Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Socialite Mom Posts " I Have the Greatest Kids!" then murders them both in cold blood.

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Socialite Mom Posts " I Have the Greatest Kids!" then murders them both in cold blood. · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy grace Well. Police say this is
0:12
Speaker 1: the case of a fifty eight year old woman who
0:14
Speaker 1: shot and killed her adult son and daughter inside her home,
0:18
Speaker 1: apparently yesterday. The woman then shot and killed herself. It's
0:21
Speaker 1: a story breaking hearts from Cobb County to Atlanta City Hall.
0:27
Speaker 1: Marcia Edwards is the woman on the left, the mother
0:29
Speaker 1: of daughter Aaron and son Christopher. Police say the mother
0:33
Speaker 1: fired the shots that killed all three Wednesday night. We
0:37
Speaker 1: didn't hear anything. There's no sign of any you know,
0:41
Speaker 1: violence happening here. Kellya Kartal lives next door to the
0:44
Speaker 1: Cobb County condo police visited Wednesday evening. Kartal is a
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Speaker 1: neighbor who'd gotten to know and appreciate the family. Just
0:51
Speaker 1: a really nice family. Children, Aaron and Chris had exceedingly
0:57
Speaker 1: promising futures. Just really bright, nice kind people. A mother
1:01
Speaker 1: from a prominent Atlanta family shoots dead her son and daughter.
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Speaker 1: This is just hours after she posts to Instagram following
1:13
Speaker 1: her return from an vacation to Italy. I could not
1:17
Speaker 1: ask for better children. What happened in this wealthy gated
1:24
Speaker 1: community of Vining's Park East. This woman guns down her
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Speaker 1: two children, her husband, a prominent orthopedic surgeon. And this
1:34
Speaker 1: is just hours after posting photos on Facebook regarding her
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Speaker 1: vacation in Italy with her daughter. Prior to that, she
1:40
Speaker 1: had been in Miami with her son. I mean, I see, Grace,
1:44
Speaker 1: this is crime stories. Thank you for being with us.
1:47
Speaker 1: Take a listen to this. Marsha, the mother who fired
1:50
Speaker 1: the shots, had been married to Christopher Edwards, a surgeon
1:53
Speaker 1: who leads the Atlanta Housing Authority Board. The family is
1:56
Speaker 1: also longtime friends with Atlanta Mayer Keisha Lance Bottoms. Aaron
2:00
Speaker 1: Edwards was an intern in the Mayor's office last summer.
2:03
Speaker 1: Chris Edwards was a current employee in the Mayor's communications office.
2:08
Speaker 1: In a statement, Bottom said, in part, Derek and I
2:10
Speaker 1: joined the greater Atlantic community in mourning the loss of
2:13
Speaker 1: three members of the beloved Edwards family. Chris and Aaron
2:17
Speaker 1: were beautiful, vibrant, and brilliant young adults whom we had
2:20
Speaker 1: the pleasure of knowing their entire lives. They filled the
2:23
Speaker 1: lives of all who met them with joy, compassion and kindness.
2:26
Speaker 1: Well educated, fantastic, wonderful, just great people. Yeah, which makes it,
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Speaker 1: you know, a lot harder just to understand where you
2:39
Speaker 1: know what went wrong, what happened, what caused this snap.
2:43
Speaker 1: I don't know if I'd referred to it as a
2:45
Speaker 1: snap because under the law, isn't this right with me?
2:50
Speaker 1: Our renowned defense attorney Jason Oceans joining me out of
2:53
Speaker 1: New York. When you have the time to go get
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Speaker 1: a gun, to load the gun, to point the gun,
3:00
Speaker 1: to pull the trigger, I mean, intent under the law
3:02
Speaker 1: can be formed in the twinkling of an eye. She
3:05
Speaker 1: killed both of her children. She shot them dead around
3:10
Speaker 1: six pm in the evening. That's plenty of time to
3:13
Speaker 1: form intent. Yeah, absolutely, Nancy. You know, there doesn't seem
3:18
Speaker 1: to be anything that intervened in some way to be
3:23
Speaker 1: some sort of you know, a factor regarding that, not
3:26
Speaker 1: that we're aware of now. So it does seem to
3:30
Speaker 1: some degree that there that there was an element of
3:32
Speaker 1: planning to this or preparedness at the very least, joining
3:36
Speaker 1: me right now and all Star panel to break it
3:38
Speaker 1: down put it back together again. To Crime online dot
3:40
Speaker 1: Com investigative reporter Dave Max started at the beginning, Dave,
3:43
Speaker 1: what happened? Police were called by doctor Chris Edwards. He's
3:47
Speaker 1: an orthopedic surgeon in Atlanta, one of the most well
3:49
Speaker 1: known doctors in Atlanta, and he called them about a
3:52
Speaker 1: welfare check because he hadn't gotten up with his son,
3:54
Speaker 1: twenty four year old Chris the third. Now, Chris didn't
3:57
Speaker 1: show up for work that day, and doctors had been
4:00
Speaker 1: trying to get up with him, and when he couldn't
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Speaker 1: get up with him, found out he never showed up
4:03
Speaker 1: for work. That's when doctor Edwards called the police and
4:05
Speaker 1: just said, hey, would you mind going and checking my
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Speaker 1: ex wife's condo because I can't find my son anywhere
4:10
Speaker 1: and can't get up with my ex wife. I can't
4:11
Speaker 1: get up with my daughter. And that's when the police
4:14
Speaker 1: showed up at six o'clock that evening. Take a listen
4:16
Speaker 1: to WSBA reporter, This is Tom Reagan. There'll a lot
4:20
Speaker 1: of unanswered questions on this triple shooting that happened here
4:23
Speaker 1: at this town home complex just a few blocks away
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Speaker 1: from Cumberland Mall. But as you reference, we have through
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Speaker 1: a family friend, have been able to identify the three victims.
