Latest / Beyond The Beacon / The best call of his life: How this former NBA referee rediscovered his faith and became a deacon

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The best call of his life: How this former NBA referee rediscovered his faith and became a deacon · Beyond The Beacon

• 0:07
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to Beyond the Beacon with Bishop Kevin Sweeney, a podcast of the Diocese of Patterson, New Jersey.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_01: Join us for conversations about our Catholic faith, and together, let's strive to live a life of faith, hope, and love.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for joining us.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: I'm Jay Agnis.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_01: With me is Bishop Kevin Sweeney, and our guest today, Deacon Steve Javi.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_01: Hi.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks, thanks for having me.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_01: How are you doing?
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks for having me on this thing.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_00: Happy day after St.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_00: Patrick's Day.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_00: That's right.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_00: We're recording this on uh uh March 18th, um, which is the feast of St.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_00: Cyril of Jerusalem, um, who gets the shorts uh uh shifts shrift sometimes because everybody says happy St.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: Patrick's Day, everybody says happy St.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_00: Joseph's Day.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_00: Nobody says happy St.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_00: Cyril's Day.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_00: Happy St.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_00: Cyril's Day, yeah.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_01: And how and how was New York City yesterday at the St.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_00: Patrick's at the Mass before the parade.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and Archbishop Hicks, his first uh time is uh um so uh do they celebrate much in uh in Philly for St.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: Patrick's Day?
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_03: Every Irish person celebrates, whether it be Philly, New York, Boston, doesn't matter.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_03: They all celebrate.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_03: And in the hell to that's right.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, Bishop Hicks talked about that.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_00: He said we're gonna sell twice, he said, we're gonna celebrate in the morning, we're gonna celebrate in the afternoon, in the evening, and all day.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_00: So pretty good.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_00: Uh but uh he did a I think he did a good job.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_00: And uh so in it was a little chilly, but it wasn't cold and it was sunny, so um uh little bit of a parade and went to uh uh uh lunch and uh so it was great.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_00: And then uh I make an a uh uh annual stop in recent years at um Murph's in Totowa.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_00: There's a local place where they uh so I was uh glad to know.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_00: It had to be hopping yesterday.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_00: It was, yes, yes, yes, yes.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_01: And we had thanks for sending your photos from yesterday, they're up on your Instagram account.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um and we are in now the fourth week of Lent, so um it's uh amazing how quickly it goes.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_00: And um and um we're starting um the uh NCAA uh basketball tournament, so being with Deacon Steve uh can give us a little chance to uh talk about maybe the intersection of uh sports.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_00: There'll be a lot of attention uh on uh March Madness, as they say.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um but uh hopefully we'd hope for as much attention sometimes on Lent and Holy Week.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_00: Uh but uh but but we can uh Jesus talked about what people knew, right?
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_00: So uh exactly right.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_01: Good.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_01: So a little more about Deacon Steve.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_01: So Deacon Steve Javi is a retired NBA referee of 25 years and currently an analyst with ESBN.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_01: He is among a handful of referee referees to officiate a thousand games, actually 1,780 in total, including playoffs and NBA final games.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_01: He was a highly respected official and one of the league's toughest, known for having a quick whistle and temper in his early days.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_01: Among his legendary moments was ejecting not just Portland's play-by-play announcer one night, but tossing then Washington Bullets mascot from the game.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_01: As far as we know, Deacon Steve is the only permanent deacon who is a former NBA official, and he drove up from the Philadelphia area to tell us all about it.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_00: So I think he did too much research, but I learned a little bit.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: Holy moly.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_00: I uh I uh watching the Knicks and the Pacers and the Bulls and uh over in the uh 90s, I guess those um Riley Van Gundy teams uh uh often saw Steve uh uh flying his trade uh trying to keep the guys apart at time.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_03: That was there, they were tough games to work.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_03: You talk about the three teams right there in Chicago, right?
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, go everybody's gone after Jordan with the Knicks, you know, and the Bulls, and then of course the pistons you throw in there.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_03: That that was not an easy time.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: Did you do any uh Chicago, Detroit, the bad boys, uh when they wouldn't let Pippen get to the rim?
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_03: Oh my gosh, I know.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_03: I I did a number of those games, but not that game in particular.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, there was always um And then there was the heat too.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_00: There was the when when uh Riley went to the to the heat in Van Gundy, uh I think that was the leg incident, right?
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_03: Where the morning went down to the heat there and then that's right, yeah.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_03: It was uh it was a physical time.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_03: I mean it's funny because even now when I'm at the replay center doing my job for ESPN and the announcers start going, well, this is really physical out there, and then we're going to be compared to Ewing and Mason and Oakley and uh Ewing, Mason, Oakley, John Starks, and um Rolando Blackman, I think.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_00: No, um no, uh Derek uh no.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the point carrier.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_00: The point Derek Harper, right.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_00: I felt uh Detroit, those would have had five that have given I said they weren't the most talented or the highest scoring, but they I think they might have won the uh award for the team that you don't want to meet in an alley.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_00: That's redundant.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_00: With the the the the two Williams on the um um uh who were the Detroit teams were pretty tough as well.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um so um but um uh uh Oh the Indiana team was tough.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_00: Dick Smith's and the two brothers, uh the two guys with the same last name.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: Uh Dale Davis.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_00: Davis, and Dale Davis.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right, right.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: And Miller.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_03: Uh that was the Eastern Conference was tough back then.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_03: I speaking of like the um uh the the Knicks and the Bulls, I did have unfortunately unfortunate time of being at a game in Chicago Stadium where the fight got into like the third or fourth row into the stands, and we're trying to break it up with Starks and all these guys.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_03: And you look two rows up, there's the commissioner, David Stern, looking down, and you sat there and go, oh boy.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_00: That wasn't the uh run of a test game, was it?
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_00: No, that was the one.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_00: I saw that on TV, thank God.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_00: I wasn't there.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my god.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_01: So we we're talking a lot of sports.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_01: We still have to open up in prayer, Benjamin.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, yes, yes.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_00: And we're gonna um uh ask the Lord to to guide us and um giving thanks for the blessings that we share and the recreation sometimes that we need.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_00: And um, so let us place ourselves in God's presence in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_00: Giving thanks to God for the gifts and blessings of each and every day.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: For those who are called and respond to the call to serve the Lord, praying for Deacon Steve and his ministry, and asking the Lord to continue to bless our diocese, the archives of Philadelphia, and the church throughout the world, continuing to pray for peace.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_00: We join our prayers together as one as we pray, as Jesus has taught us.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_00: Our Father, who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name, thy kingdom come, thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us, and lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_00: Our Lady Seat of Wisdom, Mother of the Church, pray for us.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_00: Saint Joseph, pray for us, Saint Cyril of Jerusalem, pray for us, Saint Sebastian, pray for us.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_00: All holy men and women, pray for us.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_00: Name of the Father, the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_00: I believe Saint Sebastian is the patron saint of athletes, I think.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if there's a patron saint of referees.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I gotta I gotta I don't know what that one is.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_00: I gotta find out, yeah.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um well thank you, Deacon Steve, for taking the trip and uh and joining us uh again as a treat for me as a as a sports fan, but as a bishop, um uh and as a as a Catholic um to see um someone who's you know really had a very high profile on the public uh arena, let's say, and uh um uh recognizable to any NBA fans.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: But to I was uh I guess it was about a year ago when you were on the Jesuitical podcast, and uh I was really grateful to hear that conversation.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um but um maybe you can just tell us a little bit about uh your faith growing up and um and uh was it towards the end of the your career where you and I think it was you really when we talk about hearing the call, um uh something about the the deacon and c the the acne came into your mind or heart.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_00: Is that right and pray?
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, Bishop, it's it's it's a long story, but I'll I'll try to keep it, you know, where it's okay.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_03: Um but first of all, I just praise God because I never thought I'd ever be sitting in this situation.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_03: I every day I mean when I look in the mirror and I put my collar on before I go to mass, I still can't believe that he's called me to serve him and his church.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_03: And it's just I just thank him.
