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Creating Systemic Change in DEI with Phyllis Reid-Jarvis · Authentic Living

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Welcome to authentic living with Roxanne, a place where we have as conversations about
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things that really matter in our lives.
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And now here's your host, Roxanne Derhodge.
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Everyone.
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It's Roxanne and Duraj.
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How are you today?
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So today, we have a special guest, a Phyllis Reid, who is going to come in and talk a little
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bit about creating change in today's, environment with beveracy, equity, and
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inclusion.
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And this obviously is a podcast that is coming in a in a timely way.
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As we've recently had the issues around, that's occurring in in, in Buffalo.
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So I'm gonna welcome on Phyllis.
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Hi, Phyllis.
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How are you today?
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Okay.
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I'm good.
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I have a mask police that's coming around, and she's already given me some slack here.
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So
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Okay.
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So let's do this.
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Alright.
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So, Phyllis, thanks so much for coming in today.
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So Phyllis, has been on on my pre recorded, podcast, but a couple of weeks ago, we'd be
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connected again, and she was so gracious in deciding to come on.
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So, her expertise is, how do we create change?
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The topic we're gonna talk about today in in the arena of diverse diversity and inclusion.
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So I'd like you to really kind of, I know this is a tough time.
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Like I've said, It's not that it's not been a tough time, but, where we are located here,
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Phyllis, for your information where I'm located about 15 minutes from Buffalo.
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So, I think it struck all of us, but I think regionally, it's also struck us even more here
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being that much closer to home.
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So our chat is is gonna be timely and I think might offer some perspective for many people
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that are looking for some guidance around, how to proceed at this time.
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So for us, tell us a little bit about you for others that have not to you before and we'll
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jump right in.
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So for some of the things that you're dealing with, not since Buffalo because we know this is
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an issue that's happening often.
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But sometimes in our backyard, it kinda makes us listen.
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So a welcome to the show.
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Great.
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Thank you so much for having me, and, it's an honor.
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And, as you said, there's just been so many things that's been happening globally, this
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one's so much closer.
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The closer they are, the the more they tend to kinda hit home a bit harder.
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So, Phyllisary Jarvis and, founder of ultimate potentials, and we're a business consultancy
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that actually works with other organizations.
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Particularly the the leaders to, build workplaces where people thrive, and we do this
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through leadership as well as using leadership as the foundation on which to build more
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diverse equitable and inclusive.
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Organizations.
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And, yeah, so that is sort of in a nutshell what we do as a business consultancy.
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And we've been doing this for the last 8 years.
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And it's just become more pronounced since 2020 that It's almost as if we've received global
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permission to talk about diversity and equity and the inclusion, but we've been doing it for
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a long time.
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So, yeah,
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So you've been doing this work for a very long time and, let's talk about the reality of what
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is and I often, you know, we've shared before that I'm from Trinidad, coming into North
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America with a I'm gonna see a bit of a different frame even though there was the
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colonial kind of, I'm gonna use the wood umbrella.
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I found there was a difference, that was heightened when came to North America and I was
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sixteen years old to go to university.
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And, you know, when I came here, it was the first time.
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Not not that I knew I wasn't different.
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For us to put in contacts, but it seemed like it was highlighted when I came to North
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America.
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Whereas in Trinidad, you know, my prime minister's Indian, my, you know, my dentists is
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african, a Caribbean descent, you know, my, you know, French parents or Chinese or whites or
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whatever.
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So I was always around a rainbow, which as a child, I just that was normative for me.
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And then I came to go to school in Mississauga.
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And then I was like, I'm different.
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And I'm like, oh, that was not that I hadn't thought about that before, but the context had
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changed for me.
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So I'm just wondering, you know, help me understand that that that space within North
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America or even within Europe, maybe compared to potentially what I may have been exposed to
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in the Caribbean.
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Yeah.
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That's a really great point that you've raised.
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And I should preface what I'm about to say that I actually came to learn.
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I am black.
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In North America because like you born and raised in Jamaica, my prime minister is a black
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person.
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My neighbors are black, and I see people of you know, Indian descent and so on around me.
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So I grew up in a rainbow society.
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And colonialism is just what it is.
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So what you experienced, what I experienced, I recall a time in in university where I was
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getting ready to apply for my internship, and we're, you know, we we need references and
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such.