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Speaker 1: They are the former wife and the two adult children.
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Speaker 1: As you mentioned, a prominent community leader and surgeon that
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Speaker 1: is doctor Christopher Edwards. He is a orthopedic surgeon and
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Speaker 1: chair of the Atlanta Housing Authority. A detectives have left
4:46
Speaker 1: the scene here for now, but I want to show
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Speaker 1: you what it looked like. Late last night, A police
4:50
Speaker 1: and detectives were going through the area looking for evidence
4:52
Speaker 1: and interviewing neighbors. A police were called here to do
4:56
Speaker 1: a welfare check around six o'clock last night. That's when
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Speaker 1: they found the three bodies, two adult women and a
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Speaker 1: man inside a town home here at the complex. At
5:07
Speaker 1: this point, police are not saying whether they believe this
5:10
Speaker 1: is a case of murder or murder suicide. They're still
5:14
Speaker 1: investigating this. This triple shooting obviously has shaken many in
5:17
Speaker 1: this town home complex. We'll be working throughout the afternoon
5:21
Speaker 1: to get more information about the shootings and a possible motive.
5:24
Speaker 1: Two Dodgor Robbie Ludwig psychologists joining us from her Facebook
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Speaker 1: live program at Times Square. Dotor Robbie question to you,
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Speaker 1: I don't necessarily think that this was a snap moment.
5:37
Speaker 1: And I don't know if you recall covering this case
5:40
Speaker 1: with me or not, but there was a mom, her
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Speaker 1: name Julie Schineker, about the same age as Martha Edwards,
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Speaker 1: had two children, not taughts, not infants, because, Robbie, we
5:55
Speaker 1: see a lot of moms that murder small children. I mean,
6:00
Speaker 1: I could list them on and on and on. I mean,
6:02
Speaker 1: Andrew Yates is a perfect example. Dan LaSIE another example.
6:06
Speaker 1: But in these two cases, the children are older. She
6:09
Speaker 1: just got on an Italian vacation with the daughter, Aaron,
6:12
Speaker 1: as she had been down visiting the son, Chris in Miami.
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Speaker 1: In the case I'm telling you about Julie Scheneker, her
6:19
Speaker 1: children were in high school and she was irritated with
6:23
Speaker 1: them for talking back to her, so she murdered them.
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Speaker 1: She was also angry at the husband, who was in
6:29
Speaker 1: the military and was gone all the time. I think
6:32
Speaker 1: this was more revenge and hate of two wonderful children,
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Speaker 1: Doctor Robby, I don't think she just snapped. Well, clearly
6:40
Speaker 1: she did snap, but there could have been, and probably was,
6:43
Speaker 1: some severe character disorder or mental health issue that she
6:47
Speaker 1: was struggling with. How about just plain old angry, revenge,
6:52
Speaker 1: fed up, frustrated, worn out, bitter. How about that that's
6:55
Speaker 1: not a mental defense, That's true. But you know, hopefully
6:59
Speaker 1: if you're feeling that degree of anger and you are
7:02
Speaker 1: somewhat stable, then you can cope with that. Rage and
7:06
Speaker 1: neutralize it to some extent, and you don't act out
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Speaker 1: in murder. Otherwise we'd have a lot more people murdered
7:11
Speaker 1: than we already do. But I agree with you, Nancy.
7:14
Speaker 1: This motive appears to be all about revenge and feeling
7:19
Speaker 1: that she had no life without this husband, and not
7:23
Speaker 1: wanting her husband to have these two kids. She is
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Speaker 1: punishing him, and punishment she's certainly induced by killing her
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Speaker 1: two kids, who sounded like fabulous people, and killing herself,
7:38
Speaker 1: which eliminated all future possibility. Dot Robbie, you know how
7:41
Speaker 1: I feel about you and your family, right, But have
7:44
Speaker 1: you ever heard the phrase flip flop? Because that's what
7:47
Speaker 1: you just did, and I mean you did it in
7:49
Speaker 1: a spectacular fashion. You said that this was mental defect,
7:53
Speaker 1: uncontrollable rage and anger, bitter resentment. You can't have it
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Speaker 1: both ways legally. Legally, you cannot, Jason Oceans, under the law,
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Speaker 1: there is no defense. I've snapped. That is a show
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Speaker 1: on Oxygen Okay, my TV home. There's no such thing
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Speaker 1: as snap. You don't just snap. You act out of rage.
