Latest / Nightmare Success In and Out / Escape the Odds Man of Impact. Aaron Smith

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Escape the Odds Man of Impact. Aaron Smith · Nightmare Success In and Out

0:02
What happens when your worst fear becomes your reality?
0:05
Hi, I'm Brent Cassidy. Welcome to the Nightmare Success
0:08
In and Out podcast, where we explore how to overcome your
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fears and nightmares that set yourself free.
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We're going to be exploring this topic with guys that was in
0:16
Leavenworth with and others who survived their own nightmare.
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These stories can be inspiring, sometimes.
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Sad. There's some humor, but
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hopefully you can come away with a nugget of something that'll
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help you knock down some of the prisms you built up in your own
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mind. All right, Welcome back,
0:35
nightmare, success, in and out, listeners.
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This is where you come for what happens when your worst fear
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becomes your reality. How do you adapt, survive,
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overcome? Well, Aaron Smith is somebody
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that I've followed on his social media for a while.
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And I I I think it's he's got an incredible story.
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You know he grew up on the South side of Chicago, tough streets
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of Chicago. And as a lot of people that I
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was with in prison, he was a great entrepreneur.
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He was just in the drug business and he, he got hit and it cost
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him 12 years in a sentence. And when he was in, what I love
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about his story was he just decided to switch up his hustle.
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You know, he had a great mind for for the business and he got,
1:28
he got a business degree. So it wasn't like this guy
1:30
wasn't getting educated, but in prison he really made a mindset
1:35
shift and switching his hustle. He was like, I'm going to make
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something happen when I get out here.
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And he did. He's created, he goes in, he
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creates workshops for financial literacy about second chances,
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how things can happen, how you can get out if you make it work.
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He runs a trucking company called U-turn.
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U-turn Transfer, teaches people how this could work for them on
2:01
a second chance. He's got 70, some odd interviews
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he's done on Escape the Odds podcast, and he's just a man on
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the move. You know if you look him up he's
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been on ABCCBS and all the the stuff that's called that they're
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they're drawn to it because this is a guy it's kind of like a
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Rocky movie. It's a comeback store.
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People like comeback stores and and Aaron is that guy that is is
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decided what I'm doing, how I'm doing it.
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I'm gonna make it work. I I'm gonna what I'm experienced
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I wanna pay it forward and he's going in and he's making it
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happen inside the prisons and I love it.
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It's it's good stuff. I can't wait to unpack all of
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it. Before we do, I want to
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Auto Plaz direct telling Brent from nightmare success since you
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Aaron Smith Welcome in my man. How you doing?
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I'm. Doing well, man.
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Thank you for having me. Thank you.
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Appreciate that. Well, I I I'm glad you made the
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time to be here because you you're doing a lot of things and
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you know, I think you know when you get a 12 year sentence you
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can do one or two things. You can curl up in a fetal
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position and and give up or say man I'm going to make it.
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I'm going to do something. I'm going to survive.
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I'm going to overcome and and you came out fighting and and
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making things happen. Take us back a little bit,
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Aaron. Where and how in the world did
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Aaron little Aaron? What was going on in little
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Aaron's world back in the day? Yeah man, I've always been like
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this entrepreneur, ambitious, hustler thinking about getting
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money from a young age. Man, I grew up in a housing
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project, part of my life on the South side of Chicago.
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They moved to another neighborhood which was just this
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drug written, gang written kind of environment but nevertheless
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like my household with structure, right Mom and pop
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step pops he raised since I was one years old.
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So that's why that's my dad that I know, but mom was really about
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education and I knew that I would get an education but I
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also knew I wanted to get some quick money too at the same
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time. So even early as you know, 6-7
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years old, I knew what was going on in my environment.
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I knew about cocaine, I knew about heroin, I knew about all
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these things that I should have known about as a kid because I
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was so yeah I I was so inquisitive though and but I
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also knew that again I wanted to make make this money.
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So I started like hustling like you know ironing my siblings
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clothes, right. Any little thing I can get an
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extra few bucks just like this. This hustle mentality was birth
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in me and as I got older. How?
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Many siblings Did you have Aaron?
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I have. It's five of us, one of my
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brothers. He was murdered back in 2005.
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We were one year or yeah, so. And that had to be tough as a
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kid. How old?
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How old were you when he? I was, I was 20, I was 24.
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He was 25. Wow.
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That was about a year before I got indicted by the fear.
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So it was a whole lot going on during that time.
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But absolutely it was, it was devastating for me.
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Again we were we were like Irish twins, were 13 months apart,
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grew up together. I have three other siblings, one
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is 7 years. My scene was also my my Co
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defendant on this case and I have two older sister.
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I'm the youngest of five. You're the young, you're the
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baby. I'm the baby.
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I'm. I was the one that was supposed
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to make it out and go do something legit.
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So, so, Eric, growing up as as a kid, getting into sounds like to
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me that you were kind of living in two different worlds.
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You were straddling your mom. It's all about education.
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It's structured. And then he straddled into the
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streets and they were like, Oh my God, look at what's going on
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here At at what age did you get into the world where you
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thought, man, this is, this is the streets.
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Like, what this is, This is what everybody is talking about.
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I'm in it. Yeah, I would probably say like
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officially, probably about 15-16 years old, but it was like a
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precursor to that stuff just hanging around.
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All of my friends were either they were all involved in gangs,
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right? Maybe not super deep involved,
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but they were all what we call in Chicago plug, right?
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They would, they would they belong to a particular
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organization? Myself, I wasn't.
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So I was one of the few in my neighborhood that wasn't Plug so
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to speak. But nevertheless, everybody
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respects me. I was a cool guy.
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And so but at the same time, again wanting to get that money,
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I I started hustling around 15 years old, started selling
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marijuana and that escalated. Sold marijuana through our high
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school, started selling crack maybe around 1718 years old.
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Really really petty hustling with that.
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I had a friend who sold cocaine so I saved the money he was
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making and I'm like, well, you know I'm selling weed to all the
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the dealers, right. I might as well sell some of
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this cocaine too. So that was, that was shortly
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maybe about a year year and a half.
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Wasn't no kind of kingpin with that.
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But then I was introduced to to heroin with my brother who ran
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operation in the housing project, so you.
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Know heroin is something you know.
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You watch all these things on Netflix, that was a drug that
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because people were getting strung out on opioids and and
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Oxycontin and all those things that then they would switch,
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they couldn't get the the scripts for that.
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And so they would flip over into heroin.
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And heroin became a big drug. And it was like one of those
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things that people weren't talking a lot about, but the
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opened up and all of a sudden heroin was a drug that that was
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on the streets that people were trying to get to.