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And I was a very good student.
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I thought I would ask this particular professor, if she would consider standing as a
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referee for me.
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And I might have shared this story before, of so forgive me, but it's it's a story I believe
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that is very relevant to the topic at at hand.
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And I, you know, she's a hard marker.
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We that's how we kind of dubbed her.
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But I didn't know she was also someone who had deep rooted, I guess, believes or ideas about
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who should be let in and who should not be let in to higher learning and opportunities and
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such And so I had booked an appointment with her.
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She and I were in her office, and I asked if she would consider standing as a referee.
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I'm getting ready to apply for this.
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Internship position.
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And she said to me, sure.
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I don't think you'd like what I have to say for.
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I was surprised.
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I said, oh, what do you mean?
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Very innocently, and I'm thinking more to be young.
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You know, I thought I was too young to be considering going into that program.
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And she did this.
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Right?
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It took me a few seconds because like you, Roxanne, I not raised a culture where I know
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I'm a person of African descent, and I have dark skinned black skin tone if you want to
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call it, but we are not raised with political, I guess, nuances and explicit I guess,
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challenges of being black because blacks is a political statement.
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It's not some of an ancestry.
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It's not some parity the political statement has been, and I was taken aback naturally.
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So, yeah, coming to inspect that.
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Situation.
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And then?
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So it seems like, we've lost Phyllis there for a little bit.
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And I here we go.
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Here she's she's back again, and this is the this is what happens on the extremes.
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We just lost you for a second there, Phyllis.
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Yes.
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I saw that.
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But nonetheless, we those were dominantly located.
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Typically, white, folks in this world, white people There are still a few.
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There's some of them who are reluctant to recognize that people who are African descent,
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Asian descent, indigenous peoples, persons with disabilities, persons who belong to
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lgbtqwestplus, the society's communities group that we also belong And it's not all who don't,
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but there's a good enough majority.
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And so that professor of mine was an example of someone who was blocked in the advancement of a
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student like myself, but I'm sure that it wasn't I wasn't the first them that that
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happened.
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And so the shooting Buffalo is just another example of the far reaches of colonization and
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how it distorts people's thinking, and stories are told to all of us, those who are dominantly
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located based on marginalized and racialized stories are told.
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And these stories are told and maintained because they're what's needed to keep the
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system of colonialism going.
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I'm happy to say, though, that there's so many of indigenous peoples working together to tell
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new stories, different stories to build new bridges and maintain those bridges that are
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based on diversity, equity, inclusion, recognizing and seeing the value that each of
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us really has to bring to this world because the world is the way it is because we are all
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in it.
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So
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and I I think, you know, I know there has been a lot of strides, but clearly, like when I when
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I read about a bit about the background of the young man from Buffalo.
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It was a political underpinnings in the US around this, neofascism that he talked you
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know, that the belief that in the concept of replacement theory, which I I had not known
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much about that it was imbued in, that he this young man had driven, I guess, hours.
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He's he's not from Buffalo.
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To locate an area, which is it's just very hard to understand because you you're you're
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disheartening to believe and I've been, like I said, I'm 15 minutes from the bridge, right?
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I go to I go to tops.
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I've been to that tops.
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So it it hit home.
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It's it's home that that could happen, but the fact that that the indoctrination of this young
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man is the scary part that when I read the concept of, you know, you know, the replacement
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theory about getting rid of certain ethnic groups, in order for, the Neo Nazi or fascism
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concept to exist.
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So those are the those are the big and the underpinnings that I would think that your work
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is is trying to get at in in having people understand the frame but what I can say is and
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I I think about since this has happened yet again, that a lot of people are they're scared
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to talk about the reality of what's happening.
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So that's what I wanna talk to you about because, you know, my world, you know, my
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friends and and a lot of people that I love dearly are Canadians and white, but there's
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always that tenuousness when something like this happens because people feel afraid to have
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conversations with someone that is, diverse for fear that they're gonna say the wrong thing.
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So My question becomes based in the state, you know, not that this isn't happening all the
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time.
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How can people deal with first of all, there's a lot of anger out there that this has actually
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happened in 2022 yet again.
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But how do I start to broach the subject without people feeling, scared to see the wrong
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thing to someone, that is diverse?
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Mhmm.
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Great question.
