Latest / The Epstein Chronicles / Mega Edition: Unnamed MCC Lieutenant And HIs OIG Interview (8-10) (7/4/26)

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Mega Edition: Unnamed MCC Lieutenant And HIs OIG Interview (8-10) (7/4/26) · The Epstein Chronicles

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Speaker 1: What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the
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Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're getting right back to
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the interview with the unamed lieutenant from MCC with the
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OIG investigators. Question. All right, now, this is the one
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that I really want you to look at. Look at
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this E one. This is now August tenth at midnight.
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Check out what it says for Za on E one.
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What number does that say? Answer seventy two question? All right,
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and check out the count slip answer what does the
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count slip say? Question? It says seventy three, So seventy three,
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But the top one that was clear it says seventy
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two right answer yeah, question, And I'll give you one more,
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just so it's not a magic trick. Look at this
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page first for the August tenth, and I have the
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rest of them too if you want to see them,
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but three am on August tenth. And then the last
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page where it says the count slip, what does it
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say on the E one? On the next one answer
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it says seventy two question? And on the E one
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and then what does the count slip say? Answer seventy
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two question. So, in looking at all of this does
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that tell you as a lieutenant and someone who worked
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in the shoe, does that tell you something? Answer? Yeah,
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But the thing is this one had up though question.
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That's exactly right. So we're trying to figure out where
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did this count change down to seventy two? And does
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it indicate to you that these counts were not actually
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conducted and that this is not that we have no
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reason to believe you were involved in this. So I
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want to make sure your we're actually just looking for
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your help here, as someone who worked in the shoe
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and someone that is familiar with these kinds of documents,
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can you help us put this puzzle together? So we
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have a reason to believe that they called in the
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midnight seventy three and the control lieutenant who was working
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that night figured out that there is actually only seventy
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two people in there. They've been calling in seventy three,
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but there's only seventy two people in the shoe. Is
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there any way from looking and that's from this point forward,
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they're now starting calling in seventy two? Is there any
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way from looking at these you're able to determine with
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your knowledge and experience where that changed. I would say
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that it changed from the ten o'clock count. This was
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printed at nine thirty three, so it has seventy three.
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And then at nine thirty three attorney conference ain't open,
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so Epstein would have probably been up by then. He
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would have went back to the shoe, so he would
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have been listed on Epstein would have been back at
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least by eight pm. Right answer, yeah, question, So that
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would have been he should have been on this one. Answer,
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so he threw it. Yeah question, And can you see
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where on let's talk about I guess that's the one
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before the five pm the four pm answer, Yeah, it
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would have been the attorney conference. Yeah question, and it
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would have showed them at the attorney conference on one
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of these correct on the e one answer, yeah, at
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three o'clock at attorney conference. Well from shoe question and
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then does it show that he's already in shoe in
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this one? Is there any way an attorney conference at
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the ten pm count? Answer? No? But see what I
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was telling you before about the numbers. See how I
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had seventy six question yep answer, and this is at
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the four o'clock count, and then it went down to
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seventy three question right answer, So you don't know until
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after the count about the whole cellmate coming back? Question right,
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But then the weird part about it is going from
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seventy three to seventy two with no movement, so we
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don't know. Okay, so they're taking off, you know, if
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they're going from what does it say, seventy six down
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to seventy three, that's three people and one person vanishes
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when it gets to seventy two. Are you able to
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tell where that person vanished from? Or is it impossible?
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Because possibly all these counts were not conducted, and that
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I know you weren't here for any of these counts apparently,
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so it's again I'm just asking for your guidance. Is
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that correct? You weren't even working when any of these
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counts were conducted? Answer yeah, Well if I was, you
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said four? Right? Answer well, you possibly worked up until
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four answer yeah. Question but he gets cut off by
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the lieutenant. So I wasn't here. I wasn't there for
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count question right, So again I want to reassure you,
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this is not a gotcha moment. We're just trying to help.
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He gets cut off by the lieutenant. No, no, but
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you know it feels like it. Question yeah, yeah, And
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I get that because you've got special agents talking to you.
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It's just all about trying to piece the puzzle together.
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So we need help with people like yourself to be
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able to say what the hell happened? You know what
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I mean? Answer yeah, Well, well there's also three here
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from indiscernible I mean, I think question and we've had others,
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and you just he gets cut off by the lieutenant. Oh,
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they hadn't keyed them out, but then they would have
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keyed them out. R and D leaves at ten. They
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leave at ten. Now they could have left somebody on
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and they came out, because like you said, it's no movement.
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The only way you get it is you key out
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like ki a guy unless somebody went to the hospital
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or something. Answer yeah, and if there is nothing that happened,
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but no inmates were moved after ten pm? If we
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know that, does this indicate that we're just going off
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on numbers and just falsifying their accounts or are you
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able to tell by looking at these all if these
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counts are legit or not. Are you able to kind
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of like give us any insight into that answer? I mean,
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the one with the plus one is the question, because
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I don't see why they would. Then again, you've got
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R and D with the plus one two I don't know.
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I don't know what's going on. They got R and
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D indiscernible sell plus one question And by looking at
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that person in R and D, are you able to
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tell who it is? Answer? Huh? Question not by looking
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at the name? Answer? Not by looking at the name.
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I mean there's no outcount. Don't have the outcount question?
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Don't have the outcount? Is that what you're saying? Answer? Yeah?
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Question and what time is that for? Answer? Well, you
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don't have the count out question? No, what time are
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you looking at? Answer? This one's for ten? Question? So
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the ten PM doesn't even have an outcount on it. Answer,
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I mean it don't add up. Because yes, something's not
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right because R and D is not on here unless
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they moved. I mean sometime they have a ghost count.
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But he gets cut off by the investigator. And what
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does a ghost count mean? The lieutenant So like the
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guy in medical, they say, hey, I didn't have time
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to key him in, but I'm verifying that he's down
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there or down here with me and put them on
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my account. Question So R and D does that say
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ninety five plus one. Answer it could say ninety five,
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or it could say nine south. Question oh, nine south
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plus one? The other investigator pipes in, what's nine south?
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Answer the shoe question? Now, this name to me looks
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like redacted? So is that somebody's name? Answer? Yeah, that's
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an officer question. So if someone was placed in R
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and D and someone was told to watch that person there,
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would the person at ten pm? Would they be able
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to see, like a dry cell, someone was still sitting
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there at night? Answer well, yeah, because you could watch
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them down there. Yeah. Question and is that like a
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small indiscernible Is it kind of like you'd be able
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to that person would know if somebody was there or not?