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Speaker 1: Rage is not a defense under the law. Bitter bitter
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Speaker 1: that her husband had divorced her and he was a
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Speaker 1: star in the Atlanta social elite and going on with
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Speaker 1: his life as an orthopedic surgeon. Bitter. I don't know
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Speaker 1: what took over this woman, but snap, and you can
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Speaker 1: quote me on this. This is technical legal talk. Snap
8:38
Speaker 1: and a defense. I agree with you. Snap. Snap is
8:41
Speaker 1: never a defense. But clearly she did. And as a
8:46
Speaker 1: result of no, you and Robbie second verse same as
8:50
Speaker 1: the first. No, you can't say there is no snap,
8:53
Speaker 1: but she did. No, I'm not using that in a
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Speaker 1: psychological term, which is clearly what she did. But yes,
9:01
Speaker 1: this was rageful. She committed murder. Uh. And as as
9:05
Speaker 1: doctor Robbie said, revenge or whatever was motivating her, you
9:09
Speaker 1: said it as well. She was. She was angry at
9:11
Speaker 1: the life and wanted to deny her husband the ability
9:14
Speaker 1: to have any connection to it. So the fact that
9:17
Speaker 1: she snapped doesn't take away that this was seemingly premeditated. Uh,
9:23
Speaker 1: in many respects having them both together at the same time,
9:27
Speaker 1: they were in different places over the summer. One was
9:29
Speaker 1: in turning up in New York. So I do believe
9:32
Speaker 1: that it was planned. And uh, you know took that
9:35
Speaker 1: moment and whatever it was, and you know, went forward
9:39
Speaker 1: and did It Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Marcia Edwards
10:01
Speaker 1: facebook page is filled with images of her children, Chris
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Speaker 1: and Aaron. She served several pictures celebrating her son Chris's
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Speaker 1: birthday in June, calling him her best guy and her
10:10
Speaker 1: daughter Aaron her best girl, and within the last few days,
10:13
Speaker 1: she posted multiple times from a trip to Italy with
10:15
Speaker 1: her daughter, sharing dozens of photos and videos over several days,
10:19
Speaker 1: visiting famous sights, smiling, toasting, and posing for the camera.
10:23
Speaker 1: And in July, Marsha posted pictures from an Independence Day
10:26
Speaker 1: trip to Destin with her son Chris. Marsha also posted
10:30
Speaker 1: about Aaron's internships with the City of Atlanta and CNN.
10:33
Speaker 1: She shared articles Erin wrote while recently interning for NBC
10:37
Speaker 1: and traveled to New York to see her. Over the summer,
10:39
Speaker 1: Aaron's page shows she was studying at Boston University. She
10:42
Speaker 1: frequently tagged her mother in post, sharing pictures of them
10:45
Speaker 1: together and writing how proud she was of all her
10:48
Speaker 1: mom had accomplished. When she was honored in April as
10:51
Speaker 1: a small business owner and community leader by the Women
10:53
Speaker 1: Works media group as one of Atlanta's one hundred most
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Speaker 1: Powerful and influential women of twenty nineteen. Just before two
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Speaker 1: brutal murderers, mom Marcia Edwards post on social media about
11:08
Speaker 1: how she enjoyed her vacation in Italy with her daughter.
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Speaker 1: That ain't cheap, sharing pictures in Vatican City, Rome, Venice,
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Speaker 1: toasting quote, fortunate to have dinner at the Vatican after
11:22
Speaker 1: our tour. Okay, the very same day as the killing,
11:28
Speaker 1: she posted Instagram, I've had the best summer first with
11:32
Speaker 1: my son Chris and Miami and Aaron and Italy. I
11:36
Speaker 1: could not ask for better children. Okay, before I get
11:42
Speaker 1: to doctor Tim Gallagher and medical examiner for the State
11:45
Speaker 1: of Florida, just drink this in for a moment. How
11:48
Speaker 1: do people get so caught up? And you know, some
11:51
Speaker 1: people are caught up in money. Obviously these people were rich,
11:55
Speaker 1: because Vinings is huge. I've driven through there before. In fact,
12:02
Speaker 1: I had my twins one of their Easter photos taken
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Speaker 1: with bunnies at a little what do you say boutique
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Speaker 1: in Vinings, and I felt like a dog upstairs. I mean,
12:14
Speaker 1: I knew I was not supposed to be there, and
12:17
Speaker 1: I got that picture and left. I mean that homes
12:20
Speaker 1: are like castles on these rolling lots, you know, wooded,
12:27
Speaker 1: gated communities, the whole shebang. So these people are lacking
12:32
Speaker 1: for nothing. So many people all caught up in the trappings,
12:38
Speaker 1: the money, the society, the prestige position. What car you drive,
12:44
Speaker 1: what clothes you wear, what home you live in, what's
12:46
Speaker 1: your zip code? Long story short, You also see it
12:51
Speaker 1: when you show off your children. And now I'm guilty
12:54
Speaker 1: of this. I'm not too hung up on my beat
12:56
Speaker 1: up minivan or my cowboy boots, but I have been
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Speaker 1: proud of my children, going, oh, John David did this,
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Speaker 1: Lucy did that, blah blah blah blah. And you can
13:08
Speaker 1: see Marsha Edwards touting her children like their trophies. My
13:13
Speaker 1: daughters at BU, my daughter had an internship at NBC.