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So the work that we do in the area of diversity, equity, inclusion, we actually
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create tools that are very specific for how to talk about messy stuff.
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So we call these things messy stuff.
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They're messy and uncomfortable stuff.
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We these tools, we show folks how to use the tools.
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So for example, we have a series of cards, and they're actually built on, yeah, one of our
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tools is ADCA.
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That's the acronym, AADCA.
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The first day is assumption.
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So there it's adequate questions, checking our assumptions.
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So when we are working with groups.
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And just last week, I was in Montreal.
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We did several days worth of training on how to use these tools to talk about these very messy
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things.
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The organization that we were working are working with.
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They they invited us.
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Sorry.
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I mean, a space that's not mine.
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They invited us to help them become more anti oppressive and anti racist.
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And so these are just some of the strategies that were one of the main strategies.
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So to your questions, how do we broach these topics?
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How do we talk about these messy stuff?
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First and foremost, we need collectively to recognize that there is a problem.
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If we don't see that there's a problem, white Asians, Africans, Indigenous peoples, LGBTQ to
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us, everything's one who is either dominantly located for marginalized and racialized.
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We must agree that there's a problem.
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When we recognize that there's a problem, we need to now say, well, how do we address this?
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So the tool of outcomes helps people to check their assumptions.
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I would say, so what are some assumptions you have about marginalize, racialize people.
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So typically, there are about 4 different, 5 different groups of people who are on the other
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side, and then you have the other sites that's typically dominantly located.
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So white skin people are on one side and then everyone else is on the other.
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Size.
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So check your assumptions.
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So as a white person, what assumptions do you hold about any of these groups.
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Where did that assumption come from?
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How did you come to see folks in those other groups and so on that way.
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So when we can actually learn to be honest with ourselves first, then it takes us to the next
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step.
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Which is creating awareness.
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Oh my goodness.
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I don't even know anyone who is member, you know, who's, say, sexually diverse or I don't
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know any indigenous person who I can say I've worked with them closely, and and I've gotten
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to kinda know them, or they might say, sure.
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I know folks, but, it's a very superficial knowing because there's an indigenous person
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who works beside me at work or there is someone who has openly say I'm a trans person or right,
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but that's not knowing people.
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And so we create awareness by checking the baseline assumptions that we have and looking
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at ways in which we now might be perpetuating the very system that we are so uncomfortable
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about.
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From awareness, we need to move into discovering solutions.
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And we've seen some ways in which, solutions are put forward.
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One of which is looking at org your organization, we do an organizational analysis.
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We look at the the language, even your when you're looking at hiring practices, this we
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look at What how how is your job description written?
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Is it written through an anti oppression, anti racism, lens?
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Is it written using some of the tenets and principles of intersectionality?
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So you look at someone like me, people see a black woman that's the color of my skin.
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And they don't know my history.
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They don't know my heritage.
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They don't know the richness.
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Of the community that I have behind me, nor do they know how I contribute my community in ways
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that actually save people's lives, keep families together, and so on, but they just see
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the color of my skin.
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So if we're looking at discovering solutions, when we hire, for example, we need to take
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intersectionality into consideration recognizing that each person has their own
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unique way of experiencing repression their own unique way of experiencing discrimination.
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Those are realities.
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So a white person will have their own unique way of experiencing the challenges of finding a
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job depending on where they're located, socioeconomically, and so on.
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And yet that experience will be very different from another person who might represent African
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decides, right, being an indigenous person.
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So we use the tool and outcome to start working within ourselves first.
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And as I said, it's, assumptions, awareness, discovering solution, creating change.
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So we look at our organization.
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Does the organization reflect the very community within which we're working?
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The very client int that we're serving.
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Who are the the, persons that are using our products, using our services?
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And does say our senior leadership, does it reflect those, that particular aspect for
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creating change and then final a in ATCA is action.
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What are the actions that we can take now to truly the experience as being anti oppressive,
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anti racist, I.
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E.
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Looking at our diversity makeup, whether there's issues of equity, how do we address
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those issues of inclusion?
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How do we address those?
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So those that's one tool, Roxanne, that I would say we start by we start losing to help us have
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those conversations, those messy we call them messy conversations.
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Actually, that's what the tool is called.
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It would be
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it would be messy, especially right now.