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Answer yeah, because someone could have come in before the
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count too. A US marshal could have brung someone in
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and they said, hey, watch this guy, he's going to
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nine South. That's why the plus one is throwing me off.
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Question have you ever seen plus one and anything before? Answer? No,
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I heard people calling in with a plus one, But
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then again, I say that's like a ghost a ghost. Count.
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Question all right, does this but seeing especially looking at
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seventy two and does this at all tell you anything
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about any of those counts. Like we've had other people,
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you know, in higher position saying to me, it tells
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me that the counts weren't done. Does that tell you that? Answer? Yeah,
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but at ten I mean yeah, I don't know, man,
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I mean, I couldn't tell you. I couldn't tell you.
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I don't know. I don't understand that question. Okay, So
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it's just a baffling type of deal because it's baffling
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to us, and then we're just hoping that people can
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help us, especially people that were there. Answer, I don't know. See,
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that's why I don't understand that. I don't see how
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they got seventy three at the time ten o'clock count
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and then they lose one after the ten o'clock count. Question,
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And that's the same thing we're trying to figure that out. Answer,
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unless it wasn't keyed in the system, question, at what
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point are you able to tell at what point it
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should have been keyed in the system by that answer, Well,
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if a guy came into R and D and they
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keep him in shoe and they put him back in
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R and D. Question, So if like he went to
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shoe and then back answer, he never went to shoe.
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They keep him in the shoe, they put him on
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the count, but he didn't make it. So the medical
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and stuff taking the guy out, so they say, hey,
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leave him down there and count him an R and D.
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I could see that happening. Question. So if like he's
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in medical and they can't he gets cut off by
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the lieutenant. Well, so like medical comes down there and
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they check him out and he don't make it up
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to the shoe for the time. Seeing that, they could say, hey, well,
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I'm not putting him in our account, put him down there. Question.
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So that would be like the ghost count you're talking about. Answer, No,
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that's the real count. That's just saying someone put him
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in there and then took him out. Question. All right,
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but if he's not physically there, he's not actually allowed
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to be on the count, is he Answer exactly No,
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That's why this is I don't know. You see this
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says RA, that's R and D question, And does it
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say anybody in R and D on this answer? Well,
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there's not out count. And that's what I'm saying. There's
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no out count with that one question. So this RA
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is one answer. RA and R and D are separate.
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You need an out count for this. You don't need
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an outcount for that. This is a unit question. But
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as far as this goes, we're looking at the midnight
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and ten pm right answer. Yeah, question, So at midnight
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there is RA one and then midnight, but at ten pm,
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you know, two hours earlier the zero correct answer. So
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I'm thinking this dude went back to RA. Question. Okay,
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that's how they lost someone. But there is a count
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slip for R and R and D. That's what we're
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talking about. That's the thing. He gets cut off by
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the investigator. Isn't the count slip he gets cut off
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now by the lieutenant at the top question that's R
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and D answer, Well, they could have messed up. They
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could have had RA count slip for that one question.
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What's the difference between RNA and R and D. Answer.
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RNA is a real unit. So when the guys come
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back from court, they're in RA status. R and D
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is when they keyed out question to leave answer to
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go to court. But if they come back, they came
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back in their unit. If they don't come back, they
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release them from R and D. But RA is technically
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a unit question and it doesn't count as it doesn't
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show up in R and D answer. No question, where
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would that one slip that says R and D in there?
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Where would that show up? Answer? That would be right here.
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But they don't have nobody in R and D question
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so there, So is that even weirder the fact that
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the ten PM count there's a count slip for R
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and D and there's nobody for R and D on
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this answer. That's why I think they put them and
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keep them in the shoe. They keep them in the
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shoe the inmate and put him down an R and
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D and then change it after the count, or they
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could have changed it right after his count cleared and
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set it up for the next count. Say the inmate,
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the inmate is this is ten answer? Yeah, this one
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is ten pm question. Yeah, you have the midnight one
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question and that midnight one right there. Answer, that's the
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three question. This is midnight answer. Yeah, So that's what happened.
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Question Does R and D have like a dry cell
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or a dry room? Answer? No, they got sells. You see,
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they got RA right here. Yeah, that's what happened. I
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think the guy came from shoe and went to RA.
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That's why they lost one question and can you think
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of why a person would go from shoe to RA
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at that late at night? Answer? A body scan, probably
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pulled something and they kept them down there, put him
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through the X ray? Answer, And is there a way
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by looking at these you can see is there you said?
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Four pm? Answer? Yeah, that's four pm? Question is the
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person in R and D at four pm? Are you
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able to tell by this? Answer? Let me see you
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know the inmate that was down there? Or no? Question?
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I think redacted? Is that right? Answer? He was a
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whitsec dude. Question do you know anything about him? Answer? No,
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I don't, but yeah, that's what it looks like. It
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looks like they took a guy to shoe, put him
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in R and D, but instead of keeping in R
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and D, they keyed him in RA. Yeah, that's what
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it looks like. Question so at four pm? Was anything
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to do with redacted on that or anything to do
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with somebody in he gets cut off by the lieutenant?
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Well the four pm no, because no one is out
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from R and D. You've got one from eleven South,
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You've got no one from R and D. Question, but
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it also said that the ten pm right or I
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don't know which one I'm looking at right here. Answer, no,
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you have one out here. Yeah, but it looks like
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this inmate from ten o'clock they did the count at
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ten plus one, Yeah, plus one. It seemed like they
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got screwed up by something, either a moving this guy
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to R and D or whatever. I mean, the count
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slip shouldn't have accepted anyway. So in the nine south
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plus one, like, I don't know why that was written,
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that's what it looked like. The guy came from nine South,
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he went in the ra stayed there throughout the night.
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Whoever the inmate was question? And we have reason to
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believe that that is the case, that there's a guy
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that was in you know, he did stay there at
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the night and he had somebody on him. And that's
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one of the reasons why we want to talk to
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somebody that was in R and D to be able
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to verify, Hey, was that guy really there? And by
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looking at that, would you be able to tell us
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the individual we talked about? Answer redacted question who did
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the count slip? Answer it's based on the count slip.
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Question All right, does this tell you anything just before
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we move on? Answer, I mean, I don't know, Yeah,
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I don't know. I don't understand it. That's the only thing.
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I think they probably took him down there. Question is
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there a witch? From looking at these? What basic like
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count seem bad to you? Does this ten pm one
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seem like a bad count to you? The way what
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you just looked at when there's nothing on the EU
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one and on the count slip? Answer? If you were
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working that night and you got a count like that,
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is that good or a bad count? Answer? I would
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have said a bad count? Question? And who can you
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tell by looking at this who was the one who
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took the count? Answer? Uh? Redacted? Question? And was there
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any lieutenants involved with these? Answer? I mean there could
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have been, I'm not sure. Question, but by looking at this,
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I think probably the midnight one there was an actual obsolutenant.