13:16
Speaker 1: My son this my daughter that did it go too far?
13:21
Speaker 1: And did she not get what she thought she deserved
13:25
Speaker 1: back for all the years she devoted to her children
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Speaker 1: and husband, Doctor Tim Gallagher, Before I go into the
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Speaker 1: thinking of moms that murder their children, how do we know,
13:41
Speaker 1: and this is the medical examiner for the State of Florida,
13:45
Speaker 1: how do you know from the angles, the trajectory paths,
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Speaker 1: the entry and exit wounds that she killed Chris and Aaron,
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Speaker 1: her son and daughter, not that one of them killed her.
14:00
Speaker 1: How do you tell that? Well, that's always a tough
14:04
Speaker 1: decision to make. It's always a tough assumption to make.
14:07
Speaker 1: You have to look at the circumstances that are leading
14:10
Speaker 1: up to the the crime itself. You'd have to inspect
14:15
Speaker 1: the crime scene very carefully. You have to look for
14:19
Speaker 1: the blood trails. Was there a struggle, is there is
14:23
Speaker 1: the house secured? You know? Are they inside of a
14:26
Speaker 1: locked house? Is there any sign of somebody else being involved?
14:29
Speaker 1: Is there anyone there is another sign of somebody breaking
14:32
Speaker 1: into the home? Was it a was it a robbery?
14:34
Speaker 1: Can you eliminate that? You know? Um fingerprints on the
14:38
Speaker 1: gun would certainly help if the if the weapon was recovered,
14:43
Speaker 1: if it was her fingerprints on the gun and only
14:45
Speaker 1: hers and the children's blood on the gun as well,
14:48
Speaker 1: then that is certainly compelling evidence that it was her
14:51
Speaker 1: that committed the crime and nobody else was involved. Also,
14:54
Speaker 1: for instance, if they just imagine Jeff Cortisi for f
15:00
Speaker 1: be a special agent. Just imagine let's pick on Jackie
15:05
Speaker 1: Howard here in the studio. If she's sitting there at
15:09
Speaker 1: the radio board, as I call it, all the equipment
15:12
Speaker 1: in front of her. She got her heads bones on,
15:15
Speaker 1: she's drinking her coffee because my instant coffee is beneath her. Say,
15:21
Speaker 1: I sneak up behind her and I shoot her in
15:24
Speaker 1: the back of the head. I would never do that, Jackie,
15:27
Speaker 1: just know that deep inside. But you can tell Jeff
15:33
Speaker 1: that the victim can't shoot themselves in the back of
15:37
Speaker 1: the head. Hey, that's physically impossible. So for instance, the
15:42
Speaker 1: gunshot wound is in the back, or the back of
15:45
Speaker 1: the head, or the back itself. That tells you right
15:49
Speaker 1: there that they were not the ones that did the killing. Yeah,
15:53
Speaker 1: that's that's correct, Nancy. You know, as the doctor had mentioned,
15:58
Speaker 1: you know, the I seen analysis is going to incorporate
16:03
Speaker 1: a look at everything from a gun, gunshot residue, gunpowder
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Speaker 1: residue on hands, shirts, trajector whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.
16:12
Speaker 1: I'm drinking from a fire hydrant here, Jeff CORTEZI you're
16:15
Speaker 1: the FBI special agent. You got a dummy down for
16:18
Speaker 1: the rest of us. Explain how and under what circumstances
16:22
Speaker 1: gunshot residue can be found. Sure, so, through the analysis
16:26
Speaker 1: of a crime scene when when a firearm is discharged,
16:31
Speaker 1: gunshot residue is ejected from from the gun and it
16:35
Speaker 1: will spray on the hand of the person squeezing the trigger.
16:41
Speaker 1: And depending on the distance between the gun and the
16:45
Speaker 1: person who is being shot, there could also be gunshot
16:48
Speaker 1: residue on the shirt or pants, or head or face
16:53
Speaker 1: of the person that is being shot. So that could
16:55
Speaker 1: give you some sense of trajectory and identify people involved. Guys,
17:01
Speaker 1: we are talking about a beautiful mother of two children,
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Speaker 1: Chris and Aaron Edwards. They were young adults. Why kill them? Why? Now?
17:15
Speaker 1: Apparently there is no doubt that mommy did the killings,
17:19
Speaker 1: whether it's from where the victims were found, the nature
17:24
Speaker 1: of the gunshot wounds to them, the trajectory pass I mean,
17:29
Speaker 1: was one asleep, was one sitting at a computer with
17:31
Speaker 1: their back turned? We don't know. Police are not releasing it,
17:34
Speaker 1: but we do know mommy pulled the trigger. And it
17:39
Speaker 1: doesn't matter how rich you are, how connected you are,
17:44
Speaker 1: murder still happens. Take a listen to eleven Allies. Doug Richards. Marsha,
17:48
Speaker 1: the mother who fired the shots, had been married to
17:50
Speaker 1: Christopher Edwards, a surgeon who leads the Atlanta Housing Authority Board.