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Let's take it.
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Let's take it.
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I mean, corporate, I know when people come in, recognize.
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I'm gonna say companies are recognizing even more.
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Kind of the, you know, the disparity in the different levels of their organization, you
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know, with parity, with, even females in leadership.
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And then, you know, by female leaders even more.
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So, there's there's so much need.
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Let's go back to say the average person and the their their listing and their their their going
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first of all, I'm gonna say one conversation.
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Maybe you can chat about this before we get into this is explain Pete to people the
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difference between discrimination and racism because I'm I feel and I could be wrong, but
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that a lot of people don't understand the difference.
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The the average person having this conversation may not understand the delineation or the
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difference between discrimination and racism.
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So can you share that?
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Because I want people to understand it.
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When they listen to some of the things that we're talking about.
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Speculate tells us that is a socially constructed idea.
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So it categorizes people in races to justify the process of exploitation of people.
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So racism itself is a tool that is used to justify taking people's land, taking their
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resources, preventing other people from experiencing lives that are, you know,
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honorable and full of integrity.
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And so the whole concept of race and racism is made up.
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It is is nothing based on biology or any of the more modern science that speaks to how we are
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as individuals.
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But race and racism were created as social constructs.
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To justify the exploitation of people.
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Discrimination is an act.
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So once we have been socialized to see each other as others.
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You're a black person, and you're this person.
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You're that person.
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We will take actions that are negative.
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So discrimination now is an act.
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It's an action that's been taken against someone often because of the socialization
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that's been imbued in the majority of us, the whole world, that we are different races.
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So that's the big discrimination.
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It's an action.
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I won't, invite, say, one to our barbecue, why, you know, I'm just so comfortable around people
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that are different from me.
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So it's an action.
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You're discriminating.
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Against them.
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So recognizing that indeed, as you said, the 2 are different and yet the 2 are interconnected.
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So that's the power of looking at things through the lens of intersectionality is when
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we put the social categorizations, I.
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E.
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Race is a social category.
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And then gender is another category.
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Your country or your nation is right because the world has been divided up.
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And so Europeans, Africans, Asians, that's not how the world was originally.
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So this was created artificially so that the process of exploitation, which is still
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ongoing, could be justified.
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The discrimination are action actions.
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So what I will hear and I will say it openly and maybe I can say it because I'm I'm brown
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and I've experienced people will say to me and I want you to and this is a controversial
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statement I'm gonna make that people my white friends will say to me Roxanne Brown people,
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black people, Asian people are discriminatory towards me.
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Oh, yeah.
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Like reverse racism.
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Right.
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So there's reverse racism.
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Let's talk a little I know this is a hot, like, they'd say hot like pepper and churn that.
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Topic, but it's something that I think we need to address because my friends will often say to
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me, you know what?
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Roxanne, you grow up privilege.
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You're a foreign student.
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You came with privilege.
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Right?
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You you cut through so many things.
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Right?
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And the the places you you sit in, I said, absolutely.
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I had economic privilege, right, and came to North America.
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I get that.
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But what I wanna talk about is concept of reverse racism because I think that's something
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that that gets, again, messy conversations that people are having in their backyards, aren't
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they at their fires or in the across their living room tables?
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No.
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Buffalo is just another blip.
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Because it happened.
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It keeps happening.
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Like, I saw something today on, on Instagram or, I guess, Lanny Kravitz.
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It was just a visual where he was placing, pieces of paper with every time somebody had
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been killed because of race.
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And I don't mean the timeline.
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I just looked at the visual and I reshared it because it was so powerful.
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So it's not just the bug buffalo.
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It's the fact that it is happening.
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But let's talk a little bit about because I think this is something that the average
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Canadian or American is discussing across their kitchen table at their fire, at their cottages
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even more so because buffalo just happens.
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So let's talk about that.
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Absolutely.
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And they've and these discussions have been going on for So the whole concept, 1st and
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foremost, of reverse racism, is a null and void concept.
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And racism, reverse racism is it's it's it's a mute point because remember how race and racism
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came about.
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It was race is created and created by those who were dominantly located.
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Therefore, reverse racism cannot happen because those who were categorized in particular races
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are not people who are dominantly located.
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So if your the color of your skin is not considered to be white.