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Yeah, absolutely. In my neighborhood, heroin has
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always been a big factor since the 80s.
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You know, I remember as young as six, 7-8 years old, just, you
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know, hearing the talks of heroin, seeing people that were
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strung out. So unfortunately that was the
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norm. And of course, over the last
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10-12 thirteen years, it has become this quote UN quote
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crisis. And nevertheless, not to
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minimize the effects of it, but it but it was always in our
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neighborhood like it was a norm in our neighborhood.
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And so I got involved with that around 19.
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You're about 19 years old, up until my arrest at 25.
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So you got into that, Aaron, and I thought the interesting part
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of reading up on you is, is that you were also involved in
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education. I mean you were educating
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yourself also. Yeah.
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And you were building this business, there was this drug
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business and going and creating, you know, this education for
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yourself. Yeah.
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And then and then you would drop back in and be running this drug
10:00
business. What did that feel like to you?
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It. It was just another day.
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Like I didn't. I knew what I was doing was
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wrong, but it was by any means necessary in my mind.
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I wanted to utilize the school so I can be educated right
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Something I knew I wanted to get a college degree, so that was
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that was numero Uno that I was going to take care of that.
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But also at the same time I had to feed myself and you know have
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all of the trinkets of that lifestyle, but also making sure
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that I get my education simultaneously.
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And again, it was it was it was normal.
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There wasn't really a It wasn't hard, man.
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It wasn't. But I mean, here's the thing
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that I think's interesting is that there's a lot of things
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that are interesting about it. But you've got, you've got
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yourself, you're studying, you're going through, you're
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getting a business degree and then you're also building and
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becoming something in on the streets that is a, you know, a
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$15,000 a day. Yeah, business, right?
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What were you thinking? I'm taking this business
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national. Or were you thinking I'm going
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to straddle this thing and figure it out as I go?
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I think, well, I definitely wasn't.
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I had no plans on going national, right, or anything
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like that. It was local but lucrative.
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At the same time, I wanted to be able to take the money that I
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was making and do some legitimate.
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And I tried that right when I was 2000 and four, 2005, you
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know I started a T-shirt brand, was wholesaling that in the
11:37
stores going to fashion shows. Like I really wanted to do
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something different. At one point I, I signed up like
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to go into like the army, right, or the the reserves or
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something. Like I just wanted to do
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something different because I don't.
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Yeah, trying to escape. I had this degree.
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But at that time, like everybody was like you need experience.
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And so I'm like, hey, I have to tell you to do what I'm doing.
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But I did want to. I want it out in such a way, but
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nevertheless the the Laurel Fast cat I knew I can always go back
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to selling heroin and I could make X amount of dollars in no
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time. And so that kind of kept kept me
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around and plus everyone I knew, most of the people that I hung
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around, this was their lifestyle as well.
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OK, so so walk us through. Aaron.
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How did it go down when your nightmare happened?
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What? What happened?
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Well, it as, you know, the federal government, they they
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watch you over a certain amount of time.
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So it wasn't maybe like most people you get caught one time
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and you locked up. It was more of an investigation.
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I remember in February, wow, February 6th, 2006, I I got a
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call from the DEA, which I know now is the DEA and they called
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private. Normally I don't answer a
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private call and so I picked up flip the phone.
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Back then we had flip phones, right?
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So I picked the phone. You're right.
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And so they, he called me about my nickname which which was ace.
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You know like private phone call sound like a white guy.
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You know, like I don't know this person.
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And so they told me like, well we are we at your mom house
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right now You need to come. We want to talk to you.
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And so I was like, yeah, I was like, put my mom on the phone.
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And I talked to my mom like, hey, mom, are they being
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respectful? That was my way of asking her,
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Are they tearing up the place? Because I knew I had some things
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over there. Of course my my mom didn't know
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I had things at her house. And she was like, yeah, they're
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being pretty respectful. I'm like, OK, cool, right?
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So I was like, OK, that's that's safe.
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Whatever's there, I'm OK. But I also knew that if they
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found some of the baggy materials that I had, that could
14:00
potentially link me to some of the overdose deaths, Right?
14:04
So I was like, wow, So I'm thinking about all these
14:06
different things. And the DEA got back on the
14:09
phone, which I know now is the DEA.
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And I was like, OK, I'll be there.
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I'll be there in 10 minutes, which will cost a lot.
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And I never went And but at the same time, my brother had got
14:19
arrested. He got picked up an hour before
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then. I didn't know at the time.
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So eventually he was released. And that's when I found out like
14:31
everything that was going on, like, OK, we're under
14:33
investigation, but this is like 5 months prior to our actual
14:38
indictment or complaint. And so from that point on, I was
14:42
like, you know what? I'm out the I'm out the game.
14:45
But let me let me take that back.
14:46
Some the day before or maybe a couple days before, I was at a
14:51
hotel and I came down to the lobby.
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It was like a movie came down to the lobby and my eyes fixated on
14:58
the front page of the Chicago Sun Times and it said, you know,
15:02
something to the effect of drop dead heroin overdose kills.
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And I'm like, Oh my God, right. I was like this is, I know that
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I have some kind of fault in this.
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Even though I'm not directly dealing hand to hand.
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My distribution is a part of what's going on.
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And I'm like, wow. And so I immediately I wanted to
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grab every piece of paper off the news stand.
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Right. But so I I immediately kind of I
15:25
was like, OK I'm kind of done. I'm going to fall back a little
15:27
bit. And then of course two days
15:29
later is the story I just told you.
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And so I was really, I was really nervous because it was it
15:34
was something high profile. I had never been incarcerated
15:39
definitely not with on the federal system.
15:41
So I knew that it was the beginning of the end for me.
15:45
I I knew that I'll eventually go to prison, despite what the DEA
15:50
agency they said. Well, could I hired a lawyer.
15:53
And I had a lawyer go down there and talk to, you know, see what
15:56
they Who was it? And I found out over the DEA.
15:58
They said, well, they just don't want you to go down to the
16:01
project anymore. Like, you're good, just don't go
16:03
down to the project. And I just knew that was too
16:06
good to be true. But as a young naive guy, I'm
16:09
like, OK, all right, cool. I'm done.
16:10
I just won't show my face in the area no more.
16:12
I can still dibble and dabble a little bit.
16:13
But I won't be in the area. I'm out.
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I'm out somewhat because again, still attracted to that fast
16:20
money. But maybe I can.
16:21
Kind of you kind of utilize other people on the?
16:25
Edges. Exactly.
16:26
So that's what ended up happening.
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So five months later, I was I was picked up with 47 other
16:34
individuals for Did they? Hit 47 in one day.
