
• 16:21
  Speaker 3: last night don't expect that to come to anything um
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: because by the letter of the law it was a
• 16:27
  Speaker 3: legal tackle for uh for the next three weeks um
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: and again I don't think there was any malicious in
• 16:32
  Speaker 3: it necessarily but um it is probably going to likely
• 16:36
  Speaker 3: end Leroy Carter this season. Certainly not playing in the
• 16:40
  Speaker 3: return bladders low, and the way he hobbled off with
• 16:43
  Speaker 3: a couple of the All Blacks medics around him, hard
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: to see him getting back for the end of year
• 16:48
  Speaker 3: tour in, what, three weeks' time.
• 16:50
  Speaker 6: Yeah, unfortunate for Leroy, isn't it?
• 16:52
  Speaker 4: And, look, that's why these style of tackles are being outlawed.
• 17:00
  Speaker 4: I've seen some clips portrayed online, and there's a bit
• 17:03
  Speaker 4: of conjecture around.
• 17:06
  Speaker 4: World Rugby killing the game, and I guess there'd be
• 17:08
  Speaker 4: more TMO intervention potentially, but this is why, because of that.
• 17:14
  Speaker 6: So Valentini, very, very.
• 17:15
  Speaker 4: Fortunate that he can't be cited for that yet. So
• 17:22
  Speaker 4: you'd expect him to be available next week. Losing him
• 17:26
  Speaker 4: would be a massive blow for the Wallabies. I'd probably
• 17:28
  Speaker 4: be without Iketau. as it is, so more changes there.
• 17:31
  Speaker 3: Indeed, likely more changes there, Napes, for the Wallabies. We'll
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: take a quick break here on Rugby Direct and have
• 17:36
  Speaker 3: a look at the All Blacks picture after this.
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: Rugby Direct with Elliot Smith and Liam Napier, powered by
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: Newstalk ZB. Hear every All Blacks game live and free
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: on air and on iHeartRadio.
• 17:50
  Speaker 3: You're back with Rugby Direct and, Napes, look, plenty of
• 17:54
  Speaker 3: possible changes for the All Blacks as well with that
• 17:57
  Speaker 3: growing casualty ward.
• 17:58
  Speaker 4: No Anton Cegna, no Asafa Almua. Ethan Blackadder has also
• 18:05
  Speaker 4: tweaked his calf, so your loose forward ranks are really
• 18:10
  Speaker 4: thinning out. No Jacobson, Sevier, Blackadder, Cegna, so Doopsy Karifi
• 18:16
  Speaker 4: gets his first call-up under Dave Rennie, which will please.
• 18:20
  Speaker 6: lot of people.
• 18:21
  Speaker 4: Ironically, a week after, Rennie came out on Jason Pine's
• 18:25
  Speaker 4: show and clarified why he wasn't selected.
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: Yeah, giving up too many penalties at ruck time. Yeah,
• 18:31
  Speaker 3: there'll be a, well, I assume he's already left, but
• 18:32
  Speaker 3: there'll be a ticker tape parade in Wellington as Duplicy
• 18:35
  Speaker 3: heads to the airport. I'm sure he's a course of
• 18:38
  Speaker 3: the breath down there at the moment, and he's in
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: the mix. And look, he's a guy and, you know,
• 18:45
  Speaker 3: a really likeable guy as Duplicy, and Whether he gets
• 18:49
  Speaker 3: an opportunity or not will be interesting. It might be
• 18:52
  Speaker 3: the last chance to loon for him potentially in the
• 18:54
  Speaker 3: All Blacks. He's been given a shot. Do they look
• 18:56
  Speaker 3: at him this week in Sydney? Does it give him
• 18:58
  Speaker 3: a little bit more freedom, the All Blacks having won
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: last night, to go, let's have a look at some
• 19:02
  Speaker 3: of these players before the end of year tour and
• 19:06
  Speaker 3: see whether they're worthy of going up north?