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It doesn't matter what you do or say to a white person, you, as a whole, person of African
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descent, Indigenous peoples, Asian people, and so on are not the ones who are dominantly
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located in Western societies.
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Therefore, we don't get to make the rules as to who gets hired or who is promoted and so on and
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so forth.
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So from that, more, I would say, baseline perspective, the concept of reverse racism, is
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it's a mute point.
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It's like saying, what's the best analogy?
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Because the fish and water thing comes to my mind, you know, a fish doesn't even know that
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it's in water until, right, It just doesn't know because that's just the norm.
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So when you're dominantly located in society, you get to make the rules.
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You call the rules.
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You you Whatever happens in society comes from those who are dominantly located.
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What people are reacting to Roxanne.
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And again, it's another aspect of a messy conversation that needs to be addressed is the
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fact that folks who are marginalized and racialized are asking to be at the table, the
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proverbial table, are asking to have a piece of the proverbial high.
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They're not asking to have the whole boardroom.
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They're not asking to have the whole high.
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What they're asking is that we are citizens who live, work, and play in these societies.
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We can tribute to the building of these societies.
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Our ancestors built these societies.
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Therefore, we to need an ought to and must have the same privileges as those who are dominantly
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located.
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And this is what makes it messy.
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So I have white folks.
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Most of our training is with organizations where they're predominantly white.
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And we'll inevitably hear from several of the participants, well, why do I have to give up
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what I have?
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What about my children?
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And there are no ones asking you to give up anything.
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What we're asking is to level the playing field.
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Right?
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So recently, just yesterday, I did a second interview with one of our prominent
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universities here in this country to do this work with them.
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And they've made me really our company, me, because I represent jump through all these
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hoops, and I know if the color of my skin was white.
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It would, it would have ended at the very first.
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Interview.
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And, and so when I look at situations like that, and I shared it with, a white client
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slash colleague of mine who said, oh, I could throw up because you know what?
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That is wrong what they're doing.
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I know that if the color of your skin was white, you would not have to be jumping through
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those many hoops to prove that you qualify to do that work with them.
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So all we're asking for is where this whole concept of reverse racism comes up, messy topic
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is that we don't want anyone to give up anything.
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Just level the playing field.
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Leveling.
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So I know when I submit my resume, now my name is a Western name, so I I don't get thrown in
30:55
the trash based on my name because it's a a colonial name.
31:00
But let's say my name was a traditional African Maine.
31:04
I wanna know that that resume of mine still gets put forward for consideration at the
31:11
selection committee.
31:12
I want to know that some of my lived experiences count towards the job for which I'm
31:21
applying.
31:22
I want to know that there are measures in place to support my growth my success in the
31:32
organization because my ancestors did not create that organization, did not create
31:39
culture is not my culture, but yet due to circumstances that occurred hundreds of
31:44
musical, here I am.
31:46
And here I am now wanting to work more than willing to work, how do you make it easier for
31:53
me to navigate my way through the system that was not created by my ancestors, but yet
32:00
imposed upon me children, my children's children, and so on and so forth.
32:07
If the playing field is indeed leveled, then we'll all have an equal, true, with equal
32:13
opportunity to apply for positions, to receive the but the positions cannot go to just the
32:22
best candidate.
32:24
That term alone is a messy topic because the best candidate often results in someone who is
32:31
white, white, someone who I can who have a beer with, someone that I can hang out with at the
32:36
cottage, someone I can go play golf with, and we know this.
32:40
I'm not making these things up.
32:41
The data is very clear.
32:43
It speaks to how even Asian peoples, they've changed their names, to make their names
32:48
Western's founding.
32:50
They put hobbies on their resume, let's say there's no golf.
32:53
They curl.
32:54
They want to know what curling is.
32:55
I been told by some of the folks that they put it on that they do curl.
33:00
They they're curlers all for the purpose.
33:04
A securing a job.
33:04
So reverse discrimination is is a mute point.
33:08
It's it's it's a point that's being used to fire up people, to create discord, to create
33:18
ambassadors towards marginalized, rationalized people, who all they're asking for, all we're
33:25
asking for is an opportunity to have a seat at the table to know that our chair is and the
33:33
table is adjusted in such a way that we can see at the same level.
33:38
Same height as others that our voices are heard and take any to consideration as well.