16:38
Pretty much, yeah, probably. Oh, maybe most.
16:40
Most were picked up on that first day.
16:42
Yeah, that was a really big thing.
16:44
So, Aaron, you you're picked. Up, Yeah.
16:48
What are you, what are you thinking?
16:49
I mean, because you kind of had some time to think about this,
16:51
You know, if it's going to be real, they are.
16:54
How involved are they? Like what it was?
16:56
You know, you know, you're being looked at.
16:57
It's the feds. Right.
17:00
I was. I didn't.
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I knew that I'll be spending a long time in prison.
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I was all in my mind. I already knew.
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Like once the feds come pick you up, that's the long.
17:13
Going back? Yeah, you're doing, you know,
17:15
because I. But I had never knowing anyone
17:18
personally to get picked up out of feds because I just figured,
17:23
you know, the federal government, when they pick you
17:25
up, you like this huge kingpin and you making a whole lot of
17:28
money, right? And so, so I did.
17:31
I just didn't know what to expect.
17:33
But I knew that it was going to be a long time before I see,
17:37
before I seen the streets again. And I was OK just coming home
17:40
before I was 40 years old. Like I had already relegated my
17:44
mind to thinking like, this is going to be a ride.
17:47
What did your mom think? I mean, she's got two boys.
17:50
They're. Wrapped up in this?
17:52
Like what? What was that all about?
17:53
Yeah, Mom was. She was devastated just because
17:58
she had so much, you know, high expectation for me, especially
18:03
at graduated college two years prior.
18:07
My, my other brother was just murdered nine months prior to
18:10
that. And now she has both of her, her
18:13
oldest. Yeah, they're freshly indicted.
18:17
And yeah, she was, she was devastated.
18:20
But she's a strong woman. She she was able to get through
18:23
it and hold us down throughout the time and you know kind of
18:27
keep us focused when we were, we were down doing those, doing
18:30
those years. How long did you have to go
18:32
through the process of from the time you guys got picked up
18:36
until the time you're sitting? Yeah, for like like almost three
18:41
years, three years, almost three years.
18:43
And then I was I ain't got got sentenced to 12 years, A long
18:48
time. Yeah, no criminal background.
18:50
First time around. I ended up doing 9 years and
18:53
five months. I got the year off for the R dot
18:56
drug program. You and I both did that.
18:59
Yeah, yeah. And that was a that was a
19:01
experience within itself. Yes, it is.
19:04
And you know what's funny about it is it's like the only thing.
19:08
And things have changed since, right?
19:11
But first, step back and everything else.
19:13
But at that time, it's. The only thing you can get it's
19:15
the. Only thing you can take.
19:16
Yeah. And and and it it is an
19:18
experience because it's all segregated.
19:21
Yeah. You're in your own.
19:22
Yeah. It's it's a it's it's like a
19:24
it's like a cult. Right, Yeah.
19:27
You know, I mean, there's some good things in it.
19:30
You know, in in my experience with it was, you know, some of
19:35
these people who were running it wanted to be correctional
19:39
officers. You know, they they wanted the
19:41
chain and the keys and the whole thing.
19:44
They wanted to set people back and and and then there were a
19:46
couple of people that really were good people.
19:48
And you know, if if there was all good people in the deal,
19:51
it's probably a really good program.
19:53
But there were some bad apples in the program that really, you
19:58
know, created, you know, a an environment where it felt like
20:07
it could be better. I guess I could say, yeah.
20:10
More More of a punitive environment.
20:12
Exactly. Yeah.
20:14
OK, so so you go in and you you. Your sentence is 12 years.
20:21
Where were you sentenced to? I was sentenced to sandstorm
20:24
Minnesota. OK, so.
20:25
Minnesota, it's cold. Yeah, UN UN yeah, unbearable.
20:30
Chicago wasn't cold, but Minnesota is up more.
20:32
Further north it's a different kind of, kind of cold, like it
20:37
snows all the way until maybe mid-May, yeah, yeah.
20:43
OK, so I want to talk more about this deal of you going into
20:46
prison and when the mindset changes.
20:49
Before I do that, I want to recognize the White Collar
20:52
support group. They're a sponsor for this show.
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prisoners.org. That's prisoners.org.
21:27
Start here. OK, so Aaron, you walk in,
21:33
you're not going to be here for a week, a month.
21:37
It's not like a bad church camp that you're going to have to be
21:40
out and you can come back. It's 12 years walking into
21:46
prison. What are you thinking at at the
21:48
age of 25? Yeah, my my walking into prison
21:52
because I self surrendered. Which I did too.
21:55
That's a weird thing on itself. Exactly right.
21:58
So you when you mentioned walking in, I'm literally
22:00
thinking about walking in from the car to R&D, which is where
22:04
you first entered. It's a weird deal.
22:07
Yeah. And so I was at this time I was
22:10
27/27/28. So I had some time to kind of
22:16
reflect on a lot of things that I was got myself into, really
22:20
got deep into my faith as a Christian.
22:22
And so I was more than ready to kind of start this time and get
22:26
it over with, like let's let's get this done over with.
22:30
The longer I wait, the longer I. Yeah, exactly.
22:34
So my, my daughter, mom was pregnant at the time.
22:37
She was four months pregnant. And so that was a, that was a
22:41
big thing. Heartbreaking for me, her and I,
22:44
to walk inside of, you know, an institution and knowing that I
22:48
won't see my daughter as a freedom I'm a dad of.
22:52
Three daughters I can't even imagine.
22:54
Yeah, so she's 10 years old. But again, thank God for the for
22:59
the strong mind that that he gave me.
23:02
I was able to, you know, kind of suck it up and say, hey, you
23:06
know, that was my motivation to get back my family and the
23:11
business venture, the entrepreneur mindset, like
23:13
really getting back to the essence of who I was.
23:16
I just had to unlearn a lot of things I have learned.
23:19
And so going inside, I remember the CEO asking me like, who do I
23:26
want to give my belongings to or who should we send it belongings
23:29
to in the case of my demise? I'm like, whoa, that's.
23:34
That's deep. That's deep.
23:36
That's it, man. You know, I never really thought
23:38
about, like, dying here, right? I mean something happened to me
23:42
in in not surviving in that in that manner.
23:47
So that really put some of my mind.
23:48
So I was like, you know, my mom was my next account.
23:51
Like this is crazy. So that was the really like one
23:54
of the wake up calls outside of course getting indicted within
23:57
itself but kind of really knowing that there's a
24:00
possibility that anything can happen while I'm on these walls.
24:03
And I had never spent time in prison before and although I
24:06
went to a low security, from the outside looking in, it kind of
24:10
looked intimidating after I look back on it.