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Are you able to tell that by looking I think
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the obsolutenant is the one who caught it at midnight?
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Are you able to tell that? Answer? Oh? This one here? Question? Yeah?
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Are you able to tell by looking at these? Are
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you able to tell me when the lieutenant actually took
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the count? Answer? It looks like she took the count redacted?
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Took the count at midnight? Question? All right? And it
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shows redacted on it. I'm looking at this upside down,
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so I can't even see it. Answer that's what it says.
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Question And this one, does it show any lieutenant was involved? Answer?
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No question, so it would just have been redacted. Answer yeah.
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All right, folks, we're gonna wrap up right here, and
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in the next episode dealing with the topic, we're gonna
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pick up where we left off. All the information that
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goes with this episode can be found in the description box.
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What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the
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Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're gonna dive right back
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in to the statement given to the OIG inspectors by
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the unnamed lieutenant. Question all right, and it shows redacted
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on it. I'm looking at it upside down, so I
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can't even see. Answer that's what it says. Yeah. Question.
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And on this one, does it show any lieutenant was involved? Answer? No, question,
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so it would have just been redacted. Answer yeah, question,
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all right? What about the four PM? Does it show
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the lieutenant's name on the four PM? Answer? No question.
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Do you have any idea what redacted's first name is? Answer?
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No question. But this does seem like a bad e
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one answer E one seems good, but he gets cut
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off even though that no one is listed on R
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and D. Answer. Yeah, that's what's confusing. Question because you
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say there's a count slip for he gets cut off
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by the lieutenant. This is at nine thirty three. Question
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wasn't that just one that was printed? Because the numbers
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are printed on that. I see what you're saying. So
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after nine thirty three, possibly something changed. Answer. So that
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could be two things. Either the marshall was trying to
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get one in before the count and they thought they
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had enough time to process them upstairs, and then when
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they call in the count it's wrong, like hold on,
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it's not it. Question. And that's what I mean by
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wouldn't this be incorrect if they get a count slip
18:11
that's not listed on the E one? Answer? Yeah, they
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got which one? Did they get? R and D? Yeah?
18:17
That would be a bad one question? All right? So
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for this, it seems like the ten pm on August
18:23
ninth was a bad E one And as far as
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the midnight, it seems like it's the count slip that's
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a bad slip. Is that correct? Whatever? That's indiscernible, I'm sorry.
18:33
So it seems like the E one is good at midnight,
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but the count slip is bad at midnight for ZA.
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And we're primarily asking you this stuff just because we've
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got to write a report about what we're finding and
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we don't want the sound. We don't want to sound
18:48
or want it to be wrong, you know what I mean? Answer? Yeah, yeah,
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So the count slip is wrong on this one question.
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So midnight count slip is wrong. E one seems right,
18:58
the E one at ten pm it seems wrong, but
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the count slip seems right at least for R and D.
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We have reason to believe that the count slip for
19:06
ZA is also wrong for ten pm, because well, it depends.
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I guess, like you said, what time the individual was
19:13
moved to R and D. We've been told that after
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you know, people or all move prior to this time,
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So if that person was in R and D, it
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would have been prior to the ten pm count. Does
19:25
that sound right to you? Answer? That's what I'm saying.
19:29
I mean, something could have happened and you know, taken
19:32
this guy downstairs question, and that's why we need to
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talk to people. So by looking at this, are you
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able to like figure out who we can talk to
19:41
to see if something happened at ten pm to change
19:44
this count? Answer? Did you see the log already? Question
19:50
the lieutenant's log? Answer? Yeah, Question do we have it? Yeah?
19:53
I have it? Answer anything with the log question? So yeah.
19:59
So here's the law from the day you were on.
20:01
That's the August it's August tenth, but you know it's
20:04
the August ninth log in there. Are you able to
20:06
tell by looking at that? And here's the day after?
20:09
So this is you've got the August ninth and the
20:12
August tenth. Answer okay, So we put someone in a
20:16
dry cell. Question dry cell is in the shoe, isn't it? Answer? Yeah,
20:21
if they're space. Okay, so it looks like they didn't
20:24
key the guy up he went to the dry cell
20:26
depending on what time? Question? Are you able to tell
20:30
by these lieutenants? I think you've got the actual lieutenant
20:33
log back there. I would assume that that's when it
20:35
would be documented when people are moved. Correct? Are you
20:39
able to tell by looking at that when someone you
20:41
know this person was moved to a dry cell? Answer? Eh?
20:46
Question Oh, and also if you've got that, are you
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able to tell by looking at that? When you worked
20:52
until no. Answer No, I wouldn't have done the log
20:56
that day from activities. Question yeah, I just didn't know
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if it was like mentioned when people, you know, OPS
21:03
or activities started or stopped. Answer no, it doesn't say when.
21:09
It just says inmate redacted on dry cell. It doesn't
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say when he went through. Question there's no time associated
21:16
with the movement on there. Question should there have been? Answer?
21:20
I mean, that's good to put it in there. Yeah.
21:23
Question so you said you would have associated with the
21:26
lieutenant's log. Who does the lieutenant's log? Answer? Ops would
21:31
take care of it. Question ops would sew on your
21:35
shift it would have been redacted. Answer yeah, but redacted
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is already on dry cell on day watch, it says. Question.
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And that's where we get confused, and that's why we
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have reason to believe, because it seems like redacted was
21:48
put on day watch. Answer at three fifteen. Yeah. Question
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does it say three fifteen he was placed there? Answer yeah.
21:57
Question so that indicates to us the four ps and
22:00
that ten PM count were also both bad. He wasn't
22:04
in the shoe, Does that make sense to you? Answer?