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_03: It's all gratitude.
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_03: In my age and what he's done for me in my life, it's all gratitude.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_03: It really is.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_03: Um but I I you know I give credit to um obviously the Lord, but I give credit to my parents.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_03: My parents were um the first ones to raise me.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_03: They were Catholic.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_03: I was a cradle Catholic.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_03: My my dad's brother, my uncle Tony, was a priest in the Archdiocese of Philadelphia for almost 70 years.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_03: One of my not because he was a priest, but he was like one of my favorite uncles, just a cool guy.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_03: Like you and I, we'd love he loved sports.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_03: So it was like to me, it humanized him more because priests sometimes can be like people are they're over here.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_03: Right, right.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_03: But it's like, no.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_03: Bishop Kevin loves sports, my uncle Tony loves sports, I love sports, and it's like the Catholic faith, both and, not either or.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_03: Exactly.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_03: And that's what I try to tell guys.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_03: So we'll get into that a little later.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_03: But my faith growing up, my dad being, of course, the brother of a priest, we went to confession every two weeks.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_03: Sat in the second row at church every Sunday.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_03: St.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_03: Philip, as a matter of fact.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, look at that.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_03: That's what I was talking to Jay about earlier.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_03: So St.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_03: Philip when I was growing up.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_03: And I can remember going to church every, you know, every Sunday and confession every um every two weeks.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_03: And so they brought me up the right way.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_03: They gave me the foundation, and I'm glad they did, because obviously I didn't always follow that as I got older.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_03: I got my independence, as I say.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_03: It seems like once I got my driver's license, um, it would be like, okay, mom and dad, I'm not going to mass with you at eight.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_03: I'll take the car and I'll go to 12 o'clock mass.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_03: But I wasn't going to St.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_03: Philip's, I'd go to St.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_03: Skipp's.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_03: You know what I mean?
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_03: So uh unfortunately.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_03: Luckily I can laugh about it now, um, and I'm not telling anybody to do that or anybody who has a driver's license because I wish that I had the faith I have now back then.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_03: But it's all in God's time, and I realize that.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_03: So Catholic High School.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_03: Catholic High School, LaSalle uh high school in Philadelphia, and went on to Temple University in Philadelphia also.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_03: So I was raised by the Christian brothers too.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_03: Um it was a great time to go, you know, go through LaSalle.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_03: They were just wonderful there too.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_03: But the faith growing up, I mean, uh, it was all right there.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_03: Um unfortunately, uh, Bishop Kevin is that I I left the faith when I got my independence because I thought I knew better.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_03: You know, it's like I thought, you know, the world revolved around me and my talents, not the talents that the Lord gave me.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_03: And uh unfortunately I carried that through my young adults in my in my uh college into my twenties and so on and so forth.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_00: And we know sometimes it uh takes time to uh uh appreciate uh our priorities and uh you know living in the world that we live, and Jesus called us to be in the world but not of the world.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um but uh and and we can find a lot of um similarities and and intersection between faith and uh St.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_00: Paul speaks about the athlete and uh running the race.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um but um uh it it can also be a distraction and we you know we face challenges of uh uh sports on Sunday mornings, uh competing uh literally with with mass.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um but um uh in terms of the interest in sports, uh which again I don't think it's as common today.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_00: I read uh was it in high school, I think, um football, baseball, and basketball.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, played all three there.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_03: Um I I played only two years of football, but I played like four years of uh you know baseball and basketball there.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_03: My first love, just like yours, was baseball.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_03: And I think you were a pitcher too, right, Bishop.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_03: At the end, at the end.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_03: So I was a pitcher also.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_03: Um and I I just loved it.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_03: I love you know playing baseball.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_03: Did you play at Temple?
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_03: I did.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_03: Um I always I always like to tell the story about the um the impact that I had.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_03: Now, the older we get, we can start talking about ourselves a little older.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_03: But the impact I had on Temple baseball.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_03: At the time in the 70s, St.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_03: John's was really good too.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_03: Always very good.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Seton Hall was very good, yeah, Frank Seton Hall was very good.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_03: Rick Saron was a catcher at the time from Seton Hall.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_03: So we had some good robberies there.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_03: But the Temple was one of the top teams in the East.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_03: And the year before I got to Temple University, they went to the College World Series.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_03: Wow.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_03: The year after I left Temple, they went to the College World Series.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_03: So that's the impact I had on those four years.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_03: They had a drought for four years when I was there.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_03: But I enjoyed it.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_03: It was really a lot of fun.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_00: And um and some minor league baseball.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_03: Minor league baseball, I signed with the Orioles, um, pitched in the single A baseball for just about just a year.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_03: Next year at spring training, I got released.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_03: So my dream, as some of our dreams are, right, um, it just like went up in smoke.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_03: And I was like, oh my gosh.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_03: And Jay and I were talking earlier about um, you know, if my dream, if my plans came through instead of the Lord's plans, what would it look like?
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_03: And I know one thing, it couldn't be any better than what the Lord has planned for me.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_03: And that's what I try to tell people because the fact that sometimes we think when we don't reach that one goal or we don't reach that one dream, that our life, oh my gosh, what's what's the Lord's got better plans for you.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_03: If you think you have good plans, just wait.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_03: He's gonna have better plans, and that's what he's done for me too.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_00: And um so I think uh did you look into baseball umpiring, but uh saw a little uh uh uh basketball became a little bit more attractive from the refereeing uh um side.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and then uh we can long MBA career, but at some point you came back to the faith.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_00: Uh yeah where take us maybe to the sure yeah I'll try to take you there.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_03: Like my first um I got in the MBA at the age of 30, 30, turning 31, so I did my first year.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_00: And CBA, Continental Basketball League.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_00: I had learned about that.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh, yeah.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_03: I know Jay and I were talking about the CBA.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_03: My gosh, Phil Jackson, we were just telling some stories earlier about Phil Jackson.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_03: He and I came up together in the CBA.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_03: Was he refined?
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_03: No, he was coaching.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, okay.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_03: He was coaching there, and we had we had some run-ins back then too.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_03: You know, so by the time we got to the NBA, we really respected each other.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_03: And I liked Phil.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_03: Phil was a good guy, I really did.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_03: I respect his ability to coach.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_03: But um my first like four years in the league, I was single.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and still faith-wise, uh, I call myself a creester, right?
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_03: Christmas and Easter I'd go to.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_03: And even then, I always thought the church had it wrong, right?
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_03: I had it right.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_03: You know, the the uh the school of uh Steve was right, uh, little did I know.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_03: But I met my wife at the airport, going in and out of Philadelphia Airport because we traveled a lot.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_03: My wife was a teacher by trade, but she worked part-time at U.S.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_03: Airways in Philadelphia as a gate agent.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_03: And I would run into her.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_03: And beautiful woman, and you know, talking to people, and we got to know the supervisors there because you need their help when you've flights cancel and so on as you're traveling that much.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_03: So Mary Allen uh I met, would talk to her.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_03: We flirt back and forth.
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_03: She would say she flirted a lot more with me when I was like kind of a chicken to ask her out because as guys, I don't know about anybody else here, but we don't like rejection.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_03: And so I sit there and said, this beautiful girl who wouldn't say yes to go out with me, but I finally got the um finally got the guts to ask her out.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_03: But the one thing, even prior to that, this is before social media.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_03: Um, no Instagram, no Facebook.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_03: You had to ask other people about somebody else to find out.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_03: Now it's not that now you go online, you find out about everybody, right?
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_03: So I would go up to everybody at U.S.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_03: Airways, and what I did, Mary Ellen, her big name was Kennedy, right?
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, what's your story?
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_03: What's going on?
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_03: And everyone, besides saying, oh, she's a very nice woman, and blah, everyone says she's really Catholic.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_03: Everyone.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_03: I said, how cool is that?
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, now that I look back, I hope someday that somebody can sit there and say, Steve Javi was really Catholic.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_03: That's what a testimony to your faith.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_03: Well, of course, I hear that, hear that me kind of like pushed my faith away for a number of years, going like, well, I'm Catholic.