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: He's certainly in the mix, isn't he? Sevilla and Jacobson
• 19:14
  Speaker 4: gone for the year. Blackhead is known to be injury prone.
• 19:18
  Speaker 4: So you've got Lakai and Cegna to come back. But
• 19:24
  Speaker 4: the door is certainly open for him and others. If
• 19:27
  Speaker 4: you think about Shea Fihaki, Amoni Narawa, maybe Josh Jacob,
• 19:33
  Speaker 4: Anton Leonard-Brown returns to the squad. Rennie was pretty open
• 19:37
  Speaker 4: about the fact that if they got the job done
• 19:39
  Speaker 4: on Saturday night, which they did, their thinking was around
• 19:42
  Speaker 4: giving these fringe guys a chance in Sydney, maybe a
• 19:46
  Speaker 4: bit of rotation. And it does make sense. You bank
• 19:48
  Speaker 4: the bladders low. They still want to win, but you
• 19:54
  Speaker 4: have to give these guys some game time or you're
• 19:56
  Speaker 4: not going to find out anything about them.
• 19:58
  Speaker 3: No, that's exactly right. And this is probably the game
• 20:00
  Speaker 3: to do it. There is, you know, Australia are a
• 20:01
  Speaker 3: good team. They lost last night, but you've got to
• 20:05
  Speaker 3: find out a little bit more about them because they've
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: got to stick to the widest squad for Europe. There'll
• 20:08
  Speaker 3: be a night of the World Cup there. As you mentioned,
• 20:12
  Speaker 3: those players are out. They've called in Duplessis, Karifi, Anton
• 20:16
  Speaker 3: Leonard-Brown rejoins the squad. We've also got George Bell and
• 20:19
  Speaker 3: Jamie Hanna plucked out of Canterbury's NPC semi-final team today.
• 20:23
  Speaker 3: It's about an hour away as we record this, so
• 20:26
  Speaker 3: hopefully it hasn't derailed the Red and Blacks' march towards
• 20:29
  Speaker 3: another NPC title.
• 20:31
  Speaker 6: Interesting that Hanna got selected over Sam Darry.
• 20:33
  Speaker 5: That's right.
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: I mean, Sam Darry, all of a sudden, he didn't
• 20:36
  Speaker 3: play well in Baltimore. Yeah, he just seems to have
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: dropped a couple of pegs on the All Blacks' lock
• 20:44
  Speaker 3: ladder as a result.
• 20:46
  Speaker 6: Yeah, possibly.
• 20:47
  Speaker 4: I guess Jamie Hanna debuted in July off the bench
• 20:49
  Speaker 4: and hasn't been in the squad, so maybe they're taking
• 20:53
  Speaker 4: the chance to look at some guys they haven't seen,
• 20:55
  Speaker 4: like a Fihaki, Hanna, and a Karifi. So get them
• 20:59
  Speaker 4: in for this one-off game, further widen the net and
• 21:02
  Speaker 4: broaden your depth, and then reselect for the end-of-year tour.
• 21:06
  Speaker 4: Tava Tavanawa is another one that has to play in Sydney.
• 21:11
  Speaker 4: You can't have him in the squad and not give
• 21:13
  Speaker 4: him game time. find out a bit more about him
• 21:16
  Speaker 4: so very interesting to see what sort of squad turns
• 21:21
  Speaker 4: out this week I think it'll be starkly different from
• 21:24
  Speaker 4: the team for Eden Park because the pressure is off
• 21:28
  Speaker 4: and when the All Blacks go north it'll be back
• 21:31
  Speaker 4: on so no test is a free hit is it
• 21:35
  Speaker 4: but certainly there's a lot more flexibility.
• 21:39
  Speaker 5: Yeah, exactly.
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: This is a bit like South Africa with the squad
• 21:41
  Speaker 3: they sent down to Australia and going, yep, this is
• 21:44
  Speaker 3: still a test match that they want to win, but
• 21:46
  Speaker 3: we do need to look at some of these players
• 21:48
  Speaker 3: and the heat is off. So let's try and figure
• 21:50
  Speaker 3: out what this team might look like. Any changes to
• 21:53
  Speaker 3: the front row?