24:13
You know, we had a double, double, double wide razor fence.
24:17
Same people, you know, walk in the yard and so everybody's kind
24:19
of looking at me because they can see me walking in and I got
24:23
in, I got a cellie. I was in the hole for two weeks,
24:26
waiting on bed. Yeah, they kept you for two
24:29
weeks in the hole. In the hole almost two weeks, I
24:32
was waiting on bed space. I guess the got some.
24:34
Shock therapy right there. Yeah, so I was, but I didn't
24:38
realize. I thought this is what my time
24:39
was going to be like. So, you know, 23 hours a day,
24:44
I'm like, OK, well this is what it's going to be.
24:46
They don't. Know any different?
24:47
They don't tell you any different in federal.
24:50
Prison. So I'm just sitting there, so I
24:52
get the phone, you know make a couple phone calls a week.
24:55
You know you get the phone through the through the truck
24:57
hold. So you talking to the family
24:58
asking know how's everything going.
25:00
This is the first few days while I'm incarcerated.
25:03
I'm, I'm kind of holding myself up.
25:04
And then I got Sally Hispanic guy from Chicago and he kind of
25:09
gave me the lay of the land like what to expect.
25:12
And so I was like, oh, OK, cool. I'll get a chance to kind of go
25:14
to the compound and and kind of walk around and be a little bit
25:17
free like that's a pretty laid back joint, blah, blah, blah.
25:20
And so OK, cool. So that gave me a sense of
25:23
relief. So now I'm just kind of ready to
25:25
go to that next step, get out of this hole right and go to my
25:29
unit and. Almost felt like freedom, I bet.
25:32
Yeah, and just another level of it like this.
25:34
Let let me just get on. And I, you know, I don't want to
25:37
pass back that because the mind buzz of that situation, 'cause
25:43
you know when, when, like when I went, you know, it was at
25:46
Leavenworth. It's 1879 building.
25:48
It puts you in the hole. And the thing that you realize
25:53
at that point is, is that you have no more control.
25:57
I I didn't know if that was where I was going to be for the
25:59
next five years. And and it it wouldn't have.
26:04
I couldn't have said anything that would have changed it if it
26:07
was going to be where I was going to be for the next five
26:08
years. And and that's such a weird mind
26:13
buzz because until you get in that situation Aaron, you don't
26:18
know and they don't tell you anything then and they know that
26:23
that's a mind buzz. They don't tell you anything.
26:26
You just the next thing you know is when they tell you to go
26:29
somewhere. So how you get through that in
26:33
your mind is, is crazy. I went through, I don't know
26:36
five or six hours of that. You went through two weeks of
26:38
that and and the idea of not knowing when you're going to go
26:43
to the next or is this going to be it is a very weird place to
26:47
be in your mind. Yeah, sure, Sure thing.
26:49
Just the unexpected. Just you don't, you don't know.
26:51
And so the anxiety with it. But again, man, this is a
26:56
testament to having a strong mind and strong will.
26:59
I knew I was going to survive. Like I wasn't going to lose my
27:01
mind. I wasn't going to, you know, do
27:04
anything that was going to just kind of jeopardize like who I am
27:10
as a man, anything like that. And so I was really prepared to
27:14
do whatever I had to to make it back to my family.
27:17
But don't you think it's interesting though, in that type
27:20
of situation that you down to your soul, you kind of learn
27:25
that I can adapt to anything? Oh, absolutely.
27:28
One of the one of the first books I read was Victor
27:32
Frankel's Man, Search for Meaning.
27:34
And ironically, that was one of the last books I read upon my
27:39
release. And that book, it it's a quick
27:43
read maybe so something like that.
27:46
But sold over 10 million copies. And that book was just it.
27:50
It really kind of helped me think about things from a
27:54
different perspective. And so my journey began, man, I
27:58
I walked on the yard, you know, got my, my roll up, you know, I
28:03
got my, my orange, what they call Jackie Chan's on, got my
28:07
khaki on. I've been in the hole two weeks
28:10
and I had dreadlocks at the time, So my hair is kind of like
28:13
everywhere. And I and I and I walked the
28:15
yard with my head up and chest out, you know, like, I didn't
28:18
know what to expect. Like, I'm like, hey, I'm here.
28:21
Like I'm going to make it back home by any means necessary.
28:24
And so I had to, I had, I had to, had to man up, you know what
28:29
I mean? So to make sure that I was going
28:32
to come back in one piece, in one mind, one soul.
28:36
And so I walk the yard compounds probably like a 200 foot, 200
28:40
feet walk. I'm walking and everybody all
28:45
eyes are on me. It's 12:00 in the afternoon.
28:48
It's it's doing child time, people kind of moving around
28:51
using the telephone and just kind of moving and here I am
28:55
walking this, this catwalk so to speak and.
28:58
Everybody's. Checking and I'm just looking at
29:00
them eye contact with everybody, right?
29:02
Like, hey, look, there ain't no chump.
29:04
You know, I ain't going. This ain't what it is.
29:06
Again, I don't know what to expect in this situation.
29:09
And so I have to protect myself. And so people just kind of
29:12
looking white, black, Hispanic, every nationality, everything,
29:17
right? It's.
29:17
A primitive environment. Yeah, exactly.
29:20
So it's the Melton Fox. You probably got 500 people out
29:22
there just kind of moving around and I'm just walking with my and
29:25
they all know that I'm new because I got my Jackie Chan's
29:28
on, I got my, you know, everything.
29:31
They know that you. You're the new guy and that is,
29:34
that is the one thing, you know, I I was trying to check out
29:36
everything I could check out before I went in and there's
29:39
nothing really to look at. Yeah, but the one thing that is
29:42
true is, is that they really do check you out.
29:44
I mean, you know, when you walk in, you walk in alone.
29:47
And one of the things I think is really cool is when you walk
29:50
out, you get so much, it's like a celebration of people, you
29:55
know, high five and and they're happy for you and you walk out
29:59
and it's it's a celebration. But when you walk in,
30:02
everybody's checking you out because you're walking into
30:04
their world. There you go, you're.
30:05
Now in their environment and their arena, what's this guy get
30:09
a break? Right.
30:10
And then I, you know, kind of to that point, I remember feeling a
30:15
course surreal, right. And I'm locked up.
30:18
Like, yeah, wow. I'm in prison for the next 10
30:21
years. I thought I had to do 10 years
30:22
and five months without the drug program.
30:24
I didn't think that I can get the drug from.
30:26
And quiet as kept, I wasn't really eligible for the drug
30:30
program. So that was a blaster within
30:32
itself. But a whole year off for people
30:34
who don't understand the RDAP program, you can get a whole
30:37
year off going into that program.