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_03: Well, we have something in common, right?
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_03: So after the first date, after the first date, we went out to an Italian restaurant in South Philly, enjoyed each other's company, and I said, Okay, I gotta try to impress this girl.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_03: Because guys are as a guy, you always have to try to outdo it.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_03: And they said the girls are like, oh, okay, it's great.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_03: Halfway through the week, I call her up.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_03: I said, Mary Ellen, you have a good time?
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, we did.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_03: But well, are you free for this weekend?
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe you can go out again.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_03: She goes, I'd love to.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_03: What would you like to do?
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_03: I go, how about we go to mass and brunch afterwards?
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_03: I hadn't been to mass, I don't know how long.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_03: And but I just figured it's a good way of getting in good with this pretty girl, right?
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_03: So you're gonna appreciate this little story here, uh, Bishop Kevin.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_03: So we pick her up, go to Mass, and all I'm thinking about is brunch afterwards.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not thinking about the mass.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_03: And Mary Allen, like my parents, like to sit up front, you know.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_03: So we're up front, okay, we're sitting there and they go, all right, I can put up 45 minutes an hour, I can do that for her.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_03: Come on.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_03: Well, then now the priest, you know, starts, and now he's now he's gonna give his homily.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_03: And I have to be careful, right?
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_03: Because I give homilies now.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm not gonna be throwing the.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_03: Little did I know that people would be critiquing me as I critiqued, unfortunately, this priest.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_03: Uh and I critiqued him, and I and obviously I wasn't listening.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_03: It was it didn't really resonate with me.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like talking about hardness of heart, right?
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_03: And that's what it was.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_03: So, but I kept thinking about that's okay.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_03: Once I'm out of here, it's like we're going to brunch.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_03: So finally the mass is over.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_03: Marielle and I were walking down to the restaurant for brunch in Philly.
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_03: And we start talking about the mass for some reason.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_03: She goes, Oh, that was really a good mass.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_03: I went, What?
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_03: She goes, Well, yeah.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_03: I said, Did you hear that priest?
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_03: I nothing he said really resonated with me.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_03: And she said, Well, it didn't resonate.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_03: She goes, Well, do you have anybody you could pray for?
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_03: I said, What do you mean?
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_03: She goes, Your family, your friends.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_03: Couldn't you have just said a little prayer at that time for them?
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_03: Or couldn't you have prayed to the Holy Spirit and said, you know, touch me with something that this priest is saying?
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_03: She goes, basically, she goes, Well, you you said you got nothing out of it.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_03: What did you put into it?
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_03: And she stopped me in my tracks, Bishop Kevin.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_03: She was right.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_03: I expected to get something for giving nothing.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_03: And that that changed my I mean, we still, my wife and I still talk about it.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_03: It's over 35 years now, and we still remember stopping on the sidewalk and those exact words.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_03: And it resonates with me, not only just through my my Catholic faith life, but in all life.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_03: We get out of something what we put into it.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_03: And and it's so true.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_03: From that day on, I just said I just saw the kind of person she was, the joy that she had, and she's the one that brought me back to my faith.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_00: So it's and she had been raised Catholic herself, uh, Catholic her whole life, went to St.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_03: Joe's University in Philly, never uh never left the church at all, like me, and a lot of people my age left and came back.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_03: She never she never left whatsoever.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_03: Very I don't think anybody loves the Lord more than my wife.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_03: We were sitting there this morning in prayer because we sing morning prayer together.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_00: Beautiful.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_03: And this is what I I invite all the men out there, you know.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_03: Of course, at my age I go off on tangents.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_03: But I remember when we first got married, Mary Ellen and I, and this obviously way before I was thinking of the call for a deacon, she'd be praying.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_03: She goes, You want to pray with me?
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_03: And I go, Nah, not me.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_03: You got your thing, I got my thing.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_03: That's how guys are.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_02: Right, right.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_03: And then now being you know in the formation, become a deacon, we start praying together.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_03: It's the best thing in the world.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_03: Because I tell guys, guess what?
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_03: We all can wake up on that left side of the bed, and sometimes both of us do at the same time.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_03: Well, when you say, Can we say morning prayer?
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_03: All of a sudden you forget all about that.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_03: That five and seven minutes of morning prayer, the liturgy of the hours, all of a sudden, once you're done, you forget about what you're arguing about.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_03: And I tell guys, drop your ego, drop your pride, like I had.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_03: I had that ego and pride, like, no, guys, we we real men don't do that.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_03: No, real men do that.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_03: And I just encourage every guy to pray with their wives because it'll make your relationship that much better, and you're getting closer to the Lord, too.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, my wife and I try to pray together.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so can we pivot back to basketball?
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_01: So so now this was you were about four to five years into officiating, right, when you came back to the to the faith.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_01: How did uh maybe you could tie the faith into your your day job?
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_01: So how did it impact uh your day job and and what you were doing on the court there?
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_01: Or maybe your interior.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, Jay, you know, I always um I always prayed before a game.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_03: It sounds kind of weird, even though I wasn't going to church or something.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_03: I bet I would pray before the game.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_03: I just say, uh, give me the strength, courage, and the stamina, Lord, to do you know be able to do my job tonight.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_00: So sorry to interrupt, but just because uh uh I Jen, I just listened to the book written by Jay Wright, um, and uh he speaks so highly of his priest chaplain.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_00: Amongst athletes, there is an openness to prayer, right?
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, uh and you're saying as a ref, even though you weren't practicing your faith, you'd say a prayer before the game.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_00: But I I uh whether it's football, basketball, maybe less so in baseball, although with uh several Latino Hispanic players, I think you say it.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um but um but uh so um I I think that's something that's that's uh an area we could it's certainly hearing Jay Wright talk about the the impact of priest chaplain and and faith on uh he said whatever you know um religion the players were, um we were we were sharing values and and and asked him just to be open and he talked about uh you know how it helped them as a team.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_00: But um, but go ahead.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sorry, you were saying you prayed before games and Jay was asking about uh you know uh how it affected your day job in terms of Yeah, I mean I how it affected I you know may maybe I think what it what it is too, Jay, is that sometimes I think we get wrapped up in ourselves.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_03: I think when I got into my faith more and so it was it was more about not just about me, because I have two other partners on the floor.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_03: It's all about them too.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_03: Whereas some people can get wrapped up that if you're the crew chief on the game and you want people to know who you are and so on and so.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_00: How about getting to mess?
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, over the years did it become something that uh because you were traveling a lot, right?
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_03: Interesting.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_03: That's a great question.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_03: I um once once I my wife helped me, you know, get back to my faith, I started going to mass every Sunday on the road.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_03: I had some favorite churches, and then when I started going to daily mass, which has been over 25 years ago, um, there was some, especially when you're staying in major cities, you can you can get the mass, there's a noontime mass at the cathedrals or downtown churches.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_03: So it's not you don't have to be there at seven or eight in the morning, you can go at noontime.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_03: So I mean, the one in Portland, we did the Mariette right there, walk right up the hill, and there's a church for noontime mass.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_00: Uh uh.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes it's about what we put into it, right?
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_00: When where there's a will, there's a way, if you want to.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and maybe uh I try to um, even though we're getting towards the end of Lent, it's not too um uh I think daily mass is one of the um unsung or best kept spiritual secrets, right?
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_00: If uh if you want to grow in a spiritual life, uh would you say that that was the absolutely I I think that helped me.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_03: I I went through a really, really difficult time, uh Bishop.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_03: I won't get I we we can get into some other time or today, but um had to do with the NBA referees.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_03: You could look this up probably.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_03: The NBA referees and um uh the IRS came after the NBA referees with expense money.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_03: And it was had nothing to do, they didn't they didn't want to s settle it civilly.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_03: They charged me, I was indicted by the United States government.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_03: Uh for for they said I owed over three years, three years, they said I owed thirteen thousand dollars.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, jeez.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_03: Now I'm I was paying five times more than that in taxes, and they said, well, you did this fraudulently, so and so.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_03: So it was a very difficult time in my life, and that's when I started going to Daily Mass.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_03: The the times when you sit there, you've heard people say that you had to give it over.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_03: I had to give it over.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_03: When you read an indictment that says United States of America versus Steve Jabby, that's pretty serious.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_03: And there's no deal making right there.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and and you were ended up being acquitted, is that right?