17:55
Speaker 1: The family is also longtime friends with Atlanta Mayer Keisha
17:58
Speaker 1: Lance Bottoms. Aaron Edwards was an intern in the Mayor's
18:01
Speaker 1: office last summer. Chris Edwards was a current employee in
18:06
Speaker 1: the Mayor's communications office. In a statement, Bottom said, in part,
18:10
Speaker 1: Derek and I joined the greater Atlantic community in mourning
18:13
Speaker 1: the loss of three members of the beloved Edwards family.
18:17
Speaker 1: Chris and Aaron were beautiful, vibrant, and brilliant young adults
18:20
Speaker 1: whom we had the pleasure of knowing their entire lives.
18:23
Speaker 1: They filled the lives of all who met them with joy,
18:25
Speaker 1: compassion and kindness. Well educated, fantastic, wonderful, just bright people. Yeah,
18:33
Speaker 1: which makes it, you know, a lot harder just to
18:40
Speaker 1: understand where you know, what went wrong, what happened? What
18:44
Speaker 1: caused this? Snap crime stories with Nancy Grace, what investigation?
19:12
Speaker 1: So At around six o'clock tonight, Cobb County Police Department
19:15
Speaker 1: uniform officers were dispatched to thirty two six Nobility Way
19:19
Speaker 1: in reference to a welfare check. Upon arrival, they located
19:22
Speaker 1: three deceased inside the home, all adults, two females and
19:26
Speaker 1: one male, and it appears that it's from gunshots. As
19:30
Speaker 1: far as relationship goes, it appears they live in the household,
19:33
Speaker 1: but we haven't confirmed the specific relationship between those inside
19:37
Speaker 1: the home. It's active, it's still an investigation, and we
19:41
Speaker 1: don't have any further details at this time. It is
19:43
Speaker 1: qualified as a murder suicide. It's still under investigation. Is
19:46
Speaker 1: there any obvious signs of unbreaking. I don't have any
19:49
Speaker 1: information on that. Are we looking for anyone tonight. It's
19:52
Speaker 1: still an active investigation. Ages are the victims, they're adults.
19:57
Speaker 1: I don't know the ages. All three are over eighteen.
19:59
Speaker 1: All your adults say it again, it's it's it's what
20:03
Speaker 1: was the mall? I'm sorry? What was the mix? It's
20:06
Speaker 1: two females and one male, said the weapon? I don't know,
20:12
Speaker 1: it's there's still investigators inside the residents. You said there
20:15
Speaker 1: was a welfare check. What we had it on a
20:17
Speaker 1: certain timeframe to hope setting her from these people. I'm
20:20
Speaker 1: not sure what prompted the welfare check. I know that
20:23
Speaker 1: that is what brought officers to this location. Today you
20:26
Speaker 1: are hearing a police conference after two children, Chris and
20:31
Speaker 1: Aaron Edwards, found dead. The shooter. Mommy, what led Marcia
20:37
Speaker 1: Edwards to turn the gun on her two children. They
20:41
Speaker 1: seem to have it all, lots of money, social prestige,
20:46
Speaker 1: great schools, Italian vacations, of the works. And this is
20:50
Speaker 1: just after mommy post to Instagram. I could not ask
20:54
Speaker 1: for better children. Take a listen to our friends at
20:58
Speaker 1: DEBUTVM looking to the case of a mother who police
21:01
Speaker 1: say killed her two adult children and then herself. Police
21:04
Speaker 1: are calling to incident a double murder suicide. Doctor for
21:07
Speaker 1: Christopher Edwards, a Columbus native and the son of doctor
21:11
Speaker 1: Delmore Edwards, who was the first African American in Columbus,
21:15
Speaker 1: is still grieving after finding his two grown children and
21:18
Speaker 1: ex wife dead in the mother's Atlanta home last Wednesday.
21:21
Speaker 1: There will not be a public viewing, but the funeral
21:23
Speaker 1: arrangements will be held at eleven am on the twenty
21:26
Speaker 1: eighth at Cascade United Methodist Church in Atlanta. You know
21:30
Speaker 1: what that tells me to doctor Tim Gallagher, State of
21:32
Speaker 1: Florida Medical Examiner, that they very likely were shot in
21:37
Speaker 1: the face or the head. When there's not an open casket,
21:40
Speaker 1: there's usually a reason for that, doctor Gallagher. That is
21:43
Speaker 1: generally it the damage done by that sort of attack
21:48
Speaker 1: would certainly not invite itself to an open casket funeral.
21:54
Speaker 1: I feel awful about this. You know, these are some
21:56
Speaker 1: of the worst possible crime scenes to attend, and it's
22:01
Speaker 1: just an awful, awful story, you know. I keep hearing
22:04
Speaker 1: Jason Oceans and doctor Robbie Ludwig saying that she quote snapped,
22:10
Speaker 1: she quote snapped, Doctor Robbie Ludwig. What do you think
22:15
Speaker 1: about potential resentment over her husband who divorced her, succeeding
22:21
Speaker 1: and being taken back into high society while she continued
22:28
Speaker 1: to be alone. Yeah, I mean, I think alone is
22:31
Speaker 1: a very important point here. We don't know what she
22:34
Speaker 1: found out. Maybe she found out her ex had a
22:37
Speaker 1: new girlfriend. Maybe it was a new younger girlfriend. But
22:40
Speaker 1: what's interesting about killing adult children versus younger children is
22:46
Speaker 1: I wonder if this woman felt like everybody was leaving
22:50
Speaker 1: her at the same time, everybody was having a new
22:53
Speaker 1: life at the same time except for her. So when
22:57
Speaker 1: your kids are in their twenties, then they're kind of
23:01
Speaker 1: going off into their own future. They're more independent, they
23:05
Speaker 1: have their own lives, And it sounds like this is
23:08
Speaker 1: a woman who was preoccupied and had a fear of
23:12
Speaker 1: being abandoned and now everyone was going off to have
23:16
Speaker 1: a beautiful future except for herself. And that's where the
23:20
Speaker 1: suicidality can come in, and of course the revenge comes in.