22:07
I think he was. He wasn't in the shoe, but
22:10
he was still keyed in the shoe. Question he was
22:14
still keyed in the shoe, but he wasn't there. Answer yeah,
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question right, So for the e ones they would still
22:21
show it. The only way that people in control would
22:23
know if is if shoe actually did their account and
22:27
said we only got seventy two people in here, not
22:30
seventy three. Right, because people working in the shoe they know, Hey,
22:35
we only count bodies that are present. Answer, oh, hold on,
22:39
this is the ninth Okay, so he went to transfer
22:42
special housing Dry cell four pm. Question at four pm,
22:47
it says, answer on the ninth. This is done on
22:50
the night before. Okay, okay. Question can you and again
22:56
I promise you not agatcha. You're being extremely helpful. Can
23:00
you just note on there where you see things that
23:03
these different things are if you can tell me at
23:05
what time he was moved? Answer, well, this just looks
23:09
like the log is the same. Question we also have
23:12
reason to believe that people manipulated the log after the fact. Question. Yeah,
23:17
that's what I'm saying. Some things are indiscernible. Question do
23:22
you know anything about that? Well I mentioned that. Answer No,
23:25
I see shoe corrections redacted Dry Cell ra Saturday. Yeah, so,
23:30
I mean that's pretty much whatever. I think that the
23:33
dial was still keyed in the shoe question. But as
23:37
far as are you able to did you say that
23:40
you saw something in there that said either three point
23:43
fifteen or then you said four after that? Where are
23:46
you seeing that? Answer? No, it looks like they're saying
23:52
that the guy was transferred back to shoe. But this
23:55
also says that I was I was relieved redacted as
23:58
daywatch ops. Question it says you were leaved redacted as
24:03
day watch ops. Answer yeah, question instead of redacted I
24:06
mean redacted answer yeah. Question is that wrong? Answer? Uh? Huh? Question?
24:12
Or was it that twenty five potential you was redacted?
24:15
Was late and you relieved her? Answer? I don't know.
24:18
I'm not sure. Question would that be like a possibility?
24:23
Like can they do that even if your activity is
24:26
lieutenant and she wants to leave and you're there and
24:29
redacted who is the ops lieutenant? Wasn't Can they say
24:32
that you relieved her even though you're you were activity
24:35
as lieutenant? Answer? Hmmm? Question or is she not supposed
24:40
to write that or not supposed to be in there?
24:43
So who wrote that? Answer? Oh? I don't know, it
24:46
could be that's the thing. It could be. It's like
24:49
from a day prior. So if you don't catch it,
24:52
you just got to keep going and doing it the same.
24:55
So it's like, because I'm OPS, I know I'm OPS.
24:58
What I'm saying, So I'm came in on doing overtime
25:01
that day, so normally I would relieve her. So she
25:05
probably left it that way anyway, thinking Okay, it's the same.
25:08
You're not changing that, you know. Question Oh, you mean
25:12
the day before you were OPS? Is that what you
25:14
were saying? Answer? Yeah, I think I was OPS that
25:17
whole quarter though, I think so. Yeah. Question so you
25:21
were that whole quarter you were OPS? Answer overtime. Question
25:26
so overtime was a different duty. Answer yeah, Question so
25:30
you were the obsolute tenant up until that day you
25:32
were activities lieutenant that day though, Answer yeah, I think so.
25:36
Question so, being that you were OPS, you were also
25:39
potentially acting as like the obsolutenant. Answer uh huh. Question
25:44
like as in, like, since that were your normal duties,
25:48
would have you also taken that on? Like, Hey, I know,
25:51
am activities, but I'll do the OPS role. And this
25:54
is again just to try to help you recollect what
25:58
you were doing. Answer? I think I was OPS that
26:01
quarter though. Question Okay, answer, yeah, I was OPS. Question again,
26:07
we don't have your records. There was no reason for
26:09
us to be grabbing your records or anything like that.
26:12
So everything we're asking you about is simply to help
26:14
us fill in the blanks. So based on what you said,
26:17
you think that it's the log is from a previous date.
26:21
It was just despite edit that wasn't caught onto. Answer. Yeah,
26:25
the dry cell stuff. I don't know about all that,
26:28
but that's what it looks like. It looked like the
26:30
guy was in there and they didn't key him out
26:33
even though he was R and D. Question. So let's
26:39
say if I'm in the shoe and I wanted to
26:41
move somebody, or you wanted to move somebody in the shoe,
26:44
you're going to do you key it in? Or do
26:46
you call it in to somebody and tell them, hey,
26:48
key it in? Who keys it in? Answer? You can
26:52
do it yourself if you want to. You can do
26:56
it by yourself. Question. And let's say you move it
26:59
is some one's supposed to be notified. Hey listen, this
27:02
person is moved or you the shoe. CEOs can move
27:06
the inmates by themselves. Answer someone from a different unit
27:10
question yeah, like control or R and D answer, no,
27:14
you tell you call control? Question is a policy that
27:18
control must be notified? Answer? I don't know if it's policy,
27:22
but I mean they take an account. It's good to know, Hey,
27:26
this is what's going on. Got to move this guy
27:28
down to the drive cell. Question and let's say sorry,
27:32
go ahead. The other investigator jumps in. I was going
27:36
to say, I guess are you asking, like who is
27:39
responsible for doing the keying? Answer? It could be CNA
27:44
question what's CNA? Answer? Control number two? Question? Okay, but
27:48
control would be responsible for him. It's not OPS or
27:52
the shoe that would have been responsible for indiscernible. It's
27:55
control that's responsible for answer. I mean the shoe could
28:01
make that change though. Question The shoe could answer. Yeah.
28:06
Question it's not an OPTS for responsibility or activity answer.
28:10
I mean, if they say, hey, I need this guy
28:12
in a dry cell, you know, okay, you notify them,
28:15
you know, hey move them? Question Okay. I guess though
28:18
what we're saying is like under the regular practice, I
28:21
understand that other some people have the ability to do it,
28:24
but who should have done it. Answer should have moved
28:28
keyed the inmate from shoe to r and D question Yeah,
28:32
answer a CNA control question Control should have answer number two? Yeah.
28:38
Question And how should they have been notified that they
28:41
needed to make that change? Who should have notified them
28:44
that that change needed to be made? Answer? I mean,
28:48
shoe could have called a head. This guy's keyed up here,
28:51
he's keyed down there. Question So, I guess what I'm
28:54
saying is like, once an inmate is moved and control
28:57
needs to be notified, Hey, this guy was in shoe,
29:00
now in RNA. Who needs to notify control to make
29:03
those changes in the system. Answer the shoe, Hey this
29:08
guy is down there. Question so the shoe answer they'll
29:12
call control. Yeah. Question Okay, So whenever, let's say, for instance,
29:16
we believe redacted was move from the shoe to RNA
29:20
on dry cell, the shoe should have contacted control and
29:23
say we just made this movement, he needs to be rikeyed.
29:26
Answer yeah. Question all right, that's the way it works.