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_00: I ended up being acquitted.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_03: Uh and so those two weeks of the year.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_00: But they were really trying to for$13,000, you couldn't.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_03: It wasn't like I can go in and say, well, I I didn't know I did wrong.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_03: I'll write the check to you.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_03: Right, right.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_03: And and then they said, nope, we think you guys were doing this as a conspiracy, and they charged so many guys, and so many guys pleaded guilty to a felony, which is a shame.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_03: It really is.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_03: But um, that was the time that I started going to daily mass, and I just realized the power of giving it over to the Lord.
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_03: Not that doesn't mean we should sit home and just say, okay, let's see what happens.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right, right.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_03: No, you just do what you have to do, and wherever it's gonna take you, the Lord's gonna help you.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_03: He's gonna put you in the spot.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_03: I still remember, Bishop Kevin, right before the jury, we found out that the jury made their decision.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_03: It was on four different counts.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_03: And I remember sitting at the table with my lawyer, and my lawyer, this is un courtrooms in in real life aren't like TV.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_03: My my um my attorney says, Bring Mary in, I'll have her sit here, you know, right next to you during the time that they're gonna read the jury the verdict.
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_03: And she did, and we sat there.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_03: And I remember right before they came, the jury came out, looking up and just praying to the Lord and praying to Mother Mary, and just saying, Whatever you have planned for me, I can handle.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_03: If that means I have to go away to uh prison or something, I'm doing it because you know, I'll do it because you want me to.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_03: And whatever it is, I I accepted whatever my outcome would be.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_03: And I just put it in his hands.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_03: And I think that daily mass, when we, as this society nowadays, everybody's got stuff going on.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_03: Bishop Kevin, when you preach every you know, every week, when you look out there, if you were to ask somebody who doesn't have stuff going on, there wouldn't be a hand raise.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_03: Daily mass, again back to your question, daily mass to me helps you trust the Lord, helps you hand things over for that day, even, you know, or maybe that week, and just say, Lord, I can't handle this.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_00: And receiving communion every day, how it strengthens us, right?
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, uh, you know, uh, yeah, right.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_00: And and also listening to God's word and whether it's the most inspiring or most exciting, it's still in the background, right?
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_00: Allowing the Lord to speak to us.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_03: I know at the times when I don't go to I miss daily mass a couple of times, not receiving the Eucharist, I can f physically almost feel it, mentally feel it.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_03: So it has something to do.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_01: So what about tell us about your preaching now?
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_01: So you you mentioned that priest who was giving that homily back at that mass with your wife.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_01: Uh what's what's that like for you?
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_03: I think it's the most challenging thing for me.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_03: I can sit and talk to you about sports.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_03: I can stand up in front of a group of referees and you know hold a clinic if you want to.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_03: You're talking about people's eternal souls.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, that's intimidating.
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_03: I still remember, and I'm gonna get back, again, tangents, right?
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_03: I still remember when we were practicing my class, who were gonna be ordained like three days later, went to the cathedral to practice.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_03: We all knew we were gonna have to preach that Sunday because our after being ordained Saturday, Sunday's our first mass and we're gonna preach.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_03: Every guy we came into the cathedral that Thursday, all the women are going, isn't this exciting?
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_03: And every guy's got that look on their face going, exciting, I can't preach on Sunday.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_03: And we knew we knew what the gospel reading was you know months ago, but we it's just that, oh my gosh, I have to do what?
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_03: Um it, Jay, it is the most challenging.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but he's never failed.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_03: He's never failed me.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_00: Did I read correctly that you were in formation seven years?
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, in Philly, it was seven years when I started.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_03: Wow.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_03: Now they put it down to six.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_03: Wow.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_03: So uh for us it's four?
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_00: Uh five.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_00: Five, yeah.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's five and all.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um uh we'll have to share this with um our deacons.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_00: Uh um, we actually I'm gonna be shortly meeting with uh we're gonna have about eight guys ordained at at the end of May.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um how did uh formation prepare you uh for preaching but also for for ministry?
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um and and maybe um how did it impact uh you know your living out of your faith now that you I think you said you it just kind of came into your mind the word deacon, right?
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_03: Or the possibility and and you spoke to your pastor and yeah what happened was um after I retired, uh which I couldn't referee anymore because my knees were bad, um the Lord blessed me with 25 years of something that I just had so much fun.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_03: I enjoyed it, you know, I really did.
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_03: But I also knew I mean it well, I had a couple knee surgeries during my career, and I knew there was something else I was gonna do in life because I was not fulfilled, Bishop.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, it was I had fun, I wouldn't change it.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_03: Right because you mean you love sports, I love sports, I made a living in sports, still do, right?
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_03: And I love it.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_03: But I remember sitting there at times during lunch by myself and just saying, you know, like there's gotta be more to this.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, I have to leave this world, not being I I blow a whistle and call fouls on basketball players, and that's supposed to be important?
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_03: No.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_03: Um and I just knew this had to be something else.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_03: So when I retired, I just prayed to the Lord.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_03: I said, I want to serve you.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_03: I said, because you've blessed me in my life so much with everything.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_03: Family, friends, vocal I mean, uh my my yeah, my my professionally knows.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_03: And it was just amazing.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_03: So I said, Lord, I just want to serve you.
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_03: Jeff Cavins came to our parish, all right, given a talk.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_03: And this is I retired in the end of June of one year of 2011.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_03: This is now December.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_03: So I've been praying, and like the word, I think it's a bad meaning, sometimes the meaning of the word discernment.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_03: I think people think discern you're on your knees 24-7 praying.
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_03: No.
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_03: Discerning is uh recognizing that the Lord's gonna have something for you.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_03: Playing.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_00: Show me, show me, show me.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_03: Show me exactly, show me what it is, please.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_03: You know, every day I'd sit in my prayer chair and go, like, Lord, I'm I'm open to it.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_03: Show me.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_03: Well, months go by and nothing.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_03: Jeff Kavan speaks at our parish and he starts talking about how God speaks to you.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_03: And I remember looking at him going, like, he might be speaking to you, but he hasn't been speaking to me.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, help me here.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_03: Well, during the course he's talking about how God does speak to us, whether it be with putting thoughts in our mind, whether it be putting people in our lives, or putting us all in situations.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_03: And then we just have to be open to recognizing it.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_03: And at that moment, when he was describing that, the word deacon came into my mind.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm like, wait a second.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_03: Are you kidding?
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, I really didn't know much about deacons.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_03: We had a couple of our parish, wonderful guys.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_03: Um but I said, Is this what he wants?
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_03: And I couldn't get it out of my mind.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_03: My wife and I go out to dinner after this presentation, and I said, Marion, you're not gonna believe.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_03: Here's what happened.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_03: She's like, Wow.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_03: She goes, You better go see Monsignor.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_03: Monsignor Bricard, my dear friend, who just you know retired, been there for 35 years.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_03: I go knocking on his door the next morning, I go, Hey Monsignor, you got a few moments?
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, what's up, Steve?
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_03: So I tell him the story, and he started laughing.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_03: He goes, Tell what works, brother.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_03: I said, What do you mean?
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_03: He goes, No, he says, if you came in here with a Bible underneath your arm, saying you're he said, I would have thrown you out of here.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_03: He said, the Lord works that way.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_03: But Steve, he's working on your heart.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_03: That doesn't mean you're going to become a deacon, but he's calling you to something.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_03: Something's going on.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_03: Let's just take it just step by step, one foot in front of the other.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_03: Don't get ahead of ourselves and see what happens.