• 21:56
  Speaker 4: I think you've got scope to change the props. You
• 22:00
  Speaker 4: know what you're going to get from the group's I
• 22:03
  Speaker 4: think Tyrell Lomax will come back into the mix somewhere.
• 22:06
  Speaker 4: Xavier Numia, I would like to see him come into
• 22:08
  Speaker 4: the mix somewhere, whether they start or come off the bench,
• 22:10
  Speaker 4: not too sure, but you'd think Cody Taylor would start
• 22:13
  Speaker 4: again as captain.
• 22:14
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I'd say so.
• 22:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, Amu is not obviously there. Sam Asoni,
• 22:18
  Speaker 3: Takeo will come onto the bench. You'd assume George Bell
• 22:21
  Speaker 3: won't be required, but will be there. As it stands,
• 22:24
  Speaker 3: barring any other injuries, the second row will be interesting
• 22:27
  Speaker 3: as well. Let's assume that in this case scenario that
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: Scott Barrett does pass his HIA three tomorrow and is
• 22:33
  Speaker 3: cleared to go. Who would you go with in the
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: second row?
• 22:37
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think Scott would... He's just come back from
• 22:40
  Speaker 4: 10 months. If he's fit and able, I think he
• 22:42
  Speaker 4: goes again. Maybe Tupou goes back into lock, but I
• 22:46
  Speaker 4: would like to see Fabian Holland come back.
• 22:48
  Speaker 6: He was a curious.
• 22:51
  Speaker 4: Omission, and for me, I don't think Josh Lord launched
• 22:57
  Speaker 4: a compelling case to retain that role, so I would
• 23:00
  Speaker 4: probably bring....
• 23:02
  Speaker 6: Fabian in to start.
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think I'd go Fabian as well alongside Scott Barrett,
• 23:06
  Speaker 3: assuming he is good to go. Second row, sorry, the
• 23:10
  Speaker 3: back row, I guess obviously last night they went with
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: Tupou on blindside. I don't know, you need to do
• 23:17
  Speaker 3: that twice in a row against the Wallabies. Is it
• 23:19
  Speaker 3: time to look at Shannon Frizzell potentially?
• 23:21
  Speaker 4: Absolutely, yeah, we didn't see enough of him and just
• 23:25
  Speaker 4: let him go for 50 minutes, run himself into the
• 23:27
  Speaker 4: grounds and build him up that way. Yeah, give him
• 23:30
  Speaker 4: the sixth jersey, I think. Tupou was very good last night,
• 23:34
  Speaker 4: but you brought Frizzell back for a reason. And on
• 23:40
  Speaker 4: Lakai as well.
• 23:40
  Speaker 5: Do you keep Lakai and Sotiri in the same sport?
• 23:43
  Speaker 6: Potentially.
• 23:43
  Speaker 4: You've got Simon Parker floating around. I'm not a huge fan,
• 23:47
  Speaker 4: but you are really depleted, so you don't have a
• 23:51
  Speaker 4: lot of options. I think Lakai, for me, it's staggering
• 23:55
  Speaker 4: to think he's 23 years old. He is going to
• 23:57
  Speaker 4: be a generational player.
• 24:00
  Speaker 6: For the All Blacks.
• 24:01
  Speaker 4: And Satiti, I thought that was his best test of
• 24:03
  Speaker 4: the year by a long way.
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I would probably retain both of those players. I mean,
• 24:07
  Speaker 3: they've got a few limited options given the injuries they've
• 24:10
  Speaker 3: now had. Signum might have been an option to come
• 24:13
  Speaker 3: in to start, but obviously he's been ruled out. Blackadder
• 24:15
  Speaker 3: might have been another option. When you bring in a
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: couple of replacements, unlikely to come straight back into the
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: starting side. Halfback's really interesting to me. Look, I wonder
• 24:24
  Speaker 3: whether this is time to Give Cam Roygaard a week off, potentially,
• 24:29
  Speaker 3: and go Kyle Preston. Let's see what you can do
• 24:32
  Speaker 3: in the starting role in a test match for the
• 24:35
  Speaker 3: All Blacks and potentially Cortez Ratema off the bench.