30:40
Right. You take like a drug
30:41
rehabilitation program. So in my mind I had 10 years,
30:45
five months to do. My out date was February, March
30:49
of 2020 and here it was 2009. And I'm like, I got to get
30:55
through this time by any means. Like it wasn't.
30:58
It wasn't a moment in my life or during that journey where I felt
31:03
like I felt and defeated to the point where I wanted to give up.
31:07
Because I I consistently read about people that had endured
31:10
similar situations, like the Victor Frankel's and man search
31:14
for meaning. You know, like the Nelson
31:15
Mandela, like the Malcolm X's of the world, like the Josephs of
31:19
the Bible. So these characters and people
31:22
really inspired me to become a better person and make it
31:26
through like man, if Nelson Mandela can endure 27.
31:29
Years. Yeah. 27 years in a Yeah,
31:33
exactly. This is nothing.
31:34
And so I that that was one of the the things that kind of
31:38
really kept me, kept me motivated and outside of know my
31:42
daughter, my daughter, mom at the time and that whole family
31:46
unit and then just want to get back to business, you know, like
31:49
legitimate business, Like, hey, I got a whole college degree,
31:52
Like I really can make something on myself and not shortchange
31:56
myself again. So that was a motivating factor
31:58
too. So, you know, one of the things
32:00
that I was reading different articles and stuff, Aaron, about
32:04
how you came in and and we're in prison and came out of prison,
32:08
but you know, one of the guys that was serving time with you,
32:10
he said, you know, he took it really serious.
32:13
You didn't want to waste time. Yeah, he was quiet.
32:16
You know, he was serious about his time, that he was going to
32:20
do something when he got out. And I thought that was
32:21
interesting because, you know, when you're in prison you can
32:26
waste time and and that time can be, you know, become part of a
32:32
routine to where you become institutionalized, you become
32:36
part of the environment. What I thought was interesting
32:39
about your story is, is that you had time.
32:42
You had real time, nine years, but the people who served time
32:46
with you saw you as somebody that was taking your time is not
32:50
wasting time, but figuring out how you were going to use your
32:53
time to better yourself, to get out and become a better man.
32:56
Absolutely. Yeah.
32:57
I I spent time around man that were you know upstanding you
33:01
know that that like had some kind of belief system that this
33:08
wasn't the end for them. You know and we we grew up a
33:13
bond, a brotherhood. And even to this day they're
33:17
they're still dear friends and brothers of mine because they we
33:20
we helped each other get through it, right.
33:21
We laughed together. We cried together.
33:23
We ate together. You know and everything the
33:26
person can do for that brotherhood and that.
33:29
That's a good point, though, in prison, Aaron, because there's
33:33
hard days in prison. Yeah.
33:35
How did how did you get through hard days in prison?
33:39
Man, no two ways. What three?
33:44
Right again, that brotherhood. Because they had all experienced
33:48
whatever I was feeling. They had experienced it already
33:50
because they had five, 1015 years being already.
33:54
So that was a it was a resource for me, right.
33:56
Another way. I will.
33:57
I will. I will pick up the mentors.
33:59
Yeah. I will pick up the phone.
34:01
And I can always talk to my mom. She's going to pick up the
34:03
phone. If no one else did, right she.
34:05
Was like your foundation. Absolutely.
34:07
And being able to, you know, look at pictures of my daughter,
34:11
right? Like, OK, this is, this is who
34:13
I'm going to come home to, to be a father.
34:15
This is my only only child. And just that was the motivating
34:18
factor. But most of all was my faith in
34:21
Christ. I was able to again read those
34:24
stories about Joseph and see myself in those stories.
34:27
Like, hey again, if he can make it through, this is only a test
34:30
for me. Like just imagine what God is
34:33
going to do upon my release and thank God, look at me now.
34:37
I I would not be on the Brent Cassidy show.
34:40
Had I not experienced the things that I experienced that I would
34:42
not have been on the, you know, Good Morning America, the front
34:46
page of the Chicago Sun Times and all these different
34:48
accolades and the connections and just don't have the impact
34:51
that I'm having. And those stories, Aaron, they
34:54
inspire people. You know I I was watching some
34:56
of those today. I was watching an ABC story and
35:01
he and he he was following your story and then he went back and
35:04
then he this one kid that was holding a basketball in the yard
35:08
and he said I'm changing because Aaron changed and I'm I'm I'm
35:12
going to become somebody because I know Aaron has become somebody
35:18
and and and I think that's such a you know it almost like makes
35:22
me emotional when I hear that kind of stuff because those are
35:27
so impactful that you're able to change somebody's life.
35:30
You know, my daughter, my youngest daughter is a teacher
35:34
in high school and she's also a coach and she shares sometimes
35:38
with stories of of teenagers where they're, she's able really
35:42
to touch people's lives at an early age.
35:45
And and I look at Aaron, what you're able to do like with that
35:48
guy that was interviewed, I could see it in his eyes that he
35:52
had decided, like you had decided that he had a brain.
35:58
He was going to, he was going to repurpose his brain into
36:01
another. He was going to switch his
36:03
hustle. There you go, yeah.
36:04
And and and and I think that's whatever that is that has to
36:09
fuel you up, because let's talk about when you're getting close
36:13
to the door. Yeah.
36:16
And it's such a weird thing when you get close to the door.
36:18
What are you thinking? What?
36:19
What's going through your mind? Hey, back to what I said
36:23
earlier. When I initially went to prison,
36:25
it was so real that I was there. Now.
36:28
It was so real that I was leaving.
36:30
So what happened in between that time, right?
36:33
How do I go from not believing that I'm actually here to not
36:36
believing I'm actually about to go home?
36:38
Right. So it was that acclamation I
36:40
got. I got accustomed to my
36:42
environment. Not that I was
36:43
institutionalized, right? But again, man can get used to
36:47
anything. Well, and I think there there's
36:50
a thing in Shawshank Redemption where Red says to Andy's frame
36:54
when they're looking at the wall.
36:56
Yeah, and and and I I think it's just so powerful.
36:59
He says, you know these walls when you look at them that that
37:02
when you first get here you see them as a way to keep you in.
37:05
And he said the longer you're here, you see those walls as the
37:08
as the arms that they put and and surround you with comfort.
37:12
And that's such a weird thing if you haven't been to prison.
37:16
But when you're there long enough, you that's what you
37:19
fight so hard to stay away from is that you don't get
37:22
institutionalized. Those aren't comfort walls.
37:26
Those are walls that you want to jump over to become into
37:28
freedom. The problem is, is freedom gets
37:30
further and further away from you when you're in and so you
37:34
have to get, you have to do everything you can to jump that
37:38
wall to get back into what you know.