29:30
Answer yeah. Question, and again these are just questions we
29:33
don't know. Answer it could have been that, or the
29:37
lieutenant could do it either or hey, I'm moving this
29:39
guy I'm moving them here. Question so, should have a
29:44
lieutenant been involved in that? Answer? Not necessarily? Question Okay,
29:49
and that's why we're just trying to figure out what
29:51
is the standard operating procedure, Like what is typically what's
29:55
supposed to happen? Answer, I mean there's no typical you
29:59
get it done. Hey I'm telling you to move him,
30:01
or I say I'm moving this guy. The lieutenant told
30:03
me to move him, and yeah, question I guess. But
30:07
if anybody can do it and no one is told
30:10
to do it, I guess I would assume that would
30:13
be quite frequently not be done because everyone would be like, well,
30:16
he could have done it, he should have done it.
30:19
I'm saying, like, who is actually supposed to do it?
30:21
Who is supposed to take the lead of make sure
30:25
that that's done, or we just move this guy control,
30:27
you know, like key that out, Like how is that
30:30
supposed to be done? Because otherwise it's always going to
30:33
fall apart because then everyone is going to say, well,
30:35
that person could have done it, that person could have
30:38
done it. Answer yeah, question so is there anybody that's
30:42
supposed to do it? Answer to notify question Yeah, to
30:46
make sure the notification to the numbers can be changed
30:49
on the E one Answer yeah, I would say the
30:52
shoe staff. Question shoe staff answer. They kind of say, hey,
30:57
this guy is not up there. Check to see where
31:01
question all right? Answer maybe keemtr and D. Question Sorry,
31:06
I didn't mean to he gets cut off. No, No,
31:08
that's exactly what I was thinking or trying to get to.
31:11
You said the shoe staff could also key it in.
31:14
If they keyed it in, would this E one document
31:16
get updated or would Control have to update it? Answer?
31:20
Control updated? Question so no matter even if the shoe
31:24
staff decided if they wanted to update it, Control manually
31:27
has to update the document specifically. Answer yeah, put a
31:31
number on it, because this is the last one that
31:33
was printed, and then you make a change after that,
31:37
it's not going to show. Question Okay, this was answer
31:42
nine thirty. Question nine thirty. But let's see the four
31:46
pm count. I just want to see what time that
31:48
was printed. Answer three forty. And according to that, the
31:54
inmate was supposed to be moved at three fifteen. Answer again,
31:57
no question the daily log. Answer, Well, you said two
32:01
different I was going back to that. You said one
32:03
time you said three fifteen and the other time you
32:06
said four pm, are you able to tell? Question? Yeah,
32:11
it looks like okay, so let's start with this. This
32:13
is the ninth right answer, yeah. Question so you got
32:16
nobody starting the shift on dry cell. So this is
32:19
three fifteen. Inmate redacted placed on dry cell from shoe.
32:25
Question can you just put a star next to that?
32:27
All right? So then you believe that this is where
32:29
things got screwed up. They never keeped him out. Answer yeah,
32:33
Inmate redacted placed on dry cell seventy five and shoe,
32:36
I do believe redacted, all right? So at nine on
32:39
August ninth, Friday, he goes in at three fifteen in
32:42
dry cell and he stays in there overnight. So the
32:45
four pm count, he's still keyed in there though, right. Question. Well,
32:50
that's what we're trying to figure out because it's not
32:53
caught until so we believe from people that we talked
32:55
to it was caught at midnight, and that person who
32:58
caught it said like, this person is on dry cell,
33:02
and then revise the numbers and the count. Now we're
33:05
trying to determine were the counts ever conducted in the shoe.
33:09
It doesn't appear to us that they would have been
33:12
because they would have caught that at four pm and
33:14
the ten PM they would have said, this is the
33:17
number of people we physically have present, and even at
33:20
midnight it still says seventy three and it's changed seventy two.
33:24
And to us, it suggests and everyone else that we're
33:27
talking to that we haven't shared this information with many people.
33:30
You're one of the very select few that we're even
33:32
showing this to. But the people that we've showed it
33:36
to before says, Hey, the fact that they're reporting seventy
33:39
three and the actual count is seventy two, they're basically
33:42
getting the number from this and just writing that down.
33:45
They're not actually conducting the counts. Would you agree with
33:47
that statement? Answer? They could do that, or they could
33:51
actually be counting but not counting, making sure that they're
33:54
just walking and making sure they're alive. Question so doing
33:58
more of a round than account Answer yeah, question, and
34:02
that is also one of the things that we believe happened,
34:04
is that at least on one of the instances, they
34:07
did not do the round, but they didn't do an
34:09
actual count. Answer yeah, because honestly, I don't see it
34:14
on this end at four and a ten question you
34:17
don't see what answer the missing of four and ten
34:21
question Yeah, and the fact that they missed both seems
34:25
very unlikely. Answer yeah, question if they are actually counting
34:29
correct answer yeah, question, and that's why we believe. And
34:32
it sounds like you agree they didn't actually do the four,
34:35
the ten or the midnight count. Answer No, I mean,
34:39
I'm thinking they did to the four and the ten.
34:43
Question even though the numbers are wrong. Answer yeah, they
34:46
probably just went off the numbers. Question so you think
34:49
they conducted a round not account answer yeah or something.
34:53
Question I mean, because they can't miss the number if
34:56
they're actually counting numbers both at four or not all,
35:00
but both at four and ten and at midnight, all
35:03
of the count slips are wrong. Answer yeah, but that's
35:06
when that those indiscernible to plus one, it's like they
35:09
know they got someone. But then it's like like maybe
35:13
they was told he gets cut off by the investigator,
35:16
but they're still using the seventy three plus one. It
35:18
should be seventy two plus one if they're doing that.
35:21
Answer yeah, yeah. Question unless it was seventy three minus one,
35:25
then they could do it, But seventy three plus one
35:28
seems to indicate that they're using the number that's provided
35:31
on the E one and saying we got you know,
35:33
one more down there. Answer, yeah, I don't know what
35:38
was going on with that. That's baffling. All right, we're
35:41
gonna wrap up right there, and in the next episode
35:44
dealing with the topic, we're gonna pick up where we
35:45
left off. All the information that goes with this episode
35:49
can be found in the description box. What's up, everyone,
35:52
and welcome to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In
35:56
this episode, we're gonna pick back up where we left
35:58
off with the unnamed lou Tenant and his interview with
36:01
the OIG investigators. Question all right, to your knowledge if
36:06
they're doing the count though, that's all on the shoe,
36:09
the people that are in there right now, nothing to
36:11
do with lieutenants. Answer no question, Okay, there is no
36:15
way for like anyone else other than the people in
36:18
the shoe. Or let me ask it a different way.