• 24:39
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I think so. Roygaard's had a massive workload. Maybe...
• 24:43
  Speaker 6: I know that, yeah, they've just.
• 24:44
  Speaker 5: Had three weeks off, but you also need to prime
• 24:46
  Speaker 5: yourself at the end of the year to.
• 24:48
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I wonder if their thinking will be to bring
• 24:50
  Speaker 4: Cortes in to start and leave Preston to carry on
• 24:52
  Speaker 4: the impact role. But I think it potentially is a
• 24:57
  Speaker 4: week to do that. But Damien McKenzie, I thought he
• 25:01
  Speaker 4: was brilliant as well, coming in, sees the reins, particularly
• 25:05
  Speaker 4: in that first half, when it was really contestable and
• 25:09
  Speaker 4: when the All Blacks had a couple of moments He
• 25:12
  Speaker 4: sees them. He challenged the line a lot, and then
• 25:16
  Speaker 4: he made really good decisions to set up others. So
• 25:19
  Speaker 4: I'd be leaving him at 10 and probably bringing Josh
• 25:23
  Speaker 4: Jacob on the bench. But outside Wales this year, if
• 25:28
  Speaker 4: you were going to give Josh Jacob a test day
• 25:30
  Speaker 4: to start the severe, you were advocating for him last week?
• 25:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I was advocating for him last week. I'm not
• 25:36
  Speaker 3: sure they'll do it. I think now with the uncertainty
• 25:40
  Speaker 3: over Moronga, You need more time in the saddle for 10.
• 25:43
  Speaker 3: So I've walked that back a little bit from Thursday.
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: So let's say McKenzie's at 10 again.
• 25:51
  Speaker 5: Midfield.
• 25:51
  Speaker 3: Now, we've just been exalting Geordie Barrett. And again, they've
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: just had three weeks off. They'll get another couple of
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: weeks rest before the end of year tour. But I
• 26:01
  Speaker 3: don't see any need to wheel Geordie Barrett out this week.
• 26:04
  Speaker 3: Similar to Cam Roy, there's such big pieces in this
• 26:06
  Speaker 3: all-black side. you don't want to risk an injury in
• 26:10
  Speaker 3: a not meaningless game in Sydney but a game that
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: you can afford to make some changes for so I'd
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: be saying to Geordie yep you're holding tackle bags this
• 26:18
  Speaker 3: week and Quinn Tupai is moving in 1-12 and Rico
• 26:21
  Speaker 3: Ioane starting at 13.
• 26:22
  Speaker 4: Yeah I like it that's Quinn's natural position he knows
• 26:27
  Speaker 4: Damien well from the Chiefs so I don't think there's
• 26:29
  Speaker 4: a lot of risk in that and Rico's played really
• 26:32
  Speaker 4: well looked sharp since he's come back so I think
• 26:36
  Speaker 4: that combination could well you've could work well. You've got
• 26:39
  Speaker 4: Antelena Brown coming back into the mix. We've spoken about
• 26:42
  Speaker 4: Tava Tavanawa, I think, off the bench. So they do
• 26:45
  Speaker 4: have a lot of options. And I think you do
• 26:47
  Speaker 4: need to be wary, just particularly with the combative nature
• 26:50
  Speaker 4: of the way that Geordie plays. You don't want to
• 26:52
  Speaker 4: run him into the ground.
• 26:53
  Speaker 5: No, that's exactly right.
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: Wings, does Morby come in on the left wing, straight
• 26:58
  Speaker 3: swap for Carter, and does Jordan remain on the right?