33:44
So Thanks Thanks for clarifying that because I think the I'm not sure that the average person
33:49
that has not been through any kind of particular training would would be aware of
33:55
that difference.
33:56
Now, let's talk about, the average person.
34:02
Because I think, you know, if you're in a corporation and you're privileged enough to go
34:05
through specific training to understand these concepts and to go into your beliefs
34:10
assumptions to look at structure and parody, all those things, you're gonna be discussing
34:15
it.
34:15
And even if you've never heard it before, you're gonna get into it.
34:18
Let's talk about the average person that that is is experiencing this and they wanna
34:25
understand and I, you know, you know, I wanna understand my I'm I'm upset and and angry and
34:32
sad and mad and all, you know, the fact that we can have these conversations with my my friends
34:39
and family are very, very important.
34:42
But it gets really messy where there's no mediator there.
34:44
Right?
34:45
Here we go.
34:46
So how do we have these average conversations on our decks set our fires at our cottages like
34:55
you know, how do we do that without it blowing up into something?
34:59
Because everybody's so hurt and fragile when it comes to this issue.
35:04
Every time something blows up.
35:06
So give us some guidance.
35:07
And you're absolutely right.
35:09
I just want to acknowledge that the emotions are very high.
35:13
And the hurt and and confuse and so on.
35:16
And I really think that that's what's at the core of it.
35:19
We're we're animals.
35:21
We're we're creatures.
35:23
Who are designed forever to protect ourselves.
35:28
So again, in our training, there's another tool that we introduce folks to, and it's a fun
35:34
tool, actually, but a powerful tool.
35:36
It's the tool of improv improvisation where we, again, the average person, you might not get
35:48
the formal training, but if you're listening to this podcast, I invite you to really consider
35:53
using these tools.
35:55
So the adequate questions are powerful checking assumption, creating awareness, and so on.
36:00
But the particular tool, and as I said, I'm in a public space, at university.
36:04
So students are going back and forth.
36:08
The tune of improv helps us manage the expected blow ups that might happen.
36:16
So these are unexpected messy stuff that gets thrown at us.
36:22
And so one simple statement that we invite people to use is when you hear someone say
36:30
something that is potentially inflammatory.
36:33
Your heart rate is going up.
36:34
You can feel that emotions are now getting high.
36:39
Is to acknowledge it by saying yes and Yes.
36:49
It means I heard you and gives you the opportunity to put your point or your
37:00
perspective, your views, your thoughts, and so on to the other.
37:05
So we show people that by saying whatever the massive topic is, the messy stuff it's thrown
37:13
at you.
37:13
And, literally, this is the title for workshops.
37:15
How to talk about message stops?
37:17
When the message gets thrown at you, You're going to.
37:23
You're hearing all that noise.
37:26
That's okay.
37:27
Well, it's it's it's live.
37:29
So let's I've got lots
37:30
of it.
37:33
So when the messy stuff gets thrown at you, we remind them that it's an offer.
37:40
It's an offer Roxanne if you disagree with what I might have just said, and then you come back
37:47
with a counter argument, train your lines to see it as an off it's an offer to keep the
37:54
conversation going by recognizing that here's a view that the person is giving me.
38:01
So, yes, I hear what you're saying, Roxanne, that reverse discrimination is real or race
38:10
replacement theory, whatever the topic is.
38:14
And I'd like to ask, so now you're gonna give them back an offer.
38:20
Would you be open for us to maybe look at it a little differently.
38:24
So let's look at it from this angle.
38:27
Mhmm.
38:27
How can reverse racism when read those.
38:33
Oh, boy.
38:33
Call me.
38:34
Gone.
38:34
Let's see.
38:39
I'm still here.
38:41
Are you still here?
38:42
Because I'm I'm still
38:43
I'm I'm still hearing you are I'm still hearing you.
38:46
Yes.
38:49
It's so live.
38:49
I don't think you've ever had any of this live.
38:52
Yeah.
38:52
I've done it for 8 for for 2 months now.
38:55
So It's the variation of live and we just kinda get accustomed to it, Phyllis.
39:01
Yes.
39:03
Yeah.
39:03
And so we put back an off to the person.
39:06
So see the missing topics as offers for us to keep the conversation going.
39:13
On to what people are saying with, yes, and we typically will say, I hear you.