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_00: One one example that is Jeff Cavins himself, uh, that was uh, you know, Bible in a year.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, when you think of what the Lord did through him and and and Father Mike Schmidt's in terms of how many people have, you know, come.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_00: And now, I don't know if you're familiar with the Hallow app, but he's uh very much and he's the every day there, um, you know, uh uh so yeah, um, and uh I mean I think he's been a scripture scholar for many years, but to think how, again, the Lord um used uh someone to uh uh give a higher profile to to to the word of God and and and to the and to the the spiritual life.
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, you know, uh I I think there's some we've been looking at and hearing some reports on how the church is growing, and there seems to be uh a return of even young adults to the church, and I think there's gonna be a you know a larger number of um adults coming in to receive the sacraments um at Easter.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_00: So um I and many have said with the craziness uh that we're seeing in our world, uh uh I think people are gonna are st are starting to see more and more a need for something.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, no, no doubt, no doubt.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_01: So um can we talk a little more about your NBA?
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely, fun.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_01: I although you know what struck me with the Jesuit Whittlecool interview that you gave uh was the kind was the idea of humility.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um maybe maybe we can talk about that a little a little bit.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um like so here's here's referee Steve Jaffey Javi who uh I mean you're constantly being screw you know, you're making these tough plays that are impacting a game situation that you could rejecting players occasionally and uh mascots occasionally.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_01: So what and it's all on national television, international television.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_01: Um and you're being screamed at by the coaches occasionally.
• 33:13
  SPEAKER_01: So but you're calling these plays and and they're right, but maybe sometimes they're wrong.
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_01: As like what's going through your mind about are you second-guessing yourself?
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_01: I know there's a review process in between uh how it's now.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, yeah.
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_01: And then there's yeah, replay, instant replay.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_03: So I thought I'm gonna answer that in a second with you.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_03: It's funny, this reminded me of something I would say to a coach, because you say coach is yelling at you know, and I tell the coach, only two people can yell at me, my boss and my wife.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_03: You don't look like either one of them, you know.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_03: But no.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um I I when I when I speak about my faith, and I try to relate it to everyday life too, is the the word, and humility can be in with this, is called being objective.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_03: Being objective with yourself.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_03: And as a referee, in order for you to improve, you have to really be objective of when you are wrong.
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_03: And whether that's admitting to a coach that you're wrong, a lot of times uh uh, you know, as we watch games on TV, we see the replay.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_03: The referee hasn't seen it yet, so he doesn't know he's wrong.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_03: He now players and coaches are trying to tell him he's wrong, right?
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_03: As we talked about, but he doesn't personally know he's wrong.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_03: But later on, when you watch the film, you have to be objective and say, you know, Jane, I missed that call.
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_03: Why now why did you miss it?
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_03: Were you out of position?
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_03: Was somebody block you out?
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_03: Did you anticipate the call?
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_03: There's so many reasons that you could so you learn from your mistakes.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_03: Same way with our spiritual life, and I think he related.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_03: We have to be objective.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_03: Nowadays, I have plenty of my buddies who I play golf with and so on to go, well, I'm a good person.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_03: I'm a good guy.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_03: I'm gonna where in the Bible did Jesus say about good guy?
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_03: You know, he likes you being a good guy, but he didn't say that's you know, to get into heaven, right?
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_03: But um, but I just really believe being objective about our shortcomings or our sins.
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_03: And nowadays we compare too much, whether it be on Instagram or social media, well, I'm not as bad as that person.
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not as bad.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_03: We should look at our own own replay.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_03: How was our how did our day go today?
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_03: How who did I treat poorly today?
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_03: Um did I have an argument with my wife, which I should have had more patience with?
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_03: That kind of stuff.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_01: Examination of conscience.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_01: Amen.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_01: You're right.
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_03: And then that's why we have the you know the sacrament of reconciliation to go and say, hey, uh, you know, I need your mercy and your love, your forgiveness.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_00: How many years are you working now with ESPN in your current uh Yeah, that's a great yeah.
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_03: My wife, I was trying to figure that out.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_03: The year I retired in 2011, which I can't believe is 15 years ago.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_03: Time just flies.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_03: I th I think that the following year they got out, I think it was about 14 years.
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_03: Wow.
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_03: And this is before the Replay Center.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_00: Uh Right, Seucaucus, right.
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_03: I used to I used to go up to uh before the Replay Center was in Secaucus, I used to go up to Bristol, Connecticut, and before the at ESPN.
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_03: You know, on the on the set.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_03: That was kind of cool for a person who loves sports to be on the set with those guys.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_03: That's really neat.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_03: And they're and what?
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_03: And they're all really good guys.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_01: So you're driving up to Secaucus now?
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_03: Now from my uh my home to Secaucus, yeah, from Bucks County in Pennsylvania up to Certain Cascadics.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_03: Are there games where you're not on at all?
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_03: Oh matter of fact, I'd say that's more than more likely than not.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_03: Uh but they just have me there in certain games.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_03: Like right now I'm working mainly Saturday nights at 8 30, the ABC uh primetime game, and then Sunday afternoon games.
• 36:28
  SPEAKER_03: But it's just with the ESPN or ABC, not the other networks.
• 36:31
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_03: Um but it's uh I'd say probably 65-70 percent of the time, I really don't get on to comment just when they feel they needed to be.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_03: Right, right.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_00: When they go yeah to the uh to the expert, yeah, right, right, right.
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_00: Uh but it's really cool.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_03: It keeps my keeps my hand in it a little bit too, and I see the referees because I'm at the replay center, and there are always active referees there helping uh referees at other games too.
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_03: So I see the guys come through the replay center.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_00: Uh you know, when we think whether family are relationships or parish, um uh there is um, you know, we look at a at a team, right?
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_00: And you what makes the team successful, whether that be uh a basketball team or a refereeing team, right?
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_00: Uh um uh and those relationships with um with colleagues and um uh and and I think being uh inspired and others who can uh you know the a player might make other team players better, right?
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_00: That's what we would want to be, right?
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_00: Uh a good teammate.
• 37:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um but uh um uh and and maybe uh uh you talked about that relationship when you were reffing with the two other guys and and how you have to be, and you really have to have each other's back.
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_00: You do, yeah.
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um but um uh I I think some of our deacons, and it's certainly in the priesthood uh um uh uh your classmates um uh uh how was that experience in terms of coming into formation and and getting a new group of guys that you got to know at a deeper level, no?
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_03: Amazing, amazing.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_03: And I think you know what I'm gonna say right now.
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_03: In that class, we had we had seven of us, all right, and seven of us ordained.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_00: 2019, you ordained, right?
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_03: 2019, yes.
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_03: Everyone's so different.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_03: Everyone, and then you start thinking about the apostles.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_03: I think of the chosen, much of the chosen.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_03: You know that?
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_03: Because I love that.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_03: Love it, love it.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_03: But I think if we're all so different, and probably would never have been come together in life except for the diaconent formation.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_03: So we do stay in touch, there's no doubt.
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_03: But also forming bonds, Bishop Kevin, within your parish.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I have a parish, St.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_03: Andrew, in Newtown.
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_03: It's the largest one in the Archdiocese of Philadelphia.
• 38:32
  SPEAKER_03: We have almost 7,000 families in the St.
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_03: Andrew.
• 38:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um You're already a pastoral hub, right?
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_00: Archbishop Perez is talking about like.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, yes, but you guys got your own little diocese that way.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_03: I know, we really do.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_03: But uh it's amazing.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_03: The men, the men in St.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_03: Andrew, I think the men have such a big have had a big part of me in my ministry, but also a big part of me of spiritually coming alive because when I got there, they have a small faith group, small faith group, 40 to 50 men every every other Saturday praying the rosary, breaking open the gospel, breaking into groups.
• 39:05
  SPEAKER_03: You don't have to talk, you don't want to talk.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_03: People talk, they do talk.