• 27:02
  Speaker 4: I wouldn't be surprised to see them give Sheafy Haki
• 27:06
  Speaker 4: a crack. this week he was selected in the squad
• 27:09
  Speaker 4: over Amoni Narawa and he's a guy they haven't seen
• 27:13
  Speaker 4: and they I think they would they like the look
• 27:16
  Speaker 4: of his aerial.
• 27:16
  Speaker 5: Abilities he can play left wing and right wing as well.
• 27:18
  Speaker 4: So I think he could be in line for a
• 27:20
  Speaker 4: chance and Morby you have seen a bit of him
• 27:25
  Speaker 4: this year he's the natural option isn't he for that
• 27:29
  Speaker 4: left wing role but I wouldn't be surprised to see
• 27:33
  Speaker 4: Sheafy I could get a crack Bowden Barrett start full
• 27:35
  Speaker 4: back I think so I think he surprised me I
• 27:40
  Speaker 4: thought he looked sharp had some real pace to scamper
• 27:47
  Speaker 4: back and save the day just after half time there
• 27:50
  Speaker 4: was two instances one in the backfield and then one
• 27:54
  Speaker 4: on the right hand side of the field scooping up
• 27:57
  Speaker 4: the ball in good position very urgent so I thought
• 28:02
  Speaker 4: he was good and It's not like he needs a spell.
• 28:07
  Speaker 4: He's only played 15 minutes of the greatest rivalry series.
• 28:09
  Speaker 4: So who else would you.
• 28:12
  Speaker 5: Put back there?
• 28:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I mean, you could go Will Jordan at
• 28:14
  Speaker 3: fullback and look at, you know, Fihaki on one wing
• 28:17
  Speaker 3: and Mobi on the other potentially. Finnegan Rofo is not
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: going to be fit. I think, you know, Bowden Barrett showed,
• 28:24
  Speaker 3: he copped a fair bit Bowden, but I think he
• 28:27
  Speaker 3: showed last night his class and the fact that he,
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: you know, he can still see things in the game
• 28:35
  Speaker 3: that others can't necessarily. And I think that McKenzie combination
• 28:39
  Speaker 3: with Barrett at the back did work really nicely. So
• 28:42
  Speaker 3: I think you've got to keep going with that.
• 28:44
  Speaker 4: How much inherent risk is there in rotation? We saw
• 28:47
  Speaker 4: the box make 13 starting changes, lose to the Wallabies.
• 28:53
  Speaker 6: What's the New.
• 28:54
  Speaker 4: Zealand rugby fandom appetite for rotation and a loss? The
• 29:00
  Speaker 4: Springboks are much more conditioned. for rotation and for potential
• 29:06
  Speaker 4: setbacks that come where the All Blacks still have the
• 29:08
  Speaker 4: expectation they win every test and they've just righted the ship,
• 29:13
  Speaker 4: how much risk is involved?
• 29:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's an interesting balance for Dave Rennie. Look, I
• 29:18
  Speaker 3: think you need to be prepared to make the risk
• 29:19
  Speaker 3: to see a bit more about these players. There are
• 29:22
  Speaker 3: so few gimme tests these days that the opportunities to
• 29:27
  Speaker 3: bring in players fewer and fewer.
• 29:29
  Speaker 6: You calling the Wallabies a gimme?
• 29:30
  Speaker 5: Nope, I'm not. I'm not calling them a gimme at all.
• 29:32
  Speaker 3: But you used to have, you know, the All Blacks
• 29:34
  Speaker 3: have barely played any tier two nations over the last, well,
• 29:38
  Speaker 3: since basically the 2023 World Cup, apart from Fiji. You know,
• 29:42
  Speaker 3: they used to play a few more of those games
• 29:43
  Speaker 3: that they don't anymore. So, um you know the tour
• 29:48
  Speaker 3: games were helpful in south africa for some of that
• 29:51
  Speaker 3: as well but they were expected to win i think
• 29:53
  Speaker 3: the appetite is there you know i think the all
• 29:56
  Speaker 3: blacks have become a little bit more conservative over the
• 29:59
  Speaker 3: last decade or so around some of their selections and
• 30:02
  Speaker 3: then going with the incumbents rather than new players. So, yeah,
• 30:05
  Speaker 3: I think this is the week to have a look
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: and you've got to be prepared to maybe come away
• 30:09
  Speaker 3: with a defeat at the, you know, greater good of
• 30:13
  Speaker 3: learning a bit more about some of those players, like
• 30:15
  Speaker 3: a Tava Tava Ngawai off the bench potentially, like a
• 30:18
  Speaker 3: Shea Fee Haki, like some of those guys.