36:21
Is there any way for anyone other than the shoe
36:24
to know that they're not doing the counts? Answer no question, No, okay,
36:28
anything that you didn't initial, just again to say that
36:32
we showed it to you. Answer, so what does this
36:35
pertain to Thomas and Owel question, Well, it's everybody, you know,
36:40
because everybody that's in the shoe, right, we've got to
36:43
talk to them, Hey, did you conduct these counts or
36:46
these you know? Because this just brought to light the
36:48
fact that it doesn't appear that the counts were ever
36:51
being conducted. So we've got to That's why we've got
36:54
to talk to the people that we want to talk
36:56
to first, people like yourself that were lieutenants on Hey,
37:01
do you know anything about this? Did you do? You know? Answer?
37:06
I mean, there wasn't counting questioned, Yeah, I know, but
37:10
I mean just letting you know, like, oh, yeah, First
37:13
we want to talk to you know about the cell mate. Hey,
37:16
did you know anything about this? Did you It looks
37:18
like from the way that this memo reads, we assume
37:21
that either you or redacted toll redacted, Hey, he's WAB.
37:25
Make sure he gets a cell mate, because that's one
37:28
of the reasons why we want to talk. He gets
37:31
cut off by the lieutenant based on that memo question, Yeah,
37:35
because like the fact he's saying, I knew I knew
37:38
he was going WAB and I told him, Hey, make
37:41
sure he gets to have a cell mate. So the
37:43
assumption that we were going off of is that either
37:46
you and or redacted spoke to redacted and said he's
37:51
going wab make sure he gets a cell mate. But
37:54
it sounds like what you're saying is you don't You
37:56
didn't even know and you never had that conversation answer
38:00
with redacted and everything. No, I don't even know. I
38:03
never knew the dude until that thing came out. You
38:06
know what I mean, he would be would have been notified.
38:09
Question right answer, But again, I mean we do get notified,
38:13
but usually R and D calls us up. Hey, those
38:16
two guys ain't coming back. Question, and is it your
38:19
belief all right? If you said you didn't speak with him,
38:24
so probably he was notified directly from Control or R
38:27
and D. Answer, I would say probably R and D. Question,
38:31
So R and D wouldn't call control, and Control wouldn't
38:34
call him. R and D would call directly to the shoe. Answer.
38:38
That's how we used to do it. Question, Okay, And
38:40
that's how it would always be. So when you were
38:43
in the shoe, R and D would call you directly. Answer.
38:47
But again that's evening watch. Again, that's on evening Watch.
38:51
That's guys not coming back. Question. But at one fifty,
38:55
that's early and that's when it's notified. All right, So
38:58
if he doesn't have WAB listed on his name on
39:01
the court list that morning, and that's what people have
39:04
told us, So we're going on the assumption that and
39:07
this is an assumption that he was somebody was contacted
39:10
in the shoe saying, hey, it looks like he's not
39:12
coming back. He did, right, possibly, but that's the first
39:16
that we're seeing WAB. So the thought is that someone
39:20
contacted or tacted. We haven't. We've got to talk to him.
39:24
But like I said, hey, it doesn't look like he's
39:27
coming back. You know, we're just notifying you now. And
39:30
again we were told typically the way it works, and
39:33
it sounds like you're correcting us, R and D typically
39:36
calls control, control, calls ops, ops, calls the shoe. Is
39:40
that correct? Answer? What when an inmate doesn't come back? Question? Yeah? Answer,
39:46
no question, No, it doesn't work that way. So R
39:49
and D you're saying, typically just would go straight to shoe. Answer,
39:54
that's a heads up, that's a courtesy question. Right answer, Hey,
39:59
this eyes not coming back? Control nos, control NOS. They
40:03
call control too. But usually they call in you know,
40:06
why would you call me? You know you and the
40:09
shoe question, that's just what we were told. Answer, hey,
40:14
this guy's not coming back. Question. And then again, we're
40:18
only as good as the people who we talk to.
40:20
Whatever information we get is like people like yourself trying
40:23
to like, hey, I know, it's probably like yourself. It
40:26
sounds like, at least in the beginning of this thing,
40:28
you seem pretty nervous to talk to us because we're
40:31
really just trying to He gets caught off by the lieutenant. No. No,
40:35
The thing about it, The thing is, I know this,
40:37
this is a high profile case. People look into, point fingers,
40:41
blame someone who dropped the ball, who did this? And
40:44
that question I totally get it. Answer. I mean, two
40:48
years later now it's still like, okay, let's go down
40:51
and see question and the reason why. I'm sure you
40:54
saw on the papers what happened recently? Answer yeah, question, Well,
40:58
that now allows us to try and back and try
41:01
to figure out all. Right, now we can do He
41:03
gets cut off by the lieutenant. Yeah, but you're going
41:06
to go after a whole shift, you know. Question, It's
41:10
not necessarily go after the whole shift. But we've got
41:13
to figure out what went wrong at the MCC and
41:15
what needs to be fixed. Do you know what I'm saying?
41:18
But I get it, trust me. He gets cut off
41:21
by the lieutenant just to deal they have suicides, man
41:25
like they do. Question. Yeah, yeah, totally answer. He just
41:30
happened to be a high profile one question, right, and
41:33
because it's so high profile and the fact that we
41:35
were he gets cut off by the lieutenant. The other
41:38
things with yeah, yeah, I know. Question, All those other
41:42
things are going on now. It looks like there was
41:44
some false you know, slips that were created. Answer. Yeah, question,
41:50
they weren't doing counts. You know, we're getting these signs
41:52
saying that, hey, you're supposed to check on them. Every
41:56
gets cut off by the lieutenant. Yeah, it's not normal,
42:00
definitely question Yeah. So yeah, and you're right, it's because
42:04
it's a high profile gets cut off by the lieutenant.
42:07
I was there for ten years. I used to do
42:09
that stuff and all that. That's not normal. Question. What's
42:13
not normal? Answer? Miscounts and all that. Yeah. Question, And
42:17
so you're saying that this seems to be abnormal. Answer,
42:20
It's definitely abnormal. Question When you were in the shoe.
42:24
Did you ever were you ever did you ever experience
42:26
people not doing counts? Answer? No question. People always did
42:31
counts when you were there. Answer yeah, but here question
42:35
and that's you know, that's what people that's what the
42:38
conspiracy theorist come in and all that kind of stuff
42:41
like wow, this one day, and that's where we've got to.
42:45
All right, well, let's figure out what actually happened. Is
42:48
this abnormal or is it normal? You're saying that this
42:51
seems to be very abnormal day. Answer. I'm talking about
42:55
that's why the counts and the slips and the rounds
42:57
and the falsifying stuff like that, but everything else. I mean,
43:00
this place is a busy place. Question. Yeah. Answer. You know,
43:04
they lose inmates, go out wab all the time new
43:07
inmates come in, so this is a revolving door. Question.