• 39:08
  SPEAKER_03: I saw guys here when I first went to the men's group, and I didn't say a word.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, I'm gone way back before, and I come home and I said to my wife, go, Mary Ellen, oh my gosh, these guys are incredible.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_03: And the the beautiful thing, hearing like 40-50 guys, which now swells to about 70 in Lent, 40-50 guys pray in the rosary.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_03: Just men praying the rosary and and and offering up our intentions to the Lord every other Saturday and every Saturday in Lent.
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_03: Um, the men are incredible.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_03: So to the deacons also who are going to be ordained, the men in your parish get to know them more.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_03: I I sit there, my best friends right now are men of the parish.
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_03: We and they they love sports.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_03: I love to play golf.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_03: We go on golf trips together.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_03: We take a couple of our priest friends, we play golf.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_03: My one buddy goes, wait a second, this is like the starting of a joke.
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_03: Two priests and a deacon, two priests and a deacon, and another guy walk into a bar, right?
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_03: Or something like that.
• 40:02
  SPEAKER_03: I said, Yeah, but it's amazing.
• 40:04
  SPEAKER_03: I just, again, the Lord has blessed me by putting people in my life, Jay, that I couldn't even imagine.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_03: And I couldn't imagine, I can't imagine my life without them.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_03: I really can't.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_00: Well, if you're looking for a new golf partner, you can have two priests, a deacon, and a bishop.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_00: But uh and uh you so you mentioned to your wife after the Caven's talk um that you this how has the experience been for her um through formation and now um that that you're in ministry?
• 40:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um uh uh there are wives that embrace it.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_00: Uh for some it's a bit of a challenge.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um uh uh is is your wife also involved in the in the parish?
• 40:52
  SPEAKER_00: Uh what's the experience been like for her?
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's a that's a great question too, because even like with your uh deacons are gonna be ordained, I'm sure their wives are thinking what's what's happening, what's going on.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_03: Um I think just from Mary Ellen's experience, is she involved in a parish?
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_03: To the extent that people would think, no, because she has her other things that she does too.
• 41:13
  SPEAKER_03: Um Mary Ellen was president of a um uh a pregnancy center for a number of years, president of the board and so on and so forth.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_03: So she has her own little ministries outside of our parish that she she does.
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_03: But um I I think what happens is sometimes the women feel pressured that they think, oh, my w my husband, you know, is a deacon.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_03: I have to do this.
• 41:35
  SPEAKER_03: You don't have to do that.
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_03: Just your presence alone of working together with your husband is is great is a great thing.
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_03: Um but during formation, Mary Allen felt so I mean she loved going to classes.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_03: She really did.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_03: At the time in Philadelphia, they had they had asked the the women, they they said, you know, we really prefer you come to class, barring any little children or whatever, whatever work, whatever it may be.
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_03: And I'll tell you, we would we had some of the best conversations, my wife and I, during formation.
• 42:02
  SPEAKER_03: Coming home after classes with these brilliant professors, I mean, our faith is so deep as you guys know, and you sit there and go, Can you believe they're talking about this?
• 42:11
  SPEAKER_03: Can you believe they're talking about that?
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_03: The next morning our cup of coffee.
• 42:14
  SPEAKER_03: What did you get in your notes about that?
• 42:16
  SPEAKER_03: And we go and it made us closer too.
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_03: But as far as the women, I mean, I think the women, whatever they feel they want to do or they feel called to do, almost like their husbands, but don't feel pressure that you you have to do this.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_01: You really don't.
• 42:27
  SPEAKER_01: Now, uh if I understood correctly, so your wife's family was very involved in the pro-life movement in Philadelphia?
• 42:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, Jay.
• 42:35
  SPEAKER_03: Um her mom started the uh one of the first uh pro-life, I should say, pregnancy centers in Bucks County.
• 42:42
  SPEAKER_03: And that was, oh my gosh, before I even met Mary Ellen, probably 50 years ago.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_03: And she and her sister, uh my my mother-in-law's sister, which would be Mary Ellen's aunt, they would work together uh helping people in Christ uh the women in crisis pregnancies.
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_03: And from there, this same uh, this same pregnancy center, there's one, two, three centers now, and they they have saved, I think last year they saved uh almost almost 400 babies.
• 43:12
  SPEAKER_03: Whoa.
• 43:12
  SPEAKER_03: But here's the other thing too, Jay, is that it's not just about the baby, it's about the mother.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_00: Walking with moms in need, right?
• 43:17
  SPEAKER_00: We've been doing it for a long time.
• 43:18
  SPEAKER_00: We finally put a name on it, and yes.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, not only up until birth, but after a couple of years afterwards, whatever they need.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's it's grown to incredible and incredible proportions.
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_03: And I just think of her mom, how proud she must be.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_03: God rest herself if she's in heaven looking down, you know, saying, like, look what look what I started.
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_00: There was a great testimony on the Halo app, um, I think the week before last during Lent.
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_00: They're doing the Brothers Kyramatsov Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, then Thursday.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_00: They have a story about somebody kind of coming back to the church and uh current sister of life.
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um, she was uh in college and uh uh her roommate got pregnant, and um she was supportive of the roommate.
• 43:56
  SPEAKER_00: Uh the roommate ended up with the sister of life um and had the child and uh uh and gave the child up for adoption.
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then wanted to keep going back to visit the sister of life, and she was saying to her roommate, her friend, why don't you come visit?
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_00: Why don't you come?
• 44:11
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and next thing she wanted to sermon treat, and she um well uh 20 plus years later, the child wanted to meet her birth mom.
• 44:20
  SPEAKER_00: And the birth mom calls the sister, the sister, can you end?
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um uh I I think the the the the child stayed with the daughter stayed with the sisters in the convent while she was visiting her birth mom, and the sister was driving her back.
• 44:33
  SPEAKER_00: And in the car, the sister said, you know, you're really the reason um when she was in the womb.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um What a great story that is.
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_00: How beautiful.
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my goodness.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_01: Well, what did what did we miss?
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_00: Give me uh uh a couple of names that come to mind.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_00: Phil Jackson, uh uh character or guys that you interacted with, players or coaches, or maybe a guy that was impressive for his uh uh I'm sure there's been a few that had model sportsmanship, right?
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_00: That were general uh uh uh uh anybody or even guys that you worked with uh um uh names that come to mind that um that made an impact in one way or positive or negative.
• 45:12
  SPEAKER_00: No, no, you're a challenge.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_03: I won't I won't name the negative.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_03: We're in the Lenten season and I'd have to go to impression tomorrow.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_03: Or maybe right outside today, right?
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_03: But um the guy the one guy, it's funny, the it always keeps coming to my mind a lot of Duke guys for some reason.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_03: I guess Coach Kay Mess Mold's guy.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_00: Coach K was Deli Mes.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so uh Grant Hill.
• 45:33
  SPEAKER_03: Grant Hill comes to mind as a guy who um just was such a class guy, uh treated you professionally, you know.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_03: Um He was a coach?
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_03: Grant Hill was a player.
• 45:45
  SPEAKER_03: Grant Hill was just great.
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_03: Mark Price, remember the most price?
• 45:47
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, Cleveland's.
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_03: If if Grant Hill or Mark Price argued with you, they were probably right.
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_03: You were wrong.
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_03: Whereas some other guys argued with the ego.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_00: I think with Grant Hill, from what I know, uh, you know, it's something that stands out.
• 46:01
  SPEAKER_00: He during his years it got some attention.
• 46:03
  SPEAKER_00: You know, so often when you see uh someone who's raised the right way, so much of the credit goes to the parents, as you say.
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, even when we look back on our faith, it's God bless uh parents.
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, you know, Derek Jeter, his his mom and dad were always there on the stand, but they would say, you know, that uh he was raised the right way.
• 46:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I I think with Grant Hill, uh his his dad, I think, was a running back for the Dallas Cowboys.
• 46:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right, right, right.
• 46:23
  SPEAKER_00: Calvin Hill.
• 46:24
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, he used to kill the Eagles.
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_03: I'm the Eagles for you.
• 46:27
  SPEAKER_03: He used to kill the Eagles.
• 46:29
  SPEAKER_03: I actually ran into Calvin Hill um when I was refereeing.