• 30:21
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think you've got to trust your depth and
• 30:25
  Speaker 4: there is risk, but we are talking about bringing back
• 30:28
  Speaker 4: guys like Tyrell Lomax, Fabian Holland, Rico Awani, you know,
• 30:33
  Speaker 4: you know, alongside some others.
• 30:36
  Speaker 5: There's no debutants there apart from Fihaki, potentially.
• 30:39
  Speaker 6: Yeah, exactly.
• 30:40
  Speaker 4: So, yes, there is inherent risk when you make change
• 30:43
  Speaker 4: and they're not established combinations. There's going to be a
• 30:45
  Speaker 4: bit of clunkiness, as we saw with the Springboks as well.
• 30:50
  Speaker 4: So it could make for what, you know, the wind's
• 30:56
  Speaker 4: been sucked out of this rematch, particularly from an Australian perspective.
• 31:01
  Speaker 4: But if the All Blacks rotate, it could make for
• 31:04
  Speaker 4: a very intriguing test match.
• 31:06
  Speaker 5: Indeed.
• 31:07
  Speaker 3: Our regular correspondent, Tim, flicked me an email and asked
• 31:11
  Speaker 3: what the deal was with Scott Barrett being the only
• 31:13
  Speaker 3: guy in white boots. Now, this came up at the
• 31:15
  Speaker 3: media conference, and we didn't get an answer from Dave Rennie,
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: who suggested that maybe this ran.
• 31:19
  Speaker 5: Out of the.
• 31:19
  Speaker 6: He missed the boat.
• 31:20
  Speaker 3: Missed the boat on the orange and yellow fluoro ones.
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: So we'll do some more digging over the course of
• 31:24
  Speaker 3: the week, see.
• 31:24
  Speaker 5: If we can come up with an answer.
• 31:25
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm sure it pleased Richie McCoy. He was always
• 31:27
  Speaker 4: an advocate, although it was black boots, wasn't it?
• 31:29
  Speaker 5: Black boots, yeah.
• 31:30
  Speaker 6: Particularly for forwards, it was non-negotiable.
• 31:32
  Speaker 3: Dan Carter had those gold boots. Remember that one time?
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: They were quite nice.
• 31:35
  Speaker 6: The golden boots for the golden boy.
• 31:36
  Speaker 5: That's right.
• 31:38
  Speaker 3: Right, we will wrap it up there on Rugby Direct.
• 31:42
  Speaker 3: See you again on Thursday from Sydney. Looking forward to it.
• 31:47
  Speaker 6: Indeed.
• 31:47
  Speaker 4: Great city and a big old week in Sydney. Rugby
• 31:50
  Speaker 4: League World Cup, Everest race.
• 31:52
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I think it's the A-League Derby as well.
• 31:54
  Speaker 6: It's all happening.
• 31:55
  Speaker 5: Yeah, and pack the speedos.
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 31:59
  Speaker 6: Get some Rugby Direct branding on them?
• 32:01
  Speaker 5: Well, yeah, we should look at that.
• 32:03
  Speaker 6: Bondi look at it.
• 32:03
  Speaker 3: I'm sure our listeners would love to buy some of
• 32:06
  Speaker 3: those as well. They'll be a hit this summer. Mark Kelly,
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: thanks so much for his production work. It's been Rugby
• 32:11
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• 32:14
  Speaker 3: to a higher level.
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: For more from Newstalk ZB, listen live, on air or online.
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: And keep our shows with you wherever you go with
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: our podcasts on iHeart Radio.