23:25
Speaker 1: If I can't have a life, then I'm going to
23:28
Speaker 1: make sure that my kids don't leave me and that
23:30
Speaker 1: my husband is punished too. Jason Hin's New York defense
23:33
Speaker 1: attorney weight in, Well, clearly, Nancy from from the end result,
23:38
Speaker 1: this was something premeditated, at least in thought, I if
23:43
Speaker 1: not an action, something that she contemplated, and you know
23:48
Speaker 1: clearly waiting for the right time that they would all
23:52
Speaker 1: be together, you know, the weapons there, they have separate lives,
23:57
Speaker 1: and so there was something going on that you know
24:02
Speaker 1: that was a trigger and then you know, waited to pounce.
24:05
Speaker 1: Un't I don't know. You know, we're using the words snapped,
24:09
Speaker 1: and I've used it, but something did along the way
24:13
Speaker 1: and U and there we have, you know, a double
24:16
Speaker 1: honicide and a suicide. So the first time a mom
24:19
Speaker 1: has a murder her children. Here's a semial case that
24:21
Speaker 1: brought the issue to the national forefront. Rusty yates praise
24:25
Speaker 1: and hugs his family and a camelliited vigil in front
24:27
Speaker 1: of the courthouse where his wife, Andrea Yates, was convicted
24:31
Speaker 1: of capital murder for drowning their five young children. Last June.
24:35
Speaker 1: Weave and jury find the defendant, Andrea Pah, guilty of
24:38
Speaker 1: capital murder as charged in the indictment. Yates showed little
24:42
Speaker 1: reaction in the courtroom to the verdict, but, according to
24:44
Speaker 1: defense attorney George Parnon, Yates is upset. Rusty Yates dropped
24:50
Speaker 1: his head in his hands and cried at the verdict.
24:52
Speaker 1: On the opposite side of the courtroom, yates mother, Karen Kennedy,
24:55
Speaker 1: appeared visibly shaken after seventeen days of emotional and also
24:59
Speaker 1: the heart aking testimony. Jews took just three and a
25:02
Speaker 1: half hours to reach their decision, all but one avoiding
25:05
Speaker 1: looking at Yates as they returned to render their verday
25:07
Speaker 1: garry hearing about Andrea Yates, who murdered five of her children.
25:13
Speaker 1: So often we see that the children are younger in age,
25:17
Speaker 1: taughts or infants when the mother murders them. If you guys,
25:20
Speaker 1: recall in the Andrea Yates case, her husband, Rusty Yates,
25:25
Speaker 1: was a religious fanatic, and he ishued I recall he
25:29
Speaker 1: was highly educated, maybe as an engineer, and he issued
25:35
Speaker 1: all belongings, and he took his family and made them
25:39
Speaker 1: live in a school bus for a period of time.
25:41
Speaker 1: Can you imagine a mom alone all day with five
25:45
Speaker 1: children living in a school bus? Is the way I
25:47
Speaker 1: remember it, talk about frustration. She ended up murdering all
25:54
Speaker 1: five of her children. So let me ask you this
25:58
Speaker 1: to doctor Robbie Ludwig's like collegist. Was the differentiation that
26:03
Speaker 1: mom killing very young children, which is typically what we
26:06
Speaker 1: see here, Like in the Julie Shitaker case out of Florida,
26:10
Speaker 1: the children were up in age. These were young adults,
26:13
Speaker 1: Aaron and Chris Well. I think the difference here is,
26:17
Speaker 1: first of all, Andrea Yates was psychotic, so she truly
26:20
Speaker 1: did not know the difference between right and wrong. Whoa
26:23
Speaker 1: whoa whoa wait wait, I don't know if you recall
26:25
Speaker 1: the facts, all of them, doctor Robbie, Because she intentionally
26:30
Speaker 1: waited till her husband went to work that morning. She
26:33
Speaker 1: locked the doors so none of the children could get
26:37
Speaker 1: out and nobody could get in. She took the children
26:41
Speaker 1: one by one away from each other, so they couldn't help.
26:45
Speaker 1: The children couldn't help each other. One the tiniest child.
26:49
Speaker 1: The little baby girl was covered in bruises where she
26:52
Speaker 1: tried not to be drowned dead, fought back, but she
26:57
Speaker 1: was covered in bruises because her mother held her down
27:00
Speaker 1: then laid them out formally on a bed and then
27:03
Speaker 1: call nine one one and said, I've done a terrible thing.