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_03: Uh he was working for the Cowboys, I guess, uh in a in some capacity, and he'd come in and out of town and he'd stay at the same hotel the referees did.
• 46:42
  SPEAKER_03: And I ran into him and I introduced myself to him, and he looked like he could still run.
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_03: The guy was just a class man.
• 46:48
  SPEAKER_03: And we talked a lot, I gave him compliments about his son.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_03: And his mom, I think, I think Mrs.
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_03: Hill is an attorney.
• 46:55
  SPEAKER_03: I met her one time.
• 46:56
  SPEAKER_03: And uh, but you're right, just great parents.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_03: And Derek Jeter, even though I'm not a Yankee fan, I love Derek Jeter.
• 47:02
  SPEAKER_03: How do you not like Dark Jeter?
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_03: Even on the ones of the WBC, the baseball, he's just wonderful.
• 47:08
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, right, right.
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_03: I love his analysis and so on.
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_03: He's just a normal guy.
• 47:13
  SPEAKER_00: Uh it's something to see uh him, Big Poppy, and Arod behind the diocese.
• 47:18
  SPEAKER_03: I know.
• 47:19
  SPEAKER_01: The competing all in life, right?
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 47:23
  SPEAKER_01: He he has a connection to my hometown, West Milford, which is in our diocese.
• 47:27
  SPEAKER_01: Uh huh.
• 47:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, definitely.
• 47:28
  SPEAKER_00: Derek Jeta does?
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um I think his mom went to um Pope John, uh, the Catholic high school in Susse County.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 47:35
  SPEAKER_00: So I love it.
• 47:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um anybody else that stands out?
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_00: How about a particular coach that uh uh made an impact on the case?
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_03: You know what?
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_03: There's there's a couple a guy by the name of Paul Silas.
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, sure.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_03: You know, he was a big guy.
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_03: And he looked like he could be really intimidating, right?
• 47:49
  SPEAKER_03: Finest gentleman in the world.
• 47:51
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, there really are.
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, there there are some out there.
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_03: I know that they have pressure on them.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_03: Right, right.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_03: They have to, you know, because their jobs are on the line and all that stuff.
• 47:58
  SPEAKER_03: But all we ask is referees, just like anything Jay and I were talking to a head time, just treat us prof treat as you want to be treated.
• 48:04
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right?
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_00: The golden rule.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_00: There you go, right?
• 48:06
  SPEAKER_03: And they were players.
• 48:07
  SPEAKER_03: Well, why, Steve, why are you yelling at me?
• 48:09
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, that's what you're yelling at me.
• 48:10
  SPEAKER_03: You know?
• 48:11
  SPEAKER_03: But if like I give you Michael Jordan was always professional.
• 48:14
  SPEAKER_03: Always professional.
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_03: Doesn't mean he agreed with me all the time, but he would do it in a way that he wouldn't bring the whole crowd down on you.
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_03: You can handle that.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_03: Nowadays, everybody's like, uh, you know, screaming up and down.
• 48:25
  SPEAKER_03: It's like, just walk, the guy's a human being.
• 48:27
  SPEAKER_03: You know, we're human beings.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_00: Replay has changed things as well, right?
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, now it it in the past they'd be arguing and arguing, and there wasn't much that was going to happen or change, but they would still press it.
• 48:37
  SPEAKER_00: But now um if the if and and I think it's a good thing that, you know, if references are human beings, if they miss a call, then you can go back and say sometimes it takes too long to but uh but they're working on that too, I think.
• 48:48
  SPEAKER_00: Uh yeah, they are.
• 48:49
  SPEAKER_03: And I think you're right.
• 48:49
  SPEAKER_03: I think uh the replay has helped because we want to get plays right.
• 48:52
  SPEAKER_03: I mean the name of a referee is to try to get as many plays right as you can.
• 48:55
  SPEAKER_03: And if you do miss one and they challenge it, well it's good because if it's gonna cost some of the game in, right.
• 49:01
  SPEAKER_03: But I I I I love like if I was refereeing now, because it seems like every whistle they want to challenge.
• 49:06
  SPEAKER_03: Bishop Kevin.
• 49:07
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 49:08
  SPEAKER_03: They twirl it off.
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_03: And if I know I'm right, I'll just get the and the coach starts to argue, I'll go, challenge it then.
• 49:13
  SPEAKER_03: Right, right.
• 49:15
  SPEAKER_03: Challenge, don't argue with it.
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_03: Just challenge it.
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_03: That's right.
• 49:18
  SPEAKER_00: Then we're gonna see who's right.
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um I won't mention names, but there's a few nicks over the years that come to mind.
• 49:23
  SPEAKER_00: Uh uh every time the guy fouls, he it's it's it's uh he he's arguing with the ref.
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_00: It's incredible.
• 49:30
  SPEAKER_00: A couple of guys, and it's like, come on, you've got to be kidding me.
• 49:33
  SPEAKER_03: I know, it's not like it's not like they're making this foul up.
• 49:35
  SPEAKER_03: But I would I told Jay beforehand, we the referees in a locker room, and even after games, we watch a lot of video.
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_03: And that's the way you become better.
• 49:42
  SPEAKER_03: You're objective, you become better.
• 49:44
  SPEAKER_03: And at halftime, it's always good because players and coaches are always trying to put doubt in your mind by saying certain things, uh, every plane, and it's like, am I missing everything?
• 49:54
  SPEAKER_03: It's like it can't be.
• 49:55
  SPEAKER_03: So you go back to the locker room, you look at it, and you know that you're right 90-some percent of the time.
• 49:59
  SPEAKER_03: So you you have to watch film because they would just tear you apart mentally and your ego, we'd be torn apart.
• 50:05
  SPEAKER_03: But you have to you need something to build you back up.
• 50:07
  SPEAKER_03: And and film does that for referees.
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_01: Favorite game or favorite series you've ever officiated?
• 50:13
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, uh, favorite game.
• 50:15
  SPEAKER_03: Uh uh.
• 50:16
  SPEAKER_03: There's two favorite games, and it's my first finals game and my last finals game.
• 50:22
  SPEAKER_03: The first finals game, the reason why it's my favorite, because I reached the epitome of our profession and I worked with my main main mentor, Joe Crawford.
• 50:29
  SPEAKER_03: And Joe and I were we still are dear friends to this day.
• 50:32
  SPEAKER_03: We vacation together with our wives and all.
• 50:35
  SPEAKER_03: And so that was an experience that I never had before.
• 50:38
  SPEAKER_03: Then my last finals game was great because I knew that it was going to be my last game of my career because my knees weren't holding up anymore.
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_03: I was happy to get through my 25th year.
• 50:47
  SPEAKER_03: And I still remember a quick quick thing on the last finals game.
• 50:51
  SPEAKER_03: Um my family was there because they knew it was my last game.
• 50:53
  SPEAKER_03: Mary Allen was there, and some other of my friends, and so on.
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_03: Um and I remember very rarely in the finals game, especially as this was a game six, this this ended the series.
• 51:03
  SPEAKER_03: Dallas beat Miami in Miami in game six.
• 51:06
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, Novitsky, uh Jason Kidd.
• 51:08
  SPEAKER_03: Oh yeah, right, right.
• 51:09
  SPEAKER_03: Um there's a good guy, Jason Kidd.
• 51:11
  SPEAKER_03: There's a good guy.
• 51:12
  SPEAKER_03: Um and I remember, like I said, very rarely do you do you have the ch the luxury of letting your concentration come down in the finals game, especially in the last minute of play.
• 51:23
  SPEAKER_03: But it it was like Dallas is gonna win.
• 51:25
  SPEAKER_03: So they're up like eight or six or eight, they're gonna win.
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_03: And I just remember sitting back and this I caught my wife's eyes in the stands and saying, I wonder what the Lord has planned for me now.
• 51:36
  SPEAKER_03: Because we knew something was gonna happen.
• 51:37
  SPEAKER_03: We didn't know what it was.