43:11
All right, I know we're talking a lot longer than
43:13
we thought. Let me just go through a lot of
43:15
these things. Now, just back to the round sheet. Where
43:19
what is the purpose of a supervisor actually signing this
43:22
round sheet? Answer? Making sure that the officer is following
43:26
and doing their rounds how they're supposed to be. Question
43:30
And we don't really need to look at it, all right,
43:33
So it's not to verify that they were done, it's
43:36
to verify that the sheets are being kept up. Question.
43:39
So if I go up there and I see the
43:41
times you all made a round after forty minutes, what
43:44
happened there? Question? So you ask them about that? Answer right, question,
43:51
But on this date you can't. You don't remember going
43:54
and speaking to them. Answer I said I could have went,
43:57
I don't recall. Question Okay, and again just going forward,
44:01
know that these are just simply questions to see what
44:04
we can find out about that day and as well
44:06
as you know, the point being you saying that this
44:09
is such an abnormal day and it was such a
44:11
big event that's been in the news now for two years,
44:15
just try and really place yourself. What was your role
44:17
on that day? Answer? Yeah, Like I said, I just
44:22
know I worked and that was it. Question all right?
44:24
And as far as you know, we're rounds being conducted
44:27
in the shoe at that time. Answer, yeah, it's day watch.
44:30
You've got to make your rounds. Question on day watch.
44:33
You've got to answer. There's no way you can avoid
44:36
around on day watch. Question what about for and I'm
44:40
not talking about just your shift. I'm saying the Shoe
44:43
in general. Are you aware that rounds weren't being conducted
44:46
on the evening watch or a morning watch? Answer weren't.
44:50
Question Yeah, we're not. Answer evening watch. You've got to
44:54
make rounds too. I worked at the Shoe for years.
44:57
You have to You've got to go. Question So, so
45:00
when when you were there they were being conducted? Answer? Yeah,
45:04
that's what I'm saying. The whole mess of the count thing.
45:07
I'm like, I don't know. Question any of those people
45:11
that we discussed that were on the day watch and
45:14
you know, anybody working in the Shoe on August ninth
45:16
and tenth, do you have any recollection of speaking with
45:19
any of those people about morning watch or I mean
45:23
not morning watch, about speaking with about rounds or counts?
45:26
Answer no, question no. And now, being that you were
45:29
an OPS the opsolueutenant, it sounds like your quarterly post.
45:34
Would that be something that you would visit with them
45:36
and just say, hey, guys, make sure what you're doing
45:39
and that you're doing your rounds or anything like that.
45:42
Would that be a duty or responsibility of an obsoleutenant Answer, Yeah,
45:46
but not, It's not really my responsibility. It's the shoe lieutenant.
45:51
Question yeah, yeah. Did you have any conversations with the
45:54
shoe lieutenant at that time? Answer? Yeah, I talked to
45:58
the shoe lieutenant redacted. Yeah. Question yeah yeah. Answer, Oh no,
46:05
you said it was redacted? Right question right answer? Yeah.
46:10
Question do you remember talking to him at all about
46:12
Epstein or redacted? Answer? I ain't seen him since that day?
46:17
Question prior. What I'm asking about is up until Longust tenth?
46:21
Answer no. Question. Do you remember ever conversing with redacted
46:26
about making sure you're going to do these rounds and
46:29
that Epstein's being you know, looked at, or he's got
46:31
a cell mate or anything like that. Answer, Man, I
46:35
don't recall that question No answer, Yeah, but we all
46:40
know it's you. You got the email. Question right, the
46:44
email saying he needs a cell mate? Answer yeah, and
46:47
all the lieutenants know. They say, oh, such and such,
46:50
we got the email. He was off a watch, you know.
46:53
Question do you think it's acceptable for any lieutenant to
46:56
say that they didn't know that Epstein needed a sell mate? Answer?
47:00
Some people say they didn't know the cellmate left. Question No.
47:05
If they're saying that, let's just talk about the people
47:07
on that day. Let's talk about, like, for instance, somebody
47:11
that maybe wasn't normally a lieutenant. Can you redacted? Question
47:15
all right, so she's in you said, basically, she's in training.
47:19
She is like an acting lieutenant. She's the person he
47:23
gets cut off by the lieutenant. I don't think she
47:25
was acting that day either, though. Question Well, I just
47:27
mean that she was activity as lieutenant. Answer yeah, yeah,
47:33
question sorry, she was the activity as lieutenant and she
47:36
was either training or she's typically an SOS at the time. Though,
47:41
Should she have known by Epstein being on the hot
47:43
list in Epstein, you know, coming off suicide Watch, should
47:47
she have just known that he was required to have
47:49
a cellmate? Answer no, question no, what about redacted? Should
47:54
he have known? Answer? I mean that's only if you're aware, though,
47:59
if I'm not aware where the guy left? Question I
48:01
thought you said if you're First of all, I thought
48:04
you said that everybody knows that in the shoe you're
48:06
supposed to have a cell mate unless you're a certain classification.
48:10
Answer yeah, but sometimes it be an odd number and
48:13
they can't have one. Question But then the second thing
48:18
would be that he's on the hot list. Everybody knows
48:21
that if you're on the hot list, you're supposed to
48:23
have a cell mate right answer, yeah, question. And then
48:26
the third thing would be that there's an actual email
48:29
that was sent out and that said he's supposed to
48:31
have a cell mate answer right question. So that's where
48:36
with all that in mind, and I'm not pointing to
48:38
one person out in particular, what I'm just asking is
48:42
these people that were working, So you're not like throwing
48:45
somebody under the bus. I'm just asking like, as far
48:49
as these people go, should redact it have known that
48:51
there should have been redacted. And I'm not saying that
48:54
he knew. These people may very well not have known
48:57
what was going on. I'm just asking like, in general
48:59
what their positions. Answer in general, Well, I probably redacted
49:05
never got the email. Question like you're saying you knew,
49:09
so yes, he knew. Should redacted have known? Answer? I
49:12
think all lieutenants should have known. Question what about he
49:16
gets cut off by the lieutenant, But then again we
49:19
all have If you're not aware to the inmate leaving,
49:21
there's no reason to follow up question. And that's why
49:25
I started after you. So at this point you said,
49:28
at least by eight people should have known that he's
49:31
not coming back. So that's where I'm going off of.
49:34
All right, there's three lieutenants from that point after you leave,
49:37
there's three lieutenants. Right, there's redacted, redacted, and redacted. And
49:42
then the next morning redacted lane should redacted who replaced you?