27:06
Speaker 1: Now in my mind, that shows she knew very well
27:10
Speaker 1: what she did wrong. And remember Ajorie found her guilty
27:15
Speaker 1: but mentally ill Okay, guilty, Okay, not insane where you
27:20
Speaker 1: don't know what's wrong at the time the incident, but guilty.
27:23
Speaker 1: G b am I guilty but mentally well. There was
27:28
Speaker 1: something in that case right where there was a mental
27:31
Speaker 1: illness that was not being addressed. She was not allowed
27:33
Speaker 1: to take care of herself or her mental well being
27:36
Speaker 1: and had postpartum psychosis. That could be a reason in
27:40
Speaker 1: some cases. In other cases it's because the children are
27:44
Speaker 1: somehow in the way of the mother having the life
27:48
Speaker 1: she wants to have or the boyfriend she wants to have,
27:52
Speaker 1: and the kids are very demanding and the woman is
27:57
Speaker 1: let's say, in some cases, was not allowed to have
28:00
Speaker 1: of an abortion and so engages in a murder after
28:04
Speaker 1: the fact or after the child is born. This is
28:06
Speaker 1: something very different. It sounds like this woman had a
28:10
Speaker 1: character disorder where she was preoccupied with being left and
28:15
Speaker 1: being abandoned and probably was highly erratic. Time stories with
28:31
Speaker 1: Nancy grace Well. Police say this is the case of
28:37
Speaker 1: a fifty eight year old woman who shot and killed
28:39
Speaker 1: her adult son and daughter inside her home apparently yesterday.
28:44
Speaker 1: The woman then shot and killed herself. It's a story
28:46
Speaker 1: breaking hearts from Cobb County to Atlanta City Hall. Marcia
28:52
Speaker 1: Edwards is the woman on the left, the mother of
28:54
Speaker 1: daughter Aaron and son Christopher. Police say the mother fired
28:59
Speaker 1: the shots that killed all three Wednesday night. We didn't
29:02
Speaker 1: hear anything. There's no sign of any you know, violence
29:07
Speaker 1: happening or Kellia Kartal lives next door to the Cobb
29:10
Speaker 1: Counted condo police visited Wednesday evening. Kartal is a neighbor
29:14
Speaker 1: who'd gotten to know and appreciate the family. Just a
29:17
Speaker 1: really nice family. Aaron and Chris had exceedingly promising futures.
29:22
Speaker 1: Just really bright, nice kind people. You were hearing eleven
29:25
Speaker 1: Lives Doug Richards talking about Marcia Edwards who shoots and
29:29
Speaker 1: kills her son Chris and her daughter Aaron the neighbors
29:33
Speaker 1: talking about the family, and if you noticey I'll talk
29:35
Speaker 1: about how accomplished and educated the family was. That did
29:39
Speaker 1: not save the children from death at the hands of mommy.
29:44
Speaker 1: Why do moms kill? This is an extremely unusual case
29:47
Speaker 1: because when mom's kill, they normally kill children that are very,
29:52
Speaker 1: very young, infants or taught. We were just talking about
29:55
Speaker 1: the Andrea Yates case. But then there's the Deanna Laney murders.
30:00
Speaker 1: Dianna Laney murdered her little boys, eight year old Joshua
30:06
Speaker 1: six year old Luke by beating them over the head
30:11
Speaker 1: with a rock, slamming it down with all her strength
30:17
Speaker 1: against her child's skull, both of them, Luke and Joshua.
30:23
Speaker 1: She tried to kill their youngest son, fourteen month old Aaron,
30:27
Speaker 1: in the same way. He managed to live, but suffered
30:31
Speaker 1: intense serious head injuries. Now, according to Laney, God ordered
30:38
Speaker 1: her to murder her children. Okay, Dave matt with me
30:43
Speaker 1: Crime Online dot Com investigative reporter. What more do we
30:46
Speaker 1: know about this mom? Marsha Edwards. Actually, we know a lot,
30:50
Speaker 1: and here's what we're looking at is that the post
30:52
Speaker 1: that she made about the vacations with both her children
30:55
Speaker 1: over the last year. It almost was like a goodbye tour,
30:57
Speaker 1: like a farewell tour, because she only made about two
31:00
Speaker 1: hundred thousand dollars a year in her own business. Well wait, wait, wait, wait,
31:04
Speaker 1: what did you just say? Did you just say she
31:06
Speaker 1: only made two hundred thousand dollars a year? Did that
31:12
Speaker 1: just come out of your mouth? That is a yes,
31:14
Speaker 1: no question, Dave Max, Yes, ma'am, it did only made Well,
31:19
Speaker 1: what do you think Alimonian child support is, Dave Mack.
31:23
Speaker 1: For Pete's sake, The husband's an orthopedic surgeon, and that
31:26
Speaker 1: was him giving some press conference about athletes. He's got.
31:30
Speaker 1: You know, she's got her own background as a medical doctor.
31:32
Speaker 1: But five years ago, in twenty fourteen, she left his
31:35
Speaker 1: practice and started her own company. I looked it up.