• 51:38
  SPEAKER_03: We had no idea that the acne would be in my the cards for me.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_03: But I just knew that somewhere, and we had talked about this prior to the game.
• 51:46
  SPEAKER_03: My wife said, Steve, we've had a great life doing this.
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_03: Traveled around, traveled around the world in China and in Europe and so on, just we're doing games.
• 51:53
  SPEAKER_03: And and she says, It's exciting, but I'm look I'm looking forward to the next chapter of our life.
• 51:57
  SPEAKER_03: Little little did she know that she'd be pulled into this too, but she wants she'll you you ask her, she'll tell you too.
• 52:03
  SPEAKER_03: This is the best part of her life, and this is the best part of my life right now.
• 52:06
  SPEAKER_03: That's great.
• 52:07
  SPEAKER_03: That's great.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe we'll close on uh speaking of uh relationships and teamwork, um, you know, our understanding of the Sacrament of Orders.
• 52:15
  SPEAKER_00: Uh there's uh Bishop Priest and Deacon.
• 52:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um uh maybe uh what is what it's been like what you mentioned, your pastor, and and the I think you said your current pastor is is great.
• 52:24
  SPEAKER_00: And uh have you had much contact with uh Archbishop Perez or uh No, not what he's a busy man, right?
• 52:30
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right, right.
• 52:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, he's a busy man.
• 52:32
  SPEAKER_00: But uh but working with um as a as a deacon working with priests, how's how's that experience been?
• 52:36
  SPEAKER_03: Uh it's well I've been I I told you, Bishop Kevin, I I've been blessed to have two pastors that are just amazing.
• 52:42
  SPEAKER_03: And they're I don't just consider them my pastor, my brothers in Christ, but I consider them friends too.
• 52:47
  SPEAKER_03: And um and I just I just say to the deacons, just you know, you're we're here to serve.
• 52:53
  SPEAKER_03: That's what we do.
• 52:54
  SPEAKER_03: We serve.
• 52:54
  SPEAKER_03: Um we serve the service, right?
• 52:56
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I mean we serve we serve whatever the bishop tells us, we go, we serve.
• 53:01
  SPEAKER_03: And I just think we just keep that in mind.
• 53:03
  SPEAKER_03: It's not about us.
• 53:04
  SPEAKER_03: It's about when you're on the altar, it's serving, it's about you know doing the best you can to bring people closer to the Lord and so on.
• 53:10
  SPEAKER_03: And y your your parish priest is just an you know, your pastor is he's a normal man like me and you, and talk to him like that.
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, just have it have a respectful conversation.
• 53:20
  SPEAKER_03: If for some reason you don't get along, let's sit down and talk.
• 53:23
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, we all want to get we're we're brothers in Christ together.
• 53:26
  SPEAKER_03: If I'm doing something that Bishop Kevin doesn't like, I want you to tell me because I what the one thing I don't want to do is something wrong.
• 53:32
  SPEAKER_03: Something that you know but I know what I too do love too, I love the the younger priests that are coming out now from seminary.
• 53:40
  SPEAKER_03: These guys are phenomenal in this day and age to be in formation and to become a priest.
• 53:45
  SPEAKER_03: I love serving these younger priests too.
• 53:47
  SPEAKER_03: I do, and I have a bunch of them who are friends of mine because you know they like to play golf, they like the sports and all.
• 53:52
  SPEAKER_03: I'll do anything for them.
• 53:53
  SPEAKER_03: I I I really will.
• 53:54
  SPEAKER_03: And I just um yeah, I just I just I just just love to serve.
• 53:58
  SPEAKER_03: I really do.
• 53:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, um it's it's really a blessing.
• 54:01
  SPEAKER_00: And as you said, gratitude, uh uh um we're it's a response to a call and uh and all of us share that call from baptism and uh trying to uh know what the Lord is asking and trying to do it as best we can, right?
• 54:13
  SPEAKER_00: Day by day uh asking his help in prayer.
• 54:15
  SPEAKER_03: That's true.
• 54:16
  SPEAKER_03: And not everybody's called to be a priest or a deacon, right?
• 54:18
  SPEAKER_03: But they're called to do something maybe you're doing right now, Jay.
• 54:20
  SPEAKER_03: Or they're called to be the best father and husband they can be.
• 54:23
  SPEAKER_03: The Lord's calling to each one of us to get closer to him.
• 54:26
  SPEAKER_03: And like you said, during this Lenten season, and even though it's halfway through Lent, and I I I m some of us have broken their Lenten, but we can get back on the back on the bike again.
• 54:36
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, back on track again.
• 54:38
  SPEAKER_03: And maybe if you haven't, and I used to do this years ago.
• 54:40
  SPEAKER_03: I'll get to it on the Ash Wednesday, and I don't.
• 54:43
  SPEAKER_03: Well, maybe now's the time we're halfway through.
• 54:46
  SPEAKER_03: It's not too late.
• 54:47
  SPEAKER_03: We got time between now and Easter.
• 54:48
  SPEAKER_03: If somebody out there who hasn't, or they're afraid to do something or haven't or forgot to do something, start now.
• 54:54
  SPEAKER_00: Start now.
• 54:55
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 54:55
  SPEAKER_01: And get to confession, right?
• 54:56
  SPEAKER_03: Amen.
• 54:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, sacrament of healing.
• 54:59
  SPEAKER_00: Monday's uh welcome home for healing here in the diocese.
• 55:01
  SPEAKER_00: We have every Monday at every parish from 7 to 8:30 confession that is available.
• 55:05
  SPEAKER_00: So we thank our priests and we encourage uh as many as possible to take advantage of that.
• 55:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um you mentioned Coach Jay Wright.
• 55:13
  SPEAKER_00: Can you tell us uh about that?
• 55:15
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's Wednesday, May 6th, we'll put it up, but uh you're welcome to come back up if you like.
• 55:18
  SPEAKER_00: And uh you said you've had uh uh some contact with them over here.
• 55:22
  SPEAKER_03: Great guy.
• 55:23
  SPEAKER_03: He's he's worth going to the listen to.
• 55:25
  SPEAKER_03: A man of faith.
• 55:25
  SPEAKER_03: A man of faith, he really is.
• 55:27
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, Coach Wright is gonna be with us at St.
• 55:29
  SPEAKER_00: Paul's Inside the Walls, our Evangelization Center.
• 55:32
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's Wednesday, May 6th.
• 55:33
  SPEAKER_00: And uh check the show notes.
• 55:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um you can register.
• 55:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um and uh for young people and coaches, uh he'll be in the afternoon speaking to student athletes and and coaches, so that's a that's a possibility.
• 55:47
  SPEAKER_00: And then in the evening, seven o'clock, uh we're gonna we're asking parishes to encourage parish leaders to go.
• 55:53
  SPEAKER_00: But there's uh an open registration if there might be some Villanova alums out there.
• 55:57
  SPEAKER_00: We want to uh given that the Holy Father is an uh an alum, we have to uh be uh supportive of Villanova's so uh so uh and the Augustinians.
• 56:06
  SPEAKER_00: But uh um look look forward to that and uh um we'll um keep each other in prayer.
• 56:12
  SPEAKER_00: And Deacon Steve, thanks so much for coming.
• 56:14
  SPEAKER_00: And uh thank you so much for be praying for you and please pray for us and uh thank you very much.
• 56:18
  SPEAKER_00: We uh we continue in our season of Lent.
• 56:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 56:21
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, and thank you all for joining us.
• 56:23
  SPEAKER_01: Please subscribe, comment, and leave a positive rating.
• 56:26
  SPEAKER_01: Get to know us better by following Bishop Kevin's Instagram and beyond the beacon on social media.
• 56:31
  SPEAKER_01: Read the bishop's weekly column on beaconnj.org and get in touch if you have a question for the bishop or a podcast topic idea, and discover our other podcasts.
• 56:42
  SPEAKER_01: See you next time.
• 56:43
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks, everybody.
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_00: God bless.
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_00: God bless.
• 56:45
  SPEAKER_00: Have a great land.