37:41
Yeah, man. So I was.
37:43
I was prepared, man. I had.
37:45
I was one of those guys from the beginning of my time that people
37:49
would ask me early on in my time.
37:52
You must be going home like this year because the way you're
37:56
programming and the stuff that you're doing, you you're moving
38:00
like somebody who's short, so to speak.
38:02
And I say no, I got 8-9 years left and like, wow.
38:06
And I kept that up. And so it's almost like working
38:09
out, you know, I I I built myself.
38:11
Working out your brain. It's absolutely I built this
38:14
muscle well and here it was time to like use it like everything
38:19
that I have done, teaching financial literacy classes,
38:23
mainly everything that I'm doing.
38:25
No, that's what I think's so cool about it.
38:27
What you did in prison. You jumped out.
38:30
Yeah. And then you jumped into
38:32
everything that you were planning for.
38:36
Yeah. Coming back in into the prisons
38:38
and teaching that financial literacy and those things that
38:41
are important to get back out into your second chance you had
38:44
really trained for while you were in, right?
38:47
I I think that's so many people don't do that.
38:51
You know, you're probably in the one percentile errand of taking
38:55
all those things that you were able to program and then teach
38:58
classes while you were in prison, jump out, and then
39:02
create an environment for people who are getting out to smooth
39:09
that pathway for them to get their second chance working.
39:12
Yeah, but even despite, you know, all the preparation,
39:15
Brent, I got to keep it real with you, man.
39:18
There was a level of anxiety. Again.
39:22
That same not knowing that UN like not knowing what to expect.
39:30
When I came in, I didn't know what to expect going out,
39:36
although I have prepared, had a strong family, network,
39:40
everything that a person can do, like I was most likely to
39:42
succeed if there was a category. And nine years is a long time
39:46
regardless. Yeah, yeah.
39:49
But what happens if you've done time before you become decent?
39:55
Well, I became desensitized to time because everything looks
39:59
the same. It came to the point where I got
40:04
so used to doing time where I would meet people that were
40:06
fresh in prison and they would tell me, oh, I got a fresh. 188
40:12
months. Oh, OK.
40:13
That's 15 years. Eight months.
40:14
Oh, yeah. You'll be home in 12 years.
40:15
Like, I'm talking about it like it's nothing.
40:18
But that's a whole 12. That's a lot of time.
40:22
Or someone will say, oh, I just got 60 months.
40:25
OK, that's five years. Oh, that's short.
40:27
Oh, you'll be home two years. Like, do this, do this, do that.
40:31
And people, I became that person that someone could talk to.
40:36
Say, hey, man, how do you do this time?
40:38
Like how you doing this time? But before that was me, I was
40:42
the one asking people, hey man, how did you get through this 15
40:45
is 20 years. Like I need to know so I can
40:47
survive mentally. Yeah, but you humbled yourself
40:50
into seeing people that were doing their time the way you
40:53
wanted to do your time, and you ask them how to get through.
40:55
It there you go, it was, it was almost like a almost like a
40:58
mimic, if you will. But still, yeah, absolutely.
41:03
OK. So you're you're at that point,
41:05
Aaron, you're you're getting ready to bolt out of there.
41:09
What's what are you thinking of? I mean, it's like jumping in a
41:12
moving car. What happens?
41:14
Yeah, I well, my brother was my again, my brother's my Co
41:18
defendant, and by this time he transferred to prison with me.
41:25
How the? Hell is that happening?
41:27
Right, You know, so blessing, man, so he was able to come with
41:30
me. Not only was he able to come on
41:32
the same compound, he was my cellie.
41:35
Four years that we were, we were together.
41:38
So we had a chance to to kind of be together and like 7 years had
41:43
I I hadn't seen them in about 7 years and up until you know,
41:47
2015. And that was hard, man.
41:50
That was probably one of the hardest things I had to do to
41:54
leave not only just my blood brother, but again that
41:58
brotherhood that I had with a handful of eyes.
42:02
You know it was like I I I tear it up man, like I it was it was
42:05
a tough moment to leave and. You know, I had a guy tell me
42:09
that. And I, I use this analogy when
42:11
I'm talking about the other people.
42:12
When you go into prison and getting out, they they say it's
42:15
kind of like this guy was in, he was in the military.
42:18
Yeah. And.
42:19
And he'd also go into prison. And he said, it's kind of like
42:22
when you leave prison, it's leaving the guys on the
42:24
battlefield that you really care a lot about and you're getting
42:27
released off the war field. Yeah, And they're still there.
42:32
It's just a it's a weird thing because you're so excited to
42:34
leave and you also know you're leaving them there to fight
42:38
their battles or wherever they are on.
42:40
The prison. And that's exactly that.
42:43
That's a great way to put it, man.
42:44
So that's that's what I felt like, but also knew that
42:49
Speaking of that, we will work out and we will all leave the
42:53
Wreck Yard together. And we all, we had this model
42:56
where it's like no man left behind.
42:59
Like we couldn't leave the Wreck Yard until all of us left in the
43:02
Wreck Yard. And so it was kind of that
43:06
feeling. And I knew that I had a duty to
43:09
help change the narrative because I had, I met so many
43:11
amazing cats back there. There were like not even just
43:15
from a business standpoint, just just personally like really
43:18
good, really good, white, black, Hispanic, whatever, right.
43:22
Because again, it's a melting pot.
43:23
And so I wanted to make sure that I told those stories right,
43:28
that I highlighted my journey and other people's journey.
43:31
And so that's how you know, Escape the Odds was birthed
43:34
actually back in 2015. Which I love the name of that.
43:39
I love the name because you're living that you know.
43:43
So you, Aaron, you get out. Yeah.
43:48
What? What year was that?
43:50
2019. 2019. Early 2019 like this, Yeah.
43:54
Around this time 2019, yeah. February, March and tell tell me
44:01
like what's your life is like when when you get out?
44:04
Well, I was. I went to the halfway house, and
44:09
the halfway house it was. I was in for a shock because
44:12
they put an anchor monster on me and I didn't realize that was
44:15
going to happen. So that really restricted me.
44:18
I had all these plans, you know. You know, you hear a story about
44:21
the how, OK, I'm going to have a house on you got plans, right?
44:26
To kind of live a little bit, right.
44:27
Nothing else. But after nine years, you want
44:30
to live a little bit. Yeah, you go right and so.
44:31
But they wasn't. Happening.
44:34
No, I didn't like the ankle monitor by.
44:36
The way, yeah. So they put the ankle.
44:37
Mine was defective, by the way. When I got there, it was the
44:41
first month that they had. The month before was the first
44:44
time they had used the ankle monitors.