31:38
Speaker 1: And when you actually look at the business of her company,
31:40
Speaker 1: which is a medical supply thing, she's the only employee
31:43
Speaker 1: and they reported earnings of pre tax two hundred thousand dollars. Now,
31:47
Speaker 1: and we don't know anything about Alimoni or child support.
31:49
Speaker 1: Robbie Ludwig, doctor, Robbie Ludwig, doctor, Robbie Alimonian child support,
31:55
Speaker 1: that's just a given with wealthy people. Of course there's
31:58
Speaker 1: Alimonian child support. Well, there may not have been child
32:01
Speaker 1: support because the children are older, so once the kids
32:04
Speaker 1: are adults. I do believe and listen, it may vary
32:07
Speaker 1: from state to state, but I don't think this had
32:10
Speaker 1: anything to do with finances. This had to do with
32:12
Speaker 1: being left and that this mother did not feel she
32:16
Speaker 1: had anything to look forward to in her life, and
32:19
Speaker 1: the rest of her family did. Her husband may have
32:22
Speaker 1: had a younger girlfriend. Both her kids were going to
32:26
Speaker 1: go off and have their own careers and their own futures.
32:30
Speaker 1: They were all leaving her at the same time, and
32:34
Speaker 1: this was something that she simply could not have happened
32:37
Speaker 1: and she could not tolerate, especially when she was probably
32:41
Speaker 1: profoundly depressed about herself and what she had available to
32:46
Speaker 1: her moving forward. So what we see very often with
32:50
Speaker 1: Instagram and when you go on an adult trip with
32:53
Speaker 1: your adult children. Any mother knows that there are moments,
32:56
Speaker 1: there are moments that really don't go well, and sometimes
33:00
Speaker 1: times the posting is about how you want your life
33:02
Speaker 1: to come off, how you want your life to be.
33:06
Speaker 1: It doesn't necessarily reflect the reality, but it reflects the
33:10
Speaker 1: hope of how you hope other people will view your
33:13
Speaker 1: life and how you want to view your life. Doctor
33:15
Speaker 1: Tim Gallagher, a medical examiner for the State of Florida.
33:19
Speaker 1: What does this scenario tell you about the violence involved
33:25
Speaker 1: in these murderers? Well, the crime scene can certainly tell
33:28
Speaker 1: you about the violence of the attack. Some things that
33:32
Speaker 1: we look for in our medical examiner's office is how
33:36
Speaker 1: many times were each of the victims shot. Oftentimes in
33:42
Speaker 1: times of a very high emotional stress, will find that
33:45
Speaker 1: the victims are shot, but quite a number of times,
33:49
Speaker 1: ten twenty thirty times, something that we call overkill. And
33:53
Speaker 1: this is an emotional reaction that they're having at the
33:57
Speaker 1: time that they're killing the person that they tend to
34:00
Speaker 1: over kill them to keep shooting at them even when
34:04
Speaker 1: clearly they are deceased, So that is an emotional release
34:08
Speaker 1: that they have during the act. Other things that we
34:12
Speaker 1: look for is the severity of the defense wounds. Were
34:17
Speaker 1: they victims of violently defending themselves? Does the place does
34:23
Speaker 1: the crime scene show a really disturbed or ransacked type
34:31
Speaker 1: apartment or ransacked type a conda where they were. So
34:35
Speaker 1: all of these things, when put together, can show the
34:38
Speaker 1: circumstances leading up to the fatal act and the emotion
34:42
Speaker 1: that was involved that may have triggered the way. Jeff Cortes,
34:46
Speaker 1: former FBI special agent way in. I think at this
34:49
Speaker 1: point in the investigation, much of the emphasis is going
34:52
Speaker 1: to be on determining motivation and degree of planning. You know,
34:56
Speaker 1: they're going to want to understand at what point, you know,
34:59
Speaker 1: the gun was acquired. They're gonna be looking at emails,
35:03
Speaker 1: text messages between the family members, talking to the husband, neighbors, friends,
35:07
Speaker 1: and looking to as you know. I think doctor Ludwood
35:11
Speaker 1: Ludwig insightly outlined looking for the motivation behind it, all
35:19
Speaker 1: the h the extent of the planning, so that we
35:23
Speaker 1: could identify red flags in the future that might be
35:26
Speaker 1: helpful in stopping these types of crimes from happening to
35:30
Speaker 1: other families. Jason Ocean's defense attorney out of New York.
35:35
Speaker 1: What do you think a tragic occurrence for the city US. Certainly,
35:42
Speaker 1: folks should be on people being aware of of what's
35:47
Speaker 1: going on around them when it's premeditated within a family.
35:51
Speaker 1: In an aspect of crime like this, Uh, people have
35:55
Speaker 1: to be more alert, see something, say something. I think
35:59
Speaker 1: that's critical. I think doctor Gallagher talked about that and
36:03
Speaker 1: certain triggers. That's really the pre eminent aspect of the
36:08
Speaker 1: takeaway from this tragedy. Perhaps that couldn't have been avoided,
36:13
Speaker 1: but we'd like to think that going forward, we can
36:16
Speaker 1: do better as a society in being alert to mental
36:20
Speaker 1: health issues. We wait as justice and falls. Nancy Grace
36:23
Speaker 1: Crime Story, signing off goodbye friend,