49:46
Should she have known that he needed a cellmate? Answer?
49:49
I could see her not knowing question? And is that
49:51
because she wasn't a lieutenant? Answer? Not a lieutenant question? Okay,
49:56
what about redacted answer? He's not a lieutenant question? Should
50:00
he have known? Answer? Yeah? Or new? Like I said,
50:05
we all knew because we got the email. Question? And
50:10
then what about redacted lane? Not only the email though
50:13
it sounds like there was at least three checks. One
50:16
he's in the shoe, should have a cell mate. Two,
50:19
he came off of Suicide Watch, should have a cell mate.
50:22
Three an email was sent out to all the lieutenants.
50:25
Should have a cell mate? Answer? Yeah, But two and
50:30
three happens all the time though, Like the guy comes
50:32
off suicide Watch, you put him in shoe with the
50:34
cell mate. And then again that's not forever question, but
50:39
in this case, you know July thirtieth to August ninth,
50:42
or tenth. Answer, but is it said? I don't think
50:45
that's up to psychology, because we have other guys on
50:48
suicide watch same thing. Once they leave, they didn't commit suicide,
50:52
and it's nothing. Question. So if you get this email
50:56
then on July thirtieth saying make sure that he's got
50:58
a cell mate? Answer there's no time on it. Question
51:02
in your mind? Is that well two weeks from now,
51:04
he doesn't need one anymore. Answer there's no set time,
51:08
it's just immediately. This guy's coming off a guy maybe
51:11
got kicked out of the unit. Question Okay, so in
51:14
this case, all right, how should it have been? What
51:17
kind of notification should have been made? Then? Answer? This
51:20
is a tough one. But if he's a guy and
51:22
he goes to court, then he leaves, you know, and
51:25
you're doing your daily operation. There's so much going on, Epstein,
51:29
ain't you know? I know he's a high profile to
51:31
the outside. Question but I mean he's still on the
51:35
hot list. Answer yeah, question so he's on the hot
51:38
list still, So doesn't that indicate that he needs a
51:41
cell mate if he's still on the hot list? Answer? Yeah,
51:44
But he had one question, right, and that's what I'm saying,
51:48
by we're knocking you and we're knocking redacted out of
51:51
this thing because you're saying eight o'clock. So now let's
51:54
look at eight o'clock on. Let's say even for this instance,
51:57
let's say even redacted and redact did they didn't know?
52:01
Now look at redacted lane. Certainly by midnight you should
52:05
have known. Right answer Yeah, But not a lieutenant though
52:09
question no answer, Like if the information is told to me,
52:13
he gets cut off by the investigator. But if they're
52:17
coming in and saying, you said that they needed to
52:19
do around right for the case, or needed to do
52:23
around in the shoe, correct, check on all the inmates? Answer?
52:27
Check inmates feeding or officers making sure they're doing the rounds,
52:31
or go to the shoe. Question redacted Lane, was she
52:36
required to check on all the inmates and do around?
52:39
Answer when she was probably doing around? Yeah? Question all right,
52:45
So as far as her by that point, now we've
52:47
only got you know where Now you know, let's say
52:50
that she's the one that corrected, you know, the count's slip.
52:54
She caught that, she goes, she visited, she's supposed to
52:57
go to the shoe. She's supposed to actually visit all
53:00
the tears and do around. Answer. I mean our policy
53:03
is really to say you've got to do around in
53:05
the shoe. You know, so in the shoe, you in
53:07
the shoe. I don't know what she did. Question, And
53:10
that's where I was getting to before. I'm doing around
53:13
in the shoe for a lieutenant. Does that mean just
53:15
walking into the shoe and walking out or does that
53:18
intel actually doing something when you're in there? Answer? I
53:24
don't think there's no guidance on that question. So we've
53:28
talked to other people and they've told us when you
53:31
a lieutenant is actually required to walk in the tears
53:33
and conduct around, not to list it on the round sheet,
53:36
but like the people who list those rounds on the
53:39
round sheet, is that your understanding of what you're supposed
53:43
to do? Answer? I mean yeah, question, so is that
53:47
what she should have done? She should have walked the
53:49
line the tears and checked on the inmates. Answer yeah,
53:53
question by policy, I'm saying, answer by policy, you've got
53:57
to make around. Question and that the round is classified
54:01
as like around like the CEOs who are in the
54:03
shoe to do around. Answer I've got a double check
54:06
on that question. Okay, answer to tell you the truth
54:10
question and that's what's unsure. Answer, yeah, question, you're unclear, okay,
54:16
And that's where I'm trying to go because we've also
54:19
had less people, but some people have also said no,
54:22
around for a lieutenant and around for a CEO is different.
54:25
Around for a lieutenant is visiting the shoe and checking
54:28
in with the officers. We've had more people say no,
54:31
you need to go into the shoe, you need to
54:33
check with the officers, but you also need to walk
54:35
the tier. And I'm trying to get to like he
54:38
gets cut off by the lieutenant. It depends on the
54:41
lieutenant question and their interpretation. Answer yeah, like I said,
54:47
that's why I really don't. I'll have to check on
54:49
that part. Question okay, And what policy would that be
54:52
in where would it spell that out? Answer that would
54:55
be an inmate discipline, which is shoe, which also would
54:58
probably be in psychology questions, So it would probably be
55:02
psychology for the lieutenant that they need to do it.
55:05
Answer I know it's about thirty and everything question, but
55:08
it would also be like gets cut off, But for
55:10
lieutenants answer a question, it would also be like shoe
55:14
type answer Yeah, but I'm thinking it's more policies. Question. Well,
55:20
I got the shoe policy. I don't have the psychology. Answer.
55:25
It isn't in there. Question I don't know. I was
55:27
going to look answer. Yeah, let me see it might
55:30
be psychology is definitely the thirty minute rounds question. Again,
55:36
these aren't gotcha, these are genuine questions. But psychology you
55:40
think might have had Like lieutenants, he gets cut off
55:43
by the lieutenant. Well, they definitely with the thirty minutes.
55:47
He gets cut off now by the investigator. Yeah, I
55:49
mean the shoe policy clearly states that rounds need to
55:52
be conducted. I just haven't seen anything that said lieutenants
55:55
need to do it. And that's where I mean. You
55:57
can look through them if you want. Answer. Nah, I
56:00
think it's in there, And it may not be in there,
56:03
but it's definitely in there. All right, we're gonna wrap
56:06
up right here, and in the next episode dealing with
56:08
the topic, we're gonna pick up where we left off.
56:11
All the information that goes with this episode can be
56:13
found in the description box.