44:46
OK, so I got a defective one and it wouldn't charge and so it was
44:50
like a big deal if it didn't if you they would send you back or
44:54
they just give you a shot. I said no, my my ankle monitor
44:57
doesn't charge. I've been charged all day.
44:59
They finally believed me after like 2 days because they were
45:01
going to like give me back to the BOP.
45:04
Yeah. But the ankle monitor thing was
45:07
bad, Aaron. Yeah, so that was.
45:09
That was a hiccup for me. But even with that man, I
45:12
learned to overcome that challenge.
45:16
I had just overcame 9 plus years incarcerated like, I'm free,
45:21
right? This is nothing.
45:22
Yes, it's a it's a little barrier, It's a hassle.
45:26
But it kept me focused and I didn't realize it in time.
45:30
But I had needed that again. Not like I was going to go off
45:33
and stray and do something nefarious, but it allowed for me
45:36
to OK. I knew I had to only go from A
45:38
to BB to CA to BB to C and so again, that kind of kept me
45:42
aligned to what my goals were that I had fought so hard to
45:46
attain over the previous nine years and.
45:49
So, so Aaron, I'm, I'm curious like because I I want to know
45:53
what, like I know you had the escape the Odds in the podcast,
45:56
but how did the how did the trucking business work into your
46:01
entrepreneurial mind of? Because, I mean, I love it
46:05
because there's a lot of guys I know that I was with at
46:07
Leavenworth of drive trucks. Yeah.
46:10
And how did that work? How did that get into your world
46:14
of of making that work? Yeah, man.
46:16
That was one of the goals I had, because while I was on bond, I
46:21
work for a a company called Chapter Robinson, right?
46:25
They're like the largest brokerage company in the world.
46:28
And so I worked there for about 18 months.
46:32
So that was pretty the most professional experience I had
46:36
prior to my incarceration. So I knew a little bit about
46:40
more than an average about the freight brokering business, the
46:43
trucking business a little bit. And so I said I can, I'm going
46:46
to go back and get that kind of job, but I also want to start a
46:50
trucking company too just as a passive income kind of a thing.
46:54
And so as part of my release plan, I put on there that I
46:59
wanted to work for a freight brokerage company and I did that
47:02
was my first job. I worked there for about up
47:04
until 2021 maybe early 22. So really last couple years I I
47:12
finally had quit. But again, I use that knowledge
47:15
and I. Decided.
47:16
Well, the other thing I love about it is you got that the box
47:20
truck deal that where somebody doesn't have to get ACDL but you
47:22
show them how they can get into business.
47:25
Absolutely. Not having ACDL, but make a
47:27
business for themselves, which is a whole another pathway that
47:31
you're teaching people in prison.
47:33
That's that's what I love. How often do you go into the
47:36
prison environment? Man, probably, I don't know.
47:41
Several times, several times a year, I would say, yeah, after
47:45
like, yeah, again, the last class I I taught was and a few
47:51
weeks ago and I did that for eight weeks.
47:53
Prior to that I was in Maryland. We had a workshop there and
47:57
pretty much all of the second quarter I was out of, you know,
48:03
doing the workshop. Well I tell you what I what I
48:06
love about it is because this this podcast goes into 300
48:10
prisons and and so that you you could have easily just gone and
48:15
done something else and but you you created a business that that
48:20
really works for justice impacted people.
48:23
You know the the EU turn transport can actually employ
48:30
people who need this job but you're also giving them not just
48:35
an idea of a job but you're also showing people how to set up a
48:38
business. You know you can set up this
48:39
boxcar box truck business and you could actually do this and
48:43
then build on this and and and you're actually giving them a
48:46
business plan. This financial literacy thing is
48:49
such a big deal, Aaron, because I think a lot of these people
48:54
who are in prison, they are. And you and I both know we've
48:57
met some great people in prison, good people that got down on the
49:01
wrong path, all kinds of different wrong stories, wrong
49:05
experiences, whatever. But if they can employ their
49:08
brain into the right path, these people can these.
49:12
People can make something happen.
49:14
And you're doing that, you're you're actually becoming that
49:17
person. And what it means for them to
49:19
come in, you to come into their world in prison and tell them,
49:23
listen, I've been there, they know you've been there, You can
49:27
talk. The talk did nine years and here
49:30
I am and here's what I'm doing now.
49:32
That's the reason why that guy that was holding the basketball
49:35
in the yard says I'm changing. Yeah, I want to make this work.
49:39
Yeah, one of the things. I experienced to your.
49:41
Point Often times when I go inside of an institution, one of
49:46
the first things that young ladies or a guy will act like.
49:49
Have you been to prison before? Because I might not always look
49:53
like I've been to prison, right? So I'll be dressed a little
49:56
different. Yeah, you know, and so it's
49:58
like. Yeah.
50:00
Have you been here before? I'm like, I'm like, yeah.
50:02
And once they hear your story, it's like, wow, now they're
50:05
like, because if they can see it, they can believe it for
50:09
themselves. And so that's, that's the impact
50:12
of actually going back inside and even not just going inside
50:15
to tell my story to inspire, but to educate too with the box
50:20
truck course of financial literacy.
50:21
And so that's what I love about it, Aaron.
50:23
That's. The goal You You don't just go
50:24
in and share. Your story you're.
50:26
Giving them tools to use absolutely that that, you know,
50:30
yeah, can work. And you're sharing.
50:33
That with them, that's what I think is the the magic sauce to
50:36
this land secrets recipe and and you're and you're dedicating
50:40
your time to do that which I think is so cool and and here's
50:44
the thing, you and I, we haven't met before but when you serve
50:47
time, there is some kind of fraternity of OK, Aaron serve
50:52
time, Brent serve time. When you go in and talk to those
50:54
people. OK.
50:55
I get it. Aaron's made this work.
50:57
I need to think about this 'cause I can maybe make this
51:00
work for myself and that's that's what you're really doing
51:02
that's really making a difference.
51:04
I think. No, I definitely.
51:05
I appreciate that. Man and we we need more of and I
51:08
think as re entry becomes like top of the list or at least high
51:14
on the list for just society as a whole, you're going to see
51:17
more of it. And I'm thankful to be one of
51:19
the you know kind of leading pioneers if you will.
51:25
You are. And I I was talking.
51:27
To Jay Jordan the other day, that has done a lot of great
51:30
work in California. And.
51:33
He said If it's not, if it's not us, who will it be?
51:36
Because these re entry points are so difficult that it's it
51:42
automatically segregates you to poverty.
51:46
You can't find a place to live or find a job.
51:49
So if if we being the people who have experienced this aren't
51:53
going back and helping people to re educate how to get from this
51:58
and it's tough there's nothing easy about it.