39:19
I can see how you can, understand it that way And this is how I see it who is facing.
39:27
What do you think about that?
39:28
So you give them back an off the person then will say yes.
39:32
I see where you're going with that fellas and and you give them back.
39:37
Why do we use yes and yes is possible?
39:41
And is a conjunction that's drawings sentences together.
39:45
So we use and to join people together.
39:50
And when someone now goes ballistic and they get super angry, that's a major block.
39:58
Because that's one of the basic foundations of improvisation.
40:01
We see that as a block, but he looks still at that block as an offer.
40:06
It is still an offer.
40:08
So Roxanne, if you're very upset, you're super angry, you're starting hurling, if please give
40:13
me, etcetera, not that you would do that.
40:16
I now recognize I need to end the engagement.
40:20
So I'm safe.
40:21
You know what?
40:22
Roxanne?
40:22
I I I hear and see where we're going with this, and wouldn't be okay for maybe we just pick
40:28
this up as another time.
40:30
So knowing.
40:31
Yeah.
40:32
So, you know, when to kind of end it if it's it's really becoming destructive versus
40:37
constructive.
40:38
And I I like that.
40:39
I like I like the fact that you're hearing the person's perspective because really if you're
40:43
if you're wanting to engage and move along with some of people's assumptions.
40:48
It's really about listening so you can understand to be able to to to to give them
40:54
that space, to give them look at it in an as an offering versus someone that's just maybe not
40:59
willing to to kind of take that step with you.
41:01
I think that's amazing.
41:04
What an amazing space to for anybody listening to apply, and if whether it's the person that
41:12
is you know, Asian or, you know, European or whatever to recognize that we all have feelings
41:22
that we need to get to.
41:23
And sometimes they bubble up on us.
41:25
Right?
41:25
Like, I mean, once the brain antibody takes over, we we we don't we go to that reactive
41:31
stance of, like you said, protection, which is as human beings, we we protect protect and
41:35
protect not because we don't wanna learn, but maybe we get a little bit scared and then we go
41:39
to we kinda run through the hill.
41:41
Yeah.
41:42
Yeah.
41:42
It is.
41:43
We are scared because when we experience anger and so on, it's because we're a freight, and
41:50
that fear now comes from a place of multiple areas.
41:55
And there's so many intersections that could create that here.
41:59
And so what we need to do in that moment is protect ourselves.
42:03
It's subliminal.
42:04
Like, it's just deep deep within us to protect ourselves.
42:08
So, hopefully, the leaders, the the listeners can see some value in using these tools.
42:15
The first is knowing how to ask those 5 different kinds of questions.
42:19
If you don't remember all 5, just remember the first 2.
42:23
Check your assumptions and create awareness.
42:26
In yourself, and then in others, never ever go and do it in others first.
42:31
Do it in yourself first.
42:33
What are my assumptions?
42:34
What do I need to be aware of, or what do I think I know?
42:38
And how do I know that knowing And then the other tool is look at any sort of conversation
42:46
that you're in as an improvisation of clay with an improv, things are going to come up
42:54
unexpectedly.
42:55
And If you can remember, just these basic rules, accept the offer.
43:01
So there's an offer.
43:03
I'm giving you an offer right now.
43:04
You've given me an offer.
43:06
And you and I are doing the top dance.
43:09
Right?
43:10
So everything that comes to us is an offer accepted with a yes and try to say yes, pause,
43:19
and rather than yes, and notice the difference.
43:26
Yeah.
43:26
Yes.
43:27
Pause.
43:30
I heard you.
43:31
I acknowledge you.
43:33
I am honoring what I'm hearing coming from you, etcetera, etcetera.
43:38
And that means I'm adding to the pool of intonation to the conversation, right, to the
43:45
building of bridges or the maintaining of the maintenance rather of bridges.
43:49
Okay?
43:50
And then when the blocks come up, which they will, because these are messy topics, know that
43:58
these blocks also offers your high level offers.
44:04
Yes.
44:05
And, yes, I'm here where you can.
44:09
Yes.
44:09
I could see how that would impact you.
44:11
That would.
44:12
Oh, yes.
44:13
I could see why you would feel that way.
44:16
And I wonder because I'm just thinking that this view of mine now is just a little bit
44:24
different and nonetheless, this is how I see it.