52:01
You're you're, you're branded for the rest of your life.
52:04
You're branded as an ex felon. But that doesn't mean you give
52:07
up. That just means that that's what
52:09
you're you're going to have to work through and it's better
52:11
than being in prison. Now you're on the outside and
52:14
you're having to work your second chance, yeah?
52:18
No, I was going, I was going to say like our goal would escape
52:21
the odds is one was the media aspect, right?
52:24
To be able to bring that awareness to the documentary,
52:27
the podcast, the documentary that we're producing, but then
52:31
also provide those tools to like workforce development and
52:35
bridging the gap right with corporate America, with the
52:38
impacted community. And I think that's that's so
52:40
important. There needs to be that that
52:43
social responsibility of corporate America to people
52:46
that's been marginalized, right. And so I'm just thankful for my
52:49
experience where I can actually lead a role in that.
52:53
So that's a big deal and and I. I hope you do more of that,
52:58
Aaron, and I think more of what you're doing.
53:01
You know, if it's something that we can duplicate.
53:04
You know, you know, I, I talked to so many people over the last,
53:08
you know, three seasons on the show and I see so many pockets
53:12
of good things being done. If we could just duplicate that
53:15
and make it happen across the nation, then it becomes a tidal
53:19
wave of good. Yeah.
53:21
And and you know Aaron Smith in Chicago doing the stuff he's
53:26
doing if that can be duplicated so that those people in Arizona
53:30
or California or Michigan get the opportunity to get back in
53:34
there and say OK I can do I have an opportunity.
53:37
Yeah, I'm. I have an opportunity when I get
53:39
out. Yeah.
53:41
If. I If any correctional staff can
53:45
hear this, directors, wardens, we need to be inside those
53:51
institutions. Seat at the table?
53:53
Absolutely. We.
53:54
Need we need to be there. Developing programs, being able
53:59
to talk to the to the men and women and even again being that
54:03
gap, that bridge for when someone comes home.
54:07
Tying in with corporate America, tying in with the different
54:10
institutions, the educational institutions, right, all these
54:14
different pockets of organizations, just
54:19
stakeholders, right. Because 95% of the people that's
54:22
in concentrated, they're coming back home.
54:24
They're going to come home. So what are we going to do?
54:26
They're going. To become your neighbor.
54:27
So how do we make that work? Yeah.
54:29
There, there you go. Yep.
54:31
Aaron I I. So glad you came on this show
54:35
today. I want to know after all the
54:37
stuff that you've been through and and I mean.
54:41
You've been through a journey I. Mean you, you, you lived this
54:44
life, went through nine years, you've come out, you're doing
54:46
all these things. What do you think's your biggest
54:49
take away from everything you've gone through?
54:53
My biggest. Take away would be just to never
54:58
sell yourself short. I sold myself short for cheap,
55:03
right? I didn't value who I was.
55:07
I didn't learn to value myself until I was incarcerated.
55:11
Right? So I became this new person,
55:13
this new minds, new spirits, you know what I mean?
55:16
I didn't. I I didn't know, right?
55:18
And again, that's part of the environment that you place
55:23
yourself in. It's almost like I want to use
55:27
analogy of like real estate, right.
55:29
The value of real estate is based upon where it's located.
55:33
So where you place yourself is how you're going to be valued.
55:37
But then another piece of it is adding value to yourself.
55:41
Just like real estate. I can add value to a piece of
55:43
property if I renovate the bathroom, right?
55:46
I can add value to myself. If I.
55:48
You know, continue to improve on myself, whatever that looks like
55:52
mentally, spiritually. And so to never shortchange
55:56
myself again. And I love that about.
55:59
Knowing my. Value and expressing my value to
56:03
other people because they're only going to treat you how you
56:07
treat yourself and value you how you value yourself And so that's
56:11
that's one of the biggest, the biggest takeaways.
56:13
And Aaron, that's good stuff. That's.
56:15
A good place to end it because that is good stuff that is and
56:19
for those who who listen to this today follow subscribe like I
56:26
mean Aaron throughout some some words of wisdom and and I I want
56:33
to give a shout out to Greg FDF Homestead Financial who who lets
56:38
me do my podcast here for any home mortgage needs.
56:43
Aaron just brought that up with real estate go to Greg after you
56:47
if he's your man to to help you through that process.
56:50
Aaron, if people want to get as a hold of you, escape the odds,
56:53
yeah, escapetheodds.com Yeah, they can reach out to me at.
56:57
Info@escapetheodds.com The The podcast is, is Escaping Odds
57:04
Podcast on all platforms. Spotify.
57:08
Apple, Instagram. I'm I'm everywhere and
57:13
definitely looking to do more inside institutions with the Box
57:16
Truck course in financial literacy.
57:18
So I love it. I'll put it all.
57:21
In the show notes on on Where to Find You documentary too.
57:25
I forgot. I'm sorry about that.
57:26
Documentary. Tell me about that.
57:27
Yeah, the. Documentary Escaping the Odds?
57:29
Of recidivism was shot between March and July of last year
57:35
pretty much interviewing people that's been in that's.
57:38
I've seen bits and pieces of that because you've let.
57:40
It out, Yeah. So there was some little
57:42
snippets. Of kind of little teasers, but
57:44
we went inside of several prisons throughout the country
57:47
and just wanted to kind of talk to the men and women about what
57:51
it looks like for successful reintegration.
57:54
But also spoke with some some other key stakeholders outside
57:58
and also some successful people like this can happen but this is
58:02
what it's going to take as well. And so I'm, I'm praying that can
58:06
definitely be a HBO hit coming to also institution near you
58:12
all. So if you guys are listening,
58:14
just really looking to be able to travel with that documentary
58:16
as a teaching tool. And so, yeah, I love that,
58:20
Aaron. I love that.
58:21
And and I've seen bits and pieces of it.
58:23
I love the fact of how it's it's it's it's I don't know where
58:27
it's going to land. It's it's, it's got good.
58:29
It's got good. Meat on it.
58:31
It's got good meat on the bone. If people want to check me out,
58:36
go to brentcassie.com. I spell it wrong.
58:38
It's with Aty, not ady. And as I used to say when I was
58:45
writing my emails back and forth from prison, stay strong.
58:47
I'll do the same. Aaron Smith, you are the man.
58:51
Thank you so much for coming on the show today.
58:54
Appreciate it. Oh, absolutely.
58:55
Thank you for having me. I had I.
58:56
Had a great time, man. And keep keep doing what you're
58:59
doing, highlighting the stories, man.
59:01
We need more of it. We need more of it, Liber.
59:04
Success in and out.