44:27
And what do you think?
44:30
Keep the conversation going mental.
44:33
What's a what a what a what a nice way, Phyllis?
44:36
What a what a very nice way in a hots to a kind of hotbed of where people are at and so I think
44:45
acknowledging pausing, which is such a powerful thing.
44:50
So it means also regulating what you're experiencing because you have to slow yourself
44:54
down if you're getting upset.
44:56
So that pause.
44:57
I'll I'll say it also allows you a bit of recalibration to say and.
45:02
Yeah.
45:03
Yeah.
45:03
I hear you.
45:03
However, and I go on just moves people along too fast like you're not really stopping to
45:08
really accept that gift like you said that offering to be able to go on plus this has been
45:14
amazing yet again.
45:15
I think we, rainy parsed out some things that, I know I have, you know, talked about, but I
45:23
think for the average person that's listening for leaders that are, you know, needing to
45:29
explore this further just to some of the basic things that we've talked about for, your
45:34
environments, by all means, I'm gonna give Phyllis the opportunity to be able to share
45:39
where she could be reached and if you're wanting to further this conversation, with some
45:44
of the things that we're talking about systemically, you know, please connect with
45:48
Phyllis.
45:48
But, Phyllis, let everybody know any last words before we let you go and then where they can
45:53
get ahold of you.
45:55
Yes.
45:55
And thank you for this opportunity.
45:57
Absolutely.
45:58
And, I would say final word is that we we who is it now?
46:05
We're we're truly we're in this.
46:08
So there's a statement that says what matters is the process versus the final outcome because
46:17
it's the process that determines the quality of the outcome.
46:23
So, again, these tools take your time to be patient with yourself in practicing and using
46:31
them.
46:31
And as you said, they're Roxanne.
46:33
Just pause.
46:35
Sometimes if you don't know what to say, just pause, but please do not use silence as a way
46:43
to avoid talking about these messy topics.
46:46
It is not an effective way.
46:49
And yet, silence by pausing.
46:52
As you said, regulates.
46:54
It helps you become a bit more mindful and aware of the emotions that have.
46:59
So people can reach me by either going to our website ultimate potentials.com, or they can
47:08
absolutely the link with me on LinkedIn.
47:11
Phyllis Readjarvis.
47:12
I am on LinkedIn.
47:14
And, of course, they can reach me through, email living at ultimate potentials.com.
47:21
Thank you again.
47:23
So for everybody listening, what am I what am I taking away?
47:26
And you know what?
47:27
I I talk about relationships and I want you to reflect on the key to awareness is getting
47:34
connected to yourself and the more self aware that you are about your space.
47:40
It impacts your space.
47:42
It impacts others around you and it it really spans out to our society of large.
47:47
So I really, you know, call to you to think, how am I being connected to myself and what is
47:54
it?
47:54
What are my blocks potentially in this arena?
47:57
And what is it that I can do to teach myself something a bit different and maybe go out and
48:04
engage with that one small action, nothing huge, but just try something small, maybe
48:10
asking a question in a different way, potentially using the pause, or being aware
48:16
that I don't know a lot about this particular subset of people.
48:21
What is it that I I should learn about them?
48:23
So, I encourage you to take that small step, this week and for anyone wanting to know how,
48:30
they can learn a little bit more above their ability to be authentic in relationships.
48:35
You can go to roxanderhodge.com.
48:38
There's a small quiz and we tell you where you kind of bench in relationships either at work
48:43
or at home and then we'll send you off that quiz results so you can know with some next
48:49
steps.
48:49
So again, Phyllis, so so, honored to have had you here today.
48:53
Thank you so much for your time.
48:56
Go out there and keep doing this amazing work.
48:58
We all need, these vital learnings so we can pursue proceed and be part of the process of
49:06
change.
49:07
Thanks again.
49:08
Alright, everyone.
49:09
Check-in next.
49:11
And, we'll see you next week as we get into another, juicy topic.
49:17
Take care.
49:18
Thanks for tuning in to authentic living with Roxanne, creating the space for positive,
49:24
healthy change.
49:25
Roxanne is a keynote speaker psychotherapist, and coach to work with Roxanne.
49:31
Visit rocksandurhaj.com/blueprint.
49:35
We'll see you next time.
49:37
On authentic living with Roxanne.